t.»iSJLi---f*>l.'..:',=-.'Bft.-*-i-,.>s^''" U^3 ^mmll ^mvmxiifi | l\)iXMl THE GIFT OF ..^Ana^.J^k£ao^-.Sf^..3f2^...Jf!nAn^ssL^^ A>..q..7..!±ll. ^^IjIj^ HF1755 ATs'mT^'*^ '""'"'^ ^'lillIlMlli»lllJf.faS.,.ffif,.Comn,i,,, S? on olin 3 1924 030 185 288 Cornell University Library The original of tiiis book is in tine Cornell University Library. There are no known copyright restrictions in the United States on the use of the text. http://www.archive.org/details/cu31924030185288 TARIFF HEARINGS BEFOES THE COMMITTEE ON WAYS AND MEANS. U.S. » \\ov^.yc FIEST SESSION, FIFTY-THIED C0NGEES3. - — 18 9 3, 1 VI II ( 'II 1' WASHINGTON: / GOTEBNMENT PRINTING OFFICE, Ci 1893. ^ \ ■ © 'III, III! { \ ' COMMITTEE ON WAYS AND MEANS. innnTY-THIRX) COJSTGrRKSS. WILLIAM L. WILSON, BENTON McMILLIN, HENRY G. TURNER, ALEXANDER B. MONTGOMERY, JUSTIN E. WHITING, W. BOURKE COCKRAN, MOSES T. STEVENS, WILLIAM J. BRYAN, CLIFTON R. BRECKINRIDGE, Chairman. WILLIAM D. BYNUM, JOHN C. TARGNEY, THOMAS B. REED, JULIUS C. BURROWS, SERENO E, PAYNE, JOHN DALZELL, ALBERT J. HOPKINS, JOHN H. GEAR. Henry Talbott, Cleric. NOTE. It being the desire of the committee to secure ready reference to all the statements supplied to them at this time, letters and communica- tions containing statistics or facts which have come to them directly or been referred have been inserted. To save space and because many were duplicates addressed to several members, these have been taken as addressed to the committee, and by request in some instances, and under direction in others, all personal matters omitted. THE CLBEK. TARIFF HEARINGS THE COMMITTEE ON WAYS AND MEANS. DATE OF STEW TARIFF. STATEMENT OF HON. SAMUEL W. M'CALL, EEPEESENTATIVE DT CONGRESS PROM BOSTON, MASS. Wednesday, September 20, 1893. Mr. McOall. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen of the committee: I ap- pear before you to-day at the suggestion of some of my constituents who are interested in the matter to which I will call attention. I shall try to limit what I have to say to a very few minutes, and then, if you have any questions to ask, I will be glad to answer them if I can do so. The proposition which I desire to present to this committee is that the committee should at the outset, or as soon as possible, agree upon the last section of the bill first ; thatis, agree upoa the time that the tariff bill shall take effect. This is the proposition which I propose to maintain before the committee to-day. It is taken for granted that if there is a bill reported it will make a general reduction in the duties. Of course, if it was going to provide for an increase of duties, it would scarcely be necessary to ask for a postponement of the day when the bill should take effect, because of the liability of importations in anticipation of the biU taking effect. But if duties are to be decreased, then there would be no such danger. In the first place, this proposition of mine would solve the question of the probable deficit in our revenues. Of course, if there is to be a reduction in the tariff, and it is not known when the change is to take effect, the Importers will import only from day to day ; an importer would only bring in what would be absolutely necessary ; he will not import for advanced consumption. I may say that this proposition has been urged as much by the importers as by the manufacturers. Any bill that you report ought to be made to take effect on the 1st of October, 1894, or the 1st of January, 1895. Then the importer could import for consumption without a derangement of the revenues in consequence of the tariff being removed. Under the existing tariff, notwithstanding the large importations that were made before October, 1890, in anticipation of the MoKinley bill becoming a law, our revenue under that bill had been sufficient to pay the expenses of the Grovernment until the present unnatural depression set in. In- cidentally you would help the business of the importer, because you would remove the uncertainty which now hangs over their business. 5 6 DATE OF NEW TARIFF. With reference to the manufacturer and what would be the effect upon him, I will say that if he can not know what the duties are to be next May or March he is going to proceed with great caution. I am informed that the> average per cent of profit in the textile manufac- tures in some lines of the business is only about 5 per cent on the cost of the product of the mill, and if they manufacture twice the cost of the plant their profit is 10 per cent; but 5 per cent on the product is a fair profit for them to make. You can easily see that if the margin is 5 per cent the danger of having to compete with goods admitted at a duty of 10 per cent will be enough to wipe out their whole prosperity. I have been informed by large manufacturers that if they knew what the Government was going to do they would start up immedi- ately. I reach this conclusion because I think it will solve the ques- tion of the deficit and produce a staple revenue. It will induce the manufacturers to start establishments which are now shut down. Mr. Bkbckineidge. What date would you suggest? Mr. McOall. January 1, 1895. That would give a clear season. The bill would not go into effect until after the election. There would be no tendency to get a verdict upon a measure the bearings of which they could not see, and the situation would not be essentially changed. I am inclined to think that politically it might be a good idea for the party which enacts it to not have it go into effect pending an election. Mr. Breckinridge. What particular advantage do you think, in a business point of view, there would be in putting off the date until January 1,1895? Mr. McOall. I am inclined to think that in the ordinary course of manufactures — for instance, in the woolen industry — that things are in process about a year ahead of the time of consumption. It takes about that time to turn the raw material into the product. Mr. Breckinridge. Is this equally true of other manufactures? Mr. MgOall. I do not know how it is as to the other manufactures ; but I know it is general in all lines to give credit and have goods sold about that time in advance of their being manufactured. Mr. Breckinridge. What is the usual credit? Mr. McOall. It is pretty nearly six months, so far as I know. Mr. Breckinridge. What is your business? Mr. McOall. I am a lawyer, and I happen to be incidentally a member of , the exception being that the duty on com- mercial boracic acid was raised from 1 to 5 cents per pound. Tlie borax producers have then for the last feu years or more been working uiuler a tariff practically the same in its character, and the prices during tins period have been quite uniform, with cue or two exceptions, and to-day BORAX. 19 +articularly iron and all kinds of machinery, wei'e shipped from abroad, say from Kew York or Liverpool, as the case might be, and then had to be transported into the interior, hundreds of miles, often on the backs of mules and over regions where there were no roads, no supplies for man or beast, even in the shape of water. These deposits, whether in the shape of marshes, as at Death Valley, or in rocky sec- tions, as at Calico, are far inland from the seaport, and require great expense, not only of transportation of material and supplies to the mine, but an equally great expense in bringing thence the products Avhere they can be shipped and put ui^on the market. The deposits in California and Nevada are the only known ones of any importance, not only in the United States, but in North America. For some years tincal and borate of lime have been produced and worked from South America. The supply, however, is a limited one, and does not seri- ously disturb prices of borax in the markets of the world. The largest producing deposit known to-day is the one in Asia Minor, lying a short distance from the town of Panderma, a seaport on the Mediterranean Sea. This deposit is probably the largest and most extensive one of its character known. It is rich in boracic acid, the essential ingredi- ent in borax, is convenient to market, and is worked by cheap labor, probably costing not one-third what is paid by the borax producers in this country. It is termed " pandermite," taking its name from the shipping port "Panderma." A very valuable deposit of boracic acid in Tuscany, Italy, has been worked for a number of years and has been a potent factor in the borax product of the world. Antici- pating here a question that might possibly arise as to what borax is, or of what it is composed, I desire to state that borax is formed by the combination of boracic acid with soda, that it is included in the gen- eral term of borate, Avhich is a salt formed by the union of boracic acid with a base, and this base may be either soda or lime ; hence the deposits as worked in this country have been of three kinds, viz: 20 CHEMICALS. Tincal, or impure crystallized borax, borate of soda, and borate of lime. Prior to the former law taking effect, July, 1883, aud in anticipating its eflects, large quantities of boracic acid were shipped to this coun- try and held here in bond or put upon the market, as occasion required. The supply was very large and lasted several years. It had its effect also upon the price of borax, as it was imported before the duty took effect. Probably as a competitor it had sometliing to do with the fluctuation of the price of borax in this country. Since that has been disposed of and taken out of the way the price lias not materially advanced, but has been steady and given assurance to the manufac- turer aud the consumer that any investment made in this article would not be disturbed by sudden and great changes in price. Boracic acid, whicb formerly came wholly from abroad, is now made here from borate of lime, and is to-day not only equal to the best in the world, but in price much lower tlian it was before the duty was imposed upon it. The consumption of this article is increasing, and it is manufactured from the products of our own soil, giving employment to hundreds of persons. The history of borax in this country shows that it is a comparatively new industry, but one that has developed wonderfully in the thirty- seven years since the first borax discovery was made at Clear Lake, in California. Since then, under a beneficent tariff, new properties have been developed until now the annual production of borax in Califor-- nia and Nevada, the only section of the United States in which borax has been found, amounts to 5,000 tons. The first discovery, in 1856, at Clear Lake, was in the form of " tincal," a natural crystallized borax. Borax was then sold in the E"ew York market at 40 cents per pound, and its uses were very limited. Later, deposits of borate of soda, a crude natural borax, were found, and after a time these deposits were used ex- clusively in the manufacture of borax. With the increased consump- tion of the article these became exhausted, and the California produ- cers werecompelled to turn to another form of borax, borate of lime, prac- tically the only article used to-day in the manufacture of borax. Before these first discoveries in California the price of borax ranged from 25 to 50 cents per pound. Notwithstanding the duty on borax at 5 cents per pound, it is cheaper than ever before, with the exception when ruin- ous competition took place between some of the leading producers on the Pacific coast, which resulted in a leading citizen of San Francisco being forced into bankruptcy. . The sterUe deserts in California and Nevada, where borates are mined, are absolutely worthless, except for these borate deposits. The development of these borax properties has been a great advantage to California and Nevada in developing sections of the two States which would otherwise have been uninhabited wastes to-day. Q^he property has been bought of the Government for the sole purpose of being de- veloped as borax properties, and frequently large sections have been purchased, only small portions of which have yielded any borax. A contrast between the cost of getting a foreign article to market and our own home product will show very clearly the necessity of at least retaining the present duty of 5 cents per pound on borax, in order to save this great mining industry of the 'SVest from being forced into a disastrous competition. The foreign article is found iu localities near the seaboard. One of the largest deposits of borate of lime is in Asia Minor, a few miles from Panderma, where labor and expenses are very low. From this seaport it is carried to market by water, the cheapest transportation known to commerce. On the other hand, our deposits BOUAX. 21 in this country are usually miles from the railroad, in the center of barren deserts, where all food and water needed for man and beast must be carried at great expense. The material for the plants erected has been laboriously freighted in, making the cost of their construction a very unusual one. Then the borax must be hauled many miles to the railroad by great freight wag- ons specially built for this service, and drawn by long teams of mules. Tlie provender must be carried on these journeys, as there is nothing to sustain life in the desert. In the case of the San Bernardino Borax Company the haul is 60 miles from the mine to the railroad, and the Death Valley Company's over 80 miles. From the railroad shipping points to San Francisco the cost of transportation is as high as the trafiflc will stand. From there the goods must be transported to New York. If by sailing vessel around the " Horn," a distance of 15,000 miles; if by rail, they must be carried across the continent. This rate alone is usually a full cent for every pound. It will tlius be seen how large a proportion of the price obtained for the article in the market is absorbed in producing and bringing it to market. In spite of all these difficulties to be overcome, there has been a steady decrease in the price since the first discovery of borax in this country, and many new uses for this article have been developed through this very cheapness and through new applications. From a limited consumption by black- smiths and druggists thirty years ago it is to-day probably used for more diverse purposes than any article of recent discovery in this coun- try. It is now absolntely indispensable in many manufacturing lines, and no article for certain purposes can take the place of anhydrous borax. One of the most extensive uses of borax that has been developed in recent years is its use as a preservative in the packing of meats for the markets of the world. Another recent application is in the manufac- ture of the excellent cooking utensils which are sold under various names; the agate ware, granite iron ware, iron clad, etc., all receive their durable coating from borax. The potterers use it in large quan- tities, while to the housekeeper it has become, practically, au indispen- sable article. Many minor uses of this remarkable article have grown up, which I can not touch upon here. It may be interesting to give the chemical composition of borax. It is as follows : Boracicacid 36.58 Soda _ 16.25 Bi borate of soda or anhydrous borax .. 52.83 Water crystallization 47. 17 Total 100.00 tlie prismatic borax of commerce. I desire to have added to and made a part of this paper what I sub- mitted to the Senate Finance Committee and found in its report ISTo. 2332, Part 2, Fiftieth Congress, first session, pages 205 to 218 inclusive. J. W. Mather, 48 WaU street, JSTew York. Septembeb 19, 1893. 22 CHEMICALS. CAMPHOR. (Paragraph 15.) The Japan Camphor Oompant, Neto York, September 7, 1893. Sir : We respectfully submit that tlie import duty now charged on relined cauiplior should be reduced, if not entirely removed. This ar- ticle has, during the last few years, considerably increased in cost, and its consumption has, consequently, become much reduced. The pres- ent duty of 4 cents per pound represents about 10 per cent of the value of camphor, and, therefore, a removal of the duty would be a con- siderable gain to the consumer. The total annual consumption of refined camphor in the United States is about 1,500,000 pounds, but so far almost the whole of this has been refined here, and it is only quite lately that imports have been made from Japan of camphor re- fined in that country. The interests we represent are those of a company organized under the laws of the State of New Jersey, and we own plant and machinery in Japan for refining camphor. Eespectfully, yours, Gkibble & Nash. DTESTUFFS. (Paragraph 18.) Saturday, September 16, 1893. STATEMENT OF ME. WHIUM J. MATHESOH, OF 178 FEONT STSEET, NEW YORK CITY. Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen of the Committee: I may say by way of introduction that I have been in the business of importing and manufacturing dyestuft's for about eighteen years. I am presi- dent of William J. Matheson & Co., limited, a corporation with offices and warehouses in New York, Boston, Philadeli^hia, and Providence and works at Long Island City in the port of New York. This company manufactures logwood extracts, sumac, and tannin^ extracts, carmine, indigotine, and indigo extract, and is one of the largest importers of coal-tar dyes. I am vice-president and treasurer of the Albany Coal- Tar Dye and Chemical Company, manufacturers of coal-tar dyes, popularly known as aniline dyes. In the t^\'o tariffs preceding the tariff of 1890 it is provided that alizarin, natural or artificial, should be free. In the tariff of 1890 as it came from the House of Eepresentatives, and as the bill prepared by the Senate was published, alizarin, natural or artiflciiil, stood ex- actly as it had previously, free; but after the conference committee had finished with it, and before the President had signed it, to the sur- prise of every one except one firm of importers, it was found that after the words "alizarin, natural or artificial," were added the words "and dyes commercially known as alizarin yellow, alizarin orange, aliza- rin green, alizarin blue, alizarin brown, alizarin black." Now ali- zarin blue, alizarin black, alizarin green, etc., are coal-tar dyes, and are simply called alizarin dyes for "commercial and tariff" purposes. DYKSTUFFS. 26 As ati importer I am engaged in importing other coal tar dyes known as diamine red, diamine yellow, diamine blue, diamine green, dia- mine orange, diamine black, diamine violet, diamine brown not pro- duced in this country nor likely to be produced in this country, as I liold the patents for them here. My point is that the above two classes of coal-tar dyes, differing only in being separate classes of coal-tar dyes, should be treated alike, both free or both taxed. There is ob- viously no propriety in basing a discrimination with respect to them on the commercial name. The revenue derived from either of these two classes of dyes, if they paid the regular duty of coal-tar dyes, is insig- nificant. That from the diamine dyes does not exceed $11,000. I contend that if the coal tar dyes, commercially known as alizarin blue, alizarin green, etc., are to be admitted fVee, then the coal-tar dyes, commercially known as diamine red, diaiuine yellow, diamine green, diamine orange, diamine black, diamire blae, diamine violet, diamine brown should also be admitted free. Ooal-tar dyes at present pay a duty of 35 per cent ad valorem. The Albany Coal-Tar Dye and Chemical Company I represent is one of the five companies manufacturing coal-tar dyes in this country. We request that all raw material, that is, all coal-tar products not colors or dyes, designed for use in the manufacture of coal-tar colors or dyes, be put on the free list, as per Mr. Tracey's bill, H. E. 167 (they now pay 20 per cent ad valorem). Coal-tar colors or dyes not otherwise specially provided for, now paying 35 per cent ad valorem, could then be reduced to 25 per cent ad valorem without crippling this industry here. The only raw materials for coal-tar colors or dyes now on the free list are aniline oil and arseniate of aniline, which products are used in the manufacture of coal-tar dyes known as soluble and alkali blues and fuchsine or magenta, and the full duty of 35 per cent has been sufficient to enormously increase the manufacture of them here. I represent the feeling of the entire body of manufacturers of dye- wood extracts when I state we are coi: specific duty as is now in operation in a return to an ad valorem duty, and ^ cent ad valorem on all dyewood extia of seven-eighths of a cent per pound, a: extracts of sumac and extracts of bar] as are commonly used for tanning or provided for, in place of the present i commercially known as hematin, 25 unenumerated and now quite largely n of numerous disputes as to classiflcati( To recapitulate, I request that the c known as diamine red, diamine yellow diamine black, diamine blue, diamine the free list, or else coal-tar colors c yellow, alizarin orange, alizarin greei alizarin black be stricken from the 1 wood extracts and other dyewoods be a cent per pound to 12.i per cent ad v sumac, extract of bark, etc., be 25 per ci duty. Hematin, or dyes commercial cent ad valorem; that Mr. Tracey's b terial for coal-tar colors or dyes, be e 24 CHEMICALS. coal-tar colors or dyes not otherwise especially provided for be reduced from 35 per cent ad valorem to 25 per cent ad valorem. Mr. Turner. Is that word used in the classification? Mr. Matheson. ISTo, sir; this class of dyes is parallel with the dyes known as alizarin blue, alizarin black, alizarin green, etc., made from coal tar. The Chairman. What is alizarin assistant? Mr. Matheson. It is a sulphated oil; it is an oil treated with sul- phuric acid, neutralized and used in developing and dyeing alizarin colors. It is artificial alizarin. This artificial alizarin should not be confounded with the dyes I have described here as dyes which are com- mercially known as alizarin blue, alizarin brown, alizarin black, etc., which are not, properly speaking, alizarin dyes, but the next class of coal-tar dyes, and the point I make is that there should be no differ- ence between the two classes of coal-tar dyes. They both should be taxed or both should be admitted free. There is obviously no propriety in admitting one class of coal-tar dyes free on account of the commercial name simply and another class should have to pay a duty of 35 per cent. That is the great injustice to all importers, and especially to our firm of importers, and "we ask that it be corrected. Mr. TuRKEU. Why are these coal-tar products so largely manufac- tured abroad and so little manufactured here: are there patents oq the process 1 Mr. Matheson. This was the case long before the numerous patents for colors came into existence, and the chief reason is the difficulty to manufacture these colors. They call for the highest class of talent. Mr. Turner. It is the question of skill? Mr. Matheson. Tes, sir; they are the most abstruse thing in chem- istry. There have been a great many hundreds of thousand of doUars lost by our manufacturers in making them. Mr. Gear. They are made mainly in Germany ? Mr. Matheson. Tes, sir; they are mostly made there. The aniline dyes were originally discovered in England and they held the suprem- acy for some time until the French took them out of the field, and finally the Germans have gone ahead of everyone. There are five companies in this country manufacturing coal-tar dyes and colors, but they are under a considerable disadvantage on account of the duty on the raw product of 25 per cent, while the finished product is 35 per cent, and the difference between 25 and 35 does not show protection, because it is impossible to get 100 pounds of color from 100 pounds of raw material. Mr. Payne. Are these so-called coal-tar products which you want free of duty manufactured from coal tar? Mr. Matheson. They are by-products of the manufacture of gas. Mr. Payne. Coal tar is ? Mr. Matheson. And the only coal tar that is suitable for the manu- facturing of these coal tar-dyes is a by-product of the old-fashioned way of making gas. And here to-day the methods of making gas have so changed by their making water gas and naptha gas which is being used so largely that the coal-tar product is unfit for that purpose. A great deal of coal tar is imported. Mr. Payne. A great many gas companies manufacture from coal exclusively. Mr. Mathson. They use coal, but a great deal of gas is used of what is known as water gas. Mr. Payne. A great many manufacture from coal and sell their by- pioduct ? COAL-TAE PRODUCTS. 25 Mr. Matheson. Tlieir by-product do not amount to anythnig like wliat it used to be, because there are cargoes and cargoes brougbt over. Mr. Payne. It is not cheap as it used to be when it was all gas 1 Mr. Matheson. A great many cargoes of pitch are imported here and coal tar from London. Mr. Payne. Is this the coal tar which comes from making gas? Mr. Matheson. No; the proportions are made from that. Mr. Panye. Goal tar itself has several hundred different ingredients? Mr. Matheson. Yes, sir; it is a basis of all these dyes, and at present they make it their basis, and they can color every dye that is known. There is no possible color that can not be obtained from dyes made of coal tar today. Mr. Chairman and gentlemeu, I have nothing else to say, and I thank you. ..n J 3 -., COAL-TAK PRODUCTS. (Paiagrapli 19.) TuE H. W. Jaynb Chemical Company, Philadelphia, September 25, 1893. In considering any revision of the tariff we respectfully ask that there be no reduction made in the already low rate of duty of 20 per cent on coal tar iiroducts, not colors or dyes. The manufacture of refined i^roducts from coal tar, for use in medi- cine, dyeing, and the arts generally, is one of large proportion in Eng- land, Germany, and France. This country has been compelled to import all such preparations until a few years ago. Five works are now in operation in the United States, of which we are the only one manufacturing exclusiv"^~ no doubt that with continued protectioi important one in this country. It has a wide-reaching influence, affe tare of colors, explosives, perfumery, ar has revolutionized the coke industry marliet for the by-products regained ovens. Abroad, all the important plai jiurpose, and three works have started i Some of the most important products i here are refined benzoles and coal-tar m tar camphor, carbolic acid (crude and ref ates, acetanilide or antifebrine, oil of m cial oil of wintergreen, nitro and dini toluol, and nitro naphthalene. . We also ask that the present duty cover coal-tar acids of all kinds, wliich ; acids for manufactilring and medicinal j The clause placing acids in general on a number of years ago when the coal-tar of little importance, and was no doubt ii mineral acids. Since that time, howevc ill chemistry, the number of acids manu very large and important. 26 CHEMICALS. The preparation of these acids requires iarge amovmts of jinneral ackls and soda, both of which are more expensive here than abroad, adding materially to the cost of manufacture, while the finished products are free. An instance of this is shown in carbolic acid. Ornde tar oils con- taining carbolic acid are dutiable at 20 per cent. The caustic soda used in extracting the acid is imported from England, paying a duty of 1 cent per pound, about 45 per cent. After passing through a number of com- plicated processes the finished product must be sold in competition with foreign acid entered free. The same is true of most of the other im- portant acids. Under the present rating we have the curious fact that the salts of these acids are protected by 20 per cent. The testing and recognition of such complicated substances as the coal-tar preparations is of extreme difiicalty. It is often impossible to say whether they are acids or not, so that many substances Avhich are dyes, or acids only in name, are admitted free. The difficulties attending such examinations can be readily attested to by the custom-house appraisers. Yery respectfully, youis. The H. W. Jayne Chemical Co., H. W. Jayne, Treasurer. lilCOEICB PASTE. (Paragraph 38.) STATEMENT OF MB. W. W. SKIDDY, OF STAMFORD, CONN. Saturday, September 16, 1893. Mr. Chairman and G-bntlbmbn of the Committee : I have very little to say and will leave really what I have to say largely in the shape of a short petition. We represent, and ^vhen I say we, I refer to Mr. John Leeds who accompanies me, not only our own concern, but we represent largely the trade both in the two lines, namely, the manu- facture of licorice paste, and the manufacture of dyestuff not aniline. Mr. Matheson has been speaking of aniline and that we do pretend to represent here : Gentlemen: We, the undersigned, representing the manufacturers of licorice paste and the product extracts of licorice roots in the United States of America respectfully beg leave to reqne.st that in the proposed revision of the tariff now be- fore your honorable body that the rate of duty on "licorice, extracts of, in paste rolls, or other forms," receive a liberal consideration at your hands. Wc have never asked for a higher duty than we believed and found necessary for our actual pro- tection, and for these reasons we have from time to time recommended reductions in the rate of duty upon this article. The original duty on this article was 10 cents per pound, at which time there was also a duty upon the root. Since the abolition of the duty upon the root (it being the crude material from which the manufactured article is made), and uuder the fostering care of the Government, we have been enabled, through the medium of improvements in machinery, etc., to reduce the cost of production so that in the formation of the tariff bill of 1883 we were enabled to recommend and approve of a reduction to 7J cents per pound upon the manufactured product. Again in the for- mation of thosed tariff changes, which are to distribute the revenue derived from the payment of duties in as fair and equitable a manner as possible, and laws which will permit 10 per cent of the total outiiut of the manufactured article to be imported and thus pro- vide its share of the revenue i^resents a fair argitment for the main- tenance of the present rate of duty on the manufactured article. All American producers are equally interested with me that the present duty on the manufactured article be retained. I have further assumed that it is the spirit of the new tariff to relieve any uunecessary tax on crude material. These points briefly represent the basis of my appeal that the present duty on crude barytes of $1.12 per ton be removed and that the present rates on the manufactured article be maintained. Yours, truly, Geo. H. Buegess. COLORS AKD PAINTS. (Paragraphs 49-01.) Wednesday, Septemher 20, 1803. STATEMENT OF MR J. SEAVER PAGE, EEPRESEWTING F. W. DEVOE AND C. T. REY- NOLDS COMPANY, OF NEW YORK, AND ON BEHALF OF THE COLOR-MAKERS OF THE UNITED STATES. Mr. Chairman AND Gentlemen op the Committee: On behalf of the color-makers of this country I shall have the pleasure of saying- just a few words and to assure you tliey will be very brief About what we want to say we have condensed here in a little brief to present to 38 CHEMICALS. you, and, with your permission, I wisli to read this and say a few words afterwards. To the Committee on Ways and Means, Fifty-third Congress: The manufacturers of colors and paints in the United States respectfully invite the attention of your committee to the following facts and arguments relative to our industry, which is one requiring much skill, large capital, and employing nura- hers of workmen who have to be educated to the art. This industry has heen hampered for many years by the tariff, successive re- visions having brought hut little relief, owing' to the fact that sufficient considera- tion has never been accorded our products in preparing schedules of duties. All of our raw mijterials are highly protected, as may be seen by the following table : Our ravi materials. Eaw materials. Market priie abroad (per pound). Duty. Onicksilver llaskaor containers Yellow prussiate of ijotaah . Bichroraate of potash Bichromate of soda Orange mineral Eed lead Carbonate of lead Acetate of lead Nitrate of lead Litharge Plour of sulphur Coal tar, colors or dyea Gents. i ^ cent. 10 cents -25 per cent. 45 per cent ad valorem. 5 cents— 35 per ct-nt. 3 cents=40 per cent. 3 ccnts=55 per cent. 3^ cents— 7.^ per cent. 3 cents— loi) per cent. 3 cents— 85 per cent, 5J cents. 3 cents— 75 per cent. 3 cents— 109 per cent. 35 per cent. The following practical formulas will illustrate how the present schedule of duties, in connection with those on our raw material, discriminate against our manufactured products : Prnssian, Chinese, laundry, and all fcrrocyanide blues, 100 pounds Prussian potash, yellow, at 5 cents duty $5. 00 100 pounds copperas, at J cent duty 25 20 pounds oil of vitriol, at i cent duty 05 18 pounds bichloride of potash, at 3 cents duty 54 Total duty 5.84 These 238 pounds of chemicals yield but 80 pounds of blue; the remainder of the chemicals are washed out and go to waste. Tliercfore, 80 pounds of blue receive $5.84 protection on the raw material, equal to 7-|^,;5, cents per pound. The duty on foreign blue is 6 cents per pound, being l-l'^u cents per pound discrimination against the domestic color-maker. Chrome yellow. 100 pounds bichromate of potash, at 3 cents duty $3.00 280 pounds acetate of lead, at 5} cents duty 15. 40 Total duty 18.40 These'380 pounds of chemicals yield but 220 pounds of chrome yellow ; the remain- der of the chemicals are washed out and go to waste. Thcrot'ore, 2:10 pounds of chrome yellow receive $18. 40 protection on the raw material, equal to 8 ft,^;, cents pi-r pound. The duty on foreign chrome yellow is ip,l\; cents per pound, being 3 ^^^„ cents per pound discriminatiou against the domestic color-maker. Chrome green, composed of mixtures of the above blues and yellow, is dutiable at 4| cents per pound, or on the average 3 cents per pound discrimination. These examples are simply taken for the comparison of our raw materials against our finished products. To these disadvantages must be added higher cost of labor — 48 to 60 cents per day abroad as agaiust $1.75 to $2 here. Also transportation COLOR AND PAINTS. 39 charges on a large proportion of raw material whicli is lost in the process of manu- facture, the ratio of yield of finished product to material employed being from 1 to 2 or 1 to 3, and even more. To further illustrate our position, we subjoin the following statistics of imports for the years 1888, 1889, 1890, 1891, and 1892: 1888. Blauc fixe Blues (20 per cent) Bluea (6 cents per pound) Chrome yellow (4^ cents per pound) . Quicksilver vermilion {25 per cent) . Vermilion red {12 cents per pound) . Lakes and colors (25 per cent) . pounds. .pounds. do... .pounds. 70, 000 $06, 582 $61, 265 $71, 738 $17, 788 ,001 ,387' $5, 180 '$480,198 173, 772 $30, 906 150, 232 70, 888 $3, 193 $29, 381 $554, 158 20O, 666 153, 253 $52, 037 $186, 489 Showing an increase of imports of finished products under the present tariff due to higher duties on our raw material. We have shown that our industry is actually discriminated against, and we simply ask an adjustment of present schedules, based upon the conditions illustrated, so that we may be able to continue our business. ShouW. the schedules of our raw materials and finished products be revised, we respectfully suggest that it may be on the basis to remove these discriminations. We also pray that when considering our schedule, specific duties may be adopted on all colors. The character of our products is such that it is practically impossible, even by analysis, to determine their true value, while if made specific the tendency to fraud, undervaluation, and mistakes would bo avoided. Now, gentlemen, in brief, tliat is my story, and I desire to call your attention to one or two of those particular points. You notice we come before you, not asking that you shall raise duties, not asking that you shall lower duties. We manufacturers believe very much in this great principle of protection, and we do not know upon what line you are going to make any new schedule ; but we say to you, in common fairness, if any new schedule is arranged, we shall ask that the changes shall be made relative ; that if there is to be any revision of the schedule, or scaling down, let the scaling down be proportionate. I need not tell you how large an industry it is. At least some 50,000 men are em- ployed on relative rates of labor abroad are much less, compared with our own. Some of our friends are just back from Germany, where they had a recent consultation in regard to the color-makers, and the average rate of wages there was from 2 to 2 J and 3 marks, and 3 marks would be about the scale. If I state to you one fact alone — the average rate of duty oh color-makers is $2— you can see we are under a very sharp competition on that question alone. Although we may be able, through our machinery, etc., to overcome a great portion, yet it is im- possible for us, unless these discriminations are raised, to continue. Eaw materials to us are highly protected manufactures to others. We do not ask to break down these duties; but we do ask, in any revision, in any adjustment, that you shall consider the compound article, and not let the component goods get a majority of the protection. Me. Bukrows. As I understand you, right there a horizontal reduc- tion of the materials going into your product and a reduction upon the finished product would work an injury to yout Mr. Page. Yes, sir; that is, relatively. I want to present this cor- rectly. We should respectfully ask not that the present should be changed in any future matter, but if any horizontal reduction should be made, 26, 10, or 5 per cent, that would work an injury to us. Mr. Breckinridge. You mean the compound; these inter-related articles have the higher taxes upon them, which constitute the basis of this finished article? 40 CHEMICALS. Mr. Page. That is tlie fact; those ar.e positive facts. Mr. BRBGiaNRiDGE. Are the&B articles wliieh you consume properly taxed as laetween tlierasel ves ? Mr. Page. ¥o-umean the chemicals'? Mr. Breckinridge. Yes. Mr. Page. I would hardly like to pass judgment upon that. Mr. Breckinribge. I speak of it from your standpoint. Mr. Page. I should class them as reasonably well protected, Mr. Breckinridge. I am not speaking so much of the rate as of the symmetry and proper relationship of the rates. Is theproportion proper ? Mr. Page. I do not know that I can answer that. Mr. Breckinridge. Is there anything incorrect in that? Mr. Page. I could only reply in regard to that by saying that ou: products as a rule get 25 per cent duty and the raw products riui up to 85. Mr. Breckinridge. That is not the point. The point I was in- quiring about can better be answered by those who manufacture what you consume than by yourself? Mr. Page. Oh, yes; I am really not competent enough to pass upon that chemical question. I was trying to avoid answering it be- cause I did not want to antagonize anj-one else's business at all. Mr. Breckinridge. I did not want to lead you into that. I am simply trying to get at the ratio, wliich is entirely difi'erent from the question as to what the rate ought to be; but if we should be able to settle our dispute as to what the rate ought to be, then we still would have to settle the relationship between rates'? Mr. Page. Unfortunately, we are on the top shelf, and it is in tliat interest I am hoinng that you will consider us, because we are way beyond. They get a great lot of chippings before it comes to us. Mr. Breckinridge. At present what is called the raw material is taxed more than the iinished article? Mr. Page. Decidedly. Mr. Breckinridge. And, therefore, the tariff discriminates against. you"? Mr. Page. Yes, sir; doubly and trebly, luy associate says. Mr. Breckinridge. It discriminates against you"? Mr. Page. Heavily against us; yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. IS'ow, upon the basis of the present tax upoTu articles which are consumed, what would you consider an equitable tax upon the article you produce? Mr. Page. If the present rate of duty should, continue on prussiate- of potash and bichromate of potash, we should be ivdyanced 20 per cent., The prussiate of potash is a raw product and the Prussian blue is a. compound product. Mr. Breckinridge. What is the finished; i)roduct?. Mr. Page. The Prussian blue. That shpuld be raised 20 per cent to be relative. Mr. Breckinridge. Twenty per cent above the present rate of duty?.' Mr. Page. Yes, sir; that is it exactly.. Mr. Turner. Were you before the last committee; did you advise the committee which prepaj-ed this bill f Mr. Page. I regret to say that I had not an opportunity of that sort,. but I think some, of our men put in a brief. I think so, but we were not able to get exactly what we ought to have, as will be seen by the; result here. COLOR AND PAINTS. 41 Me. Turner. Was tlie action of the committee in accordance with the recommendation of that brief V Mr. Page. I thinli not. Mr. Turner. It left the two articles tlien Mr. Page. Just the same. Mr. Turner. What embarrassment is there between you and the other x)ortions of the trade in regard to giving advice to the trade? Mr. Page. I know of no embarrassment. Mr. Turner. Ton stated just now that you did not wish to antago- nize somebody? Mr. Page. Oh, the chemical men, because they are our raw products;. They are another industry entirely. Take ^hite lead, for instance;; that is another industry. That is a raw product to us, but it pays ai very high duty. Take linseed oil; that is another raw product to us-.. Mr. Turner. How long since have you felt the ill effects of these discriminating duties of which you have spoken? Mr. Page. I am sorry to say it has been going on every sin.ee the new tariff. Mr. Turner. It has materially affected your business?' Mr. Page. Materially, as this illustration will show. They are in- creasing at- a steady rate of importation. Mr. Turner. How would it suit you to reduce the duties on the raw materials; would that satisfy you or not? Mr. Page. I think that would help us materially. Mr. Turner. Materially is a good Avord. Mr. Hopkins. If we were to reduce the duties on these other artiute^,, what effect would likely be had on the production of the other articles which are finished products ? 'Mr. Page. It is just upon tliat point I wanted to avoid making any criticisms. I do not know enough of their business to wai'rant a state- ment of what it would do, but I must say in frankness that if you reduce them we could stand it. Mr. Hopkins. If you would reduce them and they went out of busi- ness, then you Avould get Mr. Page. I have no desire to do that; I do not think we would be-, better off' if they were out. Mr. Hopkins. The principal trouble with you, if I understand yau, is; the difference of wages you i^ay here and what your competitors, paj abroad ? Mr. Page. Plus the fact our raw materials aie taxed beyondl the finished product. We have still another article which is even more potent in this illustration than what I have given you. Take the arti- cle of quicksilver. We make quicksilver vermilion. It pays a duty of 10 cents a pound. Quicksilver, as known to most all of you, is made abroad. The Spanish Government controls the quicksilver interests, and it is found here in our own country, largely in California. Tliat is about the only place we get the product of quicksilver, bat the quick- silver men, singular enough, will sell for export in our home market at a loAver price than they will sell to us for manufacture and turn into a vermilion. For instance, the price for export; we liave known it to h/^--. at times from $30 to $32.50 a flask, while here for our own manufiictivae- it would be $37 to $38 a flask. Now, this discrimination agaiust ii^is ; very severe, because the quicksilver pays 10 cents and the quicksilver ■ vermilion only pays 12. There is very little difference, especially if the : raw quicksilver could be had cheaper, and the compound jn-oduct does; not get anything like what it should get. Now, if the committee couldi 42 CHEMICALS. find it in their -way to reduce our raw material— that is, the quicksilver— we should have abetter result in the compound product of vermilion. We do not want, as I said before, to antagonize any business, but we are compelled, in justice to ourselves, to call attention to this fact. Mr. Beeckineidge. How many pounds of quicksilver are there in a flask? Mr. Page. Seventy-six and one-half pounds. Mr. Beeckineidge. You have felt the effects of this discrimination of the tariff since the passage of the last bill? Mr. Page. Yes, sir. Mr. Beeckineidge. You stated the imports? Mr. Page. Yes, sir. Mr. Beeckineidge. Are you sure these imports are exactly of the same character of goods which you manufacture? Mr. Page. Yes, sir; from actual comparison. Mr. Beeckineidge. How do you sustain yourself in the output? Mr. Page. That is a surprise to us; when we think how bad it has been, we only wonder how we have lived. I will tell you frankly we have not been doing pretty well, and we are hoping you will help us to do better. Mr. Beeckineidge. I think you are just in what you state. Mr. Page. Those are solemn facts, I am sorry to tell you. Mr. Beeckineidge. You have made expenses and a fair living? Mr. Page. Upon my word, we have had a bottle or two, but not enough to go around. Mr. Beeckineidge. I am glad you have been able to get that. Mr. Page. We do not come here as kickers ; all we ask is that while this apple is being cut that you will see a generous portion comes to our plate. Mr. Beeckineidge. Your position is worse than free trade? Mr. Page. It is worse than that. Mr. BuEEOWS. Did you state the amount of capital iuvested in your industry in the United States; do you know about that? Mr. Page. Yes, sir; the amount we can give you; it is about $20,000,000. Mr. BuEEOWS. How much labor is employed? Mr. Page, fifty thousand laboring people. Mr. Hopkins. Are those men, women, or children? Mr. Page. Men mostly ; we have very few women. Mr. Payne. What article of raw material which you use has advanced since 1890? Mr. Page. Prussiateof potash and bichromate of potash. Mr. Payne. How much ? Mr. Page. I think from 3 to 5 per cent. Mr. Dalzell. Have you, in the statement from which you read given us the rate of duty which prevails now? Mr. Page. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzell. Both the specific and ad valorem equivalents? Mr. Page. My friend tells me I have been entirely too modest in stating the capital in our trade, and he says there is $20,000,000 alone in New York, and that it is really nearer .$50,000,000. I have no desire to swell the figures, but we have a very large industry engaged all over the country, and all the cities almost are represented. Mr. Hopkins. Are these employes as a rule men of families? Mr. Page. Yes, sir. We have been employing many for a great many years, some of them for thirty-odd years. LAMPBLACK. 43 Mr. Burrows. How are these industries distributed over the coun- try'? You have been speaiiing about $20,000,000 capital being invested alone in this business in the city of ]S"ew York and $50,000,000 in the country ? Mr. Page. Illinois, Pennsylvania, Ohio, Michigan, all over the country, generally. My friend thinks I should call your attention to one fur- ther point, and that is, in the prussiate of potash there exists a combina- tion between the American and foreign manufacturers, and thus the consumers of the article pay the foreign rate of duty on a product which comes over to this country, and that discrimination is very severe. In the bichromate of potash I think, perhaps, it is not so sharp a discrimi- nation, but it bears against us. Mr. Payne. Are not you mistaken in stating that the prussiate of potash was increased by the tariif act of 1890 ? Mr. Page. My associate here, who is posted on that, thinks it was. Mr. Payne. The book seems to show you are mistaken. Mr. Page. I am relying upon my friend here, who looks at that; I have an idea it was increased. We have been, however, suffering on this score for some time. Mr. Payne. I guess you will find those rates were not increased on any of your raw materials under that act, but remained as they were under the tariff of 1883. Mr. Hopkins. Your real trouble was, the rate was not increased on the compound i^roduct produced by you. Mr. Page. Mr. Chairman, that about concludes our story. I am very much obliged to you for this opportunity, and we have tried to make our statement as brief as possible, and the papers will show the points there just exactly as we have stated them. liAMPBLACK. (Paragraph 52.) Boston, Mass., August 31, 1893. Sir: I own two factories in Pennsylvania for making carbon black, and respectfully submit to your honorable body my opinions, as follows : First. That a protective tariff tends to arbitrarily interfere with economic production and fosters less advantageous production. Secondly. That it tends in a certain measure to take business out of the hands of men who have made a life study of it, and are calculated by training, experience, and self-interest to handle it in the most eco- nomical manner, and makes it a football for men who, whatever their inherent intellectual ability and legislative training, are mostly mere amateurs in business and must, of necessity, never under the most favorable circumstances have more than a smattering of the vastly complex and difficult matters which they undertake to control. The goods I produce are all i^rotected. My chief raw material, natural gas, is not protected; nevertheless I should look with perfect equaniuiity to seeing the tariff on lampblack iind on lubricating oils removed, and it would cheapen my production if the duty on pig iron and on cooiJerage and on paper were removed. I, therefore, respectfully solicit and iietition that the duties above enumerated be removed, believing that it is for the common welfare 44 Ghemicals. and for my own hidiviclual iuterest, and also for tho interest of the men working for me and receiving, in addition to their regnlar wages, a fixed proportion of tlie profits. Very respectfully, yours, GoDFEEY L. Cabot. P. S. — I am not in favor of the immediate removal of all duties. I am in favor of a gradual removal of all duties that have any considera- ble tendency to foster industries that could not thrive to an equal ex- tent without them; in other words, that interfere with normal conditions as to locality of production. UJGTRAMAEINE. ( Piiragrraph 55. ) STATEMENT OF ME. HENRY MEEZ, OF THE FIRM OF THE HELLER & MEEZ COMPANY, NEW YORK, Mr. Chaieman and Gentlemen of the Committee: I only want to give a few facts in reference to this industry. Ultrainariue was first manufactured here in the year 1870, when the duty of 25 per cent ad valorem was changed to cents per pound specifio. At that time, the first two or three years there was no perceptible difference in the prices noted. The European manufacturers never thought that we would be succe.-5>ful in manufacturing any here, as that manufacture is a very intricate and diflicult one, and they did not think we would make a success here, but after about two or three years we establislied ourselves thoi'oughly and then prices began to go downward. Tlicn the duty was raised from 25 per centum ad val'irem to 6 cents a pound. Prices never changed when we started ; they were the same. We could not get the full prices of the imported, but we got at that time an average price of about 15 or 16 cents a i^ound. Thr<'e years after these prices had been reduced to about 12 cents and to-day it is 9 cents a pound, and taking the average price of blues at that time we are really getting less now than if there was no duty at all on it. But European manufacturers know very well that we can not stand any further reduction. They were expressing themselves, and particularly one who has been here lately, in reference to the affair, stated to me that they are waiting for your action to reduce the duty, and if you did they will make short work of us. Of course, the price would have to be reduced for a certain time and then they would have their harvest. This is the expression of not only one but all; this seems to be the sentiment of all. To show you that it is not that they make the best ultramarine, can be presented by the fact that we have received the highest price for ulti-amarine in Canada where there was no duty at all than we received in New York. It was simply a matter of our being in competition, and as soon as Ave introduced our goods there and had established our trade then the price dropped down in Canada, and ultramarine is sold for less than in Europe, in England, and Germany to-day. We can not get more in Canada than the actual cost, simply because the Eurojjcan manufacturers will not let us have that trade. There is a great difference in the quality of ultramarine, which enables European manufacturers to make a great deal of money on blue, unless competition comes in. Now, for instance, take the ULTRAMARINE. 45 paper blue, the blue used in manufacturing writing paper, book paper, etc. At tiie time we started tlie price of that blue was oL! cents a pound, and to-day an excellent article can be sold for less tlian 15, 12 to 12J cents a pound. Printing blues for calico printing that used to be 30 to 40 cents, to day are 15 to 18 cents a j)ound. Printing bines for printing inks and for lithograrphing, which used to run from 40 cents to $1, and the tinest from $1 to $1.25, are sold to-day for 30 cents, all in consequence of our competition here. We understand that a proposition was made to your body here that there should be an ad valorem duty put on ultramarine. 1 beg you not to do so, because it is absolutely impossible to collect an ad valorem duty on ultramarine justly and properly. There is no man in the cus- tom-house and no man outside of it except he is a manufacturer of ultra- marine, who could tell the exact quality and exact value of ultrama- rine; it is absolutely imijossible. The imx^orter may import ultrama- rine just as he sells it, say for 50 cents a pound for lithographic establishments and he will put it in the custom-house at C, 8, or 10 cents a pound, and the custom-house appraiser would not be able to detect the difference. He could not see what the difference is because there are qualities which he can not discriminate and he can not detect. The industry has become of great importance here now. We have actually employed somewhere about 100 people, and the difference in the labor which we pay and the labor wages paid on the other side is very, very great. Wepay no less than $10 a week. We generally start a mauat $1.50aday,butwecannot keep himniore than two or three weeks bcibrewe have to give them §10, $11 and $12. On the other side they pay 2i and 3 marks a day, which would be 15 to 16 marks a week, or $4 a week against our $10. By makingit that way, i would be piTtting their high average of $4 a week against our low average of $10 a week, and that would be about two and one-half times as much. I do not think it jjossible to have any considerable reduction and compete with the European manufacturer. I can tell you one of our experiences. We liad for some time, by means which I can not explain to you now, accumu- lated a large quantity of ultramarinewhichwecould not sell as largely in the United States as we desired. We tried to sell it elsewhere and -we thought we might possibly sell it in England even at a loss. We sent off' samples and prices to England and found this article, which we sold in the United States at 11 cents a pound, was sold in England at 0^ pence. Of course we were very much gratified at linding that out and we made our office in England so as to get rid of this surplus. As soon as we did this prices were reduced and I did not get more than 9 cents a pound for that, but if I contin ued at that rate and doubled my product and kept my prices up in the United States as they can keep up their prices there, it would pay us instead of making 28,000 and 30,000 to make 40,000 hundred weight. If I get cost price of my product here for exportation and get a reasonable profit here I am ail right, but I can not reduce that and there is what the European calcu- lates upon. Mr. Ebyan. You said you ex]iorted? Mr. Meez. At that time, when we had a large surplus which was by some very peculiar circumstances in the manipulation, we bad a certain blue which we could not dispose of here to an advantage and 1 tried to dispose of it there. Mr. Beyan. Uo you sell in Canada? Mr. Meez. Not, sir, any more. We have here and there a customer who buys a little. 46 CHEMICALS. Mr. Bryan. When did you export it and sell it abroad cheaper than you could have sold it at Lome! Mr. Meez. With the exception of that one lot that was exported there is very little of it we export. We had a fire which burned us out, and we run short of stock, and we could not export any more. Mr. Bryan. You could dispose of it there, but at a declining price? Mr. Merz. Yes, sir; we could have disposed of it here at that time, but we could not have disposed of that quantity we had, that would have been absolutely impossible. Mr. Bryan. So you sold what you could on this market at one price and then exported it and got a lower price! Mr. Merz. That brought a higher price only when it was a small lot — 5 tons ; but we found we could not get a price, and then of course we did not care to export any more, and at the same time the fire con- sumed the whole quantity and did away with it and we could not ex- port any more. I only give that as an illustration how it is that the Europeans would do, you know. We did that then, but we can not do that now, as we have got enough to do to supply our home market. Mr. Bryan. Is there any other factory ! Mr. Merz. There is one more. Mr. Bryan. You employ 100 men? Mr. Merz. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. How many does the other factory employ? Mr. Merz. I suppose about 40. Mr. Bryan. So that this industry employs 140 men in the United States? Mr. Merz. About that. Mr. Bryan. You say your price has been reduced from 16 cents a pound to 10 cents a pound ? Mr. Merz. i said our average price in 1870 and 1871 was that: but now our average price is 9 cents. Mr. Bryan. Does it cost the same to make it now as it did then? Mr. Merz. It costs a little less, because the raw material is a Uttle cheaper; not a great deal. At that time there was a duty of $0 a ton on china clay, and then, afterwards, the duty was reduced to ¥3; but the price on China clay did not change. The cost of soda ash is somewhat less. Mr. Bryan. Your profits are not as great now as when you were selling at 16 cents a pound? Mr. Merz. No, sir; except by making so much more, our plant is so much larger. Our plant is now three times as large as then and the expense a very large one, because it requires an immense buildiug and an immense plant to make an ordinary small quantity. Mr. Bryan. Has your plant been building up as business went along? Mr. Merz. Is has been built up in all these years. We have in- creased the plant from time to time and have made a larger product Mr. Bryan. Let me ask you this question : are you connected in any way with the other firm which manufactures this product? Mr. Merz. No, not at all ; we are on friendly relations, but not other- erwise : we have no business connection. Mr. Bryan. Have you an agreement in regard to selling prices ? Mr. Merz. None at all; no, sir; but there is on the" other side. There is a large combination with the manufacturers in Goruiany and then with those iu England and ]3elgium. I think there are some- where about 12 or 16 who are a close corporation. ULTEAMARINE. 47 Mr. Beyan. You mean in each one of these countries is a combina- tion of all together. Mr. Merz. They are all together, and thus they are really enabled to compete in an effectual way from all points. There is one in Germany, one in England, and one in Austria, and I think one in Belgium, and they are all under one leadership. Mr. Bryan. They ai-e all different associations under one head? Mr. Merz. Yes, sir ; under one head. So, actually, if you want to bay from one man in Grermany you have got to buy from this corpora- tion ; you have got to buy from their agent in New York. Mr. Bryan. You have to iindersell them in Canada in order to com- pete? Mr. Merz. "We have; but, of course, we cannot undersell them now, because it is beyond our capability. Mr. Bryan. But they can not pay the same duty in Canada! Mr. Merz. They do not pay any duty at all there; what we sold in Canada goes from the port of New York. Most of the ultramarine goes to New York as the most convenient port of importation for ultrama- rine. The ultramarine which comes from Hamburg, Bremen, Liverpool, England, and France most all comes via New York to Canada. I wiU furuish you with a table of statistics about the sales. Mr. Turner. Where do you get your raw material? Mr. Merz. We got some material here and some from Europe. Mr. Turner. Which is which? Mr. Merz. We get the greater part of the raw material from Europe. We have not been able to find any clay here that would be a suitable quality for ultramarine, although we are trying all the time to find it. And now we have two or three different qualities of American clays under experiment, seeing what it would do. The soda ash we can not buy, because manufacturers will not sell us any, and we have to buy the English soda ash. We can not get it from Syracuse, and it all comes from England, Belgium, etc. Mr. Breckinridge. Ultramarine is your principal product ? Mr. Merz. Yes, sir; that is right. Mr. Breckinridge. What is the present price of ultramarine? Mr. Merz. I say its average price isa bout 9 cents a pound; but the price varies for different qualities. The highest price we can get for the finest qualities is somewhere about 18 to 19 cents, and as low as 6 and 7 cents. Mr. Breckinridge. When you are selling the best article at 18 and 19 cents what is that article selling for abroad! Mr. Merz. Abroad, that article? I will give you an illustration of it Mr. Breckinridge. I just want the price. Mr. Merz. Well, there is an article, say, 40 cents a pound ; and, say I come in and offer ours at 23 cents ; that foreign article goes to 25, and Mr. Breckinridge. I just want to know the current quotations ! Mr. Merz. They aie genei'ally from 40 to 50 per cent higher than our prices until we can get the trade, and if we find a buyer who wants to buy Mr. Breckinridge. I do not want to get into an argument; I am just asking for the current quotation ? Mr. Mekz. That is about the difference. Mr. Breckinridge. The current market quotation upon different gi'ades is usually 40 to 50 per cent higher than yours! 48 CHEMICALS. llr. Meez. Yes, sir; they are usually quoted in the open market at 15 cents. Mr. Beeckinetdgb. I understand, then, that the statement is that Eusually the price is 40 or 50 per cent higher abroad than here? Mr. Merz. Yes, sir; the foreign ultramarine is charged so much 'more than ours until we make a competition in a certain quality and ■then prices come down. Mr. Beeckineidge. I am not seeking to develop an argument; I "was simply asking you for a few elementary facts, merely market facts. Mr. Dudley. We will include that in the statement; we will have that put in it. Mr. Beeckineidge. I understand you to say, as a rule, these finer qualities of ultramarine sell for a great deal more abroad than in America"? Mr. Meez. I would have to qualify my answer, or else the answer may mislead you. They have higher selling prices in Europe than here, that is, they sell at higher piiees than here, but when those goods come here and they can not sell on account of competition the price goes down and we are cut out. Mr. Beeckineidge. You are now explaining what I am not asking you. Xow, in the lower grades of ultramarine, what is the usual diifer- euce in the price between Europe and this country ? Mr. Meez. I should think somewhere between 5 and 10 per cent higher than here. I will give you a little illustration about the Eng- lish blue Mr. Beeckineidge. I beg you not to go into an argvinient on the subject, I simply wanted to know the elementary market facts. What are the x)rincipal articles you use in the manufacture of ultramarine? Mr. Meez. There are paints Mr. Beeckineidge. Such as what"? Mr. Meez. I mean general paints for tinting, also blue that is used in paper manufacture. Mr. Beeckineidge. I did not ask what it is used for, I asked what .you used in making this article? Mr. Meez. We use China clay, soda ash, brimstone, silica, and resin. Mr. Beeckineidge. What are the principal ingredients? Mr. Meez. The China clay, the soda ash, and the brimstone are the principal ones. Mr. Beeckineidge. There are three or four articles. What per cent of your material is soda ash, estimated in the cost"? Mr. Meez. I can not tell you exactly in regard to the cost of material. I do not know exactly, as the cost of soda ash varies. Mr. Beeckineidge. One moment, as I see you have not the drift of my question. If you have an order for a given amount of ultramarine say $100,000 w-orth, and you are gathering now yourmaterial outof which to make that, you would expend a certain amount on material to make that article. ISTow what per cent of that money which you expend for material would be expended for soda ash? Mr. ]\IEEZ. That I could not tell exactly now. I simply figure it this way. I use so much soda ash. I have not got that in my mind now what the soda ash alone would be, I could only tell you about 135 or 30 per cent of the cost of the ultramarine is raw material. Mr. Beeckineidge. Have you figured out what per cent of that .30 per cent each of the ingredients composing the raw material is? Mr. Meez. That would be absolutely impossible for me to figure now in my mind because I use so much raw material — we use two and a. ULTRAMARINE. 49 half times as much raw material, audto figure that out would be very hard. Mr. Breckinhidge. Do you use more raw material Mr. Merz. We use about more than double the quantity. Mr. Breckinridge. What is your point of comparison; you use more raw material than what "J Mr. Mebz. We use more ra-sv material in pounds than we get ultra- marine. We would for instance use about 250 pounds of raw material to get 100 pounds of ultramarine. Mr. Breckinridge. That has nothing to do with my question. I want to know what per cent of each one of these articles makes the total ? Mr. Merz. I have gone over that with our chemist, but you must excuse me now from answering it. Mr. Breckinridge. Which is your most imiiortant raw material? Mr. Merz. Tliey are all important. I can not make ultramarine without China clay, nor without soda ash, nor without brimstone. Mr. Breckinridge. I beg your pardon. I am not asking what it is chemically, or any chemical question, but I want to know which is commercially the most important, which one do you buy the largest of, and which one yon understand to be the most important? Mr. Merz. We pay the most for soda ash. Mr. Breckinridge. Which is the next most important? Mr. Mbhz. The next, I think, is the brimstone. Mr. Breckinridge. And then the next? Mr. Merz. China clay. Mr. Breckinridge. How much more important is the soda ash than the brimstone'? Mr. Merz. In the imce? Mr. Breckinrtdge. As to the amount you pay. Mr. Merz. We buy all of these about even amounts. They are used so close to each other in the compounding of ultramarine it is hardly worth while Mr. Breckinridge. If you keep account of what you spend for soda ash, brimstone and— what is the other article? Mr. Merz. China clay. Mr. Breckinridge. Your expenditure for one would be as much as the expenditure for the other? Mr. Merz. No, I say, it is the quantities. Mr. Breckinridge. I am speaking of it commercially. Mr. Merz. Commercially soda ash is the most important, and finan- cially it is the most important, because we pay the highest price for it. Mr. Breckinridge. You pay more money for soda ash than any other raw material ? Mr. Merz. We buy about the same quantity, not the same amount in money. Mr. Breckinridge. 1 am speaking of it commercially. I have re- peated it now about three or four times. Do you pay more money for soda ash than bri mstou e ? Mr. Merz. Yes, sir ; we i)ay more money than for brimstone, because the price of soda ash is higher than the price for brimstone. Mr. Breckinridge. I am not going into the price of either soda ash or brimstone, because one miglit be much less per jjound and the other might be more per pound, and your expenditure might be much larger for the one than the other. How much do you pay, not ior soda ash, but how miich of the total amount of money do you pay T H 4 50 CHEMICALS. Mr. Meez. We buy about 600 tons of soda ash. Mr. Breckinridge. How mucli money! Mr. Merz. Six Mmdred tons of sodii ash is about cent and a lialf, cent and three-quarters a pound. Mr. Gear. About $18,000 or .|20,0001 Mr. Merz. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. How much brimstone do you buy a year? Mr. Merz. About 600 tons. Mr. Breckinridge. How much do you pay for that? Mr. Merz. That varies. I thiuk the average price is $20 a ton. It is less now, but the average price is about that. Mr. Breckinridge. That is near ejaough. What else do you buy! Mr. Merz. Cliina clay. Mr. Breckinridge. How much do you pay for china clayl Mr. Merz. We pay $i;:i.50 to $14 a ton. Mr. Breckinridge. How many tons do you buy! Mr. Merz. Also about COO. Mr. Breckinridge. Those are the three chief materials'? Mr. Merz. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. You have no other material on which you have to spend much money! Mr, Merz. Yes, sir; we buy considerable of silica, and that we buy in this country. Mr. Breckinridge. How much do yom buy! Mr. ilERZ. The quantity of silica used varies with every quality of ultramarine made. Mr. Breckinridge. You do not iiuow how much silica you buy a year ! Mv. Merz. No; 1 can not tell you what I buy, but I buy when a man comes and says he has fine quality. I might take .50 or 100 tons; It is put aside, because I think I may be too busy and I do not know when I Avill get a chance to buy that quality again. It is nscd, but I do not know exactly how much it is during the year. That is the chemist's business. j\Ir. Breckinridge. You do not know how jnuch is used! Mr. Merz. No, sir; I could not tell you that exactly. Mr. Breckinridge. When you say 50 tons and 100 tons I judge that would last you a long time? Mr. Merz. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. You use a great deal less than that in a year! Mr. Merz. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. How much do you have to give on an average for a ton of silica! Mr. Merz. We pay from .f 3.5 to $40 a ton. Mr. Breckinridge. Where does that come from? ^Ir. Merz. That comes from the United States. Mr. Breckinridge. You get all of your silica from the United States? i\lr. Merz. Y'es, sir. Mr. Breckinridge, What other material do you use! Mr, Merz. Ilesiu. Mr. Breckinridge, Do you get your resin here! Mr. Merz, Ves, sir. Mr. Breckinkidgb. How many tons of resin do you use a year! Mr jMerz. We use resin for other purposes, so I do not know exactly what we would use for ultramarine, and I could not tell. I generally ULTRA.MARINE. 51 buy two or three hundred barrels of reshi and the chemist takes as mucli as he wants of it. Mr. Breckinridge. I take it then that the resin is not a very im- portant factor. Mr. Meez. No, sir; it's a cheap article and is not used to a great ex- tent. Mr. Breckinridge. What other important article do you use to any large extent '? Mr. Merz. We do not use anything to any large extent. Mr. Breckinridge. Of course I do not want to go into any minor items. Mr. Merz. We do not use anything else. Mr. Breckinridge. To whom do you sell this ultramarine! Mr. Merz. To the paint people, to the calico people, and printing men, lithographers, and all that sort of people. Mr. Breckinridge, llow much is manufactured in this country in a year? Mr. Merz. I think the whole thing is about 2,800 cwt. ]!Tew York, ScpemUr 18, 1893. Ultramarine blue was first manufactured in this country in 1870, when the duty was changed from an ad valorem of 25 per cent to a specific duty of C cents per ijound. TJie average selling price remained for several years about the same as before, and was on the qualities we manufactured 15 to IG cents per pound. As soon as our success was established the European manufacturers reduced the prices and we had to sell at about 12 cents per pound, now at 9 cents per pound, though we are now making better and higher grades than at our start, with the prospect of still lower prices under the pressure of the European combination which embraces the most effective concerns in Germany, England, France, and Belgium. The decline in prices is only due to our competition as proved by the fact that the higher qualities of ultramarines which we did not make at the start only dropped in price when we came into competi- tion. Ultramarine used by paper-makers sold for 28 to 30 cents per pound is now sold for from 12 to 15 cents per x^ound. Ultramarine, for calico printers and cotton finishers, dropped from 24 and 28 cents per pound to 12 and 15 cents. Ultramarine, for printing and lithographers' inks, dropped from 40 cents to $1 per pound to 10 to 25 cents per pound. In Canada, where ultramarine was entered free, it was sold at higher prices than in this country, and has now come down below European prices since and on account of our comxietition. Of course exportation had to be sto])ped. In England, with ultramarine on the free list, we find ])rices on an average higher than here, the finer grades being from 4 to 5 cents per pound higher. The raw material used in manufacturing ultramarine blue is china clay, soda ash, brimstone, silica, and rosin. For china clay we pay $3 per ton duty. For soda ash we pay one- fourth cent per pound. Brimstone is free. Of these three materials we use about equal quantities and get about 50 per cent ultramarine from the raw material consumed. The duty on these materials will cost us 25 cents per hundredweight ultramarine. In this respect we are not much worse olf than the 52 CHEMICALS. European manufacturers; but as to labor the Europeans are far better situated. We pay our help from $9 to $12 per week; the Europeans pay from 15 marks, or about $3.75 per week, and makiug a very liberal allow- ance, the difference will be at least $G per Aveck, nnd amounts to nearly $30,000 in our factories, and in the ultramarine department alone fully $20,000. The consumption of ultramarine is about 31,000 cwt. per annum, of which 28,000 is made here and about 6,000 cwt. is imported. If we compute the average reduction, caused by our competition, only 5 cents per pound (which is a very illiberal estimate) the savings of the American consumer amounts to at least one and one-half millions of dollars for the past ten years. The German ultramarine combination expect a lower duty and thus take chances to drive us out of business by a sharp temporary reduction, and having succeeded in their attempt, will control the ultiamari:ie market of the whole world. We therefore petition your honorable committee not to make any changes on the duty of ultramarine jeopardizing the interest of this industry. The Heller & Merz Co,, Henry Merz, Treasurer. PHOSPHOEtTS. (Paragrapli 08.) Tuesday, Se^jfemler 12, 1803. STATEMENT OF ME. PENEOSE AILEH, EEPEESENTrSfG THE AMESICAN MANTJFAC- TOEEES OF PHOSPEOEUS. Mr. Allen read a paper as follows : September 11, 1893. To the Ways and Means Committee of the United ^States House of Repre- sentatives : Wo respectfully request that the present duty of 20 cents per pound be allowed to remain on phosphorus. As we stated in our testimony before the Committee on Ways and ]\Ieans and the Senate Finance Committee of tlie Fifty-first Congress (pages 377 to 380 of tlje printed hearings), the history of phosphorus in tliis country is: Until about twenty-five years ago it was not manufactured in this country and was selling from England at $1.50 to $1.20 per pound, and was, we thiidv, entirely free of duty. A duty of 20 ])er cent was then put on, and a plant was erected in this country, costijig over $100,000. As soon as the American works PPIOSPHORUS. 53 were fairly under way English pLosphorns was reduced to 75 cents per pouud, delivered at New York. Tliis ruined and closed tlie American works, and the price of Englisli phosphorus was advanced to $1.10 per pound. The American works stood idle several years, were finally bought out, were started up, and English phosphorus again dropped' to 75 cents. It was found that a moderate profit could be made at the works at this price by careful management, and they continued about three years, during which time another large ])lant was erected in this country and, we think, a third one nearly completed. The English manufacturers now evidently decided to wipe out the industry here, and sold phosphorus at less than 50 cents per pound, delivered at New York. This closed the American works, and they remained closed nearly twelve years, until the McKinley bill increased the duty. During that interval phosphorus sold here at about 75 cents per pouud. The European manufacture is a monopoly, having been entirely con- trolled by one house for thirty years or more. The duty was increased by the McKinley bill from 10 cents per pound to 20 cents per pound. The result has been that phosphorus has been sold by the United States manufacturers at less price than it ever before sold in this country and the United States works are produ- ■cing more than two-thirds of the American consumption. The works in this country have been increased to four times their capacity pre- vious to the passage of the McKinley bill, at which time they weie standing idle. If the duty is reduced the United States mauufacturers must cloi^e their works on the expiration of present contracts, as history will undoubtedly repeat itself, namely, the English monopoly will undersell us until the United States works are closed and our trained laborers scattered, when the price will be advanced and American consumers will pay very much more than they have paid since the McKinley tariff bill enabled us to take contracts and enlarge our plants. We believe that the consumers appreciate this and Avisli the present duty to remain. All materials entering into the manufacture of phosphorus are pro- duced in this country ; the largest item is labor. Very respectfully, yours, J. J. Allen's Sons. Eancocas, Burlinoton Coitntt, N. J., Svpiemhcr G, 1893. To the Honorable Committee of Ways and Means, House of Representatives, Washington, 1). G. : We, the undersigned, are employed in the phosphorus works at E.an- cocas, N. J., and have been informed that an effort is being made by the foreign manufacturers to allow phosphorus to come into this country free of duty. 54 CHEMICALS. Tour petitioners therefore respectfully pray tliat you will not remove the present duty from phosphorus, as under that duty this works has been rebuilt and has run continuously on full time, whereas for twelve years previous they had been closed. During the time that tliese Avorks have been running the selling price of phosphorus in this coun- try has beeuless than when it was furnished by the foreign manufac- turers. We are workmen, depending upon our wages for the sujiport of our- selves and our families, and many of us voted the Democratic ticket at the last election, and we are credibly informed, and do believe, that the removal of the duty from phosphorus would close these works at the exiuration of the firm's current contracts for pliosphorus. Therefore, we do most humbly pray that your honoroble committee will allow the jjreseut duty on phosphoriis to remain. Harrisou Asay, George PI. Ellis, and others. DISTILI.BD Olli. (Faragrapli 76.) United Oil Company, Nciv Yorli, September 33, 1893. SlE: The Standard Oil companies, and the companies that they directly and indirectly control, are the makers of 98 per cent of all of the pale mineral and lubricating oils from tar used in these States. They control about 95 per cent of all other oils on tlie eastern seaboard as well as the western. JSTo pale mineral oil is sold to our knowledge except that which is made by them there. They have successfully destroyed all competition in the manufacturing of this article. We would respectfully ask you, in the interest of all users of machines, from the farmers to the manufacturers, who are the greatest users of this oil, to put such a mineral lubricating oil, either red or yellow in color, with specific gravity 850 or over, on the free list. Further details or description of oil can be given your committee if desired. The danger of competition with the Standard companies is too great for any concern to venture in it, as they control such a large iiercentnge of the tar products and whose business methods are such that they would willingly lose money to ruin such a comj)etitor. Their policy allows them to sell Englishmen, Frenchmen, and other nations a better grade of this oil at 2 cents per gallon under the rela- tive American price here. Why should Americans not enjoy what for- eigners have been for years enjoying? Article 671 in the present tariff admits mineral or paraffin wax free. This should be continued. On grease, for soap making, wire drawing, or leather dressing, are CHLORAL HYDRATE. 55 admitted free, but tliickened rape oil, or other seed oils that are thick- ened, are not so admitted, which are used here largely to make our mineral oil saponify, or soap, and for no other reason or puri)ose. We think it is an injustice to have these thickened oils wliich require American labor to work up, and which enable the American users of lubricating oils to purchase a better article from their use for less money and a saving to their machinery. We would respectfully ask you to include all blown or thickeiied rape seed oil and other thickened seed oils on the free list in your pro- posed new tariff. Yoiu's, truly, United On- Company, F. G. Colby, President. CHLORAIi HYDRATE. (Paragrnpli 76.) St. Lotjis, September 20, 1893. We would respectfully ask that chloral hydrate be placed iipon the free list in the forthcoming tariff bill. All of the reasons for putting quinine on the free list are applicable to chloral hydrate. Chloral hydrate is a chemical compound, and properly a raw mate- rial which is used principally in the preparation of remedies for insom- nia, delirium, and nervous diseases, and therefore should be put upon the free list. It is not manufactured in the United States, except in an experimental way. Prior to the act of 1890 it was dutiable at 25 per cent ad valorem, but under that act its classification has not been accurately determined, the Treasury Department and the United States courts holding it to be dutiable at 25 per cent ad valoreni and the Board of United States Appraisers prior to and subsequent to the de- cisions of the courts holding it to be dutiable at 50 cents per pound, which is equal to 100 per cent ad valorem. A perusal of the appended opinions of the United States court, Treasury Department, and Board of Appraisers, will give the reader a description of the nature of chloral hydrate and its uses, as well as an understanding of the unfortunate contentions concerning its classifica- tion which compel the importer to appeal to the courts upon each im- l)ortation. The latter can be obviated by mentioning chloral hydrate by name in tlie forthcoming tariff bill. Asking a consideration of this subject we are, respectfully, Yours, truly, Battle & Co., Chemists^ Corporation, J. M. Battle, Secretary and Treasurer. 56 CHEMICALS. Saturday, September 9, 1S93. SACCHARINE. (Paragraph 7G.) STATEMENT OF LOUIS C. KAEGENEB. Mr. CnArRMAN and Gentlemen oe the Committee: I have been reqiiested by Messrs. Falkberg, Lees & Co., of Germany, who are manufacturers of saccharine, to appear and protest against the tariff, which is prohibitory, practically, upon the article produced by them, under paragraph 76 of the present tariff bill. This article was taxed 25 per cent, which amounts to something like from $2.50 to $3 a pound. Saccharine is coal-tar sugar. It is more exactly termed a derivative from benzoic acid. Benzoic acid is on the free list. The reason why we believe that this tariff ought to be removed is that, for all practical purposes, it is raw material, and the duty upon it pre- vents its employment in many domestic industries, which is of more or less importance in aiding and assisting manufactories than the amount collected as duty. Mr. TuRNEE. Will you enumerate those domestic uses ? Mr. Raegenee. Yes, sir; this duty is mainly prohibitive, because this article does not come into competition with any home industry. On the other hand, if the duty were lowered, it is to be presumed, consumption would increase, and, in that case, would produce a revenue. Consequently, it is neither a protective tariff — for this ar- ticle is not in competition with any similar industry — nor is it a tariff for revenue, for it is prohibitive, prevents consumption, and produces no revenue. Mr. McMiLLiN. At what price does the article sell in the market? Mr. Eabgenee. It is worth $12 a pound. It is three hundred to five hundred times sweeter than sugar. The particular substance sells at $12 a pound, and the substance, called, I believe, refined saccharine, is five hundred times sweeter than sugar. It is taxed, under para- graph 76 of the present bill, as a chemical compound; but I believe a jirotest has lately been made, and it is a question as to whether it is particularly classified or whether or not it ought to come in under the head of coal tar and pay 25 per cent. In the other bill it was 20 per cent. There is another reason why this high tariff is unnecessary and falls heavily upon the consumer, and that is because it is patented in the United States. It is protected by very strong patents. The patent upon it might be called a foundation patent, because from its very nature, it being a new creation, patents of that kind are generally called foundation patents. That is the reason why this article cannot be produced in this country. If gentlemen ask me for what purposes this article can be used, I will say it can be used for almost all purposes for which sugar can be used, and it can be used for a great many purposes for which sugar can not be used — I mean cane sugar. It is an antiseptic, and is the only sweetening substance which has not fermentation. It is used in medicine and in the pharmacopoeia. It is very valuable in diabetes and a great many other diseases. It can be used in con- nection with alkaloids, such as quinine, in which it deadens the bitter taste quickly, readily, and cheaply. SACCHARINE. 57 Mr. Turner. Does it substantially subserve tlie same inirnose in dietetics? Mr. Eaegener. Yes, sir : it is not injurious. In several works Avliicli I have before me it is stated that the substance is somewhat iu the nature of a spice, like salt and pepper. It is particularly useful in con- nection with preserving fruits, and to some extent useful iu manufac- turing dye bleaches; is generally used in soft drinks, such, as soda water and ginger ale. It is used in minute quantities and does not give the sirupy taste, and for that reason is very useful. It prevents fermentation and acts as a preserve. It is used much iu that way. Upon the question as to whether or not it is harmful in its nature, there are a great many authorities which I have collected from eminent sources all over the world who testify to its usefulness as a medicine a.nd as to its harmlessness in every respect. It is particularly well known as a remedy in case of diabetes, for it goes through the system readily and easily. The use to which it might be put in this country is the sweetening of glucose. In the proportion which I have mentioned it sweetens glucose in quantities of three fourths of a pound of saccharine to a thousand pounds of glucose. In other words, three-fourths of a pound of it in connection with a thousand pounds of glucose would make g;lucose as sweet as cane sugar. Inasmuch as cane sugar is substan- tially on the free list, and beet sugar likewise, this might be added to the home industry (in this country in the farming industry)— by the removal of the duty from saccharine. The addition of saccharine to glucose would increase the price of glucose very imperceptably, per- haps only three-fifths of a cent a pound. I have not figured that out, but I take it for granted that, if there was no duty upon saccharine, glucose could be used as a sweetening by the introduction of sac- charine, and the price of glucose thereby would be increased only three- fifths of a cent a pound. The United States letters patent, under which this substance is pro- tected, were granted on June 2, 1885, to Staunton Falkberg, who was a resident of this country and was an assistant professor at the Johns Hopkins University, Baltimore. It being impracticable to make this in this country, he, having wealthy relatives abroad, who were incUned to put money into it for exploitation, caused to be started in the neigh- borhood of Magdeberg a plant for making it, from which place it is exported. This has been on the market now about seven years. It is used in England in large quantities, and also in larger quantities throughout the world where there is no tariff of this nature. I do not think it will be necessary for me to occupy the attention of the committee any longer, further than to sum up, as well as I can, by saying that the tariff is not a protective one. This article absolutely does not compete with any domestic industry in this country. It is not a tariff for revenue, because the tariff is as high as $2.50 to $3 a pound, which makes it prohibitive and i^roduces no revenue. Therefore Con- gress can put it absolutely upon the free list. Oertainly.it should be reduced, because then it would be possibly productive of some revenue. I ask the permission of the committee to reduce my remarks, sub- stantially, to writing, and also to send to the committee a little pamphlet which has been printed upon this subject in the English language. Saccharine is exhibited in Chicago, and for many years has been before the world in use in numerous articles of scientific moment, which I have here before me. I have here a sample flask, which contains saccharine tablets, which are supposed to be three hundred times aa ^^ CHEMICALS. sweet as sugar; andone of tliese dropped into a glass of water will illus- trate what I have said. Mr. Beeckinbidcje. Vou speak of saccharine being used increas- ing the price of glucose about three-flftlis of a cent a pound ; tliat would be increasing the price of the glucose in that improved condition? Mr. Eaegener. Exactly: it would be sweetening it, or saccharin- izing it, at a cost of about three-fifths of a cent a pound. It would sweeten the glucose without increasing its bulk, as would be the case if sugar were added. Mr. Beeckineidge. This represents the increased cost of the sweet- ened glucose. Mr. Eaegenee. Yes, sir. Mr. Beeckineidge. I understand you to say, generally, that if used in this way it would cause an increased consumption of glucose and an enlarged market. Mr. Eaegenee. Yes, sir: you can see the additional advantage. It is three hundred times sweeter than sugar and it takes three-fourths of a pound to sweeten a tliousand pounds of glucose, it requiring 225 pounds of sugar to produce the same result. Even if the price were the same it would be no advantage to increase the bulk; and that would be in favor of the saccharine. For certain purposes, such as candy manufacturing, where it is essential to have a bulky sweetening substance, saccharine could not take the place of cane sugar, because it is necessary to have a sweetening substance which also has bulk. Mr. Payne. In 225 pounds of sugar there would be a certain amount of nutriment. Mr. liAEGENBE. Certainly. Mr. Payne. In the saccharine there would not be nutriment? Mr. Eaegenee. No, sir; it is sijnply a spice, but it would be an infinitesimal quantity — a thousand pounds of glucose to three-fourths of a pound of saccharine. Mr. Payne. A thousand pounds of glucose would be converted into so many pounds of sugar. Mr. Eaegenee. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. It would not add to the bulk. Mr. Eaegenee. No, not perceptibly. Mr. Payne. Do you consider it cheaper? Mr. Eaegenee. It is cheaper. Mr. Payne. You say it cost $9 a pound. Mr. Eaegenee. It costs $12 a pound. Mr. TuENEB. You can buy 225 pounds of raw cane sugar for very much less money than that. Mr. Eaegenee. The market price is about 5 cents a pound. Mr. Tuenee. That is for refined sugar. I suppose you would use a low grade of sugar. Mr. Eaegenee. That would be all the more an argument why it would not come in contact with cane sugar. Mr. Tuenee. When you add glucose to sugar you get so much more product. Mr. Eaegenee. That would be a reason why they do not compete with cane sugar. Mr. Tuenee. I think it would ; cane sugar is cheaper. Mr. Eaegenee. It would not compete with cane sugar. Mr. Payne. It would not be used in glucose, then? Mr. Eaegenee. Therefore it would do no harm. It would be prac- MINERAL SALTS. 59 tical to use it to exjjand the sale of glucose if it were cheaper in price. If the duty were reduced it would, perhaps, be much cheaper — $5 or $6. Mr. Payne. It is now worth $12? Mr. Rae©enee. If the duty were taken off it would bring the price down to $9. It would then be added at about the same price as sugar. Mr. Payne. You say it is not manufactured in this country because there are patents on it? Mr. Eaegener. It could not be manufactured here. Mr. Payne. They could manufacture it here except for the patents'? Mr. Eaegener. I doubt not; and, for the same reason, a great many coal-tar colors could be manufactirred in this country because of the raw material which can be obtained cheaper on the other side ; that is, the residuum, it seems, can be obtained cheaper on the other side. For that reason most of the coal-tar products are made on the other side. Mr. Payne. If the raw material were free for how much could it be made? ]Mr. Eaegener. Benzoic acid is free, for it is a derivative product, and I said it was in the nature of a raw material, because, by itself, saccharine can not be used. It can not be used for any purpose except in connection with another substance. A great many coal-tar colors are now on the free list, and, for that reason, are not and can not be produced here. They are very necessary for dyeing purposes, and are beneficial in the manufacture of dyers' and weavers' goods. This thing ought to come in free also, for the reason that it is useful for medicine. Tlie revenue is infinitesimally small, and if the committee does not tbink that it should be entirely free then, if you desire to produce a revenue from it, yoTi certainly ought to lower the tariff. Mr. Payne. It comes in under the head of alkaloids. Mr. Eaegener. Yes, sir. Mr. McMillan. Could you make a calculation as to what rate would enable it to come in and produce a revenue? Mr. Eaegener. No, sir ; I have not the statistics here. If the com- mittee will permit me to file a brief paper I will do so, and further particulars may be found in this little book, which I will leave with you. Mr. Turner. Have you more than one copy of that pamphlet? Mr. Eaegener. Noj I will send several. I thank you for your at- tention. MINERAL SALTS. (Paragraph 76.) STATEMENT OF MB. W. W. DUDLEY, ATTOENEY, WASHINGTON, D. C. Monday, September 18, 1893. Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen of the Committee: First, I wish to thank you for tlie courtesy in giving me a half hour of your valuable time at the close of your hearings. I shall endeavor to be as brief as possible, and shall not consume more than half of the time allowed. I desire to be heard first upon the question of the duties arising under paragraph 76 of the present and existing law found on paj^e 4 of the printed pamphlet, and which comes under the head of " Products or preparations known as the alkalies, alkaloids, distilled oils, essen- tial oils, expressed oils, rendered oils, and all combinations of the fore- GO CHEMICALS. going, and all chemical compounds and salts, not specially provided for in this act, 25 per centum ad valorem." Now, I wish to call attention to the free list, paragraph 650, and my remarks are addressed to mineral salts, which are a product of the mineral waters which are admitted free by section 650 of tbe act which is as follows: " Mineral waters, all not artificial." Mineral waters which areadmitted free are those from specified springs io foreign countries which have no duplicates in their analyses in this country. All bottles and cases and paclcing in which these waters are imported pay a duty, but waters do not. Tlie medicinal salts which are produced by evaporation of these waters at the places where they are found at the springs" are subject to a duty of 25 per cent ad valorem. The importers of this article contend that this is an un.jast discrimination, as the salts themselves are natural products of the spring as much as mineral water tliere. They are not sophisticated, they are not adulter- ated, nor is any admixture of any foreign substance put in them what- ever. Therefore they are entitled to admission free as not being in comx)etition with any product of this country whatever. Moreover, they are in their way a specific for certain diseases. I wish to call your attention sharply to thefact duty is laid upon themedicinalproduct of a spring, say in Germany, for instance, wliile the water which is from that very same spring is admitted free. We have notliing to say what- ever as to the charge upon the bottle in which they arc im))ortcd, or the packing, on which have it as you may see fit to lay it. The firm I represent are large importers of Carlsbad Sprndle salts, and they Avish to say they believe it is unjust discrimination of that product of these medicinal springs which they import, and which is consumed upon pre- scriptions of a pliysician, and in this way the water from curative springs of Carlsbad can be brought home to tbe poor classes of this country. Those who can afibrd to do so can go there and enjoy the benefit there of these springs by staying at Carlsbad and taking the waters, but the middle classes and the poorer classes can not do it, and yet they suffer from the same diseases and are entitled to the same re- lief without having to pay a duty upon them. I have condensed what I have to say in the paper which I will leave with the clerk, and which can be placed in your record. Mineral wato's, all not artificial, and mineral salts of the same, obtained hy evaporation when accompanied hy a duly authenticated and satisfactory proof, showing that they are in no way artificially prepared, and are only the product of a designated mineral spring. Washington, D. C, September IS, 1893. Sirs : The natural mineral w.aters from the springs at Carlsbad and elsewhere are under the operation of parajiraph 650, admitted free of duty, and this is confirmed by the decision of the United States customs oflflcials March 22, 1893 (see reference) although the bottles in which they are contained pay a duty of 1| cents per pound' or about 30 per cent ad valorem. But a duty of 25 iier cent ad valorem is laid upon the natural mineral salts, wliich are obtained from sucli natural mineral waters by the simple process of evaporation, without auy sophistication or tbe addition of any chemical or other substance whatever, and, in connection therewith, li5 per cent Is laid upon tlie paclcing and 40 per cent upon bottles in which imported, all of wliieh at present amounts to loading tbe cost of the natural mineral salts at least 6i cents on each one-fourth pound liottle. This matter was fully represented to the Tariff Commission in 1882, and again to the/Jommittee on Ways and Means of 1889, and the testimony of numerous witnesses was given, to the cft'ect that this article of import should be placed upon the free list. In the testimony of David C. Stiirgis, assistant appraiser, port of New York, p] 500, Vol. 1, Tariff Commission of 1882, and of George C. Ticbener, special agent p. 2491, and reports reierrod to, it is recommended that natural miuer.il waters and tbe salts be admitted free. Their reasons apply with double force to natural mineral salts. In a statement filed with the Committoe on Ways and Means of the Fifty-first Congi'ess, the facta couceruiug natural mineral waters, and the salts ob- SUMAC, ETC. 61 taiiiecl from tlio same by evapovation, are fully set forth, and the rjiicstinn iuvolved lias had full discussion, both in tariff hearings and in the argnnient of cases before the customs officers, general appraisers, iind oflicers of the Treasury Department See Synopsis Opinions 13957, March 22, 1893. We suggest th.at the following be adopted as a part of the tariff measure now under consideration by your committee: In lieu of paragraph 650 of the present tariff law, insert the following iu free list. "Mineral w.aters, all not artificial, and mineral salts of the same, obtaiued by evap- oration, when accompanied by a duly authenticated certificate, and satisfactory proof, showing that they are in no way artificially prepared, and are only the prod"- iict of a designated mineral spring." The anomaly is now presented of the admission free of duty of the n.atural waters of noted mineral springs, while a duty of 25 per cent ad valorem is laid upon the mineral salts obtained by a process of evaporation of the waters of the same springs. Take, for example, the waters and salts of the Carlsbad Sprudel Springs, l^ie peculiarly specific curative properties of this great spring are well known to all the world, and thousands of American citizens, who can att'ord to do so, visit the Carls- bad Springs every year, to be cured of diseases which have baffled medical skill, but which have been cured liy their use. Because there are thousands of our citizens who can not afford to go to Carlsbad, who are in the same need of this wonderful specific, the one who can afford tbc luxury of going to them, they are by the city authorities of Carlsbad officials bottled and sent to this country, in convenient shape for use, admitted free of duty by our Govern- ment, and their beneficial effects brought within the reach of the poorest and most needy of the class referred to. But their compoucut medicinal salts, when condensed by evaporating the water in which they were held in solution, and put up in small bottles of one-fourth of apoundeach, are subjected to a tariff duty of 25 per cent ad valorem, under the head of a chemical preparation, paragraph 76. It is used by physicians in cases of diabetes, catarrh of stomach, adiposis, gout, and rheumatism, with the same effect as when administered at the springs. It is unique in its action, and can not be substituted by any artificial or natural product obtained in this country. It should, therefore, come iu free of duty, the same as the uatur.al mineral waters, as the levying of this duty on this article only enhances the price to the consumer for whom it is prescribed. These salts are imported for the benefit of those who can not aft'ord to go to these springs for treatment. There is no sound reason why such medicinal salts should be taxed, provided they are the simple and natural salts obtaiued by evaporation only. Quinine is admitted free, because it is a necessary inedicuial remedy in certain cases, although it is produced in the United States. Natural mineral salts should be admitted free for the same reason. They are almost as generally prescribed by physicians as is quinine and kindred remedies. Lastly, they can not be used in combination with other medicinal agents, nor used for any other than curative purposes. Hence, they can not properly be classed as "medicinal preparations," but are strictly natural remedies. We represent in this matter the firm of Eisner & Mendelson, of New York City, who import the Carlsbad Sprudel natural salts, and are authorized to say for them that they are ready and willing to appear before yon at any time, and substan- tiate, by'proper certificates of the city of Carlsbad, and by affidavits of experts and chemical analyses, the fact th.at Carlsbad Sprudel salts are strictly natural salts, obtained from the water of that famous spring by evaporation only, and that they are not sophisticated nor adulterated, nor is any other substance mixed with the product of such e\aporation, as they have hitherto frequently done. On their behalf, therelbre, we ask you to add tliis great medicinal agent to the free list, for the reasons above stated. Respectfully, Dudley & Michbm, For EisA'EK & Mendelson. SUMAC, ETC. (Parngraph 89.) STATEMENT OF HON. GEORGE W. COOPEB, OF INDIANA. Mr. Chairman: 'Neav theclose of the last session of Congress I intro- duced a -bill to place cod or fisli oil, used for tanners' purposes, degras, sumac, and tallow on tlie free list. My attention was called to this class of items by the firm of W. W. 62 CHEMICALS. Mooney & Sons, manufacturers of leather, located and doing an exten- sive business in my home city, Columbus, lud. I submit for your con- sideration some correspondence upon these items and some data taken from the official statistics showing- the operation and effect of the pres- ent huT, and also the extent of the leather industry in the United States. I earnestly pray that the committee -will put these items on the free list. Here is an industry in which millions of capital is invested, and thousands of hands employed. It furnishes a market for and consumes nearly all the hides produced in our country; it is making a brave, self- reliant tight for the world's trade in leatlier and the manufactures of leather, and it is a great hardship that it should be obliged to support a few sporadic grease factories in their spasmodic efforts to supply the trade. There was an effort to get these items placed upon the free list when the present tariff law was enacted. Statements were tlien made by those who have a more thorough acquaintance with the controversy, and I ask that you consider also the statements then made before your committee, as well as those taken by the Finance Conmiittee at the Senate hearings. I think these statements conclusively show that all the items mentioned by me should be duty free. GROUND SXIMAC. Imports iu 1892, 10,822,014 pounds; value, $225,821; duties, $43,290, equal 19.10 per cent ad valorem. Large quantities of sumac are pro- duced in Virginia and North Carolina. This domestic sumac is used iu making the coarser grades of leather, but can not be used in tlie flner grades. The sumac imported comes from Italy, and is used in the finer grades of leather. There is no competition between the imported and domestic article, and no injury would result to the latter if ground sumac were made free. Dried sumac (unground) comes in free under paragraph 500 of the tariff. COD OIL. This article was free when imported from Canada under the treaty of Washington, piior to the abrogation of certain articles of that treaty which provided for free entry offish and fish products from the Dominion or from Prince Edward Island (see section 2500 Eevised Statutes). It is now dutiable under paragraph 40 of the tariff' at 8 cents per gal- lon. Its present market value in Halifax is 24 cents per gallon, so that the present duty is equal to 33J- per cent ad valorem. It should be free, as an article used in dressing and stuffing leather. Imports of whale and fish oils in 1892 were 99,278 gallons; value, $20,377; duties, $7,941.90; equal to 30.11 per cent ad valorem. This should not be con- founded with medicinal cod-liver oil, which pays 15 cents per gallon duty. The cod oil used by tanners is made from cod livers and other offal of codfish, but is allowed to become rancid and is unfit for other than manufacturing purposes. BROWN GRBABE OR WOOL GREASE OR DEGRAS. This article is produced to a limited extent in Rhode Island but, manufacturers have to depend chiefly upon the foieign supply. Im. ports in 1892, 8,070,990 pounds; value, $194,404; duties, at one-half cent per pound, $43,385, equal to 22.31 per cent ad valorem. G3 This is a higher rate than tliat imposed upon perfumed grease or entienrage pomade, which is dutiable at 20 per cent ad valorem. It should be expressly included in the provision for grease and ods used in stuffing and dressing leather, paragraph 599. The revenue derived from it is insignificant. Sod oil or French degras is now admitted free under a decision of tlie board of general appraisers. TALLOW. The imports of tallow in 1892 were only 25,906 pounds, upon which there was a duty collected of $259.00. The exports in the same year were 89,780,000 pounds, valued at $4,425,030. There is, therefore, no object in a protective or any duty on tallow. LEATHER. The value of leather exported during the last fiscal year was 0,618,363, and of manufactures of leather $2 311,530, making a total of $12,829,893. Columbus, Ind., Fehruarij 9, 1S9S. Dear Sir : There has m the past three months been an advance on cod oil of about 20 per cent, and on American greases, with which foreign degras competes, of from 60 to 100 per cent. The tremcndons advance in pi'ioes on tliese materials that are in such general use by tanners is making it very difficult to secure fair profits in our line of trade. We are, of course, endeavoring to get some advance on finished leather fully in keeping with the advance made on hides, oils, tallow, degras, sumac, and other tan- ning materials. Most of the imported sumac comes from Sirily, and we believe the duty now is $7.50 per ton of 2,240 pounds, and the price in New York at tliis time is $62 to $65, while the price of the American product is $36 to $38 at Lynchburg or Richmond, and the facts ai'e that the Sicily sumac does not really compete v^ith the American product, and tanners now using Sicily must continue to do so to get the results required, which they can not witli the domestic article, and the dnty does not benefit tbe jjrice of the domestic article. In fact, since the passage of the McKinley law increasing the duty on Sicily, Sicily sumac has advanced considerably and the domestic article has declined fully as much. The reasons therefore we do not attem])t to explain, but the fact remains the same. Yours, very truly, W. "VV. MooNEV & Sons. Columbus, Ind., February 20, 1S93. Dear Sir: We are in receipt of a letter from Messrs. George H. Leonard & Co., 201 Purchase street, Boston, Mass., large importers of cod oil, and .also dealers in domestic fish oils, from which we ([note as follows : "The prusont duty on Ncwfoundl.and cod oil is 8 oenos per wine gallon, which, it certainly seems to us, should be cither reduced or removed, as thi^^ year, in order to kec]) ]iace with the growing demand for pure cod oil, we have already had to import fully three-foiirtli.s of all the cod oil we have had, and the duty we h.ave paid this year is from $:!!'. iHO to $33,00:) on that article alone. It is now so high tuat what little there is in Newfoundland is now held at 45 cents per giiUon, delivered in Bos- toji, dnty paid.'' During the past two or three years the average price of pure Newfoundland cod oil has been about 32 to ."4 cents, and this advance means an increase in the cost of leather of at least 1 cent per pound, so you can readily see that the consumer of this leather is going to pay this duty, if we can possible get him to do so. This is another case of wliere the foreigner does not pay the tax, but the domestic cou- sum 'r must and does. Yours, very truly, W. W. Moo^•KY & Sons. G-i CHEMICALS. Boston, Septemicr 19, 1S93. Dear Sir: Your favor of September 16 is received, and I note the effort on tlio part of the Hon. Gcoi-ge W. Cooper to place cod oil, degras, Sicily sumac, etc., on the free list. I shall do all I can to assist Mr. Cooper in this laudable undertaking. Three years ago, when the McKinley bill wiis being framed, it was proposed to put wool degras on the free list, and 1 think it was so voted in the AVays and Moans Committee, hut Senator Allison, of Khode Island, expecting that some of the woolen mills in his State would put in plants to make it, proposed a siiecific duty of 1 cent per pound, which, as degras was then worth about 2.} cents a pound, exporter s value, would have quadrupled the duty on tliis product. Mr. Andrew G. Webster, of Boston, went with me to Washington, where we had a hearing before tJio teen- ate Finance Committee in regard to this matter, Senator Aldrich, of Rhode Island, being the strong advocate of the duty, and abetted therein by Messrs. Jerome Marble & Co., of Worcester, Mass., who at that time made the most extrav- agant and unwarranted statements as to their ability to supply the tanners of the United States in event of the duty being placed on the product. We were able to show that where one workiugman would be employed in pro- ducing this product one hundred workingmen who handled it in connection with the production of leather would be adversely ati'ected, say nothing about the in ■ creased cost to the consumer of leathers in which this article was used. We were also able to show that all degras which had been produced by tliis concern had not been of good merchantable quality, and that many of their stn t(?ments could be read- ily controverted. In spite of the strenuous efforts of Mr. Aldrich in the committee, his associates, after hearing the evidence which we produced, recommended that instead of putting a duty of 1 cent per pound on degras, that they offer us a com- promise of one-half cent per pound, which compromise we subsequently accepted, believing that it was better to have saved for the leather fraternity one-half cent per pound on the great amount of degras which they were using than to refuse this concession. The liistory of the production of degras in this country has been a marked failure. Although the duty was increased from 10 per cent up to one-half cent per pound, or say doubled, as the law now stands, the price has steadily fallen, and American producers have fallen out of the race; Messrs. Marble, in particular, who, we understand, after making this savage light for the duty, and adding to the price of degras in this country, have withdrawn from the manufacture of the same altogether. We, therefore, think that in the matter of degras there will be little or no opposition to a reduction or abolition of the duty. Yours, truly, Fkbdekic W. Clarke, SCHEDULE B. EARTHENWARE. T H 5 fif' POTTBRX. Schednle B.— 90 et seq. Saturday, September 16, 1893. STATEMEBT OF HOIf. GEOEGE P. IKIRT, OE EAST LIVERPOOL, OHIO. Mr. IKIRT. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen of the committee : In view of the fact that this is Saturday afternoon and that there are a number of gentlemen here representing the pottery interest, both manufacturers and pottery workers, and in view of the further fact that we are now half an hour later than the time when we expected to begin, and also for the reason that I am not well, I will cut out much of what I had to say in the beginning and let it go into the report for consideration in future. I have here the tariff bills for the last ten years in regard to pottery. I will not consume your time with this, bufc will come down to a reca- pitulation of all those bills and measures which substance, not provided for. [ gQ 1; 70 EARTHENWARE. THE TARIFF LAW OF 1890. [Present law. ] Followed JD the main the same general classification as the law of 1883, but made two residuum clauses or rates where that of 1883 had but one. It placed a duty on common brown earthenware, stoneware, and crucibles, not ornamented or decorated, of 25 per cent ad valorem. On china, porcelain, Parian, bisque, earthen, stone, and crockery ware, including plaques, ornaments, toys, vases, and statuettes, painted, tinted, stained, enameled, printed, gilded, or otherwise decoraied or ornamented, 60 per cent ad valorem. If plain white and not ornamented or decorated in any manner, 55 per cent ad valorem. RESIDUUM CLAUSBS. All other china, porcelain, Parian, bisque, earthen, stone, and crockery ware, and manufactures of the same by whatsoever designation or name known, etc., not spe- cially provided for in this act, if ornamented or decorated in any manner, 60 per cent ad valorem. If not ornamented or decorated, 55 per cent ad valorem. It is impossible to put the nomenclature exactly in tabular form, concisely. Tahle showing tariff rates on eartlienware in laws 'before ISSS, ire law of 1S8S, aa proposed by Mills hill, its Senate amendment in act of IStiO, its Senate amendment, and aspro- posed by the Tariff Commission of 188Z. 1. Stoneware above the capacity of 10 gallons (and ' ' cru- cibles," act of 1890) 2. Brown earthenware, common stoneware, and stone- ware not decorated 3. China, porcelain, and Parian ware, and bisque, includ- ing pl.^iques, etc., 1883, gilded, ornamented, or deco- rated in any manner 4. China, porcelain, and Parian ware, and bisque, 1883, plain white, and not decorated in any manner* 5. All other earthen, stone, and crockery ware, white, gilded,edged, printed, painted, dipped or cream col ored, composed of earthy or mineral substances, and uot otherwise provided for , McK-inley law — Clauses 3 and 4 combined thus : China, Parian, liorcelain, bisque, earthen, stone, and crockery ware, including jdaques, ornaments, toys, channs, vases, and statuettes, painted, tinted, stain- ed, enameled, printed, gilded, or otherwise deco- rated or ornamented in any manner If plain white, and not ornamented or decorated in any manner Eesiduiim clause, divided ; All other china, porcelain, Parian, bisque, earthen, stone, and crockery ware, and manufactures of the same, bywhatsoeverdesig- nation known in the trade, including lava tips for burners, not specially provided for in this act ; if ornamented or decorated in any manner If not ornamented or decorated 50 25 55 25 60 sa *In Mills bill there was added class of "white grauilo, common ware," etc., at 35 per cent. POTTERY. 71 I could not get a copy of the Morrison bill, but it did not recommend but a slight reduction on pottery ware, and not a 20 per cent horizontal cut on all grades of ware, only a slight per cent reduction. This table shows conclusively that for twenty years it has been recognized by all, irrespective of party, who have considered this sub- ject, that justice and right demands this industry receive recognition. It also shows that all these acts or proposed acts vary in amounts or rates but little, and all cluster round the general average rate of 55 per cent, varying but little either way. UNFORTUNATE EPISODES IN THE INDUSTET. "To err is human, to forgive divine." It is not my purpose to apologize for wrong, or to disguise any of the facts known to me in connection with this industry. Why should it be 1 The past in an open book that may be read and known by all men. Local troubles have occurred in this industry as in others, but in view of the fact that a better feeling is sure to exist between manu- facturers and their employes when the latter are well paid, I am unable to explain why a reduction of wages of about 10 per cent was made in 1877, or why, after an increase of protection, a reduction of about 8 per cent was made in 1883. Having no information as to why such was done, I can offer no explanation. Neither do I attempt to justify the lockout, in East Liverpool, of 1882. I certainly am opposed, most uncomprom- isingly, to such actions, but as to the real reasons that inspired such action in either instance, those responsible therefor alone know best. However, that such mistakes have been made, and injustice thereby done, is no cause for retaliation, as no number of wrongs ever made a right. Let right toward the industry prevail, whUe we indulge the hope that similar mistakes will not again occur. ENGLISH PEICES PAID TO LABOE COMPAEED WITH AMEEICAN PEICES. Prices paid by John Edwards & Sons, of Staffordshire, for white granite, cable shape. (This firm manufactures almost exclusively for the American trade.) English sizes are generally one size smaller than in America. The comparison is with American prices, both being fur- nished me by a reliable practical potter who has worked ten years in this country and fifteen years in En-land just previous to coming here. Size. English price. American price. 6's 7'3 8'3 9's Per doz. $0.66 .72 .78 .84 .72 Not given. . 66 .72 .54 .60 .54 .42 .36 .30 .26 .26 .10 .10 .10 .10 Per doz. $1.00 Do . 1.05 Do 1.15 Do 1.30 Not given. Not given. .90 9'8 6'8 9'3 6'a 6'3 12'8 24'3 30'3 36'3 42'8 ^ in. 3 in. 4 in. 5 iu. Do - 1.00 Do .70 Do .55 Do .45 Do - .42 Do .. .36 Do .30 .10 .10 Do .11 Do .12 *Jug8 are over a size larger here than in England. 72 EARTHENWARE. Size. Ent'ti-sli pri»(^ I'er doz. $0.12 .12 .12 .14 . 14 . 14 .]-! . 211 .30 !30 2.64 2. 40 2.16 .10 .10 .10 .10 .10 .10 .10 .10 t.03 1.32 .32 .36 .42 .68 .82 .VinericaiJ price. Dishes, flat and bakers' 6 in. 7 in. 8 iu. 9 in. 10 in. 11 in. 12 in. 14 in. 16 in. 6's 9's I's 2's 3'3 4'3 5's 6' a 7', ^^1' l^Ho Imports in 1892 1, 916, 711. 4d Decreased imports in 1892 't> "^^O- ^^ And there is the one single item iu the classification on which there has been a decreased importation. What further? Brown earthen and common stone ware, not ornamented, shows — Imports in 1892 $66, 695. .36 Imports in 1891 50,963.18 Increased imports in 1892 15, 732. 18 What further? China, porcelain, parian, bisqne, etc., including plaques, statuettes, etc., painted, tinted, gilded, or otherwise decorated, shows — Imports in 1892 $6,347,058.75 Imports in 1891 - 5, 752, 186. 22 Increased imports in 1892 594,872.53 Again I ask, what further? Total earthen, stone, and chinaware imports, as shown hy this report was — Total imports in 1892 $8, .362, 292. 54 Total imports in 1891 7,768,559.90 Total increase of imports in 1892 593,732.64 Now, I desire to point out and call special attention to the fact that this increased importation was at a time when there was a decrease of over one hundred and ten millions of dollars of imports of all kinds (or of total imports dutiable), as shown on page 123, and not at a time when there was a general increase of importation. If these conditions enu- merated did not obtain, I would not be here before you to-day; but having investigated this subject to some extent, I am fully persuaded of three things — that there is a very marked difference in the produc- tion cost in favor of the foreign manufacturer ; that importation is not decreasing, but increasing, and competition for benefit of consumer with it; that the revenue to the Government is increasing by reason of the increased importation, not by reason of the present law, but in spite of it. These tables are official, unbiased testimony, and from them and the other evidence I have submitted I make the following deductions and reach the following conclusions, viz : First. In view of the fact, clearly shown, that production cost is so much higher in this than in foreign countries, all materials and chem- icals used in the process of manufacture (and commonly ca,lled raw materials) should be admitted duty free to enable the American prod- uct to compete both at home and abroad with the higher grades of products of the ceramic art. Second. In view of the fact that this industry is both an industry and an art, for I desire to emphasize the fact that it is an art and en- POTTERY. 77 titled to be so considered. If a reduction of duty be determined upon, in tlie light of tliese facts and figures, as well as the merits of the in- dustry as an art, it should most certainly be accompanied by free raw- material of all kinds; and such reduction should not be in excess of, but fully equalized by the reduction on materials. I further recommend that in the adjustment of rates the administra- tive act allowing a crate and package duty be not considered as being unjust, as the undervaluation of the product made possible by the weak points in the law more than overcomes or equalizes the crate and package duty. While disclaiming all desire to appear as dictating to the very able and honorable gentlemen that compose this committee, permit me only to ask that you, while remembering we are all but clay in the hands of the G-reat Potter, carefully weigh all the facts and consider the sub- ject in the light of the rightful interests of a legitimate art and indus- try. Mr. Eeed. Is this establishment in the district which you represent? Mr. Ikibt. Yes, sir ; East Liverpool is in my district. Mr. Ebbd. What is about the average rate of tariff' taxation which is put upon the foreign article? Mr. Ikiet. The average rate of the present bill is about 58.50 per cent. Mr. E.BED. How much does that increase the price to the consumer? Mr. Ikirt. That is a question I can not answer. Mr. Ebed. It does increase the price to the consumer, does it not? Mr. Ikirt. I can not answer that question. Mr. Ebbb. You do not think that the tariff tax is added to the price of the article ? Mr. Ikirt. Yes, sir; undoubtedly it is. Mr. Ebed. Of course you know the increased price to the con- sumer Mr. Ikiet. You asked how much in price and I thought you meant in value on articles, and I answered that I did not know. Mr. Eeed. It undoubtedly does increase the price to the consumer. Mr. Ikirt. I believe the consumer pays the duty. Mr. Eeed. And therefore we should have, with present duties, to impose a tax upon 65,000,000 of consumers of 58 per cent on this article. Mr. Ikirt. I have shown that it is no imposition upon the consumer in the American market from the fact that importations are increasing, competition is increasing, and therefore there is no injustice done. Mr. Eebd. Why ? If the consumer pays the tariff taxes on all that is imported he pays on all that is manufactured, does he not? Mr. Ikirt. The consumer pays all the duty ; yes. Mr. Ebed. What excuse do you offer us for imposing upon the people not only the tariff taxes on the imported article, but upon what is manufactured also? Mr. Ikirt. I simply submitted the facts, and I am willing to say that if you were to crush out this industry there is a possibility that the price at which the foreign ware is sold might be advanced. Mr. Ebed. That is one of the reasons which induced you to submit this proposition to the committee? Mr. Ikirt. Yes, sir. Mr. Eebd. You admit the result might be an increased price to the consumer? Mr Ikirt. It might be. 78 EAETHENWAEE. Mr. Eeed. That is one of the reasons that you have in mind ? Mr. Ikirt. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. The great growers of cotton do not have any tariff taxes upon their cotton in this country? Mr. Ikiet. Tou, perhaps, have investigated that matter more than I have. Mr. Eeed. What is your impression? Mr. Ikiet. They have not. Mr. Eeed. The great growers of wheat do not have any tariff tax imposed that is of any importance to them, do they? Mr. Ikiet. I do not claim they have. Mr. Eeed. The market is made at Liverpool? Mr. Ikiet. Tes, sir. Mr. Eeed. And it is also true that the cotton market is made there? Mr. Ikiet. Tes, sir. Mr. Eeed. The producers of cotton and wheat have none of the bene- fits imposed by this tariif taxation which you propose in behalf of some ol your constituents? Mr. Ikiet. I think the cotton and the wheat raisers have to take the value in the foreign market leas the cost of carriage. Mr. Eeed. How do you justify creating among your constituents a special class to the detriment of the cotton and wheat growers? You will have no difficulty in furnishing an argument to convince me. I want you to address your argument to the majority of this committee, for perhaps your argument would be more convincing than mine. Tou recommend to us to establish this privileged class in your district, and I wish you.wOuld present your argument in such a way as to convince the majority of this committee. Mr. Ikiet. I have tried to present the logic of facts and official reports in the papers I have read; I have made that full and clear. Mr. Eeed. You ought to present some argument that will convince them, for they -do not seem to be convinced. Mr. Ikiet. I believe in tariff sufficient to raise revenue to defray the expenses of the Government economically administered. Mr. Eeed. Yes; I remember that. Mr. Ikiet. I stand right on that. Mr. Eeed. I want you to stand on the other position. Mr. Ikiet. Yes, but I am going to tell you of that. I understand that the majority of this committee are not in favor of the destruction or abolishment of any legitimate industry Mr. Eeed. That is, in your district. Mr. Ikiet. Please let me get through, and you will have your answer. Mr. Eeed. I wiU be glad to help you. Mr. Ikiet. I will not ask your help. I speak of levying this duty in view of the fact that we have to raise $400,000,000 per annum for the expenses of the Government, and that duty should be so placed, keeping reform in view, as to meet the revenues of the Government with in- cidental protection. Mr. Eeed. What incidental protection? Mr. Ikiet. To protect any legitimate industry where it can be clearly shown that the cost of production is much greater than the foreio-n cost. That is what I understand incidental protection, so called, 'to mean. Therefore, I am in favor of incidental protection, and I can say that this is both an industry and an art. Mr. Eeed. You are arguing at the same time that we should keep up a protective duty, and I want you to address your argument to this POTTERY. 79 committee, because it would be more effective. I approach it from a different standpoint. Mr. Ikiet. I understand you do, but we approach it from this standpoint. Mr. Ebed. That is a little general. Mr. Ikiet. This industry is entitled to a proper amount of recogni- tion, and it should be given to it. Less than that is injustice to the in- dustry, and would do no injustice to the consumer. 1 am not in favor, as you are, of levying a protective tariff for the sake of protection ; but I am in favor of incidental protection because of the necessity of our raising $400,000,000 to defray the expenses of the Government. Therefore, if you have this amount to raise you must raise it, and you should, in justice and right,, irrespective of party, but upon the broad principle of right Mr. Eeed. (Interposing.) For protection. Mr. Ikiet. Do justice as to the tariff protection. The principle ot the Democratic party — since you have referred to politics — is not the principle that proposes to close up all the American workshops and manufacture tramps for the sole benefit of European plutocrats. Mr. Eeed. 'No, no. Mr. Ikiet. We propose to have equity and justice, and we make the fight on tbat ground. Mr. Eeed. You speak of revenue as being one of the objects. What proportion of these goods are imported into this country as compared with the domestic product? Mr. Ikiet. I can not answer. Mr. Eeed. Answer as near as you can. Mr. Ikikt. I will not undertake to answer. Mr. Eeed. Can you not give something near the amount? Mr. Ikiet. I have not the data for it. Mr. Eeed. Is there not one to five? Mr. Ikiet. I do not know. Mr. Eeed. Is there one to four? Mr. Ikiet. I presume that one-fourth is made here, but must refer you to the manufacturers as to proportion. Mr. Eeed. If you could give the figures it might be striking. Would not a tariff tax upon all articles imported, if imposed upon an equal amount to supply the place of the domestic manufacture, visibly in- crease the revenues of the Government? Mr. Ikiet. As a matter of course, if yoa abolish the business and get an increased importation at the same duty it would increase the revenues of the Government. Mr. Eeed. In proportion there would be more and more imported, and more and more revenue? Mr. Ikiet. There might be; quite likely there would be. The amount required would have to be furnished, and if none were fur- nished here the increase would be furnished at other hands, and that would increase the revenue. Mr. Eeed. You are not urging this on account of revenue, are you? Mr. Ikiet. I was going to complete my remark. But if this indus- try were stricken down and no duty imposed, supposing you needed revenue, in that case would you then get revenue for the Govern- ment? Mr. Eeed. In case of what? Mr. Ikiet. In any case if importations increase and competition also, it indicates the rate is not too high. 80 EARTHENWAKE. Mr. ,Eeed. Not too high for what? Mr. Ikirt. Justice and revenue. Because if the importation is steadily increasing, therefore revenues are steadily increasing. If it were the other Avay, it would argue it was too high. Mr. Eeed. Too high for protection, so as to render foreign competi- tion Mr. Ikirt. Too high to render justice to your Government for the purpose of raising revenue. Tou would be taking advantage of your consumers and tlie Government. Mr. Eeed. Then you do not admit your former statement that lower tariff taxes would increase the revenue to a reasonable extent? Mr. Ikiet. That is a mooted question; it might, and depends en- tirely upon the amount you cut it. Mr. Eeed. You say you think that labor is 200 per cent more costly here than the labor abroad? Mr. Ikirt. I said the wages paid in America were 200 per cent more, approximately, than the wages paid in Germany — not near that much dilt'erence in the wages here and in England. Mr. Eeed. You are making the American producer of cotton and wheat pay double the wages, as shown by the product of this industry which you desire to protect, are you not? Mr. Ikirt. In what way? Mr. Eeed. Those wages go into the product, do they not? Mr. Ikirt. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. These gentlemen who raise cotton and wheat pay for that product, do they not? Mr. Ikiet. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. ■ They pay its wages ? Mr. Ikirt. I went over that a few moments ago. Mr. Eeed. You want them to pay this wages? - Mr. Ikirt. I took the ground that the consumer pays the duty in addition. Mr. Eeed. How do you justify this infliction upon the cotton and wheat growers? That is the question I asked. Mr. Ikiet. I justify it on the broad ground of right, equity, and justice, all conditions considered. If you put it so high as to make a monopoly, it would not be right. Mr. Eeed. What you want is such reasonable protection as to enable your constituents to live? Mr. Ikirt. Anybody's constituents. Mr. Eeed. You extend it to anybody's constituents? Mr. Ikiet. Yes, sir; I said I would not be here, except for the fact that certain conditions I have shown obtain. Mr. Eeed. Would you be in favor of any other industry which is protected ? Mr. Ikirt. I say it is perfectly right, if certain conditions exist, to have sufficient tariff protection. Mr. Eeed. In order that protection might not fail by incidentally being incidental, you put it here purposely? You would have inci- dental protection borne in mind by this committee; but you want it to be down because you do not trust it incidentally? Mr. Ikiet. We do everything from a motive. I have tried to show that, and I believe I am right. AU tariffs protect. Mr. Eeed. You do not regard anything as incidental that is done for a purpose, such as creating a class. Mr. Ikirt. It does not create a class, if not too high or, unless high POTTERY. 81 enough to create a monopoly. It is on that also that I would measure the cost of production. Mr. Ebed. You are not the only gentleman of your politics who has come to that conclusion. The gentlemen representing the pearl-button industry have come to the same conclusion. Mr. Ikirt. I also say that I do not believe your committee will err in this connection. Mr. Reed. The effect ts the same upon every Democrat — to specify the incidental protection to prevent the possibility of its being a failure. Mr. Ikibt. The Republicans desire to get it to the highest point. Mr. Reed. So as to make sure that incidental protection does not fail. Mr. Ikikt. The Republican theory is that it is for the beneiit of one class. Is it not? > Mr. Reed. I presume when you come down to theories, we are all the same. The difficulty is that you are asking this without knowing it; that is all. Mr. Ikirt. I do not agree with your proposition. I do not believe wages are higher because of a protective tariff. There is where you and I differ. Mr. Reed. I will discuss it with you, if you desire. Mr. Ikirt. I have been at your service for the last several minutes Mr. Reed (interposing). I think you have. Mr, Ikirt. And am willing to continue. STATEMENT OF MB. HENHY BHTTirr, OF BALTIMOEE, MD., POTTERY MAUTJFACTTmEB Saturday, September- 16, 1893. Mr. Brunt. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen of the committee : The real reason for my being here to-day is the fact that I had a somewhat unique experience in the manufacture of pottery which I thought might be of interest as well as some benefit to the industry with which I am connected. I have been engaged in the pottery business for about thirty-five years, most of the time in England. Since I became a man, I have spent ten years of my life in the pottery industry in England under free trade. I have spent twelve years in the pottery industry in America under protection ; so that I think I am in a position to speak somewhat of the benefits, or otherwise, under free trade or protection. I have had an experience as a workingman in England in the pottery industry. I have been engaged as a manager in England, and as such I have had to pay wages and engage men. I have had an experience as a workingman in the pottery industry in America, and I have been a manager, and am now a manager; so that whatever I say in connec- tion with it will be drawn from my own personal knowledge, and not collected from books. I come here to ask you gentlemen to maintain the present rate of duty on pottery, and I do so for several reasons : One of the reasons — which you have heard many times before — is because if the duty is reduced, the burden will fall on the working man. In connection with this, I want to make a little statement about the difference I have paid for some labor in America and in England. Most of these comparisons are made with English manufacturers, chiefly, I suppose, because reli- able statistics are more easUy procured in England than in some of the T H 6 82 EARTHENWARE. other foreign countries. We can, consequently, compare the conditions in England and America better than we can the price and condition of things in other countries. I have not a very long list, although it is on a long piece of paper ; but I have taken the average of what I consider to be the regular num- ber of men that it requires to run a pottery. I have started with what we call the engineer in England. I paid $6 a week in England, and $11 in America for an engineer. There are many places which are filled by women in England, and men in America. Mr. Stetens. Those were the prices which were prevalent twelve years ago? Mr. Beunt. Yes, sir; but there has practically been no change in prices since then. Mr. Stevens. Have prices not risen since then? Mr. Brunt. Very little in twelve years. Mr. Stevens. They have in other trades? Mr. Brunt. I can not say. I am speakiug of my experience as a potter. Mr. Payne. There has been no reduction in the last three years in England? Mr. Brunt. The reason for my coming to America was to avoid a strike which was imminent, where the men had been reduced 8 per cent some years previous, and had gone on a strike. The rate has never gone back. They still have the same reduction of wages. If the tariff is reduced it would affect the working potters, the coal-miners, and others who handle products of all kinds. Mr. Bryan. You say youpaid$2.90 for coal! Mr. Brunt. Yes, sir. Mr. Tarsney. Is that slack? Mr. Brunt. It was Cumberland coal, which is equal to slack. What we call coal here is usually called slack in England. In England they make three selections of coal. It is about equal to the higher grade of coal used in the ordinary house fires. The part of it which goes through a screen is slack. In England in 10 tons of coal there would be 8 tons of slack. They allow us, when we go to the coal])its, to load up the carts and count it as slack. What is slack in England is coal in America. Another reason which I wish to assign is because if the tariff is re- duced the wages of the working potter will be changed for the worse. I want to call attention to a number of cases where work is done in America by men and in England by women-. Of course they have caused a material cheapening of the product; but at the same time it cheapens the product it deteriorates the condition of the employ^, man woman, and child, because the labor of the man is brought in compe- tition with the labor of the woman, and very often is brought in com- petition with the labor of his own child. If this is so, then the condi- tion of the man having these things to compete with is worse than in a country where he only has to compete with the labor of his fellow- men. There is no more sober, honest, or industrious workmen in the world than the working potter of America, and I attribute it chiefly to the fact that he is well paid. If you bring a man down in his wages of course you reduce him in his general condition. If you reduce his hon- esty and morality you reduce his pride. I do not want to enter into a discussion of that point; but you all know that honesty is more a ques- tion of appetite than of principle. If you fill a man's stomach and POTTERY. 83 send him through a market, he is not so likely to steal ns if he goes through the market with an empty stomach. If a man makes good wages he will live decently and is more likely to be honest than a man who has i)oor wages. Mr. Betan. Does that not apply to the manufacturer as well as to the laborer? Mr. Beunt. It does. Mr. Bryan. How long have you been a mamifaoturer in this country? Mr. Brunt. Three years. Mr. Bryan. Before that you were a manager? Mr. Brunt. Yes sir; for five years. Before that I was a foreman for three years, and before that I was a workingmau on the bench for three years. Mr. Bryan. Do you own this factory yourself ? Mr. Brunt. I own it in conjunction with two others. Mr. Bryan. How much of it do you own? Mr. Brunt. I own one-fourth. Mr. Bryan. What is the capital ? Mr. Brunt. The capital stock is $80,000. Mr. Bryan. Did you bring that with you from England after you had been working there ? Mr. Brunt. No sir. Mr. Bryan. You made it in this country ? Mr. Brunt. All I own I made in this country. Mr. Bryan. How much did you start with three years ago ? Mr. Brunt. I did not start with anything very much. The condi- tions of ownership are more or less private. It does not follow that because I have this interest I have made sufficient money to pay for the shares that I own in the corporation. I want again to quote my personal experience in this matter. Chil- dren are put to work early in England. I myself went to work in the pottery when I was only 7 years old. I finished my education, and have never had a day's schooling since. At the present time the condi- tions of child-labor are better than when I was a child ; but the whole trend of the legislation on education, and everything else, is to encour- age a child to get along in school so that it can be put to work earlier and be made to earn money to bring into the general family fund; so much so that even to-day children are compelled by law to go to school in England three years. They are sent to school before they are 2 years old, so that they can be hurried up and brought to the factory to earn something for the general family fund. Mr. Bryan. Has there been any increase in the wages in the facto- ries in the last three years? Mr. Brunt. No, sir; there has been no increase in wages nor in the price of the goods. Mr. Bryan. Has there been any decrease? Mr. Brunt. There has been no decrease in the wages for years. Mr, Bryan. Not in any part of the work? Mr. Brunt. Not that I remember. As a matter of fact the men were, up to the late panic, making more money, and the pay roll was higher than it has ever been since the existence of the pottery industry. Mr. Taesnby. Has there been any case where women and children have been employed? Mr. Brunt. We have employed more women, because we have es- tablished a decorative department, which was not established before 84 EARTHENWARE. I went there. There have been engaged in that department a great number of women. Mr. Byntjm. You are speaking of your own inill now. There has been some in other mills ? Mr. Betint. I do not believe there has. Mr, Byntjm. Was there not a reduction of 10 per cent in the Trenton mills soon after the McKinley bill went into operation? Mr. Betjnt. I do not believe there was. Mr. Payne. If there was you never heard of it? Mr. Bktjnt. No, sir. Mr. Btnum. I have such information from a gentleman who lives there. Mr. Bktjnt. My reason for saying that I do not believe there was is because we are governed by Trenton prices. If there had been a reduc- tion of 10 per cent anywliere in America of course you may be sure that as business men we would learn it very soon and would conform to it. Mr. Taesnbt. Eegardless of the profit you were making in your business? Mr. Beunt. If they had reduced their wages there would have been a cause. The same reasons would have caused us to reduce ours. Mr. Taesney. Eegardless of whether you make money? Mr. Brunt. No; but the supposition is that if they had reduced their men 10 per cent they were not making money, and consequently had reduced wages. Then we should have reduced ours 10 per cent. Mr. Stevens. Have there been improved methods of manufacture in your industry in the last few years by which the i^roduct is made cheaper? Mr. Beunt. In some cases we have had imiiroved methods of manu- facture. Mr. Stevens. Have you reduced prices accordingly? Mr. Beunt. That is rather a difittcult thing to say; and I will tell you why it is diflflcult. A gTeat many of the goods we have been manu- facturing are decorated goods; in fact, one bianch in which we are en- gaged in producing — American porcelains — is all decorated. That is the principal decorated ware. It is selling at i)rices which are made by the individual manufacturer. Mr. Stevens. Have you a combination? Mr. Beunt. Not on the decorated ware. Mr. Stevens. Have you on the plain goods? ■ Mr. Beunt. Not on the plain goods. There is a combination of man- facturers. Mr. Stevens. To keep the prices up? Mr. Beunt. For the general benefit and general usefulness, just ex- actly as you gentlemen here are engaged in a combination to make laws for the benefit of the nation. [Laughter.] Mr. Stevens. Did you say there was a combination among the man- ufacturers to keep up the prices, or for general trade purposes ? Is there a fine attached if they undersell each other? Mr. Beunt. Yes, sir; I believe there is something of that kind. Mr. Bet AN. Is it the object of this association to create competition and thus reduce prices ? Mr. Beunt. The object is to create competition. It is not to destroy competition. The object is to protect the trade, for several reaso.is, exacfly the same as trades unions protect their workingmeu; it is exactly the same. POTTERY. 85 Mr. Bryan. Is your product covered by this combination'? Mr. Betjnt. We produce some goods covered by this combiuatiou 1 Mr. Tabsney. If you were to dispose of the product at 5 per cent less than you are disposing of it would you come in conflict with this association and subject yourself to the penalties provided by this association'? Mr. Bkunt. We should. Another reason which I desire to submit why a reduction of the tariff should not be made, is that this pottery industry should be pro- tected, because all other nations in the world protect the pottery in- dustry. I say that, in view of the fact that England has got free trade, but England has not always had free trade. Englandwas once in the same posi tion we are to-day with reference to the pottery industry. She has developed it. When she was developing it there was not a country in the world which had such strict protection as England had. It was her policy, through her ambassadors, to engage skilled work- men and manufacturers froiai other nations, and induce them by special protection to come and locate in England and develop that industry. It was in that way that it was developed. To such an extent was that systam carried out that at one time the importation of crockery for the purpose of sale in England was absolutely prohibited, and all goods that were imi:)orted for the purpose of sale could be confiscated wher- ever they were found;' and any man who had it in his possession could be fined for having it. It was through such a system as this, when England was young in the industry, that she developed it; and when she had developed it and got it to such perfection that it was more highly developed than the same industry in other countries, then, and only then, did she throw open the doors and say to the other nations, " Come in and compete." Mr. Bryan. When did she adopt free trade in crockery ?" Mr. Brtjnt. I think in 1833. Mr. Bryan. Has the industry developed there since that time?" Mr. Brunt. Somewhat; but no more than the natural increase in population. Mr. Bryan. Have wages risen in the crockery industry since 1833 '? Mr. Brunt. Wages have risen in the pottery industry since then some little; and the reason is, as I am trying to illustrate, that at that time she had thoroughly developed it, and she could afford to say to herself, " Now our industry is developed, and we can afl:brd to go out and sell goods broadcast throughout the world." Mr. Bryan. What, in your judgment, would be the time that would enable us, like England, to do that and increase wages of labor? Mr. Brunt. The time would be when this country can produce all the crockery that this country can consume. Mr. Bryan. When will that be? Mr. Brunt. That is going into the prophecy business. Mr. Bryan. You have no idea when we could do that? Mr. Brunt. It would not be in my lifetime. Mr. Bryan, lou would not want it to be in your lifetime? Mr. Brunt. It took England three hundred years to develop her industry. The growth of nations is counted, as a better man than I has said, by centuries, not by years. Mr. Bryan. You say that England went abroad to bring skilled laborers to that county? Mr. Brunt. Yes, she did. Mr. Bryan. Are our manufacturers bringing in skilled laborers'! 86 EARTHENWARE. Mr. Brunt. To some extent. Mr. Bryan. What proportion of foreigners have you in your employ " Mr. Brunt. About 10 per cent. The remainder are, I think, American born — certainly the men and boys and women who have learned the industry in this country are. Mr. Bryan. Have yoa brought in any yourself! Mr. Brunt. I have not. My idea has been, since I have been in the industry, to try to develop American talent. Mr. Bryan. What is the total value of the product of your firm annually ? Mr. Brunt. The total output is anywhere from $125,000 to $100,000. Mr, Bryan. What amount of money do you pay yearly in wages! Mr. Brunt. The pay roll right in our works approximates $75,000, or a little more than that, as near as I can come to it. Mr. Bryan. That includes all labor on the works and the salaries of the officers ? Mr. Brunt. N'o. It leaves three out. I have mentioued about Eng- land and the way she has developed the pottery industry. Even to this day she nurses and protects it, and tries to develop it to a great extent in this way: By establishing schools of art and science in the centers of the pottery industry, which are supported by the Govern- ment, and where young men and young women can attend the special part of the business that they are going to be engaged in. That is one of the drawbacks at the present time to the advancement of the pottery industry in America. Tou know that France and Germany and some other counties have royal potteries which are supported by the Govern- ment, which are experimental. The benefits of those experiments are to go to the general industry. In England at this time, while of course there is no Government grant, yet there are potteries there under the particular protection and particular patronage of royalty and also of the nobility. I saw instances of that in the World's Fair, where I saw on one of the booths, painted in English in prominent characters, " Potters by special appointment to Hei Majesty Queen Victoria." Mr. Tarsney. You can see that sign over every peanut stand in Eng- land. Mr. Eeed. I think that is a local exaggeration. Mr. Brunt. I never saw a peanut stand in England, and I am not able to say what there would be over it. Mr. Eeed (to Mr. Tarsney). That is certainly a local coloring you give to it. Your idea is right. Mr. Brunt. The contest we have to make in this country in fighting this royal patronage has materially affected the trade. There has been, since I have been here in the small town of Trenton, alone, twelve large firms that have gone into liquidation, which is an average of one every year. Most of these firms have been the firms that have especially distinguished themselves in trying to develop that high grade of goods, and have been fighting to compete with the royal potters of foreign nations. They have simply gone under. I think that if the legisla- tors of this country would devote a little money to developing the arts and industries of the country, instead of spending so much to invent machines to manufacture widows and orphans, the arts and in- dustries in America would be in a great deal better position than they are to-day. Another reason I will suggest is, that if you reduce the tariff on pot- tery, it will be a setback for a number of years. When I say that it wiU be a setback, that premises that there has been some advance- POTTER?. 87 ment. I think it only riglit, gentlemen, that you, who have charge of the purse strings of the nation, should know whether pottery has ad- vanced under your system of protection. I have brought here samples of what I consider to be fair samples of every kind of pottery that is produced in America. I will explain to you why I brought them (exhibiting samples). There are certain grades of goods that America can now produce as good, if not better, than any other country in the world. These grades of goods of which I speak are preferred by the trade to the foreign goods, everything else being equal. That shows some step forward. There has been at least one class of pottery created in America, and that is the class made by Euppert in Cincinnati. I do not know whether that could have been created under a system of free trade; but I do know that it has been created under a system of protection. You have in Cincinnati the finest grade of goods in the world, and it is entirely new. There has never been anything like it seen in the world before. It was produced in America, and you can speak with great pride and say, "This is purely American." Here Mr. Brunt produced and explained several samples of goods as follows : Here is what we call Eockingham ware; it is a red earthen ware. It is a little common, but very, useful. This next sample is stoneware, or yellow ware. This next is china ware. This one is called C. C. ware, which is chiefly used by workingmen in America. Those grades I have selected because they are as good, if not better, than the same grade of goods made anywhere else in the world, everything else being equal, and are preferred by dealers. Mr. Bryan. Are they produced at as low a price here as elsewhere? Mr. Brunt. The selling price, do you mean? Or do you mean that they cost as much to make? Mr. Bryan. Are they produced at as low a cost in this country as abroad? Mr. Brunt. ~No. Mr. Bryan. Are they sold at as low a price? Mr. Brunt. No, sir; they are neither produced nor sold as low. Mr. Bryan. Are they as good in quality? Mr. Brunt. They are as good, or better, in quality. Here is another piece which is called " hotel china." I am a little inclined to think that that is an American production. Certainly, no other country can produce as well as America can. Mr. Brunt produced samples of American porcelains, white granite, glass, and printed ware. Mr. Brunt. As you will meet with this class in your tariff laws it would be just as well for me to mention and explain them. These are being produced now in Ameiica, and I think they are as good as are produced anywhere, but they cost more. The object of producing American porcelain is this : In America there is a large class, the better class of working people, who can afford to purchase a little better grade of goods than the ordinary C. G. brand, but who are not sufficiently wealthy to purchase the French china, which is expensive. America has tried to produce something as good as the French china, and yet which might be sold at half the cost. This is the article, American porcelain. This [indicating] is French china. It is called French china when we wish to distinguish it from any other china. It is made in America, and is made to compete with French china. The whole ap- 88 EARTHENWARE. pearance of the article warrants us in saying so. Tlie mode of making certain kinds of French china is a secret. Mr. Turner. What brand is that? Mr. Brunt. That is the Onondaga Pottery Company's, oi' New York State. Up to the present time it is the finest imitation of French china that has ever been produced. Mr. Bryan. What articles are covered by the tariif ? Mr. Brunt. Simply this, the C. C. Mr. Bryan. What proportion does the O. 0. china bear to those; what is the most ordinary kind, the kind of which most is sold"^ Mr. Brunt. I think the most of this white granite is sold. Mr. Bryan. Tou do not know what the annual product is of the 0. C. I Mr. Brunt. No. Mr. Turner. Is that brown teapot included within the combination of which you have spoken 1 Mr. Brunt. Yes, sir; I believe there is a combination on the manu- facture of this brown teapot. They have an association of manufac- turers. Mr. Bryan. How many combinations do you belong to? Mr. Brunt. One. Mr. Turner. How is it as to the W. G. and decorated? Mr. Brunt. Every manufacturer makes his own price on them. Mr. Turner. Are all these goods made on the ancient potter's wheel ? Mr. Brunt. Some of them are. Mr. Turner. Have you improved the process of machinery so as to substitute it for the old potters' ^^ heel? Mr. Brunt. We have improved the old potter's wheel. The princi- ple is practically the same, but we have improved it by adding power to it. Instead of a man kicking it around, it is turned by machinery. The mode is practically the same. Mr. Turner. Is it the same as the Egyptians use? Mr. Brunt. Yes, sir; with some modifications. It is the same principle. This [exhibiting] is another class of china goods, which is called English china. These are made in America. This is the term nsed to denote the goods, not meaning to convey the impression that they are made in England. These are as fine as anything made in England. They are made by factories in the West, and if the present rate of duty is maintained, so that the industry can be develojjed, there is no reason in the world why English and French china shall not be made as good in America as in those countries. Mr. Bryan. Where are those factories located ? Mr. Brunt. At East Liverpool, Ohio. I am reminded that I am occupying a little too much time, and probably I am. I have one other reason why the tariff should not be lowered: we are making this grade of goods against geogTaphical protection. I want to say that if we are driven out of the market on this better class of goods we will have to go back to this commoner, heavier class on account of the geographical protection. Mr. Bryan. Tou refer to transportation? Mr. Brunt. Yes; that is what I understand by geographical pro- tection. Mr. Bryan. These goods were being manufactured before 1890 ? Mr. Brunt. I do not think these were manufactured before 1890. Mr. Bryan. The industry was successful before that time? Mr. Brunt. You can never say that the pottery industry has been very successful in this country, because there has been a large propor- POTTERY. 89 tion of failures, owing to the expense of developing it, whioh is out of proportion to that in other industries. Mr. Bryan. Has there not been ruore money made in it than in other kinds of manufacture? Mr. Brunt. You are very wrongly informed in connection with that. I have told you that in a town of 50,000- inhabitants, out of twenty- seven to thirty potteries in twelve years twelve large concerns (npt the small ones, iu which failures have been numerous) have failed. Mr. Bryan. What were your profits last year? Mr. Brunt. I do not think that is a fair question. Mr. Bryan. Do you not believe that the people ought to know that, if you are insisting that you can not live without the aid of the law? Mr. Brunt. I think it is fair that the people should know what is the general profit of the pottery business. Mr. Bryan. Are they not entitled to know how much you are making? Mr. Brunt. I do not thiuk they are entitled to know what is the profit of an individual firm. Mr. Bryan. You do not care to give it? Mr. Brunt. I would not want to say what are the profits of my con- cern, because if I said we were making nothing it would destroy our credit; and if I said we were making .30 per cent people would think it was very profitable. I do not waiit to state it as an individual. If a manufacturer is making 8 per cent on his capital he considers he is doing a fair business. Mr. Bryan. You have $80,000 invested? Mr. Brunt. We have $80,000 invested. I will submit this table, and then that will close my remarks, except as to the questions you may wish to ask me. This table I have copied from our books. It shows that the special articles manufactured by the potters have been reduced gradually year by year, and that, therefore, there is no neces- sity for any reduction of the tariff, because the only necessity that any one can suggest for a reduction of the tariff is to cheapen the article, and the cost of the article has been reduced. Mr. Bryan. I do not understand your statement. Did you say that prices have gone down? Mr. Brunt. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Did you state that there had been no change in the prices for the last three years? Mr. Brunt. Yes; I think there has been no change in prices during the last three years, with the exception of two articles, where the size has beeu increased and the prices also, owing to the larger size. We made larger sizes, and increased the price. There has, consequently, been over five years when the price has been going down. . Mr. Bryan. Do you mean to say that the reduction in the price of 'goods has been caused by the tariff? ■ Mr. Brunt. No, sir; I do not mean to say that the reduction in the price has been caused by the tariff, but has been caused by home com- petition. Mr. Bryan. By such associations as you belong to ? Mr. Brunt. By such associations. Mr. Bryan. Suppose one firm fixes the price and they find others selling below that price ? Mr. Brunt. If I were to tell you something in that connection you would not think it were true. If I were to tell you that the associatiou prevents prices going up- 90 EARTHENWARE. Mr. Bryan. Do you fix a cast-iron rule, so that you cau uot lower or raise the price? Mr. Bktjnt. We fix a cast-iron rule so that we can not raise it with- out the permission of the association. The average reduction in the United States from 1870 to 1893 on twenty-four articles has been 40J per cent. Mr. Bryan. And yet you can say that competition has done all that? Mr. Brunt. Competion has done all that. Mr. Bryan. Can competition reduce prices, except where prices are exorbitant? Mr. Brxjnt. Sometimes it can, unfortunately. I was going on to say that during the time these goods were reduced 40J per cent I took the wage book and found that the reduction in labor has been only 18 per cent. Mr. Bryan. In labor cost or in wages ? Mr. Brunt. In labor cost. Mr. Bryan. There has been a like reduction in materials t Mr. Brunt. I simply took labor. Selling price on helow-named C. C. ware. 1870. 1875. 1893. Per cent less between years 1870 and 1893. Bakers' 6.inch per dozen .. Bakers' 7-incli do ... . Bakers' 8-mcli do Bowls, 6s do Bowls, 9s do Bowls, 128 do Chambers, 6s do Chambers, 98 do Dishes, 8-inch do Dishes, 9-inch do. . .. Dishes, 10-inch do Dishes, 12-Lnch do Ewers and basins, 9s do Jugs, 128 do Jugs, 24s do Mugs, 30s do Bin. nappies, G.inch do. . .. Pin. nappies, 7-inch do Pin. nappies, 8-iuch do Plates, 6-inch -do Plates, 7-inch do Sugars, 30a do Hd. teas st. D per gross.. Unhd. teas st. D do $0.90 1.10 1.40 4.00 3.00 2.00 3.70 2.90 1.40 1.66 2.00 3.50 9.25 3.30 2.00 .86 .90 1.16 1.40 .55 .65 3.00 5.60 4.25 .98 1.19 3.57 2.70 1.82 3.50 2.80 1.19 1.47 1.75 3.80 7.88 2.98 1.75 .77 .88 1.12 1.33 .53 .63 2.63 5.25 4.20 $0.66 .77 .94 2.81 2.12 1.43 2.75 2.20 .94 1.16 1.38 2.20 6.19 2.34 1.38 .60 .69 .88 1.05 .44 .55 2.06 4.13 3.30 $0.60 .70 .85 2.55 1.93 1.30 2.50 2.00 .85 1.05 1.25 I 2. 00 I 6.63 I 2.13 1.25 .65 .63 .80 .95 .40 .50 1.88 3.75 3.00 $0.54 .63 .77 2.30 1.74 1.17 2.25 1.80 .77 .96 1.13 1.80 6.06 1.92 1.13 .50 .57 .72 .86 .36 .45 1.69 3.38 2.70 $0.54 .63 .77 2.30 1.74 1.17 2.25 1.80 .77 .95 1.13 1.80 5.03 .92 .13 .50 .57 .73 .86 .36 .45 1.69 3.38 2.70 40 42 »r 45 42i 42 414 39,V 37fi 45 43i 484 M,V 41,\ 43i 41W 36f 37„», 38j 34^ 30^3 43J 39/j 36^ Average, less cost, between years 1870 and 1893, on above twenty-four articles about 40| per cent. ' ' POTTERY. 91 Table showinf/ the difference paid for the same lator in EiigJand andin America. Enfrland, America. Per cent of ditlerence. Engineer or engine driver per week- . Laborers do — Watchman do Clay mixers do Plate-makers for 12 plates, 7-incl) Saucer-makers for 12 saucers, made by women in England and men in America Cups, per dozen of 12 complete, including making, turning, and band- ling, made by women and girls in England and men in America. - . HoUowTvare pressers, per dozen of 12 cover disbes, Siucb Giffgerraeu, covered cuarabera, complete per dozen . . Kjln bands t per day.. Dipper hands do .'. . Boys in dipping room will start at do — An average boy will make when learned "Women in biscuit wareroom "Women in glost wareroom Boys in glost wareroom start at Grlost warehousemen por day. . Printers, average price paid do — Fillers in or decorators, girls ilo. . . . rulers in or decorators, women do Gilders or gold workers, women do Teamsters do Foremen do... do--- $6.00 3.60 6.04 i.84 .025- • Olg • 0.5J .72 .36 l.i2 1.60 .06 .16 .26 .26 .06 1.00 1.08 .04 lio .K6 1. 20 1.60 $11.00 7.50 9.00 10. 00 .034 . lOi 1.11' .65 2.00 2.50 ■ ■m .66J .75 .75 .33V 2.00 2.60 .15 1.16 1.665 1.50 2.50 5.00 Average increase of American labor over English - 831 lOSi 78J 1064 190iJ 171? 176^ 545 80} 781 .'i6i 455;- 316J 188ft 188 », 455S 100 131i? 275' 364 108i 108i 212i 185 Price of principal materials enterinf/ into the cost of mamifact tiring earthenware in Eng- land and America. England. Per cent of difference. Ground flint jer ton . Cornwall stone in England and feldspar in America do..- Ballolay do.-- Cbina clay do... Coal do... Saggar clay Average increase of American materials over English $7.00 6.72 2.40 0.52 1.30 .84 $8.50 10.40 9.05 16.00 2.90 3.05 21? 64if 277Vj 130A% 123A 263jr 145 Failures in Trenton in twelve years. City Pottery. American Crockery Co. (Fiske). Clarke Bros. Eagle Pottery. Ott & Brewer. Union Pottery (Cooks). Pope & Lee. Trenton Pottery Co. Dowd Bros. Trenton China Co. Willets Manufacturing Co. Fell & Throp. statement of jerome jones, of boston, mass. Septembee 16, 1893. Mr. ChaiemaN: I come to represent the National Association of Wholesale Dealers in Crockery and Glass-ware. Our association is com- prised of members of firms in all the large cities of the United States. They are associated, not to combine on prices nor to fix prices, but to study the interests of the trade and in a "way to be better acquainted and come to "what "we call a better uuderstandiug as to the methods of doing business and the better understanding of the earnings of our help. 92 EARTHENWARE. Mr. Bryan. The association does not have any thing to do with prices? Mr. Jones. Nothing whatever. There is an understanding that no as- sociation shall give away the covering of tlie ]mckages. It provides that there shall be a uniform price attending the sale of all packages. There was a disposition on the part of some of the members to fix prices on some of the goods, but others would not agree to it. There were too many dif- ferences of opinion and no agreement could be arrived at. We stand be- tween the consumer and the various manufacturers. For instance, we import largely from England, France, Germany, Austria, Japan, and we also sell largely in the markets where we buy. In other words, we are interested in high prices as we supply the wants of the American people. We own no interest in any pottery, but we are assumed to be intelli- gent buyers, and, therefore, we as importers, are aware of the prices of merchandise and we stand as a barrier between the importer and the merchant as to prices of goods that people want. There is no doubt but what the claim ofthe potters can bejustified in saying that crockery has been reduced in price in the last twenty years. Presumably this has been during the period covering these high tariff taxes, but there are other facts that are responsible for the reduction in cost of pottery. The rates of tariff have not always been the controlling factor, as I can prove to you in two minutes. There have been two or three inventions that have been of enormous importance in reducing prices within the last twenty-five years. One of those improvements was in the old-fash- ioned bin where the coal was put in directly into the flue fire and much of it was wasted. They now have a patent ^vhich nearly doubles the saving in fuel, or rather furnishes nearly double the heating capacity of the old kiln. Another influence has come in the shape of the displace- ment of hand power. This has been adopted in other countries as well as in America. Another important factor, within a few years, has been the introduction of ths lithographic transfer process. They now take a plate and spray leaves or foliage upon it, and instead of having to spray it carefully by hand they simply wipe a ijieee of tissue paper on the lithographic transfer process and wipe that on the plate, and it is done almost as rapidly as I have told you. I am willing to give the domestic potters the benefit of the claim that they have helped to introduce' wares to create competition be- tween the home and foreign manufacturers. But you must not lose sight of the fact that there is competition between the English, French, and Chinese potters, which brings the price of the products down. The cause of bringing the price down have been these new methods of firing the ware. That and decoration have gone together. They have both had their effects in leducing the cost. We find, as dealers and importers, that the present tariff law is very troublesome in its ambiguity, and I want to show you a practical test. Yesterday morning I left Boston, and I selected a teapot similar to the one which has been shown here. It is a yellow mug. There was a little stripe around it. I asked the appraiser to send me word what would be the rate of duty on it. I sent a messenger to him for the in- formation, as I wanted to get away and wanted a quick answer. He sent word back that it would be 60 per cent duty because there was a stripe on it. The McKinley bill says, that any ware printed, etc., shall be dutiable at the rate of 00 per cent. That is dutiable at 60 per cent, , and it is one of the commonest and cheapest things in the kitchen. That plain yellow mug should be 25 per cent. If I were to enter it in an invoice, I should be charged 60 per cent on account of the orna- mentation. That will show you that there is great ambiguity in the POTTERY. 93 law, for the appraiser gave me this answer after he had had two years' experience in the office. Ton can not blame him because he does not know. Mr. Byntjm. If you had to import that they would charge you 60 per cent, and you would add that to the price 1 Mr. Jones. Yes, sir. Mr. Byntjm. If you got a return of that difference in duty ydu would take both 1 Mr. Jones. Tes, sir; the consumer would bare the burden, and we would walk off with the difference. Mr. Bryan. Is not that one of the evils of the present law that this common ware is sometimes decorated to cover up a defect and in- creases in price 1 Mr. J ONES. That is one of the troubles. Another point is that we ask that the duty on packages, which was raised from 40 per cent to 55 per cent, be left unchanged. In 1883 the tariff commission bill made the duty on packages free, and raised the duty on the contents from 40 to 50 per cent to compensate for that. The McKinley bill reimposed the duty on packages which added to the taxes on all pot- tery that came in — increased the duty virtually. We ask you either to abolish the duty or take off the outside package duty, and so define the law that there shall be no ambiguity about that. There should be no duty on crates and sacks and packages of that kind. That crate and package duty clause has brought a thousand or more cases into the Supreme Court, because it was drawn so bunglingly. Mr. Payne. They brought in more valuable pa(;kages than were usually used for such goods? Mr. Jones. Yes, sir ; they took advantage of the law. They would take a thimble worth a penny in England, put it in a morocco case, satin lined, and that would come in duty free, and it might have cost more than $10. Mr. Bryan. It was not the ordinary case for that purpose? Mr. Jones. Ko, sir; it was never so intended. It was unfortunate that that was done under the law of 1883, because it caused its abolition. I think the outside packages on cases and crates should not be so onerous. I think I can prove that by stating that while to- day on English earthenware the rate is 55 per cent the administrative act brought the duty up to 66 per cent. That is the duty paid on com- mon washbowls and chamber sets and on cups and saucers. If you are going to retain the duty on packages, it is only fair to have a com- pensatory rate based on such reduction as may be made. Then another point upon which I wish to speak — ^that is as to the reestablishment of the damage allowance. To-day, if a ship comes in water-logged and there is damage to the amount of one-half the cargo, the importer is compelled to pay the full duty on property that does not exist. I submit that this is an outrage upon the citizen of the United States who happens to be an importer. Mr. Turner. What percentage would cover that? Mr. Jones. I do not suppose it would amount to 2 per cent on a cargo of crockery ware. Mr, Payne. How much would it amount to on an average? Mr. Jones. There is a great deal of difference between the tariff at Boston and New York in that respect. Mr. Payne. There was a great difference between the importers as to the amount of damages claimed. Mx. Jokes. Yes, sir; I will undertake to say that in Boston it does 94 EARTHENWARE. not amount to more than 2 per cent and I will undeitake to say that in New York it is abused, because it is a larger city, and the administra- tion of the custom laws has been much more corrupt. Mr. Payne. On the larger part of the importations this clause was abused, and while it should not be over 2 per cent it amounted to a larger proportion and was a fraud upon the Government? Mr. Jones. Yes, sir. The Chaieman. Do the importers insure against such damages? Mr. Jones. I do not think they do. Mr. Tttrnee. The underwriter would want these back? Mr. Jones. It is a question of assuring a total loss and the particu- lar average. For years we have insured for total losses because the trouble in certifying was such that we would rather loose the whole, and for that reason we let it stand. I had a talk with the collector of the port of Boston about this very question of damage allowance, a.^d asked him to take his pencil and indicate how the law ought to be changed. He said "The law is all right. The fault is with the Kew York custom-house. The Government ought to be able to put a man there who will certify as to damage allowances. The Government ought not to put a man there who has not to be bought. I do not like to intimate that the United States is not capable of putting up the proper estimate on damage allowances, in cases where the ship comes in filled with water. I think that it is right that the importer should be indemnified in case of a loss on the sea." I want to suggest that I have talked with some potters in reference to the question of a reduction on the tariff. If you could jDut their raw material on the free list, that of itself would be a recognition. There is a question also of clays. There is hardly a State in the Union which has not more or less clays that are presumably sometime to be used somewhat in the potteries. Some States have better clays than others. There are a great many clays mined in this country which are used for paper and it is also put into soap. The clay miners tell me that a large part of their business was from soap manufacturers. If you take a cake of soap with a great deal of clay in it and wash your hands in a bowl of water the Avater will be quite turbid. Mr. Turner. There is a duty on soap ? Mr. Jones. There ought not to be. It ought to be free. As to the merchandise which comes into contact with the custom-house, I want to say a word as to the general appraisers law. This has been brought about by reason of the McKinley bill. I think that the old merchant appraisers system was wrong. It let one merchant into the secrets of another, and I have no doubt that the Government was wronged many times by the system they had of favoring one another. Under the present system in New York you can get what the Constitution re- quires — equal duties in all places. You have one bureau, and one duty covers them all. Under the old system they had one duty in San Francisco, one in Boston, and another in New York. I feel it is due to the Board of Appraisers in New York to say that they satisfied the merchants, and the merchants have no doubt that the Board of Ap- praisers have brought about a thorough and more advantageous system than existed under the old one, which was, in case a local appraiser and the merchant disagreed about an invoice it was the duty of the collector to appoint a merchant in that line, and that merchant was to sit with the general appraiser in that place, and they settled the matter. If they disagreed then the collector step])e(l in. Therefore, I believe that the present Board is the one that can best administer the duties on POTTERY. 95 that part of tlie law more- uuiformly and more tliorongli]y than under the old system. I want to call attention to another fact, and that is in the progress of the development of the crockery ware business. The present duty on Eocldngham ware and yellow ware is such that while twenty-five years ago there was a part of it imported the duty to-day is prohibitory. Rockingham yellow ware has not been imported for several years. I do not believe that there has been a crate of it imported. The tariff is a barrier and it has absolutely excluded the foreign Eockingham ware from this country. Mr. Taesnet. The cheaper grades ? Mr. Jones. Yes. That used in all of our kitchens. I simply assure you that that is a fact. Mr. Bkyaw. What would be the cost of that if it were brought in without a tariff! Mr. Jones. The present combination between manufacturers would have to disappear. To-day manufacturers have a combination under which they are under severe penalties if they undersell, and if the duty should come down 20 per cent that would make no difference, because the home pottery would not be lower. Mr. Taesnet. That would 'dissolve this close corporation? Mr. Jones. It would at least make them take a rail off the fence. Mr. Bkyan. Can you tell what proportion is controlled by this trust? Mr. Jones. I should say on the produce of this country it would be 30 per cent in bulk and perhaps one-half of that amount in value. Mr. Bryan. That is a lower grade of goods ? Mr. Jones. Yes, sir; a sample of that was shown here. Mr. Taesney. Can you give any reason why that trust does not ex- tend to the other grades ? Are there any trade reasons ? Mr. Jones. The difflculty I suppose is in defining decorated ware. Mr. Taesney. Is it not due to the fact that the rates of duty on the higher grades are not prohibitory as they are on these grades ? Mr. Jones. Undoubtedly. Mr. Taesney. Notwithstanding competition from abroad is such as to destroy this combination f Mr. Jones. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Since this association was formed have prices increased on any line of crockery made by the association ? Mr. Jones. I don't think they have. Mr. Payne. Do you not know they have not ? Mr. Jones. No, sir. Mr. Payne. Are you a member of an association of crockery dealers ? Mr. Jones. I am. Mr. Payne. How long have you been a member of that association ? Mr. Jones. Several years. Mr. Payne. You say that it is formed for social and business pur- poses. Have prices anything to do with it ? Mr. Jones. I am absolutely free. Mr. Pay'NB. Has the association anything to do with the price of crockery. Mr. Jones. I can not say that it has. Mr. Payne. You are a member of it ? Mr. Jones. I did say that it had no effect on the prices except as to the package clause. On that it would be $2 for a crate. It is intended to increase the price on that. Mr. Payne. It compels them to charge for packages a certain rate ? 96 EARTH EN WAKE. Mr. Jones. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Prior to that yon had been giving away packages? Mr. Jones. Not if I knew it. Mr. Payne. Some of the parties had been doing that? Mr. Jones. Some of my competitors had. That was one of the troubles and that was one of the things that caused a change of the law. Mr. Payne. You say that the association has not increased prices? Mr. Jones. No, sir. Mr. Payne. Has the association any rule in reference to discounts ? Mr. Jones. We have this rule: For instance, if a buyer should buy on sixty days and should not be able to pay we have an understanding that he is not to be charged more than 1 per cent. Mr. Payne. There is an understanding that you would not be will- ing to make more than 1 per cent. Mr. Jones. Yes, sir; in the case I have mentioned. Mr. Payne. Is there any agreement as to freights? Mr. Jones. No, none whatever. Mr. Payne. How long have you been in the business of importing goods ? Mr. Jones. About forty years, the first of June. Mr. Payne. Did you go into the business with a large amount of capital? Mr. Jones. I started with one second-hand suit of clothes. Mr. Payne. How much have you invested now? Mr. Jones. I do not know, but I have got a small reasonable com- petency. Mr. Payne. That might be one thing to you and another thing to me. What is the capital that you have invested? Mr. Jones. That I never tell anybody, except my wife, and I have not told it to her. Mr. Payne. What profits per year have you made for the last three years in your business? Mr. Jones. That I never tell to anybody but my wife. Mr. Bryan. That is another family secret? Mr. Jones. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. It has been suggested that as you want the duties re- duced on those commodities it would increase your business. You do not know but that some of the other members of the committee would want to know what your profits were as an importer in order to be able to frame a tariff bill. I mention this for fear Mr. Bryan might forget to ask the question. Mr. Jones. That is all right. Mr. Eeed. I suppose you think that to lower the rate of duty would cause an increased consumption and an increased revenue? Mr. Jones. I suppose we would be quite selfish in that, bat I think it is fair to say that if the duties were to be lowered our homes would be better supplied with satisfactory styles of ware and the consumer would own that ware at the lowest cost. Mr. Tarsney. Is not that class of goods manufactured in this country? Mr. Jones. Yes, sir; that is a character of ware that is unique. This is blue canton china, and it is hard and coarse but fashionable among high grade families. That comes from China exclusively. The wonder is everybody wants it. There is a certain amount imported yearly. T omitted to say that we thought in the arrangement of schedules one POTTERY. 97 rate of duty on both China and earthenware would simplify, and in the ad valorem principle, the value would carry the tax; for'exami)lc: a dozen white plates costing 2 shillings, 50 cents, 40 per cent tax is 20 cents; a dozen richly decorated China plates costing £2, $10, 40 per cent tax is $4; so that the goods for the million and those for the mil- lionaire would each bear its fair bund en of tariff tax; we think also that 40 per cent be the rate in lieu of 55 and GO, and no duty on outside packages, crates, casks, and cases. statement of feed. a. walkee, pottee, teenton, n. j. September 46, 4893. Mr. Chairman: I have come here to state to the committee that I am one of a committee of pottery worlcers from Trenton, whom I repre- sent. ^Ye represent the industry in other communities. So much time has been consumed that we will only speak of the trade as it lelates to Trenton. "We are interested as operatives. I want to present 1o you a set of resolutions adopted at a convention of pottery workers held at Trenton in 4S78, which I have been instructed to do. We are here as a committee appointed at a mass meeting held in Trenton to petition the Ways and Means Committee and Congress in the preparation of a new duty on crockery and ask that they will c^S:J7 a set. I have also a set of decorated ware which has equally decreased in price, I liud that a set of '-IS pieces POTTERY. 99 sold iu 1880 for $0.50, and tlie same sells to-day for the same price. I want to state that the man who has had charge of that decorative de- partment told me positively that these goods Avere superior to those Avhich were sold in 1880. We have made considerable progress iu decoration. A set which sold in 1880 for SSO.80 can be bought to-day for $3.75. In toilet ware we find that prices have equally decreased. A set of white granite ware which sold iu 1880 for ft2.80, sells to-day for $2.62. The 10 pieces which sold in 1880 for >?l.do, sell to day for $1.50. It is clear that the tavitf has had the effect to keep up wages, even though there has been an apparently small redaction. I do not think that there has been a reduction amounting to 5 per cent in our wages. The larger portion of the reduction has been on the common grades of goods, from the fact that some of them are ou the free list. Since 1887 there have bceu only two reductions on the common grade of goods. This is evidence to me that the tariff on crockery has not had the effect of reducing our wages. In fact, I think it is shown that the development of this in- dustry in years past has been very great. I may say to Mr. Bryan and the members of the committee, that although I can not answer his question quite positively, froui statistics, that from the best informa- tion which I can get, there is not, at the present time, in all lines of crockery produced in this country, more than 50 per cent of home prod- uct consumed in this country, even under this high tariff. The increase in i^rices under the JIcKinley bill was so imperceptible that it did not make any showing in 1880, and yet the consumption has increased, while the amount manufactured in this country has not increased to a large extent. Mr. Taes?JEY. When you say the domestic manufactories only sup- ply one-half of the American demand, why do you attribute the reduc- tion in price to American competition? Mr. Walkbr. Simply because I believe that caused the prices to go so low as to force many of them out of the business. Mr. Tarsney. If foreign goods had been imported would domestic competition have produced this restilt? Mr. Walker. I suppose that domestic competition would not have increased. Mr. Tarsney. But competition has not alone reduced the foreign prices when you have only supplied one-half the demand of the country ? Mr. Walker. That is a question which I can not answer accurately as I am only an operative. I represent the potters of Trenton, and I hope you will at least give this matter your most serious consideration. Mr. Tarsney. You have stated that the American labor cost in this industry was 60 per cent more than in England"? Mr. WALitER. I said it ran over 60 per cent. We receive 00 per cent at least. Mr. Tarsney. Now, do you not think that 55 or 60 per cent duty levied upon this product is ample protection for the difference in wages ? Mr. Walker. Yes, sir. Mr. Tarsney. Do you not think that it is a little hard and unjust to the consumer of this product? Mr. Walker. jSTo, sir. . ■ Mr. Taiisney. In order to make up this 00 per cent you think it requires 60 per cent on the aggregate cost of the goods? Mr. Walker. I think that there is a reduced ]nice on crockery sell- ing to-day because it is lower than it was ten years ago. 100 EAETHENWAEE. Mr. Tabsney. You state that tlie wages of Labor is GO per cent more than it is in Ens;Iand? Mr. Walker. I stated that we received CO per cent more thaa in all brandies. My own branch receives as high as J 00 per cent. Mr. Tarsney. 'There is no branch which receives less than 60 per cent"? Mr. Walker. ]t:fot as I understand it. Mr. Tarsney. Did j^ou liear tlie statistics read by Mr. Ikirt, the Kepreseutative of the East Liverpool district? Mr. Walker. I did not. Mr. Tarsney. Did you hear him state that the wages statistics showed that the wages were about equal there and here ? Mr. Walker. I wish to state why this is so. Mr. Tarsney. You have stated that there was a differeuee of GO per cent. Mr. Walker. I am speaking of mechanics' wages. Mr. Tarsney. You stated that there was no branch in tliis industry in which the cost was less than 60 per cent. Mr. Walicer. Yes, I repeat that statement. The simple fact is that the Representatives' figures are for boys and girls employed, and not for mechanics. He did not quote a single man who rccci\cd less than 60 per cent. I challenge the correctness of that statement. Mr. Bryan. You speak from the standpoint of an operative; I want to ask you, Avhat you think of this proposition: Do you believe that a reduction of the tariff would reduce the price of goods ? Tliat is, would the manufacturers have to sell the goods for less if the tariff -was reduced ? Mr. Walker. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Do you think that the price would bring a reduction to the laborer in wages '? Mr. Walker. Most assuredly. Mr. Bryan. Have you any knowledge or have you made any compu- tation shoAviug whether you have received better wages than those working in other unprotected occupations, like farming * Mr. Walker. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. What right do you think you have to ask a man work- ing in Nebraska in competition with the cheapest hiborcis in the world and at less wages than you receive, to pay more for what he buys in order that you may get more wages than he '? Mr. Walker. I want to answer that intelligently. I do not think that that is hardly a fair proposition on this account. I do not think that my wages should be brought down on account of that man re- ceiving lower wages. I would rather see the standard of that man's wages raised, so that the man in Xebraska should get better paid in order to enable him to pay the extra price for his cr(ickery. Mr. Bryan. Have you any plan by which he can get higher pav for his labor? Mr. Walker. 'No, sirj I did not come here for that purpose. Mr. Bryan. Will you give me any reason for the position you take that that man should pay higher for what he buys in order that your wages may keep up when he is receiving less wages than you are? Mr. Walker. I do not think, as an operative, considering the ex- pense of living, that we receive any too much for our labor. Mr. Bryan. I am not saying you do, but you recognize that that man has no protection whatever against the cheaper labor of the old world. He sends his product to Liverpool, has to pay freight for its transportation, while the product which you manufacture is sold in POTTERY. 101 competition with the foreign product after it comes here. Do you not know that the average farm wages is not more than $18 per month? Mr. Walker. I do not know wliat it is. Mr. Bryan. The report issued by the last admhiistration shows about that to be the average wages paid to the farm laborer in this country. Mr. Payne. What report is that"? Mr. Bryan. That is the report issued by Secretary Rnsv. [To the witness :] You come before this committee and represent that the labor- ing men engaged in your industry do not receive sufficient wages? Mr. Walker. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. -You come prepared with statistics and you say that you are receiving 60 or 100 per cent more than the same men employed in the farming industry? Mr. Walker. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Can yon give us, injustice or in right, any good reason why the people who buy your goods and who receive less wages than you do, should be made to bear this extraordinary burden for your benefit? Mr. Walker. I did not come here to answer any such question. Mr. Payne. If wages have steadily advanced for the last thirty years under the protective tariff figures, that would take away some of the strength of the question proposed by Mr. Bryan? Mr. Walker. It certainly would. Mr. Payne. You are a skilled laborer? It requires more skill to learn your business than to learn the business of farming? Mr. Walker. 1 should judge so, when a man has to serve six years' apprenticeship. Mr. Payne. You recognize that skilled labor is entitled to more than unskilled labor? Mr. Walker. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. And you have come over here without any intimation from the manufacturers that they wanted you to come? Mr. Walker. Positively. Mr. Payne. There has been no reduction in wages except in the manufacture of sanitary ware, or plumbers' supplies? Mr. Walker. Xo, sir. Mr. Payne. That is a small portion of the business. In the bulk of the business there has been no decrease in wages? Mr. Walker. No, sir. Mr. Payne. It has not been to exceed 5 per cent in the last ten or twelve years? Mr. Walker. ISTot since 1888. Mr. Payne.' Is it not a fact that in some lines of business i^rices have advanced within the last twenty-five years? " Mr. Walker. Yes, sir. Mr. PA.YNE. These are the branches which have made the higher grades of goods? Mr. Walker. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Of course the higher grade of goods command higher wages. Has there not been a readjustment of wages generally since 1888? Mr. Walker. There has been a readjustment in this way, that some men in the better grade of goods who are skilled have been receiving a little higher wages. Mr. Payne. You say yon represent some 5,000 workingmeu? 102 EARTHENWARE. Mr. Walker. Tes, sir. Mr. Payne. Are they uuited'? Mr. Walker. I have not heard a single oj3,iec.tion to this tariff. Mr. Payne. Are Eepublicans and Democrats alike united! Mr. Walkke. There are a number of potters who are Democrats, but they are firm in their belief iu protection. Mr. Bryan. How long did you work as an apprentice before you be- came skilled? Mr. Walker. Five years. Mt. Bryan. I suppose that a farmer may work twenty years at that business and remain a raw laborer? Mr. Walker. I have had no experience in farmiug. Mr. Bynum. Were you at work in this coiintry iu 1SS3? Mr. Walker. Tes, sir. jMr. Bynum. Was there any increase in wages in 1883? Mr. Walker. There was,' just about the time the potters were branching out in this country in a line of porcelain goods. J\lr. Bynxim. You say that'there are in Trenton two firms which are in the liands of a receiver. j\Ir. Walker. One went into the hands of a receiver about three or four months ago. Mr. Bynum. That has all occurred since the passage of the McKin- ley bill? Mr. Walker. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynum. It is worse than I thought it was. Mr. Payne. In the last ten years more than three have gone into the hands of a receiver? Mr. Walker. Yes, sir; had the Mills bill passed I think that almost every thing m Trenton would have gone into the hands of a receiver. ilr. IjRYAN. Was that told you by the manufacturers 1 Mr. ^VALKER. Xo, sir; that was my own opinion. Mr. Bryan. Did they not tell you they would shut up if the Mills bill went into effect? Mr. Walker. They told us that there would have to be a readjust- ment of the selling prices. Mr. Bryan. Did they tell you that wages Avould be reduced if the Mills bill went into effect? Mr. ^VALKER. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. It was not necessary for them to tell you that? Mr. Walker. No, sir ; we knew it. Mr. Bryan. What reduction did the Mills bill make? Mr. AValker. I do not Ictiow that I can ijitelligently answer that. ]\Ir. Bryan. That bill only made one reduction iu the pottery schedule ? Mr. Walker. I could not state. You have the statistics. Mr. Bryan. You know that if that bill had gone into effect it would have mined the industry? Mr. Walker. I know that we would have suffered. Mr. Br VAN. You know that? Mr. Walker. I believe that. Mr. Bryan. You believe that without knowing what the bill provided? Mr. Walker. You do not ask practical questions. I do not tliink it is right to ask me questions on which I ought uot to be expected to have personal knowledge. POTTERY. 103 STATEMENT OF W. V. BLAKE, OF EAST LIVERPOOL, OHIO. Mr. OnArnMAN. In bciialf of my fellow- woikmeii, the Operative Potters of the Ohio Valley, I respectfnlly ask yoiT not to lower the schedule on pottery. Any reduetiou of the tariff will nuist assuredly reduce'our wages and degrade our labor. It will endanger the pros- perity and happiness of the Avnerlcau potter. For the sake of the hundreds of idle potters who are now walking the streets; for tlie sake of our wives and children, we implore you not to reduce the tariff. As an American citizen and pfttter, I ask you, in the name of all that is nol)le and good in civilized life, to let the safeguard of our industry stand erect. To reduce the tariff will be the death-blow to our factories. We do not come here to dictate to you, we come liere as suppliants. Oentlemen, the responsibility rests with you. Will yon elevate the honest toiler by alloAving the tariff to remain, or will you humiliate and degrade labor by the advocacy of lower tariff ? I pray God that the results of your deliberation be such as shall cheer the hearts autl en- courage the 9,000 potters of the Ohio Valley. We beg of you to recognize no conditions that will allow our indus- try to come in competition with foreign products. The grades of ware we are manufacturing to-day will not only bear favorable comparison with any ware made in the world, but stands second to none. There- fore, T ask you again to allow the tariff to stand as it now exists. STATEMENT OF WILLIAM BURGESS, OF TRENTON, N. J. Mr. Chairman. The time is so very short that I am afraid that I can not do justice to my end of this affair, but I will try to condense it as much as possible and will present a few trenchant iacts. We all recognize the fact that the cause of the manufacturing potters and the operativ-e potters is one and the same. We have no thought that we iis manufacturers ought to come here to bolster uj) our own industry from our own standpoint. We thought that something ought to be said in regard to the workingmeu, but they ha\e been here and have pleaded their own cause. They have told you distinctly that their wages are entirely dependent upon the tariff. We come here not to ask that the tariff rates be increased, but that we do get better pro- tection. If we had a duty now levied at 55 and 60 per cent and it could be collected, we would have sufficient protection, but there is no in- dustry that I know of that is so open to loopholes for fraud as this particular branch. When goods arri\'e I defy any examiner to take a crate of ware and state what is in the shipment or to tell how a single sample may coaipare with a crate of goods. It is difficult to tell the different qualities of ware. There are a great many goods imported into this corrntry as inferiors, seconds and thirds, and lump. We have no way of preventing that. We have no chance of stopping that kind offi-aud. That is e([ual to a reduction of the rate. I can assure you, gentlemen, from facts that have been stated and that have come to my knowledge and from what I know also, that a number of works are in the hands of receivers, and owing to the dei)ressed coiulition of busi- ness that there is no profit, worth speaking of, at the present time in the crockery business. There may be individual cases where, perhaps, some manufacturer has made 10 per cent, but I will guarantee that there has not been, as a wliole, any thing like S per cent made in the business in the last three to live years. The amount of labor entering 104 EARTHENWARE. into the product is 90 per cent of tlie cost. From 50 to CO per cent of tlie actual amount paid on our pay-roll labor cost. The material makes up tlie balance. The pott(!rs of the United States do not wist a reduction of the duty on clays and raw material, for the simple reason that they recognize that raw materials, having been protected, have developed resources in this country that have never been known to exist before. We have now a number of clays developed within the past few years. I have a prospectus of one of the concerns which I will leave. The quality of these clays have been recognized by the manufacturers of this country and foreign countries as equal to anything presented to the pottery manufacturers of the world. This is particularly the case with refer- ence to tlie clays produced in Florida, North and South Carolina, Vir- ginia, and Texas. Those clays are worth from $2& to $80 per ton. Mr. Payne. You refer to kaolin"? Mr. Burg-ess. It is china clay or disintegrated rock, and worth from 87.50 to $10 per ton. Mr. Payne. The duty is about 33^ per cent. Mr. BuEaESS. We do not use foreign material. Mr. Payne. If you do not use more than 10 per cent and the duty on the material is 33.^ per cent of course free clay would not cut much of a figure. Mr. Burgess. But the proportion of the material is more than 10 per cent. Mr. Pay^ne. Toil say that labor is 90 per ccnf? Mr. BuEGESS. The total labor that we pay is from 50 to CO iDcr cent, perhaps 55 per cent. Mr. Bryan. You have the total product of your own factory ? Mr.. BuEGESs. I have the total product of very nearly all the fac- tories in the country. Mr. Bryan. You have that of your own factory? Mr. Burgess. Yes, sir; it is in the neighborhood of stSl 75,000. Mr. Bryan. What is your pay roll ! Mr. Burgess. About $80,000. Mr. Bryan. A little less than 50 per cent. Mr. Burgess. Yes, sir; of the total amount. Mr. Payne. It does not include packing and shipping and making sales? Mr. Burgess. No, sir. Mr. Payne. How much does the pay roll amount tol Mr. Burgess. It would amount to'betweeu $90,000 and $100,000. We have a total number of eighty-one potteries in this country. They are distributed as follows: Twenty-six in New York; eiglit in Oliio: five in ]\lary]and; three in Pennsylvania; one in Indiana; five in West Virginia; one in Massachusetts; one in Illinois; two in Virginia, and othei's in the different States. Tlie capital invested is about $8,000,000, and the annual product is iVoin $8,000,000 to $9,000,000. The value of the material used, including fuel, is in the neighborhood of $1,()()0.000 and the wages paid is about $4,000,000, and the number of em]iloyea is from 10,000 to 12,000. Mr. Payne. You produce about two-thirds of the consumption of the country? Mr. Burgess. We calculate that we produce a little over one-half of the consumption of the ordinary Hues of goods. The material in the ground is worth $25 to $50 a ton. It is worth from $8 to $10 a ton when it is ready for the potter. When it is made into a plate it POTTERY. 105 brings the value up to $80 per ton. When it goes through the hands of the decorator, it is increased 332 per cent. In tlie finest grade of goods, when mannfactnred it is worth considerably more than its weight in gokl. This shows that the labor which enters into the man- ufacture of goods adds vastly to its price. We do not want a reduction in the duties on clays simply because it has developed clays in this country that we knew not of. For every reduction of 15 per cent, taking it in round numbers, in the rate of duty, the wages of the men must come down 15 per cent, in order to equalize things. The manufacturers do not intend to come before this body as manu- facturers, but out of justice to labor, for they fear being misunderstood by labor and they fear being misunderstood by this committee. We have therefore come here to present this matter so that if any tamper- ing is done with the tariff that will injure the industry we want the blame to rest where it belongs and not with the manufacturers. Mr. Bryan. How long have you been in the business! Mr. Burgess. Since 18; 9. Mr. Bryan. Have any reductions in wages been made during that time? Mr. Burgess. There was one partial reduction of 8 per cent. It amounted to a total reduction of only about 2 per cent. It was counter- balanced because we increased the wages in making a certain class of goods of an irregular shape. Mr. Bryan. But for the ordinary grade of goods there has been no increase*? Mr. Burgess. The goods I mention are ordinary goods. They take the place of the oval-shaped covered dish. They were made with square corners and sold at the same price. They were more difficult to make, and we recognized that by giving more wages for them. Mr. Bryan. Was that reduction of 8 per cent caused by the reduc- tion of the tariff'? Mr. Burgess. ISTo, sir; there was no reduction on the tariff' in 1885. Mr. Bryan. Was there any strike against that reduction? Mr. Burgess. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. You did not lay that reduction at the door of the Ways and Means Committee, at that time? Mr. Burgess. ISTo, sir. Mr. Bryan. But in case there is a reduction made now, you would lay that to the Ways and Means Committee? Mr. Burgess. Undoubtedly. Mr. Tarsney. Was that reduction per piece or per diem ? Mr. Burgess. It was 40 per cent on piece work. Almost every thing in pottery is made on an increased schedule in point of size. Mr. Payne. Wages depend somewhat upon piece prices, and there- fore tvhatever invention has been introduced has resulted to the bene- fit of the laborer, rather than to the manufacturer ? Mr. Burgess. It has been for the benefit of the laborer in almost every instance. Mr. Bryan. The laborer, you say, gets more wages but not more per piece ? Mr. Burgess. He gets less per piece but makes more wages at the end of the week. Mr Bryan. Is there any instance in your industry where you pay the same per piece as you did in 1870? Mr. Burgess. Yes, sir; that is the case in what is known as pressed 106 EARTHENWARE. ware; such pieces as covered dishes, saucers, soup tureeus, and that class of goods. Mr. Payne. Notwitlistandiug the machinery which you use the work must be done mostly by hand? Mr. BUKGESS. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Each piece must be handled 1 Mr. BuKGESS. Yes, sir; making a vast number of handlings. Mr. Payne. The work is done by contact with the liuman hand, and no machine has yet been made as a substitute for the human hand in that business. Mr. BuKGESS. No, sir; except in the melting department. Mr. Payne. Melting is done by hand. Mr. BuKGESS. Yes, sir; a certain class of goods must be handled in the making. One of the great difficulties of the pottery business is that when ware is made it is not finished. It is in the clay and is in a brittle state. It has, after the first fire, to be taken out, sanded, brushed, dipped, and fired again. There is a- great deal of loss. We would earnestly request that there be no change in the classifi- cation on pottery goods. There was in the old bill of 18S3 a loophole for bringing in certain classes of crockery ware as toys. Tliat has been stopped by the McKiidey bill. That custom of bringing in toys entirely ruined the manufacturers in that class of goods in this coiTntiy. Mr. Payne. Was there not some trouble in tlie law of 188.3, whereby they brought in some goods as not decorated, when they were decorated. Goods were imported as not decorated so as to get in at a lower rate? Mr. BuEGESS. Y"es, sir. Mr. Payne. That is not the case under the law of 1890. Mr. Jones had something to say about that. Mr. BuiiGESS. Y^es, sir; that was the package clause. I was glad to hear Mr. Jones recommend a continuance of that in the pottery busi- ness, because there has been no one thing that has so injured the busi- ness as that fraud. I have known of instances wliere the package on croclcery was over 50 per cent of the value of the invoice. Mr. Taesney. In a case of that kind it would not be the (n'dinary package? Mr. Burgess. I have known a case where there was a certain number of plates packed in fancy boxes to be used for other pnrjioses, when the box was opened. This fact has been referred to, that 10 per cent of the revenue on packages aniounted to a 10 ix'r cent increase of duty. Y'ou can figure out that on the cheapest class of goods. It did not amount to 5 per cent. Mr. Beyan. Have you an ofiice across the water? Mr. BuEGESS. We sell on the other side. When the McKinley bill went into etfe(;t there was a slight change in the prices of numnfac- turers on this side, but I do not think that the importers can say that we increased the prices on this side. Mr. Taesney. If an article sold at 2 cents over there it would be given away here, because the price could not drop below that, and you say that the seller dropped the selling price to correspond with the duty? Mr. Btjegess. Tlic article woiild not be given away; it would fmd another market. Tilings of that kind have been done. Tliere is no question but what the foreign manufacturers are eagerly looking at the present time to this country, which is the best market in the trade. This is what they tell me. It has been said that the duty increases the cost of the goods. I had sent to me in 1889 a plate from a certain POTTERY. 107 dealer, whicli is a conntovpart of the one displayed here. I could not tiud tlie oiiginal one. They wanted ns to loannfacture one like it, which would sell at 10 cents per plate, or $1 per dozen. When I went on the other side of tlie water I happened to recognize one of these plates in a window, and I went in and asked the retail price of the plate, to which I have referred, and learned tliat it was 10 cents. The retail price was 10 cents, or 81.21* a dozen. We are making this article to-day to take the place of that. The matter of failures I will not touch upon, as that has been pretty well treated. The matter of natural advantages has been mentioned on some occa- sions. We claim to have no natural advantage. We have had preju- ■ dices to contend with, which prejudices liave been fostered in the minds of the American people by many of the importers, so much that I know of some who have sold inferior goods. No matter liow old the goods may be the dealers will x)nt them on the table and make them appear as new English goods. That is business. That is why they get trade. Tliey have worked up and fostered this prejudice against American goods. We have to carry in this country a much larger stock than they do in England. I was greatly surprised on entering a manufactory in Englnnd of twenty-one kilns — we have only six kilns — and we carry a stoL'li on an average of $40,000 woith. The manufacturer abroad told me that in his works of twenty-one kilns tliey only had $8,000 in stock. Eight thousand dollars in stock with twenty-one kilns, against $40,000 in stock and six kilns ! We need more capital to do business than they. JVIr. TARTs^gEY. Wliat is the cause of that difference? Mr. BuEciESS. They do business on orders and are not compelled to keep the stock which we keep. Our stock usually runs down at Christ- mas time. Mr. Payne. Why is it that he gets along with so small a stock? Mr. BuKGESS. The orders are sent there and the goods are shipped immediately to this country and in many cases they invoice the bill of lading, which is taken to the bank and they get the money. Mr. Payne. The importer keeps the stock? Mr. Burgess. Yes, sir. The jobber in this country largely uses American manufacturers as a matter of convenience. We have to carry a stock and if they want goods they will buy. We have to keep the stock and if they want it they come and buy. We book the order sent to them to fill. They get the cream and we get the skimmed milk. We have no geogra])hical protection in this line of goods. The rate from San Francisco to Xew York is in the neignborhood of $23 per ton. The rate from Liverpool to San Francisco I have known to be as low as $l.no for the same line of goods. Mr. Payne, llow does the rate from Liverpool compare with the rate from Trenton to New York ? j\rr. Burgess. It is about one-half the price of the rate from Trenton to New York. Mr. Payne. Is that the rate at the present time? Mr. Burgess. It is a little more. Mr. Payne. How much more? Mr. Burgess. I am not prepared to answer that accurately. Mr. Payne. These goods being so valuable according to weight, it does not cut much of a figure? Mr. Burgess. Not on the higher class of goods. 108 EARTHENWARE. Mr. Taesnet. Tour factory being located in a populous district gives you some advantage in the rates of freight? Mr. Burgess. We do not have any advantage in that way. The rates at the present time from Liverpool and to almost any other inland port, are cheaper than from our shipping point to Trenton, and cheap- er than to New York. Mr. Bryan. The long and short haul does not cover that? Mr. Burgess. ' It does not seem to. Goods come to Chicago through the lakes and from Montreal down that way. Mr. Bryan. That rate to San Francisco was by water? Mr. Burgess. Yes, sir; It was not across the country. STATEMENT OF MB. JOSEPH WHLETS, OF TEENTON, N. J, Mr. Chairman: The consideration of the revision of the tariff now before your honorable committee, fraught as it is witli the greatest in- terest to the people of the United States, we desire to offer for your carefnl consideration the following statement of facts relating to the pottery industry of this country : REDUCED TARIFF MEANS REDUCED REVENUE. The English Government returns of the exports of pottery wares to the United States for the years 1890-'91-'9i! and for seven months of 1893 show as follows: Pounda sterling. 1890 904,557 1891 902,161 1892 918,510 Seven montbs, 1891 504,518 Seven months, 1892 499, 191 Seven months, 1893 613,033 From United States Bureau of Statistics, the imports of pottery wares for 1890 were $7,030,985; for 1891, 87,703,338, and for 1892, 8,293,770. The above iigures show that the present tariff rates have not cur- tailed or diminished the im])ortacion of English pottery wares, but on the contrary, the increase for 1891 and 1892 has been a litcle over 20 per cent, and the total imports from all foreign countries has increased about 8 per cent. Consequently the revenue has increased under the present tariff' rates, and any reduction of the tariff' rates, short of crippling the American i^otters and reducing American production, must result in a loss of revenue. REVENUE TARIFF MEANS REDUCED WAGES. "We most positively assert that the wages paid in the American pot- teries are fully double those paid in the English potteries (see p. 8 of Argument before the Tariff' Commission, August 22, 1882, herewith annexed, and also Tariff' Commission Eeport, p. 1980, etc.), and the difference between American and German wages is still greater. The present tariff rates falling far short of the diff'erences between Ainerican and foreign wages, there is an absolute certainty that any decrease of the present tariff rate must be followed by a decrease in wages. Any reduction of tariff' rates that will not cripple or close the American potteries can not sufiiciently increase the importation of POTTERY. 109 pottery wares enougli to oifset the reduction of reveniie caused by tlie reduced rate made. If the tariff rate is reduced, the working potters must accept a cor- responding reduction of wages or find other employment, which, when thousands of other artisans are in a similar condition, will be very difBcult to do. Should the reduced rates of tariff produce a sufficient increase of importation to increase the amount of revenue collected, this increase of importation must surely result in less work for the American artisan, and more for his foreign competitor, working for far less wages. COST TO CONSUMERS. With the increase of the tariff rates the cost of pottery wares to the consumers has steadily declined. The tariff rate previous to 18G0 was less than one-half of what it now is. Then there was no American competition. The cost of crockery to the consumer at that time was 60 per cent greater than it now is. That is to say, that §100 will now buy for the consumer as much crockery as §100 did buy in 1800. MATERIALS. "We are opposed to materials being placed on the free list, for the reason that they are the finished products of those who prepare them for the potters, and for the further reason that the present tariff rate should be maintained, in order to encourage the develo])ment of the clay resources of this country. Under this encouragement several re- markable discoveries of excellent clays have been found in Florida, North Carolina, and elsewhere, within the past three years, of kaoline of very su])eiior quality for XJotters' use. Eesijectlully submitted. John Moses, George H. Goodwin, J. H. Brewer, Joseph Willets, Joseph Mayer, John N. Taylor, Edward M. Pearson, Ux. Com. TJ. 8. Pottery Association. We think the duties on packages shuld be retained, as it has formerly been the door through which the greatest frauds on the revenue have been perjietrated. Mr. WiLLETTS addressed the Committee: Mr. Chairman and gentlemen of the committee, I have submitted this paper. I had hoped to read it, but I will leave it with the reporter, and in doing so I would like to suggest one thing in regard to the prices. It has been said that the prices of crockery have been greatly re- duced. I have the books of our concern, which has been in business for seventy years past. I looked over these for crockery lor tifty years and compared them with the prices at the present time. I did not quite succeed in going back fifty years, although I m ent back forty- seven years and I find that -slOO at the present time will buy as much crockery as $100 did in 1800, when the tariff was less than it is to-day, Mr. TuKNEE. Do you make sanitary pottery ? no EARTHENWARE. Mr. WiLLETTS. We do malce some sanitary goods. That was, in fact, the main part of our business. Mr. Turner. Is that branch of your business in a trust? Mr. WiLLETTS. No, sir. Mr. Turner. Is there any combination about it? Mr. WiLLETTS. There is an association, similar to the association which has been mentioned here. Mr. Turner. Does it regulate the output or prices to the wholesale merchants, or as to the matter of discounts? Mr. WiLLETTS. It does arrange for the matter of discounts. Mr. Turner. It does dictate prices? Mr. WiLLETTS. It does. GLAZED BKICKS. (Paragraph 94.) New York. Prior to the enactment of the law of 1890 the duty on tiiest.' bricks was 20 per cent ad valorem, which, for 1,000 brick, glazed white, ivory and cream on one loiig side, was §8.00. Since the enactment of the law of 1890 the duty on 1,000 brick, glazed white, ivory and cream on one long side, is .'orter "! Mr. Lesley. Yes, sir; I said it. Ihavetheseflguresfor four years 1890, 1891, 1S92, 1893. They are all here. Mr. Hopkins. So the workingsof the ?iIer cent of those paid in this country. Mr. Burrows. Of what date is that ? Mr. Leslet. That date was 1888, I think. I think that is the time these figures were made from. From the United States consular re- jiorts in one German Portland cement manufactory in Silesia the total pay roll in its whole works was $32.72 a day. In an American works where the same number of workmen are employed tlie total ])ay loll was $226.30 a day; a daily difference in favor of the German manufac- turer and against the American manufacturer of $192.50. In England the wages are a little higher than those in Geruuiuy. From the consular report of 1890 I find that the average wages in English works were $5.82 a Aveek. That is considerably lower than our average wages and considerably higher than the German average. Mr. McMiLLiN. They have a higher protective duty tlian in England ? Mr. Lesley. What is that? Mr. jMcMillin. What I speak of is, the system of wages in Germany are under a protective system and England has free trade? Mr. Lesley. That is very likely; I do not want to deny it, because 1 am not thoroughly posted whether there is a duty' on this or not. I do not know wliether there is or not, and I would not like to say. Now the last fact, and it will possibly answer Mr. McMillin's question, is cement is a heavy article and weighs 400 pounds to the barrel, and CEMENT. 117 wlien you get a barrel of cement here in Washington about 50 per cent of the cost of that barrel is freight. For that reason in Germany the industry is closely coui]iotitive, that is the German market; the English or French cement would hardly come in. Mr. McMiLLiN. That being so, the transportation is a heavy em- bargo on it, to say nothing of the import duty. Mr. Lesley. I will show why it is not here. It would not apply to the case of transit between England and Germany where they have got freight one way and then they take back wood or staves, but it would apply here where no ballast is as good as cement bai'rels, which are large barrels and which lie nicely on the bottom of the vessel, and it is actually cheaper for them to carry it back than to take sand. Mr. Gear. Is it not a matter of fact that to a Southern port during the shipment of cotton, cement and other articles of that kind are car- ried for nothing? Mr. Lesley. I will say we have discharged a cargo of cement where it cost 12 cents toget itout of tlicship, and we only paid 9 cents freight to the ship; that is, they paid 3 cents a barrel for the ballast. That is one case. Mr. McMiLLiN. What is the rule? Mi-. Lesley. On steam freiglits abou.t 20 cents a barrel. Mr. Geae. How about sail'? Mr. Lesley. On sail vessels we had one cargo from France — which is I will say an exceptional case possibly — that came as low as 9 cents. Mr. McMiLLiN. What is the rule there? Mr. Lesley. On French vessels we would run up to probably 30 cents, but there is not much French cement that comes in here. Mr. Gear. You do not know about these Southern sliipmeiits? Mr. Lesley. I know l^ew Orleans cement rules as low as it does in New York and the transit is jnucli greater, and on the Pacific coast Mr. Gear. That is the distance? Mr. Leslee. Yes, sir; and on the Pacific coast the quotations are not much above New York, barely 10 cents; but I will say frankly there was an over importation, and some dealers carried more than they should. Mr. Gear. Is not the best quality of American cement equal to the foreign importation? Mr. Leslie. Here is a book that will show pretty much all of tlie important works in the United States. Yes, sir; there is a large work done with it. Now, bear in mind this question of ballast which ]Mr. McMillin asked aboiit, the rates will run about 20 cents a barrel. The rates on the same cement to tidewater in New York from the works in Pennsylvania or in New York State will exceed that, in New York being 30 cents and from Syracuse being 40 cents. That is, to bring the American article of equal grade to the port of New York costs in one case 150 per cent more and usually 100 per cent more than to import the foreign article. Mr. McMiLLiN. The same rule would apply if you attempted to get the foreign cement out to the interior"? Mr. Lesley. It would apply in this way: The rate from the Lehigh district to Chicago is 51! cents a barrel. The rate from Antwerp to Chicago is about 55 to 60 cents a barrel. It goes by lakes or canals, it being a heavy article. At Sioux City where a bridge was lately built the works at Yankton, Dak., could not take the contract there becaiise the foreign cement was laid down there at a lower figure than they could get it from Sioux City, which was not over 300 or 400 miles. Mr. Hopkins. When was this 1 118 EARTHENWARE. Mr. Lesley. This present season. Mr. Hopkins. Under the present tariff rate, of course? Mr. Lesley. Yes, sir. In concluding wliat I have said I only want to urge, if it is possible, for the committee to consider this question upon the basis of a specific duty. 1 should be very glad if they sliould do that, because I speak both for myself, as a manufacturer, and I think on behalf of all the importers -who try to do business honestly, and who tiy to be fair and square with the Governmeut and with their customers ; for I do not think that any one of them would ask anything but a duty which would allow a man to swear fairly; not strain his con- science by swearing against his Mr. TuENEE. Do you represent both interests? Mr. Lesley. I happen to be a large manufacturer and I represent about a quarter of the American product, but I am also an importer. Mr. Turner. Is the interest of the importer identical with that of the manufacturer? Mr. Lesley. I will say it is not. Mr. Turner. As a representative manufacturer what is your wish? Mr. Lesley. A specific duty. Mr. Turner. The present duty? Mr. Lesley. Yt s, sir ; the present duty. Mr. TuiiNER. And as an imx)orter what would be to the interest of your clients? Mr. Lesley. I should say that the present duty has not restricted importation and is a fair duty to the importer. Mr. Turner. Do you think lowering the duty on cement has tended to increase the importation. Mr. Lesley. No, sir; I do not say that. I tliink the reason imports went up in 1891 was due to the fact it looked like it was going to be a very busy year and some people brought in more than they could take. Mr. Turner. This you do not ascribe to the change in duty? Mr. Lesley. No, sir; I think the imports grow with the consump- tion, and the American product grew and took up a percentage of the increase. The American Portland product doubled from 1890 to 1891 increased from 250,000 barrels to 450,000 barrels. Mr. Turner. Is there much expense attending the making of cement? Mr. Lesley. Portland cement; yes, sir. It is about 95 per cent labor. Mr. Turner. Do you find the raw material, and is your process grinding or manipulation ? Mr. Lesley. The raw material is found all over the country. In making Portland cement it is ground to a powder, made into bricks and put in a kiln at a temperature from 1,800° to 2,000°, roasted to a clinker, and ground to a powder and shipped. Mr. Turner. Is there a large element of lime in that cement ? jMr. Lesley. The clinker will analyze about 60 per cent of lime, about 35 x^er cent of argillaceous matter, some oxyde of iron, and some other matter which we do not reckon. Mr. (tear. You stated the contractors at Sioux City could not buy the Yankton cement for the bridge there owing to the lower price for foreign cement? Mr. Lesley. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. Do you know the distance from Yankton to Sioux City? Mr. Lesley. I think it is some 200 or 300 miles? Mr. Gear. It is 70 miles. Mr, Lesley. I did not know that fact. Of course the Yankto]i CEMEKT. 119 people are at a disadvantage in buying their colie as tbey Lave to get that from n distance. Mr. Gear. They get their coke from Colorado. Mr. Lesley. I did not know that, but they are at a considerable disadvantage. I want to show one further fact, and that is the price of Portland cement has also reduced the American article. Tliey have both come down. Mr. BUEEOWS. That is, the American Portland '? Mr. Lesley. Yes, sir ; that is, while the tariff has to a certain ex- tent prevented undervaluation it has not prevented it to the extent of barring competition. Mr. EuREOWS. Do you know anything of the extent of raw mate- rial In this country out of which Portland cement can be manufactured 1 Mr. Lesley. I thiuk you can go in nverj State in the United States and make Portland cement. I know j'ou can make it in at least twenty Stat«s because I have analyzed it and have had peoxjle come to me with schemes'to go into business. Mr. BuEEOWS. It is practically inexhaustible ? Mr. Lesley. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. Is the breaking strength of the American Portland, cement equal to the foreign"? Mr. Lesley. Yes, sir; this book will show you all that. I have got a\erages here of some twenty brands. Mr. Tuener. In the trade which you , have are you able to sell imported cement in the interior, taken by "water, as cheaj) as you can sell the American product"? Mr. Lesley. Yes, sir. In Chicago it is as low as we can put our cement there. Mr. Tuenee. Assuming what you say, that the raw material out of ■which Portland cement is made exists all over the country, why is it tliat these factories do not spring up wherever the raw material is, to take advantage of the diiference in the freight transportation Irom the seaboard? Mr. Lesley. Thii fact is they do. Mr. Tuener. How can the foreign article compete with the domestic product at such a disadvantage when you say the American product is so much better "J I am spealcing about the interior market, off the water. Mr. Lesley. For instance, a man goes to build a large building, and he goes to his architect and says, "I may have to use American Port- land cement on this building," and the architect will say, "I^^^ow, Mr. Smith, you are going to put $100,000 in this building and these foun- dations are very important. If you use Mr. Lesley's cement you -will save $100 dollars. Now, do you honestly think, when you know what this other cement is and you do not know mncli about the other, do you think it ls right to risk ^100,000 to save $100 on that build- ing?" Tlie other cement has an established reputation, and the Ameri- can manufacturer has to meet that, and it has been only within the last two years that they have been long enough in business to meet it. You can see how this is. Suppose I come to you with a, new cement and I say, "This has been on the market for only a year," and another fellow should come to you iind say, "Mine has been in use for tifteeii. years." You would say to me, "I would like to oblige you, but I would rather know what I am doing." Mr. Stevens. What amount of capital is necessary to establish Portland cement works If 120 EARTHENWARE. Mr. Lesley. Cement works, well located, with a capacity of about 150 barrels, could be started with from .*(i(l,000 to ¥100,000. Ivlr. Stevens. What would be tlic product of that per year? Mr. Lesley. The product would rim from 40,000 to 00,000 barrels a year, according to whether you use tlie wet or dry process. Mr. Dalzell. How much American capital is invested in this business'? Mr. Lesley. If we count the capital invested in building up a reputation, and not confine it to the establishiiicnt alone, it would be a great deal; but if you take the whole industry there is prolmbly $10,000,000 or $13,000,000, and of Portland cement I shirald say prob- ably $4,000,000 or $5,000,000 Ijave been sunk, and probably 83,000,000 remained out of the $5,000,000. That is to say the plants to-day could be duplicated for th^t. Mr. McMiLLiN. Tou said $2,000,000"! Mr. Lesley. Yes, sir; the total plants in the United .States would probably take $8,000,000 or $10,000,000 to duplicate it. Mr. Stevens. That comes from the experiments in the method of making it? Mr. Lesley. Tes, sir. Now, for instance in one class of work of ours, Ave built the work in 1S85 and 1S.S7, and we have had to tear down the whole business, a loss of ■'t^ 120,000 sunk in that. Mr. Stevens. Improving the method of manufacture? Mr. Lesley. Changes. You know the grinding machinery wears out. Grinding this hard clinker is like grinding a hard slab of iron almost. Mr. Stevens. If only the grinders wore out you did not go to that expense 1 Mr. Lesley. The trouble in this case was the engine wore out. If you run engines and machinery for ten years night and day they will wear out; you need to put in cylinders, and the machinery in general gets pretty well knocked out. The Chairman. Then your sole contention is that it is better to retain a specific duty, the 8-cent duty than to go back to the ad valorem duty, although the actual tax is the same? Mr. Lesley. I think the actual tax to day would be about 30 cents. I think the duty would be on the better brands 30 cents eitlier way. Mr. Payne. That is, assuming that the ad valorem duty could be honestly collected"? Mr. Lesley. And in saying what I do, Mr. Wilson, I want to say when all the committees of 1887 and the committees of 1890 came tn a conclusion about the thing 1 am i)retty sure they were right, and for that reason, altliough 1 know a good many of our manufacturers want a higher duty, I do not think it is fair to aslc it, and I wi.iuld not ask it, and as this duty has operated to the benefit of the consumer and Government I do not think it is fair to ask more. The Chairman. You think if the old ad valorem duty had been col- lected honestly it was equivalent to about this specific^ Mr. Lesley. Yes, sir. ■ Mr. Hopkins. Do you think it would be poor policy to put this article on the free list, both for the (iovernment and the consumer"? ]\Ir. Lesley. I would not want to say what I think. Iff was try- ing to get a revenue and lielj) the consumer I would not do it, hut that is for this committee to do, and I submit that to their judgment. If tliere is nothing further, I desire to thank you ibr your kind at- tention, and 1 am sorry if I have taken up too 'much of your time. CEMENT. 121 STATEMENT OF CEMENT INDUSTRY. [Presented Ijy Mr. Eoljert 'W. Lesley, of American Cement Company, Philadelpliia, and roprcsoiiting American (.cnient industry.] The following five reasons are given for the retention of the present specific duty of S cents per 100 iiounds on this article. They are as foUo-n-s : First. The present tax is a duty for revniue, and since its adoption the amount re- alized to the Government from the importation of cement has iiicrea .serf, while the cost of cement to the consumer has decreased. Second. Vement is not a, raw material. It is essentially the product of labor. No imported raw material enters into its production. Coal, coke, limestone, cement rock, cooperage stock, all the product of domestic lator, constitute, togetlier with the labor employed^ in the mills and quarries, from 90 to 95 per cent of the selling price of the manufactured article. Third. The cement industry is not controlled hy any trust or trusts, hut is a closely competitive industry, where 300 pounds of cement, calcined argillaceous limestone, are put in a barrel and are actually sold at a rate per bushel less than the average rate per bushel of the ordinary lump lime of commerce not yrouiid nor barreled. Fourth. The present duty on cement is practically the same duty that existed orig- inally tinder the Act of 1883, that was nained in the Randall bill of 1887, that was fixed in the Mills bill of the same year, and that was also fixed in the 8enate bill of 1887. Fifth. Imported cement comes in practically as ballast, the rates from Europe to New York being as low as 10 to 15 cents per barrel, as against 30 to 40 cents to tho same point from Am(jrican works. In support of the above reasons the following facts are given: 1. The Phesent Tax is a Doty eoe Eevenue. Prior to the passage of the McKinley act cement \vas dutiable at 20 per cent ad valorem under the act of 1883. The average invoice value per barrel in 1883 was $1.73, and this value was maintained until about 1886. The net duty under the act of 1883 upon the valuation mentionetl was 34 cents per barrel. In 1886 the .Secre- tary of the Trensury rendered an opinion admitting packages and cost of inland transportation free of duty. As a result of this decision the invoice value of cement fell to $1.19, so that in 1887, when the matter of the duty on cement was considered hy the Mills committee, tho average duty on cement was about -2 cents. This duty fell right along until 1889, when by the undervaluation of the cemeut and the over- valuation of the packages one invoice came into this country at a valuation as low as 60 cents, the duty being 12 cents. Under the McKiuley bill the ad valorem duty was abolished and a duty of 8 cents per 100 pounds was placed upon cement. This duty upon a w<'ight of 400 pounds, the trade weight of a barrel of Portland cement, yielded to the Governuieut 32 cents per barrel, and this amount is the amount now collected. At the time the McKinley bill took effe(;t (July 1, 1890) the four leading brands of cement imported into the port of Philadelphia, as per the bills and invoices hereto appended, cost the importer as follows, laid down in Philadelphia : Hilton (EnolLsh) $2.35 Burham (English) 2.8^) Dyckerhoft' (German) 2. 60 Heyn (German) --^-^ Since the passage of the McKinley bill the prices of the same brands of cement, laid down in Philadcl])hia, have steadily fallen, so that to day, as per the bills here- with of August, 1893, the same brands cost, laid down, duty paid, at Philadelpliui, as follows : Hilton (English) $|-98 Burham (English) }^- -f^y Dyckerhoft' ^(.Jerman) ^^- j?-^ Heyn (German) - -- ■-•^" so that while the cbansie from an ad valorem to a specific duty, together with the packages dutiable, nominally incroused the average duty about 12 cents a barrel, the actual cost of the identically same cement, laid down at the same port, lias de- creased uearlv 31 cents per barrel, equivalent not only to a reduction to the con- sumer of the nominal inrreuse in the duty, but to an amount actually more than the total amount of the duty charged. , , i This decrease in the price to the consumer of foreign Portland cement has also benefited the consumer of the American Portland cement with which it competes. 1 22 EARTHEN WAEE. The price of the leading brand of the American Tortlnnd romont was as per bills annexed in July, 1890, $2.11, delivered at tlie port of fhiladelplim, and in August, 1893, $1.96, delivered at tlni port of Pliiladelpliia. These same figures apply practically to the same cements delivered at the ports ol Baltimore, Boston, and New York. , While there has been this reduction in the price of the imported article,^ tlierc lias been actually au increase in the Imiiortations since tlie passat^e of the McKinicy bill, as follows: The result of the first years shows imports : 1890, 1,940,186 barrels prior to the Mc- Kinley bill; 1891, 3,988,313 barrels since McKiuley bill. The yield to the Government in 1S!I0 upoij the value of the importations, viz, $2,249,741, was $449,9'.'8.20, whih' the vicld to the Government at the incrc-nsed duty upon the increased importation was $1, 276, 2.59. 16, so tliar in the years mentioni-.d it is shown that the increase of the duty did not diminish the amount of the impor- tations, and the actual gain to the Government was $826,330.ii6. The prices of the several brands of cement in the years 1891 and 1892, laid down at the port of Philadelphia, were as follows : Hilton (Unslish) Burli.'mi (Euiiiislif Dyckerholi (LiL'rmaii) . Heyn {German) American From these facts it can be seen that the present lax is csscntiaUij a duiij for ferenne, inasmuch as it has (a) decreased the duty to the consumer, and (h) iticreasid tlie revenue to the Government. 2. — Cement is not a Raw Materiai,, nor is its Manvfactuke a Local Industry. the cement industry. The manufacture of cement is not a local industiy. It i« national. Works exist in Maine, Connecticut, New York, Arkansas, Utah, Pennsylvania., Ohio, Maryland, Virginia., Washington, Oregon, Alabamba, Colorado, Texas, California, Illinois, Wisconsin, Kansas, West Virginia, Kentucky, Indiana, Michigan, and South Dakota. It stands seventh on the list of nonnietallie mineral ju-oducts of the United States. It ranks just below lime aud salt. It employs a capital of $10,000,000, has an out- put of over 8,000,000 barrels per annum, and gives work to about 20,000 laborers. The largest works arc in New York State, where nearly 3,00U,0ass it down by elevators and conveyors to the packing department. Those are little round plates where the barrel sits in, and these plates have a lipping motion by which the cement is passed through these little pipes, so that when the barrel is filled there is 300 pounds of cement. The men become so accustomed to regulating the speed that, although they weigh every barrel so as to be sure the consumer gets the proper amount, it is hardly necessary, because these men can really, by watching, tell almost to a pound how much cement is in a barrel. After it is barreled the men take the hoops and heads and head it up, and then it is in a condition to be rolled to the railway. This factory shows the cars loaded ready to go. Probably some of these cars are to go to Beaver Dam, Ohio River, where Coi. Stickney is building a large dam, and expects it to take 50,000 barrels of cement. We supply the United States Government; Ave have supplied 70,000 barrels in the last two years to Ool. Gillespie for the fortifications at Sandy Hook. Tlie colonel paid us the compliment of stating after we got through that it was the cleanest and the most comjdete con- tract that he had ever had made with any company, and not one barrel was found fault with. Every one was thoroughly satisfied. Those are the engines [exhibiting photograph] which drive the mill where we make our railroad shipments. It is a tandem compound Corliss engine, four engines working on a common center. They are so constructed that the engine on one side can be run independent of the other. At the present time the engine on the right has broken her cylinder and it is now at Moiint Vernon, Ohio, being repaired, and we are running our mill with one engine. Our idea in putting the engine in was that in case of accident to one engine we could still run the works and keep the men employed. This wheel is 26 feet in diameter, 4^ feet across, and two large belts running 30 odd feet in length between centers. The maximum capacity of that engine is 4,000 barrels a day; Ave are now running about 2,000 barrels. Here is a picture of one of our mills on the creek. A boat has come there to take the cement up the Erie Canal. The boat comes to our dock and up here is where we take the cem"ent and it rolls itself by a grade to the boat which saves us the handling. This picture rep- resents the manufacture of the barrel. Probably I had better show you Avhat the stock is [exhibiting another picture]. This is 128 EARTHENWARE. the cooperage stock wliicb we bring froBi Maine. Our company consumes about 500,000 bundles of "these staves every year. It takes 1,000 men to produce the cooperage stock from Maine to supply the Roseudale industry alone. We have to buy and rarry a year's supply of these staves on account of the necessity of liaviug them thoroughly seasoned. This stock represents about 400,000 ))arrels. So you see it takes a good deal of mo:;cy to carry on the industry in that particular alone. After these staves are sufficiently seasoiied^ they are taken to our cooper shops and then run through a heater. We do that because we have to have the barrels thoroughly dried. If there is any moisture the cement being so hot will shrink the barrel and the heads will fall out and consequently we liave to allow a good many damages to our customers, so we are very particular to see that the staves are seasoned and the barrels dried. After they arc thorou.ghly dried and i^repared by machinery they are turned over again to the cooper for finishing. They put flat hoops on, using an elm material which comes from the West, then they put the heads in, and they are placed on one side until used. We have five mills in Ulster County, a Port- land cement mill in Pennsylvania., and a mill at Cumberland, ^Ed. ^A'e produce from a million and a quarter to a million and a. half barrels every year. We are said to be the largest manufacturei-s in the United States, if not in the world. This shows our mills [exhibiting photo- graph] where we make our railroad shipments. There is what is called Biunewater, an Indiair name for a pleasant body of water. As .1 stated, the capacity of this mill is aboirt 4,000 barrels a day. Here is a little mill which we have on the water again, which has a capacity of about 000 barrels a day. The day of the 600- barrel mill has gone by. This is a mill we keep in thorough rejiair, but do not now run. We use it as an auxiliary mill. AYe have had two fires inside of three years, and this mill came in handy when we had one of our mills consumed. It is necessary now, in order to have an- industry at all paying, to make from 1,000 to 2,000 barrels per day. When I first went into the business twenty-seven years ago, the sec- retary then, who was selling about a week ahead with 3,000 barrels well ordered, could init his feet up on the desk and feel comfortable, and the profit of the business permitted it. E"ow, we have to make at least 2,000 barrels a day at our mill to be really on a paying basis. This is is one of our mills [exhibiting photograph] where we make most of our water shii^ments. The product of that mill is 2,000 barrels per day. This is one situated on the Delaware and Iludsou Canal, two mills of about 2,800 barrels; one makes 1,300 and the other makes 1,500 barrels. I have laid before the members of the Ways and Means Committee a little folder in regard to cement. Tlie cement industry has become an established one in this country and it takes its place alongside of the iron and the building material business. If you have ever noticed in New York City now the first thing they do in erecting a large building where so much cement is consumed, they run the skeleton iron up first and then they fill in with bricks, stone, and other things, and what bolts are to the iron works cemeiit is to the stonework. The superiority of the Eosendale cement as well as the American Portland, which by the way is a new industry in this coun- try — well, Portland cement has been made in Pennsylvania probaly for twenty years in a small way, but in the last five or six years in a very nnich larger way. The industry is being now carried on and the growth of American cement and Portland cement is growing, and I think the CEMENT. 129 time will come, if they have no drawback, when America will produce all the Portland cement required in this country. For a long while the American manufacturers had to contend against a prejudice that there was no cement like the imported, but the advent of the testing machine enabled us to show its qualities and we are able to demonstrate clearly to the consumer that American cement is equal to any foreign. Still we have that prejudice to contend against. The younger element, students in colleges particrilarly, are studying very thoroughly the cost of Amer- ican cement. There is hardly a month gaes by that we do not have some professor in a college write us for samples of our cement, stating that the young students were making a series of experiments. We always encouraged it, and we are always very careful to send them what we can produce every day. We want them to know what it is, because we believe when they are educated and go out into the markets they are the ones in the future who will recommend the goods that are American because they will thoroughly understand them. The old engineers, the old architects, still adhere largely to foreign cement, but I think the day is dawning for us when the American cement will be more thoroughly understood. Mr. TuENBK. Has it been determined scientifically as to what is the chemical process under which this material hardens in water? Mr, SOULL. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. What is the chemical change which takes place which makes it hard, if it does not detain you too long? I know that is aside from your purpose. Mr. Scull. I can explain it in a moment. Our idea in burning ce- ment is to drive off the carbonic acid gas. If we add water to it, just about 25 per cent, to this powder, it absorbs again that same gas from the water. Mr. Turner. Do you mean when you put it in the water? Mr. SouLL. It has got to get that g^s before it will harden again. That which we drive out nature demands again, and as we know nature abhors a vacuum it will get that; it is bound to have it, Mr. Turner. It will, then, harden in the water, but not otherwise? Mr. SeuLL. It will harden out of the water. Mr. Turner. I meant to ask why it hardens in the water; does it get the «xygen from the water? Mr. Scull. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. What percentage of lime is there in that? Mr. Scull. In Portland cement there is about 66 to 70 per cent, sometimes a little higher, but we do not like to see over sixty odd per cent. In the Eosendale, I speak now particular of our brand, the Hoff- man, there is about 48 per cent. That is the lowest Eosendale cement in lime, consequently it is much more desired in the market, because it is slower setting. There are about 4 barrels of Hoffman used to any other Eosendale. We make of that 800,000 barrels in two hundred days. Mr. Turner. You are aware there has been a great difference of opinion between the scientists as to what is the immediate cause of this hardening in the water, buti will not detain you in regard to that. Mr. Scull. There are 64 mills manufacturing what we call American hydraulic cement. The first American cement discovered in Ulster County was in 1832, when they constructed the Delaware and Hudson Canal. After they got through usimg cement for the canal the Law- rence family, from Flushing, Long Island, became interested in the manufacture of cement, and eventually the Lawrence Cement Company T H 9 130 EAETHENWAEE. was formed, so they are the original maufacturers of American hy- draulic cement. While there ^^-ere some factories in the West probably a little later, we are probably the oldest, and we still retain the original qnarry where the original stone was taken from to con- struct the Delaware and Hudson Canal. There are 18 mills manu- facturing American Portland cement. This industry of the Portland cement is one that is going to grow. When we first manufactured Portland cement there was a great deal for them to learn, but by care- ful study in the last five, ten, or fifteen years they have perfected it, and now the question is to get the money interested in that industry. There is an inexhaustible supply of this rock, and the beauty of it is it is natural. We do not have to have clay and chalk and other chemi- cals, but find what God has given us, and we find it right in the rock itself. There is one advantage in American Portland cement; it has never lost any of its strength. I made a series of tests, running up to two and a half years, and the ficrst six months T was very much pleased with the way the cement worked. The foreign showed great results. lu a year 50 per cent of the foreign cement commences to show a loss; in eighteen months there was none of that but what showed a loss of tensUe strength at the end of eighteen months than it did at the end of a year, and in two years there was quite a marked falling off. I have started a series of tests running up to fifteen years, breaking them every year. At the end of that time I hope to demonstrate when it is that Portland cement ceases to get hard, and when it is that Eosendales and American Portland reaches its ultimate strength. I tried it uij to five years, but it did not demonstrate. But now I have started for a period of fifteen years, and I hope by that time, if I live so long, to see the results. Cement is purely a product of labor. The raw material in the hill is of no use unless we put the liand of labor to it. We buy lands and we have to pay pretty high for it, too. The farmers in our section have realized their value, and they have put high values on it. For instance, there was about fitfy acres a year or so ago, and they got over fifty odd thousand dollars for it. I have seen it stated in Europe they buy their laud, and in America they get them for nothing. We have not found it out. As I was saying, cement is purely a product of labor; 87 per cent of the cost of cement is labor, and everything that goes into the manufacture of cement, coal, coke, staves, is also, like ourselves, a product of nature. We pay in Ulster County for the poorest kind of labor $1.50. Our labor from that will run up to our foremen as high' as $6 a day. We do not desire to have poor talent or inexperienced men in Ulster County. When we stop to consider we have to go in the earth sometimes 1,000 feet, or start at the base of a mountain and travel under that mountain itself from 300 to 500 or 1,000 feet, we have got to have men who understand leaving sufficient strength under that mountain, or else you can readily see what the disastrous result will be. We have to contend with the labor of Europe. Thanks to the Democratic as well as the Republican party, they have always protected the cement industry. Four committees in addition to this one have set upon this question, and they have always agreed that cement was not an over -protected industry. The miners in Ulster County receive $1.50 to $2.50 and $3 a day. The foremen sometimes receive as high as $5. In Europe, the miners in Prance receive 87 cents a day, Germany 52 cents, Belgium 60 cents, and England 52 cents. Laborers in Ulster County receive about $1.50 a day. In Prance they receive about 87 cents, in CEMENT. 131 Germany 65 cents, in Belgium 82J cents, and in England $1. The millers have to be men thoroughly skilled in preparing the stone to grind or they would very soon ruin all our mills and engines and would enhance the cost of cement so high that there would be no profit to us. The secret of success in the cement business is in our quarries and the burning in the kiln and grinding in the mills. At these three points we have to have the very best labor that we can find. Millers receive in Ulster County $2 to $2.50 in those mills pro- ducing alpng about 800 to 1,000 barrels. Mills where we produce 2,000 we feel, as their care is a great deal more, they should be larger recompensed, because we feel that if we make an object for our men to work faithfully and do what is right with us we will get better results from them, so we pay them a little more, probably 50 cents to $1 more a day, where they manufacture in the larger amounts. Of course they have th eir assistants undei' them. In Europe the millers receive, in Prance 48 cents to 87, in Germany 65, in Belgium 88J cents, and in England $1. The millwrights receive from us $2.50 to $3 a day; in France they receive $1.12J, in Germany 70 cents, in Belgium 83J cents, and $1.16 in England. The engineers in Ulster County re- ceive from $2 to $2.50. We pursue the same policy with our engineers as with our millers. We pay them more in our larger mills. We pay them generally $3.50 to $4 in our larger mills and in our smaller mills they get about $2.50. In Europe, the engineers in France get 97 cents, in Germany 73 cents, in Belgium $L.03, and in England $1.10. Our coop- ers make about $3 a day. We pay them 2^ cents for every barrel they prepare for the market. They prepare from 130 to 150 barrels. They get to work in the morning about 8 o'clock and they quit about 4. They are probably the best paid men we have for the amount of hours they work. For coopers in France they pay them 93 cents, in Germany 66 cents, in Belgium 86 cents, and in England $1.13. These are statistics which I have taken from the statistics prepared by the House Committee on Ways and Means, July 1, 1888. Consul-General ITew, in April, 1891, verifies these figures. These figures were of 1884, and we felt we would like to know a little more recently how wages were in Europe at this time, and we find that Consul-General New writes: Employment in the cement manufcictories is generally by gangs, i. e., the men are paid in accordance with the amount of the product, and not per diem. The average wages will probably not exceed 24 shillings ($5.82) a weelf, and in many cases will fall below this. The poorest laborer we have makes $9 a week, and they run from that up to $21 a week. The Chairman. You will pardon me for stating you are running into another hearing. If you have that in your pamphlet could you give it to the reporter? Mr. Scull. If you will allow me I will read these statistics and then I will do so. I would like to state in reference to the McKinley bill. This bill went into effect October 6, 1890. From October 1, 1890, to June 30, 1891 — these are statistics furnished by the Treasury Department— there was imported 2,066,390 barrels. In'l892, 2,576,628 barrels; in 1893, 2,812,358 barrels. In 1893 there was more cement imported into this country, maknig a total importation since the Mc- Kinley bill was passed of 7,475,376. The price before the McKinley bill went into effect was $2.70. Immediately upon the passage of that bill the price of foreign cement dropped to the consumer to $2 40. These are market Quotations, which we always very carefully keep. In 1892 the average price was $2.25; in 1893 the average prices was $2.20. 132 EARTHENWARE. Up to June 30, 1891, the consumer saved by the falling in price $619,917. The Government received in excess duty $268,630. In 1892 the average price was $2.25, and the consumers saved $1,168,482, and the Government received in excess revenue $337,561. In 1893 the average price was $2.20, and the consumers saved $1,406,179, and the Government received in excess duties $365,606, making a total saving since October 6, 1891, to the consumer of $3,194,578. and an increased revenue to the Government of $971,797, or $1,000,000 in round figures. In other words, the saving under the McKinley bill has been about $4,000,000, two-thirds of that to the consumer and one-third to the Government. The Chairman. Does the McKinley bill increase the tariff on foreign cement 1 JMr. Scull. No, sir; in one sense they did not. The Chairman. How could there be a saving by the bill, then? Mr. Scull. On account of changing from the ad valorem to the spe- cific duty. The price of cement, as invoiced by the importer i)revious to the McKinley bill, was as low as 96 cents, and it immediately jumped up to $1.50. ]\Ir. Payne, That is, the imported valuation jumped 1 The Chairman. At what price can English and German cement be put down in New York now? Mr. Scull. I saw a letter the other day, written by a foreign concern, offering cement delivered here in New York City for $1.60 a barrel. Mr. Breckinridge. Does that include the duty? Mr. Scull. Yes, sir; everything paid delivered to the importer. The Chairman. At what price can you put your cemeut in New York City? Mr. Scull. My freight from Siegfried Bridge is 30 cents a barrel on Portland cement. We can not sell Portland at less than $1.00 a barrel at the works. Mr. Payne. That would be $1.80 delivered in New York? Mr. Scull. Yes, sir. Mr. Tarsney. Are there any uses for cement to which yours can not be adapted ? Mr. Scull. Wherever cement can be used ours can. Mr. Tarsney. For any purpose? Mr. Scull. Yes, sir. Mr. Tarsney. Is American Portland cement used in the construction of engine beds, conduits for cable railways, and such works as that. Mr. SouLL. Yes, sir. Mr. Tarsney. What cable road in the United States has constructed with American Portland cement their conduits? Mr. Scull. I do not know I can call to mind any work of that kind constructed with American Portland. Mr. Tarsney. They manufacture a Portland cement in Louisville, Ky. ? Mr. Scull. No, sir. Mr. Tarsney. Milwaukee? Mr. Scull. No, sir ; they do not make Portland. Mr. Tarsney. Do they nuinnfacture any cement adapted to these puriioses ? Mr. Scull. They can manufacture American cement there which can be used in any building. Mr. Tarsney. For all purposes? Mr. Scull. Yes, sir; they can use the cement for such purposes as I have named. CEMENT. 133 Mr. Tausnbt. Then, why does the contractor for tho cable railroad near Louisville paythree times the i^rice iu order to get German cement for that purpose? Mr. Scull. Because he is prejudiced against the American. Mr. Taesnet. It is a matter of prejudice to pay out hundreds of thousands of dollars'? Mr. SOTJLL. Yes; it is prejudice. The East Eiver bridge is built with American cement. Mr. Taesney. But that is not subject to any vibration of its founda- tions? Mr. ScTiLL. I should say so, when the railroad track and heavy trains pass over it. Mr. Taesistet. An engine working does have influence upon the foundations'! Mr. Scull. Probably. I would like to state in answer to your ques- tion, when wo had our lire at Binnewater Mills we had occasion to put a foundation of an engine in there previously of a 1,000-horse power and we wanted to put in 2,000-horse power. This foundation was made by our cement and small particles of stone, a kind of concrete about that size. We put men to work there with picks and crowbars, and they could not disturb any of that work, and they had to get steam drills and blast it apart. Mr. Tarsnbt. The controversy between you and myself is not whether your cement is adapted to foundations, such as a bridge or a house or something of that kind, but the question is, whether there was any purpose for which cement is used in this country to which Ameri- can cement has not yet been adapted ! Mr. Scull. There is no work done by foreign cement that can not be done by American. Mr. Taesney. Is work done in America, a large quantity, to which it has not yet been adapted? Mr. Scull. T would not like to say it is not adapted. Mr. Taesnet. Eight here, almost the center of cement industry, has any been used in this railroad construction here? Mr. Scull. How is that, Mr. Ackerman? Mr. Ackeeman. Yes, sir; in the Washington and Georgetown. Mr. Taesney. In the conduits of the road? Mr. Ackeeman. Mr. McGill, 914 G street, can give you the informa- tion you want. Mr. Tuenee. You make cement out of the original rock without any manipulation at all other than the mechanical operation you described? Mr. Scull. That is it. Mr. Tuenee. On the other side, the cement is made by manipula- tion? Mr. Scull. Yes, sir. Mr. Tuenee. Have not you an advantage, then, over the foreign manufacturer? Mr. Scull. Why should we? We can not turn over the soil and dig clay like we would sand; we have to blast. Mr. Tuenee. You have no manipulation, but your blasting is more expensive? Mr. Scull. Then we have to bring the materials together. Their works are located right in easy reach of the raw material they use. Mr. Tuenee. Then you have shown with great success, I think, the superiority of your cement. Can you enter the market with the 134 EARTHENWARE. foreigner on his own ground and beat him with his product — can you export? Mr. Scull. Providing we have the labor as cheap, we could. Mr. Turner. Tou do not export at all ? Mr. Scull. Yes, sir; since the passage of the McKinley bill we vn-- tually controlled the Cuban market. Mr. Turner. Anywhere else; do you ship to any other point? Mr. Scull. South American points. Mr. Turner. Does it go across the Atlantic? Mr. Scull. No; we can not supply coal to Newcastle. Mr. Turner. But in Cuba and South America you compete success- fully with the foreign cement? Mr. Scull. I understand since the reciprocity treaty with Cuba the foreign cements from Europe are not now coming in. Mr. Turner. On account of the discrimination in duties? Mr. Scull. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. What is the freight from Liverpool to New York? Mr. Scull. I suppose to-day about 20 ceuts a barrel. Mr. G-BAR. What is it from German ports ? Mr. Scull. About the same, I should think. Mr. Gear. What is the output of American cement of all kinds ? Mr. Scull. 1 should say there was in the neighborhood of nearly 8,000,000 barrels, Mr. Breckinridge. Have you as low freight rates to Cuba as the foreign cement steamers? Mr. Scull. We sell our goods on board the steamer in New York. Mr. Breckinridge. But are freight rates as low from here to Cuba as from England to Cuba? Mr. Scull. Well, I do not attend to any of the shipping part, so I could not answer that question. We sell here on board of the vessel in New York. Mr. Turner. Do you sell the same to a foreign purchaser as an American purchaser? Mr. Scull. Oh, yes. Mr. Turner. You make no difference? Mr. Scull. There is not a sufficient margin to do this. Mr. Payne. You have only had this exportation since the reciproc- ity treaty under the McKinley bill? Mr. Scull. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. And only to countries where reciprocity treaties exist? Mr. Scull. That is it, sir. I would like to state to the comnnttee the Eosendale cement industry is not a very profitable one since the panic of 1873, and the Lawrence Cement Company has not, I will state frankly, averaged over 5 per cent on its investment. Mr. Payne. Is this Louisville cement the same as the Portland and Eosendale? Mr. Scull. It is not a Eosendale. Eosendale gets its name from the township of Eosendale. Mr. Payne. I know that, but it is applied to that class of cement? Mr. Scull. Yes, sir; the Louisville is somewhat similar to it. Mr. Payne. It is not Portland cement? Mr. Scull. Oh, no. Mr. Payne. The Wisconsin cement spoken of by Mr. Tarsney is not a Portland cement? Mr. SouLL. No, sir. CEMENT. 135 Mr. Payne. Tou do not know of a canal or railroad that uses Eosen- dale cement to lay a foundation? Mr. Scull. No; I do not know that I can recollect of any special work, but I have often tried to have our cement used, but the engineers have always been very insistent on Portland. Mr. Gear. Did you furnish the cement for the Sioux City bridge? Mr. Scull. No, sir; that would be done by the Western people, the freight rates from our point would prevent us from going that far west. Mr. Payne. Is there anything that shakes a foundation any more than a heavy steam engine? Mr. Scull. I should not think so. Mr. Payne. Running for a series of years. In regard to this foun- dation of your engine, did you find it destroyed in anyway by using the engine on it? .Mr. Scull. No; not a particle. Mr. Tarsnby. I see in your brief there is a cement manufactured at Kansas City, Mo. Mr. Scull. Yes, sir; that is Portland. Mr. Tarsney. Do they make good Portland cement there? Mr. Scull. Yes, sir; said to be. Mr. Tarsney. Why, then, did the constructors of 40 odd miles of cable railway in that city import all of their cement for this purpose from Germany instead of using that made right at home? Mr. Scull. Well, they ought not to do it, if they are doing it. Mr. Ebed. You say they ought not. Do you know why they did do it — on what grounds? Mr. Scull. Well, they say that the foreign cement — that same preju- dice comes up — is suiaerior to the American, but we hope to demon- strate to engineers and architects that the American cement is all right, and I have known cases where they have made tests of American cement, and the American cement has beat the foreign cement on the machine, and even then they said "we are going to use that cement anyhow." Why they did it I do not understand. It has always been a mystery to me, and I certainly hope some day the thing will be over with. Mr. Payne. You are gradually getting a market? Mr. Scull. Yes, sir; we are increasing. Mr. Payne. And increasing right rapidly in the last four or five years? Mr. Scull. Yes, sir; Portland cement particularly. I desire to thank the committee for their kind attention. Gentlemen : Thanting yon for your tind permission to offer our views in relation to the cement industry we would present the following facts for your consideration : The manufacture of cement has become one of the established industries of this country. In the building trade it takes its place alongside of the iron industry. In large and important masonry it is as valuable as the building stone. What the bolts are to the iron work, cement is to the stonework. It is possible now for engineers and architects to undertake with confidence large and extended pieces of work, as the American manufacturers are producing a cement of superior quality. This is becoming a recognized fact among consumers. For years the American manufac- turers were forced to contend against the prejudice that the foreign cement was superior to the American ; but the advent of the cement-testing jnachine has enabled the American manufacturer to obtain fair treatment, and to have his goods more properly understood. The future of the American cement industry is one of promise, if no set-backs are 136 EARTHENWARE. met with. Tliere are 64 mills manufacturing what is known as "Natural Hydraulic Cement." Eighteen mills in Ulster County, N. Y.; 8 iu Onondago County, N. Y. ; 1 in Schoharie Coanty, N. Y. ; 4 in Bufifalo, N. Y. ; 6 in Lehigh Talley, Pennsylvania; 3 in Cumber-land, Md. ; 2 in Virginia and West Virginia, 1 in Georgia, 2 in Ohio, 2 in Illinois, 1 in Milwaukee, Wis. ; 11 iu the Louisville, Ky., district: 1 in Mankato, Minn. ; 1 in Kansas City, Mo. ; 1 in Fort Scott, Kans. ; 1 in Salt Lake City, Utah; 1 in Chattanooga, Tenn. There are 18 mills manufacturing Portland cement in the United States. There is not less than $10,000,000 invested, and over 20,000 men employed in the industry. From statistics that were presented to the House Committee of Ways and Means, and published in the Congressional Record of .July 1, 1888, p. 6,328, we give the following figures, which we believie to be substantially correct : COMPARATIVE LABOK FIGURES. Cement is nearly all the product of labor. In the United States. Per cent. Quarrying represents . ; 40 Burning represents 6 Grinding represents 6 Moving, etc., represents _ 5 Packing represents 3 Goal, coke, and cooperage, all the products of labor 27 Making of labor 87 This labor, which is all performed by men, represents on an average for : Per day. Quarrymen $1.50 to $2.50 Laborers 1. 30 to 1.50 Millers 2.00 to 2.50 Millwrights 2. .50 to 3.00 Engineers 2. 00 to 2. 50 Coopers 1. 50 to 2. 00 In foreign countries. In Europe both men and women are employed in cement works. The wages paid as gathered from the investigation made in European cement works and from con- sular reports of 1884, are as follows : Wages per 'lay. Laborc ra. France. Germany. Belgium. EngLind. $0.87 $0. 18 to . 87 . 29 to . 39 1.12i .76 .68^ .97 .93 $0.5-2 .65 $0. 60 .88J $0.52 Millers - . .... . . Millwrights .70 .60 .24 .73 .68 .83^- .66 .57 1.03 .86 ■Women laborers AMERICAN MALE VS. GERMAN PEMAXE LABOR. From United States Consular reports, Ex. Doc, Forty-eighth Congvess, t). 464 one German Portland cement manufactory in Silesia employed in 1884, aoco'rdiua- to its pay-roll, in its whole works : ° Three workmen at $0. 3B Sixty-six workmen at .' [24 Seventy men and women aA I24 A total daily pay-roll of -WS.T?, CEMENT. 137 i An AmoricaTi worlcs, of same numlior of liands, employs, according to its boolsB: ! Two engineers $2. 00 Four millers 2.50 Two millwriglits 3. 00 Thirty coopers 1. 75 Fi£ty-one laborers 1. 30 Fifty quarrymen 1.75 A total daily pay-roll of $226.30. A daily difference ia favor of the German mannfacturer and against the American manufacturer of $192.50 in labor alone. Again in the Consular Eeports No. 127, for April, 1891, Consul-General New, of London, states: "Employment in the cement manufactories is generally by'gangs,' i. c, the men are paid in accordance with the amount of the product, and not per diem. The average wages, probably, will not exceed 24s. ($5.82) a week, and in many cases will fall below this." There is no building that exists that could not have been built and made just as strong mth cement of American manufacture as that of the foreign product. In support of our assertion, we point to the following structures which were built with Ameri- can cements : New York and Brooklyn bridge, New York post-office. New York cus- tom-house. Equitable building, Mutual Life Insurance Company building, City Hall in Philadelphia, Baltimore waterworks, Davis Island dam at Pittsburg, Pa., the piers of the Baltimore and Ohio railroad bridges at Havre de Grace and Brandy Wine creek, the Cantilever bridge at Niagara Palls, Baltimore post-office, Pittsburg post-office and court-house, United States custom-house, Cincinnati, Ohio; State House, Indianapolis, Ind. ; and this list could be continued almost od tfl^miiim. At least 100,000 barrels were used in Washington on the following buildings : Capitol, Bureau of Engraving and Printing, new Patent Office, new Pension building, new Navy, War, and State Department building, Washington waterworks, Treasury building. Patent Office, and many other buildings. We have sent as many as 60,000 to 75,000 barrels a year to San Francisco. To-day we are not sending a barrel. The freights are less to San Francisco from England than we can ship from New York. We are being driven out of Galveston and New Orleans also, and our lines are being drawn tighter and tighter every day. Statement sTiowing the quantities and values of cement entered for consumption in the United States; also the rate and amount of duty collected thereon from 1878 to 1893, inclusive. Year ending June 30— Qn,antity. Yalue. Value per barrtil. Rate of duty. Dnty. 1878 BarreU. (*) (*) (*) (*) 370,406 456,418 685, 768 554-, 306 650, 032 1, 070, 400 1, 019, 718 1,515, 31« 2, 169, 590 ( 843, 789 } t697, 094 ( t753, 173, 298 $184,086.30 212,719.14 873, 'Xi. 71 441, 512. 62 683, 684. 49 802, 294. 06 825, (194. 98 874, 069, 94 733, 296. 60 1,101,994.41 1, 896, 876. 19 1, 459, 875. 98 2,171,450.22 1, 123, 363. 13 5, 585. 00 2, 847, 203. 06 Per cent. 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 20 t$0. 08 $36, 817. 20 42, 543. 83 18S0 74, 652. 73 1881 38, 302. 48 $1.85 1.80 1.41 1.68 1.13 1.03 .94 .96 1.00 136, 736. 89 1883 160, 458. 80 165,018.09 1885 174, 813. 99 146, 659. 31 1887 220, 398. 88 379, 375. 23 1889 291, 975. 20 1890 434, 290. 05 224, 672. 63 1891 1, 117. 00 602, 538. 66 1.50 2, 726, 722 C tl, 039, 451, 207 { tl, 131, 602 3, 780, 632. 84 11, 762. 00 6, 804. CO 3, 760, 937. 00 ;$o. 08 20 ;$o. 08 831, 560. 96 1892 1.60 2,362.40 2, 698, 628 2, 812, 358 1893 1.35 899, 964. 66 17, 529, 752 23, 337, 504. 67 4, 914, 239. 84 * Quantity not stated. t Pounds. J Per 100 pounds. § Duty remitted. The House Bill 9416, so-called " McKinley bill," was passed by Congress September 30, 1890, and went into effect October 6, 1890. The importations of foreign cement into this country, by fiscal years and average selling price to the consumer at New York for the following years, has been as fol- lows: 138 EARTHENWARE. Importations of Portland cevient since 1SS5. [Fiscal year being from June 30 to June 30.] Cement. Selling price. 18S5 Barrels. 6.54, 396 em, 032 1, 070, 400 2,019,7]8 1, ,51n. 316 2, 169, 590 2, TliO. 722 2, 598, C28 2, 812, 358 Per barrel. $2.75 1880 2.05 18S7 2.00 1888 2.70 1889 2.65 1890 2.70 1891 2.40 1892 2.25 1893 • 2.20 16, 117, 160 Increase of importations since 188.5, over 500 per cent. Since this bill went into effect (October 6, 1890), according to tbe following table, we can readily see the number of barrels imported, the average price paid by the consumer, the amount saved to consumer, and the increased revenue received by the Government : Tear ending June 30 — Imported. Average price. Saved to consumer. Increased revenue to Govern- ment. Old. New. 1891 (from 1892 Oct 1 1890) Barrels. 2, 066, 380 2, 598, 628 2, 812, 358 $2.70 2.70 2.70 $2.40 2.2.5 2.20 $619, 917 1, 108, 482 1,406,179 $268 630 337, 561 1893 365, 608 7, 475, 376 3, 194, 678 971 797 Since 1885 there have been imported, according to Government reports, 16,117,160 barrels of Portland cement, and at the lowest calculation over $8,000,000 was expended abroad in labor for making the same, which might just as well have been kept in this country if the American manufacturers had supplied the cement instead of the foreign producer. During the fiscal year ending June 30, 1893, 2,812,358 barrels of cement were im- ported in spite of the operations of the McKinley bill, a larger number of barrels imported in one year than ever before, and yet the average price to the consumer for the same year was 50 cents per barrel less than during the year previous to the enact- ment of the McKinley law, as we see from the foregoing statement. Since this law became operative and to July, 1893, according to the corrected sta- tistics of the Treasury Department, there have been 7,475,376 barrels of foreign build- ing cement imported, having a declared value of $11,536,286.23, or an average of $1.54 per barrel. As compared with the average price of $2.70 per barrel, that cement sold for in New York City in 1890, and as compared with the average prevailing price of $2 40 in 1891, of $2.25 in 1892, and $2.20 in 1893, there have been saved to the consumer over $3,194,578 on the importations of those three fiscal years. Yet, because of the duty beiug specific instead of ad valorem, an increased revenue of $971,797 — nearly $1,000,000 — accrued to the Government, and although the price to the consumer declined during the said three years 50 cents per barrel, yet the invoiced value rose from $1 per barrel in 1890 to $1.35 during 1893, an increase in declared value of 35 cents per barrel. This proves conclusively that incident upon the operations of Ihe McKinley bill the consumer obtained the same article, if not a better one, at a lower cost, while the Government was the gainer in revenue to the extent of $1,000,000. Believing that the industry will receive such consideration at your hands as it deserves, we remain. Very respectfully, The Lawrenck Cement Co. Ebnest R. Ackerman, "' I'resident. M. Albert Scull, Makion S. Acker^man, Ueiidi-al sale agents. New York City, Septemlcr 14, 1S93. PORTLAND CEMENT. 139 POKTIiAKD CEMENT. (Paragraph 95.) Syracuse, N. T., September 8, 1893. Sir : I desire to make a plea for the retention of the duty on Port- land cement. The industry is in its infancy and to remove the duty at this time would cripple a new industry which is struggling for life. There is a concern in our midst who have invested about $300,000 in starting a cement works. They are just under way and after a few years would not care particularly for the duty, but as there are only one or two factories in the country at present, to abolish the tarijf on Portland cement at this time would practically force our friends to go out of business. I would respectfully suggest to the committee that changes and reductions be made only on those products where the industries have attained their full growth. I am in favor of abolish- ing the tariff on the products of all industries that have grown im- mensely wealthy because of the tariff and who are best able to stand a reduction. In behalf of many citizens in central ISiew York, I would most earnestly request that no change in the way of a reduction be made on Portland cement. I have no interest in the cement business, and am actuated solely by the best motives in advocating the retention of the duties. Eespectfully, yours, James K. McGuire. Fleming Cement and Bkick Company, 23 Liberty Street, New YorJc, September 8, 1893. CEMENT. Sir: Mr. E. W. Lesley, one of the selling agents for American cement, is represented as giving befoie you his reasons for the reten- tion of present duty on imported cement, viz, 8 cents per 100 pounds in barrels and bags on Portland, Eoman, and other hydraulic cement. I respectfully submit for your consideration the true facts. Mr. Leslie states that cement comes in practically as ballast, the rate of freight being as low as 10 to 15 cents per barrel as against 30 to 40 cents to the same points from American works. E'ew York City is the chief point for importation. The rate of freight by steamers from London to IsTew York by the different steamship lines is uniform, and established for the season annually in the months of March and April. Tear. Per ton. Per barrel. 1889 «. d. 10 8 6 8 6 li 6 5 Cents. ■ 43. 38 1890 . . 36.90 1891. 30.90 1892 28.15 1893 21.76 The importation by sailing vessel from London is insignificant. From continental ports the freight by steamer is a little higher than from London, but a considerable quantity is imported by sailing ves- sels, so that the average freight is a little less than from London, but 140 EAETHENWARE. the additional insurance for sailing vessels brings it to about tte same. I take it that as Mr. Lesley refers to the price of English cement lie makes it the basis of comparison. Mr. Lesley^s statement that cement comes in practically as Mllast freight is, therefore, refuted. The statement that it costs 30 to 40 cents per barrel to bring cement from American works to Few York is possibly correct. I would' point out that imported cement is sold at places where the freight from Atlantic ports is much higher than from American cement works, and buyers assert that the reason for paying the increased cost for imported cement is because of its superior quality and greater suit- ability. Mr. Lesley states that cement is essentially a labor product, and labor to the extent of 90 to 95 per cent of the selling price entered into that price. In order to refute this fiction I would state that in Europe cement is sold by the ton and delivered to the buyer in the pacl^age and of the weight desired. For the United States and other markets it is packed in barrels, as most easily handled, and the average weight per barrel is 400 pounds. Importation of cement in bulk is not feasible, and if packed in sacks it is liable to damage from dampness and loss of cot:- tents through injury. The cost of the barrel is Is. 6d. to 2s, say, 36 to 49 cents, according to quality. The cost of making by hand or machin- ery is inconsiderable — the wooden staves and heads, iron and wood hoops are the largest item of expense. Labor, therefore, does not enter into the cost of making the paclcage to the extent of 90 to 95 per cent. Cement inEnglandis made from chalk and clay. Manufacturers have to make large investments in lands to obtain the raw products, or if they buy from vendors it costs Is. 6d. to 2s. 6d. per ton. Ookefor the burning, fuel for engines and replacement or 'repair of grinding and other machinery can not be classed as labor. I assert that the actual item of labor does not exceed 10 per cent of the selling price. The increased and increasing importation of cement is due to its larger employment, and the price to the consumer has been lowered through the lessened cost of manufacture, whilst quality has been bettered by improved methods. The aggregate margin of profit to manufacturers and importers being greater on thelarger scale, though the profit on each barrel may be less than when a smaller business was done. I subynitfor your consideration — (1) Ocean freight, insurance, and importing expenses increase the cost of cement free on board, London, 20 to 25 percent, according to port of importation, which is protection to an American manufacturer. (2) That a specific duty of 4 cents per 100 pounds be assessed on all cement, which would furnish a large revenue to the Government. (3) That section 3052 of Ee vised Statutes, in as far as it afi'ects cement be repealed. This section inflicts on buyers of cement outside the United States a penalty of 3 cents per 100 pounds, or 12 cents per barrel for the privi- lege of buying cement in bond in United States, and is a restriction to foreign trade; its enforcement has been a loss of freight to vessels trad- ing between United States ports and West Indies, South America, and Mexico, and of wages for labor connected with shipping and warehous- ing. Tours, respectfully, Fleming Cement and Brick Company, Howard Fleming, President. PORTLAND CEMENT. 141 LESLEY'S REPLY TO HOWAKD FLEMING'S COMMUNICATION. Mr. Fleming's argument may be divided into two heads: First. Freiglits. Second. Per cent, of labor in manufactured cement. First. Freights. — Taking up his statements brieily on this point of the case, I would say, that on pages 1 and 9 of my pamphlet I fully set forth the matter of freight, and the figures I give — of from 10 to 15 cents — are made up from freights actually paid to the points mentioned, and relate to the freights of the year 1893, which is, as I understand, the present year and the year we are discussing in considering this tariff question. In 1893, according to Mr. Fleming's figures, the freight was 21.76 per barrel from London to New York. I state that "sailing vessels have brought cement for as low as 10 cents per barrel to New-York." This is a fact, and can be substan- tiated by the original invoices showing importations this season by sailing vessels as low as 9 cents, and importations by steamer from Antwerp as low as 6^ cents. So far as steam shipments are concerned, I name them as low as "20 cents to Philadeli)hia," which is the exist- ing rate, and which is also the existing rate from the same ports to New York. Further, the statement of Mr. Fleming that "the freight from continental points by steamer is higher than from London" is incorrect, inasmuch as the inclosed two letters offer a " guarantee" of a "5- shilling freight from Antwerp" to Philadelphia for large business, so that from these figures my statement that cement comes in practi- cally as ballast freight "is not refuted" by anything that Mr. Fleming states, and it is not necessary for the gentleman to be charitable enough to remark that my allegation as to the freight from American works to New York "is possibly correct" as against the receipted fr^eight bills shown by me to the committee on this point of the case. In this connection it can be stiU further seen, by examiniag the figures of freights given by Mr. Fleming, and examining the figures of cost of four brands of English and German Portland cement laid down on the American seaboard, as shown on pages 2, 3, and 4 of my argu- ment, that when the duty on Portland cement was averaging the United States Grovernment about 20 cents per barrel in 1889 and 1890, an En- glish "freight pool," controlling the different steamship lines from Lon- don to New York, and making the Mr. Fleming's "uniform and estab- lished freight rate," charged on an average 40 cents per barrel freight, while the same English " freight pool," when they found their business was threatened by the growth of the American industry, caused by the change of the duty to 30 cents, actually reduced their freight from 36 cents in the year 1891 down to the present rate quoted by Mr. Fleming, of 21 cents per barrel in 1893. In the same connection it will be noted that while the English steam- ship trust, which is a well-recognized institution in New York, was perfectly ready to take the extra 20 cents freight that they were enabled to do by reason of the low duty on cement prior to 1890, that the foreign importers were also not idle in taking their benefit fi-om the action of the same pool. By compariiig the figures of cement laid down, given by me, it will be found that in the year 1892, when, according to Mr. Fleming's figures, the freight on cement by the steamship pool was 28 cents per barrel, that the importers of English cement were charging $2 and $ 1.97J.per barrel for their cement, and that in 1893, when the rate of freight had dropped, according to Mr. Fleming's figures, 7 cents per barrel, the same importers kept on charging the American jobbers 142 EAETHENWAEE. the same figures for their cements, generously absorbing this 7 cents reduction in the treight. From Mr. Fleming's figures, therefore, on the question of cement com- ing in as ballast, I must respectfully claim that he has utterly failed to "refute" the statements made by me, but, on the contrary, has directly shown that when a reduced rate of duty is made an English trust (the Loudon steamship pool) is ready to absorb all it can in freights, and that importers are ready to share in the booty, at the expense of the American consumers. As against these facts, whicli show what becomes of any reduction in duty that might be made on cement, the committee has before it, on page 3 of my argument, the figures show- ing an actual reduction of 15 cents per barrel for American Portland cement lor tide-water deliveries, with the rates of freight exactly the same in the years 1890 and 1893, as shown by freight bills. Certainly Mr. Fleming did not intend to ask the committee to do what his figures clearly prove, and that is to destroy an American industry, uncontrolled by trusts, in order that an English steamship trust and English importers should profit at the expense of American consumers and laboring men. Second. The la hor cost of cement. — In reference to the statement I made as to the labor cost of cenient, which Mr. Fleming characterizes as "fic- tion," his large experience as an importer and his absolute want of knowledge as a manufacturer no doubt enable him to give much more accurate figures than those found on page 6 in my argument, which are actual costs gathered from a number of American works by men actu- ally engaged in the business and providing the money with which this labor is paid. These figures show by items that from 87 to 95 per cent of the selling price of a barrel of American Portland cement is for labor. Mr. Fleming broadly states : "I assert that the actual item of labor does not exceed 40 jDer cent of the selling price." In support of this broad statement he makes an argument which is almost unintelligible. He begins by saying that the cost of the barrel (from 36 to 49 cents) does not enter into the labor cost of cement, though in the next sentence he says : "The cost of making barrels by hand or machinery is inconsiderable; the wooden staves and heads, iron and wooden hoops, are the largest items of expense." Whose "hands" other than those of labor are to make the barrel? Whose hands make the staves and heads and the iron and wood hoops into whose production Mr. Fleming says "labor does not enter?" Certainly in this country all these items are produced by human labor in some form, and this labor must be paid for at the Ameri- can rates for American labor, and is properly so stated by me. His second point is that in England coke must be used for burning Portland cement. This is also the case in this country, and why coke is reckoned as labor product in England and should not be considered as a product of labor in this country is left for Mr. Fleming to explain. His third point is that, after considering coal as a labor cost in England, it is improper for us in this country to consider the coal pro- duced by American labor and used for the engines as a proper element of labor cost; and. Fourth, he claims that the millstone-dressers employed at daily wages in the cement mills for the repairing of grinding and other machinery are not labor properly chargeable against the cost of cement, though certainly they are just as much so as any other class of workmen employed in cement works. All of these four items of cost are embraced with the others on page 6 of my argument, which gives the total labor cost of a barrel "of PORTLAND CEMENT. 143 cement at about 87 per cent, and shows that the single itena of quarry- ing, according to my figures, which figures are absolutely unassailed in any of their details by Mr. Fleming, is alone 40 per cent of the cost of a barrel of cement. In the absence of more specific details verified by proper statements there can be very little importance attached to Mr. Fleming's unsupported "assertion" that labor in America "does not exceed 40 per cent of the selling price of cement." If further proof of the gentleman's absolute want of knowledge and lack of candor in treating this branch of his subject were required it can be found iu a single quotation from his remarks on this same question, where he states as an element to refute the "fiction" of the labor cost of cement in America the fact that "manufacturers in England have to make large investments in land to obtain the ra\y product," thus leading to the ridiculous and unjust inference tliat the American jiroducer gets his land free, a thing which up to this time has not occurred to the average American producer, but is a point upon which Mr. Fleming is no doubt ready to enlighten him with more misinformation. So much for the two main points iu Mr. Fleming's statement. On another subject I must again take issue with the gentleman, who could hardly resist the temptation of an attack upon the quality of American Portland cement, and M'ho states: "I would point out that imported cement is sold at places where the freight from Atlantic ports is much higher than from American cement works, and buyers assert that the reason for paying the increased cost for imported cement is because of its superior quality and greater suitability." As to this, " the proof of the pudding is in the eating," and when Mr. Fleming will sit down and explain how it is that in his own city, ou the ZSTew York aqueduct, where he formerly sold the cement, American Portland cement is almost exclusively used, and at prices as high, and in some cases slightly higher, than those paid for the standard brands of for- eign cement for similar deliveries, he need not bother about describing what may occur at distant points. Furthermore, I would say that ocean freight, insurance, and import expenses do not "increase the cost of cement from 20 to 25 per cent, _ according to the port of importation," and that if they did, such increase of cost would uot "be protection enough to the American manu- facturer," and in support of this I submit an offer of cement from Lon- don, which shows that one of the best brands of foreign cement can be laid down in this country at $1.80 per barrel, and that the ocean freight, insurance, and import charges on such shipment will not exceed 22 to 24 cents per barrel, and as against these figures which show that the cost of a barrel of English cement at IS'ew York is made up as follows : Cost on ship at London (5«. 3d.) $1.26 Freight ..'... 20 Dnty 30 Insurance, banker's commission, etc 01 Cost delivered New York 1.80 American Portland cement would cost at present figures: Price at mill $1-60 Freight to New York 31 Cost delivered New York 1.91 144 EARTHENWARE. The difference in the two costs is clue to the additional cost of Amer- ican labor, nearly two and one-half times greater than in Europe. If, however, the American producer were given the same cost on cars as the English producer is given on board vessel, including exchange, etc., regardless of the additional cost of labor in America, the ligures would be : Price at mill ^I'S" Freift'M to New York • ■ ■'■ Cost delivered New York . 1.61 ^ So that if the duty were taken off or reduced, it can be seen that, even figuring American labor at the same figure as the English labor, and the price to the Americon manufacturer at the same price as is paid to the English manufacturer, the American manufa-cturer would be entirely driven out of thfi business. Especially is this demonstrable when the inclosed offer of a second-grade Portland cement from Bel- gium is considered : Cost on ship Antwerp (4s. 5d.) $1. 06 Freight to New York, Red Star steamship ^^k Daty 30 Insurance, banker's commission, etc 04 Cost delivered New York L 46^ If the dnty were reduced or taken off in this case, the American laborer in cement works, in order to compete, would have to receive the wages of the Belgian laborer, the poorest paid workingman in Europe. In conclusion Mr. Fleming recommends a specific duty of 4 cents per 100 pounds, which he says would "furuisti a large revenue to the Government." Mr. Fleming, however, does not say how mucli revenue would be furnished, and does not deny that under the present tariff the Government is getting more revenue than ever from the importa- tions of cement. Taking the figures from the last three fiscal years (the figures in my original argument being the calendar years, in order to make comparisons between the census and the import figures), it can be seen that the average annual importations have been about 2,700,000 barrels : Earrols. In 1891 2,726,722 In 1892 2,598,628 In 1893 2,812,358 And that the present duty has not decreased the importations, but, on the contrary, has increased them on an average for the period, say 600,000 barrels per annum since 1890. They show also that this figinre seems to be about the maximum fig-^ure for importations, the additional demand for Portland cement being supplied from the American mills which have increased their product nearly 100 per cent within the last two years. Assuming, therefore, that your honorable committee in the framing of the tariff is acting under the platform of the Democratic party, and is, therefore, to consider ttie question of i;evenueto the Gov- ernment and the price to the American consumer, it can readily be seen that were Mr. Fleming's suggestion adopted two things would occur : First. That the selling price of cement to the consumer would return to the figures of 1890, where, under the lower rate of duty (act of 1883), the consumer paid an average of, say, $2.41 per barrel for his cement, as against an average price of $2,075^ for the same brands of NATURAL HYDRAULIC CEMENT. 145 cement under tlie act of 1890, thus creating a state of facts whicli would tlierefore cause a total loss to the American consumers of cement, estimated on the importations of cement for the calendar year ending- June 30, 1893, of about $928,000 per annum. Second. That upon imports equivalent to those of the fiscal year of 1893 the Government, instead of receiving nearly $900,000 per annum in duty, woiild receive only $450,000. Under these conditions, without considering the question of whether labor in this country commands more wages than abroad, or whether an American industry established after great loss and trouble should be maintained, it is respectfully contended that the recommendations of Mr. Fleming as to the rate of duty should not be followed by your hon- orable committee upon the basis alone of the lessened cost to consumers and the increased revenue to the Government resnlting under the existing law. EoBEET W. Lesley. Haebler «& Co., 71 Wall Street, New Yorlc, September 6, 1893. ■ Sir : We see by to-day's paper the argument of Mr. E. W. Leslie, of the American Cement Company, relating to the duty on foreign cement, and are surprised that your honored committee was given to under- stand by him that, owing to the " McKinley bill," the price of foreign cement has been lowered from $2.35 to $2.60 — which were the prices before the " McKinley bill" went into effect— to $1.97J to $2.10 at the present moment. To state that this decrease in price is due to the working of the " McKinley bill " is entirely erroneous, and we beg to correct same. The fall in price is solely due to increased production and poor busi- ness in general, which has compelled manufacturers of cement to lower their prices in order to secure business wherever they can get it. Like most other articles cement has suffered in prices on account of the poor business all over the world. We further beg to state that the production of American cement is so small that it hardly comes into competition with foreign cement, and although the quality of same has been repeatedly claimed and advertised to be as good as the imported cement, we have found, so far, no cement made in this country that has proven so. Yours, very truly, Haebler & Co. NATUEAIi HYDRAULIC CEMEKT. (Paragraph 95.) Sinclair & Babson, ISFetv Yorlc, September 15, 1893. Sir: Mne-tenths of all the cement manufactured in this country is of this class. This article regnlarly sells in the open markets at 75 cents to $1 per barrel. The actual cost of imported cement loithout the duty is $1.75 (as an average) per barrel. Therefore, what protec- tion does this article need? T H XQ 146 EARTHENWARE. The McKinley bill increased the duty on cement from an average of 21 cents a barrel to 33 cents a barrel, being about 50 per cent, an out- rage on the masons and builders of this country. Imported cement is an actual necessity to the masons of the country, and American cements never will and never can take its place. Yours truly, A, C. Babson. lilME. (Paragrapli 90.) STATEStENT OF HOH. FRANK JONES AND OTHEES, PORTSMOirTH, U. H. The above petitioners represent that, with possibly one or two excep- tions, they are all citizens and most (if them residents of the United States; that they have a large amount of American capital invested in lime properties across the line at Dudswell, near Sherbrook, Province of Quebec, and at St. John, New Brunswick, consisting of lime quarries, limekilns for the manufacture of lime, and vessels for its transporta- tion; that they have been engaged in the manufacture of lime at said places some six or eight years past, being practically the only firms outside of the United States engaged in the manufacture of and impor- tation of said article, and that most of their product is marketed in New England and New York at a low figure and to the benefit and advantage of every consumer of this product. They represent that this market for the past score of years has been entirely controlled and manipulated by a combination and a trust com- posed of lime manufacturers in the towns of Eockland, Kockport, aiid Thomaston in Knox County, Me.; thatthis unlawful trust has about one hundred limekilns situated in said county ; that it has enjoyed for a long period complete control of this market by a system of curtailing x)roduc- tion — running at times 50 per centof its kilns, at others 30 per cent, andat others, shutting down all of them— thereby creating an artificial scar- city of this much-used commodity, to the great detriment and pecuniary loss and injury of all consumers — builders of houses and pulp manu- facturers — and further, that by this unlawful system and complete lack of competition they have been able to accumulate enormous fortunes every consumer along the Atlantic seaboard through New England and New York having been forced to pay tribute to this most complete and absolute monopoly. Your petitioners further represent that the duty on lime was for- merly 3 cents per barrel, until the enactment of the McKinley law when it was raised to the dizzy height of 6 cents per 100 pounds or from 13 to 15 cents per barrel, according to the weight of different limes from different quarries. Or, in other words, raised from 400 to 500 per cent, thereby distancing any and all other performances in that remarkable law. They represent that this great fraud was perpetrated on the people by a committee of the Eockland Lime Trust, who pio- ceeded to Washington with the avowed purpose and with instructions to ask that the lime tariff be raised to 5 cents per barrel, and that one member of this committee, more sagacious politically than the rest after a reconnoiter of the premises, decided thatit was best for them to ask for 16 cents per barrel, and on the principle, to use his words, " that yon never got anything in this world without you ask for it." TI\\h LIME. 147 said committee returned to the Eockland Lime Trust astounded at their fortune in obtaining a tariff duty of about 14 cents per barrel in- stead of 5 cents per barrel, for which they went on to Washington to ask in place of the former duty of 3 cents per barrel. Tour petitioners represent that this monumental rise in the tariff of between 400 and 500 per cent in the McKinley law has completely par- alyzed and ruined their business, and has left a large amount of Amer- ican capital tied up in idle and unproductive lime works at Sherbrooke, Province of Quebec, and St. John, New Brunswick, and they pray that this unjust tariff on their merchandise may be removed altogetlier in the contemplated revision of the tariff'. They further aver that the freight, either by water or rail, from their works to the market is always from 4 to 8 cents per barrel more than from Eockland on account of the greater distance, and that this, coupled with the well-known fact that most of their lime is not of such good quality as the Eockland, except for ordinary stone or mason work, and that for that reason it must sell at a lower price in the market, should give, and in fact does give, the Eockland Lime Monopoly all the protection they are entitled to (10 to 13 cents) at the expense of the consuming class. They would call attention to the fact that after the erection of the kilns most of the expense in the production of a barrel of lime is the cost of the labor and the cord- wood consumed in burning of the lime rock. In the point of labor your petitioners claim that their labor is paid practically the same, or, if anything, more than the Eockland labor, except for some of the coarser grades of common work, as some of their labor was taken from Maine. The only item of any importance which they get much cheaper is wood, it being convenient and accessible to their works, and long transportation being saved thereby. To show further the iniquitous injustice of the McKinley law in regard to lime it may be stated that the Eockland Lime Monopoly imports from the St. John Elver, and other points in the marine provinces, an immense amount of cord wood with which to burn its lime; that a large fleet of provincial vessels is constantly engaged in this trade; that stated roughly in round figures the Eockland Trust uses in this business some 80,000 to 90,000 cords of wood each year, and that between 60,000 and 70,000 cords of this wood comes from the maritime provinces, they not paying a single cent duty on it. Query. — Why should the consumers of the lime produced by this com- plete and Olegal trust and monopoly, which does not have to pay any- thing in the shape of duty on the hundreds of cargoes of wood it im- ports from St. John and other points, be forced by law to pay 400 to 500 per cent in rise in duty on the lime which a few American merchants were unfortunate enough to venture into manufacturing at St. John and Sherbrooke? It may be of further interest to know that the Government of the maritime provinces is being petitioned to put on an export duty of $1.50 to $2 per cord on the wood thus brought to this country, which would naturally be stayed were the unjust tariff on lime removed. It would be a misfortune of no small proportions to have such an export duty put upon this wood, as it would tend to make the American farm- ers denude their wood lots much faster than would be for the best gen- eral interests and future common welfare. Your petitioners, therefore, respectfully pray your honorable commit- tee to recommend the complete remission of this duty, so that they may light up their kilns and set to work the capital now locked up since the enactment of the McKinley law. 148 EARTHENWAEE. The statement and objection may be made by the Eockland Lime Oombination, that while they got the tremendous rise on the lime tariff in the McKinley bill on the ground that they were making no money at that time, because of the competition of the foreign lime manufactur- ers, and that the avowed object of said rise was to " freeze out " foreign lime commerce and have a chance to raise their own lime in the market, " so that thej could pay their labor more." (Which labor they regarded with a touching affection before the committee.) As a matter of fact, lime on the market went lower after the passage of the McKinley bill than it was before. Your petitioners will not deny the truth of this statement, but it is easily explained. The committee representing the Eockland Lime Trust returned home after having procured the said rise of about 500 per cent in the tariff', and individ- ual members of said combination were so elated at their luck that they, for the time, broke up the combination and engaged in a fierce compe- tition among themselves, with the fancied security that, having killed completely all competition from your petitioners, they would have an unlimited market at their own price. Your petitioners, however, aver that they themselves have still been manufacturing some lime in a small way, running some four to six kilns out of thirty, and putting said lime onto the market at a loss, for the purpose of making a price for the said unrighteous combination ; and, further, that the said combination and trust is now in force again at present time, and that it has issued circulars to the trade, raising the price of its productions from 5 cents to 8 cents per barrel. To sum up your petitioner's cjaim : (1) It is, with one or two exceptions, all American capital which they have invested in New Brunswick and Quebec. (2) That the great difference in the freight to market, on account of the greater distance to market, varying from 4 to 8 cents per barrel all the time, and that the fact of their lime being principally fit only for rough stone and brick and mortar work and not for plastering, which necessitates the selling of their lime on the market at a price varying from 5 to 10 cents per barrel lower than the lime produced in Eockland, gives the Eockland Lime Trust all the protection it is entitled to at the hands of the consuming class. (3) Your petitioners simply ask your honorable committee to recom- mend the putting of this commodity on the free list, that they may have a fair chance for open and honorable competition with this monopoly for the benefit of the consuming class, and for their own benefit and salvation, by allowing the unlocking of their capital, which has been unjustly tied up in idle limekilns since the passage of the McKinley law. (4) They freely allow that the amount of capital invested is not so great as in some of the great manufacturing industries, though some of those interested have all they have in the world invested in it, but they feel they should not be ignored for that reason, as the principle run- ning through the whole McKinley law of fostering by absurdly hioh duties disadvantageously situated home industries is wrong from the start; and they pray that this unjust discrimination may be removed at the earliest moment jjossible. GYPSUM. 149 GYPSUM. (Paragraph 97.) P. W. Devob & 0. T. Eeynolbs Co., New Yorl; September 19, 1893. Deae Sie: We import an article known as gypsum, or plaster of Paris, unground, used solely in the manufacture of paper and for no other purpose whatever. It is known in the iiaper mills as a filler to give weight, hardness, and smoothness to the paper, and as it enters largely into the manufacture of paper, being mixed in the pulp, we think it should be free of duty. The appraisers here have examined it and find it to be a sulphate of lime, pure and simple, and if it is named in the tariff act as plaster of Paris or sulphate' of lime, unground, crude or manufactured, free, it will cover our article ; and if the words crude or manufactured be added toparagTaphs97 and 680 — plaster of Paris or sulphate of lime, unground, free ; ground, $1 per ton — it will settle the question of duty that our cus- tom-house has been contending with for some time. EespectfuUy, G. A. & B. Meter, 59 Maiden Lane, New Yorh City. Easton, Pa., September 13, 1893. Sie : If the duties are lowered on the goods we manufacture we will have to close our mills unless we are able to reduce wages to the extent of meeting the reduction. The wages we pay are much higher than is paid for the same class of work in foreign countries. We jjay quarrymen from $1.25 to $2 per day of nine hours. England pays for the same kind of work 50 to 60 cents per day; Germany, 52 to 60 cents; Belgium about the same; Erance, 60 to 75 cents. We pay our millers $1.50 to $2.50 per day; abroad their pay is much less. The freight on these goods — clays, plaster of paris, gypsum, barytes, etc. — is very low, coming out frequently as ballast, so that the item of transportation does not count against their introduction into this coun- try, and we must depend on the tariff to protect our home industries on this class of goods. Our competition comes from abroad and we shall have to meet it or close our works. Their agents are here among us and we have to meet their prices and be content with the present small margin ot profit. If the tariff is further reduced on our line it will mean extinction for us. I here give you the present rate on goods which we say can not stand any further reduction, but which, in fact, should be increased: Per toii_ Ground plaster of Paris or gypsum $1.00 Calcined l.lo Should be doubled. Unmanufactured clay or earths not specially prepared 1. 50 The above I suppose means unwashed clay. It should be $3 per ton gross. Prepared clay, known as paper clay, should be $5 per ton. 150 EARTHENWARE. Cliina clay or kaolin in bulk not washed, should be $3 per ton aiid ■washed and prepared not less than $5 per toTi. White barytes, sulphate of Baryta crude, should be $3 per ton manu- factured, not less than $10 per ton; whiting and Paris white, manu- factured in casks and barrels $10 per ton; ground in oil or in putty j cents per pound. Chalk white 2 cents per pound. Crude soapstone and crude white talc should be $5 per ton, and manufactured should be $10. Mechanically ground wood pulp should be $5 per ton. Mechanically manufactured wood pulp should be $8 per ton. Bleached wood pulp should be not less than $10 per ton. You have on free list the following articles which should not be there: Unmanufactured white chalk. This should pay a duty of $3 per ton. Common blue clay should be classed with crude and pay a duty of $3 per ton. Yours truly, M. T. Waene. CHINA CLAY, OR KAOLIM. (Paragraph 98.) SiK: On behalf of the consumers in the United States of the raw material Englisli china clay (kaolin), your committee in framing your bill is requested to remove the duty, $3 per ton, on the above article, and to place the same on the free list. Ninety-five per cent of the English clays coming into this country are used by the manufacturers of paper, and this latter industry is one of the largest, employing a vast number of hands, almost entirely all skilled labor. There has been a revolution in the last fifteen years in the manufac- ture of nearly all grades of paper, owing to the modern methods of using wood, and this change has brought English clays into promi- nence. The increase of the imports of English clays in the last ten years is remarkable. As much has been imported in the six months, January 1 to July 1, 1893, as was brought in throughout the entire year 1892. With our export trade in paper rapidly increasing, with still greater promise, owing to the natural advantages on account of wood, the relief from this tax would still further enable our manufacturers to compete with the English makers, in whose product this clay plays an important part. The domestic industries protected are the talc interests, and the so- called Southern clays. The first named is practically controlled l)y two companies, one of which is capitalized at $5,000,000. The other is smaller. The Southern clay interests taken in connection with the talc organi- zations do not seem sufficiently important to burden the entire paper industry of the United States. Indeed, a large proportion of the paper manufacturers can not use either of the above domestic articles or any others in their papers, to take the place of English clays. The market price of talc and Southern clays is today, in large quan- tities, $9 to $10 per ton. That of the English clays is to-day $14 to CHINA CLAY, OR KAOLIN. 151 $16 per ton. With this difference in ])rioe what is the need of protec- tion 1 If the paper-makers of the United States can find an article sat- isfactory at ¥10 per ton, why is it that they are usini;- English clays at $14 to $16 per ton! The removal of this duty is requested because the great paper manu- facturing interests of the country demand it. English clay is necessary to them, as it forms a large per cent of their raw material, and domestic substitutes can not be advantageously employed. In support of the foregoing, attached herewith is a petition signed by a number of the leaders in this same paper manufacturing industry. Tours truly, John Eichaedson. Philadelphia, Hqrtcmber 15, 1893. Kaolin or china clay as prepared for the potters' use derives its value piincipally from labor in mining, Avashing, i^ressing, and drying. In pre- paring it for market 75 per cent of its valuation is represented in labor at the various mines. The principal mines producing china clay are located in North and South Carolina, Georgia, Florida, Kentucky, Mis- souri, Delaware, and Pennsylvania. The average price of labor is found to be $1.25 per day. The total importation of the higher grade of clays used by potters and paper-makers comes from Cornwall, England, and the average price of labor at the English mines is 2s. per day. The cost of transportation from the Cornwall clay mines will average lis. per gross ton to any of the principal seaports of the United States, large quantities being carried as ballast by steamers coming westward for lading. The average raih'oad freight from the American mines to the pottery centers exceeds that on foreign clays from any American port, with the ocean freight added. That from Florida is $6 per ton by rail and water ; that from South Carolina and Georgia is $4 per ton by rail and water; that from B"orth Carolina, all rail route, is $4.50 to $5.50; that from Delaware and Pennsylvania, all rail, $1.98 to $3. China clay, when prepared for market, constitutes but one-sixth of the material mined, as all geological authorities show, while the mate- rial carried to the miU for washing, pressing, drying, etc., results in but one-third of marketable goods, so that it can not properly be classed as raw material. They are manufactured goods, and so classed in various State tax laws which discriminate in taxation between manufacturing and other classes of corporations, notably in Pennsylvania. It will be seen that the present tariff duty on china clay, while not affording a satisfactory j)rotection to the American miner, has increased the importation very largely. We find that thei'e were imported into the United States during the fiscal year 1889 at the ports of Boston, New York, and Philadelphia, 19,249 gross tons of kaolin or china clay at a valuation of $109,398, and for the fiscal year 1892 at same ports the import was 33,003 tons, at a valuation of $264,738, showing an increase in importation of foreign clay of 71 per cent in tonnage and 140 per cent in valuation. Prom data furnished the Clay Miners' Association it is found that the product of the American miners of china clay for the year 1889 was 18,040 tons, and in 1892 was 25,100 tons, being an increase in produc- tion of near 39 per cent, while the imports as above stated increased 71 per cent. 152 EAETHENWAEE. The capacity of American clay mines already developed is fully eqaal to all demands, and there is an unestimated abundance of it lying un- developed in Virginia, North and South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, Texas, and in fact, in nearly every Southern and border State m the Union. While New Jersey, Illinois, Missouri, Kentucky, and other States have what are called ball clay, technically known as " unwrought," dutiable at $1.50 per ton, the present duty of $3 per ton on china clay and $1.S0 on unwrought clay does not cover the difierence in wages paid in Ameri- can mines over that of Cornwall, En-gland. It would require $1 per ton added to the present duty of both china and unwrought clay to bring the American production on an equal footing with the foreign. American clays are in every respect as good as the foreign. Eespectfully submitted, Jesse B. Kimes, Secretary Clay Miners^ Association. The Standard Kaolin Company of Florida, Ocala, Fla., September 6, 1893, Sir : Within the last few years large deposits of the finest quality of kaolin or china clay have been discovered in Putnam and Lake coun- , ties, Florida. Several plants have been erected for the preparation of the kaolin for market, and the business will soon grow into large pro- portions if present conditions remain and the present tariff of $3 ijer ton on foreign clays is not removed. English clay, which is no better than our Florida material, and of which 65,000 tons are imported per annum, is now sold at Trenton, N. J., at about $12 per ton, after paying a tariff of $3 per ton, which would bring the price to §9 per ton if the tariff is removed. Freights to the potteries at Trenton, N. J., from Florida are but little less than $7 per ton, and the cost of mining, washing, and preparing the clay for market is about $4. You will see from this state- ment of facts, which you can easily verify, that if the duty is removed we can not go into the market at all and that our already large invest- ments in the clay beds are practically lost. I can assure you that the business of raining kaolin in Florida is ■ likely to be one of the important industries of the State. The deposits are very large and practically inexhaustible. The quality of the clay is better than any yet found in America and equal to any in Europe. Of this there is no doubt, as it has been tested, both chemically and practically, by potters in France and England and by a great numljer of manufacturers in America. All unite in saying that the Florida clay is an almost perfect article, and they would be glad to use it to the ex- clusion of all others when they can get it in quantity. The capital already invested in the lands and mines is large, and ex- tensive preparations requiring larger expenditures for machinery eh:. for practical mining are under way. Two plants are already in' suc- cessful operation. The amount of capital that will come to Florida to be invested in the kaolin business is very large, but all negotiations in this direction are delayed on account of the fear that the duty on foreign clay will be removed by the i^resent Congress. Yours, respectfully, Sam'l W. Teagtjb, President Standard Kaolin Company. CHINA CLAY, OR KAOLIN. 153 Geo. Knowles & Son, Hast Lhierpool, Ohio, September 6', 1S03. We take fhe liberty of brmging- before your committee the subject of olay and other materials imijorted for the mauufacture of pottery, white granite and china-ware, tile, etc. Cornwall china clay, present duty $3 per ton. This clay is required to enable the potters to make goods equal in quality to foreign; also un wrought ball clays, which are also required for their plastic properties, in which the American clays are deficient. Without these clays the American potteries could not make such fine grade of goods, for the reason that they are finer clays, being more uniform in color and plastic ; also stone iiints and spar. All these ought to be free of duty to help the potters to compete with foreign goods. The present duty on manufactured goods is not sufficient to make potteries profitable with having duty to pay on crude materials as well as manufactured materials, largely imported, such as boracic acid, colors, and liquid gold. These are not made in this country in any quantity, therefore have got to be imported. By putting on the free list would assist the manufacturers in competing with the foreign goods, which can not be done at the present time without reducing wages. These are facts from my own knowledge. I sincerely hope the committee will recommend the duties on clays and manirfactured articles required which is now imported be put on the free list and allow the present duties now charged on manu- factured earthenware, china, tile, etc., to remain, or the consequence will be a reduction of wages to any changes your committee may make. Yours, respectfully, Geo. Knowles. OCALA, FlA., Septemher 7, 1893. Some three or four years ago it was discovered that there were de- posits of china clay in various parts of this State. After the most thorough tests it was discovered that this clay was equal to the very best imported for use in making the finest grades of chinaware. Of course this discovery led to a close investigation as to just what we had in the clay line in various parts of the State and the area of the various deposits. This brought to light the fact that in the counties of Putnam and Lake, together with one or two other counties, there were large depos- its of what has proved to be as fine clay as any yet discovered in the world. Like the phosphate industry, which has been and is so considered by the people of this State its salvation, and which has poured its mil- lions, and is yearly putting hundreds of thousands, of dollars into the pockets of our people, the fact that we had a very superior quality of kaolin has led to the i)lacing of capital in lands and the erection of plants for preparing the clay for market. By reason of its superior merits it brings in the market from $1 to $2 more per ton than the imported article, but on account of its nec- essarily high price, by reason of distance from the potteries and high freights, it is only used in the manufacture of the finer grades of ware; consequently the demand even at present is limited to these grades and not to the common wares. In Trenton, K. J., the imported clay with which ours has to compete can be, and is, sold at the regular price of not to exceed $12 per ton after paying an import duty of $3, which, if removed, as I now under- 154 EARTHENWARE. stand is contemplated, will enable the miners from France and Eng- land to place their clay at $9 per ton with the same profit as now. As it is said figures do not lie (though the figurer may), it is very easy to see just what the effect will inevitably be upon our Florida product in eveni; this import duty is removed. At present the potters of Tren- ton have use for but very small quantities of our clay at $13 to $13.50 per ton when he can obtain the foreign article at $1-!. In Bast Liver- pool, Ohio, I am informed by the potters that Florida clay at $14.50 meets with slow sale with the foreign clay at $11! per ton. (Please note the fact that foreign clay is quoted the same in East Liverpool as at Trenton, and that, too, after paying a freight of from $1.80 to $2 per ton, which shows conclusively that at the present it can be placed in Trenton for as low as $10 per ton at the same profit as at East Liv- erpool at $12; also that the ton on foreign clay is quoted as 2,240 pounds while our ton is but 2,000 pounds. Some few weeks since, in answer to an inquiry of mine, I received from one of the leading potters of East Liverpool the information that it would be necessary for Florida clay, in order to successfully com- pete with the imported which sold at that price delivered at their ware- house, to put our clay on the market at from $10.50 to $12 per ton. It may be necessary to remark that there can be little hope of doing this in years to come, for it all lies in the hands of the railroads, to which I refer further on. Kot allowing anything for wear and tear on the plant necessary for preparing the clay for market, and which costs from $15,000 to $25,000, nor interest on a total investment of from $30,000 to $75,000, it costs from $4 to $5 per ton to prepare the clay for market and place it on board the cars, whUe the freight from various mines ranges from about $6.50 to $7, free on board at Treuton, and from $7 to $7.50 at East Liver- pool, and these rates were only obtained after a continuous and well contested fight for the last two or three years with the transportation companies for low rates. By these flgiires you can see at a glance just the condition and posi- tion the clay miners are in at present, and where they wiU be, or rather where they will not be, in event the present tariff is removed or even reduced. Even the prospect of this removal or reduction of tlie rate has, so I am informed, caused the shutting down, of every mine in the State. The owner sits in his office waiting on Congress, while the laborer stands around with hands in his pocket waiting on the owner and the merchant, etc. The clay we produce goes into the finer grades of chinaware, and the purchaser of this class of goods is not the man usually classed as one of the " masses " but of the " classes ; " he is the man that is willing and able to pay his hundreds and thousands for the wares that suit his fancy, and is not the one that buys to fill a necessity. If the potteries of this country are in a bad way financially, it can not be laid at the door of the men furnishing them with the raw material as one can see at a glance there is too much of a contrast between the raw and the manufactured article. Sincerely yours, L. N. Green. GERMAN POT CLAY. 155 GERMA:Nr POT CLAY. (Paragraph 98.) Pittsburg-, Pa., Sepieniber 22, 1893. SiK: The duty exacted b.y tlie. Government on German pot clays of $1.50 per ton on the raw clay and $3 per ton on the calcined clay does not at first glance appear unreasonable, yet when the amount of it used by some of the signers is fully considered (some of them usiug from 4,000 to 5,000 tons per year), the amount paid for duties is quite an item in these days of forced economical management in our line of business. The large amount of German pot or fire clay imported annually into this country is used, as your committee is no doubt aware of, almost exclusively in the manufacture of glass house pots and tank furnace blocks, and placed in melting furnaces for the manufacture of all kinds of glass. Owing to the intense heat of these furnaces and the charac- ter of the material used in glass-making, the life of a pot or tank block at best is of short duration. The pots used in window glass or bottle furnaces will only average a life of from five to six weeks; the tank furnace blocks will, in certain places in the furnace, average from three to four months. Pots or blocks used in furnaces for making what is known as flint glass will last a longer time, from the fact that the comjjosition or batch, as it is called, is somewhat different, not having the amount of flux or element which destroys the clay in it that others have. The life of a pot or block depends largely upon the quality of the clay usedin it. A pot or block that does not remain in the furnace the average life often causes serious loss to the glass manufacturer. The unexijected breaking of it mean's not only the loss of thepotitself, but also the contents, as well as the loss of time to workmen and the consequential loss to the manufacturers before it can be replaced. Hence the desire on the partof the manufactui'ers to have these articles made from the best material to be had, even at an extra cost to them. Long experience has taught them that for this purpose a pot or block made from the German clay is decidedly the best, no other clay known throughout the world giving the satisfaction that it does. The ijeculiar qualities of it being not only to withstand the intense heat, but also the attacks of the fluxes or allcalies in the composition at the same time to a degree no other known clay possesses. It is true tliere is one concern in this country, and only one concern, which has been established for the past twenty -five or thirty years in St. Louis, Mo., who mine and wash a clay that is used to some extent by glass manufacturers in the manufacture of pots and blocks. The concern referred to, however, are also manufacturers of furnace blocks, and use their own clay in the manufacture of same with fair success. Their capacity, however, for supplying their clay to the glass manufac- turers is somewhat limited, from the fact that tlieir own works are sup- plied first with their products and only the surplus sold. This surplus, when used by glass manufacturers for pots or tank blocks, is used in nearly all cases in connection with the German clay. In very few cases is it used alone. Large shipments of the German clay are being made continually to St. Louis and vicinity, to the glass manufacturers located there, not- withstanding'they are located, in some instances, almost within a stone's throw of the mine where the Missouri clays are produced. It is evident from this fact that they obtain much better results from the use of German clay, in part or in whole, or they certainly would not 156 EARTHENWARE. use it at the additional cost through the high rate of freight, etc., if they could obtain satisfacitory results from the clay mined almost at their own door. This statement can easily be verified, if desired; and if we are correct, would ask why we should pay a duty on the raw material in question. In speaking of raw material, please notice that we also include the calcined clay, as we can see no reason why it should not be classed the same as the raw clay. The burning of it is done simply to reduce the shrinkage of it before being used in pots or blocks. In the manufacture of pots aud blocks certain proportions of calcined and raw clay are used, usually about two-fifths being raw and three- fifths burnt or calcined. This mix or batch is ground together, after- wards pugged or mixed, and then let stand for several weeks before it is molded into the diiferent shapes required. The burning of this cal- cined clay will not cost more than from 50 cents to $1 per ton, and why the difference in the duty was ever made so great is past understand- ing, as is also the present small duty of $1.25 per tonlevied on imported blocks, while the duty on the clay or raw material which these blocks are made from is $1.50 and S3 per ton, as above stated. This is such a glaring injustice to the manufacturer of furnace blocks that it was probably done through a clerical blunder. If our petition for the abolishing of the duty levied on the raw material is granted, we feel that the small duty of $1.25 per ton levied on the manufactured article should stand as it is. The raw and calcined clay we should by all means have free of duty. We can not obtain a similar clay in this country, aud any duty we are compelled to pay on it adds to the cost of window glass, tableware, lamp chimneys, and all other articles of glassware, such as are in use in every household throughout the'laud. Take the duty off this clay and you deprive no industry and no class of workmen of any needed protection. While we advocate protection of American industry and American workmen where it is needed, we are surely not so weak as to require protection for the ordinary laborer in the mining of fire clay, even should a claim be made that we have or may have at some time in the future a clay that will fill the requirements for glass manufac- turers. The long haul and conseiiuent high rate of freight should be sufficient protection for the home producers of such raw materials. Yours, very truly, E. E. Woods, Secretary. We, the undersigned manufacturers, hereby protest against the present duty we are compelled to pay the Government of the United States on importations of German pot clay, the present duty being $1.50 per ton (2,240 pounds) on the raw clav and $3 per ton (2,240 pounds) on calcined clay. We do not refer to or include any arti- cles that are or may be manufactured from the said clay, but only to the clay itself. We are compelled to use large quantities of it in our business, owing to the fact that there is no clay produced in this country having its peculiar qualities suitable for our business, and can see no reason for the continuance of tlie present high duty exacted by the Government on it. We feel that an injustice is beino- done us in allowing it to continue, and that Congress should remedy it. Tub WiLLisTTS Co., and others. PORCELAIN. 157 PORCELAIN. (Paragrapli 100.) STATEMENT OF ME. THOMAS C. SMITH, OF BKOOKIYN, N. T. Saturday, September 16, 1893. Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen op the Committee : This is my I first appearance before the Committee on Ways and Means, not that I have ignored action on the tariff, but it has been generally in a more quiet way, and I did not trouble the Committee on Ways and Means. I would not do so now, but the manufacture which I conduct has a pecu- liar condition which I think is not well understood, and I ask the privilege of explaining my peculiar position to have it better under- stood than it is now in this revision, if there is to be a revision on all branches of manufacture in this country. I am a manufacturer of porcelain, commonly known as " China ware " in the English-speaking tongue, and is called " porcelain " by the Latin race, both meaning the same thing. I should like to make myself well understood, and go back a little in history considerably. I will state that the manufacture of waies, as we all know, is very old. The earliest record we have of it is in China two thousand seven hundred years ago — they had pottery ware, and there is the distinction — but they did not discover the method of making the vitreous body which is now known as porcelain, or China, until two thousand seven hundred years before Christ. That was the first manufacture of China ware we have any record of, and it was from that time to two hundred and six years before Christ before they discovered a method of producing from the earth a body vitreous all through, both as to the body and glaze. From 206 before Christ to 1709 A. D. we tried to discover how to make this ware that was found to be so superior to all other wares which was brought over by Portuguese navigators now and again really as curi- osities. In 1709 it was discovered by accident in Saxony, and there kept a secret for many years, but the secret, like other secrets which get out, had too many to keep it, and it got into France, Prussia, Aus- tria, etc., and they began to establish manufactories to produce this newly discovered ware made from the earth, the simple earth and no admixture. All other wares have a metallic oxide in them. The diffi- culty to manufacture lay in its being purely and simply earth and nothing else. They established factories, but always by the Govern- ment, as its aid and patronage were ever made use of to bring that one mantifactare into existence. It is the most difBcult manufacjture of any that is attempted ; perhaps there is no process attended with so many difficulties as that of making porcelain. The other wares were made in large quantities, including wares of various kinds, and when the French, and Austrians, and Germans, etc., began to produce these wares upon the market the English were envious of the sui^eriority of their wares and improved their own C. C. and granita wares, and improved them under various names, calling them sometimes porcelain china, stone china, iron stone china, and all those various names" were given to the wares, to attach the name of porcelain to it to make it appear it was a superior ware. Now, to come down to making these wares in this country. As we all know, there were factories in this country — very small and very few of them — prior to the tariff of 1861. After that, under the protection of • that tariff, factories sprung up in all directions in this country, and I, 158 EARTHENWARE. had been somewhat connected with a manufactory, Ibein^ an owner, lu a small way, accidentally, from having loaned a maimfaoturer some money; it finally fell into my hands. They made but little table ware. They made doorknobs and little shutter and drawer knobs, and such things of that kind. At the breaking out of the war the establishment failed, and it fell into my hands. I was in Europe when the second battle of Bull Eun was fought, and I read the uewstbere and made up my mind that all business I was engaged in was gone. They called that a porcelain factory. I did not know one factory from another, but I visited the French factories and became imbued with the idea I could produce porcelain in this country. There had been great many attempts to produce porcelain in this country. The first attempt was in Phila- delphia, I think, and probably about thirty or forty attempts, but they failed. I got the impression that we could make porcelain in this coun- try. I returned and experimented for two years, and in 1865 I placed the article of pure porcelain upon this marliet, and have kept it there from that day to this. I do not wish to be understood as claiming any particular merits for having done this. Perhaps the merit lies in what Commodore Vauderbilt called, in respect to his success, " main strength and stupidity." And I did it. The American people found this ware was competing with the earthen manufactures, and since then they have turned wares upon the market called Trenton china, stone china, stone porcelain, and American porcelain, etc. — American china under these various names. I do not wish to be understood as condemning these wares. They are not to be condemned; in my opinion they are ware deserving a position in the market, but they are not porcelain. They are very meritorious wares, and those gentlemen who have brought them forward deserve much credit; they have even forced the English manufacturers wlio have been manufacturing for hundreds of years in England to better their products to keep in the market, but none of them make porcelain. That is a particular ware which is the most difficult and troublesome ware to make. It has never been made in any country in the world without direct government aid and patroiiage. Factories were establisLed by the Government in France, as Ave all know. But in this countrj' there has never been any sort of recognition of producing that ware, except what benefit might be extended through the tariff, and there has none ever been asked for. We ask now no more than that the tariff under which we are laboring may not be dis- turbed. To disturb that tariff' in our state of progress in tbat line of manufacture will be to wipe us out, for our conditions are so dissimilar from what they are in Europe. I will name a few of their conditions so that you may see the difficulties under which we labor in relation to producing these wares. In the first place, in Europe all the clays, spars, and quartz are taken from their deposits and maiuifactured into paste ready for the manu- facturers' hands. The laws are such that if there is any portion of these pastes that do not stand up and burn precisely as bought and recom- mended that the manufacturer of the paste is at a loss for the damao-e to the product; hence there is no chemical knowledge and there is' no machinery required. There is nothing in the world to do but to buy this i^aste prepared at hand and brought at the factory and put at their doors. We, on the contrary, have to be our own chemist, we have o-ot to compound our products from the material we find as best we can understand it, and chemistry alone is of very little value. Chemistry together with the great chemist of fire, the two comj)ounds, iswheie we find out our results. This is the disadvantage under which we labor. PORCELAIN. 159 Then onr clays in this country have not been such as we could make our best ware from, for the reason that there has not yet been discov- ered in this country until recently anything but sedimentary deposits, deposits washed by the waters into basins, etc., which takes its vitality from it, and those clays will not make a true and proper porcelain. There has been recently discovered a bed in North Carolina of feldspar that is a tertiary deposit, a deposit of clays rotted down. The ordinary clays of the earth will make common ^\ares. The clays of New Jersey will make wares made in New Jersey, but you can not make porcelain with those clays. You have got to have clays produced from the disin- tegration of feldspar, which is called kaolin, a name taken from the Chinese. These clays must be had from somewhere in order to produce the' article of porcelain, and then we have got to establish not only a manufactory of porcelain, but we have got to own mills to grind it. It cost me $30,000 to erect my mills for grinding, all of which is outside of anything we manufacture; so all of which is oritside of anything that the manufacturer of Europe has got to have. Then we have to dis- cover where the best material lies in the other States to combine and produce our results. This thing is bi'oadcast. The manufacture of all kinds of pottery benefits every State in the Union. For instance, before the recent dis- covery in Dillsboro, N. C, on this mountain you could have bought the whole mountain for .$10, and which is now selling at a high price. I bought for the purx^ose of getting a superior kind of feldspar, the use of ground for my own uses, and paid $5,000 for 3 acres, and that farmer a year before would have sold the entire farm of 100 acres of hind with good buildings on it for less than the 3 acres sold for when this was discovered, so that is one benefit of keeping these manufactories in existence in this country. Crowned heads have dabbled in the manu- facture of porcelain as owners, and it has been considered the very acme of the fictile art, and I doubt whether it is to the interest of this country to disturb it in its infancy. I am alone. There are no other manufacturers manufacturing a pure vitreous porcelain body and glaze, homogeneous, no metallic oxide or boracic acid, or any other foreign substance used in the body or glaze. It is simxjly a thing of pure earth, and I am the only manufacturer; but I have been in hoi)es of others coming in and starting Avith me. They make good ware. There is excellent ware made in Trenton and East Liverpool, perhaps as good ware as is made anywhere, and those gentlemen deserve great credit in the way in which they have brought their manufactures forward, but they do not manufacture porcelain. We labor under difiicultics that can not be surmounted in the ordinary manufacture. I simply come before this committee and lay this state of facts be- fore them, and it is for them to consider whether it is not worth while for this nation to hold on to a manufacture that will, if properly in- duced and have simply the ordinary fostering care of the tariff as it exists to-day, live and go forward and produce that much-coveted ware in this country. Now, in regard to prices, I would like to state that in connection with asking the tariff remain where it is, I want to show that we do not ask that which costs the consumer in this country anything. In the low tariff of 1856, 1857, 1858, the ruling tariffs, there was no sort of difficulty in getting for a China cup and saucer $2.50 to $3 per dozen. The hotels could not get them for less than that. The tariff was then 25 per cent. The tariff is now 60, but to-day the same style cup and saucer, but a better one is produced, and I will thank any 160 EARTHENWARE. gentleman in this room to give an order for a million dozen at f 1 a dozen. Tlie tariff is now 60 and it was then 25. So I could enumerate other articles. Take the article of dinner plates. When I first began to manufacture I sold dinner plates for $2.50 a dozen. We sell now the same style of plates, but a better plate, at $1 to $1.25 a dozen. Thus, you see, gentlemen, we are not asking that which will cost the people of the United iStates anything, for we have reduced the prices. I could go all through and enumerate articles by articles through our list which we have reduced since we commenced to manufacture China. It can be bought for less than one-half of what it was formerly, but it will rise to the same price again if we are thrown out of the market. I believe I have said all that I care to say uijon the subject. If there are any questions that any gentlemen wishes to ask I shall be pleased to answer them. Mr. Stevens. Is China clay and kaolin the same thing? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir; essentially they are, because the man when he says China clay means kaolin. Mr. Stevens. That is imported, you say*? Mr. Smith. No, sir. We do import some because we can import a good quality of clay, not as good as the ISTorth Carolina clay, but we can import clay and save on a cargo of 600, 700 to 800 tons $3,000 or $4,000. It differs mainly in the freight. Now, for instance, as regards freight, it is a thing very curious and I have put a note in my pocket taken from our books in regard to the prices we pay on freight; for instance, we pay on freight from Cornwall, England, $2.16 per ton, and we will pay on freight from Dillsboro, K. C, $5.13. There is $3 a ton difference in freight alone. There is a $3 difference per ton on the China clay, which I would like this committee to retain for throiigh that we can get our best clays discovered and can use tliem. If we did not keep that duty upon it, it will shut the clay beds up and we will shut up, because that is another peculiaiity in relation to our manu- facture. I can not manufacture my ware from imported clays for the reason that German and other clays lie too far interior. The clay of Cornwall will not make first-class porcelain without an admixture of our own clay with it. My grade of ware would run down if I used other than Dillsboro clay. Mr. Stevens. There is a large consumption of China clay or kaolin for other purposes, which is imported ? Mr. Smith. There is much kaolin used for other purposes. The papermakers are consumers of clay, especially for paper boxes ' but it is not a very high-priced clay. ' Mr. Stevens. We import China clay for other manufacturing pur- poses? Mr. Smith. Oh, yes ; American competitors use a good deal of clav but they get a very cheap clay. So long as it stands up well they "et this clay at a half— well not over one-third— of what it costs to get our clays at. Mr. Stevens. Regardless of freight the clay of North Carolina is better than the Cornwall clay? Mr. Smith. Better by far. Mr. Stevens. Are they digging it out in North Carolina? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir; they have gone forward with it. Mr. Stevens. You want a duty on the China clay? Mr. Smith. We want a duty on the China clay. Though itmif>ht bo called raw material to me, but it is not raw material to the man who PORCELAIN. IGl gets it out when you get the raw material. I know of nothing which is raw material except the mountains. Mr. Stevens. I do not understand why you want a duty on China clay when there is better duty, except the difference of freight in the difference between the Cornwall and the North Carolina clay! Mr. Smith. Simply to give you a little idea of how clays have worked in this country. Seven years ago you could not buy a pound of tirst-class clay; the best kaolin then known came out of Hockessin Valley, Penn- sylvania. That was a sedimentary deposit, not a first-class article, but it was the best we could get and we were using it and that clay was covered with 50 or 75 feet of superincumbent earth M'hich we had to remove, and the lowest price we could get it for was $20, and we could import, by paying $3 duty, good clay from Cornwall at about $12. Mr. Stevens. What do you say about Connecticut"^ Mr. Smith. That is not clay, that is a pure feldspar and quartz. Mr. Payne. How long has it been since this North Carolina clay was discovered? Mr. Smith. It is not more than seven or eight years since they began to find it. They first struck that clay hunting for mica. In the eastern States they did not have mica enough and they were trying to get it in North Carolina, and in going there and digging over the mountains to discover beds of mica they found this. Mr. Payne. You say you use that clay in the manufacture of china or porcelain! Mr. Smith. Yes, sir ; mica you know is Mr. Payne. I know about that. Mr. Smith. Feldspar, quartz, and mica are constitnents of granite rock and they have tumbled down, the mica going one way, the quartz another, and the feldspar another. Mr. Payne. Did you say you advanced the price of the land contain- ing that clay since you bought some of it! Mr. Smith. No, sir; I did not. Mr. Smith. Do parties own any of it! Mr. Smith. Yes, sir; there are others competing for those clays. Those mountains which were worth nothing ten years ago are valuable noAV. Mr. Payne. Would not that induce other parties to go into the manufacture of porcelain ware! Mr. Smith. I did not quite catch your question. Mr. Payne. Would not that induce other parties to go into the manufacture of porcelain besides yourself! Mr. Smith. I should think it would. Mr. Payne. Where do you manufacture! Mr. Smith. At Brooklyn, N. Y. Mr. Payne. The Onondago Company, what sort of ware do they make! Mr. Smith. They make the ordinary earthenware, a superior grade. Mr. Payne. Have they got very fine clay there! Mr. Smith. No, sir; they have got no clay that is as good as the clay of New Jersey. They buy some imported clays. Mr. Payne. Their product is a very superior quality! Mr. Smith. Their product is an excellent product, and they take a gi-eat deal of pains to get their products into the best possible form. In my mUls I think my material is ground finer than anyl)0(l>- else, and the Onondago Pottery Company i)iiy an extra price for grinding grades they use becawse it is gronutl fiuef and Ho]ecte4 closer, 162 EARTHENWARE. Mr. Turner. Where is your pottery? Mr. Smith. In the northern district of Brooklyn, -n-hat used to be called Green Point. I\Ir. Turner. Do you say that your product is superior to the French product"? Mr. Smith. Oh, no, sir; I Leg y(jur pardon. I do not attempt to equal this thin egg-shell ware. I'make nothing finer than hotel ware, first-class hotel ware. It is useless for anyone to try to surpass the French in the art. Mr. Payne. The Haviland's of Kew York are much interested in it. Mr. Smith. They have a large factory in Limoges. It is beyond the ambition of any human being to surpass their ware. Mr. Turner. IIow are they in'ogressingin the manufacture of china ware in Xew Jersey. Mr. SaiiTH. They do not make it there. They make a superior qual- ity of earthen ware. Mr. Turn:er. Did you observe rhe discussion that was had in the House during the Forty-seveiith Congress on this question of chiua ^^are. Mr. Smith. I did. I was much misrepresented in that discussion, but I did uot stop to correct it, for I presumed that the tariff over their exertions would be satisfactory to me, and it was with one exception. I urged and demanded of those gentlemen to let the tariff alone and not for me to become a mark for the public to shout at about increasing the price of the poor man's breakfast table. The tariff' was enough as I considered it, but they raised it, although I considered it a. great mis- take to raise the tariff' at that time. Mr. Turner. You have noticed some ware displayed on the floor of the House as samples of Ameiican china. Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. Some gentlemen stated it could not be told from the imported article. Mr. Smith. To the inexperienced that is so, but to the experienced it is not so. Mr. Turner. Having a species of American pride myself, I bought a set of the American china on that occasion, and it fell to pieces, my Mufe told me, on the shelves. Mr. Smith. Y'ou did uot get china. I am sorry to say that is a mis- take on the part of some of our manufacturers to manufacture earthen- ware and sell it as china. Mr. Stevenk. What proj)ortion of china clay impoited from Europe is used in your ware? Mr. Smith. We import about half we use simply because it makes equally as good ware and saves us money. ]Mr. Stevens. You did not get my questiou. The raw clays which are imported, the china clays which are imported, what proportion < if it is used in the wares that are maiuifactured in this country ? Mr. Smiti-i. No one makes my style of ware except myself. Mr. Stevens. Is it not used by other people in making different wares '! Mr. Smith. Tiiey do some imported clays precisely as I do. Mr. Stevens. Do you know what proportion of the amount uscss the duty is retained ? Mr. Smith. JSfo, sir; it could not. We live under two disadvanta"-es- We have to pay American labor so much and we have to remove n"ioi'e superincumbent earth. Our mines do not lie as well as iu Coru-wall PORCELAIN. 165 and we liare to remove move superinenmbent earth at a greater i-ost than they do in Coiuwall. Mr. Bryan. You said you have paid $5,000 for 3 aere.s of land in Conuectiout'? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Bkyan. And that before the deposit Avas discovered the whole farm was not worth that? Mr. Smith. No, sir; it was not. Mr. Bkvan. Wliat made that great increase in the price of those few acres? Mr. Smith. Simply because it was a bed of feldspar and quartz com- bined, the best discovered in the United States. I think it is an origi- nal formation come up from the bottom. It was found there in digging for mica. The old farmer, under the auspices of Prof. Brush, of Yale College, was getting specimens out of that for college purposes, and they induced this old farmer that what he did not get of mica they would make up if he would go forward and dig in this place. He dug in this place and he discovered this deposit of feldspar and quartz. I bought what he got out and then he made up his mind to sell it, and in competition between the Trenton people and myself I had to pay $5,000 for this piece of land which would have sold for $75 twelve months before. Mr. Beyan. Is that clay below the surface? Mr. Smith, It is not clay, it is feldspar aad quartz. Mr. Bryan. Well, that then. Is that below the surfaced Mr. Smith. As I said a moment ago, I believe this is an original up- heaval from the bottom. Mr. Bryan. How far down do you have to go to find it? Mr. Smith. Oh, there; it is within 5 feet of the surface. Mr. Bryan. What does it cost to take that out of the ground? Mr. Smith. It costs — there is no tariff on that, you understand, and we do not want any. ISTot at all. We have got the best felds^jar and quartz in this country. Mr. Bryan. That can be produced without a tariff? Mr. Smith. Not only that, but we have calls for it from abroad; we get it far better than they can i^roduce. Mr. Bryan. Does it cost you any less to make a dozen plates to-day than in 1865? Mr. Smith. Oh, yes; sir. ]\Ir. Bryan. How much less ? Mr. Smith. Well, it costs me 50 per cent less at least. Mr. Bryan. What does it cost you now to make a dozen plates? Mr. Smith. That is getting it down finer than I can. Mr. Bryan. You know what you sell them for? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir; I do. Mr. Bryan. A dollar and $1.25? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir; we do. Mr. Bryan. Can you tell the committee what it costs to make those plates ? Mr. Smith. To tell you what it costs to make that particular article comes down to a fine point. Mr. Bryan. If you know for what you sell it can not you tell what it costs ? Mr. Smith. I can tell of the general manufacture, but hardly down to special plate, cup, or saucer. 166 EARTHENWARE. j\rr. Bryan. Can yon ivpproximatc, the fost of a do/en platea which j'ou are willing to sell at $1.2.")? Mr. Smith. Of course 1 can. IMr. Bryan. Wliat Is your best intl2;ment? Mr. S^iiTH. Our approximation 'is that if we do not get 25 per cent on onr products Ave are not being paid. Mr. Bryan. Over and above the cost of the product? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir; if we do not get that we can not run our fac- tory, because you must recollect in that line of production it is very different from a mercantile transaction. You take S300,000 and put it in a mercantile transaction and you can turn it over ten, ttfteen, or twenty times in a year, but yon can not turn ours over once. Mr.'BRYAN. Do not you think that the fact that these goods cost you less to ifeke them than they cost in 1805 has had something to do with the fall in the prices? Mr. Smith. My dear sir, I could not have met the foreign competitors if I had not bettered my appliances, and got different appliances, and got myself in different shape, and all that sort of thing; otherwise they would have wiped me out. Mr. Bryan. Then yon were compelled to improve your niaciiinery because of foreign competition? Mr. Smith. I was compelled to improve my methods because the for- eigner would not give up this market without a struggle, and I found when I first began it took all the money I could get, because I had to learn my trade. ]\[r. Bry'AN. Then the foreigner has made you come down with your prices instead of you making him come down ? Mr. Smith. If I had been out of existence the foreigner would not have come down. Mr. Bryan. But the fact is you said here you made him come down in the price and the result is we ha^e all enjoyed the benefit. Mr. Smith. That is it, the competition. Mr. Bryan. Xow, having brought down the cost of the product to a point you have brought it to, if you should go out of existence would the cost of the product rise again ? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir; if you take competition off prices will go up always. Mr. Bill' AN. Will the selling price or the cost of the product go up? Mr. Smith. The selling price will go up. Mr. Bryan. So that the price would go up to wher(-' it was before? Mr. Smith. I can not say it M'ould, but the foreigner would reap the advantage of no competition in this country for his particular goods and he would charge more for them. Mr. Bryan. Is that your reason for wanting this? Mr. SMiTir. I want the tariff kept whei'e it is. I ask for neither a rise nor ask for a fall. I do not care about a 5 per cent fall back to where it was, 45 per cent. I am content with any reasonable thing, but in regard to taking and putting that tariff down to what is callcfl a revenue tariff', whatever that may be, that would wipe me out. Mr. Bryan. You stated awhile ago you were opposed to raising the tariff' at a former time? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. For fear it would make this industry marked? Mr. S^riTH. Yes, sir; for fear of making the cry that has been created of increasing the poor man's breakfast table.- Mr. Bryan. But the tariff was raised in spite of your protest? PORCELAIN. 1C7 ]\rr. Smith. Yes, sir. .Mr. Bbyan. Would you b« willing to have it go bacli to where it was before? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. What was it then? Mr. Smith. There was a duty then upon inland charges and 4.") per cent. Mr. Beyan. So you would be willing to have it go back to that? Mr. Smith. I have no objection. Mr. Bryan. You do not like, in other words, to lia\e a tariff that might attract attention? Mr. Smith. I did not at that time wish to have it put np so it wonld attract attention becanse that called attention to us, and we were never spoken to or anything said to us until after the tariff was put np, and then we were charged with increasiug- the prices of the poor mail's breakfast table. Mr. Bryan. Do not you think it is quite important that public atten- tion should be called to the tariff which manufacturers enjoy? Mr. Smith. I do not; Ithir.k that neither public attention nor poli- ticians' attention should have anything to do with an industry of the country. I think it should be run without the interference of politics or politicians. Mr. Bryan. And when you get a good thing you ought to be allowed to keep it without having any attention called to it? Mr. Smith. I will answer that good thing by stating that in the last five years I have not made 2 per cent upon my capital. I could have gotten more out of my capital in almost any other waj'. Mr. Bryan. That is between 1805 and 1888? Mr. Smith. I made more money then than ever since. Mr. Gear. By loaning it to banks you could have gotten 10 per cent ? Mr. Smith. I have not got 10 per cent within the last five years. Mr. Bryan. Do you thiidc the price has been reduced by the taiift' of 1890? Mr. Smith. No, sir; it has gone neither up nor down. I never moved my prices the least in consequence of that; I could not do it. Mr. Bryan. Was the tariff on your particular goods raised in 1800? Mr. Smith. No. ]\Ir. Bryan. It is just the same? Mr. Smith. I think so, but I would not speak square to the cord, but I think it was not. At all events I paid no attention to it. Mr. Payne. The change made in 1883 was leaving off the inland charges and making the import a larger percentage? ]\[r. Smith. That is the idea. Mr. Payne. Eealiy, was there any difference in the tariff? Mr. Smith. There was in the neighborhood of four or live per cent. Mr. Payne. About that ? Mr. Smith. There was a 4 or 5 per cent raise. Mr. Payne. Now, your main competition after all comes from people who make a little cheaper grade of pottery, not quite as good as yours? Mr. Smith. We have a competition of that kind. Mr. Payne. Do not they supply the main bulk of trade, the con- sumption ? Mr. Smith. Which, the cheaper? Mr. Payne. Say the Trenton and East Liverpool? Mr. Smith. Of course they make ten to my t>iw. 168 EARTHENWARE. Mr. Payne. They make the Inills: of the pottery that is used in the United States? Mr. Smith. They do. Mr. Payne. And yours is sold to hotels or rich people? Mr. Smith. That is the class; we can not sell for anything like their prices because it costs us more. Mr. Payne. They are producing this class of goods which an ordi- nary observer can not tell from yours at a lower price, and of course that tends to keep down prices both on your article and the foreign manufacture'? Mr. Smith. Certainly; necessarily so. Mr. Payne. And they could not live; the other potteries would be closed except for the tariff? Mr. Smith. Certainly they would. Mr. Payne. So that we should be wholly at the mercy of the foreign manufacturer ? Mr. Smith. If this tariff is materially lowered we will be at the mercy of the foreign manufacturer. Mr. Payne. And there is the fiercest kind of competition between these manufacturers in Trenton, East Liverpool, and Syracuse and throughout the United States ? Mr. Smith. There is the fiercest kind of comiiotition amongst them all. WHITE BAETHElSrWAIlE. (Fanagrapli 100.) East Liverpool, Ohio, Septemher 14, 1893. Sir : Our firm has been in business over a year. ^Ve have given the birsiness the closest attention and have run the business very econom- ically, and can say we have had as few losses and as large profits as any firm in the business here. We have taken stock twice and the re- sult both times has indicated that the profits are only ordinary. Competition is very close. Some of it among our own iieople, but the worst competition we meet is the English trade. Why only this morn- ing we had a letter from a customer saying he could buy for |5.5() what we were asking him $7.53 for. He said the goods offered at the price he named were of the best English make. Believing that the tariff is a i)rotection to American industries, 1 have no hesitancy in saying that a reduction of the same would result in a corresponding loss to the American potter, which, if greater than could be borne by the manufac- turer, Avould naturally have to be shifted onto the men in the work- shops. If you could take a look over our books you would think like myself that there was a poor show to reduce the price of labor and give the laboring man a chance to live. We pay our unskilled labor lgl.50 and skilled labor $2 per day, where we hire by the da.\', and Avhere tlie work is done by the piece (I take the pay roll of September 2 for my guide) the men and boys earn from $1.75 to $12,150 per week in the pressing shops; journeymen dish-makers and jiggermen drtiw more money, but they have so nmch help to pay out of the $25 or $30 per week we pay them that they only have ordinary wages left for themsches. John W. Hall, iiecretary of East Liverpool Pottery Company. PASTEUR FILTEE. 169 PASTEUR FILTEK. (Paiagrapli 101.) Dayton, Ohio, Septemher 12, 1SQ3. Sirs : We respectfully petition your honorable committee that in the revision of the tariff laws of the United States you place the filtering- medium of the Pasteur germ-proof iilter (and which is commonly known as "bougie" or "candle") upon the free list, and submit the fol- lowing reasons in substantiation of our claims therefor: It is a well-established fact that typhoid fever, malarial fever, cholera, cholorine, cholera infantum, diphtheria, and many other diseases are due to certain germ life, and that the cause of such diseases are nearly al- ways traceable to the presence of these germs in drinking water. How to obtain pure \\ ater for domestic purx^oses has been a serious problem for manj^ years. It is well known that as countries become settled up the formerly pure spring and well water becomes contami- nated with the excreta from persons and animals who live in their prox- imity. The building up of cities, towns, and mannfactoi'ies on our water courses is polluting this source of supply also. To purify water and free it from these danger elements we must look to some practical mechanical means. This has been accomplished b>' Dr. Ohas. E. Ohamberland, director- general of the Pasteur Institute, by the use of a peculiarly compounded biscuit, iu upijearanceresembling ungiazed porcelain. That this filtering medium will remove from water the germs of diseases is attested to by the ablest physicians and bac- teriologists of this country and Europe. Louis Pasteur, the great French savant, in whose laboratory this important discovery was made, wrot(; Dr. Ohamberland at the time, saying, "This filter, invented in my laboratory, where its usefulness is put to test every day, knowing its full scientific and hygienic value, I wish to bear my name;" hence it is known as the Pasteur-Ch amber- land filter. Surg. Gen. George M. Sternberg, TJ. S. Army, says, " I have tested the Pasteur-Chamberland filter and find it germ proof." H. W. Austin, of the United States Marine-Hospital Service, says, " I regard it the most efficient and safest filter I have ever seen." They have been tried and uufjualifiedly indorsed as germ proof by professors of chemistry and hygiene in Cornell University, Yale, Har- vard, the University of ^Michigan, the University of Pennsylvania, and elsewhere, and are to-day employed in the study of bacteriology iu every imj^ortant laboratory in the world. Ail of the army posts of the Eren(;h army are supplied with them, as are also the armies of continental Europe and the British army of India. Mr. Freycinet, minister of war, in his report to the President of the French Republic, in ISili;, said tlnit since the introduction of these filters typhoid fever had been almost entirely overcome, and that the few cases occurring weie readily traced to where the soldier drank unfiltered water in villages outside of the camp. Epidemics of typhoid fever in this country have been stopped by the general use of the Pasteur filter, notably at Duluth, Minn., in 1S91, Avheie they were recommended by Profs. Formad and Marshall, of the University of Pennsylvania, and at .Vshland, Wis., in 18913, recom- mended by Prof. Vaughn, of Michigan University. Many other 170 EAETHENWARE. instances fonlflbe cited, and tliousandsof testimoiiinl^fan iie furnished if desired. TLe great hygienic and scientiiic value of the Pasteur filter is estab- lished throughout the \yorld. That it will remove from water tlie germs of typhoid fever, cholera, cholorine, malarial fevers, and other diseases incident to drinking impure water, is absolutely <'ertain. The high price which we are compelled to charge for them alone prevents their nearly universal introduction. Under the tariff laws of 1890, Schedule B, paragraph 101, has been classed by the collector of customs the filtering medium of the Pasteur water filter, known as "bougie" or "candle." This filtering medium is composed of ground biscuit of porcelain clay, or any granular earth substance which does not vitrify at a temx)erature of, say, li,500'"' P., mixed in specified proportions with pipe clay, or any suitable plastir clay, and baked at a temperature of from 1,800° to -!,400o P., the object being to make a filtering medium which is^of a uniform porosity and sufficiently fine to remove from water and other fluid microscopic organ- isms and all matters held therein in suspension. The formula for this compound is protected in this country by let- ters patent of the United States, granted to Dr. Chailes E. Chamber- land, of Paris, Prance, director-general of the Pasteur Institute. The bougies are all made in Prance and imported into this country exclu- sively by the Pasreur-Ohamberland Filter Company, of Dayton, Ohio, and are used only in Pasteur filters manufactured by it. They are not sold upon the open market, but are only sold in connection with Pasteur filters, or to rei)lace such bougies as may become broken by use of those owning Pasteirr filters. They are not, therefore, in any way in competition with a similar product manufactured in the United States, with the exception of a very limited number, which we contend are an infringement upon the Chamberlaud patents; two of such cases of infringement, and the most important ones, having already been decided in favor of said patents, and one of which was by the cir(.'nit court of appeals, the highest tribunal in patent cases. Whilst we have always contended that these articles have been im- properly classed under Schedule B, paragraph 101, becairse they are not what is contemplated in the language of the paragraph, as " china, jjorcelain, parian bisque, earthen, stone and crockery ware, and man- ufactures of the same, by whatsoever designation or name known in the trade," for they are not "ware," as applied to the articles enuniei-- ated in the law, nor are they known to the crockery and pottery trade as an article of merchandise. Nevertheless, the decisions of the De- partment ha\e been against us. AVe have, therefore, been compelled to pa>' a duty of 55 per cent ad valorem, which cost has of necessity been charged into the cost of construction, and makes the retail price of the bougies come very high, v\z, $1 each. By placing the bougies upon the free list they can be retailed at 60 cents each, and leave to the- manufacturer and local agent substantially the same ])ercentage of profit as now, thus making a reduction of 40 cents on each bougie sold, which already amounts to more than 50,000 a year in this country, used in filters and as repairs. We, as manttfacturers, have been stri\'ing to reduce to the minimum the cost of production as well as the sellin"- lirice, preferring to make a small margin of profit on a large nunUxn- of filter-s, rather than a large profit on a few. The filtering bougies are the largest single itein of exjiense, and inasmuch as they are not in competition with any manufacturer in this country, we respectfully GREEN GLASS BOTTLES. 171 1 petition that they ]>e placed upon the free list for the following rea-ons, j viz : ' First. Beiiis' pi-otected by letters i)atent of thi' United States issued I to a citizen of u foreign country they can not be made in this country, ■except with the consent of the patentee. Second. Beins>' used only in a single article of manufacture in this country they are not known to the pottery trade as an article of mer- chandise, and should not, therefore, be classed with the subjects specified under Schedule B, ^laragraph 101. Third. Because by removing- the tariff it will enable us to so reduce the cost of the manufacture and retail price of the completed filters as to place them within the reach of the majority of the citizens of this country. Fourth. Because by the removal of the tariff it will enable us to reduce the retail price of bougies for repairs, thus making a saving to the consumer of about 0C| per cent. Fifth. Because, being an appliance of great hygienic value, the United States Grovernment should not levy a tax ui)on them to preveiit their general use throughout this -country. We submit herewith for your inspection a bougie which is a sainple of the filtering medium above referred to and is the article which is the subject of this communication. We also submit you herewith our illustrated catalogue, showing the various styles of filters which we manufacture. In these filters are used one or more of the bougies. The water to be filtered passes through the filtering medium from the exterior to the interior, and escapes through a small orifice at one end. The impurities of the water which are removed accumulate on the ex- terior, where they are readily removed by washing the bougie with brush and water, thus restoring it to its original porosity and efflcieucy, for the minutest particle can not enter into the filtering medium. Very respectfully, The Pasteur-Giiajmberlawd Filter Company, By J. S. Miles, Secretary and Treasurer. GREEK OT.ASS BOTTr,E.S. (Paragraph lOS.) Thttrsdat, September II, WfiS. STATEMENT 0'? LOTUS ARKINGTON, 0? MASSILLON, OHIO, REPEESENTING THE GEEEN GLASS BOTTLE BLOWERS OF THE UNITED STATES. ^Ir. Ol-IAnnrAN AND (lENTLEMEN OP TIIK COMMITTEE: T Shall not take up much of your time. 1 have prepaic^d a^ pai»ei' which I will i cad : Massillon, Ohio, Septrmher l.t, IS'.iS. Gentlemen': In tl\e pvojidsiil to reform the tariff now under eonsiileriition by your committee, in belialf of tUi". Green and Aml)er Glass Bottle Blowers of the l'nit(;d States of America, I resiiectfnlly submit the following reasons why the pi'esent tariif ou glass bottles should be retained: Tlio present prosperous condition of the glass bottle industry has licen attained solely by the protection given our trade liy the tariff' acts of 1883 and 1890. H:id not these acts given our trade additional protc^ctiou, it would undoubtedly have jiassed in a groat measure into tlie hands of tlie foreign manufacturer, but since 1883 the number of workmen employed at our trade west of the Allegheny Mountains has 172 EARTHENWARE. more than trebled, and east of said.moiiutaina more than doubled. Vet in tha fc 8aDif> period theselling price of our principal product in the West— export beer bottles— hii» declined from $6 and $7 per Krosa to something less than $5 at the present time. Internal competition is so keen at present aud the sellin.a: price of beers, water bot- tles, minerals, brandies, demijohns, carboys, hock and Rhine wines especially, so close that any reduction from the present tariff would fall entirely on the price of labor, demoralizing our trade and placing us entirely at the mercy of the foreign man- ufacturer. Nor can I see that a reduction of the tariff would be of any benefit to the people at large. The product of all our factories is disposed of in large quantities to brewers, beer bottlers, mineral and water bottlers, aud wholesale medicine dealers, etc. If by a reduced tariff they should get the goods cheaper, they aud they only would receive the entire benefit, as the cost of each bottle would be so small that it would have no appreciable effect on the price of the contents, which would be the same, and the public at large would receive no benefit. An impartial consideration of our case will show conclusively that any reduction of the duty on glass bottles will benefit no one but the wealth}- brewers, bottlers, and patent-medicine dealers, while, on the other liand, the entire labor class of the industry would suffer, from the manufacturer to the common laborer. The present tariff on glass bottles is by no means exorbitant, wlnm we consider the many reasons why glass can be produced much cheaper in Europe than we can hope to get it in this country, and the difference in the price of labor is certainly very substantial. One other reason why we can not compete in pricewith Europe is that from climatic conditions, the oppressive heat of .July and August, all our factories are compelled to shut down these two months, while in Europe worl-c goes on the whole year round, aiid in some cases work is actually continued on Sundays. It is necessary that we have the present protective tariff' to protect labor from such a condition of afl'airs. I hereby show you the cost of ]3roduction at one of the large glass factories of Ger- many, the Gresheim works, of Hoye, and the cost of the same class of goods in Ohio, where glass is supposed to be made as cheap as it can be produced in this country. Cost of production at Gresheim works — cost of making a gross of amber pint and quart bottles : Fuel, material, boxing, and supplies $1. 0.5 Labor, salaries, and blowing 65 Total cost of production 1. 70 Cost of production in Ohio — quarts : Fuel, material, boxing, and supplies 2. 00 Labor, salaries, and blowing 2. 09 Total cost of production 4. 09 Cost of production of pints : Fuel, material, boxing, and supplies 1. 44 Labor, salaries, aud blowing 1. 57 Total cost of production 3. 01 Average cost of pints and quarts in Ohio $9. 55 per gross. Average cost of pints and quarts in Gerruany 1. 70 per gross. Louis AlMilXCTdX. Frcsidciil. Mr. ABRiNGTON. (Presenting several samples of bottles.) I ^vill refer you to the price of patent medicines. This bottle wliicli I show yon is Warner's Liver and Kidney Cure. That bottle can be produced at the factory for A3.75 per gross, at Eochester, X. Y., and for $4.05 a gross, including freight and discount. Last spring a year ago that botlie aud contents was sold at $1. Last May or June the retail price was raised from f 1 to -1^1.25, which would make the price per gross of that medi- cine to the general j^ublic >!<170, while the bottle costs only $f .04. That is a sample. That holds good ou all articles made by our jjeople. Take a mineral-water bottle that a few years ago sold for ^3.1') and J153..50, and the dealer will charge Just the same for soda A\-ater. The general public gets no beneflt. ISTeither does the mantifacturer get any benefit in the reduction. According to the figures I have, 1 can show that it would neeessaiily compel' a I'cduction of wages of tlic workiuo'. mail, while the general public would get no benefit. GREEN GLASS BOTTLES. 173 AVe Lave in the United States 85 plants which make that class of goods, and which employ from 200,000 to 250,000 people, depending for a livelihood on that industry alone. I have been in business for forty- oue years, and I can say to you that I never saw glass bottles sell as cheap as they are selling to-day. If you go to the drug store to-day and get a prescription filled, they will charge you 5 cents for an ounce bottle. They can be produced for 95 cents per' gross, which is not over one-half cent per bottle. Mr. Payne. That is about 1,000 per cent? Mr. Aebington. I want to show you some figures. It was said that soda ash has never been as cheap in forty years as it is to-day. Here is what it costs to make a gross of quart bottles: The duty on soda ash is $5 a ton. It is $4.09, and without the duty it is $3.97. So you will see that it only is a difference of 2 cents a gross. What difference will that make to the people'? Mr. Taesney. What species of manufacture are you speaking about"? Mr. Aeeington. Quart and pint bottles worth $2.16 a gross. Mr. Tarsnet. What do they sell for on this market? Mr. Aekington. I hav(>, stated the amount for which they can be purchased. Quarts were sold last year for $4.80. Mr. Taesnbt. What is the duty per gross on quart bottles ? Mr. Aeeington. Two dollars and sixteen cents a gross. The duty on quarts is 1 and 1^ cents. On pint bottles, with a duty on soda ash, the cost is $3.01, and without the duty on soda ash it is $2.91. The difference is 10 cents a gross. Mr. Payne. What is soda ash worth per ton now? Mr. Areington. One and one-eighth cents a pound. In regard to cheapness, I would say that ten years ago we did not buy Mason fruit jars for less than $1.50 a dozen. That has been the price for several years. To-day you can buy all you want in Pittsburg, Philadelphia, and other cities at $1. Since the patent has run out they are lower, for that determines the price. They have come down $1 a dozen. It is not the bottle which makes it dear; it is the patent. The reduction of the present duty would not cheapen the product to the consumer. If you were to reduce the duty, it-would simply go to the patent medi- cine man and the mineral-water man, and also to the bottler. My friend, Mr. Auth, has been at the trade for some fifty years. Mr. AxJTH. Forty-nine years. Mr. Aekington. We respectfully ask your honorable committee to retain the present duty on glass bottles. I can say to you that our fires are not lighted. There is not a factory to-day that is in opera- tion. We should have gone to work on the 1st of September. We are not running west of the Alleghenies, nor east, because they are afraid you are going to take off the tariff. The manufacturers say they can not do anything, can not get any orders, and can not see their way clear to put the men to work, because it has gone forth from the dealers, brewers, and bottlers that there is to be a reduction in the tariff, and they expect to receive the benefit of it. Mr. Taesney. That condition would exist no matter how high the tariff was, if they know there is to be some change in it, whether it were lust or not? Mr. Areington. It is the uncertainty of your action that is keeping us idle today. Mr. Taesney. That does not enter into the merit of the question-^ , wbetUer there sJiouId or should uot be ^ recinctionl IT-i EARTHENWARE. Mr. Abrington. The failure of the manufacturer to start his works depends entirely upon the action to be taken by this committee on the tariff'. They are afraid to start their works, fearing a change. They can not afford to pile up stock, and the dealers will not give them orders at this time. They are holding back to receive the benefit of the re- duction, because they claim on all sides that if the t;iiili' comes down — and the manufacturers havenotifled us to that effect — the workingman's wages, skilled and unskilled, is to be cut down. Mr. Tausney. Can you manage to live on the present duty? Mr. Areington. Yes, sir. We only ask that the duty be not changed; that it be retained. STATEMENT OF CONEAB ATJTH, OF PITTSBURG, PA. Mr. AUTH. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen of the committee, I have only a few words to say. All that 1 want to say is I have been working at the glass buisness for fifty years. I began in 1813. I liave been working for one firm, Whitcomb & Co., of Pittsliurg. During that time I have worked under low and liigh wages, and we have had our struggles with the manufactiu'crs, and everything else. 1 can say that a high protective tariff has been a benefit to us. 1 am sure of it. AVc have got liberal wages since the tariff' has been raised, and we Ijavc had less contention and more work. _ While the tariff' Avas low the importers would crowd our manufacturers, and every year or two run in two or three shiploads of foreign goods. To-day avc are idle. AVe liave been idle six or eight mouths on account of the European imi)orters. It has caused us to form an organization, and we Avant to protect both the laborer and the manufacturer. Mr. Wliitcomb and I are inti- mate friends, and he has told me again and again thathe was in favor of organization. He said it was a benefit to the business. We n-ouldask this committee aud Congress not to interfere with the tariff' at this time, because I do not think the country is in a. condition to stand any Avorse times. I hope youAvill not create any more foreign importation.s. Mr. Dalzell. You think protection is good in your line of business? Mr. AuTH. Yes, sir. 3Ir. Dalzell. But still you presist in voting the I>emocratic ticket? 31r. AuTH. Yes; T can not help it; I am built that way. Mr. Payne. You do not interpret the last Presidential election as an ON'erwhelming victory in favor of free trade? Mr. AuTH. I do not knoAv; I do not think our President is a free trader. Mr. Reed. The juajority of this committee entertain the same fear you do. Mr. Atjth. I hope that they will not be deceiAcd. I ha\-e always followeIr, Blair, It was very light, FLINT GLASS. 177 Mt. Payne. I believe those lamp chimneys were sold for certain pat- ented lamps which had been taken from this country? Mr. Blaie. Most likely so. Mr. Bynum. Mr. Macbeth exports largely, I believe? Mr. Blaie. He exports only to a very limited extent. riiINT GLASS. (Paragraph 105.) AMERICAN FLINT-GLASS WOKKEES' UNION, PITTSBUEG, PA. SiE : Our workers are unanimously in favor of higher duties on glass embraced in the paragraph above designated — not a prohibitory tariff, but a tariff sufficient to cover the difference in cost of labor and mate- rial between the United States and those competing foreign countries whose labor and material cost least. They favor a specific rate rather than a compound rate or an ad valorem rate, and a compound rate rather than an ad valorem rate, as affording the most permanent protection to home industries. Their reason for this preference is this: The labor of those foreign countries which aie our greatest competitors in glass being unorgan- ized,, can not protect itself against reductions in wages. The cost .of foreign goods being uncertain, an ad valorem duty depending on that cost must necessarily be uncertain as a measure of protection. A higher rate of duty on glass — that is, a rate anijily sufficient to pro- tect the home industry — does not necessarily increase the cost of glass to the consumers. That this is true is shown by the prices at which pressed tableware is selling to-day. There is little, if any, foreign competition on that class of goods; yet home competition, and home competition alone, has reduced the prices of tableware to the consumers to the lowest figures that the glass has ever been sold at in the history of tableware. If we can not have a, better duty on glass, particularly on thin-blown tumblers, molded chimneys, and shades, then our workers protest against any change in the present lav/ which would reduce the duty on glass as being calculated to reduce their earnings or dexuive them of employmeiit. The cost of labor in German countries, from -w hich the great bulk of molded chimneys, shades, and thiu-blown tumlilers are brought into this country, is about 33 per cent of the cost in the United States; material is about 75 per cent of the cost in the United States. These immense advantages have enabled importers to lay glass down in Kew York, duty paid, at j) rices approximating the cost of manufac- ture in the United States. The effect was to reduce wages in some in- stances and in others to deprive American workmen of enii)loyment. Manufacturers ceased to nui.nufacture and bought imported goods because they could buy cheaper than they could manufacture. The present law improved the condition of ghiss workers, but e\'en the present law was not sufficient to make an imjnovenu-ut in their con- dition in some departments until they themselves had aided the law to reduce foreign competition. This is notably true in the working of thin-blown tumblers. Therate asked by us on this chiss of goods Avas 10 I'cnts per dozen and forty per centum ad valorem. Our request was denied and a lower rate estab- TH 12 178 EARTHENWARE. lished. Fiudiug themselves deprived of work to some extent by foreign competition our workers voluntarily reduced their own Avages, and as are- siilt but few thin-blown tumblers are brought into the country. The trade on that class of goods in this country has grown from one million dozen to four million dozen annually, while home competition has reduced their price to the consumers far below the figures that prevailed ^^hen the trade was in the hands of importers. From the present proceeds of the sale of thin-blown tximblers labor is certainly receiving as much as capital can afford to pay it, aboiit S.> per cent, leaving the cost of material and other items to be paid from the balance. Therefore, any reduction of duty on this class of goods must ]^a^ e the effect of reducing wages or depriving workers of employment. In our shade deiDartment our workers have also reduced wages in the hope of reducing foreign competition, but foreign shades are still brought into this country to the extent of depriving our workers of continuous employment. Many manufacturers are importing certain kinds of shades, such as can be nested easily, because they can buy cheaper tliau they can manufacture. Any reduction on this class of goods, therefore, will necessarily make the condition of the workers worse. On chinrneys we have increased our output to try to reduce foreign competition, but importers still hold the trade on some cliimncys. It is not right that American workmen should be comijelled to reduce their wages below the means of a respectable living Avhen Congress lias it within its power to so arrange all the tariff schedules as to make reductions in wages unnecessary in order that liome-juade goods may successfully compete with the products of foreign countries. The average yearly earnings of glass workers employed on the lines of goods designated in this communication will notexceed *] 1 per week — a bare subsistence. "We therefore pray that your committee will not make their condition ■worse by making any reduction in the present duties on glass. EespectfuUy yours, W. J. iSMITII, Frenident. MAGIC-IiAXTERISr SlilDES. (Paragrnph 106.) SiES : I wish the duty to be taken off' magic-lantern slides for the reason that they are educational and scientitic; they bring the outer ay orld home to the people. Most of the slides, full 05 per cent, are nmde in Eng- land and France, and there are only two or three firms that make them in this country as an article of trade, and it needs no argument of mine to proAC their value to the peo])le in general and to the children in par- ticular. They are photographs, and the duty on photogra])hs at pres- ent is -5 per cent; but magic-lantern slides are ])hotographs on glass so they are charged with a duty of 65 per cent. It would only be nec- essary for me to show you Y(nk"s (of London) catalogue and then the catalogues of two of our larger dealers in magic-lantern slides to show yon that the catalogue is made up almost entirely of the slides im- liorted. I am myself a maker and dealer in magic lantern slides in a WINDOW GLASS. 170 j small way, it is true, but tlie duty on the slides hurts very much luy 'trade; but indepeudeut of auy personal matter tlieir value to our 'schools, churches, aaul educational institutions sluuild prom^it the removal of the eutii'c duty. Yours, respectfully, JEX BnfUWELL, SEl'TEMIiEU VJ, 1803. JJctroil, Mich. WINDOW GLASS. (Panif^rapti 112.) Wednesday, ^ej)1fmlcr 13, 1S'J3, STATEMENT OF E. S. MORRISON. Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen op the Cojimit'J'ee : We are im- ])orters of what is known as common windov; glass. That word " com- mon " has followed the history of the tariff on our article for a long time. The duty, ])rior to 1801, was 15 per cent ad valorem. At that time Mr. Chase, who was Secretary of the Treasury, sent for the head of the house of which I am at the present time the senior partner, and asl^ed what per cent of taxation could be carried up(jn window glass — that being needed to iJrosecute the war. The ad valorem duty put upon it was equivalent, si^ecifically, to about GO per cent of the duty on com- mon window glass, according to its size. The history of the duty has always been iu the direction of an ascending scale from 1883, and the Ijreseut ad valorem rate runs from 110 to 150 per cent ad valorem. We have a brief statement to make m this connection, simply to present a very few facts in regard to the existing duty on window glass. We pre- pared for the use of the members of the Fifty-flrst Congress a state- ment, of which Ave have only one or two copies; the rest have been destroyed by fire. Among the results of that collation it is shown that ad valorem averages from 115 to 1-5 per cent. AVe have various statistics, from actual experience, one of the representative importers of 189:2 running from 110 per cent ad valorem, and as high as 130 per cent in the experience of that house. 1 have also the exi»erience of another house, showing that the ad valorem rate was as high as 14-8 per cent. This is actual experience, -without covering the whole busi- ness of the house, from the first of January until through the month of August, showing the total exportation of 17 different iu\'oiues with rates of 110 to 130." That is all we have to say in bringing before this committee the ex- isting condition as regards the tax on common window glass. If there is anything further that will serve to enliglite]i your ideas, we -will be glad to answer any fiuestions. ?iir. Dalzell. What is it that you want? Mr. MoiiRiwoN. We have no request to make iu this matter except in a geneial direction. We have no detailed re(juest to nnike, because J think this committee is sufficiently posted as to this matter. We would be glad to assist in any way Ave can. Mr. Dalzell. Yon do not indicate whethei' you want a lower or u liigher rate. 180 EARTHENWARE. Mr. Morrison. The natural conclusion would be tliat, if any chauge be made in the tariff, we are to have a lower duty. I made the state- ment that 15 per cent ad valorem had been the increase since 1860. It was increased during the war for the purpose of raising money, and had the cooperation and was suggested by thofse importers. Mr. Dalzell. Do you know what relation the total consumption of the imported article bears to the home-made window glass ? Mr. Morrison. About oue-quaTter of the consumption is foreign, aud about two-thirds is home-made, or a proportion of 70 per cent to 30 l)erceut. Mr. .Dalzell. Is there any difference as to the wages on this side and those on the other side! Mr. Morrison. I have no personal knowledge of the rates of wages on the other side. Mr. Stevens. Is there any difference between the quality? Mr. Morrison. The imported glass is conceded to be of better qual- ity. Mr. Dalzell. The reduction of the duty, in your judgmeut, would increase the importations? Mr. Morrison. I think it is very likely. Mr. Dalzell. And to that extent it would shut out the American product? Mr. Morrison. I do not know. Mr. Dalzell. Naturally, it would? Mr. Morrison. I don't know to what extent the American product would meet the demand with the competition from time to time. Mr. Payne. Do you compare the consumption prior to 1889 with tlie consumption of 1890 ? Mr. Morrison. There is no perceptible change, and there has been none for ten years. Mr. Payne. Do you refer to importations? Mr. Morrison. The importations have been about 30 x^er cent of the total consumption. Mr. Payne. I suppose that different sizes and qualities have been imported 1 Mr. Morrison. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Where do you import your window glass from? Mr. jNIorrison. Prom England, but principally from Belgium. Mr. Dalzell. Do you know tlie amount of American ciijiilal invested in this business, and the number of men employed? Mr. 3IORRISON. 1^0, nir. The Chairman. Do you give any employment to Ameri(;aii labor? Mr. Morrison. Yes, sir; our employment of labor is relati\'ely large. Mr. Payne. How large? Mr. Morrison. I suppose the importing homscs of ]S'ew York employ 1,000 men. Mr. Payne. What kind of labor is that? M]-. ^lORRisON. They are <'utters and packers, and men who select the glass, and who are engaged in making up and executing orders, and, of course, laborers and handlers. Mr. Payne. Has there been an.y increase in prices? Ml'. i\l(ji;i;isoN. No, sir; tlie jirices have remained steady for some time. WINDOW GLASS. 181 STATEMENT OF MB. VANHOENE. The (Jhaikman. Are yoii a- manufautarer of ylass"? Mr. Vanhoene. AYe are maiuifaetiirers of bent glass. The Chairman. What is the duty on bent glass"? Mr. Vanhokne. There is uo duty on that, except the same duty as on other glass before it is manufactured. The Ohaieman. Yon bend it in this country? ^Ir. Yanhornb. Yes, sir. Our works are at iSTewark. The Chairman. How many employes have youf Mr. Vanhorne. About twenty. The Chairman. And you take the flat glass and bend it? Mr. Vanhorne. Yes, sir; we take the flat glass, and the plate glass. Our raw material is flat plate or flat window glass. That, of course, is a taxed article. There is no protection on bending. Mr. Turner. Is there much labor in making the iflain window glass'? Mr. Yanhoene. That I don't know. I am not a manufactuicr of window glass. Mr. Turner. I believe it is generally done by boys and girls ? Mr. Yanhorne. That is done in the glass factories, and of coiu'se a certain proportion of girls and boys will be emx^loyed. Mr. Turner. You do not happen to know the per cent of cost in making the grade of glass which you have mentioned"? Mr. Yanhorne. Yes, sir; nearly one-half of the cost is labor. Mr. Turner. The cost on the other side is nearly one-half labor'? Mr. Yanhorne. Yes, sir; lean give you the exact figures if you wish them. Mr. Payne. I would like to know if the labor is skilled labor that is required ill making glass? Mr. Yanhorne. The bulk of it is not. Mr. Payne. The majority of it is, I think. Mr. Yanhorne. I do not think it is. Mr. Payne. This skilled labor is highly skilled, is it not? Mr. Yanhorne. Yes, sir; the skilled labor employed in it receives good wages. The exact figures of the total labor in the manufacture of foreign glass is about 44.30 per cent. Mr. Payne. Have you itemized the cost of labor in that estimate'? Mr. Yanhoene. There is the labor of blowing and flatteidng and cutting. Mr. IPayne. Are there not different prices for laborers"? Mr. Yanhoene. I have not them separated. These are the figures which I got abroad, and they are certified to by fi\'e of the largest manufacturers. Mr. Payne. They did not give you the items'? Jlr. Yanhoene. Not in detail; but it could be made. Mr. Payne. Do you give the itemized expenses of the materials! Mr. Yanhorne. The materials amouut to about 31 per cent. Mr. Payne. Have yon those items"? Mr. Yanhoene. No, sir; the materials cost about .'!! per cent, and the labor costs 41 per cent. Mr. Payne. Of what is the balance made up"? Mr. Yanhorne. Expenses and transportation charges; those make 24 per cent. Mr. Payne. How much is the transportation? Mr. Yanhoene. Less than 4 per cent. Mr. Payne. So thatthe boxing is over 20 per cent? 182 EARTHENWARE. Mr. YAXHOBrs'E. Keaiiy 21 per cent. Mr. Payxe. Do you kno^T how much labor is in that item of 20 per cent. Mr. Yanhotine. I do not. Mr. Payne. Yoir have only the general result ■? Mv. Yanhorne. Yes, sir; only the general result. Mr. Dalzbll. Do you indorse what the other gentleman has said as to the employment of 1,000 men in Few York city, in reference to your importing business? Mr. Yanhorne. Yes, sir; there must be fully that many.- Mr. Dalzell. You say that there are 1,000 men who are skilled laborers 1 Mr. Yanhorne. No, sir ; the bulk are not. Mr. Dalzbll. What do they do"? Mr. Yanhorne. Handle the boxes, select glass, and drive carts. The latter are laborers; the cutters are skilled. Mr. Payne. Do you know what material is used in making glass? Mr. Yanhorne. In making glass there is nothing used but sand and alkalies. Mr. Payne. And soda ash. Do you know the percentage of soda ash? Mr. Yanhorne. I do not. Mr. Payne. Do you know what labor is required to produce soda ash '? Mr. A^ANHORNE. E'o, sir. Mr. Payne. Do you know that the materials from which soda ash is made are crude in shape? Mr. Yanhorne. I have been told so. Mr. Pay'ne. What else is used in making glass? Mr. Yanhorne. Nothing else. Mr. Payne. Nothing but sand and soda? Of coarse, it requires more or less work to get soda ash ready for the business. Mr. Yanhorne. I presume so. j\lr. Payne. It does not come of itself, but must be prepared. Mr. Yanhorne. It must be handled ; there are a great many steamers required to bring it across, and men to handle it in New York. Mr. Dalzell. You import your goods to the port of New York? Mr. Yanhorne. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzell. Where are the largest importers of glass; in New York? Mr. Yanhorne. Yes; and largely into Boston, Philadeljdiia, Port- land, and most all the coast cities. A great deal comes to New Orleans and San Francisco. Mr. Pay'NE. Would you increase your importations 50 per cent if the tariff were increased ? :\Ir. Yanhorne. I hope so. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you believe you could sell it cheapei' lo the consumer? Mr. Yanhorne. Of course; it would make that difference. Fifty per cent off would not come to us. Mr. Breckinridge. Then you are not a criminal if you are an im- porter? Mr. Yanhorne. I hope not. Mr. Payne. Nobody is a criminal, except the American manufacturer, wlio is a robber baron. Mv. Yanhorne. If we reduce the duty, the American manufacturer WINDOW GLASS. 183 must go do wr to that price. We are not working- for the Anicrk'nn manufacturer, and we do not care for him. He has been ;iltpr ii.s for years. We do not care if he has to go out of business. Mr. Payne. Ton wouhl a little prefer, if he went out of business ? Mr. Vanhorne. Yes, sir; I hate him. Mr. Beeckineidge. What yon really desire is to be able to sell glass to the American people? -Air. Yanhoenk. AVhat I really desire, is to do business unhampered. Mi: Dalzbll. If you could get the American manufacturer out of tlie way, you could put your own price on glass"? Mr. Vanhoene. We have never had that chance yet. Mr. Dalzell. But that is Avhat you want"? Mr. Vanhoene: We always have had competition, and always will. That takes care of itself. Mr. Breckineidge. There is no love lost between you and tlie manufacturer? Mr. Vanhorne. ISTo; they have done everything they could to hamper ns, and drive us out of business. The high duty Ave pay now is the result of their eftbrts and annoyances. Mr. Payne. AYhat are those annoyances ? Mr. Yanhoene. Tlie handling of glass. If the box is 50 feet and weighs over 65 pounds, we have to pay an extra duty, while nobody gets any benefit from it. The glass in it is not worth any more. ;\Ir. Breckineidge. Are you not both decent people?' Mr. Yaniiorne. He is a nice fellow. Mr. Payne. Then you do not mean to say that he is a robber? Mr. Yanhoene. He ought to be. He has every chance to be, with the United States Government backing him up. Mr. Payne. Then you are rather inclined to think that he is a ni( per cent of the total consumption in the United iStates is of foreign glass. The present duty on cyliiuler window glass under the j\[cKin)ey bill is practically the same as under the tariff of 1883, the only changes being to charge on the actual weight of glass imported, instead of, as before, on an agreed weight, and making the duty proportionate on part of the larger sizes now used, the cost of which is much greater. The rates now are, per jiaragraph 112: Cents per pound. Sizes not exceeding 10 by 15 im-hiw IJ Above, and not exceeding 16 by 24 incbes 1 J Above that and not exceeding 24 by 30 inclies 2if Above that and not exceeding 24 by 36 inches 2-} All above that .•... 31 Provided, That unpolished cylinder, croAvn,nnd coiiimon window glass imported in boxes shall contain 50 square feet, as nearly as size will permit, andtUeduty shall be computed thereon according to the actual weight of glass. Paragraph 118 : Cylinder, crown, or common windowglass, when ground, obscured, frosted, sanded, enameled, beveled, etched, emliossed, engraved, stained, colored, or otherwise orna- mented or decorated, shall be subject to a duty of 10 per centum ad v,aloi-em iu addition to the rates otherwise chargeable thereon. 'So allowance for breakage on imports is now or should be made. A statement from Bureau of Statistics afew years since showed the average amount was not 1 per cent. Such claims are difficult of adjustment, lead to uncertain settlements, and are but fair offset to breakage in trans- portation of American glass. A rate per pound, increasing with size, is the only fair basis for assessing duties, as weight and size are the essential elements of cost, and are the conditions controlling prices for both foreign and American glass. Specific duties are necessary to secure fixed conditions, especially to make stable rates and to secure protection at the time of greatest need from depressed business conditions. They are also most necessary to secure fair valuations by foreign manufacturers or importers whose in- terests are so mucliinfaN'or of undervaluations, which are believed to exist largely under ad valorem rates. Present specific duties are rep- resented as equaling a very high ad valorem rate. This is only because American competition has very largely reduced the price on which duties are computed. Eeports of the Bureau of Statistics show that higher duties in 1873 and 1874 equaled 37 per cent ad valorem ; in 1883 equaled 72 per cent ad valorem; in 1893 the rate appears higher, foreign prices being much lower; yet during all this period duties were the same or higher than now, the proportion increasing as price declines. The present rate is one-eight cent per pound less than in 1873, when duties averag(Hl but 37 per cent ad valorem. The selling price of both American and French glass has been largely reduced since 18C0, when the duties were very low^ (15 to 17 per cent ad valorem). The books of principal importers and mauufacturersengaged in business from 1857 to 1860 show the reduction since 18(i0 of 30 to 33 per cent in the selling prices. Bureau of Statistics reports show the cost price per foreign invoices 188 EARTHENWARE. in 1873, was 5.33 cents per pound ; in 1S83 was 3.16 rents per pound ; in 1893 was 2.33 cents per pound; a decline since 1883 of 2.5 per fent, and since 1873 of more than half the foreign i)iice. The effects of any reduced duties would be to diminish wages to the least possible rates, and if required beyond the ability of men to meet, then stoppage of the manufacturers and aljandonment of their plant with enormous loss of capital. If duties are reduced, the revenue of the Government would be reduced unless the imports increase in large proportion. This would decrease the eniplo^inent of men in the United States in like measure, and consumers' increasing demand for foreign glass without American competition would again i)ay high prices, and the only benefits resulting would accrue to foreign manufacturers. Almost all the details as given for window glass apply to the manu- factirre of green and amber bottles, and also flint and lime glass bottle ware, not including chemical glassware, or glass for table use, orlamjis, globes, and chimneys. The materials employed for green glass are the same, find about the same proportion ; those for flint and lime glass vary but slightly. A larger proportion of boys' labor is employed for bottle ^vare. The imports of bottles are not as convenient ^s for window glass be- cause most of the ware required is made specially to order, being blown in molds, and hence requires longer time to import. Imports of beer, mineral water, and wine bottles, however, were increasing very rapidly until the specific duties of from 1 to li cents per pound were charged. The duties now are on bottles not filled, holding more than 1 pint, 1 cent per pound. If holding not more than 1 pint, and not less than one-fourth pint, 1 cent per pound jholdingless than one-fourth pint, 50 centsper gross. If filled, and contents arecharged ad valorem duties, the value of .thebot- tles is to be added. If filled, and contents are not subject to ad valorem duties, or are free, then the duty on bottles is to be added at the same rates as charged on emi^ty bottles : Provided, Deities shall be notlessthau 40 per cent ad valorem. Duties on vials under one-fourth i)int contents, are levied at a specific rate per gross, which is the way they are bought, because the larger part of labor and smaller weight would not be the proper measure of value. The cost of importii:g bottles is still lower than cost of manufacture here, and large orders are made abroad. American competition in manufacture of bottles has 'leduced prices. The cost to consumers is lower now than before 1860, so that the in- crease in duty has not been at consumers' expense. The manufacture of bottles is even more widely diffused than of window glass, both green and flint; bottle glass extending as far south as Georgia and Alabama, and west to California. It is an industry natural to the United States, with established ca]mc- ity beyond the total consumption. It has, like window-glass manufacture, been stimulated by new fur- naces started in the natural-gas district, and by the changes of plant to the continuous-tank system, so that consumers have the advantages of vigorous competition, and as low prices as the general conditions in the United States permit. Mr. Turner. Were you before the committee which framed the present law? Mr. BODINE. I was. Mr. Turner. Did you not formulate this paragraph of the law which you have cited ? Mr. BoDiNE. I think I prepared practically the language of the pres- ent bill. WINDOW GLASS. 189 Mr. TuKNER. Have you prospered under it? Mr. BODINE. I Lave just stated in this statement tliat we have not made interest on our capital during that time, since the passage t)f the bill. Mr. Turner. Would you like to write it over again; would you like to try and formulate it a.gain '! Mr. BoDiNB. I said I had formulated that, aud in the light of all ex- perience I should not change the bill from the present rate. It has se- cured the lowest i)rices to the consumers and the largest reveuue to the Government. Mr. Turner. Is there any trust or combination amongst the glass man ufacturers ? Mr. BoDiNE (continuing former answer). It has not secured us the protection we need and our competition has been excessive from both doinestic and foreign and forced us down. I know of no trust. There was a trade organization to discuss matters of general interest. I am ]iot aware of anything of the sort. The Chairman. What is the E"ational Window Glass Company, chartered by the State of Wisconsin? Mr. BoDiNE. I am not aware of anything of the sort. There is an organization of the Western manufacturers which includes most of the Western manufacturers, but I am not a member of that, nor is any man- ufacturer in the East. Mr. Turner. Do uot.they regulate prices'? Mr. BoDiNE. They try sometimes, but they have never succeeded. The Chairman. Where does Mr. Chambers manutacture? Mr. BoDiNE. Pittsburg. The Chairman. Is not he president of the National Window Glass J^ssocial.ion? Mr. Chambers. He is. ]\Ir. BoDiNE. Perhaps I might state how far they attempt to regulate prices. This organization does not consist exclusively of manufacturers. They have about as many jobbers included in it as manufacturers. Jobbers are those who buy in very large quantities and distribute it. There never has been, as far as I have known, any attempt to regulate the price to sell these jobbers, through whom ijrobably ninety-nine one- hundredths of all the glass made in the West is sold. Ml'. Turner. Does not the specific duty, when converted into ad valorem, on most of your goods amount to 100 per cent? Mr. Bodine. Adopting foreign invoice prices at present, I suppose it does; while our wages, if you will remember, amount to 150 to 200 per cent. Tlie Chairjiian. lioughly speaking, what amount is raw material and what amount is labor in tlie production of common window glass? Mv. Chambers. That is covered in the original statement. Mr. Bodine. It is stated that 85 per cent is wages, direct and in- direct, and taking out the indirect, roduction long since. Tlie Chaik:man. Has not the glass industry Mr. BoDiNB (continuing). And the wages of the laborer have cer- tainly been paid because of the i)resent tariff. The Chairman. Is the glass industry an infant industry, or is it an old one in this country '? Mr. BoDiNE. It is an old one. The Chairman. It began beftu'e the tariff! i\Ir. BoDiNB. It is very well developed, too much developed for the proxier The Chairman. Does this organization of woi'kmen dictate their own pay to a large extent? Mr. BoDiNE. They try to. The Chairman. Do they determine the number of mouths they shall work in a year ? ]\rr..BoDiNB. They do not. Three montlis x»ractically they do not work, in the hot weather. If they have any such rule it would be beneficial, for it is xinprofitable to make glass during those months under all circumstances. The Chairman. Do they limit their output per week to a blower'? Mr. BoDiNB. I think they do, and that accounts for part of the dif- ference between the Ameiican product per month and tlie product abroad. The Chairman. Is there any difliculty in American boys getting an opportunity to learn this skilled trade, especially the one of blowing"? J\Ir. BoDiNE. Very few do. The Chairman. That does ]iot answer the iiuestion. AMiat I M'ant to know is whetlier this oi'ganizatiou draws a. limit as to how many sliall be apprentices and discriminates against Anicricaii buys? Mr. CnA]\niBRS. He snys he does not know whether I hey have any rules on this question. I think the workmen will come befoi'c you anil tliey can a.nswei' that. WINDOW GLASS. 191 The Chairman. Is your free raw inuterial as cUeap in tliis eoaiitrj- as it is in Belgitim ; take coal for iustauee ? Mr. BoDiNE. It is not. I tLink the foreign prices show a large per cent under ours. The Chairman. How about coal ? Mr. BoDiNE. The difierence there is not as large as other foreign ina- terial. Take the article of sulphate of soda, there the difierence is, A' cry great. Mr. Chambers. The difference is great in sand too. Mr. BoDiNE. There are other materials in which the difference is ^-ery great. The Chairman. I want to know whether the American product is as good as the foreign product, take for instance the blowing? Mr. BoDiNE. I stated in the statement that the best makers of ^Vmerican glass are producing glass which could not be distinguished by experts when jmt in a window. There is some made not as good as the best imported, but there is some xerj poor glass imported. The Chairman. Why is so much imported under this high tarilf ? Mr. BoDiNE. Because they seem to be able to meet our cost here and tlie preference they have in selling sells it, but there has been a com- lietition between the foreign manufacturer and the importer and the goods manufactured in this country and we hope some day to take it all. "We have a capacity beyond the total consumption. And archi- tect's specifications requiring foreign glass has a good deal to do with the matter. When a contractor gets a building the architects have been in the habit of specifying its construction and they say that foreign glass shall be used. They do so stiU in a vast majority of cases. some of them after examining the subject are statisfled the glass here is equal and they will specify Amerit^an. Now. unless these specifica- tions are changed the contractors put in French glass tliongh they might be able and prefer to put in better American; they are afraid to deviate from the letter of the contract. Mr. Bryan. Did you say the plant in its status at this time is suifl- cient to produce all the glass we can consume? Mr. BODINE. There has not been a consumption equal to the present actual capacity. Mr. Bryan. Then you want a tariff sufficient to enable all of this glass to be manufactured at home? Mv. BoDiNE. Yes, sir; but I have ]iot advocated rates which would be prohibitory but restrain foreign nuinufacturers by a fair amount of duty. Mr. Bryan. Would you desire the tariff should be just equal to the difference in the cost of production? Mr. Bodine. I do not think it is sufficiently equal to the cost of pro- duction. I think the tarift' of 18S3 was more nearly equal. 3Ir. Bryan. But your idea of a perfect tariff ^^-ould be a tariff just equal to the difference in the cost of production? Mr. Bodine. Yes, sir. 3Ir. Bryan. So we would produce all the glass at home and not im- port it, and you would like the same jirotection extended to other indus- tries? Mr. Bodine. Certainly we would. Mr. Bryan. So that, according to your idea, a perfect tariff' wimld be a tariff which enables us to produce at home everything which w(! could produce at home? 192 EARTHENWARE. Mr. BoDiNE. That was properly adapted for productioD. Mr. Bryan. And tbat the tariif which we collect ought uot to be col- lected upon articles the like of which we do not produce, and they ought to come in free'? Mr. BoDiNE. As far as revenue requirements permit. Mr. Bryan. Now, have you discussed any plan, or considered any j)lan, by which we would raise the necessary revenue if we had a per- fect tariff, which enables us to jiroduce everything we could i)roduec so we need not import? Mr. BoDiNE. That is the province of this committee. Mr. Bryan. But your idea of a perfect tariff would enable us to produce everything that we could produce? Mr. BoDiNE. I think everything adapted for our consumption and adapted to this country shoidd be produced here by American work- men, if we are able to do it. Mr. Bryan. The tariff ought to be such a one that we should uot import anything which we can produce? Mr. BoDiNB. I think we might import luxuries, not necessaries. Mr. Bryan. Have you compared the wages paid in England and Belgium? Mr. BoDiNE. ls"ot in detail. They are a little higher in England than they are in Belgium. I do not know what the difference would be as I never have made a careful estimate, but the fact is there is almost no glass imported from England, and nearly all the glass, cer- tainly I believe 80 or 90 per cent, of the importation comes from B'A- gium, so that would indicate that England can not compete witli Belgium. In fact, England imports a large proiK)rtion of its own con- sumption from Belgium, showing that they can not compete with them. Mr. Bryan. You know nothing of the facts and figures on that sub- ject? Mr. Bodine. I know the facts, which I have stated, but not exactly the proportion. Mr. Bryan. But not exactly the proportion? Mr. Bodine. Ihave looked at it, but I do not recollect tliem, although I think I have them somewhere. Mr. Bryan. What is the price of 8 by 10 window glass per 100 feet .' Mr. Bodine. We make four qualities. Mr. Bryan. What is the price of each quality? Mr. Bodine. Taking the quality principally used, do you ineau tlie lowest price sold the large buyers or the jirice sold to consumers? Mr. Bryan. Take the average price. Mr. Bodine. The average price would be about $1..J0 a box. That is for a 50-foot box. The glass is sold here in 50-foot boxes. Mr. Bryan. For what quality of glass is that ordinary quality? Mr. Bodine. The third. Mr. Bryan. Is that going up or down in quality? Mr. Bodine. That glass would be used in mechanics' buildings and smaller-sized houses. The fourth quality is used a great deal infactor- ies where there is a demand of mere exclusion of air and demand for light. The higher qualities are used more as a matter of taste and not necessity. jMr. Gear. Is window glass at the lowest point in manufactured prices ever known in this country? Mr. Bodine. It is. WINDOW GLASS. 193 Vanhoene, Griffbn & Co., New rorl; September 15, 1893. Sir: I understand the American window-glass manufacturers are to have a hearing before your committee next week. For your iufonna- tion, I would state that they have so far failed to come to any arrange- ments for the next season with their workmen, as the latter refuse to sign the reduced scale of prices ijroposed and insisted upon by the man- ufacturers. Further, that a strong association exists between the various com- peting American glass factories for the purpose of maintaining high selling prices. This association is backed by a large money deposit of upwards of $200,000, and provides for heavy fines and penalties in case of any variation from said agreement. I inclose herewith a detailed statement of the cost of manufacturing common window glass in Belgium. These are the same figures which I used before your committee on the 13th instant. • The division of cost of labor is as follows per 100 feet of glass : Francs. Blowing 2. 92 Flattening 76 Cutting 68 AIJ other labor 79 Total 5.15 Tours, truly, D. A. Vanhornb. Cost price in Belgium per 100 feet window glass, single thick, 16 ounces, free on board, Antwerp, to be shipped to the United States. Francs. Per cent. Materials of all kinds for melting 3.61 or 31. 09 Labor, blowing, flattening, cutting, etc 5. 1.5 44. 36 Boxing, average small and large sizes - 2. 40 20. 67 Expenses, transport to Antwerp, and shipping charges 45 3. 88 11. 61 100 (Charleroi, March 27th, 1893. G. Beicouli. (Certified true and faithful: M. GKEGORIU.S, And others. STATEMENT OF ME. JOHN P. EBEEHART, PRESIDENT OF THE WINDOW-GLASS WOKKEES' ASSOCIATION, OF PITTSBUEG, PA. Monday, September 18, 1803. Mr. Chairman: I desire to offer a few remarks in the way of calling your attention to the interests of the meu who are eu gaged as laborers in the window-glass industry in the United States. I deem it scarcely necessary for me to enter into an extended discussion of the question of the necessity for a high-rate protection to the industry in general, after the elaborate and able exposition of that phase of the subject that has been presented by the representative employers that have preceded 194 EARTHENWARE. me, aud shall therefore confine myself mainly to a plea on behalf of the working-men, who, after all, are the most numerous and the most directly and vitally interested in the issues of this discussion. The window-glass business has been, perhaps, as much talked about as any other business, and yet is as little understood, or, more properly speaking, more misunderstood, as to its conditions and operations than almost any other branch of industry. I take it tliat the members of this committee, however they may be divided as to the general policy of tariff for protection in itself con- sidered, are a unit in a desire lor the success of American industries and for the prosperity of the American people. If I am not wrong in this, then there will be no objection raised to a retention of the duty on the imports of the prodiict of this branch of in- dustry, if it can be shown — First, That we have the raw materials, the skill, all the natural ad- vantages for producing, the best market in the world, and everything right here in our own country that ought to guarantee to our people this industry in the very highest state of iirospei'ity. Second. That on account of certain conditions pertaining to and nec- essary for the cariying on of this business successfully, and in accord with the spirit of the free institutions of our country, and on account of the unfair competition of the product of said industry in foreign countries, made possible by the operation of certain systems, and tlie existence of certain conditions that can not be otherwise properly met by those who would operate the business here, this high rate of duty is made necessary to secure success for those interested in this industry here in this country. And lastly, that this high rate of duty can be retained on the im- ports of this product, to the success of the manufacturers and the reasonable prosperity of the artisans and laborers engaged in the work, and without prejudice to the interests of consumers or injustice to any- one anywhere, to say nothing of the advantages of the revenue a('cru- ing to the United States Government from the duty on such of the product as may still be imported. As to my first proposition there can be no dispute. Indeed, it has been urged by some that because of the truth of the existence of the advantages referred to the necessity for a high rate of protection is removed. But let us see. A few days since a member of an importing house appeared before this committee to ask for a reduction of the duty on window glass, lu the course of his examination he was iforced to admit that from some cause unexplained by him yet, notwithstanding the natural facilities for manufacture in this country, and under the present (as he styles it) exorbitantly high rate of duty, the importers are able to supply one- fourth of all the glass consumed in the United States from the product of the factories of foreign countries and of the labor of foreign people thereby, as he acknowledged and as we all know, curtailing the pro- duction to just that extent in this country, and, as our experience proves rendering idle for an important percentage of each year the capital in- vested in the business and lengthening the necessaiy suspension ot the operation of the factories in each year to an extent that greatly reduces the profits of the business to the employer; and by shortening the time of work and so reducing the yearly income of the workmen they find that the wages that appear to be satisfactorily large, when received for eight months in the year aud used for twelve mouths for the support of their families, the wages that appeared so large have by the intevfevence WINDOW GLASS. 195 of the foreign product been reduced in the aggregate for the year until, even with care, they scarcely last until the resumption of work after the summer stop. Assuming that the importer's estimate is correct as to the amount of imports (and I believe it is), then one-fourth of the total amount of window glass consumed in the United States is imported under the present tariff; and this when we have not only the materials but also the facilities to produce it all here. This shows conclusively that the present tariff is not prohibitory in its operation by any means. I will here endeavor to briefly notice the history of the business as affected by the duty and the imports. As to the imports, beginning with the year 1880, we flud that for the years ending June 30, 1880, 1881, 1882, and 1883, the amounts are ap- proximately the same as to quantity and value, the four years' imports amounting to 189,762,111 pounds, valued at ^5,808,690, while in the four years ending June 30, 1887, or the four years immediately succeed- ing the reduction of the tariff in 1883, the imijorts amounted to 254,058,887 pounds and $6,907,451. That is, nearly 34 per cent more glass came into the country, with prices reduced, until it only amounted to a fraction over 17 per cent more value, and every man that depended on his trade in a window-glass works during that time looks back on the dei^rivations he had to suffer with a shudder. During the years ending June 30, 1888, the imports again increased to 70,513,836 pounds; 1889, to 75,964,827 pounds, and in 1890 they dropped to 70,235,443 pounds. During the year ending July 30, 1891, they amounted to 60,814,537 pounds and $1,484,797; to June 30, 1892, they increased in quantity to 67,320,577 pounds and $1,549,707. The values kept on sinking, so that while the increase in that year was nearly 11 per cent in quantity it was only 4J per cent in value. The quantity for year ending June, 1893, decreased (evidently), on ac- count of the late and ijresent depression and the prospects of tariff re- vision, a little over 14 per cent in quantity and a little over 11 per cent in value. So, you see, that through all these years the business has been developing in this country through the possibilities presented by the protective policy of the Government, and just as surely and as steadily has the price of the product cheapened in the market, until to-day it is the cheapest article that enters into the constiuction of a building, and it is a well-known fact that the more window glass that can be worked into a building the cheaper it will be to the owner. The glass in a house with twenty windows, with four lights in each window, the glass to be A quality, each light 13 by 28 inches, would cost $9.96, covering the space of 202 square feet, certainly very cheap wall. I made the state- ment in the outset that the window-glass business was greatly misun- derstood, even where it has been much talked about and discussed. It is not surprising that this should be the case with the uninitiated when it is so largely true of so many who have given the subject long, earnest, and intelligent study and in many cases years of costly experi- menting. One reason why the advocates of the necessity for a high rate of, protective duty on window glass have difficulty in convincing others of the justness of their claims, is that the business is, in fact, so simple as to the processes of manufacture, as well as to the ingredients used, that it is hard for the inquirer to believe that it is impossible to reduce the whole matter to mathematical certainty as to results. This is to say, it is hard for anyone to understand that if an experienced manufacturer has a properly constructed works, secures the proper materials and fuel, that this very simplicity is one source of many of 196 EARTHENWARE. the complications that arise to make the business more or less precarious as to results, both for the men and the employer. In some branches of industry, where the materials are put through several processes and are gradually worked toward the merchantable state, there are oppor- tunities to rectify mistakes, either in materials or in the working of them , so that loss may be avoided or at least greatly lessened. In the glass business this is not the case. When the materials are once put into the furnace the thing is done, and the least shade of dif- ference in the nature of any of the principal ingredients, such as sand or salt cake, which is liable to occur and can generally be detected only in results after it is past remedy; anything wrong with fuel or furnace, a slight mistake in the application of the heat, anyone of these, and many other apparently small accidents that frequently occur and are very hard to anticipate and are discovered only in results, once having occurred are beyond remedy, and all the expense attached to that lot of materials is either almost a lotal loss or must result in a very infe- rior product that yields very small returns to either the employer or workmen. Yet just as much money has been expended, except as to the wages of highly skilled labor; just as much hard work and as great skill have been brought into requisition in producing this product, which is of little value to either emj)loyer or skilled workmen, as had been figured on by investigators of the business as surely yielding a class of product that would give a handsome profit to both. And so is it clear through the whole process. The business is subject to innumer- able accidents, many of which can not be foreseen . An experienced manufacturer, who understands his business, may build two furnaces under the same roof, on the same plan, from the same materials, the work done by the same mechanics, and the two furnaces may work very differently. The same materials and the same fuel will not pro- duce the same results in the two furnaces, and it may require a long series of experiments and the making of a great deal of unprofitable product before they can be got to working right. I could go on and enumerate similar causes that work to the same results that are quite unavoidable, but which arise in every department of the works, and all work to the same end — that is, to the disappointment of both employer and the skilled workman and the destruction of the faith of each in the figures that had led them to expect different results, and, blinded to the true situation, each is apt to look upon himself as the only suf- ferer, and the employer says he suffers from paying too much wages, the worker claiming he suffers because the employer absorbs all and leaves him nothing, when in point of fact they are both victims of the same accidents that they each failed to make proper provision for in their calculations in the beginning. But, you say, what has this to do with retaining the tariff! If you will bear with me a very few minutes I will iry to show its near relation to the subject. I desire to show that while, should the American manufacturer be forced to reduce the price of his product to meet the lower price of the foreign product made possible by inadequate protection, his only recourse, if he desires to continue in the business is to a reduction of the wages of his- employes. Yet the difference in wages paid here and abroad, while constituting the principal point of advantage the foreigner has over him, is not the only one. As, for in- stance, the window-glass business in this country is scattered over a vast area of territory, reaching from Massachusetts to different points on and beyond the Mississippi and occupying a dozen States, and is still extending westward until the fires will shortly be lighted in the WINDOW GLA.SS. 197 State of Wasliington. Over all this territory there is strong competitiou bet-(veeii the manufacturers, and while the American market is the best in the world, yet it must be remembered that it is the only market we can look to for the consumption of our product, and, for causes which will appear in this discussion, must necessarily remain so. On the other hand the territory in which the glass is made to supply all other markets of the world is much smaller. England, France, Germany, Belgium, and Italy supply the whole of the markets of the world except the American market, and are fondly hoping for a reduc- tion of the tariff when they may be able to monopolize that. England with her colonies in which she has the advantage, and the others with all the states of the continent, it can be readily seen that the strongest competition between them would be in the American market which is the best in the world, aiid having such a diversity of markets they are relieved of much iuconvenience met with here, where we depend on the home consumption alone and are subject to all the fluctuations in the activity of our own market. Not only so, but the rapid advance in the demands of the American market as to the sizes and qualities used calls for more care in the business and the use of the best and most costly materials and appliances in order to increase the percentage of the best qualities which the market now requires and to meet the relative de- cline in the demand for the poorer qualities which renders them even less desirable than formerly, while in foreign countries the majority of their markets are as an important part of our home market was until re- cently, indifferent as to the quality and hence afford ample market for their mediam and poorer qualities so that they can use a lower grade, and hence cheaper materials, even if the product in the aggregate is much poorer in quality they can send the bulk of it to China, India, Spain, the islands, Canada, and all over Europe and Asia, and select the very finest to bring into our market to compete with us. And yet with all we have by American diligence and enterprise been enabled to so advance the business in this country as to be able to place on the market at prices that can not possibly be complained of glass that can not be surpassed, if indeed it can be equaled in the world, the state- ment of the importer to the contrary noth withstanding. JSTot only have they advantage of this kind, but in Belgium, which is our greatest com- petitor (the so-called French glass coming from Belgium), they have the advantage of mere nominal cost of transportation, the Government owning the railroads and carrying all goods destined for export to other countries, to the point of shipment, for actual cost of carrying, and it is well known that freight of this character (having weight with- out much bulk) is sought after by the steamship companies and is fre- quently carried at mere nominal freight charges for its use as ballast. English manufacturers are all either on or near the seaboard, and so far as cost of transportation is concerned glass can be laid down in the Kew York market cheaper than it can be done from most of the Amer- ican factories, and can, I am informed, be reshipped to points in the Western market cheaper than can the pioduct of the American factories as far as west as Pittsburg. These and other things operate against the American producer, and he can be compensated only by a protect- ive tariff to place him on an equal footing as to these particulars. And now we come to consider the greater disadvantage the American producer labors under on account of the added cost of prodaction by reason of the great additional cost of labor. It must be mentioned that all materials, except perhaps fuel, are cheaper to the foreign em- ployer, yet all the cost of production, aside from the wages of labor, 198 EAETHENWARE. according- to tlie most careful estimates amounting to only about 15 per cent of the total cost, it is easily apparent that a slight difference iu the remaining 85 per cent of cost, or the wages of labor, sinks into insigniiicance any possible cheapening of the imported materials by placing them on the free list as so-called raw materials, aside from the fact that it would discourage the development of the production of said materials in this country, which has been making rapid progress of late. IsTow, as to the great difference^the great necessary difference, in wages paid in this country and abroad. It is scarcely necessary for me to dwell on the question of fact as to the difference existing nor as to the extent of that difference. There are so many elements of difference, and they differ so in char- acter in different places abroad, as to render it difficult to reduce it to exact figures; be.sides, on account of the many accidents to which the business is subject in this country, as referred to above, it can not be stated exactly what the earnings are here. That is to say, with the men working in all the factories of the country on the same scale of wages and doing the same amount of work, we find that in one month, or even for a whole blast, the men in some factories will make more than in others, according to the relative degree of success in those works, and probably the next month or the next year the relative posi- tions as to amount of earnings of the men in the same factories will be reversed. This is because the skilled workmen are paid, not only on the principle of piecework, or according to amount produced, but their wages are also rated according to sizes and quality produced, the size in a general way depending on the quality. I will say, then, that the men make a very great deal more in this country than they do in for- eign countries. Take for example the report of the Commissioner of Labor. The average of the American workman is $834.85 per year. The Belgian workman makes $478.40, the English $424.94, and assuming- this to be correct, the difference of cost to the employer is much greater according to amount of production than would appear from the figures, inasmuch as in England the employer gets the advantage of having the boys bound to them for a term of seven years, at least half of which time tliey do the work of a journeyman and receive for it appren- tice's wages which are exceedingly small, while the American boy is allowed to receive full wages as soon after entering the trade as he can fit himself to fill a place. Besides the wages pretended to be paid to journeymen in England are deceitful to the statistician because of a system of fining by which they are mulcted of a large portion of it in many cases. In Belgium they work twelve months in the year and seven days in the week, while here we work under present conditions about eight and one-half months, and on account of climatic and other conditions we could only work ten months under the most favorable circumstances. Precisely the same methods and appliances are used in this country as are used abroad, the work being exclusively hand work; yet experi- ence proves, and has clearly demonstrated in this business, that in any department of manufacture American industry and inventiAe genius will accomplish all the possibilities in point of quality of product and economy of ijroductiou, while American aggressiveness and enterprise and spirit of competition will guaranty to the consumer the very low- est possible price of said product. There can be no question that this added to the fact that under the present tariffthe foreigner can success- WINDOW GLASS. 199 fully enter our markets and further stimnlate this spirit of competition, lias already brought window glass to so low a price that every means of cheapening it, and at the same time producing- the higli grade of quality the market requires, has been exhausted, except reducing the wages of the men, so that this committee, if contemplating a leduction of the tariff, is in reality discussing the propriety of reducing our wages. The impression has been made, in ways and for purposes which I need not here discuss, that window-glass workers make very large wages, and this has been urged by some as a reason why the tariff ought to be reduced, because to continue it is to continue to our people wages that, as compared with other workingmens' wages, are unjustly high. The people who think and talk that way know not of what they speak. I have returns of the wages earned by the most highly skilled workmen from different concerns, which cover all the different parts of the glass-making districts in the United States. These reports are taken direct from the actual pay rolls of the companies, and- are all duly sworn to. Taking the sum of the average monthy wages of tlie men in these different factories and dividing it by the number of factories repre- sented we find the average to be for the time worked $95.12 per month. This is not a strictly accurate average, as there were more men working in some of the works than others, yet it is approximately correct. Kow, figuring that they had all worked the full working time of a year, or ten months, each would have made $951.12, which, divided into twelve parts, representing the number of months this must be distributed in for the support of the family, we find it to be $79.27. This represents, not what they actually received, but what they could possibly earn if they got full time at the present rate of wages. It is true we make a higher rate of wages than men in some other crafts do, but when the lost time is considered, even the necessary lost time in each year, it leaves little if any more than our necessities require. It has been said by some that window-glass workers live too extrava- gantly, buying more of the more' costly articles of food, such as beef- steak, etc., than their neighbors. They need to. Go into a window-glassworks and see them work, constantly exercising all the strength of which they are possessed, and this in the midst of almost blistering heat, note the wonderful draft on their energies that is constantly manifested by tlie streams of perspiration that issue from every pore of their skins, and you will agree that to expect them to recuperate this rapidly wasting strength, so as to be able to endure it day after day on the food requisite for the clerk at his desk, the salesman in the store, or the laborer on the street, is scarcely less reasonable than to expect to satisfy the requirements of the heavy draft horse on the diet of the goat that preys on the empty cans and refuse in the back alley and vacant lot. We want better wages than they get abroad ; we are not satisfied to have our wives and sisters wheel coal and sand in the factories; we desire to have our children attend school instead of working before they have even the elements of an education, as is the case with our competitors in the American market who work abroad. We are not satisfied to live in houses with only bare flag or cobble-stone floors as many of them have to do. To talk of American workingmeu working and living as they do in foreign countries is un-American. It is said that no society can be better than the average of its niem- bers ; can we then hope to advance our civilization, or maintain it, if 200 EARTHENWARE. we introduce a system to degrade the most numerous class of its mem- bers'? Can we liope to maintain a free Government for tlie people, by the people, if we destroy the spirit of individual freedom and independ- ence in that people. The degradation of the masses is incompatible with free institutions and popular government, and must call for a multiplication of standing armies and reformatory insfitutions. I regret to have taken so much of your valuable time, gentlemen of the committee, but I am conscious that, to a large extent, the thousands of now idle workingmen, with their families, who depend on this indus- try for a living are looking to me and tlie gentlemen who accompany me to place this matter before you in its true light, and to plead their cause before you, so as that you will be led to concur in our opinion, and request that the window-glass business be left at least the already inadequate protection it now has, for we are to a man impressed with the belief that you are sitting in judgment on the very life of the business in this country, and are the keepers of their hopes for success in their life's avocation. In submitting these remarks to you 1 am voicing the opin- ions of all who appear with me as a committee of the Window Glass Workers' Association of America, and whose names are appended. We will cheerfully answer any questions you may ask, if we are able to do so. We thank you, gentlemen, for your courtesy. Eespectfully, John P. Ebbehabt, President, Pittshurg, Pa, Simeon F. Putney, Cleveland, N. Y. Jos. EiGGiNS, Bridgeton, N. J. Ghas. Bryant, Findlay, Ohio. John A. Kealt, Jeannvtte, Pa. A. M. Hammett, Pittsburg, Pa. James Campbell, Pittsburg, Pa. George L. Cake, Pittsburg, Pa. Committee of Window Glass Worlcers' Association of America. Mr. Eberhart. It is absolutely impossible for the Commissioner of Labor, or any other statistician to determine this matter accurately, and I only assume these figures to be correct, and will argue on that basis. I had not anticipated what Mr. Bodine would say this morning; but I think his statement as to wages is approximately correct. We come here to-day believing that we are right. We come here believing that you would know we are right if you had a fair knowl- edge of this question in all its bearings. There is no body of people on the earth who have been so misrepresented and misunderstood as the window-glass workers of this country have been. We have sub- mitted to having ourselves talked about a.s receiving too much wages, and everything of that sort; but this is simply a question of business. We desire to tell the whole truth, and have come before you willing and anxious to answer every question that you may ask us, in order that you may understand the matter. Mr. Tarsney. It is not true that the accidents of which you speak in this business are inherent in business everywhere"? Mr. Eberhart. I only gave tliat as a reason why it is impossible to reduce it to figures. It makes the figures taken from other countries just as erroneous as those in this country. Mr. Tarsney. Do you indorse the figures given by Mr. Bodine? Mr. Eberhart. We indorse them as being perfectly fair. Mr. Tarsney. I understood Mr. Bodine to state that the difference WINDOW GLASS. 201 in wages and labor cost between England and Belgium was the same as that between England and the United States. Mr. Eberhart. You thoroughly misunderstood him. Mr. Taesnet. He followed it with the statement that because of that big increase the Belgians were encroaching upon and almost monopolizing the English market. Mr. Ebbrhart. Excuse me, "but you misapprehended him. He said that after all, while there were apparent differences in wages, they were evened up. Wages are approximately the same on the same qualities of goods. A great deal of goods have been imported from Belgium to England. Mr. Tarsnet. For what is jovx association formed? Mr. Eberhart. It is formed for the elevation of its members, for their education in th(} principles of American citizenship, as well as for the purpose of protection in our industry. Mr. Tarsnet. On what do you look with most apprehension 1 Mr. Eberhart. By being closely bound together we hope to be able to bring to bear an influence that will work to the benefit of our busi- ness, and from time to time resist any unjust encroachments from our employers, and to do everything that goes to make workingmen more prosperous. Mr. Tarsnet. One of the principal objects is to prevent encroach- ments by the reduction of wages ? Mr. Eberhart. That is one of the principal objects. Mr. Tarsnet. You find a necessity for organization for that pur- pose? Mr. Eberhart. ISTecessarily. Mr. Tarsnet. You frequently have to exercise force for that purpose? Mr. Eberhart. Yes, sir; I would like to give you some reasons why. We realize, Mr. Chairman and gentlemen, that our employers are only human; and not only that, but they are American and aggressive, as are Americans of every kind; and that when they are crowded by the foreign product and harassed in their own market by the foreigners from year to year, as they have been through the latter years of the business, it is only natural that they would protect themselves from ruin. The wages of the men in their factories being an all-important factor in the cost of production, they would naturally look to reduction in that line. Mr. Tarsnet. Does not that sometimes occur when it is not the result of competition ? Mr. Eberhart. I remember that we were reduced in wages some- time after the reduction of the tariff in 1893 ; and it is the only reduc- tion of wages that I have any knowledge of. Mr. Tarsnet. Were importations heavier at that time than they are to-day? Mr. Eberhart. They were somewhat heavier at that time than at present. Mr. Tarsnet. Did you not in your paper state to the contrary? Mr. Eberhart. JSTo, sir. At that time the reduction was conceded because our organization recognized the justice of it on account of this reduction in the tariff'. I will also state that we have an express written agreement with our employers that if the tariff be reduced we would be willing to accept a reduction. Mr. Tarsnet. As to the figures that you speak about, will you please give them again for 1880 1 202 EARTHENWARE Mr. Eberhaet. For the year ending June 30, 1881, the amounts are approximately the same. For the four years ending June 30, 1881, or succeeding the reduction of the tariff, the imports amounted to $6,000,- 000 ; nearly three-fourths more. Mr. Tarsney. Please explain why it is that you suspend work for a couple of months in each year. Mr. Eberhart. I will try to do so. You must understand that the window-glass work is more arduous than anyone not actually expe- rienced in it can possibly appreciate. You must know that when the heat becomes oppressive in the spring of the year the men, with all their excellent food, with all the nice beefsteak they can get, are unable to recuperate sufficiently to continue the performance of that work. About the latter part of June the men are completely fagged out, and must have a cessation of labor ; not only that, but by reason of the ex- cessive heat used in the works it is rapidly destructive to them, and it is necessary sometimes to place these works in working order, so that stoppage is necessary. "While that acts as a loss to the workingmen, they have discussed the matter, and they do not want the stoppage to be any shorter. Mr. Tarsney. Is there much difference between the climate in mid- summer in Pittsburg and that in Belgium'? Mr. Eberhart. Experience shows that while the difference in the heat at a given period would not vary so much in their climate, still it is more even over there, and it does not come on so suddenly as in this country to "knock us out," if you will excuse a glass-house expression. Mr. Bregkinrid&e. In what department of the glass-manufacturing business are you engaged? Mr. Eberhart. I am not engaged in glass works, but am president of the Iron Workers' Association. My trade is that of a cutter. Mr. Breckinridge. Does that relate to window glass? Mr. Eberhart. Yes, sir; there are blowers, cutters, and flatteners. Mr. Breckinridge. Have you any export trade at this time? Mr. Eberhart. None that I know of. That question could be bet- ter answered by the manufacturers. Mr. Breckinridge. I infer from the trend of your argument that it is needless for us to hope to have an export trade in window glass? Mr. Eberhart. It is absolutely needless for us ever to hope to do that, unless the working people of foreign countries are elevated to the status of ours. We have other things to overcome besides that in the matter of transportation. Mr. Breckinridge. That applies more particularly to the glass establishments in the interior? Mr. Eberhart. Our glass-manufacturing establishments are in the interior principally. It has been found that the most advantageous localities for manufacturing glass are considerable distances from the seaboard, as a rule. Mr. Breckinridge. Are you familiar with the difference that has existed between the cost of production in this country at former times, as well as at the present time? Mr. Eberhart. I could not answer that very accrrrately, except in this way: That I did have positive knowledge that as the tarilf has been reduced the cost of production in foreign countries has been reduced. I remember that in 1890, when what is known as the McKiri- ley bill was passed, immediately after it was known that it would go into effect notices were posted in the works in express terms : "We will enforce a 10 per cent reduction in our works to meet the advance WINDOW GLASS. 203 in the tariff on account of the McKinley bill." That is one of the instances. When the development occurred in this business in this country and manufacturers had taken every effort to improve their works and to cheapen the article, and when there had been over there reductions made in order to increase tlieir ability to sell glass they made an aggregate reduction of 20 per cent after the passage of that bill. Mr. Brbckinbidge. When the tariff was advanced by the passage of the McKinley bill did you find foreign competition in the interior as well as on the seaboard? Mr. Eberhaet. Yes, sir; but of course not to the same extent. I know something about the business farther back than my personal recollection will go. Mr. Beeckinridge. So far as you know the American producers require as much protection now as they ever did! Mr. Eberhart. No, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. You see no hope of establishing an export trade? Mr. Eberhart. ISo, sir; unless conditions greatly change in foreign countries. It will never be possible unless some great revolution is made in the business whereby machinery can be used to produce glass still cheaper than it can be produced in foreign countries. It will never come about so long as American workingmen have a right to work and live as American citizens. Mr. Breckinridge. And, so far as I see, it will never be possible for American manufacturers to establish business in such a way as to sup- ply this country without the rates of protection remaining substan- tially as we have them at the present time. Mr. Eberhart. We always will have to accept ideas of certain cranks in this country who are determined to have anything that is imported; but we think the time ought to come when we will have a much larger percentage of the home market than we liave ever had before. Mr. Breckinridge. My question was as to whether you could fore- see any possibility of being able to supply our market without sub- stantially the same rate of protection that the glass manufacturers have at this time. Mr. Eberhart. I will say that within the last few years there has been a wonderful advancement in this country by manufacturers in the introduction of the continuous-tank system, and so on. The manu- facturers in this country have been very ambitious to get the very best methods and the very best ways to reduce the cost of the product. This may continue, and the time may come when we will not need so much protection. Although Mr. Bodine stated this was no longer an infant industry, for it has been in existence a long while, yet it is struggling as much to-day as it ever has. For instance, in the Westorn country we discovered natural gas to be a very good fuel with which to make glass. Everybody went into this and it has beguii to react now. It must be so, and I believe that today, so far as actual results are con- cerned, taken in the aggregate, the manufacturers of this country have profited by this fuel. It has caused a wonderful advancement in that business in this country, because it has stimulated manufacturers to the introduction of other new methods of manufacturing fuel that will pro- duce a finer quality of glass. For instance, in one mill Mr. Chambers is erecting an apparatus to make his own gas, without the hope of using natural gas. Other manufacturers are manufacturing gas from coal, 204 EARTHENWARE. not because it is clieapcr, but because there, was a necessity for a gas of transcendent power that will justify tliem. Mr. Chambers told me that he could not put in an expensive plant were it not to be permanent. Mr. Breckinridge. I infer from what you say about natural gas and other things that the cost of manu&cturing has not been in- creased ? Mr. Eberhart. I really believe that during the time of this -^Nonder- ful development prices have declined. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you know the difierence in the selling price of window glass in this country and that abroad 1 Mr. Eberhart. In this country? Mr. Breckinridge. Yes, sir ; or in the foreign market — say the price to the jobbers. Mr. Eberhart. I do not, sir. That is not exactly in my department of the business. My best information is that glass is sold in foreign countries so low that, even with all our advantages, we do not see how they can do it. We know that it sold so low as to force our prices down to a low notch. The Chairman. Did I understand you to say that when the McKin- ley bill was passed there was a reduction of wages in the glass business in Belgium? Mr. Eberhart. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Have they trades unions in foreign countries? Mr. Eberhart. I believe they have a sort of union over there. The Chairman. And yet their union was obliged to submit to a reduction of wages? Mr. Eberhart. Yes, sir; I do not think they were able to hold on long enough. The Chairman. In some lines of occupation they have international unions. Is there such a thing in your trade? Mr. Eberhart. No, sir; we have nothing of the sort. The Chairman. There was no corresponding increase of wages on this side of the water because of the McKinley bill? Mr. Eberhart. No, sir. The Chairman. Are there any glass manufacturers who employ non- union labor in this country? Mr. Eberhart. Not one. The Chairman. You have a pretty good organization? Mr. Eberhart. There is no window-glass manufacturer in this coun- try who runs nonunion works. If a manufacturer should be short of a man and the union could not supply one we riever stand in the way of that man's services. We would allow him to be employed on the same terms as our own men are. The Chairman. There is a scarcity of glass blowers in the country? Mr. Eberhart. There has been such a thing known. The Chairman. Is there any difficulty in an American boy learning this trade? Mr. Eberhart. No, sir. The Chairman. Is there any obstacle in the way of his entering the trade? Mr. Eberhart. If there is any such thing anywhere I have "been unable to learn it. The Chairman. Does not your union regulate the number of appren- tices? Mr. Eberhart. Yes, sir. The Chairman. And who shall be apprentices? ■WINDOW GLASS. 205 Mr. Ebeehakt. Yes, sir. If you will allow me, I think I can give you better information by reading the laws of our organization on that subject. I am anxious to have this thoroughly understood. Our law reads that gatherers shall be 10 per cent; cutters, 4 per cent; and flat- teners 4 per cent. When, however, it can be shown that it is necessary, the proportion of cutters can be raised to 20 per cent and that of flat- teners to 5 per cent. The Chairman. That is the proportion of apprentices to the number of workmen"? Mr. Ebeehaet. Yes, sir. I desire to explain that. Up to the time of the discovery of natural gas, this number of apprentices related to the number of workingmen; so that always an ample number of young men could enter the trade. There is no necessity for any places being vacant. ISTatural gas was discovered, and there was an abnormal growth in the business. We increased the number of apprentices in the quarries. Every man who is an American citizen, and who has been in the trade a sufficient length of time and is capable of taking care of an apprentice, has the right to take his son or brother outside of this percentage. We make a sufficient provision for apprentices to supply the demand. In order to do that we not only relax the laws so that we can get a boy into the trade, but we advance him as fast as possible in order to assist him in becoming a workman in six months, if possible, in order to make room for another apprentice. There was an impression among the manufacturers for several years, because the business was growing so fast, that there would be difficulty in getting apprentices. My impression was that there were boys enough, and I thought I understood the business better. We took all the apprentices that it was possible to take. This year we have received notice from the manufacturers that they do not want so many boys next year. For the last two years the manufacturers, when the time came to arrange the scale for the year, said nothing about the number of apj)rentices ; and this year they have informed us in express terms that they do not ask the number of apprentices to be increased. Our law says that no apprentiship shall be granted to any one who has not attained the age of fourteen years. Is not that equitable? An apprentice must have a good moral character, and be able to read and write. The law also says that a father or brother, being a citizen of the United States and in good standing, maybe allowed to take a son or brother as an apprentice. The son of a deceased father has the Ijrivilege of entering the trade, provided said father was a citizen of .the United States at the time of his death. So, you see we are Ameri- cans in our rules and laws. Section 15 says that in any one of the four trades where apprentices are received, no money shall be paid for such apprentices, and it fixes a fine of from $5 to $50, and tlie party is liable to be expelled, who violates this law. We are no enemies of the American boy. That belief is a great misapprehension. It has been suggested that I should state the fact that the trade of blower is usually grown fromthat of gatherer, and that every gatherer who works in the business has always the right to advance himself, so that we have a constant stream pouring in as fast as the capacity of the works will take them. The Chairman. Speaking of the character of the work, has there been a shortening of life among the workingmen in that business? Mr. Ebbehart. It has been found that it is a very heavy draft on any man's vitality, and that any man who works at the trade, unless he is extraordinarily strong, would not live as long as a man engaged 206 EARTHENWARE. in other avocations of life. There have been men who worked until they were comparatively old. I remember one instance where a man who was thought to be so old that he was looked upon as a wonder. I have seen hi7u tottering on the street; but when I came to inquire as to his age, I found he was not such an old man after all. He was consid- ered old because he was a glass- worker. I think the time of service is greatly shortened on account of the character of the work. Since I came to Washington to meet this committee I received a let- ter from the secretary in the ofBce at Pittsburg in relation to a man for whom I had procured work; but I understand that he has not been accepted because he was thought to be too old. That man is as vigor- ous as any man in this room to-day. I had made a positive arrange- ment for a place for him. After a man gets too old for the business he is relegated to idleness, or has to take up common labor or go to the poorhouse. The Chairman. There was something said in the papers about glass- blowers being imported in Pennsylvania. Was there any truth in that ? Mr. Bbbrhaet. We were never able to prove it in court. The Chairman. You could not make out a case in court? Mr. Eberhart. There was a failure to get sufQcient evidence to have the case recognized in court as a case — it was such an utter failure. Mr. Bryan. I want to ask you whether the fact that workingmen live better and have shorter hours makes their labor any more efiftcient during the time they do work? Mr. Eberhart. Yes, sir; I believe it is possible. Mr. Bryan. In Belgium they work Sundays as well as other days, and have no vacations in the summer? Mr. Eberhart. Iso, sir. Mr. Bryan. Does that tell upon the constitution or render their work less valuable to the employer ? Mr. Eberhart. I will have to answer that question a little at length. The conditions are so different over there that it is hard to understand all these things. I can not, as a matter of fact, state it; but myimx)res- sion is that in Belgium they have created a surplus of workingmen, and if a man gets played out he can be replaced and the place be kept stlH'going. When you speak of works running, they refer more to the place than to the man. If a man becomes disabled the x:)]ace goes on, because the women and children keep on working, and can manage to eke out a sort of existence. Mr. Bryan. Do you know what the hours are over there? Mr. Eberhart. No, sir ; except this, that in a continuous tank they have to work three sets of men in twenty-four hours. Mr. Bryan. Over there, as well as here? Mr. Eberhart. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. So they work eight hours a day each? Mr. Eberhart. I suppose so. Mr. Bryan. When you are giving th^ comparative wages, do you mean the wages for each man, or the wages that go to each place? Mr. Eberhart. I am glad you make that point. Wlien statisticians go to get statistics they get the wages of the men. A man is working in a glassworks, and it is always known as a certain place. The blower in the place gets the bill. It is called his place. The bill is made out to that man, no matter if he Avere off three or four weeks, unless discharged, or he surrenders the place permanently. The work WINDOW GLASS. 207 would be credited to that man. When statistics are made up, there is no allowance for sickness or anything of the kind. The statistics appear according to the wages paid to the man working in that certain place. Mr. Bryan. Is that true in this country? Mr. Ebeehaet. I was speaking particularly of this country. I sup- pose it is the same in other countries. Mr. Bryan. Have you made any estimate by which you can speak intelligently on this subject of the labor cost of making a particular piece of glass, or do you base your opinion entirely upon the relative wages paid ? Mr. Eberhart. I could by a short calculation give yon what the wages of our four trades would be on a particular box of glass. Then we would have to iigure on estimates as to the percentage of this to the total cost. Mr. Bryan. Is it possible for a manufacturer to take a box of glass and figure out just what it cost to produce that box of glass and put it on the market? Mr. Eberhart. It is possible to figure close to it, but it could not be, done exactly. We can calculate that so much glass can be made out of so naany pounds of soda-ash, sand, etc. — that it is in that mate- rial to do it. But we can not calculate whether a pot is liable to break and the glass run into the cellar and become a total loss. Mr. Bryan. A man who calculates must take those things into con- sideration ? Mr. Eberhart. Yes, sir; there may be a general average of such damages, and then he might meet a loss which would bankrupt him. Mr. Bryan. There is nothing in this country to make it more risky than in other countries ; it is possible for a business man to compute the cost here as well as the cost there, of such accidents'? Mr. Eberhart. I believe it is moie risky here than there, because there are so many of these things. If he is unfortunate enough to lose by such damages, they will cost liim so much more here than on the thero side. Another thing is that in the old country the melting tank is not so much of a loss when the product is compared. It turns out often to be unfit for the market in this country; but in that country they can go ahead and work it up again, and ship it here and there to points where quality is not required. Such glass in this country would have to be dipped out and melted over again. Last year several tanks had to be emptied of glass as soon as it could be done. Mr. Bryan. I understand, then, that your estimate of the cost in this country and the cost abroad is based upon wages paid and not necessarily upon the cost of the article produced? Mr. Eberhart. The wages are such an immensely large factor in it (that difference being 85 per cent of the total cost) that they go far toward making the difference in the total cost. Mr. Bryan. However much you may argue that subject, the fact remains that your estimateis based upon the wages paid and not upon investigation made of the actual cost? Mr. Eberhart. Kot altogether. We have sent men to Belgium and England to investigate this matter, and these estimates are the out- come of those investigations as near as we could get them. It is impossible to get them accurate on account of the difference in the places. Mr. Bryan. You simply give the figures as to the wages and not as to cost of a particular piece or quantity of glass. 208 EAETHENWAKE. Mr. Ebeehabt. I do not pretend to give the figures of wages in other countries. I only quote from the report of the Commissioner of Labor, wliich we can only assume to be correct. Mr. Bryan. I believe you stated that, counting the tiine the men did not work, it would make a httle less than $79 per mouth for their wages? Mr. Ebeehaet. I took my figures from a large number of works in the countries from the pay rolls of the companies. Mr. Bryan. The figures you give are not actually figures, but merely prophecies ? Mr. Eberhart; They are the average rate the men worked for this year. Mr. Bryan. Can you give us the actual amount for each man. Would it fall short of $79? Mr. Eberhart. Eeally, I have not figured that out. Mr. Bryan. Would it be more than $60? Mr. Eberhart. It would be more than $60. Mr. Bryan. Would it be $70? Mr. Eberhart. Well, you are asking me to guess at something. Mr. Bryan. Give your best judgment, Mr. Eberhart. It would be over $60. Mr. Bryan. Do you really believe that a reduction of the tariff would reduce your wages by reducing the price of glass in this country'? Mr. Eberhart. I have every reason to believe that if the tariff were reduced we would have to meet that reduction in a reduction of wages. Mr. Bry'AN. Because of the reduction in the price of glass '? Mr. Eberhart; Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. In other words, you argue that the price of glass in this country is maintained at a higher point because of the tariff than it would be without the tariff'? Mr. Eberhart. I do believe that a reduction in the tariff would enable the foreign manufacturers to sell their glass here and it would cheapen it. I think that the maintenance of the tariff has developed the industry in this country, and will continue to develop it until glass sells for a lower price than it otherwise would if such development had not taken place. Mr. Bryan. The glass business is an old one, is it not? Mr. Eberhart. It is pretty old. Mr. Bryan. We had about the same amount i^roduced in this coun- try before as we have had under the McKiuley bill. Is not that largely true? Mr. Eberhart. What was the Walker tariff? Mr. Bryan. It was a so-called free-trade tariff. Mr. Eberhart. At that time the window- glass business was circum- scribed in this country. Mr. Bryan. Did we not manufacture about as much as we do now at about the same price? Mr. Eberhart. I am not able to answer that. Mr. Bryan. Mr. Clay said, in 1832, that window glass was selling at $3.75 per* hundred feet. That was over sixty years ago, and the devel- opment has not brought a great reduction since that time. Mr. Eberhart. I will tell you why. In 1832 8 by 10 was the best glass there was, and it was about the highest glass that came into the ]narket. Now we have 8 by 10 simply a drug on 'the market. It is only sold now with other glass. WINDOW GLASS. 209 Mr. Betan. So tliat it is hardly fair to compare the two? Mr. Ebebhakt. It woiikl hardly be a fair comparison. In 1832 the window-glass business in this country was very small. Mr. Betan. At that time Mr. Clay was bragging about how it had grown. • Mr. Ebeehaet. Since that time it has probably grown a great deal. Mr. Betan. I think it was said this morning that the price was $1.50 for 50 feet in a box. Mr. Ebeehaet. It has been suggested that at that time it would have cost a great deal more than that to have got that glass to the market. For instance, the industry in western Pennsylvania at that time was in the backwoods, and the cost of trausj)ortation was very excessive. Mr. Betan. With that geographical protection the protection was greater than it is now f Mr Ebeehaet. It could not be gotten to market. Mr. Betan. Mr. Clay in his speech did not go into details, but simply mentioned it as an industry. You have stated that you did not see in future how we will be able to import much glass in competition with other countries, for many years to come, without a tariff. Mr. Ebeehaet. I can not see it. I think it would be wise to keep on developing, as far as possible, in the hope of attaining that end. Mr. Betan. Tour defense of the tariff is that it pays us as a country to encourage the manufacture of glass at a higher price in this country than it can be bought for abroad ? Mr. Ebeehaet. I advocate a tariff on glass from a little narrower standjioint than that even. Mr. Betan. That is narrow. Mr. Ebeehaet. I think protection gives an opportunity of manu- facturing here and employing men at good wages. Mr. Betan. But suppose, to give those men good wages, it is neces- sary for some people in this country to pay more for the glass, you would still defend the tariff? Mr. Ebeehaet. But I contend that this very system which has been carried on in America and given the people good wages has also, by developing the business, not only as to the methods of manufacture, but also as to localities the most advantageous, developed the busi- ness and cheapened the article in this country. Mr. Betan. Can competition reduce the price of an article except where it is exorbitant? Mr. Ebeehaet. You know that in every department of hiiman activity we always figure on a profit in relation to the bulk of the business done. Now. the time was w^hen the business was done in a small way, and the individual profit would necessarily be greater where the product is made in enormous works. Men can afford to sell for a less profit when they do a large business, and in the aggregate get a fair income. Mr. Betan. You think doing business on a large scale will lessen the cosf? Mr. Ebeehaet. I think so. Mr. Betan. Suppose that (conceding it for the sake of the argument) this industry can not be kept up without this tariff, would you still defend the collection indirectly by the G-overnment of a higher price from the people to pay the manufacturers in order that you shall get more ? T H 14 210 EARTHENWARE. Mr. Bebrhabt. If you will come with me out into the State of Indiana I will show you there where this business has developed more rapidly than it has in any other portion of this country; and I also will show you where it has employed labor and where cities have been built in that section, and where people have bought glass to put^ in their houses; and I can showtheii' ability in building those houses has beeu infinitely increased by this system. In that section cities have sprung up like mushrooms. Substantial towns have been built; and if you figure it down it will be an infinitesimal increase in the cost of the whole people and in their ability to buy, Mr. Bryan. Then your theory is that the direct benefit goes back indirectly to all the people who pay it! Mr. Ebbrhart. Yery much multiplied. Mr. Bryan. The little direct benefit which you get is multiplied before it goes back to the people who pay it? Mr. Ebbrhart. Yes, sir; through those and others. The Chairman. In the average earnings, do you include the un- skilled along with the skilled labor"? Mr. Ebbrhart. ISTo, sir; that was the average in the skilled trade. The Chairman. Is it possible for a skilled blower to make that per diem wages? Mr. Ebbrhart. Yes, sir. They do not make such large wages per annum. It will depend upon quite a number of conditions. The Chairman. What would be the maximum for a skilled blower of double thickness ? Mr. Ebbrhart. That would be very hard to state, owing to the con- ditions. There are men in the country in the industry to-day that I have in mind who can make very large wages at times, when they have hours and glass fit for making extra large sizes. They are strong men and highly skilled. At the same time they are dragging themselves out and becoming old men before their time. The Chairman. I have heard instances where men have made S25 to $30 a day- Mr. Ebbrhart. Yes, sir; and they have continued to do it for a whole settlement through. There have been manufacturers who have built works — and especially has this been the case where workmen were scarce and where there was a rivalry between companies — there have been times when there would be rivalry as to reputation of the amount of production; during those times they have allowed some of the blowers, who were strong enough, to work on their very highest-x^riced sizes, whether they had orders or not; and they even allowed glass to go into those orders at extra price of wages, when it was hardly fit to go into it, simply for the purpose of saying that a blower made so much in a settlement. It goes out to the men that they are doing a good business at such and such works. That has been done in some in- stances. The Chairman. After all, I imagine that in the American trade the tariff is the most effective agency? Mr. Ebbrhart. I think I can assure you of this, that if you will con- tinue the system jon can safely leave the question of prosperity to us for we will get our share of it. Mr. Payne. Then you are not afraid of not getting your share? Mr. Ebbrhart. Not in the least. Mr. Dalzbll. If we strike down the manufacturer you will suffer? Mr. Ebbrhart. Yes, sir; it will take away his ability to pay. You can not squeeze blood out of a turnip. WINDOW GLASS. 211 Mr. Payne. Your organization was as strong in 1883 as it is now? Mr. Eberhaet. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. You could not prevent a reduction in 1883 1 Mr. Ebbehaet. No, sir. Mr. Daizell. Suppose the tariff were lowered to the extent of driv- ing out home competition, do you suppose the foreign manufacturers would give us glass at the same price it is now"? Mr. Ebekhaet. There is no guestiou but what prices would be greatly enhanced in a short time. Mr. Balzell. You do not think it would put up wages over there. They put down wages over there when we raised the tariff; and do you not imagine that the workingmen would compel them to put it up! Mr. Eberhaet. The workingmen over there are just where a work- ingman in this country will be if protection is abolished. They have not even the power to combine, and so unite their strength. The Chairman. I understood you to say that they had labor unions over there? Mr. Eberhaet. We have tried to assist them to an effective union and have spent thousands of dollars in assisting them, besides a great deal of time and labor. The Chairman. You say you have spent money assisting them? Mr. Eberhart. Yes, sir : thousands of dollars. Mr. Burrows. You say window glass was never so cheap as it is to- day? Mr. Eberhaet. It is my belief that there never was a time when window glass was selling so cheap as to-day. This is the best informa- tion I have. Mr. BuREOWS. Then our people are suffering who buy glass for a less price than they have ever been able to buy it for before? Mr. Ebeehaet. It is lower than it has ever been before, and tlie manufacturers who have any glass on hand will not sell it, because the people who want it have no money to pay for it. STATEMENT OF MR. PHILLIPS. Mr. Phillips read a paper as follows : New Castle, Pa., SeptemJicr 6, ISOS. Hon. T. W. Phillips and M. S. Quay : Dear Sirs : We, the window-glass workers and members of local assembly No. yOO, K. of L., at a meeting held on the 4th day of September, unanimously resolved that. Whereas it is apparent that Congress is about to revise the tariff on window glass ; and Whereas we believe that a reduction in the tariff on window glass means a reduc- tion in our wages ; therefore, be it Resolved, That we request that you a,s our representatives in Congress and Senate do protest before the Ways and Means Committee in behalf of tlie window-glass worlsers of United States thac no reduotion be made in the tariff so far as it relates to window glass. Clark E. Gleason. ALI'HONSE W. Eeykolds. Horace B. Clark. William D. Camp. H. S. Haint^s. R. C. ViDEON. 212 EARTHENWARE. GERMAN MIREOE PLATES. (Paragraph 113.) S'fATEMENT OF ME. ALFEED BLUM, OF 13 FIRST STSEET, NEW YOKK. Wednesday, September 13, 1893. Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen op the Coimmittee : Our busi- ness is tbat of importiug plate glass for the jmrpose of mauufactur- ing mirror plates. About 90 per cent of the glass which we import, or nearly 90 per cent of the business which we do on plate glass is on sizes as you mentioned, 24 by 30 and below. The only reasons we import these sizes is on account of the American factories refusing to take orders for these sizes, or in other words, as Mr. Hitchcock stated, he does not manufacture any small glass at all. They manufacture very large sheets and the breakages or defective parts or pieces that are left of large plates are cut up and sold in that way. The principal object of my being here is due to the fact we bring in German looking- glasses. That is entirely a product of a foreign nation. We are in- formed that there is to be a change on that article, and the duty is to be either reduced or taken off so as to make practically no duty on it at all, which, of course, materially affects our business. For my part I can not see why there shoiild be any duty on glass under 10 feet, that is, plate glass, and I think that the duty over 10 square feet, that is, 50 cents a square foot, is a very high duty, and I do not consider that duty right and necessary to protect the American manufacturer. I am not a manufacturer of plate glass, I will tell you that. Mr. Dalzbll. You are only interested in those two sizes? Mr. Blum. I am interested in all sizes, large and small ; we import aU sizes. The Chairman. You are an importer, consumer, and seller? Mr. Blum. We manufacture mirror plates. The Chairman. You sell to furniture factories? Mr. Blum. Entirely so. Mr. Gear. Where do you make them"? Mr. Blum. jSTumber 12 First street, jSTew York. Mr. Dalzell. Could you give us an idea of the sizes you have been importing? Mr. Blum. Yes, sir; they were mentioned by one of your committee, by the gentleman at the end ; I do not know him. Mr. Dalzell. Those are the sizes you have been importing? Mr. Blum. We have been importing all sizes, but I am speaking about the bulk of our importations, which have been sizes up to and including 5 sfjuare feet, which is 24 by 30; 1 should think that was 90 per cent of it. Mr. Dalzell. Only 10 per cent of your imports were sizes above that? Mr. Blum. On account of this duty, yes, sir. Mr. Turner. Do you use any American glass for your mirrors? Mr. Blum. Yes, sir; occasionally. Mr. Turner. Is it equal to the other? Mr. Blum. Some is, yes, sir; but all glass does not run uniform. One shipment may be of a very fine quality and the next may not be equal to it, or may be superior to it. Mr. Turner. How does the cost of our glass compare, with the duty added, to the foreign articles of equal quality and grade? GERMAN MIRROR PLATES. 213 Mr. Blum. Tlie quality is about equal. Mr. Turner. There is not much choice, then, whether you buy home or abroad? Mr. iSuuM. You can not buy at home; they will not sell to you here. They will not take any large order for a big shipment. That has been our experience. In fact no factory which manufactures here an article we could use for our business will take any orders from any of the manufacturers. Mr. Turner. Is this business of yours of silvering plate glass an extensive industry in this country? Mr. Blum. I think so; yes, sir. I think it is greater than the man- ufacture of plate glass in this country. The Chairman. I understand when you get beyond 5 feet you find the tariff' prohibitory? Mr. Blum. Yes, sir. E"ow, the duty on plate glass, say 24 by 60, that is exactly 10 feet square, is $2.50 a plate. When you go above that size the duty jumps to 50 cents a square foot. Mr. Turner. Are you familiar with the manufacture of plate glass on the other side? Mr. Blum. No, sir. Mr. Turner. You have no experience across the water? Mr. Blum. Kg, sir. Mr. Burrows. What did you say your business was? Mr. Blum. We are manufacturers of mirror plate, importing plate glass for that purpose; that is, the plate glass which we import we use for the manufacturing only. • Mr. Burrows. Do you silver it? Mr. Blum. Yes, sir; bevel and silver. Mr. Burrows. Can you buy that glass in this country? Mr. Blum. Yes, we can buy it in this country from jobbers, but we can not buy it as we can import it. Mr. Burrows. Where is your place of business? Mr. Blum. Number 12 First street, New York. Mr. Burrows. How many hands have you actually employed? Mr. Blum. One hundred to-day. Mr. Gear. Are yoa the only man in that business in this country? Mr. Blum. No, sir; unfortunately there are many more. Mr. Gear. How many are there ? Mr. Blum. There are more in that business than in the plate-glass business. Mr. Gear. More hands employed? Mr. Blum. Yes, sir; than in the mauiifacture of plate glass. Mr. Gear. Then there are over 8,000. Mr. Blum. Well, in different sections of the country, yes, sir. Mr. Tarsney. What is the effect of this condition which Mr. Hitch- cock has just described in regard to the manufacture of large plate glass where he says they are compelled to cut up 50 per cent of the product into smaller sizes? Mr. Blum. Well, I can not explain that. Mr. Tarsney. Is it a fa'ct? Mr. Blum. It is a fact they will not take any orders. They have had orders from our firm, not this particular factory, but other factories, members of this plate-glass association. Mr. Tarsney. I understand 50 per cent of the manufiictnreiscutup for causes stated by Mr. Hitchcock, so it must supply a considerable demand from dealers? 214 EARTHENWARE. Mr. Blxtm. Tlie demand is so mucli in excess of their cutting, as you call it, cutting for breakages or defects, that it would not begin to sup- Mr. Dalzell. What does the demand amount to? Mr. Blxtm. It is something enormous. Mr. Dalzell. Can not you give the figures? Mr. Blum. What it amounts to for mirror plates? Mr. Dalzell. What does the demand amount to for plate glass to be made into mirrors in a year? Mr. Blum. Oh, I suppose several million dollars' worth of mirror plates are sold. Mr. Burrows. Do I understand you to say the manufacturers would not take your orders ? Mr. Blum. Yes, sir. Mr. Burrows. Do you know why? Mr. Blum. I do know why. In the first place, as near as I can under- stand, the manufacturers or members of the association have two classes of buyers; one class are jobbers and the other class is the class we come under, manufacturers. The jobbers can buy at much lower prices than we can as manufacturers, and to buy from them at their prices we cannot compete on this market. Mr. Tarsney. This small-sized glass goes in your product? Mr. Blum. Yes, sir. Mr. Tarsnet. If it is sold, as Mr. Hitchcock says, for one-half its cost there ought not to be much difficulty? Mr. Blum. I am prepared to say there is no American factory which will take an order for these sizes mentioned by the gentleman at the head of the table at prices they are selling for prompt shipment. If you order five hundred of one size and get one hundred in a shipment you are very lucky. The Chairman. Have you completed your statement? Mr. Blum. Yes, sir. ADDITIONAL STATEMENT PILED. The so-called Gennan mirror or German looking-glasses, known as silvered or looking-glass plates, for which this Government now charge the following duty per square foot : Glass plates per square foot — Ceuls. Not over 16 by 24 inches square — 384 square inches 6 Over 16 by 24, not over 24 by 30 — 720 square inches 10 Over 24 by 30, not over 24 by 60 — 1,440 square inches 35 All above 24 by 60 60 This so-called German looking-glass plate is the product entirely of a foreign nation, made mostly in Purth, Germany, and also in Holland being manufactured and brought inio this country in condition for immediate use. The demand for these mirror plates is very large on account of their being in such competition against the same sizes of mirror plates manu- factured by ourselves an d other manufacturers in this country. There is no doubt tliat all of the manufacturers in this country would be per- fectly content to allow the duty in these small sizes to remain as it is without any change, on condition that Congress would double the duty on finished mirror plates coming into this country all sizes. As you have the statistics before you on all sizes of plate glass manufactured in this country, also imported in this country, you can form an idea for GERMAN MIRROR PLATES. 215 yourself as to the consumption on these sizes. The duty on plate glass over 10 square feet at 50 cents per square foot is entirely unnecessary and unjust. A duty of 26 cents a square foot on all plate glass over 10 square feet would give the American manufacturers sufficient i^rotection to manufacture, and do so at a profit. The plate glass under 10 square feet — there is no occasion whatever for having any duty on this at all, it being a raw material and in an unfinished state. The German looking-glasses or silvered plates coming into this coun- try are manufactured in Furth, Germany, handled exclusively by the German Looking-Glass Plate Company of Kew York City. This cor- poration have a large monopoly, all of the stockholders being million- aires. They are enabled through the present low tariff to sell a finished article manufactured entirely abroad a great deal cheaper than the manufacturers in our line can sell a same sized plate. For instance, you take a mirror plate, beveled, that you make in this country, as does all manufacturers in our line in this country — we can sell in large quan- tities an 18 by 40, IJ bevel, or 24 by 30, IJ bevel, at $3.20. The German- Looking Glass Company can sell the same sized plate to larger manu- facturers in equal large quantities at $2.25 each, or, in other words, almost a reduction of 50 per cent lower than we can furnish the same article for. In our judgment it will be well to just double the present existing tariff on all silvered plates coming into this country, or else take off tariff on all small sized plate glass and not reduce tariff on German plates at all. EespectfuUy, Blxjm & TOCH. The Karges Furniture Co., EvANSVlLLE, Ind., Sej)t<-mher 12, 1893. Sir: It is possible that the subject of removal of duty from German mirrors (of Irom 5 feet and under) will shortly be considered by you. Should this be the case, we, the undersigned, wish to express our feel- ing opposing the same, for we are now buying a much better mirror of home manufacture at less money than we bought the German mirror from the monopoly of' importers two years ago. Tours, very respectfully, Karges Furniture Company. - Karges, Secretary. STATEMENT OF MR. LEO ASTEIAN, OF CHICAGO. Mr. Chairman: At the last convention of the National Furniture Manufacturers' Association, held in St. Louis last June, a committee of three, consisting of Mr. F. Mohr, of New York, Mr. Joseph Sextro, of Cin- cinnati, and myself, were appointed to appear before yoU in the intei'est of our trade. We have a few complaints in regard to the way we are treated by the tariff laws, and we propose to let you gentlemen know where the shoe pinches. Let us say at the start we do not come here to ask protection. Our industry is practically one of the few that could stand upon its own bottom; we need no protection of any kind. The census shows we import about $400,000 worth of furniture, so that would 216 EAETHENWARE. not make any difference, as far as imported furniture is concerned, as it does not come in competition with our trade. But we do ask that Con- gress ought to assist us in trying to gain an export trade for wbicli we have been seeking so long and in vain. There are about 3,000 furniture manufacturers in this country, employing over 100,000 hands' and turn- ing out annually $125,000,000 worth of furniture. ' In prosperous times it has been possible to find a market sufficient for all tliis furniture here, but when this last stringency came upon us the furniture industry was the first to feel it, and since the 1st day of June we have not turned a wheel in the city of Chicago, and to-day there is not a furniture factory running. They closed down at Grand Eapids, which is a great furni- ture center, as Mr. Burrows will bear me out. They closed down all over the country for want of an outlet. They have no other trade but the home trade, which now of course has left us for the time being. In order to help us to the export trade we ask merely to have German looking-glass plates, which enter largelj'^ into such articles as we can export, and which is used by the masses — cheap furniture — we ask to have that clause, including the size of 24 by 30, or 5 square feet and under, put upon the free list. The Mills bill favored it to this extent. They had a glass i)ut on the free list of that size. We do not ask for free-listed glass larger than that, and I understand Mr. Hitcbcock made a statement that they are not interested whatever in sizes under 5 feet. The chairman asked the question of Mr. Hitchcock why it is that most of the glass that has been imported comes under that size. The answer he has given is because you could not deliver it, and you do not care for that business. Mr. Hitchcock. You mean silvered glass? Mr. AsTEiAN. Yes, sir; we have no other object except that. Now, Mr. Chairman, the German i)late is window glass, and comes here under the tariff called cylinder crown glass, commercially known as German looking-glass plate. Last year the importation of that class was 4,103,210 square feet, or value of $1,549,968. Seventy-five per cent of this total glass is under 5 feet, and that is what furniture manufac- turers desire to have placed upon the free list. It comes in competition with nothing produced in this country; in thirty years' protection no- body has ever attempted to make a single establishment of it. There has never been an attempt to make it, and every sheet was imxiorted and duty paid on 24 by 30, 10 square feet, or 50 cents on every plate entering into the cheap chamber sets selling iipon the market from $8 to $10 for three pieces. These cheap chamber sets are the very sets we ajje trying to export, and that is the only class of furniture we can export, and which is in demand in the South American Eepnblics and in Mexico and in the West India Islands. If your committee should see fit to make any recommendation to have this put upon the free list you will certainly relieve us from another great distress — relieve ns from a trust formed in the city of New York which controls the entire sale of this German plate; a combination of five men who have control of the entire sale in this country, who squeeze us at their will and let us go at their will. They have placed the prices 30 per cent up after the passage of the McKinley bill and since that time and relicA^ed the price only 10 per cent in the last month. It is hard for us when we know we are entirely dependent upon a trust, the German Looking-Glass Com- ]iany of New York, who are squeezing us for all there is in it, and we desire to be relieved, and we hope the time is at hand when we will be. Mr. Dalzell. Are they importers'? GERMAN MIEKOR PLATES. ' 217 Mr. ASTEiAN. Tliey are importers and manufacturers. TLey manu- facture on the other side and at the same time they sell that output in this country. Mr. Dalzell. I understand what you want put on the free list is German silvered glass"? Mr. AsTEiAN. That is all, sir, we desire. Mr. Dalzbll. H"ot glass for silvering'? Mr. AsTEiAN. 'No, sir; it competes with nothing. We want the German looking-glass plate under 24 by 30, 5 feet and under, put upon the free list because there is nothing to compete. There is not an objection filed by these gentlemen here, and nobody has come here to protest against it. Mr. Howard (representing the Howard Plate Glass Company.) I take exception to that statement. Mr. AsTEiAN. I did not know there was anyone who objected. Mr. Howard. Every plate glass we make under 10 feet goes into this furniture. We are supplying this German looking-glass plate by a superior article than the article which Mr. Blum is fighting for. Mr. ASTRIAN. 1 differ from your opinion ; we can not use the French plate as a substitute for German. What the French plate is to the rich the German plate is to the poor, and why not give the masses the benefit of the cheaper article. We can not use the French plate for export because the weight is too great. In Mexico we have to pay duty by the weight and not ad valorem as we do here. That would hamper us and we could not use the small-size French plate; we are obliged to use the German j)late, and for that reason we ask why not do it when there would not be a voice raised against free-listing that article. Mr. Burrows. I understood you to reply to a question of Mr. Dal- zell that you wanted this glass after the silver was put on — silvered on the other side. Mr. Astrian. Yes, sir. Mr. Bttrrows. What is there to hinder bringing in that glass and taking off the silver and then its coming in competition with our win- dow glass! Mr. Astrian. The expense of the silver itself in connection with putting it on the glass and taking it off will far overbalance the bene- fits to be derived. Mr. Burrows. Do you know what it costs to silver glass on the other side? Mr. Astrian. I am not positive; I know they figure it here at 12 cents a foot. Mr. Burrows. Do not you know it does not cost to exceed 3 cents? Mr. Astrian. Then they bamboozle us considerably in selling them. Mr. Burrows. Does it not cost even less than 2 cents? Mr. Astrian. I have to take the word of the manufacturers, and they tell me it is 12 cents. Mr. Dalzell. Do you mean 12 cents here? Mr. Astrian. Yes, sir. Mr. Burrows. If it can be silvered for 2 cents there, and if the glass be imported as silvered glass and then the silver be taken off, would it not come in competition with window glass? Mr. Astrian. You must bear in mind that they would have to be repolished. Mr. Burrows. Would it not come in competition with our glass here? 218 ' EARTHENWARE. Mr. ASTKIAN. I do not believe it would come in competition to any extent in those sizes. Mr. Btjebows. One thing more. Ton say before these hard times you found the market for the furniture manufactured in this country among our own people? Mr. ASTEIAN. To a great extent. Mr. BXJEEOWS. "Well, substantially? Mr. AsTEiAN. Yes, sir. Mr. BuEEOws. What did you say your business was ? Mr. AsTEiAN. A manufacturer of furniture. Mr. Btjeeows. Are you not in other business 1 Mr. AsTEiAw. 1^0, sir. Mr. BuEEOWS. Are not you the agent of the importers of German silver glass? Mr. AsTEiAN. No, sir. Mr. BuEEOAVS. Never have been? Mr. AsTEiAN. No, sir. Mr. Btjeeows. Or in any way connected with them ? Mr. ASTEIAN. No, sir. Mr. BuREOWS. Or interested? Mr. AsTEiAN. No, sir. Mr. Dalzell. Can not yon use this German imported silvered glass in making up furniture and then in exporting it get back a rebate un- der the McKinley bill? Mr. ASTEIAN. No, sir. Mr. Dalzell. Why not? Mr. AsTEiAN. I have not heard of it. Then the amount would be too small to make these claims. Where we send four, five, or six sets to a dealer in Mexico or South America, it would be a great deal of work if we had to claim a rebate. Mr. Dalzell. Did not you know you could get this under the McKinley bill? Mr. AsTEiAN. 1 suppose so, but it would not be practical in our busi- ness for us to go to the custom-house and get a duty refunded of $3, and it would probably be too little money to make the effort. Mr. Dalzell. Then your idea of the export trade you get is, it would be so small it would not pay to get the rebate? Mr. AsTEiAN. We get a large export trade, but the individual retail- er s in those countires do not buy to a large extent. They buy five, six, or seven sets, probably, at a time, but the aggregate amounts to consid- erable. Mr. Dalzell. The aggregate would amount to 99 per cent of the entire exjiort trade, whatever that miglit be. Mr. Geae. Do not you ship by carload lots to Mexico? Mr. AsTEiAN. No, sir. The demand down there is not such a one as to justify any one man to buy carload lots. They buy small quantities open freight. Mr. TuRNEE. I understand your complaint is you ought not to have to pay the extra duty. Mr. AsTEiAN. We ought not because the 24 by 30 is the size used for cheap chamber sets, which are used for export, and for the M-i by 30 it would be $2.50 for each of the sets, almost one-third of the entire value of the chamber sets. Mr. Breckinridge. You are an exclusive manufacturer of furni- ture? Mr. ASTBIAN. Yes sir. GERMAN MIEROR PLATES. 219 Mr. Breckinridge. Why is not tliis kind of glass made in this , conn try "J Mr. AsTEiAN. Well, tliere has never been any attempt to make it [here. I do not know of a single step that has been made in all the [twenty years I have been in business. I never heard of an attempt jbeing made. I take it tor granted that the polishing business, which is a very expensive one, is a great deal cheaper in Germany than it is here. Mr. Hitchcock has stated that the labor in polishing has no competition here. Mr. Breckinridge. The glass of this size which is offered to you here appears to be a by-product to the making of larger sizes of plate glass? Mr. ASTRiAN. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Are you offered some glass of this size by Ameri- can manufacturers ? Mr. ASTBIAN. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. But it is only such pieces as are sold out of the wreckage of the larger sizes of jjlate glass f Mr. AsTRiAN. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Is that a higher priced article? Mr. ASTRIAN. Yes, sir ; it is a higher priced article. Mr. Breckinridge. That may be termed a by-product of the manu- facture of plate glass ? Mr. AsTRiAN. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. And it is also a matter of importance in weight? Mr. AsTRAiN. Yes, sir. There is much more weight to a cast plate than in Grerman plate, probably 5 to 1. Mr. Breckinridge. I would like to know to what extent this makes a difference in the price of the furniture which enters into it? Mr. AsTRiAN. With the German plate 24 by 30 we would be able to sell a cheap chamber suit at $10. JSTow, with the French plate it would make $1.50 more. Mr. Breckinridge. Suppose instead of using the French plate you use this plate glass of American manufacture, such as we have been talking about, what difference would that make? Mr. ASTRIAN. About $1.50. Mr. Breckinridge. You think that glass down to this point has been used under a kind of compulsion? Mr. ASTRIAN. It is because they forced it upon us, and we have to use it to some extent. Mr. Breckinridge. Our furniture manufacturers have a large ex- port trade? Mr. AsTRiAN. We had an export trade of $3,000,000 last year. Most of that, however, let me explain, was chairs. Mr. Breckinridge. And have for a number of years? Mr. AsTRiAN. Let me explain that. We were not able to export much chamber furniture Mr. Breckinridge. You mean last year? Mr. ASTRiAN. Kor any previous time. Mr. Breckinridge. Are you able to do any exporting now? Mr. Astrian. We are trying to, and we have made some headway in that direction, and it is for that reason we seek to get some relief Mr. Breckinridge. When you use this German plate glass in your export trade are you able to get a drawback for that glass? Mr. Astrian. We never attempted to get a drawback. 220 EARTHENWARE. Mr. Payne. You could get it back, but you have not exercised dili- gence. Mr. Dalzell. Tou could get it back. Mr. AsTRiAN. I suppose so, but as I have stated before, the amount is so small and scattered that any claim we would put in would entail so much work it probably would Jiot pay us to attempt it. Mr. Payne. It is really a small thing. Mr. AsTBiAN. The duty is a large thing, but most of the purchases in those countries are small. Mr. Payne. It would be small to you. Mr. AsTRiAN. Mr. Sextro tells me in order to get a drawback we must be importers ourselves. Mr. Dalzell. Mr. Sextro is mistaken. Mr. Breckinridge. It is well known that you can not get a draw- back exceiat on an identification of the goods. Mr. Turner. There is no provision to get a drawback on a finished article like that. Mr. Payne. The glass is not the finished article, the furniture is the finished article. He gets the silvered glass and then completes it ready to use. Mr. Dalzell. It goes into an American manufacture when it goes into a piece of furniture, and he is entitled to a drawback. Mr. Breckinridge. This duty which you pay now on this G-erman looking glass, the equivalent of which you say is not made in this country Mr. ASTRIAN. IsTo, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Is that duty entered upon the cost of your fur- niture and charged to the American consumer '? Mr. ASTRIAN. Certainly. Mr. Breckinridge. They have to pay that much more? Mr. AsTRiAJsr. Certainly. Mr. Payne. Tou say it is not made here? Mr. ASTRIAN. JSTo, sir, Mr. Payne. So it is purely a revenue duty? Mr. AsTRiAN. It seems to be a duty for revenue. Mr. Payne. That is this glass. Mr. AsTRiAN. Yes, sir. It is cast cylinder or blown cylinder glass. Mr. Gear. You have no foreign competition in the manufacture of furniture? Mr. ASTRIAN. Not for our own. Mr. Eeed. Are you asking us to take off a revenue duty? Mr. AsTRiAN. Well, it can not be called a protective duty, because there is no industry here competing with it. Mr. Eeed. We are not doing that now; that is not our line. Mr. Gear. The reason you are able to hold the home market and also get what exports you have is that because of the favorable conditions of the timber of this country? Mr. ASTRIAN. Yes, sir; to a considerable extent. Mr. Gear. Is it not to a large extent? Mr. ASTRIAN. Well, and the favorable condition of machinery. Mr. Gear. With the exception of mahogany and bay wood, you have the only timber in America that is adapted to furniture work? Mr. ASTRIAN. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. No other country can compete with you in the manufac- ture of furniture? Mr. ASTRIAN. No, sir; we are ahead of any in the world. GERMAN MIRROR PLATES. 221 Mr. Gear. Tou can export wherever you cau find a market? Mr. ASTRiAN. Yes, sir. Mr. Ohairinan, I desire to call yotir atten- tion to another article which the manufacturers of furniture Mr. Tabsnet. Before you leave that point. Inyour judgraeut what was the entire value of that polished silver glass consumption of the United States in 1891? Mr. ASTRiAN. I have not got the figures for 1891, but I have them for 1892. It is 4,103,216 square feet. Mr. Taesney. Can you approximate what it was in 1891 1 Mr. AsTEiAN. I suppose it would be the same 4,103,216 square feet. Mr. Taesney. What was the value of that? Mr. ASTRIAN. $1,549,968. Mr. Taesney. The importation of that kind of glass in 1892 was 4,282,855 feet, notwithstanding these plate glass manufacturers Sold 50 per cent of their product at half cost? Mr. AsTEiAN. Well, I am not familiar with it. The article I wish to call your attention to is mahogany lumber. That certaiuly is an arti- cle which can not be grown here by legislation. Mr. Payne. We have struck another revenue duty, have we not? Mr. AsTEiAN. I furthermore think that none of the gentlemen would contend that it is a protective duty, nor is it a duty for revenue. Ml'. Payne. Is it not used largely by rich people ? Mr. AsTEiAN. It is used for rich jjeople. Mr. Payne. Robber barons and all that class of people. Mr. AsTEiAN. Well, I wish to call attention, we are manufacturing for the rich and the poor. Mr. Dalzbll. You do not manufacture mahogany furniture for the poor? Mr. AsTEiAN. No: but we would like to benefit the poor so that the poor people might have some chance to use it. Mr. GeAE. What is the duty on mahogany logs ? Mr. AsTEiAN. There is no duty on that, but on sawed lumber it is 15 per cent ad valorem. Mr. Geae. You do not want to give the American workmen an op- portunity to saw that lumber? Mr. ASTRIAN. The cost of sawing a thousand is $2, and as protected to that extent we are satisfied. Mr. Gear. What is the value of mahogany lumber? Mr. ASTRIAN. We have to pay for it about 20 cents a foot. The reason we object to buying logs is we get fooled. We buy apparently sound logs, and when we get them here and saw them we find they are bad, cracked, knotty, and faulty. We have no other motive in asking this duty should be removed except that under the present law we do not know what we are buying. Mr. Gear. Cau you saw the veneers for $2 a thousand? Mr. AsTRiAN. We do not speak about that; we are speaking about seven-eighths stuff. Mr. Geae. A large consumjition of the mahogany used in this country is used for veneering? Mr. ASTRiAN. Because we can not use the solid stuff under this law. Mr. Gear. You make imitation bedsteads of mahogany ? Mr. AsTEiAN. Oh, that time is past. Mr. Reed. Are the logs sawed in this country? Mr. AsTRiAN. Yes, sir; and the cost of sawing is $2 a thousand feet of himber. Mr. Reed. Is it all sawed here? 222 EARTHENWARE. Mr. ASTKIAN. Yes, sirj it is sawed here. Mr. Eeed. Then there is no duty? Mr. ASTEIAN. There is no duty on round logs or hewn logs, but there is a duty of 15 per cent on the sawed timber. Mr. Eeed. What you want is to have it sawed somewhere else? Mr. ASTBIAN. So when we get the lumber we can see what we are getting. Mr. Eeed. And you can not see it when it is sawed here? Mr. AsTRiAN. But we have to pay for the faulty stuff which these people buy, and which we can not help buying. Mr. Eeed. Do not you have to pay for bad lumber sawed, too? Mr. ASTRiAN. Xo, sir; not to that extent. Mr. Gear. Is it not more convenient, as a matter of fact, to import logs or square stuff than veneering, cheaper freight and cheaper in the handling? Mr. AsTKiAN. We could not get veneering sawed down there. Mr. CtEAr. I guess you could get it if you took off the duty fast enough. Mr. Astrian. We do not use any veneering to amount to anything in our business. Mr. Gear. It is largely used in the country. Mr. Burrows. A statement was made before the Committee on Ways on Means in 1890 as follows, and I will ask you whether it is true or not: "Mahogany has been imported into this country for more than fifty years as raw material, free of duty when brought in the shape of logs. The logs are by expensive machinery and by skillful labor reduced to a different form by a process of manufacture, which at the present time employs several thousand skilled laborers and a capital invested in ijlants to the extent of many millions of dollars. The amount of wages paid to skilled mechanics in this particular line of industry averages from $2.50 to $5 per day. The machinery necessary for the manufacture of this peculiar wood is of a very expensive char- acter." Is this statement true? Mr. AsTRiAN. I suppose it is true, substantially. The Chairman. Eeferring to this export trade, you say that was largely chairs. Mr. AsTRiAN. Tes, sir. To a great extent we exported chairs. The Chairman, l^ow, the wages paid for the manufacture of chairs and other furniture, how do they compare with the ordinary wages of this country? Mr. AsTRiAN. I believe there is a large difference in the wages paid here and those paid abroad. The Chairman. I am not s]Deaking of the comparison between this country and abroad, but do you pay to the workmen who make chairs and other furniture as large wages as are ordinarily paid to skilled mechanics in this country? Mr. ASTRiAN. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. What is your standard of ordinarily skilled paid mechan- ics. You have been asked to make a comparison with an ordinary skilled mechanic, now what is your standard? Mr. ASTRIAN. $2.25 to $2.50 a day, as prevailing in furniture facto- ries. Mr. Eeed. I am not talking about furniture factories, Mr. ASTRIAN. I suppose so. Mr. Eeed. You suppose; do you know? Mr. ASTRIAN. $2.25 to $2.50 a day. GERMAN MIEEOB PLATES. 223 Mr. Payne. Are chairs largely made by macliinery? Mr. AsTRiAN. Largely so. Mr. Payne. And the material from which they are made is cheaper here than in any other country on the globe? Mr. Abtkian. Yes, sir. GERMAN MIRROR PLATES. (Paragraph 113.) STATEMENT OF HON. GEORGE F. RICHARDSON, REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF MICHIGAN. Wednesday, September 20, 1893. Mr. Ohaiemajst : I have received a number of communications from manufacturers of furniture in the city of Grand Eapids, where I live. They desire me to present some facts to this committee before the close of these hearings, and I would like to have done so under more favor- able circumstances. I recognize that the committee is wearied with long sittings and much argument, but I feel that it is my duty to speak of this important industry in my district, and to call the attention of the committee in a few remarks which I have prepared, and which, on account of the lateness of the hour, I will submit to be printed. The city of Grand Eapids is now leading the manufacturers of the world in point of its industry in furniture. These manufacturers are taxed, instead of protected, by the duty levied upon the materials which they are necessarily obliged to import. They wish to have this removed, particularly upon burlaps and German glass, all of which they are com- pelled to import. Other materials are extensively used in this industry. It is a perfectly projjer request to make of the committee and of this Congress. I have secured statistics of this industry, and I find that they pay on an average 30 per cent to labor for every dollar of product that goes to market. While the other industries are protected to the extent of 22 per cent, these industries have to pay a tax. I have pre- pared these figures, which I think are of interest uijon this subject, and, owing to the fact that the committee is pressed for time, I will submit them to be printed. In behalf of the manufacturers of furniture in the cities of Grand Eapids, Holland, and other places in the Fifth district of Michigan, and at their request, I appear before you. The city of Grand Eapids now has a population of 100,000. It is a great railroad center, situated on Grand Eiver, the distance by whicli river to Lake Michigan is about 40 miles. Grand Eapids is an impor- tant manufacturing town, having over 1,000 factories employing an aggregate of 15,000 hands. The output of these factories approximates $12,000,000 per annum. The wages paid amount to nearly $5,000,000 yearly. The principal industry is the manufacture of furniture. So exten- sively is this industry carri(}d ou that Grand Eapids has become the first city in the world for the production of furniture. The wages paid in this industry average 37 per cent of the value of the total i>roduct, which is greatly in excess of the general average, which, for 1880, was but 17 per cent. I would be pleased to give the general average for 1890, but the aggregate value of manufactures and the aggregate of 224 EARTHENWARE. wages paid therefor have not yet been tabulated by the Censiis Depart- ment, bat for some of the leading indiistries the wages paid show tbe proportion to the value of the products as follows : l.'he average for all branches of woolen goods is 22.7 per cent. The average labor cost for all silk products is 21 per cent; for chemicals is 20 per cent only; for the products of Cotton factories labor was paid 26 per cent; for combined textiles, 24 per cent. The value of the products of all the various factories as shown by a preliminary table, prepared by the Census Bureau at my request for 1890, was $6,259,954,579; wages paid, $1,553,858,962, equal to 24.8 per cent. Furniture dealers in Michigan sell their goods chiefly in this country, but they have some trade in all parts of the world, and desire more. In the matter of tariff they are handicapiied instead of being protected. They ask an even show with the producers the world over. They And the tariff on looking-glass plates and burlaps a grievous tax. They desire that burlaps and German looking-glass plates be placed upon the free list, and the rates upon French plates greatly reduced. German looking-glass plates are imported into this country, both beveled and plain. It is a kind and quality of glass not made in the United States. It is a blown glass and the bevel is ground on it with wheels after it has been flattened and polished. I have here a sample marked " I." Upon this glass there is charged a duty of 6 cents a square foot on size 16 by 24 and under, making the duty equal to 16 cents a plate of that size. Above 16 by 24, and not exceeding 24 by 30, or 5 square feet, 10 cents per square foot, equal to 50 cents a plate; above 24 by 30, but not exceeding 24 by 60, or 10 square feet, 35 cents per square foot, equal to $3.50 per plate; all above the 24 by 60 size, 60 cents per square foot. When the McKinley tariff law went into effect, the custom ofQcials levied an additional ad valorem duty of 10 per cent, but by special deci- sion of the Treasury Department the ad valorem duty was remitted from German looking-glass plates. The standard sizes used by furniture manufacturers are plates 24 by 30, 18 by 40, 18 by 36, and 20 by 24. Other sizes are also used some- what. The average tax per plate as used approximates 60 cents each for the more common sizes, and upwards of $3 for the large sizes. All of the German plates are im]3orted. The principal places of pro- duction are in and near Fuerth, Bavaria, and at Amsterdam, Holland. This sample, marked "II," is called " French looking-glass plate," and is imported in small quantities, beveled and silvered. Uiion plates of this kind the specific duty is respectively 5, 8, 25, and 50 cents; if silvered, it is higher, and an additional 10 per cent ad valorem duty is charged if the glass is beveled, so that imports are of the plain glass, then silvered and beveled for market in this country. This quality of glass for silvering is principally made abroad. Considerable American plate glass is also being used, but it does not compare with the foreign product. About 35 per cent of the mirrors now used are of American glass, the balance — 65 per cent — being imported. Factories making the finer grades of furniture prefer to use only the imported glass. The principal place of production of American plate glass is in and about Pittsburg. The Creighton factories turn out the best. Some plate glass is also made at the Depauw plate glass ^voiks at jSTew Albany, Ind., and also at Kokomo, Ind., but the quality is not good enough for silvering. The duty upon the French plates is so high as to prevent importing in silvered glass in sizes above 5 square feet, and even these sizes can GERMAN MIREOR PLATES. 225 not be imported to advantage. The so-called French plate is a oast glass and the beveling is usually put on by hand, although lately wheels have been somewhat used, but by the use of wheels a perfectly fiat bevel is not produced, but ratlier a hollow bevel similar to that seen on the German looking-glass plates. The average duty paid, as shoAvn by the report of commerce and navigation for the year ending June 30, 1892, on actual imports, was equal to 51.2 per cent of the value of the imports of plate glass unfin- ished and unsilvered, thus increasing by over one-half the cost of one of the principal materials used in the manufacture of furniture. I have not been able to procure from the Census Bureau data by which to determine the value of looking-glass plates produced in this covrntry and the wages paid; solamunableto state the proportion of the wages to the valueof theprodrict. I will furnish the committee with the figures as soon as I can procure them. The production of plate glass, as shown by the census of 1880, was equal to 13 per cent of the total glass product of America, and the wages paid for the entire American glass product was, for that year, 42 per cent of the value of the output. This sample, marked " III," is commonly known as French sheet glass. It is a piece of blown glass, such as is used for cars, coaches, and window glass, and is much used by furniture manufacturers in their cabinet work. It is imported clear, as shown in the sample. Upon shipments of this glass, containing the average sizes used, a duty of 12-1 per cent is paid, and on sizes 26 by 28 to 30 by 30 the duty is as high as 188 per cent. This glass comes in competition with American glass, but the duty is manifestly too high when the labor cost is but 42 per cent of the value of the product. Here is a small sample of burlap such as is chiefly used by furniture manufacturers for wrapping and packing their manufactures. The price is from 3|- to 5 cents per yard. The duty averages about 30 per cent upon the value of the goods imported. The jute is grown in India. An inferior quality of burlap is made in Calcutta, but the principal product used in the United States is made in Dundee, Scotland. These goods are not made in the United States, so that a tax upon them is a tax upon a leading industry of our country, that pays the producers in wages a much larger proportion of the value of the goods made than does the average of manufactures that are in reality pro- tected. Our manufacturers ask that German plate glass and burlaps be placed upon the free list and that the tax be greatly reduced upon French looking-glass plates and French sheet glass. Mr. Payne. The furniture people want a tariff on their production? Mr. EiOHABDSON. I would not come here to pray for that. Mr. Payne. Are you aware that the United States census report counts labor in the various stages of manufactured Mr. EiCHAEDSON. I understand that fully. Mr. Payne. Do you know that while the census returns take in all the labor, only in one instance do they count the raw material? Mr. EiOHARDSON. They count it every time it is used. Mr. Payne. Labor is only counted once. The labor, for instance, of making a yard of goods is counted once in the factory where the cloth is made. It is counted next in making the cloth, and it is counted as cloth and as clothing, so that the percentage of labor is not counted accurately at all. Mr. EiCHAKDSON. I understand that to be so. If we pay 18 per cent for labor to make a yard of cloth, and I pay 18 cents for weaving that yard of cloth, and then we pay 18 per cent on the manufacture T H 15 226 EARTHENWARE. of clotliing, so tlie value of the clotliing already made will be so great that the wages paid to the man in the wool clothing and the making of the clothing would not be more than a relative proportion to tlie same product. If 20 per cent is paid for the making, and 20 per cent is paid on the cloth, 20 per cent on the clothing, each is taken into con- sideration. Mr. Payne. Is that the proposition on which yon build your theory ! Mr. EiGHAEDSON. Yes, sir; and I propose to defend it. Mr. Payne. I wanted to know on what you built your theory. Mr. EiCHABDSON. Yes ; that is it. Mr. Payne. Do you know that burlaps is a large industry in the United States? Mr. Richardson. Not of the class used at these manufactories. They are all imported. Mr. Payne. The making of burlaps is a large industry in this coun- try. Mr. EicHARDSON. Somewhat. Mr. Payne. I suppose that any tariff bill admitting part of them free and putting a duty on the other part would be impossible to enforce? Mr. Eeyan. They would get a rebate, like the salt on fish. Mr. EiOHARDSON. I do not think the manufactured burlaps in this country is very satisfactory. I will present all this in a paper from the Census Bureau, which I will submit. 1'IjATE GIjASS. (Paragraph 115.) The Metropolitan Plate Glass Insurance Company of Nevf York, New York City, September 2.3, 1893. Sir: I beg to submit a crude abstract of my views relating to the production of plate glass, now almost solely manufactured in this coun- try, on account, as I may say, of a prohibitory tariif, which was pre- , sented to my board of directors at their annual meeting last January. The cost of plate glass holds about the same, showing a little weak- ness in i^rice, whicli is now almost wholly produced in this country. Under the old tarifl'law the duties averaged from 120 to 160 per cent on its importation, which allowed importers to send their material to this country in competition with our prodltcers, affording them only a small margin of profit. The subNe(iuent modification of tlie tariff l;i« s made the importation from England, France, Germany, and other places in Europe prohibitory; that is to say, it cut off' foreign importation as a general commodity to this country. With a duty now of about 160 per cent we would naturally supjiose that the consumer would, through our own production, receive a sub- stantial benefit; but this condition of affairs is not realized by tliem, as the old prices are well maintained under a duty of at least 160 per cent as before relerred to, by our manufacture I's, through a thorough com- bination of the different plants in this country. In 1act there is now ' one of the largest, located in Pennsylvania, owned and controlled exclusively by English capitalists, as well as having mostly foreign employes. PLATE GLASS. 227 A rumor is iio-sv rife, while writing, that the manufacturers are now encoaragiug a combination with some of the wholesale dealers in this city for the sale of this vitreous article still further to increase its price, thereby creating a double monopoly in the production and sale of jjlate glass; therefore is it not well that some protection should be extended to the consumer by a modiiication of the tariff laws? While I favor a reasonable encouragement to our home industries, at a fair cost to the consumer, and the encouragement of our own artisans, I do not think it ecjuitable or beneflcial that a revenue should be so imposed as to create monopolists, or any act that will have a tendency to bring foreign workers to this country to supplant our own country- men in the cost of producing or manufacturing articles or wares that are marketable. In short, a reciprocity in trade, I believe, would lessen the cost of the necessaries of life and give at least the producers of the soil a more staple and profitable market for their products. I have attemx^ted to show in this digression that the cost of i)late glass is too onerous, in my judgment, on the consumer. I will add that there is no superior material known than is at hand of the manufacturers at their works for the production of i^late glass. With foreign experts or workmen, lean safely state, that it is equal to any manufactured in any country, and has always commanded about the same price. I am strongly of the opinion that a reduction from the present rates of 25 to 30 per cent upon this article of merchandise would give our manufacturers a fair profit for their productions in competition with foreign producers or importers. Yours, truly, H. Harteaxj, President, Wednesday, Sejytem'ber 13, 1893. STATEMENT OF MS. ETHAN A. HITCHCOCK OF ST. lOTJIS, MO, Mr. ClIAIEMAN AND GrENTLBMEN OF THE COMMITTEE: I simply desire to read and file the following statement: Washington, D. C, September IS, 1893. Plon. W. L. Wilson, Chairman, and members of the Ways and Means Committee: Mr. Chairman and Oentlb.mkn: I neither intend nor desire to weary or worry you on the suject of plate gliiss, but have asked for the hearing so liiiidly granted simply becanse absence or silence on the part of its represeuta lives might be con- strued as indilforouce on tlieir part and thus lead to such action of the committee as would greatly jeopardize, if not destroy, an interest which, by judicious tarififlegis- lation, has reached gigantic proportions. We ask yon on behalf of this interest, as well as the labor interests so closely identified with us, not to disturl) the existing rates of duty on plate glass, and we justify the request by asserting that we have already aocomplislied what you would seek to secure by reducing rates, viz, lower prices to the consumer, whicli prices are to-day less than one-half what they were ten years ago, while no change or reduc- tion whatever has been made in either the tariif or in the rates paid for labor done by our employes. The explanation is simple enough, and easily stated: The success of former years induced and resulted iu the establishment of such an additional number of plants as to increase the output, and consoiiueiit coniiictition, to an extent that compelled manufacturers to resort tn and adopt every available improvement iu machinery suitable for their business; to reduce the cost of steam power by expensive condensing apparatus ; to invent and put in operation automatic appliances for handling raw and waste material; to substitute and utilize certain 228 EARTHENWARE. kinds of tlie latter ill place of tbo former ; and Anally to obtain the raw and mann- faotured materials used by them at iigures which can not be further reduced, while, of course, steadily increasing output has further tended to reduce the selling price. In this way has" the American manufacturer reduced cost and given the consumer the benefit of the result, as is shown by the decline in prices above referred to, until there now remains but one direction in which cost can be further reduced, and that is by a reduction of wages, which, during the existence of the present tariff have not been disturbed nor varied, but which must feel the full effect of any blow you strilre against this industry, all other means for reducing cost having been exhausted. This is the one point I wish to emphasize, and shall be pleased to supplement and further explain the statement I have made by answering any questions, or by giving such details as will the better enable you to understand and appreciate the present situation of the plate-glass industry. I am, your obedient servant, E. A. Hitchcock, President. For The Crystal Plate Glass Cojipany. That, Mr. CTiairman, is all we liaA^e to say for the momeut, but I shall be very glad to explain to any member of the committee the present situation in respect to the number of plants, where located, etc. The Chairman. We will be glad to hear you in regard to the nunr- ber of plants, where located, where you get your raw materials from, wages of labor, and things of that sort. Mr. Hitchcock. There are to-day eight corporations in the United States, operating twelve plants. These plants arelocated, four in Indiana, seven in Pennsylvania, and one in Missouri. The capacity of these plants to-day will represent 18,000,000 feet of plate glass. The labor employedin these plants is from various countries, principally now, however, from America. The material used, with the single exception of soda ash, is all manufactured in this country, and I am glad to say there is now building in this country a large soda-ash plant, which all the plate- glass makers, as well as other users of soda ash, hope will be a success, because we desire to see all of our industries built up. Mr. Daizell. Where is that? Mr. Hitchcock. In Michigan. Mr. Gear. Do not you get a large amount of gypsum from Iowa? Mr. Hitchcock. We get our plaster (which is burnt and ground gypsum), the article which holds the glass on the table, from Iowa, and we get our felt, which polishes the plate glass, from New York, and we get our coal from Illinois and Pennsylvania. Our works were located on the Mississippi Eiver, 30 miles below St. Louis, because of the ex- traordinary deposit of white sand found there, and extending from the river some distance back into the woods. At first there was simply a log cabin there, and the land could be purchased at $5 to $10 an acre, while there is now there a village of 3,000 people and no laud can be bought for less than $100 an acre. With reference to your next ques- tion, viz, the raw materials used and where obtained The Chairman. And the number of hands employed in this industry and the wages. Mr. Hitchcock. The capacity I have stated is 18,000,000 feet. That capacity is made by some 800 pots, and the average men employed to the pot is ten, so that we employ about 8,000 people, and it is fair to estimate one man represents a family of three and a lialf, so that there is directly and indirectly interested in this industry 28,000 to 30,000 people. It provides a livelihood for that number of people. These figures are nothing comi)ared with the number of emi^loyes mentioned here by the iron and steel interests, but to each individual who is em- ployed any action by your committee which Avill affect wages is just as important to our 135,(»00 people as to their 2,000,000 or 3,000,000.' PLATE GLASS. 229 Mr. GrEAE. Ton give employiueut virtually to a lai'ge, nuniber who arc. prepiiriiig tUo raw uiaterial, iu the mines, etc.? Mr. Hitchcock. I wa,s going to refer to that; I have referred only to tlie direct labor. The fact of the matter is, about 85 to 90 i^er cent of the cost of producing plate glas.s is represented by labor directly or indirectly. For instance, our sand has to be quarried, the coal and gypsum has to be mined, and the latter calcined, and all transported from distant points. You are all familiar with the extent to which labor enters in the matter of transportation, so that the total labor cost involved in the manufacture of plate glass is about 85 to 90 per cent. Mr. Stevens. That is on the whole industry? Mr. Hitchcock. Yes, sir; I shall leave with the committee a state- ment of comparative wages paid in Belgium, England, and America at the present time, and you will at once see how largely we are handi- capped in the matter of ^^'ages. This statement represents thirty-six different occupatious, beginning at the first step and ending with the last in the process of manufacture, but it takes only one man in each instance for comparison, and does not represent the whole number of men employed in each position indicated. This statement shows that the American manufacturer is to-day paying 120 per cent more for labor on this one-man basis — that is a man here and a man there — than is paid in England, and 167 per cent more than is paid in Belgium. But the actual pay rolls in each country show that there are a greater number of high-priced men than low-priced men, so that if you take the full pay roll of our works in comparison with a pay roll representing the same work in England you will find a difference in dollars and cents in rates paid amounting to more than 200 per cent, while in Belgium the difference will be nearer 300 per cent. These figures are not guesswork, and are not taken at random. The manager of one of the leading Belgium works was here within ninety days. He visited the American manufacturers and in return for information freely given to him he gave information to us. He gave the cost as to employes, where worked, and what paid. That list on this basis makes a difference, as stated, on the one-man basis, of 167 -per cent. Not only that, the American workman begins to work Monday morning at 6 o'clock and stops at 12 o'clock on Saturday, in order he may go home, attend to his personal and family affairs, and get ready for Sunday. The foreign workman begins on Monday morning at 6 o'clock and he stops the following Snndaj' morning at 6 o'clock, so that, besides the difference in wages' the foreign manufacturer secures a gain in pioduct represented by eighteen hours' extra time per week, namely, from 12 o'clock noon Saturday until 6 o'clock Sunday morning. Eighteen hours multiplied by four weeks in the month makes seventy-two hours. Sev- enty-two hours amounts to seven days of ten hours each and two hours over, and seven days in the montli means 25 per cent more production. Now, if you add the 25 per cent increased production to these compar- ative prices for labor, you will see at once how our labor cost is excess- ive. Take special departments — our founders, who are the men who melt the glass. In Europe that founder turns out 2,600 feet against the American 2,000 feet; there is a difference of over 30 per cent right there. Take the men who cast the glass. The day's work of this gang is forty-eight pots abroad, while in this country a corresponding gang casts twenty pots as a day's work. The Chairman. Why is that? Mr. HiTcnooOK. Simply because in England the manufacturer de- 230 EARTIIENWAEE. mands, and gets, forty-eight pots as a day's work, while in this country custom has established twenty pots as the day's work. Mr. Dalzell. How long does it take them on an average? Mr. HiTOHCOCK. The time required varies with the seasons of the year. The men begin to cast these pots as soon as they can see, which is at 5 or C o'clock in the morning, say in the spring, and by 12 o'clock that whole gang has finished work and gone home. They are paid for that specific service. I will tell you what we pay. The leading man engaged in casting those twenty pots earns $65 a month, and on the other side he gets $44. That is a difference of 47 per cent. That is one of the smallest percentage differences on the statement submitted, but on the other side they get forty-eight pots and we get twenty pots, so that if you take the product with the price paid for labor it makes over 200 per cent in favor of the foreign manufacturer. It puts up that labor item to an enormous figure. There are other differences quite as hurtful to us; for instance, the wages paid the very first man on the list — the man who makes the pot^upon which largely depends the success of glassmaking. If you do not get a good pot it will not stand the fire, and if there are any imperfections in it it breaks quickly and its contents, with the cost of the pot, are lost. Potmakers are paid in England $30 a month, and we pay on this side $100 a month. The per- centage of difference is 233 per cent, and so it goes on down through the list. There are material variations in this list of thirty -six different kinds of occupations in the respective works in the countries named. Ton will note that we pay from 44 to 306 i)er cent higher wages than are paid abroad, the greater part being nearer the higher than the lower percentage — not taking into account the largely-increased product obtained abroad, as I have just explained. I am reliably informed that the Belgian pay roll will average 65 cents i^er day to the man, while in England the average is 83 cents. The average of our pay roll at our works is $1.85; such is the actual difference in the pay rolls here and abroad. I repeat, the only special point we wish to emphasize is that w^e are not making any idle assertions; we are not here to Influence the com- mittee, except to say that we have exhausted all other means of reduc- ing cost. We have reduced cost fully one-half to the consumer, and the next stej) must be in the direction of labor. I may have anticipated some questions which may be asked, but shall be glad to make such further explanations as maybe desired. So far as present rates of duty are concerned, they have existed ever since I have been in the business, some eighteen years. The present rates are not prohibitive, as is shown by the fact that last year, with an actual consiunption of about 15,000,000 feet of plate glass, about 2,500,000 feet were imported and sold in this country from abroad. Now, if the rates were prohibitive, why and how did these 2,500,000 feet get into this country? If these rates are reduced the price of foreign imi^orted glass will be reduced, and just in proportion as that is reduced we must reduce our prices or close our works or get the difference from labor. We do not want any contest with labor. I do not sympathize with the statement made here by Mr. AVharton in respect to pauper labor. I think a statement of that kind, unless explained in some way, should be corrected. The case he mentioned, of Krupp's establishment in Europe, is exceptional. We do not claim pauper labor prevails in Eng- land or on the continent; but it is not fair to take a notable and praise- worthy exception, like Krupp, and cite that, and say there is no mate- rial difference between the labor of this country or in England or in PLATE GLASS. 231 Europe. The fact is that in some of theso factories abroad wimeu are employed at a rate of 30 cents a day, men are employed at less than 70 cents. We can not ask workmen in this conntry to take such wages; we do not want to ask them to take any such wages, because we think we would be doing ourselves as great an injury as we would be doing them. Mr. Payne. Krupp is protected by patent methods of manufactui'- ing? Mr. Hitchcock. I believe so. The Ohaikman. The largest importation of plate glass in 1892 seems to have been two particular sizes— 10 by 24, 24 by 30. Is there any rea- son for thaf^ Mr. Hitchcock. I do not know that there is any special reason, except, perhaps, that those sizes are most largely used for silvering by the manufacturers of furniture. The Chairman. You make all sizes? Mr. Hitchcock. W«? try to make the largest sizes, but, unfortunately, there is much risk involved in its manufacture, and plate glass is a very delicate and difficult thing to handle. Our object is to cast as large plates as possible, and we put the equivalent material for 125 feet in a pot. We cast on a table which will tulcc the whole of it, and as far as possible try to get that plate out and finished without breaking, because the value is more the larger the ])late. After casting on an iron table 12 by 18 feet, the glass is pushed from the table into the kiln and there it remains three or four days to auneal, after which it is drawn from the kilns, placed on racks, and is ready for the next proc- ess — grinding— and after that, and on separate tables, polishing. Each step unavoidably increases the risk, not only the risk to us but risk to the men who handle the glass. The Chairman. Let me ask you on that point. Do the workmen have to stand the defects in that glass? Mr. Hitchcock. ISTot at all. The Chairman. You said something about that? Mr. Hitchcock. We take the whole risk. I suppose you mean imperfections that might be found in the glass 'I The Chairman. 1 mean whether there is any risk thrown upon the workman in the way of pay? Mr. Hitchcock. No, sir; not a bit. If a man demonstrates that he is capable for the position he occupies lie is retained. We have, in fact, had to teach a great many, this being a new ijidustry in this 'country. If he goes on and malces glass of such character that we can not sell it, like any other business corporation we get somebody else to take his place. Besides the risk of breakage and loss by handling the glass so frequently in the course of casting, giinding and j)olishing, seiious loss is sus- tained by having to cut tlic large plates down to smaller sizes because of imperfections, such as " bubbles," " seed," ''ream," "streaks," and plenty of other defects not discernible until the glass is nearly finished, and every time you cut that glass you reduce its value, the fact being that fully 20 to 25 per cent of the glass that ^\'e make is so reduced in size by breakage and cutting for defects as to prevent us getting more than half of its cost, or, in other words, sell at a great sacrifice. The CiiAiR^MAN. That makes the glass 10 by 12 feet. Mr. Hitchcock. You mean feet? The Chairman. You say you try to make each plate 125 sqtrare feet? Mr. Hitckcock. We try to cast as large plates as possible. The larger it is the more valuable it is. 232 EARTHENWARE. These plates, uext taken to the grinding department, where we both grind and smooth it, involving two handlings of the glass, each side having to be treated. The risli is in handling snch large plates, and it results in a great deal of breakage. I think the breakage in tliat de- partment alone averages 10 per cent. Then it is taken to the polishing department, and there a double handling takes place again, and there the risk increases, as by grinding these large plates are reduced one- half in thickness. Again, we have to take the risk of turning it from one side to the other. Then, added to that is the washing, cleaning, packing, etc., so that the 125-foot plate which you take out of the kilns may be reduced to many very small plates by the time it is ready to box and ship. When you take all these contingencies into considera- tion, namely, cutting the glass to match on the tables, breakage in the kilns while annealing, breakage while handling the glass at least twice in each of the several departments, and the loss by cntting for defects, I think I may safely say that the aggregate loss on the product with which you started will fully equal 50 per cent, while of the remaining 50 per cent fully 20 per cent will be in glass under the 10-foot bracket. The Chairman. Where do you sell your glass whicli you make in your works? Mr. Hitchcock. Our particular factory sells its glass in the N"orth, West, and East, but hardly any in the South. Other factories, I believe, have the Southern trade. We sell our glass direct to representatives in Detroit, St. Louis, Chicago, New York, and Philadelphia. We do an exclusively wholesale or jobbing business. The Chairman. Who supplies the market of the Pacific coast? Mr. Hitchcock. That comes from England, I believe, almost entirely. The cost of transportation and the risk of handling glass across the continent is such that we can not get there. The Chairman. Then this importation here is i^robably for the Pacific coast largely ? Mr. Hitchcock. Yes, sir. While I do not say that — Mr. King, how is that? Mr. King. Largely so. Mr. Hitchcock. Largely so on the Pacific coast. The statistics which we have here were obtained from the New York custom-house. In that connection, gentlemen, I would like to state for the benefit of some of the members who may be under the impression that the piresent tariff is equivalent to 150 per cent duty that the average duty on the 2,500,000 feet imported for the twelve months ending July 31, 1893, will average about 50 per cent. Mr. Dalzell. Is not a large proportion of that glass imported brought here to be silvered? Mr. Hitchcock. I think so, and that we can not compete with. The machines make what we call the ordinary glazing quality, such as is perfectly suitable for building purposes, but when you get to silvered glass it has to be as nearly perfect as possible, and the machines being regular and steady in their movement will leave a slip here or a slide there or a little spot that can not be reached by the machine. That work has to be done by hand labor, and tliat hand labor in Europe costs about 30 cents a day and is chiefly done by women. We have no such labor in this country; therefore we do not attempt to secure tliat business. Mr. Burrows. That is the labor of silvering? Mr. HiTCHOOCK. Preparing glass for silvering in bringing it to a higher polish. PLATE GLASS. 233 Mr. Dalzell. As to tlie quality, how does the Americau glass com- pare with the foreign glass'? Mr. HiTCHCOOK. There is no difference iu what we call the ordinary glazing quality. American manufacturers liave frequently puttlieir glass in competition v>ith foreign glass for Government buildings, as well as large private buildings, the samples having been sent without the architect knowing where it came from, simply numbered A, B, C, or D, and it has been accepted on its merits. It was ijut in your State house, Governor Gear, the architect having no knowledge where the sample came from, and the same is true of the custom-house at Memphis, Tenn., and many other Government and State buildings. Mr. Gbak. We had an expert expressly employed to look into that matter. Mr. Hitchcock. It has been used in various places. Mr. BuKEOWS. You have almost exclusively the trade of St. Louis, Kansas City, Memphis, and that section of country? Mr. Hitchcock. Our particular works have not; other works sell at those places as well as we do. We send some glass, of course, to Kan- sas City. Mr. BuEEOWS. Ton stated that the average labor earnings were $1.85 per day. In making your average did you include labor engaged in obtaining the sand and mining coal, etc.? Mr. Hitchcock. That average of $1.85 includes all wages at our works. It does not include, for instance, any ofBce expenses, such as my salary or the ofBce employ 6s of the company, who are not on the pay roll but are paid by separate voucher. Mr. BuEEOWS. It does not include miners and sand diggers? Mr. Hitchcock. It does not include the coal miner, but it does the man who digs the sand, because our own sand is found immediately at our works, and the men who mine it are on the pay roll of the works. The coal we use is mined in Illinois and the miners' wages, of course, are paid there and not at our works. Mr. TUENEE. Have you made an estimate of the percentage of cost on the other side as to production? Mr. Hitchcock. We have not, except that I understand Mr. TuENEE. You only arrive at it by the relative difference iu the cost of labor. I did not know but you may have made an actual com- putation. Mr. Hitchcock. We have figures which give the actual cost of labor per foot of glass made on the other side, and we know these figures are reliable, as they were furnished by one of the leading manufacturers in Europe within the last ninety days. The labor per foot of glass in England has been reduced 25 per cent in the last ten years. Mr. TuENEE. You mean the prices i^aid? Mr. Hitchcock. The labor on the product; they have reduced it 26 per cent. The Chaieman. They still pay higher wages than France? Mr. Hitchcock. Yes, sir; they do. It is the difference between 120 and 167. Now, these figures are not guesswork and are not of long date. They are absolutely recent and absolutely correct. They are made from the actual pay roll of operated works at the present time. Mr. TuENEE. Do you represent all lines of glass? Mr. Hitchcock. No, sir; we have nothing to do with anything but plate glass. Mr. TuEWEE. Do you know anything about the other qualities? Mr. Hitchcock. Except in a very general way. 234 EARTHENWARE. Mr. Turner. Do you know anj-thing a\)Out the common window glass? Mr. Hitchcock. I do not. We have never made it, and therefore I do not feel justified in speaking in regard to it. Mr. Taesney. How many men do you employ directly and con- stantly at your works'? Mr. Hitchcock. In the works proper we have on the pay roll be- tween 600 and 700 men, and in our coal property, which we also oper- ate, we have 200 or 300 more. Mr. Stevens. Is there any combination among your labor? Mr. Hitchcock. If there is, we do not know it. Mr. Stevens. Do they regulate the price of your labor'? Mr. Hitchcock. No, tbey do not. Mr. Dalzell. They regulate, however, the number of pots that shall constitute a day's work? Mr. Hitchcock. Custom has done that. I recognize the right of labor to organize; there is no question about that; but I will not allow employes to manage the business I am paid to manage, and so long as they do not attemjit to dictate to us in the management of that busi- ness — in other words, interfere with my xesjionsibilities to our stock- holders, I ask no questions. .Mr. Stevens. Have they unions abroad? Mr. Hitchcock. Tes, sir. Mr. Stevens. They regulate it in the same way as they do here? Mr. Hitchcock. I am not sure, but they somehow or other control them over there much more effectively than here. iMr. Turner. Is there any combination between the manufacturers in this trade? Mr. Hitchcock. Not that I know anything about. We are in no way connected with any such combination. Mr. Burrows. What would be the effect of materially lessening the duty on plate glass ? Mr. Hitchcock. In what respect? Mr. Burrows. Upon your industry. Mr. Hitchcock. I think before you came in I said we simply would have to reduce wages on the same pro-rata basis. Mr. Burrows. Or else shut up business? Mr. Hitchcock. Yes, sir. Mr. Burrows. You stated the amount of capital invested in this industry was how much? Mr. Hitchcock. The capital invested in this industry is about $12,000,000. Mr. Burrows. And how many employes? Mr. Hitchcock. Eight thousand directly, with some three and a half to the family, which would made some 28,000 or 30,000 that are directly and indirectly interested in this industry. Mr. Burrows. And dependent upon it? Mr. Hitchcock. Yes, sir. I would like to ask a question myself, and that is, whether any member of the committee can tell me if any demand lias been made by any individual, or consumer, or community of consumers, for a reduction in the duty on plate glass ? If there has been I should be glad to know it, for I thiiilc, as far as I can learn, the consumers are entirely satisfied with what Ave have done and will try to do, if we can go on as in the past. We have not heard of any demand or inquiry on the part of any consumer for a reduction. Mr. Dalzell. I understand these duties have been substantially the same ever since the tariff was j)ut onl PLATE GLASS. 235 Mr. Hitchcock. Tes, sir; that is, since 1862, or for thirty- one years. Mr. Payne. There was no change made in the Mills biU? Mr. Hitchcock. No change whatever. Mr. Dalzell. Except a consolidation of two sizes'? Mr. Hitchcock. Yes. Mr. Payne. How many factories were in existence in 1881 — when was this industry first established? Mr. Hitchcock. It was first established about 1869, by Mr. Depauw, of New Albany, who lost some several hundred thousand dollars and started u]) again, and then the next was ours, and then the others dur- ing the last four or five years. Mr. Payne. When was yours established? Mr. Hitchcock. In 1875; STATEMENT OF MR. E, FOED, PEESIDENT OF THE PITTSBTOG PLATE-GLASS COM- PANY OF PITTSBUEG, PA. Mr. E. Ford next addressed the committee. He said : Mr. Chaieman and Gentlemen op the Committee: Mr. Hitch- cock has covered this subject so thoroughly that I have nothing to say, and I will not take up the time of the committee. I have no remarks to make. Comparative atatcment sTimving rate? of wages paid per month in Belgian, English, and American plate-glass works for similar sei-vices. Occupation. Belgian. English. American. American higlier than Belgian. American higher thaB English. $27. 00 14.82 14.82 25.60 30.00 26.50 34.00 28.00 25. 68 18.60 20.00 50.00 30.00 21.30 $30. 00 8.00 22.00 24.00 44.00 34.00 48.00 44.00 33.00 30.00 32.50 65.00 32.60 30.00 29.00 26.00 24.00 26.00 22.00 20.00 11.50 30.00 35. CO 65.00 35.00 31.00 26.00 33. 00 26.00 24.00 76.00 33.00 29.50 29.50 29.50 20. 00 $100. 00 32.50 39.00 39.00 100. 00 52.00 100. 00 65.00 47.00 68.60 76.00 100.00 80.00 62.00 52.00 44.00 44.00 80.00 52.00 39.00 39.00 65.00 80.00 100. 00 80.00 90.00 65.00 80.00 60.00 35.00 100. 00 65.00 52.00 60.00 89.00 30.00 Per cent. 270 119 103 52 233 96 194 132 83 214 275 100 166 191 Per cent. 233 300 77 62 127 53 108 47 42 95 134 53 Grinders : 130 106 78 69 18.30 22.25 14.82 14.82 9.88 21.22 19.76 34.00 28.00 21.30 18.30 13.00 25.00 27. 00 50. 00 22.10 23. 40 32.00 20.80 15.00 140 259 250 163 293 206 304 194 184 322 249 515 140 29 100 194 122 87 828 100 83 207 136 50 339 116 128 53 Pulishers: 128 190 150 142 130 45 31 97 76 103 201 50 *English employ female labor. tEuropeau average, 2,600 feet per dayi American, 2,000 feot. JEnglish, 48 pots; American, 20 pots per day. 236 EARTHENWARE. IjENSBS. (Pttragrapli 120.) T. A. WiLLSON & Co., Beading, Pa., September 21, 1893. Dear Sir : We desire to caU attention to the item in the "McKinley bill" putting a duty of 60 per cent on lenses costing $1.50 or less, per gross pairs. The lenses in question are all made in France and Germany; are largely, or very largely used by us, and to some extent by other manu- facturers. The other lenses we use are bought of American manufac- turers, but as the cheapest lenses listed by American makers is $3.-!5 per gross pairs, it would be no discrimination against lense manufac- turers to admit lenses costing |1 or less per gross pairs free of duty, as they do not comx^ete with the American lenses, and it would enable us to successfully compete on finished cheap spectacles against French and German manufacturers. As it is now, Ave pay on these cheap lenses 60 per cent duty, with no beueiit to American lense manufacturers, but a decided drawback to American spectacle manufacturers. Instead of protecting the American manufacturer, it is virtually a jirotection to the French and German spectacle manufacturers. Yours, respectfully, T. A. WiLLSON & Go. MAEBLE. (Paragraph, 128, 124.) STATEMENT OF MB. E. E. MORSE, TREASURER OF THE VERMONT MARBLE COMPANY. Saturday, September 16, 1893. Mr. Chairman: We have prepared a very brief statement in re- gard to the marble industry and the present effect of the tariff upon it. To the CommiUee on Ways and Means: By the tariff of 1883 the rate waa reduced oil all classes of marble — very greatly on sawed marble — and -was mademore specific than before. We believe that this change has greatly lessened the frauds and been more satisfactory, to the American producer and the honest importer. The McKinley act made no change in the rate on any class of marble. There was a slight change of wording in regard to the measurement of marble of less than 1 inch in thickness, made to prevent frauds. That, gentlemen, was this. The act of 1883 was based on cubic measure. Now, to introduce this marble Italian importers, the rule being twelve slabs to the foot, rubbed down their marble so thin they could put in from sixteen to eighteen slabs to the foot, which enabled them to bring in that much more. The present tariff on marble ought not to be reduced for the following reasons : First. Marble is a proper commodity on which to raise revenue. It is never a necessity. All foreign marbles may properly be classed among luxu- ries. The present duty operates to tax the wealthier consumer who buys expensive ornamental marble, while the buyer of the grades of marble in common use gets them at a lower price by reason of the tariff. People of moderate means use little marble except for cemetery purposes, but use a great amount there, and they now use, and will continue to use, American marble almost exclusively, whether the duty is hiijli or low, because it is bettor for out- door use, and that mainly used in ceiiietoi-ies is cheaper than any foreign marble would be even if admitted free. The cheaper grades of Americau marbles are so mixed with the finer in the same ijuarries that they must be produced together, and MARBLE. 237 the more of tlie finer tliat is produced the more of the medium grades must be, and, of course, the lower their price. Cemetery marble is cheaper than it would be if duties were reduced, because no foreign marble competes or could, if free of duty, compete with it in price or quality for that use, but it is produced from the same quarries which produce higher-priced ornamental marble, with which foreign marble does compete. Hence anything which reduces the nrice or quantity produced of this higher-priced marble will reduce the quantity produced and increase the cost of the cheaper grades. The marble in ordinary use for cemetery purposes could not be produced by itself alone for the price at which it is now sold. It is the production of the higher grade of ornamental marbles from the same quarries competing with the foreign that admits of the production of the cheaper cemetery marble at all. Take tlie Eutlaiid marble as the basis. The price of that marble de- pends upon the excellence of the marble. That is to say, marble that is white commands the highest price. Then it is graded down accord- ing to the excellence of it. Sutherland Falls marble is priced upon the fineness and whether it is true blue or mountain dark marble, etc. In the marble quarry we find marble in layers like this dipping to a given angle. We strike first, say, a piece of statuary marble, next a layer with a little more color, and so it varies throughout the quarry. We have very many difterent layers. Then always in the same block we get out a certain amount of white marble and, perhaps, a light quantity of colored marble, and the colored marble is precisely as good marble as the white, but custom and taste has decreed that the one shall com- mand the higher price th4n the other. Mr. Bkyan. Where do you find blue marble ? Mr. Morse. In the same deposit with the white. Mr. Bryan. Everywhere? Mr. Morse. I am only speaking of Vermont quarries, but there are certain quarries which produce nothing but blue marble, and others produce both blue and white, and in the same block, sometimes you will find what we call Rutland Italian in the same layer with what we call blue, only separated from each other a short distance. This country uses more marble than all the rest of the world combined. The total Italian output is about 2,000,000 cubic feet, of which this country imports and consumes more than one-fifth, which is more than the total consumption of any other country. Besides, we consume nearly all of our own production of over 3,000,U00 cubic feet, which is in itself more than the entire foreign production, so that this country nses,according to the best estimate we can make, at least 60 per cent of the entire marble product of the world and six times as much as any other nation. This is because people of limited means use it so generally for cemetery purposes. Any action, then, which restricts the production of this class of marble or enhances its price is clearly against the interests of the people. So far as its superior fitness for cemetery or any outdoor work is concerned it is . sufiicient to cite the well-known fact that twenty years ago a large amount of Ital- ian marble was used in cemeteries and now it has practically gone out of use in this country for that purpose. Second. The present duty does not restrict trade. The statistics show that the changes in the rate of duty have not afi:ected importations. This confirms the point tliat foreign marble is always a luxury, bought by those who are able to buy, and what is wanted will be bought regardless of price. Importations are increasing under the present tariff quite rapidly, as will be seen by the following statement : Total value of marile and manufactures of marhle imported. For year ending July 30— Value. Kemarks. 1888 $541, 542. 89 672, 613. 10 703, 706. 50 822, 209. 79 910, 839. 25 1,101,560.00 1889 Increase of nearly 6 per cent. 1890 1891 Increa^se of nearly 8 per cent. 1892 . - - . Increase ol U per cent. 1893 Increase of over 27 per cent. 238 EARTHENWARE. In the last five years the total importations have doubled in Talno and increased about 70 per cent in quantity, and the importation of manufactured marble has in- creased nearly threefold in the same time. The fluctuation in the rate of increase is apparent rather than real. The larger importations may happen to arrive in certain years, while the increase in the rate of consumption is not greatly irregular. Tlie production and use of American marble has also steadily increased, and some- what more rapidly than of imported marble. According to the census the total value of the marble product of the United States in 1880 was a little over $2,000,000. In 1889 it was nearly $3,500,000. In that time the production in Tennessee was more than doubled ; that of New York increased more than 50 per cent. Georgia's production in 1889 was nearly $200,000 ; that of California $100,000. The production in both those States is doubtless much larger now, although none was produced in either of them in 1880. These figures show, both for the home production and the importation, a healthy state of business, to disturb which would be unwise, and would benefit nobody but the Italian producer and the comparatively small interest engaged in the importation, sawiiig, and sale of Italian marble ; and this benefit would be at the expense of the revenue, the Amer- ican producer, consumer, and laborer — several times as many as are engaged in this country in handling the foreign product. We believe that the rates on marble should be, so far as practicable, specific, and we' understand that the importers also favor the specific principle. (See page 1650, Vol. II, of the "Report of the Tariff Commission, 1882," where a committee repre- senting the importers of marble in the block asked that on that class of marble the tariff might be changed from a " compound" rate to one entirely "specific." Also see Vol. I of the same report, page 666, where a like request was made by another committee representing the Boston importers. See also several briefs submitted be- fore the Committee of Ways and Means by the ijnporting interest.) The estimate made by the tariff reform committee of tlie Reform Club, if the rate on marble was reduced, as they recommend, to an ad valorem rate of 20 per cent, is that the importations would be increased nearly 50 per cent and the customs receipts reduced about 40 per cent. That is due almost entirely to the fact that Italian marble is used in interior work. The Chairman. Marble is used for walls, etc. 1 Mr. Morse. It has been used for wainscoting in hotels and large buildings. The Chairman. That is, you mean the cheap imported? Mr. Morse. Yes, sir; that is being used to a certain .extent. Mr. Turner. How is it that the American people use so much more marble; because they use it more for cemetery purposes'? Mr. Morse. Put that question again? Mr. Turner. Is it due to the larger use of marble in this country for monuments, for cemetery i)urposes'? Mr. Morse. I think so, and I think it is also true that they are using . now a large amount of marble for the interior finish of buildings, wains- coting, mantels, and that sort of things where ten or twelve years ago there was very little used. Third. The production of American marble is of far greater importance as an in- dustry than the importing interest. As already shown, the value of the American product is more than three times the total value of importations. The expense according to the census of producinn- the three and one-half millions in value of American marble in 1889 was $2,675,000 exclusive of interest, exhaustion of quarries, and wear and tear on plant. It thus apijears that the proiit is very small and will not bear sharper competition than it now has. Of this expense over two-thirds was for labor direct, and about one- fourth for supplies and material. This latter item being mainly for machinery and iron, and steel, it is certain that over 90 per cent of the expense in the production of marble is for labor. These figures of the census a,£cree with the evidence before the Tariff Commission (see Report of the Tariff Commission, Vol. II, p. 1553.) The number of men employed in such work as is done at the quarries is given in the census as 4,529 and capital invested over fifteen millions, but this estimate of men is too low. MARBLE. 239 Fourtli. Tbere ia no occa,sion to go abroad for marblo for there are in the United. States, developed or undeveloped, deposits of marble of all known varieties and suitable for every purpose for which marble is used, and in quantity sufaciet to last for all time. Marble is abundant in .ill the Slates along the Blue Eidge range, from the Gulf of Mexico to the Canada line, viz: Alabama, Georgia, Tennessee, North Carolina, Virginia, Maryland, Pennsylvania, New York, Connecticut, Massachusetts, and Ver- mont. It is .also found in Missouri, Colorado, Iderhaps, what you refer to was a selling asso- ciation, which was in force from 1883 to 1887, when it dissolved, known as the Producers' Marble Company. Mr. Bryan. Did they fix the price? Mr. Morse. Competition fixed the price, because they did not con- trol anywhere near the product. Mr. Bryan. It was an unsuccessful effort to control the product? Mr. Morse. There was an effort made to reduce the cost of selling by doing away — each individual concern had a branch in different cities, and it was to do away with this and reduce the cost of selling. Mr. Bryan. You stated the present duty does not compensate, on any class of marble, for the difference in cost of labor in this country and Italy, and on our manufactured marble it falls far short. If the tariff is not equal to the difference in the cost of labor, how is it you are able to compete with those people? Mr. Morse. Just let me see if I understand that; because we claim we have got superior marble for cemetery purposes. Mr. Bryan. Then it sells for more than the foreign marble, and in getting higher prices you are able to pay more for producing? Mr. Morse. It does not sell for more. Take Eutland marble as a sample, and the price is graded by color, as I stated. Now, unques- tionably, we would go down some if the tariff was off. The white marble would probably go down some with the tariff off, and that would affect us because we produce a liirge amount of marble which we sell at even less than it costs to produce it This fact can not be disi^uted, for the reason it lies in the quarries certain ways. Mr. Bryan. Your statement here that the present duty does not equal the cost of the labor would lead us to infer you could not produce tbis marble in this country in competition with foreign marble because of the greater expense? MARBLE. 241 Mr. Morse. There are perhaps some reasons in connection with the fact that our quarries lie entirely different from the Italian quarries. We use certain kinds of machinery and they use none. Mr. Bryan. Then while you pay more in wages your labor has more efficiency here because of improved machinery. Mr. Morse. I do not know that you can say our labor has any more efficiency, but I presume we produce a little cheaper than they do. ■ Mr. Bryan. Then a block of marble, say a cubic foot, would be pro- duced in this country for a small ]price Mr. Morse. No; oh, no, sir. I do not mean that. I did not mean to make that statement, but I think it helps to compensate for the dif- ference in price. Mr. Payne. The machinery does? Mr. Morse. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Then one man with machinery in this country can do more than one man without machinery abroad. Mr. Morse. Certainly ; there is no question about that. Mr. Bryan. That enables you to produce the article at a less cost than it is produced over there? Mr. Morse. Now, as to that, I can not tell you, sir, but Mr. Gilson can. He has been a large producer of American marble, and has made a careful study of Italian marble, and he is here and will be glad to answer all questions. Mr. Bryan. You have made no comparison as to the cost of produc- ing marble here and abroad "? Mr. Morse. No, sir. Mr. Bryan. Simply the difference in wages'? Mr. Morse. Exactly. Now, if you care to go into the question of Italian quarries and the cost of labor there, Mr. Gilson will be glad to tell you anything he may know of his own personal knowledge. STATEMENT OF MR. E. P. GILSON, OF EUTIAND, VT. Mr. Chairman and G-entlemen : I suppose from the call you desire to know something about the conditions or difference of condi- tions between the Italian quarries and those in Vermont. Do I under- stand it rightly? Mr. Bryan. I desire to ask you a question, and the only reason I ask it is this : It seems to me that there can be no intelligent fixing of a tariff in order to compensate any greater cost of production in this country, unless we know what the cost of production is there, and that the wages paid are not material, but the cost of the finished article, and none of the witnesses seem to have paid any attention to the cost of of the article, but simply compared wages here and abroad. Mr. Payne. It would be difficult to demonstrate what it would be if the wages are immaterial in the demonstration. There coiild be no revision of the tariff whatever if the cost of wages is immaterial. Mr. Gilson. I can simply state, sir, while in Carrara in the winter of 1883-'84, and "being intimate with the largest producers of Italian marble and exporters to the United States, and there was a statement of one of these members, made of his own accord, a general statement, and I find I have not the figures here to substantiate it, however, that the present tariff of 65 cents a cubic foot on the block, did not cover the difference in labor between the Italian labor and the labor in Vermont. T H 16 242 EAETHElSrWARE. Mr. Bryan. Ton have this statement? Mr. GiLSON. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Did lie know anything more about the cost in this country than you knew about his country? Mr. GiLSON. He has been here, and has sold a good deal of marble for years in this country, and has been very much interested in the subject. Mr. Bryan. What is the cost in this country of getting out a cubic foot of marble? Mr. GiLSON. It would be very difficult to figure it exactly, because it varies in different conditions in different quarries. In some quarries the cost would be of the whole product $1.25 to $1.30 a cubic foot, but the conditions in the various quarries are very different. Mr. Bryan. In some of the quarries of this country the marble can be produced for much less than others? Mr. GiLSON. I should say it could be. There are quarries where it is not so hard, and they quarry it cheaply, and others where the marble is very much harder, so that it costs an extra expense on account of the hardness of the marble. Mr. Bryan. Can you give any idea of the various costs of produc- tion in this country? Mr. GiLSON. I should think on the average with the facitities that now exist that marble could be produced for at least $1.30 to $1.35 a cubic foot. Mr. Bryan. On the average? Mr. GiLSON. It might. Mr. Bryan. Can it be produced in some quarries for $1 a foot? Mr. GiLSON. Possibly. Mr. Bryan. And in some for less? Mr. GiLSON. I should think not. Mr. Bryan. And in some places it runs even higher than $1.25? Mr. GiLSON. Tes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Do you know what the cost of producing a cubic foot is in Italy? Mr. GiLSON. I only know what we have to pay for blocks that may vary from time to time, but these blocks, I understand, are sold for $1 to $1.25 a foot over there. Mr. Bryan. Then there is the freight on the cubic foot to the market ? Mr. GiLSON. The freight at the time I was in Italy did not vary very much from Carrara to New York than from Vermont to 'New York, and in some of the Western towns it was cheaper from Carrara direct than from Vermont. Mr. Bryan. That was due to the terms given by the railroads? Mr. GiLSON. That was due to the terms given hj the companies on the vessels sometimes. Mr. Bryan. I would like to have the amount of freight on a cubic foot of marble from Italy to New York. ■ Mr. GiLSON. I have not those figures before me now. Mr. Bryan. Could you approximate it ? Mr. GiLSON. No, sir; because I do not have them in mind. We could easily ascertain, however. Mr. Bryan. Would you give your best judgment? I do not mean a comparison, but is it $1, $2, or $5 a cubic foot? Mr. GiLSON. I do not think it Avould be $1 a cubic foot; no, six. Mr. Bryan. Would it be 50 cents? MARBLE. 243 Mr. GiLSON. Theso, rates vary very much, from $2.50 to |4 a ton, dependiug upon, of course, what freight may offer. It might vary in different months in different years. Mr. Bryan. Is not the freight itself qu.ite a mateiial protective tariff? Mr. G-LLSON. No, sir; I do not consider it is when freight from the other countries and from our country to the market is equal. Mr. Bryan. If the rate Mr. GiLSON. And there are places where it costs more to reach the quarries here than over in Carrara. Mr. Bryan. They may have a shipping advantage, but is not the freight from Italy to B'ew York quite a considerable cost of a block of marble when laid down in ISTew York? Mr. GiLSON. No, sir; I would not think so. Mr. Bryan. If you could buy a block for $1 in Italy a cubic foot, and it costs 50 cents to bring it to New York, there is 50 per cent! Mr. GiLSON. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Does it cost that much? Mr. GiLSON. Your blocks cost more than that there. Mr. Bryan. Is not that 50 cents a 50 per cent advantage? Mr. GiLSON. I should take the marble here and not at the quarries in Carrara. Mr. Bryan. Is not distance and the freight a material advantage to the producer here? Mr. GiLSON. That has not been so iu the past. A good deal of this marble was brought here as ballast, and some of it was low, depending upon the demand for these ships. Mr. Bryan. So you can not give any estimate upon the cost? Mr. GiLSON. I can not do it this moment and give the exa«t cost, as it varies so. The quarries in Italy, I might say— I do not want to take up your time— are on the surface of the mountains of Carrara, which are 4,000 or 5,000 feet high. This mass of material has been thrown up there, and the blocks are thrown oft' by powder in large masses. I have seen masses estimated to weigh 150 tons thrown a quarter of a mile with powder ; then men are put on these blocks, and they are broken up and fitted for the market. There is no capital invested, as I was told, in marble property. There is rental paid to the municipal- ity of Carrara for the i)rivilege of working this. The blocks are moved by gravity to the surface below; and in Vermont the quarries are all underground, probably from 100 to 300 feet. The marble has to be gotten out instead of blasted. There is never any powder used in quarrying that marble. In the first place, being uncler a hill or moun- tain in the earth, the material top deposit has to be blasted out — what we call drifting, and that has to be blasted and a channel put in between that and the deposit, so it will not interfere with the deposit or choke it up. That is blasted and opened up this great distance by powder, and that is an item of large expense. Then this deposit is mounted by men and machinery, and the channels put in. Mr. Bryan. Is that true of all quarrying in this country? Mr. GiLSON. That is true of all I know anything about. You put a channel on either side to the end, then you put holes underneath. Mr. Bryan. Then Italy has a natural advantage over us iu finding marble? Mr. GiLSON. Very great. Mr. Bryan. That makes it necessary for us to put a tarift' on to util- ize our marble? 244 EARTHENWARE. Mr. GiLSON. Taking labor into account in Italy and their wages, it seems necessary. Mr. Bryan. And if ihis marble was 200 more feet down it would require still more tariff? Mr. GiLSON. That is a question, of course, what depth — that has been talked of more or less — it would pay to quarry this marble. On the other hand, there is another item. Quarries that generally amount to anything are unsound on the surface, and 20 or 30 feet has to be re- moved ; then it is an experiment. There have been thousauds and thou- sands of dollars — I may say hundreds of thousands — sunk in that way to test the quarry and find nothing, and sometimes they go down below the action of the water and tlie deposit gets sound. Mr. Bryan. Are these quarries you speak of in Yermont owned by private individuals ? Mr. GiLSON. They are, generally. Mr. Bryan. Are they quarried by the owners or do they let them out usually? Mr. GiLSON. They are quarried by the owners. Mr. Bryan. Is the property valuable? Mr. GiLSON. It becomes very valuable as it is developed, if it proves to be good. A great deal of money is used. Mr. Tarsney. What is the railioad rate per cubic foot from New York to the Missouri Eiver? Mr. GiLSON. I would refer that question to Mr. Morse, who is up on that whole business; I have not given it any attention. Mr. Morse. I can tell you the rate from 'Sew York, and I think it is the same from Vermont. I think it is 35 cents a carload and 41 cents less than carload per 100 pounds. That would be about CO cents a cubic foot, as we call 180 pounds a foot. Mr. Tarsney. That thing itself would give protection to the Mis- souri marble produced in that section? Mr. GiLSON. That section ; yes, sir. Mr. Tarsney. And would preclude the use of marble in that section that is only equal to the home product? Mr. MoRSE. Not quite that, compared with Italian, because the marble comes up tlie river from New Orleans, and I can not tell you what the rate is to St. Louis. I am inclined to think it is about the same as to New York. Mr. Tarsney. You only could from that one point. Then it woukl meet the local freight rates greater than the through freight from the seacoast? Mr. Morse. I can not say as to that. Mr. Tarsney. And the result would be in the interior of Missouri Nebraska, and Kansas — that section of country — Italian marble would only be used by those who wanted it simply because it was foreign marble and different from what they had at home? Mr. Morse. It would depend upon what your rates were from the Missouri Eiver to those points. Mr. Bryan. If you improve the Mississippi you can bring up the marble. Mr. Tarsney. Is there any Tennessee or Georgia marble sold in that country ? Mr. Morse. There is quite a large amount of Tennessee marble sold there. Mr. Tarsney. Is it the same quality? MARBLE. ' 245 STATEMENT OF MR, J. J. CEAIG, OF KNOXVILLE, TENN. Mr. Ohaie^sian and Gentlemen op the Committee : I have very , little to say Mr. Tarsney. I would like to have this question answered, if you please, that I asked Mr. Gilson. Is it the same quality and grade of ' the marble produced in Vermont? Mr. Ceaig-. 'No, sir ; it is not. Mr. McMiLLiN. Tennessee marble is a conglomerate that is used extensively for mantels and furniture. They have not used the conglom- erate mantels so much lately and they have not had so much demand for it as they have had. Mr. Craig. I have nothing to say further than what is presented in that petition, having been signed by, I think, nine-tenths of the pro- ducers and manufacturers of Tennessee. But from a producer's stand- poiut, not being a manufacturer or exjiorter or importer, I would state that we think our fellow quarrymeu are entitled to protection on our home resources so long as our products and quality and prices are equal to those of the imported goods. Mr. Bryan. Do you need any protection where the quality and prices are equal? Mr. Craig. We do on account of the price of labor we have to com- pete with. Labor is one of the most serious things. Mr. Bryan. Taking that statement that so long as quality and price are equal to that of the imported goods, you say you deserve protec- tion. Why do you need protection? Mr. Craig. I mean to say, so long as we are protected to the extent we can produce our products here. Mr. Bryan. At the same price with the foreign products? Mr. Craig. At the same price foreign articles are laid down here; but if products are laid down here for less than we can produce, of course we have to stop our operations. Mr. Bryan. Then you want your products protected, so as to raise the price at which foreign products could be laid down here, so you can sell the prodiict at a higher i^rice? Mr. Craig. We claim that a block of marble is not a raw material, from the fact that it is in the ground, a resource, and is worthless unless it is produced, which occupies both capital and labor, the greater per cent being that of labor, not more than 5 or 10 per cent would repre- sent the raw material so called, and the balance of 80 per cent we esti- mate goes on the labor alone. We further claim that the marble indus- try of our country, more especially, is yet in its infancy. American marbles are all over the Western States, but we feel if we meet any encouragement or reasonable protection it will be only a short time that we can produce all the known varieties of mai-ble; and we claim further that our quarries in East Tennessee produce 300,000 to 400,000 cubic feet of stone per annum, and give employment to some 1,200 to 1,500 men, and they represent from 5,000 to 8,000 people who are paid from our pay roll, and our labor costs us about three times that of the Italian labor. The Chairman. How could any foreign imports compete with your product? Mr. Craig. We have to compete with the white marble, the pink marble, and the variegated marble. There is a quite a variety of Ten- nessee marble, yet while the imports of foreign marble have increased 246 EARTHENWARE. at tlie average rate of 17 per cent per annum during tlie past five years our quarry output liave decreased 25 to 30 per cent and many quar- ries have been abandoned. We claim, furthermore, on account of the lay of the stone in Tennessee ^ve are compelled to compete more directly for the Italian labor than some other American stones. We are not able to introduce machinery to the extent that would offset this cheap labor of Italy. The lay of our stone is quite different from that of Ver- mont and that of Georgia. We are on the top of a hill or a slope of the Mil and instead of lifting ours ont we have great difticulty in getting it down hill sometimes, because when we get it down hill we have to get it back and over the hill and then it has to be hauled away by wagon. The transportation is a factor in our country, to reach these quarries. Mr. Bryan. Do you mean to say that in your particular case it costs more to produce marble than it does io Vermont*? Mr. Craig. 1 am not prepared to say as to the cost in Vermont en- tirely, but we can not use powder in our quarries as they do in Italy. Mr. Bryan. Do you know the relative cost of- production in your quarry and in others in this country? Mr. Craig. Our quarries, I will say, sometimes double one month to what it was j)reviousIy. Mr. Bryan. You say your product has fallen off 25 per cent ? Mr. Craig. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. A statement here shows that the total product has in- creased 3,500,000 in five years. Mr. Craig. In Tennessee? Mr. Bryan. In America. Mr. Craig. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Yours has been falling ofti Mr. Craig. Ours have on certain qualities of marble, not on the en- tire output, but on the highly colored marble, which we have to compete with extensively, that has fallen off from 25 to 30 per cent. Mr. Tarsney. What are those used for chiefly? Mr. Craig. Interior decorations. Mr. Tarsney. Is not the falling off on account of the development of the onyx quarries of Missouri and other sections? Mr. Craig. No, sir; manufacturers tell me and my brother quarry- men tell me it does not seem to be a matter of cost that goes into inte- rior decorations. Mr. Tarsney. There has been a large increase in the use of onyx for this purpose? Mr. Craig. I do not think onyx is so popular to-day ; it has not in- creased in the same proportion as the increased importation of foreigu colored marbles. Mr. Bryan. Have you been brought in competition with foreign quarries for this interior decoration ? Mr. Craig. I certainly have. Mr. McMiLLiN. The falling off may be due, in a slight degree at least, to the fact that styles have changed and they have not been used for mantel pieces as they used to, woodwork being more used and tiling. Mr. Craig. Yes, sir; that is a fact. Mr. Tarsney. Fancy woods are being used? Ml-. Craig. Yes, sir; it has very seriously affected the question. But manufacturers Avho used to import and carry large stocks of our marble now import large stocks of foreign and use very little of ours. MARBLE. 247 Mr. Btnxjm. What does it cost to quarry your marble? Mr. Oeaig. That is a very hard question to give an exact answer, sometimes it costs just twice as much as it does at others. Mr. Bykum. M'hat is about tlie average? Mr. Craig. The marble may cost from $1 to $1.25 at the quarry. Mr. McMiLLiN. That is per cubic foot? Mr. Craig. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. What is the price you can buy it for in Italy? Mr. Craig. AVell, sir, 1 am not prei)ared to say what the importers pay for competing stone. I will say, Mr. Chairman, that Col. Hart is here representing the manufactirring industry of our section and I will be glad if you will hear him for a moment. STATEMENT OF ME. J. E. HAST, OF TENNESSEE. Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen of the Committee : I will not take up your time long. I will be brief in wbat I have to say. I represent not only the manufacturers of marble in Tennessee, but also the foreign productions in the way of manufacture. I not only produce marble, but I manufacture it, and 1 know something of both departments. The quarrying of marble has been very unsatisfactory in Tennessee for the last few years ; it has been unprofitable by reason of tlie competition Avith foreign marbles. The use of marble has not diminished in tbis country, it has increased. Tlie use of marble for interior decorations has been growing for years, and is growing rapidly, and the iiroduction of marble in Tennessee is not keeping x>ace Avitli the growth of the use of marble throughout the country. Mr. Bryan. How do you explain the falling off of whicli Mr. Craig speaks ? Mr. Hart. I will say, for instance, our Tennessee marble is almost exclusively used for the interior decorations of buildings. It is never used for monumental purposes, but it is used altogether for furniture purposes and in interior decorations. It has largely fallen off for the furniture purposes by reason of the use of hard wood largely in Michi- gan, where the manufactories are principally located. But in buildings the reason I attribute the falling off is this: Almost every large build- ing in the United States that is put up, that is, an extensive building, the architect prescribes specifically Italian marble. Now, I am engaged in the manufacture of marble and finishing of marble, and our business extends through the country very largely, and in every instance where we have gotten interior decorations of buildings at all it has been by reason of a change of specifications from Italian to Tennessee. Mr. Payne. Is this a conspiracy of the architects against you? Mr. Hart. I could not answer that. Mr. Bynum. But in regard to public buildings, do not the Govern- ment architects prescribe nearly always Italian ? Mr. Hart. For Government buildings? Mr. Btnum. Do they prescribe the marble with which it is to be built? Mr. Hart. Yes, sir; and they have very largely prescribed Tennes- see marble, particularly in the southern portion of the country. They did not, however, in the library building. They forgot Tennessee on that. But in general ofiices, fine buildings, hotels, and such buildings, Italian marble is specified, and the only chance the Tennessee has to get in there has been by effort with the architect after the specification 248 EARTHENWAKE. has been Jiiade. lu that way the work has beeu maintained to the extent it has. Mr. Bynum. The reason I asked the question is, I have an encaustic tile mamifactory in my district, and they complain all the time that by the special prescribing of marble by the architects marble is put in there to the exclusion of the tile. Mr. Hart. I do not know tliat there is any compulsion. I do not think there is any compulsion of that sort. The Government work lias been liberal to the home industry. Mr. Bynum. They say the American marble is given to the exclu- sion of the tile men? Mr. Hart. I will not say it is to the exclusion of anybody. I do not think probably they want the tile. Tiles are a comparatively new thing in this country; it is not very old. Mr. Byntjm. It has been here seventeen years. Mr. Hart. It is not used so much. I know of a building in St. Louis that is going up, and they say they do not want them to go into it. Mr. Payne. That industry has grown rapidly in the last two or three years; I refer to the tile industry? Mr. Hart. Yes, sir; very recent growth, but we can not compete — I say we can not compete — with the Italian marble or with any foreign marble if the present duty is taken off. The only means by which we can now get our work in is by reason of the cost of the Italian marble by having it kept where it is. If that is taken off it is fair to presume we can not compete, because it will be reduced that amount in cost. Mr. Bryan. Do I understand you to say if the tariff Avas taken off the cost to the consumer of marble in this country would be reduced ? Mr. Hart. I say it would be fair to assume the cost of foreign marble would be 65 cents less, and if that was the case we could no longer in Tennessee compete with them at all. Mr. Bryan. Or if you did compete you would have to sell that much lower? Mr. Hart. In that case we would shut down. Mr. Payne. Or would have to reduce the wages of labor? Mr. Hart. I want to say to you the wages of labor in Tennessee, while they may be three times the amount of Italy, the average wages of Tennessee of the marble labor there is from $1.05 a day to $1.10, which is low-j)riced labor in this country. Mr. Payne. I want you to understand that I am not in favor of reducing any labor in the United States. Mr. Hart. But we would have to do it. Mr. Payne. Of course, if you had no duty, but I am not in favor of taking off the duty. Mr. Hart. We would shut up the quarries if that is taken off, be- cause we simply can not compete. Mr. Bryan. You say the average price paid to your labor is $1.05? Mr. Hart. And to $1.10, I should say. Mr. Bryan. Is that true of all quarries of the United States? Mr. Hart. No, sir; I do Jiot know what prices are paid in other quarries. Mr. Gear. Do you use a large percentage of colored labor? Mr. Hart. There is a number of colored labor. Some quarries have none. Mr. Bryan. Do you give less to the colored labor tlian to the white labor! Marble 249 Mr. Haet. We pay about $1 for tlie lowest labor, that is, men doing strij)ping, and the highest-priced labor we pay is about $1.50. Mr. Bkyan. You do not know a\ hat is paid in other quarries'? Mr. Hart. I do not know what is paid in other localities, and I do not know what is paid abroad ; but I know our labor does not get too much. I know it ought to be better compensated as regards the way labor is paid generally throughout the country. Mr. Bbtan. How long have you been in the business? Mr. Hart. Since 1888. Mr. Bryan. Kot very long? Mr. Hart. No, sir; but I have had my experience since I have been in it. Mr. Btnum. The Italian marble is all white marble? Mr. Hart. Yes, sir. Mr. Byntjm. Now, is it not a fact that certain quantities of Italian marble are used with the American marble for decorations, that they are both used, and do not you think that a reduction of the price of Italian marble would absolutely increase the demand for the home marble. Mr. Hart. Ko, sir; they are never used together. Mr. Byntjm. Are uot they blended together in some buildings? Mr. Hart. IsTot that I know of. I have never seen them blended for wainscoting or mantels. Mr. Bryan. You have seen them blended for floors? Mr. Hart. Very rarely. Mr. Bynum. They use them in alternate blocks? Mr. Hart. That is, generally speaking, Vermont or something else. The white Italian is never iiut in floors. It is never used in conjunc- tion in this country that I know of in any interior work. There may be sometimes a piece different from the main body of the wainscoting, but it is not Italian; it is always some other marble than Italian, generally the colored stone. ISTow the principal reduction Mr. Oraig referred to in Tennessee has been in the colored marble. Several years ago, prob- ably ten years ago or more, the colored marble of Tennessee, what is known as Hawkins County marble, sold at from $4 to $8 a foot. These quarries are to-day all idle. There is no quarry among them that is going. They are all shut down, as they can not compete. They can not quarry that stone and sell it, and therefore they have had to shut down. Mr. Bynum. And there are gentlemen in this country who complain they are losing millions a year on the corn crop; so they are not the only people who are losing? Mr. Hart. They can not keep that up very much longer. They have stopped the production in that State of Tennessee and at least very little is produced. We ask the gentlemen of this committee to give us protection and full consideration, because it requires that amount of protection and not less than that. The condition of aftairs now is un- satisfactory and there has been more money lost there than there has been made. And if this industry is going to be further embarrassed by the removal of this tariff the foreign marble will come in and the foreigner will sell for aU he can get. 250 EARTHENWAEE. GRANITE. (Paragraph 127.) Calais, Mb., Septemler 11, 1893. Our granite does Bot come in competition with any granite found in the United States. It resembles the Scotch red granite whicli is largely imported. That we expect by keen economy and the closest applical 'on to com- pletely exclude the Scotch red granite from the American market. Our stone is exactly the same color and formation as the Scotch and it is a stronger stone, having been tested in Boston in 1873 and stood pressure of 14,000 pounds to the Scotch a little under 9,000 pounds. We have the only quarry that can effectually compete with the Scotch. That is, putting our stone in this market in place of the Scotch, it will give employment to many thousands of men, which will be a bene- fit to the United States and an immense benefit to Calais, Me., without injury to any person except stonecutters in Scotland. That the 11 cents a cubic foot will pay a dividend of more than 6 per cent to any company or companies on whatever capital may be required to work the business, be it much or little. That every different color stone, especially where the article is so good and pretty, gives the architects a larger variety to make desirable contrasts. This we think is a great benefit to the nation. That we have an inexhaustible supply of stone of the finest and prettiest red gTanite in the world. Our quarry is 40 miles by water from Calais, Me., and 16 miles from Eastport, Me. It is 1^ miles long, from 150 to 200 feet high, and one-third of a mile wide, Enough first- class stone to make fifty inexhaustible quarries. We trust you will accept this stone as one of the raw materials to be admitted free of duty for the development and prosperity of the United States, especially as in admitting it free it does not interfere with the American granites, only with the Scotch granite. We will strengthen the above statements later by petitions signed by architects and builders in the large cities of this country. New Beunswiok Eed Geanite Co. op Maine, Per F. T. C. Bukpeb. QuiNCT, Mass., Septemher 20, 1893. The undersigned represents the Granite Manufacturers' Association of Quincy, Mass. The objects of this association are to improve and advance the interests of our business, but in no way to control the sale, leaving competition in trade to govern the price of our product. Quincy is the oldest granite center in the United States, being noted for its production of granite for public buildings and monirmental works. At the present time nearly all its business in granite is confined in the latter trade, paying for labor each month, approximately, $75,000. In the troubles with employes of 1890 we based our prices for labor on the McKinley tariff of 40 per cent. It is shown by the selling prices of importers as quoted that they undersell us in Scotch and Swede mon- uments about 10 per cent, where labor is largely the component part of the design called for, showing you that 50 per cent, what we asked for at that time, would have given us an equal chance to compete with GRANITE. 251 foreign manufacturers, where labor is from 33 to 50 per cent lower; Monuments can be landed in Boston cheaper from Great Britain by steamers than we can ship 50 miles by rail fro2u that center. It is also a fact that since 1890 the importation has increased about 100 per cent, a fact taken oflQcially from the custom-house, Boston, vshowing you that if the tariff was scaled down the increased price of labor in this coun- try will take away almost the entire business of Quincy. In 1892 we had trouble with the unskilled labor supported by the skilled labor. After a long struggle we settled with them by agreement, which we will iile, on the prices of 1891, agreeing to pay that bill of jmces until 1895. Therefore you will see, Mr. Chairman and gentlemen, any reduc- tion in tariff means no business unless we should break our agreements with employes, as competition to-day brings us down to only a living profit in our business. See designs with prices as quoted by importers. Therefore, in behalf of the G-ranite Manufacturers' Association of Quincy, Mass., which comprises all the granite dealers of the city, I respectfully ask that no reduction in the tariff on granite be made. Yours, respectfully, J. Q. A. Field. SCHEDULE O. METALS. 253 IKON AND STEBIi. (Schedule C.) Monday, September 11, 1893. A delegation consisting of the following members appeared before the committee : Mr. Joseph Wharton, chairman and vice-president of the American Iron and Steel Association, Philadelphia, Pa.; Hon. George H. Ely, president of the Western Iron Ore Association, Cleve- land, Ohio; William R. Stirling, first vice-president of the Illinois Steel Company, Chicago, 111. ; Mr. John Lambert, vice-president of the Con- solidated Wire and Steel Company, Joliet, 111.; Capt. H. S. Chamber- lain, president of the Eoane Iron Comiiany and Citico Iron Company, Chattanooga, Tenn. ; Col. A. M. Shook, director of the Tennessee Coal, Iron and Eailroad Company, and director of the Soirthern Iron Com- pany, Nashville, Tenn. ; Mr. Thomas Seddon, president of the Sloss Iron and Steel Company, Birmingham, Ala.; Maj. G-. M. Laughlin, of Jones & Laughlins, ]?ittsl)urg. Pa.; Mr. Charles L. Gilpin, representing W. D. Wood & Co., Pittsburg; Mr. W. C. Cronmeyer, president of the Tinned Plate Manufacturers Association of the United States, Pitts- burg, Pa. ; Mr. David Eeeves, president of the Phoenix Iron Company, Philadelphia; Mr. P. W. Eoebling, representing John A. Roebling's Sons Co., Trenton, IST. J.; Mr. P. H. Laufman, representing the Apollo Sheet Iron Works, Apollo, Pa. ; Mr. James M. Swank, general mana- ger of the American Iron and Steel Association, Philadelphia, Pa.; Mr. Cyrus Elder, representing the Cambria Iron Comxiany, Johnstown, Pa.; and Dr. L. E. Coates, representing the Locust Point Iron and Steel Works Company, Baltimore, Md. The Chaieman. The hearing this morning is given in response to the request of the Iron and Steel Association of the United States through Mr. Swank, and he has placed before me here the order in which each person will address the committee, and the first name is that of Mr. Joseph Wharton, who is chairman of this delegation, and who is the vice president of the American Iron and Steel Association. STATEMENT OF ME. JOSEPH WHARTON, CHAIRMAN, AND VICE-PEESIDENT OF THE AMEEICAN IKON AND STEEL ASSOCIATION, PHILADELPHIA, PA, Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen of the Committee: lam obliged to take this place in consequence of the absence of tlie president of the association, the Hon. B. P. Jones, of Pittsburg, who is not able to be with us to-day, and I come unprepared to make anything in the nature of a formal speech, as I merely have to introduce these people in the con- versational way, leading up to the point where each gentleman present will speak in regard to the particiilar section or particular line of industry which belongs to himself. The bond of union between tlie iron and steel manufacturers in this country is not a very close one. There is nothing in the nature of a league, or even of an alliance. The Iron and Steel Association of America is nothing like a close corporation, 255 256 METALS. but it is an association -which we belong to for the purpose of keeping correct statistics and keeping up a general fellow feeling between the different sections of the country and the different branches of trade. We quarrel among ourselves when it suits us, but we all feel a certain attachment to the association which I have the honor of representing. The magnitude of this iuterest, I think, is not always appreciated either by our friends or by our enemies. The industry has run over twenty -nine States, makiug pig iron, bar iron, steel, etc., and is widely disseminated, therefore, fi-om North to South and from Bast to West, and I think the number of workmen actually engaged is about 450,000, which, by the rules of ordinary calculation that each married workman has a family of 5, a wife and a family, and while the number is some- times more than 5, it makes an average of about 5 for each workman, and that makes a population of 2,250,000 who are directly interested in this manufacture of iron and steel. The Chaieman. Do you include the miners in that? Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir; the miners and the makers of coke, but not the persons who are engaged in transportation. That includes the miners of fuel and ore and the manufactures of all sorts of the differ- ent branches of the iron and steel industry. It is a thing that is not so easy to get at. I tried to get the information accurately, but the most I can do is to say I believe it is about 450,000. Now, it is not only that 2,250,000 persons who are directly interested in all parts of the country — a larger constituency, a larger number of persons in whose interests we are at work are the consumers. There is not one in the country who is not interested in extending the iron and steel industry in a highest state of efficiency, because by that he gets his wares at a lower price and better than if this industry is broken up, crippled, or extinguished. I know every gentleman on this committee will claim that every one desires to have his own country prosper, that no one imagines that such a thing could be done if we do as was done in Spain when all the best artisans were driven out by Ferdinand and Isabella, or as happened in France when the Huguenots were driven out sind industries were crip- pled. Such things are not to be done nowadays, and yet to read the newspapers on the free-trade side one would imagine nothing less tliau something of that sort would satisfy the people who are clamoring for a reduction of the tariff rate. They seem to desire to have our indus- tries put down to a point of inefftcieucy, to be crippled, to be made unable to perform their functions. When people come to the responsibility of holding a place on the Committee on Ways and Means they are not to be classed with that class of irresponsible writers and speakers. When a man has reached the dignity of becoming a member of this committee he feels the responsibility and knows he is to act for the whole country and not for any one section or even for tlie political part of it to which he belongs. I do not propose to say a word, therefore, to-day that can be construed as expressing any doubt of the intention of every mem- ber of this committee to do his duty, as he conceives it, toward his fel- low countrymen in this matter of sustainiug an industry by which they personally help them and their families, and by which all the citizens of the country are provided with the necessary things that the iron and steel industry produces. The question as to how to treat this industry in order to promote our greatest eflicieucy is one that people naturally differ upon. No one, I thirik, imagines that his own particular views are to rule. It is a matter of compromise; for debate and discussion and finally for compromise. In that sense everv tariff that has been IRON AND STP^EL. 257 made since the time I paid attention to that subject, which has been tliirty or forty years — and I have been in Washington almost every win- ter during that time i)articipating in discussions before committees on tlie tariff question — (^lu every occasion the resulting bill has been a compromise or a series of compromises. It will be so on this occasion. Some gentlemen, no doubt, desire to have a full, wholesale revision, a pulling to pieces, and tearing down of what seems to them to be the exorbitant high rates which are charged for commodities, and some- how or other to cut folks up who are sometimes called robber barons, a very fantastical title to apply to anybody in this country; but this liiscussion of the tariff will have the result that all others have, in a (•ompromise of the different views. We who are here before you to-day, I think everyone of us, is thoroughly cnuvinced that the tariff we are now living under is the best one the country has ever possessed. The country has not been living under it long enough to feel fully the benefits that it has brought. It has done no harm in any instance that I am aware of. It reduces the rate of nearly everyone, I believe, of the whole range of iron and steel industries, ex- cept perhaps in the matter of tin plate. With no other exception is it very important. We are living under these reduced duties and we are satisfied with them. But we want no change. We believe that the fashion of changing the tariff duties is one of the most obnoxious things that can be possibly introduced into the economy of any country. Men wlio undertake to carry on any of these great industries have to make a. very serious investment of their capital and their time. One can not iiglitly say that he will become a Bessemer steel manufacturer to-day and that he will be in that business to-morrow, even if he could buy an establishment. A i)lant is a matter of slow growth. If a man wants apples to eat when he is old he has to plant that orchard when he is young. When a man wants to have a Bessemer steel establishment he has to plant that also when he is comparatively young, and when he is a little aged, in the latter part of his life, perhaps, if he is lucky, and the free traders are not too strong for him, he may possibly reap some fruit. But all these plants, as I say, are of slow growth. They are very far-reaching, both as to the places from which they derive their supplies and as to the places in which their benefits in the way of pro- ducts are disseminated. Anything that cripples one of these huge es- tablishments, or, still more, the whole branch of industry to which the establishment belongs, is a matter of the most serious concern and ought not to be entered into lightly. We know that all branches of the iron and steel industry are suffer- ing from a condition of strain and distress, of which I suppose a very few persons out of the business are aware. We hardly dare to admit how great that strain is. It is not only that we are unable to make a I)rofit, it is not only that the losses that we incur are almost more than we can endure, but our vitality is touched in a nearer way by the de- struction of credit. Every great establishment uses credit. JJo mer- chant in a large way and no manufacturer in a large way expects, nor is it expected of him, that he will have capital enough to carry on all branches of his business without borrowing. Everyone, I may say, is a borrower. Now, when a time like this comes, of strain and distress all over tlie country, and when in addition to the strain and disti'css incident to a demoralized and abnormal condition of things there is added a series of assaults upon the foundation upon which this industry is Ijuilt, namely, a certain reasonable degree of protection against the avaricious assault of foreigners, when that foundation is assailed, TH 17 258 METALS. then every person who gives credit to an establisliment or individual begins to draw in. Here is a case where some one has a mill which is worth all he is in debt for. He has some capital, but he can not be mak- ing money in a time like this, and when it is known that there is a prospect that the tariff on which he is living is going to be taken away from him his creditor says, "I guess we had better make him pay up. That is the thing the people are now suffering from. The banks are not able to succeed in sustaining the industries, although they are, in a general way, doing all they can. But a bank can not go beyond a certain distance; it has to take care of itself, and when banks are shown that the foundations of a great industry are being withdrawn by legislation they can not in prudence do anything else than refuse credit, and the next, of course, is general bankruptcy. The bankruptcies that have occurred in the iron and steel industry within the last eight months — I have the statement made up— amounted to 93. A great many other concerns have held on to this time, and now it depends upon what you gentlemen do if they are able to hold on. The question of revenue is one that is not immediately in our province to s])eak of, and yet it is so wound up with the business that it can not be avoided. We do not think that the Government can afford to destroy the industries of the country in the hope — it has no assurance, but in the hoi)e — that by lowering the duties a larger amount of goods will be brought in, and therefore, even at a lower rate of dutj', larger revenues will come into the Treasury. We do not think that you gentlemen of the committee intend to treat the question in that way. The revenues have to come in, and so far as they are paid by foreigners I believe none of us could imagine a more satisfactory way to replenish the Treasury. The nations are all hostile to each other in trade; theie is no friendship in trade. Any nation that can see the way to take pluu- der from another people in the way of trade is going to do it surely. Now, in defending our own industries against the assaults of foreigners, wliich the tariff does like an armor plate on a man-of-war to protect her crew against the enemy, the industrial soldiers of this country are quite able to take care of themselves and light their battles, provided they are on equal terms with the industrial soldiers of other countries. On the other hand they are not on these equal terms because they have to pay more for living here and have to get more wages. We do not see any reason why they should be exposed to be picked oft' and destroyed by the enemy by reason of having no protection. If they are behind the walls of a reasonable protective tariff they can fight as well as the men on board an armor-plated ship. They can do their duties then and bear their part with a certain degTce of confidence. But, to finish that point, I think that everybody will agree that, so far as the revenues for the United States Treasury can be derived from foreigTiers, it is a highly satisfactory way of getting a revenue. If, however, that revenue that comes into the Treasury of the United States had to be taken out of the pockets of our peo^ile by the prices being added to the goods, then a very serious question will arise whether on the whole it was the best way of getting any revenue, but we, are prepared to say that is not what takes place. We are prepared to show — that I will not undertake, because gentlemen can do that in details of the iron industry, if you desire to hear that, or it can be given to you in form of statistics later — but we are prepared to show that in nearly every case, we might say in every case, the foreigner who desires to enter our markets is willing to pay, and knows he wiU have to pay, for the privilege of getting into oru' markets a certain sum IKON AND STEEL. 259 of money, a certain rate ad valorem or specific against the goods they send it. They deduct that from the price they would like to have. They make their prices to their American customers such as will enable them to pay the duty themselves, and not to exact it from the Amer- ican customers. The instances where that can be specifically shown are very numerous, and therefore, I say, when revenues are derived from duties upon imports it comes almost entirely out of the pockets of the foreigner, and is therefore a highly satisfactory way for the United States Grovernment to replenish its Treasury. These foreigners, the men who make goods to send to America, are not citizens of this country and are not amenable to our laws. They are not liable to conscription, or drafting, or anything of that kind, for filling up our armies in case of war. They pay no tax of any sort into this Govern- ment, and merely to equalize their case with that of our working peo- ple it is simply just to our working people that those foreign compet- itors of theirs should pay to the United States Treasury something in the nature of a tax for the privilege of coming in here, and, as I say, they do it. It does not come out of the pockets of the American con- sumer. It comes out of the pockets of the European, and that we are prepared to show. Now, the question as to how to levy these duties is an important one, and one point I desire to briefly call your attention to is this : Whether specific or ad valorem duties on the whole are most desirable. We think that all experience shows that ad valorem duties are exactly suitable for allowing foreigners to defraud our revenues, for it is a common prac- tice of exporters to this country to undervalue their goods. It is a common practice for these exporters to send their goods not to a bona fide buyer in America, but to their own American agents, who have no interests therefore in pointing out an error in the valuation. When our Treasury agents are sent to other countries and instructed to ascertain the prices of various kinds of goods that are habitually sent here they find very great difficulty in getting the honest price of those goods. The manufacturers abroad will not give those prices, and it is almost impossibletoascertainwhattherealpricesare, and impossible, assuredly, to ascertain whether the ad valorem duty is fairly collected. If a piece of goods is worth a dollar a yard and pays 50 per cent ad valorem duty it would seem to be a very satisfactory rate of duty, but if that piece of cloth is valued in the invoice at 25 cents a yard and pays the 50 per cent I think that is something very different. We see no advantage in any case of an ad valorem duty, and we think in every case the duty should be specific, so that the buyer and seller both know with great distinctness what they have to pay. With this branch of the subject is closely connected another, namely, the administrative clause of the tariff bill we are now living under. This administrative clause was framed with great care, and I think one of the greatest grievances the foreigners have against our tariff is that their little methods of cheating the Government are ordi- narily unavailable. In this respect the present tariff bill is the best one the country has ever possessed. We think therefore, whatever you do as to the rates of duty, that you ought to adhere to the specihc plan instead of going to the ad valorem, and we think that you ought to adhere to the administrative clause of the tariff bill we are now liv- ing under. When we come to speak of the rates of duty there is of course an endless field for discussion and for a difference of opinion, but from our point of view the thing to be aimed at is to have a rate of duty such 260 METALS. as will prevent on the one hand any slouching dependence upon that duty as a means of getting- a living and will prevent on the other hand foreigners having such easy access to our markets as to destroy our own working people. Between these two extremes the rates have to be iixed in every case. It is not to be expected — I think it is quite be- yond human powers for any one person to know wliat the duties ought to be on the whole range of articles embraced in the tariff schedule. It is very much as if a person who is extremely well posted upon one branch of a business, such as iron and steel, should be able to give fair rates of duty upon all articles embraced in that branch; I should not pretend to be able to do it, and I do not know of any person who would undertake to do it. The persons operating different establish- ments are the only ones. They are face to face with what I may call the enemy. They know what the strategy is likely to be; they know what dodges he is getting up, and they know about what course ought to be taken to baffle his pirrpose of using our markets to the disadvan- tage of our own people and for his own selfish gain. I think that any committee considering a question like this is bound to listen with very respectful attention to the views of men who know of this matter, who know what they are talking about, and know the specific rate which is needed upon a specific article or a series of articles in which tliey are interested. No matter if the committee does not agree as to the rate ; they will learn Avhy it is that such a rate is thought to be desirable, and I think in many instances they will be convinced that the person speak- ing in the way I suggest really understands his business, and probably, on the whole, he is part right in his views. But we are bound to ad- mit, we know, that our views are not those of all the members of this committee. On the other hand we do not for a moment believe that the views that some blatant free traders put forth, that the manufac- turers of Amei-ica are to be looked ui>on as a set of thieves and rob- ber barons and the like — we know that no idea like that is going to find lodgment in your minds. We believe you are going to approach this question as pa triotic Americans, who feel a pride in the tremendous advance the country has made in all kind of manufactures and the promise of the future of this country if it is properly taken care of by legislation, the leading country in the world in manufactures, and after we have said what we have to say we shall await the decision which you come to in regard to a specific rate with a good deal of interest. We are not going to-day to propose any rate of duty ourselves, be- cause our ground is the country is satisfied and is prosperous, so far as the prevailing money conditions will permit, with the existing tariff. We believe that the distress that now prevails everywhere is due quite as much, and probably more, to an apprehension that we are all suffer- ing from of an ui)rooting of the foundation upon which we are building by adverse tari if legislation more than by the currency question. We know it is as necessary to have an absolutely fixed standard of money payments as it is to have an absolutely fixed standard of weights or measures. Eo country can carry on its business by any rude system of barter. The pay has to be as accurate as the measure, and we are therefore entirely in accord with President Cleveland's views as expressed in his message upon the silver question. I do not think ' there is one of us who does not think the currency question is one of chief importance, and it must be settled before the country can be set- tled down to permanent prosperity, but we also believe that that is not the sole, even not the greatest, source of the present misery. It is an apprehension in addition to that currency trouble that we are going to IRON AND STEEL. 261 Lave the whole fabric of our establishments destroyed by legislation honestly intended but not thoroughly acquainted witli the facts that ought to govern.it. As Isaid, wedo not to-day propose to suggest rates. We think that our function to-day is to protest against change. We are suffering from a strain we can hardly endure. We think if that one point of the tariff rate was fixed, namely, that it should remain as it is now until this period of distress is entirely over, a couple of years hence — because the distress is not going to pass over rapidly — we think the country, under certain conditions, would recover rapidly, and then when the tariff question should be taken up it could be done without any acrimony or dispute, and where changes are shown to be necessary you will find the manufacturers of the country would meet the views of those who think the rates should be changed in as liberal a spirit as possibly could be. We have no desire to jjlunder our fellow country- men, and we have no desire tp have more than our share of the national prosperity. Kow, titien, I may speak upon one other point which belongs to that general treatment of the subject. We hear a great deal about class legislation; about taking by legislation money out of one man's pocket and putting it into another man's pocket. IsTow, then, this is a fantasy, a kind of bugaboo, and it has no real existence. There is no law which says John Smith shall pay John Jones so much per annum; there is no law which says John Smith, if he thinks John Jones is getting too much of this world's goods, shall not go into the same line of business. The laws are such that any man can go into any kind of business whatever. Any section of the country which thinks another section of the coun- try is prospering too greatly will probably find if he pays attention to the subject it can itself go into the manufacture of that product, just as in the South they have found in regard to the iron and steel business. I remember very well in the manufacture of iron and steel when it was confined to a small region along the Atlantic seaboard, and it did not penetrate inland and did not go beyond the Alleghany Mountains. We consequently had to encounter the hostility on the part of the country west and south from getting such a rate of duty as to protect us on the Atlantic seaboard from the assault of foreigners across the sea. That has been all changed. Some of the most prosperous and magnificent establishments in the whole country are at what we would even call the extreme far West and in the extreme South. The States westward, Colorado even, are strongly interested to maintain in vigorous activity the manufacture of iron and steel. In the Southern States you all know Alabama has stepped to the front, and the iron industry there is of great magnitude and the Southern people are thoroughly convinced they are going to be able to give the Northern people all they want in the way of competition, and in point of fact by this domestic competi- tion it is continually reducing prices. The conditions which are estab- lished by legislation are in the nature of an invitation to all of our peoi)le to go into this or that industry. A railroad president may think that his company on the whole is paying more for steel rails than he thinks it ought to, and he may perhaps be a Southern man and wish to encourage the establishment of steel rail works down in his own region. Our laws are such as to invite him to do that business. The laws prom- ise if anj^ person having the brains and the money will devote his brains and his money to the production of a certain article that lie shall have certain advantages, not over his fellow men but the foreigners, and on that promise these works are established. They require great capital, they require long toil, they require education in a great many special- 262 METALS. ties, and all these conditions exist and people are willing to enter upon an industry with the assurance on the part of their government that they are going to have a reasonable protection, not, as I said, against their fellow countrymen, but against foreigners who owe no allegiance and who are our enemies in time of war and no less our enemies in times ot peace. Mr. Ttjener. How long has it been since this organization which you represent was formed? Mr. Wharton. Mr. Swank, I think, can answer that better than I can. Mr. Swank. In 1855. Mr. TxTENEE. Could you state succinctly the history of tariff legisla- tion of this interest which you represent during that time? Mr. Wharton. I do not think I could add anything to the knowl- edge that the members of the committee possess. It has been a tussle ujihill and downhill; but, as a general thing, the protection was inad- equate until the year 1861. Then the tariff was made, commonly called the Morrill bill. Mr. Turner. Were these industries prosperous prior to 1861 ? Mr. Wharton. They were very feeble, and as a general thing I might almost say they were insignificant. They were struggling and feeble. The development since then has been of the most magnificent character, until now this country leads the whole world in the manu- facture of iron and steel. Mr. Turner. Why do you lead the whole world? Is it on account of the operation of this tariff or is it on account of the improvements in the process of manufacture? Mr. Wharton. It is on account of those two things, and also another, namely, we possess here the materials necessary, or most of them, for the manufacture of iron and steel in all their branches. That condi- tion underlying, we are then depending upon the legislation of the country as to the terms upon which we are to meet foreign competitors; and then, being in the business, it is our function and duty to make all the improvements we can to carry out the manufacture to a higher degree of efficiency. The conditions making it possible even to exist having been once established, then, in part, inventive talent has been brought to bear upon all the different problems involved in the manu- facture of iron and steel. Mr. Turner. To what extent are these processes protected now by patents ; to a large extent ? Mr. Wharton. They are generally not protected at all. Some few are. Mr. Turner. Has the Bessemer patent expired? Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. Are there patents in the process of converting iron into steel expired or are they still patented f Mr. Wharton. Some have not expired, namely, those in regard to the manufacture and treatment of basic steel. Mr. Turner. Are some new patents for utilizing more fully the ores in Southern and Western States frequently proposed? Mr. Wharton. We hear from time to time of processes by which iron is to be made direct from the ores without the hitervention of the blast furnace, but if there are any they have not come to any good. Mr. Turner. These iroTi goods which you meet in the market from Tennessee and Alabama, are they really displacing your goods to any extent in the market? IRON AND STEEL. 2G3 Mr. Wharton. In pig- iron tliey are. Mr. Turner. Wiiiit elfect is tluit Slaving on yonr product; do you use tlieir pig iron In your flnislied processes, or liow is that? Mr. Wharton. The iron made in the South is generally unfit for conversion into steel by the Bessemer, sometimes called the acid pro- cess. The Southern ores are adapted for most manufactures of iron, that is, for making wrought iron in all its forms and for making cast- ings of all sorts. The Southern ore is capable for making those things, but as a general thing persons who make wrought iron like to mix other iron, so it is probable it would be desirable to mingle some of the Northern iron, particularly those made of magnetite, in whole or in part, with irons of the South; but in a general way, you will say, the South is able to supply itself with iron for all the uses that iron is put to.. But when you come to the conversion of iron into steel the South hitherto has notdisplaced anypart of the so-called Bessemer ores, that is, oreswhich are very low in phosphorus and which are able to be treated by the Bessemer process, sometimes called the acid process, because the con- verters are lined with silica or something rich in silica, whereas in the basic process the couA^erter or open-heartli furnace is lined with basic lime or maguesia, or both. The South possesses a considerable quan- tity of basic iron ores, but so far they are not greatly developed, and therefore no one can state how great or how small they are. Mr. Turner. Has the condition of this Southern iron changed the character of your production in Pennsylvania to any extent! Mr. Wharton. In the production of pig iron it has been a very seri- ous injury to us. We have had to endure that competition of the South- ern pig iron in our market. Mr. Turner. What effect has that had on prices? Mr. Wharton. It has had a very depressing effect on prices. Mr. Turner. What does pig iron cost to produce in Pennsylvania? I suppose you get your ores largely from Lake Superior mines, and what does it cost you to produce pig iron from any ores which you get? Mr. Wharton. Well, every establishment has a different price; no two would produce pig iron at the same price, but I supj^ose in a gen- eral way the cost price of pig iron would range in Pennsylvania from $13 to |l6. There are gentlemen here who are more closely informed as to that point than I am, but these figures will not be Aery seriously out of the way. I have heard it said that they can make it for $12 in certain favored localities. Mr. Turner. Is that from Pennsylvania ores or from ores which you import? Mr. Wharton. The Pennsylvania furnaces used to make their iron — I am speaking of those east of the Alleghanies — from an ore from New Jersey and the northern part of New York, but now their furnaces are supplied to a great extent either from foreign ores or Lake Superior ores. When you go west of the Alleghanies the Lake Superior ores are much more largely used, and freights are such as to enable these ores to be brought as far as Pittsburg, for instance. Mr. Turner. Has the dexeloiiment of these pig-iron establishments in the South been followed by any large creation of the smaller indus- tries in iron ? Mr. Wharton. In the South? Yes, I think to a very considerable extent; but this is a thing of rather slow growth, and you can not ex- pect that to take place immediately. Mr. Turner. What is the character of these productions? Mr. Wharton. I think mostly in bar iron in all forms, in cast-iron 264 METALS. pipe for carrying water, and gas pipes, and all the innumerable small x\ses to which wrought iron is put, castings of all kinds, such as stoves, and, to some extent, agricultural implements which are made of iron; also for building railroad cars. . . Mr. TuKNEK. Now, are you prepared to state how prices now existing in this country compare with prices prevailing on the other side for similar goods in your line of iron and steel ? Mr. Whaeton. In the special articles, when you come to speak of articles such as agricultural implements, our prices are quite as low as and in a good many instances lower than in Europe. Mr. Turner. Some of your associates export these articles and com- pete with the foreigner in his own market'? Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir; especially in agricultural implements. Mr. Turner. What class of agricultural implements— plows, reapers, etc? • Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. Edged tools'? Mr. Wharton. Edged tools, also; yes, sir; axes, chisels, and that kind of thing. Mr. Turner. Why is it that the producers of these iron goods are enabled to compete w^ith the foreigner in foreign countries? Mr. Wharton. They are enabled to compete because their goods are rather neater, more effective than the foreign ; and second, because having this market assured to them by reason of the protective tariff, they are able to reduce the cost price, the price of production, and in that way in America they are able in a great many instances to bring the cost of production down to a point that permits them to go into the foreign markets. Mr. Turner. Do they sell their goods cheaper abroad than they do in the domestic markets'? Mr. Wharton. Not that I know of. I have heard rumors of that kind, but in every case where it was hunted down to the ground it turned out to be a fallacy. Mr. Turner. Then, it would seem, the foreigner in this line met in, his own home by the American producer would be kept out of this market by some other influences than the protective tariff. Mr. Wharton. I think I can answer that question very well byrefer- ring to an elaborate paper which was produced in Germany by a man whose name I have forgotten — I have the original German treatise at home and read it carefiilly. He takes up the question as to what the; effect is upon imports and exports of a protective tariff. In Germany ; the rates of duty are such that he di^'ided them into three classes. He i first takes up the articles or commodities which enter into Germany free of duty; next those which enter into Germany with some duty but insuf- ficient to be protective ; and next he considers those articles which are protected by an adequate duty so as to keep out foreign goods. 'Now, he takes the entire statement of importations and cxportations for a period, I forget how long the period is, but possibly only for the year before that in which the treatise was written, or possibly for several years, but he shows with the utmost clearness that in the case where' importations into Germany were free the Gevnuin i^ioduct of that arti- cle has dwindled. In the case where the duty upon theforei;;n articles' coining into Germany was inadequate to protect the Geruiau product the German manufacture has dwindled, but not to so great a de^iree; while in the case where the protective duties have bee'n adequate the German products have been so cheapened in price by domestic compe- IRON AND STEEL. 265 tition tliey Lave overflowed inl'o foreign countries, and tlie exports of Germany, of tliose tljiugs which Germany malies, are exactly the things which are jirotected by a dnty adequate to keei) out the foreign com- petitors. Now it is a very striking fact, which has never been before so well developed as by this German, whose name I can not recollect, that making an adequate dike against foreign invasion causes prices to fall in the home market. As I said before, we are able to point to a number of instances in our country, but T do not know that this question has been so thoroughly examined and discussed in this country as it has been by this German author, whose work is quite undeniable. Mr. Turner. If you broke down the dike would it have the effect, according to that theory, to raise prices or lower them"? What would be the tendency ? Mr. Wharton. It would raise prices, because it would cripple the home product. Mr. Turner. We were talking, you know, about the reasons why the home product could enter the foreign market and compete with that foreign market? Mr. Wharton. Yes. Mr. Turner. Would the breaking down of this barrier increase the comj)etition by adding that of the foreigner? Ml". Wharton. Yes, this increased competition would be disastrous to the domestic producer. Mr. Turner. Could he come over and compete with you at home and do more harmf j\Ir. Wharton. Infinitely more, because the foreign market is al- ways trifling. The foreign market we have for iron and steel goods, 1 think, would add up a rather steep figure in millions, but it is nothing to compare with this huge market here. You have all heard of the dog who took a piece of meat in his month and went over a stream of water on a bridge and saw another dog under him who had what he thought was a little better piece of meat and he dropped his to get that. That is what we would do if we gave uj) our home market in order to go after the foreign market. Mr. Turner. Is there any agreement or understanding practiced within your organization to limit the output of your mills? Mr. Wharton. Are you speaking of the whole Iron and Steel Asso- ciation of America? Mr. Turner. Or any branches of it? Mr. Wharton. No ; I may say generally there is not. In the steel rail trade we have samething which approaches this, but it is not just of the nature you state." I can not give an affirmative answer therefore to that question. Mr. Turner. What are the prices for steel rails at this time in this country? Mr. Wharton. Well, I should say generally about $29 a ton. Mr. Turner. I did not mean at a time when a stringency existed, but I mean the average rate of price? Mr Wharton. It is about $29. It began at $30 and it gradually dropped down to about $29. Mr. Turner. What is the price on the other side for similar goods? Mr. Wharton. Well, I do not keep posted in regard to that, but I should say I think it is about 2 pounds 10 shillings. Mr. Swank. It is about $18 on the other side. Mr. Wharton. That is more than 2 pounds 10 shillings. 266 METALS. Mr. Turner. The difference in price is not quite equal to the tariff rate? Mr. Wharton. Xo, it is not. One point has to be considered, how- ever,iu regard to the possibilities of foreittiiers coming into oar markets, and that is the question of transportation. It costs us more than the English to get to the Gulf ports. When they send down there for cotton they can carry steel rails, for instance, to a cotton port at very low prices, even lower than we can send our rails from the ISTorth. Their mills are generally close to the water and their cost of inland transportation and putting on board of ship is less than ours. Mr. Turner. The ocean transportation to this country affords an additional protection? Mr. Wharton. It is where we are sending inland, but when we have to go to the seaboard it is not, because, as 1 said, I am a member of the Bethlehem Iron Company, and if we are competing with English- men to deliver rails at Xew Orleans, Galveston, or any of those places along the Gulf we have to pay a higher rate of transportation than the Englishman does, and the transportation in that case diminishes to that extent the protection which tlie duty appears to give. The Chairman. I understood you to say the 450,000 persons engaged in the iron and coal industries of the country included miners of ores? Mr. Wharton. Yes. The Chairman. Miners of coal? Mr. Wharton. Yes. The Chairman. And those em^jloyed in coke ovens? Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir. The Chairman. The various workers in iron and steel? Mr. Wharton. Yes. On that point I have not the information very sharp and accurate as I desire. I was not able to get hold of the cen- sus statistics on that point and I took the statement of a well infoimed man who has paid more attention to it than I, but I have no reason to doubt it is accurate. The Chairman. Can you give the average wages of a miner of iron ore who has regular employment all the year? Mr. Wharton. That differs very much in different parts of the country. In the Lake Superior region they pay more than we do in Pennsylvania or Kew Jersey. The climatic conditions under which they live there are not so favorable and men have to be paid to go up there. I think in regard to the Lake Superior region I would like to have Mr. Ely answer. The Chairman. Mr. Ely can probably answer those questions I am asking you, and I will not ask you to answer them. Probably he can tell us what I intended to ask you as to the cost of the ore at the mouth of the mine in Michigan, Pennsylvania, England, Belgium, and Ger- many. Mr. Wharton. I think it would not be judicious for me to speak in regard to that, as there is a gentleman here who knows the thiug better, and for whom I have no right to speak. The Chairman. I understand you to contend that the foreigner pays the tax, and it is a good thing for us to have the foreigner pay our tax€ s '? Mr. Wharton. Yes. The Chairman. If you shut out foreign products by a tax we take away from him the opportunity of paying our taxes? Mr. Wharton. Yes. The Chairman. So it throws the tax upon our own people? IRON AND STEEL. 2G7 Mr Wharton. Yes, sir; in point of fact that has never talicn place, and under the present tariff the importations are larj;er tha)i ever Vje- fore the McKinley tariff. In fact the charge was that we were setting- up a Chinese wall and stopping foreign commerce. In point of fact it did not have that effectffind the commerce of the country increased under it, both importatilns and exportations. Just at this time impor- tations, of course, are cheolied, but the cause is the extreme stringency of money first, and second, by apprehension on the ])art of foreigners or hope on the part of foreigners, that if they delay sending in goods they will get them in on better terms. The Chairman. This dike or defensive armor on the ship would effectively prevent the foreigner from paying our taxes for us? Mr. Wharton. No man who is authorized to speak for the Iron and Steel Association of America, or authorized to speak generally for the protective side of the argument, has ever claimed or desired to have that kind of a barrier. When I use a simile of armor plate or dike— I am glad you called the attention of the committee to it — it does not at all mean that we are afraid to meet foreigners upon terms where we have equality, but if a trained boxer, is brought to fight with an untrained man the untrained man is a little bit uneasy and wants to see if he can help himself in some way, and we in this country have been in the condition of the untrained man against a prize fighter. We are not plead- ing the baby act. We have grown to a stature where we can fight our own battles, and we merely demand of our legislators to give us a fair showing and let us in on equal terms. The Chairman. That is not the particular thing that I was speaking about at the time. I was getting at the idea of the advisability of throwing our burdens upon the foreigner and taking them from the shoulders of our own people? Mr. Wharton. This Is a question of rate and not absolute prohi- bition. If the duty is very light the foreigner pays the light contribu- tion, and if the duty is heavy he will have to pay more. The Chairman. Now, in regard to this dike of which you were sjieak- ing. If I understand the trend of your argument it was that this dike should be deep or broad enough to save the home market as far as pos- sible for the home producer? Mr. Wharton. That is always with the reservation we never have desired and do not now desire to have an absolutely exclusive foreign tariff. We are quite willing to stand our just competition, provided our legislation does not make that a destructive comx^etition. The Chairman. If I caught your idea with the protective tariff", which was the dike, we would to a large extent at least save the home market for the home producer? Mr. Wharton. Yes. The Chairman. Save the opportunity to make the thing that we use in the home market to the people of this country? Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Suppose there is a class of people in this country who, after they have exhausted the home market, still have an immense surplus of products on hand, what are you going to do with that class of people? Mr. Wharton. That class of people will endeavor, I imagine, to sell their product abroad, and if the teims on which they are producing are low enough they will have some success. If they have been en- couraged to put in one improvement after another and organize their industry the higher and higher will grow the perfection until we reach 268 METALS. a point wliere we are able to put some of tlie product in the foreign market and meet tlieni there. That is the normal result of the adoptioji of a system of protection. The Chairman. I am not speaking so much of those who have worked up so they have a slight surplus which they can send out into the foreign market, but of the very class of our people who produce products for which they are obliged to seek a foreign market for a larger part, per- haps, of what they produce, or for so large apart of what they produce that the price of the foreign market malces the price of the home prod- uct. jSTow what benefit will your dike be to them ? Make it specific ; take the cotton planter who produces three or four times as much as he can sell in this country; what good will this dike do him ? Mr. Wharton. The cotton-planter so far has had his price regu- lated for him by the i^rice in Liverpool. If this country can stimulate or develop its own consumption of cotton to that j)oint where this market becomes the ruling market and governs quotations he then will no longer be subject to the whim of the Liverpiool people or their adopt- ing that plan, which they are capable of, of rigging the American planter against the Indian cotton-planter. The Chairman. Do you think it is within the limits of any reason- able time to have a sufficient demand in this country for all the cotton produced in the country ? Mr. Wharton. Probably not for the whole of it. The Chairman. Is not our cotton crop of America to-day larger than the cotton croj) of the whole world fifteen or twenty years ago f Mr. Wharton. I do not know the facts, but I have no doubt of it. The Chairman. The same way with the wheat-grower. ISfow, let me pursue that inquiry a little further. The man who sells to the home side of this dike you speak of seUs subject to the competition of the home market only, does he not? Mr. Whar,ton. Yes; modified by the extent of the foreign goods coming in. The Chairman. Only a mere trickling stream of foreign goods comcM across that dike? Mr. Wharton. When we are importing $300,000,000 or $400,000,00(1 of foreign goods that is something more than you would call a trickling stream. The Chairman. Take steel rails. We produce in this conntivi 1,500,000, 1,700,000 or 1,800,000 tons of steel rails; there is no foreigi- competition with that product? Mr. W^HARTON. N"one. The Chairman. Practically none? Mr. Wharton. Practically none. The Chairman. 'Now, if a man who sells to the home side of th( ditch has his market price fixed by the competition of the home iiiarkel only? Mr. Wharton. With the result that as soon as he gets a little tot lofty in his views then the gates are opened and foreign rails come iu. The Chairman. That is, whenever the price would be put up so higl. that foreign rails could be imported into this country with the taiifl paid upon it, then he is subject to a competition. Mr. Wharton. Just so. The Chairman. But so long as he keeps slightly below that limit he has no competition but the home market? Mr. Whar'JON. Yes. The Chairman. But the man who is obliged to sell on the outside IRON AND STEEL. 269 of the ditch, as tlaecottoii-producer, the wheat-grower, the cattle-raiser, and other uieu in this country, just as soon as he gets outside of the tariff ditch he sells at a price made by the competition of the world's market, does he not? Mr. Wharton. Yes. The Chairman. Now, if you place a tariff tax upon products that he gets in exchange for his wheat, cotton, or meat, is it not the same as if you placed a tax upon those products themselves before they went out"? Mr. Whar i on. I think I will have to divide your statement into two branches. In the first place, these men who raise wheat, pork, etc., by reason of the immense number of persons engaged in the manu- factures here, sell nine-tenths or more of their products here in America at high prices, which our people are able to pay by reason of getting good wages. Mue-tenths of his product is sold at much higher prices than he could hope to get, except by protection, which leads some of the men to engage in other business than the raising of these same prod- ucts. The Chairman. Isit your understanding a bushel of wheat consumed in Washington produces a higher price to the producer than a bushel of wheat consumed in Liverpool"? Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Are there two prices in the market, one for home consumption and one for loreign! Mr. Wharton. Ithinkyou will find that is the case. It may seem to be a little unreasonable, but I think you will find the foreign market, being in the nature of a surplus or slaughter market, is always a little lower, but in the long run the farmer gets a better price when he does not have to pay freight across half the continent and the ocean than when he does have to pay those freights. In other words, the man who is raising wheat, we will say in Minnesota, will get in Chicago a higher price for that part of his wheat that he can sell in Chicago than for the larger part he has to sell in Liverpool. The Chaie:man. Does he not sell all in Chicago; does he know which particular bushel goes to Liverpool ? Mr. Wharton. He does, and Chicago being an immense market keeps up prices and prevents the market sagging down low at prices Avhere the foreigner would be willing to take the wheat. The Chairman. Do you refer to the farmer using Liveri^ool as a slaughter market, sending over his surplus when he does not get rid of it in this country? Mr. Wharton. The farmer personally does not know where it goes. but he sells it to the nearest elevator and that is the way it works out. The Chairman. A market which takes more than one-fourth of all our product is not a slaughter market? Mr. Wharton. I think in point of fact it is about one-tenth. (See correction at end of statement.) The Chairman. You are mistaken about that, I think; and in cotton it is about two-thirds. Mr. Wharton. We are speaking about wheat; I think it is about one- tenth. I do not pretend to be correct, because I am not in that line of business. The Chairman. I think you will find when it comes to fat cattle at least (I represent a district that has a great many fat cattle raised in it) that the price of them abroad is a little better. Mr. Wharton. That is probably because you send the pick over. 270 METALS. The Chairman. That is true, those are picked cattle which are sent abroad. Mr. Whaeto^;. But I think I may fairly ask whether your people who arc engaged in raising rattle do not feel satisfied, on the whole, they get better prices for their cattle by reason of having an enormous home market at their doors than they could get for their cattle if they had no other market except Liverpool "! The Chaieman. I think our people feel that if they can send their cattle over to Liverpool and sell on the Liverpool market that we can take care of the home market. If they can jjay the freight and sell them in Liverpool nobody can beat them out of the home market. I think that is their idea. Mr. Whaeton. I « ould say at one time the argument was used against us when we were talking about a duty on steel rails that we Avere unable to supi)ly steel rails which the country needed. We were asked why should the railroad companies be obliged to pay a bonus on steel rails when the country did not supply them; that if we were able to make all the rails that was another question. We went on and did build more mills and imjiroved these until now we are more than able to supply the whole country. The Chairman. You spoke of being willing to contend with the foreigner when you were put upou an equality with him in answer to Judge Turner's question, did you not? Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir. The CHAIR3IAN. Xow, let us take the matter of steel rails as a mat- ter of illustration. I understood you to say that the price of steel rails in this country hasgone down to $29 a ton? Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir. The Chairman. It is, has been generally $30 a ton in recent years? ]ilr. ^^'HARTON. Yes, sir; the price ran about $30 a ton for about a year, and then when this depression began there were not orders enough to keep the mills going and they competed with each other and cut the price down to $29 a ton, and I have heard of some sales made at some mills at a lower ligure. Mr. Gear. As low as $26 a ton? Mr. Wharton. We fortunately have not come to that yet. Mr. Dalzell. We have not struck that point in Pennsylvania yet? Mr. Wharton. IsTo. The Chairman. Let us pursue that inquiry a little further. Can you tell us the difference in the cost of producing a ton of steel rails in Pennsylvania and in England and on the Continent? Mr. Wharton. No; I can not. I did not come prepared for that. The Chairman. Have you ever examined the volume of the report of the Commissioner of Labor where he has gone into this subject very exhaustively? Mr. Wharton. JSTo; I have never seen that book. The Chairman. It is the Sixth Annual Eeport of the Commissioner of Labor. Mr. Wharton. I remember to have heard from some persons who had read the book that the Commissioner of Labor did not include in the statement of what the labor was for making a ton of rails all of the branches and items that should have been included. The Chairman. These are thefiguresof the reportof theCommissioner of Labor. The average cost j^er ton of 2,240 pounds of steel rails in the United States was $24.80, in Great Britain it was $18.59, and on the continent it was $19.57. Can you give us any idea what the expense IRON AND STEEL. 271 is of transporting a ton of steel rails from abroad where they are made in England to the seaboard in this country? Mr. Wharton. I do not think it would be fair for me to attempt to give figures like that when I am not prepared to give them. I am will- ing to say if the committee desires to have accurate and carefully pre- pared information on that point we will prepare such a statement. The Chairman. I am not pressing that question, of course, Mr. Wharton. Assuming these figures of the Commissioner of Labor to be correct, so that the diilerence between the cost of producing a ton of steel rails in this country and in England is $6 a ton, then to get upon an equality with the English producer you would need a tariff upon steel rails which, added to the cost of the transportation to this country, woiild make his steel rails enter the market at the same price as you can produce? Mr. Wharton. I have answered that question in part in a remark 1 made a while ago that I have been told by persons who have examined that statement of the Commissioner of Labor that it is not a true statement, because it did not include all those items or branches of labor which has been engaged so as to properly show the difference be- tween the two. Then as to the transportation, I have already stated that wherever the Englishman can get in by water he has the advan- tage over us instead of we having the advantage over him. He can get to Galveston, New Orleans, Mobile, and all of those places, and still more so San Francisco, at much cheaper transportation rates than we can. The Chairman. I presume these items of cost as taken in one country were taken in all the others, so if any were omitted in the United States they were omitted in the other countries also, and if I remember cor- rectly, I will not state it as a fact, the Commissioner complained that only one of the steel manufacturers of this country would give any information as to the cost of production. I may be mistaken about tliat, but this equality which you spoke of in answer to Judge Turner would be brought about by a tariff sufficient to bring up the cost of the English rail when brought to this country to the increased cost of production in this country, would it not? Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir; but I am not prepared to admit that this statement made by the Commissioner of Labor is accurate when, on the contrary, I have reasons to believe it is not accurate. The Chairman. I am not pressing that at all. I am just asking of the general proposition that a tariff which added to the cost and trans- portation, if there be any increased cost in bringing rails over here, would equalize the price at whi(;h the Englishman could sell in this market, and the price you could produce and sell would be made on that equality. Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir; but now comes another branch of the sub- ject which has to be considered, and that is to say that in countries which pretend to be much more nearly free-trade countries than we are, no country, not one that pretends to the lowest degree of civilization, will admit that its citizens shall not have an advantage. They do not say that their citizens shall stand in the arena merely on equal terms, but they say that the legislators are guardians of those people and that we will see that our champions have some advantage over their antag- onists, so that Germany, and France, and Austria, and countries which are nearly on equal terms as to labor, each protects its labor, notwith- standing that fact, by an import duty to protect their enterprises. 272 METALS. The Chaibxan. I was simply putting tlie r[uestion on the basis of your own answer Mr. Wharton. If I remember what was said, perhaps I do not re- member it accurately, it was we were able to produce here on the same terms of other persons if we had labor upon the same terms and if that point was equalized by tariff legislation we would then be on equal terms. The Chairman. Now, anything which increases the jirice of crude iron and crude steel, if I use those terms properly, to the workers in iron and steel, is to their disadvantage? Mr. Wharton. That question is not so pertinent to the point as it would seem, becanse the persons who make finished products in iron and steel are to some extent the same persons who make those crude materials. The steel-rail maker these days does not expect to pur- chase the pig iron to make it. He purchases pig iron from time to time when he finds he can buy to advantage, and when he finds he can produce it to more adA^antage he produces it. The Chairman. I understand the 450,000 workers which you alluded to included all the workers in iron and steel? Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir; all of them. The Chairman. Well, those who are obliged to have crude iron and crude steel in their works, are not they injured by anything which stimulates the price of the material in which they work? Mr. Wharton. There are present here gentlemen who are in the position to which you allude, for instance people who make wire, wire nails, one of the largest branches of the steel business at the present day. I think it would be far more enlightening to the committee to let some of those gentlemen answer the question whether he thinks he can get his material in the long run cheaper if the American mills were shut up than if the American mills were kept going with a tariff, even if the tariff rate was apparently unnecessarily high. The Chairman. That reminds me to ask a question which I thought of while you were making your first remarks. Taking the improbable supposition of wiping ou^t all rates on iron and steel goods of every kind, what would the effect of that be upon the foreign producers? Mr. Wharton. Why, of course, that would stimulate them to a larger production, and they would occupy this market to the extent they could. The Chairman. Is there any country which could occupy our mar- ket? Mr. Wharton. Not wholly. The Chairman. Could any country occupy a very large part of our market? Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir ; there is England, Cermany, and France, and Belgium, which are ready to occupy a large portion of it. The Chairman. Would not the effect be to increase prices abroad so we could still hold on to our market? Mr. Wharton. That is problematical; we do not know to what extent that would take place, but to some extent it would, and if they undertook to carry it too far they will reach a point where we can Itcgiii to gain even without any duty, but that, of course, would be temporary, and in a very little while the i)rice would drop again, and probably drop lower than before. You see these things are so enormous and the interest is so widespread it is quite impossible for them to be inactive and to perform their function of supplying the country cheaply and, IRON AND BTEEL. 273 that is to say, steadily. They have to be satisfied they can M-ork steadily. ,The Chairman. Have yon any idea what part of the world's prodnet of iron is consnnied in the United States? Mr. Whakton. Mr. Swank can tell that. I think it is between a ^ and a ^; how is that, Mr. Swank ? Mr. Swank. We prodnce 28 per cent of iron ore, 27 per cent of coal, 33 per cent of pig- iron, and 34 per cent of steel. The Chairman. Yon say we consnme at least one- third of the world's product of steel ? Mr. Swank. No, we produce it. The Chairman. That is a pretty far advanced civilization. Mv. Wharton. Tliat is very satisfactory. Mr. Turner. In regard to this riuestion of equality between our manufacturers and those abroad, I have no doubt that it is a subject you have thought of a great deal in the last thirty or forty years since you have been here studying this matter, and I wish you to state as distinctly as you can what you make the basis. of the equality between our manufacturers and those abroad. Mr. Wharton. The first point of the basis is the higher rate of wages our people have without which we can not have the work done. Mr. Turner. Generally the wages are one element? Mr. Wharton. That is a fundamental point, the wages are the chief point. Mr. Turner. Is there any other point you would like to have protec- tion for? Mr. Wharton. Then there is a question, that we have to bring in material which we can not get in this country. Until quite lately we had to bring in our material generally, ferro manganese and spiegeleiseii. The duty upon these things has enabled us to explore our own country, and we have come to constantly increasing independence upon foreign material, but they still send us a great deal of those things and to that extent we are at a disadvantage to pay transportation on those things which enter into the manufacture of steel rails coming from abroad. Then the interest on capital is large over here. We are not able to set out a plant and spend $5,000,000 or $10,000,000 and get that money upon as cheap terras as people in any of the old countries can get it. We can not indiice it to come out, we can not gather it together, and can not get it uidess with such inducement in the way of interest that other countries do not have to pay. Mr. Turner. Is not the interest rate rapidly approaching to an equality between all countries °? Mr. Wharton. If you had asked that question a year ago I should say it \vas approximately, that there was some prospect it would come together, and even then while we were paying in the open market about 4 per cent the London market was about 3.4. We have not reached the point of getting money like they get it abroad, and besides that we have not the same steadiness in our money market, and the danger we are under of having all our floating debt demanded is greater than that danger on the other side, and we have to meet it by something like 3. special insurance lisk, which Mr. Turner. Then what makes the elements necessary to put you on equal terms to fight with your competitors abroad would be the wages in chief, the difference in interest account, and I believe you mentioned some small items. T h 18 274 METALS. Mr. Wharton. The difference of cost of some materials we are obliged to get abroad. Mr. Turner. The difference in cost of some imported material! Mr. Wharton. Then I think I ought to add to that this point :_ That this country is very full of enterprises of all sorts, very full of schemes of all sorts that you have to promise something in the way of profit. It is not merely the cost of interest on the plant, but you can not induce people to go into a particular line of business unless they have a pretty good show of a profit in addition to interest. Now, they are in the habit on the other side of being contented when a business has anything like stability with lower rates of profit than we are, and that, although it might seem to be an argument claiming for manufacturers an undue rate of gain, is really nothing but meeting one unavoidable condition which, we have to encounter here, we have to induce capi- tal to go into any particular branch of business. It has to be coaxed and has to be shown that it will do better in this than elsewhere. When there is an excess of capital seeking investment people will take the risk of the enterprise on cheaper terms than they will where capi- tal is always scarce. Mr. Turner. In other words, you are in the habit of getting larger dividends here? Mr. Wharton. We know we can not get capital to go into an enter- prise unless we hold out inducements. Mr. Turner. Is that an element which enters into this question we are talking about? Mr. Wharton. It is. I am perfectly aware that this line of argu- ment has some danger for our cause, and yet I think in fairness it ought to be stated; and on the other hand I think it is not entirely as potent as it migbt be, because the foreigners get as big a price as they can; but in point of fact the condition can not be escaped that if any one wants to establish a new line of industry, no matter Avhat it is, he can not get capital to go into that unless he can show a very strong pros- pect of profit, otherwise that capital will go somewhere else. So, it is not merely we borrow capital, but it is also we borrow capital that is invested that has to have a higher rate of interest or dividends than a corresponding capital borrowed or invested in foreign countries. Mr. Eeed. Would it be just to say that the interest or the use of the money element is larger in this country, and also the ri.sk element which you bave to meet by a larger profit is greater in this country owing to the extent of it and the various kinds of enterprises; is that your idea? Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir ; I spoke of that a little while ago when I spoke of the extra fire risk or hazard in this country seeming to be greater than other countries. Mr. Eeed. On account of its size and instability Mr. Wharton. It is partly on account of a less degree of stability in all our institutions; I am not speaking of civil, but our commercial institutions. We have not the solidity of other countries, but further- more we have to encounter this constant apprehension that some new king may arise who knew not Joseph and knock the pins from under us. We do not know at any time what the next Congress is going to do. Mr. Eeed. Is it not also a fact we are engaged here in new enter- prises whicli have a certain element of risk ? For instance, take the Alabama venture ; at one time that was a great risk. It was not certain, with all the information you could get, that these mines would turn out to be good. Mr. Wharton. Then the persons wliosaw that opening, and analyzed IRON AND STEEL. 275 the veins of ore and coal, they even did not have the money to put up great establishments, and as a general thing, no one man has. The per- sons who saw these advantages had to induce other persons to associate themselves with them. They had to induce capital to come in and hel]) them to put up these establishments, which now may be fairly called magnificent establishments. Mr. Turner. On the subject of these risks to which Mr. Reed has referred, I understood you to state just now that this business you rep- resent has been inaugurated a long time. I believe it has been more or less in existence for a hundred years. Mr. Wharton. The manufacture of iron? Mr. Turner. In pretty full vigor"? Mr. Wharton. It has not been in full vigor. I happen to own down in the State of New Jersey one of the old establishments that made iron before the Eevolutionary war. Well, they made that iron from the bog- iron ores of that region and charcoal which was made from the pine and oak trees. Mr. Turner. At any rate, this business is not in the experimental stage here any more than it is abroad? Mr. Wharton. Well, it is somewhat so; to the extent that they were at it for some number of centuries before we were. We have, however, come up to the front in a marked degree. Mr. Turner. You stated just now what gratified me very much, and that was that you are willing to fight on the principle of equality; I understood you to say that awhile ago. Mr. Wharton. I should like for the reporter to turn back and see what I said and then I can tell. Mr. Turner. I think it is perfectly fair for you to put it as you wish, and I made that statement just then in order to follow itup by an inquiry I was going to make on this question of equality. I certainly wish to take no advantage of you, because you understand it much better than I do. Speaking of the disadvantages you encounter in the market, some of which you have enumerated here to me, the difference in wages, the difference in capital, and this question of your custom of paying higher profits or dividends on your capital, etc. ? Mr. Wharton. I do not think I should say it was the custom to do it, but we can not induce these persons whose money we want to let us have the money without doing it. Mr. Turner. Is not that presented in the difference in interest rates ; does not that cover that? Mr. Wharton. I tried to point out that while the two things run in the same general channel they are not identical. Part of the money we hire, we borrow, we have in the form of mortgage bonds and part floating debts, another part we have fixed in the way of capital stock, and a certain part is therefore invested and a certain part borrowed. On each of these branches of capital required in our business we have to encounter high rates. We have to pay more for money we hire and we have to have the inducement in profit higher than other countries because the general rate of money is higher. Mr. Turner. Did you note in this computation — I am endeavoring to come to your aid — the element of watered stock ; did you refer to that? Mr Wharton. IS'o, sir; I made no allusion to anything of the kind. Mr. Turner. You did not mean to include that? Mr. Wharton. So far as I know, watered stocks do not exist in the iron and steel business. I think I may safely say in the whole iron and steel business through and through that there is no watered stock, but 276 METALS. the stocks are habitually lower than the actital money there. I know for certain that is the case in several large establishments I am inter- ested in. Mr. Turner. Take this little itemized account I am trying to make with you on the other side. Do not the American manufacturers have some advantages which the foreign competitors do not have? Mr. Wharton. Well, I am not sure I comprehend what you mean. Mr. TuRXER. Is not your labor more efficient than it is on the other side? Mr. Wharton. I am not prepared to say that. I have seen people work in a great many foreign establishments and they seem to be per- fectly diligent. We try to get some advantage in the matter of having the work done as far as we can by the piece, piecework instead of day wages. Mr. Turner. Is not the product of your labor, man for man, labor for labor, greater than on the other side? - Mr. Wharton. That is a general question to which I am not pre pared to say yes or no. Mr. Turner. It is generally conceded, is it not? Mr. Wharton. No ; I do not think it is. Mr. Turner. If you are not prepared to admit it as to your busi- ness Mr. Wharton. I think, as a matter of patriotism, we are rather inclined to think the Yankee is a good deal quicker and brisker than anybody else. You ask an Englishman that question, and he will say his workmen are superior to any American, and you ask a Gei'man or Frenchman, and he wiU say this, his countrymen are quicker. Mr. Turner. I see you take certainly a very intelligent view of this matter and have thought it all out. Can not a laborer who gets more generous pay, lives better, with better facilities for education of his children, under free institutions, cheaper food, cheaper rents, perhaps, but certainly cheaper food, can not he produce more than the pinched laborer we have heard of so much on the other side? Mr. Wharton. If the laborer is in that condition which we hear called "pauper," a poor, famished animal, of course the well-fed, pros- perous animal Avill do more, but it is the function of the people who carry on these large establishments to keep their men in perfectly good condition. Mr. Turner. Do I understand you to say, from your observation, that it is not a well-founded charge that the laborers are paupers ou the other side? Mr. Wharton. I know a large part of them are faMy prosperous. I know that the talk about the pauper labor is like extreme statements that are made upon what I might call the free-trade side of the ques- tion, but I have never for my part — I do not know that I have ever, in a single instance — used the term "pauper labor." ■\[r. Turner. I am glad to see you take that view of it. Mr. Wharton. A pauper is a person who has sunk below the posi - tion of being a laborer. He is a man without employment, without a home, and almost without a hope, but I know that large employers of labor in other countries take pains to keep their men in great efficiency. I know in the great cstiiblishment of Krupp, in Germany, tbey have all kinds of institutions connected with that establishment which gives to his workmen advantages not merely Mr. Turner. Docs this labor fare as well on the other side as here? Mr. Wharton. I think in Krupp's establishment they do. What IRON AND STEEL. 277 you may call the faucy side of living is loss indulged in there than here, but as far as substantial comfort is coiicetued I should saiy Krupp's workmen are as well oft' as any in this country. I happened to know Mr. Krupp personally, and I asked on one occasion in regard to a statement of the different establishments that he has set up in con- nection with his works, for the benefit of his men. Well, it was an as- tounding list. I began in his shops, and there are all kinds of supplies, food of all kinds, mutual benefit associations that take care of him when he is disabled, which bury him when he is dead, and gi^-e attention to his family, libraries, instruction of all sorts, and the whole thing on a scale of what can not be called anything less than magnificent. I know also on one occasion, when there was threatened a strike — this malady of trying to injure your employer by striking — which threatened the Krupp establishment and Krupp announced to his i^eople that any man who joined, who belonged to these associations, would forfeit all the advantages he possessed as a workman of his establishment in all these different associations, naming them, and the quarrel or insur- rection ended. Mr. TuENEB. Then you would say the American laborer has no su- perior advantage over the laborers on the other side as a general rule? Mr. Whaeton. No; I said on the contrary our people here, I think I said sometime ago our people here had these advantages : They did live in a better style. They are not content without that, and that on the whole our people are better housed and fed and cared more for than those of other countries, but now when you come to specific instances we find that the people with whom we have to compete — I am speaking of iron and steel now — we find in numerous instances our most efifective competitors have taken pains that their men shall be well cared for, housed and well clothed to an extent none of our people in this country have yet been able to reach. Mr. Turner. Then you would not admit that they have any advan- tage here in the productiveness of labor growing out of the conditions I have mentioned. Let us advance a step farther. Do not you as an employer, or your associates in this business, find your labor better than it is on the other side from the fact the American laborer has so many larger j)ossibilities before him than the laborer iu theforeign mills? Does not he have more ambition, is not he more anxious to rise in the world on accoimt of his better opportunities ? Mr. Wharton. My personal belief is, our people do have this am- bition. Mr. Turner. I mean in a higher degree than on the other side? Mr. Wharton. I know in the establishment in Bethlehem in which I am intesrested our people do have just that spirit you speak of. They hope to improve, and in a number of cases they have been iiro- moted, and I think most of them work up every chance they have. We can not say we have exclusive possession of these advantages, because in every other country you will find the same thing has happened. Krupp, the original founder of the establishment, began as a black- smith and his sons carry on the flnn, the establishment which has grown to this magnitude. It is not the college-bred man, it is not the man whose father was rich, it is not even those who had the advantages of a scientific education who habitually come to the front. It is the tough, hard-working, honest, solid men, whether they are educated or whether they are born rich or college-bred or the reverse, that come to the front. It is the personal quality of the man and not inherited advantage. Mr. Turner. Now, resuming this discussion between us as to the 278 METALS. elements of this equality or inequality which exists between the two countries in fundamental conditions. From your experience in the business how large a percentage would represent the ditierence between the labor cost, the interest cost, and the other items you mention, on this side and on the other? Mr. Wharton. I would not consider that I was doing justice to my colleagues if I attempted in an off-hand way to answer so far-reaching a question. If you desire to have that information I think it is our duty to prepare a statement to that effect, but I can not give it to you at this time. Mr. Turner. I thank you, sir, for your candor. Now, do you want anything more than equality. I understood you to intimate to the chairman a moment ago a sort of retreat from that position, probably not Intending it, but when you are contending with these soldiers of industry abroad I understood in the first part of your remarks you wanted to be on an equal footing, and afterwards I understood you to imply you wanted a little better position thau the foreigner"? Mr. Wharton. It was because I was not clear as to what I said that I asked you to have the reporter turn back and read it. Mr. Turner. It is perfectly fair for you to make your statement as you want it, either now or by revision. What I want now is, to know which position do you mean to take. Do you want to be on an equality with your (jompetitors on the other side or do you want a decided ad- vantage over them? Mr. Wharton. As to what I meant to say, and what I should have said was, if this point of disadvantage was removed, that we were able then to work as cheaply, and produce things as cheaply as people in other countries, but now I want to say this: Supposing an army of in- dustrial soldiers on the one hand is made exactly equal to an army of industrial soldiers of another country, of a hostile country. Here are those two armies face to face, and suppose you or anyone of the gentle men here were the general of our army aud the other army had a dif- ferent general, I want to ask you whether it is not our right, if it is not your duty, to see that your army has every possible advantage that your strategy and your skill can give them. Have not we the right to demand that you will keep us in this position or put us in a strategic spot that will give us an advantage over our common antagonist? Mr. Turner. But this is not exactly a question of war? Mr. Wharton. I think it is, sir. I think it is exactly. Mr. Turner. It is of interest, not only to these particular soldiers that you mention, but also of a great public at large. The question of ])rice is one which concerns them as well as your industrial soldiers you are talking about? Mr. Wharton. These industrial soldiers are in our case our indus- trial army which is defending our country from an invasion. Mr. Turner. Yes; but we have industrial soldiers wOio want to invade other countries for instance. Mr. Wharton. If they are defeated at home and their own country is taken from them they will not be a large number. Mr. Turner. The wheat and cotton producers and the farmers gen- erally to whom the chairman alluded just now, and these men who make edged tools and mowers and reapers, and agricultural implements, are not they standing on that wall you are talking about, and do not they want to charge into other countries and "carry the war into Africa " to use a phrase in military parlance, I believe. Mr. Wharton. We need our own makers of things which go into IKON AND STEEL. 279 the productiou of wheat and cottou, aud cattle, and whatever it may be, aud we are able to give them those things more cheaply if we are protected than we could otherwise. Mr. ToRNER. I want to say that a remark you made awhile ago about fighting this battle had a sort of inspiring effect upon me when you said all you wanted was equal terms, but now Mr. Wharton. Let me go back once more, I have tried to correct that several times. I am under the impression I did not say that all we wanted was that, all yve needed was that, but that these conditions being equal we were able to fight on equal terms. Then when you ask if we want something more I say this, if you command our army we expect you to do your duty and give us the advantage that your skill as a legislator can give us. Mr. Turner. How much advantage do you want? Mr. Wharton. If you had been at the battle of Gettysburg in Han- cock's army Mr. Turner. I was there; but, unfortunately, on the other side. Mr. Wharton. I did not know that. Mr. Turner. I found there was a considerable advantage on one side there. Mr. Wharton. I am glad you mentioned this, because it brings up a question I alluded to a little while ago, and that is in regard to the hostility which used to exist between the different sections of the country on this question, between the North and South, and between the At- lantic seaboard and the West. Those two lines of demarkation have been greatly obliterated, and we think they ought to be entirely obliter- ated, and we feel therefore we have a strong adherence in what I may call the national cause, instead of a protective cause, in the South and West, as in the Bast. In the East there is a sort of weariness which has come upon us. We have been contending with this trying to de- velop the country so long we are rather tired out, and we have almost come to think if the country can get along without us we will let them try it, go and do something else, and give it up. That is a sneaking round way of looking at the question, for I do not think, in fact, we can give it up. There is a great population around us, and we can not shake them off. Tou may say there are thousands and tens of thousands of our industrial soldiers now idle and in danger of starving. We can not say, in an indifferent manner, if these people are to have free trade let us have it. We can not do that. We have got to do what we can to help these men ; to help them to employment and to give them a fair chance for decent living, and we think we have a right to ask your kindly consideration. Mr. Turner. Well, sir, speaking for myself alone, I do not think there is any purpose on my part to destroy your industry; but I inter- rupted a question which the gentleman from Tennessee desires to ask you. Mr. McMiLLiN. If I understood you correctly you said that you did not desire the rates to be exclusive in their nature, that would exclude importations 1 Mr. Wharton. Yes, I think I said that we never had hoped to have importations excluded. Mr. McMiLLiN. I think you said you did not think it would be well to have them excluded ? Mr. Wharton. I think probably I did. I think in other words it is quite possible to have duties set at so high a point as to make people what I call slouchy and negligent. That is theoretical and not 280 METALS. altogether sound, because when wc come to see what experience teaches us we find on the contrary when the rate is so high as to induce rather too many persons to go into a trade we liave then two liinds of fights among us, internal competition, domestic competition in different busi- nesses. Mr. McMiLLiN. The rate on steel rails in England lately is pro- hibitive? Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir. Mr. McMxLLiN. Then the rate on steel rails you admit to be too high? Mr. Wharton. That is another question. I do not admit it to be too high. May I introduce another analogy? I should say, if the people of Holland find it necessary for their land to have dilies around them to keep the sea out, I do not think it would be a wise Plollauder to say he has lived in that country for five years and never saw the tide rise above the level and therefore he will only put the dike an inch above that level. There are times when a huge wave can sweep over it, and in commercial affairs it is like in the ocean, where you may have enough protection just sufficient for ordinary times, but extraor- dinary times it is utterly insufficient and it is drowned out. Now, I ad- mit in the case of steel rails that this duty is so high as to be at present prohibitive. Mr. McMiLLiN. 1 was going on your premises; you stated that it was neither desired nor did you think expedient that rates should be prohibitive. Then I said the rates on rails are prohibitive, therefore the rate on steel rails is too high. I was going on your premises ; I was not making the premises. Mr. Wharton. Would it not be a fair way to ask the consumer of steel rails what they think about the rate of duty? The great buyers of steel rails, the only buyers of course, are the railroad companies, ex- cept small private operators; the railroad comj)anies are the buyers of -steel rails, and the question was brought ujj in a very favorable way some years ago in regard to the extortion steel-rail inakers practiced in regard to railroads, etc., and the question was put before the presideiits of the great railroads of the country and they I think unanimously, 1 do not remember one to the contrary, all said that they desired the rate to remain as it was, a much higher rate than the present one, as they were satisfied thereby they could get their rails cheaper than tliey would if the industry of making steel rails here was discouraged. Mr. McMiLLiN. I want to get you to state if it is not a fact that a number of the large consumers of steel rails in the country Avere stock- holders in your association. Mr. Wharton. I know of only one instance where they were used in a large degree Mr. McMiLLiN. It was so in a larger or smaller degree in a number of individuals? Mr. Wharton. I presume so. Mr. McMiLLiN. Now, in regard to the one of lai-ge degree, of course they were willing for their roads to continue? Mr. Wharton. The Pennsylvania Railroad was a large stockholder in the Pennsylvania Steel Company, birt that company is ])erhciips the closest buyer in America. The Pennsylvania Eailroad is the closest buyer perhaps in America and did not allow its interest as a stockholder in this steel company to influence its conduct. Mr. McMiLLiN. As a matter of fact, when they were saying they IRON AND STEEL. 281 were willing for the rates to contiuue the same they were stockliolders in tliat concern whicli isroiited by the rates continuing 1 Mr. Whaeton. Yes. Mr. McMiLLiN. We are large exporters of agricultural implements, plows, reapers, mowers, I believe large exporters of sewing macMnes, pianos, and other forms of iron, screws, etc., are we not? Mr. Whaeton. I think se, I think of all those you have enumerated. Mr. McMiLLiN. Now, is not it a fact we are large exporters mainly of those things where a large amount of work is expended on the orig- inal material rather than on those which are in the cruder state? Mr. Whaeton. Yes, undoubtedly. I must clear up that point a little further by saying those articles are only where the ingenuity of our j)eople have displayed themselves and the article produced is a better article. It is not merely the question of price but it is they are the better thing. Mr. McMiLLiN. It is where a large amount of labor has gone into the manufacture of the things which we principally export? Mr. Wharton. Yes, sir; skill also. Take for instance the Baldwin Locomotive Works. They export locoJJiotives to a great many parts of the world in competition. Mr. McMiLLiN. Now, on a subject you touched on in the begin- ning. Very briefly I wiU ask you as to our exportation of wheat. We are large exporters of wheat, cotton, tobacco, and other farm products, corn and things of that kind? Mr. Whaeton. I am not sufficiently up on statistics to answer that question. Mr. McMiLLiN. We have statistics to show, and is it not a fact that the rise of the price of 1 cent a pound or 1 cent a bushel on these things in Liverpool raises it here; do not the markets fall and rise together? Mr. Whaeton. That is approximately true, yes. But in a local way, when we go into details, you find in a great many instances the farmer gets more money selling in this country than by selling to a foreign customer. I do not know, gentlemen, how you feel, but I feel I am ab- sorbing time that belongs to my colleagues. The Ohaieman., You have been very interesting; it is our fault and not yours. Mr. Eeed. I want to ask you this question. Some figures are pre- sented here showing what things cost in Great Britain and what they cost here, and what tbey cost in Belgium and what they cost here. Now in regard to the elements which go to make up a ton of steel rails, can these figures from the nature of things be invariable — do not they vary at different times? Mr. Whaeton. They are affected constantly, of course. Mr. Reed. Consequently anything which exactly fitted a certain state of figures may not exactly fit when they come to be put in operation? Mr. Whaeton. Yes, sir; all we can hope is to approximate in a case like that. Often we have tried to fit the figures to a particular moment of time and we can not be sure is absolutely- accurate, and we can only approximate it when we come to apply the figures to that time. Mr. Eeed. There is a question of relative prosperity at a given time and you make a wide difference as to what is necessary for a protective tariff ? Mr. Whaeton. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzbll. Does not the cost of labor of the various items whicli go to make up steel rails differ at various places ? Mr. Whaeton. Of course they do, Mr. Dalzell. The cost of mining the ore at one place differs from 282 METALS. the cost of mining at another place, so that very likely there are no two establishments in the country where the cost of making a ton of steel rails is exactly the same? Mr. Whaeton. There are no two places where the same figures rule, and in the concern I am particularly interested in I do not remem- ber any time when the rate of the cost to produce steel rails was so low as stated by the Commissioner of Labor. If they went to one particu- lar concern but one particular concern produced steel rails as low as that. I do not deny his veracity. Mr. Dalzell. Taking into consideration the difference in cost in all these various items and then of the final cost at these various mills, in the nature of the case could you make anything like an approximation of the average cost for the whole of America or the whole of England? Mr. Wharton. You could not be accurate, of course. Mr. Beeckineidgb. This law of variation of which Mr. Eeed spoke, is it not liable to operate the same way in two countries 1 Mr. Wharton. Yes. The fluctuations are perhaps more in a newer country where enterprises are so numerous and affect them more than in an older and more settled country. I do not in fact believe that Krupij's wages fluctuate to the extent that Carnegie's do. Mr. Breckinridge. If we get the cost of production in two coun- tries and let it average over a considerable period of an ordinary normal Superior and Bilbao and Cleveland labor cost per ton. Our last census reports 38,227 persons engaged directly in American iron ore mining. There were 1,306 foremeu, 2,079 mechanics, 12,432 miners, 21,010 laborers, 820 boys, 520 men in mine offices. The amount paid in wages was $15,458,118, an average annual earning capacity for each person so employed of $409.95. This was an increase iu wages per man employed over the census returns for ISSO of $101.01 per annum, or 32.7 per cent, due principally to the fact that more mines are wrought underground, permitting more steady employment and requiring a higher grade of labor. These census inquiries, as to labor and wages, included the working forces at the mine only. The average wages of foremen was: Above ground, $2.40; below ground, $2.46; mechanics, $1.90; miners below ground, $1.91; laborers above ground, $1.29; below ground, $1.60. The range of wages on Lake Superior is about 20 to 25 per cent above these total averages for tlie whole country. The average labor cost per ton iu the United States is $1.06. In 1889 the total capital invested in mines was $109,766,199. The increase has been very large in the last three years. In view of all these facts it can not be doubted that the present rate of duty on ore really represents much less than the difference of the labor cost of production at home and abroad. iSTor can it be doubted that the presence of the duty has always powerfully operated to stimu- late the exploration and the development of American ores. Underneath our iron and steel industries, then, in consequence, lies an abundant and reliable American ore supply as against an impossible reliance on foreign ores. The essential conditions of prosperity and permanence, as to mate- rials of primary manufacture, are now all here — quantity, quality, and price; for it must be borne in mind that, uuder improved methods of mining and the domestic competition, the prices of iron ore to mills and furnaces have steadily declined, until tlie range of prices at the opening of 1893 was materially lower than ever before. The following table of prices of Lake Superior ore for the last six years shows this: Grades, Repuljlic and Champion No. 1 Clbvclaud and Lake Superior specular No. 1 non- Bessemer Chapin Soft iieinatii es No. 1 non-Bessemer Gogebic, ilarqnette, and Menominee No. 1 Isesse- nier tieiu al.ites Minnesota No. 1 Ucssemer Miunesola No. 1 non-J?eHsemer Chandler No. 1 Bessemer Lal, sir. I have not the data, but I could get it. Mr. Breckinridge. Therefore you are not prepared to say what your industry actually needs? Mr. Stirling. I can remember when it was thought to be bank- ruptcy to sell steel rails at £4. They are selling now for £3 12s. 6d. Tlie i^rotoction that I want is the iwotection that will give me a living price, and which will enable me to pay Avages and give the margin to which capital is entitled to have beloAv the least possible figure that the foreigner can run on. Mr. Breckinridge. Have you submitted the cost of production or the approximate of what your industry really needs? ' Mr. Stirling. No, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Are you going to submit that to us? Mr. Stirling. I do not think the cost of production of my company would be a fair basis for the action of this entire country. There is a ■ STEEL. 303 differencpi between the cost in the product of my own mills. Five years ago I had a small billet mill in this country, at Joliet, and in the year 1892 the whole total outcome of the manufacture of that plant at Joliet by our company, after taxes, maintenance, and regular repairs were done, showed no profit, with about 11,000,000 capital. We did not earn or declare any dividend. I \vill have to spend $12,000 to have that plant put in repair, and I have not turned a wheel this year. The money I have in it is going to be idle, adding that much to my fixed charges. How am I going to get it back again f Mr. Breckinridge. When you endeavor to influence capital to go iuto your business, do you not submit to capitalists an estimate of what you expect to make? Mr. Stirling. The only way I can get capital to assist me is by putting on a mortgage and guaranteeing it a certain rate of interest. They do not want to subscribe capital. The capital I have got intliat plant is not worth 50 cents ou the dollar. Mr. Breckinridge. Have you made an estimate of the cost of pro- duction? Mr. Stirling. Yes, sir ; we do that every month. It does not matter, however, what oue month's cost may be. Mr. Breckinridge. It is necessary for the committee, having to dis- charge as important functions as we have, to have a good idea of the average cost of production in these industries in this country, in order that we may know where to trace it. Mr. Stirling. I will say that individually for my company I do not believe there is any call for a change in the tariff as it now exists. I think it would be a great injury to change it. If the committee lias made up its mind that there must be a change, I think that our manu- facturers will be ready to give them any data which they can. Mr. Breckinridge. That is what I am trying to get. Mr. Stirling. I am not prepared to give it now. Mr. Breckinridge. Are you willing to do that? Mr. Stirling. I as one individual, or for the entire trade? Mr. Breckinridge. I do not expect you to go into a combine, I want the information. Mr. Stirling. I can get it. Mr. Breckinridge. You want this rate maintained, but you do not submit proof that it should be maintained. Mr. Stirling. I have always, so far, tried in any statement I have ever made to any committee, in any shape or form, to make no state- ment that I could not substantiate. I have always tried to give figures that I could stand on. Therefore, I would not hastily give an answer to th at question. I think that when the time comes that this committee requires information of that character we will be willing to submit figures. Mr. Breckinridge. If you can submit that kind of data, I would like to receive it, so far as I am concerned. Mr. Stirling. Bear this in mind, that the question is so peculiar, and there are so many i'actors in it that answers do not occur to me, and probably in the niultijolicity of details would not occur to you. It is impossible for me to-day to reach the Pacific coast under the i)resent duty. I think the Eastern manufacturers have hard work to get to the Pacific coast. Twenty-five thousand tons of steel came to the Pacific coast in 1890. If you bring the English rail from the seaboard and ship it to Chicago, the present duty is sufficient; but if you expect to reach the Pacific coast and meet competition, a greater rate is neces- 304 METALS. sary. The cost of production in my mill does not give you a comprehen- sive review of the «iiole situation. Mr. BkeckinridCtE. But do you believe that we ought to lay rates of duty that would bind the whole country to the American manufac- turers, regardless of the cost of transijortation"? Mr. Stirling. Practically, yes. Mr. Breckinridge. Would that enable you to charge a rate high enough to make up the difference in proximity? Mr. Stirling. If you have iron ore in Texas, and in the State of Washington, you have resources of this country which are constantly changing. The Chairman. Where do you get your ore? Mr. Stirling. From Michigan, Wisconsin, and Minnesota. The Chairman. What does it cost, delivered at your mills? Mr. Stirling. This year I suppose it will be somewhere about $3 to $4.75. The Chairman. That is Bessemer ore? Mr. Stirling. Tes, sir. The Chah;man. Where do you get your coke? Mr. Stirling. We get onr coal from Indiana and Illinois, and our coke from West Virginia and Pennsylvania. The Chairman. Do you use anthracite? J\Ir. Stirling. No, sir. The Chairman. What does your coal cost delivered at your mill? Mr. Stirling. From $1.50 to §-1.25. The Chairman. What does your coke cost ? Mr. Stirling. About $4.25. The Chairman. Where do you get your limestone? Mr. Stirling. From Logansport, Ind. The Chairman. What does that cost? Mv. Stirling. $1.25. The Chairman. Are those rates the chief cost of assembling your materials? Mr. Stirling. That is the price of transportation. The Chairman. Transportation and cost of product? Mr. Stirling. I am speaking roughly. I did not know that I was going to be asked about these details, and I may not have them ac- curate. The Chairman. Suppose that iron ore were put ujion the free list; would that aft'ect you in any way? Mr. Stirling. Mr. Breckinridge has been questioning me and he says I do not prove anything. I do not profess to prove anything. I must theorize as well as any one else. The Chairman. What eflect would it have if we put iron ore on the free list? Mr. Stirling. It would give me iron ore cheaper. The Chairman. Your iron ore conld be luid at Chicago cheaper, and you get it from Wisconsin and Michigan? Mr. Stirling. It would be cheaper in this way; but the miners in Wisconsin and Minnesota would have to work for less money. The men on the railroads would have to work for less money; the capital would have to be content with less money, and the capital invested would have to do without dividends. The Chairman. If foreign ore could not be delivered at your works cheaper than the ore from Wisconsin and Michigan, how would that affect the wages of miners? STEEL. 305 Mr. StiklinGt. The foreign ore would get to tide water and the hxke, and would j)robably meet us at Pittsburg. The Lake Superior mines would be dependent upon the consumption of Illinois and Ohio, and that would cut the business in half. The Chairman. You say that your Eastern competitors would get ore cheaper than you would? Mr. Stirling-. No, sir. The foreign ore would come into this countiy and be moved from the seaboard west, and would meet the Northern ore at a certain point, probably Pittsburg. The foreign ore would com- pel the native ore to come down in price. The Chairman. You want to be shut out from all competition where the two ores meet? Mr. Stirling. No The Chairman. Would not there be a fluctuation? Mr. Stirling. My anticipation is that the use of foreign and native ores would bring down the price. The Chairman. Do you know whether it costs more to put down a ton of ore here? Mr. Stirling. 1 do not know absolutely, from personal knowledge, but I have circumstantial evidence that that is undoubtedly the case. The Chairman. Suppose there was an American demand for foreign ore. Would not that raise the price of foreign ore at once? Mr. Stirling. If there was no impairment of the demand, probably yes. The Chairman. In order to make any reduction felt in this coun- try there would have to be a substantial demand for foreign ore, would there not? Mr. Stirling. I think we would have to import as much as 1,000,000 tons of ore to the seaboard. I do not carry the llgures in my mind. The Chairman. Do you know when the price of ore was highest? Mr. Stirling. I think that occurred in a year when the production in this country was hardly up to the consumption. The Chairman. I understood you to say that if raw material were liut upon the free list it would destroy the whole system of x^rotectioii? Mr. Stirling. I say that, based upon my definition of what raw material is. The Chairman. You employ about 9,500 men, and your pay roll was six and a half million dollars last year. How much is that per man — between $000 and .$700, is it not? Mr. Stirling. It is not far from $700. The Chairman. In that average you include not only the workmen but the clerks, superintendents, and that kind of labor, do you not? Mr. Stirling. We include the office force at the mills, the actual superintendents at the mill; but we do not include the city-office force, the president and salaried men. The Chairman. Is that rate of wages more than the rate of wages which prevails in this country in the manufactures involving arts and trades where there is no foreign comi)etition ? Mr. Stirling. I do not know. The Chairman. You are speaking of the very much higher rate of wages paid to railroad employes in this country. There is no foreign competition there, is there? Mr. Eeed. They are in the same situation as if they had a prohibi- tory tariff'. Mr. Stirling. Their employes make their wages from the product of the mines to-day. th 20 306 METALS. The Ohaieman. The only prohibitive tariff which they have is the rate on foreign tonnage to this country. Mr. Stirling. Let me state that the tonnage from our mills for the first year was $4.67 per clay; for the next year, it was $6.26 per day; the next year it was $6.97; the next year it was $7.78; and the next year it was $8.18 per day. The Chairman. Is it a question of the daily wages of labor, or is it the question of the cost of putting the product in the market? Mr. Stirling. They go together. The Chairman. Each is an element; but is not the last the princi- pal one? Mr. Stirling. The last is made up of the first. The Chairman. I thought you were rather dwelling upon the first, as if that were the only element involved. Mr. Stirling. When 1 say labor cost is 80 per eeut of the whole, it seems to me that that is the greater factor. The Chairman. It is SO per cent of the whole, if you go back to the ore'? Mr. Stirling. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Do you count everything as labor cost except roy- alty? Mr. Stirling. I count everything except taxes, insurance, and roy- alty. They are not labor. The Chairman. In the report of the Bureau of Labor, a Govern- ment publication, the cost of making a ton of steel rails is put down at about $24.80. Mr. Stirling. My exiierience with figures that I have seen pub- lished by Labor Bureaus are perfectly wild statements. The Chairman. This report of the Government is a very exhaustive inquiry into the cost generally of steel rails in this country and Eng- land, and the entire labor cost of a ton of steel rails in this country was put down at $24.80. Mr. Stirling. I nev^er in my life was able to make rails for any such price. I have Jiever done it, and I have no pros])ect of ever doing it. The Chairman. Can you not make rails as cheap as any other pro- ducer "I Mr. Stirling. I do not know. The Chairman. What portion of the product of the country do you make? Mr. Stirling. If I could run on full time I think I could make product enough to supply nearly all the country wants this year. The Chairman. How many companies are engaged in making steel rails in this country? Mr. Stirling. Tliere are eight or ten. The Chairman. Have you an agreement as to the quantity you make each year? Mr. Stirling. There is no agreement in any sliape or form that limits the product or fixes the price. The Chairman. There ii- no agreement as to the disposition of the product of tlie mills"? Mr. Stirling. There is an agreement among manufacturers, but it in no shape or form limits the product of steel rails. The Chairman. What is the agreement, then? Mr. Stirling. I do not think it necessary to state that here. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you divide the territory or the market among yourselves 1 STEEL. 307 Mr. STTELrNGr. The agreement between ourselves does not in any- way impair the customer in any shape or form. A man can get all the rails he wants at a satisfactory price. Mr. Breckineidge. Can he buy from anybody he wants to? Mr. Stirling-. He can buy from anybody. Mr. Breckinridge. Is there no correspondence between you ? Mr. Stirling. I am not aware what other mills sell for. If a man wants to buy at Sparrow's Point I can not prevent him. Mr. Brbokinkidge. There is no division of territory? Mr. Stirling. No, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Whjit is the nature of that agreement? Mr. Stirling. I said I did not think it was necessary to explain our business, and you are asking in detail the same questions which the chairman asked. Mr. Breckinridge. You are expecting your business to be protected at the cost of the people, and you are not willing to let the people know what your cost is. Mr. Stirling. I have gone on record as saying that the product is not limited, nor the i)rice monopolized or limited. Mr. Breckinridge. You declined to answer the chairman's question, however. Mr. Stirling. I did not think it was necessary. Mr. Tarsney. Have you any foreign market for your product? Mr. Stirling. No, sir. Mr. Tarsney. You do not transport goods to Mexico? Mr. Stirling. No, sir. Mr. Tarsney. Do not some steel rails go to Mexico? Mr. Stirling. I do not think that is possible. Mr. Tarsney. Did not some American steel rails go to Mexico last year? Mr. Stirling. Not that I am aware of. Mr. Tarsney. You say the cost is $1^5 for a little over the third of the cost of production in England? Mr. Stirling. The selling price in England is £3 12s. and (id. Mr. Tarsney. And the duty is $13 Ai; and you say it costs about $12 to make them. Mr. Stirling. It is about $18 or $19. Mr. Tarsney. That includes labor, material, and everything else. Mr. Stirling. Yes, sir. The Chairman. As a rule, when an article of common necessity be- comes cheapened, its consumption increases, does it not? Mr. Stirling. I should say so. The Chairman. If you make steel rails cheap, would there not be more railroads built? Mr. Stirling. I do not think so, under present conditions. I think the country has all the trunk lines it will need for sometime to come. The Chairman. Are there not a great many lines of projected rail- roads in this country ? Mr. Stirling. Not that I am aware of. The Chairman. Your idea is that we have all the railroads we need ? Mr. Stirling. For the immediate present I think the country is well supplied, unfortunately; I wish it were otherwise. The Chairman. If steel rails were cheaper in this country would it not stimulate railroad building? Mr. Stirling. I do not think so. The Chairman. The cheapening of the cost of railroad building to 308 METALS. the amount of 15 per ton on rails per mile would amount to perhaps $500 per mile lews. Mr. Stieling. Yes, sir. The Chairman. If we did imjiort steel rails, in what would we pay for them? Mr. Stirling. I suppose we would pay for them with the additional wheat which would be raised bj^ my men, because they would have to go to raising- wlieat. Whether that would make a better price to the wheat-raisers I do not liiiow. The men in the mining regions to-day have gojie from the farms, mostly. The Chairman. Ton think, as a general proposition, it would be better to hire somebody else to do your work than to do it yourself? Mr. Stirijng. 1 am a Scotchinan, and the Scotch are a little slow. I confess that I do not quite catch on to that. The Chairman. You do. not do anything for yourself that you can hire done cheaper? Mr. S'J'IRLING. 1 should think it x>robal»]c. The Chairman. You do not take care of your horses because you^ can hire somebody cheaper? Mr. Stirling. I do not take care of my horses; but what does that prove? The Chairman. If a man can make more by raising wheat or cotton, and paying for the steel rails with the wheat aud cotton than he can by making the steel rails, it would be good business for him to do it, would it not? Mr. Stirlng. Yes, sir; but if the price of that cotton is made in Liverpool, and is fixed by the price in India, I do not see where the farmer would be benefited. The Chairman. The price of wheat is fixed by the price it gets in Liverpool? Mr. Stirlin(t. Yes, sir; the price in England or in Russia. As for myself, I prefer not to take that class of connietition. Mr. Keed. The unjre ^^•heat that \\'onld be raised by your men the lower would be the price in Liverpool ? Mr. Stirling. Yes, sir. Mr. Keed. When you set j'^our men to raising wheat there would be more wheat raised aud put upon the market? Mr. Stirling. It would multiply the proilnctioii of wheat, whereas they are now consumers of wheat. The lalioring men are living on their wages. The Chairman. That is the ]iredicament of the cotton and wheat planter, Mr. Stiri-ing. I do not think you need worry al)out that. We have 90 per cent of our agricultiiial products consumed here. The Chairman. Do you think we consume 1)0 per cent of our wheat in this country ? Mr. Stirling. 1 do not know tlte detnils. The Chairman. I^o we consume 90 per cent of the cotton raised in this country? Mr. Stirling. I can not tell. We consume 90 per cent of wheat, ac- cording to the Government reports. The Chairman. Are wages in the trades and arts, which export goods such as cotton mill machinery, sewing machines, locomotives furniture, and things of that kind, as high as in your line of produc- tion? Mr. Stirling. 1 really do not know. STEEL. 309 The Chairman. Do you think it is the proteetpd industries that keep up the rate of wages in this country, or is it tlie otiier industries that maintain the rate of wages? Mr. Stirling. I am not sufficiently posted in all the rates of wages in the miscellaneous trades of the country to answer that. That is the case in my own industry, I am firmly convinced. Mr. Turner. You say that on an average the labor element in a ton of steel rails amounts to about SO per cent of the aggregate cost? Mr. Stirling. The direct and indirect labor. Mr. Turner. You said that ou this side it is two to five times as great as ou the other side. What would be the percentage of labor in a ton of the steel rails made in England? Mr. Stirling. I really do not know. Mr. Turner. Would it be one-half, or one-fifth, or what amount would it be according to the ratio you have given? Mr. Stirling. I do not know. I would have to analyze that pretty carefully. Mr. Turner. Do we pay twice as much or five times as much as on the other side? Mr. Stirling. I would say one and a half times as much. Mr. Turner. Did you not state just now that the labor cost here was two to five times as great as in England? Mr. Stirling. The labor cost, as far as I know anything about it, is two to five times as much on this side as in England. I state that as a result of an investigation made years ago. Mr. Turner. At this time, under existing conditions, what would be the relative cost of steel rails as to the element of labor between the two countries? Mr. Stirling. I have made no investigation for several years, so I can not answer that. Mr. Turner. To say that it is two to five times as great in this country makes a pretty wide margin. Who pays for the added i^rice of steel rails in tliis country? Is it the foreign manufacturer, if im- ported, or the railroads that buy as consumers? Mr. Stirling. I don't see that the foreigner has anything to do with the cost, as no importations come in. As to tin-plates, 1 can state that the foreigner is paying for them. The price has never gone up in proportion to the duty. Mr. Turner. On the question of steel rails, you have such a com- plete domination of the market as to exclude the foreigner altogether? Mr. Stirling. Mr. Swank could tell more about that than I could. I know very little, if anything, about it. Mr. Turner. It has been stated by Mr. Wharton and otiiers that very little steel rails are imported. Do you think it would be fair to put a duty at a rate that would keep them out and prevent the market coming down to a fair price? Mr. Stirling. The American consumer is satisfied with the price. The railroad people have told me so — that they are entirely satisfied. All the railroads ask is that the price should be stable. They do not want fluctuations up and down. The railroads are not asking this, for their traffic comes largely from the steelrail industry. If you will take the railroad statistics and look into them, you will find that their busi- ness in 1888 in ore, coal, steel, iron, limestone, aud coke exceeded their business in agricultural products vastly. Mr. Turner. But you forget that a great many of the railroads have 310 METALS. not tliat same relation to that traffic. They have to depend upon the agricultural communities. Mr. Stirling. You would be surprised to find how many of them are engaged in that. Mr. TuKNBR. Do you mean to say that the railroads are content with the prices you charge? Mr. Stirling. I have been so informed by the presidents of some of the leadiug trunk liues. Mr. Turner. Would they not be glad to get them at $18 instead of $2S'? Mr. Stirling. I could not state as to that. Mr. Turner. I think that must be wrong about the railroads having no souls. If that is true, I think they are very liberal. Mr. Stirling. 1 did not go to Mr. Vanderbilt for my information. Mr. Bynum. You spoke of 90 per cent of the agricultural products of this country being consumed hero. It was 98 per cent in 18G0. Mr. Stirling. I don't know about that. Mr. Bynum. Don't you know that the percentage of exportations of agricultural products is increasing, and has been increasing ever since 1800! Mr. Stirling. I was not aware of it. Even if what you say is so, it is easily explained. Mr. Bynum. It would be explained by the fact that we have been giving the home market to the farmers. Mr. Stirling. We commenced to manufacture steel rails somewhere about 1867. The growth of the trunk liues has been enormous since the introduction of steel rails. Mr. Bynum. You were giving the statement as showing that such a large proportion of agricultural products were consumed at home; and what 1 want to call your attention to is the fact that 98 per cent of our agricultural products were consumed under a low tariff, and only 90 per cent are consumed under a high tarilf. Mr. Stirling. What was 98 per cent then compared with 90 per cent now? Mr. Bynum. I want to call your attention to the fact that agricul- tural products are increasing all the time. Mr. Stirling. We are eating more of them. Mr. Bynum. You speak of the wages paid to the tonnage men. What proportion of the 9,500 men which you employ are tonnage men"^ Mr. Stirling. I could not answer that off-hand. Mr. Bynum. It is only a small proportion. Mr. Stirling. I wouldn't like to make a guess. Mr. Bynum. You have men employed by the day, I suppose? Mr. Stirling. Yes, sir; lots of them. Mr. Bynum. What do you pay them? Mr. Stirling. Fifteen cents an hour. Mr. Bynum. How many hours do they work? Mr. Stirling. Ten or 12 if they want to— at least before this depres- sion. Mr. Bynum. I am not talking about the time since the depression. 1 suppose that not more than half your men a.ie working at that rate of wages'? Mr. Stirling. Certainly not ; but that is the common rate of wages. Mr. Bynum. Is not that so in most of the iron industries? Mr. Stirling. Not that I am aware of. Mr. Bynum. Is it not so in Homestead? STEEL. 31 i Mr. Stirling. I do not -want to mislead you, or have you niisnnder- staud me. Common labor is 15 cents an hour. Foremen get $2.10 a day at Chicago. Mechanics get another rate, and there are other meu who are not common laborers or tonnage men. Mr. Bynum. The tonnage men are the highest paid labor you have? Mr. Stirling. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynum. What were steel rails worth in 1886? Mr. Stirling. I can not recollect. Mr. Bynum. You were in business then? Mr. Stirling. Yes, I have been in business ever since 1879, but I do not carry those figaires in my mind. Mr. Bynum. In 1886 there was a large increase in the demand for steel rails on account of the increased railroad construction, amounting to 12,000 miles. The price in 1885 ran up from $27 to $39 in 1886. Is not that true? Mr. Stirling. I don't know. Mr. Bynum. In ^hat year was it that they went up? Mr. Stirling. I know the Joliet Steel Company lost money in steel rails about that time. Mr. Bynum. Do you not recollect that in 1886 the price of steel rails went up from $27 to $39 a ton ? Mr. Stirling. I do not remember; there was an advance. Mr. Bynum. Do you not remember that there was an advance in the price of steel rails of about $12 a ton? What was the cause of that advance 1 Mr. Stirling. I presume it was on account of the demand. Mr. Bynum. When they were selling rails at $27 a ton, they were making a profit, were they not? Mr. Stirling. No, sir; Host my capital. Mr. Bynum. Then it would have been wise business to have closed up? Mr. Stirling. It would have been difficult to have closed up. Mr. Bynum. The tariff at that time was about $17 a ton on rails. Mr. Stirling. It may have been; I don't know. I cannot recollect these figures. Mr. Bynum. Did not the steel-rail manufacturers during that year, because of the high tariff and low competition, ruu the price up from $27 to $40 a ton? Mr. Stirling. If I had those facts and figures before me, I would be very willing to answer, but I do not recollect. Mr. Bynum. Being in the business, you ought to know. Mr. Stirling. I have not taxed my memory with those things. I do not keep track of selUng prices in years past. I have enough to do to keep up with the present time. Mr. Bynum. You speak of importations injuring the business in this country. Was it not in 1880 or 1881 that the largest importations of pig and scrap iron were made? Mr. Stirling. I fancy it would be, but at the same time that was a year of extraordinary activity all over the world, and prices were abnormally high. Therefore the suiplus demand had to be supi)!ied from abroad and was supplied. It was high iii this country. Mr. Bynum. Have you examined statistics with reference to the ques- tion as to whether years of prosperity are not usually accompanied by the greatest importations aTid exportations ? Mr. Stirling. I do not know about that. 312 METALS. 1027 The Eookeet, Chicago, October 2, 1893. Dear Sir: When I bad the honor of appearing before your commit- tee and addressing you on the subject of the tariff as related to the iron and steel indiistries, questions were put to me which I could only answer approximately from memory. Having now looked up the sta- tistics that I compiled early in 1888, and which I had in mind when answering the questions referred to, and believing that it will interest you and the members of your committee to leceive specific statements, I beg to submit the following figures, which are taken from memoranda and letters in my possession: Comparative wages paid in ConnelhvilJe coal region, Pennsylvania, and in tlie coal mines of Lanarkshire, Scotland, Scotch rates being reduced to American currencjj ; years 1887-'SS. Connellaville. Lanarkshire. $1. 95 to $2. 19 1. 90 2. 20 2.50 $1.08 to $1.26 do ' __ .60 .96 Comparative wages paid in United Stales and Lanarkshire coal mines. Wilmington, 111., 1803 (3-foot vein.) Danville, 111., 1893 (6-foot vein). Seotland, 1888. ^riners' (paid liy the ton) average earnings Engineers Traeknien. timliermen, roadmen, etc .per day.. do ....do.... $2.28 2. 00 to 2. 60 1. 80 2. 25 1.50 $2.12 2. 50 to 3. 00 2. 00 2. 50 2.00 $1.09 .91 $1. 03 to 1. 09 .48 .91 EAILEOAD LAEOE. Chicago. Scotland. Xiocomotive en,i,nneers — Passenger per month. . Freight do-. Switchmen do. . Section foremen do.. Section hands ])er day .. Blacksmiths per hour.. Boiler-makers jter day . . Helpers do.. Apprentices do.. Painters do.. 45.00 1.10 $145. 00 125.00 70.00 to $55. 00 1.25 .27i 2.75 1,35 1.00 2.25 00 to $51. 00 00 48. 00 06 00 69 m 81 68 20 13 28.34 26.00 .75 .]5i 1.31 Mr. J. S. Jeans, secretary of the British Iron and Steel Institute, in his book on "Eailway Problem," confirms the above figures, for he says that in Belgium, Germany, Switzerland, and France the earnings of the different grades of railroad labor vary from about $11 to $o8 per mouth, a great majority being less than $20. Blast furnace labor. Top lillers Bottom fillers- Cinder loaders Blast engineer General lahor . Chicago. $2.40 2.10 1.68 3.25 1.08 At Cum- berland seaport (England). $1.13 1.13 0.86 1.09 0.77 Newcastle (England). $1.71 1.19 1.00 1.27 I. 81 to 0. 97 Glasgow (Scotland). $1.09 0.97 IKON AND STEEL. did The rates named above refer to the years 1887-'88. Inquiry shows that the rates paid for raih^oad hibor on lines running into Chicago at the present time do not vary materially from the rates given herein. I am not informed as to what change in wages may have been made abroad. In steel plants I have the flgiires for 1888, covering a converting mill and rail mill at ShefQeld, England. The comparative rates that I give are based upon an average run at the works of my company in Chi- cago, in 1892. The English rates are for a day of 10 hours, the Chicago rates are mostly for a day of 8 hours. CONVERTING MILL. Lartlemen per day Pitmen do. Kuiiners do Iron cupolas do. Iron stocliers do. Locomoti\'e engineer do. Comniou labor per liour Slieilield. $2.43 1.04 1.40 2.01 1.46 1.1)4 .11 EAIE MILL. Heatersi per d.ay . Helpers - do . . Levcrmcn do. . Cold straightenora do.. ilelpers do. . Gagger do. . Drulers do. . Table engineer do. . $6 65 4 4.S 5 .')8 6 ](l 3 40 ] 7'> 4 :;8 3 25 $2.01 1.04 1.04 1.94 1.21 1.21 1. W 2.43 Eeferring to the point that I raised, that the cost of transportation — owing to the rates of wages paid upon our railroads and lakes, and owing to the distances from which the raw materials have to be brought together — raised our cost and necessitated adequate protection, I find that Mr. J. S. Jeans in his book entitled " Steel, its History, Manufac- ture and Uses" shows that in eight different iron and steel manufac- turing localities in Great Britain, at which live-sixths of all the iron and steel in Great Britain are manufactured, the approximate cost of conveying the raw materials required for making one ton of pig iron varied from a minimum of §1.22 to a maximum of $3.89 ^er ton of pig lEON manufactured. In our case the assembling of the same raw materials on cars in our mill yard costs us not less than $5.81 per ton of pig iron amounting, as you will see, to 49 x)er cent more than the highest cost in Great Britain, or to 376 per cent more than the lowest, an amount that I be- lieve you will readily admit is a very serious factor in the cost of manu- facture. Yours, truly, W. R. Stirling, F'ln^t Y ice-President, Illinois Steel Company. 314 METALS. IRO:^r AISTD STEEIj. Schedule C. STATEMEHT OF JOHW LAMBERT, VICE-PEESIDENT OF THE CONSOLIDATED STEEL AND IRON COMPANY, JOLIET, ILL. Mr. Chairman: You have been listening for several hours to a fnll and comi)lete statement of the iron and steel industry and it seems to me unnecessary for me to say much on tbe subject. I think it has been very fully answered. Indeed, most of the argument that I had preiiared to make has been so fully covered as to practically leave me without a speech. I take it, gentlemen, that you are seriously considering the question ■whether there is too much protection to the iron and steel industry ; whether or not the protection that is now on that industry has a ten- dency to increase the price of the article; and, that being the case, whether or not the present protection or duty can not be reduced. I will take up but a few moments of your time as I shall speak on but one subject. I shall undertake to show you why the duty does not increase the price of the article but, on the contrary, decreases it. To do that T will take you back to 1883. Wire rods and billets are our raw material. In 1883, when I first engaged in manufacturing barbed wire, we imported all the rods from abroad. The average i)rice paid for the foreign rod in I^ew York was $02 to $65 per ton. The cost of that rod at our works in Joliet was about $68 per ton. This was at a time when we imported rods from a free-trade country. The wages which we pay to-day are the same that we paid in 1883. We have practically the same machinery in use as we had at that time. After a duty of six-tenths of a cent a pound was put on the wire rods immediately wire rod mills were built in this country. The first one, I think, was built at Johnstown; the next one was at Worcester, Mass. ; the next at Cleveland, Ohio; then one at Pittsburg; then at Beaver Falls; then at Braddock, and then at Joliet. With a duty of six-tenths of a cent a pound on wire rods in 1883, the price of the domestic rod has gradually gone down until to-day we can get the same rod and a better one at home, or in Joliet, for $30 a ton, compared with the rod in 1883, which was bought abroad at $68. I submit that when the duty of six-tenths of a cent a pound was placed on wire rods it had the tendency to de- crease the cost of wire rods rather than increase it. Suppose the duty of six-tenths of a cent a pound had not been placed on wire rods, would we not be paying the same price we paid in 1883*? In 1883 barbed wire, j)roduced from a foreign rod, was selling at 8 to 10 cents a pound ; it is selling to-day, made from domestic material, at 2 J cents. We can not go much lower; we have got pretty near to the bottom. If it is a question of raising a revenue, then you must necessarily reduce the price of the article to a point where importation can be made. How low will you have to go? You would have to put it exactly where it was in 1883. We would then have free raw material, closed mills, and would have to set our idle working men to raising wheat, corn, and oats, as they did years ago when wheat was burned for fuel out in ISTebraska. If you want to keep the American market for the benefit of the American woikiaen, why share it with the foreign manufacturer? Our tariff laws at present are so nicely adjusted that IKON AND STEEL. 315 the Ajnerican manufacturer has complete control of the home market, and at the same time is able to compete in all countries with his for- eign competitors. As an illustration, I will say that we can import rods, get a rebate of 99 per cent of the duty, and put our product in the markets of the world. We would prefer to have our home market and let the for- eigners have the markets of the world. After our present tariff law was passed we had a fair chance in the markets of the world. I may state that in 1883 wire nails were sold in Cleveland and Chicago, made from a foreign rod, at 10 cents a pound. You can buy them to-day for $1.90 a keg. Mr. Gear. The base sizes are lower ? Mr. Lambert. I expect the base size would be $1.25. Mr. Bynum. The duty is 2 cents a pound? Mr. Lambert. Yes, sir. Mr. Byntjm. You think that it is necessary to protect you? Mr. Lambert. It seems to me that that is irrelevaat to the question. If the duty has reduced the cost to the figures named, not only on wire rods but on nails, and the wages have remained as they were, what is the use of reducing the duty! Mr. Bynum. What harm would it do if it were reduced"? Mr. Lambert. We do not know. At the present time the manu- factories of all kinds are being closed. Mr. Bynum. I am taking your own argument. Mr. Lambert. There are two ways of looking at that. One way of looking at it is this. Is it the intention and desire to divide with our foreign competitor ? I say that so long as protection is not abused there is no necessity for interfering with the duties. Mr. McMiLLiN. If the import duty is now already higher than the cost of the article why can it not be interfered with? Mr. Lambert. That is a question of nails, which are 4 cents a pound. Mr. McMiLLiN. I was asking about nails. Mr. Lambert. There is no disguising the fact that nails would not be imported, if the duties were largely decreased. But if the duty cuts no figure in the cost, what is the necessity of reducing it? Mr. McMiLLiN. It is to prevent a possible abuse. Mr. Lambert. I have shown you that while the rate is 4 cents a pound we have reduced the cost of wire nails down to i^l.90. Mr. McMiLLiN. The cost of wire nails has fallen all over the world. It is the lowest in this country. Mr. Lambert. I think that is possibly true. Mr. MoMiLLiN. Do you uot know it is? Mr. Lambert. No. Mr. McMiLLiN. Well, it is true. Mr. Lambert. I think that, had it not been for the duty imposed on wire rods, they would be selling as high to-day in the United States as they were in 1883. It is strange that the foreign manufacturer is so anxious to get to our country and wants us to reduce the duty suffi- ciently to enable him to do so. If he is a philanthropist to-day wliy was he not so in 1883? If he can sell them to-day he certainly could have done it in 1883; but he did not. Ml". Bynum. Thirty dollars now will buy as much of the farmer's product as $68 would buy then. The general rcHluction in prices goes hand in hand with the reduction of the i^rice of rods. Mr. Lambert. Not to such an extent as that. 316 METALS. The CnAiEMA-N. This business of making wire nails is a new industry. Mr. Lambert. It is about about twelve or fifteeu years old. The Chairman. It is new all over the world. Mr. Lambeet. It is old in Germany. The Chairman. It was a hand industry in Germany. Mr. Lambert. ISTo; the first machines used iu this (country for mak- ing wire nails were imported from Germany. The Chairman. Has there been any improvement in the machines since 1883"? Mr. Lambert. In America there has been. The Chairman. The cheapening of the price of wire nails has been because the machines have improved, jjerhaps? Mr. Lambert. The industry of wire nails is in thatresiiect the same as every other industry in this country. Just as soon as we have pro- tection ou them to give a fair return to capital as an investment just so soon brains will produce machines for cheapening the cost to the consumer. The Chairman. As you introduce the machinery it disi)laces labor, in whose name you ask protection. Mr. Lambert. B'o, sir. The Chairman. Do you not produce a much larger amount than you did ten years ago"? Mr. Lambert. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Do you employ men or boys? Mr. Lambert. Men and boys, both. I Avould like to answer your last question before you get too far away. You. asked the question whether we did not displace the men on account of using machinery. That is true. Ten years ago we employed 75 men in making wire nails, whereas to day we employ 1,100. The Chairman, yeventy-flve men can make more nails now than 75 men could ten years ago"? Mr. Lambert. Yes, sir. The Chairman. It is because you have improved the machinery with which they work. That macliinery is used all over the world to-day, Mr. Lambert. It is used more in the United States than abroad. The farmers get tlieir material cheaper. The Chairman. Is not the farmer expected to share in the progress of industries"? Ma. Lambert. He does share in them, and he gets his full shnro. The Chairman. You started out with the proposition that a tariff duty decreased prices to the consumer. Mr. Lambert. I made that statement. I said in our line. The Chairman. Does it not operate in oUmv lines? Mr. Lambert. I came down here in the interest of wire rods and wire Tuiils. The Chairman. T want to know whether the increased duty on wool had any effect on the price of wool? Mr. Lambert. As the wool men are to be lieard, I presume they will be able to come and state their own case better than I can. The Chairman. I want to read a report of the McKiuley bill made by Maj. McKinley: We do not liclieve that onr people, already snfforing from liigli priees, can help heiiig satislicd with legislation wliieh will result in lowei prices. Do you suppose that a.nything which will increase the duty on arti- cles will lower the price? IRON AND STEEL. 317 Mr. Payne (interposing). Perhaps it wonld be edifying if you read the whole report. Mr. Bynum. It is very clear so far as it goes. Mr. Lambekt. I think I can answer the question without hearing any more of it. l^To matter what the intention was the fact remains that it did do it. The Chairman. I want to get the theory of this tariff question. Sometimes it is said the duties increase the price, and sometimes it is said they decrease the price. Your peculiar jjosition is that it lowers . the price to the consumer, which I am very glad to hear. Mr. Lambert. It does in our article. Mr. Turner. Then, why do you want to maintain the protection? Mr. Lambert. If it has reduced the price of the article, then what is the use of repealing it? Mr. McMiLLiN. If, as you claim, the increased duty decreases the ]irice of the article, how does it follow that by reason of an increase of the duty you are able to give the higher rate of wages to your labor! Mr. Lambert. I will say in answer to that that practically our Avage scale has not been changed from 1883 up to the present time. It costs more per hundred than it did ten years ago, but by our increased cajiacity and better machinery we may reduce the price per hundred to the men, but the number of hundred pounds or tons net which is pro- duced is equivalent to an increase of wages. Mr. McMiLLiN. Then you do not insist that an increase of the rate of duty enables you to increase the wages of your workmen at the same time? Mr. Lambert. Most assuredly I do. Mr. McMiLLiN. At the same time you increase wages of labor and decrease the cost to the consumer? Mr. Lambert. That is what I say, and that is the fact. Now, had it not been that a duty was put on wire rods we never should have engaged in the business of barbed wire and wire nails. The G,000 men in our works would have had to look for work in some other line if that protection had never been given, for certainly they would never have had employment in the iron and steel industry. Mr. McMiLLiN. In what line of business are you engaged? Mr. Lambert. We are engaged in making wire nails and barbed wire ; to some extent we are engaged in making wire rods. We have two mills; one in Braddock and one in Allen town. The rate of wages jiaid in 1883 was based on what we could aii'ord to pay at that time for that class of manufacture in common with other lines of steel. While the cost of the finished product to the consumer has diminished from 1883 to 1893, an increased capacity and improved machinery has allowed us to retain the same scale of wages which Ave had in 1883. Mr. McMiLLiN. It is the increased efficiency of machinery that sus- tains you and not the protective duty? Mr. Eeed. I would like to ask a question bearing upon that point. Were these improved machines invented by our people? Mr. Lambert. In every case. Mr. Eeed. Would they have been invented if there had not been any nail mills? Mr. Lambert. Certainly not. Mr. Eeed. This improved machinery is the result of the establishment of the mills? Mr. Lambert. Yes, sir. 318 METALS. Mr. Eeed. Could the mills have been established without a tariff? Mr. Lambert. Most certainly not. Mr. Eeed. Then the invention of the machinery is owinjj to the mills ; the establishment of the mills is owing' to the tariff, and therefore the increased eflicieucy of the machines is due to the tariff in a general way? Mr. Lambert. Most certainly. The Chairman. Is it a fact that your men are making the same wages 1 Mr. Lambert. Yes, sir. The Chairman. And it is the fact that you make a cheaper product? Mr. Lambert. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Is it not a fact that in a great mntiy other indus- tries they have not only increased wages but have reduced the price of the product? Mr. Lambert. Yes, sir; but I am speaking particularly of our own line. The Chairman. That is a fact, paradoxical as it may seem — cheap- ened the product and at the same time raised Avages? Mr. Lambert. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynum. The patent laws have protected inventions in this coun- try, and that has been an inducement. Mr. Laimbekt. There w<^uld have beeu tio inducement for invention were tliere no machines used in the mills. Mr. Eeed. That is the point I wanted to make. Mr. BynujM. The inducement was because of the high prices. Mr. Lambert. The inducement was because of the demand. Mr. Bynum. You said the price was high; tliat was an inducement, was it not? Mr. Lambert. The American people are so smart that they always know just what their neighbors are doing. If they find J(din -Jones is engaged in a business that is making money, somebody else wants to go into it. The result is that capital seeks an investment there. The last mail to go into a business Avants the best machijies, so that he can compete with his neighbors. Mr. Bynum. You are too voluminous in your answers. You said the elfect of protection Avas an inducement to make machines, and the machines reduced the price of x^roduction one-fifth on wire nails. Our people are able to manufacture nails in competition Avith any country. Mr. Lambert. If you are after the best information I can give, I will give it to you; but if you are not, I can not giA^e it to you. The tariff' was an inducement to us to manufacture. After Ave commenced manufacturing the next inducement Avas to get the best possible ma- chinery. We haA'e gone on from stage to stage until Ave have got the best machinery, and it is all on account of having the inducement to manufacture in the first place. The Chairman. It never happens in this country that invention of itself is an inducement to manufacture? Mr. Lambert. Oh, yes. The Chairman. Hoav can you say, then, that there must be existing industries before the people will go into inventions? Mr. Lambert. I am speaking more particularly of our line of busi- ness. The Chairman. I presume that you can find a great many industries where the cause of their establishment was invention. IRON AND STEEL. 319 Mr. Eeed. That has no relation to industries already in existence, which is the question under discussion. Mr. Bkeckineidge. Do you export? Mr. Lambert. To some extent. Mr. Eeeckinridgb. What do you export? Mr. Lambert. Barbed wire and wire nails— principally barbed wire. Mr. Breckinridge. To what countries? Mr. Lambert. South Africa, South America, Mexico, and some to Brazil. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you do some exporting business under these reciprocity treaties which have been negotiated? Mr. Lambert. Yes, sir; I think we got into Cuba under those. Mr. Breckinridge. And you export a good deal to other countries also? Mr. Lambert. Our export business is small comiiared with our domestic business. We export probably in a year 6,000 or 7,000 tons all told of wire nails, while the domestic production is over -;00,000 tons. Mr. Breckinridge. To what country do you export wire nails? Mr. Lambert. I can not give you the information, but 1 wish I could. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you export any to Europe? Mr. Lambert. jSTo, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you export any to Australia? Mr. Lambert. No, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you export any to Africa? Mr. Lambert. 1 am not positive as to wire nails; but we export barbed wire to Africa. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you export 6,000 or 7,000 tt>ns of wive nails? Mr. Lambert. Our exports of wire nails do not amount to much. Mr. Breckinridge. Your export of all, you say, is 6,000 or 7,000 tons? Mr. Lambert. Six or seven thousand tons altogether. Mr. Breckinridge. Your sales are profitable to you, are they not! Mr. Lambert. They are not quite as profltableas we would like; but when we have a surplus we must dispose of it. It depends somewhat upon the q uantity that we make. If we can clear on oui' product at home we are willing to do it. Mr. Breckinridge. You do not export at a loss ? Mr. Lambert. No, sir; it is much easier to make acombination with a maker of wire nails and barbed wire abroad, or to form a trust in a foreign cour.try, than it is in the United States of America. Mr. Breckinridge. Why is that? Mr. Lambert. Because abroad there are very few makers. There are few in England, but none in Germany, and only one or two in Praiu'c. They are always anxious to get as much as they can abroad, and once there was a combination formed in order to put up prii'cs. We were not a member of that trust, because we could ship in there at lower prices than they could, and could undersell them. Mr. Gear. How much have you reduced the price offence wire within the last year? Mr. Lambert. From 10 cents down to 2J cents. We can sell any quantity at $2 a hundred. Mr. Gear. If I recollect, nail machiaes were first introduced into this country from Germany? Mr. Lambekt. Yes, sir. 320 METALS. Mr. Geae. We now make iu this country better machines. The American inventive genius has developed better machines than the German ones? Mr. Lambert. All we have to do is to see a thing, and we can beat anything they can get up. We have one machine in New Y(5rk that will make nearly four times as many nails as the best foreign machine. Mr. Eeeckinrtdgb. What is the duty on nails? Mr. Lambert. About 2 cents. It is the same as on wire. Mr. J-iiiECKiNRiDGE. What is the lowest paid price for nails? Mr. Lambert. Sixties have been as low as $1.25 at Beaver Falls and Pittsburg. Mr. rJRECKiNRiDGB. What is the average? Mr. Lambert. About $1.90 a keg. Mr, Gear. The largest consumption, I suppose, is of 8's and lO's? jMr. Lambert. Yes, sirj 8's, lO's, 20's, and .30's. The concern which 1 represent has five mills, one in St. Louis, one in Joliet, one in Lockport, one iu Braddock, and one at Allentown, Pa. We employ in those five mills nearly 5,000 men. To-day our mills are closed and have been since about tlie i5th of Jaly. Those men are out of employment in all lines • and there is nothing left for them to do. The question with us is, how soon arc those men going to be put to work? As things stand to-day we do not know when tliat will be. i^lr. Gear. Does the question of the revision of the tarift enter into that as a factor? Mr. LAjWBERT. It is perfectly impossible to make sales until we know whiit is going to be done with the tariff'. The farmers of the Northwest hnve been told that the tariifis a robbery. They think it ought to be rc])ealed. No matter how cheap prices may be, it is human nature to want them cheaper. Every man who is deijendent upon his earnings wants to know what is going to be done. At the same time hundreds of thousands of men are out of employment and will be until this ques- tion is disposed of. Inasmuch as it is experimental I do not think it is wise at this time to attempt to do anytliinjj;- with the tariff. Our industries are paralyzed at the jiresent time. Gentlemen, I hon- estly believe tliat it is the fear of tarift'legislation to-day tluit is distui'b- ing the business and keeping closed the iron and steel industries of this country. If it were known to-day that there would be no tariff' bill passed, I think that before the tirst of next January every miU in this country would be at work and would be prosperous. Mr. BvNUiM. Then it would be better for them to have been left where they were before? • Mr. Latmbert. 1 "-hink so. The Oha[rman. I want to know wlietlicr these vai'ions inventions and improved inethofls of making wire rods and nails were made by mechanics in yonr mills? Air. Lambert. Yes, sir. AUour own improvements have been made in this way. lEON AND STEEL. 321 IRON AND STEEIi. (Sclieilulo C.) STATEMENT OF MR. THOMAS SEDDON, OF BIEMTNGHAM, AIA. Mr. Chairman: I ■would say that I was absent wL en this meeting was called. The uotice is &o short that lam totally unable to make any speech. As a representative of the Birmingham district I want to say that we appeal earnestly to this committee and to Congress to postpone any action on the tariif at the present time, because of the terribly unsettled condition of the country, and especially of our district. We are more unfortunately situated than the districts of the North. About 80 per cent of our laborers are negroes. They are thriftless and have not a day's ration ahead. We have not been able to give them more than one or two days' work in a week, and they are almost at the point of starvation. Our own company is running two furnaces out of four, and the output of coal has been reduced to 15 tons. I would be glad to answer any questions in relation to the joroduction of iron, or give you any information about our district. I want to make an urgent appeal, especially, against the reduction of ore. If you make ore free, in my judgment, it would ruin a new industry iu Alabama and Tennessee. Our great need now is a market. Our iron has to be transported a great distance. It is sold all over the United States from Maine to California. We have been making pig iron. We have no credit to sustain ourselves, and money is very difticult to get. Mr. McMiLLiN. What is the cost of making iiigiron in your section? -Mr. Sbddon. That depends very much upon how your accounts are kept. It would be my rough judgment that it costs in the Birmingham district about an average. It would be more or less of a guess. I do not carry the figures iu my mind in detail, although I would be very glad to furnish them. Mr. McMiLLiN. I have always presumed that it could be made there very cheaply. Mr. Seddon. I should say that $9 would be an average. Mr. McMiLLiN. There are other furnaces there, I suppose, that could make it for less °? Mr. Sbddon. Yes, sir; I expect so, without counting interest on the plant, the capital invested, or anything of that kind. The Chairman. At the prices you have given it could be made there cheaper than anywhere iu the world? Mr. Seddon. So; I don't know about that. The Chairman. It can be made as cheaply as in England? Mr. Seddon. When we are bragging we say we can make it as cheap as anywhere. I am aware that this is strictly true, if you g" by the selling price. We sell it within 50 cents a ton of the English price, Our great drawback is our long haul. We are influenced in our in- dustry by our lack of proximity to the market. It is a good deal like a young couple getting married and going out in the woods, and after they have spent everything they have they begin to look around for a market for their product. [Laugliter.] We have got to malce a market for our product, and it is a new home industry. We are obliged to get money to put into it. The Chairman. I understood you to say that you are idle now| T H 2X 322 METALS. Mr. Seddon. We are mostly idle. The Ohaieman. Is uot the pig-iron trade picking up now? Mr. Seddon. No, sir. The Chairman. 1 have a copy of Bradstreet's before me, and it says the iron trade has been active, stocks low, and for pig iron good prices are asked. Mr. Seddon. We might as well ask them, for we have no market for them. [Laughter.] The Chairman. It says there is an active trade in groceries, hard- ware, and pig iron iu St. Louis. Mr. Seddon. We have not felt it. Mr. Bynum. Perhaps it is a want of reform in the tariff. Mr. Seddon. If we had what you call "reform" then we would never have a chance. inON AND STEEL. (Scliedule C.) STATEMENT OF KR. G. M. lATJGHLIN, IBOIT AND STEEL MINITFACTTTKEE, OE THE FIRM OF JONES & LAUGHLIN, PITISBUBG, PA. Mr. Chairman: I came here not with the intention of having any- thing to say, but simply and wholly in the light of what I thought was my dnty, to aid merely by swelling the proof of what the others say here to-day, and to aid in any way I could in whatever conferences the other gentlemen may desire to hold. Kot being accustomed to public speaking, or appearing before Con- gressional bodies, I feel considerable embanassment, and I desire only to say that I was called merely because I was the only gentleman pres- ent representing the iron and steel business of Pittsburg. I did not come prepared with statements or tabulated facts, and have not well arranged in my mind the facts by which I could enlighten you gentle- men. I am inclined to think it would be unnecessary, as the ground has been so thoroughly gone over here and ou other similar occasions that it would seem as though you were generally informed on the ques- tian as it affects not only the manufacturers, but the public at large. My private judgment in regard to the tariff question is that the manufacturing interest suffers in these changes of the policy of the Government in common with the remainder of the community — no more, no less— if anything, it is less than the outside public. ' I be- lieve the tariff, in the judgment of any reasonable man, is justifled on the plane of the greatest good to the greatest number; and my judg- ment is that the manufacturer is less interested in the question than any other citizen in this country. I have no doubt that the present depressing and deplorable condition of every branch of industry and trade is most largely, perhaps, accounted for by tlie uncertainty as to future legislation in regard to these industrial questions. In regard to our own business it is in a wretched condition. The concern with which I am connected and which 1 represent here is a very large one, employing a comparatively large number of men. We IRON AND STEEL. 323 have been struggling along for the last two months endeavoring to •keep our men employed. We have succeeded partially, and are trying to do the best we can; but it is with no encouragement or prospect of fiiture encoirragement to ourselves or our employes. The outlook is for a dull, dreary, idle winter, and we are making every efl'ort we can to keep our establishment going. We have thus far succeeded in keep- ing at work about 60 per cent of the men which are usually employed. Our x>roduct is costing us more than it ought to, and we can not con- tinue to keep our works going unless there is a change brought about by something, I do not know what. The prosi:)ect is that what little we are doing we must stop in order to cut off expenses and to save ourselves. I do not know that I can say anything further. I would be very glad, and perfectly willing, to answer any questions which any gentleman of the committee may desire to ask, if I can do so with sat- isfaction to myself. If my knowledge is such that I can give the information I will be very glad to give it. Mr. Beeokineidge. I see, through the public press, that a great many men in your district have recently been returned to employment — lierhaps 25,000. I believe these people lost their work, principally, within the last sixty or ninety days, did they not"^ Mr. Laughlin. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckineidge. And in a great measure have they now been restored to work ? Mr. Laughlin. I ought to say, perhaps, that that information, to a large extent, is erroneous. It is, no doubt, caused by the fact that the newspapers are very active and energetic in reporting the news. As an illustration, I will say that I was talking to a reporter about the condition of our own business — as I told you, that we were running on short time, and would start one mill out of several that we have — and every time we start or stop a mill the newspapers publish that we have started or stopped our works. I regret to say, that the newspaper information in that way is generally wrong. I do not think there has been anything like 25,000 men returned to work recently in the Pitts- burg district. Mr. Beeckineidge. You do not consider that the condition of the unemployed is materially improved in your district? Mr. Laughlin. I think possibly that there has been some improve- ment which has been brought about by the extraordinary ettbrts made on the part of manufacturers to make a start in the hope that the mere starting will help trade. There hasbeen no encouragement, and, really, the other works are running, no doubt, as ours have been, at a very great cost to the proprietors and manufacturers. We had better have been entirely idle for the last two months than to have been running as we have been. Mr. Beeckineidge. There has been a considerable improvement, but not as much as the newspapers indicate? Mr. Laughlin. K^o, sir. Mr. Eeed. Do you mean to say that there has been a considerable improvement? Mr. Laughlin. I do not think there has been any improvement in the number of men employed in Pittsburg recently-. Tliere has only been an apparent improvement. Mr. Reed. It is an important matter in your business, I suppose, to keep your plant going? Mr. Laughlin, It is a desirable and necessary thing to keep ouj' 324 METALS, organization up, and to keep our men from going away; for this reason I say we had better have been stopped than to be running as we have been in the last two mouths. A part of our necessary expenses is going on whether we are running or stopped; therefore I say the present mode of running is worse tban complete stoppage. Mr. Eeed. If it were not for the injury done your mills you would not be stopped? Mr. LAuaHLiN. JSTo, sir; we would be running to-day. Mr. Eeed. So the idea that business is reviving is not a correct idea? Mr. Laxjghlin. 'No, sir. Mr. Dalzell. What has been true of your mills has been true through Allegheny County? Mr. Laughlin. I should say so. Mr. Dalzell. They have been stopped and started spasmodically? Mr. Latjghlin. I do not know a single concern which has been run- ning more than a week in tlie last six weeks. Mr. Dalzell. Is that not true in respect to Braddock, Duquesne, and Pittsburgh? Mr. Latjghlin. Yes, sir. I do not believe there is a mill engaged in iron and steel which has been running entirely an average of three days a week. Mr. Dalzell. Do you attribute that to an apprehension as to tariff changes? Mr. LauCtHLIN. There is such a condition existing in the iron and steel business to-day as I have never seen before. In my business experience I have been through a number of panics, and I have never in any one of them seen such a condition that we could not run our works at some price or on some time. To-day we can not. From that I am forced to the conclusion that it is not simply a question of money, because I have been through worse financial panics than this. Mr. Gear. How many men are now emx^loyed by your firm of Jones & Laughhn? Mr. Laxjghlin. About 60 per cent. Mr. Gear. With short time? Mr. LAtjghlin. Our rolling-mills and steel works are not running an average of 2J days a week. Mr. Gear. You are not running more than one-fourth of your force, then? Mr. Laughlin. 1:^0, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. This depression was precipitated upon you quite suddenly, was it not? Mr. Laughlin. So far as absolute paralysis was concerned, it was sudden ; but there had been a gradual decline in trade in our line, I should say, from about the 1st of .January last. We noticed the dechne in the demand for our product, and the difficulty in making sales and finding a demand sufficient to keep our mills going fully. That condi- tion continued until money began to get tight, and then the absolute collapse came. Mr. Breckinridge. Have your mills been entirely shut down at anv time? Mr. Laughlin. Yes; our mills are a^ great deal of a conglomerate. We make iron and steel in all its phases. We have quite a number of different finishing departments whore we consume a large amount of the products of iron and steel that we produce. We have been able to lEON AND STEEL. 325 run our finisliing department to a greater extent, and more regularly, than our iron and steel departments; but everything lias been subject to great interruption. We have been compelled to lay off men in every department. Mr. Breckinkidge. What has been approximately the smallest per- centage of men employed by you in the recent pastf Mr. Latjghlin. I could not an&wer that exactly. For days together we have not employed any of our rolling-mills nor our iron and steel works. We stopped cLtirely, with the exception of the watchmen and foremen and the salaried men who are paid by the year, whether the mills are running or not; and there have been many days, some even in almost every week, when they were entirely stopped. This statement I have made as to running about CO per cent of our works was an average. Mr. Gear. You do not run that percentage on fall time? Mr. Breckinridge. When was that condition most acute? At what time did you have most unemployed men? Mr. Latjghlin. I should say we have the most at this time. Mr. Bebckinriuge. When did that begin? Mr. Latjghlin. I do not know that I can distinguish as to the shades of idleness of our mills. Mr. Breckinridge. Were you as badly oft' in June as you were in July? Mr. Latjghlin. No, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Were you as badly off in July as in August? Mr. Latjghlin. I should say it would depend pretty mucli on the .same condition of affairs. To fix a time without knowing absolutely, 1 should say the 1st of July. Our trade had been gradually dropping off until about the 1st of July, when our wages scale was to be ad- justed with our men. Mr. Breckinridge. I asked the question simply as to time. Did you not find along during this period of depression that your collec- tions were poor? Mr. Latjghlin. Undoubtedly. Since this financial trouble began in the country we f^und it more difficult to make collections. Mr. Breckinridge. You found difficulty in getting such accommo- dations at the banks as you might need in your business? Mr. Laughlin. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. You say you had difficulty in June and July in making collections and getting satisfactory credit at the banks to carry on your business affairs. Do you attribute that to the impending tariff legislation? Mr. Latjghlin. I consider that was a large factor in the difficulty of doing business. I had considered that (piestion a long time, and had only been able to attribute this falling off in ourbrauch of business prior to this difficulty in financial affairs and the disorganization of all kinds of industry to the jirospect of a readjustment of tariff duties. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you think that was the cause of the inability of your customers to meet their paper? Mr. Latjghlin. No, sir; I do not think it was, but it made them cur- tail their orders. Mr. Breckinridge. It did not affect their payment? Mr. Laughlin. I do not think it did. Mr. Brbc!Kinridge. Do you think it affected the willingness of the banks to extend conditions in the usual way? 326 METALS. Mr. Laxjghlin. I do not think it did for tlie reason that fortunately there was no necessity for us to make any inquiries of that kind. ]\Ir. Breckinridge. Were you able to get your dej^osits out of the banks'? l\Ir. Laughlin. We got all we wanted. Mr. Breckinridge. You said there was a general curtailment of commercial credit, I believe, all over the country! Mr. Laughlin. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you think that the unwillingness of the banks to discount commercial paper was due to the dread of tariff changes? Mr. Laughlin. Of course; I think it was a factor in the general problem and condition of affairs. I do not say, however, as to that question that I can answer beyond speculating- on it just as anybody else would. I foiined a judgment a long time ago about it. I thought that that was one of the factors in the changed condition of the pros- perity of the country. I noticed that thing, as I had a right to do and as every business man ought to do. I endeavor to acquaint myself with everything that 1 think will affect the prosperity of the business in wliich I am engaged. I study the effect of such things closely and after doing tliat I came to that conclusion. I came to the conclnsion a long- time ago that that would be the natural effect upon the ]irosperity of the country and the prospect of its being injured. It does seem to me that that is a natural and inevitable effect and it is unfoi'tunate that it should be so. I for one would like to see the country maintain stability long enough to allow it to get settled and to discover the effects of a tariff policy. We have been subjected to so many and to such rapid changes that it seems to me the country is kept in a turmoil all the time. Mr. Bynum. The changes have always been upward. i\ir. Laughlin. No, sir; the last one made, so far as my particular line of business is concerned, is the reverse of protection. On almost everything that we make there was a change in the rates of the McKin- ley bill, so far as I understand it, which had the effect to reduce the duties. 1 think it would be safe for me to make thg statement that everything in the bill affecting our business was reduced rather than increased. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you mean everything in the iron and steel schedule? Mr. Laughlin. Yes, sir; those schedules were all reduced. Mr. Dalzbll. You have a general knowledge of this industry in the Shenango and Mahoning valleys! Mr. Laughlin. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzell. Does the same condition exist there that exists in the Monongahela Valley? ]Mr. Laughlin. I think so, and to a greater extent. Mr. Gear. You manufacture a variety of productions? Mr. Laughlin. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. You take orders in advance! Mr. Laughlin. Yes, sir; we have to. Mr. Gear. Were your orders about current with former times up to June! Mr. Laughlin. We had a very steady trade in all lines up to about the iirst of the year. Mr. Gear. Your main business is running on orders, which are com- IRON AND STEEL. 327 wg in all the time from all parts of the country, but you are not get- ting tlieni now? Mr. Latjghlin. It seems impossible. Mr. Burrows. Have you been crippled by want of means or by want of orders for your goods ! Mr. Laughlin. For want of orders. The Chairman. In the line of goods that you produce is tl](M.'apacitj' in this country for production in excess of the home demand '? Mr. Laughlin. Just now there is no demand. The Chairman. Is it generally the case? Mr. LAUC5HLIN. In my experience of almost thirty years in the iron and steel business I have never known a time when the demand and supply were as nearly balanced as they have been within the last two years. In my judgment that is the only thing that has put the coun- try in a condition to stand this financial panic as well as it has. There has been no accumulation of stocks of any kind. The margin between the cost and the selling price has been the closest that I have ever known in my experience. Consumption has been large, production has been large, and they have almost balanced each other. The result is that the stocks of merchandise now more nearly represent intrinsic value than ever before. The stocks of material in the hands of manu- facturers is less than it ever has been before, and therefore, with the new condition of things which I saw, I thought it wise to sit down and wait to see what is going to be the result. The Chairman. I had an impression that there were periods of great activity and then periods of sluggishness in the iron and steel industry. I think Mr. Stirling said that he could produce the entire amount of steel used in this country to-day. Is the production far beyond the wants of the country"? Mr. Laughlin. I presume what Mr. Stirling meant to exjiress was that at this time he could meet all the demand. I should say that small as our production is compared to our district I think we could make pig iron enough to supply our whole district. The Chairman. After the adoption of the McKinley bill, which went into effect on the 6th of October, 1890, Mr. Swank, in his report f(jllow- ing the year 1891, speaking of the time of the depression in the iron and steel industries, said there was a depression in 1891, and that ex- penses in that year were confined to the strictest necessities, and that assessments were as light as possible. Mr. Laughlin. He meant so far as the price was concerned. The price was low and prices got better in 1892 and the price has been a little better ever since. The demand and consumption, as I said, has been immensely large. Mr. Gear. The consumption was large, but the price was small? Mr. Laughlin. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzell. Is it not a fact that the price went down the year after the McKinley bill went into effectf Mr. Breckinridge. What are your principal products? Mr^ Laughlin. We make steel in the form of billets and we consume billets in our rolling mills. We Jiiake bar iron and light steel rails, beams, channels, structural material, and iron and steel in all its aspects. Then we have in connection with our works machine shops and founderies. Mr. Breckinridge. Are your machine shops repair shops? S28 METALS, Mr. Lattghlin. "We are prepared to roake anytliing. We build a good deal of our macliinery. Mr. Bkeckineidgb. Do you make steam engines? Mr. Laughlin. We build engines for our own use. We do not go into the market to sell them. We have quite a large trade in shafting and in fitting up motive power for factories of all kinds. Mr. Breckinkidge. Tou do a general outfitting business? Mr. Laughlin. Yes, sir. Mr. Beeckineidge. You do not export any of your goods? Mr. Laughlin. No, sir; there is nothing that we are able to export. Mr. Bykum. I understood you to say that last year there was no overproduction in any of your lines of business? Mr. Laughlin. I do not think there was, so far as my observation has gone. Mr. Bynum. I have the testimony here of Mr. Frick, given before an investigating committee in July, to which I want to call your attention. In his testimony he said there Avas a reduction of wages of about 15 per cent, and that there was an overproduction of billets. Was it not the largely decreased price of billets that caused the reduction in the wages of the workingmen at Homestead, which redaction caused the strike there? Mr. Laughlin. No, sir. I think the matter of overproduction is often imagination largely in the mind of the party. When I speak of overproduction I mean the actual condition of demand and supply. An individual is apt to think that production is much greater on the part of his competitors than it actually is, and it is impossible to arrive at a correct judgment as to whether there is overproduction or under- production, because when they are so nearly balanced a manufacturer is liable to overestimate it because of the natural desire he has to keep his works largely sujiplied with orders, and to keep them comfortably going. They are not satisfied to wait. They are like other people, and therefore they are apt to exaggerate existing conditions under ordi- nary circumstances. My judgment has been arrived at not from esti- mates of supply and demand, but from the actual conditions iu the country. Mr. Reed. Your judgment is made wp after the event? Mr. Laughlin. My judgment is made up after the event, and the judgment which reduces the prices is made up before the event. This is x^artially brought about by thefearsof the individual himself in mak- ing his price. Of course that year's supply and demand was most evenly balanced. That has been a condition which was remarkably evident during those three years. Mr. Bynum. The proposition which Mr. Reed makes as regards Car- negie & Co. is a mere prediction, and there is no foundatioii for it. Mr. Laughlin. I do not care what the cause was that interfered with the selling price. Mr. Bynusi. Tliey produce billets cheaper in the Homestead institu- tion tliau they do in any other in Pittsburg, I believe? Mr. Laughlin. I am not i)repared to admit that; no, sir. We are in the billet business ourselves. Mr. Bynum. It was reported at Pittsburg that they could undersell any other industry at Pittsburg. Mr. Laughlin. They are enterprising, and possibly they do. I am not ])repared to say generally, but I do not think they have a great deal of advantage over us. IRON AND STEEL. 329 Mr. Btnum. Tliey have sold billets down as low as $22 and also $22.50, have they not? Mr. Laughlin, Yes, sir. The Chaikman. I find by looking at Swank's report for 1892 that he says the last year was a year of good iirices, few or no failures, and, that sales were slow. Many failures have occurred since 1892. Mr. Laughlin. I have no desire to controvert that, and yet that juay be true and the statement I have used be maintained. If you take Mr. Swank's statement in connection with i)roduction and consumption it will api)ear to be correct. The Chairman. Your statement is correct from your point of view. He speaks of the whole industries of the country. I\[r. Laughlin. He means the price was not satisfactory. I am pre- pared to agree with him perfectly that during the last three or four years the manufacturers have been producing at an infinitesimal mar- gin of profit, and in seeking for a reason for that I have arrived at the conclusion that it was on account of the remarkable coincidence that supply and demand were so nearly and so nice.y balanced that indi- viduals at no time were able to get prices which they Avould like. Mr. Breckinridge. You need a larger market'^ Mr. Laughlin. Sometimes we do. Mr. Breckinridge. If the tariff will give you a better foreign mar- ket would it not improve your condition? Mr. Laughlin. That would be desirable if possible, but I do not see that it is possible. While the conditions exist it seems to be hopelessly imi)ossible that we could expect or that we shall be able to get into the markets of the world when we need production in our own market. Mr. Breckinridge. If you could get free raw material that would enlarge the domestic market and give you more of the foreign market'? Mr. Laughlin. I think that if any manufacturer has had that expec- tation that he has been nursing a wrong impression. Mr. Breckinridge. If that could be done would it not help you? If you could get a foreign market added to your business would it not improve your condition*? Mr. Laughlin. I do not think it is i^ossible. The only possible con- ditions under which that could be acquired would be by such a reduc- tion of wages and costs as would enable us to get into those markets. Mr. Breckinridge. For instance, take leather, we have large exports in leather goods and have a very satisfactory domestic market. "Would not that be correspondingly true of your industry? Mr. Laughlin. I do not know anything about the leather business, and I am not able to enter into any reasonable estimate in regard to that, because I have no information in regard to the conditions existing and the question of supply and demand. There nuiy have been enough hides in this country to su])ply it, and it may be necessary that hides should be admitted free to carry on that business. It is necessary to know the conditions that govern the trade. Mr. Breckinridge. J\Ir. Swank says trade has been very unsatisfac- tory in your business. Mr. Laughlin. We have not been getting along as well as we thought we were entitled to, considering the amount of work we do and the amount of capital invested. Mr. Breckinridge. Tlie system of protection has not brought the price down to what you think you should enjoyi 330 METALS. Mr. Latjghlin. We have been working hard for a little profit, and we have sometimes thought we were entitled to more. Mr. Beeckineidge. This hidebound policy has not produced the returns that you hoped for, and do you not think it would be well to loosen it up a little! Mr. Laxjghlin. In what way! Mr. Beeckinridge. By giving you free raw material. Mr. Laxjghlin. I do not think it would cheapen anything for us. We are satisfied to pay a duty on raw material that we buy. Mr. Beeckinridge. At a higher price? Mr. Laxjghlin. No, sir; not at a higher price than we are compelled to pay; but we believe that an article of any kind imported into this country on which there is labor expended is not raw material, but that it comes directly in competition with those iudxistries in this country which employ and require labor in their handling and transportation, and that, even if this raAv material costs a little more, the general pub- lic can get it back in the general happiness and better condition of the people than if those industries were throttled or driven out of exist- ence. Mr. Breckinridge. You are assuming they would be throttled? Mr. Laxjghlin. I know they would if the principles of free trade were carried out. Mr. Breckineidge. You are not talking abcrat your business but about other people's business. Mr. Laxjghlin. I am speaking in a general way. I do not know of a siugle industry that can get along without protection. Mr. Beeckinridge. Are you thoroughly familiar with all the condi- tions in all the i^rotected industries ? Mr. Laxjghlin. I am in a general way; not in a way that would ena- ble me to answer questions of detail in regard to the costs and methods emi:)loyed ia their manufacturing business, but I have an ordinarily intelligent knowledge of all the industries that come under my obser- vation. Mr. Beeckineidge. You are stating this as a general oi)inion'? Mr. Laxjghlin. Yes, sir; it must be so. Mr. Beeckinridge. Your proposition is that you want to get all your materials as cheaply as possible under commercial conditions and as favorable as possible? Mr. Laxjghlin. Undoubtedly; that is the thing we are striving to get, and everj^thing we buy we buy as cheap as we can with relation to our competitors and sell the product as high as the markt't. will allow. That is the problem which we sit up nights to figure out. IRON AND STBEJL. (Schedule C.) STATEMENT OF CYETIS ELDER, OF THE CAMBRIA IRON COMPAITT, OF JOHNSTOWN, PA. Mr. Chairman, I know that you are worried with your long investi- gation. I come upon short notice, and am prepared merely to give you a few facts in regard to the situation of the industry which I represent, the Cambria Iron Company, of Johnstown, Pa. I liave here some memoranda, and I will give you a few figures in detail. IRON AND STEEL. 331 Mr. Elder read the following paper: The employfe of Cambria Iron Company during the year 1893 numhered 7,616, of whom 124 were under the age of 16 years. Of this nnmlier 5,500 men at Johnstown are out of employment. The Johnson Worts at Johnstown are practically closed. The population of the city of Johnstown by recent census is 24,544. Taking in the populous contiguous territory belonging to the city, this is swelled to 36,144. There are |35 churches. The property owned by the school board is valued at $150,000. The fire dep.artment has 9 steam fire engines and hooks and ladders. The company's property at Johnstown consists of 6 blast furnaces ; open hearth and Bessemer steel works, rolling mills, shops for the manufacture of agricultural" implements and other steel products, with foundries, machine shops, etc. Tlie com- pany has in and about its works 40 miles of railroads and 16 locomotives. It owns and operates limestone and ore mines in Blair County, 783 coke ovens in the Connells- ville region, and iron mines in the State of Michigan. The company began business in 1853, Avith i charcoal furnaces, which were soon abandoned, and a rolling mill, the original capital of the company, amounting to $1,000,000, having been sunk by the promoters. The average of railroad buildiug in the United States in the twenty-one years from 1867 to 1887 inclusive, was 5,414 miles. At the beginning of this period'the use of steel rails was merely nomin.al, but in the year 187IJ steel overtook and passed iron, and there was a constant increase in steel, and a constant reduction in iron until 1882, after which the use of iron rails became but nominal. During this period there was a wave of railroad construction ivhich culminated in 1871, in which year the average of railroad building was exceeded by 1,965 miles, and from 1872 to 1878 the figures of railroad building and prices of iron and steel compare as follows : From 1872 to 1878 inclusive, railroad building was 15,938 miles below the average, or 2,277 miles annually. During this period iron rails steadily declined, year by year, from $85.13 in 1872 to $33.75 in 1878; steel rails declined' regul.arly, year by year, from $112 in 1872 to $42.25 in 1878. Taking the period now of 1878 to 1882, railroad building rose steadily from 2,785 miles below the average to 6,154 miles above the average. The movement of prices in iron and steel rails during this period was as follows : Steel rails rose from $42.25 in 1878 to $67.50 in 1880, and declined to $48.50 in 1882. Iron rails rose from $33.75 in 1878 to $49.25 in 1880, and declined to $45.50 in 1882. Railroad building then receded from 6,154 miles above the average in 1882 to 1,806 miles below the average in 1885. The movement in prices of iron and steel rails during this period was as follows : Steel rails steadily declined year by vear from $48.50 in 1882, to $28.50 in 1885; rails were $10.75 per ton cheaper in 1883 than in 1882 ; they were $7 ciieaper in 1884 than in 1883 ; and they were $2.25 cheaper in 1885 than in 1884. This shrinkage during four years was large and constant, but it was no more eflective in inducing railroad building than the very great and constant shrinkage in prices from 1872 to 1878. It may be said that these statistics of prices and consmnption stand mutually related to each other as cause and consequence; that it was the decline in railroad building which caused the decline in prices of rails, and that it was the increase in railroad building which caused the increase in price of rails. But the point is still clear that very large and continued decline in prices of rails, year b.y year, during a series of years, did not induce railroad build- ing and did not check the decline in railroad building, and that increase of price did not check increase in railroad building. In point of fact, the price of rails is no very considerable factor in railroad building, and has not been, and can not be. Railroad building goes forward when the country is prosjierous and when bonds and other securities are in demand, and this condition is only found when the iron and steel industry of the country is prosperous. It may fairly be conolnded that continued depression of the metal market tends to prevent railroad construction, and the cause is not far to see. The iron and steel trade gives to maiiy of the railroad companies an enormous amount ot traffic directly, and a still greater amount indirectly. This indirect traflic being of far-reaching and general benefit, any depression in the metal industries reacts at once upon the business of the railroads and aftects the prices of stocks, bonds, and other railroad securities. An accurate statement of the mileage of transportation of the principal materials used in themanufacture of steel rails in the year 1887 by the Cambria Iron Company, including only ores, coke, limestone, clay, and ganister, and adding to tliis material a safe estimate of the transportation employed in the distribution of the finished product, shows a total of 226,364,977 tons of freight moved 1 mile, This contrasts with the railroad tonnage of a number of States as follows: 332 METALS, Hailyoad haul on principal materials used hy one Pennsylvania Bessemer-sleel eompamj in 1887. Tons. LaTxc Superior ore 75, 153, 420 Limestone 8,901,615 Coke 20, 003, 902 Neighborhood ore 2, 199, 318 Foreign ore 1, 494, 600 Manganiferons iron ore 6, 687, 630 Arkansas ore 2, 15H, 650 Virginia ore 108, 500 Clav 194,112 (ianister 263,230 Jtaterials moved one mile 117, 164, 977 In delivering tinished product (200,000 tons, 540 miles) 109, 200, 000 Total 226,364,977 Comparison of I'reight traffic of one Pennsylvania Bessemer-steel company with that of selected States, as shown by Poor's Manual for 1886 : Tons. Cambria Iron Company 226,364,977 Vermont 226, 958. 239 Connecticut 225. 276. 508 Maine 176, 108, 517 South Carolina 126,140,374 Colorado 225, 380, 399 North C arolin a 72, 828. 927 Arkansas 89, 463', 502 Oregon 87, 838, 013 Florida 49, 735, 047 West Virginia 47, 791, 962 Mississippi 28, 867, 722 New Hampshire 81,56.5,584 Rhode Island 18,688,314 Delaware 20, 856, 082 This exhibit of the contribution of one steel-rail manufacturing company to the railroad tonnage of the country may appear striking, yet it does not nearly tell the whole story. Depending upon this steel company in its various operations there are six mining towns and a manufactuving city, containinga population of about 30,000 souls, and all their supplies which have a railroad haul and the traffic and travel which goes along with their prosperity should be added to the statement above made, and would swell it very greatly. Multiply the figures we have given above by the large number of like steol works distriliuted through the country from the Atlantic seaboard to the Rocky Mountains and the magnitude of the railroad traffic which they create can be partially estimated. We say partially, because the inter- dependence of business is multifarious, and the incidental and collateral activities which the prosperity of these great operations call into being can not be traced or measured. To deprive the trunk lines of this traffic, which moves ores and food for working-men from the West to the East, and fuels and metal fabrics from the East to the West, would deprive them of their efficiency. They would render less service to the farmer, and necessarily at higher cost. Instead of lowering rates of tr.ans- portation cheap foreign rails would increase the cost of transportation very greatly through a decrease in railroad business, and there are lines of road which it would not jiay to operate. If deprived of the business furnished by the steel companies they would be abandoned and the grass would grow over them. A comparison of freight rates, as given by Edward Atkinson, for a x)eriod of nineteen years from 1867 to 1885, inclusive, shows that while the general tendency was in the line of reduction, and the economy to the country from this source was very great there is only a general conformity with the reduction in the price of rails, and taken year by year there is no evidence whatever that thi^ price of rails was any factor in fixing railroad freights. Railroad companies paid largely more for rails in 1872 than they did in 1871, and in 1873 th.an they did in 1871, but they were unable to charge higher rates of freight for this reason. With the price ruling in 1880 at $67. .50 for steel rails and $19.25 for iron rails, the freight rate was materially less than in the year 1877, wh<^n steel rails were sold at $45.50 and iron rails at $35.25. In 1883 with steel rails ruling at $4.50 lower in price than ever before, and with low prices for IRON AND STEEL. 333 rails in the previous year, the railroad companios wore able to exact a freight rate very much higher than they had received during the live previous years, in one of which the price of rails was materially higher than it had been the seven years previous to 1883. Mi^. Breckineidge. Tour manganese is on tlie free list, I believe? Mr. Elder. I can not tell; I think likely it is. I was not asking for a duty on it. If the steel works were only prosperous we would get along very well, but under the present conditions I am afraid they will not be able to buy. The maintenance of these industries is a benefit, and a very large benefit, as I claim. Eailroad building goes on under those circumstances whether the iron and steel industry does or not. It may be said that it is a little difficult to see how these things stand, as the railroad has already got its track down. Of course it is difficult. It is a paradox which the metaj)hysical mind of your chairman might be interested in, but it is a fact, and I can show you briefly what the fact is in regard to that matter. I made this investigation for the reason that Edward Atkinson, is so well known to you, and whose opinion of course will be accepted unquestioned, for he is not known to be a protectionist. I was very much interested in his explanation of the case. He had a table, and I thought it might be of interest to compare his figures, which he gave for a period of twenty-one years, with the price of iron and steel rails, and with the statistics of railroad building, so as to see the whole in a short diagram, in order to give an idea as to the relations between these things. I satisfied myself that the ques- tion of the price of steel rails is a question for the railroad company, and no one else. Nobody buys rails that I know of except the railroad company. It buys them, and that is the end of it. It does not charge off the price to anybody; it does not make any difference whether the cost of rails has been high or low. Low rails have not benefited any- body in freight rates, nor have they hurt anybody. Of course, there may have been a general fluctuation by the lines in the rates of freight, and perhaps to some extent in the building of railroads, but in the price of freight there has been a general shrinkage. If taken year by year nobody can take up this table and say that there has been a particle of influence in the price of rails. It may be said at once because there was building of railroads the price of rails had declined. The rails of a road are a permanent invest- ment. They are not something that is bought from day to day; they are something which lasts indefinitely. Nobody knows exactly the life of a steel rail. People do not make permanent investments ou a falling market. They are not apt to. People do not sell for a rise and buy for a fall. And this question of steel rails obeys the same law. I think that the prosperity of the iron and steel business of the country is a gauge of the general prosperity. It is the thermom- eter. The wire-rod business has been spoken of as furnishing an object lesson. For three years the Cambria Iron Company had in the heart of its works a rod mill that cost fully $100,000. It was a good mill, and still they were not able to operate it to make ijrofltable wire rod, simply because under a Treasury decision wire rods were under an ad valorem duty of 35 per cent; and so, for three years, the owners of that mill were unable to make wire rods. They were obliged to go oat of the wire-rod business or to go abroad to Germany and buy rods, as this wire manufactory was doing. Mr. Breckinridge. If they had been securing billets without exor- bitant (iuti(?s, could they have been doing so? 334 METALS. Mr. Elder. No, sir; they would have to pnt out two or three times as many men as the rod mill now keeps. That shows what a delicate and nice thing it is. If you are goiug to just try to get the American on an exact equality with the foreigner it will be utterly impossible. If you have set yom^self about that task, you are going about a task such as was never imposed upon American statesmen before. If you adjust the matter so that the foreigner shall be exactly equal with your own people and your people shall not have a particle of advantage over the foreigner it is a difficult matter to do. These conditions are chang- ing constantly, and where you think you have done perfectly well to admit the foreigner, you have at the same time put your own people at a disadvantage. That you do not wish. I would merely suggest that it is a great deal better to make this thing a little bit safe for your own people. I do not know of any country that has a fiscal policy which arranges its duties with any consideration whatever for any people but its own. I do not think they take into account whether you will be satisfied with it or whether you will not be; whether it pleases you or whether it does not. There is a tariff war abroad now. Tariffs have been spoken of openly as war, and it is war. This struggle for exist- ence which we ar(^ all undergoing is war for existence. It has been perpetuated from the earliest times. It has existed from the earliest organization of societj^ It is war between nation and nation, a strug- gle for trade. A little while ago I read a book called " Wars of Great Britain;" and I remember that Mr. Butler predicted the adoption of free trade as being an era of universal good will; but I find that Great Britain has not been without war. She does not fight us that way, but in a different way. IRON AND STEEL. (Schedule €.) AMALGAMATED ASSOCIATION OT IRON AND STEEL WORKEES. Thursday, Seytcmher 14, 1893. Mr. GarLjV^d. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen of the committee: We appear before this committee to-day as representing our labor organization, and asking for the retention of the present duty on differ- ent iron and steel products. We believe it to be a matter of interest to those who work in that business. We believe that Ijy having duties on iron and steel products it enables us to get a better price for our labor. We do not claim that the simple facts of having protection on those products gives us all we desire; but we claim and beheve that through organized labor we can get a better rate of wages by having protection on those goods than if there was no protection on them. That is the reason why we ask for a retention of the present duties on those different articles. It is said that if everything was cheaper it would be satisfaiitory to those who work by the day, if they got lower rates of wages. This we Ao not believf, to be a fact. We liave noticed that, no matter in what country labor is employed, nor at what price it is employed, it seems to be a battle to keep wages up. We prefer to battle on a higher plane than on a lower plane. We do not expect to get our wages without combination and trying to protect our trades by IRON AND STEEL. 335 combination and prices to work by. "We believe that protection allows us to get a better rate, and that the plane on which we are now work- ing is higher than in other countries. The Chairman. Is the Amalgamated Association composed of skilled workers in the rolling mills? Mr. Garland. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Have any of your mills in recent years broken with you, or, rather, ceased to employ members of your association and em- ployed nonunion men? Mr. Garland. Yes, sir. The Chairman. After the strike at Homestead began they employed non-union men, did they not? Mr. Garland. Yes, sir. Mr. Tarsnet. As I understand your argument, your organization heli)s you to get better wages, and that is one of the objects you have in organization! Mr. Garland. Yes, sir; I may say in addition to that, we do not believe that protection gives better morals to some persons; but we find that many manufacturers believe that organized labor is better for them; unfortunately, some do not. Mr. Dalzell. Your tlieory is, that protection enables the employer to give better wages, and you get these better wages by your organi- zations'? Mr. Garland. Yes, sir. IROISr AND STEEL. (Schedule C.) STATEMENT OF MR. JOHN GEASOTG, OF PITTSBURG. Mr. Gearing. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen of the committee: I have no set speech to make. I am one of the committee of the Amal- gamated Association, and I am engaged in the cotton tie industry. I have come here to appeal to you, gentlemen, to make no change in that tariff schedule. The establishment at which I am employed, and haA^e been for many years, runs on that as a specialty, and there is a great deal imported of that particular commodity — cotton ties. We have now employed in that place at least a thousand men, and I think I can safely say that if there is any change to be made in that particu- lar schedule the result will be that we will have no emxiloyment. For that reason I am here to implore you to make no change in the cotton- tie schedule. Mr. Dat,zell. Do you work at Mr. Painter's mill? Mr. Gearing. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzell. Which is running exclusively on that article? Mr. Gearing. Yes, sir; that is their specialty, or they would be doing nothing. Mr. Dalzell. Do you know how many men are employed there? Mr. Gearing. There are 2,000 men employed in this industry. As one of the committee, I represent here to-day over 80,000 men. Mr. Dalzell. Prior to the passage of the McKinley bill the mill was not running? 336 METALS. Mr. Geabing. Prior to that tlie mills frere shut down, and the men -were walking the streets. To-day they are employed. Our i:)eople have spent money to bring that industry to perfection, and to day I suppose the works are the most perfect in America. Mr, Breckinridge. What is the condition of the metal when you begin to work it in your establishment? Mr. Gearing. It is in the nature of a raw product. Mr. Breckinridge. In what state is it when you take charge of it to make cotton ties? JMr. Gearing. We take it from what we call the steel billet. Some time ago we used to puddle iron and make our material at the works, but now we buy it from Carnegie and Co. Mr. Breckinridge. You start witli the billet? Mr. Gearing. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. What is it that you do with the billet? Go on and tell us the process. Mr. Gearing. The billet comes to us in the shape of pig or raw material. We have to cut that into shape and length and Aveigh it, in order to make what we want to make. It is heated and rolled, and then of course it is recut again and handled and bundled aud put into bundles ready for shi]Dment. Mr. Breckinridge. When you cut it into strips and have it in that last condition where you roll it out into a cotton tie, how many bun- dles of ties will one man roll out? Mr. Gearing. In the process of making ties there are probably 35 or 40 men and boys who handle it. It goes through those hands before it is completed and ready for market. Mr. Breckinridge. Will you state the mode of manufacture? Mr. Gearing. We are to-day, I think, about as far advanced in making it as any other firm in the country. Mr. Eeed. How do you make it from the steel billet to the cotton tie? Mr. Gearing. We simply heat and pass it through the rolls, and cut it to desired lengtts. Then it is diijped or varnished to preveut rust- ing and bundled. Mr. Reed. You pass a whole billet? Mr. Gearing. One billet will make eight cotton ties. Mr. Eeed. You heat it and pass it through again aud again? Mr. Gearing. It passes through the rolls fourteen or fifteen times from the time it leaves the furnace. Mr. Eeed. It is one continuous piece until cut up into cotton ties? Mr. Gearing. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. You have a gang of heaters and a gang of shearers? ]\Ir. Gearing. We stait with the shear men, and then the heater takes it. There are four men at a furnace. Mr. Gear. The boys take it and straighten it? Mr. Gearing. Yes, sir; then the roll hands take charge of it. They manipulate it through the rolls and pass it on to the shearers, who cut it, and then it is bundled and passes from this ])arty to what we call the galvanizing department. Mr. Stevens. From the bloom to the finished product, how many times does it pass? Mr. GeAIUNU. Fourteen times. Mr. Breckinridge. How many men will you work in running those fourteen rolls? Mr. Gearing. We run, between men aud boys, about twenty; and IRON AND STEEL. 337 wlien we inclnde sliearmen and bmidlers, where it ia tarred to keep it from rustiug, it will pass througli tlie hands of twenty- five men and boys. * Mr. BEECKiNRiDaE. How many bundles of cotton ties will those men and boys turn out in a day? Mr. GrEARiNa. It is owing to the size of the mill. They make four hundred and ten bundles of those cotton ties for each train of rolls. Mr. Beeckinridge. That is to say, it would take twenty-five men and boys. Mr. Gearing. It would take that number of men and boys ten hours to make four hundred and ten bundles; and when I say that, I mean that they Avill work ten hours and do not have time to eat. They vshould not do it in twelve hours. Mr. Gear. What size train do you use? Mr. Gearing. We use an 8 inch train. Some use 6 and some use 10. We use 8. Mr. Gear. Don't you think you can work a 10-inch with greater facility? Mr. Gearing. I do not think so. The history of the works to-day is that their output is as great as any in America on 8-inch mills. There are outside other firms making 9 and 10 inch; but they do not make it as a specialty. They do that in connection with other orders, but do not get the output that we do. Mr. Gear. You think an 8-inch train is best adapted? Mr. Gearing. Yes, sir; I speak from thirty years' experience. Mr. Burrows. Do you know anything about the quantity of ties produced in the United States in proportion to the consumption? Mr. Gearing. No, sir; I could not auswer that question. I simply know what we make, and I have heard that from other sources, but that would not be satisfactoiy to you. rROK AND STEEL. (Schedule C.) STATEMENT OF WILIIAM WEICHSEL OF AMALGAMATED ASSOCIATION. Mr. Chairman. I do not know that I can improve upon the remarks or ])ut it to you, gentlemen, in any better manner than has been done by many who have spoken. The manufacturers have also come here and I can corroborate their statements in almost every remark that they have made. They have told you what was the difference between the wages here and those in Wales; that it was 150 per ceut more in America than in Wales. This is true and there is no job that I know of in America now in the tin-plate business that does not receive wages 100 per cent higher than in Great Britain to-day. I will say further that, in ray opinion, and I represent that class of workmen, if there is any change made in the taiiff schedule on tin plate it will injure the work- iiigman directly, because I think he is the one who will suffer most. I have been in this business a very long time. I am not an imported man. I was born right here in America and am not one of those spoken of as imported. I was at one time rolling sheet iron, and from tliat Mr. Banfleld, the man for whom I am working at present, took me into his mill. I afterward started to roll tin and have been at tliat for a little over a year. There has been a great deal said in the remarks TH 22 338 METALS. that have been made with reference to the importation of these men. There are a great many more men in the business than there are im- ported men. I want to appeal to this committee in behal^of the wovk- ingman 7iot to tonch the duty on tin plate, because if you do you will injure the workingman. If there are any questions you wish to ask I will answer- them with pleasure if 1 can. Mr. Dalzell. You are rolling on black sheets in the same mill that was making steel sheets prior to the passage of the McKinley law ? Mr. Weighsbl. Yes, sir. lEOlST AND STEEL. (Schedulo C.) STAEEMEin: OF GEOKGE D. EVANS, BEIBGEPOKT, OHIO, OF AHALGAHATED ASSO- CIATION. Mr. Chairman. I come here not as an imported man, but still I came from the other side, and have a practical knowledge of the tin business in both countries. While listening to some of the remarks questions were asked, and I thouglit they were proper questions to put to anyone, and while perliaps a workingman can not answer all these questions, especially those who are not used to speech-making, why was it that tin plate was reduced in price during the least eight or ten years? There was some kind of an answer given to it, but I thonght, perhaps, I would be able to give a more satisfactory one and could exi^lain more in detail because I have been employed making tin from the time I was a boy. Mr. Oronemeyer says steel had taken the IDlace of what we call iron. We know it has, but a little further ex- planation is required on that particular x)oint. I will say that tin plate was rolled and cut and worked in the fire in former times. After that it was taken to the hammer, stamped out to be cut for work in the refiner's fires. By that process the grain of the iron was more closely worked. During the last six or eight years it has not been done so thoroughly as before, because it took more work. Since they have been cut down in price it has reduced the amount of work put on them. They first dropped off the fire work ; then they dropped off the refiner's work, and therefore the material in the article in the first plate is nothing like as good as it was; and in addition to that there is not so much tin in the article as there was ten or twelve years ago. If you buy a tin can which was made ten or twelve years ago it wonld last longer than a tin can which you would buy now. If you liada tin roof put on your house at that time it would last longer than a tin roof which would be put on now. I know a tin roof which has been on for ten or twelve years and is comparatively good to-day. I know some tin roofs which were put on six or seven years ago and are worn out now. If it is not painted tin will rust. This is a j)ractical reason why tin plate has been reduced. I think it would be well for you to encour- age the manufacture in this country for that reason. Tiiere was a qnestion asked as to the tin made in America and wliether it was as good as that made in England. I say it is, and I believe it is much better, because the material of which it is made is richer. The iron here is better than it is in the old country. Tlurt M'as proved by consumption. What 1 hope and trust is, that you gentlemen will consider this mat- IRON AND STEEL. 339 ter and not drive this business out of tlie coimtry, because if you do it will throw a large number of men out of woik. We all kuow that if the tariff on that particular product is reduced it is the men wlio -will suffer. I came over to this country pretty well flxed. In tlie old country when I was a boy I worked from in the morning till 8 at lught and did not have the second change of clothing. I did have auother change but I had to keep that for Sunday to g'o to church in. I suffered a great deal in the old country in this way. I do iiot believe it is iu the minds of the American people to keep us from making bet- ter wages. We will all be benefited by it. I hope you gentk^meu will cousider this. This is what we all believe and I hope you will deal leniently with us. Mr. Payne. Do you work at the same business here you did over there? Mr. Evans. For a few years here I did the same kind that I did over there, but I am now a sheet-roller. Mr. Payne. How much better wages do you get here than you got there ? Mr. Evans. I get very much better wages here. Mr. Payne. How much do you get here? Mr. Evans. About three or four times more than I got over there. A good sheet mill will make |24 iu a day for seven men. Mr. Payne. How much would seven men malie over there in a day"? Mr. Evans. Nothing like so much as they would make here. A catcher there would make $1.25 and $3 here; a rougher wovdd make 81.25 there and about $3 here. The work of the matcher and doubler over there is consolidated, and they have but one. Mr. Payne. They work from 6 o'clock in the morning until 7 at night! Mr. Evans. Kot now ; they used to. Mr. Payne. What hours do they work there? Mr. Evans. I believe they work now eight hours, Mr. Payne. You work here how many hours "I Mr. Evans. Eight. Mr. Payne. You say they used less block tin some ten years ago, and also used poorer stock ! Mr. Evans. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Our people use more block tin than they do over there, and make better quality! Mr. Evans. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinbidge. How do they pay you in the old country, by the day or by the piece? Mr. Evans. By the box. Mr. BRECKiNRtucfE. A squad divides just as they do here? Mr. Evans. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. How much do they pay you a box ? Mr. l']VANS. Tiiey used to pay on the otlier side 28 shillings for 100 boxes. Mv. Breckinridge. How much do you get here per 100 boxes? Mr. Evans. We work by the ton. 1 w^ork now in the sheet mills. 340 METALS. IRON AlfD STEEL. (Schedule C.) STATEKENT OF HE. C. H. HATJFMAN, OF BRIDGEFOET, OHIO, OF AMALGAMATED ASSOCIATION. Mr. Chairman: I came here to represent tlie slieet and jilate rollers. I represent about 12,000 men, in tlie aggregate, wlio are following that line of business. I came here to-day to see this committee, and to plead with yon to kee}) the duty on sheet iron and plate. To-day at least two-thirds, and jn'obably more, of the men I represent in this country are idle. Some few mills are running and manage to keep going. We know that in case this tariff is taken off there will be a reduction of wages. There is no doubt in my mind that that will be the case. The working man is the man who has to suffer every time. We have not done much work in my part of the business, but I am satisfied if the tariff' is taken off' we will not do any at all. Our people tell me that they can not get a single order for the size that I am working. I think this is something which requires a great deal of consideration at your hands. You are aware of the number of idle men in this country. We are satisfied that the remarks made by our colleagues in the Amalga- mated Association of Iron and Steel Wor]?;ers will convince you that they will be thrown out of work. I can tell yoir, gentlemen, that we agree with the manufacturers. The manufacturers have told you the truth. lEOlSr AIND STEEL. (Schedole C.) STATEMENT OF PHILIP HAGAN, OF YOTINGSTOWN, OHIO, OF AMALGAMATED ASSO- CIATION. Mr. Ohair^ian: I am from Youngstown, Ohio. There are five large firms there which make wrought iron exclusively. Every one of those firms employs union labor, and we always agree pretty well together; but as regards that 1 have nothing to say. The men working with me in our town have asked me to come liere, 400 miles, and say to you gentlemen that if the tariff' is reduced their wages will be reduced. This is their bread and butter. That is honest. In regaid to imported workmen, if ycju go into that, I am imported. 1 was not born under the stars and stripes. I did not have the say-so as to that. I can tell you that I know what it is to work under free trade. I stand here to say that I worked foi' 20 cents a day. I had to go to work before I was 9 years of age. That deprived me of any part of an education. As soon as I got a very limited education, enough to enable me to understand that lab(n' in America was j)rotected, 1 went to an. English gentleman and discussed the matter with him, and he ^;aid to me, " The American people are not such fools as to reduce their tariff. Young man, go there." Consecxuently I came here, a.nd received the benefit of it for several years. With this extra money which I made I was enabled to give myself some instruction. Jt was a strug- gle for existence over there. Here I was al)le to raise my family. Gen- tlemen, are you going to wipe it outi For God's sake, do not do any- IRON AND STEEL. 341 tLing of tlie kind ; it is a great advantage to have citi^iens who arc good, intelligent citizens, and if you deprive tliem of education they will never be good citizens. I could stand here and talk for hours for the 6,000 men in Youngs- town, Ohio. They beg of you not to reduce the tariff on bar and wrought iron. We have had current prices for years. I wish to tell you the difference between the puddlers in England, wlien I worked there, and the prices now. I went to work for ten hours a day for -(» cents. When 1 advanced to the position of boiler in a furnace I re- ceived 5 shillings per day. I was getting 6 and G pence in 1869. Mr. Payne. How old are you? Mr. Hagan. That was in September, 1842. I worked on the Eiver Tyne. To-day they are paying the same prices, Mr. Daj.zell. I suppose these 6,000 men for whom you are speaking are Democrats'? Mr. Hagan. When it comes to a tariff we know nothing about poli- tics. A Delegate. I want to say that the men are from both political liarties. Mr. Hagan. That is bread and butter. Mr. Dalzell. But you go in for a tariff? Mr. Hagan. I go in to protect labor. Mr. Turner. When did you come to this country? Mr. Hagan. On the 19th of January, 1870. Mr. Turner. How old were you then 1 Mr. Hagan. Well, you have me there. (After reckoning) 27. Mr. Turner. Had you then learned the trade? Mr. Hagan. Yes, sir. I had learned the trade early, because I had been in the mill from infancy. I was not more than an infant when I went to work. Mr. Burrows. That was really an infant industry. The Chairman. What was the difference between the wages there and here of the same grade of work? Mr. Hagan. It was $2.60. I received therefor puddling .$1.20, or 5 shillings for 3,000 weight; and here I received $3.80 for 2,750 weight. I went uji with the market. That is the present price. I have realized higher wages before. We have the highest in the country; there is none higher. Mr. GrEAR. The wages in England are higher than in Belgium? Mr. Hagan. Yes, sir; they are higher in England. I do not know just exactly how much; but wages in Belgium are about 75 cents a day. We start on Monday morning and stop the furinice on Saturday night to clean it; but in Belgium they never stop as long as a furnace holds out. Mr. Gear. That is true in Germany? Mr. Hagan. As long as the furnace holds out, they never stop. Mr. Turner. You said just now that you Avere inqxu'tod. You do not mean that you were brought in under contract? Mr. Hagan. Oh, no; I mean to say that there was so much talk about people being imported Mr. Turner. You paid your expenses? Mr. Hagan. Yes, sir; there were no men imported twenty-three years ago. We all "came over" then. The Chairman. There was a time when manufacturers used to im- port labor for their steel mills ? Mr, Hagan. I heard it said. I can not say as to its truth. 342 METALS. The Ohaieman. Tlie president of the Amalgamated Association tes- tified as to that. Mr. Hagan. T belicA'cd so too at one time; but I conld not trace it. The Chairman. I understood from your argument tliat it was your sincere belief that the high rate of wages is due to the protective tariff? Mr. Hagan. That is my belief. The Ohaikman, How many ix'ople own land in England? Mr. Hagan. I do not know, but about twenty-five people own 2,000,000 acres. The Chairman. A very small number of people own all the land? Mr. Hagan. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Let me give you this idea: There is a large popula- tion in England compared to tlie size of the country. Mr. Hagan. I think it is about 190,000 or 200,000 square miles. The Chaii;man. England is less in size than some of the States of this Union. Mr. Hagan. In fact it is, I believe, about 50,000 square miles less. The Chairman. We have one State, Texas, with 275,000 square miles, and California probably has 150,000 square miles. Laud in Eng- land is limited to a low owners? Mr. Hagan. Yes, sir. The Chairman. So that a man born poor has little chance of owning his own home? Mr. Hagan. It would be imi)ossible. The Chairman. I will ask you this hypotlietical question, and it is not original with me : Suppose that to-morrow morning the people of England were to wake up and find that during the night as if by magic England had extended her territory half way across the Atlantic Ocean, so as to make her territory average as large in proportion as our terri- tory is to our population. Would not the.opening up of that new west- ern country, vast and rich in valleys and green fields, with great rivers, and with mountaius full of ores of various kinds, with water power and timber, cause a great rush to settle up that country; and don't you imagine that there would at once be an increase of wages in England? Mr. Hagan. Yes, sir; I third? tliere would be. The Chairman. I think that has something to do with the wages in this country. Mr. Eebd. Now, suppose Belgium was right alongside, where the wages are only 75 cents a day, would not the wage-workers of Belgium come in and regulate the prices of wages in England in consequence of the discoveiy of these great valleys and beautiful fields, which the chairman has hj-pothetically pictured? Mr. Hagan. Yes, sir; certainly. The Chairman. TJie Belgian manufacturers would not supply tlie English trade at once? Mr. Hagan. In^o; not altogether; but in time they certainly would. The Chairman. They could not pour all these people into this coun- try at once withont making high prices. Mr. Hagan. iJo you mean to say that the population is so sparse in the United Statics that we are entitled to these wages? Tlie Chairman. Yes, sir; that is the idea. Mr. Hagan. I can assure yonif y(m take the duty off imports wages will be as small here as they are in England, in a short time. The ChAir^man. Are not the wages of' the people who work in unpro- tected industries in this country, in agricultural machinery and those IKON AND STEEL. 343 wlio work on the farms, larger than the wages of those people in like occupations in the crowded countries of the Oki World? Mr. Hagan. Wait a moment on that. I do not exactly know what farmers are getting in Dalvota. The Chairman. Take Ohio farmers. Mr. Hagan. I am not in that business; but I tliink $20 a montli is the wages in Ohio. In Ireland a farm laborer today will re(;eiv(' .'! shillings to 4 and 6 pence and board. That I take from the public press. Mr. Payne. Twenty dollars includes board in Ohio? Mr. Hagan. Yes, sir; but I may not be correct about that. The Chairman. Is not the difference between the ^\■Agcs of the farm hand in Ohio and in England quite as much as the diflereiice between the skilled operative in the rolling mill here and the skilled operative there? Mr. Hagan. I believe not; but I am not positive on that question. The farm laborer in England gets 6 to 8 iience. I do not know about that, however. I do not look after that part of the trade; but they used to receive that, I know, for six mouths, the time for which they contracted. Eighty- live cents would be 40; it would be as many as six would go into 40. There is a big difference. A Delegate. About the scarcity of men in this country being thd cause of high prices, I want to say that a great many men are out of work. There are more men than there are jobs. Mr. Breckinridge. You speak of getting $1.25 for puddling, and paying a certain amount of that for help in the old country. Mr. Hagan. That is the amount after paying for help. The price was about 6 pence per ton, biit call it that. We used to have 3,000. I had to pay one-twelfth of it for help. Mr. Breckinridge. What would it leave you, after paying for the help? Mr. Hagan. Three dollars and eighty cents. The amount I made here was $G.30j and after paying for help that leaves me $3.80. IRON AND STEBIi. Sclicdule 0. STATEMENT OF ME. J. C. KILGAltON, OF PITTSBTTBG, PA., OF AMALGAMATED . ASSOCIATION. Mr. Chairman : I suppose it is hardly worth while for me to try to extend the argument that has been offered by my colleagues, and par- ticularly that relating to my own occupation, or what was my occupa- tion up to the time of my having been elected to the position I now hold as secretary. My friend who has just spoken, Mr. Hagan, has covered it. Perhaps it is sufBcient to say that he made two or three points which perhaps I could cover a little better. I can, however, sub- stantiate what he said. I can do it with more force when I tell you that it has been my lot to have had some experience, though less limited than he has had. I have puddled in England and America, If the wages for boiling in the United States were the same as they are now in England I would prefer to boil in tlie United States. The point I wish to bring out is that tliere is nothing in the conditions of labor in this country that would warrant me or any other person in 344 METALS. expecting- any more for tlie performance of that labor tlian I -would be entitled to at the same class of labor in England. It fs not harder here, but far easier, and I believe our friends here will concur with me in this statement. 1 am not, however, alone interested in the retention of this particular branch, but in the entire trade. It is to me a matter of great importance. I feel that our people are in a position where to change the present tariff would undoubtedly bring great suffering; and right here I wish to make some reference to a remark which was dro]iped by the chairman a few moments ago. We were asked why it was that the wages of the workmen employed in trades that necessarily were unprotected were higher than were the wages in free trade or tariff for revenue only countries. We hold that this difference in favor of unprotected American industries is due to natural advantages. We are firm in our belief that the example of high wages in the protected trade is one of the influences in creating that high rate in the unprotected trade. Take the bricklayers. There is no doubt in my mind that the brick- layer could not commence to command the present high rate of wages unless the rate at which he works was virtually made up by the pro- tected trades. If it were not for that his wages would be so great in comparison that there would be no inducement to go into any other trade. This is true of every unprotected trade ; and we hold that pro- tection does not only protect those specifically named but it protects the whole community, if not directly, then indirectly. Hence our posi- tion as iron workers is that we believe we are j)erforming a duty which we owe to our fellow citizens of every trade in assisting with them in preventing in every way we j^ossibly can, that is legitimate, any inter- ference with the administration of the tariff that will injure our present prosperity. I did not intend, when I started, to occupy so much time and I will not continue further. I have simi^ly to say, as I am the last speaker, that I wish to thank this committee for the kind attention with which the members have listened to us. I believe that we will all go away feeling that our interest is safe in the hands of this committee. Mr. Eeed. You refer to the matter of bricklayers. I suppose that if any of the goods on which you work could not be imported, that ques- t;o 1 of wages would have to be settled in America entirely i Mr. KiLGALLON. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. So that anything we can not imj^ort is protected just the same as anything is protected by law, or on which there is a prohibi- tory duty? Mr. KiLGALLON. That is my belief Mr. Eeed. Brick houses can not be imported? Mr. KiLGALLON. No, sir. Mr. Eeed. Then it is better than protection to them, for it is the same as a prohibitory tariff? Mr. KiLGALLON. That is what we believe. Mr. Eeed. Perhaps the same causes operate in other things? Mr. KiLGALLON. The men in certain employments have certain nat- ural advantages of which you speak, and in addition to that there is the advantage created by the specific wages under our ijrotective sys- tem. Both combine. The Chaieman. Wheat can be imported? Mr. KiLGALLON. Yes, sir. The Ghaikman. What makes the farm hand in Ohio get so much larger wages than the farm hand in England? IRON AND STEEL. 345 Mr. KiLGALLON. It is my belief, and I And i(, to be the belief of a great many people who follow labor for a living and who do not know of the niceties of the theories and the technicalities of the way in which the law is administered, that even in the case of a farm hand in Ohio the wages of his neighbor are higher than they otherwise wonld be. The Chairman. He sells abroad at free- trade prices? Mr. Kjlgallon. He does not sell all he produces at free-trade prices. The Chaikjian. He sells a large part of it? Mr. KiLGALLON. There are other things. The establishment of manufactures in the farming States, we think, is beneficial, for it gives him a rise in the price of his grain. The Chairman. Does wheat sell for more in the manufacturing dis- tricts than anywhere else? Mr. KiLGALLON. I should judge so. I have never lived in a farm- ing district. Mr. Eeed. Is it a fact that the price of wheat depends very much upon our surplus; the size of our surplus may have very much influence? Mr. KiLGALLON. I think so. Mr. Reed. Whereas 1,000,000 bushels of wheat might not have much effect on the market price, yet 50,000,000 or 100,000,000 bushels w^ould have a much greater effect on the price than the proportion of figures would indicate. Mr. KiLGALLON. I think so. Mr. Reed. If we ceased consuming in this country and had a less number of laborers, we would have more surjilus and the price would be down? Mr. KiLGALLON. I think so. Mr. Breckinridge. As a question of national policy, do you believe that the farmers could afford to hire iieople to eat wheat? Mr. KiLGALLON. That involves the whole question of the tariff, and, as I said, as to the farmer's relation to it I would not like to go into the question, not because I fear investigation as to the relation of pro- tection, but for the reason that, not having lived in a farming district, but in the midst of industrial districts, I do not feel safe in arguing that feature of the question. Mr. Breckinridge. As bearing upon your own business, if there is a manufactured article produced in this country more cheaply than in any European country, from whatever cause, and so much less that it can be readily placed in the principal markets at a still less price than the product of any other country, and the party charges more for it, ATOuld not that restrict labor ? Mr. KiLGALLON. Home competition would be really needed in that case to prevent exorbitant prices abroad. Mr. Breckinridge. It needs no protection at all? Mr. KiLGALLON. lu answer to that I would state that it is possible for a case to arise; that there would be a time wheu protection would be needed. Mr. Breckinridge. I will ask you if the case is not already here? Mr. KiLGALLON. I am coming to that. The article might be pro- tected and sell high for a long lime, but the time would come when, for some reason or other, whether by the production of the article or other reason, the cost would be below the cost in the country against which the legislation is designed to protect us. Temporarily it would look like the tariff is unnecessary, but a removal of the duty may have 34fi METALS. tbe effect of raising prices iu tliis country, becanse when tlie tariff was lowered there would be a great introduction of English goods and our manufacturers would be destroyed. I think, therefore, the manufac- turer needs protecttion. Mr. Breckinridge. Suppose I manufacture (as some people do in my country) a coarse article of cotton cloth and I shii) it to Liverpool or China and can make it more cheaply than in any country in the ■world, and suppose there is a tax of, say, 2^ cents a square yard jKit upon that cloth. Have I not to make it cheaper than anybody else, so no one else can undersell me? If there is a tax put upon that, am I not compelled to make the American consumer pay more for it? Mr. KiLGALLON. I think so. Mr. Breckinridge. Is there not a less chance for the employment of labor in my mills on that account? Mr. Kilgallon. If I understand you, you mean to say that a tariii tax is asked to protect us because it is being sold for less. As for my- self I would regard such a tariff as not only unnecessary, but not projjer. But cases can arise where during the operation of the tariff this change may take place. But in asking for a tariff to cover an article already protected by reason of its cheapness it seems to me would be improper. Mr. Breckinridge. But if the duty on any article is much iu excess of what will cover the cost of production, in the interest of labor that excess should be lowered. Mr. Kilgallon. I have reason to believe we do not ask an unneces- sary protection. s Mr. Eeed. This supposed collection of people who are making con- siderably larger i^rofits in excess of others would be likely to be found out, would they not, by the workiugman? Mr. Kilgallon. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. I would put some provision in the law by which he would find it out. Mr. Kilgallon. Perhaps if the tariff were so arranged as not oidy to create prices and to enable the employer to i)ay high wages, but to insure their payment, I think it would be a better scheme. Mr. Breckinridge. That is an admirable point. I think such pro- vision should be made in the tariff. Mr. Kilgallon. Occasionally we have labor troubles. I never ex- pect to see a day when we will not, so long as the present system obtains. But, as was said by the first si)eaker, there is a common ground of agreement. There are certain points upon which employer and em- ployes can not agree, and that point is reached by tliis diiference. One wants to ijutit at one point and the other at another point, but remove the tarift' and we will be simply on common ground. They differ be- fore they get to that point. Those troubles will occur. Generally speaking, we find manufacturers disposed to treat our people fairly. Occasionally we find people disposed to take advantage, when oppor- tunity arises. We do not, however, look upon that as a reason for any alteration that would injure the trade. A reduction of wages would not only cause labor troubles, but itwould cause all points to be more fiercely resisted and would cause troubles to be more numerous and more objectionable than under the i)rosent method. Generally a good feeling prevails now. Mr. Byntjm. Do you gentlemen believe that the tariff which has been iixed on the iron and steel schedule helps you iu your Avages ? IRON AND STEEL. 347 Mr. KiLCrALLON. We get tlie benefit of it. Mr. 13 YNUM. What is the average tariff on the iron and gteel schedule ? Mr. KiLGALLON. Our president, Mr. Garland, who spoke tirst, liaU arranged to go into that matter. Mr. Bynum. I suppose you have often discussed this question of wages and tariffs in your labor meetings'? Mr. KiLftALLON. We have, but not often. Mr. Bynum. Did you ever calculate the output of your employes and then calculate the portion they receive to see whether you got your share of it? Mr. KiLGALLON. In our negotiations about schedules, while we do not take the tariff' rate and dissect it, we do start at the raw material and count its cost, then go into all the avenues by which it is turned into the finished product, go through the process of ascertaining the cost and follow it right into the market, until we get a selling price. The tariff must be included in it. Mr. Byntjm. Did you ever calculate to ascertain whether you got your share of the tariff? Mr. KiLGALLON. Sometimes we think we ought to get more, and sometimes the manufacturers think they ought to get more. There is a commoa agreement among us that we get a fair share of it. Mr. Byntjm. Is it not a fact that the tariff' on the iron and steel schedule is about 55 per cent? You do not get 55 per cent, or more than half of the output of the manufacturers? Mr. KiLGALLON. Do you mean the value of the product turned out? That is a very indefinite question and one I do not understand. Mr. Byntjm. You know what the output of the manufacturer is? Mr. KiLGALLON. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynum. Do your workingmen get half of that for their wages? Mr. KiLGALLON. I can not see your point. Mr. Bynum. If it should turn out that the tariff is much more than you get, then if the tariff' were reduced it would notaft'ect j^our wages, would it? Mr. KiLGALLON. If the tariff is higher than is necessary ? Mr. Byntjm. If the tariff' is 55 per cent, and you get 25 per cent. Mr. KiLGALLON. Do you mean if the tariff' is 55 per cent, and I and my fellow-workmen only get 25 per cent? As to that, I should think if the tariff was higher we would try to get more, and we believe we could get more. Mr. Byntjm. As a matter of fact, you do not get more? Mr. KiLGALLON. It would necessitate a close investigation as to the cost of those things. Mr. Bynum. That investigation has been made, has it not? Mr. KiLGALLON. Not in that way. We do not take the value that is added to the i^roduct by the tariff and find that duty. We simply take the raw material, and follow it up until it is finished. Mr. Bynum. You go through and calculate the materials, cost of pro- duction, etc., and the selling price, and your wages are fixed in that way? Mr. KiLGALLON. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynum. You do not take into consideration whether the tariff is more than enough ? Mr. KiLGALLON. When we take the cost, or value, we deem that sufficient. Mr, Bynum. Suppose the tariff is in excess of that. Suppose you 348 METALS. do not use it, and suppose you get no part of it, then there could be a reduction of tlie tariff without alfecting you? ]Mr. KiLGALLON. Certainly. Mr. Bynttm. If the tarift is excessive, then you do not get any ben- efit from it ? Mr. KiLGALLON. If unnecessarily so, we would not. Mr. Bynum. In the case of some articles of woolen clothing the tariff runs up to 3-!5 per cent. Do you think that is necessary? Mr. KiLG-ALLON. I could not say. Mr. By'ntjm. You wear some woolen clothes? Mr. KiLGALLON. Occasionally — they tell me they are wool. Mr, Bynum. You are not right certain about it? Mr. KiLGALLON. They may be mostly shoddy. Mr. Eeed. You take the difference between the raw material and the finished product — the difference between the raw material and the work you put upon it? Mr. KiLGALLON. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. If you simply took the value of the product and calcu lated the percentage, and did uot calculate the percentage of the differ- ence, you would make a mistake, would you not? Mr. KiLGALLON The man who employs us buys the raw material. We do not carry our iuvestigation to that particular state. For in- stance, in calculating what a boiler should secure for boiling, we w'ould start at the pig and not at the ore, because we would first ascertain how much a ton of pig costs that man, and then we would carry it no further. Mr. Eeed. Then your percentage of labor would only be the differ- ence between the pig and bar iron. If you undertook to calculate your percentage upon the whole price, bar iron and all, you would make a great mistake? Mr. KiLGALLON. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. That is a mistake which some tariff reformers make. IIlO:iSr AND STEEL. (Schedule C.) STATEMENT OF HON. T. W. PHILLIPS, OF NEWCASTLE, PA. Mr. CrrATKMA >; : 1 have been re(|uested to read in your hearing the fol- lowing jjetition, whicli is addressed to me: Peak Sir: We are pleased to know that yon liave been placed on the Labor Gom- mittee, as we well know from the jiast that yon are the friend of the honest labor- ing man. We, as inemliers of the Amalgamated Association of Iron, Steel, and Tin- plate Workers, respectfnlly request yon, as our Ixepresentative in Congress, to enter aprotest before the Ways and Means Committee in behalf of the workmen in all of tlie tin-plate establishments in the United States against any reduction in the tariff on black and tin and terne plates. The workmen now engaged in the manufacture of tin and terne jilates in this country have demonstrated their ability to make plates of a quality equal to .any produced .anywhere in the world. If the present tariff is retained on Idack and tin and terne i)lates the expansion and growth of the manufactures of tin )}lates will be greater than that of any other branch of the iron and steel business, and will, in time, give employment to thousands of skilled work- men and laboring men. The United States of America can uot at the present time so easily establish any mauufacturiug industry that will give employment to so IRON AND STEEL. 349 in.Tiy wortmen directly and indirectly and that will distribute so many millions of dollars each year througbout the country, asthatofthc manuikcture oftiu andterne plates. Harry Herbert, Williaim Jenkins, Albert Uusskll, Rohkrt Johnes, Edmund Absalom, Thomas Sadler, C.J. HosKiNS, Da\'id Davies, Paul Lewis, Alfred Wilson, David John, Enock Gunter, David Williams, Thomas Thomas, John D. Williams, Committee of iron, steel, and tin-jilate loorlcers. Mr. Phillips. These are practical men who have been working in my own city. They have a large plant there, and I am informed by friends that they can not tnrn a wheel. It has not started, but com- pleted. They will be nnable to oi)erate their •*»'orks if the tariff is reduced to what it was before the McKinlej' bill was enacted. They requested me to present this j)aper. I hope you will not recommend a law reducing the tariff. IRON AKD STEEL. (Schedule C.) STATEMElfT OF ME. JOHN JAREETT, SECEETAEY OF THE ASSOCIATION OF lEON AND STEEL MAN0FACTTJEEES AND TIN-PLATE MANUFACTUESIiS. Mr. Chairman : I want to make a few remarks explanatory of some of the remarks made by preceding speakers. On behalf of the sheet- iron and steel manufacturers, we desire to say that we enter our i)lea simply for the amount of the difference in the wages paid in each coun- try. I have before me the official statement — something that has never been seen before — of the union scale of wages paid to steel and iron workers in England. These are the highest wages paid in that coun- try. I have also before me the Western schedule of prices of the Amal- gamated Iron and Steel Workers' Association. These are also repre- sented as being the wages paid in the United States. I desire to com- pare these rates of wages. I will give the figures in dollars and cents so that you can understand them. If I used the terms " singles," " dou- bles," and "laterals," you would not understand them, because they are terms different from what we have in the United States. Here areanum- ber of gauges uji to number 8, and lighter. I should explain that single means anything up to 20; double means anything up to 24; and lateral means anything up to 27; the others given simply run to 28, 29, and 30. The price paid for 31's is precisely the same as the price paid for 38's. The price paid for 38's in the United States is $10.05. So you may understand that rolling includes not only wages of the roller, but the wages of rolling, heating, and shearing. The figures in the old country include other sums, as there are certain allowances. In the United States the price is $10.05 per gross ton of 2,240 pounds. In Eng- land the price is 18 shillings and C pence per gross ton of 2,240 pounds. Tliis 18 shillings and 6 pence, according to the schedule before me, is subject to reduction of 2^ per cent, and also a reduction of 2J per cent which took effect on the 14th of April last. That is, altogether, 5 per 350 METALS. cent, or nearly 1 shilling to the pound. Hence, this is 17 shillings 9 pence, or $4.40, against $10.05 in this country. With this diiference, the daily labor in the United States amounts to $4.25, while in England they pay rollers 2 shillings, or 48 cents, per ton. Puddlers.in the United States get $5.60 as against 4 shillings, or 98 cents, in England. I will explain why these wages are eo low. I dare say you have read reports of what is known as the sweating system, which will be found in the Parliament reports. The British Parliament entered into an investigation of the wages paid. Having been consul at Birming- ham under the late Administration, I had au opportunity to personally investigate this question for myself, and I became familiar with the facts in the case. A gentleman handed me a piece of paper in connec- tion with women as blacksmiths in this district in England, and I should be pleased to place it before this committee. I have taken this official statement, which the committee, of course, can accept without hesitation. In this district the men and women, boys and girls, do manual labor that none but males do in this country. Even the Hon. William E. Gladstone says this is one of the results of the feudal system in that country which has not been swept away. There is no doubt of that. The low wages paid in these mills affects the wages of the union or organized mills in that country, and, conse- quently, the sheet-iron workers receive low wages. If the sheet-iron workers in England are idle for a week the public is compelled to fur- nish something for them to eat. If idle for several weeks the public institutions take care of them. We do not want any such system in this country; and, consequently, I say these wages are fair, reasonable, and equital)le, and enable these people in this country to live respecta- bly and to raise their families as they ought to do. We believe in good wages. Even Congress itself believes in that. We do not want low wages in this country. I heard a question asked about wages in Germany. In that country you will find that even in the legislative halls, if you will follow that question up, wages are low. The salary of the members of the Eeich- stag is only $600 a year. A BYSTANDER. It is Only $300. Mr. Jaeeett. Then it is half what I supposed it was. I trust that in consideration of this fact you will not place the workmen of this country in that position. I speak feelingly, for I have been a working- man myself I know what it is to work hard for wages, and I want to see the workingmen paid good wages. It is for the Congress of the United States to decide whether the wages of our workingmen shall be put down to the level of the wages of England. This is a serious question, and I trust, speaking inbehalf of theeiiiploy(5s and workmen as well as the manufacturers, that you will not reduce the duty in any shape or form, for the duty is barely sufficient to cover the difference in wages for fine goods. I also want to say a few words in counection with the tin-plate indus- try, for I happen to represent that, too, though a Welshman by birth. When I became an American citizen I, from that time on, began to favor American industries independent of other considerations. I speak for tin plate just as much as for any other industry, though it is exclusively a Welsh product. Why? Because Divine Providence gifted us with a larger area in proportion to population, twice over, than any other country in the world in coal, limestone, and iron ore, and these IRON AND STEEL. 351 are the three elements which enter into the manufacture of iron and steel. Were those elements given us by Providence to remain unde- veloped simply because England can produce cheai>er than we can? The question is, does En gland possess these in larger measures than we do? Uas Providence been kinder to her than to us? I say He has been kinder to us, and He has given us these iu larger proportion, and they are a great deal finer than England possesses. We do not need to go down into tlie bowels of the earth 400 or 500 or 1,000 feet to reach good coal. Ours is almost on the surface. We do not need to cross the channel to get our iron ore. Ninety per cent of the tin plate manu- facturedin Wales is from imported ores. It is not, then, a natural indus- try at all. She has to import ores for more than 200 miles at the pres- ent time. Again the subject of tin plate has been talked about so much. I maintain that we have the resources in this country in a greater meas- ure than England has; and why should we not manufacture these goods? If we i)ossess it in a greater measure, how can England manufacture it cheaper? I had a conversation with Mr. Gladstone^aud I say it with the highest respect for him — in which interview I presented this question to him, and asked him why England could manufacture it cheaper. He said simply " We have cheaper labor." Will you gentlemen concede that? We are more abundantly supplied with material to make tin plate from than is any otlier nation on the face of the earth. Why can any other people manufacture it cheaper ? I am told that this industry was established in Great Britain without protection. That is not true. Nor is it true that any great industry has been established there with- out protection. Many people are under the impression that protection ceased in England in 1846. There are evidences of it left, and have been as far down as 1872. From that time England has been going down. In 1877 England produced 0,600,000 tons of pig iron; we pro- duced 2,0(f0,000 tons. Last year we produced 9,000,000 tons, and Eng- land produced a little over 6,000,000 tons. We will progress, if you will permit us to progress. And I, therefore, appeal to you not to interfere with the duty on tin plates. Do not be led away by all this fallacy about tin plates being imported. Why are they imported? In this country the raw material exists in greater abundance than it does there. Some industries have started up to the present time, but they have been under a cloud and are now uiuible to make advances, fearing that these duties which have been placed on tin plates will be swept away. I trust tliat you gentlemen, not as mendiers of Congress alone, not as members of any political party, but as American citizens and statesmen, will stand by this industry. The remark was made that tin-plate rollers get the highest wages in Wales. It would appear, theiefore, as being too high. I have heard remarks that too high wages have been X)aid to labor. It may be that there have been cases where wages may ajipear somewhat too high; but the labor cost in this country is no more tlian it ought to be. There should be something done in the way of equalizing the wages of work- men in tliis country. There was a question raised as to the price of tin plates. It was immediately preceding the tin-plate industry in this country that the McKinley bill was adopted. The bill was adopted aiter the iiidnstry got a foothold. There is sometliing very subtle in this question of 332 MTEALS. prices. At tlie time wlien the McKinley bill wa,s adopted the price of "".in plates had not iucie;ised 1 cent in this market, but they had ncreasedin the English market., You know perfectly well that the iron and steel boom commenced in England in November, 1888, and continued through 1889, and about August, 1890, the reaction commenced in tin plates. But instead of tin plates going np, as other prices had done in England, they failed to go up. They were kept down. Sir. Swank made a remark, and called attention to the fact, that steel bar had advanced in price very mate- rially, but that tin plates had not advanced. In other words, while at the very moment the discussion of the question of duty on tin plates was going on in this country, the Welsh manufacturers took good care that prices did not advance then. They were manipulating the market, and had it in their own hands. Now, Mr. Chairman and gentlemen of the committee, look at the price of tin plates. The wages of labor did not advance 1 cent. Directly after the McKinley bill passed the price went up. While the price of tin plate went up in this country, the price of sheet bar went down. Why did the price of tin plate go up? I happen to know that there was a little collusion to advance prices, not because it was necessary, but they advanced the price simply because they wanted to stultify the sentiment of the American people in connection with this tin-plate industry. They wanted to stultify the consumer because he dared to intrude upon their sacred ground as manufacturers of this commodity. However, the tin-plate clause did go into effect. The price fell some- what after that. The prices also went down in England, and why? Simply for the purpose of beating down the price in this country. I remember that when I was consul in Birmingham I received letters from the State Department asking why the price of tin to the United States was diftlTcnt from that shipped to South America. The price of invoices to the United States was jjlaced at $21 while the iwice to other countries was $30. The invoices to Prance and Germany were $'2Q ; to the Argentine liepublic, $36 and $37. Those were i^laces where there was no competition. We had the market in this country, and they had to bring their prices to meet that competition. It has been the case all along the line. During the nine months' time that England took advantage of the American market before the tin-plate clause in the bill went into operation she reai)ed enough profit to live for three years. After that she sold at cost or less, if possible, with the hope of wiping out this industry in this country. I need not go into details as to the industry generally. I waiUt to say a word in behalf of the tin-plate workers. Something has been said about imported labor to manufactuie tin plates in this country. If you go back far enough all of us were imiiorted. I am an adopted citizen, and I thank God for that privilege. But in one sense I was imported. I came because I desired to come here. It may be said that I am imported for that reason. Large numbers of Welshmen have come over here because they expected to get more wages. They have come here with the object of becoming American citizens. You, gen- tlemen of the committee, have heard that some of them have come over and gone back, and they have told the people over there that this industry was going to fail. They are simply the hired agents that have been sent heie for the purpose of getting up a scare in this matter. New works can not be run on the line of old establishments. These men came here and went back and described the industry, and one pai'.er said this American industry could not succeed. IKON AND STEEL. 353 Let me appeal to your patriotic spirit and enthnsinsm to stand by this industry, and say that we must have our industrial independence in tin plate as in other commodities. There is no reason why we should depend on England and Wales, so long as we have such gifted natural resources to become a large producer. I appeal to you in behalf of the workmen to stand by them, because, standing by them, you will stand by their employers. Not long ago I was addressing a public meeting, when a gentleman challenged me, and said that I was there in the interest of the Ameri- can manufacturers. I said that I was in the interest of the American manufacturers, and I come here to-day in that interest, because, being in the interest of the manufacturers, I am at the same time in the inter- est of the workmen. I thank you, gentlemen, for your very kind attention to what I have said. IHON OKE, ETC. (Paragraph 133.) STATEMENT OF EJEPRESENTATIVE SPESET. Wednesday, September 20, 1893. Mr. Chairivian : I have two points in behalf of two manufacturers which I wish to submit. One is from the Collins Company, a letter from the president. The Collins Company are located in my district. They employ several hundred hands, and have almost exclusively a foreign trade in South America and the tropical countries. They make tools which are used and particularly adapted to those countries. Mr. Collins wrote me a long letter touching his interest in this tariff". He hopes ]'t will not be changed, though in some ways he might be benefited. Scrap iron is described as a by-product. He uses Swedish bar charcoal iron which he puts through the open-hearth process and transforms into steel. He does not care for free coal. The Collins Company is particularly interested in the reciprocity features of the present tariif. The company has very largely extended its trade under reciprocity and they very much hope that, whatever changes may be made in rates of duties, the reciprocity features will continue as a feature in the new tariff. I would like to submit the original letter, and when the committee come to read the printed record, the members will find that letter of great interest in that connection. The Collins Company. Collinsville, Hartford County, Conn., September 16, 1S93. De\r Sir: Yonrs of the Wth instant received. We wish you would urge upon the Ways and Means Committee the importance of not disturbing the existing law as to reciprocity. The commercial arrangements that have been made with various Latin-Amorican countries whereby our manufactures, which are agricultural implements, are ad- mitted to those countries free of duty is of great importance to us as well as to others of your constituents. We, of course, had trade in those countries before, but only a small fraction com- pared with what our competitors in England and Germany with their low cost of materials and labor have controlled. It has taken a long time, with the aid of the State Department and our own rep- resentatives in Cuba, Brazil, and other countries, to get the details arranged and SH 23 d04 METALS. compel customs officers to pass free of duty nntler reciprocity agreement onr goods, and not until recently have we been able to get the details at some of the principal ports properly arranged. With our goods on the free list in those countries ire know our trade will be largely increased, and we are making great etfort with our men on the ground to push things on those lines. Already we are having orders in consequence not obtainable under old duty rates that buyers were obligeil to pay and business will under these con- ditions increase from now forward. If you will examine copies of the commercial airangements with Spain for Cuba and Porto Rico, Brazil, San Salvador, and other countries south of us, which copies you can get at the Department of Sta.te, yon will see at a glance the extensive list of manufactures under which Connecticut may be favored if reciprocity arrange- ments are continued. Connecticut is nothing in a business way comparatively except for her manufac- tures. We hope you can help us as to reciprocity if not on the tariff schedules and beg to thank you in advance for promised effort in this direction. Free iron ore will help thi^ iron manufacturers of Pennsylvania. Please remember tliat no iron ore nor pig iron is used in the manufacture of bar iron in New England nor generally on the Atlantic seaboard. What we want as iron manufacturers, here as elsewhere in New England, is free wronght-iron scrap, which is the raw material here for bar-iron making. Scrap iron is a by-product and waste, not an article of manufacture. It ought never to pay a duty and no industry exists that produces it purposely for the market. The duty on wrought iron scrap should be removed. In steel making the best tool steels are dependent upon the use of Swedish char- coal bar iron, and we, as well as tool-steel makers in Pittsburg, are obliged to im- port it for such irses. The duty on charcoal iron bars should be reduced. Iron masters will say they ciin nuike as go^ iron in this country as Sweden can produce. They can not do it except for the cheaper steels. Tile ore does not exist in this country that is suitable for best steel making. We do not object to the removal of duty from soft coal, but we do not want the miners of bitmninous coal in Maryland and Virginia who supply New England killed off in consequence. Anthracite coal pays no duty, but costs more than bituminous coal. If vou will examine the reports of scjnie of these bituminous mining companies you will see they have had a hard time of it during the past few years. Ad valorem duties in jdace of specific duties in this country will open the door for endless frauds on the revenue and honest importers by undervaluations. Yours truly, E. H. Sears, I'msidcnt. BAR IROlSr. (Paragraph 135). Boston, Septeniber 1, 1893. Sie: We anderstand that it is proposed by the Ways and Means Committee to place a duty of 25 per cent on iron of all kinds. We would like to call your attention to the effect of this on high-grade bar irons. These irons cost two or three times as much in England as American costs in America, so there is no question of protection as between them, and they are used largely in this country by the leading railroads solely on account of quality and for the element of safety which they give in locomotive work. They have no competition in American iron, as these qualities of iron are not made in this country. The cost of these irons is so high that an ad valorem duly of 25 per cent on bar iron of all kinds will advance the duty from one-tenth cent per pound up according to the value. In view of the fact that these irons are not made in America and therefore, there is no question of protection, would it not be well in case the ad valorem duty is put on, to have a proviso fixing the maxi- IRON AND STEEL SHEETS. 355 mum rate which shall be paid by any bar iron ? For instance, if the maximum rate is fixed at one-half cent per pound the American iron manufacturers will have a protection of 25 to 33 per cent, and the consumer of the high-grade irons, which are not made here, will get them at about one-half cent per pound less than he now pays. The duties on high grade plate iron (item 138, tariff law) and on iron forgings for locomotives and steamboats (item 153) are particularly excessive and onerous. For instance, the duty on Low Moor iron plates is 2 cents per pound, which is a protection to American plate iron of 50 to 75 per cent. We think these duties on plates and forgings should be reduced at least one-half, and even then the American manu- facturers would have a protection of 25 to 33 per cent. Yours truly, Houghton & Eiohards. mON AND STBEI; SHEETS. {Paragraphs 144, 145.) STATEMEirr OF MR. J. G. BATTELLE, REPKESENTING MAITUFACTXfKEES OF IRON AND STEEL SHEETS OF THE UNITED STATES. Thursday, September 14, 1893. Mr. Chairman. We appear before you on behalf of the manufac- turers of iron and steel sheets of the TJnited States. We do not undertake to represent the entire iron and steel indus- tries of the country, as they have been generally, and as a whole, repre- sented by the American Iron and Steel Association and otherwise. ISTor do we include the manufacture of tin and terne plates, which will be separately represented to-day, although some sheet manufac- turers make tin and terne plates and back plates for coating with tin and terne mixture. We omit also from our representation all boiler and tank plates. Sheets are broadly included between the gauges or thicknesses known in the trade as Nos. 12 to 30, inclusive. Our products are iron or steel sheets, varying in width from 21 to 50 inches, and from 6 to 12 feet in length, and are used for making stove- pipes, stamped ware for galvanizing, for corrugating, and for a variety of other purposes well known, but rarely for tinning. The iron and steel sheet manufacturers above described have 200 finishing trains of rolls, having an average practical capacity of 2,000 tons each per annum, or a total anniral capacity of 400,000 tons, which amounts in value, including galvanized sheets, to $24,000,000 annually. For the manufacture of these sheets the capital invested closely ap- proximates $15,000,000. The employes hitherto engaged in producing the output stated are over 13,000 in number, to whom wages have been paid amounting to more than $10,000,000 annually. According to the usual rule of computation, our employes represent a total of 65,000 of our population. At the present time the industry which we represent is suffering from a depression unparalleled, and, indeed, uiiapproached in its his- tory, especially since its faller development, which includes the last fifteen years. 356 METALS. As with all other occuiiations, the maiiufacture of iron and steel sheets has been seriously interfered with by the great financial distrust that has overspread the country, bat the partial relaxation which has more recently occurred has not been met by a corresponding ia- crease in business. Not more than one-third of the sheet-mill capacity is now in operation. Many of us have, in the ordinary course of our business (as sales are usually much greater in volume in the first half of each year) accumulated large quantities of sheets, which will, in the present outlook, prevent our operating our works in full, even if orders increase materially in the near future, owing to the uncertainties of tariff legislation. We all remember how a change in the interpretation of the tariff about the year 1880 from IJ cents per pound to 45 per cent ad valorem caused great loss to makers and holders of stocks of cotton ties, and a total removal of their manufacture from the United States to England. The uncertainties regarding tariff legislation have suspended all orders for further construction of sheet mills and threatened the value of investments already made. We are convinced that the financial legislation urged by the Admin- istration will greatly improve the financial situation. But we are even more firmly convinced that any legislation on the metal schedule of the tariff will be injurious in the extreme to the interests which we repre- sent. We admit, and desire to emphasize the fact, that our selling prices are less in this country than the cost of sheets in Great Britain, plus freight, and pins present tariff and other costs added ; but we claim that this is the universal rule in case of all protected goods made in this country, through the operation of competition among our manu- facturers. Where we have our investments and the wages proper for American citizen workmen protected, we have invariably reduced the cost to our customers below the apparent standard established by a protective tariff. It will not do to argue that we therefore can dispense with a meas- ure of the amount of protection granted us, which was, by the way, reduced by the tariff act of 1890. For while the facts are clearly as above stated, relative to our selling prices, yet the course of prices everywhere is more or less irregular, as is also the classification in different countries, and, at times, certain grades could be imported for a period, owing to changing conditions in both countries, and thus we would constantly be threatened with con- ditions which would unsettle our entire business. A tariff on a strictly revenue basis would destroy our business, for, to produce revenue, the tariff must be such that sheets can be imported freely at less cost than they can be afforded by American manufacturers. We are firmly convinced that you, however much we may differ as to some methods, feel the interests of our country no less than ourselves and that you can not commit yourselves to any course which must result fatally to this large and important industry. Therefore you must con- sistently grant us the continuance of a protective tariff; and if the tariff be protective, it should be thoroughly so, as is the tariff now in force. The greatest need for protection to our industry arises from the higher wages paid in the United States as compared with foreio-n countries. The price tor sheet rolling, for example, is $4.l!2 per ton in lEON AND STEEL SHEETS. 357 England, and $10.05 per ton here. For sheet-bar heating 24 cents ])er ton in England and 63 cents per ton here. Puddling, $1.74 per ton there, and $5 per ton here. Sheet-bar rolling, 10 cents per ton there, and 45 cents per ton here. In Belgium and Gerniany, wages are still lower. It has been urged upon us, "What difference will it make to you if the protective tariff is removed? You will then get your labor as low as in England and will do as well as you do now." Let us look at this practically. In the first place, the condition confronts us that Ameri- can workmen will not submit to foreign wages except after long, bitter, and exhaustive contests. Severe as such struggles must be on them, they will be only less se- vere on their employers, and the results of such strife may even threaten the peace of the nation. ' We have seen an exemplification of the pos- sibilities of this in many instances familiar to all. But we can not believe that you contemplate a system which will bring these ills upon us, and will hope and appeal to you to maintain that system of protection under which our industrial system has grown to be the greatest and most prosj^erous of any country at any time. By our reciprocity treaty England has been practically barred out of Cuba and Porto Eico on bar iron, pipes, structural iron, and many other commodities, which are now purchased from the United States, and Cuban merchants inform us that Cuba imports more goods from the United States than are purchased from us by all the states of South America, Central America, and Mexico. But the United States is the best market in the world. If we can preserve our own markets we can afford to leave such markets as we can not secure through reciprocity, to European competition. We are encouraged to hope that the financial condition \n\\ be im- proved by the repeal of the Sherman law, but there can be no restora- tion of confidence while the tariff' is being agitated. Hence we ear- nestly hope and pray that Congress may at least give us the assurance of a postponement in tariff' legislation for a sufflciently definite time to give the country an opportunity to recover from the eff'ects of the present depression. The Chairman. Can you tell us the discrimination on our exports of bar iron, pipes and structural iron in Cuba and other countries where we have reciprocity ti'eaties 1 Mr. Battelle. Not definitely; but it is rather a lack of memory than knowledge, for I went through the matter when in Havana and figured it out exactly. Mr Byntjm. The duty on black plates, such as you manufacture, is what? Mr. Battelle. One cent and 1.4 cents. Mr. Bynom. Are not a good many of these plates imported and coated in this country 1 Mr. Battelle. Those items are represented by Mr. Neidringhaua who succeeds me. 358 METALS. TI]V PLATES. (Paragraph 145.] STATEMENT OF MH. F. G. NIEDEINGHATJS. Mr. Chairman and Gentleman op the Committee: I have no written speech. I am here to make a few statements merely as to what I know about the much vexed question of tin plate. A little over twenty years ago the manufacturers of tin plate in England, their agents and importers, succeeded in having the duty reduced to a merely nomi- nal one of a cent per pound, barely a duty for revenue only, and thereby they crushed out the small attemj)t at that time to manufacture tin plates in this country. Now, that same influence is at work to-day, not so much for the reduction of the duty on tin plate but mainly for the destruction of th e tin-plate industry which really does exist in this country to-day. Millions of dollars have been invested and thousands of peo- ple are employed in the industry. The duty was raised under the last so called McKinley bill $1.20 per box. Kow, on this $1.20 per box the English manufacturer reduced his price 50 cents a box, leaving the balance to be paid by the American consumer. But, however, it must be stated that the weight per box has been gradually reduced by the English manufacturer to about 90 pounds per box, and the American manufacturer (speaking now for my own company) furnishes 108 pounds per box, so that really, when you consider that, the price has hardly been advanced to the American consumer. The prices we pay for labor are 150 per cent advance on the English price. The duty imposed is perhaps 70 per cent. Now, labor gets all of that duty imposed and 70 per cent in addition, or, in other words, the labor gets the benefit of all the duty and the natural advantages which we possess in America. If we had labor at English prices, with our natural resources, we can not only hold our own but we will beat them in their own market. Now, if duty on tin plate is reduced to the former duty before the last act it will reduce labor wages one-third. If it is put on the free list it will put it to less than one-half. It was not only putting on the duty, but the American Congress attached to that duty in the last act a five years' limit, to allow the manufacturers and those who were willing to risk their money fi^e years' time to demonstrate whether plate could be manufactured in America. Now, that has been practically demonstrated, and the mystery in which this business was clothed at the beginning has disappeared. The manufacture of tin plate is one of the most simple manufactures imaginable, and I can call your honorable chairman to testify in that respect, becau,se he worked at the trade himself at one time. The Chairman. I made some in Mr. Niedringhaus's mill. Mr.NiEDEiNGHAUS. Now,it is not only American moneythatwentinto the manufacture of tin plate, but the largest English manufacturers have already transferred — at any rate there are tinner ies on this side waiting for the party in power to see whether they shall also bring their iron works and help us to develop our American resources or not. Of course I am very closely acquainted with the manufacturers abroad, and they look with a good deal of hope for relief to the Ameri- can Congress, and the more relief you give them of course tlie greater will be our burden. Now, if the duty should be leduced on tin plate it will not only destroy this industry. If it were, for instance, piit on the TIN PLATE. 359 free list another important branch of the iron business would suffer, and that is the galvanized- sheet business, because those sheets could be slightly tinned and brought over free and would destroy that also. Now, I am not giving any statistics. My successor, I believe, will attend to that, so a summing up of the qase would be looking at our own works. We have a capacity of about 700 boxes of tin plate per day. We have machinery on the ground which we will put in the old mill, and if we run it all it will give us a capacity of 1,000 boxes per day and give employment from the mine and torest to the fliiished sheet in the box to about 1,500 people, all of which, including works and ground and money invested in material and finished stock, amounts to nearly $1,000,000, but if the industry is destroyed the actual loss to machin- ery, tools, and fixtures of all kinds, which would be worthless, would be $400,000, as far as we are concerned. Still another branch of the iron business I would merely allude to as a side remark, and that is the manufacture of glazed iron, enameled goods, under a duty of 45 per cent, which was not changed under the McKinley bill. Now, I exchanged notes with one of the manufacturers of Germany a month or. two ago and I find that he hires three men to my one, virtually as good workmen, producing more, working longer hours than we do here, and all that being labor from beginning to end. They make their own iron and steel. Tliere is a product that only costs him one-third of what mine cost me, and he paying only 45 per cent duty can come into the country readily, so that if tliere is any change made we will be obliged to transfer our factory to the other side, paying the duty and making more money than we can in hiring American labor. It, therefore, lies within your power to destroy a vast quantity of property and sweep away the life earnings of the operators, and if so, where is the multitude of operators going? They must of necessity go into the field, and then raise cotton, corn, or wheat, and take away that incidental protection that those people have now as well as others, or else we will have to discount the American mind and muscle to the European standard and take from it the hope of independence and the love of home; or in otlier words double the j^ower of accumulative capital to make the rich richer and the poor poorer. As far as we are personally concerned we do not take as gloomy a view of the case. We still have hope and trust in the honesty of the American Congress and implicitly in the Executive. So our works have started irp and they will continue as long as we can find the money to pay the hands. TIN PIjATES. (Paragraph 145. ) STATEMENT OF ME. W. C. CEONEMEYEB, OF PITTSBTJEG, PA. Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen of the Committee: When, in former years, I appeared before this committee to plead for the Amer- ican tin i)late-interests I had to make the statement that I represented an industry which did not exist in the United States. To-day I am happy to say that I represent aii industry which does exist, and although it is yet very young (only about two years old) it is uii to the present time a very health}' infant, wljich lias grown vigorously 360 METALS. nuclei' the most adverse circumstances. I don't believe that any other industry, if ever so well protected, has been established so rapidly and with as few failures in the start as our young industry, and that in spite of its being called into life at the time of a serious depression caused by financial collapses in South America and Engiand, and ■which had their reflex in this country, but the full force of which was happily averted because just at the time a tariff bill was passed by our Congress which tilled our industries with new hope and our financial institutions with new coniideuce in the future of our industries". The tin-plate industry has grown in spite of a bill having passed the House of Eepresentatives and hanging over our heads like the sword of Damocles repealing the very law which only a few months previous had called this industry into life. The following is a list of names of firms who have embarked in the tin and terne plate manufacture during the last two years, and the amounts which, according to their last- report, they have invested in their plants: Firms or companies. A. A. Tliompsnn & Co Aliqnippa Tin Plate Co American Stamping Co American Tin Plate Machine and Alanul'ictLirini; Co. American Tin Plate Co Apollo Iron and Steel Co Baltimore Steel, Iron and Tin Plate Co Eritton EoUing MiU Co Elairsville Knllin^ MiU and Tin Plate Co Cleveland Tin Plate Co Cincinnati Corrugating Co Coates & Co Cumberland Rolling Mill and Tin Plate Co Columbia Tin I'late Co E. Morewood & Co Falcon Tin Plate and Sheet Iron Co Grifiith &. Cadwallader Gummey, Spering & Co Hughes hia, Pa lialtiiimre, ^fd A\^ilkinsburg, Pa I'hila(iel]ihia, Pa Jvlizabsth, N. ,J Pliiladcl|iliia, Pa Clrlcago, III ^■<■\^■ ( 'astle, I'a Nnri istown. Pa 1 hiladclidiia, Pa Apollo, Pa -do Now Kensington, Pa. (Jniiueaut, P,a Pittsburg, I'a St. [,oui.s; Mo nio.dilyn, N. Y Dciutulcr, Pa Irondale, Ohio Total. Amount in- vested in tin- plate plant. $22, W, TO, SOU, 3, 250. 00 811.65 UOIJ. 00 UUO. 00 000. 00 68. ion. 12, oao, 00 CI'll. DO 000. 00 000. 00 no, 4. 125, 110, 15, 25, OUO. 00 000. 00 000. 00 000. 00 000.00 000. 00 ; 000. 00 . 6o(). 00 400, 400, 200, 000. 00 GOO. 00 000. 00 000. 00 oou.oo OUO. 00 BO, 000. 00 10, ■100, •2.^.8, 147.42 000. 00 500. 00 01,0. 00 640. 50 1)00. 00 000. 00 3, 490, 379. 57 I could not ascertain the investment of tea of these above firms. TIN PLATE. 361 The following figures, taken from Special Agent Ayer's report, will illustrate more clearly the growth of this industry: First year. Quarter, ondilic; — ■ Pounds. September 30, 1891 26,922 December 31, 1891 1, JOt), 821 March 31, 1892 3,' 209i 225 June 30, 1892 S, 200, 751 13,646,719 Second year. Quarter ending — September 30, 1892 10, 952, 725 December 31, 1892 19,756,491 March 31, 1893 29, 506, 399 June 30, 1893* 35, 000, 000 95,275,615 Total 108,922,334 The product in the last quarter of the fiscal year 1803 was 4,332 times greater than the production in the ilrst quaiter of the fiscal year 1892. Did you ever hear of any other industry increasing to such an extent within two years? The recent ruling of Secretary Carhsle is another damper on the prog- ress of our industry, to which I shall refer again later on. The reason why this industry was not developed before was because never before the McKinley bill was passed did the industry receive equitable treatment and consideration by the United States Govern- ment, and without that it could not exist. An erroneous Treasury Department decision, the misplacement of a single little comma, caused probably by the lack of knowledge of the Secretary then in office as to what tin and terne plate consisted of, has retarded to the extent of a full quarter of a century the development of an immensely valuable industry. I suppose all of you gentlemen are by this time sufficiently informed as to what tin and terne plates are, so that I need not go into details about the process of manufacture. I will simply exhibit a few sam- ples, which will show you, first, the pack of sheets as it comes from the rolling mill; second, the ijickled and annealed sheet; third, the pickled and cold-rolled sheets (finished black plate); fourth, the bright tin plate, coated by oil process ; fifth, bright tin plate, coated by acid proc- ess; sixth, three grades of terneplate, with more or less coating of the terne mixture. Mr. Beeckineidge. Are these American or imported ? Mr. Ceonemeyer. These are American. This is what we call the coke plate. Tliis is coated by an acid process, and here are several grades of terneplate. Mr. Breckineidge. Is this the first stage of these sheets ? Mr. Oeonbmeyee. Those are the sheets after we roll them and get them from the mill. We get eight sheets together out of the mill. Mr. Beeckinridge. I see there is a difference in color ? Mr. Ceonemeyee. Yes, sir ; some sheets catch a little air. That is black oxide. Mr. Beeckinridge. These are supposed to be in the same general condition ? Mr. Geonemey'ER. Yes, sir; just about the same common condition. On some of them are a little oxide formed in tlie rolling that we have to take oft' afterwards so we can tin them. If the committee desire ■) * Estimate of Col. Ira Ayer. 362 METALS. we have some of these little pamphlets which we call our World's Columbian Exposition pamplilets, which gives briefly a description of the process.* Through the law of 1890 the industry was granted protection by an import duty which is in harmony with the rate of duty levied on the products which enter into the manufacture of tin and terne plate, and this is the first time our industry has ever been accorded equity and justice. Some of the people who were ready and willing to invest their capi- tal, knowledge, skill, energy, and labor in this industry as soon as equity was granted did so. Others, however, were scared by the pas- sage in the House of the Bunting bill, already alluded to. The Spooner amendment to the tin-plate clause, which was made in the Senate, has, however, acted as a strong stimulant to the rapid development. This amendment reads : Provided, That on and after October 1, 1897, tin plates anrl terneplatea lighter in weight than 63 pounds per 100 square feet shall he admitted free of duty, unless it shall be made to appear to the satisfaction of the President (who shall thereupon by proclamation make known the fact) that the aggregate quantity of such plates lighter than 63 pounds per 100 square feet produced in the United States during either of the six years next preceding June 30, 1897, has equaled oue-third of the i amount of such plates imported and entered for consumption during any liscal year ' after the passage of this act, and prior to said October 1, 1897 : Provided, That the amount of such plates manufactured into articles exported, and upon which a draw- back shall be paid, shall not be included in ascertaining the amount of such impor- tations : And provided further, That the amount of weight of sheet iron or sheet steel manufactured in the United States and applied or wrought in the manufacture of articles or wares tinned or terne plated in the United States, with weight allowance as sold to manufacturers or others, shall be considered as tin and terne plates pro- duced in the United States within tlie meaning of this act. Several of the parties interested objected to this amendment as a cumbersome rider which would have the effect of deterring many from investing their money, for fear that the limit could not be reached. Others, however, who had full confidence in the resources and ability of this country, accepted the i^rovision readily, especially as we received the assurance that if such was enacted into law no change could be made until the time had expired. The result was that immediately after the passage of the McKinley bill an association was formed, the main purpose of which was the dissemination of knowledge regarding the manufacture of tin plates and to otherwise encourage capitalists to invest their money in this industry. Those who had already facilities for manufacturing tin plate threw open their works for inspection to those who contemplated becoming competitors. In short, we had to invite comi^etition. There are now forty-two firms engaged in the manufacture of tin plate, and while they are friendly and impart knowledge to one another readily, not once has there been a suggestion made that we should combine to force higher selling prices, all assertions to the contrary notwithstanding. Under the plea that we had six years' time to demonstrate what we could do, the association of which 1 am now the president has induced many of the above-named firms to embark in the business, and as far as we on the manufacturers' side are concerned, we had honestly no doubt that this promise would be kept, for we consider the law as passed a solemn, binding contract between the United States Govern' ment and whoever would invest his money in a tin-plate manufacturing plant. To our regret we learned at the time the Bunting bill was passed by the House of Representatives that we could not have any legal redress TIN PLATE. 363 in case that the bill became a law, and the consequence was that mil- lions of dollars which would otherwise have been invested were with- drawn. If it had not been for the Bunting bill and the agitations of the importing interests we, for our part, would very likely have filled the full conditions of this agreement already during the last fiscal year. As it now stands, we have produced last year nearly 50,000 tons, when the law requires us to produce 85,000 tons to meet the provision. And, gentlemen, we feel, and the people of the United States will certainly side with us, that while we have no law by which we can compel the United States Government to live up to a contract, the moral obligation on your part as lawmakers remains all the same. We, for our part, have so far kept our promises. We have established the industry. We have not advanced the prices by combination or trust. We have paid our workmen the wages we promised to pay, and our selling prices at present are about as low as the average at which consumers have bought during the last ten years, all of which we hope to be able to prove to you by statistics and facts. I append a table copied from report furnished by the K". & Gr. Taylor Companj^, of Philadelphia, to the Bureau of Statistics. Values IC, 14 by 20, 112 sheets, f. 0. 1)., Liverpool or Englis 4 per cent. hipping ports; cash, less Tear. 1865 1866 1867 1868 1869 1K70 1871 1872 1873 1874 1875 1876 1877 1878 Melyn grade tin. Coke tin. Highest. Lowest. Highest. Lowest. *. d. s. d. s. d. s. d. 30 6 24 24 20 6 32 6 28 6 26 21 28 26 24 21 27 25 6 22 20 6 28 25 6 23 21 27 25 6 22 6 21 31 27 26 6 22 6 46 32 40 28 42 6 36 35 25 37 34 6 29 6 26 35 25 6 27 20 27 23 21 6 18 6 22 6 20 19 17 20 19 17 13 Year. 1879 1880 1881 1882 1883 1884 1885 1886 1887 1888 1889 1890 1891 Melyn grade tin. Highest. Lowest. Highest. Lowest. s. d. 19 20 19 19 19 17 16 15 6 16 15 6 16 18 6 16 Coke tin. «. d. 23 30 18 18 16 6 15 6 15 14 15 14 9 16 17 9 18 s. d. 14 6 14 6 14 15 6 14 14 12 6 12 12 12 12 13 12 Values IC, 14 bi) 30, in store, Fhiladelphia or Neio York; cash, less one-half per cent. Tear. Melyn grade tin. Coke tin. Tear. Melyn grade tin. Coke tin. Highest Lowest. Highest. Lowest. Highest. Lowest. Highest. Lowest. 3869 .870 .f 9. 00 9.00 9.375 13.75 12.59 11.00 10.09 7. .375 6. 875 6.125 8. 375 10.00 $8.25 8.25 8.25 9.50 9.75 9.625 7.50 7.00 6.125 5.875 5.875 6.00 $7. 25 7.75 8. 375 12.50 10.50 8.75 7. 875 6.625 6.00 5.375 7.50 8.625 $7.00 7.00 7. 125 8.25 9.50 7.50 6.23 5.875 5.375 4. 025 4. 875 4.875 1 1 1881 1882 1883 1881 1885 1880 1887 1888 1889 1890 1891 $6. 625 6. .''.0 6. 375 6.00 5.75 5.73 6.125 6.123 6.375 6.50 7.00 $6.00 6.25 6. 23 5. 75 5.511 5.375 5.50 5. 375 5.50 6.125 6.50 $5.75 5.50 5.125 4.875 4.75 4.50 4.75 4. 75 6. 125 5. 75 5.875 $4,875 4.875 4.875 4 50 1871 . 1872 1873 1874 1875 4 '*3 1876 1877 1878 4 50 1879 1880 The present price in Eiiv^o. 30 gauge Galvanized sheet iron, No. 30 ,uau;ri' Tin and terne plate, eheapeat (iiiality Selling Xiriee per net ton at Hate of mine or mill duty. in this eoiintry. $2.00 $0.75 13.00 6.00 2(1. 00 8.00 2.). 00 10.00 50.00 22.00 64.00 28.00 7.5. 00 33.00 95. 00 43.00 100.00 44.00 Eqni ra- le] it ad vu- lortsiii. Per cent. 37i 60 40 40 44 43i 44 45J 44 Again, I will say, I plead for nothing more than equity. The duty which lias been placed on all of these articles is intended to overcome the diffcreiice of the cost in this and foreign countries of labor, machinery, and supplies, rate of interest, and running expenses, and if that policy is correct as to other products why should it not be correct as to tin and terne plate? The following is a table which I have clipped from a pamphlet edited by Mr. Joseph D. Weeks, of Pittsburg, Pa., which, although perhaps not absolutely correct, gives you a fair idea of the difference of the cost here and abroad: TIN PLATE. 365 Comparative estimate of cost of 16\ hoxes IC li l)y 20 tin-plate in Wales and the United States. Materials, labor, and cost. 1 ton steel, 7 by g bars Less 486 pounds shearings Available at KoUing Beliiuding (catcliing) Donbling Fumacing (heating) Shearing Opening Cold rolling Annealing Pickling Tinning "Washing Kising -.. llubbing and dusting Assorting boxes, etc 2^ pound's tin per box, or 41^ pounds per I64 boxes Allowances for scruit" Coal Acid Palm oil "Wood boxes Bran and raiddliiigs Annealing boxes (wear and tear) •. Castings, etc., in the different dejiartmeiits (wear and tear) Management and clerics Other labor and trade expenses Eates, taxes, and bank ch.arges Cost of IGi boxes Cost of 1 Box ■ , Welsh cost, Eng- lish money. 9 V.i I 1 3 3 1 1 1 1 1 4 4 1 1 2 14 1 Equiva- lent in Anieiiraii jnoney. $24.00 2.16 22.44 l.ns .M .88 .74 .40 .24 .24 .36 .40 .96 .96 .28 .44 .60 8.25 .24 1.56 1.44 1.66 1. 45 .60 .72 .48 1.44 .76 49.14 2.97 Estimated cost in tlie United States. ,$35. 84 2.34 33.60 4.85 2.47 2.10 2.43 .76 .82 .82 1.65 1.98 1.82 .68 1.23 1.65 8.71 .27 1.80 1.84 1.32 1.65 .60 .82 2. 00 1.50 4.50 1.25 80.92 4.00 In this table the cost per box ia Wales is estimated at 12s. dd., but only a few days ago I had a visit from Mr. Edwards, an extensive tin-plate manufacturer of South Wales, "who assured me that the total cost of cheap coke plate at his works did not exceed 10s. per box, which in America would be about $2.43 per box, or not much more than the duty le"vied in this country. I have not the least doubt of the truthfulness of Mr. Edwards's assertion. The conditions in Wales have not mate- rially changed in late years, and consequently the same cost price must have ruled for some time. Previous to the enactment of the McKinley bill the duty "was 1 cent per pound, or $1.08 per box. This added to the cost of tin plates at mill in Wales would make the total $3..50, yet the lowest average selling price of coke plates in this country during the eleven years 1881-'91"was according to the table of the IST. & G-. Taylor Co., as given before,- $4. 86, or just $1.36 more than the cost at mill in Wales plus the duty. WLo received that amount, "which as a remark- able coincidence is within 2 cents the same as the additional duty which was put on tin plate by the McKinley bill 1 Somebody has been taxing our consumers to the same extent all along, but the amount did not go into the United States Treasury. Sombody else has been receiving this tax for revenue only. Now, gentlemen, is it not much more desirable that this revenue should flow into the United States Treasury instead of into the pockets of foreign manufacturers and importcr.s? During the fiscal year ending June 30, 1893, there were impoi'ted into the United States 628,425,902 pounds of tin plate, paying duty at 2.2 cents, or a total of $13,825,309.84. Is not this a pretty good revenue duty, especially wlien you consider the fact that such duty has given incidental protection to a new industry, 366 METALS. and that besides the importations there were produced in this country 95,275,615 pounds, and that the selling in-ices at the present time of the cheapest grade of plate referred to in the above table is only $5.20, or only 34 cents above the lowest average. The great cry of our antagonists, that the new duty would seriously enhance the cost of the workman's dinner pail, has not been verified as yet. Tin ware to-day is cheaper than ever before. I have some letters which I wish to iile with this paper, and in those letters you will find comparative prices of what it has been in 1890 and 1893. Here is an oval tin bucket which in 1890 sold at $4.32 per dozen, and in 1893 it was $3.25 per dozen. STow, that is the ratio, and I believe that one gentleman here has still further evidence of that fact, and we can fully demonstrate that household tin-ware is cheaper to-day than ever before. If you conclude to reduce the duties on imports again it may be possible that the cost of the dinner pail will be still lower for a short period of time, but will the workman in such case have anything to put into his pail °! And if, on account of the reduction in duty, all the tin-plate works in the United States have to shut up shop again, and will have to withdraw from competition, will not the foreign manufacturers and importers put on the tax again for their own benefit ? Wheu, previous to the passage of the McKinley bill, I had made the assertion that we could make tin plate and sell at ruling prices, pro- vided we were protected against severe foreiga competition, I was severely criticised by several newspapers, as well as by certain mem- bers of the House, because I admitted we could meet i^resent prices, and still insisted that we should rob the people by still higher duties. Those gentlemen took it for granted that the American manufacturers will always charge extortionate prices, but that the foreign manufac- turer is so conscientious that he never takes more than a very small margin above his cost. Human nature, or the nature of business men, is the same the world over. Every one will endeavor to get the highest possible price for his product, no matter how low the cost of production is, and only the force of competition will bring down selling prices. While we do pay much higher rates of wages, our selling prices in this country and the selling prices of foreign manufactiuers to consumers in their own coun- try or in countries in which they have uo fear of competitiou do not show the same great difference. The export invoice values can not be taken as an exact basis for the market price. Every manufacturer who has large facilities must seek for a dumping ground on which to unload his surplus product. The United States, with its large con- suming capacity, is the dumping ground for European manufacturers whenever they have a surplus product. The demand in each import- ing country makes the invoice value at the foreign port. Therefore if you want to protect us at all the rate of duty must be such that will protect u^, especially in times of severe depression. The simple dif- ference in wages will hardly be sufficient to protect us from an invasion of foreign goods whenever dull times set in in foreign countries, but we shall be satisfied if you will maintain the present ratio, which means that if you reduce the duty all along the line of the goods com- prising the cruder forms of material, we shall be compelled to make an average reduction of 3 per cent in wages all along the line lor every one-tenth cent of a reduction in the rate of duty. If you put it back to the old rate of duty as provided in the Bunting bill, and which is 1.2 cents per pound lower than at present, we must have TIN PLATE. 367 wages 36 per cent lower. If you put it on the free list we would have to have out labor 66 per cent lower than now, and then we would pay about the same wages which are now paid in European countries, and we would be still at a disadvantage by having to pay 6 per cent for money against 2J to 3 ])eT cent, at which money can be had in most European countries, by a depreciatiou in the value of our plants, and by having to pay much higher rates of railroad freight to i^oints which can be reached from Liverpool or Swansea cheaper by ocean vessels. I desire your attention to the significant fact that most of the im- porters who have been antagonizing us do not desire tin plate on the free list. They want a duty of 1 cent a pound because that is a pro- tection to their business. It requires ready cash to pay the duty, and if it were not for that every small dealer could do his own importing. Hence, it shows that a, low rate of duty i^rotects the importer; but does the importer distribute the proceeds of his business amongst our own people and workmen the same as the manufacturer? No; there- fore, if there shall be any protection at all, place it where the most people are benefited and where it will yield the largest incidental rev- enue. To-day there are very few consumers or users of tin and terne plates who are opposed to the present rate of duty. To the contrary, the large majority of them have changed their sentiments in our favor. As proof of this fact, I will produce only one letter, but this one is but a sample of hundreds more which I can produce if you demand : Bernabdin Bottle Cap Company, Evansville, Ind., September 9, 1S93. Dear Sir : I am in receipt of your letter of the 4th instant and fully note its con- tents. You ask for the views of our company in regard to the present tariff on tin plate. Answering you candidly, for eighteen months after the passage of the Mc- Kinley bill we looked upon this additional duty of 1.2 cents per pound on tin plate as an outrage. This additional duty made a difference of about $8 per day on the tin that we used. Being aware that the trade would not stand an advance on our prices, and our profits already being small, you will readily understand that this was quite a loss to us. About eighteen months ago, when all the newspapers of the country were filled withtin-platestatoments, the Democratic papers saying that the American tin-plate industry was a myth, and the Republican papers were boasting of the progress that was being made in this direction, not knowing which to believe, and being anxious to know the true state of aft'airs, I concluded to make a tour of investigation, and to go to tlie tin-plate mills direct and see for myself what was being done. I first visited the Apollo Iron and Steel Company, of Pittsburg, then the United States Iron and Tin Plate Comijany, of Demmler, Marshall Bros., of Philadelphia, Pa., the Britain Tin Plate Company, Cleveland, Ohio, and the plant at Elwood, Ind. At all those points, I saw both the black plate rolled and tinned, asking for quotations from all these firms as I went along, wliich resulted in placing my order with your concern, from whom we have since Ijought our entire supply, aii average of about 200 boxes per month, at a cost of about .55 cents per box over tlie lowest price we had ever paid for imported tin prior to the McKinloy tariff bill going into effect, and we consider the quality of the American tin equal to this difl:ereuce over the imported. In conclusion, notwithstanding that I have been a lifelong Democrat, it would pain me very much to see any changes on the- present duties made, which would have a tendency to cripple the present American tin-plate industry, and to cause those beautiful mills that I have seen to shut down, and once more be compelled to use the rotten English tin-plate that was dumped on this market before this great undertaking of supplying the American market with Amerinoan tin plate. I feel confident that within a year or two at the most, if you are not disturbed by legislation, we will be able to buy our tin-plate from the American mills for less money than we have ever paid for the imported. Very truly, yours, A. L. Bernardin. Mr. Dalzell. What do those people do? Mr. Ckonembyee. They use it mostly in making bottle caps and 368 METALS. soda water and beer bottles, and also in the canning business, canning fruits. Mr. Byniim. What is the last industry he states there as having visited? Mr. Oronemeyer. I think it is the Britain Tin Plate Company. Mr. Bynum. Where? jMr. Oronemeyer. Cleveland, Ohio. Mr. Turner. What was the price of tin plate when you appeared before the committee in regard to the previous bill? Mr. Oronemeyer. The jirice of these coke plates? Mr. Turner. Seven and a half dollars, was it not? Mr. Oronemeyer. No, sir; on these plates I have been, speaking of it was about $5.50. Mr. Turner. I am talking about the better grade. Mr. Oronemeyer. The charcoal grade ? The better grade plates were then about $7.50 ; but it was a short period at which those prices ruled, and previous to that the prices had been $6.35 and $6.50. Mr. Turner. What was the grade you priced at $5.60, the I. C? Mr. Oronemeyer. Yes, sir, which is now sold at about $5.20 a box. Mr. Turner. What is the other grade selling at now ? Mr. Oronemeyer. The other grade is selling at about $6.20, some- times lower than that. At the present it would be a good deal lower, but the selling price during the last six months would be about $6.25 to $6.50 at the mill. Mr. Turner. You gave in your statement, I beUeve, of prices since Mr. Oronemeyer. From 1865 to 1891. Mr. Turner. Taking that scale as a whole, it was a descending scale, was it not '? Mr. Oronemeyer. That is practically so; but, still, at the same time it shows theie were periods when it was liigh. In 1870 it rose up very high, and then it went down until 1879, and then it rose up again, and ruled higli for sometime, and then it went down again. It has fluctuated all along the last eleven years in a ratio, say from about $4.50 to $5.50 a box, going up and down all the time. Mr. Turner. The general tendency,, though, has been downward and prices have generally tended downward? - Mr. Oronemeyer. Naturally so; it is true that the raw material entering into tin plates has been cheapened somewhat. That is, we can now use steel where we had to make charcoal iron. The manufac- ture of charcoal iron was very expensive. Mr. Turner. The materials entering into it during the period you have named, have cheapened, not counting the labor? Mr. Oronemeyer. In this way, steel has been substituted for char- coal iron. Mr. Gear. Is it just as good? Mr. Oronemeyer. Yes, sir; and the fa(;t is, it is more homogenous, more uniform. Mr. Payne. When was it made? Mr. Oronemeyer. It goes back to about 1875 or 1876, and I will say I believe the first time tin plates were made out of steel was in the United States right at our works. The little pamphlet we have given you gives those facts. Mr. Turner. It gives these details? Mr. Oronemeyer. Yes, sir; some of them are right in that pamphlet I have handed you. TIN PLATE. 369 , Mr. TuENEE. How great were these fluctuations you have spokou of; can you state that ! Mr, NiEDKlNGDAUS. lu 1879 and 1880 it was about double the pres- ent price. Mr. Ceonemeyee. Yes, that is right. In 1872 it went to the highest point, $13.75, and then it went down to $G.12i, and it went up again in 1880 to $10. Mr. TuENEE. Is that I. 0. ? Mr. Ceonemeyee. Yes, sir; of the better kind. In 1881 it came down again to $6, in 1882 to $6.25, in 1881 to $5.75, and in 1890 it was again $5.75, and that is the lowest price. Mr. TuENEE. Since 1879 the price has run from $12 down to $4.50. Mr. Ceonemeyee. According to this list it ran down from $10, and it was at one time as low as $5.37. That is the lowest price it ever reached, and that is in 1886. Mr. TuENEE. In your statement made before the committee of which Mr. McKinley was chairman you stated : It ran from $12 to $4.50, and tlien it fluctuated between $4 and $6 aud $7.50, and as high as $9 in 1879. Is that your statement 1 Mr. Ceonemeyee. I believe I explained it in this way. I have given a statement I took from the Bureau of Statistics, while that one was a statement of prices paid by the people in the trade. Mr. TuENEE. I do not mean to pursue any slight discrepancies of that sort; that is not my idea. Mr. Ceonemeyee. That is the reason why it is. I did not have access while writing this paper to the statistics I gave in before. Mr. TuENEE. Summing it all up, the general tendency of the tin market was downward ? Mr. Ceonemeyee. It was for the reasons I have stated. We got cheaper material to make it from. Mr. TuENEE. The general tendency of prices have been downward all over the world, I believe, for most manufactured products? Mr. Ceonemeyee. Yes, sir. Mr. TuENEE. Now, at the time we are talking about, during that period there was no American manufacture of these tin plates? Mr. Ceonemeyee. The American tin plate was manutactured in 1873 to 1875. Then again from 1877 to 1879 we manufactured some. Mr. TuENEE. You laeihaps do not understand what I mean. There was not enough manufacture of American tin to produce any effect upon the market? Mr. Ceonemeyee. ISTo, sir; we had to begin it. Mr. TuENEE. That is all I am asking. The high prices went down, although the Welsh tinners had a comparative monopoly of the market? Mr. Ceonemeyee. Yes, sir ; at the same time we were ready to go into business as soon as prices ran to such an extent we could make anytJiing. We have been agitating that question for the last twenty years, and the fact is that agitation had a great deal to do with keep ing those prices down. Mr. Tuenee. At any rate the American consumer did not have to pay prices for tin higher and higher, but he had to pay lower and lower? Mr. Ceonemeyee. That is right; like every other commodity that has been made in late years it has been cheaper than in former years. Mr. Tuenee. When you began to make the American aaticle of tin 1 H 24 370 METALS. and compete vfifh the imported tin, why is it that, according to the theory of protection, tin has not gone down? Mr. Cronejmeybr. We are only two years in the business, and we have brought it from $7.50 to $0.25 for the higher, and the other from 15.80 before the passage of the McKinley bill down to $5.20. We have brought it down in this way. There was an additional duty placed on tin per box of $1.37, and the difference in the United States is it only pays 35 to 50 cents of what it was before. On the prices in England for can tin, as you will see by that table, it was reduced from 14 shil- lings 6 pence to 10 shillings 9 pence on their side. Mr. TUENEE. The price has gone down over there? Mr. Ceonemeyee. Yes, sir, almost to the extent of our duty. Mr. TuENBE. Now, is the present price in this country due to the tariff or due to the prices of these goods on the other side? Mr. Ceonemeyee. I think it is due to the prices that the American manufacturers established. The English manufacturer comes in here and meets our prices, and it does not make any difference how low we sell he will have to put his prices the same as we do in order to make sale. Mr. TuENEE. So you regulate the price on this side? Mr. Ceonemeyee. I suppose to some extent we regulate prices here by whatever jjrices we sell at. That is, if we reduce prices, they must follow accordingly. Mr. TuENEE. As a matter of fact have you during any one year since the passage of the McKinley act made of tin plate lighter than 03 pounds to the hundred square feet as much as one-third of the amount of plate imported and entered for consumption during any year since this act passed ? Mr. Ceonemeyee. IsTo, sir; not yet. The law gives us six years time to demonstrate we can do it. Mr. TuENER. How near have you come to it? Mr. CE0NE3IEYEE. Well, as I stated before the requirements will be about 85,000 tons and we have reached 50,000 tons already. If it had not been that this Bunting bill was iiassed in theHouse we would have had perhaps .^3,000,000, $1,000,000, or $5,000,000 invested in that in- terest in making black plate. Mr. TuRNEE. Do you mean by that estimate the tin made out of imijorted black plates ? Mr. Ceonemeyee. Yes, sir. Mr. TuENEE. How much American tin plate is made out of Ameri- can black ])late? Mr. Ceonemeyee. That statement shows it was about half of that 95,000,000 pounds, perhaps a little more than one-half will be American black plates. Mr. TuBNEE. Was there not a practice of the late administration of allowing this drawback of 99 per cent on tin made of imiiorted black plate? Mr. CE0NE3IEYEE. I havc never heard of it; I do not believe so. Mr. TuENER. You are aware there has been a recent Treasury deci- sion that tin made of those black plates imported was not tin plate entitled to a drawback? Mr. Oronemeyer. I did not know that. I understood the decision was it was not to be considered as American product in counting up our total. Mr. TuENEE. I am speaking of another xmnt. You are aware of this late Treasury decision? TIN PLATE. 371 Mr. CeoTsTEMEYEE. IsTot the one you refer to. Mr. TUKNBK. I refer to the oue recently made. Then I recur to the other question I made as to whether there was under the former admin- istration a practice of allowing a drawback on tin plates exported when it was made of foreign black plate imported ? Mr. Oeonembyek. Well, before the passage of the McKinley bill Mr. TXJENEB. I am talking about the operation of this previous to the McKinley bill. You perhaps are not familiar with that drawback? Mr. Oronbmeyer. I did not have anything to do about it because we are in the inland country and we have nothing to do with the ex- ports. Mr. Turner. 1 think you are in some sort the father of the enter- prise? Mr. Oronbmeyer. Well, some people think so. I have been work- ing at this thing for the last twenty years. Mr. Turner. Where do you get your labor? Mr. Oronemeyer. Eight around the works there. Mr. Turner. Are they peojjle yon have trained? Mr. Oronemeyer. A great many of thein. We have people in our mills of all nationalities; we have Americans, Germans, Welsh, English, Irish, Swedes, Hungarians, and a few Italians. Mr. Turner. Do you get your labor from the other side? Mr. Oronemeyer. We have a few that have been doing work on the other side, but we find our American boys can learn just as quick as any of them, and perhaps they are more apt to than those we get from abroad. Mr. Turner. Tour American labor performs all these operations? Mr. Oronemeyer. These people we have in our works there by this time, a great many of them that came from foreign countries, very nearly all are American citizens, if not, all have declared their inten- tions of becoming such. Mr. Turner. They have become so since entering into your employ- ment? Mr. GROisrBMEYBR. Tes, sir; we take some little pains to ask tliese people if they intend to become American citizens. Mr. Gear. You have American citizens engaged in all branches of your dei^artments ? Mr. Oronemeyer. Yes, sir; along with the others. Mr. Turner. What kind of people do you employ in that part of your process which I believe yon call pickling, which is, I understand, the stage in which you )ise the sulphuric acid ? Mr. Oronemeyer. Yes, sir; we do that by machinery mostly; but that of course takes a little handling, but the injurious part of the work is done by machinery. Mr. Turner. That is done by hand largely on the other side. Mr. Oronemeyer. They have adopted machinery, too, largely of late. Mr. Turner. This new machinery? ^ Mr. Oronemeyer. The machines we have are an American product. Mr. Turner. Originally patented? Mr. Oronemeyer. Perhaps two years ago. Soon after the j)assage of the McKinley bill. Mr. Turner. Who owns the patents? Mr. Oronemeyer. The Leechburg Foundry Oompany. Mr. Turner. You do not have to pay a royalty ? 372 METALS. Mr. Ceonemeyeb. No, sir; we pay only one price and that settles the whole thing. Mr. Brbckineidgb. What is the price of I. C. tin at your mill now? Mr. Ckonejieyee. The better grade we sell for $6.20 at our mill, charcoal grade. Mr. Bkeckineidgb. ^ow, what is that same grade worth in a mill in Wales! Mr. Oeoneivieyee. The price would be in Wales about 14 shillings. Mr. Bkeckineidge. That illustrates, I presume, about the difler- ence between all classes of tin, does it not? Mr. Ceonemey'EE. I did not catch your question. Mr. Beeckineidge. The difference between these two articles would indicate about the difference between the other grades? Mr. Oeonbmeyee. The price of these cheaper coke ])lates would be over there about 11 shillings, aiid 11 shillings would be about $3.55. Mr. Beeckineidge. That is the less valuable grade? Mr. Oeonemeyee. Yes, sir; and the one that is most used for can- ning. Mr. Beeckineidge. What is your price for that? Mr. Oeonemeyee. Our prices would be about $5.20, that is, taking the average price. I do not want to give prices that we would sell at now, because we have to sell at almost any price we can get in order to get some money. Mr. Beeckineidge. Have you given us the list of prices running back for some time ? 3Ir. Oeonemeyee. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzell. Do you make black plates at your works ? Mr. Oeonemeyee. Yes, sir; we make all of our tin plates. Mr. Dalzell. You do not use any imported black plates at all? Mr. Oeonbmeyee. No, sir. Mr. Dalzell. I understand that practice prevails among tin-plate works in the country that they make their own black plates. Mr. Oeonbmbyee. They have their own rolling mills to make plates. Mr. Dalzell. Aside from that altogether, there are establishments which do no tinning, but make black plates? Mr. Oeonemey-ee. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzell. And sell to the trade to be tinned? Mr. Oeonemeyee. Yes, sir ; they sell to those people whom you see in the reports use partly American black plates and partly imported. Mr. Dalzell. There is no trouble about our making all the black plates necessary? Mr. Oeonemeyee. Not at all; the only trouble is to have money to put in building mills, and money is not invested at present in this industry, because people fear there may be some tinkering done with the duty. Mr. Dalzell. Were not many of our establishments which existed prior to the JMcKinley bill capable of being turned into black plate establishments by the expenditure of a very small amount of money? Mr. Oronemeyek. So they were. Mr. Geae. It is .simply a set of rolls? Mr. Oeonemeyee. Yes, sir; we had to change the rolls somewhat. There are a good jnany mills that would make black plate, but they do not do it hecause the i)eoi)le do not know what is to be done. Mr. Payne. Has tliere been aiiy improvements made in the method of manufacturing tin plate, since the Americans took up the business? Mr. Oeonbmeyee. Yes, sir, some. AVe roU them somewhat differ- TIN PLATE. 373 CDt from what tlicy used to roll them in P'liRland; v^e mash where they double orit of one piece and we roll the sheets a little longer than we used to do, and in that way we get a larger output. When we first began we thought if we turned out 3,000 i30unds a turn of tin plate we would be Mr. Payne. How long is a turn? Mr. Okonemeyee. Eight or ten hours. ITow, in eight hours, we get about 4,500 pounds. So in that way, by being practical in the business we have learned, and for these reasons have been able to reduce the price of black plate considerably below what we were able to sell be- fore, simply because we have learned the business and know how to do it. Mr. Payne. Is this bright tin plate of American manufacture as good quality as the English or Welsh tin plate? Mr. Okonemeyee. Yes, sir. I have several ^letters filed from cus- tomers on that point. Mr. Payne. Who used the tin plate"? Mr. Ceonbmeyee. Yes, sir; the American tin plate, and in their judgment American tin plate is the best. Mr. Payne. Did I understaud you to say all the articles that go into tinware are cheaper than prior to the McKinley bill! Mr. Ceonemeyee. Yes, sir; 15 to 25 per cent lower than what they were before. Mr. Gbae. Are not many imported tin plates what you iron men call short? Mr. Ceonemeyee. They are light in weight. Is that what you- refer to? Mr. Geae. Is not the raw material itself short, will break — very fragile? Mr. Ceonemeyee. Oh, I think so; still it depends upon what it is. Some of it is. Mr. Geae. Showing that they do not use the best sort of raw ma- terial. Mr. Ceonejnieyee. Not for this cheap plate, they do not. Mr. Beeckineidge. You say utensils made of tin are generally cheaper than before the McKinley bill passed! Mr. Ceonemeyee. Yes, sir; 15 to 35 per cent. Mr. Beeckineidge. Then tin, out of which it is made, is also cheaper ! Mr. Ceonemeyee. Well, it is cheaper than what it was immediately before the passage of the bill. Mr. Beeckineidge. Then you do not attribute the reduction in utensils to tariff, but tin plate? Mr. Ceonemeyee. To some extent; but, then, these tiuneries now are not required to keep such a large stock of tin plates on hand, as they can buy of the American manufacture whenever they want it, in small quantities, at about the same price as they could buy a hundred boxes from England. Mr. Beeckineidge. They could buy from the importer to any extent they wished, could they not? Mr. Ceonemeyee. Oh, yes; but at the same time we maintain that the effect which was prophesied would take place, did not take place. Mr. Payne. Prices did not advance. Mr. Ceonemeyee. On the contrary, they became lower. The Chaieman. Just at that point. The statistics of the American 374 METALS. Iron and Steel Association, as prepared by Mr. Swank, are generally considered to be very reliable 1 Mr. Oeonbmeyer. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Kow, in these statistics for the month of June, which ■was the montli in wliich the McKinley bill was reported to the Senate, and it became known practically what the rate upon tin plate would be, the price tin of plate in New York City, according to this report of Mr. Swank, that is, oil. 0. Bessemer tin plate, per box $4.43, and the price last April, which is tlte latest month, was $5..50, which is the highest it has been in the last three years. Mr. CE.ONE:\iEyBR. On the other quotation it was the lowest that it The Chairmajn^. But these are his flgures. Mr. Cronemeyer. I say that is the lowest price it reached. The Chairman. Four dollars and forty-three cents ? Mr. Cronemeyer. Yes, sir. The Chairman. In February it was $4.61. It never appeared as high as $4.72 in that year until it became certain what the Senate was going to do in regarcl to the JMcKinley bill. So, Mr. Swank's table shows, contrary to your ars'unient, when you say that the price of tin Xjlate lias gone steadily down in England, wliile here it has gone up since the passage of the McKinley bill as soon as it became certain in the Senate that the bill was going to pass. Mr. Cronemeyer. You must acknowledge that year was a year of serious depression in England — -just what we have here in America — and in consequence it was natural that they should go and sell at low l^rices in order to get money. The ChvIirman. This does not confirm that reasoning. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you know any improvements in the oper- ation of making tin buckets and other utensils? Mr. Cronemeyer. In some cases there are wonderful imjirovements in the manufacture of cans. ISlr. Brecikinridge. It is not probable, therefore, if tin utensils have gone down while tin has gone up, it has been as much by the cheaper operations by which utensils are niade; and they would be a good deal cheaper than they are now if we had been permitted to get the benefit of til e lower tin. Mr. CRONE.MKYER. The theory I believe would be right, but whether it would practically or not, I do not know. ]\lr. Breckinridge. You think it is all upset by the fact that the manufacturer of utensils can buy smaller quantities now from the American manufacturer ? Mr. Croneimeyer. I do not give it as the sole reason ; I said it might have something to do with it. I think also improved machinery may have something to do with it. Mr. Payne. Inqoroved machinery to make other articles than fruit cans ? Mr. Cronemeyer. I do not know; I say I can not tell. Mr. Payne. Has there been imiMoved machinery to make other utensils than fruit cans? Mr. Cronemeyer. ISiot that I know of— not that I am iiware of. Mr. Payne. Inqiroved machinery to make fruit cans would not have much influence on the price of tin pans or other aiticles ? Mr. Cronemeyer. No, sir; I did not intend to argue on that basis that prices have gone down on account of the McKinley bill on tinware- I simply want to show it as the cry had been before that it would raise prices, and it did not do it. TIN PLATE: 375 Mr. Payne. Ton are .simply stating a fact? Mr. Ceonemeyeb. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynum. In regard to tlie Treasury clorision. That decision was to the effect that under the hiw black plates imported into the country and coated in this country were not American manufacture"? Mr. Cbonemeyee. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynum. What proportion of the cost of production is the coat- ing of black plates? Mr. Oronemeyeb. The cost of coating; it would be about from IJ to 2 cents a pound. Mr. Bynum. What is the foreign total cost? Mr. Cbonemeyeb. It would be under 25 per cent. Mr. Bynum. Twenty-five per cent; has it not been estimated as low as 5 per cent? Mr. Cbonemeyee. The additional cost . Mr. Bynum. The cost of coating, simply coating the black plate with tin, to make tin plate out of the black plate, has not that been esti- mated as low as 5 per cent? Mr. Cbonemeyee. No, sir; not if you include the tin that goes in it. We put 2^ to 5 pounds of tin on a box. That runs from .50 cents to a dollar on an article that in the black would cost us nbout .if to 4 cents a pound, and then we have to have the labor, which amounts to considerable in coating. Mr. Bynum. Do you think it is about 25 per cent? Mr. Ceonemeyeb. Twenty-five to 33J- per cent would be the per- centage of the cost of coating. Mr. Beeckineidge. Are not there machines which have recently ceased to be under patents, which are more accessible than formerly, by which tin pans and similar utensils or articles are made with great rapidity? Mr. Ceonemeyeb. I think there are no patents on them, except there is a machine in Chicago in which they take a piece of tin plate and lay it on the table and it's picked up and goes through this machine and comes out a finished can at the other end. Mr. Bbeokinridge, I have been informed by a manufacturer that when they had to make them by hand one man could only make two dozen a day, and now a boy with a machine will make ten a minute? Mr. Cbonemeyee. It is wonderful how fast, they make them, that is true. Mr. Beeckineidge. I understand now these machines are much more accessible to the trade, so that I would deduce from that, that although the price of tin has greatly gone up, that the use of these machines have put the price of these utensils down, but if we got our tin correspondingly cheaper I suppose tliat would be correspondingly lower? Mr. Ceonemeyeb. I do not want to theorize on that; it might be one way or the other. Mr. Beeckineidge. It is a business question, and you are a business man? JMr. Ceonemeyeb. If I was to do business on that I would think a good while before I would decide it either way, whether that Avould raise the price or lower it. Mr. Bbeckineidgb. You laid down a true principle awhile ago; it depends ujion whether you had to do it, brcanse you stated, and stated truly, every man seeks in business to get a.ll the profit he can, regard- less of the cost of the product. I can recognize that you would not 376 • METALS. lose if yon had the power to prevent it, and I think all bnsiness men would do the same. I am not criticising that at allj that is a general question. TIK PliATB. (Paragraph 145.) STATEMENT OF W. B. LEEDS, OF ELWOOD, DTD. As clmirman of the tariff committee of the Association of American Tinned Plate Manufacturers I come before you, gentlemen, incidentally as a representative of the tin-plate industry of America, but absolutely as a representative of the American Tin Plate Company, of Elwood, Ind. The history of the tinned-plate industry from the political side is one with which you are all familiar, but with the practical workings there are doubtless some points wliich I can furnish that may prove beneficial to us all in more thoroughly understanding the situation as it now exists. The tinned-plate industry from its inception has been unfortunate in having been a football of politics, thus unfortunately arousing antag- onisms especially directed towards it. The defense and attacks of the ■press representing the political parties of the last campaign were themselves unfortunate on account of the tremenduous amount of mis- information which appeared in the columns of the various papers, and which, being widely read at that time, has clouded the understanding of everyone as to just what constitutes tinned plate. Your honorable body doubtless understands thoroughly every detail of the manufacture of tinned plate, but it may not be amiss to state that the tinned-plated industry is as separate and distinct from the mining of tin ore and the making of pig tin as is the production of stovepipe sheet iron separate and distinct from the mining of Besse- mer ore at the head of Lake Superior to be turned into steel billets in the great mills of Pittsburg and others. While I have personally seen in the Black Hills evidences of a large supply of tin ore, nevertheless the development of this industry is as separate from the development of the tinned-plate industry as it is in Wales, the home of tinned-plate manufacture. There are some 30,000 tons of pig tin used in Wales annually for the production of tinned plate, which is sent all over the world, while there are only some 9,000 tons produced by the Cornish mines, and it is a question whether there is a pound of Cornish tin used in the Welsh tinned plate, as the greater portion of the English tin is used in the production of fine brass and other alloyed metals, and nearly 5,000 tons of their tin is exported for like purposes and some 33,000 tons of tin were imported, nearly all of which was used in the tin-plate industry. The home of the tin seems to. be in the far East and Australia. From there the pig tin is now derived Avhich supplies the world. The two great items of expense which enter into the prodaction of tinned plate are labor and steel. In a box of tinned plate of I. C. coke quality, weighing 108 pounds, there is used abont 2 pounds of tin and something like 130 pounds of steel, and a small amount of sulphuric acid and palm oil; thus, it is the high labor cost in the first place, and tlie cost of steel in the second place which controls the cost of production in this country. ' TIN PLATE. 377 Pig tin is, and always has been, brought into this country by im- porters, being sold here for about the same price as in London. It is sometimes cheaper here, owing to an excessive supply, and sometimes cheaper in England, owing to an excessive supply there; the prices being generally stable all the world over, excepting so far as the tariff put on last July may aflect the future price in this country, although it has not done so up to date, the pi-ice of pig tin being lower now than it was before the duty of 4 cents per pound was put on; in fact, being- lower since the duty was put on than at any time since we have been in the business. The American Tin Plate Company was formed through the combi- nation of a great many stockholders, the great majority being persons of moderate means, there being very few wealthy men in the company. When the company first started we had our capital raised from 150 stockholders, a great many of them in the employ of the company for which I work — the Pennsylvania Railroad Company — being young men in the ofBces, who subscribed from $1,000 to $3,000. In fact, the largest stockholder of the original subscription did not exceed $5,000, and they belonged to both political parties. We raised some $300,000, all of which has been invested in the tinned-plate industry. ' We confess that we all had confidence in our ability to manufacture in America anything which is manufactured anywhere else in the world by mechanics, all things being eqiial. As the 98 per cent of finished tinned plate is sheet iron or sheet steel, and as America was then making the finest sheet iron or steel in the world, we felt there was no reason why we should not successfully produce a merchantable article. With this feeling, the money was subscribed and with this feeling the investment was made, and to-day we have invested in Elwood in machinery, buildings, and facilities for manufacturing tin plate $300,000. All of this $300,000 was invested by persons, few of them wealthy, simply as a saving fund of their own on the strength of the law passed by the United States saying protection would be afforded them in this country for at least six years, at the expiration of which time to be re- moved unless we were manufacturing a certain proportion of the total amount consumed in the country. These stockholders of ours, all of them citizens, and good ones, invested their money in good faith. There seemed to be a doubt manifested by Congress when it passed the law that tinned plate could be successfully produced in America, for which reason the clause was inserted requiring a certain proportion to be pro- duced within six years, or the tariff to be taken off in consequence. In this connection the Welsh are openly saying through their press that they are very much in hopes the tariff will not be removed at all now, as the effect of the political canvass has kept money from being invested, and the fear of political changes and that the tariff will be removed within the specified limits keeps capital intimidated, with the result that enough tinned plate will not be manufactured, as the time will soon be too short for erecting necessary plants to reach the proportion required. The tariff will then be entirely removed and they will have a complete monopoly of the tinned-plate trade in America, as they have had in the past, but free from any duty restraints. These foreigners are banking upon this. Had it not been for the feeling that tinned plate could not be manu- factured in this country this condition would not have been made, but as we have accepted this condition, and as we have gone ahead with this understanding, we feel justified in asking that the promise to us 378 METALS. be kept, and that we be allowed to develop our industry without the tremendous antagonism which has been blocking oui- way in the past. Our stockholders have not invested their money for political effect, but only as a business investment, and I, as an oflicer of the comi')any, am not conducting the business for iiolitical eflect, but to show the men who have intrusted their capital to my management that I will look after it properly for them. Up to date, although our stockholders have had their money invested two years, they have not received any returns, and with the present condition of trade their courage will have to be sustained without the influence of dividends for many weary months longer, as the conten- tion the company has had with conditions unprecedented will render us for a long time unable to declare even a moderate capital return on. the investment. The protection afforded to day to the manufacturer of tinned plate has not up to date yielded any returns, as it has been consumed in his experiments in getting started and getting his mill upon a good work- ing basis, and by the large wages paid the men whom he employs. This large- wage question is one of the i)oints which now controls us. We pay very much higher wages in all branches than are paid on the other side, and to-day in their desperate effort to secure the American market the Welsh manufacturers are making reductions in the cost of manufacture, throwing away their profits entirely, indicating a condi- tion of affairs existing on the other side, possible through the long control which they had over their men, which can not be brought about in America short of a desi)erate struggle with a tendency toward anarchy, as the wages we could offer our men in order to compete witli the existing English conditions would be such as would at first seem an absolute impossibility for them to accept, and when the final ac- ceptance comes it will only be through the long weary road of starva- tion, which I as a manufacturer trust I may never be called to put into effect. It is a foregone conckision that we can not run our mill at loss. If the tariff is reduced our mill has to stop until our wages can be adjusted to the same basis as our competitors on the other side have, and in order to do this we must go to a lower basis for labor in America than now seems possible, and allow sufficient to support the men and their families, with no possible chance to lay up anything for a rainy day. In proof of this I would like to cite some comparisons : We pay our rollers 24 cents a box as against 7 cents per box on the other side, and we pay through the rolling mill at the rate of 3 and 4 to 1, and in the tinning house 2 to 1, paying 12 cents a box for tinnhig, washing, and 4 cents for rising as against 6 cents and 2 cents on the other side. We pay our engineman to drive our engines in the mill $60 per month, or $2.50 per day, as against -So per week on the other side. For day labor in our mill we pay !?1.40 to $1.65 per day; on the other side $1 and $5 per week is paid. We pay our men in charge of pickling and annealing $2.60 to $4 per day, whereas on the oth So far as operations are carried on in the United States, the business must be looked upon as an American industry, employing American labor, purchasing Ameri- can sugar and American milk, as well as many other less important American materials. At the time the McKinley act was under consideration, the Anglo-Swiss Condensed Milk Company, through its general manager, by letter to the Committee of Ways and Means in Congress, advocated the doujuling of the tin-plate duty, predicting that TIN PLATE. 381 the advanced duty would not increase the cost of the tin plates for the American con- sumer, while believing- that competition in manufacturing plates between American and English irianufacturors, would result in a better quality of tin plates produced tin America than are obtainable abroad. An experimental lot of American tin plate used by this company proved to be very superior to any European manufacture. The Anglo-Swiss Condensed Milk Company, manufacturers in Switzerland, in Germany, in England, and in the United States, with its general manager located at 82 Hudson street. New York City. In a letter dated August 24, 1893, the manager of this company's London branch writes the general manager in New York as follows: My opinion is that the English tin-plate makers are working at the lowest possi- ble margin in order to prevent a number of tin-plate factories from springing up and succeeding in America. Immediately, however, the American protection is with- drawn you may be assured that the English tin-plate people will have achieved their end and up will go their prices. I think it altogether probable that English tin plates will cost the Americans as much after the duty has been removed as they do to-day. The Anglo-Swiss Condensed Milk Company, unlike most (if not all) of American tin-plate importers, did not stock themselves for future use just prior to the enforce- ment of the McKinley act. True at that time tin plates were not produced in the United States, but prospective protection in America, through the influence of the advance in duty, had exactly the same eft'eet to cheapen the price of tin plates in England that actual prodnetion here would have had. In like manner the prospec- tive abolition of all protection has the same influence, promptly felt, Upon all pro- tected industries that actual hostile legislation would have. You are at liberty to make any use of this letter and the accompanying statistics Xiertaining to tin-plate purchases you may see tit. Yours, very truly, Anglo-Swiss Coxdkssed Milk Co., Geo. H. Page, The General Manager. Comparative price-list of tinware. [Wholesale prices.] Per o»^nt Price profit be- charged tween by tbi? re- wholesale from tlie foregoing gross prices to tailer to consum- er, which price and retailers, jiriceand 1890. 1891. 1892. 1893. price has consumer piece. changed by com- m SIX paring years. preceding column. $25. 20 G $27. 84 G $25. 20 6 30.44G $23. 87 G $0. 16i .20 $0.40 .45 30.44G .33.64G 28.84G 120 36. 14 G 39. 94 G 36. 14G 34. 24 G .24 7 IC plain -vrash pans 6.62& 6.21G 5.80G 5.80G .04 .10 150 8. 06G 7.56G 7. 30G 7. 30G .05 10 100 7 10 retd. wash pans 9.64G 9.03G 8.44G 8.44G .06 .30 400 12.24G 11. 48 G 10.71G 10. 71 G .07 .30 300 3.00G 3. GOG 2.90G 2.75G .02 .05 100 1-pint tm cups 2.15G 2.15G 2.10G 2.15G .OIJ .05 200 6.00G 5.00G 5.00G 5. OOG .03* .10 200 lO.OOG 10. 50 G 10. OOG 10. 00 G .07 .20 200 13. 50G 14. 00 G 13.00G 13. OOG .09 .26 100 8.75D 8.75D 7.00D 7. OOD .68 1.25 112 9. 26D 9. 25D 8. OOD 8. OOD .66 1.50 130 10 Q IC Har. pails 15.00G 16. 60 G 15. 00 G 15. 00 G .lOJ .40 300 10.26G 16.19G 18. 00 G 11.34G 17.89G 18. 00 G 10.26G 16. 19 G 16. 50 G 10. 26 G 16. 19G 16. 00 G .07 .11 .11 .25 .35 .25 250 240 10 Drea kettles 200 l-gallon IC oil cans 130 4-qiiart sq Liarn dinner pails. . . 42..50G 43.00G 41. 50 G 41. 60 G .30 .60 66 4.00G 4. 50G 4.40G 4. 30 n .03 .05 7U 2-quart IC covered buckets... 7.00G 7. 25G 6. .50 G 7. OOG .05 .15 2(111 4-quart IC covered buckets . . . 11. 50G 12.00G 11. 50 G 11.25G .08 ■ ■-'* 207 The above wholesale prices taken from original biUs for articles named. 382 METALS. Average ralue of till plate 2'cr hox, f. o. h., Xcw Tori:. 1890 $4.80 1891 (first six months), 5-33 1891 (second six months) .5. 35 1892 5.30 1^;!I3 (first four months') '5.41 * We are now selling this delivered in Chicago for $.5.35, equal to $.5.10 Kew Tork City. KoTE. — Inerease in duty went into effect July 1, 1891. The American has, in the majority of cases, substitnted plates weighing 100 pounds per box, costing 27 cents less per box, reducing the cost to about .$4.85 per box, and in many cases use plate weighing 90 and 95 pounds per box, and at a corresponding reduction. These being concessions made by the Welshmen not possible to the American, as his labor increases for light weights. The Americans have never yet given up a struggle, but have always gone ahead. The past has shown that the American manufacturer is content with but a fair portion, and is perfectly willing to divide with his men. But let it be a flght to death; let him be forced to come into competition under lower duties all around — his capital is invested in his mill, and all he can do is to sit down and wait until nature turns to his aid and forces the men back to work upon the terms offered by the AVelsh master on the other side, unfortunately made necessary to be offered by the American master on this side. There has been brought to me, by men M'ho buy on the other side, another point, and from men who one would naturally think would be opposed to the tariff on tinned plate. They are now forced to buy tinned plate on the other side three or four mouths before they expect to use it, and the smaller meu are forced to buy through the brokers, who have heretofore received a large profit; they have been forced to pay the prices effected by the combination of capital on the other side with the importers on this side. A great many of these men say they are glad to see the American indu.stry start up, as they can order tinned plate and have it delivered to them in two or three weeks, which does not necessitate the large outlay of capital which in the past has given to a few wealthy importing houses a monopoly of America's vast tinned plate trade; and, besides this, if the tin is not satisfactory they can make a du-cct complaint and have it rectified, whereas on the other side it is absolutely impossible, except in rare cases, to know who makes the tin, it having passed through so many hands, while here they can make their complaints direct, or return the tin; and for this reason they are glad to see the American manufacturer starting up, even if they have to pay a trifle more, having the calm assurance that in a very few years the comj^etition even in this country will de- crease tliis slight advance in the cost which now exists between what was i^aid before the tariff and what is paid under the tariff, so before the six years have expired the American consumer will not be paying more than before the duty was put on, and will also be able to get his supplies within two or three weeks without any investment of capital from the American manufacturer right at his door. I have read a great many articles on the "robber barons" and the "robber tariff," and 1 have with interest read everything in regard to the great tariff' struggle of 1892, but 1 fail to see where there can possibly be any harm or loss to the country in allowing the tinned plate tariff, which is absolutely necessary for the continuance of our industry, to re- main asitnowis, and on the other hand tlie benefits seem to be very large. It will enable us to manufacture some $20,000,000 worth of goods in this country for which we have formerly been compelled to send gold abroad. We have just had an experience which has severely taught us the valuo TIN PLATE. 383 of our gold, that with the balance of trade against us, prosperity dis- appears at once, and with each day's shipment of gold our chances of prosperity decreases proportionately. Here is an opportunity for an in- dustry to be developed that will keep in this country $20,000,000, which will certainly go a long way toward overcoming any difference in the balance of trade against us. Besides this, it is yielding a revenue most urgently needed now of 815,000,000 per year, or more than $1,000,000 per month. This revenue will not, of coarse, be obtained when we are manufacturing all the goods in our own country, but it will be now when it is most needed, and if we can manufacture all the goods in our own country and sell it as cheaply to our consumers as before the tariff of 1891 was enacted, then the Government can well aflbrd to spare the revenue derived from the tin plate, and take in its place the largely increased balance of trade in its favor. Having invested our money in good faith; having accepted the pledge as extended by the accredited officers and institutions of this Government in good faith; having on this acceptance gone ahead and invested our money, and having turned out marketable tin in large quantities — the largest of any manufacturer; having done everything on our part indicating our desire and determination to go ahead and become a component part of the tinned plate manufacturers of Amer- ica, and as we have shown that the American consumer has not paid one dollar from the increased duty, we feel justified in appearing be- fore you, gentlemen, and asking on j'our part that you see that nothing is done by this Congress which will in any way jeopardize our interests, but that the i^ledge honorably given by our Government be maintained inviolate. Time permitting, I could continue indefinitely showing how the tariff vitally necessary to our industry does not tax the people. How the consumer is benefitted through the i:)roduct being manufactured at his door. How, during the long weary months of our start, discouragement, sickeningin its intensity, prevailed. How odds, seemingly insurmount- able, showed endless accumulation. How viciously we were assailed by a powerful press impugning our integrity ; assailing our credit in the commercial world; appealing to our stockholders of the Democratic faith to cast obstacles in our path, and even resorting to forgery, that they might print over our stockholders' names offers to sell our stock at a discount, that the entire enterprise might stand discredited finan- cially. How, with unassailable proof finally brought home, we were as- sailed as the hirelings of the Republican National Committee, Avith but a few men in our employ, all to be discharged after the election. How, before this increasing antagonism, we stood appalled with won- der and amazement almost convinced that our honorable eflbrt to x^ro- mote industry and the general bettermeutof our community had indeed made us a stranger in a foreign land as one unclean. How desperately the Welsh manufacturer is fighting to strangle this ew American industry now struggling for existence against such monstrous odds. How the foreigner wages his desperate battle in- trenched behind the accumulated capital and experience of a century. How he now stands joyfully expectant waiting for the tariff changes, which will restore him to his threatened prestige. How he is assisted by the powerful marine, nourished with such care, who, in many instances, pay him to carry his product as ballast, provided they be allowed to keep it in their hold for two or three trips. How their ships, in many instance-^., bring it in free to this country as ballast. How the powerful 384 METALS. ocean lines make a throngh ocean and rail rate, deliveringplates to Indian- apolis, Chicago, and other interior points for less than we can ship to New York City. How to-day there is a rate from Cincinnati to Kansas City of 34 cents per 100 pounds on domestic plate as against 12J cents on foreign plate. How, failing in success with all these tremendous and startling advantages in his favor, and with an American Congress still loyal to American industries, he hopes to transfer his plants bodily to America, and there do battle royal with us on our own soil. How the entire jobbing and consuming trade stands paralyzed as a purchasing power through the uncertainty produced by the anticipated tariff changes. How every producer has curtailed his purchases to the minimum necessity of his secured trade. How labor stands aghast before the present condition and trembling for the future. How bank- ing looks askance at any form of accommodation to manufactures liable to be affected through tariff changes. How the ghastly falling off in freight business on the railroads has multiiilied the army of the unemployed through the necessity of reducing force to meet the loss in business. How the intelligent employed and unemployed plaintively plead that they little dreamed that the change they asked for meant any change in their previous happy condition of employment, and how the unintelligent openly advocate uprisings as a means of expressing their discontent. How, on all our vast railway systems, silent factories eloquently speak their keen apprehensions. How the erstwhile teem- ing hive of industry, the Indiana gasbelt, now stands a silent cemetery of depression. The empty factories, gloomy monuments of the country's pause and the laborers' want. How, on all sides, the helpless call aloud, that you gentlemen may read the oracle's scroll ere 'tis "too late. How the now happy employes of our mill as I left it Monday, keenly appre- ciating the personal interest in my mission, looked me God speed for success, and could I but reproduce here that mute appeal, my cause is won. I have strong faith that I could take you gentlemen with me as a judicial court of inquiry, and honestly win the cause I advocate on its merits. I speak with malice towards none, but as one who entered the ranks of labor's honorable army. If I appear before you wearing a ser- geant's straps, I have not forgotten the boys in the camp. I do not, nor can not, appear for the American Tin Plate Company. That is a certificate from the State; buildings, machinery, money, and supplies, all beyond the reach of change. I do appear for labor — on the one hand those who produce our commodities, on the other, those whose frugality and economy furnished the means to sustain the labor all still dependent on honorable labor for the livelihood. Unrest has been rampant throughout the laud; manifestations of discontent have been accepted as just demands, and the ant sees the result of its toil vitally endangered by the blast. I believe the statesmanship which has always been inherent within these walls at every crisis will prevail and our marvelous y)rosperity continue on apace. To your honorable body has been reserved the possible distinction of nailmg to the mast of our proud Ship of State the flag of American industrial independeuce, so that, no matter what strife may develop amongst the struggling crew below, that bright banner may be first visible on all sides to the eyes of the industrial uatiuns of the world as they come knocking at our doors. TIN PLATE. 385 COST OF TIN PLATE NO GREATER SINCE DUTY WAS ARVANCED THAN BEFORE. List of imwices, emhracing all purchases made in England of tin plate, SS-gauge, b>/ the Anglo-Swiss Cundensed Milk Company, New York, during two years and two months immedialely preceding the enforcement of the McKinlci) act, July 1, 1891. STEEL TAGGERS, 112 POUNDS TO A BOX. COKE PLATES, 36-GlTAGE. [These cost prices iiiolade all expeusea, duty paid, laid down in 'Sii'Vf York.] D.'ite. 18S9. May 21 May'.!l Jnne 3 Aii!jn,st27 Julys Octobers 1800. September 26 September 26 Boxes. 24 171 Cost price. 135 $8.58 119 8.60 190 8. 5915 324 8.788 402 8. 5838 325 8. 7604 1.872 1.872 Date. 1S90, October 30 November 18 1891. January 16 Marcb 12 April 27 Boxes. 195 195 195 195 195 Cost price. $9. 3696 9. 1402 8.9957 9. 3735 9.3135 115. 8-102 Average cost before tlie advance of duty, $8.89. List of invoices, enibraeing all pnrclinses made in England of tin plate, SC-gauge, by the Anglo-Swiss Condensed Milk Company, Kew York, during two years and two months following the enforcement of the McKiniey act, July 1, 1891. STEEL TAGGERS, 112 POUNDS TO A BOX. COKE PLATES, 36-GAUGB. [Tbese cost prices include all expenses, duty paid, laid down in New York.] Date. Boxes. Cost price. Date. Boxes. Cost price. 1891. September 14 November 2 Ib02. March 23 June 6 June 25 September 5 November 25 195 195 210 210 90 210 210 $8. 7863 9. 1067 8.878 8. 1906 8. 1984 8. 1868 7.829 1893, January 31 January 31 March 9 April 24 June 12 August 11 August 11 105 105 210 210 210 210 210 2,580 $7. 9353 7. 9423 7. 9421 8.057 7. 8646 7.847 7.847 Average cost after the advance of duty, $8.20. T H 25 386 METALS. List of invoices, embracmg all purchases made in England of tin pi ale, SO-gaur/e, lii tlie Anrjlo-Swiss Condensed Milk Compani/, Xew York, during two years and two months following the enforcement of the ALcKinleij act, Jnlg 1, litOl. 112 POUNDS TO A BOX. COKE PLATES, 30 GAUOB. [These cost prices inclado all ospenses, duly paid, laid down in Kew Turk.] Date. Boxes. ie'.)i. July 27 Ang'ust K( - . AiiiiLisl 22 Aui;a8t 'Al September 14 Sej)tember 29 October 20 October 20 October 30 !November 18 IN'ovember 18 November 26 1832. March 23 March 28 March 28 April 11 April 23 April 30 April 30 June 15 June 25 Jnue 30 July 11 Aujiust 2 Au^just 211 An^'iist 20 Se])teniber ■'> Oct.ibtrl.- October 4 October 17 10,-1 $5. 8333 1 111 5.89 I'l.l 6. 086S IM 5. 81S7 1!);-, (>. 0862 I!!.") 5. 8186 300 5. 8222 lO.T 6.09 390 6. 0762 10.1 5. 8554 IDS 6. 0352 390 6. 0562 210 210 210 210 210 210 210 210 120 210 210 210 420 210 210 210 210 420 Cost price. 6.095 5.00 5.90 5.903 6.00 5.9S12 5.8110 6. 8638 6. 6935 5. 7377 5.607 5. 7746 5. 7718 5. 7783 5. 7453 5. 7745 5.764 5.792 Date. 1,0503. Cost 1892. October 2.5 October 2^) November 25 November 25 December 19 - December 19 1893. January 31 January 31 January 31 January 31 January 31 January 31 Januarv 31 February 18 Febrnary 18 February 18 Febriiarv 18 March 9' April) April24 May 12 MaV23 Ma\^ 23 June 19 August 4 Angnst 4 August 7 August 18 210 210 210 215 $5. 7574 5. G55 o. 366 5.42 210 5.708 210 5.67 210 5.56 420 6.6446 245 5. 6673 70 6.65 35 5.604 175 5. 5778 105 5.6142 210 5.604 130 5.598 310 5. 6128 210 5.608 420 5. 5364 840 5.656 1,044 5.648 210 5. 59438 210 5.668 210 5. 6283 840 5. 5525 210 5. 4954 420 5. 5407 210 5. 4971 610 5. 5705 15, 644 332. 96958 Average co.st after the advance of duty, $5.72. List of invoices, emhracing all purchases made in England of tin plate, SO-gauge, l)y the ^Lnglo-Swiss Condensed Alilk Company, Xew York, during two years and two months immediately preceding the enforcement of the MvKiiiley act, July 1, 1891. 112 POUNDS TO A BOX. COKE PLATES, 30 GAUGE. [These cost prices include all expenses, duty paid, laid down in New York.] May 21 May 21 June 3 Augu.st 27. August 27. October 2.. Boxes. 1890. January 2 — January 9 rebruaVy 17.. February 24. . June 23 June 30 Jnly 3 Julv 12 October 13 October 27 November 1 8 . November 19 . November 20 . November 28 . 216 324 260 804 ■i:\:, 400 190 190 670 570 195 585 585 390 195 585 195 190 195 195 Cost I>ric6. $4.97 4. 9853 4. 9759 5. iJaliS S.1095 5. 3979 4257 42(i5 5126 (12117 8804 9:120 l!0:i5 005 21174 542 5409 0715 8400 7435 Date December 2 .. December 6 ., December 20 December 20 . 1891. January 14. . January 27. . 'January 28. . February 3.. Febrnarv 3. . FelnilarV 16. ll.'iri'.h I'l..-. JIarcb 28.... .\pril 6 A|.ril 27 jM:iy 11 Jnne 1 -Tune 1 Jnne 22 Boxes. 12, 467 Cost price. 195 $5. 7905 390 6. 0036 196 6. 0809 190 6.0S73 195 6.339 195 5.642 195 5. 3213 390 5. 4031 195 5. 5323 390 5. 5274 390 5.902 300 5. 8828 195 5.912 195 5. 9418 390 6.00 195 5.974 390 5. 9466 390 5.70 215. 9009 Average cost before the advance of duty, $5.66. ROOFING TIN PLATE SWEDISH IRON. 387 The Chairman. About M-hat ad valorem is 4 ceats a pound ? Mr. Leeds. That is about lio per cent. Mr. Bynum. What real estate have you in connection with your plaiit tliere ? Mr. Leeds. About 10 acres. Mr. Bynum. I understood yon, in your statement, to say that 98 per cent was sheet steel ? Mr. Leeds. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynuji. Which you estimate as cost ? Mr. Leeds. 1 am speakijig of Aveight. Xinety-eight per cent is iin- ished steel ; two pounds, pig tin. Mr. Bynum. What do you estimate as the proportion of the total cost of the tin ? Mr. Leeds. I should think about 35 per cent. ROOFING TIN PI;ATB. (Paragraph 145.) Sirs : We are manufacturers of sheet-metal shingles, used for house covering. Our raw materials are roofing tin plate and steel sheets; the latter are known to importers as black taggers; wire gauge ISTo. 30. These are the sheets used by some of the American tin-plate makeis, and the finished tin plates are sold as American tin plate. During the past twelve months we have received over 6,000 com- munications from people who prefer to use the kind of roofing we make, but are prevented from doing so because of the high duty on the raw ma- terial, and which we are obliged to add to cost of our goods, and which we require the consumers to pay, ISTow, gentlemen, we ask in the name of 6,000 people Avho are de- prived of using that which they prefer, by reason of the said high duty, that roofing tin plates, and particularly steel sheets, of which tin plate is made, be placed on the free list. The Xational Sheet Metal Eoopin& Go. By 0. B. Cooper, President. SWEDISH IRON. (Paragraph 146.) Friday, September 8, 1893. STATEMENT OF N. A. GILBERT, OF CLEVELAND, OHIO. The Chairman. If your statement contains the substance of what you desire the committee to know, you can submit your statement and enlarge upon it in any remarks you may desire to make. Mr. Gilbert. Very well; I will be very brief. I will state it in a nut shell. In July, 1891, several gentlemen, realizing that it was almost impossible to get tubes for the manufacture of bicycles, aud lia\ing visited England for that purijose, found that there was but one place 388 METALS. iti the -world, practically, where they eoiild be obtained, Birmingharii, England, conceived tlie idea, of having these articles maniifactured in this country, in sonie way, ft'om material which iw obtained alone in Sweden, tip to tbat time there had ne\er been a pound of cold-drawn steel tubing made in this country. It is a weldless steel tube, drawn cold. We knew that it was for the interest of the people of this coun- try, and these gentlemen bought from a company of Birmingham the process arul machinery for its manufacture, and as a result of that there was established at Shelby, Ohio, what is known as the Shelby Steel Tube C(mrpany. From that time to this they ha-ve been progressing with that work, and have now what are called benches to the number of forty-two in operation. They sold last year aborrt 2,000,000 feet of this tubing to the people who use it in this country. They have been obliged to pay on this material, which to them is, to all intents and purposes, raw material, under section 146 of the tariff act, 1.6 cents per pound. This material which they import is called billets or blooms. Mr. Payne. What kind of material is it? Mr. Gilbert. It might be called a grade of steel. It has very little manganese and very little carbon in it. In this paper which I have left with the committee it is analyzed. The component parts are a little hard to name. It is ranked and called steel in the tariff act. We have to pay 4 cents a pound for it and 1.6 per pound to bring it in. We have now 400 tons of it on the way, and we are bound to pay $14,336 on it, unless this be taken off. Our importation has amounted to the sum of $97,000 in round numbers, exclusive of this $14,336. Mr. Dalzbll. How is it described in the tariff law? What is it called? Mr. Gilbert. It is called steel or blooms. It has a certain schedule of duty, owing to the price per pound of the material, and we have to loay 4 cents or under, practically 4 cents, or 1.6 per pound. ISTow, it is fair to say at the outset in this matter, that when this tariff act was passed there was not, commercially known, any sach billets or blooms as we present to you to-day. There was not in the United States a manufactory of this cold-drawn tube to be protected. It came into use in 1891, and by the wording of section 146 of the tariff act, it was held to be dutiable at 1.6 cents per pound. Perhaps the reading of this paper will bring the matter before you better than can be done in any other way. Thereupon Mr. Gilbert read the following paper: Gentlemen: The Shelby Steel Tube Company, of Shelby, Ohio, having heen kindly accorded a hearing, respectfully represent that they commenced business in the summer of 1891, and have now invested in their plant and business $350,000, and are supplying a large number of our American consumers with the best of tubing. We believe that the duty of ov(!r 40 i>er cent ad valorem on the hollow billets or blooms imported by us, and of which we are the only importers, is very nnjust and unnecessarily burdensome, and is the result of the a.pplicati(m of tho'tari'if act to the material now imported by us, but which at the time of the passage of the act was neither commercially known nor had any of it been imported into this country. So believing we ask to submit the following: (1) The importation of hollow billets or hollow blooms for the purpose now used had not commenced when the present tariff act was being prepared nor when it was enacted. (2) The combination of composition, construotion, a.nd uses of these billets and blooms is not jjroduced in this country (nor in any other except Sweden), nor is the material or constructiim found or produced in this country. (3) The first mauufacturiug of tube in this country IVoiu these billets or blooms was started by the people we represent in 1891, and none others have ventured. (4) We leave with the committee a sample of the billot or bloom as it is when imported, and samples of several sizes of the finished tube as manufactured in America. SWEDISH IRON. 389 (5) The bloom or billets so imported is practically raw material, as very little labor is bestowed upon it where it is made. It is simply heatod, placed in. fonu, aud cut in lenghths for shijiping as you sec it here. (Sample.) (6) This material has and may bo again analyzed aud has and will be Ibuud to contain : Carbon 0. 130 Silicon 0. 035 Mansrauese 0. 1!55 Sulpiur : 0. 005 Phosphorus 0. 041 demonstrating that it is practically not a competitor with steel for its general and ordinary use, iier of ir' n in its general aud ordinary use. (7) The process of making this ma.terial uaefnl is by drawing the same cold into what is known as cold-«h'awn seamless steel tube. (8) Our company employ about 260 men, has been in operation since July, 1891, aad have not yet made a dividend. (9) Heretofore these billets have been manufactured into tubing in other countries, priucipally at Birmingham, England, where all our consumers were comiielled to buy. (10) In addition to the burden of transportation, freight, insurance, commissions, and incidental expenses attending the importation of this material, we are com- pelled to meet the difference in price of labor, which is its chief cost, as every billet must be put through from 60 to 200 operations, depending upon the size of the fin- ished tube, before it is perfected and ready for market. (11) All this the manufacturers might be said to anticipate, but in order to com- pete with the foreign manufactured tubing the American manufacturer meets with a still more serious obstacle, viz: Under the present tariff act the importer of these billets or blooms paying 4 ceats per pound is required, under paragraph 146 of the tariff act, to pay 1.6 cts. per pound duty, or 40 per cent ad valorem ; while the foreign manufacturer, making the finished tubing from exactly the same billets and blooms, is required to pay diity, under section 157 of this act, of less than 7 per cent ad va- lorem. (12) We believe this discrimination against American labor or against American manul'actHrers to have been the result of the application of a statute prepared be- fore the article we now use was commercially known, and before there was any American manufacturer of such tube to protect, and that the compulsory payment thereof was aud is unfair aad unjust, and that in the amendment of the law such provision should be made as to enable us to receive back all or a portion of the duty paid by us. We have imported of these billets 2,505,842 pounds, at a cost of $97,158.74, and have in addition paid a duty thereon of $38,910.94, aud in addition there is now in bond at Cleveland, Ohio, 400 tons, on which as now classified we will have to pay a duty of $14,336. It is necessary and but fair, that we should be relieved of tliis. The question has occurred to us how to so word a proviso as to meet our views, and we concluded that if a new tariff bill was to be prepared, and if not if the present tariff' act was amended, or in either event a proviso might be added to section 146, or its substitute in event of a new bill identifying this class of importations and substantially as follows : Provided that any duty collected or payable on hollow steel billets or hollow blooms purchased abroad and imported since Jauu;\ry 1, 1S92, into the United States to be tliere manufactured into cold-drawn seamless tube, shall be refunded, and if not paid, released without the payment of duty; and hereafter no duty shall be charged thereon. Kespectfuily submitted. The Shelbv Steel Tube Co., By D. L. COCKLBY, President. During the reading of the paper the following interruptions occurred : . Mr. Dalzell. What is this used for? Mr. Gilbert. It is used in the manufacture of bicycles. It is used by the Government in its naval affairs. We have furnished the Government with what it has used. It may be used for boilers, to some extent. Mr. Tarsney. You have stated that the material of which this is composed is not found in this country. Of what materiitl is it com- posed? Mr. Gilbert. It is a peculiar grade of steel, and is found alone in Sweden. Efforts have been made in this country on every kind of 390 Metals. steel almost, without snccess. It could not be made to work. It must be a steel that can be drawn cold without tearing, so that it will pro- duce this perfect seamless tube. So far as experiments have gone, there has been an utter inability to do it, except with the iron of Swe- den as handled there. Mr. Tarsney. It is a peculiar ore found only in Sweden, and is by reason of the process of manufacture? Mr. Gilbert. Very likely there is something in the fuel found there. I am not a chemist, and I can not answer all those questions, if I should try. Mr. Dalzell. You make these tubes, and is it your proposition that this article ought to come in free? Mr. Gilbert. Yes, sir. Mr. Hopkins. EeaUy, these tubes are your raw material? ]Mr. Gilbert. Yes, sir. As manufacturers, it is our raw matei-ial. It is demanded to a large extent in this country, and it has heretofore been purchased at Birmingham, England, entirely. The Chairman. What is the average cost of your material, independ- ent of the tariff? Mr. Gilbert. ¥out cents per pound. The Chairman. The tariff is 1.6 cents per pound ; you pay 40 per cent ad valorem on the raw material. What is a tariff' on the tube that you manufacture? Mr. Gilbert. It is less than 7 per cent ad valorem. The Chairman. What is the average value per pound? Mr. Gilbert. About 35 cents. The Chairman. And the tariff is 2^ cents. Mr. Gilbert. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Your contention is that you pay 40 per cent on the raw material, whereas the finished product can come in at 8? Mr. Gilbert. Yes ; a fraction under 7. The Chairman. But, in spite of that, you have been able to do a large business? Mr. Gilbert. We have not been able to make dividends; but we have pushed the business as well as we could, and have supplied the trade. We propose to continue and do the best Ave can. Mr. Payne. Do you make any other goods? Mr. Gilbert. ISone whatever. Mr. Tarsney. Is it used for no other purpose than that in this country ? Mr. Gilbert. It is not used for any other purx^ose. There is some speculation and experiment as to whether it can be used for caues, umbrella handles, etc., but it is not now used for anything else. Mr. Stevens. Why is it not used for boiler tubes ? Mr. Gilbert. It is not in shape for that. The president of the company, Mr. Cockley, can answer that better than 1 can. 1 suppose tlie material, if produced of the proper size, might be used for boiler tubes. Mr. Hopkins. What percentage is the tariff' of the value of these tubes? Mr. Gilbert. The tariff is 1.6 cents on a valuation of 4 cents. Mr. Hopkins. I was vspeaking of your finished product. Mr. Gilbert. It is 2J cents, or less than 7 per cent ad valorem. Mr. HOPKINW. Is it not 45 x^er cent ad valorem? Mr. Gilbert. No, sir; the flnislied bicycle that is made up ready for use comes in at 45 x^er cent ad valorem. SWEDISH IRON. 391 Mr. Dalzell. It comes in under the head of '-Boiler and other tubes, 2^ cents." Mr. Gilbert. Yes, sir; and has been so decided by the courts of the country. On a careful reading of the tariff, with which you gen- tlemen are familiar, you will find that there is a way of avoiding the payment of 45 per cent ad valorem, because the machine will simply be dismantled and come in without being assembled. They will not come in as a finished bicycle, but will be put together here. Mr. Hopkins. It is a species of evasion 1 Mr. Gilbert. Yes, sir; they send in the parts and assemble them on this side. 1 will say here that I heard from a bicj'clc man who has had to do with this matter, that about the time this concern started, the only way he could get within half a mile of the plants at Birmingham would be to put his money in bank, subject to their order, some four or six months before he wanted the goods, and then they Avould respect his order. Mr. Payne. Can they get orders respected any more readily now in Birmingham? Mr. Gilbert. Yes, sir; they can get them more readily now be- cause we have a plant right in this country producing it. I think they are a little more lenient now across the water. Mr. Hopkins. That has been the case since the establishment of the plant on this side ? Mr. Gilbert. Yes, sir; and the price is lower this year. We are starting into a new year and we expect competition will bring the price a little lower. Mr. Hopkins. What did you say about their being a little more lenient abroad? Mr. Gilbert. We have understood that they can get their orders there with not quite so much trouble as before. Mr. Payne. Without accompanying the order with the cash? Mr. Gilbert. Without putting up the cash four or five months in advance. This takes money, and a great deal of it. Mr. Hopkins. What is the difference in the cost of wages here and abroad ? Mr. Gilbert. I can not tell exactly. I presume you would have more ready access to that information. I am told that while we pay from $1.50 to $3.50 that they pay from three to six shillings. That is my information, but I do not state it as a fact, because I do not know. Mr. Payne. From whom did you get that? Mr. Gilbert. From men who have come over liere, aiid from niaiur- facturers who have been abroad and given us that information. Mr. Payne. Who have been in the factories abroad? Mr. Gilbert. Yes, sir; one of our x>rincipal stockholders has been a manufacturer there, and when it was proposed to arrange to manu- facture it here, he got the facts. In proposing a rate I do it with all respect to the committee, not for the purpose of wording your tariff' bill, but for tlie purpose of the identification of this material as well as for the enlightenment of others who maybe heard on this subject; and also in order that there may be some record of the matter. If you think our views are meritorious, it would be well to take out this article from schedule of section 140, or in any similar section which you may have in any bill. 392 METALS. Mr. Dalzell. If the provision -was made to apply to blooms pur- chased abroad, would it not cover more than this product! Mr. Gilbert. It might be made to read so as to refer to articles to be used for a certain purpose, naming the one for which this one has been used. Mr. Dalzell (reading). "To be there manufactured into cold-drawn seamless tubes." Oould not a manufacturer under this clause import other than those made in Sweden 1 Mr. Gilbert. No, sir; I think not. This whole subject will be up before you from all parts of the country. We are of the opinion, from investigation — for we have not been asleep, but have been trying to protect our property invested in this plant — and have written, sent word, and exhausted every effort to kuow what we are doing and to see "where we are at" Mr. Tabsney. I see he watches the proceedings of Congress. Mr. Gilbert (continuing). And we have not yet found anything of the sort. Mr. Stevens. What use will it be when bicycles go out of use? Mr. Gilbert. From what information we have, we think bicycles will never go out of use; but if they should, there is more or less ex- perimental work in the way of finding a use for them in boiler tubes, canes, umbrella handles, and other uses, where such an articles are es- sential in point of strength and lightness. Mr. Stevens. WiU your works supply enough of these for bicycles? Mr. Gilbert. The demand is about 4,000,000 feet every year. Our factory lias doubled its capacity. We delivered 2,000,000 ieet and over of this tube during the past year. We calculate to be able to take care of this trade, or at least such of it as the foreigner does not take care of. We feel that this has been a matter of great convenience to the people of this country, and while we did not go into it for the purpose of making it a matter of convenience, but of making money, yet we feel that it is an institution that is necessary on this side of the water. It is not necessary for me to say that we have had differences with the collector as to his construction of the law, and thinking (and there is no doubt that he is right if he takes the exact wording of the law) that the fact of its being commercially unknowji before this law was enacted, a fact that no human intelligence could give, before its exist- ence, we so claimed, though unsuccessfully, but nevertheless had to pay it. Mr. Payne. When was this raw material first manufactured'? Mr. Gilbert. I can not tell. It was before the last tariff act was passed, but up to that time none had been imported into this country, and it was not commercially known here. 'Sot a pound of it had ever reached our shores for any manufacturing purpose. We did not even have a specimen of it. We, therefore, think that under the circum- stances we ought at least to be put on a level with the people who ar-e manufacturing this product across the water, so that wecau have a fair chance with them. We must pay the cost of transportation and incidental expenses the same as they. Mr. Tabsney. You say that the demand has so largely increased that you have doubled your capacity"? Mr. Gilbert. There was a demand, or we would not have started. We have doubled our cax)acity. Mr. Turner. How much money have you paid in this duty? Mr. Gilbert. Ninety-seven thousand dollars over and above the $14,000 which we will be compelled to pay. SWKDlSH IRON. 393 Mr. Turner. That is what you want refunded? Mr. Gilbert. We want the judgment of this committee as to whether or not we should not have it, or a portion of it, refunded. It ought to be refunded from January, 1893. Mr. Turner. Do you make your customers pay it back to you by charging tliem your increased cost in the product in your original charge to them; and, if so, will you refund to them? Mr. Gilbert. We do not believe that we shall go through that pro- cess. We feel that since we ventured the capital necessary to organize this business and created this plant, we should have a fair return for our money. If over 40 per cent ad valorem had not been paid out by way of a tariff, while the foreign imi^orter only pays out less than 7 per cent, the situation would be different. Mr. Tarsnet. How much of the earnings have you diverted to the betterment of the plant"? Mr. Gilbert. We have not taken out anything, and yet I do not mean to say that we liave lost money. Mr. Tarsney. Have you used any of the proceeds of the plant to better it? Mr. Gilbert. I would like to make an exact statement of that, for we have it; I know that we have kept paying in money to increase the plant. Mr. Hopkins. Outside of the plant what have you put into it? Mr. Gilbert. We have put in $60,000 or $80,000 at a time. The Chairman. Tou have not, however, sold the product for less than cost? Mr. Gilbert. No, sir. The Chairman. You are obliged to have this raw material because of the quality of the Swedish steel, it being free from some impurities which adhere to ores in this country? Mr. Gilbert. Tes, sir. The Chairman. If we admit iron ore free this raw material could be gotten in, I sujipose? Mr. Gilbert. We do not know how to make these blooms, and we would be shut out if we could not get them. The fuel has some pecu- liar combinations. We do not have the cedar that is used for the char- coal, and by reason of not having other things we are not able to make a full explanation of what would enable us to do this. We do not know how to make these billets and we do not know anybody who does. It has been tried again and again in France and Germany, but it is not produced successfully in any other place except Sweden. Mr. Dalzell. Do we import any Swedish ores now? Mr. Gilbert. I do not know. The Chairman. They have been obliged to pay at the rate of 1.6 cents per pound on the raw material as a duty, and 4 cents is the price of it abroad? Mr. Gilbert. Tes, sir. • The Chairman. The finished product is worth 35 cents a pound, and can be imported by your rivals at 2J cents tariff, whereas you pay 40 per cent ad valorem? Mr. Gilbert. Yes, sir. The Chairman. You pay your workingmen better wages than are paid in Birmingham? Mr. Gilbert. I think we pay two or three times as much. The Chairman. You pay 40 per cent ad valorem on your material, 394 METALS. you pay better -wages to your workingmen, and yet you carry on the business in this country without loss? Mr. G-iLBERT. We can carry on the business, and have carried on the business, but Avhether we think it wise to continue if we have no hope of being relieved fi'oni this tariff', or if we knew that the matter was ended, and we would have to come up against it as against a blank wall, I could not answer as to the question of continuing. The Chairman. You do not claim that you have lost anything on the sale of your product? Mr. Gilbert. 'So, sir ; but we want to continue to do business, and we want to make something from it. The president of our com]iany, Mr. Cockley, is here, and I hope you will be kind enough to hear him. IRON BIIiliETS. (P.iragari)li 140.) STATEMEUT OF ME. D. I. COCKLEY. Mr. CHAIR3IAN AND GENTLEMEN OF THE COMMITTEE : I do not know that I can add anything to the very comprehensive statement which you have just heard from Mr. Gilbert. I think he did not under- stand one of the questions asked by Mr. Hopkins. Mr. Dalzell. The question was with reference to the amount ot duty. Mr. HorKiNS. I think he said that the finished product was 35 cents and the duty was 2A cents a pound. Mr. CoCKLET. As we figured in the original contemplation of tlie establishment of the works in this country, and from the best knowl- edge we could get, the duty would not exceed 822.50 x>er ton on the raw material. We could not find that it was classed otherwise than as billets or blooms not otherwise provided for, and coming in at 822.50 a ton. Mr. Payne. If you produce these billets or blooms here from ore imijorted from Sweden the tariff of 75 cents a ton, of course, would not make much difference ? Mr. Gilbert. Ko, sir. Mr. Payne. You would not care whether it was 75 cents a ton, or over "? Mr. Cockley. No, sir. The difficulty that we would run again.st would be our own want of knowledge of the manner of making them, as well as the want of knowledge of the combination of material requisite to produce the metal in this condition. You can see that it is a peculiarly soft metal. It is the only one we can find that we can work in that manner. In our experience we have used American ores from Tennessee to Wisconsin, and we have never found one that would draw in a manner like this when cold. Mr. Payne. But you never have tried the imported ore of which this is made? Mr. Cockley. No, sir; we have not the combination and it would take a good deal of money. Mr. Tarsnby. You are not manufacturers of billets of any kind? Mr. Cockley. No, sir. STEEL-SAW PLATES WIEE RODS. 395 STEEIj-SAW PIvATES. {Parai?rapli 110.) STATEMENT OF HENHY DISSTON & SONS. PHiLADELPniA, Sc^teml/er 32, 1893. Article 146 of the tariff act of 1890 calls for 7 cents per iiound on steel-saw plates when valued at 16 cents per i)ound. We would respectfully recommend that the duty on band-saw plates, wholly or paitially manufactured, black or bright, thinner than 13 gauge (or .095 inch), up to 14 inches wide, should be at the rate of 7 cents per pound. We have positive knowledge and know it to be a fact that l^ew York imi:)orters import blank baiids all ready to be toothed into finished saws, and they have been brought in under a very low classification. This enables them to take these blades and have the teeth cut in, making them finished saws complete. This places our saw makers at a great disadvantage, and the mills which manufacture these steel bands are also hurt to a certain extent, for the people who import these blanks are enabled, after having the teeth cirt in, to sell them as saws at a price not nuicli greater than what the home makers charge for the blanks in the rough. As the manufacturers here have gone to con- siderable exi»ense in making ira])rovements in the manufacture of band saws, it seems that their request to have proper appreciation made of their eflibrts by a sufficient du.ty should receive consideration. We would suggest, therefore, that the tariff' on steel-band blanks intended to be made into saws should i^ay a uniform rate of 7 cents per pound. WIRE RODS. (Pariigrapli 147.) San Feancisco, Oal., Septeniber 13, 1893. Sir: Respecting the duties levied on wire rods, we beg to say that wire rods is the raw material of all wire mills who draw the wire rods into wire and manufactures of wire. Wire rods ISTo. 6 gauge (0.192 inches diameter) and larger pay a duty of six-tenths of a cent per pound or |13.44 per long ton. This is far in excess of what is needed to protect the domestic makers of wire rods, and the duty could be reduced to one-tenth of 1 per cent per pound without injury to the existing industries. The export price of ordinary steel rods, No. 6 and larger, is £5 2s. Cxi. per ton, F. O. B. Antwerp or other European ports, or $L'4.94 per gross ton — freight and other chargesfor delivery in T^ew York is about $2.56 per ton — total, $27.50 per gross ton. Tlie cost of freight and charges to San Francisco is about $4.00, making cost delivered in San Francisco $29 per gross ton without custom duties. If a duty of one- tenth of a cent per pound was added the cost would be, delivered in New York, $29.74, and delivered in San Francisco, $31.24. By such an adjustment of duties the domestic maker of wire rods would be protected in the entire country except on the Pacific coast, and the wire mills on t^ie Pacific coast which are now idle could start up and give employment to about 1,200 men now unemployed. 396 METALS. The present all-rail freight rate from 'New York to San Francisco on wire rods is 60 cents per 100 x)ouuds, and on wire nails is 30 cents per 100 pounds, and the Pacific coast manufacturers are suffering from discrimination of both freight and duties. Eespectfully,, Califobnia Wire Works, Per Henry L. Davis, Secretary. SOUTHINGTON, CoNN., September 8, 1893. Sir: In our business we use a large percentage of imported Norway iron, and in a variety of shapes and sizes. We think the present tariff wrong in charging a higher duty on large bars, or even billets, for rerolling to sizes, than on some certain small sizes termed "nail rods," "rivet rods," " wire coils," etc., that much more labor has been expended on. The rolling to shapes, as done in Sweden, is much inferior to work done at our own mills. We do not see reason or justice in the tariff as it now stands, and respectfully call your attention to this matter. Very truly, Atwater Mf'g Co. WIRE. (Paragraph 148.) Saturday, September 16, 1893. STATEMENT OF EUTHEEFOED BTJRGHEK, OF PITTSBURG, PA., EEPEESENTING THE KIDD STEEL WIEE COMPANY. Mr. Chairman and Gbntlejien op the Committee : We appear before the committee representing the manufacturers of needle wire. This is a practical industry in this country. I have brought a few samples of the wire to be passed round and looked at, so that we can intelligently understand each other. This wire is all drawn within the thousandth of an inch. The smallest is the tto o of an inch, and is used for watches, and for needles of all kinds. We have prepared a state- ment which we will put in the hands of the committee. I sui^iiose I had better do that rather than take the time in reading it. The Chairman. If this statement covers all you want to say, you can leave it with the stenographer. The follovnng is the paper referred to : Sharpsbukg, Pa., Septemlwr IS, 1S9S. Sirs : As manufacturers of drill rods .and needle wire, we appear before you to re- spectfully ask for tbe retention of the last clause of section 147 of the metal schedule of the present tariff act, which reads : " Provided, That all iron or steel rods, whether rolled or drawn through dies, smaller than number six wire gauge, shall be classed and dutiable as wire." And we also ask the retention of that jiart of the last clause of section 148, which reads: " Prorklcd further. That all iron or steel wire valued at more than 4 cents per pound shall pay a duty of not less than 45 per centum ad valorem." We submit for your consideration the following as our reasons for this request: First. Our output is the highest form of manufactured steel, being used for watch WIRE. 397 and clock parts, dental tools, small twist drills, taps, roamers, punches, delicate shafts for electrical apparatus, and machine needles for all kinds of sewing, and consequently requires the greatest cost in labor per pound to produce, as it is high- grade steel, containing over IJ per cent of carbon, and requiring to be finished uni- formly within the one-thonsandth part of an inch of the given diameter; and it is practically a new industry in this country. Second. The wages paid in England are about half those paid in our factory. The comparative English wages in the following table were tho.so paid in 1887, and, ■we understand, are those paid to-day: Annealing Pickling Roughing Ij'inishing Scouring Straightening Inspection — Poliabing ■Wiig&s per day. American. Engli.^ih. $3.00 $1.20 2.00 $0, 80 to 1. 00 2.00 .80 to 1.00 3.00 1.20 to 1.75 1.75 . 80 to 1. 00 1.75 .80 to 1.00 2.25 1.20 $0.75 to 1.50 .20 to .40 In explanation of the foregoing table we would add that the English operatives are paid by the hundred weight, and that the amount of their earnings vary accord- ing to the "skill of the operator, within the limit stated. The Americans are all paid by the day. In regard to the polishers, this work is performed in England by girls and women, and in our factory by boys and men. We oii'er in evidence the appended bit of ancient history. On October 6, 1890, the McKiuley act went iuto eflect, and on October 10 the New York importers issued the following notice, advancing the price about 45 per cent: TO THE TEADB. On and after the above date the following prices will prevail, owing to the change in the tariff : Stubs steel "bright" in IS-incTi or 36-incli lengths. Pcr*pound. No.'5 $0. 95 6 to 15 1.10 6to30 1.25 31 to 38 1.35 39to46 1.55 47to50 1.80 51 to54 2.10 55to57 2.60 58to60 3.00 61to62 3.40 63to65 3.90 Per pound. No. 66 to 68 $4.30 69 to 70 4. 70 71 to 73 5. 15 74. 75. 76. 77. 78. 79. 80- We made no change in our prices, and emphasized the fact to the trade by issuing the attached price list on November 15, 1890. Price list of "Kidd" polished drill rods. AtoZ.. ltol5-- 16 to 30. ito38-- 39 to 46. Per pound. .... $0.75 75 83 90 . ... 1.05 ^toDO 1-20 51 to 54 1 • 45 55 to .57 1-80 58 to 60 2.10 61 to 62 2.40 63 to 65 2.70 Square, hexagon, and octagon drill rods, all sizes, iV to %, $1,60 per pound. Per pound. 66 to 68 $3. 00 69to70 3.30 71 to 73 3.60 74 75 76 77 -|f4:t0 78- 79 80 3.90 4.05 4.20 4.50 4.80 5.10 5.40 398 METALS. We Tvould like to have appendpd also an original of the importers' notice with each of these statements, but the importers withdrew their advanced list so quickly after hearing of our action that we were able to secure only two of them. By our thus keeping the price down to the consumer and preventing the importers from making this tremendous advance under pretext of the McKinley law, we have in- curred their enmity to such an extent that we have since been unable to secure a single customer among them. We are proad of our achievement so far, and beg to add letters from customers bearing on the high quality of our goods. Al'PENDIX TO THE STATEMENT OF THE KIDD STEEL WIRE COMPANY, LIMITED. From questions asked others we note that your committee desires to be informed as to how the rel.itive cost of production here and abroad compares with the actual dift'erence in wages paid. The English operatives are paid by weight. We keep an accurate account ol' the total cost of production in wages, and therefore are able to furnish this information as far as it relates to our special line of manufacture, as follows : Cents. Average cost per pound in wages at our factory 14J Average cost per pound in wages in England 6 We would call your attention in this place to the fact that this is not ordinary wire drawing, but a specialty in that line. Drill rods from their inductility re- quire special skill and command a special rate of wages. Our object in paying day wages is to get the most accurate work possible, while working by the piece has the result of getting the maximum of output. In conclusion, we would say that in the manufacture of a watch there is at present prices about three cents worth of drill rods required in each watch ; and that oo cents buys a poimd of wire which will make about one thousand needles, retailing at 25 cents per dozen. Consequently any reduction in the price of the wire could not be subdivided in any possible manner to affect the retail price. In view of these facts, we beg that the present rate of duty be maintained, EespectfuUy submitted, EUTHEKFOKD BURGHEP., 'Treasurer. Mr. Burgher. We have two reasons for asking this. One reason is because in the manufacture of steel it requires a great deal of skilled labor to draw it. It is of very high carbon and steel, and is not dtxc- tile. It is required to be drawn in the smaller sizes. We have jiist made a start since 1889. In the next i^lace, we find that, by looking up the matter of wages in England, they are paying less than half what we have been paying in our factory. One gentleman of the comndttee made a statement that he had not heard anything about the poor consumer from the manu- facturers. We have a case which we would like to call to the atten- tion of the committee. The McKinley bill went into effect on October 6, and on the 10th the importers of New York issued a circular to the trade advancing the price of this wire on an average of 45 per cent. When we heard of that, we were selling it without any change in prices, and we issued a circular stating that fact, with the result that the importers immediately withdrew their advanced rates and returned to the old prices. As to the quality of the material we append circulars from the Waltham AVatch Company and from the Edison Phonograph Works attesting the superior quality of our wire. The Chairman. In what shajje do you buy your material? Mr. Btjrgher. In the shape of steel rods. They are laid down at our works in that shape. We supply the electrical companies and all the watch companies in the United States. Mr. Dalzell. About how long have yon been established? Mr. Burgher. Tliere were efforts made to establish works of this sort for fourteen or fifteen years, but there never has been any Ameri- can steel rods made that could successfully comjiete Ayith the Enolish FLAT STEEL WIRE WIRE. 399 product imtil aboiit five years ago. At that time we were making a ' struggle to do it. Mr. Dalzell. Wliat lias been the course of prices ; have they gone up or down'? Mr. BuRGi-iER. Prices were 25 to 35 per cent higher, and we thought we saw a margin, and went into the busiuess. Mr. Dalzell. The effect of the establishment here has been to bring down prices! Mr. BuRaHBR. Yes, sir ; I think that is the case. Mr. Dalzell. What you want is the reduction of the present duty? Mr. BuK&HER. Keductiou of the present duty on wire of all kinds at 4 cents a pound. We would also like a clause deiiniug wire. I think that is all I have to-day. FXAT STEEL WIRE. (Paragraph 148.) New York, September 19, 1893. Sir : As steel manufacturers and importers, we respectfully beg to call your attention to the fact that the specific duties on steel named in the latter part of section No. 146 of the metal schedule of the present tariff act averages, for the better qualities, between twenty-five and thirty per cent ad valorem, and as such steel is known as raw material and mostly imported a liberal reduction of said rate is earnestly re- quested at your hands. We also beg to call your attention to that part of section No. 148 which reads as follows : '■'■And provided further, That flat steel wire or sheet steel in strips, whether drawn through dies or rolls, untempered, or tempered of whatsoever width, twenty-five one thousandths of an inch thick or thinner (ready for use or otherwise), shall pay a duty of fifty per cent ad valorem." We claim this rate to be a great injustice to American consumers of articles made from this steel, such as pens; also very fine springs for watches, watch parts, and so forth. Steel for these purposes is all im- ported, and as the present high rate is beyond all reason we feel sure that you will, in your good judgment, greatly reduce the same. Eespectfully submitted, S. & 0. Wardlow. Feank S. Pilditcii, Attorney. WIKB. (Paragraiill 148.) Trenton, K J., September 14, 1893. Sir : We herewith beg to call the attention of your committee to rea- sons which seem conclusive to ourselves why, in the proposed revision of the tariff law, the duties on iron and steel wire, wire rope, wire strands, and other wire goods should not be further reduced. The duty levied on 400 METALS. iron and steel wire prior to the act of 1883 and the reduction due to that act are shown in the following table: Eeduction. Duties por ads prior to 1SC3. Dutif^s per actof J883. Sizes. Steel. Iron. Steel. Ironandst^el. Spe- citic. Ad va- lorem. Spe- cillc. Ad va- lorem . Fer ct. Fer ct. Per ct. Per ct. I^ot smaller 2 cents per pound 2^ cents per pound 1^ cents per 25 15 40 20 tlian Nu. 10. and 15 per cent ad valonsm. and 20 per cent ad valorem. pound Kos. 11 tol6.. 2 cents per pound and 15 por cent ad valorem. 2^oent8perpound and 2u per cent ad valorem. 2 cents per pound. 15 20 20 I^os. 17 to 26.. 3 J cents per pound and 15 per cent ad valorem. 3 cents per pound and 20 per cent ad valorem. 2^ cents per pound. 28^ 15 ICJ 20 Smaller than 4 cents per pound 3 cents per pound 3 cents per 25 15 20 :No. 26. and 15 per cent ad valorem. and 1^1) pLT cent ad ^'alurem. pound. The reductions shown in the foregoing table are perfectly enormoiis and would have closed every wire mill in the country had it not been for the fact that during the last ten years the commoner grades of soft steel have been very largely reduced in cost, and they have gradually been substituted for iron. Tliis, however, has not been the case with the higher grades of steel, which have been largely imported between 1883 and 1890. The act of 1890 wiped out all differences in the schedule between iron and steel wire, etc., and made a further reduction in duty of $5.60 per ton. The result of this is that importations have increased enor- mously, as is shown by the following flgures taken from the summary statement of imports and exjiorts during the fiscal year ending June 30, 1890, as published by the Treasury Department, page 5: Imports of twelve months ending June 30, 1893, 9,305,075 pounds. Imports of twelve months ending June 30, 1892, 8,07ii,i37 pounds. In- crease, 15-1^0 per cent. The foreign value at works of the importations of 1893 is Gtu-q- cents per pound. Imports of the month of June, 1893, 1,205,713 pounds. Imports of the month of June, 1892, 754,736. Increase, 59-j^„- per cent. The range of size and quality in iron and steel wire goods is very great and covers a list so extensive that it would be exceedingly diffi- cult to provide for each specifically. In addition to the existing low rates of duty is the fact that wire- rope ship rigging for vessels in foreign trade is admitted free. An American manufacturer has no possible chance to compete for this business. Very respectfully, John A. Eoebling's Sons Co. and others. WIRE, ETC. 401 WIKE, ETC. (Paragraph 148.) Sirs: I call your attention to various articles on which the duty should be greatly reduced, particularly on files, which should not pay a higher rate of duty than 25 per cent ad valorem. I also suggest that section 164, in reference to chains, be passed according to the bill introduced by Mr. Mills, and that "Articles of jewelry" should include only such as are made of precious stones and precious metals, making an exception of those that are made of base metals. Furthermore, section 148, referring to wire, should read "Steel and brass wire," 1:^ cents per ])ound up to 1:^0. 10. Smaller than No. 10 and not smaller than No. 16, If cents per pound. Smaller than No. 16 and not smaller than No. 20, 2J cents per pound. Smaller than No. 26, 3 cents per pound. The balance of section No. 148 to remain as it now is. And that section 155, referring to anvils, remain as it now is, the duty being 2J cents per pound. In regard to the mauufacture of glass, the present law places lens stock on the free list. As that article is simply cylinder glass, and can be used for many other purposes, lean not understand why it should be free, when cylinder and crown glasses are assessed at from If cents to 3^ cents per pound. If one is free, the other should also be so, or vice versa. The present rate of duty on these articles shows a great discrimination between one manufacturer and another. Anotlier i^oint to which I desire to call your attention is the great annoyance to which all imi^orters are put in regard to the McKinley bill in having to stamp every article imported with the name of the country from whence it comes. This is a great hardship to all import- ers of small wares, and it is something utterly impossible to be com- plied with, and I therefore call your attention to this matter for the purjiose of having that section of the law repealed. I also wish to add that the duty on spectacles and eyeglasses and parts thereof should be reduced to 25 per cent ad valorem for the reason that the laborer and farmer, who are the real jjroducers of our noble country, would bein aposition to preserve their eyesight, as the eye is one of the most delicate and most necessary organs of the human body. Under the high rate of tariif of 45 per cent of the year 1883 the Ameri- can Optical Company has grown to be a very rich corporation. Dur- ing a conversation I had in the year 1890 with one of the largest spec- tacle manufacturers in this country, Mr. T. A. Willson, of Beading, Pa., in reference to this subject, he informed me that the rate on spectacles and eyeglasses and on lenses might be lowered without detriment to the American manufacturers. He also stated that he exported large quantities of spectacles and eyeglasses of his make to Canada and Eng- land as well as to other parts of Europe. Consequently, if the duty on spectacles, eyeglasses, and lenses were reduced to 20 per cent or 25 per cent there could be no question at all as to that rate of duty being amply sufficient protection for our American manufacturers, particu- larly with a reduction of duty on lenses. Furthermore, if you will make inquiry you will learn that a good deal of the work is done by female helj) — at least I have so been informed upon investigating the matter. T H 26 402 METALS. As I know that you are pestexed with petitions in reference to every known article, wbetber in its ra\^ state or manufactarecl, I will refrain from alludiug to any more tlian the few articles mentioned in the fore- going", althoufi'h 1 consider tlie present rates of duty on a great many articles entirely too high; I will leave it to others to call your atten- tion to such as I have not-referred to. I, however, recommend the duty of 4.5 per cent on pebbles being maintained. Very truly yours, J. W. ElGLANDBB, 205 West Fifty -seventh street. AXLBS. (Paragraph 15i). Satuedat, Septemher 16, 1893. STATEMENT OF MR. W. C. DALZELL, OF SOUTH EDCtSEMONT, MASS. Mr. Ohaieman: I desire to call your attention to-daj^ to something included in the present tariff law which works an injustice to the in- dustry which I represeut. I refer now to the manufacture of carriage axles. Under the old law these goods paid a duty of 45 per cent ad valorem ; under the new law they are admitted at 2 cents a pound, which in the higher grades of these goods amount to 12 or 15 per cent protection. This is entirely inadequate for a proper protection of our business inasmuch as the larger part of the cost of carriage axles is in the labor employed in making them. I refer to that inequality in the tariff, and to show you where this inequality lies, I would refer to the schedule of duties under the law of October, 1890, and in that we find that the duty on carriage axles as I stated, on axles of whatever grade is i)laced at 2 cents a pound. In the same line and next to it we find that the duty on axes and articles in which labor does not bear so im- X)ortant a part is placed at 45 per cent ad valorem. We find that cables, chains, and articles not difficult to manufacture are x)laced at 45 iier cent ad valorem; also forgings of iron or steel in whatever state of manufacture, be it in the rough or partially finished, shall not enter at less than 45 per cent duty. Now, I suppose, gentlemen, that the committee who framed that bill intended this low rate of duty of 2 cents a pound to apply only to the lower-priced axles and to car axles or locomotive axles, and I should think that would be a sufflcieut duty applied to articles in which labor bears no larger proportion of the cost than it does in the car axles, but when it is applied to carriage axles, an article difficult to manufacture, call- ing for the highest character of skill in the workmen, it is entirely in- adequate, and it is insufficient for the following reasons: The first is the large proportion of cost which labor bears and large percentage of cost it bears to the cost of the product. In many of our goods the labor costs twice and in a few of them three times as nruch as the materials used; and another reason which lies close alongside the first one is the very much higlier rate of wages we pay in this country than our competitors pay abroad. This amounts to a difference between this country and England of 80 per cent; between the German manu- factures and ours there is a difference of 100 per cent and over in the AXLES. 403 amount paid for labor, and in parts of France the difference is even greater. Now, tlie axle to which I referred was not enumerated in the schedule of the tariff of 1883. There is no word of axle in that tariff bill. They therefore probably came in as manufactures of iron and steel not elsewhere provided for at 45 per cent ad valorem. What I would like to have this committee do is, we pray your honorable body' to restore the duty which was in force previous to the present time and place these goods where they belong in the line of other carriage hard- ware. You will notice in the present bill carriage hardware is omitted and pays a duty of 45 per cent. Mr. TuRNEB.. What paragraph is that; do you remember? Mr. Payne. One hundred and iifty-four, I think it is. It is stated in our tables here as being 2J cents a pound in 1883. Mr. Dalzell. Axles'? I do not so understand it. Mr. Payne. I have not the law of 1883 before me. Mr. Dalzell. I would like to show to the gentlemen of the com- mittee the article upon which I am speaking, and the different combi- nations, and the amount of labor necessary to the production of this article. The duty of 2 cents a pound, as applied to the truck axle, or the express- wagon axle, or the car axle, is entirely sufficient, but as applied to the axle, the high-priced axle, such as is used for the high- priced, luxurious carriages, the labor on them is such that it is entirely insufflcdent. Representative Dalzell. Pardon me for a moment. The act of 1883, section 166, provides that iron or steel axles, or axle bars, axle blanks, or forgings for axles, without reference to state of manufacture, are 2^ cents per pound. Mr. Dalzell. Gentlemen, be that as it may, I stand here to plead for the recognition for the amount of labor and capital which is in- vested in this industry, and to show you the difference in the cost of the construction of such an axle as this and those which run under a car or a truck, or express wagon. You can see for yourselves [ex- hibiting]; this is an article calling in its manufacture for skill of the highest character of the labor employed. There is the brass work be- longing to this axle which is charged 45 per cent. When it is attached to this axle which I show you it comes in at 2 cents a pound. We claim that is unjust to us as manufacturers. Mr. Bryan. You mean you prefer an ad valorem duty to a specific'? Mr. Dalzell. Yes, sir; you may take an axle on tlie truck or under an express wagon on the street and it weighs 80 pounds and the duty on that express axle is $1.60, and you may take an axle under one of your broughams which cost $1,000 and it weighs 80 pounds and the duty on it is $1.60. There is no justice in that to the manufacturer of high-priced goods. He has to compete with these things which places him on an inequality, and we desire and maintain we are right in calling for an increase of duty on our goods. All other carriage hardware is taxed 45 per cent. A little of that axle pays a duty of what is de- manded on the finished product. The iron of that case pays a duty of IJ cents a pound before it is placed on the axle, and yet the total cost is almost all labor. You can see these goods are finished like a gun barrel, and it requires high skill and greater amount of labor to do it. Mr. Bryan. Is not that objection made to all specific duties? Mr. Dalzkll. It certainly M'orks that way in this case. I have not investigated to know what may be the result in other kinds of manu- facture. This axle which lies here only weighs 11 pounds, and this would have a duty of 22 cents if it were imported. Now, I do not 404 METALS. know but what there are some things in the list too high, but what I know, and what any reasonable man can see, is that these goods are too low. Mr. Bryan. The total duty is 22 cents? Mr. Dalzell. Yes, sir. Mr. Beyan. What do you sell tbem for? Mr. Dalzell. Sixteen dollars a set; $4 for that axle. ilr. Payne. How long have you been making these? Mr. Dalzell. We began the manufacture of those in 1873. Mr. Bryan. Has your industry grown? Mr. Dalzell. Yes, sir. Jlr. Bryan. ^STotwithstanding your duty is 5 per cent you are pros- perous ? Mr. Dalzell. That axle is not a fair illustration perhaps of the duty. The duty goes nearer to 15 per cent, and in some cases 20 per cent in the cases of heavier goods; this manufacture is a light one. Mr. Bryan. Now, will you give us a reason why that duty should be increased if you are progiessing under it nicely? Mr. Dalzell. I stated the goods came at 45 per cent, if I am mistaken in that I stand corrected. The foreigu goods were not pushed in this market until after the .McKinley bill passed and the most I know of it then, I did not kee^, any track of tariff legislation, is we Avere not represented before tbe committee, that is the manufacturers of axles were not represented before the committee, not haA'ing had any trouble previous to that time, but immediately after the passage of the McKinley bill we began to have such letters as this from our customers: "We are oifered 1-^ full collinge with flaps on all for §19 per set. What is the matter with the tariff?" Those are very prominent carriage peoide in NewTlaven, Conn. I went down just after that to see those gentle- men and while there a solicitor from an importer was in the olhce and he stated that the duty had been lowered and there was not any pros- I)ect of having it put back again and they were going to push for the market. He said thiit they had hoped for a long while to have it revised in their favor, and as it liad been done that tiiey were ready to furnish the market with products. Previous to this time we had'not encountered this competition. Mr. Bryan. Do you meau to say they were offering to sell that kind of an axle for $19 a set? Mr. Dalzell. It was dilTerent from this. It was a heavier axle with a solid flap over the side for the spring which he offered to sell at $19, but I have bills, invoices from tliis house which are even lower than that. These same goods cost us •'523 to manufacture. Mr. Bryan. Then yon want a tariff to charge $23 or more. Mr. Dalzell. Our price is $20 for that article. It is offered at $18.75, 3 off'. Mr. Bryan. You cannot sell in competition with the $19 axle at all. Mr. Dalzell. No, sir. Mr. Bryan. You Avant the tariff raised so you can sell your axle for $26. Mr. Dalzell. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. How can you do that, except by making the foreign art- icle cost $20 ? Mr. Dalzell. I do not see any other way, sir. If we can have a duty that is (Mmiinensurate with the diflercin'ce in the cost of material and the cost of labor we will stand on a footing with other industries. Now, as I remarked before, carriage hardware, av hi ch is similar to this! AXLES. 405 taking a prominent or important place in the construction of a carriage, and wliich is largely composed of what is simply drop forgings, pays 45 per cent duty. There is much more labor percentage in the cost of this article than the so-called carriage hardware. Mr. Bryan. Where is your factory ? Mr. Dalzell. South Egremout, Mass. Mr. Bryan. Do you know Mr. Sargent? Mr. DvVLZELL. I have heard of him. I do not know him. Mr. Bryan. He has a large factory? Mr. Dalzell. I ^ as near his place Wednesday. Mr. Bryan. Mr. Sargent, I believe, has stated that where a greater proportion of labor is employed and less material is used you can com- pete with foreigners better than where the proportion of material is large and labor small. Mr. Dalzell. That is entirely opposite to our experience. It may be entirely true in liis business, but you can easily see the difference here. The man who is running a delivery wagon or an express wagon for a living pays as much duty on his axle as the gentleman who rides in a §l,2(t0 carriage. Mr. Bryan. You do not think that is fair ? Mr. Dalzell. It is not fair to those parties, and it certainly is not to the manufacturer here. Mr. Bryan. Do you believe in a high duty upon what are called luxtiries ? Mr. Dalzell. I believe in a higher duty upon those articles upon which the greatest amount of cost is labor, be they articles of luxury or otherwise. Mr. Bryan. Do you know what the labor cost of making that axle abroad is, or simply the wages paid ? Mr. Dalzell. I know simi)ly the wages paid. Mr. Bryan. You have never made any investigation of the actual cost of production? Mr. Dalzell. That would be beyond my power, I suppose. I can tell you that we have a man in our employ, acting as foreman, who learned his business in England, and he stated to me that men who are now employed making $18 could not make over $10 there, and making $16 could not make over $6 to $7 there. Mr. Bryan. That is a reference simply to the relative wages paid, but does not affect the labor cost of the article? Mr. DAiZELL. Certainly. In these axles the labor, as I stated, in some cases is two-thirds the cost. Mr. Bryan. But is it not true that one man working at a. dollar a day may realize less to his employer for every dollar paid to him than another man who receives ■?-! or $o? Mr. Dalzell. That may be true, but we would not keep him a great while. Mr. Bryan. You want men who receive $3 or $4 a day, and yet you get more work for every dollar? Mr. Dalzell. We iiud the mechanics who come to us from abroad are fully equal to our mechanics here, and we expect fully us much of them, and we receive it. The plans and methods of manufacture are very similar in both countries. This is forged out under a steam or trip hammer from a solid bar large enough to make that collar, and the amount of hand-labor on this exceeds that of any other product which has been before you, I have no doubt. The man talvcs that u]), the forging, which is entirely hand-labor, and places that in an engine 406 METALS. lafhe, and he turns it up, wliioh is a laborious operation. It has to be perfectly true and parallel, because it has to go ou that lillustratissg]. It is absolutely hard, like glass, and it has to be a perfect tit, which requires skill and a great amount of labor to do it. Mr. Bryan. You say you have only compared the wages per day and not the labor cost? Mr. Dalzbll. No, sir; I can not state to your committee whether they cost twice as much or three times as much. Mr. Bryan. How long have you been engaged in this business? Mr. Dalzell. I went into business myself in 1862. Mr. Bryan. How long have you had the same tariff you have now? Mr. Dalzell. I do not know. Mr. Bryan. Tou do not know how long this tariff has existed? Mr. Dalzell. I know when the goods began to appear in our mar- ket. I do know this. They were imported in this country when we began to manufacture them, and they cost then $40 what we now sell for $20. Mr. Bryan. What did you sell for at that time? Mr. Dalzell. We sold for the same price. Mr. Bryan. Forty dollars? Mr. Dalzell. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Has the reduction in the cost been due to competition or due to improved machinery ? Mr. Dalzell. It has beeu due to home competition. There are other concerns engaged in this indastry which I had hoj)ed to have here to- day with me. I have a letter here from one of them, which I will read to the committee. He is a prominent manufacturer in Newark. Mr. Bryan. How many manufacturers are there? Mr. Dalzell. Five manufacturers in this country. Mr. Bryan. How much did you start in with in 1863? Mr. Dalzell. How much capital? I know what I paid for one- third interest in the business. My father took my brother and myself into partnership with him in 1868,.after I had learned the trade, so to sx)eak. Mr. Bryan. How much had the three invested at that time? Mr. Dalzell. We invested about $24,000. Mr. Bryan. What is the capital now? Mr. Dalzell. I believe our plant and capital in it would amount to $100,000. ■ Mr. Bryan. I'hat is since 18G8? Mr. Payne. You say you have mechanics who vSpent years in their business who come from the old country and go to work for yoa. You have never made the discovery that these men the moment they landed in this country were able to produce twice as much in an hour as in the old country? You never made that discovery in the business? Mr. Dalzell. No, sir. Mr. Payne. Have you ever discovered they could do any more? Mr. Dalzell. No, sir; I think that the average man with the aver- age intelligence, taught his business, will do as much in one place as another. The Chairman. You could not have read Mr. Blaine's statement? Mr. Payne. I tldnk that has never been discovered outside of theories. Mr. Dalzell. We have had a good many men working for us at different times who learned their business in the old country, and we have always found them to be fully equal, as far as I remember. There will be poor workmen among them as among our own workmen. AXLES. 407 Mr. Bynum. And you think a, mau who eats nient only once a week can perform as much kibor UiS the man who euts meat every day? Mr. Dalzbll. I would like to be as stout as some Irishmen who come here who never saw much meat. Mr. Bynum. He is so bloodthirsty he does not need meat, I pre- sume? Mr. Dalzell. The fact is, that the most robust men we have had are not those who have had the privilege of high living. Mr. Payne. There are, I suppose, some Italians there who always live on maccaroni? Mr. Dalzell. We have not had much experience with those, as "we do not want them around. Mr. Beyan. Ton do not mean to insinuate that the labor of this country is guilty of high living? Mr. Dalzell. Our men live very nearly as well as I do. With your permissiou I will read this communication from Mr. Theodore Gray, of the Tomlinson Spring Company, of Newark, N. J. : Newark, N. J., Septemler 12, 1S93. Mt Deak Sir: Yours llth. at hand, and I have already wired you tlia£ I c:ui not go to Washington with you, as proijosed hy you. Our Mr. Hotel kiss is away this week, and other matters besides this, that would keep me here. I am j^lad that you are going on, and trust that you will be well fortified with facts and figures. The present duty on axles is clearly one of the most unjust of the present tariff sehcdule. The very fact of their being no classification of axles based on their value, finished, makes it unjust. I trust yon will advocate an ad valorem duty; that's the only (air way of getting at it. Take, for instance, a set of IJ axles, to weigh, say, 80 pounds, at 2 cents per pound duty is $1.60. If they are of common-axle class, that sell here for 3i cents per pound, thoy would be worth $2.80, and would pay duty of $1.60. If of Collinge class they are worth here, say, $18 to $22, yet they pay iluty of $1.60, same as the axles worth only $2.80. Surely there is no justice in that, and the fact that they come in under the head of uufiuished goods is again all wrong. You know they are finished absolutely, ready to weld in the center, the same as you and we seud out to all carriage-builders, and the same as the foreign axle-makers send their home customers, the carriage-builders. Again, flaps and crank axles, on which much labor is spent in forging on an anvil by hand labor, the additional weight of flaps and crank is all the extra duty paid, a few cents only, yet the labor on that set of cranks and flaps cost $3 to $10 or even $20, and while the foreign axle-maker charges the carriage-builder here an extra price for these cranks and flaps, depending of course on the cost of forgings and his profit added, the Government gets but a few cents extra duty, merely the additional weight over plain Collinge axles. With an ad valorem or per centum duty on all axles, based on their home values when produced, the Government would receive a revenue in accordance with the value of the goods. Again, there is no reason why they should not pay duty ac((u-d- ing to their honest value. Take the low grade of 3^- cents per pound axle, if im- ported at all, it is for use on trucks, carts, express and delivery wagons of all kinds, used by tradesmen all over the land, and on farm wagons to a large extent, all vehi- cles that people use to carry on their business with and to earn their living with. But how different with Collinge's that are used exclusively for pleasure vehicles of high cost and by people who can afford to buy and. use this class of vehicles. Let me illustrate further. Take, say, a light farm wagon, or city delivery wagon, IJ axles; cost of axles, say, $2.80; weight, 80 pounds; if imported, duty, $1.60; wagon sells complete for $75 to $100. Take a brougham or cabriolet; sells from $900 to $1,400; axles, li Collinge; weight, 80 pounds; if imported, duty, $1.60; axles valued here $18 to $22. And we have one fellow with a wagon costing $100 to earn his living with, his axles costing $2.80; another fellow with a luxurious carriage which to ride in, costing $900 to $1,400, his axles costing, say, $18 to $22, and each set of axles paying duty of $1.60. Nothing in the way of duty on goods couhl be more unjust than this. A per centum duty on axles is what is wanted, and to equalize difference of cost of materials and labor used, not less than 15 per cent ad valorem .should be the rate of duty. I have written you hurriedly, but with time .and paticni'o you will bo able to make out what I say, and if of any use to you \y]u-ii you appear Ijefore the commit- tee, why use it. Let me hear from you when you return home. Youis, truly, TnEO. Gray, Seoretary. 408 MKTALS. I have here invoices of that axle to which I referretl, which we pur- chased for a customer of ours in New Haven. This industry is of considerable importance, not only to the gentle- men who happen to be at the head of the establishment, but to quite large communities. We are not millionaires ; we are not large manu- facturers. I worked at the bench for seven years, and have since had charge of the business. The village in which I live is entirely dependent upon the success of our manufacturing. Nearly all the places in it are inhabited by workmen in our employ, and many of them have suc- ceeded in obtaining a competency and are living in their own homes. We trust you will put us in a position where we can continue this con- dition of aftairs and go forward in the hope of even better things. As I stated, the home competition has reduced the cost of these goods from what was at one time $40 to the present cost of $20 to the public, and we think that while we have spent our time and money and are growing old, incidentally, we do not wish to see the fruits of our efforts in that direction taken away. I have nothing more to say, gentlemen, but to thank you. Mr. Betan. Where is the town's Mr. Dalzbll. It is in the Berkshire Hills, Egremont, Mass. Mr. Bryan. You say that almost all the inhabitants are dependent upon your business? Mr. Dalzbll. Yes, sir. Mr. Bbyan. What is the population'? Mr. Dalzbll. Some 250 or 300, 1 should say more than 250, becanse we have 60 men in our employ; I should say in the neighborhood of 300. Mr. Bryan. I understood you to say you did not appear before the last Ways and Means Committee? Mr. Dalzell. No, sir. Mr. Byntjm. You were unfortunate. Mr. Dalzell. I believe we are talking to fair men. I do not sup- pose, Mr. Chairman, that that committee had any knowledge whatever of this article. We ought to have been here to demonstrate to them that we were entitled to 45 per cent duty, and if we had demonstrated it we would have had it. Mr. Payne. You would have had the protection that every American manufacturer is entitled to. Mr. Dalzell. I believe this honorable committee to be men whom I can trust to be as fair-minded as much as the other committee. CARD CLOTHING. (Paragraph 169.) North Andovbr Depot, Ma ss., Septemher 18, 1893. Sir : The present duty on card clothing is 50 cents per square foot on tempered steel-wire clothing, on all other 25 cents per square foot. (See custom laws under head of manufacturers of iron and steel, sec- tion 1.59). When the Mills bill was prepared no hearing was held upon this article and it was in the bill as 25 cents per square foot, on tempered steel and 15 cents on iron-Avire clothing. The matter was presented before the committee later, showing them the great hardshij) it would produce, and with the cheap labor of England and material so cheap POCKET CUTLERY. 409 there it would be impossible for manufacturers in this country to com- pete with foreign makers, and after investigation the Ways and Means Committee through Mr. Mills proposed that the duty be restored to 45 cents per square foot, and it was so changed in the Mills bill in the House. When the McKinley bill was reported the duty on wire and other articles entering into the manufacture of card clothing having been increased quite largely they increased the duty on tempered steel- wire clothing 5 cents per square foot, making it at present 50 cents per square foot, instead of 45 cents as before the Mills bill was reported. Iron-wire clothing and all other kinds of wire remaining at 25 cents, the same as formerly. The increase of 5 cents on tempered steel-wire clothing was only about one-half the increase of duty on the stock from which it is made. The competition in England is still very great, as their labor and material is so cheap and they seem to be willing to make clothing with- out profit and send it to the United States, in order to keep their machinery in operation. The returns from the custom-houses of New Tork, Philadelphia, and Boston from July 1, 1892 to July 1, 1893 show that there was imported during that period 225,860 square feet of card clothing which is about 25 i^er cent of all the clothing made in this country. At the same period fully one-third of the card-setting machinery in the United States was idle on account of lack of work. You will see by the above statements the necessity of substantially the same rate of duty upon card clothing as it is at present, in order that we may compete with the English or be able to operate our estab- lishments. EespectfuUy yours, Davis & Fueber, Machine Company, Per John A. Wiley, Treasurer. POCKET CUTLERY. (raragraph 165.) Thursday, September 14, 1893. STATEMENT OF MR. W. F. ROCKWELL, OF MERIDEN, CONN. Mr. Chairman: If my associate, Mr. Bradley, will give the members of the committee a copy of this ijaper they can follow the statement much better. We respectfully submit the following comparison of amounts and prices of pocket cutlery imported, with quantities and prices of the same class of goods made in the United States : 410 METALS. Total Am eric aa produefc. $1, 320, 000 815,000 795, 000 730, OUO in — Total value of fr)reign pocket cut- lery, duty paid. oo<- o I OOOO ■ o o =" ifi ' s 5 x S : -+■ CC CC o ■ CO CO 00 CI ^1 §§s§ ; ggSS : 10 CJ f ■ t-''o"# CI i Hates of duty. ills ills llli i.t. 1^1^ 1. i ft--ft" .§S -ea ftOft'' .§■§ ^a .io?o P-g f^S gogo P-S P^g CI "-^ '-■^ rH ^ <-l ^ CT*"o'" W "^ -) ^ \ a ftlS a* i ^° 5^ S S.2 as. 1 'S-a si S gS= "1 - g-a .§.:§ g |&» St. S ?& ^--a IIP! il Pi Hilf ii P| c-% s_ s.^ S °i2 c-|»t-.« S.Z s- g ="?';■- iJ rS^^^^"-^ |g||||,pft^^p.„-a^9 |g|||5 ^^ g S P S !m fe |j 5 Tear. V. r. r. '/ Oj "/.■ "jC y CI 3 1 POCKET CUTLERY. 411 Total foreign value of pocket, cutlery importeil liist yenr $005, 208. 72 Approximuto foreign value of pocket cutlery juado in United States. . . >H'2, 105. 00 Total lor: Urn value of pocket cutlery consumed in United States. 1, 747, 403. 72 If mills were closed here, and all pocket cutlery imported at 50 per cent ad valorem, the revenue received.would bo but 873,7.51.00 The revenue as shown above for past year amounts to 816,571.67 The above statement shows the condition of the pocket cutlery trade, foreign and domestic, from 1882 to 1893. The American manufacturers were gractually losing their business from 1882 to 1891 under the 50 per cent tarilf. They have more than doubled their capacity and output since i891. The cost of foreign pocket knives has been greatly reduced since 1890, and the wages in Americau factories materially increased. We have proven before, that cutlery-operatives' w.iges were four times greater in this coujitry than in Germany, and more than double those paid in Eng- land. We believe that a glance at the average foreign prices per dozen as compared with American will amply confirm our statement. About 2, 000 operatives are now employed in the manufacture of pocket cutlery in twenty factories in this country. Skilled workmen are earning from $2. 50 to $4 per day. About $2, 500, 000 is now invested in pocket cutlery and lines of manufacturing auxiliary to it. We invite your particular attention to the following statements. The average rate of duty on dutiable imports is about 50 per cent. The average proporticm of labor to cost of all goods imported is now about 30 per cent. The actual proportion of labor to cost of Pocket Cutlery is 80 per cent. The average protection to labor, with labor cost at 30 jier cent, is 166|- per cent. The protection to labor on pocket cutlery, with labor cost at 80 per cent, is 62J per cent. To make the protection to labor employed in the manufacture of poclcet cutlery equitable with the average duty at present in iforce, the rate should average 133j per cent. EXAMPLE. Average labor, as 30 percent; pocket-cutlery labor, 80 per cent; average duty, 50 per cent; should be on pocket cutleiy, 133^3 per cent. Prior to 1891 it was practically dcmoustrated that a majority of American pocket- cutlery manufacturers were losing money, on a continually decreasing business. Since 1891 the majority have been doing a satisfactory business, the earnings from which have been mainly used with new capital in increasing and improving factory plants. The foregoing comparison of foreign and domestic pocket cutlery interests would seem to indicate that rates of duty had been established, Avhereby not only the largest revenue could be realized, but a fairly equitable competition maintained. William F. Rockwell, Meridcn, Conn., Thomas W. Bradley, Walden, N. T., Commiitee Sepresenting American Poclcet-Cuilery Manufacturers. We have nothing further to state ia regard to it only to answer any questions the committee may see fit to propound to us. Mr. Beeokinridoe. I observed some time ago advertisements in the Kew York newspapers from the cutlery uianufacturers in which they were offering stocli in a proposed consolidated concern upon the mar- ket, and there was a business statement of the profits of the business for a long time in the past. Do yon know anything about that pros- pectus? Mr. EoCKWELL. I had nothing whatever to do with it. Mr. Breckinridge. Your linn is not one of the number? Mr. EocKWELL. We were not connected with that ariangment in any sense, shape, or form. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you know the firms who were connected under the proposed arrangenhcnt ? Mr. EoCKWBLL. That our firm was named as one company, and there was an arrangement, some people talked of buying us ont, but so far as any advertisement was concerned we never knew anything about it. 412 METiiLS. Mr. Breckinridge. These advertisements seem to liave been only put in the newspapers by the bankers who were the agents for floating the scheme. Howeveir, the matter of chief concern is the responsibil- ity of the statements made in that bnsiness publication. Mr. EooKWELL. We were in no way responsible for the statements made in that business publication. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you believe the statements made in that publication were true. Mr. EooKWELL. I know they were not true. Mr. Breckinridge. They appear to have been made under oath of these diflereut firms ? Mr. Eockwell. Not the statement that appears in the publication, as I understand it. Mr. Breckinridge. I have a copy, not here by me, of the prospectus issued by these bankers; are you perfectly familiar with the paper issued by those firms ? Mr. Eockwell. I have seen it. Mr. Breckinridge. You say you do not believe the statements are true I Mr. Eockwell. There are a great many statements in that which are entirely untrue. Mr. Breckinridge. You believe their general statement of the cut- lery business is not true? Mr. Eockwell. I think they are greatly exaggerated. Unless I had the statement you know I could not particularize, as it has been so long since I saw the particulars. POCKET CUTLERY. (Paragraph 165.) STATEMENT OF ME. THOMAS W. BRADLEY, OF "WAUDEN N. Y. Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen op the Committee : As the firm of which I am a member is also named in the United States cutlery prospectus, I prefer to meet that question at the outset. Mr. Breckinridge. I will be very glad to have your statement. Mr. Bradley. I will give a simple recital of what I know about it. After some forty years' connection with the manufacturing business and having reached the time of life I would rather pursue something not so onerous, I was open to proposals of purchase and sale of the manufactory with which I am connected, and when a party came to me with good recommendations and asked me what I would sell the plant of which I am a majority owner and first officer of, after conferring with my associates, 90 per cent of whom are widow ladies whose part- ners in lite grew up witli the business forthe past forty odd years, and therefore who would rather casli their assets in the manufacturing busi- ness, we unanimously agreed to sell the plant. I named the price and made a contract with a ])arty Mr. Breckinridge. What price did you name? Mr. Bradley. I really forget now, but I thinlt it was something like $300,000, of which I would take two-thirds in cash and one-tliird in stock in the united company which I was told by this iiarty certain i influential people in the trade expected to form. That was a matter of POCKET CUTLEEY. 413 little concern to me. I made a business contract with the party, and the main point of that contract is this — I was very careful to see to that — that it should be a boua fide purchase and sale; there should be no advertisement of any united company, or formation of any company, or anything said about the matter uutil I had received the purchase price and transferred the title. We rested on that. The transfer of purchase was to be made on the 1st day of July, 1892. As a delegate of the 14th Congressional district to Minneapolis returning from the convention, I was razzledazzled to read in a New York pajjer, which I got in Toledo on the way home, a prospectus of the proposed, or as stated there, the organized United States Cutlery Company. My con- tract was simply to sell. The parties who j)repared that prospectus — I do not know who prepared it, I was and my firm was no party to it. My name was used without my authority; my lirm was mentioned without authority; and the company was organized without authority so far as I was concerned. I at once telegraphed the bankers who had placed the matter upon the market, and absolutely and positively repu- diated the whole matter or any connection with it and demanded that they withdraw it from the market. 1 at once received word from the bankers, who were respectable men, that they had been informed to the contrary, and they hoped that I would not publicly repudiate the trans- action ou their account, and recognizing their respectability, recogniz- ing also that they had been most shamefully deceived, I agreed not to publicly repudiate the matter on the condition I was indemnified against any expenses connected with the matter in any way whatever. My action was followed, I believe, by the action of every other member whose name was mentioned and the matter was withdrawn from the market and that ended it. Mr. Breckinridge, this is the age of buncoing. I am grateful for the experience I have, because I do not think I shall ever be caught again in the same hole, but 1 never came so near being buncoed in my life. Mr. Bbeokinridgb. Ton have given us a very interesting state- ment, but a phase of the matter which was not the point to which I was directing my inquiry? Mr. Beadley. I will try to answer any questions you wish to put. Mr. Beeckineidge. I am not making any criticism upon the fact of sale, and of course I know nothing of that sale, but I was simply in- quiring as to the correctness of the statement which was made in the business i)rospectus. Mr. Beadley. As I recollect aright, it was a grouped statement of the condition of the profits, possibilities, etc., of these four plants. In my opinion the statements are incorrect so far as any -statements are there shown. I never contributed to them under oath or in any other way, save so much as my business was open to the inspection of the party to whom I was to sell. Mr. BEEGKiNEiDaE. Now, you were api)roached, and there was a proposal on the part of certain parties to buy up several of those estab- lishments ? Mr. Beadley. The proposition originally was to buy all in the country. Mr. Beeckineidge. They were to get all? Mr. Beadley. Yes, sir. Mr. Beeckineidge. Now, the business of your concern was ex- amined into by expert accountants. Mr. Beadley. Yes, sir. Mr. Beeckineidge. Have you any reason to believe that the gen- 414 METALS. eral statement which was published over the signature of those ac- countants was truthful and correct? Mr. Bkadlby. If I had felt that the statement published of the prospectus was truthful and could have been borne out and no one de- ceived, I do not think I should have repudiated the sale even tlionffh there was a breach of confidence and an attempt to bunco and sell a lilant that had not yet been i)aid for. IMr. Beeckineidge. You believe then that the statement or propo- sition issued by these baiikers was not a true statement as drawn by these experts from the books of these various companies? Mr. Beadley. Not entirely so. Mr. Beeckineidge. How far were they? Mr. Beadley. I can not tell you unless I should dissect the pros- pectus in comparison with the items of my own business and dissect the items of my own business from the aggregate of the four companies as presented. Mr. Beeckineidge. They presented only a generalization ? Mr. Beadley'. Exactly. Mr. Beeckineidge. My sole object is to get at the state of the business and the condition of this industry. Do you know these mag- nates who undertook to float this scheme? Mr. Beadley". Ho, sir; only as I met them after I read the pros- pectus. Mr. Beeckineidge. You know nothing of their responsibility? Mr. Beadley. 1 understand they are highly respectable and respon- sible batdvcrs of New York City. Mr. Beeckineidge. Do you know anything of the accountants, the experts vfho made this examination into the books and business. Mr. Beadley. I simply know who they are from presentation of their cards; 1 believe they are highly respectable gentlemen. Mr. Beeckineidge. They are considered responsible men by busi- ness men generally? Mr. Beadley'. I believe so. Mr. Beeckineidge. And competent? Mr. Beadley. Yes, sir; I believe so. They are so repox'tcd; I do not know. Mr. Beeckineidge. That, of course, shows for itself. Mr. Beadley. Now, Mr. Chairman and gentlemen, it is the labor side of the American pocket cutlery interests and the side of the workmen in that industry to which 1 desire to call your attention. It is a small industry employing a httle over 2,000 people, and important only as it is one of the numerous small industries of tlie country that in their growth form a very large i)roportion of tlie volume of l)usiness of the country, especially in the industries of the country. Prior to the act of 1890 the duty of .50 per ceut ad valorem on pocket cutlery was not sufficient to meet the condition of wages in this country and abroad. Even in the Morrill bill the interests of the industry had never been looked into or presented by those who were interested in the business, or a duty higher than 50 per cent would have been placed, in my opin- ion. Ho\yevcr, the gold premium that existed until tlie resumption act covered the difierence to a great extent and the want of protection was not felt until after 1679, and gradually from 1882 .down to 1887 and 1888 the business languished, and this decreased the wages of its work- men, decreased to such a degre(; it was imjiossible to keex) skilled workmen to any extent in tliat line, because other branches wherein the labor percentage was not so great called them away from this POCKET CUTLERY. 415 brancli. Tlie matter was fiilly presented in the preparation of the bill of 1890, and still, in my opinion, it does not cover the difference in la- bor in this country and abroad, as I believe no duty ever has done on any tariff bill of the country. But I am not here to ask a higher duty. I am here to call the atten- tion of the committee to this fact, that the increase of duty from 50 per cent ad valorem to a compound duty equivalent to 90 per cent in ad valorem has increased this business, doubled it since 1889. It has al)out doubled the number of people employed, and advanced the wages of the operatives employed to the extent that places them among the skilled workmen of the country, with returns equally as good as nearly any branch of skilled labor in this country. In regard to the advance in labor, I will cite my own works. On the 1st of January, 1890, I called to me my people one by one — no committees about it — and volun- tarily advanced the wages under the opportunity of this advance of duty from 5 per cent to 33|y per cent, equalizing the benefit as much as possible where the men needed it throughout the mill. Among the twenty-seven or twenty-eight pocketknife manufacturers in this country a great majority are located in small towns, small villages, and most of them are the main support of the villages wherein located. If 1 may give a brief description of the concern with which I am con- nected it will answer for nearly all. I will go with you to Orange County, N. Y., to a valley of about 40 uiiles square, just below the southern range of the Oatskill Mountains, and where the Wallkill Kiver plunges its waters down, there is located a manufacturing village of a little less than 3,000 individuals, employing about 775 mechanics, 660 of which work in the two x^ocket-cutlery manufactories of the place. In that section of the country of which I have spoken, of 40 miles square, besides this manufacturing point, is devoted to the dairy business, a great deal of which is disposed to the Walden Con- densed Milk Company. The boys and girls of tlie farmers work on the farm and produce milk. They produce great quantities of milk, and the dairies have three or four times as many cows as they can feed, and an immense volume comoi to them from the West of feed of all kinds. The sons and daughters of these farmers not needed on the farm come into our workshops arid begin work in the wrapping department, where 100 or 150 are needed. ISTow, our condition, just at this time, is pecvdiar in this respect; we do not know what to do. I entered right on that same spot forty years ago in the employ of this New York Knife Company as an apprentice, at the age of 10 years, and for forty years, with the excep- tion of three years in the Union army and one in the New Y'ork legis- lature, I followed this same line from an apprentice to a skilled mechanic, assistant superintendent, manager, treasurer, and president, and it is niy lot to be president of the just one national bank in our section and an officer of the savings bank. When the depression came in Maiy first over the country I looked upon it as a bankers' panic, and feeling that it was simply financial the mills of that town were kept running full-handed, full time, paying full wages up to now. In all that three months of products one week's products of the mills would have filled all the sales we have made. The bankers' panic has passed almost, money is easier, and we see light coming. I wondered lately why business did not improve with us. I have frequently made inquiry of large jobbing points — St. Louis, Chicago, Baltimore, Philadeljjhia, etc., and I received the reply. Independent of political afhliations or any partisanship whatever, it comes to me — we can not place our orders as usual. Now, it is customary for us to receive during the 416 METALS. months of June, July, and AugTist orders to be delivered during Jan- uary, February, and March of the next year. They have not come in, they are not coming, and they will not come until this tariff question is settled. Of course, people expect everything. 'No one knows what change is to be macle, and, of course, it is wise to reduce stock on job- bers' shelves, and especially wlien the promise is that they think goods are to be lower and markets to be broken. Of course, it is wise to wait until they are broken and buy goods as low as possible. ]Srow, in our mills there is three months' product, one-quarter of an entire year's products stored; it has been at high wages at full time, and running full-handed. I should, in common with everybody else, like to see this tariff question shelved, but it is not respectful to this committee on Waj^s and Means to suggest that, in my opinion. I therefore hope you will progress with the question to the extent of your physical endurance and let us know as soon as possible what changes, if any, are to be. Naturally I protest against any change in duties, the present compound duty ou American pocket cutlery. I beheve these duties have worked to the benefit of every employe in the business, and I frankly confess that this condition has worked to the benefit of those whose means are invested in these manufactures. In my mill, in 1891', I am glad to say that we folly averaged 10 per cent in the last two or three years, unless we throw in this year. I do not know how it will turn out yet, as it may reduce us, but the business has been an entirely satisfactory one. I state right here, as one experienced in manufacturing, knowing well how valueless the manufacturing plant becomes when not ably man- aged, I have seen so many manufactories calling for an investment of hundreds of thousands of dollars go down to ruin simply because of a want of practical experience on the part of new hands which undertake to manage them, and that is the one tiling that gives me the shivers in think- ing that when the Lord calls me I leave to my wife and family that which, through a change in "the tariff, or want of proper management, may become to them the value of old junk. This mill machinery is pre- pared for that special business, and that article has little or no value to a manufacturer of another article. Now, we are not goingto.be ruined whatever you do in our community. We may cease to manu- facture pocketknives, but we shall manufacture something else, or do something else just as long as the water falls down 40-odd feet and gives us power to turn our wheels. What we shall make I do not know, 'or, pending a lodgment in the street, may go to the field. That is Avhy I ask your attention to the labor question, and as the manu- facturer, as a "robber baron," and to some extent fairly well to do in this world's goods, I really ask no consideration for myself. I have my views upon this case and recognize fairly that other gentlemen have a right to their views. I will take my medicine, whatever it may be, with the rest of the boys, but for the'iOO operatives that every week I personally pay off in my mill, every one of whom I know personally, a great bulk of whom were born there, and as American boys have grown up to be American workmen, I want you to carefully consider their interests, no matter how little this iudustry may be. We have made a statement that the proportion of labor in this industry is 80 per cent; it is more than 80 per cent to-day, because wages are higher than they were when the statistics were prepared from which the 80 per cent was arrived at. I will just present two items and will then answei' any questions in regard to piiccs either by wh(]]esa]e, retail, or cost of manufacture, and leave with yourcomndttee just a simple statement taken from our cost books of the cost of pocket- POCKET CUTLERY. 417 knives. I do that for no other reason than because I want to call a little attention from iiie raw-material side of this business. Here is a jackknife [exhibiting samej, used by boys of good size, sometimes by men, and fairly represents all the jackknives of American make going to the farmers and workingmen of this country. It costs $1.82i a dozen Mr. Gbak. That is your cost! Mr. Bradley. At the mill. Of that $1.82 $1.22| is labor. The steel in that dozen of knives costs IQi that is, the steel in the blades. The steel in the back springs cost 4J cents; that is 14| cents for steel. We import steel for the blades and also use steel made in our American mills at 14^ cents a pound. The steel made in the American mills is just as good as Sheffield steel. Park Brothers and Smith Brothers make as good steel as the Sheffield steel, but to some extent we use the Sheffield steel on account of a conviction on the part of some of the American dealers that Sheffield steel is better than the American. But as a practical workman, understanding forging and tempering of steel, I say the American steel is equally as good, and it is a quality of steel that has grown up in the last two or three years, too. ISTow, the steel of the back springs cost about 5 J cents a pound delivered at Walden, and you take the whole total of steel, if you put steel on the free Hst you will only benefit us about 2 J cents, just about 2^ cents on the dozen knives. Mr. Payne. How much would free iron ore benefit it? Mr. Bradley, Of course that enters into the question of steel. Mr. Payne. Have you calculated that amount! Mr. Bradley. No. This American made iron costs about 4J cents a pound. Then there is the wire ; but if you were to put every product that enters into that knife on the free list you would only benefit us about 3 cents a dozen. Mr. Gear. How much would it amount to the consumer! Mr. Bradley. It would not amount to anything. You know that pocketknives start in at 10, 20 cents, 25 cents, 35 cents, 50 cents, 75 cents, and $1; there is no such thing as splitting a nickel. Mr. Gear. Practically the consumer gets no beueflt"? Mr. Bradley. The benefit would go to the middleman, just exactly as the benefit of this increased duty came to the manufacturer by let- ting the middleman "divvy" up in the matter of profits. Mr. Payne. The consumer had to pay no more since the McKinley bill on pocketknives. Mr. Bradley. To the best of my opinion the consumer has paid no more for the American or foreign pocketknife, except in one instance, and for that I am truly sorry. The American boy has been in the habit of buying a pocketknife which was 18 cents net foreign value. It is the only knife that has not gone down in foreign value. The duty, of course, was 50 per cent, and it could be landed here for 27 cents, and it was sold to the jobber perhaps at 35 cents, and by them sold to the retailers at perhaps 40 cents, and by the retailers to the American boy at 5 cents a piece. !N"ow it has to come here at about 39 cents landed, and from 39 to 60 cents is not margin of profit in this country in handling a pocketknife like that, and therefore it has affected it. I am sorry for it, sorry for the American boy, who can not be huuibugged and fooled. As Barnum, says we like to be humbugged, and to enable that boy to buy that knife for 5 cents I am willing to see it go on the free list. It has no value at all, except on the outside — it is only the appearance of a knife. The price to consumers is practically the same, and I was informed by an imijorter yesterday he could imjjort T H 27 418 METALS. from Germany a duplicate of anything at the price rnling before the McKiiiley bill. Now, it can not be done of Sheffield, they are higher 10 per cent value than before the ]\IcKinley bill, and not on so low a for- eign value as before. I mention this little illustration of fact that the foreigner pays the tax so far as the German goods are concerned, and as far as the Shefiield goods are concerned we probably divide with them. This knife [exhibiting same] shows a higher class of work, and as it is Columbus year I would like for you to examine it carefully. This knife cost $3.92 a dozen ; the material is 42 cents, and the labor is $3.50 1-10, showing about 89 per cent labor. K^ow, not to take up your time, I will bring it down to this. In all the time I have employed men I have never had a strike or a labor diiBculty. If anything is to be said on that question the boys are invited to come to me one by one, each man, and he states his views, they think it over, and we set- tle it. Mr. PATrrE. Your laborers generally own their homes ? Mr. Bradley. Tes, sir ; they built sixty homes within the last three years in our village ; nice little cottages, indeed. We have increased our labor nearly double; we have scoured that whole valley, charcoal pits, mountains, and every otlier place, to get American boys to go to work there. We have about doubled our products and number of workmen, and we pay, as I say, for skilled workmen as high as from $2.25 to $4 a day; that is, they earn it by the piece; 90 per cent of our j)ay roll is piece work. The men take them out by the gross, whether ten gross or a dozen, and they use their own tools, and have their place in the mill, and they earn these wages entirely by energy, skill, and industry. Mr. Payne. Is there any export of American pocket cutlery ? Mr. Bradley. No, I think not ; no, sir. I will say if the change of duty is conservative and moderate, there will be very little change, if any, in the condition of our business and workmen ; if the change is radical, it is purely a question of labor. My boys understand, it and they will come in and smoke a cigar, and see the other men, and talk it over, and they understand that the wages are to be less ; and there is all there is to the question of protection and question of revenue. You may take all the essays and orations and speeches about the tariff for revenue and protection, and it comes down to just simply one thing : Can you make these goods and compete with the people who make them abroad, and if not, why not. Aud if you can not, it is no fault of your location or mill, or your facilities mechanically; it is simply one thing, and that is the difference we pay the men in this country compared with what workmen are paid abroad. I have that from practical ex- perience, and not from consular reports; and it is a fact that a radical reduction of duty means a radical reduction of wages. I want to refer to one point — Mr. Eockwell, ha^^e you got Mr. EUery Anderson's proposed tariffl I am serious about it, and it will take me just about five minutes. I mention this simply because it was mailed to the trade of this country, to the jobbers and dealers and others, and people who are not versed in tariff' matters, in looking the bill over, might suppose they are going to buy any article for just ex- actly the difference we reduce the duty. I have simply to deal with the question of pocketknives. This proposed bill says that the im- portation of penknives in 1892 was $704,480 in value. That is cor- rect. It also says the duty was ad valorem $90.75; that is correct; and that $1339,304 was the duty collected. That is correct. Now, it makes POCKET CUTLERY. 419 tlie duty 25 per cent ad valorem, and says from the importation of last year the revenue derived therefrom would be $176,000 instead of $639,- 304, and that is correct. It then goes on and gives the opinion that there will be $2,500,000 of pocketknives of foreign value imported in 1894 should this proposed bill become a law. Now, that is a mistake. We have shown you, and you will prove them from the iigures of the Bureau of Statistics of the Government, that the importation, and with the product of our mills combined, placed at the foreign value, is only about $1,740,000, 1 think. Now, these people — and I speak with re- spect; I see among them men who stand as distinguished men in mat- ters of economics, and I am merely stating it as a fact and offering no criticisms whatever — but how can they expect the American consumers to use only foreign goods, and then increase their consumption 50 per cent, and close every mill in the United States 1 It is the fear of such legislation as that that has brought me before the committee; but for that, gentlemen, I would not have taken up your time. For your courtesy, Mr. Chairman and gentlemen of the committee, I am obliged. Mr. BuECKiNEiDaE. How long has your concern been manufacturing? Mr. Bkadley. Since 1852. It began as a cooperative concern, the workmen combining together with a little money, and they gradually worked up the business chiefly by contributions from their wages. In fact, the other mill of our town is the same way. Mr. Breckinridge. I observe we export some cutlery to foreign countries; Brazil for instance? Mr. Bradley. Yes. Mr. Breckinridge. Venezuela? Mr. Bradley. Yes. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you sell any particular class of goods to those countries'? Mr. Bradley. We do not in pocketknives. So far as those goods are concerned, there are certain steel table cutlery with iron handles, cheap goods, which go there. There is an excellent quality of steel put in them, and with the low cost of labor we are able to export those to the South American countries. Mr. Payne. This is table cutlery? Mr. Bradley. Yes, sir; but what goes there chiefly is hatchets, axes, cane knives, and the heavy class of cutlery. Of course, in the distinction of our department everything that is an edged tool is classed as cutlery. Mr. Breckinridge. Not in exports; they are separated. Mr. Bradley. In the later classifications? Mr. Breckinridge. As far back as 1863 arid 1870. Mr. Bradley. I think then cutlery was kept separate from edged tools. Mr. Breckinridge. You do not export any cutlery, then? Mr. Bradley. Not pocketknives. Mr. Breckinridge. I see we export a little all over the world. Mr. Bradley. We have sold a little to Canada, but it has been more curiosity, I think, than anything else. Mr. Breckinridge. This table cutlery of which you speak is steel- bladed metal handles. That is rather a modern contrivance, is it not? Mr. Bradley. It has been largely manufactured, sir, within the last four years. 420 METALS. KlSriVES. (Paragraph 105.) STATEMENT OF GEOEGE C. HATCH, OF BRIDSEPOET, COITO., AS TO THE COST OF POCKETKNIVES. In Germany the cost for making 2 dozen knives, which is an average day's work, is 70 cents, and the men workiug make from $4 to $5 a week, averaging fourteen hours a day. The same work here costs us •§2.20, and the men make from $12 to $18 per week, averaging ten hours a day. This is tlie relative cost of what is called the cutler's work. For the grinding and finishing the best men in Germany make from $8 to $10 a week, working an average of sixty-three hours per week. Our men here on the same work average from $14 to $23 a week, work- ing fifty-eight hours. I have said nothing here in reference to mate- rial, as that, relatively speaking, costs about the same. As near as I can make out the relative cost of grinding and finishing is, Germany, 24 cents; here, 56 cents. I have figured the total cost of labor in Germany and here, and as near as I can figure it it stands, Germany 68 cents as against $1.66 here on a single dozen knives. This is paying no attention to material or cost of manufacture or anything. Tt is merely jus^. the exact figures to-day for labor, and if anything the cost here is more than what I have made it. I have taken merely one knife and figured through on that knife, taking what our labor cost is and the labor cost of the same knife in Germany. ■ Of course, different patterns would vary this more or less. I find it to be a positive fact that knives that we sell at $3.40, our lowest figure, a knife the same size and in every way supposed to be the same, is bought in Germany at $1.30 per dozen. I would also mention that as a matter of protection to labor what are commonly called jack- knives should receive more of a protection in the way of a duty than the finer quality of knives called penknives. The reason of this is that a 4-bladed knife with pearl handle coming in under the same percent-, age of duty as a jackknife would have the benefit of the difference in cost between the wood covering of the jackknife and the price of pearl, as the labor is all in the other part of the knife, and to cover the same percentage of labor on a jackknife would require more of a duty than on the higher-priced knife using shell, ivory, pearl, and stag. I might add that pocketknives are an article easily transported, and the stock in 1 dozen two-bladed knives does not at the most amount to over 35 or 46 cents; all the rest of the cost is labor. I have ascertained the number of times that the parts of a two-bladed knife and the knife itself are handled is over 2,000, and that the blades in one dozen knives are handled over 700 times. The character of the work is such that it is not possible to utilize machinery. We here are far in advance of any other factory, so far as I know, in the manufacture of pocketknives, and the character of the work on a great many of the parts is such that it can not be done by machinery. I might say that so far as the cost of material goes, in comparison with Germany, I think that in some respects we get ours cheaper. The only matter in question between us and them as to the cost of production is labor. If we could get our labor as cheap as it is there we would make our knives just as cheap in every respect. RAZORS AND RAZOR BLADES. 421 RAZORS a:hd razor blades. (Paragraph 165.) STATEMENT OF J. E. TOREEY, TREASUREE OF THE J. E. TOEEEY EAZOB COMPANY. We ask that the existing tariff law, so far as it relates to razors, be allowed to remain as it now is, viz, razors and razor blades, finished or unfinished, valued at less than $4 per dozen, $1 per dozen; valued at $4 or more per dozen, $1.75 per dozen. And in addition thereto, on all the above razors and razor blades, 30 per cent ad valorem. We ask to have this protection continued because of the great differ- ence in wages paid to razor-makers in this and foreign countries. An average difference of more than three to one, when the furnishing of tools, shoproom, etc., is considered. We ask for the greatest duty on the lowest grade of razors, because a low grade of work always calls for a low-priced workman, and against the competition of this low-priced foreign workmen we require the most protection. Mu'ch has been said by the importers about foreign razors costing $1 per dozen in England, and even less. They claim that all such razors are prohibited by the present tariff. We maintain that it is for the best interest of this country that they should be prohibited: they are trashy imitations of razors, absolutely worthless for use, and never bear the name of a responsible manufacturer. We can show from foreign manufacturers' price lists, and from our own 12 years' experience in competition in this market with foreign razors, that the lowest priced razor sent to this country by a responsible maker such as. Butcher, Wostenholm, or Eodgers, costs in England 6 shillings, or $1.50 per dozen. This is the lowest priced razor thab were cognize as suit- able for shaving. All below that price are worthless imitations of razors unfit for use. To-day the above English razor, duty paid, costs the importer in New Tork (who often proves to be the manufacturer himself) less than 25 cents each, and sells to the consumer at 50 cents each, leaving a profit of 100 per cent to be divided between the importer and dealer, which would seem to be an ample margin. In 1880, when we commenced business, a full concaved razor, ground on a 2-inch stone, was selling to the retail dealers at $18 per dozen, and even more. To-day, notwithstanding the increase in tariff duty, that same quality of razor is selling to same trade at $12 per dozen. This reduction in price we claim is a direct result of home competi- tion, brought into existence by the protective tariff'. And we submit that with the present facilities for production in this country, and the strong competition which necessarily follows, the present rate of duty does not and can not increase the price of even cheap razors to the consumer, but it does guarantee to the poor man a good razor for 50 cents that he can shave with without torture. Eegarding the second clause of the present tariff law, razors at $4 or more per dozen, $1.75 specific and 30 per cent ad valorem, we have to say: Our competition on this class of goods (full concave) is from Germany, where the workmen labor eleven hours per day, and at less than one-third what we pay for same grade of work. A competent razor- grinder in Germany gets from $5 to $10 per week, and, as in^ Eng- land, the workmen as a rule are obliged to furnish their own power, grindstones, and all other tools, which virtually reduces his wages full 422 METALS. 30 per cent more. In this country men labor but ten hours, and all necessary tools and power are provided by the manufacturer. In closing I desire to add, the J. K. Torrey Kazor Company, of Worcester, Mass., incorporated in 1880, are the oldest existing razor manufacturers in the United States. We have invested in our plant more than $100,000 and employ about 100 workmen. There are in this country four other manufacturers, whose combined product about equals ours. We estimate from best obtainable statis- tics that fully 33 per cent of the razors consumed in this country to-day are of home manufacture. And we know if undisturbed by tariff changes the razor manufacturers in this country will soon supply the whole market, and, while keeping up wages, continually reduce the price, as we have done in the past. For thirteen years we have struggled against the greatest obstacle of competition from low-priced foreign goods, and thus far have been unable to sell our razors at a living profit to the largest dealers; but at great expense we have sent out our representatives to the smaller trade to which we have sold in small lots, and gained a reputation for good work and established the fact, beyond question, as good razors can be made in this country as anywhere in the world. As about 85 per cent of the value of a razor consists in the wages paid to labor, it is obvious that any material change in the tariff at this time must seriously affect the workmen, as we know the cost of razors can be reduced in no other item than labor. We feel confident that when you consider this matter you will read- ily see the justice of the caae and grant our request that the law of 1890 remain as it is, and thereby enable the people of this country to sup- ply themselves with razors of their own production. FILES. (Paragraph 168.) Keakney & Foot Company, New Yorlc, September 11, 1893. SiE : Regarding flies of American manufacture, they should be prop- erly put in three classes — namely, files for mechanical uses, files for jewelers' and silversmiths' uses, and rasps for blacksmiths' or farriers' uses. Considering the first and last classification ; the concern of which I am president is largely interested, being one of the principal produ- cers and employing 370 hands at the present time in their manufacture. I stand on record concerning this industry which my company repre- sents as having asked for a moderate reduction when Mr. Mills, of Texas, was framing liis tariff bill. Since that time for one or two special reasons I have thought best to revise my opinion as to whether it would be advisable or not to make a reduction in the duty on these goods. My principal reason is that while these goods made by special machinery, invented and patented by home talent, enabled the manufacturer to successfully compete against the cheap labor of foreign markets, since that time, through expiration of patents and the sale of rights to foreign companies, there has been quite a large introduction of these machines into England, Switzerland, and Germany, and in fact all points where files are manufactured, and to the writer's certain knowledge, within FILES. 423 six months, no less than three or four large manufacturers from Eng- land and Switzerland have been in this market for the latest inventions for manufacturing flies cheaply. With these inventions and the low price of labor, too, they would to a great extent demoralize the business of this country if now permitted to come into the markeb with any great reduction from the present duties. For this reason I would re- spectfully submit that to make the reduction on tiles 10 inches and upward of over 20 per cent below the present duty would be a direct injury to an established industry whose production amounts to several millions a year. While on the subject of the industry covering flies for mechanical uses, I would also say that horse rasps are also manufac- tured under the same head and by the same companies, although prac- tically a special branch of the business. The duty on these should be governed by the duty on above-mentioned goods. Files for jewelers^ uses. — Under this heading I can write with special fairness, as the company of which I am president does not manufacture this class, nor are they manufactured by any company in competition with our line of manufacture, except the Nicholson File Company, of Providence, E. I. Up to within the last ten years, flies for jewelers' and silversmiths' purposes and die sinkers' tools were all imported, there being no established industry in this country, but the ISTicholson File Company have undertaken the manufacture of these goods and with marked success. There have also sprung up in other sections of the country, principally in Philadelphia and Brooklyn, smaller manu- facturers, who are to-day producing this class of goods and making an article which competes in every way with the better brands of imported flies. As these smaller concerns develop the business, where formerly making flies by hand, through the inventive genius peculiar to Ameri- cans, there have been machines invented which cheapen the cost of these flies and are building up a valuable industry in the country. To in any way reduce the duty covering these small flies, which cover all sizes 10 inches and under, would be a direct blow to an industry to a certain extent in the formulative state, and which for several years must be fostered and protected. It would mean the ruin to the business and the loss of capital at present invested. I would, there- fore, recommend that no change in the duty on flies 10 inches and under should be made, but if it is necessary to make some reduction, that this should not exceed over 10 per cent less than the present duty imposed. GENERAL INFORMATION OF VALUE TO THE COMMITTEE IN FORMING AN OPINION. Taking the opposite view of this question, as to what the committee owes to the dealer and consumer, to insure a saving to the consumer, I desire to say that in 1871 1 represented a concern in this country, hav- ing full charge of the business, who were large importers of flies for mechanical uses, and it is a matter of book record that at that time a 12-inch file cost the dealer, and only the buyer of large quantities, the net price of $5.40 per dozen. Up to that time the foreign flies con- trolled the market. To-day, through American ingenuity and inven- tiveness and home competition, the consumer can now purchase the same flle at from $2 to $2.50 per dozen, net, and were it not that the foreign manufacturer has the advantage of using several American patents which succeeded in giving these results, in relying on the foreign market for files, this country would stUl be paying fuUy 100 per 424 METALS. cent over the market price. These are facts that I am stating, and as facts go to prove that a moderate protection to an American industry in its infancy has resulted in a large benefit to the consumer, and also that though this may not apply now to large files for mechanical uses, 10 inches and upward, as a reason for their protection, it certainly does apply to small files, 10 inches and under, which I have cited as now being manufactured in this country but in the manufacture of which my company is not interested. Wages. — To offset the difference in wages paid to mechanics and laborers in the production of files in this country and in the production of files in foreign countries, I would say that, taking the average wages paid in our works, employing from 370 to 400 hands during the past year, including boys of 16 years to mechanics at $3.50 a day, the wages average about $1.67 a day for every person on our payroll. It is only necessary for me to call your attention to the fact that in England for the principal part of the work on large files 75 cents a day would be a fair average per capita for labor, while in Germany, where both large and small files are manufactured, from 40 to 50 cents a day would be high wages. Consequently, a moderate reduction would react in a very large reduction in price of labor and a consequent upsetting of values. Eatc material. — To the file manufacturer raw material is represented in bar steel rolled to exact sizes for use in the manufacture of files of all shapes. When such steel as is used in this manufacture was im- ported from England (very little file steel being made in this country) the price varied from 10 to 14 cents a pound. To-day, through home competition, the price varies from 4 to 6 cents per pound,'and such is the fact that if by an act of Congress should an export business be estab- lished in files, by which the steel could be imported into this country and on custom-house oath reexported in files, thereby obtaining for the manufacturer of files a practical remittance of all duties, no manufac- turer of files could afford to use this steel in comparison with home prices even with this rebate allowed. Consequently there will be no possibility of reducing the cost of producing files by a corresponding reduction in the cost of raw material in the shape of bar steel through the removal of duties on same. In conclusion, I would respectfully submit to your body that any radical change in duties on files would be a direct injury to the capital invested and to the labor employed in manufacture of files. But if a reduction is made, it should not exceed 20 i^er cent b.elow the present duties on 10 inches and upward, nor 10 per cent below the duties on 10 inches and under. Yours, respectfully, James D. Foot.- SnOTGUN"S. (Paragraph 170.) Ithaca Gtjn Coimpany, Itliaca, If. Y., September 14, 1893. Sir: We desire to call your attention to a comparatively new indus- try in this country, that of the manufacture of sporting shotguns. This industry is peculiar in that so large a part of the cost of the article is represented by labor, about 60 per cent being for labor per- HORSENAILS. 425 formed in the factory and about 25 per cent for labor upon material and supplies made in our own country and used in the industry. (Gun bairels in the rough, not being made in this country, are imported duty free.) A number of large factories are already running in this country, two more just starting, all of whom are obliged to employ the best of skilled labor at great expense. These industries would be destroyed if the tariif was reduced, and we pray, therefore, that it may be left as it is, since it is now much less than the diflerence in the price of labor here and other countries from which sporting guns are imported. Yours, truly, Ithaca Gun Company. FoEWiOH, Conn., September 16, 1893. Deae Sie : The undersigned companies, being largely interested in the manufacture of revolvers, shotguns, and rifles, liaving invested capital here amounting to about $200,000, and employing some 450 men, with a pay roll of about $20,000 per month, would respectfully petition your committee that in such revision of the present tariff as you may deem proper you will give due regard to the facts which we beg leave to present. JBy importing guns "in parts" the specific duty has been avoided, thereby reducing to that extent the protection which was intended under the present law, leaving only the ad valorem duty of 45 per cent. This is certainly a moderate tariff on goods the cost of which is fully 75 per cent in labor and not over 25 per cent in material. We would urge upon you the importance to this industry of main- taining at least the present duty. We feel constrained to urge this quite as much in the interest of labor as in that of capital. The com- panies here will endeavor to adjust their business to any rate of duty which may be decided upon, but should there be any reduction from the above rate it will of necessity result in a corresponding reduction of wages. It would also without doubt materially interfere with the manufacture of our class of goods in this country, as it would admit firearms of foreign make which would take the place of those made here. EespectfuUy, The Hopkins & Allen Mfg. Co., By Chas. W. Hopkins, Treasurer. The W. H. Davenport FmBABMS Co., By Frank Ulmer, President. The Crescent Firearms Co., By H. H. Gallup, President. IIORSENAILS. (Paragraph 174.) AUSABLE HORSENAIL CoMPANT, New Yorlc, September 22, 1893. Sit?: The making of horsenails by machinery is absolutely an Ameri- can industry. I do not think that any machines for this purpose were ever invented by anyone except American citizens. The process is 426 METALS. now so perfect that nails ready for driving are produced of a superior quality than could be made and pointed by hand and at a very much lower price. The horsenail machines now in operation in Germany and other Euoropean states were mostly built in this country, and are now operated by the cheaj) labor of those countries. Before the intro- duction of American machinery, horsenails were forged by hand and the pointing was done by the consumer in his own shop. Such nails cost the users 50 to 60 cents per pound. After the introduction of nails made by machinery on American machines, the price to the consumer was 12 to 18 cents per pound. The total annual production of horse nails in this country is from 6,000 to 7,000 tons, the cost of which, at factory, is about $2,000,000 to $2,500,000 per year. Fully 50 to 60 per cent of this cost represents labor. Of course if the duty were removed the manufacturers in our country would be compelled to reduce the wages of their operators to a point where it would equal the cheap labor of Europe. This, of course, would bring hardships to many a home. The treasurer of an Eastern company, which company has a factory in London, says that girls getting 80 cents a day here are hired in London at 20 cents per day, and for exactly the same kind and amount of work. We thiuk that the horsenail industry can stand a reduction in the duty of 1 to IJ cents per pound, making the dutj^ 2J or 3 cents per pounds. There are no combinations or trusts in our industry, so that the market is open and free to domestic comjjetition, which is active and strong. Trusting that your committee \vill give this matter their careful con- sideration, and awaiting your acknowledgment of this letter by return mail, if possible, we remain, truly, yours, AusABLE Horsenail Company, By A. Bussing, President. WOOD SCREWS. (Paragraph 184.) New York, September 19, 1893. Sirs : Eepresenting a very large majority of the wood-screw manu- facturing industry in the United States, I desire to lay before you cer- tain facts relating to the import tariff duties upon wood screws and their consequent effects upon the wood-screw industry of this country. There are fifteen organized and well-recognized manufacturers of wood screws in the United States, located in the States of Massachu- setts, Ehode Island, Connecticut, Pennsylvania, Ohio, and Illinois, using an invested capital of more than $6,000,000, employing more than 4,000 persons, and producing and marketing all the wood screws this country now consumes; and at prices in the market, averaging for the past fifteen years less than 40 per cent of the average prices prevaiHng at any previous like period. It is a well-recognized fact with all wood-screw manufacturers that to provide for the daily product of each 1,000 gross of screws of aver- age sizes, capital invested in permanent plant, machinery, tools, fix- tures, and working, means to the extent of $100,000 must be provided, and that the most successful manufacturers are unable to manufacture and market at average market prices, a quantity of wood screws WOOD SCREWS. 427 "?.qual in value to the capital invested in less than two years of time; that is, it requires the market product of two years' time in which to turn the capital once over. Iron and steel wire drawn to required sizes is the raw material of the screw manufacturers. The average cost of this wire in this country to the screw manufacturers is about 3^ cents per pound; in England, If cents per pound; in Germany, 1^ cents per pound; in France, IJ cents per pound; in Belgium, 1^ cents per pound. Other incidental supplies, as oil, fuel, soda, gas, etc., bear about relative pro- portions. Investigations recently made in the various foreign countries re- garding comparative wages paid upon similar processes in manufacture of screws show that where the manufacturers in this country pay $1 in England is paid 52 cents, in Germany is paid 46 cents, in Prance is paid 47 cents, and in Belgium is paid 43 cents. In Norway and Italy wages are still lower. My own company, being interested in works near Hamburg, has been able to verify this comparison. Many foreign makers use the same pattern machinery as is used in this country, and the speed of the machine is governed by the power applied, and controls the rapidity of the product. In this country we are certainly not ahead of our foreign friends in the production or ap- plication of power for rapidity of production; consequently, one day's wages of foreign labor will produce as many screws as the same time of American labor. The report of the chief of the Bureau of Statistics for the year end- ing June 30, 1892, does not show the importation of any wood screws in 1892. The probable cause of there having been no importation is in the fact that the manufacturers of England, France, Germany, Belgium, and Italy have been joined in an international association, and have held market prices much higher than formerly. This, however, can not long continue, as, through differences between the various makers, there has, within the last few months, been large reductions made in their prices. A further reason may be found in the moderately low rates prevailing in this country. There are more than 600 sizes, lengths, and kinds of wood screws in the regular assortment, ranging from one-quarter inch, No. 0, to six inches, No. 30, each size and length of different list price, and each kind siibject to different discounts from list prices. The detailed knowledge and labor necessary to justly fix an ad valorem duty on each invoice of screws, the prices current frequently changing, would be so great that a wide door would be open to errors and undervalua- tions. Under the present classification, with specific duties, it is only necessary to determine within which of the four classes the imijortation may come, by length, and the weight included in each class of lengths, to correctly fix the duties thereon. A further danger to the revenue would be found in foreign makers shipping to agents in this country if the rates were ad valorem instead of specific. Eeferring again to the report of the chief of the Bureau of Statistics in regard to imported merchandise, the report for the year ending June 30, 1890, p. 65, shows importations carrying an average ad valorem rate of duty of 26.55 per cent on the total valuation. This was under the law of 1883, while in the report for the year ending June 30, 1891, p. 85, are shown importations for 1891 under the same law of 1883, carrying an average ad valorem of 47 per cent. Tlie report for the year ending June 30, 1891, p. 85, shows, also, importations for the year 1891, under rates fixed by the law of October 6, 1890, carrying an 428 METALS. averasre ad valorem rate of duty of 24.2 per cent. These results, wliile undoubtedly exact for the speciflc quantities of each size and price whicli were included in the importations stated, might be somewL«at varied either way by a different assortment of sizes and prices. As a matter of fact, the statistical statements do not show a fair average per centum of tariff rates upon average practical invoices of screws, but a rate per centum considerably less than the law really provides. The imports in question undoubtedly consisted of the lesser weights per gross in each of the tariff' clauses. The money value of screws per pound in- creases in an inverse ratio to their size. Tims, in the importations of 1891, in the 12-cent clause, 77.76 pounds were valued $30, while in the 6-cent clause 2,935.58 pounds were valued $303 — the one being of value 38.58 cents per pound and the other only 10.32 cents per pound. A practical illustration of the average per centum of duties on wood screws is found, as follows : From the 250 sizes take 24 sizes from the 14-cent clause, 42 sizes irom the 10-cent clause, 56 sizes from the 7-cent clause, 78 sizes from the 5-cent clause; total, 200. Upon the average of these sizes the duties show protection of 77J per cent on foreign export price which, added to the export price, gives 14.1 per cent over American cost of production. Consider, if you please, gentlemen, that our raw materials — wire and general mill supplies — very largely the product of American labor, are the finished product of other manufacturers and producers, and their cost to us is quite double that paid for similar materials abroad; that the necessary waste in material in converting wire into finished screws is not less than 37 per cent of the original quantity by weight, and by reason of the excess cost of the wire this waste is double in cost as against foreign makers, and that the wages paid by foreign makers to workmen engaged upon the same class of work, as shown by the above comparative table, averages only 47 per cent of the price paid in this country. I have asked your attention to the necessity for speciflc duties on wood screws as against ad valorem duty, by reason of the immense variety of sizes, kinds, and prices, and the varying trade discounts on the different kinds; and we are willing to admit that, with low prices rulingintheAmerican market, thepresentrates ofduty are prohibitory, and not in any sense a "tariff' for revenue," but they are better than that; they make possible the direct employment of more than 4,000 American citizens at liberal wages, and contribute to the support, education, and well-being of a much greater number, and indirectly contribute to the greater ability in home revenue— municipal, state, and national — in the various places and States wherein located. It is not to the pecuniary interest, nor the desire of employers, to reduce the wages of employ(Ss where margins of sale are suiftciently above cost of production to admit of continuance of good wages, but there is no margin of safety to the wood-screw manufacturers below the present duties, except it be found in reduced compensation to labor. We ask that the present classifications and specific rates be con- tinued. A "tariff for revenue" upon articles manufactured at home in quan- tities sufficient to fully supply the whole market of this country means to the manufacturer cither a division of his business with foreigners, and consequent reduction in his aliility to employ labor, or the entire suppression of his industry in favor of the foreigner, and entire lack ALUMINUM. 429 of employment to his former employ6s in an industry which, from long employment therein, has become to them their trade occupation. In this latter event the American manufacturer has left to him but two alternatives — either abandon his business or transfer it to a foreign country, where, with cheap material and labor, he can take his chances with other foreign makers in supplying alien goods to American con- sumers. Our mills are now on short time, with reduced help, or wholly idle. The invested capital for the time is nonproductive, and labor stands idle, asking for work when there is none to be given. We wait the action of Congress upon the tariif question. Eespectfully submitted, in behalf of the wood-screw manufacturers of the United States, by M. J. Woodruff, President of Russell & Erwin Manufacturing Company, of Neic Britain, Conn., and d3 to 47 Chambers Street, New York. ALUMIlSrUM. (Paragraph 186.) STATEMENT OF MR, AIFEED E. HUNT, OF THE PITTSBUEG EEDTTCTION COMPANY. Monday, September 18, 1893. Mr. Chairman : I appear before you to present a plea for aluminum. You will recollect that in 1881 there was not a pound made in this coun- try, and all that has been made in these years since has been the result of the work of the infant industry in alnminum manufacture. I have a paper which I will read, which explains the whole matter. Mr. Hunt read the following paper: Pittsburg, Pa., September 18, ISOS. Hois'. Wm. L. Wilsox, Chairman Committee on Ways and Means, House of Representatives, Washington, D. C: Dear Sir: We -wonld respectfully submit the following facts regarding the manu- facture of aluminium and the arguments that we wish your committee would consider regarding the retention of the present tariff upon aluminium. Aluminium was very properly placed upon the free list in the tariff provisions con- tained in the act of March 3, 1883, for the reason that it was not manufactured upon a commercial scale in the United States at that time, nor was there any prospect of it being -manufactured in this country in the near future. Prior to the commercial production of aluminium in the United States, the metal had only been manufac- tured abroad by expensive chemical processes. The Eeport on Mineral Products of the Department of the Interior, for the years 1880 to 1891,* puts the value of the 3,000 pounds of inijjorted aluminium used in the United States in the year 1886 at $27,000, or a rate of $9 per pound. The same report puts the value of the 150,000 pounds of aluminium of domestic manufacture in the year 1891 at $100,000, or a valuation of only 66f cents per pound. This reduction in the cost and selling price of aluminium aud the enlargement of the use from 3,000 pounds in 1888 to 150,000 pounds in 1891, was due entirely to the inventions of Charles M. Hall and others, and the etforts of those who have devel- oped these processes for the manufacture of aluminium by electricity — methods which are now being universally used throughout the world for the manufacture of every pound of aluminium now put commercially upon the market. The production of aluminium in the year 1893 will reach 250,000 pounds; the valua- tion remaining about the same, from 65 to 75 cents per jiound. 'United States Geological Survey Tabulated Eeport, pulilished under the author- ity of the Department of the Interior, dated Washington, October 1, 1892. 430 METALS. The quality of the metal produced has been constantly improved and the metal is now being manufactured regularly with over 99 per cent purity. In other words, by the improved methods of manufacture the metal has been, in quality, brought up in a ooiiimercial way to the purity of copper, and far superior to that of lead, zinc, aud other kindred metals, during the past few years. Tlio development already made in the manufacture of aluminium in this country has only been rendered possible by the protection given by the 15 cents per pound duty, for the selling price abroad during most of the last two years has been as low as, and for a portion of the time has been actually lower, than the cost of manxifao- ture in America. Due to this tariff, the manufacturers in this country have developed the business and reduced the selling price of the metal, as shown above. As a matter of fact, the American manufacturers, enjoying the protection of the tarift', ha-^-e constantly improved on the methods of manufacture, to the end that the price of aluminium has been regularly lowered. Their improved methods of manu- facture have been immediately adopted, without any expense for development, by our foreign competitors, who, by means of their cheaper labor and materials, have been able to undersell the American market. The policy of the Pittsburg Reduction Company has been to Ipwer the selling price of aluminium as far as possible and thus allow its introduction into new and varied uses. This concern has always sold the aluminium they have manufactured at a very close margin, has invested a large amount of capital and their labor for the past five years, and as yet have paid no dividends, having invested their profits in ajiparatus for increasing their production. Briefly stated, the method of manufacture of aluminium by the Hall process, used by the Pittsburg Reduction Company, consists in the reduction of the purified ore, alumina, dissolved in a molten bath of fluoride salts by the means of an electric current. The process can only be carrried on by the investment of a very large sum of money in plant and machinery, and the materials used in its manufacture are themselves largely expensive finished products, some of which there is at present a considerable duty on. The cost of production of aluminium by this process consists very largely in Labor and skill required in the work, and its raw materials are principally themselves manufactured articles. In this, aluminium is in the same category as the highly finished products of iron and steel, and it dift'ers from copper, zinc, nickel, aud other similar metals whose cost largely depends upon the rarity and consequent high price of the ores containing the metal. Aluminium is present everywhere; nearly one- twelfth of the earth's crust is composed of it, and every clay bank contains from 15 to 20 per cent of the metal. It took not only years of toil and experimenting to obtain successful results, but as well all the items that are chargeable to labor and skill in manufacture, as at present carried on, constitute at least 60 per cent of the total cost of the production of the metal. We do not ask for a prohibitive duty against foreign manufacturers, for the tariff of 15 cents per pound is barely sufiicient, and in the past has not been sufficient, to balance the difference in cost of manufacture. We simply ask for the present duty to be retained to put us on an even footing with the European manufacturers, whose labor costs are less than one-half of these costs to us, and whose costs lor materials are much less owing to the much higlier development of chemical manu- factures and cheaper cost of labor in Europe than in America, and whose costs for power have been as well much cheaper than ours. Without this tariff foreign com- petition will be able to ruin our business. Aluminium is one of the lightest known metals, being but one-fourth as heavy as silver, bulk for bulk. It is of a silver-white color, and is susceptible of being polished and finished in many ways. It has so far been used largely for luxuries, as, for instance, in fancy goods articles and in ornamental work. It will be to the interest of our Government to foster an industry that is likely to produce war materials for our Government later on. The oxide of aluminiuin, used as the ore in the manufacture of the metal, is found in the mineral liauxite, in the States of Georgia, Alabama, and Arkansas only, in the United States ; and in these States recent discoveries have shown it to be present in large quantities, and the increase in manufacture of aluminium will bring a large and paying industry to these Southern States. The Pittsburg Reduction Company were obliged|to purchase the oxide of aluminium for their first work abroad, there being large deposits of bauxite in Ireland, the south of France, and in (iermany ; and the chemical manufacturers of this country were obliged to import all their ore for the manufacture of alumina, which, added to their more expensive labor costs, made their selling price such that it was much cheaper for us to purchase alumina abroad. In fact, there was no concern in the United States then able to supply us with the amount of alumina which we required in the years 1888 and 1889 and the early part of 1890; and before the provisions of ALUMINUM. 431 the tariff act of October 1, 1890, American aluminium manufacturers ■were in the anomalous position of having to pay a duty of six-tenths of a cent per pound on the ore which they used, while the metal -which they produced was upon the free list. Tliis manifest injustice was removed by the tariff act of October 1, 1890. The imports of bauxite into the United States in the year 1889 were 28,94,5,674 pounds; in 1890, 27,503,730 pounds; in 1891, due to the very large replacement of the foreign bauxite by the bauxite from the States of Georgia and Alabama, the impor- tation dropped to 17,936,504 pounds, and in 1892 there was a further decrease to only 12,804,253 pounds. Witli the industries of the production of alumina and aluminium protected, this replacement of the foreign bauxites will increase very rapidly, as will also the pro- duction of bauxite from these Southern States, due to the enlarged demand for alum- inium. We would also call your attention to the fact that this duty of 15 cents per pound on aluminium is only equivalent to an ad valorem duty of 20 or at most 25 per cent on the selling price of the metal — a rate which we claim, due to the increased price of labor and skill'paid by us, is only equivalent to the increased cost to us of manu- facture of aluminium over that of our competitors who are manufacturing the metal abroad. We respectfully ask of your committee that they incorporate in the proposed new legislation regarding the tariff, provisions that the present duty of 15 cents per pound be retained upon ingot aluminum and alloys of which aluminum is the com- ponent part of chief value. And that a duty of 26 cents per pound lie substituted for the present ad valorem duty of 45 per cent (see section $15, Schedule C) upon rolled,, forged, or drawn bars, rods, plates, sheets, uire, pipe, tubing or castings of aluminum; or of alloys of which aluminum, is the component part of chief value. And that on manufactured articles or wares, not otherwise provided for, composed wholly or in part of alumi- num, and whether partly or wholly manufactured, the present duty of 45 per centum ad valorem be retained. Very respectfully, The Pittsburg Reduction Company, Alfked E. Hunt, President. Mr. Hunt. There has been a great difference in the price from 1886 up to 1890. In 1888 and 1889 the production was 10,000 pounds. Tlie development has been rapid. In Germany it is used for munitions of war and is being made for that purpose. In many places it is used for soldiers' equipments. The metal is well adapted for that purpose, being quite light. For that reason I wish to call the attention of the com- mittee to the importance of protecting an industry which is likely to furnish war materials to this Government. I will submit specimens of the mineral which we call bauxite. It is found largely in Georgia, Alabama, and Arkansas, which have furnished some 20,000,000 pounds of it. This shows the development of this industry. This is not only used for aluminium but is used in chemicals. Mr. BEECKiNRiDaB. What are your principal materials? Mr. Hunt. The ore is an aluminium ore. This ore is dissolved in various materials. This sample is the crude product. The carbon used is the carbon anode. It takes five bags to a pound of aluminium. Mr. Breckinrid&e. Is that the only item upon which you pay duty? Mr. Hunt. The ore is dutiable at 16 and there is a duty upon the carbon anode. The Chairman. Do you import your aluminium ore? Mr. Hunt. We have imported large amounts of aluminium ore, but within the last year or two we can get chemicals to produce it at about the same rate. Mr. Breckinridge. Tou produce it from bauxite? Mr. Hunt. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Can you produce it from clay? Mr. Hunt. It could be produced from clay, but not chemically free. Mr. Breckinridge. You do not procure aluminium from clay? Mr. Hunt. No, sir. That is a fallacious notion. It is popular, but not true. 432 METALS, Mr. Beeckhstridge. That was done for a while? Mr. Hunt. That was tried. Mr. Breckinridge. Can you state anything as to the way the tariff operates for your material ? Mr. Hunt. The cost of labor last year was heavy, about 40 per cent. Triolite comes cheaper. It is shipped from Greenland to Europe, and we procure it from England. Mr. Breckinridge. Is fluor spar on the free list? Mr. Hunt. Triolite and fluor spar are on the free list. These arti- cles are labor cost. Mr. Breckinridge. Carbon-anode is used in the process? Mr. Hunt. Yes, sir. The Chairman: What are the commercial uses of aluminium? Mr. Hunt. It is now largely used in replacing high grades of brass for ornamental work. It is used in naval architecture. The Chairman. Is it easily oxidized? Mr. Hunt. Yes, sir; it is oxidized in the same way that silver is. Mr. Turner. How does it withstand the action of salt water? Mr. Hunt. I have at the World's Fair a piece which has been on the side of a wooden vessel along with copper, and we find that copper corrodes more readily than aluminium. Mr. Turner. Is it capable of being tempered ? Mr. Hunt. I hope so; but we have not undertaken that, Mr. Turner. Its tensile strength is not great? Mr. Hunt. That is another one of the popular errors regarding the metal. It is soft. Its tensile strength is less than steel, and its weight is only about one-third that of steel, bulk for bulk. Section for section it is weaker than steel. Mr. Turner. Is it used much as an alloy? Mr. Hunt. It is used some as an alloy. Its use is growing. Mr. Turner. For what purpose? Mr. Hunt. Its greatest purpose is in quieting metals and making them solid. It is also used in this new nickeled steel, becouse it is with- out porosity. Mr. Bryan. Do I understand correctly that one- twelfth of the earth's surface is composed of aluminium? Mr. Hunt. Yes, sir; one-half of the clays and silicates in the ordi- nary clay bank is aluminium. Mr. Bryan. But there is no chemical way of separating the alumin- ium from the other matter? Mr. Hunt. No ; in comparison with the much easier way of getting it from the Southern States. You generally select pig iron from which to make iron. So have we. We use bauxite in making aluminium. ; Mr. Bryan. What is the cost of producing aluminium from clay? ' Mr. Hunt. The question would be much easier answered by saying, ! of course, that we produce aluminium iron more easily from bauxite than from clay. Aluminium ore costs us IJ cents a pound. We calculate to ' develop this manufacture of bauxite ourselves; and it is for that reason ■ we ask that this duty be taken off, in order to help us to develop this Southern bauxite. We intend to develop it quite largely. ' Mr. Turner. You would like to have the duty put on the bauxite? i Mr. Hunt. No, sir; that is our material. Mr. Turner. How much does it cost to make aluminium ore in that way, pound for pound 'I Mr. Hunt. It takes two pounds of this aluminium iron to make a pound of aluminium. * ALUMINUM. 433 Mr. TuENER. That costs 5 J cents'? Mr. Hunt. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. After that, it is just as easy to make aluminium of one kind as the other? Mr. Hunt. In other words, aluminium iron is aluminium made of clay or bauxite. Mr. Turner. So that the cost of making it from clay is simply 4 cents on the pound, or 8 cents on the pound of aluminium? Mr. Hunt. I would hardly put it that way. Mr. Turner. It costs 5 cents when made from bauxite, and 8 cents when made from clay 1 Mr. Hunt. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. After it reaches that point, it does not cost anything more to make it into aluminium 1 Mr. ' 1 [TNT. No, sir. Mr. Turner. So that making aluminium from clay usually costs only 4 cents more than making it from bauxite? Mr. Hunt. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. There has been a great reduction in the cost of alu- minium ? Mr. Hunt. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. What is it mostly used for? Mr. Hunt. It is being used largely iu obtaining electrical currents. Mr. Bryan. How long has your factory been in existence? Mr. Hunt. Since 1888. Mr. Bryan. Have you paid any dividends? Mr. Hunt. We have made dividends, but we have reinvested them, Mr. Bryan. What was the capital? Mr. Hunt. The capital has been the same all the time. Mr. Bryan. You have increased the capital stock? Mr. Hunt. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. The reinvestment has gone to increase the capital stock ? Mr. Hunt. Exactly. Mr. Bryan. What has the increase in the actual value been above what it was in 1888? Mr. Hunt. The first plant cost $20,000. We have now nearly $300,000 in the business. Mr. Bryan. How much have the profits been? Mr. Hunt. Twenty thousand dollars. Mr. Bryan. On how much capital? Mr. Hunt. Over $200,000. Mr. Bryan. You commenced with $20,000 and kept it up. Mr. Hunt. We have not made 5 per cent, and that has been made during the last year. The entire amount has been made within the last year, because it took time to develop the process and get into shape, and also to get the costs down by increasing the output. Mr. Bryan. The duty you seek of 25 and 20 per cent ad valorem? Mr. Hunt. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. That you would consider sufiicient? Mr. Hunt. No, sir. We have lost money by selling at rates which we were compelled to sell at in order to reach the trade. That rate is sufficient to-day. With development we hope to meet the question. We have not many salaries. Mr. Bryan. Do you think that there is a prospect of still further decreasing the cost of production? Mr. Hunt. Undoubtedly, but that decrease will be due to an In- XH 28 434 METALS. creased output, wliicli will decrease the general cost. If you give us this tariff for a reasonable time we will soon be in the position of Andrew Carnegie. Mr. Bkyan. There is some question as to his position. Mr. Hunt. We will be in his newspaper position. Mr. Betan. You do not mean to say that if this tariff is continued you will be as rich as he is 1 Mr. Hunt. I do not say that. I mean that we will be in such a strong position that we will not feel the necessity of a tariff for devel- opment. Mr. Turner. I have been asking, because this is a new industry, and I am interested in its jjrogress. I am glad to know that the differ- ence in the cost when it is made from clay and bauxite is so small, because where the supply of clay is inexhaustible it seems to me that it is promising. Mr. Hunt. We went down to this Southern district, and saw the enormous amount of bauxite, millions of tons, which can be mined economically and satisfactorily. Mr. Turner. Ton sell aluminium at about 60 or 70 cents, Mr. Hunt. It has been selling at about 70 cents. Mr. Turner. You are able to produce the bauxite? Mr. Hunt. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. Is it found in mountain regions'? Mr. Hunt. Ifc is found in great folds through a district like the Ap- palachian range, and it is about as inexhaustible as is the supply of iron ore in Michigan and the Lake region. It lies in great folds in large geological districts, running 70 or 80 miles wide, in the States of Ala- bama and Georgia. METAIi AND GOLD LEAF. (Paragraphs 190 and 197.) Gentlemen : We hereby present you with detailed description and comparative cost of the manufacture of gold leaf in the United States and Germany. The process of manufacture in the United States is generally as fol- lows: The manxifacturer starts out with absolutely pure gold, which is purchased either from the gold-refiner or of the United States assay office in the form of bars. This gold is then alloyed to the standard color commonly called extra deep gold, the alloy consisting of 12 grains of copper and 12 grains of silver to 1 ounce-of gold. This production is cast into bars and passed between rolls and lengthened until they become as thin as an ordinary silk ribbon. This ribbon is then cut into pieces 1 inch long, and then the process of beating begins. We might say here that each workman receives 50 pennyweights of this ribbon, for which he is responsible until the whole process of manufac- ture is completed. The beater places each piece of this 50 pennyweights (about 180 pieces) between leaves of manufactured paper, commonly called "cutch (3J inches square)," and beaten out to the edges of the same. These leaves of gold are then placed one upon the other and cut into quarters, this forming the first part of the beating. The second, consists .of placing these pieces between skins, commonly called "shoda" skins (which skins are manufuctuxed from the entrails of GOLD LEAP. 435 an ox aud are 4 inches square), beaten out of the edges, and the surplus gold being rubbed off so as to make each piece of the 180 pieces origi- nally cut off weigh 6 grains. This completes the second stage of the process, called "shoda" beating. The third and last stage consists of beating in molds. These molds are manufactured from the entrails of the ox, and are the same as the shoda in the second stage, except that they are newer, finer, and more delicate. These molds are 5 inches square, and hold 900 skins Each workman is furnished with three of these molds, and is person- ally responsible for their care. He begins this last process by clean- ing and preparing these molds by rubbing each skin with a hare's foot and a preparation of talc, baked and ground to a white powder ; after which these molds are put into a heated press and all the ex- cessive vapor or damp drawn from them. This process is very delicate, and requires judgment aud adaptation, and if improperly done is apt to spoil all the previous work. After pressing, each leaf of the shoda is taken separately, cut into quarters, and placed between the skins of each mold. Each mold is then covered by bands of parchment and beaten to the edges. This consists of beating one hour, then placing the mold in a warm press to keep the skins close together, then cooling in a cool press, and so on for four consecutive hours. This completes the heating process. These three molds are then passed to the girls, who take each leaf out of the mold separately, aud cut a square out of the center of 3| inches, placing the same into a book, holding 25 leaves, and the work is completed. And on completion we find we have about 4 packages of gold leaf, containing in all 2,000 leaves. The gold in each package weighs 4^ pennyweights. Thus we have : 4J pennyweights of gold in eacli package $4. 25 One man's labor on one package of gold leaf 1. 55 One cutter, at 2-J- cents per book (one package) '. 50 Melting, rolling, rent, selling expense 40 6. 70 Profit on one pack 30 7.00 The work of one man produces eight to nine packs of gold leaf per week. The process of manufacturing in Germany is somewhat different. Gold-beating is worked in blocks or teams, consisting of one or two men to several children, who are put to it at a very early age, and who average from twelve to thirteen hours per day. The cheapness of their labor must be acknowledged when we find it a fact that one pack of German gold leaf can be placed in this country, duty and all expense of transportation paid, at fi-om $6.80 to $7. » EespectfuUy, Charles Bricb, 262 West Thirty-ninth street, New York City. SiE: We beg to call your attention to the fact that the two firms who manufacture bronze powder in this country only place on the market a very small proportion of the bronze powders consumed. These firms never would have started to manufacture bronze powders if the 436 METALS. tariff at the time they commenced business (twenty-five years ago) had not been protection enough for them. The yearly consumption of bronze powders by wall-paper factories alone is about 1,300,000 pounds, and on this is paid a duty of 12 cents per pound, or $156,000. Not one pound of the bronze powders used by the wall-paper factories is of domestic manufa(;ture. There appears to be no just reason why consumers should be comx^elled to pay an ex- tremely high rate of duty on an article which is manufactured on such a small scale in this country. Bronze powder is really a raw material ; in itself it is not an article which can be consumed, excex)t for finishing and making thousands of articles marketable ; it is used in nearly every branch of industry to give articles a good and salable- appearance. We herewith submit a letter of Messrs. William Campbell & Co. (wall-paper manufacturers); this firm alone requires more bronze powders than the entire production of the two domestic manufacturers combined. I^he large quantity of bronze powders which the wall-i)aper manufacturers are compelled to use at an advance of 35 per cent over a former tariff (which was 15 per cent — now it is 12 cents per pound or 50 per cent) forces them to advance the prices of their products which are used for decorating the homes of the working classes, and these are the people who must pay the advance. W^e respectfully ask for a reduction of the duty on bronze powders ; as stated above, the former duty was 15 per cent ad valorem, which made the duty on the cheapest grade 3.6 cents per pound. Other wall-paper manufacturers will send their protests against this unjustly high tarift' direct to you. Tours, respectfully, T. BiESSisrEE, and others. William Campbell & Co., Neio York, September 13, 1893. Sir : We beg to invite the special attention of the Committee on Ways and Means to the exorbitant tariff which bronze powders and brocades are now subject to under the McKinley bill. There have never been any bronze powders or brocades manufactured in this country, except by a small institution, which simply ground up the refuse of imported goods, and there is no likelihood of there ever being, even should the tariff be advanced another 12 cents per pound, for the reason that we have not the metal nor anything else connected with its manufacture. Germany has been, and will be for years to come, the only place where these articles can be produced, and they are now supplying the whole world with the product. Fifteen per cent ad valorum (which was the rate of tariff charged prior to thepassageof the McKinley bill) in our judgment is ample to provide for our revenue, and we therefore beg your honorable body to place the tariff back to where it was before the passage of that most infaiuous McKinley bill. The damage already done by the passage of same will take many years to repair, and we trust it may be revised at an early date. Yours, respectfully, W, Campbell & Co, DUTCH METAL. 437 DUTCH METAL. (Paragrapli 190.) Kew Tore', Septemler 5, 1893. SiS: I beg to draw your atteation to an article on which the duty has been raised to a most enormous extent, and this, I believe, more by a mistake than intentionally. I refer to the article leaf metal, or Dutch metal, as it is to be found among the enumerated articles in the tariff. This "Dutch metal" was never manufactured here, but always im- ported. The rate of duty varied in the different tariffs. In the tariff bill of 1846 it was 20 per cent ad valorem, then 15 per cent, and for sev- eral years before the McKinley bill went into existence it was 10 per cent ad valorem. The last bill made the duty specific. It was pro- posed to fix it at 10 cents per pack of 1,000 leaves, but was finally passed at 8 cents per pack of 1,000 leaves. This "Dutch metal" comes in two different forms — either in boxes of 10,000 leaves, and is then called "schlag metal," or in the old form of packs of 2,520 leaves. Now take, for illustrating the monstrosity of the present tariff, an in- voice of, say, 10 boxes schlag metal and 50 packs Dutch metal j under the old tariff the duties would have been as follows : Marks. 10 boxes sch] ag metal, 10,000 leaves, at 36 marks 360. 00 50 pucks Dutch metal, at 6.50 marks 325.00 Total 685.00 At 23.80 cts $163.00 Old duty of 10 per cent ad valorem 16.30 Under the present tariff it will be that — 10 boxes ScUag metal, 10,000 leaves, equal to 100,000 leaves, new duty, at 8 cents per 1,000 leaves $80.00 50 packs Dutch metal, 2,520 leaves, equal to 126,000 leaves, at 8 cents per 1,000 leaves 100.00 Present duty 180.00 Difference between the old and now duty $104, or eleven times as much as formerly. As I stated before I believe there has been a mistake made. In the explanatory tariff bill of 1890, marked H. E. 9416, you will find on page 44, for paragraph 184, a note below, saying: "This is a change from ad valorem to specific rates .and is intended to be an equivalent." Equivalent, indeed! Arise in duty of 1,100 per cent! I wrote at the time of the passage of the act to our Senator, the Hon. Mr. Bvarts. He saw the mistake, but it was too late to do anything. Evidently Mr. McKinley intended to fix the duty at 8 cents per 10,000 leaves (10,000). Then it would have been about an equivalent with the old rate of duty. The article is not manufactured here. Under the exorbitant new duties it has been tried, butwitli very poor success. It is u.sed largely on cheap picture frames, etc., and therefore increases the prices for these articles unnecessarily to the poorer classes. Tours, respectfully, I. BiCKNEE. 438 METALS. GOLD LBAF. (Paragraph 197.) Friday, Septemler 15, 1S93. To tJie Committee on Ways and Means, Souse of Hepresentaiives: Gentlemen: We Ibeg your indulgence in the consideration of tlie present specific duties upon gold, silver, and metal leaf. It lias been our experience for more than forty years that we cannot compete against foreign manufacture without the assistance of a taritt'. Through want and privation we were driven to appeal to Congress to relieve the deplorable condition of our trade through foreign competition, and after mauy ear- nest appeals, and the most convincing proof and statistics, we succeeded in being par- tially relieved. The relief was a blessing to thousands in our trade, for which we have been ever grateful. Previous to last increase of tariff the union rate of wages was $11 per week, and after the increase the union rate was, and is now, $13.50 per week. We received 80 per cent of the increase for our labor. We would respectfully call your attention to the fact that the enormous amount of one million leaves of gold can be shipped in an ordinary packing case for a nomi- nal sum to any of our ports, which would represent four years and six months' labor of a good, quick, and clever workman. The gold-beater, although a skilled mechanic, has never been able to live better thr.n the poorest of American workmen, as the industry comes directly in competi- tion with European labor, and the first to suffer the depression of business and the last to receive the benefits of prosperous trade. In Germany a skilled workman earns 22 marks (or $.5.28) per week of seventy-two hours, tor which he is tasked to produce 7,000 leaves, which makes the cost of one pack (of 500 leaves, less the amount of gold) less than 49 cents. The cost of one pack of gold leaf in this country (500 leaves, less the amount of gold), is $2.05 ; al- lowing only $13.50 for the skilled labor of sixty hours a week and a man and a girl produces less than 4,000 leaves per week. Home competition has so reduced the prices of gold, silver, and metal leaf that it is now sold upon the market at a lower rate than was ever known in its manufac- ture, and the laborer receives the entire advantage of the tarift'. The present tariff has encouraged home manufacture and several manufactories have been established. The competition in the manufacturing of metal leaf is equal if not greater. The cost of production abroad is so much less than that of our home manufacture assures us that if any alterations made in the tariff of gold, silver, and metal leaf, there will be a sharp reduction in the wages of labor, and it will also be impossible for us to compete and our industry will become extinct. German manufacturers offer now gold leaf, delivered in this country, duty, freight, and all expenses paid, at cost of manufacture. The duty is $2 jjer pack of 500 leaves, ■ which sells at $7, and in which the male employ6 has $1.55, the female 50 cents, which is union wages, and 40 cents for tools, rent, expenses, etc., making the cost $6.70, as shown below ; Gold $4.25 Men 1.55 Girls 50 Expenses, tools, etc 40 Total 6.70 Now, if the duty Was removed the sami> firms could, of course, offer gold leaf at $4.65 per pack, which would leave nothing for the workman. The Gernmns alloy their gold more heavily, and the gold in their packages is probably worth about $3.87. Any reduction of a part of this duty would operate on our wages in a pro- portionate degree. When the duty was $1,50 per pack — which it was several years — the same thing existed, and the extra 50 cents put on was met by the Germans by reducing their wages to that extent. That this stiitement is positively true is proven by the fact that in England the trade has been almost entirely destroyed, as their markets are opem to and fully supplied by Fuerth and Nureniburg. In Lon- don, with 4,000,000 people, no factury has over 10 to 12 employes, while in New York, with 2,000,000, there are several with 50 to 75, and many with from 25 to 50. In Philadelphia, with 1,200,000, there is one with over 200 and several with 15 to 50. In Boston, with 400,000, there are several with 25 to 50 employ(?.s. Baltimore has several, and Chicago four with 25 to 50. The contrast with London, with her 4,000,000 people, is strongly in favor of this duty being maintained. ■TINSEL THREAD. 439 Wages are very low compared with other skilled liibor. Men getting $2 to $2.50 per day, and females 70 cents to $1, and our work being Interfered with by two dull periods in each year, we do not average over three-quarter time in prosper- ous times.- At present we are getting less than half time. As our wages have always been so arranged as to keep the imported article out, there has been very little brought in, and so the question of saving expense to the Government in col- lecting any duty ,on this article does not enter into the question. The only effect of a reduction of duty would be to lower the wages of those employed in this busi- ness. There is no trust or monopoly possible owing to the great number of small establishments, and competition is It'ree and severe, thus keeping the profit to our employers at a minimum. Trusting you will see the necessity of the continuance of the present duty, we remain, very respootfully, committee representing Journeymen Goldbeaters op the United States. Mr. Beicb. I have copies of the Eoyal Commission showing the amount of leaf in the various countries in Germany which I would like to submit. I was in hopes that one of our employers would be present to show you that the majority of the employers are in sympathy with the employes in this country. Mr. TuRNEE. This work is all done by hand? Mr. Beice. In this country it is all done by hand. There is a second process in the metal leaf which is done by machinery. TINSEL THREAD. (Paragraph 190.) STATEMENT OF ME. J. E. MONTGOMEEY, OF WIITDSOE lOCKS, CONN. Saturday, Sejptemher 16, 1893. Mr. Chairman. I will read from the law of 1890, paragraph 196 : Bullions and metal threads of gold, silver, or other metals, not specially provided for in this act, 30 per centum ad valorem. I merely wish to call attention to what is bullion and what is metal thread, which I place before you and leave as a part of my argument merely to define the article. In the free list, paragraph 737, is tinsel wire, lame, which is the French name, and lahn, which is the German for the same thing, a sample of which I also leave to shoAV the article. I represent a corporation whose capital of $350,000 is engaged in the manufacture of cotton warps and yarns, novelty yarns, bullions, and metal threads. It is only the rate of duty on the last two articles above referred to which I desire the attention of the committee for a few moments. The needs of the other branches of my business have been more ably presented to you by others than I could do them myself. Eeferring to Schedule C of Tariff Act of 1890, paragraph 196, " Bul- lions and metal thread of gold, silver, or other metals not specially provided for in this act, 30 per centum ad valorem." That the committee may more perfectly understand what the articles are referred to by this paragraph, I submit herewith samples of bullion and metal thread. These articles are made with a core or base thread of cotton or silk, and twisted or wound about this core or base thread is a tinsel wire so twisted or wound as to produce striking and novel effects. These yarns or threads are used by the manufacturers of cur- tains, upholstery goods, dress and bonnet trimmings, theatrical goods, and in other lines to produce the peculiar effect desired. Prior to 1890 these goods were not manufactured in this country, but 440 METALS. after the passage of the tariff act of that year we commenced the manufacture of them, and although the 30 per cent duty phiced upon the foreign goods did not allow us a sufficient measure of protection our proximity to the market enabled us to compete in all except the cheaper and more staple goods. In the staple goods that can be ordered in large quantities from abroad we can not compete with them, and there is a large amount of those goods imported, but in some fancy articles the close proximity to the markets helps us because they want their goods quickly. Our request to you, gentlemen, is that you allow the present rate of duty to stand. Paragraph 737 in the free list exempts from duty our raw material, the tinsel wire, lame or lahn (of which sample is here- with submitted), used in the manufacture of bullions and metal threads. We desire that no change be made in allowing this article to remain upon the free list. Should any lowering in the protective feature of the existing law towards these goods be permitted we would be com- pelled to give up this branch of our business at a great loss of capital invested in machinery and a large curtailment in the employment of labor. Mr. Payne. How many firms are engaged in this manufacture? Mr. MoNTGOMEEtY. At the present time I think there is another besides ourselves. Mr. Payne. There was not prior to 1890? Mr. Montgomery. No, sir. Mr. Payne. How much capital is invested? Mr. Montgomery. I can hardly answer that question. As far as we are concerned our business has an investment of $350,000, but it is made up in the manufacture of other things besides this. Mr. Payne. Ton have to provide special machinery for this? Mr. Montgomery. :fes, sir; we probably have in the neighborhood of $40,000 or $50,000 in this particular line, but it is used for other pur- poses also. Mr. Payne. How have prices been since 1890? Mr. Montgomery. In 1890, when we commenced, it was about $3.50 a kilo, and we are now selling it for $1.25; but the whole of that is not because of the McKinley bill. Mr. Payne. Part is on account of the material? Mr. Montgomery. Yes; in these rather seasonable goods, when there is a demand and they can not get enough, they are willing to pay any pritie to get the goods, and in such a season we get a large profit for it, but at times, when the style does not call for a large x^roduction of it, a large use of it, the prices are very low. Mr. Payne. Prices generally have been low since 1890? Mr. MoNTGOMERY^ Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Is that a new industry? Mr. Montgomery. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. How old is it? Mr. Montgomery. Since 1890, new in this country. Mr. Bryan. Is there any tariff on those goods now? Mr. Montgomery. There is no tariff upon the metal; these goods are not manufactured in this country, this tinsel wire. Mr. Bryan. You import the tinsel wire? Mr. Montgomery. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. And make it into Mr. Montgomery. Theseothergoods— bullion, metal threads. Mr. Bryan. There is no tariff on the tinsel wire? TINSEL THREAD. 441 Mr. Montgomery. Ko, sir. Mr. Bbyan. What duty is on the other? Mr. Montgomery. Thirty per cent. Mr. Bryan. You want that retained? Mr. Montgomery. I do. Mr. Bryan. Did you say the price has gone down in the last two or three years? Mr. Montgomery. Tes, sir. Mr. Bryan. But, as you say, not necessarily on account of the McKinley bill? Mr. Montgomery. 'So, sir. Mr. Bryan. What was the cause of the decline. Mr. Montgomery. Because there was less use of it in the last few years, and the style has not required tinsel wires. In fact, in regard to ladies' dress trimmings, hat trimmings, etc., at different times you will see wings and feathers and furs made, and these tinsel effects for the last two years have not been in demand. Mr. Bryan. The demand varies according to fashion ? Mr. Montgomery. Entirely so. Mr. Bryan. Can you continue to manufacture at these prices? Mr. Montgomery. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Has there been any reduction in the cost of making in the last three years? Mr. Montgomery. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Any material reduction ? Mr. Montgomery. Except in the ingenuity of manufacture. Mr. Bryan. What has been the reduction in cost; what proportion? Mr. Montgomery. When we first commenced we were the only ones manufacturing in this country. We invented all our own machinery, and the cost was certainly 15 to 20 per cent more than it is to-day. Mr. Bryan. And the price is now about one-half of what it was? Mr. Montgomery. Less than one-half. When I stated "in 1890," I stated a year which was particiilarly high-priced for the goods. Mr. Bryan. You make a fair profit now? Mr. Montgomery. Fair ; yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. You must have had a pretty good profit before ? Mr. Montgomery. Yes, sir; at times there is a good profit. We have to take, in manufacturing these articles, an average — one year with another. Some years we will be out of pocket, as we are this year a good deal. Mr. Payne. That high price was when there was no tariff on it? Mr. Montgomery. In 1889 — prior to 1890 — there was a duty of 25 per cent on both the finished goods and the metals. Mr. Payne. There was no protective tariff ? Mr. Montgomery. No, sir. Mr. Bryan. The act of 1890 gave you raw material, but increased the tariff' on the product ? Mr. Montgomery. Twenty-five and 30 on the finished product and gave us raw material free. Mr. Payne. Before that there was no discrimination and prices were high? Mr. Montgomery. Yes, sir; there was no check upon the foreign- ers previous to that time in their prices. Mr. Payne. And none manufactured here? Mr. Montgomery. No, sir; and they made their prices to suit them- selves. 442 METALS. Mr. Payne. If competition were broken would prices go to the old standard? Mr. Montgomery. That would be a strong temptation to put prices up where they could get them. Mr. Payne. Suppose you were the only manufacturer? Mr. Montgomery. We would get all we could. Mr. Payne. But if there was competition you would not ? Mr. Montgosiery. That would limit us. Mr. Bryan. Do j'ou think you would run nearly thirty years without competition, as a previous witness did? Mr. Montgomery. We should hope so; but we have competition; we are not the sole manufacturers. LEAD ORES. (Paragraph 199.) STATEMENT OF MB, L. E. HOLDEN, OF CLEVELAND, OHIO. Wednesday, September 20, 1893. Gentlemen of the Committee : I come before you to present for your consideration the subject of lead ores, but with a special refer- ence to the lead ores produced in the Eocky Mountains. I wish to be mindful constantly that your duties compel you to consider all subjects from a national standpoint. While you are doing this you must of necessity consider every productive industry of the land. In raising the great revenue that is essential in carrying on the expensive administration of the Government it is of the highest impor- tance that you so adjust the tax that it will bear as near equally as possible on the people. It is clearly within your power to so adjust the tax as to make it strictly a tariff for revenue and protection, no matter under what subterfuge of language the idea may be hidden. It may be called incidental protection or any other name. If there is a tariff for revenue on any product produced in this country in competi- tion with the same kind of product produced in any other country which is brought to this market for sale, such tariff is piotective. If it is a 20 per cent tariff it is on such articles a 20 per cent protection. The scope of your wisdom, which is but another name for judgment and discretion, will lie in the golden mean between a tariff which prohibits importation and extreme free trade, both of which bring no revenue and are alike in their effects so far as producing revenue is concerned. So long as it is the policy of the Government to gather its revenue largely from a tariff tax it will require the soundest discretion to con- sider each and every industry, and so adjust the tax that it will be borne willingly by the people, while at the same time it encourages our national industries. The location of mines is remote from the great business centers. The' price of living, the cost of carrying on business, and the expense in transportation of products to places where they are consumed, and the cost of labor aud materials that are used in producing ores are neces- sarily very great. It must be considered, also, that all mining property when worked is constantly being depleted and its value diminished. The mines of the mountains are extensive patrons of the manufac- LEAD OEES. 443 turers of steel, iron, lumber, powder, clotliiug, tools, and macliinery, all of which are produced in the great business centers of the country. When the mines are idle, of course they cease to be patrons of other great industries. Hence, it is wise that they be not discriminated against in the adjustment of taxes. They should not be made to pay high prices because of tariff on that which they consume and receive no beneiit by the tariff on that which they produce. I claim that where labor is the larger element in the cost of i^roduction it has the same right to consideration and protection in the ore as it does in the ax or engine. The dangers in mining ore are far gieater to the men than in the mills, where the finished products are produced. The risks of life and capital are far greater. I hold that labor is one and the same wherever it is used, and should at all times and in aU places have the same consideration. I hold, also, that money invested in mines should have the same consideration, so far as protection from the Government is concerned, whether it be from police or tariff, when invested in a mine or a mill on a mine, as in a factory or shop, where finished articles are produced. It is well known that in a few years most of the mines that are worked become exhausted, and the mills and the machinery that are used in hoisting ores or in concentrating them, 6v in smelting and pre- paring them for market, become valueless. Mindful of these facts, it is certainly unjust to enact laws discriminating against the product of mines and in favor of manufactured articles. I do not come here recommending a tariff so high that it should in any way, shape, or manner be instrumental in the organization of monopolies or trusts, but I do sincerely believe in such a tariff, so long as it is the policy of the Government to collect its revenue by tariff taxes, as will enable the mines of the country to be run, fair wages to be paid, and just compensation for the uses of money invested to be earned. I would not be misunderstood. I would have the tariff so low that in case prices were carried much beyond a fair compensation to the owners of mines that foreign products of the same kind could be brought in, and thus prevent the establishment of monopolies and trusts in our own country. A fair measure for such a tariff is the difference in the price of labor paid in this country and that of other countries with M'hich the miners of this country have to compete, and the difference in interest on money in this country and in those countries which would compete with us in this country. For the last three years there has been no money made in the lead mines of the great Western mining districts. It is well known that the lead ores of the Eocky Mountains produce a small per cent of silver and gold, and that these products thus associated with lead have in years gone by enabled the lead miners to produce lead and ship it to our Eastern cities. The low price of silver, in fact its constantly decreasing value since 1875 and 1876, has been a great setback to all lead mines in the Eocky Mountains, so far as their earning capacity is concerned. To-day I believe that three-fourths of all the mines are closed because of the low price of silver. When lead reaches 5 cents per pound, then it can be imported from Europe. It can not be produced in the Eocky Mountains and shipped to New York, unless it is associated with silver and gold, for 5J cents per pound. 444 • METALS. As a general thing it requires the three metals combined to enable the mines there to be worked, and a tariff has been and is now absolutely essential to the life of these mines. The mines are almost the only source of money for that country. The miners buy the products of the farmer, and. thus make a home market for the surplus produced by the permanent settlers of the land. Strike down mines and. you strike down shops, stores, and farms, and stop the settlement of the valleys and the hillsides, and you take the very heart out of the intermountain country. The mines of the great basin, as well as those of Arkansas and Mis- souri, are brought directly into com]^etition with the lead mines of Mexico. The laborers of our mines, who receive from $2.50 to $3 per day, are brought into direct competition with the peon laborers of Mexico, who receive from 40 cents to $1 per day. With a free importation of lead ores our mines must close or our miners must work for substantially Mexican wages. They can not and will not do it. Hence, in case free lead should be admitted, this great industry, giving work directly to thousands of men and indirectly vital- izing all industry and trade from the mountains to the ocean, would be paralyzed. It can not — it must not — be done. Oar country is one; our industries are many; but they are all American and should all be treated with equal and exact justice. The j)olicy of our country is to foster, not to destroy; to keep the wheels going, not to make them stand still. 1 have great confidence in your discretion. Yours is not a policy of destruction, but one of justice between producer and consumer. As legislators, to us who are both producers and consumers you stand as the Government. The Executive can carry out only what you enact. The recommendations of this committee will be fraught with greater responsibility than that of any committee of any Congress for many years. While that policy remains the lead miners of the West and Southwest ask and insist that the same pro rata tariff be kept on im- ported lead in every shape, name, and .form as is placed on steel, iron, machinery, tools, and implements which they use so largely in mining. We claim that silver-lead ores, and all lead ores which have to be milled or dressed in order to fit them for smelting, are not raw material in any fair sense of the term. More than three-fourths of their cost is in labor, and that labor is just as much entitled to protection as it would be if used in a factory or a mill east of the Eocky Mountains. Considered, then, as a means of revenue, there must be a tariff on lead and lead ores, or no revenue can be collected from them when im- ported; not a tariff so high as to be prohibitory, for then it ceases to be a revenue tariff. It is, therefore, your duty from a national standpoint to recommend the golden mean between the extremes. It is uncertainty concerning the tariff policy which has put business at a standstill. What business men want is a definite governmental policy, especially when the great expense of carrying on the Government must be paid by the business of the country. We must know definitely what taxes we have to pay and reckon them as part of the expense in our business. We must also know to what extent the baxs of importation are to be let down ; for the for- eigner is our competitor if he does not pay our taxes. We do not deceive ourselves. We know that a tax on imports is a protection to our industries close to the extent of the tax. We believe it is good policy to so place the tariff as to equalize the burdens and the benefits, to foster home production, and as far as possible prohibit LEAD ORES. 445 trusts. The lead trust of Kew York has controlled the price of lead ever since its organization ; so that the price of pig lead has averaged about 4 cents, and the price of white lead in New York, which costs compara- tively nothing to mannfacture, sells for 6.58 cents per pound. This is the product of the lead trust, and the uniformity, of the price wiiich they sell at, as shown by the following table, tells how well they con- trol the market : Neio Toric prices of white lead. [Centa per pound.] Montli. JaBUary.. I'ebruary March April May Juno 1891. 6.34 6.34 6.34 6.34 6.34 6.34 1892. 6.58 6.58 6.58 6.58 6.68 6.58 July August . ., September October ... NoTember. Deeeniber , 6.58 6,68 6.58 6.58 6.58 6,58 1892. 6.58 6,68 6,58 6.58 6. .58 6.68 The average yearly price of pig lead and white lead have been as follows : [Cents per pound.] 1891. 1892. White lead 6.46 4.32i Vi" lead 4 05 DitFerence 2.13i 2 53 The tariff" on lead ore and lead dross is IJ cents per pound; on pig lead and old scraps, 2 cents per pound ; lead in sheets, pipes, shot, glaziers' lead, and lead wire, 2 J cents per pound ; white lead, dry, or mixed with oil, 3 cents per pound; red lead, litharge, and nitrate of lead, 3 cents per pound. The cost of producing pig lead is ten times more and requires ten times more labor than it does to take the pig lead and put it into white lead, pipe, or sheet lead, or shot, and yet the tariff on these products is from 60 to 200 per cent greater than it is on lead ores, out of which even the pig lead is made. If it be your plan, as it should be your purpose, to equalize the tariff tax, then manifestly it wonld be unjust to reduce the tariff on lead ores and pig lead, and keep the same tariff on lead products. Manifestly it would be still more unjust to admit lead ores free from duty. If in your wisdom you decide to recommend a reduction, then let it be pro •rata on lead in every form, and certainly not at a greater per cent than you make on other branches of the metal schedule. I trust that you will bear in mind that the mining industry of the New West has been built up under the laws of protection; their investments have been made and their business adapted to and based upon that principle. Certainly whatever changes are made by way of reduction in the tariff should be made gradually and equitably. I desire also to call your attention to the fact that the carbonate or free working ores, which formerly were found on the surface in lead mines, are worked out; mining grows more expensive as we sink ; nearly all mines now are obliged to run long and expensive tunnels, or put in heavy pumps for drainage. The ores are all sulphides, and are mixed 446 METALS. witliiron and zinc; to make them marketable, they mast be crushed and jigged, so as to wash out the waste and be concentrated and then roasted. All this work is chargeable to the mines. The cost per ton of crude ore for dressing is from $1.50 to $2 per ton, and the cost of roasting is $2 to $3 per ton. There are generally 3 tons and sometimes 4 or 5 concentrated into one; thus, besides mining on every ton of ore fitted for smelting, there is an expense besides mining of $9 to $12 per ton. A caieful calculation brings the conclut ion that labor alone is 80 per cent of the cost of ores prepared for smelting. It is proven by our experience that mining, grows more expensive as we sink. If a tariff was ever required for the development of lead mines in this country, it is required now. If it was necessary to establish, it is necessary to preserve our mining industry. If anything like former prices are to be maintained in this country, if labor and the prices of commodities are not to be measured by a gold standard and reduced to a level with European prices, then it is essential that a tarili'for revenue with inci- dental protection be maintained on lead ore and all the products of lead. It is certainly the low price of labor in Europe and Mexico that enables them to produce lead so much cheaper than it can be done in this country. It would not be a wise policy, and certainly it would not be just, for you to recommend the abolition'of the tariff and let in ores from other countries free, whereby our own mining industry would be destroyed and the Government receive no revenue from such imi)ortation. Total production of lead in tlie United States tons.. Total desilverized ore '. do... Tot;al Missouri and Galena do . . . Desilverized product to total product per cent. - Average price cents per pound.. 80,241 180, 97.1 50, 478 148, (180 28, 763 32, S'.i.T 83 82 4.32i 4.5 I have carefully studied the cost of producing silver lead ores in Bingham Canyon, Utah. The facilities lor mining and transportation are the best in the Territory. The ores average from the sale of lead 54 per cent of the receiiits, from silver 39 \)er cent, and from gold 7 per cent. The most of the mines have paid no dividends and have made no profit. In mining 10,394.43 tons of ore, and marketing the same under the most favorable conditions, and paying $2.50 and $3 per day for labor, the mine paid 4.7 per cent interest on the investment during the last two years, and the cost of producing lead and delivering it in New York, without estimating the value of silver and gold associated witli it, was 5J cents |)er pound. If it had not been for the tariff I doubt if a single lead mine in the Territory of Utah, and I might' say in the entire Rocky Mountain region, would have been at work. Certainly not if they had been obliged to pay the rate of wages which they did pay. It is difficult for me to describe to you the condition of the miners and the mining industry of the far West. For years they have been at work hoping and expecting that legislation would be enacted by wliich silver would take its place in the money of our country side by side with gold, ^rhey have worked and hoped almost against hope under a constantly declining market. These men are as good and true as any in this land. Many of them, in fact most of them, have gone LEAD ORES. 447 out from Eastern homes. In many instances they were the brightest and the most enterprising in their families. Tliey have sought fortune in the mountains under trial, deprivation, and danger. Many of these men are graduates of our colleges and are familiar with the best of our civilization. To-day they stand by their cabins on the mountain side in despair. Some — nay, many — have taken their blanket ux)on their backs, all that they had left in the world, and tramped down the moun- tain and out the canyon because neither work nor food nor hope is left for them there. When the great decline in silver and lead took place, scores of these men came into the offioe of our company, and as they looked back upon the work they had done, the claims they had been obliged to forsake, and the blasted business hopes before them, these strong men and true, wept like boys. I beg of you gentlemen, not to think that the lead ore of the Eocky Mountains is all produced by great and rich mining companies. The truth is very far from this. Thousands of poor men go out into the moun- tains and prospect. If they are fortunate enough to tiud a lead they work it, get out a few tons of ore, have it packed on mules, or drawn down the mountain side on sleds or rawhides, and then by wagon either to the raOroad or to the furnaces in the valley. Perhaps one out of a thousand finds what may be developed into large mines ; pros- pects are many — mines are few. But these prospectors and these poor miners produce a very large percentage of the ores that go to make up the aggregate production. These men, shod not in patent leather, but in stout cowhide boots, thickly studded with iron nails; these men, clad not in royal puri)le, but in butternut or blue jeans; wearing no sash of silk about their loins, but on their shoulders a bundle of coarse bedding; carrying no sword with jeweled hilt and scabbard, but in- stead a shovel and pick; wearing no crown of gold, but a broad and stout sombrero ; these men march not with a retinue of body servants or military escort, but solitary and alone up the dark canyon — dark at mid-day, because of the mountain heights which shut out the light; these men, American citizens, are the silver kings to whom so many sneers and jeers have been graciously thrown. These are the men who have been adding a hundred millions of wealth per year to the permanent wealth of our country. It is the industry of these men for which I speak to you. It is the mining industry of the whole West, whether represented by rich or poor, you have to consider. It is an industry which in peace we should foster, and in war we can hardly do without it. I understand that there will be a great effort made to induce you to let in free lead ores by parties specially interested in smelting furnaces close to the Mexican border. They will tell you that they want Mexi- can ores as fluxes. The facts are that we produce e^ery kind of ore that a lead furnace requires, and they are produced in abundance. These parties want the Mexican ores because they can make more money out of them than they think they could make out of American ores. The furnace men of the country are few; they are easily organ- ized into trusts. In fact, they are now so combined that between them and the lead trust of New York the miners stand between the devil and the deep sea, and are obliged to accept for lead and ore just such price as they see fit to pay them. If free lead ores were admitted it is not probable that the consumers of lead would pay any less for what they use. This was not the case during the years that under the ruling of the Treasury the lead in silver lead ores was admitted free. It is weU known that we can not produce lead in this country cheap enough 448 METALS. to ship it abroad; the nearest mines to the seaport are 1,000 miles away, and most of them are 2,000. Five-sixths of all the lead produced has to be transported from 1,500 to 2,500 miles to market. This fact alone must show to you the great value of this industry to the carrying trade. I have not the figures before me, but I believe I am safe in saying that one-half of all the silver and 25 per cent of all the gold produced each year in this country is produced in connection with and directly from the lead ores of the Eocky Mountains. I know from years of expe- rience that neither the lead alone nor the silver and gold alone will pay for the extraction of these ores under the most favorable circumstances in which they have been heretofoie mined. It is understood and ex- pected that under your advice there will be a revision of the tariff. It is not expected that there will be a destruction of the tariff. I earnestly solicit your most careful consideration of this subject, and that what- ever modification you recommend that it apply equally to lead ores and to the products of lead, and that under no circumstance, that under no name or form, lead in ores or otherwise be admitted into this coun- try free; it would be far wiser to place a specific duty on silver lead ores, including both the silver and the lead, than to admit them free, especially in these times, when there seems to be so mucli fear and an- tipathy towards silver. I thank you for your attention, gentlemen. Mr. Taesnet. Where are your mines located? Mr. HoLDEN. In Bingham, Utah. Mr. Taesnet. There is not now, and never has been, any duty on what are known as dry ores? Mr. HoLDEN. I think not. You mean ores bearing silver also? Mr. Taesnet. That is, silver and gold ores not bearing lead. There is not now, and never has been, any duty on them? Mr. Holhen. I think not. Mr. Taesnby. The silver-bearing lead ores are used as a tool, imple- ments in the smelting of dry ores. Is not that essential to their use? Mr. HoLDEN. There are two methods of working silver. Mr. Taesnet. But the general method is to use what are called flux- ing ores? Mr. HoLDEN. They are both used, one perhaps as much as the other. Mr. Taesnet. There is, and always has been here for many years, a tariff of IJ cents a pound on lead ores? Mr. HoLDEN. Yes, sir. Mr. Taesnet. Are there any lead ores imported into this country? Mr. HoLDEN. Yes, sir. Mr. Taesnet. Known as lead ores ? Mr. HoLDBN. There is quite a large quantity of ore that is brought from Mexico which bears lead. Mr. Taesnet. I am talking about what is known in mineral par- lance or commercial parlance as lead ore — galena? Mr. HoLDEN. I think there are a good many imported. Mr. Taesnet. Do not you know that a tax of $30 a ton upon galena ore is absolutely prohibitive, and that the reports show that not one ton is imported into this country? Mr. HoLDEN. I think, on the contrary, that during last year there were about $750,000 duties paid on lead brought in in ores from Mexico. Mr. Taesnet. Exactly. Now, you know that that result also, do you not, from the fact lead is being smeltered in Mexico and sent to New Jersey smelterers to be there refined and desilverized, and that duty is paid upon that lead? LEAD ORES. 449 Mr. HoLDBN. Not at all. Mr. Tarsnet Is it not a fact that tlie reports sliow that not one single ton of base galena lead ore has been imported into this country in years. Mr. HoLDEN. I think not. Mr. Taesnet. You can not speak positively"? Mr. HoLDEN. I can not say with certainty about it. Mr. Tarsney. Now, I find from the report of tlie Director of the Mint that there were in 1891 about 4,000 mines xjroducing silver in the United States that year; that is about correct? Mr. HoLDEN. I should think so. Mr. Tarsney. I find from that report there were 150 of those 4,000 mines whicli produced these lead-bearing ores; that is about correct? Mr. HoLDEN. I think so; that is, I wish to state this Mr. Tarsney. Wait a moment; if there be a duty upon silver ores, upon all dry ore, 3,950 of which mines are producing these dry ores, what protection is there for the miners engaged in that indn^stry? Mr. HoLDEN. Do I understand you to mean the mines producing Mr. Tarsney. There are 4,000 mines, according to the report of the Superintendent of the Mint, in this country here, which in 1891 pro- duced silver ores, 50 of which only were producing these wet ores, leaving a balance of the 4,000 mines producing dry ores upon which there has been no duty and never has been? Mr. HoLDEN. I wish to state here, that report can not cover all the prospectors and small mines that do produce a large percentage of the lead ores. Mr. Tarsney. It includes everything worthy of computation in the Superintendent of the Mint's judgment. Now there were 50 of them in Colorado, you have just stated, producing the greatest amount of lead of any section in the country. Mr. HoLDEN. I did not state that. Mr. Tarsney. That is true, is it not? Mr. HoLDEN. I am not certain whether Colorado produces more; I think Utah produces nearly as many tons of lead, but not as much silver. Mr. Tarsney. I find from the census statistics that in 1889 there were 49,078 miners engaged in silver mines in the United States, and the same report estimates that only 6,439 were engaged in mines pro- ducing lead-fluxing ores. If these statistics are correct then there are but 6,000 or could be under any condition but 6,439 miners receiv- ing any protection under this system out of more than 55,000 miners; that would be correct? Mr. HoLDBN. On your statement you make from these figures, I think it is. Mr. Tarsney. I am taking the official figures. There are 49,078 miners engaged in mining and all of them engaged in unprotected mines save 6,439. That is the report. Now what proportion of the de- mand for these wet-fluxing ores in the smelters of Colorado do the mines of Colorado provide? Mr. HoLDBN. I do not know. Mr. Tarsney. You do not know? Mr. Holden. No, sir. Mr. Tarsney. I find from the statistics of the census report that in Lake County, Colo., four mines turned out (iS ]icr cent of the entire fluxing ores of that county; that in Gunnison Coirnty, also a large silver and lead county, the same autlionty shows that one mine pro- TH 29 450 METALS. duced 93 per cent of the total production; that in Tinsdale Gonnty one mine produced 89 per cent of total production of tliat county ; that in San Juan County one mine produced 86 per cent of the total product; that in Eagle County three mines turned out 90 per cent of the total pro- duct; that in Custer Comity one mine produced 90 per cent of the total product. I find from another official report tliat the Denver smelters, the two Denver smelters,, purchased only 10,157 tons of lead in Colorado as against 20,468 tons in Idaho and 8,177 tons in Utah. Therefore the smelting of ores in Colorado which produces the greatest amount of lead in Colorado was compelled to import from without her borders of these implements which she absolutely needed for the smelting and refining of silver from dry ores. Are these statis- tics correct? Mr. HoLDEN. I think that they are substantially correct. I will state the reason of it. Fuel is cheaper iu Colorado than it is in the extreme West, and these ores can be more readily transported to the fuel than the fuel can be transported to the ores. Mr. Taksnby. But if there is an abundance of these leads-fluxing ores in Colorado and it be not controlled by a trust, bearing that in mind — if there is an abundance of these lead-fluxing ores in Colorado to reduce all the ores of her mines and she has got the cheaper fuel also, liow do you explain she would pay freight transportation from the Conr d'Aleue region and Utah to Denver to supply iierself with that material? Mr. floLDEN. It is simply because she can make money out of it, and because they carry a large percentage of silver. These ores carry a percentage of both silver and gold. Mr. Taesney. Tliis is a matter of protection to American labor ? Mr. HOLDEN. A]id Anjcrican establishments. Mr. Taesney. How did the imposition of this duty of IJ cents upon these fluxing ores afiect American labor and affect the American inter- ests, when it was imposed in 1890? Mr. HOLDEN. It existed previous to that. Mr. Tarsney. I beg your x)ardon. Mr. HoLDEN. Oh, yes ; 1^ per cent existed Mr. Taesney. I mean on these silver lead-bearing ores — those that are used for fluxing purposes ; liow did it affect American labor and Amei'ican industries ? Mr. HoLDBN. It increased the prochiction of lead and silver in the Eocky Mountain regions. It stojiped, if I remember correctly, the im- Xiortation from Mexico, wliich ran from 15,000 tons up to 20,000 and then to over 30,000 tons of lead ])er year, and that amount was produced in America, instead of being produced in Mexico, and the American mines and miners did it, and not the Mexican mines and miners. Mr, Tarsney, I will read you a paragraph from the report of Consul- General Sutton, at Xuevo Laredo, published in May of this year, and when I have read it I will ask yovi if it is correct. He says :' Owing to tariff legislation in tlie United States in 1889 anol 1890, which shnt on* low-grade Mexican ores ioniierly exported in lar.i^e quantities for reduction in the United States, a large anioltinn industry has been built up in Mexico. In 1889 the export traffic had just barely begun, and liad immense possibilities. Our smelters of Kansas City, in Colorado, and other ])la(es, were taking large quantities of flux- ing ores at sucdi rales as uiade their mining profitable in Mexico, ami gave a large traffic from the mines out of Mexico and through a portion of our territory. It was a trallic sorely needed by tlio railways recently built through a country largely un- developed. This oue item of iieight might easily atUQUut to $2,000,000 per aiiftuw, LEAD OEES. 451 Further on he says : There was, however, another result. American capital left the United Statea and came to Mexico to establish in this country ^mclt^rs to do here the work which had previously been done in the United States. Three smelters have been erected at Monterey, one at iSan Luis I'otosi — pi>i-haps the largest and most comiilete of its kind in the world — besides several other plants in dillereut portions of Mexico. 'I'he cost of those plants and the money directly invested in ores and in handling the business may be safely stated in round numbers at $10,000,000 in United States ccjin. Not only has our country lost this much capital by investment abroad and Mexico gained that much, but with this money have come mauy prominent ami enterprising citi- zens and a large number of employi^s. They have bnilt up Monterey, San Luis Potosi, and other towns. The railways in Mexico which had formerly carried low- grade ores to the United States, getting a long haul, are now obliged to haul these ores shorter distances to the Mexican smelters, etc. Now, has not that been exactly the result of the imposition of this duty upon these fluxing ores in 1891, and it shut down the smelters at Laredo, Tex., just completed when that tax was imposed, which cost more than a quarter of a million of dollars, and prevented it from ever open- ing to this day; is not that true? Sir. HoLDEN. If that is true this is true, that during the three years there has been more than one hundred millions of money saved in the United States Mr. Taesney. I will get at that- Mr. HOLDEN. Wait until I get through. I want to talk just one minute. There has been more than .§100,000,000 saved in the United States by working our mines and smelters and sending their products to market; we have added to the permanent wealth of America more than $100,000,000, as against the $10,000,000 you speak of. Mr. Tarsney. Is it not a fact that the imposition of tliat tax only reduced the importation of those ores 3,000 tons that year, reducing it from 21,000 to 18,000 tons, and that the only effect so far as the impor- tation was concerned was to impose a bunlen of -$7 and a fraction of added cost for no benefit upon the American smelterer? Mr. HoLDEN. I will give you the facts of theimj)ortationof lead and lead products. Mr. Taksney. I have them here. Mr. Hopkins. Let him give them in his answer so we can get them. Mr. HoLDBN. May I file these papers with the stenographer'? The Chairman. Yes, sir. Mr. HoLDEN. I wish to file the statement of the importation of ores and lead for the three years preceding the enactment of the present tariff tax, also the importation which has taken place since then in order to show the value of this industry to the United States in comparison with the statement which the gentleman has made. Mr. Tarsney. If the statement that I have made that the importa- tion of these ores has only fallen off 3,000 tons, and if on the other hand the exportation of lead from Mexico has increased from $13,000 worth in 1889 to $1,500,000 worth in 1892 by reason of the transfer of the smelting industry from the United States to Mexico, the lead pro- ducers of the United States have got the worst of it. Mr. HoLDEN. They have not got the worst of it. Mr. Tarsney. The American railroads got the worst of it by having these freights taken away. Mr. HoLDEN. No, sir, I deny it. Mr. Tarsney. The American labor at Kansas City and Texas and otherplaces where these smelters were and which were shut down by this tax got the worst of it, did they not! The American country got the 452 METALS. worst of it by the transportation of $10,000,000 of its capital ont of the country to furnish an implement for industries they built up with this cheap labor of Mexico and the output of Mexican lead has been in- creased to the extent I have stated; then that would indicate the lead industry of this country got the worst of it. Mr. HoLDEN. It does not indicate it at all Mr. Taesnet. Well, then Mr. Hopkins. Let him answer the question. Mr. HoLDEN. The facts are, the carrying trade in the United States has been increased from 157,000 tons from the Eocky Mountains in 1888 to 180,241 tons in 1891. Mr. Taesney. Do you mean that would not have occurred notwith- standing this tariff? Mr. Holden. It would not by any means. Mr. Tarsnet. I thought not. Mr. Holden. It would not have occurred if the free importation of lead ore had continued. Mr. Tarsney. You interrupted me when I asked you if it is not a fact that this smelter at Laredo, Tex., costing over a quarter of a mill- ion dollars, and another down the river at another point an the Eio Grande which had been constructed and which was ready to proceed with the smelting of these ores was not compelled to be abaiidoned, and never has been and never had opened on account of the imposi- tion of this tariff. Mr. Holden. I do not know it, but have been so informed. I will state, also, during the years of the ruling of the Treasury, when those ores were admitted free, that a large percentage, I think three-quarters of the stacks in Utah, in Idaho, and in Montana were closed, and I believe that more stacks have been set at work in the United States since the enactment of this law than have been built in all Mexico. Mr. Taesney. Why were these stacks in Idaho and other States idle during all the years when under the Treasury regulations these ores were admitted free; because of the price of lead? Mr. Holden. For two reasons. They were in competition with Mexican labor and Mexican ores. Mr. Taesney. I asked you, if it is not a fact, because you are an ex- pert, were not prices of lead in 1886, 1887, 1888, and 1889 higher than they have been since 1890 ? Mr. Holden. No, sir ; I may not give that accurately, but I know that prices went down at one time to 3J cents. Mr. Taesney. 1889, was it not, that a firm undertook to corner lead on the market and they failed, and the suddeu throwing on the market of all they had accumulated crushed prices during the year 1889? Mr. Holden. I am not certain. Mr. Taesney. But is it not a fact that the average price of lead in 1886, 1887, 1888, when these ores were imported free, was higher than it has been since the duty of IJ cents per pound was imposed in 1890? Mr. Holden. No, sir; in 1886 it was the lowest price. In 1892— the fore part of 1 S!tl and 1892 — were the highest, and the lowest were in the years 1885 and 1886. Mr. Taesney. Wliat are you reading from? Mr. Holden. I am reading from the statistics. Mr. Taesney. Prepared by whom? Mr. Holden. Caswell's Eeport. Mr. Taesney. The official report of the census does not show it. LEAD OKES. 453 Mr. HoLDEN. I believe this report is correct. This is the IJ'ew York price list. Mr. Taksney. That is a private report. Mr. HoLDBN. This is the New York price current on which we sell our lead. Mr. Tarsnby. Is there a scarcity of these lead ores in the Rocky Mountain region which are essential implements in the reduction of dry ores, and the control of them in the few hands affects the value of the product of the miners of dry ores? Mr. BLoLDEN. I do not kuow that I understand your statement. Mr. Tabsney. Well, a smelterer is a good deal like a gristmill, he takes and reduces it at a fee. Mr. HoLDEN. Yes, sir; and if all these gristmills are put into one and controlled by oue man it would be what we call a trust. Mr. Tarsney. And a scarcity of these fluxing ores measures and regulates to a great degree the price of the dry ores which are them- selves brought to the smelter. Mr. HoLDEN. If the trust fixes the price, it does not, as in the case of a trust in 'Sew York, say white lead Mr. Tarsney. Let us see. If I was a Nmelting man in Colorado and had control of the fluxing ores which were necessary in the reductiou of dry ores and I was purchasing your dry ore, I could fix wliatever price 1 pleased upon that dry ore because I had the oTdy implement which would reduce it? Mr. HoLDEN. That would be about as impossible to put all the wheat-growers in this country into a trust as to get the miners who produce lead into a trust together. Mr. Tarsney. Is it not a fact that the fluxing ores of Colorado have been in the hands of one or two smelters ! Mr. HOLDEN. I think not. You think not? I think not because You are not in the inside where you could know, I I think I know. You are near to them? I am not near to them. You are a smelting man? No, sir; I am not, but I have been a smelter. Mr. Tarsney. You were four or five years ago ? Mr. HoLDEN. I was eight or ten years ago, but not within the last eight or ten years. Mr. Tarsney. There was no trust on this then? Mr. HoLDEN. No, sir. I wish to reiterate what I said before, that these miners are all over immense distrcts of the Rocky Mountains, and you could not combine them into a trust. Above nearly every other interest they should be looked after instead of the interests of the furnace men, who can combine and who do combine together. Mr. Tarsney. How are we looking after these 98 per cent of miners, whose industry is not protected at all, engaged in this dry-ore i^roduc- tion? Mr. HOLDEN. I would look after them and not let Mexican ores come into competition with them. Mr. Tarsney. Would not you suggest, in order to put that plain enough, that the lead producers of silver ore have a high duty put upon it so as to protect the miner of silver ores ? Mr. Tarsney. Mr. HOLDEN. Mr. Tarsney. suppose. Mr. HOLDEN. Mr. Tarsney. Mr. HOLDEN. Mr. Tarsney. Mr. HOLDEN. \ 454 METALS, Mr. HoLDEN. It is very mucli of a question whether one is entitled to it and that the other is not. Mr. Tarsnby. It could not be very much of a question if you want to put them on an equality. If we are to put all miners — and, under- stand, the miners themselves understand generally that there ought to be an equality among them — how do you justify permitting an impor- tation of silver ore or gold ore in competition with the American miner of silver and gold ore without any duty ? ^Ir. HoLDEN. I do not undertake to overturn the established policy of the United States G-overnment in permitting the free importation of gold and silver. Mr. Tarsnet. These tariif systems are not established policies. They always have been in a formative state, have they not f Mr. HoLDEN. Yes, they have. Mr. Taesnbt. 'Sow, they are "reformative," as the gentleman from New York suggests. Mr. Payne. The silver-bearing lead ores came in freely prior to 1890 ? Mr. HoLDEN. Yes, sir ; by the interpretation of the Treasury Depart- ment. Mr. Payne. And by a proviso in the law of 1890 they bore a duty of a cent and a half a pound ? Mr. HoLDEN. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. As I understand you, you think it is just to have a fair protection on the difference in labor and interest in this country and other countries'? Mr. Holden. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Therefore, you advocate a retention of that duty? Mr. Holden. I advocate the retention of such a duty as is propor- tional to all other lines of duty; that is to say, if there he a change or a reduction it should be i^ro rata and not destructive of the duty on lead ores. Mr. Payne. You want such a duty as will make up for the difference paid for labor in this country and competing countries, and forinterest and these other expenses which are higher here than in other countries all along the line? Mr. HoLBBN. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. And while that is incidental, still it was designed to protect all the industries all along the line in the construction of a tariff? Mr. Holden. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. That is your idea of it? Mr. Holden. Jly idea is, if there is a tariff at all on the thing we produce it is protective, no matter what you call it. Mr. Payne. You want a tariff? Mr. Holden. I think it is a wise policy and there should be a tariff. Mr. Payne. You tliink it would be a wise policy to have a tariff to protect the labor and capital of the country? Mr. Holden. I so stated. Mr. Payne. Are not you the publisher of a Democratic newspaper in Cleveland, Ohio, called the Plaindealer? Mr. Holden. Yes, sir; I am. Mr. Payne. And I supposed you indorsed the last Democratic plat- form, tariff for revenue only? Mr. Holden. I do not know that that enters into my examination on lead ores. Mr. Payne. Of course if you have any delicacy in answering that question I will not press it. LEAD ORES. 455 Mr. Tarsney. After this increase of the tariff of 1890 did you increase the pay roll of your employes? Mr. Holhen. After the increase of 1890 — in some respects, yes; in some respects, no. Mr. TABiSNEY. That covers all the period between the imposition of this tax and the present ? Mr. HoLDEN. No; during the last— during this panic — the mines were closed up, and thus when they were started up again we started on a lower rate of wages, optional with the men. Mr. Tarsney. That is owing to the panic? Mr. HoLDEN. Yes, sir. Mr. Tarsney. You say you are the editor of a Democratic newspa- per. It is taken for granted that we were commissioned and directed by the people to reform this tariff, commissioned by theni last fall to pro- ceed with the revision of this tariif, and I would like to have your Democratic advice where we shall commence the progress of reform. Mr. HoLDEN. I am not going to give you that advice here; I think you are abundantly competent to consider it. The tone of my paper which I presented Mr. Dalzell. You agreed it should be outside of anything you are interested in, of course. Mr. HoLDEN. No; I am perfectly willing it should be on the line of what I am interested in. Mr. Payne. I suppose you do not know of any industry which you have personally investigated yourself and been interested in so as to make an investigation of any article in the whole list should be re- vised; I mean where you have made a personal investigation? Mr. HoLDEN. Yes, sir; I have made quite a number of them, and I can say right here in regard to the one in wlii(;h I am personally inter- ested that I am perfectly willing you shoidd begin with what I am in- terested in, but you should make the reduction pro rata in the same ratio you do on all other industries. Mr. Payne. If you made that reductioTi large enough it would de- crease the price of wages, would it not? Mr. HoLDEN. If you collect Mr. Payne. Will you answer my question? Mr. Hold EN. If you will collect the present amount of revenue which is essential to carrying on the expenses of the G-overnment which were instituted by a former administration it will be all the protection I want on any industry. Mr. Payne. As a capitalist yourself, but if you made a large enough reduction it reduces the price of wages'? Mr. HoLDEN. Yes, sir; I stated the same thing. Mr. Payne. You do not desire the reduction to amount to such that will rednce the price of wages even in your industry? Mr. HoLDEN. No; I do not. . Mr. Gear. You have an average protection at the current market price of lead of about 37 J per cent; a cent and a half duty is about that? Mr. HoLDEN. Yes, sir; I think so. Mr. Gear. You are willing to have that average protection on other industries of the country? Mr. HoLDBN. Perhaps. It depends upon the policy to be adopted. Mr. Gear. All around on everything? Mr. HOLDEN. I am willing to have that, provided it is the established policy; of course I do not want an exception made to lead ores. 456 METALS. Mr. Gear. You have got as liigli an average tariff as almost any- one. Mr. Payne. Tour opinion is that the inteiest of the Government re- quires such a policy should be established and jnaintained in this coun- try? Mr. HoLDEN. Tes, sir; I mean a tariff policy for revenue and inci- dental protection. Mr. Gear. There are, according to the reports, 55,000 or 56,000 men engaged in producing lead ores in this country under the present sys- tem. Now, you stated in your paper that a reduction of this tariff would seriously affect their wages and close up the mines? Mr. HoLDEN. 'No; I did not state that a reduction of the tariff would do that; I stated if the lead ores were admitted free it would. Mr. Gear. If lead ores were put on the free list your mines would have to shut up? Mr. HoLDEN. They would. Mr. Gear. Where would your 50,000 men go? Mr. HoLDEN. I do not know. Mr. Gear. They would gradually go to the farms and compete with the farmers' products ? Mr. HoLDEN. A great many have left and come East. Mr. Gear. And they have been brought in by the railroads free? LEAD ORES. (Paragraph 199.) STATEMEirr OF ME. HUGH N. CAMP, OF NEW YORK. Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen of the Committee: I appear before you to-day in behalf of the lead i^roducers of Missouri and its vicinity, and I respectfully ask the consideration of the committee to the following facts touching an industry built up in the United States by and under the protective system, which we shall show has been the law of the land ever since the industry began. First. The chief tariff changes, briefly stated, have been as follows: By the act of May 19, 1828, a duty of 3 cents per pound was placed on lead, which was reduced to 20 per cent ad valorem in 1842, but soon after was made 2 cents per pound. In 1846 it was again reduced to 20 per cent; again in 1861 it was raised to 1 cent per jiound; and again in 1864 to 2 cents per pound, where it has remained u^) to the present time. Until 1860, the production in the United States amounted to but little, but from that time the beneficent protection to this industry has built it up from almost nothing to a point that CTiables us to rely entirely upon our own resources for this important article of commerce. Our importations and productions for each decade since 1860 are as follows : Produced in U. S. Average ;New York prico r(^r pound. Value in market ai. Xiw York. Iniporta- tiim.s in gross. Value market at j^ow York. ] ftfin 70 Tons. i:i4. :ioo 424. 200 1 270, OOU Cents. $16,721,80.1 47, 880, 000 154,112,000 'fans. 222,000 141,110 ;12, 250 .$26, 760, 000 15, 000, 000 2, 780, 000 1870 'fto . , 188a '02 32 y ears 1, 828, 500 ^iVc 218, 513, 800 396, 260 44, 540, 000 LEAD ORBS. 457 The above table shows conclusively that as imports fell off our pro- duction increased and lower prices followed, and that we have built up an industry which employs not far from 10,000 to 15,000, and supports at least from 100,000 to 120,000 people in its various ramifications, and meanwhile we have reduced the price fully 2 cents per pound, or 33J per cent; namely from 6 to 4 cents jjer pound. Assuming that at least a portion of the lead produced was the out- come of silver, and if it were not for the lead contained in the ore the silver would not have been mined, we may add to the $218,000,000 at least $30,000,000 as the outcome of the article, thus making $248,000,000 as an additional wealth to this country since 1860. It must be especially observed that lead is a production of the earth, an article worthless until labor transforms it to an article of commerce, and consequently an absolute and direct addition to the wealth of the nation, differing in this respect from many industries which merely turn capital over and can be reproduced year after year. The value of this product in 1892 (in round numbers 180,000 tons) was, at New York. $14,400,000, and of this quantity the Virgin lead mines of Missouri and vicinity, which we especially represent, pro- duced about one-fifth, the State of Missouri alone since 1860 having produced lead to the value of $50,000,000. The mines operated by the St. Joseph Lead Company and the Doe Run Lead Company have been the largest producers in this country, having turned out, since their first working in 1866, over 182,000 tons, to the value of $14,500,000, having capital to the amount of $3,250,000, and employing about 1,200 people, all of whom get a comfortable living, and are enabled to educate their children, and are in every respect a valuable addition to our population. We now desire to show the reasons why this industry can not com- pete with Europe and Mexico entirely unprotected. The average labor paid by the great "Metternich mines" of Germany, one of the largest in the world, and a fair criterion of foreign labor, does not exceed 50 cents per day for all grades of labor; the wages of Mexico and Spain are about the same. It must be considered that the actual value of lead ore in the bowels of the earth is comparatively small, not over a quarter of a cent per pound, and that labor and transportation make fully from 85 to 90 per cent of its cost laid down in the market of sale. If labor in this country was the same as in Europe, or even 25 per cent higher, we would under- take to make lead as cheap as any otlier country in the world, but we can not compete with Europe and Mexico when we pay three times as much for labor as is paid in those countries. The cost of transportation from a geographical center of the mining districts of the United States, somewhere in the Eockies, to the geo- graphical center of the consumption, cost close to $20 per ton, while even from the Missouri mines to New York it averages $8 per ton. On the other hand, freight from Spain and Germany averages, by steam, not over $3 per ton to their markets, either at London, or New York, and by sail not over $1 per ton. From these facts it is evident that the foreigner has a clear advantage over us from 1 J to 2 cents per pound in labor and freight. To ascertain just where the foreigner, with these advantages of labor and freight, touch the bed rock cost of lead, we cite the Loiulon price, which, from 1860 to 1870, averaged £20 10s. per ton, or 4J cents a pound ; for 1870 to 1880, averaged £20 7s. per ton, or 4 a,- cents a pound; froip 458 METALS. 1880 to 1802, averaged £13 4s. per ton, or 3 cents a pound. At tlie pres- ent time it is £9 17s. Gd. per ton, or 2^ cents a pound. Tlie discoveries in Australia of mines enormously rich in silver have carried the London price down as low as £9 os. per ton, the lowest figure on record, and equivalent to 2 cents a pound. These prices are now shutting up the Euglish mines to a great extent, and are closing all the low grade mines ofSpain. If at these prices in Europe, with the low cost of labor prevailing there, they can not live, it goes without saying that it would be simply impossible for a great majority of the mines in the United States to sustain themselves if lead or lead ores shoidd be made free, or any radical change in the tariff be made. I hold in my hand a copy of a bill introduced by my friend Mr. Tarsney, in tlie House in the last Congress, permitting these ores of which I have been si)eaking, and which were changed in the McKinley bill, to come in free. I want to say very emphatically and without any reservation that the lead producers, rather than have this become a law, would prefer to have lead and lead ores free. Now, that is a startling proposition to you, and I will tell you why we make it. Free lead ores would undoubtedly stop mining ores in Missouri and in many States in the L nion, but we might as well have free lead ores all over the coun- try as to have them from Mexico. If you are going to have free lead ores in Kansas and western part of Missouri, let us have free ores from Spain at Boston, Philadelphia, Baltimore, and the seacost. We either want to have a chance of making some money Mr. Hopkins. Is Mr. Tarsney's bill to let in ores from Mexico free! Mr. Camp. Yes; and we might as well have lead and lead ores free. Mr. Hopkins. You are fi-om Missouri? Mr. Camp. I am treasurer of this Missouri corporation, but I am from ISTew York, and 1 say that with the importations of free Mexican ores, undoubtedly within a year and a half there will be ores enough coming here to supply the whole United States with lead. Mexico is very rich in lead and silver ores, and if they had the advantage of im- portation of free ores in Kansas and the western part of Missouri, it would work the whole lead industry a great deal of injury. Mr. Hopkins. What, in your judgment, would be the effect on the lead mines of Missouri if Mr. Tarsney's bill became a law? Mr. Camp. It would have the effect to ruin them. Mr. Hopkins. How many men are employed in the lead mines of Missouri ? Mr. Camp. Actually employed in the lead mines? Mr. Hopkins. Directly and incidentally. ]Mr. Camp. Probably not less than 10,000 people, directly and indi- rectly, certainly 8,000, and supporting a large population, taking the coal we use, and the wood we use, and machinery, and everything of the kind. In other words, the amount of labor which we employ directly and indirectly undoubtedly amounts to 8,000 or 10,00 people.' We desire to particularly protest against the treatment of lead ore as a raw material, and we ask whether an article worth only about J of a cent per pound, 500 to 1,000 feet below the surface of the earth, and which by labor has been advanced to 3^ and 4^ cents a pound, can possibly be called a raw material. Ores ready for shipment can not come under that ciitegory; they must be readied by costly shafts, blasted with expensive explosives, broken up and handled by hand in the cars, hoisted hy power to tlie surface, loaded again by cars and trans- ported to the dejiots for shi])nieiit. All this time they have advanced many steps toward a finished product, and have increased in value from LEAD OEES. 459 J of a cent per pound in the ground to 3J to 4 cents per pound laid down in the market. We desire to empliasize the fact that in its bearing on the TJuited States production, the importation of free ore is practically identical with the importation of free pig ]e:id. By rulings of the Treasury Department, there was imported from JMexico during the last few years, prior to 1891, not far from 100,000 tous of lead in the shape of silver ore free of duty; the McKinlcy bill changed this and they now pay duty on the amount of lead contahied, as per assay, and the result has been that over §1,175,001) duty was collected in 1891 and 18913; permit us to say that this ouglit not to be changed. There is no reason why a large additional revenue, so much needed, should not be gathered from this source. There is no doubt that tlie imi)oitation of free silver ores would give employment to a few refineries on the borders of the Rio Grand Kiver, but it is manifest to the most casual observer that the importation of free ore or free lead will rob the country of one- halt' at least of the wealth thus dug from the earth, and would instead send out of the country millions of dollars to enrich foreign mine owners and throw out of employment thousands of our own miners. We, therefore, respectfully appeal to your committee to leave the pres- ent duty on pig lead and ores as a necessary factor to the healthy growth of this industry to apply the same to all leads in silver ore as well. W e desire to call the especial attention of the committee to the fact that lead is one of the few articles which every country for its own protection must produce and be ready to produce. It is a contraband of war and one of its chief sinews. The German Government appreci- ates this so fully that it controls some of its largest lead mines, and it would be a sorry spectacle for this country to be called upon to defeTul itself against invasion, and by a shortsighted policy to have crippled itself so completely as to be unable to produce within its borders so important an article of amunition. For it must be remembered that lead mines and their development are the growth of years, and can by no possibility be quickly put into operation. This argument alone should make lead a class by itself, and an article which should be es- pecially fostered. This production should be the tirst to be protected and the last to be handicapped, since it rises above the ordinary influ- ence of trade into one of the defenses of the nation's necessities. In conclusion, Mr. Chairman, let me say that my observation as a merchant and a manufacturer for over 40 years has taught me that no one thing so disturbs the business of the country as the agitation consequent upon a change of tariff laws, and I have often said that I would rather live 20 years under a bad tariff than have two changes in the same time, even if they were good ones. I am one who believes that the terrible ordeal this country has been through during the past three months was brought about quite as much by the fear of changes in the tariff as by the silver agitation, and tlu\t if the Senate would at once' pass the Wilson bill, and the country be assured that the McKiu- ley bill, which, if not perfect, is to my mind as good a tariff' law as we have ever had upon our statute book, would be allowed to stand, that the clouds that now rest upon us and the fears of the business men of the country would pass away, and that the coming years would be among the most prosperous the country has ever known. One word more and I am done. If the fiat )ia-i gone forth that a new tariff bill must be made, then let the c be n i delay, let its know at the earliest possible moment our fate, so that we may enter the new 460 METALS. year with a full knowleclge of what is in store for us. This much I ask iu behalf of every business man in the land. Mr. Taesnet. You reside in New York? Mr. Gamp. 1 do. Mr. Tarsnbt. Your interests are in Missouri? Mr. Camp. Some are. Mr. Tarsnet. You are one of the principal owners of the St. Joe mines? Mr. Camp. I am quite a large owner. Mr. Taesney. How many men own that mine? Mr. Camp. We have about 230 stockholders; we have about 300 in the two mines I represent. Mr. Tarsney. Your principal interest in the maintenance of the tariff duties upon these ores is for the protection and benefit of the mine workers? Mr. Camp. It is, and, of course, also to sustain an industry in which we have $3,250,000, and which we put in in expectation and belief that protection would be the basis of the law. Mr. Tarsney. In the census statistics I find that the production of the lead mines of Missouri — those mines ijroducing simply lead and not anything, led production purely — for the year 1889 was 69,000,000 and some odd pounds. That was the lead product of Missouri? Mr. Camp. How many tons would that be? Mr. G-ear. Thirty-four thousand and a half. Mr. Tarsney. I find for the entire production of that lead in Mis- souri there was paid in wages $401,440.77. Mr. Camp. Permit me to state here that that amount had better be corrected. Mr. Tarsney. That is a matter between you and the census bureau. Mr. Camp. (Continuing). Because we pay almost as much as that ourselves. Mr. Tarsney. I find from the official reports of the Government that amount was the wages to the operatives in the lead-mining industry. There were paid contractors $8,525.55; supplies, etc., $244,783.84; rent and taxes, $142,153.55, making a total of $796,893.21. Now, in these figures it would appear the wages were a small percentage of the min- ing cost of producing lead in Missouri. I find also from this same re- port the value of the lead output from these mines was $1,571,161.04, or, in other words, upon the total outlay for wages, amount paid con- tractors, supplies, rents, taxes, etc., that of all this only amounted to ■ 50 -pev cent of the value of the ijroduct, and I find from this same report that you protected your miners by paying miners $1.13 a day; that you protected laborers by paying them $1.12 a day, and I find from this report in the Washington County Mines adjoining yours that $1 per day is the general rate and as low as 70 cents a day is paid for what is called common labor and not skilled miners. They need some protection, do they not? Mr. Camp. Are you through with your statistics? All I have to say in regard to that is this, that of the men in the two mines in which I am interested there is not a man who gets less than $1.12J per day; that is, on the common labor. We pay up to $4 a day for many of our men Mr. Burrows. Your foreman gets the highest price, I presume? Mr. Camp. The foremen get $1,600 a year, our captains. I was going to say the expenses of our mines, the two mines I am interested in, is not far from $16,000 a week. 1 mean by that, our labor and our LEAD ORES. 461 machinery -whicli we have to keep up in condition and with all of its various ramifications. I do not mean to say that all of this is paid directly for labor, but iu our mines we have to pay freight on wood and all the articles necessary for the mines, and we have an absolute expense of our two mines of not far from $16,000 a week, or $800,000 a year. What these statistics may show I do not know. Mr. Tabsney. These statistics show this. It shows, in regard to the lead industry of Missouri, that there are 21 foremen, at $2.19 a day; there are 206 mechanics, at $1.63 a day; there are 306 laborers, at $1.27 a day; there are 8 boys, at 72 cents, and there are 22 foremen, 411 miners, and 244 laborers working underground at wages I never heard stated. Let me go to another branch. Are you familiar with and watch your men's interests out there? Mr. Camp. I am. Mr. Tarsney. Are you familiar with the political nomenclature out there, what is known as the "Pluck-me" system? Mr. Camp. No ; I do not think I am. Mr. Tarsney. Are you aware it was made a political issue in that State, and that the legislative authority of the State was invoked to prevent you miners of lead in Missouri from establishing at your mines stores at which you compelled your miners to purchase all their sup- plies at such prices as you put upon them, and exhausted all of their wages in absolute necessities for themselves and their families, and that the power of the legislature of Missouri was invoked by criminal statutes to prevent you doing that in the year 1891 — let me be specific ? Mr. Camp. Are you through 1 Mr. Tarsney. I am through. Mr. Camp. I would say since the formation of our mines we have had a store of tlie St. Joe lead company only; that we have never asked a miner to buy at our store; that we allow other stores to come to the place and comiiete with us, and we have miners that never bought a dollar's worth of goods at our store from the time they commenced until the present time. Mr. Tarsney. Do you mean to say that the labor commissioner of Missouri did not report to the legislature of Missouri that your partic- ular mine is the most obnoxious in the State! Mr. Camp. I mean to say we have a letter from the commissioner that you spoke of — I wish I had it here — which speaks in the highest terms in the manner in which we treat our men and the liberality with which we treat our men. Mr. Tarsney. How did you come to expend $244,782.84 for supplies, when you only spent $400,000 for labor? Mr. Camp. I can not answer that. I do not think that is correct, but I do not know. Those are ligures I have not seen. Mr. Tarsney. Now, you have said that the bill introduced by my- self, and which passed the House of Representatives in the last Con- gress, to place these fluxing ores upon the free list Avould be more injuri- ous to the h^ad interests of Missouri than to put all kinds of lead and lead ore upon the free list. Mr. Camp. 1 did not say all ; I said equal. Mr. Tarsney. Have the lead miners, other than yourselves, in Mis- souri reasonable knowledge of their business industry; are they intelli- gent enough to know their own interests? Mr. Camp. I suppose so. Mr. Tarsney. Are not you aware of the fact that a large proportion 462 METALS. of the leael property of western Missouri is owned in my own city of Kansas City! Mr. Camp. Yes, sir. Mr. Tarsney. How do you account for the strange and anomolous fact Mr. ('Aiip. I wonld like to correct myself. You asked me if I was aware a large portion of the Western property was owned in your city. Mr. Tarsney. I said of western Missoui'i. Mr. Camp. Our mines are in soutlieasteru Missouri. Mr. Tarsney. How do you aicount for the fact during all the time from the time I introduced tliat measure uutil it was put through the House of Represeutatives that no one of my constituents, nor a person interested in lead production from the State of Missouri, ever made a request of me or auy member of the House not to pass it? Mr. Camp. I will answer that question by stating in the first place it was very natural the people of western Missouri and Kansas would want to have that, because by that they can make dollars where they are making cents. Why I would not want a better trust than the Kansas City i)eople will have if the bill which you introduced can be- come a law. Mr. Tarsney. They are not interested, not one of them, in the im- portation? Mr. Camp. You say they are not? Mr. Tarsney. Not one of them are interested in importing any ore. Mr. Camp. But they are interested in the Kansas City smelters, which would be about the same thing, and if your bill passed I should not want Mr. Tarsney. You are the only individual that I have yet heard speaking on the line you have been speaking, and I will ask you if you are aware of the fact that one of the delegates from the lead and zinc mining districts of westerii Missouri to the national Democratic con- vention at Chicago last year in the name of the operators and miners of that section presented to the chairman or the juesideut of that con- vention a zinc gavel, and in his S])eech — mind you they produce zinc and lead together there, and the effect upon one is an effect upon the other — he presented that gavel to the president of that convention in the name of the miners of Missouii with the statement that they wanted no protection. Mr. Camp. Western Missouri, if you please. Of course, western Missouri wants it. Western Missouri produces a little lead with zinc. Mr. Tarsney. It produces 20,000,000 pounds. Mr. Camp. We produce 00,000,000; three or four times as much. Mr. Tarsney. Three times as much. Mr. Camp. Oh, very well, I do not hesitate to say if I was a west- ern Missouri mine owner I should go in for your bill. It would be a great thing for the western Missouri miner — I think there is no ques- tion about that. It would transfer the whole lead interest of the United States right in that direction. Mr. Tarsney. I can not understand it. Mr. Hopkins (to Mr. Camp). You are not responsible for that? Mr. Camp. It A^ould have the result I tell you. I, as a lead miner, would just as soon have free lead as to have A'our bill passed through'. Mr. Tarsney. You do not desilverize any lead? Mr. Camp. Bo, sir; we are pure lead miners. Mr. Taesnet. You do not use a single pound of silver lead ores? LEAD OEES. 4.63 Mr. Ca:mp. ISTo, sir. Mr. Tausnby. Aud not a pound of galena ore is imported into the country 1 Mr. Camp. Tliat is true, sir, and why? Because we have kept the price down a cent a pound below the cost of importation. Mr. Taesney. Now, you were tor several years in the condition you would be in if that bill introduced by me would pass ? Mr. Camp. I would say the importation commenced at 3,000 or 4,000 aud the next year it was 10,000 and the next year it was 20,000 and then it was 30,000. That is the way it was. We found that there was such a large amount of lead being imported in competition that we put a stop to it. Mr. Tarsney. Is it not a fact during that period when, under the Treasury reguhitious, lead ores were coming in free that our lead was higher than it has been since 1890 when this duty was put upon it! Mr. Camp. That does not prove anything. It proves this in the first place the production of Europe has largely increased and prices have ruled very low there, and we have increased the production and lead has raled low here. Mr. Hopkins. You said something about the Kansas City smelters. What is the relatiou of the Kansas City Consolidated Smelter and the smelters on the border ? Mr. Camp. They are ail substantially one. Mr. HoPKi^^s. Under one combination? Mr. Camp. Yes, sir; the Kansas City Smelting Works is a gigantic concern. If this bill of Mr. Tarsney was passed it would be one of the greatest trusts in the country. I would not care to have a sugar trust or any other kind of trust if I could have such a thing as that. Mr. Hopkins. If there was a trust, instead of making it here they would seek to get free lead from the cheaper labor of Mexico 1 Mr. Camp. Yes, sir. If I was in the business I would give $100,000 to have that bill passed. Mr. Hopkins. Does this Mr. Myers live in Kansas City? Mr. Camp. Yes, sir. Mr. Tarsney. There was no smelter iu Mexico prior to the passage of the act of 1890, that is true. I take it for granted American capital has been driven out of America and invested in Mexican smelters, and the actual output of lead to-day from those smelters built by American capital in Mexico in competition with Missouri interests is more than 40,000 pounds. Mr. Camp. You have the statistics and I have not, but all I have to say is, it is a grand thing for Kansas smelters. Mr. Tarsney. It was a grand thing to have the peon labor of Mexico and let that come in competition with the labor of this country? Mr. Camp. I reiterate my statement that the lead miners would pre- fer free lead aud free ore than to have such a bill pass as that. Mr. Hopkins. I want to know whether there was any change made iu the labor of your mine after theintrodnctiou of the so-called McKiuIey bill, and if so what? Mr. Camp. Within two months after the passage of the McKiuley bill we increased our wages 10 per cent on the ground that we felt we were in a position to know what our condition was going to be for some time, and we kept those wages the same until about two months ago, when lead fell to 2| cents a pound in New York aud the question came whether we should close our mines or work at a loss. We concluded that we would prefer to work at » loss rather than to close them up, and 464 METALS. at that time we reduced the wages of one-half of our men 10 per cent. Mr. Tarsney. You state that iu 1890 you iucreased the wages of all the employes, the whole list of employ(§s in the St. Joe mines 10 per cent? Mr. Camp. I think every man; we increased our wages 10 per cent. Mr. Taksnby. Have not you had a strike since then? Mr. Camp. ISTo, sir; we have never had a strike there. Mr. Gear. Do not your mines deteriorate by closing? Mr. Gamp. Yes, sir. It would be ruinous to close them up, and therefore we would rather work it at a loss. It would be ruin to close them up for a year. LEAD ORES. (Paragraph 199.) The present duty on lead ores of $30 per ton is almost prohibition. Lead ores contain from -5 to 42 per ceut of lead. Three tons of lead ores yield upon an average about 1 ton of lead. The duty at ^30 per ton for 3 tons of lead ores amounts to $90, and will produce 1 tou of lead. The duty of lead in bars is $10 per ton; hence it discriminates against American labor in favor of the lead already extracted from the ores. The advocates for the retention of duty on lead ores claim that higher wages are paid in this country than anywhere else. The Elev- enth Census (House Mis. Doc. No. 340, part 1, Fifty- second Congress, first session) positively disproves this assertion. Page 167 of that re- port says : Hi must be noted that the average wages of the miners are lowered because of the low wages paid lu Washington County, Mo., where $1 per day is the general rate, and as low as 70 cents per day. Page ICG gives the amount produced in 18S9 to be 44,482 tons of lead, and their commercial value $1,571,161.94. On page 167 the cost of produ^ction is given thus for the State of Mis- souri : Wages paid $401 , 430. 77 equal to 25.5 per cent Supplies furnished 244, 783. 84 equal to 16.6 per cent Rent and taxes paid 142, 153. .55 equal to 9.1 per cent Paid to contractors 8, 525. 05 equal to 0.8 per cent Total expenses 796, 893. 21 equal to 51 per cent Commercial value $1, 571, 161. 94 Total expenses -- 796,893.21 Leaving a profit of 774, 268. 73 Equal to 49 per cent. Thus it will be seen that labor only received 25^ per 3ent, while the profits, according to census returns, were 49 per cent. These profits, as compared with payment for labor, are 92 per cent in favor of profits. Eeferring again to page 167, there were emiiloyed below ground 411 miners and 244 laborei's. The miners, upon an average, for underground work received $1.13 per day, but they were given work only during 218 days ; hence, they earned the sum of $246.34 for the whole yea.r of 1889 ; but as they had to live 305 days, this munificent sum of $246.34, spread over the whole year, gave them an earning upon an average a fraction over 67 cents a day. LEAD ORES. 465 Eeturning to tlie production and tlie cost of tlie same, the 44,482 tons of lead were produced, according- to census returns, at a cost of $79(5,493.21, equal to $17.91 per ton lirst cost. Considering that tlie duty on a ton of lead is $40 per ton it will be seen that the tax is over 123 per cent over the cost of production. Protection over 123 per cent on first cost, while labor receives only 25J per cent. As remarked before, it takes upon an average 3 tons of lead ore to produce 1 ton of lead. The present duty of $3Q per ton of ore is equivalent to $90 on the ton of lead. The cost of production being $17.91, labor and all other expenses included, bub as labor receives of the total cost only 2;")| per cent, or the sum of ■'?4.57 per ton for its share, to produce a ton of lead protection to the amount of $90 to enable the mine-owners to pay the munificent sum of •'J4.57 per ton is absurd Enormous as this evil is respecting the IMissouri lead tax extortion, that of Utah and Colorado is infinitely worse, and but for the oflicial returns published by the Director of the Mint, would be incredible. The Ontario Mining Company, of Utah (see Report Director of the Mint for 1887, p. Ill), produced 32,162 tons of ores at a cost of mining, reduction, etc., of $25 per ton of ores. From these ores they extracted 2,014 tons of lead, 1,908,668 ounces of pure silver and 927 ounces of pure gold. Cost of production : 32,162 tons of ores at $25 per ton $804. 050. 00 Sale of— 1,968,668 ounces of pure silver 1, 94S, 981. 00 927 ounces of pure gold 18, 540. 00 2,015 tons of lead 193, 746. 80 2,161,267.80 Cost of production 804,050.00 Net profit 1, 357, 217. 80 The silver alone covered the whole cost of production, leaving on that item alone a profit of $1,144,931, more than 140 per cent on the whole cost. The 2,015 tons of lead hence did not cost the inflnitesinuxl part of a cent to produce, and yet, on the 3 tons of ores the duty, if im- ported, would have been $90. Oji the lead itself, not costing one cent to produce the whole 2,015 tons, the duty is placed at $40 per ton, to protect the mine owners against so-called peon labor of Mexico. The Crescent Mining Company, of Utah, produced 5,209 tons of ores, which, according to their own report, cost them to mine, reduce, etc., $131,725. From these 5,269 tons of ores they extracted 2,107 tons of lead, 118,025 ounces of pure silver, and 150 ounces of pure gold. They sold the 118,025 ounces of silver for $110,844.75 and the 150 ounces of pure gold for $3,000, realizing a total of $119,844.75. Deduct this from the cost of production of $131,725, and the whole cost of producing 2,107 tons of lead was $11,881.25, equal to $5.64 per ton of lead, pro- tected by $40 per ton of duty; but the 2,107 tons of lead sold for $202,- 693.40, leaving a net profit of $190,812.40 on the lead. These 5,269 tons of ores produced 2,107 tons of lead, equal to 2J tons of ores to 1 ton of lead. Had these ores been imported the 2J tonjs would have been taxed $75 to produce 1 ton of lead. The Daly Mining Company, of Utah, rained 20,563 tons of ores at $25 per ton for mining, extracting, reducing, etc., extracting therefrom 1,005,760 ounces of silver and 78.3 tons of lead, at a cost of $514,075. The company sold the silver for $995,428, making a profit of $481,353 on T H 30 466 METALS. a half-million dollar investment. The lead thus produced was only a by-product not costing one cent to produce the same, yet there is a tax of $40 on a tou of lead to protect these rich mine owners, who appeal to Congress to protect them against peon or pauper labor of Mexico. The Colorado Adams Mining Company produced 6,527 tons of ores, which contained over 2,000 tons of lead and 54,245 ounces of pure sil- ver, cost of mining, reduction, etc., $82,905, as given by that company to the Director of the Mint and published in his report for 1887. The silver sold for $53,702.55, leaving $29,203.45 as the cost of producing 2,000 tons of lead, equal to ^14.60 per ton first cost, protected by $40 tariff tax. The same report of the Director of the Mint for 1887, on page 110, states 20 similar mines in Colorado which produced 18,890 tons of ores, from which were extracted 1,004,907 ounces of pure silver, 3,830 ounces of pure gold, and 639 tons of lead; total cost of mining, reducing, ex- tracting, etc., $652,3 , 0. The silver and gold sold for $1,002,100, leaving a profit of $349,790, or over 53 per cent on the cost of production. The 639 tons of lead sold for $54,275, all clear profit, and yet they ask pro- tection to the amount of $40 per ton of lead. Eespectfuily submitted. Ivan C. Migiiejls. MICA. (Paragiapli 202.) Boston, Mass., September 23, 1893. Sir: We ask that mica be put on the free list. The duty was im- posed at the request of the domestic miners; since the duty has been placed there has been little if any increase in the production of mica in ISTew Hampshire, Mr. Eandall, one of the prime movers, not having don-e any mining since then. In North Carolina there has been quite an active effort made, but tlie output is not much in excess of the last year or two previously (without the duty); aside from these there is but a trifling amount produced iu all other sections. We claim that the duty on mica is an unjust tax on the consumer, and should be re- pealed for these further reasons; First. Thebulkof theconsunix)tion is largely by electrical companies for insulation. Thfy require mica of a quality not found here, a softer, easier-splitiiig mica, and of an inferior quality. For stove use mica must be clear and clean ; for insulation the mineral qualities are chiefly desired — tliat ifc, that is insulate. For this purpose mica is used that stove iniinufacturers would not accept as a gift. Spotted, stained, cracked, inferior ])ieces will do if capable of splitting freely. Second These companies who have always (nearly) imported the mica they required from India, Canada, etc., have continued to do so and pay the duty. This company handles more mica tlian any other and for the past year has bought less than $1,000 of domestic mica, price being no object, and has imported from $100,000 to $150,000 of mica from India and Canada etc., paying the duty and beneiiting no domes- tic miner, except by the price being advanced for his benefit. We claim that it is most unjust that mica should be taxed to protect some one when it does not protect. When the duty was under consideration (McKinley bill) scein;; that it was bound to go, we then asked for a PENS. 467 discrimination in favor of Mexican mica bnt was refused, and it was all taxed alike. In this a very large proportion of the mica is imported in the rough or with the sheets roughly trimmed on edge to put in good shape for cutting here. Then all the mica is cut up here by domestic labor. We employ at times fully 100 hands working up mica, and the mica we handle gives employment to several hundred hands when worked up by our customers' factories. We sell large quantities uncut. This we have always considered an outrageous discrimination. We ask however for total repeal. We have mined largely in North Carolina and jSTew Hampshire and by not finding the mica we needed were forced to import. Yours, truly, American Mica Company, By Geouge B. Watson, Manager. PENS. (Paragraph 204.) Gentlemen : We respectfully ask the continuance of a specific duty of 12 cents per gross on steel and metallic pens. No increase of duty on pens was made in the McKinley biU, and the industry we represent was not in any way benefited by that measure. We submit the following reasons for your consideration : That while our industry is not a large one, it is important to the country. No demand for a decrease in duty on steel pens comes from the con- sumer, and any suggestion to that effect is from the foreign manufac- turer directly, or through those interested with them, on this side of the ocean, as imx)orters. If the duty should be reduced and our factories closed the consumer would probably not buy his box of pens 1 cent cheaper. Being a small and inexpensive article, the difference would go into the pock- ets of the foreign manufacturer and the dealers. The quantity of pens imported last year was578,100 gross, at a specific duty of 12 cents per gross, yielding a revenue to the Government of $09,372. The average rate figured ad valorem is 45 per cent, while the unit of average value is given as 27 cents per gross in the Government statistics. If the duty had been 45 per cent ad valorem instead of 12 cents specific, the foreign makers would probably have invoiced their goods about 8 cents per gross, without greatly undervaluing them as shown below, and the revenue which the United States Government would have received would have been about $21,000 in place of the $69,372, which was act- ually paid in. A large proportion of our business is in the manufacture of " imprint " pens; that is, with jobbing stationers' names stamped thereon. The average price which we can obtain for these pens is 22 cents per gross. The average cost price of our pens is 20 cents per gross ; the average cost price of pens in Europe is 8 cents per gross; specific duty, which we want, is 12 cents per gross, making cost of imported pens laid down here 20 cents per gross; average cost of pens in Europe is 8 cents per gross ; a 45 per cent ad valorem duty would be 3.6 cents per gross; would make the foreign pens cost here 11.6 cents per gross; average cost of our pens 20 cents per gross; average cost 468 METALS. of imported pens with a duty of 45 per cent ad valorem is 11.6 cents per gross, 8.4 cents per gross. Showing that with a duty of 45 per cent ad valorem European pens could be lauded here at 8.4 cents per gross less than our pens cost to make. Six factories are engaged in making pens in this country. There are about twenty processes in the manufacture of i)ens, most of which are by hand, making labor the principal item of cost; our wages are more than double those paid abroad. While an ad valorem duty of 45 per cent appears to be a fair protec- tion, it is not so in fact in our case, as the great bulk of pens imported are "imprint" work, as mentioned above, and cost but 8 cents per gross on an average. Any reduction of duty would seriously affect, if not destroy and throw into foreign hands, the largest part of our business, without the least benefit to consumers, and at the same time decrease or entirely take away the wages of our employes, much the largest proportion of whom are women. Any change by way of reducing the duty is to give the advantage of the market to the foreign producer. From long exi)erience, it is our judgment that a specific duty is the only way to counteract fraud and evasion. We therefore most earnestly urge that you continue the duty on steel and metallic pens 12 cents per gross specific. Very respectfully. The Esteebeook Steel Pen Company, Camden, N. J. The Millee Bros. Cutlery Company, ileriden, Conn. Turner & Harrison, Philadelphia, Pa. QUICKSILVER. (Piiragiaph 207.) Boston, September 18, 1893. Sirs : The undersigned, representing the quicksilver manufacturers of California, begs leave to submit to your honorable committee the following facts in regard to the manufacture of quicksilver: Quicksilver in the United States is produced only in California, and is an important interest there, giving employment to more than 5,000 men at good wages, and representing a large amount of invested capi- tal. The only other countries producing this article are Spain, Aus- tria, and Italy; the first two producing the largest amount, and owned and worked by the Spanish and Austrian Governments, Italy produc- ing but a small amount. The i)rodiict of the Spanish mines is virtually mortgaged to the Bothschilds to repay a loan, which arrangement con- tinues ux) to 1900. • Until tlie discovery of the American mines, quick- silver brought a very higli ])rice— more than tjjree times wlmt it is selling for at present, and tlje production of the California mines has, therefore, since their iliscovery, practically controlled the price of quicksilver in tlie w(n'ld 1).\' preventing the .S])anish and Austrian mines having a monopoly. Tiicse two mines — Aimaden in Spain, and Idria in Austria — arc very rich, aud hold immense reserves. The gi ade QTTICKSILVER. 469 of ore in the Almaden is about 11 per cent, and the Idria about the same. The grade of ore in the California mines averages but little over 1 per cent, and they have practically no reserves, but are dei^eud- ent on their yearly developments of ore. Statistics of the expenses of working the mines abroad and in Cal- ifornia show that the average number of tons handled per each work- man in the Spanish mines is a little over 6 tons, while in the California mines (J3 tons per workman are extracted, showing the superior intel- ligence and energy displayed. Comparing year by year the Spanish mine with the New Almaden of California as to the amount of rock mined, we find that in the Spanish mines nearly 98 per cent was good enough ore to put into the furnaces, while in the New Almaden of California 24 per cent only could be used, showing three-fourths of all the rook mined was waste. The wages paid, res]5ectively, are as follows : . At Almaden, in Spain — Miners in ore, per day $0.81 Miners in barrou rock 57 Masons in quarries 1. 03 Lumbermen 55 Furnacemen 40 At New Almaden, in Califin-uia — Surface and underground laborers, per day - 2. 00 Furnacemen 1. 75 Timbermen 3. 20 Miners 1 2.80 Carpenters - 3. 04 Blasters 2. 75 Surface miners 1. 50 The New Almaden being taken asatfin'ding the most complete figures but a fair sample of the whole. About 80 jier cent of the total cost of a flask of quicksilver in California is labor. In 1878 California had 30 producing mines, in 1893 she has but 9, the decrease being largely due to the declining prices, and at which they could not be profitably worked. The cost of producing a flask of 76J pounds at the Spanish mines averages $7.86. The cost of producing a flask at New Almaden was, in 188G, $29.14; 1887, $23.10; 1888, $27.85; 1889, $31.38; 1890, $28.20; 1891, $46.57, the ore running extremely low in 1891 and no better in 1892. The cost per flask in '"1886, 1887, 1888, 1889, 1890, and 1891 was a fair average for all the mines; so with the i)resent selling price of about $37 per flask the margin for return on capital investments is. ex- tremely small. The amount of production for the past five years has been as follows : 1888, 33,250 flasks; 1889, 2,s,8S3 flasks; 1890, 22,615 fla.sks; 1891,25,584 flasks; 1892, 27,000 flasks. The anu)unt produced in this country is about equal to its needs at present. I beg to call your attention to the fact that were the mines of California to be closed down, as they must inevitably be unless some i)rotection is aflbrded, that the whole power of making the price would lie witli the Spanish and Austrian govern- ments, and we should be at tlieir mercy. When tlie duty lias been so low as to cause this shutting down, this has been the case heretofore. We are now protected by a duty of 10 cents per pound and the flasks filled with foreign quicksilver are subject to tlie same duty as if empty. This is little enough, and we ask, in consideration of the amount of capital involved, over •'!i30,000,()i)0, and the labor employed, comprising over 5,000 men at liberal wages, that the duty be not reduced but kept at the present rate. 470 METALS. A gain, any reduction of duty would not bring in an increased revenue. Quicksilver is an article which can be used only for specific purposes, within narrow limits, and the price has little to do with the consumption. A low price will not extend its uses, which are confined to amalgama- tion, vermilion, and mercurial preparations. As it is used over and over again in mining, the slight duty cuts no figure there, and all prepa- rations of mercury are protected by a duty higher than that on quick- silver, so that no detriment is worked to their interest. Again, the specific duty of 10 cents gives us protection when most needed — i. e., when the price is low — which an ad valorem duty does not do, but affords greater protection when least needed — i. e., when the price abroad is higher. The quicksilver mines of the country are struggling for existence because of the low prices existing, and were lower prices to come would have to succumb to foreign competition. The average of ores now being- worked is but a little over 1 per cent, yielding 20 pounds of quicksilver to the ton of rock, while the Almaden of Spain yields over 10 per cent, or 200 ]3ounds to the ton, a difference in favor of the SjJanish mines of 180 pounds. Yours, respectfully, W. B. BUCKMINSTEE, General Manager, Wapa Cons. Quiclcsilver Mining Co. ^tna Cons. Quicksilver Mining Co. WATCHES. (Paragraph 211.) New Toek, September 22, 1893. Sir : We Import clocks. But a few corporations manufacture them in this country. At a tariff of 30 per cent they all become rich. A duty of 45 per cent was i3ut on them by tie preseut tariff for the benefit of a few, and the cost of the masses. Clocks are no luxury; they are a necessity for rich and poor. We import watches; no article of luxury either. The very shopgirl, if not in i^roper time to work, will have a certain amount deducted from her wages. Watches pay, as before, 25 per cent. Without any duty at all our American factories, by their improved machinery, can easily compete with European labor. A duty of 10 per cent would certainly protect them according to their arrangement with jobbers. The American watch-manufacturers don't sell to the dealer direct. They sell to the jobber only, and the jobber is duly bound to charge an advanced price of 15 per cent. This was done to induce jobbers to drop imported watches and handle American watches in preference. We can buy the American watch cheaper in Europe than here. We import music boxes. They paid formerly 25 per cent duty, were raised by McKinley tariff to 45 per cent. Music boxes are not made in this country at all; never were made here. They bring joy and pleasure to the working classes as the piano does in richer houses. That pleas- ure should not be refused them. On gold and silver jewelry, silverware, a former duty of 25 per cent well balanced the difference between European and home labor. A duty of 45 per cent was put on them. METALLIC BEDSTEADS. 471 1 may add, tliis statement is not made for any personal benefit. We liave not suffered in business tlirougli the liigiior tariit, but we con- sider it unjust. Yours, respectfully, A. Feankfield. Metallic bedsteads. (Paragraph 215.) Wednesday, September 6, 1893, STATEMENT OF MR. W. 0, WHITCOMB, OF BIRMINGHAM, CONN. Mr. Chairman : I appear before j'our committee as president of the Whitcomb Metallic Bedstead Company, of Birmingham, Cdnn., a cor- poration engaged in the manufacture of metallic bedsteads — brass and iron bedsteads, in other words. I do not propose to take up but very little of your valuable time, although, perhaps, it will be better for me to briefly state the history of this euterjirise, so you can see the justness of our claims, etc., and be fully informed. I was formerly an importer in the city of New York and was in the habit of going to Eurojie annu- ally to make extensive purchase of those bedsteads. I was engaged in the business six years as an importer, in H'ew York, and becoming convinced of the rapid demand for" these bedsteads by tue growth of of the business, and satisfied in my own mind that the goods would eventually be manufactured in the United States, and that our import- ing business would cease, I withdrew from my old concern and started this enterprise. It has now been in operation about three and one-half years, during which time we have invested in buildings the sum of about $00,000, and in our plant, etc., the sura of about $100,000; so we have about $160,000 invested in our business, including our buildings, etc. We have never yet taken any money out of the business at all, and we are just now getting on our feet, so to speak, and able to manufacture. The goods we are now producing we are selling at from 10 to 20 per cent less than I formerly obtained for the same goods I im- ported from England. The present duty under the McKinley bill is the same as it was under the Morrill bill, or the former bill. There has been no change in the duty; it is 45 per cent, the goods coming in as manufactures of metal. The duty on the raw material — we import some parts of the material which go into the bedstead — and tlie duty on those is the same, 45 per cent. We appear this morning, and the gentlemen wlio are with me, come in the interest of another concern engaged in the same business, to appeal to your committee to make no reduction in the present tariff. We do not ask any advance, but we think the present tariff as it exists is but a fair one, and the one thing "which is necessary for us to make a successful competition, for the wages which we pay in our business are from 100 to 200 per cent more than our employes would get on the otlier side. Mr. Payne. Can you give us tlie comparative scale of the wages paid in this country and on the other side? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir. The wages we are paying our men will average $2, $3, and 84 per day. Tln-y work on piece work, and the same men would get from 18 to 20 shillings or perhaps 25 shillings on an average 5 that would be $4.50, $5, and 'jiG. 472 METALS. Mr. Payne. I would like to know wlietlier tliey do the same amount of work per day? Mr. Whitcomb. They do not do any more work here than on the other side. That is the common misapprehension, I think. I have never been able to see that a man has tnnied out two ortliree times as much work under the American atmospliere as they do under the English. We manufacture these goods on both sides. Gentlemen who compose this corporation have been engaged in the manufacture of these goods in England and also here, and we have some of the same men who worked for us on the other side and the same men come over here and get two or three times the wages on this side that they got on the other; we are obliged to pay it. Mr. Payne. Do not they serve a longer apprenticeship over there as a usual thing? Mr. Whitcomb. I do not think so. Usually it is customary for the children of these workmen on the other side to follow along in the line of their fathers. Usually when the father works at manufafturing bedsteads, his claldren are likely to go in the shop and follow in his footsteps. Just as here we have a man; we have five of his family in the works now, girls and boys, following in that trade. Mr. Payne. You do not think there is much difference in the relative skill of the workmen there and here'^ Mr. Whitcomb. We have not been able to see it; no, sir. In our works our operatives are made up of all classes, Germans, Swede.", Americans, Irishmen, and all nationalities there. We started with about 10 men, and we have had this year as high as 125 operatives. We now, owing to the depression in business, have reduced the force to 40 or 50; we were obliged to suspend operations during the month of July and we are now running three days in the week. 3Ir. Payne. With forty or fifty men? Mr. WHtTCOMB. We have seventy- five operatives now working- three days in a week. Of course we have this investment made and we have got to continue in business; we do not propose to go out of business under any circumstances. The only thing for us to do in the e\'ciit of a reduction of the tariff will be to get ourselves on the same plane that our competitors are on. Of cnurse we can not continue and do not expect, and our men do not expect they are able to get from us or we to maintain the same scale of wages. Mr. Hopkins. What do you mean by sayiug you will get on the same plane? Mr. Whitcomb. Our competition comes from foreign goods entirely.* There are but comparatively few manufactures in this country at the present time. Mr. Hopkins. You inean you must reduce the wages to your em- ployes? .Air. Whitcomb. Yes, sir; of course, we will be obliged to. Mr. Hopkins. You say that competition comes from al)road? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir; we compete with the foreign goods. With the reduction in the tariff, of course they are less liable to the compe- tition, and in f;tct to-day there are probably per cent of their bed- steads sold in tills country to one of American. Mr. Payne. What i)ercentage of the cost of your goods is labor? Mr. Whit( ;omb. The cost of goods to-day is from 30 to 35 per cent of labor. Mr. Payne. What is your raw material? Mr. Whitcomb. What percentage is raw material? METALLIC BEDSTEADS. 473 Mr. Payne. What is it; is there any labor expended on it before it comes to you! Mr. Whitcomb. No, sir; not much; it comes in a pretty raw state; some parts come liuished. We buy a good many parts, which go into our bedsteads, made by other concerns. We buy at present because we can not do better. Tliese parts are made from the raw material into the iinished parts of the bedsteads, and we buy these parts and finish them and apply thorn to tlie bedsteads. Mr. Dalzbll. Where does your competition come from? Mr. Whitcojib. (Jhieily abroad. Mr. Dalzell. Where abroad 1 Mr. Whitcojib. Birmingham, England; that is where all the bed- steads are made, uine-teiiths of them. As I said, there are three or four times as many foreign bedsteads sold in this country as American bed- steads. The American manufacturers are all creations of the last three years. There are a number of these — ten, I think — which now have started in this business and are more or ]ess advancing. Some of them have not got to producing goods yet and some are just starting. There is one in Jersey City, one at Lockport, N. Y., and some other loca- tions. Some have not put anvthing on the market yet. Now, after three or four years struggling away at this thing we have gotten it into a shape wliere we are i)utting in goods snpeiior to the foreign goods on the market for less price than we formerly could have imported the goods. Mr. HoPKtNS. Do I understand you to say the articles you are speak- ing of are being given cheaper to the consumer than before this duty was put on by the McKinley bill 1 Mr. Whitoomb. The duty was not put on under the McKinley biU. Mr. Hopkins. Well, before they were manufactured here ? Mr. Whitcomb. Oh, yes, sir: they are much cheaper. Goods are sold here now — as I said before, I am selling goods liere which we man- ufacture at 10 to 20 per cent less than I used to sell goods as an im- porter. Mr. Burrows. When was your concern started ? Mr. Whitcomb. Three and a half years ago. Mr. Burrows. How much have you invested ? Mr. Whitcomr. A bont 8160,000 in buildings and plant. We have just built that large building (exhibiting photograph) this last year. That cost about $20,000 without anything in it. As I say, we appear before you to appeal to your committee in regard to these bedsteads. They come in as manufactures of metals and we do not see how we cau compete, without a very heavy reduction in wages, with a reduced tariff for these goods. The tariff is not high, I think; I do not consider it so. Mr. Burrows. Is it satisfactory now ? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir; it is satisfactory. We appeal to your com- mittee to maintain this daty and if possible to reduce the duty on some raw material which we are obliged to impart and which we can not get in this country successfully at the present time. We formerly imported extensively, but we are gradually ceasing importing and are iirobably not importing more than 1.5 per cent of what we imported when we started in business.' There have been some things on which I think the tariff might be reduced, because I do not see the consistency of a tariff' on the raw materials equal to that on the fiuistied iiroduct. Mr. Payne. What is this 1.5 per cent 'I Mr. Whitcomb. We import a material, what we call case tube; tliat 474 METALS. is au iron tube whioli goes in tlie brass tube, wliicli is used for bedstead purposes almost exclusively. Mr. Payne. Is this 15 per cent you import now largely of these case tubes 1 Mr. Whitcome. Is largely now of a special kind of bedstead tubes which we use for iron bedsteads. This is a tube (exhibiting sample) which is used for bedsteads exclusively and is made on the other side, and our tube-makers on this side have not cared yet to make them. It is a light-weight tube and they say the demand is not sufficient here for them to make preparations and lay down a plant. We expect to be able to buy this all here, but up to the present time we have not been able to do so. Mr. Payne. Is there not as much labor represented on that as on your article? Mr. Whitcomb. Ko, sir; it is rough tube. I can show you a piece of it if you like. Mr. Payne. It has not been polished or turned up? Mr. Whitcomb. No, sir; it is a plain close-joint tube. Mr. Hopkins. When you say there is 30 to 40 per cent labor in your work, you take that as raw material? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir. Mr. Hopkins. And you do not consider the labor involved in that? Mr. Whitcomb. That is our individual labor after it gets to us. We take this and shape it into bedsteads and finish it. There is a class of stuff you see we make (exhibiting book) and it all comes to us in long lengths, and then we have to shape it up and fix it. At present, for in- stance, that tube pays 45 per cent, and we pay more duty on some classes of raw material than on the finished product. Mr. Hopkins. What you call raw material is the finished product of some other manufacturer? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir; we admit that; we do not claim that this is raw material. Mr. Payne. This is all ad valorem duty? Mr. Whitcomb. This is ad valorem and this is specific (exhibiting same). Mr. Dalzell. Where does that come from? Mr. Whitcomb. Birmingham, England. Mr. Hopkins. Is not that article produced in this country? Mr. Whitcomb. That particular article is not. This is what we call a close-joint tube, and it is made out of rolled iron and they can not make this as well on this side as the other, or rather they do not want to make it. The tube manufacturers claim that there is not a sufficient demand for this particular weight of tubes, as it will not stand the pressure of steam or water, and they say they do not care to work in it. Mr. Payne. But if all of this bedstead business was manufactured here Mr. Whitcomb. They would make that; it only wants a demand. Mr. Hopkins. In other words, the development of the interest you represent here would create a demand which would be met by the man- ufactures of such articles in this country ? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir; that is done in all other businesses. We are buying now from one to ten thousand dollars worth of goods in this country that was never made here before, and, moreover, people have come to us and said that "if you men would give us orders, that wiU be an encouragement to us to expend this money in making these plants and patterns, and all of this, we will make them for you." They METALLIC BEDSTEADS. 475 ■would not toncli them unless we give them orders so that they could certainly see their way to getting their money back. Mr. Hopkins. In other words, they are not willing to invest their money on an uncertainty? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir; exactly. I might say in this connection, while I think of it, in regard to this particular business, we started this business three and a half years ago. The scheme was all prepared and all laid out, and capital all provided for, and the enterprise all planned, ready to start three years prior to when we did start, but when the agitation of the tariff commenced, and the prospect was we did not know what would be done, and there was a probability of the reduc- tion of the tariff, we dropped the whole thing for three years, and I continued importing and going to Europe and buying goods. We did not dare to invest our money in that enterprise on an uncertainty, and later on, when the thing was determined and the policy was to be con- tinued, we went ahead and spent our money and built the factories, but before that we did not care to do it; we could not start the busi- ness; it was absolutely impossible. It would have been suicidal for us to start the business without a protective tariff'. Mr. Hopkins. Has this tariff you speak of worked beneficially or otherwise to the consumers of this country? Mr. Whitcomb. It has been decidedly beneficial; as I have said we are selling goods much cheaper than I sold the foreign goods and our prices are reducing all the time. We have reduced our prices ever since we commenced manufacturing. Mr. Hopkins. And the quality of the articles manufactured on this side of the water compare how with those on the other side of the water ? Mr. Whitcomb. They are a much superior goods. Mr. BuKEOWS. Taking a sample bed of the production, which, for instance, live years ago you sold to the retail trade, what can it be sold for now ? Mr. Whitcomb. We are selling a bed to-day for $6 that we used to get $7.50, $8, and $8.50. I have had as high as $8.50 for a bedstead we are selling to-day for $6, better finished, a better mounted bed, and better in every particular. You can go to Chicago and see the goods on exhibition there to day, our goods are exhibitied in the Manufac- tures building, and compare them with foreign goods, and if they are not superior, if the line of goods on exhibition of American manufac- tures are not superior to the English I am much mistaken. The English goods are more elaborate, more expensive goods, something beyond the general ability of people to buy, but for staple goods that everybody can buy our goods are very much superior, and the public, can decide for themselves. Mr. Geae. The tariff act of 1890 stimulated your business? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir; as I said, the tarift' act of 1890 was no change from what it was before. There was no change in the McKin- ley bill ; it remained as it was before. Mr. Hopkins. The only benefit of the tariff was that the tariff was to remain stable? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir. Mr. Hopkins. And you had a certainty for the investment of your capital and the development of your business? Mr, Whitcomb. Yes, sir; that is it exactly. We had confidence to go ahead with our business and that is what we did. We started right in from the ground, broke the ground, and built the whole thing. 476 .METALS. Mr. BuEEOWS. How would it affect your industry to reduce the duty now! Mr. Whitoomb. Of course we would be obliged to meet competition. A reduction of duty would open us to cuts, of course, and u further influx of foreign goods. As 1 stated a few minutes ago, there are prob- ably two or three times as many foreign goods sold here to-day as American goods, and, of course, with a reduced duty they would flood the country with them, but we would continue in business and be obliged to reduce wages and curtail at every point. Mr. TuENEE. Yon mean you would have to reduce the price on your goods also? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir; we should in some way reduce prices in order, of course, to meet the competition, and the first thing would be, of course, on the labor. Mr. TuENEE. How do you attribute the concessions you are making to your customers to the operation of the tariff, if taking the tariff off will reduce the prices still more? Mr. Whitcomb. The point is, these goods are imported, they come and go into the importer's hands. He has to have his price to get a profit, he can not do it otherwise because he has to carry a large stock of stuff and take chances of damage and distribute them all over the country to the consumers and he has to have that intermediate profit. We as manufacturers sell direct to the trade. Mr. TuENEE. If vou have reduced your price from $7.50 and $8 to -Sti Mr. Whitcomb. That is the retail price. Mr. TuENEE. How have prices on the other side been, what course have they taken, have they gone up or do^vnf Mr. Whitcomb. The prices on the other side have been about as low as they can get them there on account of the extreme competition. Mr. TuENEE. You put your prices down in fact in order to compete with those goods? Mr. Whitcomb. We are obliged to have our prices, of course, in range with those of foreign goods. Mr. TuENEE. Is it not a fact, then, that your concessions to your customers are due more to the competition of the cheap foreign goods than to the tariff? Mr. AVhitcomb. No, sir. Mr. TuENEE. What part of your concessions to your customers is due to the tariff' and what part to this competition? Mr. Whitcomb. The reduction in the price of our goods is neither due to competition nor the tariff'. We manufacture our goods Mr. TuENEE. Then you modify what you stated just now. Mr. Whitcomb. I may have misunderstood it. I will ask you to state your question once more. Mr. TuENBE. You are proceeding and I would like to have your ex- planation in your own way. Mr. Whitcomb. I was saying our tendency in prices is downward. Mr. Ttjenee. Then you do not attribute it to the protective tariff'? Mr. Whitcomb. I do not attribute our downward prices. They are the same as anything else in getting out a large volume of goods. ' The more goods we sell the better oui- showing will make. We do not want a large profit; we want a large sale. Mr. TuENBE. If you had kept your price on the article mentioned to $7.50 or $8 would not the foreign goods have come in and undersold you? METALLIC BEDSTEADS. 477 Mr. Whttcomb. No, sir; those were foreign goods that we were selling. Mr. Turner. Then you bought cheaper? Mr. VVhitcomb. We bought not necessarily cheaper; there was no competition for American goods. Mr. Turner. Then you mean by your illustration to state that the tariff had nothing to do with this, that it was a business arrangement of yours to make this reduction in prices! Mr. Whitoomb. Yes, sir; our idea was to get the goods out as soon as possible and sell them. Mr. Turner. If the tariff was taken off the goods could not you sell cheaper ? Mr. Whitcomb. We could if we reduced our wages down and get the goods out cheaper as would be the natural result of competing with foreign goods at a much less cost of production. Then Ave could sell our goods for less because the cost of making them would be less. Mr. Turner. I misuaderstood you. I thought you were an imj)orter. Mr. Whitcomb. I was. Mr. Turner. Then you are one no longer. You are competing with the importer! Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. How much would it reduce wages'? Mr. Whitcomb. The rate of wages, as I stated to the committee a few minutes ago, we pay our men on an average of from 100 to 200 per cent more than what they could get on the otlier side. We have men working in our place to-day, and I have seen the same men working in England for 18 shillings, $4.50, a week. Mr. Gear. How much money is engaged in this business? jVlr. Whitcomb. I think there are about ten manufacturers. Mr. Gear. How many employes! Mr. Whitcomb. We have had as high as 125 in our factory, and I presume there are probably four or five other concerns which perhaps may have had as many more. Mr. Gear. It would be about 600 or 700 people! Mr. Whitcomb. I should think so. Mr. Gear. How much capital is there employed in this business in this country! Mr. Whitcomb. Judging from my own business, and assuming my competitors are quite as well off as I am, I presume likely half a rail- lion of money. There is the Westlake Company, of Chicago ; of course I can not tell exactly how much that is, but there is the Gcmld Merce- reau Company, the Buffalo Company, of New York— they have $100,000 capital, and we have $100,000 — and there is $200,000 in those two con- cerns. I presxime our competitors are as well off. Mr. Burrows. It was suggested if the duty was taken off you could sell this product cheaper; how much business would you do if yoa took oif the duty and kept up the price of wages! Mr. Whitcomb. I do not see how we shonld be able to do anything, as these goods would come in so much cheaper than we coald sell them. Mr. Burrows. It would stop your business! Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir; we could not make any competition and maintain the same scale of wages. Mr. Burrows. You would go out of business entirely iu the United States, and what would be tbe effect on the foreigners! Mr. Whitcomb. If the manufactarers of the United States were 478 METALS. wiped out of the business the importers would coutinue to import goods at the same price I did, $7.50 for a bed we are selling at $6. That is the way it worked before, and that is the way it would work again. I have been on both sides in this business. We have made goods in England and in America, and we know what we paid in wages on the other side and here, and at what price we sold the foreign goods in this country and the domestic products, and the consumers are getting the goods cheaper to-day. Mr. BuEEOWS. Have you made a statement in regard to the rate of wages paid on the other side? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir ; I have made that statement. I have seen girls working there who got 7 and 9 shillings a week — that is, on the other side. That would he $1.75 to $2.25, and we do not pay any of our girls less than $1 a day and from that to $7, $8, and $9 a week, according to their ability to do piecework. We would not dare to offer a girl $2 a week to do work if she did not have any experience at all. In regard to woven-wire mattresses, a thing we sell a great many of, I have made the same goods right in New York Oity and paid a man $14 a week, and I have seen the same man work on the same identical thing for $4.50 a week on the other side. I have seen that of my own personal experience. He got 18 shillings a week. Of course, my position in this matter is to demonstrate that the develop- ment of this business is for the benefit of the consumer. There is a home competition in this business. We can not get any fancy prices for our stuff; we are competing with one another here and the goods are steadily being reduced in price, so much so that one of my com- petitors has clapped a mortgage on his factory. That did not surprise me, for I could not see how he could sell at the prices at wliich he was selling. Mr. Gear. Do you know anything about the social condition of workmen on the other side ? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir. Mr. Geae. How do they live there compared with the workmen whom you employ 1 Mr. Whitcomb. They do not live in any approach to the way they live here. Now to illustrate, I have a man who makes very high wages here. He is one of our foremen in one of our departments. He came from the other side, and that man had never made at the top price on piecework over $10 to $12 a week. He has made on the average — I have just gotten the averages out, as I have been obliged to look over our pay roll — that man has been making 40 cents an hour since we com- menced to make bedsteads. He had other men to work for him, but his net result was about $4 a day. Now that workman takes his family and goes to Europe this summer. Last year he came and wanted to know if he could not get a cottage down on the seashore] that he was going to the beach. Mr. Payne. That is the kind of a man who can buy Malaga grapes. Mr. Geae. From your observation and personal knowledge the same workman in this country receives far better than he would for work at wages you have indicated abroad! Mr. Whitcomb. Infinitely better. Mr. Payne. Where abroad, England? Mr. Whitcomb. Birmingham, England. Mr. Geae. Do you compete with any other country? Mr. Whitcomb. Not for bedsteads. Mr. Geae. Wii'e mattresses? METALLIC BEDSTEADS. 479 Mr. Whitcomb. 1^0, sir; we can mate wire mattresses cheaper Bere than they can on the other side because the lumber is so much less. The Chairman. You say you have made these metallic bedsteads both in England and here? Mr. Whitcomb. My partner was a manufacturer in England, and I used to go over there and buy goods when I was an importer, and he came over here and started the business with me, and while I did not personally make them myself, he has, and it substantially demonstrates Avhat I stated that we have made goods on both sides. He was a man- ufacturer for 15 years. The Chairman. You say you now employ the same men you worked over there? , Mr. Whitcomb. We have some men, we have about six here — six or seven men who came over here with us. We had to start the business and we needed experienced men, whom we could not obtain here. The rest of our employes have been picked right off the streets of the town — every one of them. We have men to-day, plenty of men, I presume 25, who were hired at $1 .50 a day, who are now making $3 and $3.5(» a day. Those wages were a little abnormal, because ours was a new in- dustry, our piecework, etc., and to a certain extent it was experimental, and they have reaped the benefit of our experience. Those same men who came in at a dollar and a half a day have been making $3 and $3.50 a day. The Chairman. IsTow do you know of your personal knowledge what wages were paid in the English factories '? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir; I know from personal knowledge. The Chairman. Did you ever see the pay rolls? Mr. Whitcomb. I have not myself, but my iiartner has paid them off himself and he knows it exactly. The Chairman. But we are not asking in regard to your partner? Mr. Whitcomb, From personal knowledge I have only the testi- mony of those men. The Chairman. Do you know anything about the different hours of work in this country and in Birmingham, England? Mr. Whitcomb. They have in England, I think, they run the eight- hour day, but 1 do not think The Chairman. How many hours a day do you run? T\lr. Whitcomb. Ten hours a day, but that eight hours a day is not necessarily in all lines of business. The busines is done by piecework anyway, so the hours of labor do not enter into the cost; they make what they can. The Chairman. Have you any personal knowledge — and of course you come before this committee to enlighten them and we want you to speak from jiersonal knowledge and not hearsay — of the net product per hand in the Birmingham factory and your factory? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes^ sir; but in this way The Chairman. You stated it a little wliile ago. Mr. Whitcomb. A gentleman asked me if I thought there was any greater capacity in turning out work here, and I said I did not think there was, because I did not see why there should be. They had the same appliances, etc., and there could be no particular reason, that I could see, why they should do more work here. The Chairman. I understood you to say the prices also of these bedsteads have fallen considerably in the last three years? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Have the prices fallen in England as well as here? 480 METALS. Mr. Whitoomb. I do not think there has been as much change there, because tlie couiijetition in England has been for years to a very fine point. There are a very large number of manufactories, and they are competing with each other to tlje very knife, you know. The Chairman. Then you further suggested if the tariff' was re- moved these manufacturers would put up their prices of goods here? Mr. Whitgomb. Yes, sir; I think the result would be that the prices would go up, for the reason the importer would go back; he could go back to the same prices he sold his goods at when there was no com- petition here. The Chairman. Now, the prices in England being made by sharp competition there, could they put up prices without a combination be- tween them? Mr. Whitoomb. Yes, sir; they have a combination between them. The Chairman. Do you mean to say they have a sharp competition and then a combination! Mr. Whitoomb. They have a combination to protect themselves. I had that direct about two days ago. The Chairman. They compete with each other and put their prices to the lowest notch, and then they have a combination to protect each other from each other? Mr. Whitoomb. They had got so low that they had to form a com- bination to get a profit, that is a fact. Mr. Payne. You do not mean to say there could be a combination without a protective tariff' ? Mr. Whitoomb. On the other "side, well I do not know. They com- pete with each other and protect themselves against the home trade as well as foreign. The competition here is keen enough among our- selves, I assure you of that, gentlemeu. The Chairman. Of what proportion of the beds sold in this country are still imported? Mr. Whii'comb. Of course, I have no means for knowing exactly, and it is only approximately that I can answer that question. I think to day there are probably three times as many foreign bedsteads sold as there are American bedsteads sold. The Chairman. Are there not probably as many sold now as there were before you began manufacturing? Mr. Whitoomb. Yes, sir; I think there are more. The Chairman. It has become the fashion? Mr. Whitoomb. Y'es, sir; the business has been increasing all the time and probably more are sold. They are becoming more used for general household purposes than they were formerly. It was a busi- ness here before we started, bnt as a matter of fact very few were made by American manufacturers, so they cost very liigh. The Chairman. How many employes did you say were engaged in this business? Mr. WHITC03IB. We have had in our concern about 125. The Chairman. How many other concerns are there! Mr. Whitoomb. I think there are nine or ten other concerns. The Chairman. Would tlicy employ I'J.") employi's each? Mr. Whitoomb. I should not imagine they would employ as many, as we are one of the leading concerns. The Chairman. Do you sujipose there are 500 or COO persons em- ployed ? Mr. Whitoomb. I presume so. METALLIC BEDSTEADS. 481 The Chairman. How many consumers do you imagine there are iu this country? Mr. Whiicomb. We hope there are 65,000,000 who will want our bedsteads. The Chairman. Tour interest is to get as good prices as you can for your product? Mr. Whitcomb. Our object is to sell the goods as extensively as we can and not at the greatest price. Our tendency is to sell goods at a fair price and get as large a sale as possible. We have to compete with these goods with wooden bedsteads and we can not get anything but a fair price for the goods. It is not the idea of manufacturing the goods and gettuig a high price for them. Mr. G-EAR. It is large sales which aggregate your profit? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir; unless we sold the goods at a low figure we could not compete with wooden bedsteads which sell cheaper than these; what we want is output. Mr. Gear. You have stated there has been a combine in England ? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. Has there been any combine in this country among the manufacturers 1 Mr. Whitcomb. No, sir; there has been no combination or an at- tempt at a combination. I think every manufacturer makes up his prime cost and puts his price at which he is willing to sell the goods at. That is our idea. Mr. Bynum. I understood you to say that your partner had been a manufacturer in Europe? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynum. When did he come over here and engage in manufac- turing? Mr. Whitcomb. Three and a half years ago. Mr. Bynum. What induced him to come over here? Mr. Whitcomb. The inducement was this: I was going abroad buying these goods, and I at one time made the remark to him (he is a young, energetic man and a thorough mechanic, good bedstead maker) and I said, "It is no place for you over here; you ought to be in Amer- ica," and I said, "I will tell you what I will do. If you will come over and associate with me in business, we will start a manufactory for these goods." He had no ties,- no family, and he said, "All right, I will think about it." He thought about it, and, as a result, he came over here. I furnished the money, and he had the practical experience, and we formed this business — this partnership; that is what induced him to come.. The Chairman. You were not a partner in the English establish- ment? Mr. Whitcomb. It is not an English establishment. Oh, over there, I was not a partner; no, sir. However, we started in England and made our plant in England and then brought it over here because I was en- gaged in other business iu New York and did not sever my relations there for six months or nearly a year after I started this. Mr. Bynum. How many men did I understand you to say he brought over with him ? Mr. Whitcomb. I think six skilled workmen came over. Mr. Bynum. Did they work on piecework over there ? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir; they worked on piecework over there. Mr. Bynum. And they work on piecework here? T H 31 482 METALS. Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir. Mr. Btnum. What were tlie prices paid there as compared here for piecework'? Mr. Whitcomb. 1 can not tell you the details of the price of the work. Mr. Bynum. You do not know the detail prices of the work? Mr. Whitcomb. I am not familiar with that, that is not my depart- ment in the business. Mr. Byntjm. Now, is it not a matter of fact that the amount of piece- work here is larger by reason of the improved machinery used? Mr. Whitcomb. No, sir; these bedsteads are made exactly in the same manner they made them on the other side, exactly; we make them on the English style. Mr. Bynum. Do not you know the English workmen do not allow the use of machinery like they do over here? Mr. Whitcomb. In the manufacture of bedsteads there is very httle of machinery used ; it is most all hand work. The parts are made, cut off, assembled, and put together by hand, and on the iron bedsteads they are all cast up by hand process in the foundry. There is no machine work which goes into them except polishing the brass work. Very little machinery can be brought to bear in this business. Mr. Turner. Have you found the business very prohtable? Mr. Whitcomb. Well, up to this time we have never paid a dividend, but we hope we have made some money, but it has all gone into the plant. I worked myself for two and a half years and did not get a cent. I did not get car fare out of it. Last year we paid ourselves a salary. Up to that time my partner had a salary, because he had to have some- thing to live on, but I happened to have a little money of my own to live on and managed to get along without drawing money out of the concern. The business is profitable, or rather we expect it will be l)rofltab]e. Mr. TuENBR. How much have you added to your plant as the result of your operations for the three years? Mr. Whitcomb. We have added to the plant, we have doubled our building, but we have not done this out of our earnings. That has been done for us on a percentage of interest by the water company of the town in which we are manufacturing. They were satisfied we wei'e going to be a fixture, and as we wanted facilities a proposition was made to have them erect this for a factory, which was done. Mr. Turner. What is the percentage? Mr. Whitcomb. I suppose — do you mean in machinery or in money? Mr. Turner. I mean how much from your eariungs has gone into your plant; that is, if you have no objection to stating it? Mr. Whitcomb. I do not think— I shall have to think a little bit to answer the question iatelligently — I think we have put in $20,000 from our earnings in the plant. Mr. Dalzbll. In three and a half years? Mr. Payne. On a capital of $100,000? Mr. Whitcomb. We have paid in a little less than $75,000, but we have not taken anything out of the business. Everything we have made has gone back in there. I suppose we. put in $5,000 or $6,000 a year in the plant from our earnings. Mr. Gear. In betterments ? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. The firm has also drawn salaries? Mr. Whitcomb. They have had salaries only this last year ; that is, three of them. Prior to that there was only one salaried man in the METAL BEDS. 483 concern. I had nothing, and my partner — last year we reorganized the business and took in another partuer as we had to have more help. Before we took him ia I practically owned the whole concern. Mr. Stevens. Do you lease the plant? Mr. Whitcomb. Yes, sir; we lease the building; we own some of them. We have expended on the property about $10,000 ourselves in buildings, but the rest belong to the water company there, as they built it IWr us. Mr. Gear. You said you had one hundred and twenty odd employes ? Mr. Whitcomb. -Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. Most of them have other persons dependent upon them? Mr. Whitcomb. Oh, yes, sir: most of .them have large families. I suppose there are not less than 400 people who are directly dependent on our business there. Possibly some of these other gentlemen who are engaged in the same business may like to say something to the com- mittee on this subject. A Representative of H. L. Judd & Company. What we would say would be substantially the same as what you have already stated; our experience has been about the same as yours. METAL BEDS. Faragragli 213. Chicago, Septemler 12, J893. SiB: The duty on our bill is now 45 per cent. Before the McKinley tariff bill it was 35 per cent. We don't ask for any great reduction simply to bring it back to the 35 per cent. We established this busi- ness in the West, and employ a large number of men handling the same, to whom we pay high wages. The manufacturers in this busi- ness in the United States, if protected with a 35 per cent duty and all the brass and iron in this country at the lowest price ever know'u can not compete with us, they most certainly ought to. The manu- facturers here are employing nearly altogether foreign labor and pay- ing very little more, if any, than the manufacturers in Europe. One house in Birmingham, Conn., was called up before United States judge for importing foreign labor. We have, also, had to pay 45 per cent, duty on boxing and bundling. The boxes are no use to us, and we have to break them up, being too large to ship again, and many of these boxes being charged to us at $3 and $4 each. Yours, very respectfully, Miller Hall & Son. RECAPITULATION WITH REFBRENCB TO IRON AND BKASS BEDS. We pay 45 per cent duty, we pay 45 per oeut duty on boxing, we pay freight 4,000 miles. Labor very nearly the same in Europe. Iron, brass, and copper, if any- thing, cheaper to-day in the United States than Europe. At the 45 per cent duty it is impossible to compete, and it is only on account of the superiority of foreign lac- quer, thus creating a demaudfor imported beds, we have thus far been enabled to do so, MiLLBB Hali. & Son. 484 METALS. COTTON MACHINERY. Monday, September 13, 1893. STATEMENT OF ME. WIILIAM H. BENT, OF TAUNTON, MASS, TEEASTTRER OF THE MASON MACHINE WORKS AND SECEETARY OF THE COTTON MACHINERY BUILD- ERS' ASSOCIATION. Mr. Chairman : I will read a statement that will take perhaps seven or eight minutes, and then I will be glad to answer any question which you may desire to ask. The Cotton Machinery Builders' Association respectfully i)resents to your honorable body the following statement of facts relating to their industry, with the desire to aid you in your consideration of their in- terests in your preparation of a revised tariff bill. In the present law cotton machinery is classed in the metal schedule, clause 215, "Manufactures, articles, or wares, not especially enumerated or provided for in this act, comj)osed wholly or in part of iron, steel, lead, copper, nickel, ijewter, zinc, gold, silver, platinum, aluminium, or any other metal, and whether partly or wholly manufactured, forty-flve per cent ad valorem." The rate of duty was not increased by the McKinley bill. It is low in comparison with other manufactures. It is not prohibitive, nor does it materially restrict importations, which have increased quite steadily, reaching last year the largest amount ever brought into the country. There is not now and ne\'er has been any trust or combination of cotton-machinery builders. Their proi3ts of late years have not been sufficient to attract new capital to this industry. From the best obtain- able statistics, it appears that the capital invested is about sixteen millions of dollars, and that, if all the establishments were working up to their full capacity, they would employ about eighteen thousand men. The character of workmen employed is of the liighest (uxler in morals, intelligence, and skill, forming a class of A^alnable citizens. Cotton- machinery manufactories have been for fifty years, and are now, the nurseries and training schools from which many of the best mechanics in the country have graduated, who have become leaders in the devel- oijment of our national resouices. They have furnished invaluable aid to our Government in times of peril, by inventing and building imx3roved machinery for the equipment of arsenals, and by making great numbers of muskets and other imple- ments of war, at a time when the foreign vendors of such articles were taking undue advantage of our dire necessities by demanding exorbi- tant prices. The great strides which have been made in the improvement of cot- ton spinning during the past twenty years were the result of the inventions of American mechanics developed by American capital and labor. We instance the fact that the latest improved spinning frames, which have recently been built by New England sliops for Southern mills, have a producing capacity GO or 80 per cent greater than those which were built twenty years ago, and are sold :it 25 or 30 per cent lower prices than similar machines at that period were sold. To the AmcricMn (•(ifton machinery builders l>elongsthe creditof this most valuable contribution to the success of cotton manufacturing, the COTTON MACHINERY. 485 reduction of prices of all cotton fabrics to the people, tlie enlarged con- siunption of cotton anil consequeut increase of the material prosperity of the whole (■oiintry. The value of these American inventions is attested by their adojition by the Engiish machine builders who now advertise them as induce- ments for the purchase of their products at home and abroad. In a leading manufacturing journal of England, called "The Textile Manufacture," published iu Manchester, you will find various advertise- ments, one I know particularly of two pages, where it is made up wholly of what are called the American novelties iu cotton manufacture, which was offered as superior to anything they have. Labor constitutes the chief element of cost in our industry; taking all lines of cotton machinery together, it probably averages 75 per cent of their cost. In addition to the workmen directly engaged iu the con- struction of the machines, such as molders, blacksmiths, machinists, carpenters, and painters, the business requires the employment of de- signers, draftsmen, pattern-makers, and experts, for the constant de- velopment and improvement of the various lines of carding, spinning, and weaving machinery. The wages paid average about double those which are paid by English cotton-machinery builders. The materials used are chiefly pig iron, bar iron, steel, and lumber. The prices of these articles are now quite low here and not a great deal higher than in England. From the foregoing facts we think the following conclusions can fairly be drawn : That whatever protection is granted us by the National Govern- ment is mainly a protection of American labor of a most desirable class — good citizens and valuable contributors to the growth and wealth of our country. That we are not enjoying any special favoritism from the G-overnment by the recently enacted tariff legislation which is so severely criticised. That the protection which we receive is less than that given to other manufacturers, in which the labor cost is certainly in no greater i)roportion than ours. That the present rate of duty allows of a sharp foreign competition and the importation of a sufiii- cient amount of machinery to afford considerable revenue. That the removal of the duties on the materials which we use, chiefly pig iron, would not sav.e us enough in their cost to compensate for any even in- considerable reduction of the duty on machinery. That the absolute necessity for our protection is the higher wages which we have to pay. The difference in labor cost is so largely in favor of the foreign ma- chinery builder that even after paying 45 per cent duty and the cost of transportation he has the advantage of us in the cost of his jiroduct laid down in our ports. That in the interest of the great cotton indus- try of our country, and particularly its development throughout the Southern States, we should be sustained and encouraged as a. most important factor in the progress of the nation. That we are not in any sense monopolists, nor do we enrich ourselves at the expense of the common jjeople; but, on the contrary, we contribute to their comfort and reduce the cost of their household goods and clothing, without receiving inordinate gains from our capital and labor. G-entlemen, we appeal to your wisdom as statesmen and your sense of justice as Americans. We believe that the present rate of duty can not be reduced without serious injury to us and our working j^eople. But we recognize that the i)arty in power was elected upon the promise of a reduction of duties. 486 METALS. If we are to be mclnded in this reduction, we beg you to spare us all you can and to give us certainly as mucli protection 'as you give to any otber industry wherein so great a proportion of the cost is American labor. Anticipating some questions which might properly and naturally will be asked, I would lilce to read, as bearing on the question of per cent of wages here and England, copies of letters. I have annexed copies to this paper and the originals I have here from the Knowles Loom Works, of Worcester, Mass. They are inventors and owners of the best woolen looms in the world, so acknowledged, and they have a very large establishment with modern equipment in Worcester. Mr. Turner. Worcester, where? Mr. Bent. Massachusetts. In order that the loom could be used to advantage in England, parties have associated themselves with the Knowles Company, of Worcester, and they have erected in England a manufactory for the manufacture of these looms under patent owned by the Knowles Loom Works. This gives the Knowles Company an opportunity to know exactly, which men do not often have, the cost in the two countries. ■Worcester, Septwnier 6, 1893. Replying to your favor of 5tli instant, I beg to say that I have often studied in det;iil the prices paid by our people in England for buildlig the Knowles loom, as their books are open to ns always, and I regret that I have not at hand the exact figures to quote in comparison, but will say that we average to pay for labor two or three times as much to build the same machinery, and in some instances the differ- ence is very much greater. The cost of materials used in the construction of a loom is not very much less tliere than here, the larger item being for labor. Hence what- ever protection is placed on machinery, so far as our business is concerned, is prin- cipally a protection of labor, not material. If there are any special questions you ■would like to have us answer that I have not covered in above, we are, Yours to command, Kmowlks Loom Works, c. h. hutchins. I saw that the question of wages being so plainly fixed by his state- ment, there might come up what I have heard brought up as an argu- ment, that the wage question of England and America is not a fair basis of per cent, because the American workmen will produce so much more in a given time than the English workmen, and in that regard we have a decided advantage. Here was an opportunity to bring that question to a solution so far as the manufacture of cotton machinery is concerned, and I asked him that question as to the labor cost and this is his reply : Worcester, Septcmher IS, 1S9S. My Dear Mr. Bf.nt: Referring to our former communication and conversation with you this morning, I begto report after consultation with our people, thatthere may be no mistake about it, that we are making a perfectly conservative and true statement fn saying that the total labor cost of building the Kuowles woolen loom in England is less than oue-half the labor cost in building the same loom herein our works. We also beg to say that so far as construi^tion of this cbxss of machinery by the gentlemen who build the Knowles loom in England is concerned, their rela- tions with this country are such that they are frequently liere examining iu detail, not only the machinery in our own works, but in many of tlie best machine shops in this country, aud for the last five years have been large purchasers of the same type of American machinery as we are using in our own works, so that they are practically fitted with modern machinery the same as we arc, and a man's work there, by rea- son of this, is fully equal in quantity to the work that can be done here. In addition to this, Mr. Edward Holliiigvvorth, of the above-named firm of build- ers in England, told me on a recent visit in .July, that lio was now purchasing machinery in Germany made on the American plan, but witli some furtlier improve- ments, and he was able to purchase this machinery, copied after the Americiin COTTON MACHINERY. 487 malcera, for a a;ood deal less inoiioy tliau lie could buy it in tliis roniitry, and this- machiuury is also to be added to bis plant. Hence, -when yon talce into considera- tion tbe tact that their price per day or week is so greatly inferior to ouis, and that they can turn off as large an amonnt of work by reason of their having- the improved machinery, you Tvill readily see that our first statement is a very i.'onser- vative one. There are many people in this country who are perfectly familiar witb their works on the other side wlio could readily substantiate our statement on this matter. If there are any other tiicts that we can give to you, yon will please command us. We are, very truly, yours, K.sowLES Loom Wouks, C. H. HUTCHINS, Prcnideni and Treasurer. I have annexed to this paper, -which 1 propose to leave with your comiiiittee, copies of those letters which I have read. I am at your service, gentlemen, if there are any questions. Mr. Turner. What kind of cotton machinery do you make? Mr. Bent. We manufacture cards, spinning frames, and looms in very exterrsive varieties. Mr. Turner. Are not they very old devices'? Mr. Bent. We have been obliged within the last few years to create an entire new syscem of patterns all through. We brought out new spinning frames,. etc., to which I refened in my statement. Mr. Turner. Es it the same old spinning frame? Mr. Bent. No, sir. Mr. Turner, it has some new attachments? Mr. Bent. I beg your pardon, it is new from the top to the bottom; we could not sell anything of the old style. Mr. Turner. I do not mean that the material is old, but the device is the same? Mr. Bent. I meant the device, sir. Mr. Turner. In what does the difference consist between your pres- ent spinning frame and the old plan of making that? Mr. Bent. We were obliged to alter the whole pattern of tlie frame from the floor up, in order to meet modern req[uiremonts of increased speed, etc. Mr. Turner. Is that ;t patented invention? Mr. Bent. There are patents upon it, not as a whole but on some portions of it. We brought out a new inule in 1887 on which we had quite a run of business, but in ISOO we found that we had to start again and we brought out a new mule in 1890 for fine yarn. We have to bring out machinery at frequent intervals in order to keep up or a little ahead of the march of improvements. Also iu looms we are con- stantly getting- up new paitterns, and are obliged to do so in order to get business. Mr. Turner. Wherein have you expedited the process of cotton raanufactuiing, say within the last three years; have you increased the speed ? Mr. Bent. Yes, sir: the machines run very much faster. Mr. Turner. Have you improved the durability of the machinery ? Mr. Bent. Tes, sir; we have by the substitution of superior work- m.en and material. Mr. Turner. Then it takes fewer hands to operate the process of making fibre int,(.) cloth? Mr. Bent. Yes, sir; fewer hands to the machine. Mr. TURNKR. You do more of it i)y the ma• in excess of the cost of the machines to the English builders, on account of the high cost of labor here; but taking into consideration the tariff of 45 per cent on machinery, we believed we should be able to comx^ete with the English builders, and we decided to manufacture these machines. We went abroad into the English shops and thoroughly examined their methods, special tools, etc., and ordered a large nuinher of these special tools in En'gland from the same tool builders that furnished the tools for the English shops. We were, necessarily, a long time equii)- ping our plant and perfecting our machine, and we spent over $250,000 on construction and improvement accounts in getting into a position to furnish the American manufacturer American-made revolving Hat cards. To show you the increased business and success we have been having, we give below the total amount of our sales from 1887 and the number of men employed : Year. Xiira- nieu . Total sales. 1887 125 215 250 250 350 425 510 $10G, 000 2^18, 000 l>^oi . . , . , , 414. 000 55 4, 000 1893* . . 697, 000 * Ass'.niiing tli.it the last four montlis will aveiM^e tlip same as tiie first ei^^kt months. Our pay roll now is nearly $6,000 per week. You will see from these figures that we have been enabled to build up a large business and give employment to many men who are well paid and prosperous, and we compete successfully with the English builders so long as we have had the present duty of 45 per cent. Our labor, which is the largest element of cost on our machine, is over 100 per cent higher than the labor on the imported machine. Many of our men have previously worked in English shops, and the wages that they received in England are compared with the wages received from us as follows, below : Molders receive in England per week (average) $8. Holders receive at our ■worts per week (average) $12 to $18. Turners and lathe hands, machinists, in England, per week (average) $7. Turners and lathe hands, machinists, at our works, per week (average) $10 to $15. Machinists, erecters, in England, per week (avera'>e) $8. Ma- chinists, erecters, at our works, per week (average) $12 to $15. Clothiers receive in England per week (average) $8. Clothiers receive at our works per week (average) $12 to $20. Grinders receive in England per week (average) $8.50. Grinders receive at our works per week (average) $12 to $15. Our daily average being for all our oper- ratives $1.90 per day, or about $11 per week, against £1, or $5, in England. We have a manufacturing village about our works of 1,500 to 1,800 people that are dependent entirely upon the success of our business. They are living in neat, well-buiit cottages, many of which they own, and are enjoying all tlie comforts and pri\ileges of a home life far differ- ent from what we have personally seen in similar English communities. The prices of the English machines in this market are practically the same as the prices of ours, and orders are decided largely ou individual 492 METALS. eftort of sellhig. Tliere is a great aniouut of competition in securing orders, and many contracts of which we know have been exactly the same so far as the English prices and ours are concerned. The margin of profit in our business under the present tariff is not large, and we rely upon the volume of business done for our return. (Our yearly accounts are on file at the Massachusetts statehouse, where the public can at any time see them.) If this tariff should now be reduced it would result in a very serious detriment to our business, if not complete annihilation. We cannot afford to reduce ourprices, and if thetariffischanged the iuiportercan be able to furnish these machines to American manufacturers for less money th in we can now afford to sell them, and this would mean that they would take all the orders and we should have to close our shops and our 525 men now employed would be thrown out of work. Now, it is recognized that the growth and development of textile machine shops are of vital importance to the sirccess and advancement of textile manufacturing. The impiovements in cotton machinery made in our American shops are most important factors in the growth of American cotton ujanufacturing. The two industries are so closely allied that the crippling of one will very soon be felt by the other, and if our machine shops are wiped out, our cotton mills will be at the mercy of English machine builders. Tliis small margin of tariff pro- tection is just what enables the builders of cotton machinery to live. If the tariff should be reduced on cotton machinery you will say that there will be a corresponding reduction in tlie tariff' on the so-called "raw materials" entering into the construction of our machine, which might lessen the cost of our finished machine enough to be an offset. This item of so-called "raw material" constitutes a very small per- centage of the total cost of the finished machine, very little of which could be imported, under any circumstances, and even if the duty should be entirely removed from "raw material" the reduction in cost of the finished machine gained thereby would be trifling. It seems to us that the only way we could attempt to continue in business and meet a reduction in duty on cotton machinery would be by a sweeping reduction in wages, which we believe is wholly imprac- ticable, considering the fact that our work people have been educated to a standard of living far different from that of operatives in foreign coirntries. The majority of our work people voted for the present administra- tion, exjiectiiig to better their condition by more business and higher prices for labor, but they are now being much disturbed over the out- look of business. Although we were the first to go into the building of revolving-flat cards, we have been followed by other concerns, and our shop is now only one of many wliich would be disastrously affected by any change in the duty. In conclusion, we would like to call your attention to the fact that the duty on cotton machinery in the last tariff' change, knOwn as the McKinley bill, was not raised, but left as before. For the above reasons we wish to urge upon your committee the great necessity of keeping the duty on cotton machinery at its present figure. AGKICULTUEAL MACHINERY — MICROSCOPES. 493 AGRICTJIiTURAIj MACHINERY. |icr cent, the same rate as on manufactures of iron and steel. The sliear-niak(_'i-,s now present their case, honestly feariu" that any dechne in duty would work to their injury. They have eiT- SHEARS. 497 deavored to show that foreign competition is so close to them that their industry is at i)resent menaced, and that they are almost prevented from making the entire line of small scissors. They therefore earnestly request that no re ! action iu duty be made. Youi's, respectfully, Henry T. Seymotje, Secretary. T H 32 SCHEDULE D. WOOD MD MANUFACrUEES OF WOOD. 499 CHAIR CANE AND REEDS. (Paingraidi 230.) Nkw Yoiik, Beptemler 25, 1893. Sirs: We mibniit tlie following in regard to cliair cane and reeds: Paragraph 770 of the act of 1883 provided for the free entry of "rat- tans and reeds uumannfactured." Paragraph 482 of said act prescribed a duty of 10 per cent on "rattans manniactui-ed, but not made up into completed articles." Paragraph 046 of said act provided also for the free entry of "bamboo reeds no further manufactured than cut into lengths for walking sticks or canes or for sticks for umbrellas, para- sols, or sunshades." The United States circuit court, December 4, 1889 (40 Federal Eeporter, 570), decided that round reeds wrought from rattan, being rattan with the outer cuticle only stripped off, and used as a raw material by hat-makers, carriage-makers, chair-makers, basket-makers, and whip-makers, were exempt from duty under the free list of the act of 1883 as unmanufactured reeds, the condition as a round reed being the same as nature produced it, except that its outer covering had been removed, and it being " in the first condition in which a reed as such is known to the tariff." Many petitions by both imjjorters, manufacturers, and dealers were made to the framers of the McKinley act to put their raw material on the free list, and in the act of 1890 it was provided in paragrajDh 518 that manufactures of rattans for hat-makers' use (hatreeds are wrought from rattans) should be exempt from duty ; in paragraph 756, that reeds in the rough, or no further manufactured than cut into lengths suitable for sticks for umbrellas, parasols, sunshades, whips, or walking canes (whip reeds are wrought from rattan) should be exempt from duty; but in paragraph 229 it was provided that " chair canes or reeds wrought or manufactured from rattans or reeds, and whether round, square, or in any other shape," should be dutiable at 10 per cent ad valorem. The anomaly exists, therefore, in the present tariif that reeds for hat-makers' use and reeds for whip-makers' use are exempt from duty, while reeds for chair -makers', basket-makers', and carriage-makers' use are subject to 10 per cent duty. One of the inconsistencies under the present tariff is the wording of paragraph 229, which the board of general appraisers render as reading " chair canes or chair reeds," on the theory that " any other rendering would lead to such absurd phraseology as reeds wrought or manufac- tured from reeds." All these reeds are in every respect the same article wrought from rattan, except that the different industries use different sizes. We inclose herewith a card showing samples of round reeds used for the various purposes above described and respectfully solicit, in the interest of the many consumers of these five chisses of goods as well as of the importers and manufacturers, that you will correct the inconsist- encies of the present act and put upon the free list of the coming tariif. Bound reeds as raw material for the chair, carriage, and basket- makers, as well as permit to remain free of duty round reeds as raw material for hat-makers and whip-makers. Very respectfully, POPPES & Partisch. 501 SOH-EDXJLE E. SUGAR. 503 BEET SUGAR. STATEMENT OF MR. HENRY T. OXNAED, OF GRAND ISLAND, NEBB. Tuesday, September 19, 1893. Mr. Chaii^ian: I appear here as presideut of the American Beet Sugar Association, in behalf of the retention of the bounty on sugar and against the repeal of the present sugar policy embraced in the several paragrajjhs of the tariff law enacted in 1890, which promised those who would invest their capital in this new agricultural industry that the bounty should remain until 1905. Our position is that if Congress may arbitrarily repeal its usual enactments, it has no moral right to do so with this statute, because a definite time was fixed for it to operate, and as if to malie that purpose plainer the appropriation to pay the bounty ^as pui-posely made con- tinuing or permanent. We claim that the object of fixing a time in this law was to influence and to induce capital ibo embark in a new and somewhat hazardous agricultural industry, requiring for success large sums of money and great skill; the national i^urpose being to attain the production of a household necessity larger in amount than the tariff policy had theretofore produced, and so cheapen the price and render this country independent of the world for sugar. It having been reported in public prints that this Congress would probably repeal this law, I ask the privilege of filing with this com- mittee a protest in writing, and I also desire to place in the hands of the individual members of this committee a pamphlet embracing some suggestions on the " sugar problem," of which I trust the committee will avail itself. With the iiermission of the committee I will proceed to give my views of this great industry, and will try to be as brief as i^ossible. As I understand it, a primary consideration which induced the enact- ment of the present law was that we were sending abroad for a product that we can as well produce here from $100,000,000 to .$115,000,000 in gold annually. We have sent abroad for sugar in forty years nearly $3,250,000,000. This is an exhaustive and an unnecessary drain upon our people for an agricultural article the raw material for which we have both the soil and the climate to raise ; and it has always been the policy of this and of all civilized nations to cherish and foster any agri- cultural product that promised so much for the people as sugar. We are the largest consumers of sugar in the world. Our consumption is about 63 pounds per capita. We produce only 10 per cent of the total amount consumed by our people, and we consume nearly one-third or 30 per cent of the world's product, and the effort making and the national object of the bounty law is to change this relation. B^ wise and salutary enactments we have become exporters of cotton and tobacco; they have had liberal protection, and cotton lequires some now; and we have become independent oi^ the world for divers other agricultural products, and the part of wisdom, as well as the dic- 505 506 SUGAR. tates of true economy, suggest that sugar be included in the list, as it certainly will be unless it is sacrificed just at tlie moment when so much is promised, as these results fully attest: Beet-sugar production. Tons. 1880 357 1890 2,800 1891 5,400 1892 12,355 1893 (Estimated) . . 25, 000 Sugai' must be regarded as an exceptional agricultural product, so recognized the world over. Unlike wheat or corn, it requires the investment of large capital, and great skill is requisite at all points, not only in the successful production of the raw material, but in pro- ducing the manufactured product as well; and yet if we produced of wheat only one-tenth of the home demand it would be wise, prudent, economical, and humane to encourage a larger supply by any reason- able means in our power. Very moderate capital is required to raise the ordinary agricultural crop, but with sugar the first outlay is heavy, and large amounts are being expended in divers ways to educate the American farmer that it is profitable to raise the raw material for sugar and that he can do it. For upwards of a century we had given cane sugar protection by a liberal tariff, which was found did not develop its production as rapidly as was desirable, and when the beet- sugar industry entered the field as a new factor it was deemed wise to give sugar a new and permanent form of protection and more of a stimulant; and relying on the honor and good faith of the Goverment, large sums of money have been invested and expended in this new industry. Eesults would seem to prove the wisdom of that legislation. But for the most persistent attacks in some quarters for a repeal of the present law, the showing would have been still more flattering. But agitation has deterred the investment of caisital in this industry in several States, notably in Iowa and in Washington, as well as in New York. These threats seem to be based on the theory that the law gives money to a class; but such is not its purpose. We must look at the object of the statute, which is for the general good of all the people and the national welfare; to keep millions of gold at home; insure a pioduct at lower cost, and finally render us dependent on no other nation for sugar. If it happens that money is paid to those who risk and venture their capital in a new industry, that is but an incident attendant upon the main object sought to be accomplished. When the result is reached the incident attached will cease to operate as a bounty, and will no longer be necessary. We build a navy for the protection of our cities, for the national welfare, paying not only the cost of the vessels to Mr. Oramp, but royalties, bounties, or allowances are given him if his ships make a knot or more an hour more than is called for. I deny that any considerable number of the American people would favor a repeal of this law if they fully understood its real purpose and its operation. I am led to venture this from a remark made by Mr. Bingham in 1890, then master of the National Grange, composed of 1,250,000 farmers. He said: I think our people would not favor a Ijounty on any commodity that we now pro- duce in sufficient (jnunliiics to supply our people. There are many of them in favor of bounties ; take for instance, sugar. At the Trans-Mississippi Convention held at Ogden last spring, a convention comjjosed of over 600 delegates from 22 States, a resolu- BEET SUGAR. 507 Ition passed, witliout opposition, against a repeal of the bounty form (of protection for sugar. A law of this kind can readily be made odious, and tliat is what is jattempted to be done in this case. Under the old tariff policy the jpeople paid a duty of, say, 53 to 60 millions annually on nine-tenths of the total amount of sugar that we consume; while under the present ipolicy they pay but 2 cents a pound on the one-tenth only which we are able to produce. So that the people are not taxed nearly so heavily for sugar by the bounty form of protection, and they have saved from 1 to 2 cents a pound on the cost of their sugar since the bounty law was enacted. If prices have recently advanced it has been in con- sejjuence of short crops abroad, where we must purchase most of our sugar. The drought in Germany, and the short crop in Cuba, will raise the price of sugar here from one-half to three quarters of a cent a pound, so that our people will pay, say, $20,000,000 more for sugar this fiscal year than they paid last, showing clearly the effect of any policy not calculated to render us independent of foreign countries for sugar, rendering us partners in the climatic misfortunes of foreign countries. Under the tariff on sugar the people would have paid at least $150,000,000 of tariff duties from the enactment of the bounty law ; while since its operation they have paid but $25,000,000; and tliey have probably saved, by way of a lower price for sugar, over $150,000,000, enough of a saving in three years to j)ay the bounty for nearly the whole period. The production of sugar is surrounded with many obstacles. The production of a sugar-beet crop is a new thing to the American farmer. The average agriculturist is slow to adopt a novelty, especially where more or less skill and increased labor is necessary ; and it is tedious and expensive work to overcome this. A beet-sugar factory is not expected to be a paying success the first year either here or abroad. In fact it has been ascertained that three to four years will elapse before the community in which a factory is located adapts itself to the work of beet-raising. A loss ensues and the present bounty law will tide investors over this period. When the Government, therefore, gave us fifteen years we relied upon making up any losses in subse- quent years consequent on this condition of things. To insure a suffi- cient amount of the raw material, the managers of beet-sugar plants have been forced to increase their offerings for beets, until the price to farmers has reached $5 per ton more than paid anywhere in the world; a point at which even small profits to the manufacturer have begun to disappear; but to educate the farmer and to get him interested in this new industry are prime necessities; and upon it, and upon Congress depend the future of this industry. Abroad, where the production of beet sugar has been going on for upwards of a century, this obstacle is not met, farmers being adepts at the business, and a beet crop has come to be there recognized as a part and parcel of the yearly products of a farm. E"othing is more imxiortarit in the manufacture of anything than the supply of the raw material ; but this is especially the case with beet sugar, because the expensive plant must have an annual " run" of at least sixty to seventy days to warrant the outlay of 3 to $750,000, which must lie idle about ten months in the year, which is not the case with other manufacturing plants. Here is a dead loss of the interest on the money invested for that length of time, and it is quite a serious consideration. Then, too, a large force of short-term labor is necessary that can not readily be obtained Avhen most needed, as it can not be utilized when the crop is harvested, and Ituowiug this, labor is reluctant 508 SUGAR. • to engage witli a knowledge tUat it is only for a few weeks. Another serious factor in the beet-sugar business is the cost of labor in the beet fields, which averages $1.50 a day; while in Europe the same labor gets only 20 to 40 cents a day. Then, too, there is the value abroad of the by-products in the sugar- beet industry, which are almost a dead loss here as yet, whatever may be their value in the future. I refer to the pulp which is extensively fed to the cattle on the continent, because it is very fattening; worth there $1.25 a ton, given away here when 25 cents can not be obtained for it. Our farmers have not yet come to realize its real worth on the farm. Then we have the potash salts and the lime cake used abroad • by farmers for fertilizing, and liberally paid for, while in this country it is an item of expense, as it must be hauled away to the factory. I speak of these things to show the advantages of the business abroad, but 1 have a lively hope that it will not be long before these by-products will be utilized, and they will probably be of sufllcient account to warrant the expiration of the bounty by its own limitation. In other words, I am not one of those who have such a poor opinion of American enter- prise as to think that a bounty will continue a necessity here in order to keep beet sugar on its feet. Conditions will change in time, when our agriculturists have come to appreciate what these things signify in raising a beet crop and to the laud when crops are rotated. They are existing conditions and disadvantages, however, which the home beet-sugar interest will over- come as education in the new work gradually i)ermeates communities where factories may be located. Another consideration is this : Abroad, the molasses, from factories scattered all over the country, is sent to some central factory, which can thus afford, by special and expensive process, to work out the sugar it contains, while we are not yet able to do this ; and this entails a loss that goes with many others to warrant liberal supi)ort from the Government for a reasonable time. Labor, here in the factory as in the field, is twice as expensive in producing sugar from a ton of beets as it is abroad. Large quantities of coal, charcoal, limestone, bagging, and paper barrels are necessary, to produce which gives employment to a large number of men at remunerative wages, increasing the number of consumers with advan- tage to producers. Transportation to and from the factories is heavy, bulky, and expensive. These are some of the obstacles to overcome. Abroad for upward of a century the sugar industry has been carefully fostered by heavy bounties; but having gained a solid footing the governments of France and Germany — while keeping a watchful eye on the matter — have been gradually withdrawing some of the very liberal protection thatamounted, according to Consul Mason (Report 137, page 214), in 1890 in Germany to $17,389,000, and for six months in 1891 to $10,341,000. But with the obstacles enumerated to overcome in this country, no new industry, like that of beet sugar, can hope to compete with the old and well-established business on the continent that has been fostered and cherished for so long a time, unless we are given help; the aid, in fact, th.roduced in ITebraska, California, and Utah at present, with a factory in Staunton, Va. But while the area of cane is limited to a few States the area of beets is practically unlimited. We thought at one time the Southern States were not well adapted, and it was generally supposed so, to the beet culture, but I can say from per- sonal experience the southern part of this country gives as good results as anywhere, probably the best ; southern California, I am speaking particularly of. It is really unlimited. I do not suppose there is a State in the Union that can not produce the sugar beet, in time, profit- ably to manufacture sugar from it. Some of them are better than others, but all of them can do it. The Chairman. How many beets do you consume in your factory? Mr. OxNARD. There are various amounts in various factories, but I would take an average factory and say 300 tons of beets every day. The Chairman. Are they raised in the neighborhood? Mr. OxNARD. Yes, sir; they are raised by the farmers, chiefly in the neighborhood; and ought to be raised within 5 miles of the factory in small quantities, say five acres, which is about all a farmer should take, on account of the cultivation of the soil. The farmer has to plow deep in the fall and get his land in condition, and the rule is to get ready two years before and put his seed in and grow a crop and get the best results in the next crop. The great advantage in Europe is this: they have found there in cultivating sugar beets that succeed- ing crops are increased all the way from 25 to 35 per cent. Take, for instance, wheat — Germany could not raise wheat at one time as it did not pay, but with the beet crop they could do it after a careful prepa- ration of the soil, and all of that; so that really you might say this bounty gives a small bounty on succeeding crops, whether wheat, corn, or anything else, inasmuch as the farmers get so much more after it. Mr. Turner. Are these other figures on these boxes reliable? Mr. OxNARD. Some of them are not and some are. Mr. Turner. Take this statement of the average yield being 15 tons per acre, is that correct? Mr. OxNARD. ISTo, that is a little in excess, but that is wliat it ought to be. In some places you can raise as much as 20 aud2:i tons. ,1 know 512 ■ SUGAR. of a case of a farmer in California where this year, on 45 acres, lie is going to make a profit of $3,100. Mr. Turner. It is stated in this statement that a ton produces 200 pounds of granrrlated sugar, is that correct? Mr. OsNAED. That is also a fictitious figure. On the average, m the factory I have worked the longest, which is thi& factory, it will average 165 pounds. Mr. TiTRNBR. Where did you acquire your experience in this busi- ness? Did you learn it on the other side? Mr. OxNARD. No, I have been connected with the sugar industry all my life, and studied it over in Germany, xVustria, and have been raaiui- tacturing sugar for a Ion g time ; 1 commenced to study for it when I Avas at school. Mr. Turner. You mean beet sugar? Mr. OSNARD. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. Not cane sugar ? Mr. OxNARD. I have also looked into that as they go together, but have not made it such a specialty as the beet sugar. Mr. Turner. What is your process of extracting it?* IMr. OxNARD. By diffusion and carbonation. Let me say one thing, the beet-sugar industry has only become a great factor in the supply of the world's sugar within the last 15 years. Previous to that the cane sugar was on top, but the science of Europe has been developing it, and has been producing more sugar in the beet itself. For instance, ill 1878 the beet contained at an average only 9 per cent of sugar; that is to say, only 9 per cent of the total weight was sugar. Now, in 1891 or 1892, the average of Europe was 14 per cent, a gain of 5 per cent. It is a biennial, growing the seed the second year. They select the richest beet in sugar for mothers. There is $15,000,000 in- vested in that business in Europe. We have been getting our seed from Europe. We have tried to raise the seed here, and I have suc- ceeded in producing a better beet seed than Europe, in Nebraska, which will give from 1 to 2 ijer cent more sugar, but I have only done it on a small scale, but there is no reason why it should not be done on a large scale. Mr. Payne. What per cent do you get? Mr. OxNABD. From this particular seed we get 16 per cent. Mr. Payne. What is the average percent of them? Mr. OxNARD. About 14.07. Mr. Turner. What do the farmers in the neighborhood of your mill usually produce; what are the crops? Mr. OxNARD. Corn, wheat, oats, and such crops, but it does not pay them very well; that is, those other croxis, and they are only too anx- ious to get hold of us to built beet factories. They welcome us when we go out there. You can get the farmers to guarantee a full supply of raw material, but as a matter of fact that guaranty does not hold, as it takes time to raise these beets. Mr. Turner. What does this yield them, at say 15 tons to the acre? Mr. OxNARD. We pay $5 a ton. Mr. Turner. You pay $5 a ton; that would be $75 for an acre? Mr. OxNARD. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. Now, if the J 5 tons gives a yield of 200 pounds to the ton it makes 3,000 jiounds of sugar. Mr. OxNARD. But it does not Mr. Turner. Wait a moment. Taking these figures on these boxes BEET SUGAR. 513 which you may correct, at 2 cents a pound, that would make $60 for the bounty on beet sugar for which you pay only $75! Mr. OxNARD. If those figures were correct that would be so, with additional considerations; but they are not correct. Mr. Turner. Now state wherein they are not. Mr. OxNARD. We only get 164 pounds — to be accurate — to the ton, instead of 200. Mr. Turner. Take it on that basis then. ^Mr. OxNARD. Yes, sir. If you want to get the cost of the manufac- ture of sugar Mr. Turner. I will get to that in a moment. If I make any mis- take you can correct it. It makes the yield for the 15 tons 2,460 pounds, and sometimes, you say, it yields less than that and sometimes more. Mr. OxNARD. Yes ; that is not the average, however. Mr. Gear. You get $49 bounty? Mr. Turner. Forty-nine dollars and twenty cents bounty, and you pay to the farmer for the same quantity of beets $75; is that correct? Mr. OxNARD. Yes, sir ; by those figures of yours it is correct if you figured it out correctly, but it is not the way to arrive at this thing. It is to figure out what you pay for the beets and the cost of manufactur- ing those beets into sugar, and divide that by the number of pounds obtained, and that would give you the cost of the product. Mr. Turner. Suppose you make the calculation in your own way. Mr. OxNARD. I make it cost over 5 cents, and the average price ob- tained by us for the last three years is no more than about, say 4J cents. Mr. Turner. In the 5 cents you estimate to be the cost of sugar, do you deduct from that the bounty you get from the Government? Mr. OxNARD. Ko; that is not included in the cost. Mr. Turner. Is it deducted from the cost in the estimate you have just given? Mr. OxNARD. Yes, sir; it is deducted, the bounty is not included in that. Mr. Turner. It costs you 5 cents after you get the bounty? Mr. Oxnard. 'No; it cost 5 cents without reference to the bounty -nhatsoever. Mr. Turner. Taking the bounty off it would be 3 cents? M r. Oxnard. It would be about 3 to 3 J cents. Mr. Turner. And you sell it at 4^ cents a pound? Mr. Oxnard. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. That is a profit of 50 per cent? JMr. Oxnard. No, as a matter of fact it is not. Mr. Turner. This is a cent and a half on 3 cents, is not that a fair profit in these hard times? Mr. Oxnard. You do not make anything like that. Just to explain it Mr. Turner. Certainly, that is due to you. Mr. Oxnard. As a matter of fact it costs over 5 cents to produce the sugar — I think it is a little more than 5 cents, but for the sake of argu- ment we will say 5 cents, and the bountj^ amounts to 2 cents, and you seU that product for 4il cents, which leaves you with the bounty li cents, but in reality it leaves you a profit, I compute, of about 1 cent, but these factories make about 50,000 pcmnds of sugar a day, and at 1 cent a pound that would be $500 a day profit. Now, if they were to run say SO days, that would be about $40,000 profit, whicli does not X H 33 514 SUGAR. count ill your wear and tear of macliiiiery on whicli tliere i.s an iii\est- iiieut of half a million dollars; you have got to take off 5 i^er cent for wear and tear of materials, insurance, taxes, etc., so reall.v, when you yet to foot it uj^), there is not much in it; there has been no protit in the factory. Mr. Turner. You have an apparent profit of 50 ])er cent! Mr. OxNARD. Xo, sir; an apparent iirofit of a cent and a half, or less than 30 per cent, which is really fictitious. Mr. Turner. And the sugar, you state, costs 5 cents! .Mr. OxNARD. I am looking at the profit on investment. As my in- vestment only runs during the three months at the outside in a year, I have to make 5 or six times as much in that time to pay while that fac- tory is idle, and all sugar factories have to do the same thing. And you must remember that the 5 cents does not include cost of factory and repairs during idle season, which amounts to say 1 cent more per pcraiid and is chargeable to cost of manufacture. Mr. Turner. In fact, assuming the cost to be 5 cents, the Govern- ment pays -! cents of your cost for you? -Mr. OxNARD. The Government pays 2 cents on that cost. Mr. Turner. I make the result which I have stated before. Have >ou any by-product ? Mr. OxNARD. Xo, sir; it does not amount to anything. We throw our l)y-iJroducts, our pulp and molasses, away. In Europe this would be valuable and would be worth a cent a pound in a beet-sugar factory in Europe. We do nothing with them and have no demand. We hope one day we will have. Mr. Turner. What do you do with the molasses now? 3Ir. OxNARD. We do practically nothino-, we sell a little of it if we can, to make vinegar out of it, and wa sell a few tons of pulp for !'•"> cents, but it does not amount to anything. It can be considered 7iii in the receipts of the factory. ^Ir. Chairman, I would like to have some other gentleman address you, because there are three or four factories represented here. Mr. TirRNER. Are you connected with the Oxnard factory at Brooklyn '' Mr. OxNARjj. Xo, sir. ]Mr. Payne. You say your capital invested is half a million dollars, on which there is an apparent profit of $40,000 a year. ]\[r. Oxnard. Yes, sir. Mr. Pa^ NK. That does not take into consideration any wear and tear of the machinery', insurance, taxes, etc. ? Mr. OxNAKD. Xo, sir. Mr. Payne. What percentage of the total value is that a year? .^Ir. Oxnard. As these factories only run two or three months in the year I should say you should take off 5 per cent; some take off 10 per cent. ]\[r. Payne. \\'ould that be fair'? Mr. Oxnard. Xo; I think once in every fifteen years you have to renew all your machinery. Mr. GiOAR. You have two factories, one at Grand Island and one at Xorfblk ? ^Ir. Oxnard. Ves, sir; and one in southern Oalifbrnia. Mr. (ii'iAi;, It is fairly remunerative (otlie iani,cis! Mr. OxxAKD. Y(^s, sir. Mr. Gkai;. IJctter than corn or wheal? Mr, Oxnard. Better than anything of the kind, BEET SUGAR. 515 Mr. Geak. If you could use your by products as iu Europe could you dlspejise witL. nearly all tliis bounty? Mr. OXNARD. I think we could dispense with the bounty entirely. Then another thing. We have to bring skilled labor a great distance to work in these factories. These men are skilled and you have to pay them all the year around or else they will leave. Mr. Geak. Your chemist is generally a high-priced man? ]Mr. OXNARD. Yes, sir; very; and our superintendent gets $5,000 a year, one man only. Mr. Gear. You have no doubt there is a vast area of country in the United States running from State to State and ocean to ocean that is able to produce the beet? Mr. OxNARD. And the Government sends out seeds and has sent for several years and analyzed the beet, and I think in nearly all of the States of the Union they And that they can raise sugar beets. Mr. Gear. It is proven by fact that they can raise them even by irrigation in Utah? Mr. OxjfARD. Yes, sir: there is a gentleman who will speak about that. Mr. Gear. You make all of this sugar direct in your factory ? Mr. OxNARD. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. There is no outside refining, you do not send it to a refin- ery? Mr. OxNARD. No, sir. Mr. Gear. You find your market in the neighborhood of the mills? Mr. OxNARD. Yes, sir; right on the Missouri Eiver. Mr. Gear. You spoke about capital having been arranged in some other States for this product, which will be stopped? Mr. OxNABD. There is a gentleman here who was making arrange- ments for a cooperati\'e factory, where the men who raise the beets themselves are to be the manufacturers of those beets. Mr. Gear. I know there were one or two manufactories arranged for in my State. Mr. OxNARD. There were two in your State. 'Mr. Gear. One at Muscatine ? Mr. OxNARD. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. I understand the quality of the beets there is extremely fine. Mr. OxNARD. They are very good. Mr. Gear. The reason that factory was not .started was the threat of repealing this bounty? Mr. OxNARD. Absolutely so. One of the gentlemen connected with it told me if it were not for that he would get ready and go ahead. Mr. Gear. A local capital of from $50,000 to $100,000 was all pro- vided for, as I happened to know, and it went up on this proposed threat to repeal the bounty? Mr. Oxnard. Yes, sir. ]Mr. Gear. Did not the gentlemen who went into these factories con- sider it, morally speaking, an absolute contract on the part of the Gov- ernment to foster tills industry? Mr. Oxnard. If there had been any doubt about that we wnuld never have gone ahead. If this thing is changed there will be more factories sold Mr. Gear. \'ou can not run a factoiy witliout it? Mr. Oxnard. No, not the first yeai-. ' My, Gear, Yow will have to shut up? 516 SUGAR. Mr. OxNAED. We will, without a doubt. Mr. Geae. Is the industry popular with the farmers of Nebraska? Mr. OxNAED. Ill the whole State they have held conventions, they have held three or four, and they say they want to develop the indus- try. This Ogden meeting reflected the sentiment of the peojile, and there were GOO delegates, and it passed unanimously without one dis- senting vote, or I think there was only one dissenting vote, rei] nesting the Government not to touch the sugar bounty law Mr. ISynum. You spoke of gold being sent out to pay for sugar? Mr. OXNARD. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynum. How much did you mention? ]\Ir. OxNAED. One hundred million dollars. Mr. Byntjm. AVhen was it sent out? Mr. OxNARD. Last year. Mr. Bynum. To what countries? Mr. OxNAED. Cuba, Germany, every sugar-producing country there is. Mr. Bynum. How much sugar did Cuba send us? Mr. OxNAED. I have not got the figures separated. Mr. Byntjm. Was not that bounty sent out in exchange paid to our farmers for wheat and meat products — it was not sent in gold at all, was it? Mr. OxNARD. I think it was. The Chairman. I have it stated here. We bought from Cuba last year about $51,000,000 worth of sugar, and we sent Cuba of our own currency $311,400, and $6,637,000 of foreign coin. Mr. OxNARD. I do not know anything about that, but that reciproc- ity with Cuba was based on this bounty law ; when the tariff was taken away from this industry and it was singled out and in return for it a permanent contract was made Mr. Bynum. But that is not the question. You asserted we sent out gold, and I want to call your attention to the fact we have not done anything of the kind. Mr. Payne. The exchanges with these difl'erent countries were all made through London ? Mr. OxNARD. That is wliat I supposc'd. Mr. Payne. And if we did not export more thau we imported of course we have to pay that balance in gold? J\lr. OxNARD. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. You do not mean to be construed that we send the gold? Mr. OxNARD. Why, no; I just used that ijhrasc. Mr. Payne. You thought the Ways and Means Committee would understand it? Mr. OxNARD. Yes, sir; I thought yon Avoidd Icnow about it. Mr. Bryan. Under intelligeiit cultivation and with reasonable care, how many tons of sugiir beets can be produced from one acre of ground? Mr. OxNARD. About 14 tons. Mr. Bryan. How mam' pounds of sugar can be secured from a ton of beets? i\rr. OXNARD. About 164. i\ir. 1>RY''AN. At wliat price can sngai' be i)roduced l)y your factories in Xebraska and California, excluding bounty? Mr. O-VNARD. About 5.4 cents i>cr pound on the ii\crage, without counting ex]))iiipcting sugnr sells at about 4A cents. BEET SUGAR. 617 Mr. Bryan. If yoii ans-n-er that yi>n can produce sugar ^Titlnn 2 ceti1 s of tlie price of sugar imported witbout duty, state M'by you tried to tetain an additioual bounty of 1 ceut in the State of Nebraska"? Mr. OxNAKD. Because I had to spend three times the amount of bounty in educating the farmers. Mr. Bryan. State the lowest bounty or tariff under which, in your judgment, your industry could exist. Mr. OxNARD. I believe 2 cents, but would hope to succeed and keep the factories running with much less after a few years. Mr. Bryan. About how much have the companies to which you belong expended in trying to secure bounties or tariffs. State and national? Mr. OXNAED. I can't answer that question. Mr. Bryan. Is it true that you contributed money and tried to defeat for reelection candidates for the legislature who had voted against State bounty on sugar and those who refused to promise to vote for boun- ties? Mr. OXNARD. Xo. Mr. Bryan. Is it true that you used your influence to defeat for Gon- gressin the Third and Fifth Nebraska districts candidates who would not promise to favor a national bounty or tariff' on sugar! Mr. OXNARD. No. Mr. Bryan. Did you contribute any money to be used in the Con- gressional campaigns of Nebraska in 1892 outside of the Third and Fifth districts! Mr. OxNARD. No. Mr. Bryan. How much time has been spent by representatives of your companies in attendance upon State and national legislatures try- ing to secure bounties to, or protective tariffs on, sugar! Mr. OxNARD. Considerable time in trying to educate the legislative members to understand the industry. Mr. Bryan. How many acres are employed in raising beets for your Nebraska factories this year, and of the total number of acres employed, ho_w many are cultivated by your companies ! Mr. OxNARD. About 5,700 acres in both factories; about 1,800 acres cultivated by us. Mr. Bryan. How much did you save by the rebate of the tariff' on machinery! Mr. OxNAED. About $90,000 in our three factories, but the rebate law was only in existence two years. Now we have to pay a tariff' of 45 per cent. We import machinery. Mr. Bryan. In case you buy homemade machinery, is it higher priced because of the tariff! Mr. OxNARD. Yes, without a doubt, AVERAGE COST OF BEET SUGAR. Sir: I take pleasure in submitting for the consideration of the com- mittee the following figures to show the actual cost of producing a pound of beet sugar, based on the average cost of production at the Grand Island factory, taken from the books of the company. I also compare these figures with those of a factory of like capacity in France, the latter figures being based on an average cost of the production of sugar for six years. Truly yours, Henry T. Oxnaud, Prenident Oxnarcl Beet-Sugar Gompaiit/, Grand Island, Nebr. 518 SUGAR. Grand Tslmul facloyy in yr'hrasTfa. — ExpiitKen per frm of heelB. Heels $5. 00 Coal 80 Coke 18 Limestdiie 15 Labor 1. 57 Lighting 07 Bags 20 Mechanical liltur liii^s 02 Mechanical filter clntlis 04 Oil and grease 04 Sundry oi>erating expenses 17 Commission on sales 04 Discount - 42 Fieight on material 24 Maintenance and repair of factory during idle season of ten uiontlis in a year, with taxes and insurance on same 1. 87 10.81 Average yield of sugar per ton of beets pounds.. 165 Cd.'it per pound cents.- . 6^ Average selling price do 4^^ In 1892 the actual cost of production was 6 cents; in 1891, cost 6-J cents; in 1890, cost 7 cents. Showing that in three years I ha\ o reduced the cost of production 1 cent per pound in this factory. Last year my books showed a profit of one-half cent a pound including the bounty; whereas in 1890 in the same factory my books showed a loss of one-half cent a pound including the bounty. This year I hope to still further reduce the cost of production. A profit of 1 cent a pound on IBS pounds to the ton would be $1.65 per ton. The cajiacity of our Grand Island factory being 300 tons per day the result would be $495 jier day, or say $500 per day for 100 days, $50,000, less 5 per cent for wear and tear, $25,000 on a $500,000 investment, and for sinking fund to replace machinery at eni50,000,000 of tariff tax annually, in consideration of which they now pay only siilOjOOOjOOO annually by way of bounty. The bounty form of protection is a relict to taxpa>ers, and promises great fluancial saving and agricultural gain to the nation. Sixth, because unless the full equivalent of the bounty law is given, the domestic sugar industry will languish, if not perish, and millions of cai)ital will be lost, leaving this country at the mercy of foreign powers, which would be jierilous and un-American, while giving for- eign governments the power to fix the price of sugar — an agricultural product which can as well be produced here as abroad. Seventh, if it be claimed, as is reported, that the law is unconstitu- tional, it is not the province of Congress to decide that question. It belongs to the judicial branch. There is not only high legal authority against the soundness of this contention but the onus has been on the (xovernment to sustain that view. It has had the whole power and machinery of the Government to test the question and it has failed to do so or to even make the attempt. As Mr. Edward Atkinson w(»ll says, the bounty paid can be secured by a temporary duty on coffee, pending the test of the lawfulness of the bounty, in a suit which can be brought. Eighth, by the construction of the sugar paragraphs and because of the x)ermanency ot the appropriation or promise to pay the bounty annually, the question has passed into the domain of public honor, and beyond any fair exercise of the power of political parties, and out of the arena of partisanship. Henry T. Oxnard, President American Beet Sugar Association. 520 SUGAE. BKET SUGAR. Schodnle £. STATEMENT OF ME. THOMAS E. CUTLEE, OF LEHIGH, TJTAH. Mr. Chairman and G-entlbmen of the Committee : 1 believe Mr. Oxnard has covered the ground in a general way. I have the honor to represent the Lehigh Utah factory, which has been built by Ameri- can machinery, and I think it is the first factory in the United States for the manufacture of beet sugar that has been built through Ameri- can labor. Mr. Gear. I would like to ask you a question right there. I have a letter from a gentleman of your State, in which he stated that that was better adapted really than foreign machinery or equally as good. Mr. Cutler. We think so. In behalf of the farmers of that section of the country, who have a very poor market for their produce, we have been for the last two years manufacturing sugar Ixom beets ciTllivated by irrigation ; also the first beets that have been ever raised in that way. Some people said that beets can not properly be raised under the irrigation system. I am able to refute that to-day, and claim that in the extreme west, including California, there is a very large amount of land that will produce beets by irrigation. Further than this, in the interior we are at the mercy of the railroads. We can not get our wheat to the Eastern market for less than 50 cents per 100 pounds. The result is that our farmers to-day have no market for their produce, and are unable to a certain extent to meet their obligations unless we pro- duce something that will give them money. We have in the last two seasons paid the farmers in the vicinity of the plant about $125,000 in money, produced on land which, if it had been in wheat, oats, or barley, or anything indigenous to that section, would have produced only about one-fourth of that amount. The profit of the farmers has been at least $30,000 in comparison to about $10,000, which would have been raised on the same land. It has been stated by Mr. Oxnard in regard to the wages. In regard to building factories, in consequence of the agitation retarding their building and equipment and the employment of capital, I have particular reasons to know. I was in New York a year ago endeavoring to bond the factory, and this question was brought up of agitation of the bounty system, and it was impossible to do anything of the kind because they said such a thing might be done, the bounty might be destroyed, and a tariff might not be popular on sugar. Now, it is an actual fact that since the bounty has been given for the production of these factories that the price of sugar to us, at least, has been 2 cents a pound lower than ever previous. I am speaking now about the aggregate. There are many other things that might be brought, but the chairman has reminded me, however, that your time is limited, and I shall prefer to answer any questions put to me. I did not come here prepared to make an argument, but will be very pleased to answer any questions which may be put to me to the best of my ability. Mr. Turner. The farmers in your vicinity are engaged in the culti- viition of these beets? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. What is the yield per acre in your country? BEET SUGAR. 521 Mr. CUTLEK. I should say it is about 12 tons; that has been tlie average for the last year. Mr. Turner. How much do you pay the farmer for them? Mr. Cutler. Five dollars per ton. Mr. Turner. How much would 12 tons produce of granulated sugar? Mr. Cutler. The first year 110 pounds, and last year they averaged 11:5 pounds. We hope for better results this year. We only produced 10,000 tons of beets the first year, and owing to the drought and scarcity of water 10,000 tons last year, but they were richer -in sugar. It takes several years to acclimate them and get the soil used to the culture of beets and also to get rid of salt and minerals in the soil. Mr. Turner. How much expense attends the cultivation of beets; how much does it cost the farmer to produce the beet"? Mr. Cutler. The first year about $40 ; last year $35, and this year we have gotten down to about $31 per acre. Mr. Turner. Indulge me a moment. Assuming your statement to be correct, that you get 12 tons from the acre and 145 pounds to the ton, which produced an aggregate yield to the acre of 1 ,744 pounds, if I make no mistake; that, at 2 cents a pound for bounty, would make $34.80 that you get in bounty from the Government on the product of that acre iu sugar. Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. You pay the farmer $5 a ton for it? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. That would make $60 an acre that you pay for it to the farmer, and you get $34.80 bounty, and the farmer paid $31 for the culture last year? Mr. Cutler. If you will excuse me, last year was $35. Mr. Turner. You get more in bounty than goes to the farmer in producing the beet. Taking the $31 off, what you pay him for the beets, he gets $29 lor profit on beets; is not that about what he makes? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir; he will make about that on the average. It has cost us in the last three campaigns $00,000 to educate farmers to the condition they are now in. They do not understand the culture of the beets in any way. We have had to send out agents among them, and these agents had to be paid, and each year we expend so much I will say tnere has been no profit at all. I have figures here to prove for the last two campaigns we have had a loss, notwithstanding we have had also a legislative bounty of 1 cent per pound iu Utah. Mr. Turner. What do you mean by campaigns? Mr. Cutler. A year, campaign means the season. Mr. Eeed. You call a campaign the beet season of manufacture? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. How much does it cost you to make that sugar? Mr. Cutler. It costs us the first year fully $5 per ton for beets to make the sugar. Mr. Turner. That you have stated; but I am speaking of the pro- cess of manufacture. Mr. Cutler. Five dollars per ton for the beets. Last year it did not cost us probably over $4.50. This year we hope to make it for $4, pos- sibly a little less. Mr. Turner. You mean to manufacture it? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir; to manufacture the sugar. Mr. Turner. Into this article? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sii'; into the granulated sugar. Mr. Turner. What does it amount to per pound 'I 522 SUGAR. Jlr. Cutler. The first year our sugar cost us 5^ cents.a pound; last ri'ar it cost us about .i cents. Mr. Tr];>ER. Five cents a pound to make it? Mr. CuTLEE. Yes; the entire sugar cost. Mr. TuENEB. Is that the entire cost? Mr. CtiTLEE. Yes, sir. Mr. TuENBE . Labor, material, etc. 1 Mr. CuTLEE. Yes, sir; labor and material, not including wear and tear of machinery at all. The cost of our plant, including 1,000 acres of land, is $680,000. Mr. TuRNEB. Taking 5 cents a pound to be the cost, not including wear and tear as you say, you then get back from the Government two-fifths of the cost at 2 cents a pound 1 Mr. CuTLEE. Yes, sir. Mr. TuENEE. So that your sugar, not including the wear and tear, costs you finally only 3 cents a pound, deducting the bounty wliich the Government pays you'? Mr. OuTLEE. I do not quite understand it that way. I figure it our sugar costs us 5J cents a pound the first year. Mr. TuENBE. Say 5 cents a pound last year. Government gives you back 2 cents ? Mr. CuTLEE. That would be correct. Mr. TuENEE. Then the net cost to you, not including wear and tear, is 3 cents a pound? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir. Mr. TuENEE. And you sell your sugar for what, 4J cents? Mr. Cutler. About 5 cents last year. Mr. TuENEE. So that you make 2 cents a pound, which is a profit of C6| per cent. Is my calculation correct on the figures we assume? Mr. OuTLEE. I presume in theory, but in practice Mr. Turner. I was carefully shielding you from the wear and tear to which you refer? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. Leaving out wear and tear, the cost of your sugar is ."» cents a pound, say. The Government gives to you 2 cents a pound, which deducted leaves 3 cents a pound as the cost of your product to you, not including the deterioration of your machinery ? Mr. Cutler. If we only make 145 pounds of sugar to the ton of beets and that costs §4.50 that is about $3 cost of manufacturing a\ul .'SO cost of beets, and that makes $8. That is the way 1 figure it out. Mr. Turner. Well, you have got your figures so I do not understand your meaning myself Mr. Cutler. That is for a ton of beets. Mr. Turner. I have been endeavoring to pursue the calculations with you on the basis of the cost per pound. Do you understand the basis on which we were pursuing the discussion ? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir; I understand it now. Mr. TuENER. You said it cost you 5 cents a pound, not including the deterioration of your plant? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. The Government pays you back 2 cents a iionnd, which leaves you 3 cents per pound, and you sell your sugar for 5 cents per pound. Is not that a profit of 2 cents a pound? Mr. Cutler. It would be. Mr. TuENEE. Not counting the deterioration of your machinery? Mr. CuTLEE. Not counting the deterioration of the machinery. BEET SUGAR. 523 Mr. Turner. That is all I luivc to nslc you. Mr. Gear. You do not emmt interest in tliati ' Mr. OUTLEK. I do not count tlie interest on it. Mr. GrEAR. You pay taxes ? Mr. Cutler. Y'es, sir. Mr. Gear. Insurance ? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. Then this '2 cents profit is profit you did not malvo'? Mr. Cutler. Which we did not make at all; it is a loss. Mr. Reed. Can you make sugar without a plant? Mr. Cutler. No, sir. Mr. Reed. Can you have a plant without spending money? Mr. Cutler. You can not without spending $500,000 to have a capacity of 300 tons per day. Mr. Reed. Can you get money -without interest? ]Vfr. Cutler. ISTo, sir. Mr. Reed. And your machinery deteriorates in the long run and you have to replace it? Mr. Cutler. We have to replace it. Mr. Reed. Consequently any calculation with the elements of cost of plant and interest thereon and deterioration would be a misleading calculation? Mr. Cutler. It would be misleading and it would more than cover the 2 cents a pound that the Government gives us. Mr. Reed. Now, notwithstanding this liguring oat a profit by leav- ing out some of the most important elements of the cost by which they show a profit of 2 cents a pound, you have not made any profit? Mr. Cutler. We have not at ail. Mr. Reed. Consequently such a calculation as that could only be misleading? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir; misleading. I have the actual figures them- selves as to what the cost was last year and the year before. Mr. Gear. Is not the producing of beets and converting them into sugar of value to the farmer by making a concentration of crops and saving a large amount of freight? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir. Mr. TAitSNEY. How much wheat is exported from Utah annually to the other States or foreign markets ? Mr. Cutler. Last year about 40,000 bushels. Mr. Tarsney. How much was imiwrted into the State? Mr. Cutler. None into the State. Mr. Tarsney. Utah more than supplies the home demand for wheat ? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir. Mr. Tarsney. How is it with corn ? Mr. Cutler. We are not a coru-producing Territory. Mr. Tarsney. So the farmers who had use for it had to pay this cost offreightto getit? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir. Mr. Tarsney. What other agricultural product do you produce beyond your home demand? Mr. OU'J'ler. Potatoes very largely. Mr. Tarsney. Oats, corn, and such things as that you do not pro- duce beyond your home demand? Mr. Cutler. We raise just about enough oats for the larmers' con- sumption, but the market for potatoes does not average 10 cents a bushel from one year to the other. 524 SUGAR. 'Slv. BRECKiNRiDfrE. What was your mitput last year of your estab- lishment ill sugar? Mr. Cutler. 1,480,000 pounds of sugar. Mr. Beeckixridge. Do you produce aiiytliiiig else? Mr. Cutler. Nothing else, except the molasses which we dump into the creek. ^Ve have no use for it. Mr. Breckinridge. The sugar was the only salable product of your establishment? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. What is the estimated salable product of your establishment this year? Mr. Cutler. 4,000,000 pounds. Mr. Breckinridge. What is the full capacity of your establishment? Mr. Cutler. I presume it will be about 5,000,000 to 6,000,000 pounds. Mr. Breckinridge. What is the length of the manufacturing season with you ? Mr. Cutler. One hundred days with us. Mr. Breckinridge. You woik one hundred days in the year? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. You work no longer because the material is exhausted? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir; we could not possibly care for it any longer. Mr. Breckinridge. And your plant lies idle two-thirds of the year? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir; and we have skilled labor which must be paid for the whole year around. Mr. Breckinridge. Is that true of the foreign establishments also that they can only work about one hundred days of the year? Mr. Cutler. I think tliat is about the maximum. Mr. Turner. I could not quite catch the conversation between you and Mr. Breckinridge and I may repeat some matters you have already stated. What was the cost of your plant? Mr. Cutler. The plant proper is $500,000. Mr. Turner. What do you say is your annual product ? Mr. Cutler. It should be 4,000,000 to 5,000,000, or even 0,000,000 pounds of sugar, and it will be in time. Mr. Turner. What is your estimate for the xiroduct this year? Mr. Cutler. 4,000,000 pounds. Mr. OxNAED. State what you made for the last two years. Mr. Cutler. 1,500,000 pounds and 1,100,000 pounds. Mr. Turner. What is the life of your macliinery? Mr. Cutler. I presume from ten to fifteen years with 5 to 10 i^er cent of improvements each year, or ^ ear and tear. Mr. Turner. Say ten years ? Mr. Cutler. Say ten years ; yes, sir. Mr. Turner. At 2 cents a pound the output of 4,000,000 pounds there would be a yield to you in bounty, or say profit, or whatever you nniy choose to call it, of $80,000 a year. There would be a bounty of that much to you? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. Interest on your plant at 6 per cent would be about $30,000? Mr. Cutler. Interest in our country is from 8 to 10 per cent. Mr. Turner . Say 8 per cejit ; that would be ^40,000 and the deteriora- tion annually of 5 per cent? Mr. Payne. I understood the plant was $050,000. Mr. Cutler. You asked a qucstiou about the plant and I said the BEET SUGAR. 625 plant itself was $500,000, but Tie have employed $680,000, iucludiug 1,000 acres of land. Mr. Turner. There is no deterioration in the laud, this larid you use for the production of beets? iMr. Cutler. It is laud we bought for the production of beets pro- viding the fanners did not take hold of it as they should do, but wc have not u.scd it much for beets. We have been raising hay on it for the i)urposc of feeding cattle and experimenting on pulp. Mr. Payne. Now, take the 5 per cent wear and tear of the machin- ery, and it is say $40,000; now where is your profit? Mr. Tarsney. In other words the Goverument is paying for your Avhole plant and deterioration? The Chairman. The Goverument gives $1.5,000 besides. Mr. Turner. Is that a fair calculation; $80,000 being paid you in bounty, and the other under your interest account at the rate of 8 per cent is $11 (,000, and the wear and tear nearly 5 jier cent would be $25,000, and that covers the deterioration of the machinery during the whole period you speak of I suppose. Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir ; I presume so. The Chairman. So you get your wear and tear back and make $15,000 besides annually? Mr. Cutler. Well, it would not cover the loss entirely on the plant the last year or two. That deterioration I believe will iucrease, of court'c; 1 have not had enough experience to tell exactly what it is, but it will increase in years. Mr. Gear. How do you know you are going to make 4,000,000 pounds '! Mr. Cutler. Well, that is our theory, Mr. Gear. That is based on theory? Mr. Cutler. Yes, sir; on theory. Mr. OxNARD. He has never got more than a million yet? Mr. Cutler. Here is a gentleman from Calitornia who would like to speak on the subject. IMr. Bynum. 1 want to ask you what land is worth, say that 1,000 acres ? Mr. Cutler. I should say an average of $84. BEET SUGAE. Schl;tlule E. STATEMENT OF ME. E. P. FOWLER, OF ANAHEIffi, CAI. Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen of the Committee : I represent the Anaheim Cooperative Beet Sugar Company of California, composed entirely of farmers, and I would lilce to lay before you tlieir plan of or- ganization, and make plain how this Governmeut bounty is paid back to the tiller of the soil for the production of beets. Gur company is capitalized at $500,000, divided into 4,000 shares, 1,000 shares being- treasury stock, and. 3,000 subscribed for by an acre of laud for eacli share of stock, and when a fanner subscribes for the stock lie deeds his land in fee to the company, and receives his share of stock. I should have stated the application sets forth that for each share of stock one acre of laud shall be paid for ti\e years. Of course our farmers are 526 SUGAR. like most farmers iu tlie United States, they have land, but no money. We thought with this organization and this 3,000 acres of land on our plan possibly we might be able to borrow money enough to erect a. plant. We found on that proposition we could not. We then formed this organization, we mortgaged, or we pledged to x^ay into the hands of a trustee, the bounty of 2 cents a jjound on every pound of sugar which we made for the seciirity of the bonds of the buyer. On that plan we found we could get our money, but the time we had occupied in forming our company and maturing our plans brought it so late, and there seems to be an uncertainty in the minds of cajjitalists whether this bounty was going to remain or not, that they refused to give us the money until the election, and we have not succeeded in getting it up to today, although it is promised, and we have made with the Kilby Manufacturing Company, of Cleveland, a contract. If there is no ad- verse legislation by this administration they will erect our plant. There are 298 stockholders, and here is a paper I would like to leave with your body. Mr. Gear. One question; what do you pay for beets in California, $5 a ton? JMr. FoAVLBE. Our farmers around the Chino factory this year were paid on an average of about $5 ; some farmers received as high as $7.90. Mr. Geak. If it was not for this bounty paid by the Government your farmers would not receive $5 a ton for their beets? Mr. EowLEE. So, sir. Mr. Bynum. And you expected to i)ay for this plant and the machinery out of the bounty? Mr. FOAVLBR. JSTo, sir; what I say was, we were to pay the 2 cents a bounty in to the hands of the trustee for security. OrifiCE OF THE Anaheim Co-Operative Beet Sugak Company, Anaheim, Oraiuje County, Cal., March 10, 189S. We, the undersigned directors and subscribers to the capital stock in the Anaheim Cooperative Beet Sugar Company, have noticed the efforts of a few men in Congress to repeal the law giving bounties for the manufacture of sugar. This company represents a capital of $500,000, $375,000 of which has been subscribed by 298 fVirmers, whose names are appended hereto, and is organized and will be riui ou the cooperative plan. This has been made possible by the wise provision of law which thus encourages and aids the farmers to embark in this ucav industry. The bounty goes directly to our farmers, and if maintained and confined during the fifteen years provided in the McKinley tariff law we believe will develop the sugar industry to such an extent as to render the United States independent of all reliance upon foreign countries for our sugar supply. There are but six beet-sugar manufactories in operation in the United States, and our company will be the tirst one organized on the cooperative plan which has made Germany the largest sugar producing nation in the world; and it successful here, as we have no reason to doubt, it will be the precursor and herald of scores of otlier factories, organized on the same basis, owned and operated by the farmers who pro- duce the raw material, and who will richly deserve the bounty, which was given to foster and encourage this long-neglected industry. With free sugar the nation saves $56,000,000 per year, which was formi'rly paid by the consumer (the people, in the shape of tarifl), while the bounty paid by the Gov- ernment will not amount to that sum for several years. With America self-sustaining in the production of sugar it would give employment to a million of workers, render productive and protitable thousands of farms, and sa-ve the deportation of $150,000,000 in gold annually to pay for sugar produced iu alien lands. We therefore enter our most earnest protest against any and all attempts to repeal the only provision of law found upon our statute books which is directly in lavor of the fanners. Willi the law prescribed and made secure for the pfi-.'icribed timr .if liftccu years our fai'iiii-r.s will li.-ivc a reasonable ci.Ttaiuty, asthey embark in this now and heretu- furo regarded problematical industry, that their eU'orls will nut be lost and tjrcjf BEET SUGAR. 527 lioiues sac [ilictil while they are develoijing aud perfecting here one of tlie greatest industries of the world. We nrg.') upon our Senators and Representatives in Congress the great importauco of seeing that the sugar bounty provisions of the McKinley tariff law shall not be disturbed. If the American Congress will do its duty as it has started out to do, the American farmer will do his fnll duty toward making our land self-snp]iorting, giv- ing employment to labor, and wringing from our soil and snn the treasures so richly garnered thera E. P. FOWI.EK, Th. F. Jones, KjiAXK .1. CaI'ITAIN, KlCHAKD GlKD, R. .T. NoRTJIAJI, H. A. PiEliCK, E. J. FI!E^•CH, Board of Directors. Anaheim, Okasge County, Cal., August S, 1S!)3. DearSie: We herewith present yon some facts pertaining to the sugar-beet in- dustry, which is assuming considerable importance here in southern California. We need not call your attention to the long struggle, the costly experiments, the wreck of many fortunes during the last thirty years in efforts to profitably establish tlie inaunfacture of sugar from sugar beets in the United States. These are a part of the history of our country. The generous aid given by Congress to the encourage- ment of this industry, after long years of experiments, and the development of advanced scientific methods, have overcome in a great measure the difficulties here- tcilbre encountered in the extraction and orystalization of the sugar contained in the sugar beet, and we may now look upon it as one of the great future industries of the United .States. The bounty of 2 cents per jiound, granted by Congress by section 3 of the Mc- Kinley tariff law, has done much to stimulate this new and important industry. Before its passage we only had two small factories in our whole domain — one located at Alvarado and the other at AVatsi)nville, both in California, and even now there are but six in the United States. Beside the two named, there is one at Norfolk, Nebr., one at Grand Island, Nebr., one at Lelii, Utah, and one at Chino, in this State. The total production of beet sugar in the I'niled States in 1891 was 12,204,838 ))0unds, audin 1892 it increased to 27,083,322 pounds. The principal gain was in California, which produced 8,175,438 pounds in 1891, and 21,801,322 pounds in 1892, and we think the production for 1893 of our State will reach fully 40,000,000 pounds. This is only the third year of the growth of this enterprise, and its progress has been most gratifying. But there are features pertaining to this industry which peculiarly commend it to our American farmers. The most of the sugar manufactured from the beet in (jer- many, from whom we get our largest supply, is manufactured by factories owned and operated by the raisers of the beats, small farmers, on the cooperative plan, and it has been the means of bringing untold wealth and prosperity to the localiti('S where it is most thoroughly established. Tliis feature is already appealing strongly to our jieople. We have organized a company here on that basis, which comprises some 200 farmers and represents $ji00.000 of capital stock, divided into four thousand shares. Every .share is rrprrsented by one acre of ground, which is deeded in trust to the company, ami whicli must be cultivated iu sugar beets for five years. Our farmers, like most of the farmeis of America, have but little money; but the land so deeded by them to the Cooperative Company, furnishes a security upon which to borr(j\\' the money to establish and successfully operate their factory. And here is seen the wisdom and beneficence of the present bounty of 2 cents per pound on domestic sugar. The farmer, having nothing but his laud and his lal)or, finds it almost impossible to borrow from capitalists the large sums reiiuired to establish a su<'<'essl'ul sugar plant. It has been demon- strated that a factory must have a capacity of at least 330 tons per day to yield a jnofit on woiking, owing to tlie heiivy expense, and such a plant, fully equipped, costs from 4^400,000 to *500,000. But we have found that by pledging and putting aside the Government bounty as a ''sinking fund," with which to meet the intere.st on our bonds, we can borrow all the money necessary to build 100 factories, and have every one of them owned and operated by the people, ^hose products they will con- vert into an article of commerce, the demand lor which is world-wide. AVe have lioen at work nearly two years iu perfecting this cooperative organization and secure the funds necessary to build its factory — $400,000 — but already there is a widespread interest and demand for the extension of this work. We are niaking arrangements for the organization of four moro cooperati\'i; companies iu Orantjo and Los Angeles '-*"' SUGAR. to'lhl'^rf; Jn?"^ '"'ill include 1,000 farmers, and everv dollar of tLis bounty will so tL n«vt fiii '"^^ ^iK''^^}^^^ "" industry that will give employment within onr nt. T ''"'"'' *° 5-000,000 of people, save hundreds of millions of money to «ug °r ''°"°*'^y™<'"' =1=1^^ render us independent of reliance upon foreign suppl^ of l,nv«l?f^'n'^'*'''n "/•.*'''' '°'l"**''y '^^ '^^^'ily dreamed of yet by our people. We ia.^e in southern California alone not less than 1,500,000 acres of land adapted to the ,'^,iH?-»1? 1 ^"l^-^i -f,*^'- f?*^ probably from 4,000,000 to 5,000,000 acres in the i i,+! I '"^ f-^ will yield an average of ten tons of beets per acre. The expeii- nieuta ot our national Department of Agriculture have also demonstrated that there IS a wide belt or zone, extending from the Great Lakes to the Pacific, capable of pro- lished in our eomitry, so prosperous irom the impetus gi\eii, tiial the iiMticiu Avill be rejiaid a hundred fold for having been interested in its h.'iialf. Very truly yours, E. P. ruWLKK AND OTUliliS. BEET SUGAR. 529 BEET SUGAE. STATEMENT OF ME. ISAAC HECHT, OF SAN FRANCISCO, CAL. Mr. Chaikman : I will be as brief as possible, and wish to submit to you here the results of the beet-sugar industry entered into by some of us in this way some four years ago. At first we worked under a tariff of 2 and a fraction of a cent per pound for the first year, 1889, working the business with all the energy and all the iiitelligence that any factory was worked in the United States, and we made nothing. In 1890 we made nothing; in 1891 we made nothing; in 1892 we declared a div- idend of $30,000 on a capital actually of .$265,000. We bought an old plant which was worth $150,000 more, so in four years, after conduct- ing this enterprise first with a tariff, then with a bounty, it did not yield but 2J per cent revenue on the capital which we invested. But notwithstanding this we are perfectly well satisfied. During that time we have paid out $500,000 in the immediate vicinity of San Francisco, of which every cent went into the pockets of our neighbors. We occupy land which is worth $300 an acre and which was used for gar- dening purposes, raising cucumbers, potatoes, cabbages, etc., and not- withstanding that oiu? firm preferred to plant beets. We consider, Mr. Chairman, that the wealth of the nation is in its soil. If we can get out of our soil so much more money than any other crop we ought to cultivate it and extend it. If Germany, if France, if Belgium can afford to import our cereals at 50 per cent more than we can get for them why should not the United States be able to put that same land into beet sugar instead of raising these crops at a loss of 50 per cent! That is all I have to say, gentlemen. statement furnished by Mr. Isaac HecTit, 1891. 1892. CoDatni'!tion account . Added during year $150, 000. 00 38, 375. 74 188, 375. 74 08, 105. 86 $256, 481. 60 9, 401. 11 $265, 882. 71 Totiil carrietl forward . 188, 375. 74 256, 481. 60 Planted acre.s . Beets received tons . Sugar made : JRaw pounds . WMf e do . . - Third product do. . . Pulp made (estimated) tons. Coal cojisumed do. . Cost of coal delivered at factory - . . per ton . Coke consumed tonf.. Cost of colte delivered per ton. Limestone consumed tons . Cost of limestone delivered per ton . Average yield beets per acre tons . Amount seed sold per acre ])0unds. Total per acre sold and fumislied gratui- tously for resowing EXPENDITURES, Beets Steam fuel Coke Limestone Labor Taxes and insurance Ilepairs Supplies Interest and discount OfBce Legal Miscellaneous expenses Loss on seed sold Dividend 958 9, 224 355. 801 1,388,933 700, 000 3,690 2, 416 $7. 62J 106 $16. 07 926 $2.85 9.62 16.3 19.4 1,320 13, 298 2, 806, 843 949 10, 94-2 1, 782, 982 1,594 15, 090 2, 506, 860 1, 162. 200 5,319 3,214 $8.03 104 $16. 05 1,193 $2. 65 10.07 14 15.1 1, 025, 516 4, 15.S 1, 8.90 $7.96 105 $13. 13 960 $2.40 10.47 13.6 17.2 1,424,510 5,772 2,080 $7.62 86 $13.13 1, 393 $2. 55 11.03 14.7 20.9 $44. 226. 50 18, 146. 92 1, 857. 56 2, 514. 49 27, 790. 57 3, 223. 44 2, 078. 36 3,835.15 396. 74 709. 29 765. 75 932. 14 106,537. 01 $58,107.16 27, 379. 05 1,767.16 3, 820. 43 28, 093. 72 4, 966. 05 1, 817. 00 .9,202.15 1,985.17 1,251.18 1,000.00 0, 160. 90 $62, 200. 76 16, 188. 48 2, 640. 88 2, 789. 63 19,408.15 2, 495. 38 10, 112. 11 5, 786. 31 934. 31 1,098.72 $78, 693. 07 14,871.20 1,144.00 3, 609. 48 24, 007. 65 2, 605. 03 7, 225. 53 7,891.73 847. 20 803. 99 2,770.28 30, 000. 00 123,994.34 I 174,529.16 T H- -34 530 SUGAR. ^ BEET SUGAR. STATEMENT OF MR. 0. K. LAPHAM, OF STATJKTOIT, VA. Mr. Chairman : If you will allow me to say oue word, I will state that I am a beet-,i> rower of Staunton, Va., and I want to merely say this: Except fortlie bounty it would be simply inijjossible to make beet sugar there, aud if this bounty is continued we ought to succeed as well as in Germany. CA]S^E SUGAR. STATEMENT OF ME. JOHN DYMOND. Mr. Chairman and (!entlb:\ien: We are here as a delegation of jilanters of Louisiana, and before taking up the economic side of this industry we would like for Dr. 8tnbb, of our State, who is a director of the exiieriment station and connected with the sugar school, to address you upon the possibilities of our products. Then we will take up the economic side of the question. STATEMENT OF DR. W. C. STTTBBS, OF LOUISIANA. Mr. Chairman aud Gentlemen op the Ways and Means Com- jniTTEE: There is a scientific as well as a politico- economic side to domestic cane-sugar industry. Its successful development requires a comprehensive knowledge of agriculture, mathematics, mechanics, mechanical engineering, drawing, and sugar-making. The successful planter must imderstand the j^hysical and chemical properties of his soils, the physiological, chemical, and botanical relations of the plant to be cultivated, and the followi7ig requirements of the latter when grown upon the former. He must understand drawing to be able to intelligently interpret the numerous blue iiriuts sent him descriptive of the machinery to be used. He niust be versed in the laws of mechan- ics to calculate the ca])acity of machines suitable for his sugarhouse. He must have some knowledge of engineering to enable him to com- prehend the Aarious motions at work in his sugarhouse. He should learn the principles which underlie sugar-making and the successful apjilication of these principles in the art. Since sugar-making is purely a chemical process, the science of chemistry should be well understood. To these numerous accomplishments should be added financial ability, executive skill, and indomitable energy, rare combinations in one man, to make a tirstclass sugar-jilanter. Is it not a wonder that the sugar- cane industry of this country survived the half century of darkness of its first existence? Eicli lauds,- slave labor, unlimited credit, with fair ])ricos for sugar, sustained it tiU buried by the earthquake of the civil war. After the war, sustained by high values, it slowly developed, but mainly along old lines, till the extremely low prices of 1880 created alarm in the l>osom of every sugar-jjlanter in the South. In this j^ear at a spfcial convention called to consider the gravity of the situation, it was decided that low prices, unreliable labor, soil depletion, aud high ijj(uiey rates had shorn the profession of much of its i)rotits and all of CANE SUGAR. 531 its pleasures and cliarms, and that a successful prosecution of this enter- prise in the future required an intelligent investigation and application of the many principles euuiiciated above. To this end they organized The Sugar Planters' xVssociation of Louisiaua, an organization which has so far bravely fulfilled the purposes for which it was created and which has been largelyinstrumentaliu developing our present x)rosx)er- ous condition. Soon after organization the leading planters were astounded at the meager literature x:)ertaining to their industry. Little or no scientific work had been given to sugar cane, though the industry had been prospering upon tropical isles for centuries. Only beet-sugar literature could be obtained and their effort to apply many of the prin- ciples and teachings of this plant proved futile, expensive, and worth- less when a]3plied to sugar cane. With th^se surroundings in 1885 the Louisiana Sugar Planters' Associ- ation established and has since supported the Louisiana Sugar Experi- ment Station, where extensive scientific and practical experiments in the field, laboratories, and sugarhouse have been carried on with sugar cane and its products. These exi^eriments have not only been productive of greatgood to the State, but have stimulated the planter to personal exer- tions in the acquirement of knowledge and the application of principles underljdng his profession. With the inauguration of this station began my career in the sugar industry, and I can now look back across the vista of eight years at the wonderful developments made during that time. At that time a majority of the sugar made in the State was upon the open-kettle system; to-day, 213 large vacuum pans, aided by over 1,000 centrifugals, give us four-fifths of our entire crop in beautiful white or yellow crystals. Then the scums, settlings, and tank bottoms went to our ditches; today over 1,000 filter jiresses squeeze from them their saccharine contents and leave the residue as a valuable contri- bution to our compost heaps. Then there were only eleven double effects in our State, and they small and imperfect; now over 100 of enormous size and of most approved patents are kept busy concentrating the juices from our mills and batteries. Then small three-roller mills, with an occasional five- roller mill, expressed 50 to 70 per cent of juices of the cane; to-day ponderous six and nine roller mills vie with diffusion batteries in their 80 to 88 per cent extraction out of a possible total of 90 i)er cent. Few and imperfect were the bagasse burners then, now every house of importance has one, utilizing tlie woody fiber of the cane in the pro- duction of steam under the largest and best constructed boilers, thereby saving thousands of dollars annually in coal bills. Then the capacity of our best sugarhouses was 250 tons of cane per day; to-day we have one house of 1,500 tons per day capacity, a score or more of 1,000 tons, with many others of 400 to 500 tons. Formerly not a sugar chemist was to be found in the State, now over seventy-five exercise chemical control in our sugarhouses; discovering and correcting losses, planning and exe- cuting experimental research along the lines of their work, and throw- ing aflood of light u])on the Avhole industry. Tlie central factory, a place where the small farmer could sell his cane, had no existence then, now over 100 houses are competing for the purcliase of cane, and small farmers everywhere liave no trouble in disposing of their cane at fair iirices. A bill for the divorce of the agrienltural from the mechan- ical side of this industry has already been filed in the minds and hearts of our x)lanters and time is now writing its liniil decree of acceptance. The agricultural side has also kept i)ace with the mechanical. Ten 532 SUGAR. to ]5 tons of cane per acre Avere once good yields. Now, with improved implements, judicious but heavy use of fertilizers, and the most advanced system of cultivation, including a wise rotation of crops, 30 tons per acre are frequent, with occasional yields of 40 to 45 tons. Formerly a hogshead of 1,000 jiounds of sugar to the aci'e was con- sidered a fair yield — last year our vacuum-x)an crop gave an average yield per acre of over 3,100 pounds. Drainage, costly and laborious as it is, has received a wonderful impetus. Every well-regulated plan- tation is now excellently drained, while many thousands of acres have been underlaid with tile at an expense of $50' to $75 per acre. Many more instances might be cited of the rapid improvements all along the line. It can be said with truth that no other industry in this country has shown such marveloirs progress in so short a time. Every dollar made on sugar in this timehas been reinvested in imi^rovements, together with the addition of many millions from the outside world. This year alone will witness several millions thus invested. The Sugar Planters' Association has also beeu instrumental in estab- lishing the Louisiana Planter, a journal devoted to the sugar-cane industry, and now acknowledged to be the leading sugar journal of the world, which weekly reaches the homes of thousands of planters, mechanics, chemists, sugar-makers, etc., shedding light and life upon the industry. As a i)opular educator it has accomplished great good. Two years since the planters of the States organized, at their own expense, a "sugar school" at Audubon Park, where experts in the sugar industry might be educated in the science and practice of its agriculture, mechanics, chemistry, and sugar-making. It is largely attended, and when its graduates shall enter the sugar world as leaders and advisers, further impetus will be given to this already progressing industry. The soils of lower Louisiana are extremely fertile. They are rich in vegetable matter and are disposed to expend their raging fertility in the product of weed or foliage. This disposition, aided by a very large rainfall, with a constant atmospheric humidity, preijminently suits a gregarious succulent plant like sugar cane. Plants grown for the seed they produce are not economically and successfully grown here because of tendency to excessive foliage. This tendency, so objec- tionable to cereals, is beneficial to cane — a crop grown entirely for stalk and not for seed. The cane plant is not the delicate exotic that some persons would have us believe, but is on the c( )ntrary entirely acclimated in Louisiana. The sugar cane crop is as certain year by year as any other leading crop in the Union. It may be truthlully said that no crop is better adapted to the alluvial lands of Louisiana than cane, and nowhere on earth can be found more intelligent, earnest, and iirogres- sive farmers and planters than those now engaged in combining the natural resources of our soil and climate with the scientific achieve- ments of modern times in the successful production of sugar. Should the present spirit and enthusiasm pervading our people be preserved undaunted tlirough the next decade,! feel confident that the larger liortion of Louisiana will be devoted to sugar cane, and that enough sugar will be produced therein to supply the wants of the en- tire Union. A slight glance at our lU'esent condition, with its marvel- ous developments everywhere visible, and a prospective glance at our future, with its vast possibilities and promising probabilities, will con- vince the student of political science of the truth of this remark. Louisiana has 45,000 s(|aare miles. Of this about 19,000 are alluvial. Of the latter amount ojjly about 5,000 are incapable of immediate CANE SUGAR. 533 iTclaniiiition. The roTnaining 14,000 squnre milps, or over 8,000,000 of acres, cau with iio-cessury capital be at once brought into wuccessiul cultivation, and every acre is well adapted to sugar-cane culture. Of the lauds once in sugar before the war, it is estimated that only about one-third to one-half is now devoted to sugar cane. This reduced area has by cultivation, fertilization, rotation, etc., given us the largest crop on record. Simply restore to this crop its former acreage and you will more than double our present yield. To these let us add the parishes of East Baton Eouge, East Feliciana and West Feliciana which are now awaiting the central factories to go bodily into cane culture. Cover thei)artially occupied parishes of Avoyelles, Point Coupee, and Eapides, and we add hundreds of thousands of acres to our area. Seek the new territory of the western prairies and you will find that the central factory at Lake Charles, on their western borders, is prospering and rapidly forming a nucleus of sugar growing in the far-away parish of Calcasieu. These prairie parishes are well adapted to sugar-cane cul- ture, and nothing but capital for central factories is needed to add sev- eral millions of acres to the sugar industry in this section of the State. Experiments have shown that sugar will thrive in both the Florida parishes on the east and the hill iDarishes on the north. But confining ourselves to our alluvial lands alone, and comparing the amount now under cultivation with what can be cultivated, and the present product with the prospective, and it requires only an appli- cation of the double rule of three in aiifchmetic to give the results. Tliere are about 1!G0,000 acres now under cultivation in Louisiana in sugar. The yield from this area will average about 250,000 tons, or one eighth of amount at present consumed by the United States. There are alluvial lands available for sugar iiilture only awaiting capi- tal to develop of at least 8,000,000 acres. When developed, whicli it will be if properly fostered, what will be the output of sugar? It will only require one-fourth of this area to supply present demands. Should the demand continue to increase, there is stiU room for an abundant supply for many years to come. This is not the idle vaporing of a wild enthusiast, but the sober, qiriet deduction of one trained in scientific thought and who has made the geology, topography, and agriculture of this State special studies for eight years, assisted by a learned corps of observers and experi- menters. 3Ir. Bryan. Have you made any computation as to the amount of land it would take to produce all the sugar the United States requii'es '! Dr. Stubbs. Yes, sir; I have it in this. Two million acres will make the crop. We compute a ton of sugar to every acre. I think there is now consumed 2,000,000 tons of sugar in the United States and 2,000,000 acres will make the present crop. Mr. Beyan. I thought the con sumption was something over 3,000,000 tons'? Dr. Stubbs. Two million tons last year, I think. Mr. Bryan. That includes all kinds of sugar? Dr. Stubbs. Tes, sir; we make a ton to each acre. Tliercfore, it would be 2,000,000 tons, or eight times the quantity we have in Louisi- ana will make it. Mr. Bynum. What is that to the acre? Dr. Stubbs. Two thousand one hundred pounds — a little over. Mr. Bynum. That would amount to about $40 an acre bounty. That Is more than the farmers are receiving in jny county. 534 SUGAR. CANE SUGAR. Schcdnle E. STATEMENT OF HE. JOHN DYMOND, OF NEW 0ELEAN3, LA, Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen of the Committee : TLe sugar Industry of Louisiana was practically destroyed by the civil war, tlio crop of 186-1 having been but 5,000 tons. Prom that date until 1890 the progress of the industry was but moderate; in 1865, 9,000 tons; in 1870, 81,000 tons; in 1875, 82,000 tons; in 1880, 136,000 tons; in 1885, 113,000 tons; in 1889, 114,000 tons. While this increase from so small a beginning- indicates large percentages of increase, yet the crops were still below the highest antebellum crop and did not by any means utilize the available lauds in Louisiana, and they were somewhat dis- appointing. There was then an uncertainty about the legal status of the sugar industry that made it diflicult to interest capitalists in it and difficult to secure in any manner the means for the proper development of the industry. When the Louisiana sugar industry was thus destroyed by the war sugars rose in value throughout the world. Louisiana produced about one-fourth of the amount consumed in the United States, and the sud- den demand on the sugar markets of the world for an amount to com- pensate for the loss of the Louisiana crop doubled the prices of sugar and gave an impetus to the development of the European beet-sugar industry that it has kept until now. The l)eet-sugar crop, now exceeding 3,000,000 tons, was but 658,000 tons in 1868; '943,000 tons in 1870; 1,130,000 tons in 1872; 1,318,000 tons in 1875; 2,301,000 tons in 1883, when it reached and surpassed the world's production of cane sugar, and finally it was 3,402,000 tons in 1S02. The wonderful growth of this industry in Europe is one of the mar- velous results of governmental intervention to promote such industries. It is a matter of record that beet sugar was the result of scientific investigation. Sugar was found in the beet, and though limited in (luantity there seemed possibility of success in securing a compensating yield. After long years of struggle and after maiiy years of goveru- iiiental fostering by practically prohibitive duties and by bounties, the beet-sugar crop of Europe had begun to assume some magnitude when the civil war began. The immense demand then created for sugar by the loss of the American crop was the opportunity of the beet sugar men and from that time the crop rapidly increased, reaching 3,402,000 tons in 1892, as hereinbefore stated, or about three-fifths of the total sugar produ(,'tion of the world. This wonderful growth of the European beet-sugar industry, while promoted by legislation, was also the outcome of the cheap capital, the cheap labor, and the great skill so readily obtained in Europe; and the start thus gained by it has made it supremely difficult for us in Louis- iana to successfully compete with it. France, Germany, Austna, Belgium, Holland, and Russia ha\'e always gi\en tiie most careful consideration to their beet-sugar industry and have always fo.stered it by such legislation as would bring about the desired results. The most recent legislation in France gives the sugar producers a minimum bounty of one-tenth the excise tax on CANE SUGAR. 53 the beets, and the laws of each of those European States gives the pro- ducer a greater or less bounty. A cargo of some 4,000 tons of beet sugar is now arriving in Kew Orleans from Germany, and comes with a bounty paid on it by the Gernian Government, and it is sold to America at a less price than it could have been sold for in Germany. It comes to us also with its cost based upon the low cost of Gernian labor and of Gernian capital. Recently many efforts have been made to induce legislative changes concerning sugar in those European States, but the authorities have persistently refused to do anything prejudicial to this important st:i])le crop. The ijrogress that we have made in Louisiana during recent years has been largely based upon the scientific methods marked out in Europe, and we have every reason to believe from our success and progress since the adoption of the law of 1890 that the path still lies open before us for constant and satisfactory progress. The value of the sugar industry to the United States is not well understood. We will say, first, that it is the chief industry of the State of Louisiana, that half of its people and half its capital are directly or indirectly engaged in this industry. More than half a milhon peo- ple are dependent upon our Louisiana sugar industry for their daily bread, and we have more than a hundred million dollars invested in it. The industry is of like interest to Texas and to Florida, where it can be largely increased, and wherever the beet industry is developed in this country it will become of similar importance there. Lands in cane culture or in beet culture utilize an immense amount of human labor and it is the largest unoccupied field open to American labor. The scientific character that the sugar industry has taken makes it an open tield for scientific men who find in it a full range for the high- est talent. The immense amount of intricate machinery used in the industry makes it a field for the exercise of the highest order of mechanical skill, while the opportunities for the investment of capital are practi- cally unlimited when we consider the immense amount of sugar we consume and that we now produce but about one-eighth of it. There is no other field wherein there lies the same opportunities for American labor, American science, American skill, and American cap- ital. In the iron industry, the steel industry, in cotton manufactures, wool- ens and silks we have close competition with all the rest of the world; the field is open and practically unoccupied to those who would supply the United States with domestic sugar. America has taken an advanced position in all other agricultural industries. We control the markets of the world in corn and cotton, in breadstuffs, and in meats. We can now add to the list of our great agricultural staples, another, sugar, capable of production in every State of the Union; and we can soon produce the 2,000,000 tons we now con- sume and retain at home the $100,000,000 we now send abroad for it, and, further, we can readily produce within the limits of the Union the 4,000,000 tons of sugar we shall want for home consumption Avithin twenty years and retain at home the $300,000,000 that would otherwise be sent abroad annually to pay for it. Apart from the magnitude of the Louisiana sugar industry and its vital importance to the people of the State, it bears relations to the other States the extent of which few appreciate. 536 StTGAE. Oanp sngar requires a given soil and climate, and wliere these exist all other supplies can ordinarily be got more cheaply from the other btates. The climate and soil of lower Louisiana is peculiarly adapted to the growth of sugar cane, and is ill adapted to the production of other staple crops. The result of this is that the $25,000,000 realized out of the Louisiana sugar crop is practically all expended in the other States of the Union. It may be said that the $25,000,000 in sugar produced in Louisiana is all sold to the other States of the Union, and that the entire amount is brought back to Louisiana in such supplies as are there consumed. The machinery used in Louisiana comes from Missouri, Kentucky, Ohio, Pennsylvania, New York, and many of the other States. The immense amount of coal consumed in the process of manufacture comes from Pittsburg and from Alabama. Our mules come from Kentucky, Tennessee, Missouri, and Indiana; our cooperage from Ohio, Indiana, and Michigan; our cow pease from the Oarolinas, Georgia, and Ten- nesee; our boots, slioes, and dry goods, groceries, and all the vast mass of supplies consumed in our industry come from the other States of the Union, until we reach an interstate trade exceeding $50,000,000— an amount which, until now, or until very recently, exceeds the entire amount of our trade with the rest of this hemisphere, Cuba and Brazil excepted. This vast interstate trade is a matter of such moment and so much greater than it is usually thought to be that we earnestly recommend it to the consideration of your committee as a possible factor in guid- ing your deliberations. While the cane-sugar industry is the leading agricultural industry of the State of Louisiana, it has afeout it so many of the features of a manufacturing industry that it employs many times the labor ordinarily used in agricultural industries, and owing to the Anally immense pro- duction, within a limited area is cai>able of supporting a large popula- tion by the labor thus given. The beet-sugar industry in a similar manner brings with it many collateral advantages wherever it exists, and long experience in Europe has shown that wherever the beet-sugar industry has been made a suc- cess that such communities are placed in a more nourishing condition by the larger agricultural results developed by the industry. This is already found to be the case in Nebraska and California, where our beet- sugar industry is developing, and we believe that similar results will follow the development of the sorghum-sugar industry in Kansas. To recapitulate, we would say that the immense consumption of .sugar in the American Union, the limited amount thus far produced within the Union, and the satisfactory results brought about in Europe and elsewhere, wherever the sugar industry is successfully introduced, would indicate that this is now the most conspicuous direction in which American enterprise, American capital, and American labor can find employment. It should be the eftbrt of American legislation to create and promote an American sugar industry. "When the Jaw of October 1, 1890, was enacted there was consider- able confidence developed in the permanence of the law. The Louisi- ana planters, most of whom are Democrats, earnestly protested against the enactment of the bounty law, preferring the preexisting arrange- ment. The law having gone into effect despite their protests, they accepted it in good faith, and its apjiarent permanence enabled the planters of Louisiana to borrow considerable sums of money, and large investments were at once made in improved machinery, and enormous progress has been made during the three years that are now elapsing. CANE SUGAR. 537 The first crop produced under the bounty la-n-, that of 1891, was but 180,000 tens; that of 1892, 2i;0,(i00 tons, and that of 1893, from present indications, Avill exceed 350,000 tons. This woukl show an annual increase of from 10 to 20 per cent, which lias been brought about largely by the presumed permanence of the law of 1890. In our industry it has required the full effect of the bounty law to cover the increased cost of our machinery, of our general sup])lies, and of our labor over the cost of the same to competing nations, and to cover the bounties paid by them. Any shrinkage or reduction would stop our x>rogress and gradually destroy the industry. Tlie first effect woukl be to destroy the small proprietors who are now having a hard struggle to meet the new conditions of capital and apparatus that our industry demands. Yet these are the men upon whom our industry most depends, they have been born and reared in it, aud if by any fair means they can be sustained in it until they become self-sustaining it Avould seem proper that it should be done. The law of 1890 has seemed to us as a definite concession to the sugar producers of the United States for fourteen years, three of which will have soon elapsed. It has seemed to us to be an obligation of the Gov- ernment to all sugar producers in the United States, made with the purpose of developing the industry and placing it in successful compe- tition with the other sugar producers of the world, whose cheap labor and cheap capital have threatened our destruction. This, and the progress that we have made under the law, the perma- nency of the same, the difficulties created by any change, the possible comxilications arising from our various reciprocity treaties, and tlie fact that the welfare of our State and of our people, the majority of whom are identified with this great industry, will be imi^eriled by any change, lead us to ask that the law of October 1, 1890, in respect to sugar, be maintained. It is a well-known fact that the Louisiana planters protested against the enactment of the bounty provisions of the McKinley act. Most of them being Democrats in their party affiliation could not bring them- selves to so abrupt a departure from the former fiscal jjolicy of the Government. But we are now free to say that under its provisions an immense impetus has been given to the sugar industry of our State. Thousands of acres of lands have been reclaimed and put in order to grow cane. Very large central factories have been erected at the cost of many millions of dollars in diiferent parts of the State. Skilled chemists, mechanics, and manufacturers have been sought for every- Avhere and when obtained given employment. The planters and sugar manufacturers of Louisiana have used all of their available capital and pledged their credit for years in order to obtain means to promote the growth of cane and the manufacture of sugar. It is not too nnich to say that .'ii<10,000,000 has been expended in our industry in the State of Louisiana alone in the past year. We, therefore, view any change of the system with alarm extending to consternation. \Ve have been led to believe that the bounty enactment was in the nature of an agree- ment or contract with the sugar-gi'owers and tlie Government. Indeed, Mr. McKinley in presenting the bill of the Committee of N\'ays and Means to the House so declared in words that admit of no otlier inter- inetation. Governor Gear, a member of the committee, went equally as far in Jiis speech in favor of tlie bill. The circuit court of the I'nited States, three judges concuri'ing, in the celobrated Galder case. 538 SUGAR. decided that the act was a contract between the GoYennnent and the sugar-growers, which could not in good faith be abrogated. The law declares that from July, 1890, to July, 1905, this bounty shall be paid to those who will engage in the production of sugar. The term of fourteen years is specifically fixed in the law. The money was appropriated for the whole term, and we claim that it would be the grossest violation of public faith if it should be abrogated. We respectfully call the attention of the committee to the fact that our industry was used by the late Administration as the lover to force reciprocal trade regulations with Spanish and Central American Gov- ernments by which other industries of the United States have been made to profit largely. Spain was forced to open the ports of Cuba to the product of the United States. Brazil, Venezuela, Mexico, and many others have opened wide their ports to the admission of American products. An immense stimulus has been given those peoples to pro- duce sugar for the American market. Since the establishment of reciprocity treaties many millions of dollars have been expended in Cuba, Brazil, and other sugar-producing countries, and you must see that to take from us the bounty pledged by the Government would be to prostrate an industry by the incieased competition with those sugar- producing countries which our laws and treaty stipulations have so much stimulated. Mr. Bryan. Did 1 uuderstaiul you to say your sugar-planters pro- tested against the change from the tariff to a bounty? Mr. Dymond. Yes, sir. Mr. BuYAN. What was the ground of that protest? Mr. Dymond. They presumed there was danger of the iiermanency of it. Mr. BiiYAN. You would rather risk permanence in a taritf than in a bounty? Mr. Dymond. That was the view, especially of the Democratic mem- bers of the committee at that time. Mr. Bryan. Why was it that you feared the permanence of a bounty more than a protective taritt? Jlr. Dymond. Well, sir, we feared the permanence of it because it was contrary to the Democratic tenets in which we were reared — tliat is, most of us. Mr. Bryan. You think as far as princix)]es are concerned that it vio- lates general principles more to collect a bounty and give it to you than to let you collect a bounty jourself through a tariff? Mr. Dymond. Well, sir^ I can only speak for myself, as in Louisiana we have all shades of political belief; but so far as I am personally con- cerned I might say I am a believer in the incidental protection as defined by Thomas Jefferson. Mr. Bryan. Do you think, then, that a, tariff which would collect eight times as much as you receive from it would be safer for you than a bounty wliich simj^ly collected from the people what you receive? Mr. Dymond. There is a revenue side to that question, and ordinarily the result of the sugar duty has been so highly appreciated by both political parties that we have had no very serious trouble thus far. Mr. Bryan. Now, is it not a fact your fear arose from this: You were afraid the people would not pay one-eighth the amount if they knew as readily as they would the whole amount if they did not know? Mr. Dymond. Well, sir, we do not analyze it in exactly that way. We felt we did not like to be singled out as the only industry, with all respect to you gentlemen who thought differently — we did not think it CANE SUGAR. 539 was fair to take one industry and single it out and place it under a different iiscal control than any other great industry of the country. Mr. Eeyan. Do you think if this tarift'is continued tlie industry will soon supply all our wants'? Mr. Dtmond. I do not think very soon, but I think that it has pio- gressed as rapidly as any other great industry of the country engaged in producing, and that Mr. Bryan. Do you know what was the iDroportion of the sugar pro- duced in this country twenty years ago"? Mr. Dymond. In 1860 we produced about 25 per cent. Mr. Bryan. How is it now 1 Mr. Dymond. Twelve and one-half per cent with an immensely increased consumption. ilr. Bryan. So your production has not increased as rapidly as X)opulation "J Sir. Dyimonu. But our industry was annihilated, therefore they are not comparable. Mr. Bryan. Take 1873, twenty years ago ; what proportion did you produce then '? Mr. Dymond. We produced then about 15,000 tons. Mr. Bryan. About what was the proportion to the consumption'? Mr. Dymond. The total consumption of the country at that time was 100,000, 110,000, or 120,000 tons. It was about the same proportion as it is now. It was about one-twelfth at that time; that was about the lowest. Mr. Bryan. You have made progress? Mr. Dymond. Yes, sir. Mr. Bry'AN. You believe that the time will come when you can pro- duce sugar as cheaplj^ as it can be produced abroad? Mr. Dymond. We believe we can. Mr. Bryan. What is your ground for that belief; where will the economy come in? Mr. Dymond. The main grounds are these: The industry has pro- ceeded under old-fashioned processes in which many million dollars were invested. Then came the time when the industry was overthrown, when almost every planter who had a debt to pay was sold out by the sheritt, and as the new men were not familiar with that industry they left it to the old people who knew the industry, and thus it has taken longer than it otherwise would have been done if new men and new capital had gone into it and the older ones had just been wiped out. Mr. Bryan. Where do you think the economy in production is going to come in in order to compete with foreign countries hereafter? Dr. Stubbs. I will answer tliat, by enlarging the pntductive capac- ity of the cane and increasing the cultivation in the field. We have already doubled the crop in the last ten years and doubled the produc- tion of sugar from the cane. Mr. Bryan. By that process you expect to be able to live without the tariff in Dr. Stubbs. We hope before the end of foiuteen years to live with- out it. Mr. Bryan. Are you any better off than you were three years ago? Dr. Stubbs. Yes, sir; we have increased our acrerage from 185,000 acres to 268,000 acres, nearly 100,000 acres gain in three years. Mr. Bryan. Have you increased the product per acre? Dr. Stubbs. Yes, sir; when I was here before in 1890 it was 18 540 SUGAR. tons to tho acre as the aA-erase of tlie State, and this last rear we have goue over 20. Mr. Bryan. Eeuaiise it happened to be a good crop? Dr. Stubbs. ]N^(), sir; ou the contrary. Mr. Bryan. If j-ou could produce sugar three years ago for 2 cents a pound and you have increased your productive power'can not you produce it now for less? Dr. Stubbs. We have a few who can do it; but remember we have to carry 1,100 planters, and money is hard to get, and to make a first- class sugar plantation takes from $250,000 to $500,000. Mr. Bryan. So some planters can produce sugar for less than 2 cents a pound ? Dr. Stitbbs. I do not know, but they can make sugar cheaper tlian the small planters. ^Ir. Bryan. And you want a bounty to enable the small planters to make sugar? Dr. Stubbs. We want a bounty long enough to get the industry iipon an assured basis; long enough to supply scientific methods until we get all there is in the cane and make an economic crop in the soil. Mr. Bryan. If the large planters can produce more cheaply than the smaU planters, and you have a bounty to enable the small planter to produce Dr. Stubbs. You do not catch the idea, sir. The small planters are being destroyed, so far as the manufacture of sugar is concerned, but they aie selling cane to the large central factories which work 1,000 tons a day. A large central factory may make sugar for §2 a ton, whereas a small factory can not make it for less than $3 or $4. Ml. Bryan. So the larger planters are gradually running out the smaller men ? Dr. Stubbs. No; we are making a better man of the small men. He has an opportunity to sell cane and get a better price than ever. We are trying to imitate the central system of Germany, which is, having the farmer grow cane and the capitalists supply manufacturing stations. Heretofore the planter, being a manufacturer and a farmer together, had to run a thousand or two thousand-ton factory at his own expense. ^Ir. Bryan. I made a comimtation from yonr figures and it will take 3,125 square miles to produce all the sugar which we consume in this country. Dr. Stubbs. Two millions divided by 640; that is about right. ]Mr. Bryan. That would be a strip of country of about GO miles long and a little over 50 miles wide? Dr. vStubbs. Yes, sir; solid. :Mr. Bryan. And the bounty paid on that would be $80,000,000. Mr. Stubbs. Yes, sir; our tariff the year before the bounty law was passed was $05,000,000. Mr. Bryan. More than seven eigths of that went to the Government, while in this case it all goes to your people? Dr. Stubbs. If we get that. Mr. Bryan. When you are able to supply the whole country with sugar you will cultivate a im'W of ground of the enormous size of little (iver 50 scjuare miles and receive $80,000,000, that will be the ultimate object to which you aim! .Mr. (lEAR. Is not the tendency of this new ])hase of affairs to start central fa(;tories where the small faxmer can bring cane and sell to them without going to the cxijense of putting up machinery? Dr. Stubbs, That is exactly what the small farmers are trying to do. CANE SUGAR. 541 Tliey are trying, by associations or by other means, to orj;auize fac- tories tliemselves. Ml-. GrEAE. It takes a large amount of capital to .start one of tlieso factories — half a million dollars 1 Dr. Stubbs. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. If yon get these large factories started yon immediately start a market and that will give employment to labor in these central factories ? Dr. Stubbs. That is the case. Mr. Btnum. I understand you to say you have a contract with the Government for the bounty; I just want to say I differ from yon- and you may have a case against the Governor, Gear, and 3Ir. MciiJiuley tor damages. Dr. Stubbs. We will retain you. Mr. Gear. Retain Brother Bynum in that case and we will be glad to have him, and I will turn the defending of the case over to my friend, Governor Warmouth. Dr. Stubbs. In my statement to Mr. Bryan — and I wish he w;is here to hear this — he stated that an area of 60 by 50 miles would grow the sugar consumed by the United States. From my remark it might be inferred that entire block would only be needed and that perhaps can be furnished by Louisiana. I want to state in the meanwhile the beet- sugar industry could be established all o'\'er the United States aad it could be developed; and I wish to supplement that remark witli this, that in our sugar growing we have a rotation of crops which involves four times the area of the land he mentions. Every crop is like sugar, but we have to have a rotation of crops and that involves about four times the area of laud which is actually in sugar. The accompanying letter has been submitted in explanation of Dr. Stubbs' testimony : Sugar Expkeiment Station, Audition I'aik, Hmo Orleans, SejJtemherSS, 1S93. To the Editor of The Times-Democrat: Tin ui.y return from Baton Rouge I was amazed at a two-cohimii article in your daily, heuded "Planters Aroused." "They Deuy a Statement Attributed to Prof. Stulibs," etc. After reading the article I was further amazed to know how you ol)taiued this statement. I was referred to your issue of September 20, contfiiuing an account of the reception by the Ways and Means Conuuittee of the House of Jieijresentativesof the delegatioil of sugar planters from this State. I had the honor of being a member of this delegation, and in the account referred to I find the following question and reply upon which the two-column article of to-day is based: "Mr. Bryan. If you could produce sugar then for 2 cents a pound, and you have increased your productive pow, 078, 315 8, 940, 058 All other countries . 684, 757 Total 28, 020, 674 17, 605, 192 23, 061, 008 13, 284, 162 21, 988, 535 10, 332, 423 28, 110, 570 14, 703, 129 Estimated duty paid, on Sumatra ioiacco in the years named. 1890 $4,062,199.48 1891 9,817,090.00 1892 5, :!-!3, Sti t. 00 1893 10,749,530.00 586 TOBACCO. These figures sliow that the present duty on Sumatrau leaf tobacco yields abundant revenue to the Government as well as protection to home producers, thus carrying on its wings a double blessing. Statement showing the total importaton of cigars into the United States for the years named. Tear. Pounds. Value. i Tear. Pounds. Value. 1800 1,250,217 $4,026,828 1892 658,169 $2,832,171 1891 885,139 3,386,899 I 1893 654,095 2,831,047 This shows that importations of cigars have diminished since 1890 almost 50 per cent. When it is considered that Pennsylvania makes about one-fourth of all the cigars manufactured in the United States it will easily be seen how a Pennsylvania industry has been beneiited by the present duty on cigars. Nuniber of cigars taxed in the United States. Tear ending June 30 — 1890 4,087,889,983 1891 4, 474, 892, 767 1892 4, 548, 799, 417 1893 - 4,814,202,117 This statement i-epresents also a^jproximately the number of cigars manufactured in the United States. Nwmier of cigars manufactured in Pennsylvania in the years named. 1890 1,007,819,252 1891 1, 169, 699. 963 1892 1,232,890,889 Pounds of leaf tobacco manvfactvred into cigars in Pennsylvania in the years named. 1890 19,422,303 1891 22,056,396 1892 22,306,001 Some of this data was supplied by P. R. Biffenderfer, of tlie Lancaster New Era, whose knowledge on the subject is excelled by that of no other man in PennsylYania. These figures show a progressively increasing business in Pennsyl- vania in the manufacture of cigars since the present tariff act went into operation. Respectfully submitted. M. Brosius, Tenth District, Pennsylvania. liEAF TOBACCO. (Paragraph 242.) Wednesday, September 20, 1893. 8TATEMENT OF HON. LEWIS SPEREY. Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen of the Committee: I repre- sent a district which is a manufacturing district, properly speaking. It not only manufactures very largely, but manufactures in great variety. 1 wish to appear to day in the interest of the farmer, and LEAP TOBACCO. 687 ask you to sustain, if possible, tlie present tax levied upon Sumatra tobacco, wliich is a wrapper leaf, as is all tlie tobacco raised in Con- necticut. The foreign tobacco comes in competition with the Con- necticut leaf. Wrapper leaf is also raised in K"ew Yort, Pennsylva- nia, Wisconsin, and Ohio, and of late it is coming to be raised consid- erably in Georgia and Florida, where they are now deriving consider- able advantage from the present tariff on Sumatra. I shall not pre- sent the matter to the committee as a protective measure, although if anybody could be benefited by a tariff, I think the farmer ought to be. That is impossible for the most part, and yet in this particular product there is some benefit accruing to the farmer from the tax on the im- ported leaf. While not wishing to put it on that ground, I would appeal to the good judgment of this committee to leave the duty on. I have procured from the Bureau of Statistics of the Treasury an accurate statement as to the amount of imports of tobacco from the Netherlands, which means Sumatra tobacco, and I hope the committee will examine the figures. I trust the committee will bear in mind that this leaf is Sumatra leaf only. The statement does not include the Cuban leaf, which is a filler leaf, although wrappers do come from Cuba. I have argued this as good Democratic doctrine — that the tax should be levied on liquors, tobacco, and the ordinary luxuries, so far as reve- nue could reasonably be derived out of those products, putting it on a revenue basis only. This present tax, although high ($2 per pound), is not a prohibitory tax. As was stated by the gentleman fi-om Balti- more last week, it is not a tax which goes to the extent of discouraging importations of leaf. I would call the attention of the committee to the fact that for the year ending June 30, 1893, the customs on imports amount to $10,749,530, which is almost double the amount of revenue that was received in any previous year, with the exception of 1891, when the receipts were considerably increased under the McKinley bill. The tax of $2 a pound now brings a revenue to the Treasury about double what it ever was before. As to the nature of this tax, I would like to emphasize, if possible, what was said by the gentleman from Baltimore, that it is not a tax on a necessity, but it is a tax .on a luxury; and 1 may still further defend it as a luxury by saying, that it is the gloss on the Sumatra leaf which so largely recommends it for a cigar wrapper. Another advantage is its color. In Sumatra it is graded down to a nicety after it has been through the sweat. The manufacturer can, therefore, buy anything he wants in the way of a shade of color to suit his trade. So that the tax, as now levied, is a tax upon the color of the wrapper of the cigar. That is just about all it is. Under the present tariff it can not be used on a cigar which sells for less than $30 a thousand. So that tax is a tax on wrapper leaf, and a tax on the cigar which sells for over 5 cents at retail. I think this wrapper is used on something over half of the cigars which retail at more than 5 cents. Mr. TuKNER. It seems the domestic wrapper is used on the cheaper cigars? Mr. Speery. Yes, sir; the Sumatra leaf is not used on any cigar that sells for less than $30 a thousand. Mr. TuENEK. You are afraid the Sumatra would be used if the duty is changed? Mr. Speeet. Yes, sir. Cigar rollers like to use it. It would pre- vent the use of the domestic leaf on the cheaper cigars. Mr. Geae. It adds nothing to the smoking value of a cigar? 588 TOBACCO. Mr. Sperry. Ko; it deteriorates the value of a cigar, because it is bitter. Nobody woiild smoke a cigar jnade wholly of Sumatra leaf. I wish to lay betore the committee, as a part of the case, an article from the New England Homestead : [From the lJ"ew EnglaTid Homestead, September 14, 1893.] Tlie proposition to double the internal-revenue tax on beer and restore the former taxes on tobacco will meet with but little opposition. These are luxuries which are proper subjects of taxation. But to couple higher internal-revenue taxes on tobacco with a reduction in duty on imported leaf, as David A. Wells suggests, would be the height of stupidity. As is shown by The Homestead's exhaustive inquiry on on another page, the average receipts from the duties on tobacco leaf under the tariff of 1883 were about $6,000,000 per year, while under the present tariff the Government has actually received nearly $8,500,000 a year in revenue, and but for the holding of an extraordinary quantity of leaf in bond in anticipation of lower duties, the revenue under the new tariff would have averaged nearly $15,000,000 a year. In other words, the present duty produces from two to three times as much revenue as the former rates and four times as much as was collected under the uniform rate of 35 cents per pound prior to 1883. Now, to reduce the duty on foreign leaf would not only reduce the revenue, but it would be mighty rough on the domestic industry to thus foster imports of foreign leaf while at the same time doubling internal taxes on the domestic product. THE TOBACCO CROP — THE WHOLE INDUSTRY THREATENED. JVliat it will mean to have the wrapper duty reduced from, ^2 to 35 cents per pound — The truth about the tobacco tariff — Just how it has resulted — Present rates are productive of the greatest revenue ever received from imported leaf — Facts that should be instantly laid before the tariff revision committee at Washingtott. The raising of fine wrapper tobacco was a fairly remunerative business in New England, New York, and Pennsylvania from 1860 to 1880. From the latter date until 1890 the domestic industry languished, owing to enormous imports of leaf from new ])lantations in Sumatra. During this period the Connecticut Valley area shrank one-half, the crop was sold at an average of from 10 to 12 cents per pound, its total value being only from $1,000,000 to $1,500,000 annually. But in 1890 the industry revived, in anticipation of the duty on foreign wrappers being increased from 75 cents to $2 per pound, with an iron-clad phraseology, so that the higher rate could not be evaded. The New England crop that year advanced in value 50 per cent, commanding an average of 19 cents per pound, against only 12 cents the year before, while the market for the 1892 crop opened at an average of 24 cents, or double the price of the 1889 crop. The New England acreage increased from 7,803 in 1889 to 13,800 acres last season. The total value of the crop jumped from $1,481,000 in 1889 to $3,421,000 in 1891 and over $6,000,000 in 1892. But values were at once unsettled when the election showed that the totiacco tariff was to be attacked, prices of the 1892 crop thereafter declined, and there is no market for the 1893 crop. The crops of 1890 and 1891, sold at old-time prices, brought prosperity. Mortgages were paid, improvements made, and thrift and cheer succeeded the discouragement of the previous ten years. Meanwhile, cigar manufacturers prospered as never before, and retail prices of manufactured goods did not advance. Our Government got a larger revenue from tobacco than ever. The burden of the higher duty fell on the few importers and the Dutch syndicates that controlled the Sumatra plantations and slave labor. Their shares depreciated and some of their plantations relapsed into jungle. Now, it is proposed to change all this, to boom these Dutch syndicates, ruin Amer- ican growers, upset our domestic manufacturing industry and deplete our already insufficient revenues by wiping out the $2 rate, and admitting wrappers like other leaf at 35 cents per pound duty. LEAF TOBACCO. 589 Table allowing the quantUics imported or witlidrawn for consumption of wrappers and other leaf, duties collected, and value per pound of the leaf imported. [Duties up to 1884, 35 cents per pound on all leaf; 1884 to October 6, 1890, on wrappers 75 cents, other leaf, 35 cents; since October 6, 1890, wrappers $2, other leaf, 35 cents.] Imported for consumption. Duties paid. Value per pound. "Wrappers. Other. "Wrappers. Other. "Wrap- pers. Other. Pounds, None ...do Pounds, 7. 036. 998 6, 372, 437 7, 630, 071 13, 811, 139 10, 913, 981 11,910,621 13, 950, 307 15, 238, 038 15, 964, 786 15,866,483 16, 644, 667 17, 003, 683 14, 353, 039 17, 859, 644 5, 304, 239 None ...do ...do ...do $31, 033 72, 375 22, 495 21, 567 170, 054 1, 180, 911 2, 817. 035 5, 463, 355 655, 604 4, 733, 008 11, 223, 870 $2, 462, 918 2,230,353 2, 670, 075 4, 833, 898 5, 447, 065 5, 913, 062 4, 882, 607 5, 333, 523 5, 587, 675 5, 553, 269 5, 825, 633 5, 972, 899 5, 023, 564 6, 250, 875 1, 856, 483 OenU. Cents, 35 ]fi79 35 1881 ...do 56 . . do 54 34, 554 88, 016 29. 994 »28; 756 226, 739 1, 574, 548 3, 756, 034 -■7, 253, 864 327, 802 t2, 300, 504 {5, 611, 935 1885 82 85 92 90 90 93 99 80 86 86 50 1886 50 1887 49 1888 53 1889 51 1890 50 1891 55 1892 43 1893 43 43 *A11 but 18,359 pounds of this quantity was imported prior to October 6, 1890, and got in at 75 cents per pound, onl.y the smaller quantity named paying $2 per pound. t The imports for consumption of the fiscal year 1893 are estimated by adding to the gi'oss imports for 1893 the leaf in bond June 30, 1892, and subtracting the quantity in bond, June 30, 1893, and amount ree.Kported during the year. The official TeriScation of these data will not materially alter the figures, but will be available next week. J The quantity of wrappers in bond June 30, 1893, was 5,622,003 pounds against 10,068 pounds on the same date in 1891, leaving 5,611,935 pounds more in bond than is usual when no tarifi" changes are in prospect. So the bonded " other leat was 12,997,413 pounds against 7, 693, 174 pounds June 30, 1891, leaving 5,304,239 pounds extra in bond now. In other words, the net quantity reported in table as iu bond June 30, 1893, represents the extra stocks, wlilch but for the prospective lower duty would have paid duties and passed into consumption ere this, leaving in bond only the usual quantity, as on June 30, 1891, allowed for above. THE FACTS ABOUT WRAPPERS. It appears from this table that in the eight fiscal years irom 1885-'92, inclusive, the total quantity of "wrapper leaf on "which the "wrapper duty "was paid amounted to 13,285,753 pounds. But it is notorious that immense quantities of wrappers were fraudulently imported at the lower rate from 1883 to 1889. It was only in that latter year that the Treas- ury Department rulings obtained by the New England Tobacco Growers' Association put a partial stop to this practice. Some of this wrapper leaf was Cuban, though most Cuban leaf is used for fillers, with a few binders. But all Sumatra leaf is wrappers — nothing but wrappers. The quantity of Sumatra leaf imported into the United States in the eight years 1885-'92 was 38,623,213 pounds, according to an official statement to the Homestead dated October 8, 1892, from Chief Brock of the Treasury Bureau of Statistics. Allow- ing that the 2,529,877 pounds of wrappers in bond on June 30, 1892, was all Sumatran leaf, deducting it from the imports just named, and we find that the United States consumed during the eight years under review 36,093,336 pounds of Sumatran wrap- pers. But the quantity of wrappers that paid duty as such during this period was only 13,285,753 pounds. The ditference between this quantity and the amount actually consumed in the United States is 22,807,583 pounds. This vast quautity of wrapi)er leaf got in as " other leaf" upon payment of only 35 cents per pound duty, whereu.s it should have paid 75 cents. The Government was thus defrauded out of a. total of $7,623,189, according to the summary below. Taking no account of wrappers from Cuba that have come in as " other leaf," the true case stands thus, in the eight years 1885-'92: 590 TOBACCO. Quantity of wrappers imported,. Pounds. Siimatra wrappers imported 188.5-'92 38, 623, 213 Total -wrappers in bond June 30, 1802 2' 529,' 877 Consumed in United States 36, 093, 336 Paid duty as wrappers 13,285,753 Wrappers admitted as " other leaf" 22, 807, 583 Total " other leaf" imported, 1885-92 120J 992^ 224 Deduct wrappers admitted as "other leaf" and the "other leaf" really was 98,884,641 Duties on wrappers and other leaf. Duties paid on wrappers 1885-'92 $10, 403, 386 Duties at 75 cents per pound on 22,807,583 pounds wrappers, fraudu- lently admitted as "other leaf" 17,105,787 Total duties due on wrappers 27,509,173 Duty ou 98, 884, 641 pounds at 35 cents 34,609,624 Total duties due 1885-'92 62, 118, 797 Duties collected ($40,403,386 on wrappers and $41,092,222 on other leaf) . 54, 495, 608 Government was defrauded out of 7, 623, 189 THE QUESTION OP REVENUE. But let us take the revenue that was actually collected. The tariff on leaf tobacco prior to 1883 was a uniform rate of 3.5 cents per pound. That was before the advent of Sumatra, and imports were practically all Havana fillers with a few Cuban wrappers. The duties collected on tobacco under the old tariff were from $2,500,000 to $3,500,000, being in 1882 just $3,470,545. For the eight years, therefore, the average revenue on wrappers would have been $3,438,646 annually but for the colossal frauds noted. Under the same circumstances, the average revenue on other leaf would have been $4,327,453 per year. There should have been a total net revenue from these two grades of leaf of $8,766,099 per year — about equally divided between the two. Beginning with the fiscal year 1884 and Including 1890 (but exclusive of the fiscal year ended June 30, 1891, when the imports of wrappers were practically all made prior to October 6, 1890, in anticipation of the $2 rate which then went into effect), and we find that the total duties actually collected varied from $4,905,000 to $8,642,- 000, and for the seven years averaged $6,123,000. The duties paid on wrappers during this period ranged from $22,000 to $2,817,000, averaging $616,000. The duties paid on " other leaf" were from $4,882,000 to $5,825,000, averaging $5,700,000. As exposed above, there were great frauds in the revenue during these years. During the two fiscal years 1892-'93, after business under the new tariff was well established, the total revenue on both wrappers and other leaf averaged $8,331,525. Adding duties on the excess in bond over the usual quantity, which would have been paid but for the expectation of a lower duty, and the revenue for these two years would have averaged $14,871,701. This is $3,435,457 more revenue than was paid during 1891, when sijch enormous quantities of leaf were rushed in before October 6, '90, to get wrappers in at 75 cents instead of $2 duty. The imports of '91 represent the maximum. Now if the wrapper imports that year had paid only 35 cents, the total revenue would have been only $8,534,699. Thus at the maximum the uniform 35-cent rate now demanded by importers was only about as much as the average duties actually paid during the two past years when duties were paid on the minimum quantity. But for speculators holding back excessive stock in bond in anticipation of lower duties, we have just shown that the revenue for the past two years should have averaged nearly 15 million dollars annually, or almost twice as much as the maxi- mum revenue possible under the 35-cent rate. THE RATE OF DUTY. Instead of being prohibitive, $2 per pound proves not to be the limit of a revenue duty. I'robably $3 per pound ou wrappers would produce still more revenue. Tobacco is a fit subject for tariff ttrxation. It pays a Ichs duty lierc than in England. LEAF TOBACCO. 591 The areraee ralue of "other leaf" imported at 35 cents duty has been 55 cents pei- pound. That specific duty has, therefore, been equal to an average ad valorem duty of 69 per cent. In 1890 the vrrapper leaf was A-alued at just about $1 per pound, so that the specific duty of 75 cents was equal to 75 per cent ad valorem. Now, under the $2 rate, the average invoice value of imported wrappers is returned at 86 cents per pound, probably a gross undervaluation. But accepting this, the $2 specific duty is equal to 233 per cent ad valorem. But 1 pound of these Sumatra wrappers will average to cover certainly as many cigars as 4 pounds of fine domestic wrappers. Hence, so far as the American grower's crop is concerned, his protection in wrappers is an ad valorem duty of cue-fourth this, or only 57 per cent. In other words, binders and fillers pay 69 per cent ad valorem duty, while the tarirt' on wrappers is equal to only 57 per cent. The existing tariff on cigars is equivalent to nearly 200 per cent ad valorem. To equal this protection to the producer of wrappers the duty on wrappers would have to be at least $8 per pound. [From the New England Homestead of August 31, 1893.] IT IS A KfVENUE DUTY ON CIGARS. THE PRESENT TARIFF 'WORKS ON MANUFACTURES THE SAME AS ON LEAF. The duty of $2 per pound on imported leaf suitable for cigar wrappers and 35 cents on other leaf was shown by the Homestead last week to have yielded an actual rev- enue to the Government of $8,500,000 annually for the three years it has been in oper- ation, against only $6,000,000 under the 75 cent and 85 cent duties of the former tariff. But for the holding of an extraordinary quantity of leaf in bond in anticipa- tion of lower duties, the revenue on leaf under the new tariff would have averaged nearly $15,000,000 a year. Thus the present duty on leaf produces two or three times as miTch revenue as the former rates, and four times as much as was collected under the uniform rate 35 cents per pound prior to 1883. Meanwhile domestic tobacco cul- ture thrived. The facts noted were all taken direct from the official reports of the United States Treasury Department, except that for 1893 was estimated, but a letter from "VV. G. Ford, esq., chief bureau of statistics, shows that this estimate of the past year's imports and withdrawals for consumption were too much by only 19,033 pounds of wrappers and 40,910 pounds of other leaf, or only $52,384 in revenue. Now we propose to show from the same official records that a similar effect has fol- lowed the increase of the duties on manufactured cigars from $2.50 per pound and 25 per cent ad valorem — the rate in force for twenty years or so — to $4.50 per pound and 25 per cent ad valorem by the tariff which went into effect October 6, 1890. Here is a table that shows the quantity of cigars imported or withdrawn for consumption on which duties were actually paid, their total value and value per pound, the amount of duties paid, and the ad valorem rate of duty. The imports of cigars and dulies paid. Cigara im- ported. Valae of imports. Duties paid. Tears ending June 30 — ■ Total. Per pound. Total. Ad va- lorem. lg84 Founds. 865, 278 895, 532 983, 893 1,095,202 1, 126, 070 1, 225, 236 1, 213, 752 856, 863 632, 715 654, 095 1, 031, 868 1, 057, 852 714, 557 $3, 146, 032 3, 078, 036 3, 233, 793 3, 301, 177 3, 375, 160 3, 637, 799 3, 955, 663 3, 368, 082 2, 709, Oil 2, 831, 171 3, 295. 333 3, 389, 666 2, 989, 421 $3.44 3.29 3.01 3.00 2.97 3.26 3.93 4.38 4.32 3.14 3.16 4.21 $2, 794, 704 3, 008, 339 3, 268, 181 3, 663, 208 3, 668, 966 3, 972, .540 4, 023, 296 3,794,928 3, 539, 470 3, 640, 840 3, 377, 671 3, 469, 903 3, 061, 412 1885 $0.98 183g 1 01 ] gf^7 1.08 1.08 1.09 1890 1.02 1.38 1892 1.27 1.29 1.05 Avftrno-p Ififii 1890 . 1.04 1.33 * The total imports for tbia year are assumed to have paid duty; the amount on which duty was paid is not yet published, but the official reports for the first nine months of the year show that fully thi3 quantity paid duty, in spite of an extra large amount left in bond. 692 TOBACCO. WnAT THE TABLK SHOWS. First. Note that the average revenTie I'or the three years of the McKinley tariff has been nearly $200,000 a year more than the average for tlie previous seven years. Second. Exchisive of the fiscal year ending June 30, 1890, when imports of cigars were abnormally large in anticipation of higher duties, the average revenue under the McKinley tariff has been nearly $300,000 a year greater than the average under the former tariff. Third. The quantity of cigars imported has been materially reduced, but they have been of much better quality and higher value, the higher duty upon which has been no burden. Fourth. These fancy imported cigars are consumed by the wealthy, who can afford to pay fancy prices. Fifth. The total duties paid on imported cigars under the McKinley tariff have been equal to 133 per cent ad valorem, or an increase of only about one-quarter over the rate under the previous tariff. The data in the above table for the fiscal year ending June 30, 1891, include imports for the three months and six days ended October 6, 1890, of the oW tariff, j During that first quarter the imports were 451,490 pounds of cigars and cheroots, valued at $3.53 per pound, on which the duty of $2.50 per pound and 25 per cent ad i valorem was equal to an ad valorem rate of duty of 96 per cent. In the ensuing ; nine months ended June 30, 1891, imports were 405,374 pounds valued at $4.38 per pound, and the-higher duties of $4.50 per pound and 25 per cent equal an ad valorem rate of 128 per cent. The duties collected in the first quarter of this year under the low tariff were $1,526,898, and during the rest of the year under the high tariff"; amounted to $2,268,030. Thus the higher tariff even in the very first year did not ' restrict imports aud materially increased the revenue. EFFECT ON DOMESTIC INDUSTRY. During this period our domestic cigar-manufacturing business was never more ; prosperous, though, like all industry, it has been dull since last June. While manu- facturers and cigar-makers have prospered, prices to consumers have not increased. To show how the manufacture of domestic cigars has developed we add a few ; figures compiled from the official reports of the Commissioner of Internal Revenue, showing the production and internal revenue thereon in the United States for the ; past three years compared with previous periods : 1891 1892 1893 Average, 1891-'l':! Average, 1881-89 Average, 1878-'82 M illions made per year. cig-- rS; 4,229 4,549 4,814 4,530 3,448 3,342 2,505 3,893 3, 177 2,858 1,425 406 Total. 6,734 7,442 7,991 7,388 4, 873 2,748 Internal revMiue IJO.id. $14, 766, 941 )5, 092, 890 16, 030, 953 15, 296, 930 ' 11, 653, 188 15, 096, 187 The $10,740,530 revenue received last year is explained in a letter from the Bureau of Stati.stics. It is estimated on the full amount of Imports. Treasury Department, Bureau op Statistics, Washington, D. C, September 14, ISOS. Dear Sir: I return herewith a table of imports of Netherlands tobacco with the estimated amount of duties paid aud the corresponding ad valorem rate for each year since 1881. I have retained all the previous figures given that the table may ifcell the story. The two columns of average rate of duty are taken from the books of two of the large importing firms of Netherlands tobacco in New York. They are therefore 1 based upon actual transactions, and I think it will be safe to assume that they are representative figures. I have taken the figures in the second column for multipli- i cation, but the averages in the first column from 1883 to 1890 will be a fraction less j LEAF TOBACCO. 593 thnn 53 cents a pound. The colnmn lieaded " Duty " is liiised upon the supposition that all the tobacco reyirescntcd in the first column went into coiisiinqitiou in the year of importation. This supposition is, of course, not scientilically true, as tobacco imported in one year may remain for a lou.u: time in warehouse before pass- ing into consumption. With this explanation, 1 think it will be perfectly safe to use the table as it stands. Yours respectfully, WORTHINGTON C. FoltD, Chief of Bureau. Hon. Lewis Spbrry, House of Bej)resentaiiccs. Iwpoils of leaf tolacco from tlie Netherlands inio the United States durliiq each fiscal year from ISSl to 189S. Years. Quantity. Value. 1S81 - Pounds. 200, 602 782, 763 3,818,931 603, 536 2, 217, 919 4, 000, 519 4, 213, 336 5, 861, 472 5, 024, 455 0, 734, 999 4, 908, 545 2, 661, 932 5, 374, 765 $140, 665 187, 127 2, 942, H8 480, 702 1, 881, 494 3, 394, 146 3, 651, 349 5, 634, 765 4, 333, 463 9, 037, 388 4, 682, 493 1, 899, 721 5, 078, 315 1883 1S,^3 JSK4 1885 1.S86 1888 1880 3890 1892 averafie ] pound. Jiy, ler en.ts. Duty. Ad va- lorem . Cents. '■ C Per cent. 35 i 35 $70, 210. 70 40.9 35 1 35 273, 967. 05 56. 2 40 52 1, 983, 844. 12 (-.7. 5 45 ; 52 313, 838. 72 65.2 50 ! 52 1, 153, 317. 88 61.3 55 i 52 2, 080, 269. 88 61.2 55 52 2, 190, 934. 72 60. .^^5 52 3. 047. 965. 44 54.0 55 52 2, 612. 716. 60 60. 2 55 52 4, 062, 199. 48 44.9 200 2(10 9, 817, 090. 00 209. 6 200 2(10 5, 323, 864. 00 •280.2 200 1 200 10, 749, 630. 00 211.6 LEAF TOBACCO. (Paragraph 243.) STATEMENT OF CIGAR MANXTFACTUEERS ASSOCIATION OF INDIANA. We, the undersigned, constituting the executive board of the Cigar IMauufacturers' Association of Indiana, and representing 583 niauufac- turers, respectfully petition your honorable body to amend Schedule F of the McKinley tariff bill so as to make a uniform rate of duty not exceeding 35 cents per pound on all unstemmed leaf tobacco, and 50 cents on all stemmed leaf tobacco, as a continuation of the present exorbitant and unjust rate will speedily drive all employers of skilled cigar-makers out of business, for we have learned to our sorrow that we could not raise the price of our product to conform to the high rate of duty, for the reason that there are many employers of underpaid and unskilled labor who stood ready to sell our customers at old prices. Consequently, relying on the hope tliat Congress would remedy the imposition we have up to the present time been sellng our product at a loss in order to hold our trade, which some of us have been years in establishing. Should the present rate continue we shall be obliged to close our factories or reduce the present scale of wages by one-half. However, we conMently hope that the result of your deliberations will not compel us to resort to either extremity. Were it uotfor the neces- sities of the Government we would petition your honorable body for free raw material as promised by the resolutions adopted at the Chi- cago convention and ratilied by the people last iv^ovember. T H 38 594 TOBACCO. We observe with deep concern that you are entertaining a proposi- tion to increase the internal-revenue tax on cigars from $3 per 1,000, the present rate, to $G per 1,000. This increase, with even a tariff of only 35 cents per pound on imiiorted leaf, would not better our condi- tion in the least. We therefore suggest that if tobacco is to raise a certain proportion of our reveiuie, that you increase the internal tax on manufiictured tobacco to the amount now paid by cigars, which are taxed at the rate of about 20 cents per pouud, while manufactured tobacco pays but 6 cents per pound; the increased revenue derived from this equalization of tobacco taxes would most j)robably meet the proportion to be raised from this product. We therefore hoi)e that after due deliberation you will see your way clear to do us justice by removing the burden placed on our industry by that monstrosity " the McKinley bill." Edwakd Anschubtz. Simon Schmalholz. John Eatjch. Thos. J. Hamilton. Feed. Eiebel. A. Steffin, Secretary. CIGAES. (Paragraph a46.) l^EW York, Septemher 23, 1893. Sir: The undersigned, importers of cigars, respectfully suggest that in revising the tariff on cigars the duty should be fixed at not more than $2 per pound and 20 per cent ad valorem, we believing that this rate will produce a larger revenue than that received under the pres- ent tariff', or under the former one of $2.50 per pound and 25 per cent, and at the same time amply protect the domestic manufacturers. The average dutiable value of imported cigars is about $52 per thou- sand, and average weight 10% pounds per thousand. On this basis the proposed duty would be 131.90 per thousand equal to 61.3 per cent of dutiable value. Taking as types "low-priced," "medium," and "fine" cigars, the duty proposed would be, low-priced, value $24, weight 10 pounds, $24.80 per thousand, or 103^ per cent; medium,value $50, weight 12 pounds, $34 per thousand, or 68 per ceiit; fine, value $100, weight 15 pounds, $50 per thousand, or 50 per cent. Should the duty on leaf tobacco remain as at present, $2 per pound on wrappers and 35 cents per pound on fillers, the specific duty sug- gested for cigars, $2 per pound, would be the same as to the wrapper (a small portion of the weight of tlie finished cigar), and would afford a protection as to the filler of $1.65 jjer pound, in addition to 20 per cent on the value of the cigar. Assuming that it requires as much as 20 pounds of filler to manufac- ture cigars weighing 10 pounds, the duty on the unmanufactured filler would be : 20 pounds, at 35 cents, $7 ; duty on same filler manufactured into cigars in a foreign country, 10 pounds, at $2, $20; thus making the duty on the manufactured product nearly three times that on the raw CIGAES. 595 material for the same, in addition to 20 per cent on the value of the finished article. Under the previous tariff of $2.50 per pound and 25 per cent the imports of cigars amounted to less than 3 per cent of the quantity man- ufactured in the United States. Under the present tariff it is less than 2 per cent. This would indicate that the manufacturing industry has for some time been established here on a secure basis. Yours, respectfully, W. H. Thomas & Bro. Park Treford. G. W. Faber. Acker, Merrall & Gondit. G. S. Nicholas. SCHEDULE G. AGRICUITUPiAL PRODUCTS AND PROYISIONS. 597 FARM PRODUCTS. (Schedule G.) STATEMENT OF MK. JOSEPH NIMMO, OF HUNTINGTON, LONG ISLAND, NEW YORK. Monday, September IS, 1893. Mr. Chairman. I appear here as representing the agricultural interests of Long Island, especially of Suffolk County,.and I have just handed to the clerk of the committee a petition which is moat numerously signed; but other petitions will follow both from Suffolk and I understand also from Queens County. I will consume a part of the time allotted to us and the rest will be consumed by Mr, Eugene Parker, of Shelter Island. * * # g^t; as the conditions, with respect to protection under our tariff laws, which apply to Long Island agriculture are common to the entire State, I can not do other- wise than treat the subject in its entirety. I shall, therefore, in as few words as possible, attempt to prove to you that there is no other State in the Union whose agriculture is so much in need of protection as is thatof iNew York; no other State more deserving of protection, or which has in its farming interests derived greater buneflts from jpro- tection. All this becomes clearly apparent upon a hasty glance at the main facts in the agricultural history of our State. The completion of the Brie Canal in the year 1826, with its subsequent enlargements — a New York State public work — made New York City the commercial metropolis of the Western world ; but in the course of a few years it became an instrument whereby the agricultural interests of our State were greatly depressed and ultimately revolutionized. Kofc even in the fruitful Genesee Valley were our farmers able to compete with Western farmers in the production of the cereals or in raising horses, cattle, sheep, and hogs. The great West became the source of supply for breadstuff's and provisions, not only in our own markets but for export to foreign countries. The inevitable result was that for many years the agricultural lands of the State of New York were greatly depreciated in value. Many of our brawniest and most enterprising young men went West. In many instances briars and underbrush covered farms which before had maintained thrifty homes. But the sturdiest of our farmers clung tenaciously to the sod of their native State. Never despairing, they set about the task of discovering some means of deliverance from an environment which seemed to be barring them out of their own market. They investigated and experimented. The aids of science and art were called into requisition. The farmers' institute and agricultural journalism also accomplished much. At last the whole character of our agriculture was revolutionized. New modes of tillage were inaugurated, and a new line of staple agricultural prod- ucts was adopted. But as prosperity was once more dawning upon our farmers a nearer and a sharper competition appeared. It was like the irony of fate. I refer to the fertile provinces of Ontario and Quebec, which join New York on the north and west, and which have a soil similar to that of northern Ohio, Indiana, and Illinois, eastern Wis- 599 600 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS, coiifin, and the -5\'l)ole of Michigan, all being situated in the St. Law- rence Easiu. The Canadian farmers began sharply to compete with our Xew York farmers in the whole line of their new sjjecialties and with tlie advantages of cheaper labor. This latter fact is unquestionable for the reason that thousands — yes, hundreds of thousands — of Canadian laborers have during the last twenty-live years been drawn to the United States by the attraction of higlier wages. Canadian competition is easy by the Champlain Canal route and over the various railroads wliich extend from New York to the Canadian frontier. In imx^ortaut instances the rates for transportation are actually less from some of the principal towns in Canada than from points in the State of New York. Besides, three-fourths of the imports of agricultural products from countries beyond the sea are brought to New York city at the very lowest return cargo rates, But relief came from an unexpected source. Our war tariff, which was, as we all know, devised with the single object in view of saving the life of this nation, was faiily protective, and the beneficent provisions of that policy have been enjoyed by New York farmers for thirty-two years. Under this favorable condition a new generation of farmers has appeared. Finally when that last and most important of all the reductions in our customs revenues was made in the McKinley bill — Republican tariff reform — our New York farmers came on here from Dunkirk at the west, and Eouse I'oiut at the north, almost to Montauk Point, at the east end of Long Island, and pro^'ecl to the then Committee on Ways and Means that they needed and had good reason for asking additional protection on theii' staple ijroducts, and they got about what they asked for. All this is clearly set forth in the printed testimony taken by the Commit- tee on Ways and Means of that time, and I need not go over the ground. And now, JVIr. Chairman, I will, as rapidly as possible, ask your atten- tion to a few of the more important of the grand results achieved by the indomitable iierseverance and intelligent enterprise of New York f'arm- ers, aided by a beneficent tariff policy. New York is today the first State of the Union, as to the value of its hay crop, which, for the last five years, averaged in value about sited'), 000,000; the next State in. the order of \i\h\e being Pennsylvania, wliose hay crop was valued at about $36,000,000. You are undoubtedly aware, Mr. Chairman, that the farm value of the hay crop of this country greatly exceeds the farm value of our cotton crop. They stand thus : Hay,.^400,000,000 ; cotton, $305,000,000. In the production of potatoes, New York stands at the head of the list, the average home value of our potato crop for the last five years reported having been very nearly $12,000,000; the next State in the order of value being Peun.syh^ania, whose potato crop was valued at only ¥6,700,000. Then New York has become the largest X)roducer of beans. The annual value of our bean crop is about .$4,000,000. The beans of Boston are chiefly raised in New York. Then certain counties ha^'e made hops their specialty, the average value of this crop for the State being over $6,000,000. Other counties have found their soil and climate suitable to the raising of tobacco, chiefly for wrappers. Wayne County produces i)cppcrmint and converts it into the peppermint oil of (•(immerce. The raising of poultry is also a large industry tbrough- ont the iState, the value of our poultry and egg product being about $7,300,000 annually. Wheat, corn, oats, also domestic animals — horses, cattle, sheep, and hog,s — ar.' altern:itive products aud chiefly for local consumption. Long Island is tliC g;ir(lcn of New York and Brooklyn. Our vegetables com- mand the highc.st prices in these markets. We can raise cabbages FARM PRODUCTS. 601 enough to meet the sanerkrant demand of the nation, and it is said that at the east end of Suifolk County we raise half the cauhflower raised in the United States. Tlien our picjlile factories have become important industries, and great helps to the farmer. Each one of these farm prod- ucts is fairly protected. Fruit raising is becoming a very important industry throughout tlie State of New York, and to it is allied hundreds of industries, great and small, devoted to the preserving of fruits, which are sold in the princi- pal markets of the country. These industries and fruit raising were greatly stimulated by puttiug sugar on the free list — one of the most important features of the McKinley act. The year after that act was passed more fruit and sugar came together in the State of Ifew York than in any previous year of its history. Yes, sir; among the felicities of our present tariff policy, the New York farmer has free_ fertilizers for the enrichment of his soil, and free sugar for preserving the fruits of his soil. He also has a free breakfast table — free tea, free coffee, and free sugar. Yes, sir; the tariff now in force protects the laboring man both on its dutiable side and on its free side. I can not, however, take your time to state in detail what the present protective-tariff poli(;y has done directly for New York agriculture. The tariff indicates that upon its face. But, Mr. Ghairman and gentlemen, there is another aspect of the benefits afforded to New York farmers in the McKinley act which I can not omit. I refer to the hundreds — yes, thousands — of local markets created for agricultural products by protected manufactures of our State from Buffalo at the west, and Plattsburg at the north, away down to Sag Harbor, on Long Island. There is no State in the Union in which manufactures have been so happily correlated with agriculture. There is to-day hardly one of the sixty counties of our State which has not some tariff-protected industry, and the result is that New York State is by many millions the first manufacturing State in the Union. Yes, sir ; it is our local markets, created by jirotected manufactures, which to-day constitute the most beneficent feature of the entire protective policy in its application to agriculture. From one end of our great State to another you can find abundant verification of the important economicfactthat wherever manufactures are located, there the farmer prospers and the value of his lands appreciates. At the same time the j)eople employed in manufactures are benefited by their proximity to agricultural production. This happy association of manufactures with agriculture has been rapidly developing on Long Island during the last ten years. We have a rubber goods factory employing 500 i^ersons, an agate-ware factory employing over 1,200 persons, a watch-case factory, lace-curtain factor- ies, quite a variety of toy factories carried on by Germans who have come among us during the last twenty years, besides gold-beaters, aluminium-beaters, platinum-beaters, and silver-beaters, and other small industries. But time forbids that I should go into the detail of this wonderful story, full of hope and joy and prosperity to the thou- sands of homes in the great State of New York. I will just give you one illustration of what manufactures do for the general interests of our State. The amount paid for wages of labor in the manufactures of the cities of New York and Brooklyn during the census year 1890 amounted to $290,512,997, whereas the total amount paid on account of labor in the importing business of New York amounted to only $2,700,000. That illustrates the relative magnitude of the market for agricultural 602 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. products created by manufactures and by foreign commerce in tlie chief commercial city of America. The value of the products of manufacture in the United States in 1860 amounted to $1,886,861,676, and the indications from worked-ui) data are that the total for 1890 will be over $9,000,000,000. It also appears probable that the increased production was greater in New York than in any other State. Our agriculture has correspondingly increased. Ml'. Chairman, it is to our protective tariff mainly that we owe this enormous development, and the fact that our internal commerce is now fully thirty times as large as our foreign commerce, and larger than the international commerce of the globe. Will you reverse the conditions under which this wonderful development has been realized? That the prosperity of our vast industrial system was promoted by the McKiuley act, and that the welfare of the people of the great State of New York was advanced by the provisions of that act, is proved by the fact that during the first two years after its passage the value of the increased production of manufactures in our State amounted to $31,315,130, while the increase in wages paid to labor amounted to $6,377,925. Besides, during these two years, there was an increase of $85,000,000 in the deposits of the savings banks of the State of New York. Yes, sir ; after thirty-two years of protection we see the commercial, industrial, and agricultural interests of the Empire State full high advanced. She still maintains her proud position as the first State of the Union in population, first in wealth, first in commerce, first in man ufactures, and among the very foremost in the value of her products of agriculture, and in the value of her farming lands at the very front. And now, Mr. Chairman, I desire to state to you the precise limitation of the protection which New Yprk farmers seek, and which, by the grace of laws now in force, vre enjoy under tariff protection. It is per- fectly expressed in the following language of that resolution reported to the National Democratic Convention of 1892 — "that when custom- house taxation is levied upon articles of any kind produced in this country the difference between the cost of labor here and abroad, when such a difference exists, fully measures any possible benefit to labor." Yes, sir; that is the sound American doctrine — American rates of wages to American laborers in every branch of American enterprise. And, sir, it remains a pleasant memory and an inspiration of hope that when this Democratic utterance in favor of adequate pro- tection was trampled in the dust by a majority which repudiated pro- tection in every form there were 342 delegates, or nearly 40 per cent of the entire convention, who voted no to the policy of demolition which prevailed. In the year 1840 a free-trade movement sprung up in France. It went so far as to threaten the destruction of the beet-sugar industry which had been inaugurated by the great Napoleon as a means of securing commercial independence of England, since which time it had been fostered by protection. The brilliant and patriotic statesman, Thiers, afterwards president of the French Eepublic, was then at the height of his powers. In a wonderfully eloquent speech in the French Assembly he pointed to the fact that hundreds of thousands of French people were earning their daily bread in the intimately related agricultural and manufacturing processes of the beet-sugar industry, and he declared that the destruction of that industry would be a gigantic polit- FARM PRODUCTS. G03 leal crime. This important iDdustry was thus savea, and it has become one of the most valuable industries of France. Sir, we lived in an age in which hot competition and narrow margins condition all commercial effort. When you strike a blow at the care- fully nurtured agricultural and manufacturing interests of the great State of New York, or enter upon any line of policy which shall disturb those relationships which have been developed by thirty-two years of fair and beneficent protection, you will perpetrate a wrong far transcending ii» magnitude that political crime against which the patriot Thiers warned his countrymen fifty years ago. Mr. Turner. You say the limit of protection is the disparity of wages between the two countries'? Mr. S'iMMO. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. Take the question of hops, do you think the present duty on hops is measured by the statement you have just given! Mr. i^iMMO. I think so, as a general rule. I propose to submit a state- ment showing the cost and prices of this country and amount of duty, and then a statement showing the average rate of wages, which I shall be able to get from the Bureau of Labor, but I have not been able to get these statistics and I have not had time to work them out : but I will submit a statement in regard to potatoes and onions and all those stajdes which we have on Long Island. Mr. Turner. Perhaps that statement will give us the information. Mi: Payne. There is a difference in the rate of interest here and in the old country, is there not? Mr. NiMMO. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Ought not the capital used in producing these crops also be taken into consideration ? Mr. NiMMO. Yes, sir; that is a view I have not taken, but it certainly should; that is to say if men propose to maintain the doctrine which protectionists maintain, that the difference in the rate of wages and the difference in the permanent body of capital should be maintained. Mr. Payne. You can not make np the difference in wages unless you make up at the same time the difference in interest and other causes which enter into it, cost of machinery, etc., taxes, laud, and every- thing. Mr. IfiMMO. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. That is all I desire to ask. Mr. Tarsney. And notwithstanding the want of competition with Long Island bean-raisers, they have been able to destroy that in- dustry? Mr. NiMMO. Well, we sue to Massachusetts. I want to call your attention, gentlemen, to this fact; that by consequence of this Canadian and foreign competition, and equally the Western competition, we were driven from these great staples, and we have to put the different soils of our State into just such products as we find suits them. Our Long- Island soil is not suitable for beans, but there are certain parts of the State of Kew York suited to beans where they can be raised, and in other parts tobacco, and so on. Mr. Turner. Is there any sale for agricultural lands in New York now, or during the past two years ? Mr. NiMMO. There has been a great deal appreciation of value. Mr. Turner. But I am talking about the course of the market value for lands. Are not the Hudson Eiver lands a great deal cheaper than they used to be? 604 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. NiMMO. They vary very much. Some have appreciated very much, and others, which were Lands suited for wheat or raising stock Mr. TuENBR. Are not tlie farms of New England much cheaper than they used to be! Mr. NiMMO. On the average I am not prepared to state that. Mr. Turner. Perhaps you will also include that in your table? Mr. jS'immo. Well, I will remember that, sir, and try to get that. 1 think you will And it is a variable thing. Some of the bottom lands have appreciated, and the upper lands, where they raise cattle, have not; but just as they have discovered the specialty adapted to the laud that land has appreciated. The same, geutlemen, as in JSTorth Carolina, where lies this bright- tobacco region. At one time it may have been bought for |2 or $3 an acre, and when it was discovered that this tobacco was a specialty it went up to $100 an acre. Mr. TuENER. I think you must be a little mistaken about it! Mr. ISTiMMO. It went up immensely. Mr. Turner. Lands are pretty cheap there now. I was raised on those poor acres myself. Mr. JSTiMMO. They appreciated very much, but it has been eight or ten years ago. Mr. TuENEE. They did at one time rise in value, but they have not gone up very much. Mr. NiMMO. I guess you are running them out; I guess you run the soil out. Tobacco is a very exhausting crop. Mr. TuENEE. Those gentlemen who make fertilizers have devised a way to make those lauds produce rather too freely and the supply is too large! Mr. i^iMMO. We discover that a certain crop is suited to the soil, but we have got to alternate. For iustance, there is Mr. Parker, who will tell you on Long Island we put out a field of cabbages. The first year there is a caterpillar who goes to work aud eats off the outside leaves, and he goes in tlie ground prepared to get up the next year and finish the job, but we do not jrat in cabbages the next year and he dies. We fool him. Mr. TuENEE. Are you familiar with the Irish potato in New York! Mr. NiMMO. Well, sir, I have collected statistics at various times, but I am not in the trade at all. Mr. Turner. I want to know when the Bermuda potatoes arrive at New York! Mr. NiMMO. I think early in the spring. Mr. Turner. Can not you fix the date? Mr. NiMMO. I am not so familiar with the nl&rket, but I think it is along in the sjjring. I will tell you what it will do sometimes. Although Bernnida is a small place, once in a while there couies along one or two shiploads and that knocks the market for our potatoes. This protec- tion simply protects Long Island farmers when potatoes axe cheap. Mr. Turner. The Florida potato gets there a good deal before your potatoes. Do you want any protection against the Florida man? Mr. NiMMO. No, sir; we live in a country in which we are as mucli free traders between each other as you are. I believe Mr. Eeed expressed that opinion Avheu he said, some years ago (I remember I took it down), that this country was formed by a union of States and presented to the foreign nations au unbrokeu front. Mr. Gear. Is not land cheaper in Canada thau ou Long Island, New York! Mr. NiMMo. Yes, sir. FARM PRODUCTS. 605 Mr. Gear. And labor, also? Mr. NiMMO. Yes, sir: very muoh. Mr. Geak. It does uot cost imicTi luoi'e to send Canadian products to the 2>re\v York markets than from Long Island ? Mr. JSnmo. No, sir; tbey have very cheap rates for carrying-, and they defy the interstate-commerce law in regard to the long and short haul. They are getting cheaper rates in many points in Canada to the United States, and I was told uot long ago by a Vermont man that hay over the line in Canada is delivered in New York and overcame the tariff of $4 a ton by violating the interstate-commerce act in respect to the long and short haul. Mr. Taksney. a citizen in Buffalo and other places along the line who has to buy some hay gets some benefit? Mr. NiMMO. A citizen who buys Mr. Taesney. a man who does not raise it, but buys it, gets some of the benefit of the reduction in price ? Mr. Payne. Does he or the Canadian farmer? Mr. NiMMO. He does not suffer to the amount of the tariff. He gets his hay always at a fair rate, at which the American citizen engaged in making hay in the first place will produce. Mr. Taesney. The product from Canada comes much cheaper? Mr. Ntmmo. Yes, sir. j\[r. Taensey. You think the higher the tariff the consumer gets more benefit? Mt. Nimmo. Yes, sir. Mr. Tabsney. You think the more con.sumers there are than pro- ducers Mr. ISTiMivio. There you strike the root of tariffs which do not coalesce. Mr. Eeed. Are there any more consumers than producers in New York? Mr. Taesney. In agricultural products Mr. Eebd. We can not have all consumers on one side and separate those on the other side. That would be too large a ratio. We want all consumers and producers tested together. That seems to be~a fal- lacious idea addressed to 65,000,000 consumers. Mr. jSTimmo. I think the proper way to quote that is not to count heads, but to see the amount of money which goes into the producers' hands, how it affects the producers as a whole, and how it affects the consumers as a. whole. Not the number of people, because one farmer raises hay enough to supply 40 or 60 different men. We can not do it on that equation. Mr. Beeckineidge. Yon spoke of furnishing some figures in regard to difference in cost of labor, and also spoke of taking into con- sideration the difference in cost of capital. I presume that these fig- ures that you will furnish us will be directed to the difl'erence in the cost of production, from whatever cause that difl'erence arises, in for- eign countries and ^n this country? Mr. NiMMO. Yes, sir. Mr. Beeckineidge. Will you make them bear upon that point? Mr. NiMMO. Yes, sir; I will remember that. The statistics do not cover everything. They do not develop everything yet. Mr. Beeckineidge. I understand you are addressing yourself to demonstrate as far as yoa can the difference in the cost of products in this country and in competing countries? Mr. NiMMO. Yes, sir; I will prepare a table showing that, illustrat- 606 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AiSD PROVISIONS. ing the fact that the tariff on agricultural products does not exceed the difference in the cost of producing in foreign countries and here. Mr. Beeckineidge. You will furnish statistics bearing upon that? Mr. NiMMO. Yes, sir. I do not think, from what I know — the Labor Bureau, though, would give as clear information as we would want. Mr. Payne. Have you had any intercourse \^'ith the Canadian farmer personally? Mr. IfiMMO. I have been through Canada. Mr. Patnb. They have got the idea generally up there that they pay this custom-house duty themselves? Mr. Nnoio. I think they have. Mr. Payne. It is a pretty general, well-fixed idea there with the farmers that they have to pay it? Mr. NiMMO. I think if the duty was taken all off their farmers and put ou the American farmers there would be a pretty decided idea as to who pays the duty. Mr. Payne. I agree with you. I think they would. Mr. NiiiMO. I think it woiild be a practical answer to that theoret- ical question as to who pays the duty. FARM PRODUCTS. (Schedule G.) STATEMEHT OF ME. J. EUGENE PAEKEB. Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen op the Committee: Please allow me, as representing the farmers of Suffolk County, N. Y., to petition you not to change the existing duty on agricultural products. Potatoes, turnips, cabbage, cauliflower, onions, poultry, eggs, hay, aud garden seeds are our principal crops and New York City our princi- pal miarket. Potatoes, I may say, is our chief money crop. On account of the dry weather this year we have only half a crop and have sold so far at an average of about 70 cents per bushel. Last year our average price was about 60 cents per bushel. There were imported during the year ending June 30, 1893, at the port of New York, 2,550,092 bushels, that sold at an average of $1.65 per barrel, as estimated by the dealers and commission men. The importation extended from December until June and if not profitable it would have stopped. Deducting the duty, about 68 cents per barrel sack, the potatoes sold at 33 cents per bushel. If you deduct 8 cents ocean freight, sack 2 cents, freight and handling to port of shipment 3 cents, you have 20 cents for the English, Scotch, or German farmer. These importations occurred during the winter and spring months and come in direct competition with our potatoes, that have been kept over in cellars at considerable exj)ense, waste, etc. The acreage in potatoes on Long Island has increased fully 10 per cent in the past two years. We cannot raise potatoes in Suffolk County for less than 60 cents i per bushel. We beg your honorable committee not to reduce duty on - potatoes. The acreage planted to rutabaga turnips is not one quarter it was j twenty years ago, and we are being driven out of our own maiket, New FARM PRODUCTS. 607 York City, by the foreign products. Thirty-six thousand barrels of Canadian turnips were sold in New York City during the winter and spring of 1892-93 at an average of 65 cents per barrel. Three-quarters of the Long Island crop was allowed to rot in the helds, as it would cost us 20 cents per barrel freight, 7 cents cartage, 6 cents i^or sack, and 10 per cent commission — about 40 cents' expense, besides labor. The freight from Gait, Hamilton, and other inland points in Canada is 7 cents per bushel to New York City. A change of duty from 25 per cent ad valorem to a specific duty of 15 cents per bushel might keep this industry from being crushed out of existence. Brussels sprouts, from France and S]iain, about supply our market. The crop requires a large amount of labor. That is cheap in Prance and Spain. From several hundred acres planted in the two eastern towns of Suffolk County, eight years ago, less than 40 acres are planted this year. The ad valorem duty of 25 per cent is not protective. A specific duty of 3 cents per pound might enable us to compete. Cabbage is one of Long Island's main crops. The acreage was in- creased 30 per cent the past year in Suffolk County alone. The duty of 3 cents per head is not prohibitory. Only the larger heads of cab- bage are sent over, weighing 12 to 18 pounds each, an average barrel of such cabbage paying a duty of 33 cents. We pray you not to reduce the duty on cabbages. Sauerkraut, a product of cabbage, is imported duty free. A duty of 1 cent per pound would enable it to be made in this country. Cauliflower. — Prior to 1885 three-quarters of the entire product of the United States was grown in the two eastern towns of Suffolk County. The importation of cauliflower in salt or brine from Germany caused a reduction in acreage, until, in 1888, only 160,000 barrels of the fresh article was sent to the New York marked, with no demand at the pickle houses for it to salt, except at 1 cent per pound, a price impossible to raise it for. The acreage has decreased until, in 1892, less than 92,000 barrels were sent to market. This year the acreage has increased 10 per cent, but the dry weather has -cut the crops off one- half. To supply this deficiency it is to be imported from England. [from Fruit Trade Journal, SeEtember 9, 1893.] There is a movement on foot to ship cauliflower to this country from England where it is abundantly raised; the outlook liere at present is unfavorable for a good crop. Long Island reports a short yield, owing to severe drought. The duty on this product is not enough to protect it and is far from being prohibitory. Onions are grown in considerable quantities. The average price for two years past about $2 per barrel. The duty of 40 cents per bushel does not shut out the foreigner and is no more protection than the crop needs, if to be grown at all in this country. The importation of onions from Spanish and other Mediterranean ports, especially Egypt, is as- suming vast proportions. JEggs. The increase of price to the Long Island farmer the past two years has been from 2 to 3 cents per dozen on eggs, a fact noticed by them and fuUy appreciated. Chickens (spring) have also increased 3 to 4 cents per pound, and farmers are increasing the number of fowls kept. The duty should not be reduced on these articles. Garden-seed growing is an important industry in Suffolk County. C-)08 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. But the raising of .seeds by tlie farmers is confiued, at the present time, almost entirely to cabbage seed, for which we have a noted reputation as "Long Island grown seed." The acreage is increasing yearly. For the growing of beet, carrot, onion, and other seeds it is imytos- sible to contract with the agents of the seed houses at prices that would be profitable to the grower. They say they can import at prices ofi'ered. The farmers of Suffolk County, through their humble representative, earnestly request that no reduction be made in the agricultural sched- ule, and that the duty on Brussels sprouts and turnips be increased, and that a specific duty be put on sauerkraut, as hereinbefore set forth. Very respectfully, J. Eugene Pakkbk. Shelter Island, Suffolk County, H. Y. Mr. Bryan. What is your business? Mr. Parker. A farmer. Mr. Bryan. On Long Island? Mr. Parker. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. How much land do you farm? Mr. Parker. 400 acres. Mr. Bryan. And your association is that of the county 1 Mr. Parker. Yes, sir. AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS. (Schedule G.) Tuesday, September 19, 1893. STATEMEirr OF MR. A.'H. GALLAHUE, CHAIRMAN 01' THE WOEKINGMEN'S EEEOEM LEAGUE OF NEW YORK. Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen of the Committee : I have been sent here from New Yorlc by two different organizations representing 9,200 workingmeu, and they ask for a reduction or a removal of duties from Bermuda produce on the grounds that the season is two months in advance of our own, and that the free importations of that produce would not compete with the American product but would allow the middle class and the working people to purchase fresh vegetables, which they need for their health, earlier than they can now on account of the high prices, due to the duty on them, and the low extent of trade of the producers. BERMUDA VK(;ETABLBS. (Schedule (3.) Associated Trades of I^ew York, New York, September 15, 1893. The Associated Trades of Xew York City and the Workingmen's Re- form League of New York held a joint meeting on Friday evening, September 15, at No. 804 Ninth avenue. Delegates were present repre- senting 9,200 workingmen. The following resolution was passed : Resolved, That we demand that the duty on vegetable products of BERMUDA VEGETABLES. 609 the Bermuda Islands be removed or greatly reduced so that middle- class and working people may be able to purchase and use the fresh vegetables which are necessary for their health in the early spring- time. These products do not enter into competition with the products of our country, for the Bermuda crop arrives two months before ours is ready for use. Resolved, That A. H. Gallahue, chairman of the Workingmen's Ee- form League, be emi:)owered to proceed to Washington and present these resolutions to the Ways and Means Committee of the House of Representatives and demand that some action be taken on them. Eespectfully, Jambs A. Fox, Secretary. AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. (Schedule 0.) STATEMENT SUBMITTED BY ITALIAN CHAMBEa OF COMMERCE OF NEW YOKE. LEMO]NS. Little or no duty at all should be levied on this fruit. A very small portion, possibly not over one-fortieth part of the entire consumption is raised in this country, and that only reaches its maturity at a time when the imports from Italy are nearly at an end. Any duty on this fiuit has no other effect but the one of raising the revenue at the expense and detriment of the people at large. ORANGES. The very large and constantly increasing home production of this very wholesome fruit, which, on the American market, generally brings a higher price tlian the one of foreign origin, together with the fact that all boxes wherein the fruit is imported are made of American wood, ought to be ample and abundant reasons to place it on the free list. OLIVE OIL. The duty now existing on this healthy and very necessary product seems to us rather unreasonable. Pure olive oil, aside from being a wholesome food, is one of the ingredients most needed in the prepara- tion of reliable medicines. Olive oil, such as comes from Italy, is not as yet produced in this country, nor does there seem to be, at present, very much probability of its being done in the very near future. In our judgment the day is still very far off when olive oil of American make can be brought on the market to compete with the one of Italian production; there is, therefore, no plausible reasons why the poor classes of the present generation should be deprived of the benetit of X)ure and cheap olive oil. As a natural consequence of the imposition of duty, both on the oil and on the bottles (wherein quite a large pro- portion of it is imported to this country), adulteration on a rather extensive scale has of late become, in the leading centers of the Union, a rather common and increasing practice ; and what is still more lament- T H 39 610 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. able, is the fact that cheap olive oil, intended only for mechanical and manufacturing purposes, by entering these ports free of duty, as the present tariff provides, finds its way to the abodes of the poor as a sub- stitute for pure and refined olive oil. We are, therefore, of the opinion that the placing of this salubrious product on the free list will offer a very material benefit to the consumer, and at the same time put an end to all kinds of adulterations. MACARONI. ITearly all the manufacturers of this article in this country are Ital- ians, and the most notable fact which we very much desire to emi^hasize is that the largest portion of them started in that kind of industry at a time when the article of foreign make Avas still exempt from duty. These domestic manufacturers assert that in the production of their goods they have to pay much higher wages thau the manufacturers in Italy, and consequently the existing duty of 2 cents per pound on the article of foreign make is the only protection that they have, but in their assertions they loose sight of the fact that the smaller price which they have to pay for their flour here in this country, together with the much more imjjroved systems of machinery of which they make use in their manufacturing establishments, more than balances the difference in the price of labor existing between the two countries. And, furthermore, if the American manufacturers can continually export their macaroni to Central and South America and to other countries, and.there meet in a successful and profitable manner the competition of the Italian article it is self-evident that every cent of duty imposed upon each pound of macaroni coming from abroad means right on the face of it so many more cents of profit on each pound ot American production. WINES. In the judgment of our leading importing houses, and in our own as well, all foreign still wines, light ones especially, ought to be relieved of a jpart at least of the duty now in vigor. It is quite amusing to lis- ten to the arguments of the protectionists that refer to the competition of California wines Avith foreign clarets, especially when such arguments are relating to the Zinfandel brand, one of the nearest approaches to the foreign table clarets that California has got, and which sells on the various American markets for less than existing duty on the article of foreign production. So long as such a state of things will be in exist- ence, but little, if any, incentive will be offered to the home grower in the way of stimulation for the improvement of his own product. It would be very much more advantageous for him, and of far more ben- efit to the mass of the consumers (which by the way is slowly, but steadily, and constantly increasing) if the tariff on pure light foreign wines was so adjusted as to protect, first, the home industry to such a margin as would call for a constant and intelligent imi)rovement on the standard of the quality made in this country; and, secondly, to do away with the promiscuous adulteration that is daily assuming larger proportions. CHEESE. The raising of the duty on this article from 4 to 6 cents per pound at the time when the McKinley bill was made a law was intended to stim- ulate and develop home production j in fact, during the last few years BERMUDA VEGETABLES. 611 any quantity of cheese dairies have sprouted up all over the country, and all sorts of imitations have been attempted, but as far as we know all such attempts have proved to be of little or no consequence. It is true that now and then some of these imitations find their way to the stores of a few bona iide buyers, but it is also a fact, acknowledged by all those who know anything about cheese production, that so long as the animal that furnishes the material to produce it grows in a country of a certain climate and feeds the pasture of a certain soil all attempts to reach a "perfect imitation" will be not only a hazardous task, but a perfectly useless undertaking. In consequence of which indisputable facts, we have good reason to hope that the wise judgment of the ruling administration will levy on this constantly growing production such a duty as will correspond to the interests and to the expectations of the consumers. As raw materials these articles will no doubt be placed on the free list. BOEACIC ACID, TAETAEIC ACID, AND SXJLPHUE. Taking into consideration the difference in the price of labor exist- ing between the United States and other countries, the present duty is entirely out of proportion. FILBERTS, AND ALMONDS. As the home production of these fruits is of but little consequence, any duty at all on them only serves to enhance their cost and to injure the iDockets of the consumers. ANCHOVIES. The importation of this product is so limited, its revenue to the Gov- ernment so insignificant, and present duty of so little benefit to any one special interest, that if it was for no other reason but for the mere sake of increasing the home production of various kinds of sausages now made abroad, in the manufacture of which the "anchovie" is one of the leading seasoning ingredients, the article ought to be placed on the free list. FINE ARTS. This commercial body does not consider it necessary to advance any arguments on the subject of taxation upon these articles, for the simjile reason that the expectation of the public is that this coming Fifty- third Congress will undoubtedly place them on the free list. 612 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Monday, September 4, 1893. STATEMENT OF SAMUEL A. MASTERS. BERMUDA VEGETABLES. (Schedule G.) Mr. CHAfR:\rAN : I do not know that I can take up less time in any way than by reading yoti a brief synopsis of what we want to lay before your committee for your favorable consideration : Washington, D. C, July 25, 1893. Sirs: We, the undersigned delegates, appointed by the house of assembly of ISermuda to approach the Government of the United States of America on the subject of the duty paid for the past three yearson the products of Bermuda when imported into the United States, beg most respectfully to submit the following for your patient and serious con- sideration : The statistics of the trade of Bermuda hereto appended show that the imports from the United States for the year 1892 (which can with safety be taken as an average year) exceeded the sum total of the imports from all other countries by more than 50 per centum, while of the exports 94 jjer centum was shipped to the United States; and notwithstanding such a large part of the exports was shipped to the United States, still the value of the imports from the United States exceeded the value of the exports to that country by nearly half a million dollars. Again, the duty paid for the same period on the prod- ucts of Bermuda under the McKinley tariff amounted to a sum equal to $10 per head of the whole population of Bermuda and exceeded the sum derived by Bermuda from its entire tariff by more than $15,0t;t). It will also be seen that of the imports from the United States 78 per centum is now, and has been for many years past, admitted at a duty of 5 per centum ad valorem, while of the remaining 22 per centum coal, ice, and all fresh fruits and fresh vegetables, potatoes excepted (which are included in the above 78 per centum), are admitted free, the goods which pay specific duties being cattle, cigars, cigarettes, tobacco, snuff, and spirits. In view of all these facts, and in consideration also of the fact that the products of Bermuda, viz, potatoes, onions, and other vegetables, on which a reduction of duty is sought, are very nearly all (in the year 1892 more than 96 per centum of the whole) imported Into the United States between the 1st day of April and the loth day of June, a period of the year when the products of the United States of the like kind are not in the market — we beg most respectfully to ask on behalf of the house of assembly and the people of Bermuda, that, if practicable, the products of those islands be admitted into the ports of the United States on the same favorable terms, with respect to duty, as similar products are admitted into Bermuda; but, if that be thought impracti- cable, then, that the duty on such products when imported into the United States may at the most not exceed what it was before the McKinley tariff came into operation. AU of which is respectfully submitted. Thos. J. Wadson", M. C. p., Saml. a. Masters, M. 0. P., Delegates. BERMUDA VEGETABLES. 613 STATISTICS. Imports, 1S92. United States $973, 757 Great Britain 422,669 British colonies 172, 440 All other countries 11, 692 1, 580, 558 Exports, 189S. United States $522,178 Great Britain 11, 870 British colonies 12, 576 All other countries 7, 560 Total 554,184 Value of goods imported in 1892 from the United States which paid a duty of 5 per centum ad valorem $708, 889 Value of goods imported in 1892 from the Uni ted States which were either free or which paid specitic duties 204, 868 973, 757 Value of goods exported to the United States in 1892 522, 178 In favor of the United States and against Bermuda 451, 579 Amount of duty paid the United States in 1892 under the McKinley tariff.. 150, 891 Amount of duty derived by Bermuda from its entire tariff in 1892 135, 662 Duty paid the United States exceeded amount collected by Bermuda under its entire tariff by 15, 229 Mr. Masters (continuiiig). Tou see from tlie reading of tliis paper that all of our business is with the United States, and we hope that you will be able in your consideratiou of the question to take favorable action upon our petition. These figures may look small to you, as we are only a little Island containing 15,000 people. It is usual to confound us with the West Indies. B'ew York and Charleston are our nearest points, and it is wrong to confound us with the West Indies. Mr. Dalzbll. Have you the figures showing how much revenue you derive from the United States'? Mr. Masteks. Yes, sir. It is more than the revenue from our own island. Mr. Hopkins. You have stated in your paper that it amounts practi- tically to a tax of $10 per capita. Mr. Masters. Yes, sir. There are 15,000, and we paid over $150,000. Mr. Dalzell. Five per cent is the duty United States products pay in entering your ports ? Mr. Masters. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzell. Have you the figures showing how much we derive from Bermuda products ! Mr. Masters. Yes, sir; and you will see that it exceeded our own revenue by the sum of $15,229. Mr. Hopkins. That is the revenue ux)on these articles upon which you want the import duty taken oil? Mr. Masters. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. You have given the value of goods imported into the United States in 1892 which were free and which paid specific duties. What proportion comes in free and what proportion does not? Mr. Masters. I can not answer that exactly. Coal comes in free and also fresh vegetables. Potatoes jjay 5 per cent, and everything else comes in free. The strongest liquors pay 5 shillings, or $1.20, imperial duty; wines, 20 per cent ad valorem; tobacco, 12 cents a pound; cigars and cigarettes are 26 cents a pound, the tax added. Mr. Bryan. What is the rate on cattle? 614 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. Masters. Four shillings, or 96 cents. Mr. Hopkins. Your conviction is that the import duty on these articles is taken out of your people in the amount you have to pay to the United States? Mr. Masters. Yes, sir; there is no doubt in the world of that. Of the crops we raise the more we import the more business we have with the United States. Mr. Dalzell. This is a case where the foreigner pays the tax? Mi?. Masters. Yes, sir. Mr. Hopkins. Then it is not the consumer in America who pays the tax? Mr. Masters. No, sir. Mr. Gear. Have yoii a classification of your exportations? Mr. Masters. No, sir; but we can furnish you the information. Mr. Burrows. What is your desire in appearing before the com- mittee? Mr. Masters. We want a reduetion of duty, Mr. Burrows. On what? Mr. Masters. On all vegetables. Mr. Burrows. On potatoes, onions, and what else? Mr. Masters. On everything. Why make two bites of a cherry? Mr. Burrows. Do you want the duty off lettuce? Mr. Masters. Yes, sir; and we would probable also ask to have it taken off tomatoes and cucumbers. Mr. Burrows. You want a reduction of duties on all vegetables? Mr. Masters. Yes, sir ; but particularly on those I have mentioned. Mr. Burrows. How much? Mr. Masters. We will leave that to your liberality. Mr. Burrows. What is your judgment about it? Mr. Masters. I would like for you not to charge us any more than we charge you. Mr. Hopkins. Are not most of the articles free, or is there an ad valorem duty of 5 per cent on some? Mr. Masters. There is a duty on everything except these articles — everything that we live on and every kind of instrument and imple- ment we use. Nearly everything we use comes from the United States, and our business is entirely with the United States. Mr. Bryan. What is the area of your island susceptible of cultiva- tion? Mr. Masters. We have 2,422 acres of arable land. Mr. Bryan. What is the population of the islands? Mr. Masters. Fifteen thousand. Mr. Bryan. What do you export to this country besides vegetables? Mr. Masters. Nothing else. Mr. Bryan. Do you know what the price of vegetables was in this country after the passage of the McKinley bill? Mr. Masters. Prices varied from 50 cents to $2 for a box of onions. Prices go up and down. Mr. Bryan. How can you tell, without knowing the price before the McKinley law was enacted, whether the consumer pays the tariff? Mr. Masters. Well, 1 was treasurer of the Farmers' Alliance, and I know that during the latter part of the present season the shipment of some 10,000 boxes of onions to New York paid 38 cents a box, and the freight was 16 cents. They sold for about 60 cents. There was clearly a loss, and they brought us in debt. If we did not pay the duty, who did? BllRMUDA VEGETABLES. 615 Mr. Bryan. Do you iisually do that? Mr. Masters. I hope uot; but we Iiave to do it on some things nearly every year. Mr. Bryan. Did you not have losses before the enactment of the McKin ley bill? Mr. Masters. Yes, sir; but not such heavy losses. Imagine the tariff of 38 cents, the freight 16, and the article selling for about that sum. Mr. Bryan. Is it not true that in the case of perishable articles those losses are incident to the trade? Mr. Masters. Yes, sir ; but still we do not want to pay such a tax as has a tendency to drive our trade out of existence. There is no doubt in the world that when these articles come here they must be sold. We put coal and ice on our free list, because we feel that coal protects our firewood, and we look upon ice as a sanitary article during the summer and as conducive to the health of our people. Our idea is that you gentlemen would much prefer to have our fresh vegetables on your tables when your ground is covered with ice and snow. Mr. Bryan. You get a better j)rice when you get them in early. Mr. Masters. Of course. Mr. Bryan. And finally, when the goods come in from our market, yours cease to sell entirely? Mr. Masters. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzell. Your season is then over? Mr. Masters. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. How much earlier are you than Florida? Mr. Masters. Two months. Some of the strongest advocates of this measure, who live in Kew York, own large truck farms in Virginia, in the Garolinas, and in Florida. They say that it does not interfere with them at all, but enables them to open a market for their products and to get a higher price. It is of great advantage to them. You must not think when we urge this that it will be an injury to the Southern farmers. Mr. Gear. What is the latitude of Bermuda? Mr. Masters. Thirty- two degrees — the same as Charleston. Mr. Bryan. How far is it from Charleston? Mr. Masters. Six hundred and fifty miles. Mr. Bryan. And how far from New York? Mr. Masters. About the same. Mr. Gear. What time do you begin to market your crop? Mr. Masters. Early potatoes come in in February. Mr. Gear. When do your onions come? Mr. Masters. About the 1st of March. Mr. Gear. How much earlier is that than the Florida crop ? Mr. Masters. Two months. Mr. Stevens. How late is it when you get off all your crop ? Mr. Masters. The 1st of June. Mr. Stevens. After that I suppose you take your crop elsewhere? Mr. Masters. After that we go to the West Indies. Our first expor- tations are to the United States, and after your crojis come we are driven out of the market. Mr. Turner. You raise nothing but potatoes and onions that we can buy? Mr. Masters. That is all. Mr. Bryan. What is land worth in Bermuda? Mr. Masters. We can not buy a great deal. Our Government has 616 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. not been as liberal as yours in encouraging immigration. There is very little land on the market, and it is worth from $50 to $500 per acre. Arable land is worth $500 per acre, and sometimes more. Mr. Betan. Is there any waste land there which can be brought into cultivation? Mr. Masters. There is only a small amount of such land. Mr. Burrows. I understand you to say that under the present rate of duty you can not make anything. Mr. Masters. Yes, sir; we do more and more trade with the United States with a reduction of duty. Mr. Hopkins. It would be more profitable. Mr. Masters. Yes, sir; we can not raise onions for less than $1 a box. Mr. Gear. How much more trade would you expect? Mr. Masters. Our trade would almost double. I think I could safely say that it would increase 50 per cent. Mr. Gear. Would you double your producing area? Mr. Masters. No, sir; we could not do that to save our lives. We could not double our producing area if we got a thousand dollars an acre in produce. Mr. Gear. Then how can you increase your trade? Mr. Masters. By cultivating more scientifically, using more manure, and tilling more expensively. We might probably increase the area 25 per cent, but I doubt if we could do more. Mr. Bryan. Do you know what the average price of onions was per box in 1889? Mr. Masters. In New York it was about $2.50 or $3. Mr. Bryan. How much in Bermiida? Mr. Masters. They would sell for $1.50 or $2 a box. Mr. Bryan. In April what would be the average price? Mr. Masters. The decline in price is very rapid from the time the crop commences to mature in this country. However, I would like to turn this matter over to Mr. Wadson, who understands it better than I do. BERMUDA VEGETABLES. (Schedule G.) STATEMENT OF MB. THOMAS J. WADSON. Mr. Chairman and &entlemen of the committee : In my younger days I was regarded as bashful, and I have not overcome it very much. Were the subject not so important, I would not have the courage to address this committee. I would like to begin by express- ing the thanks of myself and colleagues for the honor of addressing! you, and to say that we have been treated by all with whom we have ! come in contact in this matter with the utmost courtesy and cordiality, for all of which we desire to express our best thanks. I would like to remove, it I can do so, what is a very common error, and that is the idea that Bermuda is a part of the West Indies, which she is not, either geographically or politically. My colleague has stated that it is distant from the Carolinas about C50 miles, and distant from New York City about the same, or a little more. The nearest of the West India Islands is, I believe, that of St. Thomas, which is something more BERMUDA VEGETABLES. 617 than 800 miles distant, so that we can not be said to be geographically any part of the West Indies, nor are we so politically. We enjoy a constitution which is somewhere about 200 years old, and whichisacopy in miniature of the constitution of England. England has a queen as well as commons, while we have a governor, a council, and an assembly, the latter being an elective body, of which my colleague and myself, as well as our friend who accompanies us, are members, and we have been, with the privilege of the British Grown, appointed as delegates to this nation, with the hope of obtaining some thing in the way of relief from these duties. I would like also to explain another matter which may be misun derstood If gentlemen will refer to a matter of this printed statement which I have here, and which is before you, they will find in the third line, second paragraph, the words, "all other countries" — and the same expression occurs in the statistics. I will say that those words in the statement include not only all other countries mentioned in the sta.tistics, but also Great Britain and the British Colonies; that is to say, that the imports from every part of the world other than the United States in 1892 amounted to $606,801, while the imports from the United States for the same period amounted to $973,757. In other words, for every dollar's worth of goods which Burmuda bought in that year (which is taken as an average), from all the world besides the United States, she bought from the United States $1.60 wortb. I feel that I should urge this point with all the force of which I am capable, because, although we do not call it the main plank in our plat- form, yet we call it the chief point in our argument, and therefore I will rejjeat that while Bermuda bought in that year (and I might say contributed) the amount stated, for every one dollar's worth of goods from all the world besides, she bought from the United States $1.60 worth of goods. So we say in this paragraph, in the early part of our statement, that the imports from the United States for 1892 exceed the sum total from all other countries by more than 50 per cent, fully 60 per cent. With regard to this question of tax, which you call the duty paid to the United States in 1892, which was referred to in the evidence, were $150,000, and was, as we have shown in our statement, a per capita tax of $10 for every man, woman, and child on the island. It was also a rate of $62.30 per acre on every acre of land in cultivation. This sys- tem is a very serious burden, not only i)er capita, but per acre, a very serious burden indeed; and therefore it is that we are here to-day to ask you to take this matter into consideration favorably, because of our being such large consumers of American products. With regard to the party who pays the duty, that is an important point. I thought fronr some of the questions put by you gentlemen, that it was held here that the consumer pays the duty. I ani very well aware that it is generally held that the consumer pays the duty on all imports, but that is not true in regard to the products of Bermuda. They are shipped in the main to the port of New York, and because of their perishable nature they must be sold immediately upon arrival, because if potatoes are held they will rot or change color, and thus lose their value. The same applies to onions, which will not stand being held, because they also will get dark in color, and sometimes begin to sprout. The farmer who disposes of his products on his own account is com- pelled to take the price the market will afford. If the market only affords $2 a box, that is all he will realize. Out of that he has to pay 618 AGRICULTUEAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. more or less, frequently more. He must pay the freight and the duty, which is 38 cents a box, really 40 cents a bushel — I say that for the reason that a box does not contain a bushel, and the duty is ascertained by weight. Therefore I hold that the duty comes out of the grower and not out of the consumer. It makes no difference what the duty is, large or small, it must be taken out of what the market will afford. Perhaps I might be told that there are dealers in the city of New York who purchase in Bermuda for shipment to New York on their own account, and when they do that they have to add the duty and other charges to the price, and, therefore, it is said the consumer pays the duty. I will remove that impression, if I can, by explaining that the man in New York when he sends an order to his agent in Bermuda has to pay in advance of the arrival of the goods, and he will take the freight and other charges incident to the buying, and cost of selling, and will instruct his agent to pay what the difference might be. If he expects to get $6, he will be willing to pay 17s. in Bermuda, and there- tore I hold that in that case the duty comes out of the farmer's pocket, just the same as if I put my hand iato my pocket and take out an amount of money I want to dispose of. The same thing applies in regard to onions. If he expects to get $1.50 a box, he will deduct the duty, 38 cents a box, freight and other charges, and instruct his agent to pay probably 3 shillings a box, and he will sell in the market for $1.50, jjrobably. I want to urge the fact of our being such good customers of the United States, and the fact of our buying and paying for the past 3 years such heavy duties, as the reason why we think we are at least entitled to your favorable consideration. If the McKinley tariff' bill had not been in operation the duty on our potatoes and onions in 1892 would have been in round figures $33,000, while under that law the tariff' was *150,000 and more. That difference is $117,000; and for the three years during which the McKinley tariff bill has been in operation Bermuda has contributed to the United States $350,000, being $144 per acre for the land under cultiA^ation. Mr. Hopkins. There has been taken from the inhabitants of Ber- muda that amount of money paid into the United States Treasury. Mr. Wadson. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzell. And yet onions and potatoes did not cost our people any more? Mr. Wadson. That depends upon the state of the market. Mr. Hopkins. And not on import duties °? Mr. Wadson. If those articles had been free your people might not have gotten them any cheaper. Mr. Bryan. You say that if there had been no duty we would not have gotten them any cheaper. Mr. Wadson. I think not. Mr. Bktan. Then what benefit can that be to this country? Mr. Wadson. I am scarcely arguing for that point. I am arguing for the Bermuda. Mr. Ttirner. Are you familiar with this trade between the United States and other islands on these articles'? Mr. Wadson. I do not think there is any trade between the United States and other islands. There is some trade with Cuba in onions, and some with Canada in i)otatoes. Mr. Turner. I see in this statement that you represent the trade in these commodities as occuring between the 1st of April and the 16th of June. BEEMUDA VEGETABLES. 619 Mr. Wadson. Tes, sirj that is about the time of the occurrence of the trade. Mr. TxjENEB. Are you not aware of the fact that Florida produces and gets to market in that time! Mr. Wadson. Only to a very small extent, and not at all in onions. Mr. Turner. Are not potatoes from Florida in market during that time? Mr. Wadson. Not to my knowledge. Mr. Turner. Florida is projected lar down across the tropics. Mr. Wadson. Yes ; but she has frost, which we never have. Mr. Turner. Doubtless, in your position, you have an earlier climate; but in Florida potatoes are produced aud put on the market in April. Mr. Wadson. We in Bermuda are forced out of the market as soon as your product appears, because it at once has an effect upon prices. Mr. Turner. Were you ever in New York at a time when your pro- duce got there? Mr. Wadson. 'No, sir. Mr. Turner. I think that at that time competition from Florida has something to do with regulating i^rices. Mr. Wadson. It would be according to the quantity we sent. Mr. Turner. Did I understand you to express it as your opinion that the tariif is a tax ui^on the producer in Bermuda, and that the American consumer pays none of it. Mr. Wadson. I say that tax comes straight out of the pockets of the Bermuda farmers. Mr. Turner. Did you ever know of any experimental tests ot that? Mr. Wadson. The freight and duty is taken out at New York. The New York merchant fixes the value of the stuff in Bermuda, and he deducts duty and other charges. Mr. Turner. Could not the New York dealer sell these articles cheaper if duties were removed 1 Mr. Wadson. No, sir; I do not think he would. Mr. Turner. Is not the price regulated in Bermuda? Mr. Wadson. No, sir ; the price is regulated in New York. Mr. Turner. Without regard to Bermuda? Mr. Wadson. There is no competition in Bermuda. Mr. Turner. What is it that affects the price over and above the duty? Mr. Wadson. The other charges. Duty and freight have to be deducted as well as the cost of buying in Bermuda and handling in New York. Mr. Hopkins. Do you think that if there were no import duties on these articles, the New York purchaser would give you more for them? Mr. Wadson. Yes, sir; as the duty is one of the items taken out. Mr. Bryan. Then you go upon the theory that where you export the country to which you export pays the duty? Mr. Wadson. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. And when we export to you, who pays the duty? Mr. Wadson. We pay it ourselves. Mr. Bryan. Then you pay both ways? Mr. Wadson. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. You are in hard luck. Mr. Turner. How does the question of perishability affect you? Mr. Wadson. The goods must be sold immediately upon arrival. The Chairman. Like any other farmer, you send your goods to mar- ket and must take whatever price you can get? 620 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. Wadson. Tes, sir. Mr. Turner. Does the element of perishability affect prices? Mr. Wadson. It does. Mr. Turner. How does the tariff and perishability go together? Mr. Wadson. For the simple reason that the goods must be sold at once. Mr. Turner. What you can not hold must be sold. Mr. Wadson. Tes, sir. Mr. Turner. In reference to the question asked you by the gentle man from Nebraska, does not the American market send articles to you and pay the duty and Government charges on the arrival of the goods'? Mr. Wadson. E"o, sir; because goods shipped from America are bought or ordered, and we must pay the cost. The dealer in Bermuda pays to the Government the duty in Bermuda, as well as the other charges, and then puts on in addition what he can get for his profit. Mr. Payne. The articles you get from America you do not produce in Bermuda? Mr. Wadson. ISTo, sir. The Chairman. There is no home competition to make the price in- crease? Mr. Wadson. No, sir; it depends entirely upon the cost of produc- tion. The Chairman. Can you tell us how many bushels of potatoes you sent to the United States in 1892? Mr. Wadson. About 25,000 barrels, containing about 2 bushels and 3 pecks each. The Chairman. Have you any idea what is the home crop of j)ota- toes in this country? Mr. Wadson. No, sir; I have not; but it is very large. The Chairman. Our home crop of potatoes is over 200,000,000 bush- els a year, while yours is only about 75,000 bushels a year. Tliat im- I)ortation would not affect the market price here? Mr. Wadson. No, sir. The Chairman. How much onions do you produce? Mr. Wadson. We produced in 1892 .350,000 boxes, with not quite a bushel in each box. The Chairman. That would be, say, 300,000 bushels ; so that you sent us altogether (without meaning to refer to the smallness of your importations) not much more than some of our truck farmers in this country would produce? Mr. Wadson. That is right. The Chairman. You have 2,422 acres of land in cultivation in Ber- muda, and the price of that land is from $50 to $500 an acre, provided that it is good-producing, tillable land? Mr. Wadson. Tes, sir. The Chairman. Has there been any decrease in the value of land in recent years ? Mr. Wadson. I can not say. There has been a great want of de- sirable buyers. The Chairman. Land brings about the same price as before? Mr. Wadson. There does not seem to be the same sale for it as before. The Chairman. Ton gentlemen think that the Bermuda farmer has paid this $150,000 duty on the products sent to the United States in 1892? Mr. Wadson. Tes, sir. BERMUDA VEGETABLES. 621 The Ohaieman. Previous to the enactment of the McKinley bill, the same quantity of imported products would have paid a duty of $33,000 '? Mr. Wadson. Yes, sir. The Chairman. That woiihl be a tax of about $13 per acre upon your land, and the present rates, according to your estimates, would make a tax of $62.30 j)er acre? Mr. Wadson. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Do you think it reasonable that if your tax had been increased from $13 per acre to $6ii per acre that your land would maintain that salable value'? Mr. Wadson. This land, as I said before, is not now sought after as it was at that time ; but it is held at about the same price in hope of getti n g relief from this duty. If, hon'ever, it should happen that by reason of any peculiar circumstances any of that land should be sold, the result is very apparent, because, as I have already said, there is not the same demand for the land as there was, not by any means. While the land may be held at the same price, there is not the same opportunity to sell, and therefore I might say that during that time land has decreased, though not nominally. Mr. Payne. There are no sales ? Mr. Wadson. No, sir; because the land is being held in the hope of our getting some relief. Mr. Payne. Has the market value stiii'ened up any since the result of the last election in November last? Mr. Wadson. I do not follow that. Mr. Gear. What tariff do you levy on yourselves? Mr. Wadson. Our tariff is a tax for revenue only. Mr. Gear. You do not levy a tariff' on coal or iron? Mr. Watson. No, sir. Mr. Gear. The reason is that you do not produce them. Mr. Wadson. We do not. Mr. Gear. You levy a tariff on things you do jiroduce? Mr. Wadson. Yes, sir; such as breadstufifs, and provisions on which there is 5 per cent tariff. Mr. Gear. On nothing else? Mr. AVadson. On provisions and the goods which are named in this statement. Mr. Turner. Do yon send any vegetables to the old country? Mr. Wadson. We have done so. Mr. Turner. Do you not ship to France or other European countries ? Mr. Wadson. No, sir; we have made shipments to London, but the result has not been such as to encourage shipments. The Chairman. How do you settle this balance of trade between Bermuda and the United States? Mr. Wadson. The British Government has sent large sums of money there for the purpose of keejjing up fortifications and holding the gar- rison there, and of course some of our people live on means which are invested abroad, and there are visitors from abroad who spend some money with us. This makes up our balance of trade. Mr. Turner. When potatoes are $6 in New York what are they worth in Bermuda, as between your citizens ? Mr. Wadson. If they are worth $6 in New York they would be worth about $4.80 with us. Mr. Turner. Do you say that the tariff has the effect to lower the price of potatoes to your own citizens ? 622 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. Wadson. No, sir; we do not consume our own stock at all. We ship it to New York. Mr. Hopkins. You spoke about the price of land not falling and being held at present because j^ou hope for relief from the political changes in this country by reason of which the duties would be re- moved. Mr. Wadson. We hoped not so much on account of the changes of political parties in this country, but we thought that we would come before whatever party was in power and we would be heard and get a revision. Mr. Hopkins. You spoke in the early part of your remarks about making this application and receiving the permission of the British Government. In order to make this application for the removal of these duties, did your little government down there in Bermuda have to make application to the British Governmenf? Mr. Wadson. We are under the Government of England ; and while, as I have already stated, we have our own local government, which levies our taxes, collects our revenue, and spends our money, yet we are, of course, under the Government of England, and we are not at liberty to enact any legislation which might be at all opposed to the interests of the Empire, or do anything which the British Government might <;onstrue as opi^osed to it. Therefore, when we intend to enter into a conference with any nation we must first consult the British crown. In this way, we have been dispatched to this nation as dele- gates for the purpose I have stated. Mr. Gear. Your legislation is subject to the Queen in council'? Mr. Wadson. Yes, sir; I might say there never has been any inter- ference on the part of England unless we trespass upon the rights of the Crown. Mr. Hopkins. You represented to the Crown that the duties under the McKinley bill were burdensome to your people, and you asked permission to make this representation to the American Government, hoping that the duties would be removed, thereby giving you relief; and the British Government graciously granted you that authority? Mr. Wadson. Yes, sir. Mr. Hopkins. You sold as much while that bill was in effect, but you did not make as much money? Mr. Wadson. Ho, sir. Mr. Dalzbll. The McKinley bill will not keep out onions or pota- toes from this country? Mr. Wadson. I am afraid that we will have to send them to you. Mr. Turner. How does it aii'ect the purchase of American goods'? Mr. Wadson. We buy fewer goods. The smaller the balance of trade that is left to our farmers the smaller will be their purchases. j\lr. Hopkins. Do your statistics show the amount of goods sent to us since the McKinley bill has been in force? Mr. Burrows. Give them for 1892, as compared with 1890? Mr. Wadson. There is not much difference; they are about the same. In Bermuda everybody lives in hope. Mr. Bryan. Can you give us the average price of these products which you exported from Bermuda before and since the passage of the McKinley bill? Mr. Wadson. I can not give it to you now. Although prices in New York may be less than before the passage of the McKinley bill, yet it has resulted in a smaller demand, and it is not the result of a smaller duty, because, as I have claimed, the farmers of Bermuda pay this. BERMUDA VEGETABLES. 623 Mr. Brtan. And if the facts are in contravention of that theory, so much the worse for the facts? Mr. Wadson. I do not think that will be so found. I try to look at the facts in a truthful way. Mr. Bryan. Can you form any idea as to who paj's the duty, unless you knew the prices received before and after the passage of the MoKin- ieybillf Mr. Wadson. I think we can by the reasons I have given. It does not depend upon the cost of production. We have to take what we can get for our products. Mr. Bryan. If the tariff is added to the price the consumer pays, and that price is higher, does not the farmer receive the same amount as before? Mr. Wadson. The price paid depends upon the duty and the other (iharges. The duty is llrst deducted. I do not believe we sell for less. The duty makes the difference. It is because of sui^ply and demand. Mr. Turner. If your position be true, that j^our goods would sell for just the same in this country whether the goods were dutiable or not, then that duty can be 'of no benefit to the man raising like articles in this country? Mr. Wadson. ISTo, sir. Mr. Turner. The principle that the exporter pays the duty on per- ishable goods only applies to perishable goods? Mr. Wadson. I am not called upon to answer as to the goods after they are received here; I am talking about Bermuda alone. Mr. Dalzell. I do not understand that the gentlemen is advancing any facts; it is a condition and not a theory. Mr. Bryan. In the case of our exports, you say your people there pay the duty on them because they are of a perishable nature? Mr. Wadson. The imiiorter pays the duty and other charges. The dealer estimates what he will be able to sell them for, and he gets the profits out of the consumer if he can. Therefore, I say the consumer pays the duty. Mr. Bryan. So that the principle laid down by you is that the im- porter pays the duty only applies to perishable goods, and the larger the exportation the more he contributes to the foreign government to which he exports? Mr. Wadson. There is no doubt of it. Mr. Bryan. So that the more he exports the poorer he gets ? ■ Mr. Wadson. IsTot necessarily. Mr. Bryan. Tou say the price of your land has not fallen, but there is a dullness in real estate? Mr. Wadson. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Have you had any financial depression there? Mr. Wadson. There has been a financial depression. The people always feel the want of money Mr. Bryan. When they do not have it. Mr. Wadson. During the past two or three years the want of money has been more severely felt in other ways, because of this onerous taxation which takes our money. Mr. Bryan. Then you have had no financial depression except that which is due to this cause? Mr. Wadson. Our country is so small that it is of course not possible for you, gentlemen of the committee, to bring your ideas down to tlie scope of a population of 15,000. Everything is on such a small scale, 624 AGEICULTUEAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. and there is such a striking contrast between your situation and ours, that it is reasonable. Mr. Beyan. You do not know whether there has been any more iinancial depression in your country than in other countries? Mr. Mastees. There could not be. We have been down to bed rock all the time. Mr. Geae. Tou have no manufacturing industries of any kind in Bermuda? Mr. Wadson. 'So, sir. Mr. Geae. Do you import from the United States what you must have in the way of merchandise? Mr. Mastees. They only ship from this country what we order, and what we buy we are able to pay for. Mr. Geae. You are absolutely dependent upon other countries'? Mr. Wadson. Yes, sir. Mr. TuENEE. Can we not buy more potatoes from you if this duty be taken off ? Mr. Wadson. I hope so. Mr. TuENEE. Because prices would go down to the American con- sumer ? Mr. Wadson. Well, no ; but it would be because we would be better able to buy. Mr. TuENEE. You have steam communication with London? Mr. Wadson. We have; but it is not with any great regularity. Mr. TuENEE. The markets are better here than there? Mr. Wadson. Yes, sir. Mr. BUEEOWS. You think that we would not abstain from eating potatoes on account of the duty '? Mr. Wadson. I do not think you would. Mr. BuEEOWS. You do not think we would eat more? Mr. Wadson. I do not. Mr. Payne. I suppose you buy all your surjilus in this country, and if you get a larger price you would not raise more potatoes? Mr. Wadson. Perhaps so. Mr. Masters has already stated that pro- duction could not be increased on account of the small quantity of land available. I do not know that I can say much more in support of this question. I hope the committee will be prepared to take the matter under favor- able consideration, and I trust that the catechising I have received and the answers I have given to your questions will not prejudice you against us. Perhaps I do not understand the matter as well as you gentlemen here, and do not understand all the circumstances, but I have tiied to show that farmers of Bermuda pay the duty. The Ohaieman. We will try to consider the facts. Mr. Dalzell. You probably will not recognize them after they have been considered. Mr. Wadson. I do not know about that. I hojje, however, that your action will be favorable to Bermuda. HORSES. 625 HORSES. (Paragraph 217.) Washington, D. C, l^epiember 7, 1893. Sir : Since the passage of the McKinley bill, the tariff' on work stock> that is, horses and mules, has been placed at $30 per head (a special tax), which tax, previous to the enactment of the McKinley bill, was an ad valorem tax of 20 per cent, which amounted to $2 per head, as the standai'd price was an estimate of $10 per head. It willbe seen at once that this special tax of $30 per head, under the McKinley act, amounts to nothing less than a prohibitory measure — thus resulting in a great hardship upon all laboring classes in the Gulf States or cotton-raising States. This Mexican work stock was shipped and sold to the cotton pro- ducers of the entire South, not costing them exceeding the price of from $25 to $35 per head. Since that supply has been cut off from Mexico, by the McKinley bill the agricultural people are now paying for the same class of stock, notwithstanding the stringency of the money market, from $50 to $75 per head. This class of stock is far superior for the Southern agricultural people than that stock which is raised in the West and Northwest, for several reasons. The first is they do not go through acclimation, as they are raised in a southern latitude; there- fore, they are not subject to diseases that Western and Northwestern stock are subject to when brought Souiih — therefore they do not require any nursing the first year when brought South, as Western and North- western stock do. During the time of acclimation, a considerable per cent of the Western and Northwestern stock die, thereby entailing a loss of from $50 to $75 per head on each one lost on the agricultural people. Besides, while the Mexican stock do not die from acclimation, they are a very hardy stock that will subsist upon 50 per cent less of cost for food than the Western and Northwestern stock require, and will do more labor than the Western and Northwestern stock can do. You will see, therefore, at a glance of this statement of facts that, as a matter of national economy, it would be but following out the Dem- ocratic idea if this prohibitory tax was reduced to the original tax ($2 per head), thereby giving great relief to the laboring classes, who are now working cattle in shafts because of this supply having been cut off from them. The Government would derive a revenue annually on this horse stock alone of not less than a half million dollars. There were about 250,000 head of horse stock brought over from Mexico annually previous to the McKinley bill. Yours, very truly, . ^^^^ Graves. West Falmouth, Me., Scptemher 15, 1803. SiE: Heavy draft horses are mostly purchased here instead of being raised. The present duties compel the use of those bred West. Those have inferior constitutions, lacking adaptation to the raw climate of the Atlantic seaboard. The adjoining British provinces furnish much hardier animals, inured to exposure to weather so much severer than what they meet when brought here that no loss occurs, set off against 20 per cent by deaths and expenses in the Western product. Yours, respectfully, C. E. Clifford. T H 40 626 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. CATTIiH. (Paragraph 248.) Wednesday, Sepfcmder 13, 1893. STATEMEHT OF F. H. EOCKWELL, OF WABKEN, PA. Mr. Chairman : My object in coming before the committee was merely to bring to your notice the unfairness of the tax on cattle between the sections of this country north -and south, between Canada and Mexico. I am a manufacturer of lumber and leather, but appear on behalf of the cattle business. Up to the time that the last duty was put on, when the McBanley bill went into effect, it was an ad valorem duty. At that time I think it was about 20 per cent. The specific duty was $10 per head, which excludes entirely the Mexican cattle from being driven across the border. The tax is nearly the full value of the cattle when they get across ; whereas, on the other hand, the cattle that come from Canada are principally fatted for the cities of Boston and New York, and can afford to stand that specific duty. Another feature to which I wish to call attention of the committee is that the cattle which are brought from Mexico are raised by Americans on American capital. 1 do not know of any Americans in that business at all ; whereas, in the case of Canada it is of a foreign interest. The Mexican steer, when he gets across the border, has to be taken to Kansas or Nebraska and fed. Corn in Mexico is worth 2 cents a pound, and they can not afford to feed it to cattle. It helps to make up the food of the country. Up to the time of the McKinley bill the balance of trade was in favor of the United States, I think in 1889 and 1890 to the sum of $571,000 on cattle and hogs. Since then the trade has ceased, as the tax is so high it is prohibitive entirely on cattle coming across. It really dis- criminates between Canada and Mexico in favor of Canada. A great many of the people who are feeding cattle in Mexico were men who were originally in Arizona, and who moved across the line. Mr. Payne. Your idea is that Canada can afford to pay duty, and Mexico can not on account of the difference in the cattle? Mr. EooKWELL. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynum. What is the value per head of the cattle which come across the line"? Mr. EocKWELL. I do not think they will exceed $15. Mr. Bynum. They are fatted cattle ready for the Eastern market which come from Canada? • Mr. EocKWELL. They are raised, grown, and fed there for that market. That is not the case in Mexico, as corn is worth 2 cents a pound. Mr. Payne. All kinds of cattle come from Canada? Mr. Rockwell. I presume so. Mr. Payne. Under the ad valorem duty the undervaluation did not amount to much? Mr. EoGKWELL. The most cattle that we ever imported from Mexico was $13,960 worth. Mr. Dalzell. Did the McKinley bill advance the duty as well as change the value? Mr. EocKWELL. It advanced the duty on Mexican cattle three or four times over; but I don't tliink it did with Canadian cattle. MACARONI. 627 Mr. Btnum. Is not the administrative bill sufficient to cover that? Mr. EocKWELL. We feel that it is a discrimination between Ameri- cans in Mexico and Canadians. Mr. Dalzell. Is this gentleman for whom you appear an American °! Mr. EocKWELL. Yes, sir ; he is a graduate of Cornell University. He joined with me in the cattle business. He started in Arizona and feed gave out. Mr. TuENEK. Do you raise horses ? Mr. EoCKWELL. No, sir; only for our own use. Mr. Ttjrnbk. The duty of $30 a head on horses has exterminated that trade? Mr. EOCKWELL. I should judge so. There are no horses in that country on account of the raids of the Indians. They have driven all the horses out. Mr. Turner. That State of Sonora is up the Eio Grande? Mr. EociavELL. That is south of Toonibstone, Ariz. I would like to impress upon the committee the fact that we do not like to be dis- criminated against. MACARONI. (Pamgraph 258.) Wednesday, September 6, 1893. STATEMENT OF A. J. TOOMEY. Mr. Chairman : I am treasurer and secretary of the Columbia Manu- facturing and Importing Company, formerly called the Columbia Maca- roni Company, doing business in New York City, having their principal offices there, and also their factory, incorporated under the laws of the State of New Jersey. We are, I think, the first Americans to manufac- ture macaroni in this country, a great many of the other manufactories being mostly naturalized Italians, a few Frenchmen, and within the past year or so, quite a number of other American concerns have started up throughout the country, but in New York and in the East in fact we are the only ones. I have not been able in the short time since I applied for this hearing to get statistics from all over the States, because there are factories in nearly every State in the Union, so I could give you anything definite in actual figures, nor have I got the statistics to show whether the importations of macaroni have increased or decreased since the Mc- Kinley bill was imposed. I think tliey are about normal, but I am not going to claim that the beneficial effect of the tariff is the only thing that has increased the consumjption or manufacture of macaroni to the extent I expect to show you it has increased in the last four or five years. Macaroni, as you know, is a product solely of wheat, or at least ought to be. It is the staple food of the Italians. The Italians are macaroni eaters just as the Chinese are rice eaters. In Italy, I believe 90 per cent of the tood used there is macaroni. Now every shipload of emigrants which comes over here brings many hundreds of macaroni eaters. They are distributed throughout the land and we all know what the history of our immigration within the last few years is and have been impressed with the number of Italians who have come to this country. They are not only Italians who are consumers of macaroni in this country but the Anierican peo- 628 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. pie are very rapidly acquiring the macaroni habit, and it is like chew- ing gum, when you once get this habit it is hard to drop it. It is not only considered a luxury, but it is now recognized throughout the country as one of the healthiest foods and it is really cheaper than meat or bread, therefore it is not at all to be wondered at that the consump- tion should have increased very enormously. Now, we use in this country in the manufacture of macaroni about 5,000,000 bushels of wheat. It is not enough to boast of as a percentage in the four or five hundred millions of crop as far as the farmers are concerned, but I venture to say there are very few of those people who are interested in the raising of wheat who know what macaroni is. Tliey all know about Yankee Doodle, and I think that is as far as their knowledge goes ; but I am not here to deplore their ignorance in this respect. But I really think people know so little about it I should explain to the ordinary observer what an imijortaut article it is. I know I have seen on Delmouico's bill of fare macaroni as a vegetable, but I think the business men of the country, the wholesale merchants, are getting to understand what it is, as one of the concerns has started a factory out ia the ISTorthwest and we have had applications for stock in our concern from some of the largest wholesale grocers in the east. I think there about 2,000 factories in this country. That is a conserva- tive estimate, but I would like to qualify the word factory in this way. Macaroni is manufactured on a small scale by a great number of Ital- ians wherever there is a mining town or they are building a railroad, such a place as Halzleton, Pa., and up in the mining regions where there are twenty or thirty factories. I am not here in their interest alone. I simply am here to represent the manufacturers on the larger scale. In New York City, Brooklyn, Hoboken, and the vicinity around there are twelve large factories. Six of these have started up in the last three years, iuLluding ours; one, an Italian, has doubled the capacity of his factory. Three years ago he started a company and built a factory that would cost over $100,000 in New York City, but he told me the other day he had abandoned the idea for fear of a change in the tariff, and was going to turn the building into a flour mill. These large factories turn out about 200,000 pounds of maccaroni weekly, or say 10,000,000 pounds a year. That is right in New York City alone, and that is equal to 250,000 bushels of wheat. Then there are other cities, such as Pittsburg, Cincinnati, Philadelphia, where there are, I suppose, a dozen factories. San Francisco and down in New Orleans there are large factories outside of those, and I think if I claim the rest of the States manufacture twenty times as much maccaroni as we do in New York I will not be out of the way in my statement. Twenty times 250,000 bushels of wheat would amount to 5,000,000 bushels of wheat that I claim goes into it. Mr. Dalzbll. How old is that industry? Mr. TooMEY. There was a manufactory started twenty- five years ago by an Italian in Brooklyn, I think, who manufactured macaroni and charged 25 cents a pound for it. It is now selling at 5 cents a poimd, but since I have been in New York it has only had its first big impetus and start within the last four or five years. It got its great impetus from the consumption by the Italian immigrants, and Americans going abroad got educated to it. The French and Italians educated them up to it; so I say the industry is practically only about five years old as an important industry, and I think since the tariff' has been put on it has increased about 300 per cent. MACARONI. 629 Mr. Dalzell. It came in free before the McKinley bill. Mr. TooMET. No ; there was a duty, I think, of a cent a pound be- fore the McKinley bill. The Chairman. ]Sr(^; it was free. Mr. TooMEY. I was not well posted on that because previous to the McKinley bill 1 had no interest in it. The Chairman. You say it got its greatest impetus four or five years ago? Mr. TooMEY. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Then it got it while it was on the free list? Mr. TooMEY. The consumj)tion by these Italians gave it this great impetus. The Chairman. You say there were large factories in existence four or five years ago ? Mr. TooMEY. 'So, sir; there were not large factories in existence then. I am a flour and grain merchant; that is my regular business, and as an outlet for the product of the mills I handle goods for in New York I naturally skirmished around everywhere, and I found a few small macaroni manufacturers who bought flour, and five years ago there was only one man in New York using a good deal of flour, using, say, 300 barrels a week. Since the tariff was put on he has doubled his factory; he is building another around the corner; he is the per- son I alluded to just now who was extending the building which is a $100,000 factory Mr. Burrows. That is, since the act of 1890? Mr. TooMEY. Yes, sir. There is one thing about the macaroni industry as it existed before the tariff. Macaroni can only be made here properly from the farina of wheat that is granulated and not pul- verized in the flour; if not it will not make what we call macaroni at all. These Italian manufacturers, who were in existence before the tariff of 2 cents was imposed, only made this cheap macaroni. They made it out of the cheap grades of flour, second and third grades and the offal, and that macaroni was sold throughout the country at actually much lower prices than the imported macaroni, which was made from the very highest grade of hard wheat, and of that wheat only the best part of it which is granulated. The starchy part which pulverizes into flour and makes the macaroni pastry is not good for it, but as soon as the tariff' was put on we started, and we make macaroni that competes in quality with that of the imported. For instance, to give you a case in point, we are exporting some of this macaroni to some oftbe Spanish-American countries, such as Mexico and the United States of Colombia. We have orders continually from Colon, and ship a great deal to Porto Eico, that we have obtained since the reciprocity treaty went into effect. Now, the price down there — the Spanish maca- roni is not quite as good as the other — is $6 per quintal, 100 j)ounds, and the American price is $8. There is a duty down there amounting to about the duty here. We also ship a little to Cuba, but we can not get in there very well, although the same reciprocity treaty obtains, because the duty in Cuba is payable in Spanish gold and we pay 50 per cent ad valorem, and the ad valorem in those countries are fixed prices made by the Government, it is not an ad valorem on the invoice. In Porto Eico it is also 50 per cent, but the duty is payable in Mexican dollars and that brings it down about 3 cents a pound. Mr. Gear. The Mexican dollars are at a discount? Mr. TooMEY. Yes, sir; I think the last we sold was at 67 cents. The main point in everything, of course, is the raw material and the cost 630 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. of production. Now, if we come to the raw material first I will show you we are on equal basis with Italy and France. I will not claim Spain, because we import no Spanish macaroni here. We grow the finest Avheat in the world in this country, and we shij) it all over the world, but there is only one wheat that is grown here that is adapted to the manufacture of macaroni, and that is No. 1 hard wheat, No. 1 hard Duluth, or No. 1 hard Minneapolis, whose qualifications are when it is ground, after the cylinders pass over it, it will granulate a flinty matter and form a harsh kind of meal, and have very little pul- verized matter or starch. It is the only wheat that will compete with the imported. Thi s wheat, unfortunately for us, is so widely appreciated by our millers throughout tlie Northwest, Bufialo, and New Y'ork city, and elsewliere, tliat the price of it is just 5 to 7 cents a bushel over the price of ordinary grade of wheat we export. Take No. 2 red soft wheat, wliich is absolutely unsuitable for macaroni. Our No. 1 north- ern hard wheat is only fairly good. The Tagenrok Eussiau wheat is largely used, also Algerian wheat, and a fiint wheat grown in Italy; I have forgotten the name. These wheats are really cheaper right at Genoa or Naples than our No. 1 hard wheat at the seaboard, and the proof of that is that sometime ago some of our manufacturers in New York city, Italian manufacturers who had been using flour pre- viously, im])orted farina from Genoa. You notice flour and wheat are protected, but fiirina comes in under the free list. The countries were in such shape abroad and these wheats so cheap that we could import this, so in raw material we are practically on an even basis. Mr. Turner. What elements of the wheat do you use in making macaroni? Mr. TooMEY. We use all of the wheat except the skin and the part between the skin and the kernel, which is the part which goes into what is called "middlings," for feeding purposes. Mr. Turner. You remove the husk or shell? Mr. TooMET. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. How would you consider macaroni so much more wholesome than bread? Mr. Toomey. Because of the way it is made. The claim is made that people throughout the country of late years have deteriorated because they have used too much starch, and used patent flour, and shipped the baking flour to Europe. We ship all the glutinous portion to the other side. We think our trade is exclusively an American trade, and we do not export at all, except what we call the by-product, that is, macaroni which gets spoiled in the process of manufacture. Mr. Payne. What does it sell for by the pound? Mr. Toomey. On the article we sell it is 7 cents, put up in pound packages. The American trade uses 95 iier cent pound packages. Mr. Payne. In bulk what does it sell for? Mr. Toomey. In what quantities ? Mr. Payne. Not in pound packages; in bulk? Mr. Toomey. It sells at about 6 cents in bulk. Mr. Payne. Do you know whether Italy contracts to pay a bounty of about a cent a pound on exports? Mr. Toomey. I have a letter from Mr. Fabrici, an Italian manufact- urer, in New York, a man who has been in business there for a long time. Most of the Italian manufacturers are people who do not speak English very well, and it is very hard to get them to come and give the facts, but this man is very clever, and he writes: KACARONI. 631 National MACABO^fI Company, Neip York, Sepieniber S, 189S. Gentlemen: Referring to our interview to-day, Tve would say we would cooperate with you in your eiforts before the Ways aud Means Committee to represent the in- terests of the maycaroni manufacturers in the matter of the tariff. As we are all well aware, the wages in Italy are so extremely low in the macaroni manufacture, being about 50 cents per day for men and 15 cents per day for women, that the present duty of 2 cents per pound is a. just protection. The Italian Government, as you know, gives a rebate on all paste exported, so that we must contend with this as well as with the starvation wages already mentioned. Another jjoint is the strong prejudice against domastic macaroni, which, if it were not for the duty, we could not overcome. In conclusion, we are an American company, using American wheat, and giving employment to persons coming to this country. We believe that any reduction in the present tariff would compel irs to close our factory, and see the eiforts of the past year entirely destroyed. If we had more time we would be glad to enter fully iuto statistics and cover the (question more deeply and broadly, but, brieflj^ stated, the above points are the main ones at issue. You may use this letter as you see fit, and if we can aid you in your efforts further will be glad to do so. Yours, truly, National Macaroni Co., G. M. Baxos, Secretary. Nov, I have taken as the basis of the wages I quoted i)aid in Italy the statement made to me by Mr. Fabrici, who was a manufacturer over there, and the statement made by the other Italian manufacturer and the statement made to me last week by some of our help. We have considerable Italian help. The men are mostly Italians, and common rumor now wojild confirm the wages. I have increased them a little, to be on a conservative basis. Mr. Payne. What do you pay for wages'? Mr. TooMET. We have reduced our pay roll because of the present financial depression, and we find people who are importers apprehen- sive the tariff would be altered who say it would no longer pay them to buy from us. So, during the summer season, as there is little or no consumption in the summer, we are obliged to reduce our pay roll some- what, and I think, I claim, we are the only people in this country who have superior machinery. Our machinery is manufactured after the style of the French mills ; we use double cylinders instead of single, and we use machinery of the most improved kind. Our superintendent has made a study of the manufacture in France. We are progressive in this industry, and we have ai^jjlied everything he has suggested, and I know in some factories it must cost them easily twice as much to turn out macaroni as it does us. Our wages lately, taken from the jiay roll which I have here with me, have run about as high as $300 a week. That does not include wages for fireman, engineer, clerks, or anything of that kind. We sublet our power Mr. Payne. How much a day is that for each man? Mr. TooMEY. That would average about $10 a week. That includes only the workmen up there and some boys we use for nailing. We only get three or four able-bodied men for hard work and some boys, so that the prices would hardly average. We pay one man $2.") a weelv, another $15 a week, and another $18 a week. Those are the kind of wages we pay. Mr. Payne. What do you pay the boys? Mr. TooMBY. Six, $7, $8, $9, and $10 a week. Mr. Payne. That is , since the reduction 'i Mr, TooMEY. Yes, sir. 632 AGRICULTUEAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. Payne. How much percentage of reduction did you make? Mr. TooMBY. About 10 per cent. Mr. Tarsney. You say there are other men engaged in the business and it costs them twice as much as it does you? Mr. TooMEY. Yes, sir. Mr. Tarsnby. Are they making anything? Mr. TooMET. I would not like to cast aspersions on my neighbors, and their methods perhaps of making a profit sometimes we would not care to resort to. Mr. Tarsney. If the cost of production to the others is double, it fol- lows they are losing money or you making a good deal of money? Mr. TooMEY. They are losing money; they are continually going into bankruptcy or quitting and changing their name and not being- heard of any more. Mr. Payne. How many barrels of flour a year do you use? Mr. Toomey. We use the equivalent to about 90 barrels of flour a week. Mr. Payne. How many concerns do you say are engaged in the bus- iness now? Mr. Toomey. In the country I said there are about 2,000 factories, but some of them are very small concerns; but there are in New York and vicinity 12 factories practically on the same basis where the aver- age would be about the same, 90 barrels a week. Mr. Payne. It was stated in 1890 that there were 58 concerns. Mr. McMiLLiN. What was the percentage of the reduction in your wage list? Mr. Toomey. About 10 per cent. Mr. McMiLLiN. Thatwassincethepresentrateof duty was imiiosed? Mr. Toomey. That reduction was simply the condition of the pres- ent state of financial affairs. Mr. Payne. When was it made? Mr. Toomey. About two or three weeks ago — I think about three weeks ago. Mr. Dalzell. I understood you to say it was on account of the pres- ent financial depression? Mr. Toomey. That had a good deal to do with it. Mr. Payne. Were you aware there was a duty up to 1883 of about 30 per cent? Mr. Toomey. There was very little macaroni consumed in the country then. Mr. Payne. And even the tariff of 1846 had a 25 per cent duty. Mr. Toomey. I think I stated a while ago that outside of Yankee Doodle very few people knew anything about macaroni. Mr. Payne. It was put on the free list in 1883. Mr. Gear. You made your reduction when? Mr. Toomey. About the first of August we reduced our plant. We have 26 girls earning on an average f 4.26 on the present basis. The Chairman. Are they all Italians? Mr. Toomey. No, sir; the girls are some Italian, Irish- American, and Grermau-American. We get girls from the neighborhood. The figures I have quoted just now, a factory of the same force in Italy which takes 16 men would be $40, $2.50 a week each, and 23 girls, $18.40 a week, would be the diflerence between $258 that we pay and $58 that they pay, or a diflerence of $200 in a week. Now, in that I have not included at all, as I say, what would cost us for our steam and firing, which costs at least $50 a week. Taking 30 per cent MACARONI. 633 off that, making it $35, that -would be a cent a pound on the 17,500 pounds we run out in a week. Mr. Taksney. Two cents a pound will be equivalent to what ad va- lorem"? Mr. TooMET. I think 33 per cent on the average price of the goods coming in, but I have here the i^rice list- Mr. Tarsney. If there was 30 per cent duty under the act of 1883- Mr. Payne. There was no duty in 1883 or prior to the 35 per cent. Mr. Tarsney. If there was a 35 per cent duty prior to 1883, why is it this trade received this stimulas under the McKinley bill"? Mr. TooMEY. For the reason I tried to explain, on account of the extraordinary increase in the consumption of macaroni. Mr. Tarsney. The increased trade increased with the character of the population which consumed it! Mr. TooMEY. And the education of the Americans to a point where they became very heavy macaroni consumers. As I say, we have not got a single Italian customer except for our refuse, and all the macaroni we sell goes to the American wholesale grocer, who sells to the retail grocers in pound packages, and that goes to the American people altogether. When I say Americans I mean everybody except the Italians ; they never buy it in pound-package form. They do not like to pay that extra cent for the package. Mr. Gear. They buy it in bulk? Mr. TooMBY. Yes, sir. Mr. Burrows. Have you a statement of the wages paid in Italy? Mr. ToOMEY. Tes, sir, Mr. Burrows. Have you made a statement covering that? Mr. ToOMBY. Yes, sir. Now, on the quantity we turn out this differ- ence of §200 makes a cent and a quarter after counting half a cent a pound for steam power. That is for the wages simply in it, not count- ing coal. In Italy they have this advantage of climate that they can dry their goods in the open air, and I believe there are factories in Nervi, outside of Naples, where the government gives some kind of a rebate on the land, and they are under some extraordinary good con- ditions compared to paying rents in New York. Mr. McMiLLiN. What are those conditions 1 Mr. TooMEY. We pay very high rents in New York; higher, possibly, than most other cities throughout the Union, and I should think it would be five times as much as they pay in Italy. Their factories are spread out regardless of space; they are put up on lands which are not arable — I think what they call " communal lands;" but leaving thai out of the question I do not believe they could possibly pay anything like the rents we have to pay in this country. Mr. MoMiLLiN. Is it not a fact that most of the factories are located outside of New York and do not pay the rent to which you allude ? Mr. TooMEY. No, sir; all the factories I have alluded to — ^I am not making any specific statement as to these smaller factories througliout the country — but the twelve factories in New York are in the heart of the city or Brooklyn. Mr. GoCKRAN. Where is your factory in New York ? Mr. TooMEY. It is at the corner of Jane and West streets. Mr. Stevens. And they are located there because you (jan get this labor much cheaper than you can in the country ? Mr. TooMBY. Wo could not i)0ssibly obtain any labor in the country. 634 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. Stevens. That more than counterbalances the rents and ex- penses? Mr. TooMBY. And also the facilities for shipping. In Italy the local rates from Nervi to Naples would not amount to half a ceut a case. Mr. Turner. In this process of making macaroni is there much man- ual slciU and experience necessary? Mr. XooMEY. Yes, sir; considerable. There is more manual labor than macliinery labor. Mr. Turner. Is there much expensive machinery in the establish- ment! Mr. TOOMEY. Yes, sir; our plant cost us over $20,000; that is, ma- chinery alone. Mr. Turner. What is the process? Do you treat the glutinous sub- stance with anything but water? Mr. TooMEY. We take the seminal or farina as it comes and then mix that with water at a boiling point, then it is thoroughly kneaded by machinery, which has one man to superintend it. It is then cut into large chunks of dough, put into vertical cylinders that look somethiug like a gatling gun, and heavy pressure — 1,000 pounds to the square inch, I believe — is brought to bear on them by a piston, and this forces the macaroni out in pipes down below. There ends the ijrocess as far as machinery labor is concerned. The rest is simply the question of gentle and delicate handling. It is a very brittle thing, and it must be kept intact and in pretty form, and all that has to be taken upstairs by boys, who spread it out nicely for the gu'ls to pack, and the packing is an important part. This duty of 2 cents a pound is on the net cost of the macaroni. The macaroni we compete with comes here in pound paclfages, and the cost of the package is a great deal againt us, the cost of the case. Although our wood is so much cheaper than abroad the cost of the case is great deal more here on account of the wages paid to the" box-makers. In fact, I was down in Cuba this spring, and in one of the factories I happened to be I asked the man where he got his cases, and he said, " I get them from Mr. Diaz." He was a man who was doing a big shipping business in spruce lumber, and I asked him what price he got for those cases, and he said 13 cents apiece. We pay 12 cents right in New York. Mr. Turner. What would your goods sell for if the tariff was taken off. What price would you be forced to take if we removed the duty of 2 cents a pound on these goods ? Mr. TooMEY. I think if the whole tariff would be taken off we would have to sell for about a cent a pound or less. There is this thing about it Mr. Turner. How do you make that estimate, according to the price prevailing on the other side? Mr. TooMBY. We do not obtain as high prices, duty paid, as the for- eign shippers do, for the reason tliat they, in order to get in at a little lower price, degraded their goods by using adulterants, while the Ameri- can public has not had time Mr. Turner. I would like to call your attention to the point- Mr. Eeed. Let him finish the statement he is making there. It seems to be an important point. Mr. Turner. If it will gratify the gentleman from Maine I will not interpose. Mr. Eeed. I will be very much obliged. Mr. TooMEY. I was going to rem irk, the American public, in the short time we have been manufacturing, have not yet been able to MACARONI. 635 appreciate that we can make anything American as good as the imported article. Now, we can not obtain as liigh prices for our goods, which we claim are better than the imported, on this account. Mr. Eeed. Why is that? Mr. Toojmey. This is a question of prejudice, and if we can get along to a point where we can spread our goods throughout the country and have them known, and have them proven to be what we chiim they are — we using the raw material as good as theirs and we using as good water in this country — then we can get as much as the imjiorters for their goods. Mr. Gear. Do you brand your goods with the American name? Mr. ToOMEY. All our goods we put out UTider our brand are bi-auded with the American name, but in some cases we have labels translated in French or Italian. That does not say they are made in France or Italy. Mr. GocKEAN. Creating that impression? Mr. ToOMBY. It leaves an innjression they are foreign goods. Mr. Turner. I would like to resume the examination, if I may be permitted, at the point you axe just now. The effect of the tariff has been to degrade the foreign goods somewhat? Mr. TooMBY. Somewhat — yes, sir. Mr. Turner. When they met and competed with you? Mr. TooMBY. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. Now, assuming the foreign goods had remained at the same high quality which they had when the tariff went into effect, what would be the difference in your prices if the tariff' was now taken off', supposing the goods were on the same grade as when this started? It would be about this difference of 2 cents a pound, would not it? Mr. TooMBY. Assuming we had. absolutely overcome the preju- dice on American goods, we would have to get down to a little under 6 cents a pound in pound packages, and the lowest which we have been able to get down to up to the present, even with the low prices of raw material now ruling, has been 7 cents. Therefore at the lowest esti- mate we would have to reduce a cent a pound, grade for grade. Mr. Gear. Would you have to reduce your wages to accomplish that? Mr. TooMEY. If we did not reduce our wages that much we would simply have to go out of business, becauss we could not do business at the present rate of wages ; we would have to do that. You wiU see the same names of employes through this book since we started. We told them that times were hard, and also we did not know whether tbe business could continue or not, and they have accepted this reduced scale of wages and Mr. Turner. What class of consumers use your goods; are they wealthy people or plain people of the country? Mr. TooMEY. Both, indiscriminately. Mr. Turner. Is the article going into very general use? Mr. TooMEY. Yes, sir; you will lind it among the cheapest of grocery stores from First and Second avenue in New York, if you are acquainted with the character of those concerns there, and on the other hand such stores as Park & Tilford keei> it in stock, and it is used largely by every- body. It is the workiugmau's food. Mr. Gear. If the tariff' is not disturbed, you will probably reiistab- lish the wages paid on the old basis? Mr. TooMEY. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. Your men understand that? 636 AGEICULTUEAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. TooMET. Tes, sir; they understand that. Mr. Turner. And the effect of the tariff, then, has been not only to stimulate the production of this class of food products, but it has been to add 2 cents a pound to the consumer ? Mr. TooMET. No, sir. Mr. Turner. I mean grade for grade, as you stated just now? Mr. Toojviey. No. Previous to any American competition — and it is a very easy thing to go down in prices, but it is very hard to go up — previous to the imposition of the tariff there was no imported macaroni bought by wholesale grocers imder 9J cents a pound. We are now tak- ing the grade of the American package, the same as the French arti- cle, and to-day they can buy the goods at 8 cents a pound. Of course we have had a reduction of the raw material ; wheat is chea]3er now than ever before. The importers and buyers here are keen enough to say, "Here is a tariff bill coming on and American factories starting up," and many a fellow comes and jews prices down, and you are never able to get them up, so that really to-day macaroni is much cheaper than before the imiiosition of the tariff. Mr. Turner. It has been so on the other side, has it not? Mr. TooMEY. Yes, sir. Whether their prices have gone down to their consumers more than was consistent with the reduction of raw mate- rial or not I am not prepared to say. I know nothing at all about that. There is one other single thing 1 would like to call attention to, and that is the prejudice to American goods. We have been manufacturing macaroni for two years, and when we got a foothold we thought we would like to get some Army and Navy Government contracts. They are right around our corner there, and I know those people well and have sold them flour. In their advertisement they state that prefer- ence will be given to goods of American manufacture, and we bid on it, and the Columbia Macaroni Company has always been turned down. The last time we put a bid in it was accepted all right, but we did not get the contract on account of a little informality in the papers ; but a contract will be given out this week which we shall probably obtain. It takes a long time to get people to appreciate that we have good American goods. You see, a man making macaroni is identified with Italy right away. I am a member of the New York Produce Exchange, and I had to put up with a good deal facetiousness on the part of my col- leagues for a long time when I entered into the enterprise. They could not understand how a man of my nationality could be a macaroni-man- ufacturer; and my jjartner is also a member of the Produce Exchange. Another ]iarty — it is a stock company and he owns part of the stock — is a member of the New York Produce Exchange and also one of the biggest pork packers in Chicago. We have made no money out of this, and in this statement of wages we have not put officers' salaries. I am secretary and treasurer of the company, and I think I have received $15 or $20 for attending directors' meetings in the last two years. I have had a great deal of work to do, and my partner has not got a cent. Our superintendent, who is a practical man and manufacturer, gets $25 a week. So there is no inflated wages there, and our salesmen have not got rich off the establishment. We have spent a good deal of inoncy in this thing, and we would like to see some money come back. We have got $50,000 tied up in it. Now, as a side show, outside of the regular business, that is a good deal to have, and while we have not begun to feel the piemonitory pangs of starvation from fear of the tariff being taken off, it is not a comfortable feeling to have it struck MACARONI. 637 down, and with it our hard earnings, and that what could have been made a "good business should be wiped out. The Chairman. You were speaking just now about a bounty being allowed by the Italian Government on exports of macaroni. Mr. TooMBY. Tes, sir. The Chairman. The letter you read spoke of it as a rebate. Mr. TooMEY." It might be a difference Avithout a distinction. In France the rebate is simply a drawback, like we have here on goods that are in bond aiid manufactured and go out, but in Italy they use their own Italian wheat. That wheat, not being imported, can not bo called a rebate; it is a bounty. The Chairman. The word in the letter was "rebate." Mr. ToOMEY. The letter was written very hurriedly, I will say. Mr. Payne. It was stated before the committee in 1890 there was a bounty of 2J francs to the 100 kilos, which was stated amoiinted to half a cent a pound. The Chairman. I understood you to say the cost or price of the imported macaroni before this tariff was imposed was 9 to 10 cents a pound. Mr. TooMEY. Nine to 9J cents; I am not prepared to give you exact figures of the cost to the importer, but that is the price charged to the wholesale grocer. The Chairman. I find in the report of the Treasury Department the average price for 1889 was 5J cents a pound. Mr. TooMEY. That is a different article. I am alluding to the French style of macaroni; that is macaroni consumed by the Americans. Seventy-five per cent of the macaroni comes here in bulk. That maca- roni comes from Italy, and is sold to-day at — I have the price cnrrent here — 5J cents a pound. They charge $1.75 for a supposed 2o-pound case, containing generally 23J pounds, but we do not compete with that. The Chairman. The price of the foreign macaroni was 5 J cents in 1889 and 5.2 cents in 1890. ]^ow you are getting the raw material — wheat and flour — cheaper than before the McKinley bill was passed? Mr. Toomey. Yes, sir. The Chairman. You say macaroni has become more extensively the food of the workingman of this country? Mr. Toomey. Yes, sir. The Chairman. And your object in coming here is to continue this 2 cents a pound on the food of the workingman of the country? Mr. Toomey. No, sir; it is not. I come here and ask you to retain 2 cents a pound, so we can exist, so we can give the employment that we do, and so we can produce a cheap food. I still contend that mac- aroni is cheaper to-day to the workman than before the duty was put on. Mr. McMiLLiN. Has th6 duty caused that? Mr. Toomey. Yes, sir; the duty caused an enormous competition in this country. Mr. McMiLLiN. How is the duty to help you to pay higher wages? Mr. Toomey. The duty has caused a competition throughout this country, and though the profits may be small, still we can live. Now, the exporters from the other side have been obliged to reduce their prices on account of the tariff. If they want to come in at all, and they manage to come in now on account of the prejudice in favor of their goods, but if there is a great big difference between the price of the 638 AGKICTJLTUEAL PEODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. American goods and imported goods, I think a great many people would swallow their prejudices. Mr. CocKEAN. Together Vvith the food'? Mr. TooMBT. I contend, further, Mr. Wilson, our jjrice of 7 cents has absolutely no bearing on the price you have quoted there which is the Italian macaroni in bulk, and I also contend, still further, that the price is not an accurate one. I have seen this over and over again. There has been trouble in New York over it. Mr. Payne. That is the Treasury report, not the market report. Mr. TooMET. The great point I want to make is, there is 2 cents a pound on the macaroni, but there is no duty at all on the packing, and the goods we compete with are all package goods. I have here the price current of Austin, Nichols & Co., and they quote French macaroni at lOf and 11 cents, Italian macaroni at 9J, Monarch, our American, 9 cents, and so on. Mr. Tabsnby. What does your macaroni sell for in the United States of Colombia and Mexico in the equivalent of our money? Mr. TooMEY. I am not aware what price it brings. We get orders from commission houses. The only place we export to direct is Porto Eico, and we get 5f cents a pound for that macaroni, which is a special grade. Mr. Payne. Is this grade sent to Porto Eico a cheaper grade? Mr. TooMEY. It is a gTade that has to be saturated with saffron. Mr. Hopkins. The macaroni you speak of is sent to Porto Eico is not the grade of macaroni you sell here for 7 cents ? Mr. ToojVTEY. It is the same grade, but it is put up in bulk; the dif- ference in price is the package, and they use the small pieces. Mr. Payne. What tio you mean — the broken pieces? Mr. ToojMEY. Yes; they use vermicelli and small pieces. Mi^CARONI. (Paragraph 258.) New York, September 10, 1893. Sin : Our attention has been called to the report of Mr. A. J. Too- mey's argument before your honorable committee to try and have the present duty of 2 cents per pound on imported macaroni continued. We beg to call your attention that this tax is most unjust; it is really depriving poorer classes of our people from obtaining the best worth for their money. Imported macaroni is made from hard Eussian wheat, and is in every way vastly superior to the American. When cooked, in fact, it is really as different as good is from bad. The present tariff is equivalent to about 35 per cent ad valorem. Surely this is too much protection when the people hope to see neces- sary and especially food products reduced to reasonable prices. If reported correctly, the domestic manufacturers stated that they are selling to foreign countries — as, for instance, Mexico and Colombia. If they can compete with the European manufacturers in those coun- tries, why can not they do so here? If they can not sell here, as they state, unless with a 2 cent per pound protection, how can they meet the foreign manufacturer there? And if they can compete there, why not here? Macaroni is an article of cheap and wholesome food for the entire people, and we respectfully RICE. 639 ask that it be placed as it was for seven years before the McKinley bill went into effect — that is, on the free list. Please also take note that, besides the 2 cents duty now imposed, there is the freight and marine insurance against the imported article. This amounts to three-fourths of a cent more; therefore the protection is now 2| cents, which ought to be abolished. Eespectfully, yours, A. Stephani & Co, BICE. (Paragiaph 261.) STATEMENT OF MR. JOHN A. HUBBARD, OF NEW ORLEANS. Me. Chairman and Gentlemen op the Committee: As a rice planter and as a representative of the Board of Trade of the city of New Orleans, I beg leave to submit the following facts and figures relative to the rice industry of the State of Louisiana. In the last few years the rice industry ias grown in magnitude in our State beyond our most sanguine expectations. Formerly its culti- vation was restricted to two river parishes, Plaquemines and Lafourche, and to-day it is an important crop in twenty-five parishes. It is culti- vated upon the sandy parishes of the east, the alluvial bottoms of the Mississippi Eiver, and its outlying bayous, and the prairies of southwest Louisiana. The large increase of production in the prairie section has been due mainly to the influx of Western farmers who applied their knowledge of improved implements in the growing of wheat to the cultivation and harvesting of the rice crop. By the extensive use of gang and riding plows, harrows, seeders, harvesters, etc., the price of growing this cereal has been materially reduced and has caused an increased acreage in the prairies with slight diminution in the alluvial lands: The total area devoted to rice in Louisiana is about 200,000 acres, grow- ing last year a total crop of about 2,250,000 sacks of rough rice, or 225,000,000 pounds of clean rice. This industry employs about 20,000 men and supports about 100,000 people. If to tbese be added those engaged in the transportation, marketing, and milling of the crop, it is safe to increase the above to 125,000 people. The lands, teams, implements, and machinery involved in the culti- vation of rice have a value exceeding $10,000,000. Add to this our score or more of expensive mills, which cost on an average $100,000 each, and we have a grand total of value $12,000,000, with annual ex- penses of $3,500,000, producing 2,000,000 sacks of rough rice worth $2.50 per sack. During the past year, on account of our large crop and the importa- tion of foreign rice, prices fell to alarmingly low figures, selling at one time for $1.60 per sack of 162 pounds, a little below the present import duty, and far below the cost of production. These low prices have had a tendency to decrease acreage this year, and this, aided by unfavorable seasons, has caused the present short crop, now being marketed, to bring fairly remuneraiive prices. It is expected that this crop will bring $2.50 per sack. Tlie tariff on paddy rice is 1 cent per pound. A sack of rice weiglis 162 pounds, the tarift' on same is $1.62, leaving 88 cents per sack to pay freight, com- 64.0 AGRICULTUEAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. mission, insurance, and the growing of the rice in foreign countries. No one outside of the crowded countries of China, Japan, and India can possibly grow this crop at these prices and live. It is only neces- sary to call your attention to the above facts to fully demonstrate that the continuance of the present tariff is absolutely necessary to pi'cvent destruction of the rice industry, not only in Louisiana but in the Caro- linas and Georgia as Avell. Louisiana now raises foui'-flfths of the entire rice of the country, and if protected our i)rairies and alluvial lauds will soon produce all the rice now consumed in the United States. In conclusion, permit me to say that the rice men of Louisiana have made an extensive and expensive exhibit at Chicago Exposition, plac- ing it under charge of a competent rice man, who is distributing in small packages 50,000 pounds of clean rice with printed instructions how to cook and serve this valuable article of food. In this way we hope to teach the people how to use this cereal, as its present low i^rice makes it one of the cheapest foods in the world. This, gentlemen, is a table I submit showing the increase in the last fifteen years of the rice crop of Louisiana: Table showhig increase of rice receipts at New Orleans in past sixteen years. [Compiled by T. J. Salvant, No. 28 Sugar Shed, New Orleans, La.] 1877-'78: Rough ricp sacks. Clean rice barrels. 1878-'79: Rough rice sacks . Cleau rice barrels. 1879-'80: Rough rice sacks . Clean rice ..barrels. 1880-'81 : Rough rice sacks . Cleau rice barrels. 1881-'82 : . Rough rice sacks. Clean rice barrels.. 1882-'83 : Rough rice sacks . Clean rice barrels . . 1883-'84 : Rough rice sacks. Clean rice barrels. 1884-'8d : Rough rice sacks . . Clean rice barrels. Add 226,000 sacks marketed ( cleaned rice. 1885-'86: 233, 707 Rough rice . sacks.. 16, 682 Clean rice. 1886-'87: barrels.. . 279, 611 Rough rice. sacks.. 21, 045 Clean rice. 1887-'88: barrels.. . 182, 999 Rough rice - sacks.. 11, 152 Clean rice. 1888-'89: barrels.. . 445, 397 Rough rice. sacks - . 29, 812 Clean rice. 1889-'90: barrels.. . 435, 692 Rough rice. sacks . . 39, 390 Clean rice. 1890-'91 : barrels.. . 392, 750 Rough rice sacks . . 37, 736 Clean rice. 1891-'92 : barrels . . . 459, 559 Rough rice sacks.. 1, 41, 055 Clean rice. 1892-'93: barrels.. . 333, 693 Rough rice. sacks . . 1, 32, 333 Clean rice. barrels.. outside city of New Orleans, BCLuals 225,000,000 889, 212 57, 983 838, 476 48, 566 626, 811 23, 263 737, 075 29, 227 777, 742 7,441 892, 374 4,115 052, 331 5,640 972, 946 6,490 pounds EICE. (Paragrapll 201.) STATEMENT OF G. ERNST, OF NEW OBLEANS, LA. Mr. CnATRMAN AND GENTLEMEN OF THE COMMITTEE : I COm© in the interest of the rice manufacturer or the rice miller. I will state in framing this tariff that the rates ought to be more on a parity than at present on the different grades of rice which now pay duty. There has been a good deal of controversy between the appraisers as to ETCE. 641 what is clean and what is unclean rice. When the i\Iills bill was formed I succeeded in having a proper distinction put in. Why they were left out of the last bill I do not know, and it has caused a great deal of controversy iu tlio courts because some of the importations decided clean at IMew Orleans were de- cided unclean at the port of New York. I have brought samples along with me to show the different processes the rice has gone througli. Here is a box of No. 1 paddy rice with a tariff of 1 cent a pound. That definition is correct, that is rice with the husk on. Now to remove that husk we hnll it through large stones 5 feet iu diameter and then screen it to separate it and get the chaff off. This is what we get off [exhibiting]; this is the husk. Now, when this is removed we claim what should be termed unclean rice is this rice [exhibiting], which is not fit to eat because it has the outer cuticle on it. I will state that to bring this rice up to the finished condition it takes from an hour to an hour and a quarter's work in mortars, which are large mortars in which we pour the rice and which have pestles worked by steam. It is a very slow process and on account of the rice being so brittle we have to handle it very carefully to keep it from breaking. Mr. Beeckineidgb. You do not run it between the stones again? Mr. Eenst. No, sir. Mr. Beeckineidge. Then you use jnortars? Mr. Eenst. Yes, sir ; after it comes out of the mortar it is separated, and this cuticle which comes off of it we call rice bran. Mr. Beeckineidge. This is all done in one mortar, one process? Mr. Eenst. Of course we have quantities of mortars. After the bran is separated from the rice it comes in this condition [illustrating]. Now, we call that cleaned rice. The ajjpraisers in New York call that unclean rice. Now, it takes one hour to bring the rice up from that condition you see there to this condition you see here. Then it is pol- ished. That adds a value of about 1 cent a pound, and it is almost an instantaneous process. It runs through a polisher and gets a gloss put on it, and the cost of putting that on is not over one thirty-second of a cent, Avhereas the cost of briugiug it from the unclean state to this state is one-half cent; and that is the reason why we wish to have a definition put on. Mr. Beeckineidge. That makes a distinction between these two? Mr. Eenst. Yes, sir; we get it through a polishing process, and you will see the difference between the two. We had this brand analyzed by Mr. Boss, of the State of Louisiana, and he says it is rice. We have had it analyzed by chemists in New York, and yet they caU it polish. Mr. Beeckineidge. You call it rice flour? Mr. Eenst. No, sir ; that is ground rice. Mr. MoNTGOMEEY. Is tlicre any use made of that? Mr. Eenst. That is exported in large quantities to Europe. After this rice goes through the polishing process and the pounding process there is always more or less broken which we separate and get this grade of rice [exhibiting]. This is called brewing rice audit is only used for brewing purposes. Mr. Beeckineidge. Your polishing rice gives two by-products ? Mr. Eenst. Y'^es, sir. Mr. Beeckineidge. One is the husk of the rice and the otlier rice polish from it? Mr. Eenst. Yes, sir. Now, when we were here in 1890, before that time the imjiorters took this brewer's rice and tliis rice and mixed it together and imported it as bioken rice at a very small rate of duty, T H^ 41 642 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. and we want this sieve retained in tlie tariff. It is known as a No. 12 sieve, 10 by 10 mesh, made out of No. 20 wire. 1 brought some samples of rice here. There was a cargo of Japan rice brought into New Orleans two years ago where the milling bill on that cargo would be about $10,000. If it had been brought in the way they are now bring-ing in, if that cargo had been brought in that condition [ex- hibiting sample], the milling bill would not amount to over il,000, so the American nullers have been deprived of $9,000 by fraud. I will put some of that rice in my handkerchief and polish it [rubbing it in handkerchief]. That is the condition you see it iu now. The differ- ence between this rice and that is that this has gone through a part polishing process and the polish left on it so as to make it appear un- clean. My handkerchief has polished that off; therefore I would like this definition to be put in there, and 1 leave you a copy of these defi- nitions. Another thing I would like to call your attention to. In flxiug tiie tariff on the unclean rice they put IJ cents on unclean rice and '1 cents on clean rice. Now, it costs half a cent to bring rice from tliat condi- tion up to the polisbed condition, and tlie diffcrciice is too great, and on a parity it should not be over half a cent on the clean and unclean if the definition is right as to what uncle70,000 a year under the 8 per cent tax. Now you have not helped a '-struggling industry " at all because this is an industry whei'e twice as many goods are exported as are imported and in which we produce a surplus over our consumption every year. Your attempt to interfere with this business by almost doubling tliis tax has cut down the revenues of the Government, injured the grower, and has not helped anybody in the world. Mr. Dalzell. Has it not added a revenue from the importation of beer? Mr. Fitch. I am told that the revenue from imported beer has some- what grown, but if you want to make a revenue that way, of course you can do it. It is nothing compared to the loss of duty on the hops. 650 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. Payne. And it has found a sale? Mr. Fitch. Tes, sir; but tlie point we insist on is that you have not helped the grower, you have not helped the Government, you have not helped the business, or anybody, and you have injured all of the parties concerned. Now, as to the i)osition of the Democratic party in this matter, I want to say to my colleagues on the committee there has never been any mistake about it at all. When the Democratic i)arty made a tariff bill, the Mills bill, they reduced this duty from 8 to 6 cents. We are all on record, those of us who voted for the Mills bill, as saying that 6 cents is a proper duty, which is less than we are asking here; we ask only for a return to the old duty of 8 cents. We all voted solidly against the increase in the McKinley bill for the reason that we, with some of our Republican friends like Messrs. Adams and Butterworth, considered that this advance was sure to work precisely as it did. The Democratic record is therefore against the duty of 15 cents, and our statements have been sustained by what has happened. K"ow I want to present to you the gentlemen who will address the committee. Mr. Payne. May I interrupt you! Mr. Fitch. With pleasure, Mr. Pajme. Mr. Payne. You say the importation of foreign hops has decreased under the McKinley bill? Mr. Fitch. I said the amount of duty collected has decreased. Mr. Payne. The importation has decreased"? Mr. Fitch. I suppose it has ; I have the figures only as to the amount of duty collected. Mr. Payne. Has the use and manufacture of beer increased? Mr. Fitch. Beer in the United States? Oh, I think so; I think it increases steadily every year. Mr. Payne. And the use of hops has increased largely? Mr. Fitch. I think that is true. Mr. Payne. So for the past three years the farmers of this country have had much larger sale for their hops than before this duty because they have supplied a void left by a lesser importation as well as an increase in the use of hops ? Mr. Fitch. I think in order to consider that question that you would have to consider the amount of the exportation of American hops during the time, the course of the market prices, the increase of production, and a number of other things not included in the question. Mr. Payne. For home consumption they have had a larger market? Mr. FItch. I do not know about that. They have had a worse mar- ket; they have obtained less money for their hops per pound. Mr. Payne. Where did you get your average prices for hops at 37 cents? Mr. Fitch. I will send them to you; I will give you all the sources of supply from which I got them, and if there is any error 1 will correct it. Mr. Payne. Is it not a fai't that the decrease in i)rice from 27 cents and a fraction to 20 cents in hops has been a much less percentage than any other farm product in the last three years? Mr. Fitch. I am Jiot from an agricultural district and I am not posted in regard to the prices in farm produce. The duties on all of them were raised by the McKinley bill. Mr. Payne. Well, from your general information? Mr. Fitch. I am unable to tell you wliat the fall has been in, pota- toes or anything elSe grown along side with hops. There has been a HOPS. 651 great fall in wheat, owing to the utilization of large wheat fields and Improved machinery. But in regard to hops raised in your district and central New York I do not know whether the people Mr. Payne. Yery few hops are raised in my district. Mr. Pitch. If my friend is through Mr. Payne. I have finished. Mr. Fitch. I want to introduce a friend of mine who is a hop-grower, a hop-importer, and one of the largest hop-exporters in this country. He is connected with the business on every side and every phase of it. He raises hops for export, and he exports and imports hops very lai gely. All of us who know him in New York know he has no selfish interest to serve; that he comes here because he believes, as all of us connected in any way or having any knowledge of this matter believe, aside from a few farmers, that it is a great deal better for the trade, for the grower, and for the Government to reduce this duty to where it was before the McKinley bill. I ask leave to introduce Mr. Fox, of New York. HOPS. (Paragraph 279.) STATEMEIfT OF ME. HUGH F. FOX, OF 35 PEAEL STREET, NEW YORK CITY. Mr. Ohaieman and Gentlemen : I feel a trifle embarrassed at the extent of Mv. Fitch's introduction. I liave been interested in the trade for some twelve years, and, as he says, in all of its branches ; but I come here more in the capacity of an expert in the trade than anything else. I have had no experience in speaking in public, and I am not much used to thinking on my feet, but I am prepared to answer questions that may be put to me and to speak according to my knowledge to the best of my ability. I would like to present to you first a shortmemo- rial addressed by members of the trade in New York. New York, Septemler 6, 1893. The undersigned, importers of foreign hops and dealers in and exporters of Amer- ican hops, desire to have the duty on liops reduced from tlie present tariif of 15 cents per pound to the old tariff of 8 cents per pound, which existed prior to the enact- ment of the McKinley tariff bill. The increased duty has proved a hardship to the consumer, and of no benefit to anybody. The old duty of 8 cents per pound is liberal even from the standpoint of high pro- tection. We respectfully request that Mr. Hugh F. Fox be recognized by your committee as our representative. Eothbarth & Sons, 35 Pearl street. New York; T. Eosenwald & Co., 13 Water and 14 Front streets. New York; E. Guttermann & Co., 11 Stone street, New York; William Junge & Co., 11 Stone street, New York; E. Uchtmann, 17 Broadway, New York; Benjamin Schwarz & Sons, 25 Pearl street. New York; Martin Rothbarth & Co., Broad street, New York; S. B. Bing & Sons, 25 Whitehall street. New York; E. Watten- berg Co., 104 Broad street. New York; Carl Ullmann li Co., 17 Broad- way, New York; Hugo Eeisinger, 38 Beaver street. New York; F. W. Simonds & Son, 18 South William street. New York; Fox & Searles, 35 Pearl street, New York; Lilienthal Brothers, 8 and 10 Water street, New York. Mr. Fox. This is signed by all the importers in NeAV York, by a number of exporters, and by several of the domestic dealers who do not handle anything but American hops and are not known as exporters. This is a copy of the petition; I have the original in my possession here. 652 AGRICULTITRAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. Fitcli lias already called your attention to the high tariff on hops, but in this connection I would like to say t]iat the a\-era.g-e price of the American hops for eleven years — from 1865 to 1875, when the duty was 5 cents per pound — was 4i cents, and for fourteen years — Irom 187C to 1889, when the duty was 8 cents per pound — the average price was 27 cents, and for three years— from 1890 to 1893, while the duty was 15 cents per pound — the average price was 26 cents. Thus you see an enhanced duty corresponding with a diminution of the market price of the domestic product. The old duty of 8 cents per pound amounted in 1886 to an ad valorem duty of 49.50 per cent, or 42.60 per cent in 1887, and 43.90 per cent in 1888. Now, a word in regard to the cost of the production of hops in this country. Opinions vary in ISew York State according to the section in which a man lives, and the value of his lauds, etc., as to the cost of production; but authorities generally consider 14 cents for a pound of hops the average cost of the product of American ho^js iu ISTew York State. On the Pacific coast, where the industry has developed with enormous strides within the last few years, and where they raise over 50 per cent of the total production of the country, the cost is only esti- mated at 9 cents per pound. The reason for this is largely because of the greater productiveness of the soil. According to the last census bulletin the average production of hops to the acre in iSTew York State was 547 pounds; in California it was 1,648 pounds, and in Washington it was 1,626 ])()unds, and in Oregon it was 1,155 pounds to the acre, and you can say in this connection it requires probably no more labor to raise 1,600 pounds on the Pacific coast to the acre than it requires to raise 547 pounds to the acre in j^ew York; therefore it will be readily seen how great a disadvantage the ISTew York farmer has in competaig against the Pacific coast. Taking the 14 cents as the cost of ]Droduction in New York and 9 cents as the average cost of production on the Pacific coast, it will be seen that the specific duty of 15 cents per pound is equivalent, pretty nearly, to an ad valorem tariff of 150 per cent on the basis of the aver- age cost of the product of hops in the United States. In addition to this, in the matter of competition one has to consider the transportation charges, which vary from 1^ to 2 cents per pound. They are |30 to f 40 a ton from Germany. Now, in spealving of the steady development — a very large development — of the beer industry in the United States, which Mr. Payne has touched upon, and the constant continued increase in the consumption of hops, we are still raising a surplus of at least 30 per cent of hops over consumption, over and above our requirements., I have here a table of the exports and imports for a term of years run- ning for some thirty years which I will be glad to leave with the com- mittee, and which will of itself demonstrate the fact that we are rais- ing a very large surplus. The only outlet for it is by export to England. During the i)ast three or four years we have annually exported from 60,000 to 70,000 bales of hops to England. Our imports from Ger- many have only amounted to a few thousand bales. It is seemingly an anomaly to import German hops to a country which raises a surplus, and it is explained, as Mr. Pitch and the other gentleman stated, by the fact that the ideal of our brewers in this country is German beer. Some ten or fifteen years ago there was considerable importation of beer from Germany and England to this country, principally from Germany, and in order to compete against that, which of course went to the high- class trade, our brewers found it necessary to use a certain proportion of Bavarian and Bohemian hops to give the flavor which was desired HOPS. 653 and wliicli -was requisite to bring the beer up to tlie ideal standard of our drinkers generally and make it poijular. Except on very rare occasions, I think pei'haps once in ten years, when we have had a failure in this country of hops, foreign hops have only been used for this purpose; but in 1886 we had a total failure of the crop in New York State. At that time the industry on the Pacific coast was small, and that year I think the brewers had to import some 30,000 or 40,000 bales of hops to eke out needs. The possibility of the failure of the crop in periods of ten years also has ever been present in their minds, and the prospect of having to pay a duty to the Government on top of the market price in such an event constitutes a constant menace to the consumer. Mr. Payne. Is that the only year it ever occurred ? Mr. Fox. My experience only goes back eleven years. I believe i)rior to that, early in the sixties, they had such an experience, but of that I am not certaiu. Mr. Bynum. Was there not a partial failure of the crop on the Pacific sloi^e two or three years ago ? Mr. Fox. Yes, sir; there was a partial failure of the crop in Wash- ington. K"ow, if I am not mistaken, and I believe it is an axiom of commerce that where a country raises a surplus of any commodity that the entire product is governed by the available price for the surplus, it will be readily seen that our market abroad has its entire inspiration from London. England is the only large beer-producing country which habitually or almost constantly has to import hops from abroad in order to meet its own requirement. England imports, I think, on an average, some 120,000 to 140,000 hundredweight of hops from the United States and Germany. The German hops are imported for some purposes and the American hops for other purposes, according to the needs of the individual brewers and the time of year they require them; but it will be seen, of course, that Germany is our competitor m the English market, where the price of our product is established. The Chairman. Is there not a very large hop production in Eng- land ? Mr. Fox. Yes, sir; very large indeed; but still I think their con- sumption of hojjs is enormous, their beer production is enormous, and it is a very precarious crop in England; consequently four out of five years they are obliged to impoit from other countries. Now the pinch comes in New York State, as I endeavored to suggest a few minutes ago, from the inability of the New York far'mers in years of low prices to compete with the Pacific coast. A large sluire went to the coast because the land, of course, costs a great deal lest; and the labor is some- what less and their soil is exceedingly fertile and rich. The Chairman. Is not some of the land on the Pacific coast very high? Mr. Fox. In some parts of Washington it is high, but in the last year or so they have opened up a new valley, T.'hich was considered in the nature of an experiment, but it i>s threatening to revolutionize the entire business. They have succeeded in watering, through irrigation, all that immense tract of country east of the mountains, in Washington, around Yakima, and have succeeded in perfecting it, so that they can raise hops there at the minimum cost and have an immense territory for the development of- the industry. They will raise there this year some 13,000 bales. Mr, TuENBB. How many pounds to the bale — 180 pounds 1 Mr. Fox. About 180 pounds. Now I have here telegrams, and I want to lay special emphasis ui:)on the telegrams addressed to me by 654 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. B. Meeker, of Puyallup, Wash., and the Puyallup Hop Company of Waslungton. Mr. Turner. That is between Tacoma and Seattle? Mr. Fox. Yes, sir; in that rich valley. The Puyallup Company raises about 4,000 bales of hops. And when Mr. Fitch said I was inter- ested in hops he alhided to this particular company in which I am interested and my partner is an officer. This company telegraphs: This company 'believes the high protective tariff on hops unnecessary, as there was a large surplus produced in the United States hefore the passage of the McKinley Mr. Meeker has been for a number of years the largest exporter of hops in the United States. He was the pioneer of the industry on the Pacific coast and, if it is of any interest to this committee to know it, he is a stanch Eepublican and protectionist. He says : 1 favor protective policy of American industry, but oppose increased duty on hops as uncalled for. We annually export large quantities from surplus of home pro- duction of choice quality. Now, a few years ago, by reason largely of the competition between the American and English markets, the English Parliament ordered a special investigation by a select committee to inquire into the depres- sion of the hop industry in England. The hearing lasted several mouths and was a most exhaustive investigation. I have here a copy of the report of tliat investigation. I only wish to refer to one point in which one party said : We consider California is the most formidable competitor of the English hop growers. I have already endeavored to show why the importer favors a reduc- tion in the tariff on hops, and in this connection I wish to read a brief statement which was made by ]\Ir. Lilienthal, who is a large grower and exporter of ho])s. This was an interview with Mr. Lilienthal in Sep- tember, 1890, after the passage of the bill, and is an iuter\icw published in the New York Commercial TUilletin. NEW YORK C0MMEECIA7, r.Ur,T,KTIX-S IMTERTIEW WITH A, LILIENTHAL, EXl'Oli'VKli, SEi'TEillSEj;. 1S91). Mr. Lilienthal, of Lilienthiil Brothers, believed that the advanced duty wouldnot be felt 60 mni-h at present on account of the high prices current as it will be when the market is low. ConsLqueutly he did not look for any decided effect of the new tariff bill on the hop market. "We were not only opi)osed to raising the tariff," said Mr. Lilienthal, "but we are out and out free traders as far as hops are concerned. We class as a mistaken notion the idea that the prohibitive tariff on hops will be of ultimate benefit to growers in this country. If German hops are excluded from this country they will only go in larger quantities to Kugland, thus cutting off there the demand for American hops, which is a normal and healthy one in that market. The result will be that England will not look to us for any hops, and our growers will then be at the mercy of the consumers in tliis country, who are able to handle the hop market pretty much as they please. The local hop market derives its whole inspiration from London quo- tations, and should these not exist in the future our hop culture would materially suffer. " On the other hand, the free importation of German hops into the United States, whicli are much more iu fiiAor with American than the Ejiglish brewers, would open the door to a larger cxporlatiou of American hops foom this country to England, a natural consequence of which must be a healthy market and one that will prove profitable to local growers." Mr. Lilienthal since that time has organized a large company inTlali- fornia for tlie production of hops and he intends, I believe, to double or treble the acreage next year. HOPS. 655 In passing I wish to say just a word as to why we are favoring a specilic duty of 8 cents a pound. It has been suggested to us that tliero is a possibility of a proposition to consider an ad valorem duty on hops. This we consider would be very detrimental indeed to the interest of all parties concerned, both to the imi)orters and producers, in this country. In the first place hops are peculiarly subject to violeut fluctuation in prices, and it is no uncommon thing in a few days for hops to advance 10, 20, or even 30 per cent. Sometimes in the course of a few weeks they may more than double. In 1882 they advanced from 12 cents to f 1.20 a pound. Therefore you will readily see imder an ad valorem duty a merchant may be almost ruined because of the fluctuation in the price while the hops were in j)rocess of transx)orta- tion from abroad. Apart from that, however, I tliink it is doubtful if there is any member of the hop trade who could tell from inspecting a sample of lioi)S' the exact nativity. It may conio from a section in Bavaiia, Bohemia, or Austria. Hops are handled in such a way that instead of each individual crop of hops being cured and packed on the farm the practice is for a merchant to buy hops i'rom the farmer and pack and cure them himself, and the result is that he mixes the hops perhaps from different sections in accordance with the requirements of his particular trade. If he wants a certain color or flavor he arranges it in that way, and in a certain sense the basis of manufacture enters into it. Theicfore I contend it would be absolutely impossible for any inspector or appraiser to ofticially determine where the hops came from and what their market price was at the point of production; conse- quently it would be imj)ossible for him to tell, and there woulcl be the very great injustice of an ad valorem taritt', and it would put a premium upon dislionesty and result in a great deal of confusion to the trade. Mr. Fitch. May I ask a question at that poiut! Has there ever been an ad valorem duty placed on hops? Mr. Fox. There never has. I wish to read a short paragraph from a handbook of Mr. Meeker. Mr. Meeker has published a handbook on the Pacific Coast which cir- culates very largely and is thought of very highly. E. Meeker's handbook for 1893 says : There ■will be this season the largest increase in acreage hoth in Oregon and Wash- ington that has talten place in any year since the business of hop-growing has been established here. This increase is not confined to one locality, but extends over all of western Washington and Oregon, and in the Yakima district in eastern Washing- ton. This phenomenal increase comes from the deliberate calculations of a class that is in the business to stay ; we havf the soil and climate to produce hops cheaper than in the older hoji-growing districts. Eegarding the fact of overproduction of hops, I may as well state the results and experience of Canada in this connection. Canada raises, or has raised for several years, hops; she has a tariff of 6 cents, but the hops are of an inferior quality, and consequently there is no demand for them for export, and last year while hops on the New York side of the border in Franklin County were selling at 22 and 23 centsa pound, in Prince Edward County and throughout Ontario, Canada, their hops were selling at from 15 to 16 cents a pound, and I myself was exporting American, German, and English hojjs to Canada for the use of their brewers. They have a very high standard of ale, and they could not possibly produce an article which would satisfy the public demand with the home product. Fortunately, here the quality of our hops meets the demands of the Canada and English brewers, so we have established a trade in these hops, and are able in the ordinary years to get rid of the surplus, but the point I wish to make is, our New York 656 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. farmers are in a large measure banking on the possible misfortune of tlieir cousins on the otlier side of the water. In a year when England has a full crop there is no demand for American hops, at least only a very moderate demand. There is no legitimate export trade in Arrier- icau hops; consequently, if it had not been for the misfortunes of Ger- many and England in the last three or four years the hops in this conn try would be selling below the cost of production. Our crop to-day, which is now being harvested, is from 240,000 to 250,000 bales. That is considered the minimum estimate, and it would have been consider- able more except for the violent storms of the last two or three weeks, which injured the crops in S"ew York State and depreciated the yield probably 25 per cent. Our annual consumption is only estimated at 180,000 bales, consequently we are at the mercy of the London market in regard to the production of hops. I do not think of anything further in that particular connection. Gentlemen, I have only to say if I was an attorney I could wish mo bet- ter proof to present to a jury of unbiased men than the case which I have endeavored to present to you, and we have confidence that the matter will be considered by you judiciously in the light and interest of the entire community, and we feel we can with perfect confidence rest the case in your hands. If the committee desires to liut any questions to me I am at their service. Mr. Payne. I wish to ask a question or two. The price of labor involved in raising hops is in the picking, is it not! Mr. Fox. As a general rule; yes, sir. Mr. Payne. The large item of cost is in picking? Mr. Eox. Yes, sir; it varies very largely in different localities. Mr. Payne. Now, the picking is generally done by the farmer and paid on a certain quantity of hops, so whether a man gets 1,600 pounds to an acre or 500 pounds to an acre, it costs the same per hundred pounds to pick his hops ? Mr. Fox. Yes ; but the proportion is not as large as you place it. Mr. Payne. There is a little diilerence in labor in different locali- ties? Mr. Pox. But apart from that, the labor of ])icking hops in the most ex])ensive localities, say the central part of New York State, is only estimated at aljout, I think, 4 or 5 cents a pound, and on the Pacific Coast it is estimated at &om 2 to 3 cents. Mr. Payne. The average on the Pacific Coast is constantly increas- ing; that is, the cost of labor? Mr. Fox. As to that point I am not sure. Mr. Payne. Even the Indians demand a much larger return for their labor than they used to for picking hops? Mr. Fox. My imi>ression is this year the hop-growers, the companies on the Pacific coast, have made a very cheap arrangement with the pickers, possibly on account of the condition of the labor market. Mr. Payne. But in a normal condition of affairs the price of picking hops is constantly increasing on the Pacific coast? Mr. Fox. Slightly. Mr. Payne. Nov,', the grent consumption of hops is east of the Eocky Mountains, of coui';-c, and the grower on the Pacific slope is handi- capped by freights, is he not, to a certain extent? Mr. Fox. Yes, to ;i certain extent. Mr. Payne. Tliat helps to c(iaali>-.e him with the New York producer? Mr. Pox. Ilis freight is on an average about 2 cents a pound; it costs that to put his hops on the eastern market. HOPS. 637 Mr. Payne. I believe the hops of New York are as good as any raised in the world"? Mr. Fox. Well, there is a diiference of opinion in that. Mr. Payne. 1 am asking for your opinion. Mr. Fox. Frankly I think the averitge standard of the 'Sew York hoi)S is very much below the standard of the Pticilic coast, but taking the best of the New York hops I should say they are certainly as good as as any in this country, and probably bettei'. Mr. Payne. I am not confining it to this country. Are not the hops produced in New Y^ork considered to be the best in the world "? Mr. Fox. No, sir. Mr. Payne. Where do they produce better ? Mr. Fox. For flavoring purposes they produce hops in a certain por- tion of Bavaria and Bohemia, and also in one or two districts in Eng- land, East Kent for instance. Mr. Payne. But for general use in the brewing business and not for a few hops jyut in a barrel to flavor beer, do not the American hops bring better prices than any other hopsi Mr. Fox. They rank with English hops as about third or fourth class. Mr. Payne. Do not Bass & Co. use principally American hops? Mr. Fox. I could not tell you. Mr. Payne. Do not they buy largely of Mr. Clark, of New Y^ork State? Mr. Fox. That is a surmise of his, but as a matter of fact Bass does not know where they come from, that is, any particular place. Mr. Payne. He st.ites emphatically he sells to Bass. Mr. Fox. As a matter of fact I do not think Mr. Bass has ever bought hops direct from any farmer in this country in his life. Mr. Payne. Mr. Clark says he has been over there and sold them to him; I do not know anything about it, but I am just taking it as I heard it. The hops iuiiiorted into this country are used largely for flavoring beer and producing a particular flavor. Mr. Fox. Yes, sir. Mr, Payne. And they are generally put into a barrel of beer in the bung. Mr. Fox. No, that practice only prevails among ale brewers. Beer brewers as a rule do not believe in the practice of bunging down. Mr. Payne. Ihey only use it for fancy? Mr. Fox. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. For brewing they use the American hops? Mr. Fox. Yes, sir. Mr. Fitch. I want to bring out the point that there is no brewer who puts beer in a buughole of a barrel. They boil the hops and Mr. Payne. They do not put beer in the bunghole? Mr. Fitch. I mean the hops ; they do not put beer in it, they take it out of it. They do not put any hops in the bunghole of a keg, and nobody who ever knew anything about a brewery would dream that they did. Mr. Payne. Is that all? Mr. Fitch. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. So a slight i^roportion of the hops used to manufacture a barrel of ale or lager is foreign hops. Have you ever made a calcu- lation to see how much of the entire duty of 15 cents a pound was col- lected out of the brewer for these hops, how much it would be to each barrel of beer for the handful of hops which is put into the barrel? T H 43 G58 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. Fox. It would vary according to the amounts used. In some cases that would amount to a cent or two, and in others it would amount to 5 or 6 cents a barrel. I believe, estimating upon the total beer product, that it would amount to $1,750,000 on the assumx^tion that each brewer had Mr. Payne. Have you ever calculated how much the brewer's profit would be it they average $1 or $13 a barrel on the entire production of this country'? Mr. Fox. That is a simple calculation. ]Mr. Payne. How many barrels of beer, lager, etc., are produced in the country? Mr. Fox. Last year it was about 32,000,000 barrels, and this year it will be between 33,000,000 and 34,000,000 barrels. Mr. Payne. ]^ow a large proportion put in less than 2 cents worth of foreign hops! Mr. Fox. A large proportion at least, and I should think the majority of the breweries use no foreign hops except at certain seasons of the year when they are getting out a certain beer for advertising purjjoses, but the best class of brewers uses quite a large j)roportiou of loreign hoi)S. Mr. Payne. That is a limited number? Mr. Fox. A limited number, but they represent in proportion to the entire business an important element. Mr. Payne. Limited in the number of barrels? Mr. Fox. No; I think it is quite a large number. Mr. Payne. Now is it not a matter of fact that the German hops lose strength quicker than the American hops after they become about a year old ? Mr. Fox. Yes, sir; theGermanhopshave very little virtue after they are a year old and are not used by our brewers here except as new hox)s, but within the last two or three years since this matter was under con- siderations previously, the brewers throughout the country have birilt lor themselves storage house, for hops which are refrigerators, and they find in that way they are able to keep both the domestic and loreign hops just as good as new for a long time, provided they do not take them out of the storage room before using them. Mr. Payne. The farmers complain that the German hops are brought in in large quantities and thrown on the market to break down the market, and after the market is broken down they are compelled by their proverty to put their hops on the market. Have you had any experience as to that kind? Mr. Fox. No, sir. Mr. Pay^ne. Never saw them go down suddenly, soon after the open- ing of the season, of course? Mr. Fox. Oh, yes; I do not think it was due to that reason. Mr. Payne. Have they not very often gone down below the cost of production? Mr. Fox. Well, they have been several times during the last twenty years. Mr. Payne. Below U cents a pound? ]\lr. Fox. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne, xind just at that time was there not a very large impor- tation of foreigu hops? Mr. Fox. I believe not; possibly on one occasion, which was in 1880, wlien there was a failure in the New York crop. Mr. Payne. Now, in regard to the Canada hops, if there was no HOPS. 659 tariff on hops, and Canadian hops at 15 cents a pound were thrown on the market when the American liops were wortli 22 cents, have you any idea that that would reduce the price of American hops on tlie marliet? Mr. Fox. Ton are assuming, in the absence of a duty on hops, Can- ada woald be still raising hops to the extent it is now. Mr. Payne. You said at one time, with the present duty on hops, they were worth from 15 to 16 cents in Canada and 22 cents in this country. ]S"ow, if the duty had been removed, have you any idea the price of American hops would have gone down in this country! Mr. Fox. If the duty had been entirely removed"? Mr. Payne. Yes. Mr. Fox. I think not, for the reason that the entire production of Canada only amounts to some 7,000 or 8,000 bales, and it would liardly be a sufficient factor in the market to affect it one way or another. Mr. Payne. Is not there a large quantity of land which could be used in raising hops? Mr. Fox. No, sir; I think not. Mr. Payne. You think it could not be increased beyond the 8,000 bales? Mr. Fox. Well, to a certain extent they would be at a very material disadvantage, because they can not raise hops in parts of Canada as in this country. Mr. Payne. Why not? Mr. Fox. I say they can not; perhaps that is an assumption. Mr. Payne. The labor is cheaper? Mr. Fox. I presume the labor is somewhat cheaper but the soil is not so good. They have only succeeded in raising 300 or 400 x^ounds to the acre in Canada, whereas the average, I believe, is 5C0 pounds in New York State. The attempt was made by a gentlemen in New York, Mr. Luce, who is largely interested in New York hops, to raise them in Canada for export. He established two farms, one on each side of the line, and he made money on the New York farm and he lost money on the Canada farm, and he recently sold out at very much below what it cost him. Mr. Payne. In regard to those gentlemen whose telegrams you read, were either of those your former partners? Mr. Fox. No, sir. Mr. Payne. Are they engaged in exporting hops? Mr. Fox. Both of them. Mr. Payne. And in importing? Mr. Fox. No. Mr. Payne. They are officers of this same company you helped to organize? Mr. Fox. I did not help to organize it. I thought it was a good investment and induced them to part with some of their stock at a little above par. Mr. Payne. And then you went into it? Mr. Fox. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Now, I suppose it would be to the interest of importers to buy hops at a lower price in this country; there would be more mar- gin of profit the cheaper he gets his hops. Mr. Fox. That is a question I think you can answer as well as I can. I do not know but that is rather a violent assumption ; because he buys them cheaper it does not follow the grower in England is going to 660 AGRICULTUKAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. Payne. Tlie cheaper he can get them relatively the more profit he gets, of course? Mr. Fox. I think not necessarily. I thinlc in that connection it might be useful to isay something with regard to the exnerieiice of the farmers of the Pacific ('oast when hops ruled low. Tliey found when hops ruled low that England, with her experience in buying and her shrewdness, instead of coming out here and purchasing their hops iu large quanti- ties, sent agents here and induced consignments by making advances against them, and tliey did succeed in getting numerous consignments from the coast, and that ruined the business for a time for any legiti- mate exporter. The experience of the 'farmers iu some sections were very unfortunate, and you could not induce them to consign hops again, but in other sections it was different. Mr. Payne. That is very interesting, but it does not answer my question. If hops are relatively lower here, of course that is for the interest of the exporter ; he gets more profit. Mr. Fox. I can not answer that question. Mr. Payne. Can you answer it iu the negative? Mr. Fox. That is a matter of conjecture. Mr. Payne. If they are relatively lower here in the market than where they are sold? Mr. Fox. The exporter gets more profit. Mr. Payne. I think you might answer that. If they are relatively lower, of course they will sell for more -abroad. Mr. Fox. Inasmuch as the market price is established there, if the price is relatively lower here it must be so in London at the sametinie. Mr. Payne. Where do you get this market price you speak of, 27 and 26 cents? Mr. Fox. I got it from the ontysonrce of information we have. There Is a concern in New York called flie Hop-Peporting Company which makes it a business to supply statistics to the trade and ])rodnccrs, consumers, etc. I have their tables with me, Avhich I shall be pleased to give you. Mr. Payne. Are those the avearge for each season? Mr. Fox. They are figured by months, giving the highest and lowest price for each month, and my figures show the average of those aver- ages. Mr. Payne. I wish you would give the average for each year and leave it with the reporter? Mr. Fox. Yes, sir; I will do so. Mr. Payne. Do you know any other farm product that has not decreased in price a greater x>ercentage than hops? Mr. Fox. My knowledge in regard to farm products is absolutely nothing. Mr. Payne. You do not know anything about it, not even as a mat- ter of general intelligence? Mr. Fox. If you chose to jiut it in that way. I certainly have not followed the fluctuations iu other farm prodxicts. I know in a general way that wheat is little lower and corn is a little lower, but apart from that I can not answer your question. Mr. Payne. Do you know any other hop-grower, except this com- pany of which you speak, who wants the reduction in duty? Mr. Fox. I am informed that the growers in Galifoi'nia as a class are in favor of reduction, but I mentioned Mr. Lilientlial, who is a large hop-grower. I rather expected that tJie California people would be represented here to-day to make some statement. HOPS. 661 Mr. Payne. We have some in the House wlio do not understand it in that way. Perhaps jour information might enlighten them. Mr. Pox. I was informed, I did not know positively, that they would come here and make that statement. Mr. Payne. Are these the prices you refer to [referring to paper]? Mr. Fox. Those are the prices for a term of years. Those are the prices at the opening of the season, those for the middle of the season, and those are the prices for the past year. Mr. Payne. The importation of hops has steadily decreased since the McKinley bill was passed? Mr. Fox. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. The importation of foreign beer is very slight compared with the consumption? Mr. Fox. 1 believe it is, but my knowledge is very vague. Mr. Payne. The amount of increase in the importation of foreign beer has been slight? Mr. Fox. I believe so, but I am not informed as to that; I have no figures. Mr. Taesney. How much of these foreign hops are imported? Mr. Fox. The importation in the last two or three years was a trifle over 6,000 bales of 400 pounds. The American hops are in bales of 180, so that represents a little more than double. Mr. Fitch. M'hat proportion does that bear to the amount of Amer- ican hops raised? Mr. Fox. This year we raised about 240,000 bales of American hops, which is just about the same as last year, and we imported the equiv- alent of 12,000 bales of American hops. Mr. GrEAE. Are you advised as to the cost of the production of hops in foreign countries — say England ? Mr. Pox. The cost is -estimated in England at 20 cents a pound, owing largely to the church tithes. The cost in Germany varies con- siderably, but I believe it is as much certainly as on the Pacific coast on the average, though I am not quite sure on that point. Mr. Geae. You said these imported hops were used for flavoring purposes? Mr. Fox. Yes, sir. Mr. Geae. And the amount would be about 6 cents a barrel added to the cost of the beer ? Mr. Fox. "Where they use it in large quantities, but in some cases less. Mr. Gear. What percentage of the prodirction of the beer industry in this country use these hops for flavoring? Mr. Fox. No, sir; I can not say; but I should think probably one- fourth or one-third. Mr. Geae. You said there were only 12,000 bales of foreign hops imported. Is that about one-fouith ? Mr. Fox. I understood you to ask as to the proportion of the brew- eries of the country. Mr. Geae. I meant product of the breweries, not the number of breweries, but what proportion the hops constitute the jn-oduct of American beer? Mr. Pox. The consumption is about 180,000 bales, and the importa- tion for the last few years has been equivalent in American bales to a little over 12,000. Mr. Geae. Just about 7 per cent of the hops used in the United States are imported hops? 662 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. Fox. Yes, sir. It is a little more than 12,000 bales. The Eng- lish bale is 400 pounds as against 180 pounds; therefore it is a little more than 12,000. Mr. Gear. It would add, theu, G cents a barrel to the cost of the beer to the parties who use it? Mr. Fox. Some use it only iu a very small proportion, perhajjs 5 or 10 per cent, and some 20 and 25 per cent. Mr. Gear. It is about 6 cents a barrel? Mr. Fox. Six cents would be the maximum. Mr. Gear. Theu this tariff would accrue directly against the manu- facturer of beer? Mr. Fox. I should say so. Mr. Gear. It would not help the consumer who buys beer by the glass? Mr. Fox. It would not in the price of the beer. Mr. Gear. Moreover, as regards the flavor, that would only affect about one-third or one-fourth of the product, so that the other three- fourths would drink beer made purely from American hops and would be satisfied ? Mr. Fox. I do not know as to them being satisfied. In some sections of the country there is a good deal of dissatisfaction in regard to the beer. The industry in some locations has been overdone and prices reduced to a point where beer could not be made and be satisfactory. Take Chicago, there has been great complaint of the quality of the beer. I am not speaking now of the few leading breweries in Chicago, but treating it generally; it has been brought in from other sections there. Mr. Gear. What do you mean by other sections, from other parts of the country ? Mr. Fox. Milwaukee, for instance. Mr. Gear. That is fancy. Some fancy the Milwaukee beer, and some fancy the beer of Northern towns. Mr. Fox. I do not know. Mr. Gear. That is the result in my country; some of our people pre- fer the home beer. Mr. Payne. I wish you would figure the average price for the past three years and three years prior to 1890, and see whether the prices do not average for the tliree years prior to the passage of the McKinley act 20 cents a pound, and for the last three years 26| cents, according to the report you present here. Mr. Fox. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Is that imported hops? Mr. Fox. No; domestic hops. The Chairman. The consumer has been paying the tariff then? Mr. Fox. I should say in this connection that we have figures for the last two years by months, and the high prices extended over a very short period, so when the reduction came consequently it reduced it to 26 as an average price instead of 20| cents. The Chairman. During that time had not the price of hops abroad been higher than previously? Mr. Fox. During the last three years? The Chairman. Yes, sir; the price of hops in the English markets? Mr. Fox. During the last two years, certainly; prior to that I do not remember. (Speaking to some one.) Do you remember as to that? A Bystander. Yes; that is so. Mr. Tarsney. What is the excess of the exportation over the impor- tation in bales ? HOPS. 663 Mr. Fox. Wei], figured out in Auierioan bales for the last three years, it would be about 45,000 to 48,000 bales. Mr. BYTf UM. That is, you exj^ort about 70,000 bales and import about 12,000? Mr. Pox. It was a little more than 12,000 last year, and probably 15,000 the year before. Tlie Chaieman. We export both from New York and the Pacific coast? Mr. Fox. Yes, sir. The Chairman. About one-third ot last year's crop, according to your statement, had to be exported? Mr. Fox. Y^es, sir. The Chaieman. That fixes the price, of course, for the home crop also? Mr. Fox. Yes, sir. The Chaieman. So, if the New York farmer is distressed, he is dis- tressed by the competition of the Pacific coast? Mr. Fox. Undoubtedly. The Chaieman. What is the average price of hop lands in the Puyal- lup country, where you are interested ? Mr. Fox. I believe that land is valued at about $500 an acre. The Chaieman. And in New York what is the price of good hop land? Mr. Fox. I think that is given in the census bulletin here. I do not recollect it exactly. I do not think it is as much as that to-day. There has been an enormous reduction in the value of land in the last ten years in New York. The Chairman. As much as $75 an acre? Mr. Fox. Much more than that; 1 should say $200 or $300 an acre. I am not speaking of the poorer sections, but around Waterville, Coop- erstown, Oswego, and Oneida County I should say the value of the land is $200 an acre; perhaps more. Exports and imports of hops, United States of America, in hales of ISO pounds and 400 pounds. Crop of — 1869 1870 1871 1872 ]873 1874 1875 1876 1877, 1878. 1879. 1S80. 1881. 1883. 1883. 1884. 1885. 1880. 1887. 1888. 1889. 1890. 1891. 1892. Exports, bales 180 pounds. 69, 463 56,453 24, 577 6, 0S5 n,3]5 1,638 35,995 40, 116 44, 493 78, 949 34, 749 43, 954 43,027 30, 025 38, 945 80, 403 38, 301 07, 390 1,4.50 01,205 32, 758 34, 030 65,224 64, 230 Imports, bales 400 pounds. 5,800 20, 885 13, 444 2,772 2,094 2, 708 7,047 1, 593 4, 600 18, 499 48, 508 9,035 17, 396 9,437 7,212 6,538 664 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PEOVLSIONS. ]S!"EW ToEK, September 6, 1893. Opening, highest, and lowest prices in New York market for choice "State" hops for the last 31 years. [Hop Eeporting Company, 15-25 "Wliitehall street.] 1862.. 1863.. 1864.. 1865.. 1866.. 1867.. 1868.. 1869.- 1870.. 1871.- 1872.- 3873.. 1874.. 1875.. 1876.. 1877.. 1878.. 1879.. 1880.. 1881.. 1882.. 1883.. 1884.. 1885., 3886.. 1887. 1888. 1889., 1890. 3891. 1892.. Crop of- Prices in September. Opening. Highest. Lowest. Average. Gents. 25 12 40 55 60 65 30 20 35 65 55 50 60 25 Cents. 25 27 50 70 70 65 30 27 35 65 55 55 50 25 Cents. 15 15 18 18 3H 47 35 36 25 60 56 1.10 32 38 30 30 13 30 3(1 30 22 22 27 31 16 28 43 48 164 32 22J 26 15 7 15 66 60 30 10 36 10 55 SO 25 20 15 9 10 12 26 21 23 27 23 10 10 15 13 10 12 17 15!, 21j Cents. 20 17 32.5 02.5 65 47.5 20 21.6 23,5 60 42.6 40 35 20 23.5 12.5 15 36.5 28 36.5 68.5 30.5 20 20 22.6 17.6 23.5 20 32.6 33.75 23.75 Average for 31 years, 31 cents. Respectfully yours, Hop Rkpoeting Company, Emmet Wells, General Manager. HOPS. (Paragraph 279.) STATEMENT OF HON. ADOLPH MEYER, OF THE FIRST DISTRICT OF lOTJISIANA. Mr. Chaieman and Gentlemen op the Committee: I do not wish to speak ou this question, but with your j)ermi8sion I liave a com- munication from the brewing interest in the city of New Orleans. They addressed me in this way. New Orli!ANS, Septeniber 5, 1893. Dear Sir: Tlie Committee of Ways and Means being now in session to deliberate on the revision of the tariff, therefore, we, the undersigned brewers of New' Orleans, La., woukl respectfully asTi you to use your iutluenee to biiug about a reduction in the duty of 15 cents per pound on hops imported into this country, now being imposed under the McKinley bill. This duty is iniquitous, is practically prohibitory, and is in excess of the cost of production. We would urge you to use all the means in your power to have this HOPS. 665 ("Inty decreased to 5 cents per pound, -wliicli would afford ample protection to the farmer and not prove so oppressive to the consumer. We vi'ill appreciate your efi'orts to assist us, and remain, Very respectfully, Nkw Okleans Brewing Association, Pat Blaise, President. Ajierican Brewing Company, Ed. G. Schliedbr, President. Jackson Brewing Company, Valentine Merz, President. Hon. Adolph Meyer, Washington, D. C. Mr. Meyek. This petition represents abont ten breweries in the city of New Orleans, and embraces all of those of any importance. I would simply state that the consumers in New Orleans, those who consume the beer, have a pretty good knowledge of its qualities; and our brew- eries use more foreign hops in the preparation than almost any other section of the country. I am informed they use about one-half hops, which are imported; therefore their interests, of course, are more im- portant than that of many others. Mr. Gbae. Is not that owing to the fact that they get hops cheap from sail vessels from the continental ports? Mr. Metile,. I think it is because they find it necessary for making the best quality of beer. Mr. Payne. Have you any information whether the retail price per glass is the same in New Orleans as it is in Northern cities? Mr. Meyek. I think it is. That is all I have to say. Mr. Eeeb. Who do you mean by the consumer? Mr. Meyee. I mean the men who drink it. HOPS. Hop City, Coopeestown, N. T., September 10, 1893. SiE: I am the largest hop-grower in the State of New York; have always been a Republican, and a firm believer in protection to Ameri- can industries, and believe so still; but as I see the brewers are trying to get the duty reduced on hojjs, T will say that I, for one, will consent to have the duty all taken off from hops if Congress will take it all off from foreign beer; for if this is done it will compel the great bulk of the brewers in this country to make better beer, which will consume more hops, or else the foreign beers, which are so mucli superior, wiU drive them out of business. But unless the duty is taken off from beer, or reduced, it is not fair to reduce it on hops. Yours, truly, James F. Claek. 666 AGRICULTUEAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. POTATOES. Faragrapb 283.) New York, September 5, 1893, Sir: As large importers of potatoes from Great Britain, we write to ask that iu the coming revisiou of the tariff you will give cousideratiou to this article and reduce the present very high duty. There arrived in this city last season 850,000 bags of about 168 pounds each, the specific duty paid was 25 cents per bushel of 00 pounds, net. These potatoes cost on an average 70s. sterling, per ton f. o. b., consequently the duty is at the rate of 55 per cent ad valorem, and we are certain you will agree with us that this is too high. Please remem- ber there are about 65,000,000 of people in this country, all of whom eat potatoes two and three times daily. When we have full crops here it is out of the question to import potatoes, but when our crop is short the foreign potatoes must come in, otherwise the prices which people would be obliged to pay would be exorbitant. Sixty-two millions of consumers against 3,000,000 of producers and these 3,000,000 have been very thoroughly protected in the past at the expense of the 62,000,000 of consumers. We are also importers of onions from Spain and Egypt. These have paid specific duty of 40 cents per bushel of 57 pounds, and on their average cost this has equalled about 100 per cent ad valorem on the Spanish onions and 80 cents ad valorem on Egyptian, \\hich you will acknowledge is also very high. All these onions are eaten by poor peo- ple and we trust you will also reduce the duty on same. The revenue derived from the duty on both foreign potatoes and onions is so small that it does not enter into serious consideration and a reduction in both articles would benefit the masses. Very truly yours, Sgobel & Day. CANNED VEGETABLES. (Paragraph 287.) New York. Septemler 19, 1893. Sir: The duty from 1883 to 1890 was 30 per cent on the vegetables alone. The tins, cases, packing charges, and transportation to the sea- coast were nondutiable, making in reality an average duty of about 15 per cent on the total value of the goods. The McKinley bill has increased duty on pease, mushrooms, flageo- JeU, and haricot verts to 40 per cent on total cost, including tins, cases, and packing, the Macedoine or mixed vegetables comjjosed of j)eaH, flageolets, string beans, carrots, and turnips, were made dutiable at the rate of 45 per cent, being nonenumerated. Truffles were also classed among the none numerated vegetables. We earnestly recommend to your consideration the benefit of a spe- cific, instead of ad valorem duty. This has worked very well on sar- dines, and has entirely i)reveuted fraud. Foreign preserved vegetables with very few exceptions are sold in this market in tins of 500 grams or 18 oirnces called one-half tins, The sijecitic duty or $2.50 per case of 100 tins would amount to 25 per FISH. 667 cent of the aveiage value of goods imported. This would be about 10 per cent ad valorem more duty than these goods paid before the McKinley bill. The other sized tins imported, in very small quantities, are whole tins, one-quarter tins, and one-eighth tins. Specific duty could bo made pro rata. Wemeanby the designation of canned vegetables, pease, mushrooms, flageolets, haricot verts, mixed vegetables, truffles, and artichokes. Truly yours. La Manna, Azbma & Faknan. We respectfully present the following: Tariff act of 1890. Articles. Sched- ule. Para- graph. Eate. Eate suggested. G G G G G G G 270 288 302 306 307 307 326 40 cents per huahel 25 per cent ad valorem. 2h cents per pound... S'cents per pound 3 cents per ponnd 3 cents per ponnd 3 cents per pound J cent per pound. ^ cent Iter ponnd. 3 cents per pound. 1 cent per pound. Free. Sage leaves were free under the tariff act of 1883, see free list, para- graph 1051, "Herbs, leaves," etc., "not enumerated or provided for in this act." Respectfully yours, Henky Noedlingee & Co, FISH. (Faragrapli 393.) Detroit, Mich., September 13, 1893. SiE : A large portion of the supply of the markets of our ISTorthern cities along the boundary line and the northern tier of States in fish is imported from Canada. As fish is a cheap and healthy food that enters largely into the daily consumption of our poorer classes of jieople, we recommend that all tresh- water iish, fresh, frozen, smoked, and salted, be placed upon the free list. We believe that the duties at present collected on a portion of the fish does not amount to a large sum, but it tends to throw the business into the hands of a certain monopoly at Buffalo N. T. By ijlacing fish on the free list without any conditions it would make the fish cheaper to the consumers and place all the deal- ers in our cities on an equal footing. Tours truly, Deteoit Fish Co. Similar communications were received from J. B. Jessup and A. McAlpine, of Detroit. 668 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. New York, September i3, 1893. Sir: I beg to call your attention to the schedule relating to fish, and to some of the effects damaging to the trade interests of this country resulting from the duties and regulations now existing. At the expiration of the treaty of Washington the duties prior to its existence were reinstated, and in the present act they were increased at the rate of 50 per cent increase on dry salt fish, and something less on pickle cured, while fresh and frozen fish, previously always free, were also assessed, though at a smaller percentage. 1 wish to be understood, in my remarks to follow, as referring solely ti > the products of the colony of Newfoundland, and the condititons of trade between that colony and the United States, irrespective entirely of the fisheries and trade of the Dominion of Canada. First, I would suggest that as fish products of this description are consumed almost entirely by the poorer classes, that the imposition of duty is a heavy tax upon a class of people least able to bear it. Secondly, it is necessary to understand the relative position of the products of the Newfoundland fisheries brought into this country, and the products of the American fisheries. To be familiar with the differ- ence in cure, and the resulting different purposes served, and with the fact that, with the exception of pickle-cured fish, 95 per cent of all the Newfoundland fish entered here is again exported to markets where American fish can not be used, and that hence neither in home consumiDtion nor in foreign trade is tlie Newfoundland an injurious or serious competitor of American fish. And of the pickle-cured qualities, a smaller but still large proportion is similarly ex]ooited. This country has been used as a convenient distributing center, or way station, lor Newfoundland flsli, and the existing tariff results in very little revenue to the country, as the fish can by law be entered in bond, and still be distributed to its foreign destinations. However, the inconvenience and difficulty of carrying on the business under the additional exi)cnse • and detail required by the bonding regulations seriously hampers and diminishes its volume, and thereby deprives many good American citi- zens of the emoluments accruing from the transferring, storage, insur- ance, and freighting which they formerly enjoyed. As evidence of the accuracy of this statement we would call attention to the fai'.t that since the imposition of the duties, whicli have necessitated' fish for export to be handled here i]i bond, there have been started two lines of steamers from the British provinces to the West Indies for the purpose of carry- ing fish to those mark(its direct, all of whic-li lormeriy used to come to New York, and be distributed fi'om liere largely in the American lines of steamers plying to Cuba, and other West India, Central and South American ports. Thirdly. The colony of Newfoundland imports all its breadstuffs, XJrovisions, leather, butter, and other products, tlie necessaries of life, as nothing of the sort is produced within its own boundaries. This trade in volume amounts to about $.3,000,000 per annum, and the products are all such as the United States is eminently fitted to supply if the interchange of trade was facilitated to the greatest pos- sible extent. The Newfoundland tariff is a very low one, for revenue purposes only, and makes no discrimination against any of the prod- ucts of the United States, admitting them on a parity with those from Canada, Great Britian, or any other country. The Dominion of Can- ada is now a vei'y serious comjjctitor for the trade of Newfoundland in breadstuffs, i)rovisions, butter, and all the principal articles of imiiort, maintaining a lleet of five steamers from Montreal to St. Johns, New- ALMEEIA GRAPES. 669 foundland, -while it is with difficulty that two small boats are main- tained on the line from ifew York to St. Johns during six months of the year, while there is only freight enough for one boat during the other six months. If the products of the Newfoundland fisheries were admitted here free of duty there would, of course, be some increase in the domestic consumption of their flsh, but there would be a very much larger increase in the quantity, Avhich would come here for dis- tribution to foreign markets, and it is an indisputable fact that the greater vokime of products of theirs which can be drawn here would result in the greater increase of American exports in return, as the proceeds of all such i^roducts sold both for domestic consumption and export, would be invested in American flour, grain, provisions, etc., for return shipments to that colony. At the present time more than 50 per cent of this business is done by the millers and merchants of Canada, whereas this country should do certainly 90 per cent of the whole of it. Fourthly. These prohibitory rates on flsh were imposed at the request of the small fishing element located mainly in Massachusetts, who, finding themselves, at the expiration of the Washington treaty, unable to procure bait and ice and other supplies at British provincial ports necessary to the prosecution of their bank fisheries, Avished to retaliate and coerce the British provinces into according them those privileges without oiiering any proper consideration for them ; and, in order to induce Congress to take up their cause, they raised at that time a great hue and cry about the competition of English fish with the American in these markets. This was purely a political makeshift, as no such competition ever did, or ever can exist, owing to the abso- lutely different characteristics and qualities ofthe two products. Inci- dentally, however, I may say that ISTewfoundland waived all charges for license to purchase bait and ice in all the harbors in that island, and oflered all the privileges of their ports to American fishermen for two seasons, for no return whatever, in the expectation, that the conditions now hampering the handling of fish in this market would have been removed in the Mills tariif bill, and I may say that Senator Mills in- formed me at that time that he, if not indeed his party, fully believed that flsh, being the food of the poor people, should be free of duty, but that at that time it was deemed inexpedient to incur the hostility of the Eastern element. That hostility has, we believe, in a large degree expired from natural causes as the conditions have now become too well known for the legislature to be longer deceived by such a plea. We are, very respectfully, youi-s, HAKVET & OUTEEBKIDGE. AIMERIA GRAPES. (Paragraph 299.) STATEMEITT OF ME. E. L. GOODSELI, OF 103 PABK PLACE, NEW YORK CrTY. Monday, September 4, 1893. Me. Chairman : I come here before you this afternoon by appoint- ment of your honorable chairman to lay a few facts before you concern- ing the importation of the Almeria grape into the United States. The grape will probably be better known to you if I call it the white or Malaga grape. The position I occupy is not at all a partisan one, for 670 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. the simple reason that I am very heavily interested in the Califomia fruit trade, and therefore, necessarily, in California grapes, and I will also say I am very much interested in oar domestic products, so that whatever I say to you this afternoon, Avith all this in view, is decidedly not to the injury of our domestic producers, because, if anything, my interests are more concerned with our domestic growers than in the cause of the Almeria shippers. I want to go into a few details in connection with the grape business, because, pevhaxis, you gentlemen have no knowledge of the industry as it now stands. Almeria is a little shipping point on the Mediterranean Sea, about 100 miles from Gibraltar, and is accessible only by steamer. The interior is fully blocked by very rough country and very high mountains, and no railroad has penetrated it for the in-esent, and probably never will. The country which produces these grapes is about 60 square miles in area. Mr. Gear. This is in Spain? Mr. GooDSELL. Yes, sir; in Spain. I intended to cover that very essential point. Outside of this particular spot of ground these grapes will not grow. The production amounts to 800,000 barrels annually, and in explaining in regard to the barrels I will say that they are, in our sense of the term, a half barrel, being about the same as a flour barrel cut in two. The shocks are manufactured in the United States and sent to Spain. These grapes are of a very hardy character and they are harvested during the months of August and September. The grow- ers cut them from the vines at this period, for the reason storms pervade Spain during the later months, and a storm would simply prevent all operations, for the reason that after a rain it does not mature and does not keep. These grapes are packed in a most unique manner in ground cork dust. The dust is not of the consistency of flour, but is about the substance of sawdust. When put into the barrels in proper condition and not having been rained upon, the grape, strange to say, although conceded by all agriculturists the most tender of all fruits, will keep for almost any length of time up to about the first of May. They have to be shipped, as I say, during the months of August and September and the first part of October as storms prevent doing this thereafter. But on arrival in this country very few find any consu.mp- tion for the reason that the domestic grape is superior in flavor and quality, and in fact almost all arrivals, in fact all of the arrivals, that are brought into the port of Xew York, which is the main source of entry, either go to very far Western points and Canada, where there are no grapes of the domestic kind produced, or they are held by the speculators and merchants In Xew York, I'hiladelphia, and Boston for the market that follows during the months of January, February, and March, when all other green-fruit products are out of supply. There- fore I contend that the Almeria grape in no way interferes with the fair sale at a just value of our domestic product, and as I sell all of these I think I am in a position to speak intelligently on that subject. The domestic grape commences to reach our market during the months of August, September, October, and November. After that time they cease to supply the trade, for two reasons. In the first place, our weather is unsuitable to the continuance of their being harvested, and, in the second place, the nature of the grape is such that it does not keep, and during the montli of November we rarely get real sound, merchantable, domestic grapes. Therefore, while the grapes of Spain and the grapes of the United States are, commercially speaking, "grapes," they do not compete with each other so as to injure the sale ALJIERIA GRAPES. 671 of the domestic fruit to any perceptible extent. Tlie grapes from Spain, as I stated, are puclvcd in cork dust in half barrels, each barrel con- taining about 40 pounds or thereabouts. The duty prior to the McKiuley bill was an ad valorem charge of 20 j)er cent upon the esti- mated cost of the grapes in Almeria. As no cost can be estimated for this fruit, for the reason that none is ever sold or shipped for account of j)roducers in Almeria and the surrounding section, I contend that that is an unsatisfactory way of taxing the imijorts of that fruit. When the McKinley bill was put into operation, none of us having been given an opportunity to present the facts before the proper committee having the bill in charge, and how incorrect the bill is iu one iiarticular, so far as the Almeria grapes are concerned, I will ^ay that iu making up the taxable duty on these the bill reads: Sixty cents per barrel of 3 cubic feet, whereas, as a matter of fact, the Almeria barrels do not contain but 2.05 cubic feet, and in consequence of which impractical action on the part of those who made this bill, a protest has been successfully carried through the board of appraisers, and we haye been compelled to pay duty only upon the proportion of 2.05 cubic feet instead of the 3 cubic feet, so that, while Idonotpretend to advise this committee, I simply suggest that any change that is made should be made upon the Ijasis of a specific duty, as no values can be arrived at, this being determined wholly upon the merits of the fruit when it lands here in America. jMr. Dalzell. Are these barrels invariably of one size? Mr. GooDSELL. These barrels, with the exception possibly of one- tenth per cent, are barrels containing 25 kilos, and I intended to say that the McKinley bill reads, 60 cents per barrel of 25 kilos, containing 3 cubic feet. Mr. Gbae. The kilo being how much — 2.20 pounds? Mr. GoODSELL. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzell. What fixes the capacity of the barrel, is there any- thing, except custom ! Mr. GooDSELL. The shook manufactories do it practically, inasmuch as their machinery made for shooks are of one character. Mr. Dalzell. How much do they pay a pound? Mr. Goodsell. Our old duty was 20 x^er cent, and averaged about 29J cents per barrel- Mr. Payne. A kilo is 2.5 pounds, and these small barrels- Mr. Goodsell (continuing). So that the McKinley bill increases the tariff' just double or a little more than double. Mr. Payne. But you say practically it did not, because these barrels are smaller than 3 cubic feet? Mr. Goodsell. That is an error of the bill, not the fault of the con- structor. Mr, Payne. On these same barrels what do you pay now? Mr. Goodsell. We did pay CO cents, but we appealed to the board of appraisers, and the board of appraisers decided that there should be a rebate of 19 cents, that being about the proportion. Mr. Payne. So you pay 41 cents? Mr. Goodsell. We will probably pay that. We have to iiay, when we take the grapes out of the custom-house, CO cents, and protest the entry, and it goes through the appraisers, and ^ve will get a rebate of 19 cents per barrel. Mr. Pay^ne. Do you import all of these grapes? Mr. Goodsell. I handle the bulk of them. Mr. Payne. As an importer? Mr. Goodsell. Yes, sir. 672 AGRICULTURAI. PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. Payne. Are the Ahneria grapes produced anywhere else except in this territory of which you speak 1 Mr. GooDSELL. No, sir. Mr. Dalzell. Nowhere else in the world! Mr. GooDSELL. iNo, sir. Mr. Payne. Are you not incorrect in statiug that the domestic grapes are not used after the 1st of November? Mr. GOODSELL. They are not sliipped after the 1st of November. All the shipments Mr. Payne. Are not you mistaken in that? Mr. GooDSELL. I do not think so. Mr. Payne. I have had very fine domestic grapes after the holidays. Mr. GooDSELL. These are kept in cold storage. The buyers of these Almeria grapes take and keep them in cold storage. Mr. Payne. Is there any difficulty in keeping domestic grapes in cold storage until spring! Mr. GooDSBLL. I have never seen any of the domestic grapes on the market after the holidays. Mr. Payne. I have seen them after the holidays. Mr. GoODSELL. No, sir; not of good quality. Mr. Gear. How do the prices of these Almeria grapes compare with the prices of domestic grapes ? Mr. GooDSELL. The Almeria grapes are high in price because of the fact a small dealer can purchase a few barrels and put them into stock and not have them knocked down in price, because Mr. Gear. Do not they usually bring 10 or 15 cents a pound? Mr. GOODSELL. The price last season averaged about $4.50 a barrel. Mr, Gear. That would be 12 J cents a pound? Mr. GooDSBLL. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. "\Miat is the average price of the domestic grape? Mr. GooDSELL. The domestic grape varies according to a number of conditions. Mr. Gear. Well, say a good Concord grape? Mr. GooDSELL. They ought to bring 5 cents. Mr. Gear. Now, Catawba? Mr. GooDSEiL. They ought to bring 8 cents and Delaware about 10 cents. Mr. Gear. The Delaware is a fancy grape? Mr. GOODSBLL. Yes, sir. Mr. Hopkins. Is it not a reason that these grapes are carried so long on account of the manner in which they are put up? Mr. GooDSELL. I think that has a good deal to do with it. I think that the nature of the skin of the grape is such that it helps more than anything else. Now^, I think I answered Mr. DalzelPs question as to whether there was any grape of a similar kind grown in any other part of the world by saying "no," and I must qualify that by saying that in California there is produced what is called a Malaga grape. It is similar in kind, variety, and appearance to this Almeria grape. Mr. Gear. Is it not better in quality? Mr. GooDSELL. It is no better in quality. Mr. Gear. We prefer them in the West. Mr. GooDSELL. You know the Malaga grape? Mr. Gear. Yea, sir. Mr. GooDSELL. This Malaga grape, of which I am now handling large quantities from California, has this fault: it does not keep. We ALMERIA GEAPES. 673 have great difflcnlty in getting tliis i'riiit from California in refrig- erator cars that are on tlie way under special fast service not to exceed ten or twelve clays. Mr. Payne. Put up in the same way 1 ]Mr. GooDSELL. K'o, sir; these, are packed in crates, generally 20 pounds to the crate, and the crates are divided into four compartments, and in each basket are 5 pounds of gra])es. The question has been thoroughly canvassed by me in California with the producers there and some experiments have been made with the cork dust, but we find that the same giape of the same nature — and the producers in California tell me that the same slip originally brought from Almeria is the father of all the jMalaga grapes that are grown in California — they tell me that the skin of the grape does not toughen anj'. Mr. Gbab. In other words, the California is the more delicate fruit 1 Mr. GooDSELL. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Do they bring the same price when they are sold in the same condition? Mr. GooDSBLL. The average price for the California grape has been about f 1.25 per single crate of 20 pounds ; that is about six and a quar- ter cents a pound. Mr. DaXiZELL. Does this entire product from Almeria come to this country ? Mr. GooDSBLL. No, sir; the total product of Almeria willbethisseason about 800,000 barrels. The continent of Europe takes about all the crop with the exception of perhaps 250,000 barrels, which will be the average quantity that has come to America for the last five years. Mr. Gear. They are considered rather a luxury '? Mr. GOODSBLL. They are considered a fruit by the dealer, a special fruit, that is on the market when all other fruits of that same character have gone out of the market. Mr. Paynb. How does the price average in this country for the last three years compared with former years? Mr. GooDSBLL. The jjrice for the last three years will average about $4 a barrel, there being one bad year in the three, which cut down the average standard price. Mr. Payne. Well, prior to that, what did it average? Mr. GooDSBLL. The average prior to tliat time was even less than that. The grape has become a very popular one for the reason the trade which handle it feels perfectly secure in purchasing it, which they do not when they buy the domestic product. Mr. Hopkins. Who are the parties who buy these grapes'? Mr. GOODSBLL. I was just going to touch on that. It is a singular fact, that so far as the New York trade is concerned, and I will not say that this does not apply to outside points, those in the trade who buy the Almeria grape, with the exception, perhaps, of 10 per cent, do not deal in the domestic grape, the two liues of trade seemingly having been drawn to the extent that the dealer who makes the Almeria grape a specialty finds it impossible to handle the domestic product. Mr. Hopkins. AVho are these people who consume the Almeria grape! Mr. GooDSBLL. Do you mean the i^eople who buy, or the people who consume them? . Mr. Hopkins. The people who consume them? Mr. GooDSELL. The people who consume them, as this gentleman has said here a-t my right, are the wealthier class of fruiL-eating public. They are considered to be more of a luxury by that class of people, and I T H 43 674 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. venture the opinion, which I can not give any authority for, that the poor pco])]e rathei' prefer the domestic fruit. Mr. Payne. What proportion of the importation of grapes does the Almeria grape constitute ! Mr. (looDSBLL. There are no other grapes imported except the Ahneria. Mr. Dalzell. At 60 cents a barrel you get $150,000 revenue out of it? Mr. G-OODSELL. Yes, sir; I think so. Mr. Hopkins. That is what I was going to find out, the amount of revenues taken in by that importation "I Mr. GO(JDSELL. From that you want to deduct the refund we are now just receiving on the duties we \md hxst year. Mr. Payne. How much was it under the law prior to the ilcKinley biin The Chairman. It was $i;^)7,000 last year. Mr. GooDSELL. The receipts last year were a little less than the year before. Mr. Payne. How much was it under the 20 per cent duty? . Mr. GooDSELL. For rough figures you can take, say; .30 cents a barrel. Mr. Payne. You do not remember the gross amount in 188!)? Mr. GooDSELL. The amount of duty? ^o, sirj I had no means of finding that out. Mr. Payne. Well, we have. The Chairman. I do not understand how you take 30 cents a barrel at 20 i^er cent duty when you said the barrel was worth $4? Mr. Goodsell, It is not a question of what the barrel is worth here; it was a question of the custom which established the value at the point of shipment. Mr. Gear. That would be $1.50 a barrel at the point of shipment? Mr. Goodsell. Yes, sir. The domestic grape growers, I think ; I have not talked with them to any very great extent, but I think they fully appreciate the fact that the Almeria grape does not injure the sale of the domestic product at all. Mr. Gear. What is the freight per barrel from Almeria to New Y^ork ? Mr. Goodsell. The freight is 40 sliillings i)er ton of 40 barrels. Mr. Gear. That is 25 cents a barrel ? Mr. Goodsell. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. That, added to the valuation, would make the cost $1.75 in New York ? Mr. Goodsell. No, sir; estimating the value at about $1.50 in Almeria and freight 25 cents and the duty 60 cents would make the total cost .$2.35. Mr. Gear. But you take oft' 19 cents from the $2.35 ? Mr. Goodsell. Yes, sir; but you have not made any allowance for the cost of the cork dust and barrel, and that is a very material factor, the shooks having to be brought from the United States. Mr. Gear. But that is included in the j)rime cost ? Mr. Goodsell. No, sir. Mr. Gear. You add the (;ost of the shooks and the barrel ? Mr. Goodsell. The cost of the bari'el and cork dust is about 20 cents. Mr. Gear. It looks to me like it was undervalued very much under the old law; how does it look to you ? Mr. Goodsell. If it was possible to estimates the value at the point" of shipment by the seUing price, that is possible, but Mr. GEA.R. Then they must be undervalued according to that. ALMERIA GRAPES. 675 Mr. GooDSELL. But there is a risk of their not coming in in a proper condition. Mr. Gear. You have just stated that the fruit is an exception, as they keep ? Mr. GooDSELL. It does when they arrive here sound. Mr. Gear. What percentage of a cargo comes in unsound? Mr. GooDSELL. Well, that's a pretty hard question to answer off- hand. 3Ir. Gear. If you are a dealer you ought to be able to answer it. Mr. GooDSBLL. I should imagine that 50 per cent of a cargo reaches here sound ; what the dealers would call sound and what they would purchase for putting in store. Mr. Payne. Have you ever had any actual experience in packing California grapes in cork dust? Mr. GooDSELL. K"o, sir; I have not. We are going to make some experiments this winter. I am, as soon as it is possible, preparing to send on some of these barrels and cork dust to my California shippers. There is one grape produced in California that it is possible may be utilized in that similar way to the Almeria grape, and that is the grape called the Tokay. You have probably seen it here in Washington. The grapes are a very deep, rich red, and they are now just com- mencing to come forward. The skin of the Tokay grape is similar in character to the Almeria grape. Mr. Whiting. I think you stated the poor people prefer the domes- tic grape? Mr. GOODSELL. Yes, sir. Mr. Whiting. Why do you think that? Mr. GooDSELL. Largely ou account of the price. I think if the Almeria grapes were cheaper they would take them as readily. Mr. Whiting. They get these grapes at a time they can not get any other grapes? Mr. GooDSELL. They get the imported grapes, yes, sir. Mr. Whiting. And anybody who wishes grapes for any purpose, whether for sickness or anything else, are obliged to take these imported Almeriau grapes? Mr. GOODSELL. Yes, sir; that is true. The doctors in JSTew York have conceded the Almerian grapes, put into the sick room during the months of February, March, and April, are a very great boon to those who need something of that kind. Mr. Hopkins. Do you mean to say that the domestic grape can not be purchased here during the months of February, March, and April in good condition! Mr. GOODSELL. I have never seen any. Mr. Hopkins. Do you mean to say they can not be had? Mr. GooDSELL. Well, nothing is impossible. Mr. Payne. I suppose every member of this committee had them on the table last February. Mr. Whiting. I did not. Mr. Payne. Well, I had them. Mr. Gear. Is it not a matter of fact that the Concord, Catawba, and the Delaware are considered a better edible grape than this by a majority of the people? Mr. GoODSELL. I think that a majority of the people would answer your question in the affirmative, that the domestic ^rape has a better flavor. 676 AGfUlCULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. Hopkins. What has been the.price of the Almeria grapes in the market during the last five years, the average price? Mr. GooDSELL.' The average price during the last three years— I can not give you for the five for the reason I have not estimated the figures — has been about $4. Last year the average was $4..50 a barrel. This is to the jobbing trade, which, of course, deals them out to the retailer, and the retailer deals them out to the men who sell them. Mr. Hopkins. That is due, is it not, to a bad year for grapes — one of those years, I think yon stated, was a bad year? Mr. GooDSELL. Tes, sir; one year was not a good year and they landed in a bad condition. Mr. Hopkins. Can you give the average price for the three years preceding those? Mr. GooDSELL. It was slightly lower; I can not give the figures. Mr. Hopkins. Was it any appreciable amount lower? Mr. GooDSELL. Tes, sir; 50 cents a barrel. Mr. Payne. What do these grapes retail at? Mr. GooDSELL. It depends largely on the character of the grape. There are two qualities of grape grown in Almeria, one on the moun- tain side at a place caUed Alabama. These vines aie on a sloping hill- side and x)roduce a grape that is called the innk grape. It has a slight pinkish tiuge to the bunch; in fact it is on the surface of the grape. This grape sells sometimes as high as $10 a barrel. Mr. Payne. By the pound, it would be how much? Mr. GooDSELL. That would be 25 cents a pound. And then there is a class of grapes produced on the lowlands, the flat lands, at places called Bentanque, Oanyaya, and Terque, that only bring -f 3 a barrel and rarely reach $3.50 a barrel. Mr. Payne. How much is that a pound? Mr. GOODSELL. That would be about 8 cents a pound. I take the average of, say, $3 to $3.50 a barrel. The pink grapes, many of them, do not bring $10 a barrel. I am only giving you the extreme, but the green grapes as a rule wiU sell throughout the entire season at $3 to $3.50, and if for existing crop conditions or because the grapes are not keeping well, or on account of rain, which has damaged the crop in Al- meria, it is frequently the case we are obliged to take for the common grades $1.50 to $2 a barrel, and I have sold, them as low as 25 cents a barrel. Mr. Payne. Suppose the duty is redirced from 41 cents to 29 cents; how many pounds are there to the barrel? Mr. GooDSELL. There are supposed to be 40 pounds net. Mr.PAYNE. That would be one quarter of a cent a pound; how much of that do you suppose the poor people would get in case of sickness in the spring? Mr. GooDSELL. That is a supposition that would be very difficult to answer intelligently, and I would not venture to exi)ress an opinion, because I think you are as fully competent to answer that as I am ; but I do say this, that the importation the year the McKinley bill went into effect decreased one- third, because of the increase of duty and the price increased one- third. This third year was when grapes were low. In consequence of the decrease in importation our prices have been higher, strange to say, on account of the less supply coming forward, and the poor people, in my opinion, stand a great deal less chance of getting these grapes in February, March, and April at a very reason- able sum, with a duty at 60 cents a barrel, than they Avill if you put it back to the old duty of 29 cents. ALMERIA GRAPES. 677 Mr. Whiting. In country towns you can not get anything but these grapes. They do not have them on sale, and if a person wants grapes for any purpose he must take these Almeria grapes? Mr. GooDSELL. That is true. The gentlemen is correct in saying we are only paying 41 cents duty, but you must remember that this decision has been just rendered and the Almeria grape season com- mences in September and ends in ISTovember, so the Almeria grower — at the present time he may have mail advices — but up to the time he received advices from me had no idea but what he was paying CO cents a barrel. Mr. Payne. Ton think the grower pays this difference? Mr. GooDSELL. We charge it to him on the account sales. Mr. Payne. You think the grower pays this difference in duty ; he pays it over there? Mr. GooDSELL. We charge all expenses to the grower, yes, sir. Mr. Dalzell. So that the $137,000 or $138,000 was taken out of the Almeria grape growers? Mr. GooDSELL. Those, I think, are the gross iigures, I did not have Mr. Whiting. The consumer here had to pay it? Mr. GOODSELL. They paid it doubly. Mr. Payne. They paid it at both ends — the grower in Almeria and the people here? The people here not only paid the one-quarter cent a pound extra to get them, but on your idea they paid from 4 to 10 cents a pound extra? Mr. GooDSELL. I believe they do, sir. Mr. Payne. We want to get your facts and we will construct the theories. Mr. Hopkins. As I understand you, whenever you send over to the Almeria grower you give him the price less the amount of duty imposed by the McKinley bill? Mr. GOODSELL. In the first place, I want to tell you about the diffi- culties which these people contend with. They live in the back country and they grow in this little province, as I say, 800,000 barrels of grapes annually. These barrels are all brought to the seaport town of Almeria, which practically does not produce a pound of grape; they are brought in ten-barrel lots on the backs of donkeys over mountain roads, some growers bringing them 20 miles from the interior, and that expense alone, taking the time into consideration, is of course a very great hardship to them. Now, to answer your question, because that hinges somewhat on that Mr. Hopkins. I was asking you, when you sent over there to make your purchase from the Almeria grower you deducted the duty imposed by the McKinley bill from the price you otherwise pay themf Mr. GOODSELL. These goods are sent to us on consignment, and they are sold at public auction. We issue what is called a price catalogue, and each grower's name, which is branded on the barrel, is duplicated in the catalogue. This catalogue shows the nameof the grower, the num- ber of barrels, and the price realized. We take all these facts, put them on our account sales, deduct the freight and duty which we ]iay and other selling expenses, including our commission, and remit liim the balance. Mr. Hopkins. So that in every instance the Almeria grower pays the McKinley duty? Mr. GooDSBLL. Yes, sir. 678 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. The Chairman. Which you, as agent or vendee, re-collect from the people of this country? Mr. Dalzell. The chairman asks you whether or not, as agent, you re-collect that; you do not remit him the duty? Mr. G-OODSBLL. Oh ! yes, sir. Mr. Dalzell. Tou send back what you collect by increasing the price? Mr. GooDSELL. No; the refund Mr. Dalzell. I am not talking about a refund. I am talking about your taking the duty out in the Inrst place which you pay under the McKinley biU; you never send him that, do you; you never send him that account? Mr. GooDSELL. 'So, sir ; we simply deduct from the gross sales the total expenses, and in the total expenses is the duty and all other charges which we pay. Mr. Dalzell. But the point of the chairman's question was, you, as his agent, assessed this duty on the American public, and now I want to know whether you, as agent, sent back or kept this? Mr. GoODSELL. We do not assess anything on the American public. These grapes are sold at public auctions to the highest bidder, and by reason of the law of supply the growers now see their way clearly to pay 60 cents a barrel. I do not want to say the American public pay, Ijutit is simply a question of supply and demand, owing to a curtail- ment of supi)ly, with an increasing demand from the small towns throughout our entire United States who are dependent in a very great extent upon Almeria grapes as their only green fruit. Mr. Gbae. Is it not true that a large majority of the consumption of these grapes are by people who are wealthy and accustomed to luxury? Mr. GooDSBLL. I think in the last two years Mr. Whiting. They find their way into every country town in the United States. Mr. GooDSELL. Tes; I believe they find their way throughout the United States right tip to the borders of California. Mr. Hopkins. You have nothing to do with the retail trade, have you ? Mr. GOODSELL. I know this about it, sir : we also have to extend credit Mr. Hopkins. But do you have anything to do with the retailer? Mr. GooDSBLL. Not with the retailer; the jobber. Mr. Hopkins. Tou deal with the jobber? Now, what the jobber does with this you do not know? Mr. GooDSBLL. These small country towns are practically jobbers, because they employ what are called brokers in New Tork, and a broker comes to our sale and purchases, say, 20 barrels of those grapes. Mr. Payne. Do the small country towns employ these brokers? Mr. GooDSELL. Oh, yes, sir ; we sell through brokers to perhaps half of the small places throughout the United States. Mr. Whiting. Each State would have a broker who would supply the State. Detroit would have a broker who would, perhaps, supply Michigan? Mr. GooDSELL. Detroit and all of those towns have jobbing houses; but small towns throughout the country employ brokers, who make a specialty of btiying goods for out-of-town houses, charging them a small brokerage on each package. Mr. Payne. Can you tell us how many barrels were imported last year? ALMERIA GRAPES. G79 Mr. GooDSELL. About 221,000. Mr. Payne. How uuiuy the year before? Mr. GoODSELL. 2-17,000. Mr. Payne. How mauy the year before tliati Mr. GooDSELL. 276,000. Mr. Payne. How many the year before that? Mr. GooDSELL. I think there were 310,000 the year prior to the McKiuleybilh Mr. Payne. How many the year before that? Mr. GoODSELL. I can not give those figures exactly. Mt. Payne. Yoxx think the reason last year you had a less importa- tion than the year before, and the year before that, was because the grape-growers were receiving less for their grapes? Mr. GooDSELL. I hope I did not say that. Mr. Payne. You said there Avas a less supply sent here because they had to pay more duty, and if they had to pay more duty they received less for grapes ? Mr. GooDSELL. That, theoretically, may be correct. Mr. Payne. Why did not they send more? Mr. GooDSELL. The grower in Spain is a man, I am sorry to say, uot altogether intelligent, and if he thinks he is comx^elled to pay more than he ought to he will act on one line of policy. Outside of that, geutlemen, please remember that America is by no means the only outlet for these grapes. The countries in Europe use them in immense quantities without duty, except France. Mr. Payne. "Will ytra tell us how much the grape-growers received for their grapes from this country in 1890 — the gross amount? idr. GooDSELL. I have not the figures. Mr. Payne. Can yon furnish those for the last three years. Mr. GooDSELL. I would prefer to send them to you in writing. Mr. Payne. Por how many years back? Mr. GooDSELL. I can go four years back and give you the exact figures. Mr. Payne. You can not go further than that? Mr. GooDSELL. No, sir. Mr. Payne. I wish you would send us the figures for the last four years. Mr. GooDSELL. I will send them; to your chairman, I suppose. Mr. Payne. Yes, sir; I do not care how they come,just so we get them. I want to ask you this further question : Suppose these Almer- ian grapes are removed from the cork dust, will they keep any length of time then? Mr. GooDSELL. I do not think so. I think the grapes in the barrels, rubbing against each other, would so bruise the skin as to cause the juice of the grape to get out, and that would start fermentation. You see, these grapes are packed in layers Mr. Payne. I have never seen them exhibited for sale except taken out of the cork dust. I have seen them o)i the shelves and on counters. Mr. GoODSELL. I think they keep fairly well. Mr. Payne. Then it is the packing which keeps them, really? Mr. GOODSBLL. Yes, sir; and the peculiarity of the skin. Mr. Payne. They will not keep any better than any other grape without that packing, would they? Mr. GOODSELL. I think so. The American grape has a comparatively short capacity to endure Mr. Payne. Have yon had a practical experience of that kind? 680 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. GooDSELL (continuing). Whereas if you iDut the Almeria grape into barrels and put it into the hold of a steamer and close that steamer up twenty days I think it is Mr. Gear. Is not the keeping capacity owing to the fact that there is less juice in the Almeria grape and more solid matter? Mr. GooDSELL. I think that has a good deal to do with it. Mr. Payne. Has the use of the California grape increased in the last few years ? Mr. GooDSELL. Very largely, and at an increased advance in price. Mr. Payne. So that the malaga grape has felt the competition? Mr. GoODSELL. I do not think so. Mr. Payne. At least it has increased upon our market in the last four years? Mr. GooDSELL. The increase has been simply because of the increased production. Mr. Payne. There has been an increase of that grape u]pon the market? Mr. GooDSELL. Do you mean the California grape? Yes, sir. Mr. Whiting. Why do the American grape-growers like to have a duty upon this imported grape; do they desire that for the sake of having the Government derive a larger income, is that their object? Mr. GOODSBLL. I can hardly speak for the grape-grower. Mr. Whiting. Do not they wish to restrict competition and get a better price for their product? Mr. GooDSELL. If I was a grape-grower I should think so, but there is no competition here. I claim that the two grapes do not compete. Perhaps you were not here when I said that 1 am a large dealer in all kinds of grapes, foreign and domestic. Mr. Whiting. The grapes were not competing in the market, for the time had passed ; there were no other grapes to be supplied. Mr. GooDSELL. I quite agree with you in one thing. I have been in the New York fruit business for fifteen years and I have never seen a good domestic grape after the holidays. Mr. Whiting. They would not sell poor grapes if they did not have anything else? Mr. GooDSBLL. No, sir. Mr. Whiting. To a limited extent, perhaps, for certain purposes? Mr. Payne. They do put them on. I want to ask whether these foreign grapes are sold on this market in October, November, and December? Mr. GooDSELL. They are sold during the months of October and November and December. Mr. Payne. They do not wait until the domestic grape goes out of the market? Mr. GooDSELL. No, sir; but as a matter of fact, while the domestic grapes are in New York — and I think this applies to all other fruit centers — we can not find a local demand for Almeria grapes. Mr. Gear. Those are more abundant and cheaper? Mr. Payne. The native grape competes with you wherever these meet with the native grape? j\lr. Goodsell. It curtails the demand. Mr. Gear. Is it not true that the American grape, being more plen- tiful and cheap, pleases most the general public? Mr. Goodsell. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzell. What do you think ought to be the duty? Mr. Goodsell. I think that everyone wcfuld be satisfied, both the ALMEEIA GRAPES. 681 domestic grape-grower as well as the Almeria shixiper, if the duty was restored to the old rate, making it a specific dirty. Mr. Dalzbll. That was 30 cents a barrel? Mr. GooDSELL. Yes, sir. Mr. BuKEOWS. Did you say that this grape does not come in com- petition with any of the graioes grown in tliis country ? Mr. GooDSELL. Yes, sir; the grape does not come in competition with the grape produced in this country to the detriment of those grown here. Mr. Gear. Is not that by reason of the better quality of grape grown 1 You know we grow grapes in this country. Mr. GooDSELL. We do; the States of ISTew York, California, and Ohio are large-producing grape centers. Mr. Gear. How do you think it would affect that industry if we took the duty off or lowered the duty'? Mr. GooDSELL. I think the record will show prior to the McKinley bill the grape-growers of this country got a better price for their products than they have since the McKinley bill was passed, whether that had any effect on it or not. Mr. Dalzell (to Mr. Whiting). I understand your theory is to take off the duty would bring down the price of the American products? Mr. Whiting. I think it would to a certain extent. Mr. Dalzell (to Mr. Goodsell). Do you think that is so? Mr. Goodsell. Make grapes free? Mr. Dalzell. Would that bring down the price of the American grapes ? Mr. Goodsell. Not materially, and for this reason: The total capable productive section of Almeria is not to exceed 900,000 barrels. Of that 900,000 barrels Europe will take at least 600,000 a year, and I think we will have an importation into this country under the most favorable circumstances not to exceed 300,000 to 350,000 barrels. Mr. Payne. That being so, does not Europe fix the price by taking it in larger quantities; does not the market of Europe fix the price? Mr. Goodsell. The market of Europe has nothing whatever to do with ours. Mr. Payne. Then it has nothing to do with the diminishing supply in Almeria? Mr. Goodsell. The markets of London and Liverpool and Glasgow and Hull last year were equally as good as New York. Mr. Payne. If the market is better there they will send their grapes there insteadof sending them to this country? Mr. Goodsell. That might hold but for the fact that by the time the first large sales of grapes are held here in America and elsewhere almost all of the grapes of Spain are in transit. Mr. Payne. So if this year they get a good market in London, Glasgow, and other places iii Europe and do not get a good market here the next year they will send the most of the crop to the best place? Mr. Goodsell. No, sir; I do not think so. I think the markets in London and New York will take about so many at a good price, and when an excess of that quantity has been shipped then they expect to receive lower prices. Mr. Hopkins. Then the demand in London and New York fixes the amount of grapes shipped to those respective points? Mr. Goodsell. Not altogether; there is a system of advances which have been made to the grower, who is rather poor in Sj)ain. The volume 682 AGRICULTURAL PEODUCTS AND PROVrsiONS. of business which goes to the various markets outside of the United States where no advauces are made controls the volume of trade. ]\lr. Geab. Are any of these grapes shipped from Almeria to France? Mr. GooDSELL. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. What is the average duty — I think you said there was a duty? Mr. GooDSELL. I think the duty is 20 per cent. Mr. Hopkins. According to your statement the McKinley bill raised the duty on these grapes quarter of a cent a pound? Mr. GOODSELL. Net, that is. Mr. Hopkins. Is that the amount of duty you want taken off, or do you want these grapes put on the free list? Mr. GooDSELL. No, sir; I would not like to see them put on the free list. Mr. Payne. Why not? Mr. GooDSELL. I think all imports in this country should pay a tribute to the country. Mr. Dalzell. Would not you have any free list at all I Mr. GooDSBLL. Not on the goods I am dealing in; I am not a cham- pion of the entire imports. Mr. Dalzell. I understood you to make that statement. Mr. GoODSELL. I am simply referring to my business. If the goods were placed on the free list I think the domestic fruit would not suffer, but I do not advocate it. I think that a perfectly ju.st duty was the one that obtained prior to the passage of the McKinley bill, and that was about 30 cents a barrel. Mr, Whiting. That was best for the importer? Mr. GooDSELL. I think we could supply grapes sufSoient to make a widespread demand at prices at which peoi^le of moderate means could enjoy the fruit. Mr. Payne. Would you have it specific or ad valorem? Mr. GooDSELL. I would have it specific. Mr. Hopkins. If these grapes were put on the free list it would in- crease the importation to this country? Mr. GooDSELL. I think it would. Mr. Hopkins. To what extent? Mr. GooDSELL. I think jierhaps we would get 400,000 barrels per annum. Mr. Hopkins. T asked you that in view of the statement you made a few minutes ago that the surplus only was shipped to America; you tliiiik they would use less of these grapes in Europe? Mr. GooDSELL. I think they would ship them here in the hopes of getting better prices. Mr. Hopkins. If they are on the free list, how can the price go higher in this country I Mr. GOODSELL. No, sir; lower. Mr. Hopkins. You would get a lower and the producer get a higher price? Mr. GOODSELL. I did not mean to make that statement. I said that he would send it here in tlie hopes of getting this. This Spanish grape-grower is not a man of high intelligence. Mr. Hopkins. That may be true for one year, but after that, if he learns it does not produce the result mentioned, what will he do? Mr. GooDSELL. The probability is the countries in Europe will get the bulk of the supply. Mr. Hopkins. Then it would drop back to the fact that the American Almeeia grapes. 683 ■would simply get the surplus of tlie grapes not taken by the European countries'? Mr. GooDSBLL. In the first place — above a certain point — because the European market takes so many anyway; but with an importation of 400,000, we can sell good grajies here on the basis of the old duty at, say, from $2.50 to $3 a barrel, and we place these grapes within the means of a great many jieople that are at present deprived of their use on ac- count of the high price. Mr. G-EAR. You would like the duty to be 30 cents specific? Mr. GooDSELL. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. The duty is 41 now? Mr. GooDSELL. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. How much less would the American consumer get these grapes; say the people, the consumers f Mr. GooDSELL. I think the consumer would benefit, by the decrease in the duty between 30 and 41 cents, at least 50 cents a barrel, and pos- sibly more. Mr. Gear. Tliat would be a cent and a quarter a pound! Mr. Hopkins. Y'ou do not mean to say, if you have a duty of one- fourth cent a pound taken off, you can sell to the consumer at 1^ cents a pound less"? Mr. GooDSBLL. I say, in my opinion there would be an increased importation to an extent that the demand would not be so keen as to cause prices to rule 50 cents a barrel lower, I think. Mr. Payne. Is it not a fact that these grapes have been retailed out of stores in the last three years lower per pound? Mr. GooDSBLL. I do not think so. Mr. Payne. Do you know "? Mr. GOODSELL. If it did, it is a loss to the retailer. Mr. Payne. Do you know whether it is or not? Islv. GOODSELL. I can not go through the country and estimate what the dealers retail them ibr. Mr. Hopkins. Then it is pure speculation on your part when you say it is more consumjjtion which will save 1^ cents to the consumer? . Mr. GooDSBLL. It is not speculation, for the reason that prior to the McKinley bill there were more consumed at lower prices. Mr. Hopkins. Now, is not your position here that you want the duty lowered because you are an importer, and you think it would be to your benefit as an importer in handling these goods if you can have the duty reduced? Mr. GooDSELL. It would be absurd for me to come in here pro bono imhllco, a man doing a charitable act. I come here for business. Selfish reasons to benefit myself and the Spanish grower, and think I would be very foolish to do anything else. Mr. Whiting. Suppose the European countries were to raise a duty, and have it equal to the American duty, do you think the Spanish grower would raise grapes and pay that duty and not have an increase in price? These folks here try to make out that they are ready to pay that; but could they cheerfully stand that increased duty and furnish grapes at the old price? Mr. GooDSELL. I shall have to answer that by assuming myself to be a grower; if I was a grower I would not. Mr. Whiting. They can not pay the duty. The Chairman. The selfish purpose you have is that you charge the grower for the sale of these grapes, and if you sell them clicaper you will have a larger demand for them ? Mr. GooDSELL. The volume of business, of course, is what pays me, 684 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. and therefore I want to see them sell lower and bring less money, and I want to see a larger demand for these grapes throughout the United States. Mr. Gear. Do you get a commission by the cargo or pound? Mr. G-OODSBLL. I get a commission on the gross sales. I am also a member of a London house, and we do a very large business in advanc- ing, and therefore it is to our benlit to see the crops are marketed to the very best possible extent. Mr. Gear. If you have 100,000 barrels more than you get now, your commission will be increased by that amount; therefore, it is to your interest that you should get in the largest amount possible? Mr. GooDSELL. Yes, sir. The Chairtnian. You believe the way to get in a larger amount is to be able to seU to the consumer cheaper! Mr. GooDSELL. Yes, sir; I think that is the only way. The Chairman. So it is a little selfishness in the interest of the con- sumer of grapes as well as involving a commission? Mr. GooDSELL. I think a very material reason why the duty on grapes should be reduced is because the general public will benefit. The rich people who can aftbrd to buy the Almeria grape will buy it if you put a duty of a dollar a barrel on it, but the poor people who can not afford the luxuries of life at a high price will buy them at a medium price if they can be gotten. Mr. Dalzell. If you make the Almeria producer pay the duty on the product what difference does it make to the consumer? Mr. GooDSELL. I think that question was gone into when it was shown here that the increase of duty cut off' our shipments. Mr. Hopkins. Have you any statistics to show what the retail price of Almeria grax)es has been during the last three years ? Mr. GooDSBLL. I do not think it would be possible to get it accu- rately. I can furnish it to the committee, so far as the New York market is concerned. Mr. Hopkins. Can you furnish the retail price of Almeria grapes for three years preceding the year 1890. Mr. GOODSELL. Prior to the McKinley bill I will certainly try to do so. Mr. Hopkins. At present you have no figures? Mr. GooDSBLL. No, sir. Mr. Payne. What percentage of the importations are carried over from the first of January? Mr. GooDSELL. I should judge fully 75 per cent are carried over of the total importation from the first of January in the hands of shippers and those who buy to speculate. Mr. Payne. Is the price higher after the first of January than prior thereto? Mr. GooDSBLL. That depends entirely on how the fruit keeps, and is governed wholly by the character of weather we have. Two years ago it was quite warm in January and February and seriously huit the fruit that had been put in store by the iiurchasers, so they had to sell for much less than they had bought it. Mr. Payne. If the fiuit keeps well it sells after the first of January for inore than before the first of January? Mr. GooDSELL. Yes, sir, necessarily; these men are always buying to speculate, and they charge a percentage on the buying price as much as they possibly can. ALMEEIA GRAPES. 685 Mr. Payne. There has not been a change on account of this quarter of a cent a pound duty? Mr. GooDSELL. Yes, that has been taken into consideration. Mr. Hopkins. WJiat is the name of your London house? Mr. GooDSELL. Campion, Goodsell & Company. Mr. Hopkins. Where are they? Mr. Goodsell. 15 Philpot Lane, London. I would be very glad to have them furnish you with any particulars in regard to what is being done in London. We have full statistics, and your committee can either write direct, or I will Avrite. Mr. Burrows. Did you come before the committee at their sugges- tion? Mr. Goodsell. I came of my own suggestion. Gentlemen, if I have been raked over the coals sufficient to bring the duty down to 30 cents Mr. Payne. Do you deal in any other kind of fruit? Mr. Goodsell. Yes, sir; I sell California fruit. Mr. Payne. Do you deal in any other kind of fruit besides grapes? Mr. Goodsell. Yes, sir. I thank you very much for the hearing you have given me, and I only hope that the facts which I shall lay before you later will have some bearing on your reducing this duty to at least the old figures, for I do not believe the interests of the general public are served by continuing the duty at 60, or 41, as probably will be this year. Mr. Whiting. Yon think we would get nearly as large a revenue with a reduction as now? Mr. Goodsell. I think there will be a larger revenue with the in- creased demand, besides the benefit the poor people can derive from having this fruit which they could not get before. Mr. Hopkins. And lowering the revenue will be a great benefit to the growers of the Almeria grape? Mr. Goodsell. It will be a benefit in this sense, he is not an edu- cated man and he takes the reduction just as he takes the advance. He thought the advance was going to ruin the entire shipping trade with America and the reduction will nesessarily have as great a weight the other way, in my opinion. They look upon the McKinley bill as a very great ogre. Mr. Burrows. They do not like it? Mr. Goodsell. No, sir. Eeferring to my communication printed in conjunction with the tariff revision, I would say that the figures given as to the quantity of importations covered the number of barrels received in New York only. Statistics of Almeria grapes in barrels received and sold in English markets ditring the last five years, u'ith estimated average prices. Year. Liverpool. London. Estimated Gla.scow, Hull, and Bristol. Total. Estimated average pritH! per barrel. Retail priee per pound (about). • 1888 Ban-els. 22] , CSl 218, 210 356, 440 28:i, 306 194, 695 Barrels. 112, 800 ]32,2:;4 223, .134 161, 724 128, 620 Barrels. 70, OUO 70, 000 115.000 85, 000 65, 000 Barrels. 404, 480 420, 444 694, 883 530, 090 378, 315 S. 8 9 10 U 6 7 8 n 12 13 Cents. 1889 g 1890 7 1891 8 1892 9 Remarks.— The fif^Lires of imports in Liverpool aud London are exact; tliose of GHs^ow, Hnll, and Bristol are estimated, as no statistics are kept in I hose ports. The average price is estimated aa nearly as possible. The retail price is usually from 4^^. to M. per pound, excejot in tiiues of great scarcity, say from February onwards. 686 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. GRAPES. (Paragrapli 299.) IMPORTED GRAPES. Philadelphia, September 5, 1893. Dear Sir: Having seeu in this morning's papers that Mr. E. L. Goodsell, of New York, had been before your committee in regard to Almeria and Malaga grapes, and liad advocated the return to the duty paid before the McKiuley bill was passed, I beg to offer the following, which I think to be just to the grower, shipper, importer, and consumer, namely : That instead of an ad valorem duty, as paid before the wretched McKinley act, that a si)ecific duty be placed on the imported grapes, viz, on the ordinary kegs or barrels, 2.5 cents each; and on the ordinary half kegs or barrels, 13 cents each. The imijortations will become three times what they are now, and the foreign grape can not in any way interfere with the domestic, being of an entirely different quality and nature. Yours, very respectfully. Paul Pohl, Jr. rRUNES AND PLUMS. (Paragraph 299.) IN RELATION TO THE DUTITSS ON PRUNES AND PLUMS. New York, iSeptemher 15, 1893. Act of 1883. Schedule G, paragraph 708. 1 cent per pound. Act of 1890. Schedule G, paragraph 299. 3 cents per pound. Sir: These goods were imported in large quantities under the for- mer tariff. Under the latter importations have been reduced to a minimum. The large bulk of the importations under the old tariff consisted of the variety grown in Bosnia and Servia and commonly called " Turkish prunes." The chief consumers of these were the poorer classes, who bought them because they were cheap food. Taking to-day's market price in Europe as a basis thepreseut duty is just about 100 per centad valorem. Under the old rate of duty the Government was in receipt of a considerable revenue ft-oin the duties paid on these articles; now it receives practically nothing, the present rate being virtually prohibitory. Why, then, was the duty raised in 1890? We were told it was a measure of protection to an infant industry — the California fruit industry. The Oalifornia fruit trade was born and reared and gTew strong and healthy under the old tariff', as it would have done without any duty at all, and the most striking result of the advance in duties has been a continual scheming and planning on the part of the California fruit-growers to form a combination, a union, an alliance — a trust to advance prices on the consumer. We ask that the duty on prunes and plums be made one-half cent per pound. This will bring the articles within the reach of the poor consumer, and will in addition make them a source of considerable revenue to the Government. Yours, respectfully, Henry 2>;ordlinger & Co. NUTS AND ALMONDS. 687 NUTS AND ATjMONDS. (I'ariigraphs 300-309.) MEJIOEIAL OP TARIPP ON NUTS AND ALMONDS. Tn accordance with the present taxation in the import duties on nuts in the shell and shelled nuts there is a great injustice done to the nut-growers aud to the dealers and manufacturers of shelled nuts. The tariff on these two articles is not in the right proportion to each other. Before the McKinley bill was in force there was for many years very fcAY shelled nuts imported, as confectioners and kitchens bought nuts in the shell and opened them by hand. About six or seven years since an Industry has grown up in Prance and Italy and other nut- growing countries by which the nut kernels or meat are extracted from the nuts by certain machines. Since that time it has been a sei^arate business to import shelled nuts into this country, and it can iiow be con- sidered that more than half of all the nuts used here have been opened in foreign countries as stated before. The import of shelled nuts was very small years ago and our wise lawgivers were right not to make any difference in the imjiort duties between shelled nuts and nuts in shell. The McKinley bill, taking into consideration the change that has occurred since a few years ago, has made a change in the tariff, but not to the benefit of consumers here, nor to the advantage of the nut- growers in this country, but only to raise dutiesin anunjustwajjtothe sole advantage of foreign manufacturers. . In accordance with the present tariff the unjust duties on walnuts and filberts in the shell is 3 cents per pound while the duties on shelled nuts is 6 cents per pound. As it takes 3 to 3:^ pounds of nuts in the shell to make 1 pound of shelled nuts, the American manufacturer has to pay from 9 to 10 cents per pound, while if the nuts are opened . in foreign countries he has to pay only 6 cents duty per pound. To keep these unjust duties in proper and just proportion the duty on shelled nuts should be 10 cents per pound to enable the American manufacturer to compete with the foreign manufacturer, provided the present tariff of 3 cents per pound on shelled nuts shall remain in force. If the duties on nuts in the shell is reduced it would be a great draw- back for the nut-growers in California, Texas, and several other nut- growing States, where farmers have commenced to pay strict attention to the raising of nuts, especially California, from where a great many walnuts have been shipiied to the Eastern markets during the last few years. The same injustice is done in the import duties on almonds. The duty on almonds in shells is 5 cents per pound and that on shelled almonds is 7J per pound. As it takes nearly 3 pounds of hard-shelled almonds to make 1 pound of shelled almonds we must, under the present tariff, leave this industry, when some thousands of hands could be employed here, entirely to foreign countries. In order to make the duty on shelled almonds just and proper it should be in proportion to the duty on almonds in the shell, say of 3x5 =15 cents per pound (as it takes nearly 3 pounds of almonds in the shell to make 1 pound of shelled almonds), or take away the duty on almonds in shell and raise the duty on shelled almonds to 10 or 15 cents per pound. By this the Government would earn the same amount of money, or more, and prices for almonds would be lower here than before. 688 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. At the same time the nut-growing iudustry of California wonld have a small protection, which it needs, to encourage the growing of almonds, the quality of M'hicli is much finer than those from any other country, and it would not take many years before we would exportthis valuable article to other countries. E. C. KOERBEE, Presidetit of Koerier Wnt-meat Manufaotur'uui Company, 307 and 309 Washington street, New York City. New York, September 14, 1S93. EXTRACT OF MEAT. (Paragraph 313.) STATEMENT OF ME. EDWARD C. FKISBIE, OF HARTFOED, COKH. Hartford, Conn., September, 1S93. Gentlemen : We are the agents of the Liebig's Extract of Meat and desire to ask that the present rate of duty be modified, and for reasons which we propose to show in tables following. First, we believe there is no reason why there should be any duty upon tljis article, as it is not needed as a measure of protection to any American product of similar. character. We shall confine our statistics to Liebig's only, in comiDaring with AmericaTi ]3roducts, for the reason that we are not aware of any other similar extract being imx3orted in any considerable quantity. The Liebig's brand is regarded as the standard of qualitj' the world over, and the name Liebig is frequently and unjustly appropriated by those putting .up similar products, and in fact the success of the Liebig's Extract of Meat has induced others to endeavor to enter the same field. Liebig's extract has always sold and always would continue to sell at a higher price than similar extracts of American manufacture. Should there be a total abolition of the present duty, Liebig's extract being admitted entirely free, it would, in consequence of the greater cost of production — chemical testing and shipping — still be obliged to be sold in this country at a higher price than the competing American products of any rei)utable character; therefore we see no reason why any injus- tice would be done to any American manufacture. Furthermore, the Lie- big's Extract of Meat is a South American product, made at Fray Beu- tos, Uruguay, and we believe we should be considered as justly entitled to consideration under the idea of reciprocity with South American trade. This extract of beef has become an article of largest use among the poorer classes of our people and should really be regarded as an article of medicinal necessity; is now used largely by the sick and those in feeble health. During the year 1889 140,000 pounds of this extract was imported and the revenue derived from it was #13,120. With a decrease of duty we believe there will be a larger consump- tion of this brand. We also believe that the competition between this and American brands would result in a higher standard of quality for our American products, and we can see nothing of a detrimental feature to accrue to any interest by a reduction in the revenue, but rather a EXTRACT OF MEAT. 689 stimulating and liealtliy competition which will result, as stated above, in a higher standard of quality. We have the pleasure of presenting a series of tables showing the cost of Liebig's as compared with the three prominent domestic brands, also showing the higher cost of Liebig's over the average price of those various brands. Liebig's Extract of Meat is known throughout the world ; is every- where accepted as a standard of quality. The sales in this country as compared with those in other countries, basing the sale u])on compari- son of population, shows that there is less than one-quarter sold here as compared with most other countries. In Austria, Avhere a large increase of duty took place sometime since, the importation of extract of meat was seriously affected, and the poorer pof)uhiition suffered both in health and comfort; and the Government, instead of receiving an extra profit, as anticipated, by the advance in duty, found a great loss, as the duty imposed prevented the importation; and they thus failed of the object which they sought to obtain. We believe that a decrease of duty here would result in an increased net revenue, and we are quite firm in our belief that no harm would be done to our home products by reason of a reduction. Below we present figures showing the cost of Liebig's as compared with other brands ; the excess of cost of Liebig's over other brands if duty free; also, excess of cost over other bra,nds at the rates of duty based on 5 cents, 10 cents, and 18 cents per pound. EespectfuUy submitted. Tajloott, Frisbie & Co. 2 ounces, net cost. 4 ounces, net cost, 8 ounces, net cost. $2.63 2.82 3.20 3.79 2.88 $i. 90 5.25 5.89 6.97 5.34 $8.40 9.00 11.02 12. 97 9.47 1.16 2.07 4.57 .59 3.27 1.08 5.92 1.95 10.87 .61 1.02 2.47 .4.5 .07 .67 .03 1.87 —.15 .39 .58 1.40 .47 .73 1.70 .54 1.03 2.00 .66 3.35 3.42 3.64 1.12 0.07 6.37 6.46 2.48 11.17 11. 47 11.95 .72 .53 .15 1.17 .82 .18 2.77 2.17 .15 .79 .CO .22 1.47 1.12 .48 3.07 2.47 .45 .91 .72 .34 1.66 1.21 .57 3.65 2.05 .93 ] 6 ounces, net cost. CMcago extract "beef — Buruhain's brand Libby, McNeil & Libby's Armour's Liebig's genuine , Average cost of three American brands Under present duty Liebig's geuuine costs more than tbe cheapest Under present duty Liebig's genuine cost above the highest priced or Armour s Cost of Liebig's if free of duty Liebig's, if free of duty, would cost more than Bum- ham's Iiiebig'Sj if free of duty, would cost moie than Libby, McNeil & Libby's Liebig's, if free of duty, would cost more than Armour's Liebig's, if free of duty, would cost more than the aver- age of Bnmham's, Libby, McNeil & Libby's and Ar- mour's If 5 cents per pound duty, Liebig's would cost more than the average If 10 cents per pound duty, Liebig's would cost more than the average If 18 cents per pound duty, Liebig's would cost more than the average Cost ofLiebig'sif 5 cents a pound duty Cost of Liebig's if 10 cents a pound duty Cost of Liebig's if 18 cents a pound duty "With 5 cent per pound duty- Cost of Liebig's over Burnham's Cost of Liebig's over Libby, McNeil & Libby's '. Cost of Liebig's over Armour's With 10 cents per pound duty- Cost of Liebig's over Burnham's Coat of Liebig's over Libby, McNeil & Libby's Cost of Libby's over Armour's "With 18 cents per pound duty- Cost of Liebig a over Burnham's Cost of Liebig's over Libby, McNeill & Libby's Coat of Liebig's over Armour's $16. 40 16.50 20. 52 24.22 17.80 7.82 3.70 23.02 5.52 L50 5.41 6.38 22.62 'Jii. 22 24.18 6.22 6.12 2.10 6.80 G.72 2.70 7.78 7.68 3.66 T H- -44 690 AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. Mr. Frisbee. The present rate of duty is 35 cents a ijound. In form- ulating these tables, I have based my calculations upon the average price x)aid jobbers. There are few who, in buying 10,000 pounds of Liebig's extract, get a little discount of. Those buying American pro- ducts get a great deal more discount. I have based that on what I believe to be a fair presentation of the facts. I do not go into the question of the quality of the goods, because that question may come up later, and it is not proper to go into it at this time. If a question is raised by our American people, it viill be time enough to discuss it then. DEGRAS. (raiagrapli 310.) SUGGESTIONS IN REGARD TO DUTY ON DBGEAS. The present duty on degras or brown wool-grease, is one-half cent j)er pound, against the old rate of 10 per cent ad^'alorem. The con- sumption of this article by tanners and compounders of oil is perhaps 20, 000 barrels per year, of which about 18,000 are imported. This browu wool- grease is a raw material which is obtained from the residue of the water which has been used for scouring the raw wool. It is ab- solutely necessary for tanners of upper leather in softening their i)ro- duct, because it has certain qualities that no other fat or article pos- sesses. The oil men use it for getting the high cold test, and they also need it for compounding. A large quantity of this oil is being ex- ported again. The present duty of one-half cent per pound, was put on at the rep- resentation of a few small manufacturers in Eliode Island and Massa- chusetts, against the repeated protest of a great many of the leading tanners, who appeared before the honorable committee before the McKiidey bill came in force; Mr. Clarke, the present collector of Chi- cago ; Mr. G. W. Oakley, of Chicago, and others were amongst them, but their statements were of no avail. The selling value of this material, including ocean freight, etc., is IJ cents i^er pound, exclusive of duty, which brings it up to 3 cents a pound. In spite of this high ju'otection, which is 33^ per cent on the selling i^rice, or perhaps 50 per cent of the original cost of production, the industry of this branch in the United States has not at all in- creased. The American consumers have tried the domestic article, and found the same unsatisfactory, even at lower prices than the foreign product. It is immaterial to us whether you lay out the duty or not, but the American consumer is the one who actually pays the high duty, which does not do any good to this country, as the article can not be manufactured successfully. We would, therefore, suggest either to have the duty removed entirely, or put it back at the old rate of 10 per cent advalorem, for the benefit of the American industry, which needs the article and can, not get it in this country good and cheap. We appear here at the request of some of the leading tanners and oil men, and include a few letters expressing their views. EespectfuUy submitted, Felix Salomon & Co. SALT. 691 DBGBA8. (Psiagraph 810.) Boston, September 16, 1893. The present duty of one-half cent per pound was a compromise with certain parties, mostly in Ehode Island, who thought that by a pro- tective duty they could establish the industry of making degras in suflBcieiit quantities to supply the demand of the trade of this country; but thus far, to the best of our knowledge, they have not succeeded in making either the quantity or the quality which is needed. The American production is but a very small proportion of the quantity consumed, and the duty of one-half cent per pound is a tax on the leather trade, which, in the present state of the industry, it can ill afford. We think if the tariff bill is to be amended, this duty should be removed and the article placed on the free list. Tours truly, Webster «fe Co. SAIiT. (Paragraph 322.) San Fkancisco, Cal., September 16, 1893. The undersigned, producers and manufacturers of salt in the State of California, hereby petition your honorable body to continue the pro- tection of the salt industry in this and other States of the Union. This protection is the present tariff of 8 cents per 100 pounds salt in bulk, and 12 cents per 100 pounds salt in bags. Under this protection the salt industry has been largely increased and the production increas- ing every year and keeping pace with the population, and ever increas- ing demauds for salt, iu fact, in many localities the production is largely in excess of the demand, and competition, coupled with high railroad freights, has brought the selling price of salt down to cost. IsTow, with the large additions of salt imported from England, France, Germany, Italy, and Mexico, on which the salt duties have been cheerfully paid by the importers, and entering into competition with our domestic pro- duct, there is a depression which has existed for more than a year past, and promises to continue and prove disastrous to the home product and industry if there is any reduction made in the salt duties, as we can not compete with salt made by the cheap labor of the countries hereto- fore named. You will please understand that this foreign salt is not sujierior to our home product, but owing to large productions the foreign producers look to the United States for a market for its surplus salt, and finding it here, compete so strongly that our home industry is in danger. The present rate of salt duties work no hardship on the consumer. We hear no complaint from those who use salt, and the duties are divided up into so many small sales and quantities that it is scarcely perceptible, and the Government derives a good revenue from the collection of the salt duties. 692 AGEIOULTURAL PRODUCTS AND PROVISIONS. The industry in these United States is of such magnitude that it can produce enough salt to supply the whole country, of a superior quality. We are not dependent on foreign countries for any. Foreign countries protect their salt industries. Mexico levies $10 per ton ; Australia, $5. ISTow, we look to our Eepresentatives in Con- gress to continue protection that has been so wisely given us. We beg your favorable consideration to our appeal for protection of the salt industry. Union Pacific Salt Company. By John Baeton, President. And others. SCHEDULE I. COTTOK 693 COTTON YARNS. (Paragraph 342.) STATEMENT OF MS. A. G. PIEECE, NEW BEDEOED, MASS. Wednesday, Septemher 13, 1893. Mr. Chairman : If I had consnlted my owu feelings, I should be in my bed. I promised that I would come up here, and I do not care to take uxi much of your time. I have penciled off what I want to say. I want you to maintain the present duty on the manufacture of fine yarn goods which may be classed as a luxury; but it is an industry which has grown in magnitude within the last few years, and has in- creased largely in the last two years. It gives employment to a large number of operatives whose wages go to make up the other part of the cost of the goods — fully 45 to 00 per cent, varying with the fineness of the fabric. These wages are on an average from 60 to 80 per cent higher than on the other side — in England, for instance — and of course this makes a high cost compared with the same goods made there, and enables the manufacturers in the vicinity of Manchester to sell goods in that market at the present time about a cent a yard less than the same fabrics actually cost the American manufacturer to make, with nothing included for dejjreciation of his machinery or interest on his capital. These items, of course, would be fair charges to include in the cost. This fabric, samples of which I have here marked 1 and 2, those marked 1 being English, and those marked -! being made in New Bed- ford. They are both of similar construction. The English cost of the labor is 50 per cent, just about one-half of ours. In this lighter article, which I have marked No. 3, the cost of the labor is 48 per cent, about the full cost of the fabric. That light article sells in Manchester for three-fourths cent a yard less than we can produce it, without any allowance for depreciation or interest on capital invested. That is about all I care to say. The Chairman. Does the Manchester manufacturer get cheaper machinery than you do'? Mr. PiEECE. i think he does. The Chairman. Does he get cheaper fuel? Mr. Pierce. I b(.'lieve he does; but that is hearsay with me. The Chairman. Is there any industry in which machinery does so much work as in cotton fabri(;s"? Mr. Pierce. Not to my knowledge. The Chairman. Do you import your machinery? Mr. Pierce. We import some of it. The Chairman. The foreign manufacturer has to get machinery just as you have, take it all the way through? Mr. Pierce. When we have to build some parts of the mills we pre- fer it should be of home manufacture; but sometimes we can not get 695 696 COTTON. it from the American machiuists wlio make tliat particular class of machinery which we want. The Chairman. My question related to the improved machinery. That is manufactured abroad, and is about as good machinery as you have? Mr. Pierce. I don't think there is much, if any, difference, except that the American machinery is finished rather finer. The Chairman. Does an operative in this country attend to more machinery than an operative in foreign mills? Mr. Pierce. I think he does. I think so far as looms are concerned, at least I am told, that a weaver on the other side tends four looms, and on this side a weaver tends all the way from four to six. The Chairman. What about the hours of labor*? Mr. PiERCB. I think the hours of labor on the other side are fifty- six and on this side fifty-eight. The Chairman. Is it true or not that the manufactories in New En- gland grew up before there was any protective tariff? Mr. Pierce. That was before my day, and I can not answer as to that, because I do not know. The Chairman. Do you know what the state of the manufacture was between 1850 and 1860? Mr. Pierce. 1 do. I was iu it as a young man at that time, but I can not bring that to mind now, for the reason that I am not in condition, and really I have no business to be standing here. COTTON XAENS. (Paragraph 342.) STATEMENT OF HE. AENOLI) B, SANFOED, OF FAIX EIVEE, MASS. Friday, September 15, 1803. Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen op the Committee : I have pre- pared what I have to say here in the form of a statement which 1 would like to read to you. The cotton-spinning industry of fine yarns and high-grade medium counts, which I represent here to-deT cent. Under the so-called Mills 1)111 it was proposed, to have .the same reduced to 35 per cent as formerly: but under the M'oKinley bill it still continues the same, viz., 50 per cent. As this material has never beea made in the United States is it pos- sible that the duty on the said yarns can not be reduced 15 or 20 per cent, as it would injure no oue, and give us a chance to compete with our foreign competitors'? We can not sell to Mexico or South .America, and even in our own country these Europeans undersell us on large orders. The duty on these yarns in Germany and Prance, imported from England, is a trifle, besides, we have to pay about two thirds more for labor in our country than they do in Europe; so you can readily con- ceive that the chances are altogether against us. Eespectfully yours, American Sil.e Label Manufacturing OoMPANy, George Hez, Manager. SPOOL COTTOK. Paragraph 348. WEDNES.nAY, Septemher 20^ 1893. STATEMEm" ON MR. A. C. DTTWHAM, EEPKESENTING THE SPOOL- COTTON INDUSTEY OF THE UNITED STATES, Mr. Ghatrman: I represent the spool-cotton industry and fine cot- ton-yarn industry, and we would respectfully request to submit a brief, and as your time seems to be well taken up we are willing to submit our brief and leave the matter in your band, Washington, D. G., September 20, 1893. Gentlemen: The spool-cotton industry employs in the United States $25,000,000 in fixed and floating capital, and 15,000 emi)loyes. It differs widely from any other industry, from the fact that three-fifths SPOOL COTTON. 705 ; of this capital is owned and used by corporations which are offshoots I of corporations in Great Britain. In fact, foreign manufacturers have invested in this country, in cooperation with resident stockholders, $15,000,000 for the manufacture of spool cotton, all of these manu- facturers being engaged in the same business in Scotland and England, controlling, outside of the United States, two-thirds of the entire spool- cotton business of the world. : The $10,000,000 invested exclusively by American owners was drawn into the business by the very high tariff of 1864, which was imposed to meet the pressing necessities of the Government. The duty on spool cotton imposed at that time was 12 cents on each dozen of spools containing 200 yards each, and, in addition, 32J per cent ad valorem, a dozen of 200-yard spools being the invariable unit of sale to the trade. This duty, however, was imposed on units of 100 yards, in order to stop the practice of short measure which existed as a method of unfair competition at that time, and which, in consequence of this division of the duty, disappeared. This duty of 6 cents on each 100 yards, and 32^ per cent ad valo- rem, was equal to 21 cents on each dozen of spools of 200 yards, and under this duty the business was gradually transferred to the United States. In 1861, under the duty of 30 per cent ad valorem, nine-tenths of the spool cotton used in the United States was imported. Now more than nine-tenths of this spool cotton is made here, and three-fifths of this is made by offshoots of the same firms which sent it here in 18G1. In 1861 the price of spool cotton in the United States was 47^ cents net per dozen. For the past four years the price of the same goods has been 38 cents net per dozen for same grade of goods. In 1861, under the duty of 30 per cent ad valorem, spool cotton retailed in the United States at 5 cents per spool, and now retails at 4 cents per spool. It will be observed that while the consumer of standard spool cotton in the United States now gets a spool of thread for four-fifths of the price in 1861, the profit of the jolJber and retailer remains the same. In 1861 the price of standard spool cotton in Great Britain was 26 cents net per dozen spools of 200 yards each. The price for same goods to-day is 28 cents net. If these figures are examined, it will appear that the English manufacturer in 1861, when the duty was less than 8 cents (at 30 per cent ad valorem) received in this country for his goods the English price of 26 cents per dozen, plus the tariff of 21 cents, which was afterwards imposed in 1864. It is fair to state that both in England and in the United States 25 per cent more value in quality is now given at 28 cents per dozen in England and 38 cents in the United States than was given in 1861 at 26 cents per dozen in England and 47J cents in the United States. It appears that while in Great Britain the price of spool cotton is 2 (Cents higher per dozen than it was thirty-two years ago, in the United States it is 10 cents lower — a total difference of 12 cents per dozen. The duty on spool cotton since 1864 has never been increased, but has been at different times reduced until it now stands at 14 cents, or two-thirds of the duty of 21 cents imposed in 1864. This duty has not changed since 1883, but has continued uniform. ■The price here, however, since 1879 (when specie payments were resumed) has fallen from 49 to 38 cents per dozen, a decline due solely ,to the active competition in the home market. As a consequence of this decline in price, the capital employed io TH— — 45 706 COTTON. this industry in the United States has earned less than 4 per cent per annum during the past four years, while the capital employed in Great Britain has earned over 8 per cent. Since 1861 the wages paid in this industry have risen 81 per cent in the United States, reckoning the amount paid per week to each employ^, which in 18C1 was $5,35 per week and in 1892 $9.70. Our present wages are more than double the wages now paid in tliis business in Great Britain. From these figures it appears that in this country the wage-earners have absorbed not only the advantages which have accrvied to the manufacturers from improved methods, various inventions, and better machinery, but also have absorbed at least one-half of the fair earnings of capital. In Great Britaiji capital still secures its share, probably because it has combined. There is here no uniformity of price and nothing which resembles a trust. "In the production of standard six-cord spool cotton the labor is two- thirds of the cost. It would seem to be clear that, if the product of spool cotton should be exposed to competition with the labor of Great Britain, either wages must be reduced here or the business be transferred back to England and Scotland. We present to this lionorable committee these facts, and believe that they warrant the following conclusions: First. That the American people have not paid for spool cotton more than would have been paid under the duty of 1861. The prices of this article from 181)2 to 1879, like other goods made from cotton at famine prices, and subject to the fluctuations of a gold premium, can not be considered in this argument. Since 1879, the price has uniformly averaged less than the price under the duty of 30 per cent ad valorem in 1861, and during the last four years has been 10 cents per dozen less and 1 cent per spool less to the consumer, while the price of spool cotton in England, of same quality, and made by the same manufac- turers, is higher than in 1861. Second. The present low price of thread in the United States, which has existed for four years, is due to American competition, and that this competition can not be continued at a lower price without a reduc- tion of wages. Third. That any duty, unless so low as to replace the industry in the hands of the foreign manufacturers, could not benefit the consumer, as a sijool of thread if sold below 4 cents must be sold at 3 cents ; con- sequently only the middleman could benefit by any change: Fourth. The arguments which favor an ad valorem duty on many goods do not apply to spool cotton, owing, in large part, to the unit of sale, as just made to appear, on which a change of price to the con- sumer would involve at the present price of 4 cents a spool, a jump one way or the other of 25 per cent, whether this change of price should be to 3 cents or 5 cents. On the other hand, an ad valorem duty would, in this industry as in others, expose us to all the disturbances in business in Europe, like war, business panics, and overproduction, making competition more acute when it should be lessened rather than increased, and would also revive the old frauds of short measure, invoicing goods purchased in one country at the lower price of another, and the like. We respe(;tfully petition your honorable committee that the duty reiniiiu sjiecitic, and that it be not reduced, believing as we do that any reduction can not possibly benefit either the Government or the couwunier, but could only enrich the middlemen at the expense of the manufacturer. SPOOL COTTON. 707 FINE COTTON TARNS. The question of duties on fine cotton yarns is much more complicated than the question of duties on spool cotton. Under the present duties — which have only slightly varied since 1883, when the duties were leduced about one-fifth and made specific — there has been a steady increase in the production of fine cotton yarns in the United States, and the industry seems to have taken root. It is subject, however, to the most strenuous foreign competition. In a district in Lancashire, say 30 miles square, five-ninths of all the cotton spindles of the world are owned and operated. Out of the entire 90,000,000, 50,000,000 run in this district. All of the mills in which these spindles run make cotton yarn, and make nothing else, selling it on the cop, for use in all kinds of cotton goods made there, and in other parts of the world. The labor in these mills is of the best quality of its kind, the Lan- cashire lass being famed, not only in Great Britain but wherever known. Two years ago, in Glasgow, a public speaker urged that Scotland shoiild be allowed two hours per day extra, for mill work, because even with this allowance the Scotch girl could not compete with the Lancashire lass. This is particularly the case with the half- timers, so called, who go into the mills at the age of 10, but under the recent education laws must spend half of their time in school, and these girls, with a good common-school education, and their early mUl train- ing, are wonderfully expert in textile work. The machinery of these mills is of the latest and best makes, and their management, being in a compact district and under acute com- petition, is of great excellence. If a raw material is an article produced without the use of a costly fixed x:)lant — a plant also which is only adapted to a particular product — certainly the yarn of Lancashire is far from being a raw material, for these vast mills cost $300,000,000 and would be worthless if cotton yarn should not be wanted. These mills of Lancashire are benefited by long experience, enjoy the use of cheap money, and use the best class of labor in the world for their purpose, which labor is paid just about half what is expected for the same service in the United States. When one knows Lancashire, it ceases to be surprising that there is a large importation of fine yarns under the ju'esent duties in the United States. One of the corjiorationshere represented paid in 1891 and 1892 $90,000 in duties on fine yarns. Still, under the present duties, the increase in the production of fine yarns has been steady and cumulative in this country for ten years. This movement might, however, reasonably be expected to be reversed under a lower duty, and the business would certainly cease to exist under a considerable reduction of duties. We submit to this honorable committee the suggestion that this would be a serious misfortuue, not only to the manufacturers engaged in this industry, but to the producers of fine, long-stapled cotton, and also to the country at large. The long-stapled cottons of which Georgia, Florida, and South Caro- lina produce 50,000 bales would, in that event, practically luive but one market. The continent now takes about 2,500 bales of this sea-island cotton, and the balance of 48,000 bales has for the past six years been about equally divided between our Northern mills and England. It would seem to us important that'this valuable industry in the 708 COTTON. Southern States stouM not be exposed to the loss of half its customers, particularly as Great Britain controls the Egyptian crop, and English spinners are already mixing sea-island and Egyptian cotton in various proportions. It may be said that this cotton will still be consumed in England, but will not the producer suffer in price, if Liverpool makes the price, without competition, especially as Egyptian cotton sells at about half the average price of sea island? In the next place, can this country afford to lose an industry of so valuable a character? A successful Lancashire spinner said lately that England was rich because she bought backache and sold brains, mean- ing that England bought raw materials and sold invention, skill, experience, and good taste in the shape of manufactured goods. We respectfully suggest that many millions of dollars have been invested in this business of line cotton yarns ; that the business is young, although at present, robust; that this industry employs a high order of skilled labor, and employs three times as much labor, in proportion to the cost of finished product, as coarse yarns; that the prices of the products are steadily receding, although as not yet as in spool cotton, below duty level; that it would be a peculiar hardship to make unre- munerative a large capital invested in this industry within the past three or four years ; that these yarns now yield a large revenue, and under a low duty, would probably yield a smaller revenue. For instance, from 1856 to 1860 inclusive; under a duty of 24 per cent, the duty paid the custom-house was not one-quarter what it was from 1876 to 1880, inclusive, under the highest duty ever imposed. We, therefore, respectfully petition that the duty on fine yarns cost- ing 40 cents and over be not changed. COTTOX-BACKED SATIIS". (Paragraph 345.) I beg to call your attention to a single article of import which, in the interest of manufacturers, should be placed upon the free list. It is one of the materials used in the manufacture of hats — the cotton-backed satin, which is used to line them. It is bought by the manufacturer from the importer at prices ranging from 30 cents to $1.10 per yard. The duty on this article is 10 cents per square yard with an ad valorem addition of 35 per centum, making a difference of at least 55 per centum to the manufacturer. The average cost of an $18-case of hats is in- creased by this lining from 75 cents to $3 i^er dozen. The duty is not only oppressive, but absolutely unnecessary in a protective sense, and of very little value, comparatively, as a matter of revenue. There is not a yard of this cotton-backed satin made in this country. The silk man- ufacturers will not undertake it. It does not pay. To class it as a manufacture of silk, therefore, is an outrage, and it should be placed upon the free list. It is the same way with the hatters' silk plush, the duty on which has been lowered gradually from 55 down to 10 x^er cent. There is not a yard of it made in this country; attempts have been made to manu- facture it, and so far as textile and general strength of the fabric is concerned it is quite equal to that of any foreign make, but it was abandoned because we have not obtained the secret of the French dye, and the plush hat which it covers is pot oovetable when after 3, few COTTON CLOTH. 709 months it turns a beantiful brown color. I do not complain, however, of this slight dnty, because 10 per centiTm is very little, and as a rev- enue measure it may be expedient. Gotton-backed satin, however, has no such defense and should not pay duty. It acts not only oppress- ively on the consumei:, but it interferes with the labor of men employed in hat manufactories. There are only a certain number of heads in this country to be covered by hats, and if the market of manufacture be confined entirely to this country, when he has filled this probable demand he either closes down, cuts wages nominally, or cuts them quite as much by working on half time. When the cost of the manu- factured article be reduced, and the cost of the raw material has been so cheapened that his surplus can be thrown Into the foreign markets, he has no need to curtail labor or reduce wages. The duty on this article can not be defended either from a revenue or protective point of View. Tours, truly, Thomas Dunn English, Representative Sixth District, New Jersey. COTTOIS^ CLOTn. (Paragraphs 344-318.) STATEMENT OF WILLI4M C. LOVEBING, OF TAUNTON, MASS., COTTON MANUFAC- TUEEE, REPRESENTING THE AEKWEIGHT CLUB. Wednesday, September 13, 1893. Mr. Chairman : In order to be as concise as possible, and to take up as little of your time as possible, I have prepared a few statements in writing and beg your attention while I read them: The cotton manufacturers of New England are largely represented by the Arkwright Club, which is made up of the treasurers of the diff- erent corporations and represents an aggregate capital of nearly $70,000,000, divided among many thousand stockholders. A commit- tee of this club is here in behalf of the cotton interests of New England. Were it simply to plead for the mill-owners and stockholders alone, I, for one, should not be here. But another and far more important interest is the welfare of the great population of New England depend- ent upon her maniifacturing industries. New England is not an agricultural or a mining region. Her fish- eries and commerce have long since entered upon their decadence. Beyond her hay and ice crops she contributes but an unimportant part of the natural products of our country. 'Tis not always June in New England, yet I would not exchange it for any other home in the world. The climate is a rainy climate, hence the pursuit of her great industries must be carried on beneath shelter. Though trammeled by many natural disadvantages, she has, by reason of her manufactures, become an enormous consumer of the products of all the other States in the Union. It is impossible to take any step which will impair the prosperity of the manufactures of New England, or of the cotton manufacture in particular, without immediately, directly, and largely attacking the prosperity of the whole country. The cotton manufactures of this country have substantially occupied the American market. The cen- sus of 1890 reports a total value of woven cotton goods produced in '710 COT'I'ON. this country of $198,750,000. Tlie total value of cotton cloth imported during the year ended June 30, 1892, was but $4,000,000. Tlie total value of cotton goods manufactured at home in 1890 was $208,000,000. The total value of all cotton manufactures imported, including fl^earing apparel, was less than $16,500,000. Inasmuch as it is inevitable that any legislation which increases the proportion of imported goods must be at the expense of domestic manufacturers and of the working people employed by them, and inasmuch as New England employes 76 per cent of the spindles in operation, and employes in this industry 150,000 operatives, it is evident that the conditions under which the manufac- turers of New England occupy the home market cannot be greatly dis- turbed without creating a danger of widespread disaster. But it is not frequently considered how important to the country, as a whole, is the prosperity of New England, and the full employment of its vast army of people engaged in manufactures. A moment's consideration will lead the committee to observe that while there is no other section of the country so densely populated as New England, there is also no section which produces so small a proportion of the articles needed to support life and to carry on manufacture. With three-fourths of the spindles of the country, it produces not a pound of cotton but consumes one-fifth of the cotton crop of the United States, and was thus a consumer of the South for this one article alone in 1890 to the value of nearly $77,000,000. It grows less than 4 per cent of the wool grown in the country, but uses one-half of the total clip. It mines not a pound of coal, but uses not less than 10,000,000 tons in its homes and factories. Of all articles of food for man and beast it produces a suificiency of hay and potatoes only, and is a cus- tomer of the West for not less than 3,000,000 barrels of flour. Manu- facturing fully three-fourths of all the boots and shoes worn in the country, it is of necessity the purchaser of a very great proportion of the hides which are to be tanned into leather. Its beef and pork are not raised at home, but are imported from the West, It is dependent upon the Northwest for its supplies of lumber to build its houses and factories. In short, there is no other section of the country which is required by its lack of natural resources to draw upon other parts of the country for anything like so large a proportion of all that it must eat and wear and manufacture. In this respect it is even more start- lingiy dependent upon communities without itself than is old England, which contains vast stores of iron and coal, and produces a very material part of its food, while New England is almost totally lacking in all these resources. It is not necessary to dwell at length upon the bearing of these facts upon the question whether protection to the cotton manufacturers should be continued or suddenly withdrawn. The question is whether it is desirable at this time to hazard the welfare of a community which, man for man and family for family, consumes a larger part of all the products of the country than any other section. Whatever prosperity has resulted from i)rotection to our section of the country, has been shared most liberally by all of the people. The greatest benefit from protection has accrued to the working people and not to the manufacturers. The great fortunes of our country have been niade not in manufac- ture, but in commerce, railroads, mines, and real estate. There is a difierence between America and Great Britain in respect to cotton man- ufactures. Here the working jieople have been elevated and prospered COTTON CLOTH. 711 as mncb as the mill-owners, while there the mill-owners have been enriched rather than the woiking people; The difference in the condition of the people in the two countries is sub- stantially equal to the difference in their wages. We hear it said that cotton manufacturing has outgrown the swaddling clothes of infancy and no longer needs any protection. There is this to be said in answer: The wages of the American operative compared Avith those of the British operative are relatively higher to-day than they were sixty years ago. And furthermore the great advance in international com- munication has so cheapened transportation as to bring the foreigner nearer to our shores and has minimized the protection that 3,000 miles of ocean travel once afforded. To illustrate this fact, consider the great change which lias taken place in the methods of doing business in the last thirty years. In 1860 the initiative in the importation of cotton goods would be taken by the American merchant, who would send or go to Europe, purchase his goods, and receive them after a lapse of two months or more. At present the foreign merchant has his agents, with their samples, in New York, watching American markets and ready toresijond at a moment's notice to any favorable conditions for shipping goods here. He has at his disposal the telegraph cable and several lines of ocean steamers, which cross the Atlantic in a week, competing for freight. The cost of transportation is so mucli lower than it was thirty years ago that it forms a smaller percentage of the cost of goods than it formerly did, and is so insignificant an amount that it hardly reaches the retail price. But aside from this reduction in the cost of transportation, the change of method has diminished the power of any given rate of duty to pro- tect the American market against foreign goods, because the risk which comes from the long interval between the time the goods are ordered and the time they are put upon the market is completely eliminated. The importer now knows exactly what his advantages and disadvan- tages will be, whereas formerly he was forced to estimate the condi- tions of the market three months in advance. A bale of cotton can be laid down in Liverpool, England, as cheaply as it can be laid down in Ifew England. Every pound of cotton used in New England is brought an average distance of 1,000 miles and every pound of coal an average distance of 500 miles. It is not infrequently remarked that it is illogical to protect the mill operative and not protect the bricklayer, the mason, and the carpenter. It is easily seen that the bricklayer is protected in that no foreign handicraft can compete with him, while the product of foreign mill operatives can be easily transported the world over. A few dollars will provide the building artisan with his necessary tools, while before a yard of cotton cloth can be made there is an expenditure for the neces- sary tools and machinery equal to $1,000 for each and every operative employed. And just at this point let me explain to you what is an unseen, but always a heavy expense in running cotton machinery. There is no class of machinery that runs at such a rapid rate of speed and wears out so fast, and a manufacturer very soon finds that his mill has grown old, and that the machinery is superseded by improved machinery. So that while he may have a new mill to-day, seven years' running will, so far as the machinery is concerned, reduce the value at least one-half. These conditions are not always provided against, but the manufacturer who Ignores them finds to his cost that he is soon impoverished. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen, in approaching the cotton schedule 712 COTTON. with view to revision, we beg you to bear in mind tliat it is not an excessive tax, and the rates imposed are not out of proportion to the difference in American and foreign wages. It was only upon the finer, higher grade of goods involving a large cost for labor that a slight ad- vance was made. The duty on medium and coarse goods was reduced. In any readjustment of the cotton schedule of woven fabrics we earn- estly emphasize the importance of preserving the form and character of the present schedule, as it has worked most satisfactorily, and is calculated to prevent undervaluations and defrauding of the revenue. 1 beg to remind you that while we appear here in the behalf of the cotton manufacturers of New England that cotton manufacturing is no longer an exclusively New England industry nor is it confined to the Northern States. It is fast becoming national. The increase in the Southern States is surj)rising, and I may say that Northern spinners are not without some apprehension that they may lose their supremacy. Five years ago, 1889-'90, the Southern mills consumed 480,000 bales. This year they have consumed 744,000 bales, an increase of 264,000 bales, or 55 per cent. While the Northern mills have increased 200,000 spindles in the last year, the Southern mills have increased 163,154 spindles in the same time. While you are sitting here, gentlemen, and at the very moment we are discussing this question, there are thousands and thousands of idle workmen all over the land waiting anxiously to see what you are going to do, whether your action is going to be such as to continue them in idleness or such as will restore confidence to the business world and return them to their work. Whatever course you may be inclined to take in this matter, we beg you to bear in mind and believe that we honestly maintain the position we take when we say that you should exercise the greatest caution in making any change in a law that has brought so much good to every one and so little harm to any one in our entii'e country. I only appear here as a representative of one branch of cotton man- facture. There are other men here who represent the various depart- ments of the industry in which I am interested. I particularly appear in behalf of cotton goods and woven-textile industry, and I should be pleased to answer any questions that I am able to answer. Mr. Bebokinridge. Does that include hosiery and underwear? Mr. LoTERiNG. It does not. I understand that there are gentlemen present who appear in behalf of those articles. Mr. Breckinridge. Define what you mean by "woven textiles?" Mr. LovERiNG. I mean fabrics woven in a loom with warp and filling. Mr. Breckinridge. I thought that was usually called cloth? Mr. LovERiNG. Yes, sir, it is; cotton cloth. Mr. Turner. Where is your industry located? Mr. LovERiNG. In Taunton, Mass. Ours is a colored mill. We make a variety of colored cotton fabrics. Mr. Turner. You use "upland" cotton? Mr. LOVERING. We use "upland" and "gulf." Mr. Turner. And "Sea Island?" Mr. LOVERING. No, sir; we do not use any Sea Island, but I am interested in a mill that does. Mr. Turner. Do you import any cotton? Mr. LoTERiNG, I do not. COTTON CLOTH. 713 Mr. TuKNEK. I believe the use of common Egyptian cotton has largely increased in New England? Mr. LovERiNG. I believe it has in some of the finer mills. Mr. TuENEK. Do you think a duty ought to be put on Egyptian cotton ? Mr. LovERiNG. It is immaterial to me. Upon the general principle of protection, it might be. Mr. TuENER. Has there been an increased use of Egyptian cotton f Mr. LovERiNG. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. You have not considered that matter much 1 Mr. LovBRiNG. It has not been brought to my mind, not being espe- cially interested in it. Mr. Turner. Ic is a competitor with sea island, is it not 1 Mr. LovERiNGr. I understand so ; it is finer fiber, but it is more irregular. Mr. Turner. About what is the average duty on goods that you manufacture ? Mr. Lovering. It would be difficult to give the average duty. Mr. Turner. Is it as much as 5 cents per square yard ? Mr. Lovering. I do not think it would be more than 3. Mr. Turner. What is the highest rate on goods which you manu- facture 1 Mr. Lovering. Not over 3 cents a square yard. Mr. Turner. What is the style of these goods 1 Mr. Lovering. I make some coarse ginghams, cottonades for men's wear, and a variety of dress goods, beside striped shirtings. Mr. Turner. The American market is your only market ? Mr. Lovering. It is almost entirely our only market. We have at times shipped some goods of a certain grade to India, made especially for that purpose. Mr. Turner. White goods ? Mr. Lovering. They were white goods, and there were also some colored goods made by us. Mr. Turner. Do you send any goods to China ? Mr. Lovering. No, sir. Mr. Turner. You speak of the present law having reduced the duties on those lower goods ? Mr. Lovering. Yes, sir. It will be seen by my paper. Mr. Turner. These goods mentioned have had a lower duty put upon them in the last Congress. Do you make any of them ? Mr. Lovering. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. What style do you make, and if a lower rate of duty was fixed under the present law, would it make any material differ- ence? Mr. Lovering. I have made very low-priced shirtings. I sell them at not over 6 cents a yard. Mr. Turner. These Southern mills that you suggest have prospered so and increased consumption of cotton to a certain extent are engaged almost entirely on that class of goods on which the duties were lowered? Mr. Lovering. The Southern goods are gradually growing finer. In the last five or six years they have gained from an average of 12 to that of 15 1^(5. That would mean that the finer grades are found to be profitable. Mr. Turner. They are unable to compete with you in the finer grades of goods in the shape of cloth? Mr. Lovering. I know of no reason why they should not. 714 COTTON. Mr. Ttjunee. I did not mean to say auytliing as to what they might do in the future, for I hope they will be able to compete with you. Mr. LovERiNG. The fact is that some of the very worst competition Me have comes from the Southern mills. Mr. TuENEK. Are you aware that at the present time they are engaged on a class of cotton goods that find a market, and they can not compete with you on the finer goods ? Mr. LovEEiNG. Some of them are engaged on goods that go to for- eign countries; but much of that class of goods have found their way to the New York, Chicago, and Western markets. I am painfully aware of that. Mr. Turner. I certainly wish you no harm, but T am glad that they are finding their way into the Western markets. They have had a trade with China at the South for some time. Have you such a trade in the North? - Mr. LovERiNG. We have not. Mr. Eeed (to Mr. Turner). You said "at the North." Mr. Turner. Mr. Lovering knows to what I am referring. Mr. Eeed. You said "at the North;" and he is answering as to his own mill. Do you understand that, Mr. Lovering! Mr. Turner. This is a conversation between the gentleman and myself. He represents the Arkwright Club. Mr. Eeed (to Mr. Lovering). Do most of the members of the Ark- wright Club compete in the China trade? Mr. Lovering. Some of them do. I thought Mr. Turner was asking me, personally, as a manufacturer, and not as to those in the Noitli. Mr. Reed, "iou misunderstand each other. You should not auswer erroneously. Mr. Lovering. I should be willing to answer as a manufacturer or as president of the Arkwright Club. Mr. Turner. I was endeavoring to find out whether the mills in that line of j)roduct in New England were in that trade ? Mr. Eeed. There are mills in my own district engaged in that trade almost exclusively. Mr. Lovering. Those are the Laconia and Pepperill. I understand they have a large trade there. Mr. Reed. The Pepperill has been a long time in the China trade. Mr. Turner. What kind of goods? Mr. Lovering. White goods. I think they make colored goods some- times; but they send a great many white goods. Mr. Turner. Twillings and plaids go abi'oad, do they not? Mr. Lovering. I am not aware of any plaids being shipped abroad except there may be some from the South. Mr. Turner. What proportion of cotton goods, if you can tell us, goes abroad for a market 1 Mr. Lovering. I am not prepared to answer that. I could get those figures and send them to you; but I would not undertake to give tliem oiihand. Mr. Chairman. There was 1,000,000 yards sent out in 1892. Mr. Lovering. Those were colored goods. Mr. Turner. If the Americaii mills require protection on the basis of the present law, how is it that tliey are able to export so many of their products and sell them in free-trade countries? Mr. Lovering. One reason is that they are able, and have been able, to send goods to China through the superiority of their goods, aud in that way they have acijuired that market. They have not COTTON CLOTH. 715 given tlie foreigner the same class of goods that the English give tliem. In other words, they have put in a good deal of foreign mate- rial; they have pnt in barytes, or Gliina clay. It is on the extremely low product that they are able to compete. They have the very low- est prices of goods that are made. It is a class of goods that is most easily made, involving the smallest amount of labor. It is not always that they can send them. They are frequently outbid, and have to And a market elsewhere. It has been so with the Pepperill mills, and the Laconia, quite frequently. They found sometimes that they could not sell the product. Mr. TuENEE. That is to say, they have been able to enter into other markets by the superior character of the fabrics. They have estab- lished a reputation in that market"? Mr. LovERiNG. I think that is now largely in their favor. Mr. TuENBR. Is there no possibility that you can still further ad- vance in this foreign progress ? Is there a tendency to increase the list of goods you can sell abroad! Mr. LovEEiNG. By due protection to the business, and producing goods more economically with a reduction in the labor cost, we might extend the amount. Mr. TuENER. Can you suggest any duties that could be decreased without detriment to the interest you represent! Mr. LovEEiNG. I would not care to suggest any; I do not think I could. Mr. TxJENEE. Tour industry is prosperous! Mr. LoVEEiNG. Measureably so. Mr. TxJENEE. I saw a statement which I would like to have j^ou verify, and that is, that at Fall Eiver they were prosperous, but ceased to manufacture, and they gave as a reason that the consumers would not take their goods. Was that correct! Mr. LovEEiNG. They suspended at Pall Eiver because they could not sell their goods at the market price — for what they could afford to make them for. The price of print cloths in Fall Eiver is about the same as the cotton market. It may be one-eight down or up, or one-six- teenth down or up. It is owing to what the printers are willing to pay. If printers have no use for the cloth they will not buy it at any price, unless some-one wants to speculate. Mr. TuENEK. That state of things began with the present financial stress! Mr.LoTEEiNG. It has been going for the last eighteen months. There was a period a few months ago when 'they were in a better condition. Some cloths are low in comparison with other goods, and they were piled up. Mr. Turner. Has there been any considerable reduction in prices of cotton fabrics in the last year or two ! Mr. LovERiNG. There has been a fair reduction, but the reduction has rather kept pace with the less price of cotton than anything else. Cotton has been cheaper within the last two years. That has made goods cheaper. Mr. Turner. Has there been a reduction in the value of cotton goods commensurate with the price of cotton ! Make the comparison with the Pepperill or I^ew York prints for shirtings, which is a standard article. Mr. LovERTNG. I believe there has. Mr. Turner. Has there been any reduction in the price of JSTew York mills shirting? Mr. LovERiNG. There are other gentlemen more capable of answer- 716 COTTON. ing that than T am, when you ask about that specific thing. They are competitors of the New York mills, who know better than I; but there has been, I think, a reduction in the price of goods, just about equal- ing the matter, on account of the less price for cotton. Mr. Whiting. Print cloths and cambrics advanced soon after the passage of the McKinley bill, did they not? Mr. LoATBEiNG. I have not that in my mind. Mr. Whiting. The duty was lower on that class of goods the year after that bill went into effect, i would like an explanation of that. Mr. LOVEKING. If anybody can tell me why print cloths go up and down I would like to know. I think the manufacturers would like to have some explanation about it. Very often there is a glut, and then they lose confidence in them, and in a very short time the goods will be up again. Mr. Whiting. Take cambrics; they have advanced nearly 100 per cent. Mr. LovBRiNG. I know nothing about that. Mr. Stevens. Print cloths run up more than any other kind of goods. Mr. LovEEiNG. They run up to a greater percentage. They are 2| cents to-day, and they have been within a year as high as 4 cents. The difference between 1^ cents and 4 cents is a very large percentage. Mr. Breckinridge. Why should they vary more than other goods? Mr. LoATERiNG. I do not know; but I could give you one reason, calicoes are a great matter of fashion, and print cloths are never sold to be worn. They are sold for printing. Sometimeslow ginghams and low plaids will be all the rage, and then again prints will be all the rage. That may continue from one to ten years, and then print cloths will have their innings as well as the other goods. Mr. Breckinridge. What is meant by " print cloths" is the cloth after it is printed? Mr. LovEBiNG. It is print cloth in brown as it comes from the loom. Mr. Breckinridge. Does that vary? Mr. LovERiNG. They have got to be pretty close now. They are making print cloths very low, and they are selling very low. Mr. Breckinridge. I imagine that the factor of fashion of which you speak would cause much more extensive variations in the printed cloths than in the other? Mr. LovERiNG. Occasionally a manufacturer will hit upon a nice thing. A few years ago they hit upon the indigo blues, and everybody wanted the indigo print. The consequence was that calicoes went up, and the demand for prints was such that they could not keep up with it. One affects the other. It is a matter of fashion. I do not suppose there are a thousand yards of print cloths used for any other purpose than to be printed into prints by dyeing. Mr. Breckinridge. After the cloth is colored, if the manufacturer developed what is called a taking style, ought it not to be scarce and have a value out of proportion to the labor or raw material? Mr. LovERiNG. It may be so; but the reverse is sometimes the case, where a style is not taking and a man finds that he can not dispose of the undesirable goods readily, and he may often find that he will close out at a sacrifice. Mr. Breckinridge. Therefore, that is speculative, and is predicated upon fashion? Mr. LOVERING. Yes, sir; anything guided by tastes is more or less speculative. COTTON CLOTH. 717 Mr. Breckinridge. Is not England more or less in a state of transi - tion from the coarser to the finer goods? Mr. LovERiNG. Slowly; yes. Theyhavemade within the last twenty years great strides; perhaps within the last year or two not so much. Mr. BRBCKiNRiDaE. Has your establishment made the fluer classes of cotton? Mr. LovERiNGr. I will say that the gentleman who will follow me will answer that more definitely than I can. I want to say, too, that there are gen tlemen who were to be here on Friday morning who were not able to appear at 11:30. They are particularly interested in this fine grade of goods. A gentleman from the Wamsutta Mills, of Fall Eiver, also makes these fine goods. Mr. Breckinridge. In regard to the labor in the coarser cotton goods which we export, is there not some discrepancy in the wages paid here and the wages paid abroad? Are not our wages relatively much higher in that line of business than goods of the finer grades? Mr. LoVERiNG. Relatively as much higher as the wages over there, I should say, yes. Mr. Breckinridge. And still we are able to export them? Mr. LovBRiNG. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. I think the reason why we can not export the finer grade of goods is that they cost so much more? Mr. LoTERiNG. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. In the metal business we export these goods to a considerable extent, except pig iron and steel rails; but in those articles which involve a large amount of labor, such as locomotives, builders' hardware, and cutlery, we are large exporters ? Mr. LoTERiNG. I am not familiar with them. Mr. Breckinridge. Why have we been able to export most largely those goods in which there is most labor cost; that you can not do in your business, which leads us to expect that you ought to do it ? Mr. LovBRiNG. I can not answer. In the regular staples our goods are very close. Mr. Breckinridge. You do not know any reason, then, why they should be able to do that in the metal and not be able to do it in the cotton business? Mr. LoVERiNG. No, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. You can not explain why this fact exists ? Mr. LovERiNG. I should not want to undertake it on my feet. Mr. Breckinridge. Is it not true that manufacture of these finer grades of cotton goods is the newer part of the cotton manufacturing industry, and are not perhaps yet in excess of the demand in this country ? Mr. LOTERING. I think they will find it close business. They do not make inordinate profits. Mr. Breckinridge. I am speaking of the age of the business. Mr. LovERiNG. I think that after ten or twelve years they wiU find a closer business than they have ever found. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you know whether they made any efforts to extend their trade in the foreign markets ? Mr. LoVERiNG. I think efforts are constantly being made to extend the trade. That comes not directly from the manufacturers, but from people engaged in commerce, who are all the time trying to find some American-made goods which they can put into the foreign market. Mr. Breckinridge. What efforts have you made in your establish- meut to extend your foreign trade? 718 COTTON. Mr. LoTETiiNG. I have sent some goods to India, and got my pay about two years after I sent them. I did not lose any money on them, bnf I did not make any. Mr. Breckinridge. What was the occasion of the delay in getting your pay! Mr. LovERiNG. I think it is the experience of all business men that when they send goods abroad they are a long time in getting payment. The special delay in this case was because they went at the wrong season of the year; so I had to wait until the following season, and then I had to negotiate the draft through London to be paid in England. Mr. Breckinridge. You have not made persistent efforts to extend your trade to foreign countries? Mr. LovEEiNG. Personally, I have not. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you know of any manufacturers who make the finer class of goods who have done sol Mr. LoVEEiNG. I do Dot. Mr. Breckinridge. You have never heard of any? Mr. LOVERING. I have not. Mr. Payne. If the American locomotive is sent abroad, is it not because it is better made, and therefore can withstand all competition of the foreign locomoti^•e '? Mr. LOTBRING. I should suppose so. Mr. Payne. As to some of the other articles which require a high degTce of skill in the manufacture, the same thing would hold good? Mr. LovERiNG. Speaking of cutlery, I can understand that. I am told — I do not know whether it is true — that a better ax is made in America than anywhere else in the world. Mr. Payne. Is it not so with machine-made watches? Do not watches made in America command good prices in foreign markets? Mr. LovERiNG. I have been told so. I do not know. Mr. Payne. That accounts for the American ax and the American watch crowding out the foreign ax and the foreign watch: it is because people want the best article? Mr. LovERiNG. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. There are a certain class of people who want the best. There certainly is in this country. Mr. LovERiNG. The best is good enough here. COTTON CLOTH. (Paragraphs 344—348.) Friday, Sepfemher 15, 1893. STATEMENT OF MR. S. B. CHASE, OF FALL EIVEE, MASS. Mr. GHAIE3IAN : I represent the King Philip Mills, who spins similar yarns to Mr. Sauford, but we go farther and we weave them into cloth and make fine cotton goods. The principal thing I have in mind in appearing before tlie committee in the first place is to ask that they do not abandon the present specific duties on cotton goods. I would rather take a decrease of duty and have it specific than even have an advance if it v/as ad valorem. This is the way I feel about it, as far as the interests of our concern are involved. The Chairman. You are si>eaking about cotton cloths? COTTON CLOTH. 719 Mr. Chase. Yes, sir. It is very easy for a specific duty to be arranged upon cotton cloths, as you will find out upon investigation, because it is levied on the width, on the square yard. I think it "has operated very well indeed. In fact we know this class of goods can not come in under a specific duty, but if an ad valorem rate was fixed upon them, we find they are sold very low indeed in competition with our goods. I realize the fact that all manufacturers are very much alike and like to be relieved from competition. That I do not expect nor ask for. I do believe and think we can prove that there is, however, certain existing conditions as between the foreign manufacturers and ourselves which it is impossible for us to overcome, and all I would ask for is that this condition under the tariff laws be equalized. But this labor and taxation has been referred to by Mr. Sanford ; they aie the principal ones. To satisfactorily adjust what that should be on any l^articular fabric is a very difficult matter for me and I realize it is a difficult matter for you. I will be perfectly content for the present duty to renuiin, but if there be any decrease I hope it will be a very small one, and conservative until we find out what we can do. We take it that you do not wish to close us up or drive us out of the business. If we have to reduce our labor, of course that is their misfortune, but we do not like to do that. We would like to keep on the same basis we are now. I have a pocketful of documents, and if it will be of any in- terest to the committee I would like to read them, but as I understand their time is limited I will not attempt to read them. These papers give the names of specific mills abroad, and takes each branch in the mill and gives the earnings of the operators emjiloyed in that branch, and our own earnings set against it so that you can see exactly the difference. I have also here samples of goods. The Chairman. From what source do you get these figures ? Mr. Chase. I have a gentleman who got them for me, who is one of our employes, who went to England. The Chairman. Have you compared them with the figures in the report of the Bureau of Labor through Col. Carroll Wrightf Mr. Chase. I have not. I do not know whether they will agree with them or not. We are williug to stand back of our figures whether they agree with Mr. Wright's or not. We know, of course, the figures, so far as our mill is concerned, are correct, and as to the figures made abroad, we believe Mr. Hayes, who is one of our employes, has done the honest thing. He also worked in England as well as worked for us, and perhaps he caji give a more intelligent idea as to the conditions between the two countries than I cau give you, because that is his native heath when you talk about England, and it is not mine. Do you desire that I should leave these documents? The Chairman. If you desire to do so. We have some exportation of cotton, they are the coarse grades'? Mr. Chase. Yes, sir; entirely. The Chairman. Then, we have some importations? Mr. Chase. They are the finer. The Chairman. They are not made in this country, are theyl Mr. Chase. Yes, sir; we make goods such as are imported. We are in competition with English-made goods. Such goods before the pas- sage of the McKinley bill were selling for 12|, and we are now selling at 11 J here; that is, the last time we sold. They have got to sell at a loss if they sell at all, because there is hardly any market, and compe- tition is pretty fierce on fine goods. The Chairman. Does fashion have anything to do with this import? 720 COTTON. Mr. Chase. Tes, sir ; fasWon has a great deal to do with everything. If you can strike something that nobody else makes you will get a market and get a good price, and you will make money whatever way it works. On the lower grades of goods the foreign competition does not amount to very much, but in the higher grades the labor is a large element, and the competition increases it. And on certain very fine goods we do not pretend to make them at all, and can not under pres- ent conditions. We are working that way as fast as we can. The Chairman. Do you pay your men at Fall liiver higher wages than other parts of the country, say, for instance, higher wages than in Maine? Mr. Chase. My impression is we do. The Chairman. Have you ever compared your wages with the South- ern mills? Mr. Chase. No, sir; I have not. They are reputed to be higher, but I have never made a personal comparison. The Southern mills, of course, in their competition with such mills as I represent would not amount to a great deal. We require higher skilled operators. The work they are doing in the South, whatever they may do in the future, has been done comparatively with inexperienced hands. The Chairman. A gentlemen testifies the mills are beginning to pro- duce a finer cloth which was pressing upon the New England mills? Mr. Chase. I think it has that tendency. I think it is the tendency all over the country and all over the world to increase the trade of weaving and to get it better and better, and as a man rises and advances in intelligence and progress, as they do in this country at a rapid rate, they want better and better goods, and we are using our wits as rapidly as we can to satisfy them. The Chairman. Is there anything else you desire to say. Mr. Chase. No, sir; I have said all that I desire to say. Comparison of wages between a fine American and English spinning mill working on the same production and the same output. TWISTING EOOM HELP. American wages. ' I Manchester, England, wages. Per week. | Per week. Men twister tenders 23s. =$5. 60 Women twister tenders.. \ $2.f|toU^40 Doffer bovs 8s.=$2. 00 Winders ". $3. 00 to $4. 00 Men twister tenders $10. 00 Women 7. 00 to 8. 00 Doffer 5.00 Winders, piecework 7. 50 to 9. 00 Pay roll for the mill in America amounts to $4,000 per week; in England, $2,500 per week, or about 38 per cent against American manufactories in spinning of tine cotton yarns. The statement is made by one of the best-known American superintendents, who has had twenty-five years experience in English mills, and is now running a mill in this country, that the operatives in the American mills do not produce any more work than they do in the English mills ; in fact, he claims that our summers here, the climate is against us, being too warm; and, if anything, he can produce more goods from the same number of hands in England than he can here, and even better quality of work, owing to the better training and long experience given to the English operatives. COTTON CLOTH. 721 Comparison of wages between a fine American and English spinning mill loorking on the same production and the same output. CAED ROOM HELP. American wages — Picker room. Per week. Boss picker tender $10. 00 3 helpers, men, $7 21. 00 Manchester, England, wages — Piclcer room. Per week. Boas picker tender $4. 88 3 women helpers, $2. 50 7. 50 Totalwages 31.00 Over 100 per cent against American mill American wages. Per week. Boss grinders $10. 00 Stripper tenders 7. 50 Lap carrier boy 5. 00 Totalwages 12.38 Manchester, England, wages. Per week. Boss grinders $6. 08 Stripper tenders, men 4. 38 Lap carrier boy 2. 00 Totalwages 22.50 Difference against American mill, 80 per cent, American wages. Totalwages 12.46 Per week. Slabber intermediate and jack frame, women lielp earn $8. 00 to $8. 50 Comber tenders 7. 00 Drawing tenders 7. 00 Ring- frame spinning $7. 00 Doffers frame spinning 4. 50 Mnle-spinning, 2, 000 spindles to the pair : Spinners average . . .$15. 00 to $16. 00 Piecers average 7. 00 Back boys average 4.50 Total cost pair mules 26. 50 Manchester, England, wages. Per week. Best women help for same work earn only 14s. = $3. 40 Comber tenders 148.= 3.40 Drawing tenders 12s. = 3.00 Ring-frame — highest wages. . $3. 75 Doffers 4s. 1.00 Mnle-spinning, 2, 000 spindles to the pair : Spinners average $11.00 Piecers average 15s. = 3. 75 Back boys average 2. 00 Total cost pair mules.. 16.75 Difference against American mill, 60 per cent. Comparison of wages. King Philip Mills. Engineer . Firemen . Slasher tenders average. . Cloth inspectors average. Boys (half time) Loom-fix(T.s average .Spoolers $2i. 00 9.57 10. 08 10.50 *6.O0 12, 82 5.60 * Girls (cloth room). TAXES, ETC. Lees Brook Spinning Company, Oldham. Capital, £80,000 ($384,000). Taxes for 86,000 spindles (85,920) are £654 8s. 8rf. per year, equal to $3, 167. 46. King Philip Mills. 124,000 spindles. Taxes are about $26, 000. Ormerod Hardcastle & Co., Bolton. 110,000 spindles and 400 looms. Weekly pay roll £700, eqnal to $3, 388. king Philip Mills. 124,000 spindles. Weekly pay roll $10, 000. Good iriill coals in Lancashire are about 6s. per ton (never over 6s, dd.), or $1.45. . King Philip Mills pay $3.65 and $4.25. T- H- 46 722 COTTON. Carding. [Eate $4.84 per pound sterling. Used 24J cents per shilling.] Pickers : Huncoat Manufacturing Company, near Accringtou 16.9. 6d.^$i. 00 Vine Spinning Company, Oswaldtwistle 17s. iOd.^ 4.32^ Acoi'ington Cooperative Spinning Company: One at 20.9 ■". .' = 4.84 Two at 14s = 3.39i Union Street Manufacturing Company, Over Darwen ■ ' ifis' == s' 88 Hippings Vale Spinning Company, OsTralilt wistlo IH«. 5d.= 4. 46.!' Average price paid nearly 4. 27 King Philip Mills, $8. 58 and $7. 42. Grinders : Huncoat Manufacturing Company, near Accrington 24.9. =$5. 81 Vine Spinning Company, Oswaldtwistle 24.9. = 5. 81 Accrington Coojierativo Spinning Company 24s. == 5.81' Union Street Manufacturing Companj', Over Darweu 22s. 7(2. = 5.46| Hippings Vale Spinning Company 23;.'. Gd.=: 5. 68t Average nearly 5. 72 King Philip Mills, $9. 25. Alley boys : Huncoat Manufacturing Company, near Accrington 14s.=$3. 38J Vine Spinning Company, Oswaldtwistle 17s. Gd. = 4. 23* Accrington Cooperative Spinning Company 10.9.= 2.42 Union Street Manufacturing Company, Over Darwen 12s. = 2. 90 Hippings Vale Spinning Company, Oswaldtwistle 12s. 9d.= 3.08 Average price 3.20 King Philip Mills, $6. Drawing tenders : Huncoat Manufacturing Company, near Accrington 18s.^$4. 35| Vine Spinning Company, Oswaldtwistle 20s. 6d.= 4.96 Accringtou Coiiperative Spinning Company 19s. = 4. 59| Union Street Manufacturing Company, Over Darwen 20s. = 4. 84 Hippings Vale Spinning Company, Oswaldtwistle 20s. = 4. 84 Average 4. 84 King Philip MiUs, $6. Sweepers : Boys 15 to 17 years 12s.=.$2. 90 King Philip Mills, girls just over school age, $3.71. Lap and roving carriers 17s. 6d.==$i. 23^ King Philip Mills, $7.20. Lap machine tenders : Ormerod, Hardoastle & Co., Bolton 14s.=$3. 38 King Philip Mills, $6. Comber girls, 8 head machines : Ormerod, Hardcastle & Co., Bolton .. .14s. =$3. 38 King Philip Mills, 6 head machines, $7.25. Slubbers : Huncoat Spinning Company (single), near Accrington 18s.=$4. 36| Vine Spiuuing Company, Oswaldtwistle 18s. 6f/.= 4. 48| Accrington CoiJiierativo Spinning Company 18s. :^ 4. 36} Union Street M:i,nufacturing Company, Over Darwen 20s. 10d.= 5.04 Hippings Vale Spinning Company, Oswaldtwistle 2.").9.= 6.00 Average 4. 86 COTTON CLOTH. 723 King Philip Mills, 76 spindles, $8.50. Intermediate : Huucoat Spinning Company, near Acoringtou (pairs 100) 25s. =$6. 05 Vine Spinning Company, Oswaldtwistle 18s. 3d.= 4. 41|- Acerington Cooperative Spinning Company 24s. Hd.^ 5. 92 Hippiugs Vale .Spinning Company, Oswaldtwistle 24s. = 5.81 Union Street Miiiiufaoturiug Company, Over Dar wen 18s. 10d.= 4. 56 Average 5. 35 King Philip Mills, $7.82. Roving frames : Hnucoat Spinning Company, near Acerington 22s. 6d.=$5. 44-J Vine Spinning Company, Osw.aldtwistle 22s. 6(Z.= 5. 44^ Acerington Cooperative Spinning Company 22s. ^ 5. 32 Hippings Vale Spinning Company, Oswaldtwistle J 22 Union Street Manufacturing Company, Over Darwon 33s. 6rf.= 5. 68f Average 5. 38 King Philip Mills, $10. Fine jack frames : Ormerod, Hardcastle »& Co., Bolton, about 25s. =$6. 05 King Phi ip MiUs, $9. Mtile sjiinniiig. [Mulea, 744 spindles.] Price per 100 haiilis. Bolton. King Philip Mills. . 52'a eo's 70's 80's 90's lOO's llO's 120'8 $3.46 3.72 4.02 4,30 4.50 4.80 4.85 6.26 $4.25 4.51 4.76 4.93 5.20 5.36 5.52 5.79 Weaving. A 39 : Swatch attached, 96x104. 39 inches. Warp, 60«. ; filling, 60s. ; length, 77 yards; 3s. 3i(i. per cut = 79^ cents. Cambric (King Philip Mills): 96x104. 40 inches. Warp, 44s.; tilling, 62s. ; length, 55 yards, 82 cents per cut. King Philip cloth same length as English cloth w^ould be $1.15 per cut; difference, 35i cents, nearly 50 per cent higher. English lawns : 72x68. 47 inches. 100 yards, 77J cents. King Philip lawns : 72x68. 47 inches. 100 yards, $1.42. Fine cloths: 104x112. 40 inches. 100 yards ; 2.2875(i. per pick per quarter, with 22. per cent added for reed = 6s. 6d., say $1..57. King Philip Mills: N. B.— (attached) 104x112. 40 inches. 60 yards, say, $1.17 or at the rate of $1.95 jjer 100 yards. English cloth : A41 attached, 104x120. 36 inches. 101 yards; 58.3d. = $.121. A 44 (attached) : 92x80. 30 inches. W, 60, 80 filling ; 127 yards ; 38.10fZ. =92i cents. King Philip styles No. 1848, 88x80. 40 inches. W, 60, 92 f. ; 55 yards, 65 cents per cut, equal to $1.50 for 127 yards; dilferenco, 57| cents. [Extract from article in Blackwood's Magazine (London), July, 1892.] THE PROSPECTIVE DECLINE OF LANCASHIRE COTTON TRADE. BY W. W. ABEAM. French, Belgian, and German traders, who have leaint some valuable lessons from ours, are now teaching British traders this one lesson, that they are no whit less persevering and pushing than the latter, whilst their craftsmen do not rank 724 COTTON. themselves as inferior in inventiveness or deftness to those of Lancashire, Yorkshire, and Lanarkshire. Nevertheless, in the infancy and youth of their cotton manufac- tories, these Belgian, German, and French competitors have not depended alone upon their native intelligence and skill. They have looked to their niouarchs, presidents, and legislatures to fortify them by protective imposts on cotton tissnes entering their countries from abroad, and they have been promptly granted such protection by the state, nor have their countrymen who are consumers and not producers of such manufactures grudged them the advantage. The cotton manufactures of the three countries named may be considered to have attained their maturity, but the shield afforded to their weakness has not been withdrawn from their strength. The French or German maker of cotton goods might perhaps now compete with the British in his own country's markets, at any rate, were the protective duties abol- ished, for his cost of production, averaging the several items, does not exceed th.it of the Lancashire mill-owner. But the duties assure him a substantial profit on his home sales before British goods can enter into competition at all. So French trade in cotton goes to the French manufacturers, German trade to German mami- facturers, and all over Europe the same condition obtains. * * * At the sane time it has to be admitted (however it may seem to tell against our theories as a nation of free-traders) that the cotton trade of the several countries which aie most active competitors in manufactures has developed under protection a good denl faster than the British cotton trade has increased within the same period under free trade. This statement is true of France, Belgium, and Germany, and in a less degree of some other European countries, as the published returns of the quantities of cotton taken by them in a series of years and other statistics of their manufac- tures indicate. ♦ * * » "We are told that the whole trade with India, China, and Japan, in the coarser counts of cottou yarn up to 24s. twist is regarded as already o-one: and it is anticipated that iu counts of yarn np to 30s. that trade can and will be entirely taken by Bombay before half a dozen years have passed. Note 6. — This will drive Lancashire to spinning fine and medium fine counts, and these are the most costly for us to produce, and on which the tariff should be in- creased instead of decreased. CORSETS. (Par.igraph 349.) Wednesday, September 20, 1893. STATEMENT OF MR. MAX ADLEK, REPRESENTING MESSRS. MAYIE, STKOUSE & CO., or NEW YORK, N. Y,, AND NEW HAVEN, CONN. Mr. Chairman : I represent the corset indttstry. I do not appear before you to find any particular fault, but simply to ask that we be not forgotten when a new bill is being framed. The industry is per- fectly satisfied with the present condition of things, and so are the employes. I have here a statement which I will read: We wish to call your attention to the fact that previous to the enact- ment of the tariff bill of 1890, finished corsets were largely discrim- inated against, and it was impossible to introduce the finer grades of goods, which sell at $12, and above, except in very limited quantities. The cause of this was, that the material entering into the corsets paid a higher rate of duty than the finished article, and in order to compete successfully with the imported corsets, it became necessary to use imported materials, 95 per cent of which paid dtities ranging from 40 to 75 per cent, while the finished corsets paid a duty of only 35 per cent. Many of these materials are not manufactured in the United States, although attempts have, at various times been made to manufacture them, but without success, owing to the fact that coutils, foreign jeans, Alexandra cloth, fine satteens, Italians, and other cloths used in the manufaclure of these fine grades of corsets, are made from yarns which are bleached or dyed before being woven into the goods. CORSETS. 725 The tariff bill of 1890 placed the duty on nearly all imported mate- rials on an equality with the finished corsets, thus enabling the manu- facturers of the United States to produce the better grades of goods, thereby giving more steady employment to their employes, and at the same time enabling them to pay more liberal wages. The corset industry in the United States has become quite an import- ant one, employing at present a capital of about $10,000,000 and giv- ing employment to about 17,000 operatives. The rapid growth of the industry has, naturally, engendered severe competition between the manufacturers in the various sections of the United States, so much so that the American made corsets are to-day sold to the dealer and purchased by the consumer at lower prices than prevailed previous to the enactment of the tariff bill of 1890. This is especially so in the cheaper grades, ranging from $3 to $9 per dozen to the dealer, and retailing to the consumer fiom 30 cents to $1 per pair. The manufacturers have not since the origin of the industry in the United States formed any combination or trust, but have transacted their business individually and on an independent scale. It is thus shown that the public have received the full benefit of home competition. The increased protection of the present tariff law has been fully offset by the fierce local competition which has forced prices down to even a lower standard than those prevailing previous to 1890. Corsets are not specially enumerated in the existing tariff law, but are entered as wearing apparel, under paragraph 349, at 60 per cent ad valorem if composed of cotton, and if silk enters into their manu- facture then they are entered under paragraph 413 at 60 per cent. If the tariff bill of 1890 is to be revised, we ask, first, that the rate of duty on the finished corset shall be at least 10 per cent higher than the duty upon the various cloths, laces, edgings, tapes, and steel for corset clasps, side and back steels, which enter into the construction of the corsets and constitute a large item of their cost; second, that the protection given to corsets shall be at least equal to that given to other wearing apparel. We believe that the interest of the consumer, as well as of the man- ufacturer, would be conserved by leaving the duty the same as at present. Any considerable reduction of the present rate of duty would force upon the manufacturers the necessity of reducing the wages of their employes, and in some cases would compel them to retire from business, as it would be utterly impossible, at a low rate of duty, to compete with the low standard of wages paid in the European factories for this class of work. Eespectfully submitted. WAKNER BROTnERg, J. G-. FiTZPATRICK Co., Mayer, Strouse & Co., And others. I do not know that I care to add anything to this brief. Mr. Turner. How much change was made in your favor in the present law? Mr. Adler. Fifteen per cent on the finished article. Mr. Turner. Is not it more than that? Mr. Abler. That is all. Thirty-five per cent was the duty before, and it is now 60 per cent on cotton corsets ; on silk corsets it is 60 per cent. The duty on raw materials previous to 1890 ranged from 40 to 70 per cent, whiliB the corsets themselves only paid a duty of 35 per 726 COTTON. cent, and even to-day there are some materials entering into corsets wliicli pay a higher rate of duty than the liiiished article. Dr. Warner, my colleagne, would like to add a few items to the brief. STATEMENT OF DS. LTICIEN C. WAENEE. Mr. Chaieman : I will try to be very brief. Although our industry is a considerable one, it is much smaller than a great many others, and it would hardly be necessary to make special mention here, were it not that we feared that what was done in the former law might form a precedent in any action that may be taken. As has been stated in the paper, we not only did not receive protection, but we were directly dis- criminated against in the former law in the change that was made, and silk corsets, even where the raw cloth paid a duty of 50 per cent, were introduced under a tariff of 35 per cent. To understand correctly the condition of the importations and process, I may say we must divide the corsets into two classes. One is the cheap goods which are made from domestic materials, which is sold as low as $1 and below in this country, and which are made almost entirely from domestic cloth, the only imported article being the lace around the top. When, however, we get to corsets above $1, especially those selling at $1.50 to $2 and $3, then we have a large number of imported corsets, from $1.50 to $2 per pair. These finer corsets are made from imported cloth. There is no cloth made in this country that is acceptable for it. They are made of cloths of which the yarns are bleached or dyed before weaving. It requires that a mill shall be especially devoted for such purposes, and cloths have been protected no less than 40 per cent for many years. There have not been any manu- facture of those cloths in this country. It therefore becomes nec- essary for the corset manufacturers making these finer grades of goods to import all of these cloths and import the laces which he uses upon the top, and also some other items. Those are the only corsets which have been imported during the past twenty years. The corsets which have been imported that sell as low as $1 are of too little con- sequence to be mentioned. Therefore, when we are speaking of the duty upon corsets we are speaking only of the higher grade of corsets. I will say, by the way, I am not a defender of the tariff, I voted and talked against it, and I feel it is a little anomalous in sajang here in this case with all of its inconsistencies and many weak points that it did treat the corset industry fairly. Under the stimulus of the McKinley bill, where we received about 5 per cent more protection on corsets than the materials paid, the amount of those better grades of goods manufactured in this country is about double ; there has not been a very large falling off of the importation of goods I am inclined to think; although I have not figures with me, I think you will find the aggregate duty received is very nearly if not quite what it was before, but under this we have been enabled to make a better grade of goods and nearly all the manufacturers have doubled their production of these finer grades of goods. The point we wish to make is this : First, that we shall not be dis- criminated against, but That the duty on the finer goods shall be left higher than that on cloths and laces, which are sim^jly intermediai;e, and which, though not raw material, are to us raw material. We will not ask that the duty shall remain at or near what it is now, for the reason the class of goods imported are luxuries; they are not for the common working people, but the better class of people, and if anything CORSETS. 727 slioxild pay a good rate of duty it should be wearing- apparel in this ease. We see no reason why it should not remain as wearing apparel, for the same condition applies to corsets as wearing apparel. Manufactured garments which are injported are generally for the better classes of people, and they are generally the expensiye goods, and, therefore, may properly pay a higher rate of duty than the material of which they are composed. I will not trespass further upon your time. Mr. Hopkins. Why do you say the duty on the corsets should be higher than the duty on the materials of which corsets are made? Dr. Warner. Otherwise we can not make them in competition with foreign goods. Mr. Hopkins. Why ; because their labor is less than ours 1 Dr. Warner. But if we have to pay 20 per cent more here for mate- rial than they do we can not make goods as cheaply. Mr. Hopkins. Is there any difference in the labor cost here and abroad? Dr. Warner. The same exists in corset manufacture as in all depart- ments. I suppose our rates are 50 per cent higher than England and 100 per cent higher than the continent. Mr. Hopkins. You mean the rates of labor? Dr. Warner. Yes, sir. Mr. Hopkins. You say 50 per cent, for the same kind of work, more than is paid in England? Dr. Warner. In England or France. Mr. Turner. What are your raw materials? Dr. Warner. The cloth and lace or edging around the top, the horn strips, which have been free for many years, horn or whale bone, and raw steel, which forms the front of the corsets. Mr. Turner. Do you make the laces yourselves? Dr. Warner. They are made in this country, and they should be included. The steel we require — the steel I referred to — is raw steel as it comes in this country, a rolled steel. The corset manufacturer buys this rolled steel, which is all imported. Mr. Turner. What is it you desire, I could not catch all you said ; do you wish to preserve the present rate, or do you wish a change in any respect? Dr. Warner. We are well satisfied to preserve the present rate, but if there is any reduction in almost all directions we could stand a little amount of reduction. Mr. Tuener. How much would you stand? Dr. Warner. That is a hard question to ask me, as 1 do not know your general scheme. If we knew, I could answer. If there should be a general reduction in all directions — say ten per cent — provided the cloths, laces, etc., were reduced proportionately, it would not be seri- ously detrimental to the business. Mr. Hopkins. Is it not a fact, since the adoption of the so-called McKinley bill, that corsets of all kinds have decreased in value in this country, and that the output has increased and volume of business has increased and the cost of the specific article has decreased ? Dr. Warner. The corsets have been cheaper than before. Some corsets are sold under a trade-mark name and the price is controlled somewhat by the reputation which they have, so some corsets are con- tinued at the same prices. Mr. Turner. Has the price of Illinois wheat and corn declined since the McEanley bill passed? 728 COTTON. Dr. Warner. It has, and we are buyiag our cloths cheaper than we were three years before. Mr. Turner. Corsets bave become a little cheaper on the other side? Dr. Warner. I am not able to answer that. Mr. Hopkins. If I understand you, you say originally you were opposed to this McKinley bill and voted and talked against it? Dr. Warner. Yes. Mr. Hopkins. And when you came to see the workings of it on the specific article you mentioned here in your argument before the com- mittee to-day you say its tendency was beneficial, both to the consumer and producer? Dr. Warner. In the case of corsets, I say it is. Mr. Hopkins. Both to the consumer and the producer? Dr. Warner. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. There is no export trade in corsets from this country? Dr. Warner. Very little ; not a large one. We sell some to Bermuda and some few to Canada and a few to the countries of South America, but not much. Mr. Breckinridge. What class of corsets — the cheaper? Dr. Warner. Generally the cheaper kind. I think I would rather like to ask Mr. A dler. Mr. Adler. It is the cheaper class. Mr. Breckinridge. The tax you pay on the imported material makes it too high for you to manufacture for export trade? Dr. Warner. Yes. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you find also the price of the material of domestic manufacture that is protected is enhanced by the tariff, or do you buy these articles as cheaply as they are sold abroad ? Dr. Warner. The domestic cloths, I judge, are sold at about the same price as abroad, and I judge so because I know they are sold in foreign countries in competition with them. Mr. Breckinridge. What grades of cloths are you speaking of — give the commercial designation? Dr. Warner. Corset jeans and coutil. Mr. Breckinridge. Are you sure they are sold as cheaply here as abroad ? Dr. Warner. The common corset jean, I suppose, would be sold about the same price; I am not an expert in that line. Mr. Breckinridge. I understand you to say you believe they are sold as cheaply here as abroad because they are exported largely? Dr. Warner. The mills that make the cloths for us make other cloths upon the same loom, and as they offer to sell those which I think are exported, they must be made at about the same price here as abroad. Mr. Breckinridge. Corset jeans vary in grade? Dr. Warner. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. What would be the technical deflnation of that particular kind of corset jean of which you are speaking? Dr. Warner. You mean the imported? Mr. Breckinridge. The kind exported? Dr. Warner. I do not think they are exported under the name of corset jeans; they are exported under the names of drills. Mr. Breckinridge, Drill of what grade, what is the commercial definition? Dr. Warner. I am only speaking of general information, it is not my business, and I could not answer that accurately. CORSETS. 729 Mr. Breckinridge. You buy tLe drilling? Dr. Warner. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. What do you call it? Dr. Warner. We call it corset jeans. Mr. Breckinridge. Is it all of one grade and name, have they not terms used in the business to distinguish the different grades ? Dr. Warner. Some are finer than others, some heavier. Mr. Breckinridge. By what terms do you distinguish them ? Dr. Warner, We distinguish them simply by the weight and the number of yards that make a pound. For instance, the lighter 3.80 to the pound and the heavier 2.60 yards to the pound. Mr. Breckinridge. You buy them by grade according to weight? Dr. Warner. Yes, sir. And also on accotint of the fineness of the yarn and number of threads to the inch. Mr. Breckinridge. What weight of corset jeans is exported? Dr. Warner. I can not answer that. Mr. Breckinridge. You do not know what grade it is? Dr. Warner. No, I do not; but I should think about 3 yards to the pound. Mr. Breckinridge. What term would express the degree of fine- ness? Dr. Warner. There are two kinds of cloth made, one of which has a large number of counts to the warp and a small number in the filling. They may have used 120 counts to the warp and 60 in the filling. There is another kind of cloth which will be reversed and which will have 120 in the filling. Kow, a loom here which makes the one cloth will turn out 60 yards a day, and if it makes the other it can only turn out half that quantity. Our mills are such they could compete on the kind of cloth which has the small number of picks in the filling much better than those that have the higher number of the picks where the element of labor is much greater. Mr. Breckinridge. That is as definite as you can make it? Dr. Warner. Yes, sir. I am not altogether a cloth expert. Mr. Breckinridge. What mills produce this article of which you speak. Dr. Warner. There is the Pepperel, the Amoskeag, and the mill at Great Falls. Mr. Breckinridge. They are located where? Dr. Warner. In Maine and on the border line between New Hamp- shire and Massachusetts. Mr. Hopkins. That grade is produced in many cotton mills over the country. Dr. Warner. I think it is. CORSETS. (Faragraphg 349 and 413.) New York, September 20, 1893. Sir: We respectfully submit our reasons for wishing that the duty on the article of corsets should be reduced, and, further, that corsets should be specified as a separate article, and not be brought under the heading of any other line of goods. (1) Under the tariff prior to the one now existing, corsets all, with- out distinction, paid 35 per cent duty. The American manufacturers, with hardly an exception, prospered under it, kept increasing their > 730 COTTON. product, wliile the imported article decreased, as, for example, the im- portations from the three leading countries, as per inclosed extract from the custom-house records in New York, show to have l)een, in 1887, $1,045,228: in 1888, $982,974; in 1889, $854,760; in 1890, $951,656 (stimulated in that year by the expected McKinley tariff). We knew the manufacturing of the article in this country to have contained such elements of lasting success that we had formed, some- time before the era of the present tariff, the plan of manufacturing corsets in this country and at the same time containing the importa- tion of corsets. We executed the plan by erecting and working a factory at New Haven, Conn. There are certain lines of the article made in Germany which could not be made to advantage in this country, which were excellent and cheap to the consumer, and which are now almost excluded from the trade, now paying, on account of some slight embroideries, 60 per cent duty, while the finest corsets, not being so embroidered, but having, instead of embroidery trimming a lace trimming pay 50 per cent duty. This was brought about in the final stages of the tariff proceedings in the conference committee, agreeing ou a paragraph concerning em- broideries, under which these cheap German corsets have to pay 60 per cent duty, while the American manufacturers then asked only 50 per cent duty. The importation fi?om Germany in 1886, as per inclosed schedule, was $550,557, and the total importation from all countries, Germany included, of all cotton corsets (all others are insignificant in amount), was, ia 1891, 8208,894; in 1892, $360,260. (2) Corsets in the former tariff bills have been, for many years, sepa- rately specified as a separate article for itself; they are not so now, being under the heading of "wearing apparel." This has created many diflQculties in the classification of the invoices, and there really is no need for this. Under the old system, the importer and the appraiser at once knew what duty corsets had to pay, and that system we beg to have renewed. We are now manufacturers as well as importers of corsets, have considerable money invested in our iactory at New Haven, and, after mature reflection, came to the conclusion that we need not fear a reduction on the rate of duty, provided the duties on the imported materials used on the finer grades of corsets, such as cotton goods now Ijaying 45 per cent, wool and woolen cotton materials paying still more, trimmings, now paying 60 per cent, be reduced also. We therefore beg- to recommend that the duty on corsets be again 35 per cent, certainly not more than 40 per cent. Yours, respectfully, Ottenhbimeb Bros. Established since 1857. Importations of corsets. [Extract from custom-house records, New York, September, 1893, submitted by Ottenhoimer Bros., 446 aud 448 Broadway.] Belgium. France . . Germany 1884. $87, 175 '..'45, IC'i 50'J, 3U4 1885. $105, 391 ■j:i5, 148 550, 557 1886. $163,304 273, 223 526, 004 $219, 175 330, 519 495, 534 1888. $200,543 I $249,864 329.969 1 308,324 452,402 I 290,572 I 1890. $280, 818 413, 837 257, 001 From all countries, all corsets (cotton) in 1891 $268,894 From all countries, all corsets (cotton) in 1892 300,260 CHENILLE. 731 CHElSriTjIjE. (Paragraph 3S1.) Philadelphia, Septemher 18, 1893. The undersigned manufacturers of upholstery and chenille goods respectfully ask that the following clause of the tariff act of 1890 be retained in the bill now in course of construction : Chenille curtains, table covers, and all goods manufactured of cotton chenille, or of which cotton chenille forms the component material of chief value, 60 j)er cent ad valorem. We respectfully call the attention of your committee to the fact that previous to the passage of the McKinley bill large quantities of these goods were imported. It is estimated that more than 1,000,000 table covers, besides large quantities of curtains, were imported in the year previous to the passage of this law. We desire to state that these goods are now all made by your petitioners, none of them being imported. By reference to Consular Eeports 1884, vol. 1, p. 408, it will be seen that the average wages in the consular district of Leipsic, Saxony (which is the district from which the bulk of these goods have been imported) for men weavers is $3.60 per week's work of 11 hours per day, and for woman weavers $2.38 per week's work of 11 hours per day, being one-fourth of the amount paid by your petitioners. Your petitioners would state that the bulk of the cost in manufac- turing chenille goods consists of labor. . Unlike other cotton fabrics there are several separate and distinct operations necessary to manu- facture these goods: First, the spinning of the yarns; second, the dyeing of the yarns ; third the winding of the yarns and weaving of the cloth for the chenille; fourth, the cutting of the cloth into strips or chenille; fifth, reeling, winding, and weaving the chenille into curtains, covers, or other goods for which intended; sixth, finishing and fringing of the goods. Three-fourths to seven-eighths of the cost of these goods consists of labor. It is therefore of paramount importance that the duty be made high enough to cover the difference in lal3or here and that paid in Europe, and to cover any contingency that may arise should the cost of production be reduced in Europe by the introduction of improved processes and machinery. Your petitioners would state that immediately on the passage of the McKinley bill they made large investments of money in new machinery, introduced improved processes of manufacture, and were at once able to supply all of this class of goods called for by the consumer. These improvements, and competition among your petitioners, has caused a gradual reduction in the selling price .of these goods, until now they are sold at from 30 to 40 per cent below the market price previous to the passage of this act. The estimated increase of these goods made now over amount made previous to the passage of this act is over 100 per cent. From f ,000,000 to 10,000,000 pounds of cotton yarn is consumed annually by your peti- tioners. The bulk of this yarn is made in the Southern States. This increase has enabled your petitioners to employ a large number of additional people and give their employes more steady employment, thus increasing their earnings. Beomlet Manufacturing Co. Stead & Millee. And others. 732 COTTON. nOSIERT AND KNIT GOODS. (Paragraph 353.) STATEMENT OF ME. JOHN O'CONNELI, OF NEW YORE, REPRESENTING HILTON, HUGHES & CO. Friday, September 15, 1893. Mr. Chairman : I tlaank you for the extension of the courtesy- after our time has been already allowed, and permit me to say at the outset I am empowered to represent the house of Hilton, Hughes & Co., of New York. I am also empowered to speak for Arnold, Con- stable & Co., Lord & Taylor, E. S. Jaffray, and that class and char- acter of merchants. They are general merchants who deal in domes- tic and imported goods without discrimination. As merchant import- ers, we believe that a tariff law will exist in this country, whether it will be for the purpose of revenue only or for protection. We ask, however, as importers and merchants doing a legitimate business, that the present tariff be reduced, and that it be reduced in a way that certain abuses which now exist may be corrected. I speak now for hosiery, underwear, and the glove interest. In all large houses these are grouped in one department and under one head, and, therefore, I am competent to speak and represent all of them so far as foreign and domestic goods are concerned. The principal abuses under the last tariff to which I would call your attention is the classification of merchan- dise whereby certain lines are drawn in such a manner that it enables the dishonest importer to enter imported goods undervalued, and thereby not only to defraud the Government, but to undersell the hon- est and fair trader, and that hurts the domestic manufacturer who demands protection, sometimes without the domestic manufacturer knowing it. I have only to point to the signs on Broadway, New York. They are not Yankee names, they are not Scotch, they are not Eng- lish names, and yet they are not small traders in dry goods. They are continental names and they have been favored and enriched because the tariff of this country has had no force as a rule. Now, I grant you that an ad valorem duty is an ideal tariff' if all men are honest; but all are not. Many of them who trade iu dry goods and dry goods business in the markets of this country have confederates abroad, and I venture to say iu every dry goods market in Europe nine-tenths of the exporters will enter into collusion so that their goods may be undervalued and sold in this country. We, the importers, have worked nearly a week on this. We were almost unanimously of the opinion that the best — the honest tariff — will be a specific one. We doubted if this committee, or Congress, would grant a specific duty, as the policy has been always toward an ad valorem, so we concluded to ask for a mixed tariff — an ad valorem duty which shall not be over 135 per cent and then a spe- cific duty, so that it may be honestly collected and the honest importer protected. Let me say we do not antagonize the domestic manufac- turers. We want their mills to run, their j)roducts to be employed, because it is by having all people at work in this country, and all prosperous, that we can find a market for our merchandise, whether foreign or domestic. You had before you this morning a gentleman representing domestic cotton industry — Mr. Osborn. He says he wants that present duty to stand, and yet that gentlemen knows as well as I know that the Government is being defrauded under tliat classification HOSIERY AND KNIT GOODS. 733 and peox)le like him are being hurt. He knows it, and yet he asks for that tariif to stand. That gentleman also misinformed you when he stated he could buy the same stocking in Germany for less than they could; that is not so. On that class of goods used in Germany there is an average of 80 per cent tariff', and while the German manufacturer may charge his own people a little more than he does the American, there is certainly not that 80 per cent difference, and you have been misinformed as to that entirely. The domestic manufacturer is entitled to thisj he is entitled to protection in the inequalities which exist in labor. I do not believe the raw material costs the American more than the foreigner. He is entitled to, and should have, that much protection which equalizes the difference in wages and difference in value. Now, hosiery has been pretty well gone over. Give us a simple duty that cotton goods be cotton goods, and give us not over 25 per cent specific duty and 25 per cent ad valorem duty, and give us on part-silk and all-silk hosiery 25 per cent ad valorem and $1 per dozen, and on woor25 per cent ad valorem and 50 cents per pound. Where you have an ad valorem duty there is an invitation to fraud; where you have a low ad valorem duty and a specific duty men will not take those chances, but where there is an ad valorem duty there is undervaluation, and the man who does it is fortified with documents, or at least with arguments, and you can not really get around him, so we have made it both, so that by weight or count you can easily ascer- tain by an examination at the custom-house whether it has been under- valued, and you can punish him accordingly. Now, not to take up any more of your time, I limit myself to a min- ute longer. We want a tariff that will be simple in its character, that can be" honestly collected, and the honest importer of this country pro- tected against the foreigner and the foreigner's agents who have had no voice in our organization, as we cut them off. We want a tariff so simple that it can be enforced. Another thing. We understand the new tariff, or rather we antici- pated a reduction of tariff, and we ask of you not to spring any new tariff suddenly upon us, but to give us a fair, reasonable time in which to adjust our business and liquidate our affairs. I would name July, 1894, as the earliest date at which we could straighten up our affairs. Moreover, I would say the McKinley administrative bill created two abuses, which exist; one was conf?igning goods to their establishments or agents here, notorious undervaluations, and the other was their power to deduct for boxes, etc. Now, in the tariff we have prepared we allow 10 cents per dozen for it; in fact, that gives 10 cents a dozen less, which is, by tbe way, all we ask. If you would fairly consider this I believe we would have an ideal tariff, one which would realize the purpose of revenue, one which would give the necessary protection and equalize the inequalities that exist, and you would stop these fraudulent importers from enriching themselves at the expense of the Government and domestic manufacturers and the honest importers of the country, and it is for them I plead. 734 COTTON. KNIT UNDBRWEAE. (Parngraph 353.) STATEMENT OF ME. EDWIN H. BAKER. Mr. Chairman : I promise to detain you but three minutes, for I think that will give me ample time to say what I wish to .say. I wish to call the attention of the committee particularly to a class of kuit underwear which has not been by itself touched upon this morning. I refer to the fine cotton underwear, such as is brought into use during the warm months of July, August, and later — the very finest and thin- nest cotton underwear. There are a few industries up in Massachu- setts which have been built up in the last twelve or fifteen years, and the particular point to which I wish to call your attention is that labor forms in this particular class of underwear a very considerable portiou of the cost of the finished product. The goods being woven light, of course the question of material is relatively a small consideration. " The amount of labor necessary to put it iuto fabric is the most impor- tant factor, and amounts to more than one-half of the total cost of the finished product. At the same time this class of manufacture in under- wear, standing peculiarly by itself, is constantly in the line of lighter weights, finer fabrics and texture, and consequently a larger relative proportion of labor cost. I am not prepared, if I had the disposition, to enter into the question of the amount of protection that it needs. I think I can safely leave that for the faithful consideration of the com- mittee, as I am sure it will have an intelligent consideration when it is reached. HOSIERY AND GLOVES. (Paragraph 353.) STATEMENT OF MAUBICE LOWY, OF NEW YORK, Mr. Chairman : I appear before you as the chairman of a committee of six firms, representing the importers of hosiery and gloves of the city of New York, to recommend to you a new tariff to be made in such a way that no undervaluations and frauds can take place as is done now, and especially since the McKinley bill has taken effect. In the year of 1890, I also appeared before the Finance Committee of the Senate, as chairman of the importers of hosiery and gloves in the United States, and before that committee I illustrated that if a scaling or graduating tariff is put on hosiery, this will open the door for frauds and undervaluations, and I am sorry to say that it has turned out even worse than I pictured at the time. I argued before the Finance Committee of the Senate that I do not urge the committee to make a higher or lower rate of duty ; I gladly leave this to the legislative body of the United States. I only wanted to impress upon the Finance Committee that I want a straight tariif, and thereby protect honorable business firms against those that will defraud the G-overnment and also ruin the business. To-day, I appear before you on the same errand, and I shall submit to your consideration a tariff rate on hosiery and gloves which I believe will not only protect the Government to collect the duties that HOSIERY AND GLOVES. 735 the Grovernment is entitled to, but also protect honest importers as well as home industry. It is a known fact that on this line of goods a correct valuation can not be placed even by the best of experts. I am importing goods since about twenty-two years, and I am free to acknowledge that I can not tax the value of a hose by 5 to 10 per cent. To prove this assertion I herewith state to you that when a hose is put before a manufacturer abroad and tlie selling price asked for the same, the manufacturer will have to examine the stocking very closely, weigh and measure it, con- sult his dyer and superintendent of the factory, and, after three men go over it very carefully, they will fix the price. This same hose taken to another manufacturer, he will do the same as described above, and his price might be from 5 to 10 per cent higher or lower, although the goods will appear to be alike. Now, gentlemen, when even a manufacturer can not place the cor- rect value on a hose — only can state at what price he can sell these goods — how is it possible that an examiner at the custom-house (who is not a practical hosiery manufacturer) can fix a correct value on stockings? Under the present tariff a hose costing not above 60 cents pays a duty of 20 xier cent ad valorem and 20 cents a dozen, while on an ar- ticle costing- 61 cents to $2 the duty at present is 30 per cent ad valorem and 50 cents per dozen. With other words, an article that costs 1 cent more than 60 cents pays a so hiuch higher rate of duty. ]S"ow, to avoid this higher rate of duty and to defraud the Govern- ment, also to iindersell honest importers, and thereby make an ille- gitimate and exorbitant profit, some firms imijort goods that are worth 75 cents and even 80 cents x*er dozen at the lowest rate of duty by having them invoiced at 59| cents or thereabouts ; that is, below 60 cents per dozen. After the McKinley bill took effect, I went abroad in the spring of the year 1891. I went there to buy a stock of goods, and a certain manufacturer showed me a hose at 72 cents, which makes in Germany 3 marks. When I stated to him that I could not buy these goods be- cause I have to enter them into the United States at the higher rate of duty, he answered that supposing you buy of me 5,000 dozens of these goods at 2 marks and 40 pfennigs (which makes the goods to be invoiced at 57 J cents), and in conjunction with this purchase you buy of me 5,000 dozens of another stocking, for which my price is 4 marks, or 96 cents a dozen, and for this latter style I shall charge you 4 marks and 60 pfennigs, which is $1.08, and thereby the average of both lots is made ; but you, as the importer, have the advantage to enter the first 5,000 dozens at the lowest rate of duty, while on the higher priced article you have to pay the higher duty anyhow. I refused to enter into any such fraudulent transactions, but the man- ufacturer stated to me that he had made such so-called combination sales to some firms in the United States. I requested the manufac- turer to send to my office in Chemnitz sample pairs of these two styles of goods, and I sent these samples to my partners in New York, re- questing them to find out if such transactions are considered rightful and admitted by the United States Government. My partners con- sulted the examiner at the custom-house, and he certainly stated that this is fraud. This decision was cabled to me, and I refused to pur- chase the goods; but I know that other firms have done business in this manner. At the time I was in Chemnitz I also consulted our consul about this 736 COTTON, matter, and he reported it to the respective department in "Washington, I was glad to hear, some weeks afterwards, that the order came from Washington to have the entire shipments of hosiery of each firm called in for examination, and by this order every honest man thought that the frauds would be stopped. For three to four weeks thousands of cases of hosiery and gloves were sent to the public stores for examination, but nothing crooked could be found out, because the seller and buyer were in- collusion, and the examiner could not, with the best of will, detect anything wrong, as he did not know any better. Although I was glad that this order was given, still it was impracticable and impossible to carry out this way of doing business, because to examine, for instance, only 1,000 cases of hosiery would take one examiner fully six months. Only a week or two ago a certain firm entered at the custom-house a lot of men's white and black Berlin gloves at 1 mark and 53 pfennigs, or 36f cents currency. These goods were advanced 5 pfennigs, or 1^ cents per dozen. I paid for these goods in Europe, for large contracts of 5,000 to 10,000 dozens, 2 marks, or 48 cents. These goods pay a duty of 50 per cent ad valorem, and they are sold here with a profit of about 5 to 6 per cent. I paid the straight duty of 24 cents a dozen, while the other party only paid 19 cents per dozen. This will show you that a dishonest man is making a large profit on this staple article, and also is able to undersell any honest merchant, and on this account I had to sell my importation with a loss. I also state to you that I have in my possession an afi&dayit, signed, sealed, and witnessed, made by a man who has been an agent in New York for two manufacturers in Saxony, In this affidavit he swears that one firm has entered woolen goods as cotton, and thereby defrauded the Government out of 10 per cent ad valorem duty and 49:1 cents per pound. In the same affidavit it is also stated that another manufacturer, whom he represented here, has undervalued goods from 5 to 30 per cent. I also have in my possession two letters, written by a certain manufacturer to his agents here, asking their advice how to invoice goods to get them through the custom-house as low as possible, also asking the agents' advice how they shall fix their books in case they should have any trouble with the custom-house authorities. These two letters contain several other damaging state- ments. I am ready to show these letters to the chairman of this com- mittee whenever you wish to see them. Another illustration of the frauds committed here by certain unscru- pulous importers is the following case: A certain agent came to my office and offered me a certain hose at $1.90 currency, which is the equivalent value of 4 marks in Germany, duty not paid. I told the agent that I am an importer and do not buy any goods in currency, delivered in this country, but I am willing to take 2,000 dozens of these goods at the foreign market price of 4 marks, which is the same as $1,90, duty paid. The agent answered me that he is only authorized to sell these goods at the currency price, as they are invoiced by the manufacturer to him, and he will pass them through the custom-house. I cabled to my office in Chemnitz and made an offer of 4 marks for 2,000 dozen of these goods to the manufacturer; he refused to accept it, stating that he will not sell these goods to us for less than 4.60 marks, and this latter price is equivalent in New York to $2.10 cur- rency. This example clearly shows that the manufacturer is making a large profit at the costof our. Government,, and. furthermore he sells HOSIERY AND GLOVES. 73? ttese goods to anybody at $1.90, while the same goods cost me, to land, $2.10. I could relate to you a good many other examples, but I do not wish to trespass on your patience; neither do I wish to use up too much ot your valuable time. I represent a very large interest of honest importers, and being a citizen of the United States since many, many years, I request you to protect me as well as any other honest citizen by making such a tariff' on our lines of goods where these frauds can not take place. At first I was in favor of an entirely specific duty, but after due con- sideration I came to the conclusion that a small ad valorem duty and a a heavy specific duty is just the thing wanted. The ad valorem duty must be so small that it does not pay adishonest importer to undervalue, and on account of the small gain to be made such a dishonest man will not take chances to be liable for a large amount of penalty. Although I am in the importing business for many years, and my own individual interest would be for a very low tariff by which I could make a large amount of money, still I do not ask for a very low tariff, because I am patriotic enough to advocate a square and fair protective tariff' for our home industries, so that the manufacturers here are protected against the pauper labor in Europe. They shall leuiain in position to sell their goods against foreign competition, and thereby give employ- ment to thousands of working people. In submitting to you the following proposition of duties on imported hosiery and gloves, I state to you that the duty on wool goods I have based on the supposition that it is your intention to recommend to Con- gress to have raw wool entered free, and for this reason I propose a lowering of the duty of 35 per cent ad valorem. I have embraced in my schedule cotton hosiery in the rough, which is imported for dyeing purposes, and made a difference of 10 centsper dozen between this unfinished and finished liosiery. The dyeingindus- try is getting a good foothold in this country, and the 10 cents per dozen protection will about square the difference in labor for dyeing and finishing between Europe and here. In closing my remarks I herewith state to you again that I am sat- isfied with any rate of duty which you may propose to Congress, but only request you again, and wish to impress upon you, under no cir- cumstances to do any different than to make a small ad valorem duty and a higher specific duty — no graduating tariff' according to values — and by this you will not only protect the United States Government against frauds but also every honest man that is doing business here as a citizen of the United States. DUTIES PROPOSED. Cotton hosiery, all kinds, 20 per cent ad valorem and 40 cents per dozen. Cotton hosiery in the rough, imported for dyeing purposes only, 20 per cent ad val- orem and 30 cents per dozen. Part silk and all-silk hosiery, 25 per cent ad valorem and $1 per dozen. Part wool and all-wool hosii.'ry, 25 per cent ad valorem and 50 cents per pound. Gloves and mittens. — Cotton, 15 per cent ad valorem and 15 cents per dozen. Part silk and all silk, 15 per ceut ad valorem and 50 cents per dozen. Part wool and all wool, 25 per cent ad valorem and 50 cents ijer pound. T H 47 738 COTTON. HOSIERY. (Paragraph 35S.) STATEMENT OF MB. J. HEKBT SMITH, OF SStlTH & ANGELl, No. 23 THOMAS STREET, NEW YORK. Mr. Ohaieman: It is very true that I have been asked to present to you what you might call a new industry. I appear before you as a manufacturer and importer, and I will briefly and simply explain why 1 am here. About seven years ago, becoming 'largely interested in an American industry, I found that in this country, we could dye what we call fast black. I concluded to invest capital, hoping to be able to furnish abso- lutely fast-black hosiery. Succeeding, I decided either to make the goods here or import them. To my surprise, when I went to the cus- tom-house with the expectation of importing goods in what we call "in the rough" (which is in an unfinished state, as they come from the loom), I found that the duty on the rough goods was the same as the duty on the finished goods. I called the attention of the custom-house department to that fact, and they said, "Mr. Smith, when the tariff which we now have was formed this subject of goods in the rough was never brought to our attention, and we would suggest, when a new tariff is made, that you bring it to the attention of the proper party, and they will, no doubt, give you a tariff for this class of goods. Mr: Payne. When was that? ; Mr. Smith. Six or seven years ago. Fow, the matter of rough goods • may not be understood by all in our line of business. I endeavored to make the goods here, and 1 am frank to say to you that I found we could not make what is called " full-fashioned " goods in this country, and we' concluded to import them and dye and finish the imported goods, our' fast black. At that time there was not an actual fast-black stocking . in America or Europe, and to America belongs the credit of inventing | a color that is now used universally throughout the world. Now the! stocking, as it comes from the loom, is in this condition [exhibiting an| unfinished stocking]. We pay the same schedule rate of duty to im-l port this unfinished one that we do on a stocking that is in that condi- tion, dyed and finished [exhibiting a black, finished stocking]. Our industry here has grown very rapidly. When we first com- menced at Sterling, Conn., where I am interested, there was only a very small plant for the dyeing and finishing of black piece goods. The Sterling Dyeing & Finishing Company have continued to increase the plant until they .have thirty-live buildings, used as mills or houses for their working people, and I understand that in the city of Phila-' delphia alone one firm dye and finish over 3,000,000 pairs of stockings | every year. That you may fully understand what the difference is between undyed goods and dyed goods, I shall submit these goods to, you. lu New York, where I brought this to the attention of the im-; porters, I simply said to them, "Gentlemen, we want to protect the American industry to a certain extent. M'e do not wish the importers to bring stockings into this country, dyed and finished, and compel usi in America to pay the same duty we p^iy on this " [exhibiting an unfln- ' ished stocking]. i Now, one more thing I would like to say to you. I hold in my handj an unfinished piece of cloth, worth '1 cents a yard. Tlie moment it isi colored or bleached, or any coloring matter enters into it, there isi HOSIERY. 739 a duty on it of 3 cents per square yard, or 35 per cent ad valorem. I do not know as it is necessary for me to say anything more in this respect. I wish to say one thing in connection with the law that the chairman has stated. Being interested in both manufacturing and importing, I have had considerable to do with undervaluations, having looked alter it in New York and Philadelphia. I agree with the gentleman in regard to what has been said about undervaluations. At first I was in*' favor of an ad valorem duty; other gentlemen were in favor of a sioeciflc duty. We have tried to agree upon something that you gentle- men would consider fair. Our object, as the chairman has said, is to prevent these undervaluations. •! am free to say to you that I have been, in the last year or two, in connection with the Government, work- ing hard, with detectives, to try and prevent undervaluations. It is not those gentlemen who are American citizens, who have lived here for years, who are doing this crooked work. My experience has been — and we had one in New York last week — that it is the manufacturers on the other side, who have representatives here, with no interest in our country, who are bringing these goods to us. They are under- valuing them and they are injuring the domestic and iu)portiug interests of our country. Now, you would naturally say to me, " Why do you not make them honest." Now, gentlemen, it is impossible for an appraiser to tell the value of hosiery within 1 cent per dozen, which makes a difference, such as has been described to you. When that is impossible, who is to decide whether the importer, or the man who makes the claims that it is undervalued, is' correct. Before T came here I consulted the officers at the appraisers department in New York. I said to them, " Gentle- men, have you anything to say to me in, regard to the tariff on hosiery ? " They replied, "Give the authorities here the simplest way, that we may be able to collect the duty due the Government and do everytliing that you can to prevent fraud." I say to you, gentlemen, frankly, that I supported the McKinley bill, and Administrative bill, but I never sup- ported the clause the chairman of the committee has mentioned in the tariff. I saw a long while ago that the foreigners were bringing stockings in here a great deal less than we su^jposed they could. I find that it was a mistake to have classification of different values, and I'say, gentlemen, to you, it has proved a great loss to our country. It has kept the Government from receiving the revenue due it, and has been a bid to thousands to become dishonest. Mr. Taesnby. Where is the defect in the system now that encourages and permits these undervaluations and frauds, or fraud by under- valuation ? Mr. Smith. In reply, I will state, if this stocking in Europe costs 2 marks, 52 pfennigs, which is less than 60 cents, it is brought in here at 20 iier cent ad valorem and 20 cents per dozen. Now, if I bring that in undervalued, that is all I pay. If this gentleman here, or any other gentleman, buys it and pays 61 cents, and should bring it in, they would pay 30 per cent ad valorem and 50 cents per dozen. Mr. Taksney. Where is the defect in the law which permits that? Mr. Smith. I think it is in this way: I may buy this stocking to- day, in Europe, or contract for its manufacture and delivery for next season. When it is ready for delivery yarn may be loAver or 10 per cent higher. Now, how can any one tell the actual value, within 10 or 15 per cent, of any stocking brought into this country under those con- ditions 1 740 COTTON. _ Mr. Taesney. CouM not they be met hy having values fixed at the immediate time of import? Mr. Smith. Now, there is a question. I may say that stocking cost me to-day 60 cents per dozen; any of these gentlemen can buy it at that price, and the custom-house authorities may say that the value of the stocking is 61 cents. Now, the question is to-day, whether they have a right to say the value is 61 cents, because they think so, or whether it is 60 cents, because that was the price at which anyone could buy on the other side. Mr. Taesney. The question of value must be determined by experts, whether Government experts, orthe importer, or anyone else? Mr. Smith. I would like to say, at this time, that I have claimed that there should be a law that if a man brings goods in undervalued he should not be taxed ; he should be imprisoned. The law states that any undervaluation above 40 per cent the collector may have the man prosecuted. I think it should read that in case of fraud it shoMd be the duty of the collector to prosecute. Mr. Tarsnet. Then the trouble is in the defects of the law— the ad- ministrative system? Mr. Smith. It is in this Mr. Tarsnet. The defect is in the law ; it is not any inherent defect in the business; can you show how these undervaluations could be reduced to a minimum; will the law which you urge do that! Mr. Smith. I do not think, under the present tariff, it can be made so as to collect duties to the Government. Mr. Taesney. Suppose, instead of imposing the penalty now imposed by the law, which is merely nominal, the goods were absolutely forfeited ? Mr. Smith. I do not think you could do that, Mr. Tarsnby. Suppose the law were made rigid enough to put a few of these honest undervaluers in the penitentiary, it would have a salii- tary effect? Mr. Smith. It would certainly have an effect. Mr. Tarsney. Then that is all within the provisions of any remedy by the law? Mr. Smith. You gentlemen, who have now an opportunity to see the defects in the law, can remedy the laws by simply having them get rid of this graduating system. It is the simplest way to get out of the present trouble. Mr. Tarsnet. In order to accomplish the results just called out by Mr. Payne of making the poorest class of goods, consumed by the poorest class of consumers, pay greater than those who purchased the higher grades Mr. Smith (interrupting). I will say this, there seems to be a misun- derstanding in regard to that. The quantity of high-priced goods we import in this country i,s very small indeed in comparison to the quan- tities of goods imported, as our chairman says, of middle or low priced goods. Mr. Tarsney. Now, another matter. You say that there is no duty on the finished black hose more thau upon the plain uncolored? Mr. Smith. There is no more duty on this stocking than upon that [illustrating]. Mr. Tarsney. Your industry is in coloring? Mr. Smith. In coloring and finishing. Mr. Taesney. Upon either of which there is no protection? Mr. Smith. They have no prote<;tion. Mr. Tarsney. And this is purely an American industry? HOSIEKY. 741 Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Tarsney. Growu up here in the last seven years? Mr. Smith. Yes; and growing very fast. Mr. Taksney. How extensive is it at tlie present time'? Mr. Smith. I' can only say that at Sterling a place lias grown nn, which we have now in mills and houses for the workiugmen, thirty- live buildings alone. Mr. Tarsney. In one town? Mr. Smith. There is nothing else there. Mr. Tarsney. Then you tell us there is a large industry of that character in Philadelphia ? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir; there is o"ne company there which dyes and finishes over 3,000,000 pairs annually. Mr. Tarsney. Where else"? Mi. Smith. All over the country. Mr. Tarsney. And that industry has grown to that proportion in seven years without any protection whatever? Mr. Smith. ISTo, sir; I will tell you why. When this Mr. Tarsney. You are asking for protection on it now? Mr. Smith. When we first started this' business here the stocking cost three times as much to dye in Europe as it does now. Mr. Tarsney. You say there is no difference in the imported cost of this finished stocking and the one that is unfinished, and that.you take the unfinished one and dye and finish it here? Mr. Smith.' I do not know that I quite understand you. Mr. Tarsney. This stocking, which is finished, can be imported from Europe without any additional duty, and your industry consists in coloring and finishing? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Tarsney. Why should there be protection on that? Mr. Smith. When we first started that business it cost in Europe three times as much to dye and finish as it does now, and they have gradually reduced the price there, so that we now seek protection in order to compete with them. Mr. Tarsney. You are seeking for something you have not had, except that which competition gives you? ' Mr. Smith. We have had increased values here Mr. Tarsney. So, if I understand you, colored finished hosiery is not in the tariff' ? Mr. Smith. Colored finished is. Mr. Tarsney. I mean there is no difference from the uncolored and the unfinished ? Mr. Smith. There is no discrimination in the tariff' between these. Mr. Tarsney. As to the coloring and finishing there is no distinc- tion in the tariff schedules ? Mr. Smith. No. Mr. Tarsney. And it is to shut out or impede that importation of colored hose, with some additional legislation, that you are now ask- ing? Mr. Smith. No, sir; we say it is not right for the importer to bring in stockings all dyed and finished the same as those which are not dyed, and which they can do under the present law. Mr. Tarsney. During all this time this industry. of coloring and finishing has been growing up in this country, and there was no spe- cific duty here, or special duty against the coloring? 742 COTTON. Mr. Smith. None at all ; only this, that tliey have been reducing their prices on the other side ia order to comjiete with u.s. Mr. Eeed. Wait a moment before you go. You say that they h.ave been steadily reduced ; what has that reduction been made out of — from profit? Mr. Smith. That I do not know. I only know this: For instance, to dye a hose in Euroije which might have cost, when we commenced our dyeing and finishing, sny 70 cents per dozen, they got it down to 60 cents and 50 cents, and now it is down to 30 cents. Mr. Eeed. They have been following you right down? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir; right down, and we claim that oar dye is su- perior to the foreign, but we can not compete with them without we have the same quality of goods. Mr. Payne. The bulk of these white stockings are imported at less than 60 cents? Mr. Smith. jSTow? Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. MHien you finish them, by dyeing them, they are worth more than 60 cents per dozen? Mr. Smith. Y^es, sir. Mr. Payne. Those which are imported in the black are valued at more than 60 cen*^s and pay a duty on more than 60 cents? Mr. Smith. I wisli it was. Usually it is so, but today, the chairman of our committee and the rest will bear me out, Ihc importer can now import, to-day, dyed and finished stockings in this country for 60 cents a dozen, because o]i the other side Mr. Payne. As good as this? Mr. Smith. That is the high-priced stocking. Mr. Payne. You said that there were not many high-priced stock- ings imported; how do you know that fact? I am told to the contrary. Mr. Smith. I am an importer of these goods, and sell them in the black exclusively. I say this : Seven years ago I'believe that the goods we sold on this market would average a dollar a dozen higher thair they do today. Mr. Payne. Of course, there has been a. general reduction of values all along the line. Now, your business has grown faster in the last two or three years than the first three years? Mr. Smith. No, sir; it has not grown fast in the last year or two as formerly. Mr. Payne. But in the last three years? • Mr. Smith. No, it has not. Mr. Payne. Has not a large proportion of the development been in the last three years in dyeing? Mr. Smith. No sir; we have had more comiDetition. Mr. Payne. I did not mean your individual firm ; I mean the dyeing- business generally. Mr. Smith. It has increased very rapidly. Mr. Payne. Much more rapidly than formerly? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. And the prices have gone down steadily? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir; and I am free to say that the price of all goods, tinder the McKiuley bill, is lower today than it was before the bill was passed. Mr. Payne. Now, this matter of the administrative, part of the tariff law is not a new matter ; it has been a matter that has been studied for many years? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. HOSIEEY. 743 Mr. Payne. And the McKinley administrative bill was the result of a number of years' study given to it by members of both parties, in order to get an honest conclusion in regard to it'i Mr. Smith. I will say to you that Mr. McKinley himself said to me, "Mr Smith, is there anything that you have to suggest in the admin- istrative bill that will help to make honest importations?" And I said, "I do not think there is; I think it is about right." But like everything else, after we see the result experience can help us, and I look at it in this way: You gentlemen, with the information that you have now and the experience of the past may be able to remedy any defects in the administrative part of the bill. Mr. Payne. Would an additional classification of these goods help out to the collection of their duty — making another class? Mr. Smith. I do not understand you. Mr. Payne. I mean to make a class of goods, say, below 50 or 40 cents — make an additional class with a lower rate of duty. Mr. Smith. I do not think it would. I think tliis, that any amend- ment where you make a graduated schedule is a bid for undervalua- tion, and of this I am positive. There is no question in my mind, with all my experience of years, that the manufacturer and lionest importer wishes to avoid the classifications. Whatever you do, avoid classifi- cation. ^Ir. Payne. For the same reason you would avoid ad valorem duty, would you not? Mr. Smith. I will say this, that when I met these gentlemen from ISTew York I wanted an ad valorem duty and the chairman wanted a specific duty, and together we have concluded to bring to you gentle- men the result of our deliberations. We sail this: We can not get a specific duty, we can not get an ad valorem duty; now we will bring this matter to the attention of your committee, and with their intelli- gence they will provide the country with a measure, whereas we will avoid undervaluation and the Government will receive all the dues due it. Mr. Payne. There would be some temptation to fraud, with an ad valorem, for undervaluation? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. That would not help the matter any. Mr. Eeed Are these colored stockings imported? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. Are the white ones imported ? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir.. Mr. Eeed. And both are imported at the same price, at the same valuation ? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir; the same duty. Mr. Eeed. What is that duty, an ad valorem or a specific duty? Mr. Smith. It is both, now. Mr Eeed. It is both ad valorem and specific? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. Now, that colored stocking is interior to the white one? Mr. (Smith. No; they are both of the same grade of goods. Mr. Eeed. Do you mean to say that they can both be imported for the same i)rice? Mr. Smith. They could be brought in under the same duty. This is the way: If the American manufacturer makes these stockings here to-day an imj^orter can bring those stockings in, all dyed and finished, under the same rate of duty as this. 744 COTTON. i\Ir. Heed. Tlie wliite ones? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Reed. After having bestDwed tliat additional labor it creates no increase of value "^ Mr. Smith. Only in this way, and I would like to state it. If the duty on these stockings is,' for instance, 30 per cent now, the foreigner is importing these stockings and would pay a duty of 30 per cent, wliich, say, cost 30 cents, so he would pay 9 cents more than the Amer- icau would, and that is what the American would have to contend with here. Mr. Eeed. He would pay more than the American would! How do you mean °] I do not understand this at all. Mr. Smith. If you imj)ort this stocking, which you bought on the other side dyed and finished, you would pay, say it cost 30 cents a dozen to dye and finish, then you would pay the (lovernment 30 per cent on 30 cents, 'which would be f) cents. Now, then, when I bring this stocking in the value is a little less. I would bring it in and pay the same duty, but I would have the advantage of simxjly 9 cents per dozen. Mr. Eeed. ISTow, then, for these colored goods, which you manufac- ture, and the manufacture is increasing, you have an advantage of 9 cents under the tariff! Mr. Smith. Under the present tariff. Mr. Eeed. Then you were incorrect in saying that they were pre- cisely the same, and you did not have any advantage under the tariff'! Mr. Smith. Excuse me. Mr. Eeed. Answer my question. Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. Then you made a mistake in saying that? Mr. Smith. If you understood Mr. Eeed. And consequently, if Mr. Tarsney inferred that this grew up without protection it is a mistake of 9 cents per dozen ? Mr. Smith. It is a mistake of 20 cents, where the bulk of goods are imported ; 20 per cent ad valorem and 20 cents specific. Mr. Eeed. How much! Mr. Smith. If you paid 20 cents more than I do it would be 4 cents per dozen. Mr. Eeed. Then you have had the advantage of 4 cents on this white stocking, or what I may call the blank ! Mr. Smith. Betw-een 4 and 9. Mr. Eeed. This white stocking is imported for 4 cents less in one case and 9 cents less in the other case, so you have had prote(;tion to that extent, and now you find that you want more because they are reducing their price abroad in consequence of your competition. That is a fact! Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. How can you state to us that you did not have any pro- ' tection at all ! Mr. Smith. I meant we had not the protection we supposed we had. We supposed that we would have a less duty on this class of goods than on the colored goods. Mr. Eeed. You supposed! Mr. Smith. That is what I meant to say to you when I stated we had no protection. 31 r. Eeed. Now, as a matter of fact, the white goods you can import for less than the colored goods. HOSIERY. 745 Mr. Smith. With tlie diff't'Tonce you liave stated. Mr. Payne. 1 want to give you an opportunity to correct another statement. I find for tlie year ending June 30. 1892, the iiuportiition of cotton hose valued at no more than GO cents per dozen has been 1,233,367 dozen, and those valued at more than 60 cents and not more than $20, was 3,371,002 dozen pairs, so you must have been incorrect in your statement that the larger imjjortations were of the cheaper hose, under 60 cents. Mr. Smith. I say this Mr. Payne. The value is foreign value, on the 60 cents? Mr. Smith, The foreign value on the 60 cents, yes, sir. Mr. Payne. It would be incorrect to say that there is a larger im- portation of the cheaper? Mr. Smith. I am only speaking of my own business in that respect. Mr. Payne. Now, you claim to have information of all importations? Mr. Smith. I will state Mr. Lowy claims, or believes, the sale of high- priced goods has decreased very much, and I simi^ly bear it out. Where we used to sell goods at $4.50 our business has run to about $2.25 or $2.50. Mr. Payne. Mr. Lowy is mistaken, or else the United States are "wrong. Mr. Eeed. Do you import your goods directly, yourself? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. Do you order them or buy them made? Mr. Smith. We order them made abroad. Mr. Eeed. They are sold to you at a given price in Germany — ^is that where they are made? Mr. Smith.' Let me explain Mr. Eeed. Will you answer my question first ? Dou you buy these goods at a fixed price? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. Are any of these goods sent here to agents or manu- facturers ? Mr. Smith. They have been. Mr. Eeed. Isow, are these goods sold in New York at a cheaperrate than you are able to buy them for in Germany, and pay the duty? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. How is that done? Mr. Smith. It is done by undervaluation. Mr. Eeed; The parties have an advantage by their sending over to their agents and giving a lower price to the customhouse than you are able to give to make bona fide purchases from the other side. Mr. Smith. It has been so always. Mr. Eeed. That has been one of the troubles that would act as a practical lowering of the duties. Has it not done that right along? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. Since the repeal of the moietes act, you have not had the protection to the full extent the statute gives you? Mr. Smith. I do not know what that act is. Mr. Eeed. Do you not recollect the moietes act? Mr. Smith. No, sir. Mr. Eeed. Your business does not extend back to that point perhaps ? Mr. Smith. No, sir. Mr. Eeed. What interest is there to anybody except to discharge public duty faithfully, to detect and punish these undervaluations; any? Mr. Smith. There is no interest that they have except 746 COTTON. Mr. Eeed. There is no money to them? Mr. Smith, ^o, sir. Mr. Eeed. While there is perpetually money to the defraiiders, wlio have their agents here? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. And consequently there is an intelligent self-interest continually operating in the direction of undervaluation ? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. And there is no pecuniary interest operating the other way? Mr. Smith. No, sir: Mr. Eeed. Consequently there would be more or less practical diffi- culty, even if the stringent laws Mr. Tarsney dreams of, in punishing these people, without having persons pecuniarily interested in looking after the cash of the country? Mr. Smith. I have concluded that it was difiicult to make people honest. Mr. Reed. That is, you must beat a dollar and a half with a dollar and a half I Mr. Tarsney. You have stated that there has been a constant de- cline in the market value of hosiery? Mr. Smith. Yes, sir. Mr. Taesney. Has not there been a constant decline in the price of cotton? Mr. Smith. That is a matter in regard to which there are other gen- tlemen who can give better information. HOSIERY AND UNDERWEAR. (Paragraph 853.) STATEMENT OF MB. PILLISO, CHAIRMAN OF THE PHILADELPHIA MANUFACTURERS' CLUB. Mr. Ghairman : Our plan is to present two papers. One in regard to cotton hosiery and cotton underwear, and the other paper in regard to woolen hosiery and woolen underwear. Mr. Osborn will read the paper on the subject of the cottou, and he will then be followed by Maj. Hansom, of Macon, on the subject of the woolen schedules. STATEMENT OF MR. OWEN OSBORN, REPRESENTING MANUFACIUBERS OF COTTON HOSrERY, SHIRTS, AND KNIT GOODS. Mr. Chairman: We will be brief in the extreme, and we have con- solidated our statement upon the cotton hosiery as closely as possible, I think, in presenting this case, but I think it would be wise to first state the duties which are now being paid. The duty upon cotton hosiery is 20 per cent ad valorem and 20 cents specific up to 60 cents; 50 cents specific and 40 per cent ad valorem up to $2 ; 75 cents specific and 40 per cent ad valorem up to f 4 ; $ I specific and 75 per cent ad valorem above. Not wishing to antagonize the proposition which has been made to you by the importers, we would simply say that where the goods are now $1.76 and 75 and 40 by that proposition they would be reduced to 40 and 20. The goods which are now 20 and 20, which HOSIERY AND UNDERWEAR. 747 they have been talking about, would be increased 10 cents on the dozen duty, and they are the goods that cover the feet of the millions. This delegation ai)pears before your honorable body as representa- tives of the cotton hosiery, shirt, and drawers nianufacturei s of the United States. In urging upon you the importance of mnintaining the whole schedule upon these goods as it now exists we speak for the knitting industry of the entire country. We will confine ourselves first to the questions of cotton hosiery, and in this connection advance the following reasons for preser^-ing the existing rates: First, importations of cotton hosiery have increased under the present rates; second, cotton hosiery, particularly the lower grades, have uniformly decreased in price to the consumer; third, labor has been fully employed and has been enabled to earn more money than under the old rates; fourth, the foreign manufac- turer has paid the tax, particularly on the lower grades of goods; fifth, the number of factories making this character of goods has largely increased under the act now in force; sixth, the consumer in Germany pays more for the lower-grade hosiery than the consumer in this country. In support of our first statement, statistics for the year 1889 show the importations of cotton knit goods to have been $6,389,325, and for the corresponding period in 1892 to have been $5,829,246. While this shows a falling off in value, the goods brought in 1892 were much lower in price, and consequently many more dozens of goods were imported. For the year ending June 30, 1893, the importations of cotton knit goods amounted to $6,385,973, while for the year ending June 30, 1892, they amounted to $5,833,652, showing an actual increase in revenue for 1893 and of course a still greater increase in dozens. Astoour second proposition, that prices have uniformly declined under the higher rates, we refer you to any honest merchant in the country. It is an indisputable fact that for the past two years it has been possible to buy cotton hosiery "over the counters" from 10 to 25 ]ier cent cheaper than before the present act went into effect. This result has undoubt- edly been brought about by home comjpetition, and the result is just what was foretold by manufacturers of this interest who appeared before the committe of the Fifty-first Congress. Our third proposition, that labor has been steadily employed and has earned more money, is a ft;Ct well known to every manufacturer in the country. Until a recent period it was almost impossible for hosiery and knit-goods manufacturers to secure help enough to fully operate their factories, and manufacturers were compelled to teach inexperi- enced hands, at considerable cost to themselves. When we say in our fourth statement, that the foreign manufacturer has paid the tax, especially upon cotton hosiery, we state what we believe can not be successfully disputed, when the fact is considered that, notwithstanding present duties, goods in this country are cheaper to the consumer. The foreign manufacturers were quick to s^e that in order to hold their trade with the United States it would be absolutely necessary to reduce costs of manufacture, as well as profits, upon those grades of hosiery, which, to quote from schedule, "are valued under $2 per dozen." To this end, immediately after the passage of the existing act, a mcet- ing_^of manufacturers was called ia Chemnitz, Germany, when the work- in gmen present were addressed by a prominent manufacturer from the balcony of a hotel, who stated that it was of the utmost importance for them to hold the trade of the United States, and to do this it would be 748 COTTON. necessary for the worlaneii to accept a decided rednctiou in wages, and they were given 15 minutes to decide between accepting tlie proposed reduction or enforced idleness. The workmen promptly accepted. Since then the Chemnitz manufacturers have been sending cheap goods into this country, but at prices far below what they asked prior to the time when the present law went into effect. They were forced to thus pay the duty themselves, simply because of the competition of the home manufacturer. To prove that the number of factories engaged in the manufacture of knit goods have largely increased, we refer you to the American Di- rectory of the Hosiery and Knit Goods Manufacturers of the United States, which shows the total number of such institutions in the United States for 1893 to be 993, and for the year 1888 to Ijave been 721, an increase of 272. states. Alabama California Colorado Conuectiotit — Delawai-e Georgia Illinois Indiana Iowa Kansas Xi'Titucky Louisiana Maine Maryland Massachusetts . Michigan Minnesota Mississippi . . . . Missouri 4 5 9 7 HB 23 9 4 6 States. Nehraska New Hampshire . ". - New Jersey New York. North Ca]^ollQa North Dakota Ohio Oregon Pennsylvania Khode Island South Carolina Texas Utah Vermont Virginia Washinffton West Virginia Wisconsin 1888. 56 20 201 2 51 2 162 16 1 1 4 11 2 1893. 1 45 26 262 13 1 40 4 232 19 1 i 3 IS 18 2 4 18 These are distributed over thirty-seven States, and the list which is herewith submitted shows their location at this time as compared with the year 1888. It will be seen from this statement that this industry is spread over the entire country, and is fast gaining a foothold in the South and West. So far as our sixth statement is concerned, that the German consumer pays more for his goods than the American, we herewith submit sam- ples. Those marked Exhibit A, B, and C are domestic goods, and such as are commercially known as "seamless stockings." Those marked D, B, and F are German-made goods. Referring to sample marked Exhibit A, this is a sock of high intrinsic value and is sold in this country over the counter for 6 cents per pair. No such goods are procurable in Germany for any such sum. Samples marked exhibits B and C are domestic goods of the seamless type, and samples marked D and E are German goods. These goods sell side by side in this market at the same price and are made to retail here at two pair for a quarter of a dollar. This is about the same price asked for such goods in Berlin by the retailers. Your attention is called to the difference in texture between these samples. It will be noticed that the domestic goods present-much the best appearance, and are practically without seams, while the foreign goods are made from the cheapest (juality of cotton, of very short fiber, and seams of a more or less objectionable character are present. In HOSIERY AND UNDERWEAR. 749 short, it is clear to the most inexperienced that much better value is given in the domestic article for the same price. While it is true that importations of this class of goods have in- . creased, and it is also true that domestic manufacturers have likewise increased, it does not follow that the consumption of goods has in- creased in like proportion. Prior to the enactment of the present law the bulk of the hosiery made in this country was what is known as cut hosiery, which consisted for the most part of simple tubes of fabric, cut to shape and sewed together by ordinary sewing-machine processes. This class of hosiery has been largely displaced by the cheap so-called fashioned imported goods, and still more largely by the seamless stock- ing, a product purely American in origin and development. t In making cut hosiery it was clearly possible for an operator to make from 35 to 50 dozen pairs per day, while 6 dozen per day is a fair aver- age in the manufacture of the seamless goods, so that it will readily be seen that more operatives, more and a different kind of machinery, and consequently more capital are required to produce seamless hosiery, and it is still more expensive to produce full fashioned hosiery. Having briefly shown the difference between the various styles of hosiery, it should be understood that the "American seamless stock- ings " is- intrinsically much superior to either the old form of cut stock- ing or the so-called fashion Imported stocking. Prejudice has existed against it and in favor of the fashioned article, but this is being fast overcome. In witness whereof we call your atten- tion to the recent action of the British war office, which, in placing its orders for stockings for the army, stipulated that they should be of the " seamless type," on the ground that they found greater favor with the soldier than the fashioned goods heretofore used. The high place which this article of American manufacture holds in the market of the world to-day is almost entirely due to the wise pro- visions of the present tariff laws, which gave opportunity for improve- ment and development ; and, as a consequence, machinery and process have steadily advanced until we now see the product accepted by the most critical buyers. We now solemnly assure you that any reduction of the present rates, particularly on the lower grades, will surely drive the domestic indus- try from the strong position it has attained. Machinery, which until recently, has been running to the full capacity, will be idle and our people will be forced to work for less reward, which means an approach to the wages ijaid to the Chemnitz operators, which, in this industry, may be represented by a mark paid in Germany for the dollar paid in 'this country. This approach must proceed in just such proportion as the present rates are disturbed. Referring to the question of cotton underwear, all that we have said in connection with cotton hosiery applies with equal force to under- wear. If any changes are conteihplated in this line, in the direction of a reduction of duty, it will surely mean an increase of importations, a decrease of domestic production, and a reduction in wages to American labor. A large amount of the cotton underwear now used is made up of what is commercially known as "ribbed underwear." Prior to the enactment of the present law the ribbed-underwear industry of this country w;i,s, practicially speaking, in the experimental stage, and since that time many improvements in both machinery and process have resulted in an immense increase of production. This has taken place despite the fact that goods valued at $1.50 per dozen and 750 COTTON. less came into the country at a rate of duty out of all proportion to the higher grades. At the time the present schedule was prepared it was impossible to say just what the future of the industry would be, and it was certainly never intended that goods which take rank with full fashioned goods should come in the same class with common cut hosiery. If, therefore, any changes are to be made in this schedule we are of opinion that it would be an act of simple justice to separate underwear from cut hosiery, and cover goods valued at $1.60 or less by a duty of 50 cents specific and 35 per cent ad valorem, and all goods over $1.50 to remain as under the present schedule. It was stated by certain importers who were heard before the com- mittee of the Fifty-first Congress, that if the proposed rates on knit goods were adopted trusts and combines would spring up all over the land, etc. Eesults since that time show nothing of the kind has taken place, and we wish to call your attention at this time to the peculiar condi- tions which govern, have governed, and always will, in the very nature of things, govern the knit goods business in this country. As we have already stated, it now comprises 993 concerns, and these are not located in any one section of the country, but reach out over the whole length and breadth of the land. All through the South and West it is not uncommon to find a knitting factory of some kind. And it has been found that, while many other branchesof industry are more profitable to the projectors, there is none which gives employment to more persons, and at the same time on account of the staple character of, and universal demand for, the products, assures a sale thereof, as a matter of course, at a very close margin. It may be safely asserted, without fear of contradiction, that many a plant of this character has been installed with the main idea of giving employment to certain classes of persons who otherwise would have nothing to do. In the face of all this it is clearly unjust to talk about trusts and combines in connection with an industry which is green and open to all, when the best machinery is easily procured and at low cost, and where, as is being illustrated constantly, the workman of to-day is the employer of to-morrow. Mr. Payne. Do the manufacturers dye any of these stockings? \ Mr. OsBORN. Some do, and others do not. Mr. Payne. A large proportion of the black stockings were con- sumed in this country from the beginning? Mr. OsBORN. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. So it is not necessary to import them for the purpose of dyeing? Mr. OsBOKN. No, sir. Mr. Payne. What proportion of the stockings are sold in the white, like that sample there? Mr. OSBORN. A very small proportion. Mr. Payne. They used to be large? Mr. OsBOEN. Yes, sir; at one time the balbriggan hose was on top; black hose only came in in the last few years, and to-day but a small proportion of-the white are sold. Mr. Payne. What proportion of the hose sold in this country are of the higher price; I want to know whether it is a large industry? Mr. OSBOEN. It is not a very large industry to-day, but we are push- ing that trade. HOSIERY AND UNDERWEAR. 751 ■ Mr. Payne. And tlie value of the liose, that is, the high price, is gradually becoming finer and more costly? Mr. OsBOBN. In the domestic manufacture. Mr. Payne. That is, they bring It to a finer finish and get a larger price; there is a large trade in the $5dozen hose? Mr. OsBOBN. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. The same factories are equipped for making that high- priced hose? Mr. OsBORN. Yes, sir; that is true. Mr. Payne. If this duty proposed by the importers was adopted it would stop that manufacturing industry? Mr. OsBOKN. Yes, sir. I asked that question of a manufacturer last night and he said they would close right up. Mr. Payne. While it would be prohibitive in the lower prices? Mr. OsBORN. The 40 and 20? Mr. Payne. Below 60. Mr. OsBORN. It would. The 10 cents — I very much doubt whether it is going to keep these goods out. There is 10 cents a dozen. With the chairman's permission I would like to introduce Mr. Hansom, of Georgia. Mr. Bryan. Did you appear before the committee in the Fifty-first Congress ? Mr. OSBOEN. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Did you ask for an increase under the McKinley bill? Mr. OSBORN. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Was yom company or firm which you represented making a large profit at that time? Mr. OsBORN. No, sir. Mr. Bryan. And you say prices have gone down since that time? Mr. OsBORN. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. And wages have gone up? Mr. OsBORN. I said more labor was employed and more money paid for wages, and in some instances more wages are paid individually where more labor is used. Mr. Bryan. Have you decreased the cost, of production since 1890? Mr. OsBORN. Ko, sir; the cost of production has been increased by making better goods. We have dropped cut hose where a man would make 35 dozen goods and gone to a product where they would make say 16 dozen. Mr. Bryan. Has the price of the same piece of hose fallen since that time? Mr. OSBORN. On the same piece of hose; besides, it has fallen on this knit hose because machinery, together with the duty, has broken down the market. Mr. Bryan. Then you do not make cut hose any more? Mr. OsBORN. Very few. Mr. Bryan. You have gone since the passage of the McKinley bill into the making of seamless hose? Mr. OSBORN. That is it exactly. Mr. Bry'AN. Does it sell for as low a price as the cut hose? Mr. OSBORN. It is right down on the same basis. Competition is bringing it right down to where really I am surprised at the price it is sold" at to-day. Mr. Bryan. Is the fall in price due to competition or decrease in the cost of production? Mr. OsBOEN. It is due to competition. 752 COTTON. Mr. Beyan. If it were not for the competition you would ask more for the goods 1 Mr. OsBOBN. We have certainly been driven to our prices by home competition. Mr. Beyan. And you want the tariff left where it is to increase com- petition ? Mr. OsBOKN. Our idea was to- improve the goods to the people. That is the thing wo had in view when we appeared before the Fifty-flrst Congress. Since that time many plants have been started in full fashioned goods. Mr. Beyan. Do you desire the tariff retained in order that competi- tion may still increase'? Mr. OsBOEN. TSTo, sir; no manufacturer invites competition in that sense, but he wishes the duties to remain because he is doing well under them to-day, employing a great many people, spreading his factories all over the country, running 271 more since the bill passed, and we think it is a good thing for the people. Mr. Beyan. And these new industries are all due to the tariff being raised? Mr. OsBOEN. Well, very nearly all, if not all, of those are due to that fact. Mr. Beyan. Has there been any increase in the number of factories? Mr. OSBOEN. There was an increase; our statement is to that effect. There was a product of 25,000 dozen hosiery when we made our state- ment before the other committee for a protective duty. Mr. Beyan. You want to be understood that the decrease in price is due to competition and not to improved machinery at all? Mr. Osboen. It is due to improvement in machinery, yes, sir; it is due as well, I think, to competition. Mr. Beyan. W^as anv of that fall due to the decreased price of raw cotton ? Mr. Osboen. Yes, sir; as cotton goes down our prices go down. Mr. Beyan. So that yon really think the fall was due to competition? Mr. Osboen. Cotton is free and the difference in the fall and rise is a small percentage in comparison with the labor used in this country. Mr. Beyan. But when cotton falls 2 or 3 cents, does not that effect the price of the goods? Mr. Osboen. It certainly does. Mr. Beyan. That is, part? Mr. Osboen. Especially in heavy weights. Mr. Beyan. And part is due to improved machinery? Mr. Osboen. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. You say that the same goods are sold for less in Ger- many than in this country, the same quality of goods? Mr. Osboen. Yes, sir. Mr. Beyan. You say they are sold for less in this country? Mr. Osboen. They are sold in G-ermany at the same price as here on their counters to the consumers. Mr. Beyan, Is that because the retailers get more profit there? Mr. Osboen. The retailers get a higher price. Mr. Beyan. Do the retailers make more profit there than herei Mr. Osboen. Y"ps, sir. The Ohaieman. Germany has a protective tariff, of course. Mr. Bryan. Then yoii think the increased cost to the German con- sumer is due to tlic increased profits of the retailer in Germany? Mr. Osboen. Very largely to that fact. HOSIERY AND UNDERWEAR. 753 Mr. Bryan. What is the cost of making hose in Germany as com- pared with this country; taking a particular pair of hose, what is the cost of making that in their country and here! Mr. OsBORN. It would be uecessary to go into the items of cost to ascertain, and we cau only say in labor costs it stands as 1 mark to $1. Mr. Bryan. In wages per day ? Mr. OsBORN. Yes, sir; per day. Mr. Bryan. But I am asking in regard to the cost? Mr. OSBORN. The scale is that if he got 2 marks there he would get $2 here. Mr. Bryan. I am not asking for wages per day, but I was asking in regard to a pair of hose ; what is the difference iu the cost of making that in Germany and here? Mr. OsBORN. The labor cost would stand at 4 to 1. Mr. Bryan. Do you know whether your operative in this country makes the same number of pairs of hose as one does in Germany? Mr. OsBORN. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Exactly the same? Mr. OsBOEN. He makes about the same. Mr. Bryan. So the efficiency of the labor is the same in this coun- try as in Germany? Mr. OsBORN. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Then you do not agree with Mr. Blaine, that we more than make up in efficiency what we lose in higher wages per day? Mr. OsBOEN. We can not make that entirely up in efficiency. Where will you get that out of? You can not make it up entirely in efficiency. Mr. Bryan. Do you mean to say our labor is no more efficient than the German? Mr. OsBORN. It is no more efficient ^^hen properly taught. We have people in our works there who have equal efficiency, Mr. Bryan. You mean to say that if the tariff were taken off entirely these goods selling in Germany at a higher price than the same goods sell jn this country would come over here and run our goods out of the market? Mr. OSBORN. If the tariff were entirely taken off, the goods would run our goods out of the market. Mr. Bryan. Notwithstanding the fact that they are being sold for more in Germany than they are sold here? Mr. OsBORN. Yes, sir; to their own people. Mr. Bryan. Then they would sell to their own people at one price and sell to our people at another? Mr. OsBORN. They do. Mr. Bryan. Do you export any hose? Mr. OSBOEN. K"o, sir. Mr. Bryan. Is there any hose exported from this country? Mr. OSBORN. I do not think there is. I think it is safe to say no. I am quite sure not. Mr. Bryan. You were speaking about the employes. Do these knit- ting factories employ women, children, or men? Mr. OSBORN. All. Mr. Bryan. What proportion are women, and what proportion are children, and what proportion are men ? Mr. OSBORN. In the seamless manufactories the proportion is largely women. Mr. Bryan. What is the proportion; cau you tell it? T H 48 754 COTTON. Mr. OSBORN. Fully half; lialf of the employment uijon the seamless hosiery would be women. Mr. Bryan. What proportion children? Mr. OsBOBN. About one-fifth children. Mr. Beyan. Do you know what is the average of wages paid to women in this country? Mr. OsBORN. We could strike an average straight down, and the wages run along for women, say, $1.25 to $2.25 a day. Mr. Bryan. None less than $1.25? Mr. OSBORN. ISToue of my 300 people get less than that and they get as high as $2.50. Mr. Bryan. Xow, in regard to children? Mr. OsBORN. They run according to their skill ; for those people who are unskilled they run from $3.50 up a week. KNIT UNDERWEAR. (Paragraph 353.) STATEMENT OF MR. TITTrS SHEABD, OF IITTLE FALLS, N. T. Mr. Chairman: I most respectfully ask a few moments attention only. I shall not go into any general argument upon the tariff as gen- erally administered in any sense. 1 take it for granted you are chosen from among the number of Eepresentatives for your special litness and adaptability for this business, and therefore you are well informed upon the general subject without any coaching from me. I may, however, be able to enlighten you ux'on some details of the business in which I am immediately engaged — knit underwear, com- monly called shirts and drawers, overshirts, etc. As to my competency to apjjear before you, I may say I worked in the mills as a boy in England, and also in this country, and for the past twenty-five years as a manufacturer. At this time I have at work in my mills about 350 men, women, and children engaged in the manufacture of knit shirts and drawers. There are employed in this country to-day. irrespective of the mills which do not make their yarn, commonly called cop-yarn mills, about 1,500 sets of knitting machines with carding and spinning facilities and other appurtenances. There is invested in these plants, not less than $25,000,000, and there is constantly invested in the maiuifacture of shirts and drawers and overshirts fully $50,000,000. We employ directly and indirectly about 40,000 persons, and pay in wages not less than $20,000,000 annually, and the output of these mills has been estimated as high as $60,000,000; this I say, irrespective of cop-yarn mills, which have been variously estimated at from 25 to 50 per ('cnt of the whole. Speaking directly as a citizen of the Em))ire State in relation to this particular manufacturing interest, I wish to impress tlie committee with this fact, that fully 70 per cent of this industry is located and car- ried- on in the State of New York, and that a much larger j)ercentaige of the production of this industry in the country at large is marketed through its agents located in that Sta.te — tliereby giving an additional employment to labor and eneigy and capital — than the measure of wliicli I spoke. I wish to call the attention of the committee to the fact to M'hich the last speaker representing hosiery alluded, that of the 1)00 concerns 300 KNIT UNDERWEAR. 765 of them are located withiu the State of New York ; fully 30 per cent of this great Industry is located within that Empire State. This industry has grown under tbe i)resent system of protective duties, and we do not see how we can continue in tlie manufacture of those goods profitably to the employer and employe unless the present rate of duties is maintained. Under the present cost of manufactur- ing, and under the present circumstances surrounding our industry, we most earnestly appeal to yon to retain in our tariff laws the full meas- ure of protection which we receive to-day as against the foreign product. One of the facts connected with the cost of our production to which I wish to call your particular attention is that of wages, which is a consid- erable and large per cent of the whole cost of our goods. From my personal investigation in p]ngland, and from statistics from reliable sources, I find the average wages per capita in hosiery-manufacturing districts average from $165 to $175 per annum, while entirely from a practical point of view I am able to state to you the fact that the average wages per capita in our knit-goods industry is from $400 to $450 per annum. This speaks volumes in itself; yet it is only one of the conditions which go to make up the difference of the cost of manu- facture between ovir country and tlie European, as it can be fully dem- onstrated that in Germany and on the continent generally wages are much less per capita than in England. It is rdso well known that the cost of our plants exceed the cost of European plants, as well as the cost of interest on the capital invested. I am instructed to present to this committee the fact that we not only indorse the present tariff as a whole, but that under whatever changes may be proposed, to make it in the same measure of protection, we most emphatically indorse that form and system of tariff which practices the ad valorem and specific combined. It should be understood by this committee that it is perfectly feasi- ble, simple, and easy to frame a tariff on knitted underwear which is wholly specific in form or partially specific and partly ad valorem, which will be practicable and equitable in operation, and will avoid all the evils of undervaluation. This may not be true of other varieties of woolen goods, but it is certainly true of knitted fabrics. I am also especially directed to call your attention to the fact that under the present administration of the tariff laws shirts and drawers are properly appraised under Schedule K, paragraph 396, "as articles of wearing apparel." I may state that knitted cloth is made by the same process of prep- aration, carding and spinning into yarn as woolen cloths, and that the cloth for knit goods is then made by knitting, instead of by weav- ing, as in woolen cloth mills. Up to that point of the manufacture of our j)roduct we are entitled to the same protection as our brother cloth manufacturer. In addition, however, to tliat measure of protec- tion we are entitled to the additional one which may be accorded the clothing manufacturer, because we take our cloth and manufacture the same into shirts and drawers for men, women, and children, and are, therefore, entitled to a protection in a double measure as manufacturers of cloth and manufacturers of wearing apparel. If the process of mak- ing our underwear was the same as in Europe, where few manufac- turers make the yarn, the cloth, and the garment under the same man- agement, then we should be provided for under sejjarate sections, but so far as we can anticipate your action on "clothing ready made and articles of wearing apparel of every descrii)tion " we take it for granted 756 COTTON. that you will give the manufacturer of clothing the same amount of protection as to the manufacturer of cloth, and an addition to compen- sate him for the further expenditure in making up the same. It is also a signiUcant fact that of the total labor cost of our manu- facturing fully 75 per cent of the whole is paid out for labor in making up the garrhent after the cloth is produced. The knit goods industry of this country, commonly known as shirts and drawers, is [leculiarly an American industry. First, because we manufacture in this country more largely than in all the rest of the world put together; and, secondly, because we use all we manufacture, which is true of no other country. We do not make those goods for export, but entirely for domestic use. It is within the life of compara- tively young men when the product of one large mill would have sup- plied all domestic demands; but the use of knit underwear has become so universal, both for men, women, and children and yoiiths, that to-day in our country it is an excei^tion to find a single person out of the 65,000,000 who do not wear uuderclothiug of either cotton or wool. Our manufacturers so nearly meet the general demand that not to exceed $1,200,000 worth of knit goods of wool or part wool, of all kinds and character, are imported annually, and the few shirts and drawers are exclusively luxuries for the very rich. You wijl, therefore, see that should you reduce the duty upon this article so as to admit of a larger importation, you would thereby displace an equal amount of production in this counti-y, shutting up asmany mills in proi)ortion, and would deprive American labor of its legitimate fruits. You may reduce the duty below the importing level on the idea that manufac- turers must run their mills and employ labor, but you must not forget the fact that no law which you can pass will compel any of my brother manufacturers to start up their mills and run them at a loss. Raw materials must first be bought to produce goods, wages must be paid to make those goods, and when they are manufactured and ready for market, if they can not be sold at a profit, the mill shuts down. There is nothing further for the manufacturers to ecolioinize, except wages ; goods must be sold in competition with those admitted from foreign countries under low duties. If the manufacturer can not make them to compete with the foreign goods and secure a profit, he must necessarily rednce his cost of production, which means a reduction of wages to the laborer. These are vital points, and of interest to the whole country. I can not believe that your policy is to so fix the tariii' that foreign goods may be imported and domestic goods and domestic labor thereby dis- placed by foreign goods and foreign labor. I have endeavored thus briefly to impress you with the fact that it is not entirely a question of protection, or tariff for revenue only, but rather the choice on the part of those who shall dictate the revenue policy of our country as to whether we will consume the product of foreign labor and leave our own in idleness, or whether we shall protect our laborers and enable them to receive proper and fair compensation for that labor, and consume in our own country their product. Mr. Bryan. Did I understand you to say the total product amounted to $60,000,000? Mr. Sheard. As far as I am able to figure the x)roduct of shirts and drawers industry which I represent fully sums iip the .$60,000,000. Mr. Bryan. And the amount of wages paid was $20,000,000"? Mr. Siieard. Aliout •':;20,(m(»,(t(i0. Mr. Bryan. So that the labor cost, then, is about 33 per cent? KNIT UNDERWEAR. 757 Mr. Sheard. Well, sir, the geiitlemau knows as well as I do there is nothing more tallacious than general averages. While the figures show that, upon any investigation with an effort to obtain an intelli- gent knowledge of the facts, it could not be obtained in any two mills alike. American goods, which you have seen by the discussions so far, range from $] .50 to $2 per dozen up to $15 and $20, and some of our manufactures $30 and $40. Mr. Bryan. I did not want to draw you into any further discussion, but simply want to call your attention to that, and ask if that is the average of the labor cost? Mr. Sheard. The facts go to show that the amount paid for labor is about the value of the products, different kinds. Mr. Bryan. You commenced manufacturing, you say, about twenty- five years ago ? Mr. Sheard. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. You commenced on a small scale and worked up ? Mr. Sheard. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. How much have you invested to-day? Mr. Sheard. 1 have invested to-day about $500,000. Mr. Bryan. As the result of twenty- five years work? Mr. Sheard. Ivo, sir; I had a little when I began. Mr. Bryan. But it was on a small scale, you say ? Mr. Sheard. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. What did you invest to start with? Mr. Sheard. My iirst investment in machinery, which was a little further back, was in the manufacture of yarn alone. I put up my first mill machinery, including everything, on $700. Mr. Bryan. So you have worked that up to a plant of $500,000? Mr. Sheard. My plant does not cost that. Mr. Bryan. You have that much invested? Mr. Sheard. Yes, sir; in bricks, machinery, and capital. Mr. Bryan. You say if the foreign goods comes in here they will replace the home goods? Mr. Sheard. Certainly they will. Mr. Bryan. Bid not the last gentleman testify that since theMcKin- ley bill passed the quantity imported had increased and the home product had also increased? Mr. Sheard. You are speaking of cotton hosiery, of which I do not profess to have any knowledge. > Mr. Bryan. So that same principle would not stop knit goods ? Mr. Sheard. I can not speak for anything that the facts do not bear out. Mr. Bryan. You think the tariff ought to be left higher on more expensive goods ? Mr. Sheard. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. What quality of goods do you manufacture ? Mr. Sheard. We manufacture goods which run generally from $6 up to $15 per dozen. Mr. Bryan. You manufacture the higher-iiriced goods ? Mr. Sheard. Yes ; of course you and the gentlemen will understand that our machinery and wool-kuitting mills are fit to make all kinds of goods and we make such goods as the trade will take. Sometimes the trade require lower-priced goods, and we make such goods as we can sell, and of course we vary them according to the requirements of the trade. 758 COTTON. Mr. Bryan. You believe as a principle that the higher tariff ought to be placed upon the higher-priced goods which the rich wear ? Mr. Sheabd. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. You are willing to adhere to that principle, although you yourself are a manufacturer of high-priced goods, getting the benelit of that high tariff? Mr. Sheard. I do not manufacture all high-priced goods. Under- stand that I do not make full-fashion goods, but my goods are what we call cut goods, made for the masses of theiseople. We do not run down to the 50-cent shirt that is sold in the Bowery perhaps, nor do we run up as high as the $15 a pair which are sold in New York, but those we make and sell at $G.50 retail at 75 cents, and the goods we sell at $9 retail for $1, and those we sell at $9 retail at $12, and the highest priced goods I make are retailed, if the loroflt is in accordance with that of the manufactory, it ought to retail not higher than $1.50 per garment. Mr. Bryan. You say the average wages paid in the knit-goods fac- tories amounts to over $400 a year? Mr. Sheard. From $400 to $450. Mr. Bryan. Does that include the salaries of the officers of the com- pany, or simply what you call the labor? Mr. Sheard. Well, I am president of the company, but Mr. Bryan. What I want to know is, in making up the average of wages paid by your company, clo you include the salaries of all the officers of the comjpany? Mr. Sheard. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. How much salary do you put in for your officers'? Mr. Sheard. I get $1,500 a year. Mr. Bryan. Do any others get more than that? Mr. Sheard. No, sir. One of my partners, or stockholders, is my old superintendent, and he gets $1,500 a year. Mr. Bryan. And they run down to the lowest figure? Mr. Sheard. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. And the average is something over $400? Mr. Sheard. Yes, sir; I take my mill as a sample and use it as an illustration, and we compared the figures and endeavored to get at it in such a manner as we could prove it. As to the English trade, what I did not know, I have the last report made to both Houses of Parliament by command of Her Majesty, which gives in detail the amount paid for every article, time or piece work, and the average of wages accord- ing to that, taking and figuring it out, the amount of wages paid to men, women, and children employed, and that takes in a large number of children, and the average of that pay is £35 in England, in Notts and Leicester, £33 in the Scotch district where they make Scotch hosiery, and if you divided the tAvo it is $170 average. Mr. Bryan. Have you ever compared the cost of making two pieces of goods in this country and in England? Mr. Sheard. No; you can not do so, you must compare results. Mr. Bryan. Have you compared the prices of any particular goods in this country and in England? Mr. Sheard. So far as I have purchased those goods in England from the retailer for my own use and investigation. Mr..BRYAN. What do you find? Mr. Sheard. I find, and I have trave'ed over England, Germany, France, Scotland, and I have had my feet more or less upon every quarter of the globe, and more or less investigated this question for KNIT UNDERWEAR. 759 myself individually, and my conclusion is that nowhere in the world can I get for value received better valne received in knit underwear than in America. Now. permit me, plea.se, to fol'ow this; it is true up to the present time in England and in Germany a large proportion of shirts and drawers manufactured are made what you would call full- fashioned, if you understand the term. Mr. Bryan. No; I do not. Mr. Sheaed. If you should drive through your district you might see a musljrat skin or a coon skin upon a barn door. You might not know what the skin of the animal was, but you could in your mind's eye put the skin over something and form an animal. A full-fashioned gar- ment is so made that, when it comes to you, you can see it is made for a shirt, for you can see it forms two arms, and its general appearance indicates its character, and the seams are such that they seem to join together, not exactly as seams, but joints. Now, in this country we have improved our machinery. We joint that by machinery so won- derfully that I can not tell when I get the garment on that there is any pressure of seams or any sense of feeling whether I have a full- fashioned garment on or not; so, consequently Mr. Bryan. I will not trespass upon the time by having you go fur- ther. I simply T\'anted an answer to that question — whether, taking the world over, the article is manufactured in this country and sold as cheaj)ly as the same kind of article in England would be manufactured and sold anywhere in England! Mr. Sheaud. I think as far as utility is concerned that is perfectly true; that is the result of my experience. Mr. Bryan. Notwithstanding the higher wages we pay, the article produced and sold to our people is as cheap as anywhere in the world? Mr. SasiRD. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Yet you think it is necessary to have a high tariff in order to protect us in the right to buy these cheap goods? Mr. Sheard. I only think it is necessary to have a high tariff or any measure of protection which shall guard us and protect us from the inequalities of manufacture. Mr. Payne. When you speak of price you mean price at retail to the consumer? Mr. Sheard. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. The price from the manufacturer here is greater than it is in Europe from the manufacturer there"? Mr. Sheard. Yes, sir. If I could take the goods offered by manu- facturers there and the amount they offer without any cost of duty, and the cost of transportation woiild not exceed the cost from the mill, it is cheaper. I visited the mills and examined them, and they could be sold for very much less here than anything I could produce in the l>resent goods I am manufacturing. Mr. Payne. And the difference is the difference in wages largely? Mr. Sheard. Yes, sir; largely, and the cost of my mills, putting in my bricks, and the cost of my machinery, and the cost of interest, etc., which, with my capital, is necessary to continue in business. 760 COTTON. HOSIERY. (Faragmph 353.) New York, September 22, 18.93. Sir: Eegarcling the proposed cliauge in the tariff on hosiery and fabric gloves, we beg to suggest a straight specific duty on these goods as tlie simplest and most practical and the only way to prevent dis- honest importers from undervaluing goods. It would protect the hon- est importer, also the American manufacturer, besides saving time and expense to the Government in examining the goods in the ciistom- honse. We believe the following schedule would yield a proper reve- nue to the Government and afford ample protection to the domestic manufacturer : Fifty cents per dozen on all cotton and lisle-thread stock- ings, whether in cut goods or full fashioned; 75 cents per dozen on all silk-plaited stockings (this class of goods has never been made at all, or any attempt been made to produce same in this country) ; $1.50 per dozen on all spun-silk or pure-silk stockings; $1 per dozen on all woolen or j)art wool stockings ; 35 cents per dozen on all cotton gloves, a class of goods never attempted to be made in this country; 60 cents per dozen on all pure silk or silk plaited gloves; 75 cents per dozen on all woolen or part wool gloves. The matter of any leather trimming on fabric gloves should make no difference in the duty whatever. The tarilf on stockings sliould have no connection whatever with that^ on underwear (shirts and drawers). They are a separate industry en- tirely and shoiild pay a different duty from stockings. Owing to the recent financial stringency stocks of goods are not being moved with the usual rapiditj^ We therefore predict that heavy stocks will be carried over and beg to suggest that any change in the tariff, be made to go into effect not earlier than January 1, 1895, to enable merchants throughout the country to dispose of their goods without serious loss. Eespectfully yours, Teeadwell & Sewaed. HOSIERT. (Paragrapli 853.) New Britain, Conn., September 19, 1893. Sir: The American Hosiery Company, of New Britain, Conn., which I represent, respectfully ask that in considering the question of a proper tariff on knit underwear and hosiery you will take into consideration the following facts relative to their particular branch of the business. This company was established twenty-five years ago, and, beginning in a small way, has gradually grown until it now employs, when run- ning full, about 1,000 hands. It manufactures underwear and hosiery from fine cotton, cotton and wool mixture (merino), worsted, silk, and mixtures of all these, and of every required weight from the lightest gauze to the heaviest for winter wear, for men, women, and children. Its specialty is full-fashioned goods, and it aims at a quality not sur- passed by any in the world. At present it has an exhibit in Chicago • in extent, variety, and general excellence comparing favorably, in the opinion of visitors, with any exhibit there. HOSIERY. 761 Fnll-fasliioned goods such as we produce are knit on complicated and delicate and very expensive frames, which narrow and widen the fabric in the process of manufacture, and so give it any required shape. They are then seamed or made uj) either by hand or on machines which imi- itate hand work, taking up the selvage loops and thereby avoiding objectionable seams and raw edges. All the machines used for full- fashioned goods are slow in their operation and difficult to keep in order and require skillful and experienced operators and the closest care and attention. AYhile the price of labor has steadily increased, that of these goods has declined, no advance having been made on account of the McKinley tariff, and prices are now lower than before. It is obvious that to produce goods to compete in excellence of fabric and iinish with the best foreign requires great painstaking in every detail of the process, necessitating intelligent, fairly paid, and satisfied labor. Now it is well known that low wages and a low standard of living have pre- vailed abroad in localities where the hosiery business has been carried on, consequent perhaps on the fact that originally much of the labor was performed by men as well as women at their homes, working long hours, and though the factory system now prevails the hours of labor continue to be many and the standard of living low. As a consequence, in conducting our business we have to contend not merely with the general low average of labor abroad, but with, as we think, exception- ally low wages, or such as amount, we think we may safely say,to only about one-third of what must be paid here for the same work. Full-fashioned goods, which might almost be classed among luxuries, are mainly used by the well-to-do (wealthy classes), able and, we doubt not willing to contribute their full proportion to the Government rev- enue, and are therefore suited to a higher duty than the ordinary make of knit goods. The production of fine full-fashioned goods is, we think, not only creditable to the manufacture but to the country, and, as the Chicago Exposition proves, is a matter in which the general public takes an interest and would willingly see encouraged. It has taken time and patience to even begin to overcome the prejudice in favor of foreign underwear and hosiery, but there is, as it seems to us, no suf- ficient reason why goods in all respects equal to any of foreign make should not be produced here. With this in view our company has invested a large amount in the very latest and best facilities for tlie successful prosecution of the bus- iness, but it can not continue to be carried on without adequate pro- tection such as shall enable it to meet foreign competition. Manufac- turers can no longer depend on the greater efficiency of labor in this country, since common and technical schools have greatly multiplied abroad, resulting in an activity of brain and an increase of intelligence and skill not easy to surpass. Besides, the desire of holding the mar- kets of this country has stimulated foreign mechanics and inventors to improvements and labor-saving devices as well as led to their speedy adoption of those originating here, which with cheaper labor are imme- ■ diately turned against us. Consumption of full-fashioned goods being limited in amount and not so dependent on price as that of ordinary goods, it is a question whether a greater revenue would not accrue to the Government from a rate of duty sufficiently high to allow of their production here than from a lower rate on the probably comparatively small increased importation which would follow the withdrawal of domestic competition. At least the difference in labor abroad and here must be made up by the duty. Already the margin of profit in conse- 762 COTTON. quence of foreign competition la so small that any reduction from the present rate would cause it to substantially disappear. In Chemnitz the earnings of the best knitters on the cotton patent frames, the best frames for our goods and such as we use, are per week of sixty-six hours from 23 to 24 marks, amounting, for a week of sixty hours, to $5.46, while the average knitter's earnings for the same time is not more than 18 marks, or $4.20, and females in the same business not more than $2.10 per week of sixty hours. For the same work, our company now pays its men $12.54 per week of sixty hours and its female employes $6.08. We think it may be safely said that the average price abroad in our business is not more than one-third what must be paid here for competent hands. That we are not paying extravagantly for this particular work will appear from the fact that while these knitters are all men working at their trade, their average weekly wages are but $2.04 more than the average of all the men and boys together in the mill, which is $10.50, and the average weekly wages paid for this kind of female labor is only about 60 cents per week higher than that for the whole mill, which is $6. ' What we ask, therefore, is that the present, or its full eq uivalent, pro- tection may be continued on these full fashioned goods, which we think they well deserve and can not do without, and that regard be had to the greater necessary investment in machinery and the greater propor- tionate cost of labor, calling for a correspondingly higher duty than on the goods produced in the ordinary and less expensive way. American Hosiery Co., John B. Talcott, Treasurer. HOSIERY. (Paragraph 353.) JSTew York, September 18, 1893. Sir : Hosiery mills have been established in nearly all the States of the South, and in proportion to the capital invested they are employing a larger number of operatives than any other branch of southern in- dustry. As the manager of a large spinning interest and handling the production of several cotton yarn mills; manufacturing yarns ada])ted to the wants of southern knitters, I can say that I am familiar, through years of correspondence, with their wants, and also with the character and prices of their products, as well as the measure of success which has attended investments in this direction. In addition to the information thus acquired, I can speak for this interest by reason of direct connec- tion with the Macon Knitting Company, located at Macon, Ga., and which is by far the largest and most imjiortant hosiery plant in the Southern States. By reason of the inexperience of our people, the manufacture of hosiery has not, as a rule, proven successful or profitable to the pro- jectors of our mills. This inexperience in both management and labor has resulted in losses in many instances of most or all of our original investments, necessitating reorganization through the employment of new capital to utilize plants and skill acquired by costly experience. This tuition of failure has not been paid in every case, but from ob- servation and experience I will venture the confident opinion that tlje HOSIERY. ' 763 success of an original enterprise lias proven an exception to tlie general rule. Eecent years have shown a steady increase in the number of our mills as well as a gratifying improvement iji the character of the goods produced. For information with reiereuce to the tirst jjoint I respect- fully refer you to the statistics alreody on file with your committee. The dry-goods jobbing trade of the country at large will confirm the truth of the second statement. Investigation will prove to you that a very large percentage of the operatives employed in Southern hosiery mills are women and chil- dren, who find in these mills light, steady, and "profitable work, which they could not obtain in many communities prior to the introduction of this industry, and of which they will be deprived if from any cause the mills are closed. Neither the wages paid to these women and children, nor the prices of the goods they produce, nor the profits ac- cruing to owners, are such as to warrant the criticism that either is ex- cessive, or that either or all entail an unnecessary or unreasonable tax upon consumers. It is true that the female mill operatives are paid two, three and four times the wages paid to able-bodied farm laborers, but this is not because the mill oi)eratives are paid too much, but it is due rather to the fact that, under conditions prevailing in the agricul- tural States of the South, farm labor is forced to accept the lowest compensation of any labor in the country. The hosiery mills employ men of course. If such are sent to the farms for employment and sub- sistence this would result in still further competition for farm employ- - ment; in decreasing the demand lor farm products and in an increase in the marketable surplus from our farms. Our women and children are not adaptedto farm work and must remain idle or find employ- ment elsewhere. ' With all the avenues for employment we have so far opened to them, many are suffering from enforced idleness, and we are powerless to provide such with farther means of sui^port in our mills, full of help while we are running, but in many cases shut down at present. If they are forced to go upon farms in order to exist, their misfortune can be measured only by the increasing distress of our present over-producing agriculture. The prices at which the knit products of Southern mills are selling indicate the best valines known to distributors and consumers, in the history of our country's markets for manufactures. Upon the question of profits to mill owners, I have already indicated what our experience has been. This feature of the case has been dealt with in a general way. In order, however, that the opinion expressed may be tested by the facts of personal experience, and to cover what I conceive to be an important omission in the testimony so far submitted to your commit- tee, touching the profits derived from the manufacture of hosiery, I beg to submit the following statement with reference to the Macon Knitting Company, of which I am the president, and which, as I have already stated, is the largest hosiery mill in the Southern States. It has been in existence over ten years. Until 1889 or 1890 (I write away from home and can not be exact as to dates), its capital all paid in was $36,000. At this date its capital was increased to $100,000. The entire dividends paid to the shareholders up to the time its capital was increased from $36,000 to $100,000 was $3,600, or 10 per cent up on its capital stock, for a period of six or seven years, whicth was about IJ per cent per annum. Its gross earnings, from the time it was reorgan- ized up to January, 1893, were less than $4,000. It is fair to say that since reorganization its operations were restricted for something over 764 COTTON. one year by the building and equipment of a new mill, wliich was filled witli wliat we der-ided, after i>atieiit and persistent investigation, was tlie best machinery of its class in the world. This machinery was not only of a high order in construction, but was complicated and expen- sive by reason of its automatic features, which were covered by patents purchased at heavy cost. With all the saving in labor which we have been able to make in the knitting department by the use of machines requiring but little labor and attention and producing almost perfect work, the expenses in all the details of finishing have been such that Ave have not been able, except with the utmost difficulty, to market the goods produced, in competition with the hand-made goods of Germany and other foreign countries. It may interest you to know that when these goods were first placed upon the market they readily commanded $2 per dozen, less 6 per cent, while for nearly a year past we have not asked for them more than $1.50 per dozen, less 6 per cent. These prices to the wholesale trade. If it is suggested that bad management of the enterprise has been the cause of failure to make profits, or if doubt with reference to this statement is entertained, it will afford the com- pany pleasure to have the plant and management investigated by your committee, or a representative from it, and to subject its books to your inspection, in order that you may verify or refute what I have said. The capital of $100,000 on January 1 last, was increased at that time to $125,000. By reason of the requirements of the business, the mill from wliich the knitting company obtains its supply of yarns, which is also under the writer's management and is largely interested in the knitting company, is carrying it for over $100,000, and has steadily carried this amount for more than two years. We have more experience now than three years ago, and if present prices for goods are main- tained there is a reasonable prospect for fair business in the future. If from any cause we are compelled to lower the prices of our goods with- out lowering the cost of production our investment iu plant will be practically valueless. Cotton is low ; as low, we hope, as it will ever be. Our labor is cheap enough, but with the price of raw material and other supplies beyond our control the cost of labor is-the only flexible item in our cost, and the only one we can reduce. We are employing nearly a quarter of a million of dollars in capital and over 250 men, women, and children in this miU. I omitted in its proper connection to state that iu the early part of last year we decided to add to our line the production of a coarser grade of goods, adapted especially to the wants of laboring men. At present . we are making these goods largely, and all that I have said with refer- ence to the machines upon which ladies' wear is produced, in the way of economy of production, low cost, and small profits in manufacturing, is more than true with reference to this class of goods. I may say, with propriety, I trust, that while I sincerely accord you the same devotion to the country's best interests that I claim for my- self, our views are in conflict. I am convinced from the history of former experiments under the policy you now propose to reinaugurate that this policy will always hereafter as always heretofore end in general disaster. Eespectfully yours, J. r. Hanson. HOSIERY. 765 HOSIERY. (Paragraph 353.) Lowell, Mass., September^ 30, 1893. Previous to the introduction of this stocking, the best stocliing for men that could be bouglit at retail for 25 cents was an imported stock- ing that, from the nature of its construction, was most uncomfortable to the wearer and noted for its seams and lumps which came constantly in contact with tliose parts of the foot that need smooth and well-fit- ting coverings. By the introduction of the Shawknit stocking, which, it has been truthfully said, revolutionized the hosiery business of the world, it has been made possible for men of all classes to buy perfect- fitting and most comfortable foot wear for 25 cents or less a pair. It has always been the policy of the Shaw Stocking Company to make an article that, from its intrinsic worth to the wearer, would be superior to the products of any other maker and thereby raise the standard of American products. Since the advent of the Shawknit stocking numer- ous j)lants have been erected for the production of circular-made stock- ings, and the growth of this industry has been marvelous. Not only as knitters, but also as dyers of black hosiery has the Shaw Stocking Company achieved success. It was the first concern in the world to put a stainless stocking on the market and guarantee its color to be fast and clean; furthermore, no foreign black stocking has been sold in this market that was stainless and fast in color before the snow- black ShawkTiit half hose were advertised over the guaranty of the manufacturers. As pioneers in the stocking industry, the influence of the Shaw Stocking Company has been felt and their fame gone Abroad, and to-day the Shaw stocking loom is in use in England. Had it not been for a protective tariff it would have been impossible for this company and many others producing circular-made goods to make the progress they have made, and I believe the people of this country would still be using, the imported stockings with all their seams and bunches and be paying for them twice to three times the price for which such goods can now be had. The industry with which I am connected is purely American, the inventor of the machine and stocking was an American, ftnd to the largest extent possible the ma- terials of which the stocking is made are American. For the general interest and protection of this industry in America, not in Germany, I wish to protest against any reduction in tariff on stockings. Bespectfally yours, Geo. L. Hoopbe, Manager Shaw Stocking Company, Lowell, ifass. THE TARLPF ON HOSIERY AND KNIT GOODS. (Paragraph 353.) New York, June 10, 1803. Sir: It is generally admitted that the rates of duty will again be re- vised. It is desirable that the duty on hosiery should be simplified as well as reduced. There was a peace tariff, and again tliere was a war tariff, and now there exists a McKinley tariff. Double the peace tariff and you have the war tariff j double the war tariff and you have the McKinley tarifl". 766 COTTON. If we accept the normal rate of ante- war times, say 17 J per cent, and add 50 per cent, we have an ad valorem rate of 25 per cent, with which it is probable most of those interested would be satisfied. War rates should terminate after twenty-nine years of peace. The exemption of wool and other materials of manufacture from duty makes it possible to put all textiles, whether cotton, wool, or silk, on the same basis. The use of microscopes, counting of threads and stitches, chemical analysis in the assessment and collection of duty, and such minutiae are hardly within the proper functions of a great government. The law should not oppress or take away the rights of the citizen. An importer should not be compelled to pay duty on goods which never came into the United States. It is hardly credible, but such is the law to-day. Duty is frequently paid on goods which were stolen or missing at the port of departure. Undervaluation is increased by high rates and by complexity inci- dental to compound rates. Under the present law the calculations are so involved that one invoice will occupy the time of an expert for hours in making up the amount of duty assessable. It is to be hoped that the next revision of the tariff will have some degree of permanency. The cost of making the great bulk of hosiery manufactured in the United States does not average above 25 cents per dozen pairs. If a specific rate is agreed upon the average cost of making the goods ought to be sufficient protection. Tours respectfully, Thomas Field. BALBBIGGAN. (Paragraph 363.) The production of light-weight gauze, balbriggan, and fancy under- wear (shirts and drawers) in this country has been largely a develop- ment of the last twelve years. At first only the cheaper grades of goods v/ere made, but as the few manufacturers of this product gained ex- perience the standard of manufacture was steadily raised, until to-day the three large corporations making the greatest quantity of 'fine under- wear turn out a product that will compare favorably in every respect with the importations from Troyes, in France; Chemnitz, in Germany, and Nottingham, in England. During the same period that the quality of goods manufactured in this country has been so improved the price to the consumer has been steadily decreasing, so that to-day the large manufacturers of this product are selling a superior article for the same, and in some cases less, money than they received for an inferior aiticle five years ago. These goods being the lightest weight underwear made, contain of necessity a small proportion of raw material and a large pro- portion of labor. Generally speaking, the elements of cost in fine underwear are as follows : Per cent. Kaw material i 18 Labor 55 V.'irious items of trimmings: braids, bindings, silli, buttons, etc 15 General expenae: taxes, insurance, etc 12 KNIT UNDERWEAR. 767 By labor as here used is meant the pay-roll labor, tlie day and job labor, so called. A comparison of tlie average wages of tliis industry in America and Europe shows as follows : Cuflflcintters. . Body Tmitters. stitchers Finishers ..... America. Europe. $6. 00 to $8. 00 2. 50 to 4. 00 2.50 to d.OO 3. 00 to 4. 50 Only through a tariff is this difference possible. In addition to the increased cost of labor in this country we pay more for taxes and interest in the item of general expense, more for braid, binding, and buttons in the item of trimmings, and more for our machinery and plant. The desire and purpose has been to continue year by year adding finer grades requiring greater proportionate employmeut and cost of labor, without adding more of raw material, the weight of the under- wear to remain the same or be lighter in weight than as now produced. For these considerations we ask first, tariff protection; secondly, a law that in its classification can be easily understood, and one that can be administered without loophole for undervaluation. Finally, we ask for speedy action as to the details of changes in the tariff, if any, and if changes are made that no change shall be opera- tive till January 1, 1895. Eespectfully submitted. And others. Boston, Se;pte77iber 19, 1893. Boston Manufacturing Co., By A. M. GooDALE, Resident Agent. KNIT UNDERWEAR. (Paragraph 363.) Waterford, ]Sr. T., Septemler 14, 1893. Sir: This is practically a new industry with which to employ a great number of people, and any change in the tariff at this time, how- ever slight, would paralyze the coming year's business, and with a small reduction the foreign manufacturer would drive us out of business. The whole question is one of labor, as between our people who have, by their brains and perseverance, got the standard of wages where they can live comfortably and in great contrast to the half-starved laboring class of foreign countries. The goods we make and sell for about $4 a dozen means $4 per dozen distributed among our people, as everything we put into a shirt we produce, starting from the planting of the cotton to the final selling of the shirt over the counter to the consumer. We have such keen com- petition among ourselves that you can not find any one connected with any part of tlie prodncing of the stock and manufacture of the goods making any more than a fair living profit, and only that by the strict- est attention to business. 768 COTTON. I understand the foreign manufacturer will sell you a shirt as good as our $1 shirt for about $2.25. Add the present duty. |1 per dozen specific and 35 per cent ad valorem, and it will bring the price up to f 4.04. The difl'erence is a mighty small margin to work on. It seems to me that it would be a great injustice to the American manufacturer and American labor to lower the dutjf now imposed on cotton balbriggan underwear. Yours truly, 0. H. Kayanatjgh. WEBBING. (Paragraph 354.) Monday, September 18, 1893. BTATEMENT OP MR. G. W. GREEN, JB., OF EASTHAMPTON, MASS. Mr. Chairman: We represent articles in the tariff act of 1890 under Schedule I, paragraph 354; Schedule K, paragraph 398 ; Schedule L, paragraph 412, in the cotton, silk, and worsted schedules. Those articles are mentioned in each one of those paragraphs. Mr. Dalzkll. The rate is 40 per cent ad valorem. Mr. Gbebn. In cotton the rate is 40 per cent ad valorem for a cer- tain number of articles, and there is 35 per cent upon the others men- tioned in that paragraph. The Chairman. What are the rates under the different paragraphs? Mr. Green. Schedule I is 35 per cent, and in silk the rate is 5 per cent. On worsted the rate is 60 per cent. On. worsted it does not amount to very much. Taking the entire line of goods, there is very little change. The Chairman. You come under paragraph 354? Mr. Green. Yes, sir; that is webbing. This general schedule is not of very much importance and we have but little to say about it, except that the industry has been built up during the last thirty or thirty- five years under protective rates and has grown to very large propor- tions under that system. We have had some experience under the tariff' at different times with the idea that the price of webbings would be reduced to the consumer, and we have found in each of those in- stances that foreign manufacturers simply advanced the price to meet the difference and the consumer paid about the same. We come here to say simply that we feel as if the protection which we have had has been the means of establishing the industry and we would like to have it sustained. If you are going in to deal with any particular paragraph we should say that in the cotton schedule it would be better to have the general rate the same as in silk and worsted, instead of having two rates. Paragraph 354 is susceptible of the same application on account of the different articles in different sections of the paragraph. There has been a great question about the meaning of a semicolon. In various bills the amounts have been named on the articles 35 per cent or 40 per cent. In this case it is divided and part pay 35 per cent and others jjay 40 per cent ad valorem. Tlie Chairman. Are not woolens as high as silks or cottons? Mr. Green. They were inc()r|)orMted m the wool paragraph and based on custom that had prevailed a great many years. BRAID. 769 Mr. Patne. There is a compensatory duty on tlie wool used in the articles? Mr. GrREEN. There is a compensatory duty on the wool — raw wools and others. There was an increase in cotton of 5 per cent, and in silk and woolens, Mr. Payne. In the last three years has there been any increase in the price of cotton goods of that description to the consumer ? Mr. Green. No, sir; there has not been, except in the ordinary market for yarns it. would be a little higher. That made no perceptible difference in the price to the consumer. Mr. Payne. Have Importations been as great in the last few years as formerly? Mr. Green. I should think the importations of narrow fabrics have not been so large. BRAID. (Paragraphs 196, 215, 354, 373, 391). Saturday, September 16, 1893. STATEMENT OF ME. HENEY W. SCHIOSS, PRESIDENT OF THE BRAID MANinFAC- TUBEES' ASSOCIATION, NEW YOEK. Mr. Chairman : As a committee of the Braid Manufacturers' Asso- ciation of the United States, we appear before you as representatives of an important American industry. We appeared before the com- mittee of the Fifty-flrst Congress under different conditions. We had, previous to this time, no organization, and our industry had therefore been neglected. We were subject to unjust discrimination. We therefore obtained, for the first time in the history of our business, just recognition. In order that you may fally comprehend the nature of our business, and the effect of the tariff thereon, we would invite your attention to the fact that it is affected by no less than seven schedules of the tariff ace. It must be apparent to you how this fact makes it possible for an injustice to be done us inadvertently through some slight error or omission. Mixed or fancy braids are manufactured from a comingling of dif- ferent materials, such as cotton, silk, wool, linen, and metal. It is a perfectly staple industry, owing to the fact that its product is used for so many purposes. The recognition obtained in 1890 was by no means exorbitant or prohibitory. This is amply shown by the fact that braids continue to be imported in large quantities in spite of the present tariff. Schedule C. Miscellaneous metals and mantifacturers of gold and silver. • Paragraph No. 196 : Bullions and metal thread of gold, silver, or other metals, not specially provided for in this act, thirty per centum ad valorem. Paragraph No. 215 : Manufacturers' articles, or wares, not specially enumerated or provided for in this act, composed wholly or in part of iron, steel, lead, copper, nickel, pewter, zinc, gold, silver, platinum, aluminum, or any other metal, and whether partly or wholly manufactured, forty-five per centum ad valorem. Schedule I. No. 354 : Cotton cords, braids, boot, shoe, and corset lacings, thirty-five cents per pound; cotton, gimps, galloons, webbing, goring, suspenders, and braces, any of T H 49. 770 COTTON. the foregoing which are elastic or non-elaetic, forty per centum ad valorem; Pro- vided, That none ^f the articles included in this paragraph shall pay a less rate of duty than forty per centum ad valorem. Schedule J. No. 373: Laces, edgings, embroideries, insertings, neck rufflings, ruchings, trim- mings, tuckings, lace window curtains, and other similar tamboured articles and articles embroidered by hand or machinery, embroidered and hemstitched handker- chiefs, and articles made wholly or in part of lace, rufflings, tuckings, or ruchings, all of the above named articles, composed of flax, jute, cotton, or other vegetable fiber, or of which these substances, or either of them, or a mixture of any of them, is the component material of chief value, not specially provided for in this act, sixty per centum ad valorem: Provided, That articles of wearing apparel and textile fabrics, when embroidered by hand or machinery, and whether specially or other- wise provided for in this act, shall not pay a less rate of duty than that fixed by the respective paragraphs and schedules of this act upon embroideries of the materials of which they are respectively composed. Schedule K. No. 391 : On woolen and worsted yams made wholly or in part of wool, worsted, the hair of the camel, goat, alpaca, or other animals, valued at not more than thirty cents per pound, the duty per pound shall be two and one-half times the duty im- posed by this act on a pound of unwashed wool of the first class, and in addition thereto thirty-five per centum ad valorem ; valued at more than thirty cents and not more than forty cents per pound, the duty per pound shall be three times the duty imposed by this act on a pound of unwashed wool of the first class, and in addition thereto, thirty-five per centum ad valorem ; valued at more than forty cents per pound, the duty per pound shall be three and one-half times the duty imposed by this act on a pound of unwashed wool of the first class, and in addition thereto, forty per centum ad valorem. No. 398. On webbings, gorings, suspenders, braces, beltings, bindings, braids, gal- loons, fringes, gimps, cords, cords and tassels, dress trimmings, laces and embroideries, head nets, buttons, or barrel buttons, or buttons of other forms, for tassels or orna- ments, wrought by hand or braided by machinery, any of the foregoing which are elastic or non-elastic, made of wool, worsted, the hair of the camel, goat, alpaca, oi other animals, or of which wool, worsted, the hair of the camel, goat, alpaca, oi other animals is a component material, the duty shall be sixty cents per pound and in addition thereto, sixty per centum ad valorem. schedule l. No. 412. Webbings, gorings, suspenders, braces, beltings, bindings, braids, galloons, fringes, cords and tassels, any of the foregoing which are elastic or non-elastic, but- tons, and ornaments, made of silk, or of which silk is the component material of chiel value, fifty per centum ad valorem. No. 413. Laces, and embroideries, handkerchiefs, neokrufilings and ruchings, cloth- ing ready-made, and articles of wearing apparel of every description, including knil goods, made up or manufactured wholly or in part by the tailor, seamstress, or man- ufacturer, composed of silk, or of which silk is the component material of chief value not specially provided for in this act, sixty per centum ad valorem : Provided, Thai all such clothing ready-made and. articles of wearing apparel, when composed in pari of India rubber (not including gloves or elastic articles that are specially provided for in this act), shall be subject to a duty of eight cents per ounce, and in additior thereto, sixty per centum ad valorem. In Schedule C there is a differeace of 15 per cent in the rates of the material used, which is metal thread and the braid product. In sched ule I and J, the difference in the rates of the cotton and flax yarns and the cotton and flax braids is infinitesimal. In Schedule K the differ eiice between yarn and braid is about 25 per cent. In schedule L sill yarns pay 30 per cent ad valorem, and spun silk yarns 35 per cent ad valorem, whereas the braidijjay 50 jjer cent ad valorem, a difference of only 15 per cent. These figures show that the average protectioi enjoyed by our industry to-day, is not excessive, in view of the great and well-known difference between the wages paid here and those BRAID. 771 nilmg in Barmen and St. Ohamoud, two braid districts that are notori- ous for the low wages paid to the work people. Our business is a very- complex one, needing for its productions the services of a very compli- cated and expensive high-class machinery, the best of which is manu- factured abroad and subject to a 45 per cent duty. The nature of our business requires a greater number of skilled help in proportion to the value of the product turned out than any other kindred industry. We wish to call your special attention to the fact that in all tariff acts a difference has been accorded us in the rate granted above that given to manufacturers of textile fabrics. This is just and reasonable, as the braid machine is very different to the loom. A braid machine is capa- ble of making only a single width and in order to produce a variety of widths, it requires as many machines as there are widths needed. The produce of a single machine is very small, about 72 yards a day, and can not be increased. While a ribbon loom may turn out an article similar in appearance, 500 or 600 yards in a day, a braiding machine will turn out only 72 yards. Our industry has been established in this country about thirty years. It exists at present in about ten dif- erent states; a large amount of capital is invested and gives employ- ment to a great many people. We are simply here 'to represent our case without expectation of any favoritism. If the duties are reduced on our materials, we will cheerfully submit to a proportionate reduction. Beyond this we emphatically and, as we believe, justly protest; as such reduction will render it impossible for us to continue our business in this country and give employment to our people. ISow I have samples here of different braids which we manufacture, and which I would like to submit and explain to you gentlemen. These are the different qualities we are making and materials used in the manufacture of these goods. This is raw silk [exhibiting] which comes into this country free of duty, and this is the spun silk, that is, thrown silk, which pays a duty of 30 per cent ad valorem, and this is the braid that is manufactured from the raw stock after it is thrown into thread and made into the braid. This is what we do with it, this is our finished product. Mr. Payne. What is the duty on that? Mr. SCHLOSS. Fifty per cent ad valorem. Mr. Payne. It comes under the general silk clause? Mr. SCHLOSS. Yes, sir ; under the general section giving the de- tails. This is the same thing in black. This is the raw wool that is used and put into the yarn. We are not spinners and we are obliged to buy yarn from the spinner. They, I believe, have a protection, and we take that and put it into braid. There is a sample of the finished article which we make out of the spun yarn. That is mohair which is not raised in this country. The Chairman. Where do you get your wool from? Mr. ScHLOSS. We buy our yarn frova. the spinner and they are obliged to import it from Europe, Australian wool, etc., and the Angora goat. This is a very long staple and I have a sample, if the committee wishes to see it. Mr. Payne. Is that goat's hair? Mr. SOHLOSS. Tes, sir; that is goat hair. I believe they mix it up with American wool and manipulate it for our purpose. This is an- other sample of braid we make. All these are samples which gives you a little idea of the class of goods we manufacture. It is quite varied. We use silk, cotton, and mohair in the construction of these. Mr. Payne. How do prices since 1890 compare with previous prices? 772 COTTON. Mr. SCHLOSS. I would like to explain that. In 1883 when the asso- ciation was not represented before they changed the tariff, and the construction of the tariff at that time was such that it gave us no pro- tection at aU and we could not compete with the importer, and the importer at that time had all the business. Mr. Payne. What did you do, shut up? Mr. ScHLOSS. We had to sell to the retail trade and do a retail business. We were obliged to wait for the demand to go up. Our machines are so constructed they will only make a certain width as I mentioned before, and there are different series selling at different times. We ran all the way from two lines up to thirty-six lines, you may say, and there are times when four lines sells, and another time ten lines sells as fashions change, and by being here, if we can wait until fashion favors us, we can make profit to keep us going. We manufactured and kept going about seven years without making much headway, none at all you might say, and the importers did all the business. But since 1890 we could buy our yarns here which we never could before 1890. There is a very large spinner up in Maine who is making these mohair yarns so that we can buy our yarns at a little less than we can import. We can buy them cheaper to-day and we are selling our goods cheaper than in 1890 with a better profit to the manufacturer. Mr. GrEAR. You make more of them? Mr. SCHLOSS. Yes, sir. JMr. Payne. Has there been any increase in the manufacturing business ? Mr. SCHLOSS. Since 1890, yes, sir; we have increased I should think over one-third. Mr. Payne. Have importations kept up? Mr. SoHLOSS. They were not quite as heavy, but they are still importing under the present tarifi'. Mr. Payne. Does the Government get as much i'evenue? Mr. ScHLOSS. I do not think so. Mr. BuEEOWS. What has been the effect on your prices? Mr. SCHLOSS. Our prices are lower to-day than they were before 1890, and my experience has been that even with the high tariff, the compe- tition among the domestic people will warrant the prices to be reduced, providing we could buy our raw material from which we manufacture our goods at a lower rate. Mr. BiTEKOWS. Do you anticipate, if the present duty is continued, that the prices will still further decline? Mr. SCHLOSS. Well, it depends a great deal upon the raw article we buy. At the present, mohair is scarcer and prices in some cases on the other side have advanced iOO per cent, but we are selling our goods about the same price as 12 months ago; there is very little change. Here we have an article, and this article comes in free of duty under the present bill. This pays 30 per cent. This is the thread that is made out of this. I believe some is made in this country, but it was never made until this went on the free list. I have the manufactured article that we make from the thread (exhibiting tinsel braid). That has only a protection of 15 per cent. It is manufactured for a fancy article which only sells in so many years, and on an average of about four years we get a demand for that article and sometimes handle and carry a very large quantity of the raAv material. JSTow, a short time ago this article of thread was as high as f 6 a kilo of 35 ounces, and BKAID. 773 people ■will not buy it at a dollar, and we liave only 15 per cent protec- tion on this. This is a fancy article. Mr. Payne. How much capital is invested in this industry in the country? Mr. SCHLOSS. I should think there is about — we. have not got the figures exactly, but I should judge it to be $5,000,000 or $6,000,000. Mr. Payne. How many hands do you employ? Mr. SCHLOSS. We employ 500 ourselves, that is the Castle Braid Company and the Sutro Braid Company employ, I think, 200. Mr. Payne. How many factories are there? Mr. SCHLOSS. There must be fifty at least scattered in ten different States. Then there is another article which is manufactured quite largely in this country and that is buttons out of our materials. Mr. Payne. Made from your braid? Mr. SCHLOSS. Yes, sir; these buttons are made from our material, our braid. That button is made out of this braid (exhibiting). Mr. Payne. These are buttons used generally on coats? Mr. ScHLOSS. Tes, sir; these are gentlemen's coat buttons and these are used for ladies' jackets, dresses, etc. There is a braid we manu- facture out of the yarn and put into the button. Now, there is a sec- tion that if these goods are brought in for the button people they only pay 10 per cent duty. Now, if we import braid, we have to pay the regular rate of duty. They are also bringing piece goods, cloths 36 inches wide, and if it is stamped oat so many inches it can be brought in at 10 per cent duty. These button people can bring in that with 10 per cent, and we have, to compete with those people as we make these braids and pay regular rates, and it takes so much money out of the country which would otherwise be employed by the domestic people manufacturing a product Mr. Gear. You do not make buttons? Mr. SCHLOSS. Yes, sir; we make the materials and also the button. These are made in the factories here. We make the braids and the parts for buttons and finish them in this way, but the button petjple can import this braid for 10 per cent if it is cut 10 inches ; but if it is cut 144 yards it pays 50 per cent duty. So they have something which nobody has ; that is the only industry, I guess, in the country that has that advantage over all the others. Mr. Geak, Do you do your own dyeing? Mr. SCHLOSS. No, sir; we have so many different materials, but we had a dye house and found out it was to our advantage to have it done outside. We have our cotton dyed in the East, and our mohair we have dyed in Brooklyn partly and partly in New York City. The silk colors are dyed in Brooklyn, and our blacks are dyed in Paterson, N. J., so we have five different dyers we employ outside of our own. We could send you samples of these stuffs if you think it is necessary. Mr. Chairman, I would like to inquire whether it is necessary for us to leave samples of our manufacture here so that you could have them before you in case you should require it. The Chairman. Just as you prefer about that. You can leave that. Mr. SCHLOSS. I could make up a little line and send it over to you. The Chairman. Probably that would be better, send it to the clerk of the committee and he will return it to you when the committee is throufh. ^ Mr. ScHLOSS. Is there any other question you gentlemen wish to ask? The Chairman. You have made your statement pretty faUy in your paper. 774 COTtON. Mr. SCHLOSS. I have. I have a letter from Mr. Alexander Kursheedt, of Few York, sent to our committee, /also by a manufacturing business representing other manufactiires in the kindred iudustries which I could submit. The Chairman. Just submit them to the reporter and they will be incorporated along with your statement. Mr. SOHLOSS. Very well, then ; I am much obliged to you gentlemen. LACES, ETC. Statement of Alexander E. Kursheedt. Of all the imperfect and inoperative laws which exist on the statute hooks of our country, the one known as the tariff act takes precedence. The statistics published from time to time which are to enlighten the public in regard to the revenue from this source, are necessarily faulty, as they give no statement of the amounts re- funded, owing to the imperfections in the law, and the impossibility of collecting the correct amount of duties when goods are imported. In the framing of successive tariff acts, no regard whatever appears to have been paid to the recognized decisions of the courts, and the same carelessness in phrase- ology and punctuation abound, so that the palpable intention of the legislators has often been defeated. While an act is in force no timely attempt has ever been made to correct an error, and it is a notorious fact that these blunders during the past ten' years have cost the Government millions of dollars, which has fallen into the hands of greedy speculators or cunning attorneys. It is confidently expected that the new law, while correcting most of the errors which have enabled such parties to reap a profitable harvest, will be replete with equal blunders that will quickly be seized upon to diminish the expected revenue. Each one for himself is the motto of most of those who seek the ear of your com- mittee to urge special consideration. No one cares what unfairness is done to some other interest. It is to be expected that you will hear from only a fraction of the many thousand separate industries which exist in our country; the rest will accept the situation because they can not help themselves. Before the ink was scarcely dry on the act of 1883 and it had gone into operation, everybody interested, both ^ here and abroad, knew that the omission of a phrase which appeared to be an intentional error of an engrossing clerk would cost the revenue millions of dollars and make endless business for our overcrowded courts and disturb and unsettle the affairs of a great many of our citizens; yet it was only a few months before the act of 1890 was passed that this mistake was corrected. It was a case of locking the stable after the animal had escaped. While the act of 1890 was being discussed in Congress the circuit court decided that nets were not laces, and yet the act of 1890 was passed, the legislators assuming that nets as formerly would be classified as laces. The board of general appraisers at first respected the decision of the court, but when it found that this decision meant a loss of millions of dollars to the revenue, it reversed its ruling. In this single instance over fifty thousand appeals were taken and the matter again brought to the court, which sustained its previous decision, as everybody familiar with the decisions of the Supreme Court knew it must. A comma instead of a semicolon in paragraph 398 will cost the Government a very large amount of money, as none of the articles enumerated in that paragraph will pay the prescribed rate except two, one of which has long since ceased to be a commodity, and is neither imported nor made in this country. It would have been better to have omitted this obsolete paragraph. I do not wish to extend this statement to mention the many errors, inconsistencies, anomalies, absurdities, irregularities, and inequalities with which the present act abounds." Its authors can not be held responsible for such errors, as they were not furnished with the requisite data wherewith to correct the inaccuracies in previous legislation. Your honorable committee, proceeding in similar way, may expect to arrive at a like result. You will doubtless be led to incorporate sec. 5 without considering the fact that the Supreme Court has always held such a section to be inoperative, as the basket clauses are held to enumerate so that similitude can never be applied. One hundred collectors at the different ports will vie with each other in misinterpret- ingthe new law, andthedecisionaoftheBoardof General Appraisers may prolong the agony so as to increase the amount of refunds. Lotus have first of all an iiftelligent tariff act that the manufacturer and importer can understand. I will close with two illustrations of how the Fifty-first Congress failed to execute its own purpose. It was decided to give a slight protection to cotton laces which had never been BRAID. 775 madeintMscountry, so haying provided for tlie material (cotton yarn) at 50 per cent ad valorem it rated the laces at 60 per cent ad valorem under paragraph S73. This insufficiency of 10 per cent has not resulted in the production of a single yard of lace. But this is not relevant to the matter to -vrhich I wish to call your attention. It was conceded that 60 per cent would be useless and excessive if lace articles could be admitted at a less rate, so the words were added making articles made of lace pay the same rate, 60 per cent ad valorem. Under the new law, aprons trimmed with lace were imported and promptly classified by the collector as articles made of lace under paragraph 373. The importer appealed, claiming that same were wearing apparel under paragraph 349, at 50 per cent ad valorem. The Board of General Appraisers sustained the collector and so did the circuit court. The case was carried to the circuit court of appeals, who reversed the decision of the court below, holding that wearing apparel is a more specific term than articles made of lace, so that a lace apron must be classified under the former and the intention of Congress was ignored. The other case I wish to refer to is the monstrous and irreconcilable protection given to cloth buttons, which I do not believe six members of Congress voted for intelligently. Under paragraph 428, material for buttons pays only 10 per cent ad valorem, and so woolen cloth that otherwise pays 49 cents a pound and 50 per cent ad valorem, or about 75 per cent ad valorem, when imported by anybody but a button-manufacturer, pays only 10 per cent protection, the difference between paragraph 392 and 396 ; but the button-maker obtains a difference of from 60 to 70 per cent, and he not only secures a monopoly against foreign button-makers, but against American as well, who might try to compete making buttons of American cloths. I respectively recommend your honerable committee to first expunge all inequal- ities, then fix the rates under each and every schedule so as not to obstruct or hinder the development of advanced manufactures. Give our people a chance to become at least artist manufacturers, as abroad, so that the word " home-made " wiU not mean trash, but the best that human taste and skill can design and create. SCHEDULE J. FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. 777 HEMP AND JUTE. (Schcdale J.) Friday, September 8, 1893. STATEMEirr OF ME. JOHIT E. STEVENS, OF LUDLOW, MASS., EEPEESENTING THE LUDLOW MANUFACTURING COMPANY. Mr. Chairman: I shall be very brief, and will not inflict myself upon you for 'more than a few moments. I am representing the Lud- low Manufacturing Company and the Ludlow Cordage Company, of Ludlow, Mass. They are identical in management, except as to the treasurer, so I shall speak of them as one. 1 am the manufacturing agent of the company, and so I shall speak from the standpoint of a practical manufacturer. I will state m the next place something which you do not know, but which you ought to know, and that is that we have no connection in any shape or form with any combination or ring, either directly or indirectly, expressed or implied. We are simply managing our own business as well as we know how. Of course we recognize the necessity of the revision of the tariff, and if there are any articles which we manufacture which can be reduced we shall frankly say so. We are here for another reason, and • that is, that while there is no demand from any section of the country for cotton, woolen, and iron goods to be reduced, or put bodily on the free list, there does happen to be from some sections of the country a demand that the goods that we manufacture shall be put on the free list. So far as we know, we have done nothing worthy of death, and we respectfully ask that we be not laid out. We demand the same treatment which you will accord to cotton, woolen, iron, and all other industries. We are in exactly the same boat. . We ask for a reason- able and just protection on the articles we make, which are cotton, jute bagging for cotton, binder twine, hemp, and jute, and we ask for them reasonable protection on two grounds : First, because we have paid, in round numbers, about $150,000 in duties on the machinery we use. We have done that because we could not get it in this country. We have been obliged to put it in, and it has gone into our permanent investment. We believe that our buildings have cost more than the buildings of our competitors abroad, and this makes our fixed charges larger. The other ground on which we ask reasonable protection is, of course, on the ground of the increased cost of labor. I will state that I have gone into this labor question with a great deal of care. It was easier for me to do so because my experience was gotten abroad and I am familiar with the wages they pay. My overseers are mostly from Eng- land and Scotland and know the wages that are gotten there. A large portion of our help comes from those countries, and we have in that way been able to more correctly compare our own wages with the latest wages paid and reported by those men. We find that in the article of cotton bagging their average pay roll is something like four-tenths of what we have to pay. In Ireland it would be stiU less than in Scotland. 779 780 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. But if cotton bagging is brought into this country it will not be brought irom Scotland, England, or Ireland,, but from Calcutta, where they pay no wages at all, or so little that it is not worth considering. That is the sort of labor we have to compete with — Calcutta labor. We have asked for so much duty as will protect us against this cheaply-paid labor. ' In the matter of yarns and twines we have not only to compete with Calcutta, but we come in competition with the Italian cheap labor. It is quite certain that the Italians can make the same goods for just a fraction over one-half of our pay roll. I will still further mention the fact that we are at a great disadvantage in two ways, namely: In the most of those countries they have, with the exception of Calcutta, a Com- plete system of apprenticeship. They get carpenters and every other kind of mechanic for a mere nominal sum until they get to be men. They do meu's work for many years before they get a man's pay. They also have a market from which to draw skilled help. If they lose their help in Dundee or Ireland they can draw help ixom a field of skilled labor, whereas we have to take labor from the country districts, and they know very little, if anything, about the business. Their wages are almost as high as skilled labor. Furthermore, we are obliged to use men, while the manufacturers in Ireland or Scotland use women. Some branches of the industry we are unable to pursue, because we can not afford to pay men to do work which is done on the other side by women. On this side when women marry they quit the factory, but in Great Britain they never seem to quit. We employ about 1,100 people in these industries. Our mills have been in operation about twenty-five years. If I were to speak specific- ally of any dutieSj I would mention the duty on cotton bagging, which is now 1.6 cents per square yard. We think this duty may safely be reduced — that it can be reduced a little. Mr. Payne. How much can you reduce the rate on cotton bagging? Mr. Stevens. I will state very frankly, the very lowest point to which it cau be reduced. Some people are in the habit of .saying that if you expect to get a certain thing, you must ask for more; I do not believe that. I think that the absolutely lowest rate that can be placed is 1 cent per square yard; it would suffer a little at that, but that is the low-water mark for bagging. Mr. Payne. If it is reduced below that, can you continue the in- dustry without a reduction of wages'? Mr. Stevens. If it were reduced below that, we would be obliged to reduce our expenses, and the only place that that could be done would be in the pay roll. Mr. Dalzell. You would make the duty 1 cent instead of 1.6? •Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Do you manufacture binder twine? , Mr. Stevens. We have only been manufacturing binder twine a year and a half. Mr. Payne. What is the price of it? Mr. Stevens. There are no sales now. The market is closed. Mr. Payne. What was the price for the last season for the best quality. Mr. Stevens. It was 7 and 8 cents for the very b^st quality. I do not believe it would be above 7 or 7J cents. Mr. Payne. That would be wholesale? Mr. Stevens. O, yes. The retail price is double that. Mr. Payne. The retaU price varies very much? HEMP AND JUTE. 781 Mr. Stevens. Tes, sir; very much indeed. Mr. Payne. A good many of the binder-twine manufacturing com- panies have famished their customers at a lower price. Mr. Stevens. Yes ; I believe that has been done. Mr. Payne. The duty is about 10 per cent. Mr. Stevens. It is about one-tenth of 1 per cent per pound. Mr. Payne. If it were piit on the free list it would have an impor- tant effect on the industry, I suppose? Mr. Stevens. Binder twine could not be made in this country, as we can see. It is made largely in Ireland now. Mr. Payne. Has the importation increased or decreased? Mr. Stevens. I can not answer; but my impression is it has decreased. Mr. Payne. Tou think, if the duty "were taken off, you could not compete in that here? Mr. Stevens. I am satisfied we could not. Mr. Tarsney. Is the labor estimated by the piece? Mr. Stevens. Some of it is by the piece, some by the day. Mr. Payne. What is the difference in the percentage of labor when it is employed by the piece in the percentage when it is employed by the day? Mr. Stevens. I have bunched them all together. Mr. Payne. Have you noticed in your investigation any particular difference between the amount of labor performed by a person employed here and a person employed in Ireland or Scotland in the production per day? Mr. Stevens. The difference is notably in favor of the Irish opera- tives, because they are so vastly more skilled. Mr. Payne. You do not mean to say that a man can do more work in Scotland? Mr. Stevens. I believe that a man can do more in an hour than op- eratives in my own factory. It is not true in regard to cotton. Mr. Payne. It is true in regard to your business? Mr. Stevens. Yes, most emphatically. I will instance a special case. We had a spinner who came to us recently, some two weeks ago. She was put at the very lowest pay, $5.40 a week, and she told us that for the same work she received eight and six pence abroad. I know of another who came from Scotland. She was put on as a spinner at $9 a week; and she told me that she got nine shillings over there. Mr. Stevens (member of the committee). You say the labor in Ire- land on these machines will produce more than they will in this coun- try? Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir. Mr. Stevens (member of the committee). You say that they are brought up in the business and are more skillful? Mr. Stevens. I think they would produce as much more in fifty-five hours than our workmen would produce in fifty-five or fifty-six hours. Mr. Stevens (member of the committee). And it is because of their being more skillful? Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir. We have to take what help we can get. Mr. Stevens (member of the committee). Is there any difference between a skilled workman who comes over here and the one who remains over there? Mr. Stevens. I do not think we get the best. We can not get them. We have to take only those who happen along. I think the adventur- ing elemejit comes here, chiefly. 782 FLAX, JUTE AND IhEMP. Mr. Stevens (member of tlie committee). You say that you do not get the best? • Mr. Stevens. I am sure we do not. Mr. Payne. You can not make a contract with them abroad? Mr. Stevens. No, sir. Mr. Whiting. The increased wages here will not bring them? Mr. Stevens. If they had the money to come on, it might; but they never have. Furthermore, respectable people will not leave their fami- lies. No respectable spinner would come unless her family came with her. Mr. Taksnet. You say the poorest come over. How is it that they can get the money? Mr. Stevens. I do not know whether they steal it or not. The tramps always get everywhere; but I do not know how they do it. I presume they work their passage. Mr. TtTKNEE. I understood you to say you had been in business some eighteen years. Mr. Stevens. Yes; we have been in business twenty-five years, or since 1868. Mr. Turner. What do you pay for jute butts out of which you make cotton bagging? Mr. Stevens. The price is to-day, for the higher kinds, 2| cents. Mr. Turner. Do you mean in Calcutta or here? Mr. Stevens. I mean laid down in New York or Boston. The cheaper kinds are $1.45, or about IJ cents. Mr. Turner. Do you mean in Calcutta? Mr. Stevi;ns. No, sir. All prices for jute butts are quoted in New York. We never buy on a Calcutta basis. Mr. Turner. Has the process of the manufacture of jute bagging for cotton been improved in any way in the last twenty-five years? Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir ; it has been improved very largely. 1 think it would be difficult to find any industry that has not improved very N greatly in that time. Mr. TuRNiiR. You still use the old roping frame? Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir; it is essentially the same kind of machinery but is much improved in construction. Mr. Turner. Are they complicated machines? Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir; I should call the roping frame a complicated one. It is as difficult as the cotton loom. It has to be complicated, because the material contains so much dirt. Mr. Turner. Do they go through the process of spinning and weav- ing? Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. Are not the employ(?s used in your business largely women and children? Mr. Stevens. No, sir; they are very largely men. That is the chief disadvantage under which we labor, as compared with the British manufacturer. Our weavers are men and most of them men of families. Mr. Turner. How many establishments are there now engaged in making bagging for cotton out of jute butts? Mr. Stevens. I do not know that I can answer that. Of course you know a great many of them are now under one management. Mr. Turner. Where are they located ? Mr. Stevens. There are two in Brooklyn, one in Paterson, three in St. Louis, one in New York, one in New Orleans, one in Ohtirlestor, and another somewhere in New England. HEMP AND JUTE. 783 Mr. Turner. There is one in Columbus, Ga. Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir; I had forgotten that. Mr. TxJENEB. Are you acq^uainted with Mr. Pierce, who has ap- peared before this committee? Mr. Stevens. I am not. Mr. TuRNEE. What was your relation to the arrangement by which bagging was advanced so largely four or five years ago? Mr. Stevens. The arrangement was made by a New York concern, notably the New York Bagging Company and "the Lawrence and Wa- terbury companies ; and after a very great pressure we joined with them one season. The arrangement was restricted, and we were glad to get out. Mr. Turner. That was soon after the Mills bill was considered by this committee? - Mr. Stevens* I should say that it was previous to that time. That ' is my impression. Mr. Turner. No; you are mistaken. Mr. Pierce was before this committee, and I cross-examined him. He said the trust was then in existence. The price for bagging had then gone up from 6 or 7 cents to about 12 or 13 cents. Mr. Stevens. Not as high as that, I think. Mr. Turner. It was, perhaps, 13 or 14 cents to the consumer. Mr. Stevens. It would. not be as high as 10 cents, so far as we were concerned, that year. Mr. Turner. That was an arrangement by which the price was put up to the consumer over and above what the former price was. Mr. Stevens. That is perfectly true. Mr. Turner. How long did that last? Mr. Stevens. I should have to speak entirely from recollection, but I think only one season. It was in operation thrjjugh one selling season. Mr. Turner. It was during that season that the farmers resorted to so many other devices to obtain bagging. Mr. Stevens. Yes; they took to the use of cotton cloth, needle bag- ging, etc. Mr. Turner. How much did that cost the farmers, according to the consumption of that year? Mr. Stevens. I do not know. Mr. Turner. Your competitors, you say, are in Calcutta as well as in Scotland. Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir; I should not expect any competition with Scotland. They could not hold their own against Calcutta. The same thing is true in the matter of burlaps and bags. They are bringing them to California now. Calcutta manufacturers are also supplying China, Japan, and Australia. This trade has all been taken from Dundee. It is Calcutta and not Dundee that would get the American market. - Mr. Turner. Your raw material is derived from India? Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. The reason you want the duty maintained at at least 1 cent a pound is becaiise your competitors obtain labor in India at a rate so much lower than you can obtain it in this country. Mr. Stevens. That is exactly true. Mr. Turner. Does not the American cotton-planter have to com- pete with the growers of cotton and other cheap labor of India? Mr. Stevens. I am not aware as to that. They certainly do not in this market. I am not familiar with cotton, however. 784 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. Mr. TxJENEE. Ton are a-w^are that the product of cotton in India is sold in competition with American cotton? Mr. Stevens. Tes. sir; but that cotton can only be used for certain things; that is to say, you would have to use other cotton with it. Mr. TuKNER. Still, it supplies a certain want which would be sup- plied by American cotton, just as we would be glad to get some other bagging when yours might be too high for us. Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. Would it be quite equitable to mate these producers of American cotton who have to compete with the Indian farmers, who raise cotton with cheap labor, pay this high price for bagging that they must use when they ship their cotton to Liverpool? Mr. Stevens. That goes into the whole question of protection, and I do not know that I want to go into that. Mr. Turner. That is an aspect of it which you do not like to discuss. Mr. Stevens. I do not. We have to compete with the foreigners, and we would like to have this protection. Mr. Turner. Aud yet you concede that about two-thirds of the American cotton is exported in this same jute bagging? Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. That goes abroad to compete with the cotton-producers in the nations you have described; but you propose, from what you have said in reference to a tariff bill that many manufacturers in this country get a rebate on their exports, and the ease of tin has been re- ferred to on which a rebate is allowed in order to enable the exporter of that article to meet equally his competitor abroad, while in the case of the cotton-planter, he is allowed no rebate for the enhanced cost of his bagging, the raw material of which is free. Mr. Stevens. I think there was a provision by which any exporter of cotton could get a claim for rebate. Mr. Turner. How do you make that out? Mr. Stevens. I don't know; it has been exceedingly difficult to establish such claims. Mr. Turner. Id what law was anything of that sort found? Mr. Stevens. I do not know. I hear that in some cases the excess was allowed. Mr. Turner. You have forgo tton that that rebate was allowed in cases where the article was manufactured from imported materials on which a duty had been paid. Mr. Stevens. I was aware there was such a clause in the act. Mr. Turner. There is no duty now on any raw material of that kind. Mr. Stevens. K'o, sir. Mr. Turner. Therefore, there is no provision in the act which would enable the consumer of bagging to get a rebate? Mr. Stevens. I submit, however, that the farmer who uses it is get- ting his bagging at a very much less rate than the rebate is by reason of this free jute. Mr. Turner. By reason of the competition between manufacturers here? Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir; in great part; because, also Mr. Turner. Candidly, now, what is there to protect the American farmer against a new combination in bagging, such as existed before? Mr. Stevens. I don't know about that; but I will say this — that I should be perfectly willing to have bagging go on the free list the very moment that any such combination goes into force. I shall never be a HEMP AND JUTE. 785 party to such a thing again. We may be driven to the wall by oppo- sition, but we will never go into another trust. Mr. Ttjrnek. Then you recog'nize that that was a wrong done to the producer, and that it would justify that penalty being resorted to? Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir; I think so. Mr. TuENEE. I thank you for your candor, and I will not press the point further. Mr. Payne. How much was the duty at the time of that combina- tion? Mr. Stevens. One and one-half cents, I believe, and the duty was raised by the McKinley bill. Mr. TxJENEE. May I ask you further how you stand in relation to this matter of machinery? If you get your machinery free, then could you make jute bagging cheaper? Mr. Stevens. Well, we could not get our machinery cheaper, because we have already got it and paid the duty on it. Mr. TuKNEE. I am speaking, of course, with reference to the trade generally. Mr. Stevens. If we had to start over again and could get our ma- chinery free, we would get along with a lower scale of duty than I now ask for. I put it upon the ground that we had already paid these vast sums in duty. Mr, TuENEE. These machines which you use are generally imported, I believe. There is no good machinery made in this country, iu New Jersey or anywhere else, for your purpose. Mr. Stevens. There has been machinery made in this country, but none of it was used. It is no cheaper. Imported machinery, with 45 per cent duty added, is cheaper. Mr. Ttjenee. Home machinery is not satisfactory. Mr. Stevens. We have not had any, and do not expect to have any. We consider that our business has been reasonably satisfactory. I think it has been less satisfactory than the cotton and woolen manu- facture. Money put into either of those would have yielded greater results than we have gotten out of jute. Mr. TuENEE. Would not there be a difference in the freight on the manufactured jute bagging, as compared with the freight on jute butts, and would it not amount to a considerable item? Mr. Stevens. I think not. The duty on cloth from Calcutta would be greater than the duty on butts — on some very much greater. Mr. TtJRNEE. What is the freight rate? Mr. Stevens. I can not answer that question. A number of vessels are very glad to get a cargo of those bags to the United States. They would be equally glad to get a cargo of cloth. They go out with ice and things of that sort. Mr. TuENEE. They would like a return cargo? Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir. It would be a little more, simply because it is greater in bulk. They charge for space. Mr. TuENBE. Would you think, as a matter of equity, that those who were situated as we have just seen should have some compensa- tion in the spirit of a fair divide? Mr. Stevens. I do not believe I want to answer that question. Mr. Tuenee. They are raising cotton now and selling it at less than cost, while you are making a small profit. Mr. Stevens. I said that in past years we were making nothing. Mr. Tuenee. Bat in the last few years you have made something. Mr. Stevens. I assiire you, as to the Southern farmer, that he will TH 50 786 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. get his cloth for less than It takes to manufacture it. He is getting it for less now. Mr. TuENEE. But, unfortunately, the farmer claims that he is not getting it for less than the cotton costs to raise it. Mr. Stevens. I am sorry for him. Mr. TuRNEE. He can not close up his farm. Mr. Stevens. K"or can we shut up our mill and discharge our em- ployes. We own the whole village of about 40 acres in the place where we are situated, and we have to take care of those people. Mr. TUENEE. I want to say if we can not get the farmer into a posi- tion where he can get his taxes off, ought not there to be a fair division? You were prospering the last few years; the farmer has not been. Mr. Steatens. I supi^ose he is in the same condition as the farmer in Kew England. There are gTcat sections there where they are suffering. Mr. TuENEE. Is it possible that farming does not pay in New Eng- land? Mr. Stevens. I can say it is true, because I have the misfortune to be a farmer. Mr. TuENEE. Then the tariff has not brought a home market to the farmers in New England? Mr. Stevens. It has' not. If there is any man in creation for whom I am sorry it is the New England farmer. I should be compelled to go out of existence if I had to live on the products of my farm. I do not think the southern farmer can be in any worse condition than the New England farmer. Mr. TuENEE. Is he not an object of compassion? Mr. Stevens. I feel some compassion for him, as I feel for all of our farmers, but I object to going to the point of extinguishing a home industry in order to give an industry to Calcutta, because I am not sui'e that that would benefit the farmer. Mr. TuENEE. It is rather unfortunate that the farmer should be com- pelled to pay this. He ought to have access to the same markets that you have, on the same terms. Mr. Stevens. M'e have that to complain of. "We have felt that in having to pay that high rate on our machinery — in having to pay $150,000 more than our competitors in Dundee. We recognize the principle and we have nothing to say, excei^ting that we hope to be recognized. Mr. Bynum. This excessive amount paid on yoiu' machinery is not a question of duty. Mr. Stevens. Yes, it is. Mr. Bynum. Then you do not subscribe to the doctrine that the foreigner pays the duty? Mr. Stevens. In the case of machinery, I am perfectly satisfied as to who pays it. Machineiy is offered to us at so much in Liverpool. It is $4.83 in Liverpool; in Boston, it is f 7 to the pound sterling. We can take our choice. Mr. Bynum. What do you manufacture? Mr. Stevens. Cotton bagging is our principle line of business. We also make binding twine, jute, hemi), and carpet yarns. Mr. TuENEE. You have a separate mill for binding twine? Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir. Mr. TuRNEE. Do you keep separate accounts as to each industry? Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir. Mr. TuENEE. What is the annual output of your manufactory, tak- ing an average year? HEMP AND JUUE. 787 Mr. Stevens. It is from 12,000,000 to 13,000,000 yards. Mr. Turner. About what was the price at which you disposed of the product"? Mr. Stevens. It is probably 6 to 6 J cents per yard; it is more for the best. Mr. Turner. What was your pay roll for that year for labor? I want it just for the item mentioned. Mr. Stevens. The pay roll is, in round numbers, for bagging, some- thing like $3,300 a week. Our pay roll for bagging- is the largest. Mr. Turner. If your pay-roll would average about $125,000 a year in that industry, and the output is 12,000,000 yards, at 6 cents a yard, it would amount to $720,000"? Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir. 1 Mr. Turner. What other difference is there in the cost of the product outside of labor! Mr. Stevens. The entire difference I could not give you. Mr. Turner. What other elements of difference are there"? Mr. Stevens. The fact that we have paid out this large item for machinery, and also the large cost for buildings and the equipment of our plant. Mr. Turner. There is nothing except the mere investment which would make any difference in the cost of production 1 Mr. Stevens. There are some other items of which I have not taken account. There are items of supply which every mill has, such as repairs, coal, iron, and things of that sort. Our repairs happen to be larger than upon cotton or woolen mills — eight or ten times larger. Mr. Turner. Is not the cotton-mill man in the same position as to machinery? Mr. Stevens. Yes, a large part of that has to be imported. Mr. Turner. The duty on your product is how much on the output? Mr. Stevens. The duty at present is 1.6 per square yard. Mr. Turner. That would more than pay the entire cost of labor. Mr. Stevens. I have already said the present amount of tariff, in my judgment, is unnecessary. I said that it was not needed, and I told you I would be perfectly frank about it. I am not asking for an increase of duty, and I do not think we need it. Mr. Turner. What about the output of a hand in this country as compared with one in India? Mr. Stevens. I do not, as I have no knowledge on that point. Mr. Turner. You have not investigated that? Mr. Stevens. I have not, but I could do so. I have asked a few general questions in a general way. One of the overseers in my miU had been an overseer in India for three years. I asked him some general questions bearing upon that. Mr. Turner. Is it a fact that labor in India is not near so efficient as it is in this country? Mr. Stevens, I assure you that one of ours would be almost as efficient as three of theirs. Mr. Gear. Have you stated the difference between what you pay your workingmen and the price paid in India? Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir; I did, in my general statement. Mr. Payne. You said that the wages in India was nominal, Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir; it is almost no wages at all. Mr. Payne. When you imported this machinery, was the same ma- chinery manufactured in this country? Mr, Stevens. Yes, sir. 788 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. Mr. Payne. You bought this abroad? Mr. Stevens. We did. Mr. Payne. The reason why it was not manufactured here was be- cause no one bought it. Mr. Stevens. A few went into the business and did buy that ma- chinery. There was a machine made in this country, but it cost more than the machine does that comes from abroad. Mr. Panne. It was made experimentally 'J Mr. Stevens. Yes, sir. iriiAX, JUTE, AND HEMP. (Schedule J.) Saturday, September 9, 1893. STATEMEHT OF ME. A. K, TUENEH, A VICE-PRESIDEWT OF TKE BABBOUE BEOTHEES COMPANY. Mr. Chairman: I appear as vice-president of the Barbour Brothers Company, and also represent the following manufacturers: Barbour Flax Spinning Company, Paterson, K. J. ; Smith & Dove Manufacturing Company, flax spinners, Andover, Mass.; Marshall & Co., flax and hemp spinners, Newark, N. J. ; A. H. Hart and Company, flax and hemp spinners, IsTew York, N. Y. ; Cable Flax Mills, Schaghti- coke, ]Sr. Y.; Dunbarto)! Flax Spinning Company, Greenwich, N. Y.; James Thompson & Co., flax and hemp spinners, Valley Fa,lls, N. Y.; Whitney, Macduff & Co., flax spinners, Millbury, Mass. I might say that originally the Barbour Brothers Company made an application, and later some other gentlemen conferred with them, and, after such informal conference, we concluded to come as one body, and, therefore, I represent the entire list which I have read. I have also prejpared a statement which I will read, Mr. Turner read the following paper : Mr. Chairman and Gentlemen: In view of tlie contemplated revision of the tarifi:', we urge that any reductions wliioh may he made may he so adjusted that maunfaoturers and those in their employ will suffer no injury. While we would prefer to have the tariff unchanged, reasonahle revision, if made in Schedule J, would effect quite a reduction from existing rates. If there is a demand that raw materials should be placed on the free list, and the duty is removed, it will represent a considerable sum, and also admif of reductions in the rates of duty on manufactured products. The duty collected on raw materials for the year ending June 30, 1892, was as follows : Flax straw $267. 08 Flax, not hackled or dressed 96, 041. 88 Hemp 115,1505.48 Tow of flax 25, 726. 55 Tow of hemp 7,312.26 244. 853. 25 As manufacturers necessarily carry large stocks of raw material, we hope that if raw materials are placed on the free list the duty may be made applicable some months before any reduction might apply to mauufactnred articles. With the duty removed on these fibers it would admit of reductions on dressed line of flax and line of hemp as follows: Flax, hackled, known as dressed line, from 3 cents per pound to 1 cent per pound, or a reduction in duty of $51,884.37; hemp, haclcl eel, known as line of hemp, from $50 per ton to one-half cent per pound, or a loauctiou of $4,601.82. The total re- FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. 789 duction on raw materials and on line of flax and liemp we estimate to he $301,339.44. Paragraph 370 we recommend shall be revised to read as follows : Yarns, threads, or twines composed of flax, hemp or ramie, or of a mixture of either of these sub- stances, valued at 13 cents or less per pound, 5 cents per pound; valued at more tlian 13 cents per pound, 40 per centum ad valorem. Paragraph 371, we believe, cau be reduced to a uniform rate of 35 per cent in place of existing duties, and this would represent a reduction in duty of $586, 706. 66. If the revision just suggested were put into effect there are other items, such as clothing, collars and cull's, embroiileries, etc., which could undoubtedly be reduced, because of reduced cost of linens, which enter into their manufacture, but we would prefer that parties representing these industries should make their own presenta- tions to you. Changes suggested for paragraphs 356, 357, 358, 359, 360, 370, and 371 represent a possible reduction of $919,381.06, and reductions could be made in other para- graps not yet referred to by us. The duty on jute yams as named in paragraph 361 is now 35 per cent, and should not be reduced. Any reduction therefrom would curtail business, and a material reduction would close the jute mills in the United States, unless reductions are made in wages. The present rate of wages is two and a half times more than is paid in Europe, and we are at a still greater disadvantage from extremely low wages paid in India. In the detailed consideration of Schedule J we trust you will examine the rates of protective duty afforded the difl^erent textile industries and compare them with the duties in the flax and hemp schedule. The summary we find to be as follows : Per cent. Wools and manufactures of, average duty 78. 69 Manufactures of wool 95.81 Manufactures of silk with free raw material 53. 96 Manufactures of cotton with free raw material 57. 33 Flax, hemp, and manufactures of 36. 58 Manufactures of flax and hemp 39. 11 "We do not ask that the other textile industries be reduced to the low rate of Sched- ule .1, but we submit that, as the rate of wages in one textile mill has a direct influ- ence on that paid in another, we can not operate out mills with any large reduction unless the other textile duties are reduced in the same proportion; nor can we sub- mit to much reduction without reduction of wages, and we have no desire for this change, although we are now paying two or three times as much for wages as the average paid for the same work in Europe. If the reductions in duties in Schedule J are large so that the operatives would not accept a low scale of wages, we must close our mills and retire from business. The importations of yarns and threads are very large, and the low rates of wages paid by French and Italian spinners enables them to produce goods at a very low cost, and already the yarns of Irish and Scotch spinners are being displaced in some markets by French and Italian yarns. The importations for the year ending June 30, 1892, were as follows. Potinds. Tarn made of jute 2,368,-549 Yams, threads, or twines valued at 13 cents or less per pound 820, 006 Valued at more than 13 cents per pound 1, 080, 439 Mr, TuRNEE. The fashion of wearing linen goods is diminishing somewhat. Mr. TuKNEE. We are thread spinners and not dealers in piece goods, therefore I can not give a satisfactory answer to that question. Mr. Stevens. Is there any of this Irish linen made here ? Mr. TUKNEK. Not the fine Irish linen ; that is made in Scotland. We make crashes and towels. Mr. Stevens. There is nothing made here except cotton goods? Mr. Turner. No, sir. Mr. Payne. Where were ^hese three factories established? Mr. Turner. One in Massachusetts was established a great many years ago. Mr. i'ATNE. When were those established for making linen out of domestic flax? Mr. Turner. I could not answer. 790 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. The Chairman. IvS the machinery used in this industry made in this country or imported ? Mr. Turner. It is largely imported. The Chairman. Where is it made? Mr. Turner. In England and Ireland. The Chairman. In this country has there been any imi^rovements in the machinery in this industry in recent years ? Mr. Turner. Only in the details; there have been no special im- lirovements to revolutionize the process. The Chairman. What are the fibers used by all these industries which you represent? Mr. Turner. Flax, hemp, and jute. Mr. Turner (of the committee). What do you make out of jute? Mr. Turner. Jute carpet yarn. . Mr. Turner (of the committee). Do you export any goods? Mr. Turner. No, sir; we do not, except a limited amount which we send to Canada. Mr. Turner (of the committee). What kind' of goods do you export to Canada? Mr. Turner. Some specialties in thread suited for American machines in connection with shoe machinery. It is a question of adaptability, rather than price. Mr. Payne. You spoke of the difference in wages between this country and Europe, and especially as to Great Britain. Have you any -pev- sonal knowledge on that subject? Mr. Turner. I have no positive information in connection with that. I myself have never been on the other side; but Mr. Barbour is here, and has personal knowledge of that. FliAX, HEMP, AND JUTE. (Schedule J.) STATEMENT OF ME. BASBOTJE, OF PATTERSON. N. J. Mr. Chairman: I do not know that I can say anything in addition to what Mr. Turner has said, except as regards the labor. We have mills both at Paterson and in Ireland. I have myself personally seefi the workingmen paid off, and I do not overstate it when I say that wages in Paterson are two and one-half times as much as in Ire- land, for the same work exactly. Mr. Gear. And the same produce? Mr. Barbour. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. Do you pay by the day or by the piece? Mr. Barbour. By the day. Mr. Gear. About the efliciency of your people, is it greater over there than it is in this country ? Mr. Barbour. It is exactly the same. The Chairman. Are the hours the same? Mr. Barbour. No; we have the 55-hours law now in New Jersey. The Chairman. The hours are shorter in New Jersey than in Ire- land? Mr. Barbour. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. And you pay the same wages for the shorter time? PLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. 791 Mr. BARBOtrlt. We did until we stopped. Mr. Payne. When did you sliut down? Mr. Baebour. About six weeks ago. Mr. Dalzell. Did you stop the mills or stop the wages'? Mr. Barbour. We stopped the mills, but that is only temporarily. I wanted to emphasize one fact that Mr. Turner stated, and it is this: Under Schedule J to-day we do not enjoy the protection that is en- joyed by other industries with whom we compete in the matter of labor. If reductions are to be made we should be put on the same basis as the other industries that employ the same kind of labor. We have less protection by far than the cotton, woolen, silk, steel, or iron in- dustries, and our labor is raw material. If the protection is reduced we can not compete with our fellow manufacturers with the labor we now have for our mills. It is diflScult to do it now. The Chairman. What do you make in your mills? Mr. Barbour. We make the entire range of linen thread and yarns. The Chairman. You did not make fabrics? Mr. Barbour. No, sir. The Chairman. To whom do you sell your yarns? Mr. Barbour. To ahnost every shoemaker, dry goods house, and manufacturer in the United States, I may say. Thej' all use more or less linen thread. It is used in harnessing the looms. In the shoe shop it is used in sewing shoes. In the dry goods stores in the coun- try it is sold for sewing on buttons. I had a conversation with Mr. Potts, treasurer of the Importers' Association of New York, and he asked me to state, if I came down here to-day, that the importers (and I think I can speak for about nine- tenths of them) would be satisiied with a 35 per cent reduction on linen piece goods. We were greatly in hopes that they might come here to-day under our schedule. We think that if the manufacturers were here they and the importers would be found to be harmonious, and we would settle our case out of court, so to speak. Mr. Stevens. What is the difference in insurance between your establishment now in this country and the one you have in Ireland? Mr. Barbour. It is about two and a hallf times as much here. Mr. Stevens. And the rates on the establishment there are the same? Mr. Barbour. About the same. Mr. Stevens. Then as to the matter of taxes. In comparing your establishment in Ireland with the one in Paterson, what would be the difference for the same productive capacity? Mr. Barbour. 1 should think it would be about the same relative taxation. Mr. Stevens. About 2J per cent. Mr. Barbour. In Paterson it costs a doUar a foot as compared with 02^ cents in Ireland. Mr. Stevens. And your mill would cost double as much? Mr. Barbour. Not quite double as much, but nearly so. Mr. Stevens. That is, for your mill building? Mr. Barbour. Yes, sir. Mr. Stevens. And how is it as to machinery? Mr. Barbour. That costs 50 per cent more, and the expense of put- ting it up. Mr, Dalzell. What is the duty on the machinery? Mr. Barbour. It is 45 per cent duty, and freight. We call it 50 per cent. That is a feature in connection with the linen business, as all the inachmery in this country has paid 60 per cent duty. 792 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. Mr. Payne. Have you been able to get a higher price for goods in this country? Mr. Baebotje. Prices have not changed since the McKinley bill ■went into eflect. The shoe manufacturers are paying exactly to-day what they paid five years ago — every one of them. We have not advanced prices. Mr. Dalzell. The change made by the McKinley bUl was from 35 per cent to 40 per cent. Mr. Baeboue. It was from 40 per cent to 45 per cent. Mr. Payne. This 35 per cent is on condition that the flax is free, I suppose f Mr. Baebotje. Tes, sir. It is free raw material, bat it makes a dif- ference of about 3 per cent to us ; not over that. That is a very brief statement in connection with the industry which we represent. Another matter which is of great importance is that any changes which may be made should be made with reasonable dispatch, because of the uncertainty which exists in the business. Delay will handicap the business, and it will remain so until it is settled. The Chairman. You suggested in the beginning of your paper that there should be an interval between placing the raw material on the free list and the taking effect of the reduced tariff on the finished prod- uct. What would you say would be a proper interval? Mr. TuENEE. That would depend somewhat upon the time of year. The Chaieman. When do you buy your raw material? Mr. TuKNEE. Generally in December and January, and it comes for- ward in the spring. The Chaieman. When do you put the fabric on the market? Mr. Ttjrnee. We bring forward only sufficient to last as f&r a year. We can not get good selections at the opening of the m,arket. We have to take what we can get. Six months ahead would be a fair time to arrange. The Chairman. How long in advance do you take your orders? Mr. Ttjrnee. Not any great time in advance of delivery. We man- ufacture for the market and sell from our stock. The Chairman. Where does your raw material chiefly come from? Mr. Ttjenee. From Eussia, France, Belgium, and throughout the European countries. The Chaieman. What is the proportion of raw material in this country to your entire consumption ? Mr. Ttjenee. It is infinitesimal. The Chaieman. In what section of this country is flax produced? Mr. TuENER. A few years ago it was produced largely in northern New York, but flax is now produced in the West, in Wisconsin and Dakota, but the amount is very small, indeed it is so small that it does not represent an industry as it stands today. A great many farmers have tried to raise flax. We have worked with them, because we would like to have a supply of our fabric turned out in this country, but we find it is an impossibility. Farmers seem to find that other crops pay better, and they go to raising something else. That matter seems to be beyond control, although our disposition has been to take the Amer- ican product. The Chairman. Is this flax produced in Wisconsin adapted to the fiber or is it produced for seed? Mr. Turner. The flax raised throughout the West is produced for seed alone. It is short and stubby and is not fitted for spinning. FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. 793 Mr. Stevens. Is tbere much labor required in preparing this flax? Mr. Turner. Yes, sir. We have to organize scutching mills for the separation of the woody parts. Mr. Stetens. How does the price compare with the former price in this country? Mr. Turner. The prices at present are higher — due to the failure throughout the European islands where it is raised. Mr. Payne. Can they produce flax in this country suitable for your business? Mr. Turner. They have produced some good grades in this country, but it is not suited for fine grades of spinning, or where you require strength. Mr. Payne. Is that owing to the natural difficulties or to the fact that the producers are engaged in more profitable business? Mr. Turner. It is partly due to both. There are peculiar conditions of soil in the peat bogs and rivers abroad in several places in Europe which do not apply here, and which give special results. Mr. Payne. Is flax an important product in this country? Mr. Turner. Hemp is, but flax is not. Mr. Turner, of the committee. What style of goods do you make ? Mr. Turner. Linen threads and carpet yarns. Mr. Turner, of the committee. Is Irish linen produced in this coun- try? Mr. Turner. Only to a limited amount. Mr. Turner, of the committee. How" does it compare with the Irish linen in quality? Mr. Turner. It compares favorably as far as linen goes. It is lim- ited as compared with the Irish linen grades. Mr. Turner, of the committeee. Is the raising of flax here of recent industry ? Mr. Turner. It has been made here for years. Mr. Turner, of the committee. Where? Mr. Turner! At Webster, Mass., Appleton, Wis., and at Sioux Falls, S. Dak. Mr. Turner, of the committee. Is it profitable? Mr. Turner. I hardly think it is, because there has been no exten- sion of the industry, while there are very large importations of that class of goods. Mr. Turner, of the committee. There used to be an idea that the mode of bleaching was better in Ireland on account of some climatic conditions. Mr. Turner. That applies more largely to the finer grades. Un- doubtedly the grass bleaching over there is better. They are resorting now more and more to mechanical methods than to grass bleaching. Mr. Turner, of the committee. What do you mean by " mechanical methods?" Mr. Turner. By acids and chemicals — by bleaching-houses rather than by the natural method of bleaching on the grass. They still carry on some part of the bleaching process on grass. Mr. Turner, of the committee. That is a chemical process. Mr. Turner. It is chemical and mechanical. Mr. Turner, of the committee. Does that kind of bleaching stand as well in the trade as the grass bleaching? Mr. Turner. I presume not in the long run. It depends upon the final handUng of the goods and as to whether anything is left in the fiber of the material which would deteriorate it. 794 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. (Paragraph S64.) STATEMEHT OF ME. J. M. BEMIS, BAG MANXTFACTTJEEE, OF BOSTON, MASS Mr. Chairman : My remarks will be quite brief. They will relate to only two paragraphs in the jute schedule, one of those being paragraph 364, which relates to the duty on burlaps under 60, and we are using nothing wider. The other paragraph is 365, which relates to bags, and is short, and the one in which I am directly interested. I have written off a tew remarks here which do not all bear directly on my industry, but pertain generally to the matter of the tariff. Mr. Dalzell. I believe the law was changed in the act of 1890 to a specific duty. Mr. Bemis. Tes; I will come to that a little later. Mr. Bemis read his paper, as follows : In my remarts before the MoKinley committee, I said, if the protective principle is to remain, tlie minimum rates of duties that would protect should be adopted. The remark is equally applicable now as then, and 1 believe it is the sentiment of your honorable committee that a revenue tariff should be so framed that it would allow our manufacturers to pay fair wages. In other words, that duties should be levied on foreign goods to even the conditions existing abroad and in this country. The minimum prices to consumers -can only be obtained by competition, and this competition we have in manufacturing bags both from home and abroad under the present tariff. A high or prohibiting tariif is only equaled or excelled in its bad effects by a ton low or no tariff rate that would discriminate aigainst home produc- tion and enable foreigners to make all the goods abroad, thus depriving our manu- facturers of their profits, the laborers of their wages, and the consumers of competi- tion prices, and finally, the taking of money away from this country that should remain here and be handled over and over again for the benefit of all our citizens. If the tariff' is a tax, let all of us be taxed; if the tariff' is a blessing, let all of us share in it, and if it is too high, it should "be reduced, but all changes should be moderate and tentative, and at stated periods, and far enough in advance to give our manufacturers and laborers time to prepare for proper adjustment. The Morrill tariff rated raw jute 20 per cent ad valorem; burlap, 30 per cent; bags made of burlap, 40 per cent. The McKinley bill puts raw jute on the free list, burlap at If cents per pound, and bags at 2 cents per pound. Your petitioner, for himself and others, labored with the McKinley committee for rate of 1-} cents on burlap and 1-J cents on bags, and failing to secure these rates, pleaded with the Senate Finance Committee for the same, but without effect. To these rates, as well as those adopted, the Pacific coast bag manufacturers strongly protested, claiming that they could not retain the manufacturing of bags on such low rates. The specific system in burlap and bags, in the present tariff, has worked well, thus preventing any possible fraud. We think all of the Boston appraisers will recommend its continuance. No appraiser can tell from mere looks what the weight is of any given sample, and to ascertain if an invoice entered for duties weighs according to the invoice, it must be weighed. The weight defines the price to a cer- tain extent. The ad valorem system was particularly objectionable to the American importers. For instance, if a contract for burlap is placed abroad for future ship- ment (the favorite way of buying) at 2 pence per yard, if when shipment is made the market value has advanced to 2J- pence, duties are assessed on this advance. If, however, when goods are shipped the market value has declined to If pence, then the duties are assessed on the purchase price — 2 pence — or the importer must have two invoices sent him, one at market value, by which to pay duties, the other at contract price, by which to settle with the manufacturer. The importer, under this last condition, lays himself open to prosecution for swindling the Government, and gets no advantage of a decline in prices, although the Government demands the advantage of any rise. The foreign manufacturers or merchants consigning their goods to this country can always invoice them at market value, thus having a decided advantage over the American importers. Some of the bag manufacturers are also importers and ■wish to be in a position to obtain their supplies at the minimum cost. No doubt BURLAPS. 795 yoiTT honorable committee "ndll sift botli systems and adopt tile one -n'liicli seems the better, but -we much prefer the specific. The drawback system has given the millers and flour-shipxiers much benefit, as the portion of their bags used for export are subject to and receive a drawbacl-c of 99 per cent of duties paid. In framing the present tariff the Millers' National Asso- ciation, having an organization in most of the States, took a lively interest in tlie drawback clause, their secretary being in Washington much of the time. Many of xhe millers also telegraphed to their JRepresentatives and .Senators direct, advocat- ing this system. As to the rate of duties on burlaps, no doubt the American jute manufacturers will present their own views. They will have great bearing on our business. The rate should not be too high, neitlier should it be too low. We believe if burlaps should be admitted free the benefit would accrue to the foreigners and not to our consumers, as we believe the foreign prices would advance nearly, if not quite equal to the reduction of the duties, and the Govenament would lose the revenue. We are creditably informed that cablegrams have already been received from Calcutta asking information as to the probable reduction on j ute fabrics. Heretofore the rule with Calcutta manufacturers has been, in selling future ship- ments at much less prices than immediate shipments, but recently this old and well- established rule has been reversed, and the farther ahead sales are now the higher the prices. This certainly indicates that they are expecting to receive benefit from any reduction in our tariff rates — that is, that they will advance their prices. We are told through the papers and otherwise, that this Congress will surely pass a free-trade tarifl:' bill. Now, we expect some rediiction from the present tariff, but when it is considered that no nation can be really prosperous and stand ahead of all other nations unless it leads in both manufacturing and agriculture, we can not be- lieve that any tariff' bill will be enacted that will destroy a single American industry, closing our factories and setting adrift our wage-earners. Without naming anything especially in praise of the bag manufacturers in this country, we will say, they have never combined or gone into any trusts to put up the price of bags on the consumers, but have always labored to produce the article wauled at the minimum cost, and we do not believe that a single consumer or bag user can be found east of the Rocky Mountains who will make any complaint of bad service at the hands of the bag manufacturers. In fact, the competition has been exceedingly close, so much so that one-third of as many factories as are now run- ning in the United States have failed during the past fifteen years. The rates of duties your petitioner asks for are indeed small, yet they are absolutely essential if we are to retain the business here, so we pray that your honorable committee will fix the rate of duties on burlaps, Schedule J of present tariff bill (paragraph 364), at H cents per pound, and on bags for grain and flour, made of the burlap (paragraph 365), at 1-J cents per pound, which we believe to be a fair and reasonable adjustment, under existing conditions. If the ad valorem system should be chosen by your honorable committee, we would ask for the burlaps rate at 25 per cent, and for the bag rate at 32 per cent. If any other rates than herein named are adopted on burlap cloth, we beg to ask a rate on burlap bags over and above the rate on the cloth in proportion to the above figures suggested. Herein we beg to submit you sample marked "single." This is the burlap cloth and dutiable at If cents per pound, and the bags made of this cloth at 2 cents per pound, present tariff'. We also herewith hand you sample of double- warp Hessian cloth or bagging, marked "double." This is dutiable in the present tariff' at 2 cents per pound, and the bags made of this double-warp cloth are also dutiable at 2 cents per pound in the present tariff. Many hundred thousands of these bags are used in this country, and up to this time not a single bag has been made here by the bag manufacturers, because it is impossible with our scale of wages to make these bags and compete with foreign makers, when the cloth and bags are lioth dutiable same price. We only bring this to your attention to show that if burlaps and bags were on the free list, it would be impossible for the bag manufacturers to retain any of the bag manufacturing here. We do not ask your honorable committee to make a new paragraph and have in the new bill that is to be bags of two kinds and dutiable at two different rates; this was brought to the attention of the McKinley committee, but they concluded to have only one dutiable rate for all kinds of burlaps and double-warp bags, and we presume "it will be the object of your committee to simplify matters in your tariff' bill as much as possible. Of coui'se, we should like this double-warp bag dutiable at a rate that would allow its manufacture in this country. All of which is respect- fully submitted. Average price for cental bags in Calcutta for 1892 (12-ounce bag) : The average custom-house exchange for the rupee would equal, per bag, 4.08 cents our money. 796 FLAX, JUTE Amy hemp. This shows the McKinley tariff rednced the duties, comp.iTed with the Morrill bill, about 8 per ceut. Ou burlaps, owing to short notice, could not make up the average for comparison. Will do so and mail, if the committee so desire. Very truly yours, J. M. Bemis, For Bemis Bro. Bag Co., St. Lovis, and Gulf Bag Co., Limited, New Orleans. Mr. Bemis. (After concluding the paper.) I -wonM like to say that Mr. Babbott, of the Chelsea Jute Company, met me yesterday and was anxious that I should not advocate changing the duty. He thought that the duty was low now, which I admit, and he seemed to think that we should not make any attempt to change it. I told him I would say just what he asked me to say, and I do so with pleasure. I would like also to say that since Congress has been called together in this extra session, the price in Calcutta for forwarded shipment has advanced exceedingly for burlaps and bags; that is, far-off shipments for winter and spring they expect would probably come in under the new tariff at a lower price. Mr. Babbitt, to whom I have referred, is one of those manufacturers. I told him what we would recommend, simply because I had asked that during the last Congress, though I did not obtain it. I have experienced no change in my views. They said I did not know what it cost to manufacture goods in this country. My recommendations were left out in the last tariff act. I have some samjoles here, which I wiU submit to the committee (submitting sam- ples). My notice of this meeting was so limited that I could not bring for- ward all the statistics which I was willing and quite anxious to send to the committee; but I have one item which bears on the subject, and the only one which I have been able to make up. I have not iaeen able to make up the showing of the average duty under the McKinley bdl. It is not very much different from the one on bags. Mr. Payne. That is left at 32. Mr. Bemis. It was 4.8 in the McKinley bill, or 40 per cent. Under the present bUl it is IJ, while under the old one it was 2.60. I appear before your committee for the Bemis Brothers Bagging Company, which has two or three branches, and also for the Gulf Bagging Com- pany Limited, of New Orleans. I have received this morning two dis- patches from two of the largest milling corporations in the United States, Pillsbury being the largest. Knowing that I was coming here to-day, through oux Minneapolis branch, they have telegraphed me as follows: [Telegram.] Minneapolis, Minn., September 8, 1S9S. J. M. Bemis, Ebhitl Bouse, Wasliirigfon, D. C: We are willing to abide by your ideas of tariff on jute, provided drawback is retained. Washbukn, Ceosby & Co. [Telegram.] Minneapolis, Minn., Septeviher 8, 1893. J. M. Bemis, Care Ebhitt House, Wasliingfon, D. C: We indorse your position before Ways and Means Committee. No changes should be made to injure export business. This Noivi'hwestben Consolidated Milling Company. BUKLAPS. 797 The ITortliwestern Consolidated Milling Company comes next to the Pillsbury ; but my impression is that Mr. Pillsbury is now out of this country, or I would have heard from him. I do considerable business in Calcutta through a firm in San Fran- cisco, and I have just received this dispatch, which is sent at this time because they have offered on purchases to be shiijped to California on January sales 4.03. The average last year was 4.08. Calcutta centals are 4.19. There is no reason why they should not be sent. They have advanced since this Congress met from 3.80 to 4.19. I can only account for it on the idea that January shipments will be in after this new tariff is made, and they expect, possibly, free bags, or some reduction, and expect to get this advance, so that this country can not expect any reduction in the full proportion to the reduced duty, if there is any made. The Chairman. Have the Calcutta manufacturers any combination by which they could put up prices? Mr. Bemis. I do not know about that. This cental bag has never been made in this country. They make that bag exceedingly cheap. Mr. Gear. What is the cental bag? Mr. Bemis. It is a 100-pound wheat bag that goes to the Pacific coast. The Chairman. I suppose the demand for that bag and all other bags varies? Mr. Bemis. Yes, sir; the demand for jute bags varies very greatly. This bag is only made in this country. The Chairman. They are competing with each other for the trade in this country and others, are they not? Mr. Bemis. Undoubtedly. Mr. Stevens. Are any of those made in this country? Mr. Bemis. Yes, sir; we make that largely. Mr. Turner. What is your price for that bag? Mr. Bemis. We have been selling that, but have now sold out. We have just sold out at 5.75. This price would be 4.19, plus 12 j^oints banker's commission, which would make it just 5.75. Mr. Turner. That includes your profit? Mr. Bemis. This is the net cost, landed to-day, on this cable which I received just now. The price in Calcutta was, two or three days ago, 6^. The difference in the price of those was owing to the detention, or nonarrival, of a cargo of bags which was several days overdue, and there was some suffering in consequence of this. The ship arrived, and the jjrice declined to 6J, which is not a large profit on the foreign market. Mr. Payne. You "said you recommended IJ on the grain bags you were using. Did you put that price as the lowest possible point at which the duty could be placed out of deference to the Grain Dealers' Association of this country ? The duty was put at 2 cents a pound, and you recommend IJ. Mr. Bemis. It was provided that burlaps should be put at IJ. Mr. Payne. You did not place it upon the ground that this was the lowest possible point at which it could go with safety? Mr. Bemis. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. You did that out of deference to the millers' associa- tion? Mr. Bemis. Yes, I did. Mr. Payne. Suppose the duty on grain bags should be reduced to three-eighths of a cent a pound, what would be the result on the manu- facture of grain bags in this country ? 798 FLAX, JUTE AXD HEMP. Mr. Bemis. That is just wliere it is to-day. It is three-eighths now. Mr. Payne. Say if burlaps were freej could it then go at three- eighths ? Mr. Bemis. I would be sorry to have it at that. I think we might live if burlaps were free; but that would not be my recommendation, because that cuts us close. The Californians wanted to knife me dur- ing the last Congress because I recommended only three-eighths. I think they have made the same proportion as they made before. Mr. Payne. How does the price average for these products? Mr. Besiis. I have given you the average of the foreign cost for 1S1)2. Mr. Payne. What is the difference to the consumer in this country? Mr. Bemis. The cental bag is sold for about 6 to 6^. It has been selling at a fair profit, if they could be sold on arrival. Mr. Payne. How does it comj)are with the price ofthe raw material? Mr. Bemis. There is very little change. The only effect, as I see, is the original cost. Mr. Burrows. Do you know anything as to the rate of wages paid in Calcutta? Mr. Bemis. I can not give you that, except as we hear from sources that almost every man is conversa.nt with. It ranges from 12 to 18 cents per day. That is one reason why I say it would be impossible for us to retain the manufacture, in this country, of these bags without the duty. Mr. Gear. None of these double bags are made in this country? Mr. Bemis. No, sir. Mr. Gear. How many are imported? Mr. Bemis. About two-and-a-half or three million. Mr. Gear. For what are they used? ]\Ir. Bemis. They are mostly used in the South for oil cakes, and are also used to a great extent for exj)orting oil. Mr. Gear. You cannot afford to make them, because there is not difference enough? Mr. Bemis. E"o, sir ; there is no difference now. Under the tariff' bill they are "goods not otherwise ijrovided for." They come in at 2 cents a x>ound. Mr. Gear. That should be 2J cents? Mr. Bemis. Yes; that is three-eighths protection. Mr. Dalzell. They ought to be added to the classification? Mr. Bemis. Yes, sir; as single and double warp bags. Mr. Burrows. With a duty of 2f- would there be any difficulty in manufacttuiug them in this country? Mr. Bemis. Yes, sir. We probably could manufacture east of the Rocky Mountains nearly all of these bags. We do not manufacture all of those. Some centals come here. They are made for the mills be- cause the manufacturer gets a drawback. Mr. Gear. What is the consumption of millers' bags in this country? Mr. Bemis. It is about 20,000,000 I should think. Half of that amount is for expoit. Mr. Gear. About what i)roportion of those come from abroad? Mr. Bemis. None of those. We malic them here, because they get a drawback on exportation. Mr. Gear. Which employs a large amount of labor? Mr. Bemis. Y^es sir. Mr. Gear. About what amount of labor? Mr. BE3IIS, I could only give it to you in round numbers, There BURLAPS. 799 are about 18 large manufactories here, and I do not know how many small ones. The help that we employ comprises about (iOO people in actual employment pretty nearly all the time. We have been between hay and grass between the February and incoming of the crop in June. Mr. Payne. What wages do you pay? Mr. Bemis. Our girls get an average of $4.50 to $7.50 per week. Most of them work by piece work. Where we can, we work by piece- work, because we find that is the better way. Mr. Gear. How do these compare with the wages in Calcutta? Mr. Bemis. I could hardly tell you aboiit Calcutta, but I could tell you about Dundee. Calcutta wages is 10 to 18 cents a day. Mr. Gear. What is it in Dundee? Mr. Bemis. Our wages just about double that of Dundee. I took special pains to ascertain that fact. Mr. Gear. Does your help produce more in this country than the Dundee people? Mr. Bemis. I think so. Mr. Gear. How much more? Mr. Bemis. About 10 per cent more. Mr. Gear. What makes this difference? Mr. Bemis. We have extra facilities for making this bag. We have been making i^ thirty-three years. We have every appliance for turn- ing out a good quantity. Mr. Gear, You pay 10 per cent more, allowing for your increased facilities ? Mr, Bemis. Yes, sir. Mr, Stevens. Are any of these bags made on the Western coast? Mr. Bemis. There are four factories, I think, on the Western coast. I think there is one at Portland and two or three in San Francisco; quite large factories. Mr, Turner, Could you itemize the cost of fabrics? Supposing the cost to be 100, what per centage is material, what per centage is labor, etc, Mr, Bemis, Well, now, a bag that would cost, to give a hasty answer Mr, Turner, Can you give us the percentage on the basis over there? Mr, Bemis. I do not know, Mr. Turner, Then give it in wages here. Mr. Bemis. I think the bag that would cost about 70 cents, would cost us, manufactured here, something like 10 per cent in wages. Mr. Turner. The labor would be about 10 per cent? Mr. Bemis. The labor and all expenses would be something like 10 per cent. That would not include material. Mr. Turner. I am talking about labor, raw material, and all the elements of cost. I would like to have each item. Mr. Bemis. We will say 10 per cent, I was giving you the expenses of labor, Mr, Stevens. Ten per cent is what you actually pay for your labor ? Mr. Bemis. I hardly think it would amount to that, without includ- ing all expenses. The items of expense of making a bag are numerous, Mr, Stevens. You say the labor of itself would be 10 per cent ? Mr. Bemis. I gave you the wages of the operatives, without any expenses. I should say it would be about 7 per cent. Mr. Stevens. Tlien 10 per cent would cover earnings and all ? Mr. Bemis. I think so. 800 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. Mr. Turner. The rest of the price that would be put on the bags would represent the value of the plant, interest, capital, cost of raw material, and your profit ? Mr. Bemis. I do not think 10 per cent would include all the capital. Mr. Turner. I said, of the price which you put on the bags, 10 per cent represents the cost of the labor, and 7 per cent the actual labor, and all the other elements of your price would represent your profit, interest on your capital, and such other expenses as you had incurred in the completion of the plant, and your raw material ? Mr. Bemis. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. This is 2J cents a pound upon the bags, that would be worth 7 per cent to the consumer. Mr. Bemis. That would depend entirely on the weight of the bag. Mr. Turner. How much would the bag weigh ? Mr. Bemis. The cental bag weighs three-fourths of a pound. The bags, over and above the cloth in them, would be three-fourths or .27. That would be our protection, 0.27 cent. Mr. Turner. You mean over and above the cost of the raw ma- terial? Mr. Bemis. The raw material is burlaps cloth. Mr. Turner. Are those bags extensively imported now? Mr. Bemis. Yes, sir; we divide profits with the foreigners. Under the present bill we have three-forty-firsts. But we do not have more than one-fifth of the California trade. This side of the Eocky Moun- tains we have more than three-fourths of it. I suppose we have seven- eighths of it this side of the Eocky Mountains. Mr. Turner. As to this drawback, does the miller who buys your bags get the drawback? Mr. Bemis. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. What is the Treasury regulation about it? Mr. Bemis. If you are an importer and buy of John Smith 100 bales of goods, if this is export business, he furnishes you with the particu- lars, the custom-house entries, the foreign price, duties paid, and every- thing accompanies that notice. We send the goods to the manufac- turers with the particulars. They make the bags, and turn them over to the miller with these particulars. He also ships the flour under a bill of lading, and the full particulars at the time, so that whether exported from Boston, or any other port of entry, the broker collects from the custom-house the drawback of 99 per cent of the duties paid on that partictdar exportation. Mr. Turner. Is there any drawback allowed on bags that are actu- ally imported ready-made? Mr. Bemis. No, sir. Mr. Turner. It is only on the American made bags that are made out of jute or burlaps imported? Mr. Bemis. That is all. Mr. Turner. Burlaps ready-made are regarded as your raw material on which drawbacks are paid? Mr. Bemis. Yes, sir. Mr, Turner. And when you sell bags to the Minneapolis man, the statement accompanies them showing the coet of the burlaps? Mr. Bemis. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. And the exporter, filing that statement, gets the draw- back? Mr. Bemis. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. Which is 99 per cent of ttie cost of the raw material? Mr. Bemis. Yes, sir. Then there is brokers' charges. BURLAPS. 801 Mr. TuENEE. Whatever the Treasury gets on the burlaps from the exporter, which is at least 99 per cent, is refunded to the exporter, no matter how many hands the bags have passed through? Mr. Bemis. -No, sir. Mr. G-EAR. What percentage of all bags used in this country are exported? ■ Mr. Bemis. As to the Pacific coast, 1 can not say; but almost all the Pacific coast bags are exported. This side of the Eocky Mountains, where I speak of especially, I suppose that of the proportion that we make in our factories, which would be an average fully 30 per cent, are imjiprted. Mr. Payne. Of course, the miller ultimately gets the drawback. Mr. Bemis. Yes, sir; that makes that part of his burlaps practically free. Mr. Turner. Suppose a dealer from London or Liverpool should go to Minneapolis to buy wheat and put it in these sacks for foreign exportation, would he not be on the same footing as the American exporter? If the foreigner should buy his cargo in Minneapolis and put it in these sacks, would not he get the drawback just the same as the American exporter? Mr. Bemis. No, sir; the American miller gets the drawback. He makes the price accordingly. That is one of the items of cost. Mr. Turner. How does the Treasury Department distinguish be- tween a foreign and an American exporter ? Perhaps you do not under- stand my question. Mr. Bemis. The exporter is the man. He ships with the bill of lad- ing and accompanying documents. Mr. Turner. It makes no difference whether he is from New York or London, does it? Mr. Bemis. He must be a manufacturer, and as soon as he ships the goods he is an exporter. Mr. Turner. The principal of the drawback consists in this consid- eration to the exporter, and is that he ought to be put on equal terms with other people who bring that same thing to market? Mr. Bemis. The foreign market; yes, sir. The competing market is the foreign market. Mr. Turner. It makes no difference how minute the drawback on each article is, I suppose it is collected as a rule? Mr. Bemis. No, sir ; there are a great many little bills which go for- ward withoutt he drawback being refunded, because it is hardly worth the expense. It would not pay to get a drawback on 300 or 400 bags. The miller does not care for that. In a great many cases the draw- back is not collected. A large cargo of 20 or 30 cars, which sometimes go out of Minneapolis, is subject to drawback and is always collected. Mr. Gear. This is a question strictly between the miller at Minne- apolis and the Government? Mr. Bemis. Strictly so. Mr. Gear. A foreigner does not get any benefit from this and the Government does not know anything about him? Mr. Bemis. No, sir; he gets no benefit, except as the price may be made to him on the flour. Mr. Payne. The miller sells at London prices? Mr. Bemis. He sells at the competing price. JMr. Payne. He has competition, gets a drawback, and is enabled thereby to pay more to the farmer for his wheat, and in that way it benefits the farmer. i Jdr, Bemis. I suppose so; tbat would be the natural waj^, T H 51 802 , FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. JUTE, ETC. (Schedule J). Boston, Septemhcr 10, 1893. STATEMENT OF WILLIAM L. CHASE. Permit me to give you briefly the facts bearing on jute goods, and more particularly burlaps. Jute. — This fiber is grown in India. It is a very cheap fiber, first introduced about one hundred years ago, but its usefulness has led to increasing cultivation and exportation. Bftbrts have been made to cultivate it in Egypt and also in the Southern States of America, but climatic conditions, independent of labor, limit its profitable growth to India. Introduction. — Its cheapness led to prejudice, and for a while there was little export demand. The Dundee (Scotland) spinners experi- mented with it. Although for years its principal use was when mixed with tow, gradually its peculiar value became recognized as the great cheap wrapper of the world. Manufactured products. — Through the many stages jute passes in the manufactare there is need of much cheap labor. Some skilled labor is necessary, yet for the greater part women and children are sufflcient. While the uses to which jute are put are manifold, the prin- cipal one is for making cloth commercially known as burlap in America. Burlaps are made mainly in (1) Scotland, whose chief manufacturing city, Dundee, is distinctly the burlap center, and (2) Calcutta, the home market of jute, and where labor is extraordinarily reasonable. Uses. — Burlaps have an important and essential part in tlie develop- ment of many industries peculiar to this country, and are necessary both for our national products, sacking our flour, grain and seed crops, bagging our ores, salt, leather, and fertilizers, and also for covering our manufactures of domestic goods, cotton and woolen, and the mats for furniture, as well as manifold other ways known to you and which can be seen daily in any part of the country. The demand for burlaps grew along intimately with these developments of our national indus- tries, and the duty was lowered from 25 per cent ad valorem under tariff of 1842 to 20 per cent under tariff' of 1846, and reduced further to 15 per cent under tariff of 1857. As a war tax, under tariff' acts of 1861, the duty was just doubled, bringing it to 30 per cent. At .the last revision (1890) to prevent the fraud of undervaluation, the duty was made specific 1| cents a pound, substantially the eqniValent of 30 per cent ad valorem. Free jute. — Under the present tariff' jute was put upon the free list, and properly as a raw material that was not grown in this country. Permit me right here to respectfully bring to yoxrr consideration the eminent fitness in a similar classification of burlaps, for they are the raw material of the bagmaker, the material out of which he makes bags (an advanced product), and likewise so are the floor-cloth foundations out of which are made the floor cloths of universal use. American jute industries. — Under the stimulus of a highly protective tariff' some jute mills were established in this country. Every consid- eration has been given them, and these jute mills had developed with a 20 per cent duty on jute, at the last revision they were accorded their raw material free. While all are as one in that juto is rightly ou the JUTE, ETC. 803 free list, what protection was given as an inducement to press the manufacture of burlaps here will be readily seen by comparing the specific duty on burlaps 1| cents a pound, with the average price in Calcutta on the jute out of which burlaps are made, and for 1892-'93 this is just under 2| cents (2.23). Still no burlap industry was hatched out, and the mills consuming jute have kept on what they had been running upon previously. These mills may be divided into two classes : (1) Those making cotton bagging used to bale cotton, whose output is large. Cotton bagging is entirely different from burlap, and any tariff provision for one has no bearing whatever on the other. (2) Then there are several small mills that make jute twines, etc., and one that has run for some ten years on one width of floor-cloth foundation. Attempts to make burlaps (and bags) have failed signally, and now is restricted to a trivial production of convict labor in the prisons on the Pacific coast. There is no distinctively burlap mill in these United States, and not a dollar of capital committed to their manufacture. Should burlaps be free? If not, why not? Under the American idea of i)rotection no reason exists, as the retention of an excessive duty protects no American caj)ita], beUeflts no American labor. Even a prohibitive tariff would not create a self-contained industry, because the raw material must be imported. Tariff for revenue. — The importance of tariff for revenue is fully rec- ognized. To my mind such revenue is properly levied on luxuries as far as practicable, and certainly should not increase the cost of living of the working class. If there were hundreds of mill hands whose wages came from the manufacture of burlaps, it would be a question to be decided upon the broad ground of political economy and the ultimate beneficial result. Now, not a single operative would be thrown out of work by placing burlaps upon the free list. On the contrary, the remission of the duty would set free the equivalent, well, for our example, say 500,000 bar- rels of flour. The remission of the duty has a direct bearing upon such general nationaF industries, that it would cheapen their frice to the consumer per force. N"ow, what are the products that would costless if burlaps were free? IvTot a single luxury, but grain would be cheaper, salt, sugar, and other food products, and everything that is wrapped for transportation would be lessened at first cost. While the farmer must reap the greater immediate benefit, the sav- ing would eventually rest with the consumer. The cheapening of the fertilizer bags necessary to renew cotton lands would appear in lower cost goods, and to my mind in no particular instance does the tarifl' cry out for revision more than on burlaps. It is hard to stand alone in my honest belief and firm conviction, but it is where I have stood for years. I fail to see under any broad guage the- ory of protection even, wliy burlajjs should pay a duty. I fail to see why national industries should be taxed to protect no American capi- tal, to bring hardship to the classes to whom the cheapening of food means a great deal, to handicap our foreign business even with the slight toll of a duty on the wrai)per. A moment's reflection on the far-reaching good that would accrue to the industries peculiartoour country froui doing away with the hardship of this most unnecessary duty, I am convinced, will lead you to realize liow important a work can be done at this time by a proper readjust- ment of the duty, or better still its entire abolition. Permit we, sir, to trespass oo your time a little further for coHgidera- 804 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP, tioii and deeper probing into this question ; I will confine myself strictly to burlaps. The use of hurlaps.—ln 1879 there were imported into the United States some 55,000,000 yards of burlaps; importations this year will be close to 200,000,000 yards; these burlaps are a necessity, the pur- poses for which they are used and enumerated above, are natural indus- tries. The movement of our crops, our domestic goods, our furniture, are not limited to this country, but we are reaching out to other lands, and every little that goes to help such pioneer woik, goes to establish our country upon a permanently solid foundation. Objections to revision. — Strong influences are at work to perpetuate the needless imposition of this unjust tax on burlaps. There are those who say free burlaps will displace the use of certain cotton goods. If a cheaper package made of jute will do the work of a costlier package made of cotton, it takes no great knowledge of political economy to sum the verdict. There are uses enough for cotton, and this objection seems to me too trivial to consider, but that it has been made. It is held that there are hundreds of poor people earning their living mak- ing bags ; if there are hundreds of thousands of equally poor people contributing unduly to their support, the good of the many should si- lence the objection of the few, although this objection does not state the case fairly, for the toll is not paid by the many to keep the few in work, but the evil harks back to an antiquated war tax. The labor employed in making bags is of ordinary intelligence, shifting readily on and off the work, and the pay itself is little, if any more than could be got elsewhere. For my own part I believe the demand for various sizes of bags would center enough of the trade here to keep aU busily employed even if the duty were removed, and the greater demand con- sequent on cheaper bags would stimulate bag making. Therefore to this objection that free burlaps would open the door for an increased competition by foreign bag houses, my only answer is that if the co- lossal protection bag making has had for years has failed to attract foreign competition, the removal of a heavy protection would seem to remove any possible inducement. I have no fear lest the American merchant can hold his own; and if he can not, it is time he gave way to those who can serve his country better. Mistalcen reasons against revision. — There are honest doubters who dread revision from what seem to me mistaken reasons. Such fears lest reducing or removing the duty on burlaips would lower the bars on other manufactured goods. My own belief is that in the press of greater industries and the consideration of what have appeared more impor- taTit branches of business precisely what the tax on burlaps means has failed of such presentation as to be understood. On the weightier mat- ters others will speak, and yet I earnestly beg for a little patience with burlaps. With every consideration for those who honestly differ with me in fundamental principles, I mirst protest against such a warping of equity so far as burlaps are concerned. All raw materials are equally open to exile on this score. Many high protectionists have cordially agreed with me in the eminent justice of having burlaps free, but have been unable to clear this hurdle. If it be necessary to leave a high tariff to protect the laborer in his hire, surely let us help him further by cheajiening the necessities of his charmed existence. Other earnest protectionists fear that any. change in the duty would be followed by an immediate and permanent rise in the foreign value that would nul- lify the duty removed. There might be some ground for such conten- tion if the United States had to buy their burlaps in one market, or if JUTE, ETC. 805 what they took more than offset what was required elsewhere, makiug them the oue great buyer. While we must import our burlaps, pro tected or free, several markets are opeu to us, aud although the Amer- ican trade is keenly competed for, and is a great factor, it is only a fac- tor among other factors, for we do not use more than 20 to 30 per cent of the burlai)s produced. Perhaps eaough has been said to temper the force of these several objections. Bag mailing. — The capital invested in the bag business fairly com- pares with thaic utilized in the jute industries, and the time has come when it deserves recognition, especially as with their raw material free, that is, free burlaps, a national good would result to the many indus- tries that would be directly benefitted. A slight duty might be left on • bags, sufficient to protect the labor employed in their manufacture, a mere one-fourth cent a pound would amply cover this; as a bag maker, I do not think that the removal of this duty would ruin my business, and if it did ruin it, it is a business that has run long enough, and has courted ruin. I fail to see Avhy what benefits my country, and Avill benefit my customers, must not ultimately be a benefit to myself.- If it does not, the individual must give way. What the reduction suggested would mean to the Pacific Coast may be judged from the annual use there of from 30,000,000 to 40,000,000 cental bags to carry wheat and burlap abroad. The larger portion of this large quantity is imported from Calcutta. The cental bag weighs three-fourths pound, and, with a 2 cents per pound duty on bags, the duty per bag is IJ cents. If burlaps are put on free list, with one-fourth or three-eighths cent per pound duty on foreign-made bags, the bag makers would be protected, and the saving to the American shipper of (one-fourth cent per pound equal three-sixteenths cent per bag ; 2 cents per pound equal 1 J cents per bag for duty), say, 1^ cents per bag, carries its own argument. A revision fully justified. — Wecomeback, then, to the needof a revision in the duty, and are face to face with the needless hardship of any duty whatever. Wo return to the ad valorem leech. — While the American people suffer greatly from duty, and while it does not protect American capital, the bur- lap business is largely turned into the hands of foreign houses who have representatives here. It is not surprising that, at this time, when the tarifi' is again under revision, that these foreign houses should be anxious to have the specific duty changed to ad valorem duty. This you know is the position taken by some who have appeared before your honorable committee. Great as the risk of fraud is, I do not question the motive which has prompted this move. Highly reputable firms have strongly recommended this course. I will content myself with simply calling attention to what it means quite apart from any possibility of fraud. The foreign houses set their valuation upon the goods "consigned" them, and Mhile this maybe checked up by an intelligent consul and made to accord with the market value, how is it when the market suddenly goes off"? If the American consumers prefer to import their burlaps, and, with the foreign houses, are under contract for goods when the market breaks, the American who is obliged to pay duty upon the cost of his goods pays a duty upon a higher value than the foreign house, who quickly adjust themselves to the altered status, and have no scruples in doing so. Every market has its ups and downs, and on every down turn of the market the for- eign houses are actually benefitted and the American actually injured. The conflict between the relative merits of a specific and ad valorem duty could best bererhoved by putting burlaps upon the free list, where I hope they will be ijlaced. 806 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. Xeed of immediate action. — I honestly believe the demand for free burlai)s is considered upon its merits, that the simple facts will carry conviction with every member of your honorable committee. Why ngt right the injustice of a tax that has not a sound leg to stand on, and thus benefit our common country? I urgently plead ftr free burlaps. I am content to leave other jute goods with the retention of such tax as may seem lit and proper, and while ready to gladly accept the removal of duty thereon would not antagonize the more important qiies- tion, my earnest contention for free burlaps. It seems that cotton is a crop of sufilcient importance to be rid of the handicap of heavily taxed baling (cotton) bagging. I question the wisdom of other portions of the jute schedule, and have no spasm at the thought of free burlap bags. Yet taking off the duty on burlaps of 1| cents a pound and reducing the du ty on bags If cents a pound would win my hearty indorsement and my cordial support. Such a A-ery slight duty on the advanced manufacture (bags) would recognize the theory that the more advanced manufacture, as involving more labor, should pay a higher duty to protect the factor of wages for labor. This one-fourth cent a pound on bags would amply protect the Ameri- can laborer in his wages, in the opinion of a very well known and quite pronounced high tariff man, Mr. J. M. Bemis. As I understand Mr. Bemis, who has appeared before your honor- able committee, he would accept free burlaps if this protection was left upon his bag industry. As he stands as a representative protectionist the statement is worthy of careful weighing, and his acquiesence would I)robably carry with the other bag houses who have opposed the redit(3- tion of the duty on burlaps. Resume. — I would respectfully recommend that in any revision of the tariff buiiaps be placed upon the free list, because the highest sort of protection with free raw material has failed to develop their manufac- ture here; because placing them on the free list would not adversely affect any American industry or injure any American capital; because they are a necessity, not a luxury; because their use is essential to established industries that are national; because on the free list the agricultural interest would be greatly benefitted ; because the cost of living would be cheapened. For these and other cogent reasons, I respectfully recommend that burlaps be placed upon the free list. I am, sir, very respectfully your obedient servant, Wm. L. Chase. Of H. & L. Chase, Boston; H. & L. Chase, St. Louis; M. I. Neahr & Co., Chicago, bag makers; Kansas City Bag, Kansas City; Victoria Mills, Xewburyport, making bag goods. lilNEK AISTT) JUT13. (.Schedule .).) STATEMENT OF ME. H. D. COOPEB, OF NEW YORK CITY, REPEESENTING THE LINEN AND THE JUTE TRADE. Friday, September 15, 1893. Mr. Chairman : I would say that most of the committee who are here are merchants and dealers in linens, and that they also deal in fabrics, both linen and jute, which ajjpear in schedule J. I have pre- LINEN AND JUTE. 807 pared a statement in regard to Jute. I believe that my ideas coincide with the gentlemen who have appeared on this question. Mr. Cooper read the following paper : To the Honorable Ways and Means Committee : I wish to luake a few short statements in as few worrTs as possible bearing prinri- pally on the tarilf on j ute and its mannf ac tures, as contained in schedule , J of the act of 1890. We believe in the principle of tariff for revenue, which ooiucides with one of the principles of the Democratic party. We are willing to contribute to that most impor- tant necessity — revenue — and see no reason why the goods in which we are inter- ested should not bear their fair proportion. We do not believe in unequal taxation. It was a protest against unequal taxation which called this country into being. Any article which is exempted from taxation puts a heavier burden upon some other article or group, and is manifestly an unfair and unequal distribution. Burlaps, a manufacture t)f jute, were imported into this country during the iiscal year ending June 30, 1892, the value amounting to $6,902,031. The duty on these goods collected was $1,971,651, a very important contribution to the revenues of the country. The average rate of duty was 28.57 per cent ad valorem. We believe in an ad valorem duty, as a specific duty on these goods, levied on the weight of the man- ufactured article, burlaps and bagging, produced considerable trouble and delay at the port of New York. As your committee is well aware, the enormous business of the port is congested because of lack of dock room and water-front facilities. Ves- sels are often compelled to cease unloading until the docks are cleared. This brings the shipping away trom the docks very often to a standstill, and this trouble is aggravated by detention on the docks until merchandise which it is necessary to weigh has been weighed by the Government officials. The weights are occasionally matters of dispute, and it is always uncertain, to some extent, what the duty on these articles will amount in consequence. An ad valorem duty is more easily collected. There are few people engaged in the business of importing burlaps, and they are closely watched one by the other, so that should there be .a disposition to take advantage of improper invoicing it is not possible to carry it through; and in fact the history of tMs business proves that underinvoicing is impossible, as the prices are easily determined and are public abroad and are cabled here for quotation. We protest against the duty on packing on imported merchandise as an unnecessary Ijurden on the consumer. In all previous bills, where burlaps and bagging have paid a duty, an ad valorem duty has been charged. In the law previous to the one of 1890 there was a duty on jute butts and jute, and we are of the opinion that on the prin- ciple of tariff for revenue there is no good reason why these articles should be exempt from contributing their fair share to the revenues of the country. It is an impor- tant matter that any tariff bill should be as simple as possible, and should offer as few opportunities as possible for dishonest importers to evade the law to the detri- ment of the Government and honest importers alike. On this account we beg to suggest duties on the following lines. The wording is as careful as possible and as simple, in order that all doubts may be set aside at the outset, and that every importer and every collecting officer may have the facts clearly at his control fi;om the outset. We would suggest the following duties: Per cent ad valorem. Joite butts 5 Jute 10 Binding twines, composed in whole or part of istle or Tampico fiber, mauila, sisal grass, or sunn „ 10 Yarn made of jute 15 Twines made of jute 20 Burlaps, bagging, and all woven fabric except such as may be suitable for bag- ging for cotton, composed of jute or hemp, of which jute or hemp, or either of them, shall he component material of chief value 25 Bagging for cotton and gunny cloth, composed of jute, or hemp, or jute butts. . . 15 Bags for grain made of burlap and all other bags made of jute, jute butts, or hemp, including gunny bags 35 All manufactures of jute or hemp, or of which jute or hemp is a component ma- terial of chief value, not otherwise provided for 25 H. D. Cooper, Hepresenting the Linen and Jute Trade Association of New York Citij. Mr. ■Cooper. I want to state that the gentlemen who have appeared here prefer to have one-half the present duty levied, and prefer 2.5 per <'ent should be levied on the article. We are being requested by the 808 PLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. steamship lines to remove our goods from the docks, and we have to wait, subjecting us t« considerable delay and annoyance. In my experience in this business I know but one attempt at under- valuation, and the matter became so public that all the other importers were constantly watching others, and it would be very difficult for an irregularity to creex) in. Whenever a nevr law is put into effect it requires a number of Treas- ury decisions before we find out where we stand. We would like to be protected against this man who wells his goods; therefore, I have drawn up a part of the schedule, which is very simple. DRESSED FLAX. (Paragraph 358.) Saturday, September 9, 1893. STATEMEirr OF JOHN WIISOII, FLAX-DEESSEE, OF NEWAEK, N. J. Mr. Chairman : I am here in behalf of the flax-dressers to ask your honorable committee to retain the present duty upon dressed flax at 3 cents a pound. One of the reasons why we ask it is that it takes 3,200 pounds of raw flax to make one ton of dressed flax. Necessarilyj the American manufactui-er will have to pay $32 for that ton of dressed flax which he uses, and not $20, as some suppose. Flax always loses so much in fhe dressing. The Chairman. He would have to pay $32 tariff upon the raw flax? Mr. Wilson. Yes, sir; to produce one ton of dressed flax. Theimporter pays $60 a ton. As an actual fact there is only a difference of that between here and Great Britain. I speak of Great Britain because Great Britain pays the highest wages paid in the world, excepting this country There is only $28 actual protection duty to labor, instead of $00. There is where the mistake is made. I know it has occurred time after time. The cost of dressing a ton of flax in this country at 60 pounds per day ' for one man is $2 on an average. My wages are $13 a week. There are men who are paid less, but the average wages in this country are $2 a day for dressing 60 pounds; and therefore the cost of dressing a ton of flax is $66.66, and the cost of dressing a ton of flax in Great Britain is $36.66, which is the highest wages paid abroad. It is only $30 for dressing a ton of flax in Great Britain of 90 cents a day for 60 pounds. That leaves $36.66 for dressing flax as an addition to the wages between this country and Great Britain. The protective duty amounts to $28 to protect us against Great Britain. Of course, I could appeal to France or Germany. In France they pay 60 cents a day for dressing 60 pounds. That is only $10.66 for dressing a ton of flax. We are more skillful in the work and get better wages. We are afraid of Great Britain, because they are more skilled. I have worked in France, and I know what they are paid. I have not had time to get from the Treasury the importations of dressed flax for the last year; but we know this, that the bother about the tariff has caused the American manufacturers to uitroduce dressed flax into his ttrm. The American manufacturer did not do it before, but con- tented himself with fighting the British manufacturer, and treated the ^Working men in a proper manner. He used to buy all his flax here. DRESSED PLAX. ■ 809 but he does not do that now. This is because he now and then buys flax from across the water, certain grades, cheaper and hackles it here. As a result of that, about 100 of us have been thrown of employment. Of course this would not have a great effect if these firms were not offshoots of Great BritaiTi, Mhich are only here for spinNing purposes, and for finishing the dressed flax into thread or linen, as the case may be. They manufacture flax in the firms abroad. I might mention one firm which employs 600 men in the old country and do not emjdoy one man to work flax in this country. They import all their dressed line in a dressed state, and simply spin and finish it here. There are a few other firms also which do that. Of course I only mention one, which is sufficient. In 1891 there were imported 1,696 tons of dressed line. If that had been dressed in this country it would have given employment to 400 men, which, at $2 a day, would be $250,000 in our pockets at the end of the year. At the same time our men are out of work. I know they are, and if that were not so I would not be here today to assure you that we are working short time. Our men have mostly got nothing to do and do not know when they will have. I have tried to state our case. I hope that you will not reduce the duty upon dressed flax. Mr. MoMiLLiN. What is the duty now? Mr. Wilson. $60, or 3 cents a pound. Mr. MoMiLLiN. ATid the difference between the wages in this coun- try and the wages abroad is $36 1 Mr. Wilson. Yes, sir. Mr. McMiLLiN. Then there is $24 more than the entire wages paid 1 Mr. Wilson. The protection is $28. Mr. MeMiLLiN. $28 more than the entire diflfereace? Mr. Wilson. No; you are making a mistake. It takes 3,200 pounds of raw flax, and the actual duty is $28. You must bear that iu mind. The difference is $26; you subtract $28 from $36, and that leaves $8 that the duty falls short of protecting our labor. Have I made myself understood? Mr. Payne. Are you a workingmau yourself? Mr. Wilson. Certainly. Mr. Payne. I see the Mills biU made flax free, that is; flax straw not hackled or dressed, and put a duty of $10 a tou on dressed Hue. How would that aflect you laboring men? Mr. Wilson. It would wipe us clean out; we could not get work at all. Mr. McMiLLiN. You say your principal competition is from England, although England pays higher wages than any other country abroad? Mr. Wilson. Yes, sir; but I want you to understand that we are not afraid of the workingmen of Germany or France, because they are not skilled. If we were not skilled we would not get the wages we do get. There is not a Frenchman or a German hackling flax to-day in America. Mr. Taesney. With the raw material placed on the free list and a duty of $10 on the manufactured article, that would give you $42 a ton advantage. Mr. Wilson. How could it, when $36 represents the difference iu wages? How could $10 a ton compensate us for $36? Mr. Tarsney. The duty is $36 a ton on raw flax. They pay $32 a ton on the flax which they produce to make one ton of dressed flax. This $10 a ton protection would be equivalent to «42 a ton on the dressed flax. 810 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP Mr. Wilson. No, sir. Mr. Tabsnbt. If you take off $33, that will leave you #10 agaiust the luauufacmred product of the foreign imiiortcr. Mr. Wilson. How can that be"? Mr. Taksney. I do not know how it is not. You get flax now imported for $33. Mr. Wilson. The manufacturer pays that. Mr. Taksney. If this were taken off it would relieve you to the extent of $33, would it not? Mr. Wilson. It would not relieve us. Mr. Taksney. Who would it relieve? Is not that now a burden upon somebody of $32? Mr. Wilson (after a pause). I can not see the drift of your argument. Mr. Taksney. Somebody now pays $32. Mr. Wilson. Hold now till I gather my wits together and perhaps I may be able to answer you. Of course I am at a disadvantage with you gentlemen. Mr. Taksney. Let me put it in this way Mr. Wilson. No, no; I understand your question, and that is what I want. It is plain to me at the present time, but the answer is not plain to me. Mr. Taksney. If there were no tariff duties at all to protect you against this cheap labor of Europe, and we put a 10 percent tariff on the manufactured article, you would have an advantage, would you not? , Mr. Wilson. That is common sense; you take the word out of my mouth. Mr. Taksney. But you have got $60 a ton protection against the manufacturer; but you have to pay $32 on the raw material, and if you take that oft' it leaves $60 a ton to $10 for that advantage. Mr. Wilson. I thank you for that, because it gives me time to collect my wits. Mr. Taksney. I think they are pretty well collected. Mr. Wilson. You separate the $60 per ton on dressed flax from raw flax. Mr. Taksney. Talking that tax off the raw material, how much addi- tional comi)ensation would you need to make up the dift'erence in the wages of labor? Mr. Wilson. It would bring $36 a ton upon the flax. Mr. Taksney. That is the entire labor cost? Mr. Wilson. The difference is $36. Mr. Taksney. Is the cost of production over $60 in labor? Mr. Wilson. It is $66.66 in labor. Mr. Taksney. What does a ton of flax sell for after it is manufac- tured? Mr. Wilson. Some flax sells for 18 cents a pound and some for $1 a pound. For instance, the flax that we spin into linen for weaving your shirt or collar, we make the thread so close, would cost 75 cents to $1 a pound, and there is a class of flax used for sewing shoes which would only cost about 15 cents a pound. Mr. Taksney. Then the manufactured flax which you have described sells on the market at $75 a ton? Mr. Wilson. That is the very dearest. Mr. Taksney. And you pay $32 a ton to bring in the raM- material? Mr. Wilson. To produce a ton. Mr. MoMiLLiN. You are a laboring man in this industry? Mr. Wilson. Yes, sir. DRESSED FLAX. 811 Mr. McMiLLiN. Ill 1883 the ditty was $40 a ton? Mr. Wilson. Yes, sir. Mr. McMiLLiN. Under the act of 1890 the duty was raised to $67.20 per ton. Mr. Wilson. A ton of 2,240 pounds. Mr. McMiLLiN. There was 50 per cent added to the original tariff— or more than that? Mr. Wilson. No, sir ; it was only one-third. Mr. MoMiLLiN. This is more than half of the original tax, which makes a third of the whole tax. When that was done, were your wages raised one-half"? Mr. Wilson. Undoubtedly not. Mr. McMiLLiN. Your wages were not raised any? Mr. Wilson. No, sir. Mr. McMiLLiN. Has there been any reduction in wages ? Mr. Wilson. No, sir. Mr. McMiLLiN. Has it remained where it was? Mr. Wilson. Yes, sir. Mr. MoMillin. When the tariff' was raised from 40 to 67J, there was 'no increase in your wages? Mr. Wilson. No, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Are yon paid by the day or by the pound? Mr. Wilson. By the pound. Mr. Breckinridge. In England are they paid by the day or by the pound? Mr. Wilson. In England they are paid by the pound. Mr. Breckinridge. How much are you paid a pound? Mr. Wilson. Sixty pounds constitutes a day's work. Mr. Breckinridge. You may not work a whole day? Mr. Wilson. Then we are paid according to the number of pounds we do at the end of the week. Mr. Beeokinridgb. How do you class this flax? There are differ- ent classes, and do you get more for one kind than for another? Mr. Wilson. No, sir. We soak the flax. For instance, there is a field of flax that might produce flax which would spin the very finest linen, and also flax that would only be fit for twine. We have to hackle and separate it according to the different grades into which it will spin. Mr. Breckinridge. You get so much for every pound you work, regardless of its class? Mr. Wilson. No, sir. There are some classes which go as low as 35 cents a pound; some classes as low as 45; some as low as 28; some as high as 60; some as high as 80, and some as high as 90 cents and $1. I am taking 60 as the average day's work. Mr. Breckinridge. Will one man in different grades of Avork turn out the same quantity in every class? Mr. Wilson. He will turn out six different sorts upon a table. He has a table or bench, and each bench is numbered, say, 15, 20, 25, 30, and so on up to 200. Some spin as high as 200. Mr. Breckinridge. So when you get a bundle of undressed flax, and separate the work, you will turn out six different sets of completed flax? Mr. Wilson. Of dressed flax. Mr. Breckinridge. Are you paid the same rates per ton for each one of these classes? Mr. Wilson. Yes, sir; we are supposed to earn $2 a day. I mean 812 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. to say this, that men must have 35 pounds a day and gets $2. And the man who has 100 pounds and gets $2 Mr. Beecktnrii>ge. You do not understand me. You turn out six different classes of this woris:; Let us assume that there are 10 pounds in each. We will call them numbers 1 to 6 in each class. Do you get the same price per pound for No. 1 as for ]S"o. 2, the same for No. 2 as for No. 3, and the same for No. 3 as for No. 4, etc.? Mr. Wilson. Yes, sir; a pound is a pound. Mr. Breckinridge. You get the same for one pound as for any other? Mr. Wilson. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. How much do you get for a pound? Mr. Wilson. Thirty-three cents and a fraction. Mr. Breckinridge. How much do they get for apoundin England? Would they get one sixtieth of 90 cents, or would they get one-tenth of 90 cents? Mr. Wilson. They get one-tenth. Mr. Breckinkid(>e. Y"ou state that you have had experience and that you have worked in France? Mr. Wilson. Y'es, sir; but I made less. Mr. Breckinridge. And your cost of living was correspondingly less? Mr. Wilson. Yes, sir. Mr. McMiLLiN. What time are you working now, and has there been any reduction in the working time? Mr. Wilson. We are reduced ten hours per week. We stop at 5 o'clock every night, and are off all day Saturday. Mr. Dalzell. W^hen did that go into effect? Mr. Wilson. Wednesday week. Mr. Dalzell. That is a recent reduction of time? Mr. Wilson. Certainly. Mr. Dalzell. It happened since this depression in business began? Mr. Wilson. Yes, sir. Mr. MoMiLLiN. Is that the first reduction of time you have had? Mr. Wilson.' Yes, .sir; it came with this depression. Mr. Gear. Do they work the same hours in England? Mr. Wilson. We work less. We work flfty-tlve, and in England they work fifty-eight. Mr. Gear. How is it in France? Mr. Wilson. In France the week is sixty hours. DRESSED FLAX. (Paragraph 3.^8.) Paterson, N. J., September 8, 1893. Sir : Having in view the revision of the present tariff laws now under your consideration, we, the undersigned, engaged in the occupation of flax dressing or hackling, beg respectfully "to submit to your consider- ation our condition under the tariii' laws as they now stand. Ninety per cent of the flax used in this country for the production of linen goods, tailors' and shoe threads, and fine twines is dressed or hackled in Ikirope, every pound of which would be hackled here, attbrding employment to thousands of hands, if we had the protection of 20 per BUKLAPS. 813 cent, or 5S160 per ton, instead of the present rate of $60 per ton, or 7i per cent, as this grade of flax at present is worth $800 per ton. From our knowledge of the business and the article required to make the same we assert, without fear of successful contradiction, that this article can not be raised in this country, and should come in free of duty in the' raw state, or unhackled. The only imported flax that comx)etes with the American article comes from the Baltic states. We therefore resi^ectfully submit tlmt the only duty of any service to us is the duty of 20 per cent. As a proof of this all the European annexes in this country get their flax hackled on the other side, thereby giving them a double advantage of the native firms. As a proof of this we refer you to Henluyson's, of Grafton, Mass., who do not employ a single hand on this side and employ thousands on the other side, in Johnston, Scotland. This firm takes the position that tow is of no use to them, and that they have no machinery to work the same, and, therefore, it is utterly useless. There never was a greater untruth uttered ; there is no article in the flax line in such demand; there is 40 per cent of all the carpet yarns of the country made from flax tow, and a greater percentage woTild be used if the article could be had. Therefore, as the representatives of the flax and linen industries of the country, we respectfully request you to put at least $20 a ton on tow and $160 a ton on hackled flax. Your attention to above will ever be gratefully I'emembered by your humble petitioners. . John Stephen, William Ma&uire, James Gribbin, William Bridges, George McKerlet, Committee. BURLAPS. (Paragraph S64.) 2^EW York, September 20, 1893. Sirs : I have been interested as an importer and dealer in bags, bag- ging, burlaps, and jute goods for the past nine years. I beg to submit as follows : Burlaps. — In rough figures, there are about 50,000 bales of burlap imported into this country every year, and practically not a yard man- ufactured here, although we have free raw jute, for the reasons that we have not the machinery here for manufacturing it, although undoubt- edly machinery would be brought here if manufacturers were put in a position to make some money, and the difference in the price of labor adjusted in this country and in Dundee or Calcutta, where the majority of the goods is manufactured. The present duty on the majority of burlap is If cents per pound. Unless this duty is increased to somewhere in the neighborhood of 2J^ to 24 cents per pound it will be impossible under the present prices of labor here to compete against the manufacturers abroad. If the duty were increased to th^it simount it would be a question of only a few years before there would be employment given here to 100,000 people making- burlap; provided, of course, that the raw material were still 814 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP, allowed to come free. This is the only benefit that could result from any increased duty. On the other hand, as the duty is at present it is merely a tax on the consumer of the goods, -which makes him as economical as possible when using the same. If the duty were taken off entirely or reduced it would not hurt the manufacturers in this country, as there are none, and would beneiit the consumer by reducing the prices of the burlap and the millions of bags which are now made from it, and would possi- bly in a slight way also reduce the prices for flour, grain, coffee, etc., which are packed in the bags. As an estimate I should say possibly one-half to three-fourths cent per bushel on grain, if there were no duty on burlap, from which bags are made. If the duty therefore is not increased to a point to enable goods to be manufactured in this country, I beg to give it as my opinion that the interests of all concerned would be benefited by reducing the duty or abolishing it entirely. New hags. — There are imported into the United States yearly prob- ably 40,000,000 to 50,000,000 new bags. The major part of them go to the Pacific coast and come from Calcutta. The general number imported there is 30,000,000 yearly. Tliese bags compete with our own local man- ufacture, although they pay 2 cents per pound duty, and our manufac- turers are kept from making them by the fact that this duty is not enough as long as there is a duty on the burlap of If cents per i)ound. We should have the making of these bags, and the only way that we can get it is by taking off' the entire duty on burlap or the greater part of it, as above spoken of, or if the duty on burlap is left as it is to increase the duty on new bags. I would be in favor of leaving the duty on new bags as it is and tak- ing the duty off the burlap. iSecond-hand hags. — In the neighborhood of 50,000,000 second-hand bags of all kinds are imported into the United States from foreign countries every year. Some of these bags are admitted free of duty under certain regulations prescribed by the Secretary of the Treasury. Others are admitted free upon refunding to the Government the amount of drawback which was allowed on them, at the time they were exported, the drawback consisting of the major part of the duty, which the for- eign material from which these bags were made had paid to the United States when it was imported, and the balance pay a duty of 2 cents per pound. The Government has been largely cheated out of duties, to the extent of $100,000 or $200,000 per year at least, for many years, through the evasion or carelessness of importers and officials, by not having the I)roper means of recording the drawbacks paid, and the inability to distinguish between certain grades of bags, to the annoyance of many honorable imj)orters and the enriching of a few; and altogether the present method of admitting second-hand bags in these various ways is very unsatisfactory. Kow, I have endeavored to imjiress upon the custom-house oificials, the custom-house investigating committee, and every one with whom I have come in contact this fact, that to my mind the proper thing for us to do was to make all of our bags in America, and I strongly advocate the entire abolishment of any laws or regulations permitting any kind of second-] I and bags, no matter wliether they werf originally exported from this country or not, to come back here free of duty, and the plac- ing (»)■ a duty u|' cvcT! more thm 3 cents per pound, say, 2^ cents per, ' BURLAPS. 815 pound on every second-hand bag that comes here, with a view of keep- in g th em out en tirely . If this were done it would be necessary to make perhaps 40,000,000 of these bags in the United States yearly, and this would give employ- ment to a vast number of people and be' of bene^t to the industry all the way through ; and it is very easy to be seen that there are in the present method of admitting second-hand bags, in various ways, loop holes for a further continuance of " mistakes," which it will be almost impossible to avoid. To sum up, if the duty on new burlap "is reduced to a very low figure or taken oif entirely, and the duty on new bags or second-hand bags is either kept as it is at present or increased, the result will be that everybody using the goods will be pleased, and we wUl manufacture the majority of our new and second hand bags here ourselves, and the industry would be greatly benefited all around, and thousands more of people will be given employment. In other words, as burlap, not being manufactured here at present, is practically to us a raw mate- rial, let us have that raw material free. Very respectfully, James Ross Collins. BURLAPS. Burlaps (jute cloth for grain bags, flour bags, etc., also for packing purposes and floor oilcloth fovmdations) is an article that might be placed on the free list, because it is not manufactured here. The aboli- tion of duty on same would hurt no established industry, but would reduce the cost to consumers — agriculturists, ete. The present duty on burlaps is therefor a tax unnecessary, and therefore, as President Cleveland has well said, "unjust taxation." Enormous quantities of burlaps are used in making bags for the grain crops of California, Washington, and Oregon. The goods are imjjorted from India direct to San Francisco. I am not able to supply statistics of the Pacific "coast importations, but I know the quantity of burlap bags used there is very large. Calcutta, India, and Dundee, Scotland, are the two great centers where burlaps are manufactured, and from whence imported into this country. In the Eastern, Southern, Middle, find Northwestern States enormous quantities of burlaps are used for grain bags, peanut bags, ore and phosphate bags, flour bags, etc., and for floor oilcloth foundations. The importations last year from Great Britain and India (not including shipments from India to the Pacific coast), amounted to 167,640,029 yards, and during 1891 they amounted to 190,066,400 yards. I have stated that no burlaps are made in this country. That is not absolutely correct, for there is one concern, the Chelsea mill, Brooklyn, makes a small quantity of one width of burlaps for floor oilcloth ; it is but a very small quantity, however, so small that it could not fully sup- ply the wants of a single floor-cloth factory of any extent. I under- stand the principal productions of the Chelsea mill are jute or hemji carpets and binders' twine. In imported burlaps there axe about twenty different widths and about twenty different weights. The Chelsea mill has been making that one grade of burlaps for fully ten years; it has not made any other grade of burlaps, nor have other fac- tories been started to make sucli goods, because, I believCj they cau UOt pompete with the cheap labor of India and Scotland. 816 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. In California I understand a very small quantity of jute is manufac- tured into burlap at some of the jails, but the quantity produced there and by the Chelsea mill here is so infinitely small compared with the quantity imported that we may truthfully say burlap manufacture is not an established industry here, and not likely ever to be developed. As burlap is a necessary article for transporting grain, produce, and packing purposes, it therefore seems unnecessary and unjust to impose a diity (tax) on same. Competition and rivalry is so keen among bur- lap sellers here, and also bag manufacturers and floor oilcloth manu- facturers, that if the duty was removed the reduced cost would be promptly given to the consumers, for it is they who eventually pay the duty. Most of the floor-cloth manufacturers import their burlap (a raw material for them) direct from Dundee, and pay 40 jjer cent duty on same. The amount they pay to United States for duty, floor oilcloth manufacturers charge their customers, say, for instance,. Marshall Field & Co., who in turn charge the jobbers and retail sellers, and they in turn charge the consumers. If that duty of 40 per cent was removed the householder who uses oilcloth would save the amount of duty (tax). In the McKinley bill, as it passed the House and as reported by the Senate Finance Committee, the rates of duty on burlaps were as fol- lows: "Burlaps, not exceeding 60 inches in width, 1| cents per pound; exceeding 60 inches in width, 2 cents per pound." But, on the 4th of September, 1890, Senator Aldrich moved to strike out the words " exceeding 60 inches in width, 2 cents per pound." At first glance that seems to indicate that the duty on all burlaps would be If cents per pound (equal to about 30 per cent ad valorem, 2 cents per pound was equal to about 35 per cent ad valorem), and no doubt most of the Sen- ators thought so when they agreed to it, as certainly most burlap importers and floor-cloth manufacturers thought when they heard with pleasiare of the change. It was a piece of sharpness and deceit, how- ever, for, after itwas passed, wediscovered that as no duty was specially provided for burlaps exceeding 60 inches in width, they had to come in under paragraph 356, at 40 per cent ad valorem, equal to fully 2J cents per pound. I know of floor oilcloth manufacturers who were so deceived that when their attention was drawn to it they would not believe it until, in answer to their telegram to Washington, their Eepresentative confirmed it. They were very much surprised and disgusted, but being loyal Eepublicans they kept quiet. In addressing this communication to your committee I express only my individual opinion for your consideration in regard to duty on bur- laps. That article is practically a raw material to floor oilcloth manu- facturers and bag manufacturers; they certainly can not get domestic goods for their trade, and have to import and pay duty on the article of burlaps. There are numerous bag factories for manufacturing bags (from imported burlaps) all over this country, also many large and important floor oilcloth factories. These two industries, therefore, should be protected by a certain amount of duty on the articles they turn out, viz : Bags and floor oilcloths, but burlaps, if placed on the free list, would be welcomed with delight by all consumers. Yours, respectfully, Wm. B. Cunningham. New York, August 30, 1803, BURLAPS. 817 BURLAPS. (Parngraph 864.) SiE : Since I sent yon my statement I liave obtained some information about California importations of jute goods. The annual importations by California are reported as follows, viz., about 30,000,000 burlap bags, and burlaj) cloth equal to about 3,000,000 bags from Calcutta. I notice from published reports of hearings that no one has asked for any advance in burlap duties, but those who have appeared before your committee have asked for reductions, viz, Messrs. Bemis, Biddle, and Cooper. The floor oilcloth manufacturers I notice asked for an increase of duty on cheap oilcloths because the present duty does not aftbrd them enough protection against shipments of cheap oilcloths from foreign manufacturers. The foreign oilcloths are made on free burlaps, whereas American oilcloth manufacturers have to pay 40 per cent duty on their burlaps. If that duty was aboHshed or largely reduced it would be equal to so much additional saving (i^rotection) to American manu- facturers of floor oilcloths that they would not need any increase of present tariff' on floor oilcloths, to protect them. With free burlaps and present tariff" on floor oilclotlis, it seems to me American oilcloth manufacturers would be amply protected. Yours, respectfully, Wm. B. Cunningham. BURLAPS. (Paragraph 361.) 233 State Street, Boston, September 16, 1893. Sir: Permit me to say that any urgency comes from the simple fact that the duty on burlaps is • excessive, a needless hardship, and only exists as- a tribute to the American idea of protection — that, although a large manufacturer, I recognize thatthe needs of the nation properly take precedence of a personal interest; that I fail to see why what benefits the whole country and those who do business with me should not be for my ultimate good — while, if my personal intereijts are subservient to the good of the many, I am enough of an American to feel they should not handicap other and greater interests. The gravest misconception exists about burlaps, and heretofore the party in power has quite failed to grasp the equities in the case. At this time, therefore, I have a natural desire to have the question decided upon its merits. Truly, yours, Wm. L. Chase. T H 52 818 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. BURLAPS. (Paragraph S64.) Califoknia Cotton Mills CoMrA?rT, East Oaldand, Gal., September 12, 1893, Sir : It is not Englaud or the other Oontinental nations of Europe we have to fear most as competitors in the United States markets— it is Calcutta. The Coolie labor of India is what we have to fear. Wages there are so low compared with either this country or England, Cal- cutta iute manufactories are gradually driving Great Britain out of the markets of the world in jute products, and to-day Dundee, the great .iute manufaeturing center of Europe, is half idle. Free trade there leaves that coimtry no protection. We have prepared a comparative statement of cost of manufactur- ing jute in this country and in Calcutta, by which you can see the measure of protection we need here to be able to pay reasonable wages. Although an operator in this country can do relatively far more work than an operator in Calcutta on the same class of machines, yet the difference in wages is so great we could not compete here without a large measure of protection. We have based our calculations on 10^ ounce 40-inch burlaps. As this is the leading jute fabric sold in all markets and taken as a basis for all prices and quotations, the cost of all other jute fabrics would be figured in proportion. It will be observed that 142 persons in California will do as much work in ten days as 231 in Calcutta will do in the same time. Still a yard of cloth made in Calcutta can be soldjanded in San Francisco for a fraction over 3 cents a yard, whereas tfie cloth made here will cost nearly 4^ cents. We hope yon will use your influence to do what you can to protect our industry here. We have now been running our mills largely on jute goods for nearly ten years and our profits at the best have never been more than a bare interest on the capital invested. We have never eraployed Chinese. We pay our help as you A^'ill see from the inclosed statement fair wages, and so far the employes are contented but are greatly concerned least the protection we now enjoj' against Calcutta competition should be reduced. Yoiu's, respectfully, W3r.«EUTHERFORD, Suj)ermten(lent California Cotton Mills. Cost of mannfaduring 100,000 yards 10.5-ounce 40-mch hurlaps in California. [To make 100,000 yards 10,\-ounce 40-incll burlaps would require 66,500 pounds of raw juto (SS^tous) and the labor of 142 persons, working 10 days, 10 liours per day.] 33J: tons of raw .iute, at $60 per ton $1, 995. 00 2 "batchers (men), at $2 per day eatli $40. 00 2 softeners, at $1.75 per day each 35. 00 8 f-ardtenders, at $1 per day each 80. 00 12 drawing-franip hands, at $1 per day each 120. 00 2 roving hands, at $1 per day each 20. 00 2 roving helpers, at 75 cents per day each 15. 00 12 spinners, at $1.25 per day cacli 150. 00 12 dolfers, at 60 cents per day each 72. 00 8 spoolers, at $1 per day eacli 80. 00 1 hand sewer, at $1 per day 10. 00 1 oiler, at $1.25 per day . .' 12. 50 2 truck l)oys, at 75 cents per day each 15. 00 3 machinist, at $3 per day , 30.00 1 S])inning foreman, at $.3 ]ier day "0. 00 1 second hand, at $1.50 Jjer day 15.00 BURLAPS. 819 1 -watchman, at $2.25 per day $22.50 9 cop winders, at $1.17 per day each 105. 30 3 beamers, at $2 per day each 60. 00 3 warpers, at $1.25 per day each 37. 50 46 weavers, at $1.25 per day each 575. 00 3 loom fixers, at $2.25 per day each 67. 50 2 finishers, at $2 per day each 40. 00 1 measurer, at $2 per day 20. 00 2 cloth folders, at $2.25 per day each 45. 00 2 packers, at $2.25 per day each , 45. 00 1 stamping and shipping clerk, at $4 per day 40. 00 1 oiler and bell fiistener, at $1.75 per day 17.50 1 foreman weaver, at $3 per day 30.00 $1, 829. 80 Power, oil, taxes, insurance, depreciation of plant and business, expenses, and interest for 10 days .V 420. 00 4, 244. 80 Cost of 100,000 yards in California, $4,244.80; cost per yard, 4.24 cents. Cost of manufacturing 100,000 yards 10.5-ounce 40-inch hurlaps in Calcutta and laying it down in California. [To make 100,000 yards standard 104-ouiice 40-iiich biirl.nps would require 66,500 pounds of jute (33J tons) and labor of 231 operators in Calcutta, working lU da^s and 10 hour.s per day.] Rupees. Rupees. 33i tons raw jute, at 150 rupees per ton 4, 987. 80 4 men batching, at 1 rupee per day 40. 00 4 helpers, at 12 annas per day 30.00 12 card tenders, at 12 annas per day 108. 00 18 drawing-frame hands, at 12 annas per d ay 135. 00 4 rovirig- frame hands, at 12 annas per day 30. 00 20 spinners, at 12 annas per d ay 150. 00 16 doffers, at 8 annas per day 80. 00 12 spoolers, at 12 annas per day 90. 00 12 cop winders, at 12 annas per day 90. 00 2 oilers and band sewers, at 1 rupee per day 20. 00 2 spare hands, at 12 annas per day 15. 00 1 skilled machinist, at 8 rupees per day 80. 00 1 skilled helper, at 2 rupees per day 20. 00 1 overseer spinning, at 8 rupees per day 80. 00 1 skilled helper, at 2 rupees per day 20. 00 1 messenger, at 1 rupee per day 10. 00 4 warp beamers, at 14 annas per day 35. 00 3 warp beamers' helpers, at 12 annas per day 22. 80 90 weavers, at 14 annas per day 780. 80 4 loom fixers, at 1 rupee 2 annas per day 45. 00 3 cloth finishers, at 1 rupee per day 30. 00 2 inspectors and measurers, at 1 rupee per day L'O. 00 3 cloth folders, at 1 rupee per day 30. 00 3 cloth packers, at 1 rupee per day 30. 00 1 oiler, at 1 rupee per day 10. 00 1 band fixer, at 14 annas per day 8. 12 1 skilled machinist, weaver, at 8 rupees per il:iy 80. 00 1 foreman, weaver and finisher, at 8 rupees per day 80. 00 1 second hand, at 4 rupees per day 40. 00 1 bookkeeper, at 6 rupees per day 60. 00 1 pay clerk, at 8 rupees per day 80. 00 1 engineer, at 8 rupees perdav 80.00 2, 429. 20 Power, oil, insurance, taxes, interest, depreciation, repairs, etc., 119 rupees per day 1, 190. 00 Freight, commission, insurance, brokerage, etc, from Calcutta to San Fran- cisco 1,220.00 7, 827. 00 Counting the rupee equal to 31 cents United States money, that would make the total cost of 100,000 yards laid down in San FrancisL'O $3,016.19, or cost per yard, 3,04 cents. 820 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. JUTE AND BURLAPS. (raragraph 364.) Chelsea Jute Mills, Heic Yorl; September 18, 1893. Jute.— The average animal consumption of jute in the United States, according to the report of W. S. Dalaud of January 1, 1893, was, for the years 1890, 1891, and 1892, 136,248 bales. The annual average for the six years previous was 90,690 bales, showing an increase of about 50 per cent. It is practically impossible to get the increased produc- tion of manufactured goods Ixom year to year in this country, but the figures given of the consumption of raw jute show very accurately the total increase in the manufactured products of all kinds when taken for a series of years. Yarns.— From the Dundee trade reports of January 15, 1890, and January 11, 1893, we learn that the average annual exportation of jute yarns from Dundee to the United States for the four years from 1887 to 1890, inclusive, was 13,877,300 pounds, and that the average for the years 1891 and 1892 was 3,429,750 pounds, or a decrease of 9,447,550 pounds per year, which difference has been wholly supplied by the increase of the American output, the consumption of yarns in this country having increased rather than decreased during the past two years. A broker in yarns informed us last week that, quality for qual- ity, yarns were cheaper to-day in this market than ever before in the last twenty-five years, during which time he has been actively engaged in their sale. The in(Tease in the production of the American mills since the pas- sage of the last tariff bill has been due to the fact that raw jute was placed by it on the free list. Before that time the jute-yarn market of the country was Aartually controlled by the Dundee spinners. The former duty of 20 per ceiit on raw jute was of itself a much smaller item than it Avould apijear upon its face, If this duty had been levied on 16,000 bales of jute which we ])urchased at different times during the past twelve months it would have averaged less than one-half of a cent per pound, and on some imrchases have been under three-eighths of a cent per pound, so that free raw material to this industry is a saving of a very small j)ercentage of the cost of even the cheapest of its prod- ucts. W'e, therefore, believe we are stating the case conservatively wLen we say that the retention of the present duty on yarn is necessary in order to maintain.the trade which the American mills now hold, and which is given to them by the small saA'ing which was effected by plac- ing jute upon the free list. Carpets. — Jute or "hemp" carpets, as they are sometimes called by the trade, are not extensively manufactured in this country, althougU the demand for the cheaper grades is entirely met by the production of our own mills. We would ask that the present specific duty of C cents per square yard be retained and that it be not changed to an ad valorem rate because the manufacturer is now enabled to know exactly what foreign competition he must meet, and so far it has not worked to the detriment of the consumer, as the prices of jute carpets manufac- tured in this county have steadily declined for the past ten years. ' The repoi't of the chief of the Bureau of Statistics of Foreign Com- ni(nce and Navigation for the year ending June30, 1892, page 798, shows ;ui average ad N'alorem duty of IS. 54 per cent on jute cai'pets under the JUTE AND BURLAPS. 821 present rate of 6 cents i)er square yard. This ad valorem duty of 18.54 per cent is based upon carpets of the higher grades only, upou which much labor is expended, and therefore appears correspondingly small. These are produced, if at all in this country, only to a limited extent and have a very small sale. Burlap. — The extension of the jute industry, if at all, must be in the increased manxrfacture of cloth, as the yarn consumption is practically supplied by our own mills. The natural development of the industry is, first, in the manufacture of yarn, and after that has become efficient the manufacturing of cloth. If it is to be increased so as to supply the wants of our own people we would ask that the present duty of 1| cents per pound on burlap under 60 inches in width be retained. The Bemis Brothers Bag Company, of Boston, who are, perhaps, the largest users of burlap in United States if not in the world, have asked you for a reduction of one-eighth cent per pound. As the same company thought 1| cents fair three years ago we are unable to see why there should be any change in the rate, even to so limited an extent, as the conditions are the same now as then. The present duty of 40 per cent on goods over 60 inches in width we believe is fair, because they are very much more expensive to manufac- ture than the narrow width. For example, one of the machines used in finishing them costs $10,000, and the difference between the duty of 1|- cents per pound on the narrower and 40 per cent ad valorem on the wider is only commensurate with their increased cost. We would call your attention to the fact tliat the percentage of the cost of manufacture of a pound of jute yarn is larger than that in yarns of the same size made out of other products; that is to say, the cost of manufacture of jute yarns to-day worth 6 cents per pound is fully 50 per cent of their value. In flax yarns of the same size, for illustration, the cost of manufacture is not to exceed 33 per cent of their value, and the same rule, we are informed, will apply to cotton yarns. We call your attention to this fact because it is often lost sight of on account of the low selling price of jute products, and people, therefore, are led to believe that the percentage of cost is also correspondingly low. We ask you for the retention of the present duties upon jute prod- ucts for the following reasons : (1) Because of the difference in wages between Dundee, Calcutta, and America. We pay two and one-quarter times as much for making the same product in America as they do in Dundee, and many times as much as is paid in Calcutta. This ratio of wages between the United States and Dundee is taken from the reports of superintendents of different mills in both Dundee and the United States, and fairly repre- sents the difference between the cost of labor for a pound of the same product in both places, as the Scotch worker is in general as efficient as our own, and the quantity of product of a fixed quality is deter- mined by the machine itself, and not by the hand that operates it. (2) The cost of our mills here, so far as we can learn, is more than double what it is in Scotland. We are informed that a mill can there be erected at a cost of from 55 to GO cents per square foot. We know that a modern mill of the best construction and insurance equipment costs twice as much in this country. This increased cost means also greatly increase of taxes, as you know. (3) Because the machinery is not made here and is imported under a large tariff impost. (4) Because the freight rates from Calcutta, which recently have been as low as $3J per ton, and from Dundee are about one-sixth of a cent 822 FLAX, JUTE AlTD HEMP. per pound, afford no protection, as -^^e are obliged to pay a correspond- ing rate upon raw material. (5) Because it is a well known fact to all who are conversant with the jute manufacturing that it has been conducted in this country at a minimum profit on account of both domestic and foreign competition and with an unusually large capital at risk in proportion to the value of the output, so that any lower duties could be balanced only by a reduc- tion of wages. (6) Because the price of jute products has decreased in cost to the consumer during the past three years as a result of home competition, until to-day a tirst-class jute carpet yarn, for illustration, is sold at 6 cents per pound. It is hardly necessary to call your attention to the fact that the tarift' on jute products has not been increased in either of the last two bills. Submitting this statement to your careful and thoughtful considera- tion I remain, in behalf of the Chelsea Jii'hat I fail to satisfy you gentlemen upon orally I will leave with you documents and testimony to prove what I set out in the first instance. Mr. Burrows. -Did you give the name of your colleague? Mr. Preston. No, I did not. He is a merchant; he is not engaged in manufacturing, and he is a man well informed and he kindly gave me the benefit of his experience. Mr. Burrows. I did not know but what you gave his name and I I did not hear it. Mr. Preston. I will give it if it is required. He is a modest man and does not care to appear in this matter. He is friendly with a great many manufacturers of these articles, and he is a man who desires to retain a kindly relation towards them, and he deems it unnecessary to appear before you inasmuch as he has made no application to be heard, and what I have said was simply for the purpose of according to him such portion of merit or whatever there may be in these papers that I did not feel myself justly entitled to. Xow, then, gentlemen, what I set out to show is this, to equalize the duties on imports, to increase the revenue, and bring relief to the people Mr. Dalzell. Are you in this business? Mr. Preston. No, sir; I am a lawyer by profession. Mr. Dalzell. You are not in the business? Mr. Prkston. No, sir; but lawyers can sometimes find out facts from competent witnesses, and when established by documeutary tes- timony they come with as much force Mr. Dalzell. Then you are going to tell us not what you know, but what you gathered from others, is that right? Mr. Preston. Yes, sir; to a certain extent that is right. Mr. Dalzell. Hearsay testimony? Mr. Burrows. Is that article prepared by yourself or by some one else. Mr. Preston. By myself. Mr. Burrows. Who assisted you? Mr. Preston. Nobody. Mr. Burrows. Where did you get your information? Mr. Preston. I got it from papers and books, which I will furnish you, trade papers, etc. Mr. Burrows. I would like to have the name of that silent partner. Mr. Preston. He is Mr. J. Crawford Lyon. OIL CLOTH. 835 Mr. BxJBE.O'WS. His residence? Mr. Preston. Baltimore City, and his place of business is number 6 South street? Mr. Dalzell. Why could he not come here and let us cross-examine him? Mr. Lton. He is here. Mr. Peeston. Kow, as a matter of course many of the members of this committee belong to the same profession as myself, and I appeal to you to permit me to proceed with my speech as I have arranged, and allow me to answer after I finish. Mr. Geae. One question before you begin. Are you a paid attorney in this case? Mr. Peeston. Well, in one sense I am; my expenses are paid to come here. Mr. Gbak. Do you get a fee? Mr. Peeston. Well, I shall get a fee, and besides Mr. Geae. That is aU I want to know. Mr. Eebd (to Mr. Gear). Ton distrust the profession of the gentle- men. Mr. Geae. I have had a good deal of experience.* The Chaieman. Of course the gentlemen on the other side who have spoken have had no interest in the matter? Mr. Peeston. Mr. Blabon has not paid me anything for it, and if I were on the market in a case of this kind I think that you gentlemen would have considered it wise for Mr. Blabon and Mr. Potter both to have paid me a very enormous retainer, a thousand fold more, gentle- men, than I expect to get. Mr. Hopkins. Tou put a moderate estimate on your abilities. Mr. Peeston. I believe it is always considered fair by the profession to break down a lawyer when you can, but I come before you, gentle- men, on this occasion, and appear before you, as I have said, in behalf of all the consumers who are not interested in the manufacture of these products. I come here before you, the grand national inquest of our coimtry Mr. Eeed. The coroner's inquest. Mr. Preston. (Continued.) And the suffrages of your constituents and the pledges you made to them Mr. Beeckineidge. The chairman suggests that you will proceed with your statement. Mr. Eeed. Omitting the exordium and peroration. The Chairman. Just come to the facts. Mr. Hopkins. I think that the gentleman wishes to present his facts with a little ornamentation. The Chairman. I hope he will be permitted to do so. Mr. Peeston. ISTow, gentlemen, this is the paper I furnished the Secretary of the Treasury, and I have taken out the original which I put in, which I will supplement when I leave here by some printed documents which will go even further than theoriginal itself to confirm the position I take here, and that is, that this industry of oilcloth and linoleum has been protected out of all due proportion to the interest of the people at large and directly to the disadvantage of the revenues of the Government and exclusively in the interest of the manufacturers. I propose to show you, gentlemen — if you will permit me to digress a little — I propose to show there has been but sixteen manufacturers in this particular industry in this country, and these sixteen manufacturers all deem it necessary for you, gentlemen, to give them additional protection 836 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. SO that tliey may be able to pay their hands liberal wages and be able to live in the meantime. I have here to show you how unprofitable the business has been. I am here to show you, gentlemen, something in addition to what Mr. Potter failed to show you, and that is how many goods were imported of this particular manufacturing industry. I am here to show you, gentlemen, liow much may be imported if you, gentle- men, will deal justly and fairly between the manufacturer and the people, and if I fail to demonstrate to you the position I have taken, it is because of my utter inability to present a plain and simple proposi- tion in dollars and cents. Now, what is my proposition? Simply a tariff to secure the largest public revenue with the smallest private gain. Paragraph 3G9 of the tariff act imposes on "oil cloth and linoleum for floors and for all other oil cloths (except silk oil cloths) and on water proof cloth, not especially provided for, costing 25 cents per squa^-e yard or less, 40 per cent ad valorem. Costing over 25 cents per squ:)re yard, 15 cents per square yard, and 30 per centum ad valorem." This is the law as it stands to-day under the act of 1890, and the amendment I propose for that law is Mr. Hopkins. How does the law differ from the law on the statute book prior to that time? Mr. Preston. I think it was about the same as ib was in 1883, except on high grades. There is a volume I believe here where I can show it to you. Mr. Hopkins. I did not know but that you had studied the subject so that you would know? Mr. Preston. 40 per cent below 25 cents per square yard is my recol- lection, but I do not want to mistake it. I have got a copy of the tariff, but Mr. Payne. We have seen that book before. Mr. Hopkins. I supposed the expert knew? Mr. Preston. Well, I informed myself on that subject before, bu.t I did not think that it was necessary to know what it was in 1883, but I thought it was much more important to show what the present law was now, and still more important to show you gentlemen what it should be in 1894. Mr. Hopkins. I supposed you would get at that by showing what the law had been and the prices of this article during that time; what the prices were before the duty was piit on and what the prices have been since. Mr. Preston. When I conclude my argument, when I reach it in the reg-ular course of my remarks, I will find it, but it will take me some little time to turn to it and find it, and it will prolong the time. Mr. Eeed. I think it will have that effect, and I think you had better not answer the question. Mr. Preston. I thank you for the suggestion; I have at least accom- plished one point. Mr. Eeed. I think it is pretty evident that the Secretary of the Treasury has accomplished one point; he is a very shrewd man. Mr. Preston. I wish he had a shrewder representative. Mr. Eeed. I wish he had. Mr. Preston. I wish he had, too; but we will see when wc get through. The Chairman. Give us the facts now. ■ Mr. Preston. Now, this iswhat I propose in place of that paragraph OIL CLOTH. 837 (3G9), and I will go on and show you gentlemen what the result of this change will be. Paragraph 369 as proposed should read as follows: Oilcloths for floors, stamped, paiuted, or printed, includingliuoleura, eorticiue, cork carpet, figured or plain, and all other oilcloths (except silk oilcloths) and water-proof cloth, not specially provided for in this act, costing 25 cents per square yard or less, ten per centum ad valorem; valued above 25 cents per square yard, 40 per cent ad valorem. That is my proposition. As regards the rate of duty on oil cloth valued above 25 per cent, i have no objection to it; I make no objection to its remaining at the present rate of 40 per cent duty. Now, by mak- ing that change, gentlemen, it will effect this result or expected result. The duty in 1892, for the last year that the Government received from imi)ortations atthe present rate, the duty was $128,929. That is what the Government received last year on the importations amounting to some $267,465. So, if there should be anything required to show why these gentlemen have been so fortunate and so successful in this manu- facturing industry, I think it would be that very fact that last year the importation amounted to the moderate sum of $267,465, on which the duty paid was $128,929. Now, if this duty is reduced as proposed to 10 per cent on this lower grade of oilcloth, costing 25 cents or less, we estimate that the increase for the coming year, for the first year, will be, instead of $128,000, $388,789 or more, making the increase the first year $257,858 revenue on this article alone. I suppose I had better go through and point out to you gentlemen other articles where you will be enabled to derive some revenue to meet the expenses of the Gov- ernment. Mr. Payne. I suppose that increased revenue would result from shutting up the factories which these gentlemen represent. Mr. Pkeston. Not at all. If these factories can not be run on the 10 per cent on the lower grade of oil cloths, where, as Mr. Potter says and Mr. Blabon says, they employ 100 hands, I think that the Gov- ernment had better close them up. Mr. Payne. Do you think they will do as much business ! Mr. Preston. I think it Is utterly unimportant for the peoi^le of this country whether they do any business or not. Mr. Eeed. That is a good point. Mr. Preston. We think where sixty-odd millions are concerned and only one hundred opposed to them the sixty-odd million should be considered every trip, and the Treasury of the Government should be protected. Mr. Payne. I want to get at the fact whether you are going to shut them up or not. I do not propose to discuss it with you. Mr. Preston. I do not propose to shut them up, gentlemen. Mr. Payne. How are you going to get this extra revenue unless you shut them up, unless you import the entire oil-cloth business under 25 cents on 10 per cent duty ? Mr. Preston. I propose to show it in this way. Mr. Eeed. Better abolish it and take the chances? Mr. Payne. I did not want to break the order of Ids remarks. Mr. Preston. It is all broken up, and I never will be able to return to it. The Chairman. There is another gentleman to be heard after you, and you will oblige the committee very much if you will condense what you are going to say and not be led off by these side questions at all. Mr. Preston. I will endeavor to do that. Now, I propose to show it in this way. Mr. Blabon, who testified before the same committee in 838 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. 1890 upon this same question wten that tariff act vyas framed, in reply to a question put by Mr. Breckinridge — Is your product turned out mainly by mactiinery? Mr. Blabon. Very largely. In the last few years we have exerted ourselves and have spent a great deal of money for machinery. Mr. Bekckineidge. So that the mere manual labor does not cost you much? Mr, Blabon. We liave still a large amount of hand labor, printers and others. Three or four years ago I offered $50,000 for the patent of a niaihine that would print linoleum perfectly. I offered it to any genius who would invent a machine that would do the work and assign the patent to me. Mr. Breckinridge. Then you would have the patent and control it? Mr. Blabon. Of course I would have it and control it. Mr. Breckinridge. You say we use better machinery in your business in this country than they vise abroad? Mr. Blabon. Yes ; I estimate the capacity of the American works as about 22,.')00,000 yards. Since that testimony vas taken, gentlemen, Mr. Blabon has suc- ceeded in acquiring printing machines, and I have brought the pho- tographs here to show you [exhibiting same], and to show what these machines make, and the multitude of yards that they can manufacture in the course of a day. I will show you, furthermore, from the extracts which I will ftirni.sh you, taken from the trade papers regard- ing the capacity of the works of Messrs. Potter and Messrs. Blabon, the following, viz: three machines, each of 1,000 yards capac- ity per hour, 24,000 yards per day, a total of 72,000 yards per day. That is what Thomas Potter & Sons are running. George W. Blabon & Co. testified before you gentlemen in 1890, or such of you gentlemen as were present on that occasion (I do not want to misrepresent him), that with these machines they could compete with any competitors at home or abroad. I have shown you, and I will leave the paper with each of you gentlemen to show the facts and authorities which sus- tain them, that Mr. Blabon has secured four ot those machines, and he is one of the most flourishing oilcloth makers in the country. Nor is this all. When you come to estimate it, Mr. Blabon has four machines running, and he has all of those four machines running in spite of this present tariff. Those four machines, manufacturing 1,000 yards per hour, 24,000 per day, a total of 96,000 yards per day on those machines, and the grand total of manufacture per diem of those two firms alone, whom you gentlemen have heard from — Mr. Potter and Mr. Blabon — or what they can manufacture if they see fit to run their machines on full time 300 days in the year, is the moderate sum of 168,000 yards per diem, which makes 50,400,000 yards per year of 300 days. Mr. Geak. Eight there Mr. Dalzell. Did you say yards or acres'? Mr. BuEEOWS. I understood you to give number of acres'? Mr. Peeston. No, sir. Mr. Eeed. I thought it was square miles. Mr. Peeston. I do not know how many thousand acres that would cover, but I am only here for the purpose of giving the number of yards, but if run on full time, which those seven machines can run, it would amount to the moderate sum of 50,400,000 square yards. Now, I do not make this statement haphazard. I have here clippings, which I propose to have printed and furnish to each one of you gentlemen, taken from the trade papers, with the date by which any one of you gentlemen can refer to these respective numbers and learn wliether the statement which I have made is correct or otherwise. Now, then, there is oue other proposition that I am here for the pur- pose of showing. If I understand the result of the late election — I OIL CLOTH. 839 will put it in a difterent way — if I understand the sentiment of the people, Republicans as well as Democrats, who are engaged upon this investigation, it is for the purpose of framing a tarifl' bill which will do justice to the manufacturers, partial justice, at least, to the people, and furnish a revenue to the Government to pay the expenses of the Gov- ernment. I propose to show you gentlemen, by the testimony of Mr. Blabon himself, that it only required his consent in order to make a large trust company of these manufacturers, and that instead of six- teen manufacturers, in point of fact there would only be one, who would apportion out the plunder among themselves which you gentlemen granted them by placing the tariff upon an article of prime necessity in use in every household in this land; an article that the poor people, more especially than the rich, are required to use because it is so much cheaper than carpeting made of wool and other floor coverings. Mr. Hopkins. Do you say those sixteen industries are combined in one trust? Mr. Peeston. I say Mr. Blabon, in his testimony in 1890 before this committee, stated it only needed his consent. Mr. Hopkins. That does not answer my question. Are these indus- tries combined in a trust? Mr. Peeston. I think I can show you so. Mr. Hopkins. Do you say so; never mind your ornamentation now, but give me a direct answer. Mr. Peeston. My dear sir, I will not state a fact unless I know it positively. Mr. Hopkins. Then you do not know — is that it? Mr. Peeston. I infer from these advertisements, taken from the Carpet and Upholstery Trade Review, which I will read if you will per- mit me : Tlie agreement on prices between the table oilcloth manufacturers expired with the 31st ultimo, and a meeting 'was held on that date with the result that one promi- nent manufacturer declined to continue in the agreement, and therefore the fall sea- son opens up with no arrangement among the manufacturers as to a uniform price list. Put the duty 5 cents per square yard specific and 30 per cent ad valorem, as Mr. Potter and Mr. Blabon suggest, and how long will it take those sixteen manufacturers to come together and make the greatest trust this country has ever seen. Mr. BuEEOWS. That alludes to table oilcloths. Do not you know that these gentlemen do not make that at all? Mr. Blabon. Only a little. Mr. Peeston. I will show you what he makes. Mr. BuEEOVfS. You are showing a trust in a thing that does not exist so far as these gentlemen are concerned. Mr. Peeston. I have something here which I apprehend the vener- able gentlemen will not deny. I have a list here — a report of the esti- mated capital of each one of those 16 manufacturers. Mr. Geae. Is their rating bad ? Mr. Peeston. Quite good. Mr. Geae. A 1? Mr. Peeston. Some of it ought to be double A 1. The aggregate of these 16 manufacturers — I will not trouble you, gentlemen, as the time is a very important matter here — I have not added it up, but many run in the millions. Mr. Potter is rated at $750,000 to a million, and Mr. Blabon is rated at the same rate. Mr. Potter and Mr. Blabon both 840 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. make table and shelf cloths, floor cloths, and linoleum. They both make all of these articles I referred to. Mr. Payne. In other words, it requires a large amount of capital to do this businesss, a large investment in machinery and otherwise! Mr. Peeston. At the present date it is done altogether with ma- chinery Mr. Payne. That it requires a large investment? Mr. Peeston. I will not say that it requires a large investment, because other people could manufacture it; but what chance has an hum- ble man who commenced like one of these parties, the large firm of Deborah, Powers & Co., of Lansingburg, IST. Y. Mr. Hopkins. What about that firm? Mr. Peeston. They are rated now at $1,000,000 and over. Mr. Payne. Did they commence with nothing? Mr. Peeston. They commenced with nothing. The senior member of this iirm commenced the work on these oilcloths in the shed of a yard, and they carried on that business and built up this trade until they are now millionaires. Mr. Hopkins. When did they commence? A Bystandee. In 1817. I have not got the date. Mr. Peeston. I am much obliged to you. Mr. Hopkins. Ydu say from 1817 up to this time they have accumu- lated their capital, and it is nearly a million? Mr. Dalzell. That sort of a thing ought not to be encouraged. Mr. Hopkins. I appreciate the fact now that this is a grasping monopoly. Mr. TuENBE. I think the gentleman should be allowed to make his statement and be allowed to conclude it, and I for one would like to have a connected statement from the gentleman. Mr. Payne. I have not asked any questions except to aid the gen- tleman. Mr. BuEEOWS. What is the name of this last firm? Mr. Peeston. Deborah Powers & Sons. Mr. BuEEOWS. Do you know they were not making linoleum or not? Mr. Peeston. I will tell you whether they are making it. (Exam- ining papers.) They do not make linoleum. They make floor cloth, table, and shelf cloth. You will not have any difficulty in finding out what they make or do not make if you read the papers I shall leave here with you. Mr. Eeed. We will read them all. Mr. Peeston. If you will read them all it is hardly worth while for me to say any more. Mr. G-EAE. You appear here in the interest of the importers? Mr. Peeston. You can put it that way if you choose. Mr. Geae. I want you to answer it. I do not put it any way. Mr. Peeston. Yes, sir; if you please. Mr. Hopkins. What importing firm or house employed you to come here? Mr. Peeston. I do not know — that is a professional question — that I should have to state it. That is a professional question, and I think I have the right to answer that or not. Mr. G-EAE. When you come into court Mr. Hopkins. If the gentleman objects I will not press the question. Mr. Geae. When you appear as an attorney in a court you have to state the name of your client; that is the rule of the court. Mr. Peeston. Now, gentlemen, I took some few notes down of the OIL CLOTH. 841 testimony wMch is ofifered by Mr. Blabon, wlio has appeared before you on tliis subject, and lie says of the manufacture that three-fourths of all made is sold for less than 25 cents per square yard. If that be the fact — I believe there is no better evidence anywhere such is the fact because there are more poor people than rich people — the tariff bears more hardly upon the poor people than the rich, who are able to buy at the highest rate, and while I make no objection to the tariff remaining as it is now upon the higher grades of linoleum, I do make the point that these lower grades which come into common use of the humblest Amer- ican citizens ought to be put down to the minimum rate, and I do think from such investigation and study is I have given that when you gentlemen are called upon to consider this matter in the preparation of this tariff bill, that if you see fit to take the trouble to read the facts ■which I have collated and collected here for your guidance, that when you return to your constituents — I find I am getting off; I do not want to get oft' any more. The Chairman. Our time is very precious and we want you to come right down to the facts and nothing else. Mr. Preston. That is what I propose to submit. The Chairman. If you have any papers, file them with the stenog- rapher. Mr. Burrows. I want to ask you in regard to that amendment; did you submit that amendment to the Secretaiy of the Treasury"? Mr. Preston. I showed the whole paper Mr. Burrows. Did you submit the amendment you propose? Mr. Preston. I did to the Acting Secretary, Mr. Hamlin, at the time. Mr. Burrows. And it met with his approval? Mr. Preston. He thought it was a good suggestion. Mr. G-EAR. Did you prepare that paper at his request? Mr. Preston. No, sir; I did not. Mr. Dalzell. You submitted these papers also to him, this whole business ? Mr. Preston. Ko, sir; I did not. Mr. Dalzell. I thought you stated some time ago you did? Mr. Preston. No, sir; these are the papers I submitted, and these are samples (illustrating). Mr. Burrows. Have you submitted the proposed amendment to the tariff law? Mr. Preston. Yes, sir; with these articles which sliow the stock Mr. Payne. Did you submit this proposed amendment to the importers ? Mr. Preston. I have to one importer. Mr. Payne. Does that meet with his approval? Mr. Preston. He tliought it was wise. The Chairman. Is the importer regarded as a criminal over in Baltimore? Mr. Preston. No, sir; he is regarded as one of the best of our merchants. Mr. Dalzell. Is he the gentleman employiug you? Mr. Gear. You said you represented the importers. Mr. Preston. I said, I can not escape. Mr. Gear. You said you Mr. Preston. One moment, permit me to answer yoiir question if you please. I said and I say again I represent first the people of this 842 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. country, tlie masses, and the next if you please the importing mercliants of this country. Mr. ClEAE. That is all right. Who pays you, the masses or the importers? Mr. Peeston. I get it in two forms, part from the importers and part from my conscience which a]iproves what I do. Mr. Gear. I did not know that you had a conscience. jSTow in re- gard to these importers have not they had trouble with the Govern- ment with regard to undervaluations? Mr. Peeston. JSTo, sir. Mr. Gear, ivone at all? ]\Ir. Peeston. ]^one at all. Mr. Eeed. I would suggest that you must not be discouraged by your reception because the majority are with you in principle. Mr. Peeston. I would like, if you gentlemen would give me suffi- cient time, to refer to a question put to Mr. Blabon. I have samples to verify what I have to say on this subject. I have here samples repre- senting each grade of oilcloth, all of which is numbered, and when he said he was satisfied, and that he desired a specific tariff in preference to an ad valorem tariff I have here a quotation which I would like to read to you gentlemen, which I think you will all approve of, taken from the Tariff Eeformer. It is in reference to this very subject of a specific tariff instead of an ad valorem tariif. For fear you gentlemen might think it not worth while to read it, if you will permit me I will read it. Mr. Dalzell. How long is it? Mr. Geae. File it with those papers as we all read the evidence. The Chaieman. Give that to the reporter, Mr. Preston. Mr. Peeston. All right, sir; I only intended to read one or two pas- sages from it. The answers of all tax-eaters to this question are practically unanimous. Public othcials whose duty it is to collect taxes prefer specific duties, because it is vastly easier to weigh goods and charge so much a pound than it is to ascertain their true value and assess them in proportion to that. Protected manufacturers prefer spe- cific duties, because it is easy in this manner to tax the people 100 per cent for pri- vate gain in cases where 50 per cent openly levied on values would not be tolerated. They prefer such duties because, .as we shall presently show, these duties have a self-acting power of constantly increasing taxation, until, after the lapse of a few years, such duties become prohibitory and secure to the domestic manufacturer a monopoly so that, in multitude of cases, that which was intended as a proper revenue duty, and was such when enacted, soon produces no revenue to the public, while it extorts enormous tributes from the masses for the benefit of a small class of capi- talists. ^Ir. Payne. You favoi' an ad valorem duty? Mr. Peeston. Tes, sir; that being more just and fair. Mr. Geae. Is that Henry George? Mr. Prest(jn. That is a letter from Mr. Thomas G. Shearman. Mr. Dalzell. There is nothing cranky about him. Mr. Payne. Have not you anything else on that subject? Mr. Peeston. There is veiy much upon that subject, but your time being limited I must proceed. Now, in regard to the cost of the burlaps. I have this to say. You will find by reference to the tariff act that the fiber comes here free and it is only the manufactured article upon which there is any duty to be paid and I understand that there are manufacturers who convert that fiber which comes in free into tlie jute burlaps. Mr. Payne. The McKinley bill puts the fiber on the free list? Mr. Preston. It did. OIL CLOTH. 843 Mr. Payne. Are you finding fault with that? Mr. Preston. I am very glad to find McKinley did soinetliing by which the American people were benefited in reference to the tariff question. Mr. Payne. We are obliged to you for saying that. Mr. Peeston. Then Mr. Potter also contends for a specific duty, like I\Ir. Blabou, on oilcloths 25 cents and under, and then he goes on to explain to you gentlemen the maiuifiicture of these and puts the cost of labor at one-third— burlaps at one-third, and the other material which he can not name he also puts at one-third. I repeat, as I have already stated, there is not a single article that goes into the man- ufactui'e of oilcloth and linoleum upon which there is a duty paid which can not be produced just as cheap here Mr. Payne. You do not take the general position of free traders, that if a duty is placed on an article and the article is maiuifat'tured here the the consumer has to pay the duty to the Government and also on the manufactured article? Mr. Preston. Put that question again. Mr. Payne. You do not take the usual position of the free-trader, that where a duty is placed on an article manufactured here that the consumer has to pay the duty on the manufactured article and to the Government? Mr. Preston. Certainly, I do. Mr. Payne. Why do you say because the burlap is manufactured here the item of 40 per cent could not come in. You say burlaps are made here and you do not take any account of that duty because they are made here? Mr. Preston. All the fiber is imported free — the raw material. Mr. Payne. But there is 40 per cent duty on the manufactured arti- cle. If 40 per cent is added to the price you ought to take that into consideration upon that standpoint? Mr. Preston. I do not exactly see why. Mr. Payne. If you do not, I will not spend the time enlightening you. Mr. Gear. Do you favor a reduction of duty on the burlaps, or is that a part of your client's argument? Mr. Preston. It is a matter of no imi^ortance as regards to that; I have not made any point upon that subject. It is immaterial to me whether it is reduced or not. Mr. Eeed. Then there would not be any manufactures to be destroyed because there would be none. Mr. Burrows. What are burlaps made of, without looking — as you are of course familiar with it? Mr. Preston. It is made of jute fiber. I will show you the article, there it is [exhibiting same]. That is the same as bagging for fertil- izers. I have brought here some samples of leathers. Here is a leather that is imported at 20 cents per square foot or $1.80 per square yard. The duty on that is 20 per cent ad valorem. On this manufacture the price is 20 cents a yard and the duty is 40 per cent ad valorem. Mr. Payne. What is that manufacture? Mr. Preston. It is oilcloth, imitation leather cloth, on a cotton back. Here is one which is used for covering books, dutiable at 40 per cent, while the leather is 20 per cent. These are some of the incongruities of the tariff. Mr. Payne. I suppose you take into consideration the fact the leather 844 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. is manufactured here and the raw material is produced here in the leather, while it is not in the burlap, or do you not take that into con- sideration in your theory of economics ? Mr. Preston. Well, I can not exactly see the point to which your question leads. Mr. Payne. I did not apprehend you would. Mr. BxJEKOWS. May I inquire your business ? Jvlr. Peeston. I am a lawyer. Mr. BxTEEOWX. And you represent the poor people — the masses? Mr. Peeston. Yes, siij I do. oiii rr.oTH. (Par.lgr;lpli 309.) STATEMENT OF ME. J. CRAWFORD LYON, OF BALTIMORE. Mr. Chaieman: I ask for ten minutes of your valuable time, and I also ask that you permit me to j)roceed uninterrupted and after that I am at your service. I am an importer, and I imi^ort a number of arti- cles; wool and matting from China and Japan, oilcloths and linoleum from England, and I am prepared to show you that as oihiloth and lin- oleum are now taxed the manufacturers have an unfair advantage over the consumers. The conversion of coarse, cheap fabrics, into so-called oilcloths and imitation leather cloths, for covering floor, tables, furniture, vehicles, and for making hats, caps, shoes, harness, traveling bags, trunks, and binding books, began in this country more than seventy-five years ago. (See Carpet Trade Ee-\dew published in New York, June 15, 1892.) The operation by hand, while simple, was tedious, and as the consumption grew, various mechanical devices were substituted for hand labor, increasing and cheapening production, enlarging and extending the traffic, and multiplying the profits of the converters, who, to-day do not exceed 14 producing oilcloth and linoleum for floors, and 10 for all other oilcloth and imitation leather cloth. Mr. Eeed. Would it interrupt you if I ask you right there, by whom is this document you are reading signed? Mr. Lyon. The document is not signed by any one, but there is a Ijrinted name at the bottom. Mr. Eeed. What is the printed name at the bottom? Mr. Lyon. John F. Preston. Mr. Eeed. It is a second edition of that. Mr. Lyon. It is not a second edition, you have not heard the first. Mr. Eeed. That is the same Mr. Preston who appeared before us? Mr. Lyon. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. That is the same that Mr. Preston had? Mr. Lyon. Yes, sir; that was prepared but it was omitted, and I assisted him in the preparation of it. I appeared before this committee in 1890 alone unaided. I succeeded in exposing to some degree the iniquity of the proposition which the manufacturers of this country then presented to it, which was to impose a duty of 10 cents a square yard and 30 per cent ad valorem on all oil- cloths, and Mr. Blabon's reply to Mr. Breckinridge's question will open OIL CLOTH. 8^1.5 up to the members of this committee the iniquitonsnoss of the intent and purpose of the manufacturers, as it is possible to get at it. Mr. Breckinridge. Did not they make a trust Inst fall? Mr. Blabon. No, sir. They are very anxinns for one, and if it were not for our house they could get one up in ten days, hut I ■will not have anything to do with it. I did not build up my husiness on combination and trust. Mr; Blabon also stated in response to Mr. Breckinridge's question — Is your product turned out mainly by machinery? A. Very largely. In the last few years wo have exerted ourselves and have spent a great deal of money for the machinery. Mr. Breckinridge. So that the mere manual labor does not cost you much? Mr. Blabon. We have still a large amount of hand labor, printers and others. Three or four years ago I offered $50,000 for the patent of a machine that would print linoleum perfectly. Since that time the George W. Blabon Company have put in their new works four machines which each have a capacity of 1,000 square yards per hour and which does the work of from 50 to 70 printers. The progress of this industry from feebleness to vigor, from a small individital industry undertaken by a mother and her sons in 1817, and through the years that have intervened conducted with such signal success that to-day the firm of Deborah Powers & Sons are million- aires, conducting the business at !N"ewburg and Lansingburg, N". Y., has its almost magical counterpart in the rise from simplicity and obscurity of the private individuals and firms now known as "Thomas Potters Sons & Co., incorporated," and "The Geo. W. Blabon Co.," both of Philadelphia, private corporations widely known in the trade as possessing unlimited wealth and resources, sprung from most modest beginning, rated by mercantile agency reports as millionaires, and now producing every class of floor, table, and leather goods, aggregating millions of square yards. Likewise may be referred to as wealthy and powerful, JVIessrs. C. M. Bailey & Sons, Skowhegan and Winthrop, Me. (reported production 3,500,000 square yards) ; the Farr & Bailey Manufacturing Company, Camden, IST. J. (reported production 3,500,000 square yards); the Nairn Linoleum Company, Kearney, N. J.; the American Linoleum Oomiiany, Staten Island, IST. Y.; Messrs. W. M. Brasher & Co. (just retired), Brooklyn, N. Y. ; Messrs. Alden Sampson & Sons, Hallowell, Me., and Brooklyn, N. Y. (estimated production 5,000,000 square yards), who produce each year millions of square yards of floor coverings exclusively, as pointed out in printed statements with exhibits hereto- fore laid before you, and with whicli you are doubtless familiar. Of Messrs. Sampson & Sons, the American Carpet and (Jpholstery Trade of June 1, 1893, said: The trio composing the firm of Alden Sampson & Sons is painfully severed by the deathof Mr. E. P. Sampson. Deceased washorn in OldHallowell, Me.,where the elder Sampson started one of the very first floor oilcloth factories in the United States. Years ago the firm had become independently rich. Of Mr. W. M. Brasher, the same authority on the same date stated : Mr. W. M. Brasher, the oilcloth m.anufacturer of Brooklyn, N. Y., who is winding up his affairs, retires a wealthy man. He was one of the pioneers in oilcloth, etc. What a commentary upon an occupation for years pampered by the tariff beyond its needs and deserts, in which some have become million- aires and none fail (except the laborers) to reach affluence, yet would make it appear to you that they still need protection to exist. The materials consumed in the construction of oilcloth and linoleum 846 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. tor floors, and all other oilcloth and imitation leather cloth, are few and inexpensive. For the most part they are produced in tliis country cheaper and better tlian abroad. It is a fact that we export the prod- ucts of the pine tree and petroleum, both used in the production of paints and varnishes, together with ocher and ochery earths, and manu- factured lampblack, largely consumed in the construction of these goods, and foreign makers pay more for all these important materials than makers in this country. The duty existing in Schedule A of the existing tariff bears with no hardship on the manufacturers of oilcloth and lineoleum for floors, and all other oilcloth and imitation leather cloth, because the majority of . materials used by them are as cheap, if not cheaper, in this country than abroad. (See quotations in Paint, Oil and Drug Eeporter, and the price list of the Pennsylvania Paint and Ocher Company.) The foundation of oilcloth and linoleum for floors is a coarse burlap of jute (Exhibit 2^os. 1 and 2), 12 to 15 threads per inch each way, counting warp and filling, and is produced at a cost of from 3 cents to 5 cents per square yard. (See American Cotton and Wool Reporter.) The liber, jute, is now admitted to this country free of duty (see para- graph 593, existing tarift), while under the tariff of 1883 it was forced to pay 20 per cent ad valorem, and its fabrication in all forms is now conducted by many well-equipped mills, fitted up for the purpose, in this country. As this fiber comes from Calcutta exclusively j foreiga siiinners and weavers pay as much for it as ours do. The foundation ot oilcloth (not used for covering floors) and imita- tion leather cloth is a coarse, cheap cotton fabric, constructed (in the grade most largely used) of about 48 threads each way per square inch, counting warp and filling (Exhibits 3, 4, 5, and 6), and is a very cheap article, cents per square yard or less, leaving the higher rates im- ])os(;(l on luxuries to be applied to 'the grades used by the wealthy and well-to-do classes, costing more than .!.■) cents per square yard. This will result in miniiiuim cost to poor consumers and niaxiiniim revenue to the Government. OIL CLOTH. 853 Paragraph No. 455 of tlie existing tariff imposes on loatlier not espec- ially provided for 10 per cent ad valorem ; and on tinislied leathers, i. e., "patent," "enameled," ''japanned," including bool^binders' leathers, a duty of 20 ijer cent ad valorem; paragraph No. 309 imposes on finished imitation leather cloth, and all other oilcloths and waterproof cloth, costing 25 cents per square yard or less, 40 per cent ad valorem. Imi- tation leather cloths are used in shoe, hat, cap, trunk, traveling bag, harness and carriage making, and for bookbinding, table covers, and infants' cloths. They are cheap and efficient substitute for leather, and being used in every household should be taxed liglitly. EXHIBIT A. [Extracts from statements of Mr. George W. Blabon before the "Ways and Means Committee, FiHy- first Con»;i-ess. See folios 570 to 572, Eevision oV the Tariff.] The Chairman, Mr. JIcKinlby. If you had raw material free Tronld you ■want a duty on your product? Mr. Blaeox. No, sir. If I get my raw material free, and if yon let me import my labor, I do not ask any favor. Mr. Gear. You want to get your labor at the same price as is paid abroad? Mr. Blabon. I am not a free-trading man; but if you put me on a fair equality with London or Kirkcaldy I can get along. I can get along even if our labor is not quite as low as theirs, for we have better machinery. Our plant contains the best machinery. Mr. Gear. Then,, in order to make things equal, you would have to reduce your wages one-half? Mr. Blabon. Yes; we would have to bring the wages down. I want to be placed in a position where I am not discriminated against. I could get along if I were on an equ.ality. I do not want any favors. Mr. Flower. Would they do so much work for the lower wages? Mr. Blabon. I can not say. Mr. Breckinridge. Is your product turned out mainly by machinery? Mr. Blabon. Very largely. In the last few years we have exerted ourself, and have spent a great deal of money for machinery; Mr. Breckinridge. So that the mere manual labor does not cost you much? Mr. Blabon. We have still a large amount of hand labor — printers and others. Three or four years ago I offered $50,000 for the patent of a machine that would print linoleum perfectly. I offered it to any genius who would invent a machine that would do the work, and assign the patent to me. Mr. Breckinridge. Then you would have the patent and control it. Mr. Blabon. Of course I would have it and control it. M. Breckinridge. You say we use better machinery in your business in this country than they use abroad? Mr. Blabon. Yes; I estimated the capacity of the American works as about 22,500,000 yards. Mr. Breckinridge. How will your output compare with theirs per hand? Mr. Blabon. I think we can do more work per hand than they can. AVe generally work our men on piecework. Some of our printers niaki- $18 jjer week. Mr. Breckinridge. Have you ever compared your output per baud with theirs? Mr. Blabon. No; I have never been able to do that. They are very close there. Mr. Breckinridge. Suppose you had everything yon I'oiinnme free and had no protection on your oilcloth or linoleum, would your condition be worse tlian it is now? Mr. Blabon. I think not. Mr. Breckinridge. Then my question is, suppose that all your raw materials were free of duty, and there were no i^rotection on your product, would your condition be much worse than it is now ? Mr. Blabon. I can not say exactly. I should .judge it could not be very much worse. We are bad enough off now. There is no trust among the oilcloth manu- facturers. They are knife-aud-pistol with each other. Mr. Breckinridge. Bid they not make a trust last fall? Mr. Blabon. No, sir; they are very anxious for one; and if it wore not for our house they could get one up in ten days; but I will liave nothing U< do with it. I did not build up my business on combinations and trusts, and if I can not run it on a square market I will let it alone. As regards the duty on oilcloth, I have made a 854 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. calculation that if the duty is fixed at 30 per ceut ad valorem and 10 cents per square yard the foreign manufacturer can still land their goods here. Note. — Since the above statement was made, perfect printing machinery has been put in operation (see Exhibits B. and C. ) and the private firm of George W. Blaboa & Co. has been changed to the corporation of the George W. Blahon Company. See their advertisement below. [Advertisement. — American Carpet and Upholstery Trade Keview, April 1, 1893.] The Geo. W. Blabon Company, Manufacturers of Oilcloth and Linoleum Table and Stair Oilcloth, Linseed Oil and Oil Cake. No. 9 North Fifth Street, Philadelphia, Pa. New York Office, 108 Worth Street. Exhibit B. [Advertisement — American Carpet and TJpliolstery Trade Eeview, April 1, 1893.] Printing Machines for Floor Oilcloth and Linoleum. Csrrespondence solicited. Patented in the United States May 31, 1892; December 6, 1893; July 12, 1892; March 7, 1893. Also patented in Foreign Countries. Dienelt & Eisenhardt, Manufacturers and Patentees, 1304 to 1318 Howard street, Philadelphia. [American Carpet and Upholstery Trade Keview, April 1, 1893.] DnSNELT & EISBNHAKDT'S OILCLOTH PRINTERS. It has been known for some time past that Messrs. Dienelt & Eisenhardt, at their machine works, Front and Thompson streets, Philadelphia, were giving particular attention to the perfection and building of oilcloth printing machines. It is further liuown that controversies were had with this firm by Messrs. George W. Blabon & Co., who went so far as to file caveats at Washington to prevent the issuance of pat- ents to Dienelt & Eisenhardt on the ground of interference. The technicalities, Messrs. Dienelt & Eisenhardt state, have now been decided in their favor and objec- tions to their patents overruled. They are also protected in foreign countries, and the firm of Messrs. M. Nairn & Co., of England, have purchased the right for the United Kingdom. Messrs. Thomas Potter, Sous & Co. built the first printing machines ever erected in Philadelphia. It was an impressive aifair and ground out some good-lookiug oil- cloth at first. The firm, though, were hard to please and rejected this printer for deficient execution. It stands in one of their buildings now, at Second and Venango, and casts knowing winks at the tower on the public building. Potter's next machine was one built by Dienelt and Eisenhart, and this so filled the bill that additional machines have been ordered. Messrs. M. Nairn &, Co. ought to feel very proud of their new patent. The only oilcloth printer we know of in England is that used by Messrs. Barry, Ostlere & Co., of the same town and shown below. This is a big revolving drum, suggestive of a tapestry printer and resembling no little James Dunlap's machine for printing tapes- try carpets. [Illustration of linoleum printing machine, English patent.] Altogether, the printing of floor oilcloths has a unique history in this country. Alden, Sampson & Co. enjoyed an absolute monopoly of this remarkable discovery for sixteen years, and the extraordinary grip which they had and held on the trade for 80 long is partly explained by their control of this patent. Exhibit C. [Advertisement, page 37— American Carpet and Upholstery Trade Keview, April 1, 1893.] Printing Machines for Floor Oilcloth and Linoleum, manufactured under the Wil- liams patents by The Moore & A\'hite Co., Philadelphia, Pa., U. S. A. Correspond- ence solicited. ^ ,, „ „, Philadelphia, January S5, 1S9S. The Moore & White Co., Pkilude^pMa: Dear Sirs: In reply to your favor would state that the floor oilcloth printing machine you built for us in 1892, under the Williams patents, has proved satisfactory OIL CLOTH. 855 m every respect, both in perfect printing and general mechanism, being much supe- rior to the other machines we have at work. Respectfully, The Geo. W. Blabon Co., G. W. Blabon, Fresident. [American Carpet and TJpLoUtery Trade Review, April 1, 1893.] DEVELOPMENT OF THE "BLABON OIL-CLOTH PRINTER." The Moore S/- White Company in the field tviih a splendid machine. The Moore & White Company have an important advertisement in this issue which imparts a new interest to oilcloth and linoleum printing. It will be recalled that Messrs. Geo. W. Blabon & Co. took up the invention in embryo of Mr. "Williams, who was formerly with the Sampsons, and caused to be built from his plans and their own suggestions an oilcloth printer, which was the iirst ever successfully run in Philadelphia. This machine, which was built by Dienelt & Eisenhardt, did admir- able work, but was not claimed as a fully perfected machine. Subsequent inven- tions, however, have so extended its working qualities and raised its capacity as to induce its present builders, Messrs. Moore & White Co., to offer it now to the oil- cloth trade. The extensive works of this house located at Fifteenth and Lehigli avenue, Philadelphia, are admirably equipped for producing a machine so important and so minute in its points as an oilcloth printer. The Geo. W. Blabon Company are using two of these machines, and their approval of them is embodied in Moore & White Co.'s full page card elsewhere in this issue. Exhibit D. [See Carpet and Upliolstery Trade Review, April 1, 1893.] Sprowles & Houseman, General Machinists and Engineers, corner Hedge and Brown streets, Frankford, Pa., Oilcloth Machinery a Specialty. Multiple Color Printing Machines, Calendars, Embossing Machines, Improved Drying Kacks, etc. [Illustration of Duplex Color Printing Machine. JoLn "Woods' patent.] [Advertisement — The Textile Recorder, XovenTber 1.^, 1892.] Established 1852. Telegrams: "Agricol a," Manchester. Telephone Nos., National 1074, Mutual, 782. Sir James Farmer & Sons, Engineers and Machinists, Adelphi Iron Works, Salford, Manchester; Makers of Every Description of Machinei-y for Linoleum Manufac- turers. Linoleum Machinery, throughout the entire procsss, for Manufacturing Floor Cloth, 2 to 4 yards wide. 856 s n s .3 t: h^ h-H o l4 o C Ph Eq _^ 'TIS p R a ^ m 3"^ — H H «5 P H ~ - - ; = = n-f:c--i:: c G o 2 5 5 o 5 = i; = o_^ o^ ■*JCOCOC+JO-t-4J^i +-C --= = = = = -r^. „--■-- .^-o ■^j-*^^^-y=-4fre^ty=-H&if>H»- {fr^l^ :>< ■^ 5.4 r-1 -w) '^ :j; ' ^3|:^i C i.-i =. O 2 i;=^.-- ^ TUr. ;^^ _ "- .- c 5 ■^ ^ p p£ P r-i «:■ K a H ? fU t^ RH^O^W'1 d, U X ■ - ^ a 2- 'A Hib- OIL CLOTH. 857 EECAPITrLATION. FlooT-clntli makers (16) — Pennsylvania 2 New Jersey 5 New York 5 Jlassacliusetts 1 Miiine _ 4 Linolcinu makers (4) — > e w York 1 New Jersey 1 Pennsylvania 2 Estimated capacity as stated by Mr, G. W. Blabon in 1890, 22,500,000 sijuare yards. Table, slielf, and carriage-leatlier cloth makers (10) — New Jersey 6 New York 1 Pennsylvania 2 Ohio , , 1 OILCLOTH AND LINOLEUM. [From Carpets, "Wall Papers, and Curtains, April 29, 1893.] All the ingredients of oilcloth and linolenm are comprised in the cheapest known ••raw materials," and there is no excuse for high prices. V.'hat is cheaper than the iiber "jute" out of which the burlap foundation of floor oilcldth is made? This fiber is admitted to this country free of duty and, as bagging, baling or pad- ding, is solvl at abont 4 to y cents per square yard for the count and weight used as fonuilation tor oilcloth and linoleum. This cheap jute faoricof a suitable width is coated with ochery earth paint of suitable color and thickness, or a mixture of jiulverized cork and oxidized oil for linoleum and dried before printing. This constitutes the body. It may be here noted that the whole family of dry paints, ochers, umbers, siennas, brown.s, reds, etc., are about "as cheaji as dirt," which, in reality, they are, being kncwu as " earth paint,'?." Thiy are sold by the producers in a refined state ready for grinding with oil, at from one- fourth cent to 1 cent per pound. (See Pennsylvania Paint and Ocher Com- pany price list for April, 1893.) Cork, comparatively, is also a cheap ingredient. The oil (vegetal>le and mineral) with which these are mixed by grinding costs from 1.5 cents to 50 cents per gallon. (See market reports in Paint, Oil and Drug Keporter. ) The incorporating of sundry pounds of earth paint with enough oil to make it a putty-like mass is not an expensive process. Spreading this on a jute fabric is quickly done. The printing of the bodies in colors, of which white lead forms the largest part in reliable makes, is now done on a great scale by most ingenious machinery, the latest priuting machine doing about 1,000 square yards per hour in eight colors, equal to the work of about 70 printers as heretofore performed. In this way oilcloth and linoleum are now made. The art consists in so "temper- ing " the cloth in its numerous drying stages that the maximum toughness with rubber and leather-like qualities is produced. This gives the quality that resists friction best. It is not the thickness that justifies the price paid, it is the toughness, OILCLOTH PRINTING BY POWBK. [From the American Carpet and TJpliolatery Trade, May 1, 1893.] The coming of the oilcloth printer constitutes one of the notable triumphs of a century already fruitful in wonderful mechanism of a kindred nature. The five American firms using power printers are: The Geo. W. Blabon Company, Thos. Pot- ter, Sons & Co., The Parr Bailey IWanufacturing Company, the Nairn Linoleum Company, and Aldcn Samjison & Sons. The last named were the first to use a printer in America, but the knowledge of this fact failed for sixteen years to arouse much interest or to stimulate inventors to evade or excel the Sampson patent ; as the patent expired the inventois became lively. The two firms abroad priuting by power are Ji,' Nairn & Co., and John Barry, Ostlere & Co., of Kirkcaldy, Scotland. Two kinds of oilcloth xniuters are now available to the American trade and both are built 868 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. here in Pbiladelphia. Both are wonderful in execTition and are marvels as showing how independent industry is of human brawn when the cunning inventor gets steam and iron to do his bidding. One printer can do the daily work of 50 men. Sampson & Sous' pioneer printer, the first ever made in this or any other country, was capable of 8 impressions per minute. The Philadelphia printers do 16 per minute. The Farr Bailey Manufacturing Company, whose spacious printing building we illustrated last year, have run oft' 130 pieces 8.4 goods in nine hours, being 7,920 square yards in one working day. This was a fancy test, 6,000 square yards, or 100 rolls 30 yards long, being considered a fine result in perfect printed goods. Shall 66,000,000 consumers pay tribute beyond the need of the Gov- ernment to the above aggregation? Will you sanction iti Gentlemen, I am at your service in regard to any questions you may ask. The Chaieman. If there are no more questions to be asked, the committee will now stand adjourned until 10 o'clock tomorrow morning. Mr. Lyon. I am glad to see I have thrown so much light upon the subject that no one wishes to x)ursue the discussion any further. Mr. Eeed. Do not pursue your triumph. OITj CJjOTII. (Paragraph 369.) Philadelphia, September 7, 1893. Dear Sir: I read a report of the address in which it is said that 33 per cent of the price of oilcloth was paid to labor. The following is what is paid to the workmen. For hand-printing the common oilcloth, !N^o. 4s, the price is 2 cents pet yard. For coating J cent per yard would be a large allowance, and for varnishing ^ cent would be above the actual cost. Most of this grade of cloth is printed by machine, when as high as 118 pieces of cloth, each 60 yards, have been run in a day. The cost of printing by machine must be less than 1 cent per yard. The cost of drying them, which is by steam heat, amounts to a small item per yard. If we say that the labor cost of combining the raw materials of oilcloth into its body is 3J cents per yard we would be very liberal, and this is many times below 33 per cent of the cost of the cloth. Tours, respectfully, W. H. Walkbe. (Paragraph 370.) The Barboue Beothers Company, iSTew Yorl; September 20, 1893. Sir: After the hearing of this company on the 9th instant, a mem- ber of the committee requested information showing the cost of threads and yarns in the United States in comparison with foreign prices, and we are pleased to note herein facts in answer to this inquiry which we desire should be brought to the attention of your committee. A. 5^ lea yarn, cost in American mills 15 iJV cents per pound. For- eign price of competing quality (to-day), 9 J cents. Freight, insurance, and shipping charges one-fourth cent.' Duty, 6 cents per pound. To- tal, 15^ cents per pound. LINEKS. 859 B. Cost of No. 18 linen thread, medium quality, 62-/^. cents per pound. Cost of similar goods landed in New Yorli, duty paid of 45 per cent, 63/0*0 cents per pound. G. Jute yarn cost in United States, 5 ^,^0 cents per pound. Jute yarn cost of foreign yarns in New York, duty paid 35 per cent, 5^,^ cents per pound. The examples are an average in each class. Of hemp and flax yarns, as noted in first example marked A, there was imported for year ending June 30, 1892, valued at less than 13 cents per pound (duty 6 cents per pound), 820,006 pounds. Of linen threads or yarns^ as noted in second example, marked B, there was im- ported in one year (duty 45 per cent ad valorem,) 1,080,439 pounds. Of jute yarns, as noted in example marked 0, (duty 35 per cent ad valo- rem,) 2,363,849 pounds. The large importations are evidence of strong foreign competition notwithstanding the present duty, and American manufacturers have had the machinery and ability to make all the threads and yarns which were imported, and we have never been so busy but what we desired orders. Ten years ago our competition was principally from Great Britain, but now we have not only British competition, but severe competition from Italy, where there is no limitation of hours for work, but the yarn factories are operated for 66 hours or more per week (while in New Jersey we are limited by law to 55 hours) and the wages paid in Milan do not amount to one-third of what is paid in the United States, and in jute manufacturing we are beginning to feel the competition of India. In the matter of results produced by a given number of workers in the Scotch and Irish linen thread mills, results show that a greater product is obtained there than we can secure from the same number of workers in the United States. The prices which we have taken for foreign goods are the prices which we believe to rule with standard makers, but we are constantly finding concessions from list prices, and special qualities, and special l^rices made, which cause goods to be landed in New York at much less than the regular market xmces abroad. Yours, very respectfully, The Bakbour Bros. Co. A. E. Turner, Jr., Vice-President. I;INEN"S. (Paragraph 371.) New York, September 19, 1893. Sir: Eepresentations were made to you on September 9, to the effect that a rate of 33 per cent ad valorem on all fabrics composed of flax, and the admission of raw flax free would be agreeable to the members of the American Flax Association and to the few who have for sometime manufactured a small quantity of the coarser qualities of linens, and to some of the importers of linen, and that the restoration of the rate of 40 per cent on flax thread (which was the rate under the tariff law of 1883) would be acceptable to those engaged in the manu- facturing of linen threads. As I have been engaged for twenty-four years in the importing of 860 FLAX, JUTE AND HEAIP. linens, and do not at all fall in with such recommendations as those cited above, I beg your indulgence for a few moments while I give my views, and my reasons for asking for a rate not exceeding 35 per cent ad valorem on all flax fabrics, or, say, 25 per cent on all other than linen handkerchiefs which might bear a rate of 35 per cent. First. It is admitted that no linens but the coarser qualities (such as crash, selling for from 5 cents to 9 or 10 cents a yard, and this made out of imported flax) can be made in this country, and therefore there is no need for a high rate of duty, as it imposes a needless tax on the many millions who consume linens. When the McKinley bill became a law, a new factory was started in Minneapolis, but after less than eighteen mouths of disastrous business, the attempt to make Hneus was abandoned, and the place has for some time been used for some other purpose, and this is only the last of a number of similar experiences. Second. Before the war linens paid only 15 per cent for the reason given above (that they could not be made in this country), and when the war broke out and the Government was in sore need of revenue, the rate was advanced to 30 and 35 per cent, and this act was regarded as a " war measure.'' The McKinley bill a currs. (Paragraph 372.) New Yoek, Septemher 22, 1893. I give you my views on the tariff question in regard to tlie manufac- ture of collars, cuffs, and shirts. A good hand can by ten hours labor perform the following work on turn-down collars: lOO-y ard Unen, 280 dozen 100-yard iuusUd, 280 dozen 194-yard muslin, 300 dozen 180-yard muslin, 285 dozen Interlining Catting 300 dozen a day Running 80 dozen tops Turning 20 dozen tops Stitching 80 dozen tops Banding 00 dozen (3-ply) Tnrning band, 24 tops Stitching band, 50 tops Buttonholing by maeliine Buttonholing by baud Collar tinished by machine, per dozen Collar finished by hand, jjer dozen Germany. Earl & Wil-I son, Ciuett, ! Coon ii Co. Pfert nig. 50 10 21 18 7 li 8 ■134 -138 ■1()4 138 104 i2i 2i ^■1 *i 1* 2i 4' 4-r,:n 4-67i 15-08i 57* C8J Tim & Co., Jinier, Hall & Hartwcll. Cents. 12i 2J 6i *J IS 14 3 2 3-46J 3^9J 12-584 49J 58J Above calculation is for collar not laundered. To manufacture a dozen collars costs — Berlin. Earl & TMlson. Tim Si, Co. Pfennig. 32 Cents. 30 Cents. 22 58 42 32 ■There are no manufacturing expenses yet added; our rent is much higher; a forewoman in Germany gets 1:^' marks a week ; Tim & Co. pays $12 and $14; Earl & Wilson pay more; an engineer gets in Germany 10 marks a week andin America $12 to $15; clerks cost more here than in Germany. The laundrying part in Germany is just as high as here, because in Germany most all collars are ironed by hand, while in this country ironing machines are in use. If a laboring hancl (girls) made 2 marks a day, which very few earn, is considered as big a pay as if our hands earn $2, because a German girl can get along better and are not used to the living of our girls. The American work- ing girls, on collars, never goto work without hats, gloves, or jackets, wear veils, good German stockings, drawers, goocl shoes, drink soda water, eat ice cream, bananas, eggs, chickens, ham sandwiches, buy jewelry, go to theaters and concerts, and spend their earnings freely. And what does the German girl do ? Wears no hat to go to work in, no gloves or jackets, but a shawl, a calico dress and apron, no drawers, a good hand-knitted stocking, good for a year, good heavy shoes (but no wooden ones); they never indulge in ice cre.im or soda water, chicken or broiled steak, except perhaps on Christmas or at a wedding. A good LACES. 875 reason why, because tliey can't afford it; but our girls do. A German girl is just as happy with 9 marks a weeli as our girls with $9; a German girl does not know any better, while our girls breathe a repu- blican air and indulge in all the comforts the world can afford to them. Collars, cuff's, and shirts made in Saxony cost a great deal less than in Berlin, and only cheap goods are made in Saxony, which is not imported because American people are used to better made goods, and as long as an American workingman has 12 cents in his pockets and wants a collar he will bay it. Mr. Rosenthal, who brought in the peti- tion for reduction of tariff on collars and cirffs, does not care one cent what the American working girls earn, only as long as he can import the goods cheap. I have cut collars, etc., worked on the sewing machines, worked in the laundry, run an engine and boiler, and have performed all kinds of work appertaining in the manufacture of collars, cuff's, and shirts, and therefore am thoroughly acquainted with the same. Should the tariff betaken off on collars and cuffs I will start a factory in Germany and laundry them here, as I can manufacture them much cheaper than they can be made in this country, being a staple article. RECAPITULATION. Germany. Earl & Wa- son. Tim & Co. Hand buttonhole fliiished Laundry dozen.. do.... do.... do.... Ffeiinu/s. 164 60 Cents. 68J 17 Cents. 68i 12i 214 85i 71 Machine button-liole Laundered 138 60 57J 17 49i 124 188 m 62 No box or other manufacturing expenses added. Earl & Wilson use a better line than I have calculated, but this is only a comparison to Tim & Go.and others which do a jobbing business, and we have to put a garment manufacturer in the same line as a jobber reaping the profit as Earl & Wilson. Very respectfully yours, Max Hermann. LACES. (Paragraph 373.) Brooklyn, 1*J". T., September, 1893. SiE : We trust that your committee will decide that at this time it is inexpedient to reduce the present tariff rate on lace goods, and that they will also provide means or measures to prevent the present gross undervaluations in the invoice iirice and the understatements in the quantity of yards or dozen of yards actually contained in imported cases of lace goods. To maintain this industry so far against great odds has been hard work. By diligence and economy, favored with the patronage of deal- ers in all parts of the United States, we have been enabled to maintain our industry, and have at times given employiueut to near a thousand 876 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. persons, whioh has proved a benefit to tliem and to onr city not only, l)ut also many other industries have been aided by our business. Although the amount of goods we inaiinfacture is not large compared, to the quantity of laces used, yet the effect, as is well known, has beeu to compel importers and manufacturers in Europe to reduce their prices to buyers in this country, and by this competition consumers have been benetited many times more than the whole amount of our production. Our Ijice industry has been reported in Europe by buyers of laces for the United States and given as a reason for lower prices. This is one reason among many why it is not for the interest of our country to let this industry fail. At present time and for mouths inore than half of our machines and employes have been and are now idle, mainly because of the large stock of imported laces on the market offered at such low pri(.'es that it is evident the legal rate of duties has not been paid on them. It is admitted that it is a difficult matter to ascertain the cost and value of lace and lace goods generally, either silk or cotton. Man- ufacturers and exporters in Europe take advantage of this fact and name very low prices in their invoices, and leave it to the appraiser to disprove them, and in the press of invoices and other matters devolving upon- him at the New York custom-house, it is simply impossible for him to properly examine and consider tliem. Also, the manner in which laces are put up makes it very easy to deceive in the quantity of yards contained in the cases, which may contain from two to five times that named in the invoice of importation. If there were a thorougli and proper examination of a number of cases of each invoice by the appraiser, aided by competent assistants, most of the fraudulent invoices would soon be stopped. It would be neces- sary to measure and weigh sample lots, etc. Id Europe, as one large manufacturer writes, " the value there of silk lace is based on two-thirds of the wages and one-third only of the raw material, silk." This is the rule, as we understand, for the com- mon run of silk laces in Europe. In the United States the proportion f)r labor averages higher. While Hon. William E. Morrison was chairman of the Committee on Ways and Means in 1886 he requested the Secretary of the Treasury, the Hon. Charles S. Faircluld, to have prepared a schedule of specific duties for silk goods, embroideries, and laces, with view of preventing uuder- valuatious in those classes of goods. The several schedules were duly prepared, biit the idea of specific duties was finally abandoned because no proper bases for valuation could be found, particularly so for laces. The Secretary submitted the schedules to the appraisers of New York, Boston, and Philadelphia for their opinion. Our schedule for laces was submitted to Mr. William Kent, assistant appraiser of New York, for examination, which he condemned, and to prove his opinion he gave a record of a number of invoices of laces (accompanied with samples) that were actually l)eing passed through the New York custom-house. Among his samples were the following: Sample 122, Wliite illusion net: 55 yards, 72 inches wide, weight 26 ounces, cost 16 cents United States currency per yard, $8.80. This is only $4.87 per pound for the finished lace, including all cost of manufacture. These goods require the best raw silk, which at the time was worth in the gum -iiO i)er pound; boiled oft' as it was in the lace, §8 ptT pouiul. Sample 365, Spanish lace: 36 yards, 4J in. wide, weight 6i ounces, cost 5J cents United States currency per yard, $1.98. LACES. 877 This is only $5.44 per pound for Spanisli silk laee clipped, scalloped, smd finished for the consumer. The silli in a boiled-off condition, in which the lace was made, must have cost $7.50 per jjound, and the fin- ished lace $18 per pound. Sample No. 1967, Spanish guipure net: 23.30 meters, 27 inches wide, weight 5 pounds 2 ounces, cost United States currency $17. This is only $5.44 per pound for silk guipure lace. The boiled-off silk at that time, of which the lace was made (for the lace was not made of silk in the gum), must have cost near $8 per pound, and the finished lace $20 per pound. It is understood that raw silk in natural gum condition always loses about one-fourth of its weight in boiling off. These samples given by Appraiser Kent show that silli laces were entered and passed the New York custom-house at an average rate per pound less than the raw silk cost per pound, and probably at only one-third of the manufacturer's cost in Europe; undervaluation is here as evident as the day, and the evidence is furnislied (unwittingly) by the appraiser, Mr. Kent, himself. His point was to prove that it was unadvisable to have si^eciflc duties. Mr. Kent gave also the record of other samples, two of which we cite: Sample No. 1.569, Chantilly lace, 14i yards, 37 inches wide, weight 13| ounces, cost $3.53 United States currency per yard, $36.68. This is $43.37 per pound. Sample 10183, Chantilly lace : 6|- meters, 37 inches wide, weight 81 ounces, cost United States currency $14.05. This is $35.76 per pound. Kotice the high prices per pound of these last two samples, but it is no higher than many silk and fine cotton laces cost. The last two sam- ples may have been the importation of someone not a dealer. Mr. Kent's full report will be found printed in the Secretary of the Treasury's letter to Hon. William E. Morrison of June 14, 188{j. The fact remains that invoices of silk laces are passed through the custom-house in which the goods are valued at less than the cost of the silk yarns of which they are made. It is these undervaluations in price, and false statements in quantity, in the invoices of importations that are jeopardizing the lace industry in the United States. Because of this, for mouths not half of our machines have been running or our operators at work. If adequate measures are not adopted and rigidly enforced to prevent and stop undervaluations of all kinds, the efforts to manufacture lace goods in this country will utterly fail, unless the price of labor here is brought down to the starvation prices of Continental Europe. The Hon. Mr. Fairchild, in his letter (June 14, 1886) to Hon. Mr. Morrison, states — That of all the silks imported into the country in the p.ist yo:ir, 98 per cent were entered at New York, and that fully 90 per cent of the.se inipovtations represented consignments on foreigu account and were as a rule undervalitod. The appraiser, in his effort to maintain the legal rate of duty named for "laces," is opposed by some importers or agents of manufacturers in Europe, who claim, and ha^•c claimed successfully, that certain la(/e goods are not, and should not be called, laces, because they are known by some other name in the trade, andtliereforetlieyoughttobe eniered at a lower rate of duty as goods not otherwise provided for. This is a source of many disputes, and vexatious lawsuits that are very costly 878 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. to the Government. Laces are known commercially, in trade, and in nso by very many names ; not one name, nor a dozen names, will describe or cover the article of lace or lace goods. The word "laces" as named in the present tariif covers all laces or lace goods, for it is the family name. Fabrics or goods made on lace machines are distinctly different from fabrics made on the loom. In the lace machine all the threads in the fabrics run lengthways with the goods as made; some threads follow- ing the pattern will vary or turn as required. JJut in loom work, as yon well know, there are the warp threads and the weft or filling threads that are thrown directly across the fabric. In lai-e fabrics no such threads are thrown across; the construction of the lace machines do not permit it; therefore it is easy to distinguish lace from loom fabrics. No particular name, therefore, should govern the rate of duty. We suggest that it is for the interest of the Government and the trade that one single ad valorem duty be placed on all laces or goods made on lace machines, be they wide or narrow, regardless of commercial names or any other designation. There is no other fabric that can be so easily undervalued in the invoice of importation without detection as lace, and there is probably no other article that is allowed to pass so freely without paying duty through the custom-house in the trunks of the tourists from Europe as lace. As laces are a distinct and definite class of textile fabrics, and as the family name of laces includes a variety of styles, qualities, and x>rices under many names, there ought to be but one rate of duty, and that ad valorem on all classes of lace, irrespective of any class or style or com- mercial name or trade designation, and this ought to be plainly so stated in any tarifl' bill enacted. A single uniform ad valorem rate would then rest equally, or in the same ratio, on all grades of lace goods. It is for the credit and interest of the Government that frauds on her revenue should be jtrevented and those who comndt them be in some way pnnished. This would also encourage the honest importer in his effort to do business. There is one way to stop fraudulent practices (which was effective before the law was repealed), and that is where the intent to cheat the Government is evident the merchandise be forfeited to the Government for its benefit and benefit of the appraiser and his department. We send with this communication samples of silk and cotton laces for your inspection, as they may afford you a better idea of the goods in question. In addition to the reasons given why the duty on silk and cotton laces shoiild remain as they now are and not be reduced, we would state — That the machinery now in use here has been imported from England, and paid a duty of 45 per cent, besides heavy freight and other charges. Some of these lace machines have cost from $5,000 to $6,000, and weigh over 15,000 pouuds. They are intricate and difficult to operate and require constant repairs; skilled designers, draftsmen, and operators have to be brought over from England and France. Now young Amer- icans are learning the art of lace-making in all its branches, and this new branch of industry is giving employment to many hundreds who are anxious to obtain work for themselves and their families. There is no other class of textile fabrics so difficult to make, or that takes the operator so long a time to learn and become skilled in the LACES. 879 art, as lace. Labor, skill, and design make up tlie value of lace more tlian the cost of material. The wages paid to lace operators in this country are from 100 to 200 per cent higher than that paid for the same class of work in England, France, and Germany, and, beside, their machinery is occupied night and day with two sets of hands, while here it is fifty-five hours only for the week. The business at best is hazardous, as is proved by the history of lace maritifacturers in Europe, and the article iu respect to value is perish- able, especially as regards silk laces; the style, make, i)attern, and color are subject to the caprice of fashiim. Most all the incidental supplies used in manufacturing lace are pro- tected by a duty of 20 to 45 per cent. Lace is a luxury in the higliest sense, and the duty collected on it is not a burden on the poor. On the contrary, hundreds of poor families have been benefited and maintained here many years by the lace industry. The industry of making cotton lace goods of every description in England and on the continent of Europe, is a large and important one. Blillions of capital are invested in it. Large communities are profitably employed and supx)orted by this industry, which has proved to be a source of great wealth wherever it exists, but of all the textile fabrics it is the most diflicult to establish in a new country. The quantity of cotton laces manufactured in England exceeds (it is estimated) that of silk, more than twenty times, and the proportion of laces and embroideries made on the continent is nearly as large. Mr. Jolin Heatlicoat (one of theinN'entors of the lace machine) gave to Notting- ham a trade which in fifty years has mainly assisted to quadruple its poijulution, giving employment to 150,000 work people, and for the past thirty ye:irs adding £4,000,000 sterling annually to the trade of the country. (From a eulogy'ofMr. John Heathcoat, after his death in 1861. Encyclopedia Brittanica.) Some of the most artistic and highest cost laces are made of cotton, either by hand or machinery. The industry of making cotton lace is known to be more sure and stable than that of making silk. Laces made of cotton or linen thread can be cleaned or washed many times without perceptible injury, while laces made from silk yarns would be ruined. This is a great advantage in favor of cotton and linen thread lace, and the i)rinclpal reason why it is preferred before silk. The quantity of cotton laces used in the United States, it is estima- ted, is more than twenty times that of silk. There are tens of millions of yards of cotton lace imported every season and hundreds of thou- sands of lace curtains. Of the large quantity used in this country very little comparatively is produced here. Why are they not and why have they not been made here? Simply because manufacturers who have given this indus- try a thorough trial have not been able to compete in style and assort- ment with the endless variety, and in price with the extensive stocks, offered at low prices in this market by agents of the large producers in Europe, who, by a system of undervaluation without penalties, do not pay the full duty of the present low ad valorem rate. The great cost of producing a new pattern of lace by machine is in the making of the first piece. After that the more pieces made the cheaper it can be sold. In England and on the Continent those engaged in making laces have large plants and great facilities for producing many new patterns j 8oO also a large market and assured demand for many pieces of every new pattern produced. Their macliiuery is made on the spot. They do not pay 45 per cent duty on that, besides lieavy freight charges, and for wood packing cases, which for some lace machines often cost over $75. The labor of making and finishing the lace is from two to four times greater in this country than in Europe. The cotton yarn used in making cotton lace is especially made for that purpose. It is harder twist than that which is used for common loom work, and often part is reverse twist or twisted to the left as well as to the right, and as it is required to be even and smooth it is gener- ally gassed. In England, there being a steady demand for these yarns, they are supplied to the lace-makers at low rates and in large quanti- ties. This class of yarns are not made in this country at all, but would be if there was a demand for them. On these j^arns we pay 40 per cent duty besides the heavy charges or expense of importing them. In England and on the Continent they have in every branch of the lace trade educated and experienced hands as well as other advantages. For the present most of our operators have to be instructed in the art. If the duty is retained and the business is once fairly established in the United States of making silk and cotton laces for all personal adornment and for use in beautifying and furnishing oiir habitations, this great industry would before many years greatly enrich our coun- try, giving emjiloyment to more than half a million of jieople, besides adding many other industries in building the costly machines, making yarns, furnishing supplies, dyeing goods, etc. It is known that the people of the tlnited States are the largest buyers of lace in the world. Eespectfully submitted. Jennings Lace Woeks, A. Gr. Jennings, Fresident. liACB CURTAINS. (Paragraph 373.) Sir: The undersigned, the founder of and a representative of the lace-curtain industry of the United States, respectfully submits for your consideration the following statement of facts: The lace curtains made in this country are jacquard-machine made and come in competition with the jacquard machine-made curtains of IvTottingham, England, and Ayrshire, Scotland, and the tamboured curtains of Saxony and Switzerland, in the manufacture of which no jacquards are applied. The tariff on all imported curtains, irrespective of grade or quality, is 60 per cent ad valorem. In manufacturing the jacquard-machine curtains 45 per cent of the cost is consumed in material, 50 per cent in labor, and 5 per cent in expense. The higher grades of lace curtains, in which we are particularly interested, are manufactured entirely of yarn made from Egyptian and sea island cotton. The tariff on said yarn averages 50 per cent. Men in Nottingham and Ayrshire, on the jacquard-machine made curtains, are paid from 24 to 30 shillings per week. For the same labor we pay from .$12 to $21 per week. There women are paid from 8 to 18 shillings per weekj here we pay from $2.50 to $0 per week. In other LACE CURTAINS. 881 words, we pay twice as much for labor here as is paid tliere. In Saxony and Switzerland men receive from $1.50 to $0 i)er week, and women from $1.50 to ^i per week for making tlie tamboured lace curtains, commonly known as Brussels point, Irish point, and Swiss. The tariff on onr machinery, which we were comj)elled to imx^ort, was 45 per cent. The higher cost of land, buildings, insnrance, and depre- ciation here, in our opinion, makes the investment at least 50 per cent greater than in Europe. Against the disadvantages arising from the cost of raw materials, labor, and expense, we have the advantage of the tariff on the imported lace curtains, the cost of transportation, also of being in the home market. By reason of said advantages, we are able to hold our own, except against the cheaper grades of tamboured lace curtains. If the tariff on lace curtains should be reduced, we shall be compelled to close our factory, unless there shall be a more than corresponding reduction in the cost of yarn, which is our raw material. Inasmuch as the raw cotton is imported into this country free of any duty or tax whatever, I submit that a 25 per cent duty ad valorem on yarn is a greater protection to the yarn manufacturer than a duty of 50 -per cent on lace curtains is to the lace-curtain manufacturer. The great item of expense in making the tamboured lace curtains is labor. On account of the vast difference in cost of labor in Saxony and Switzerland, as compared with this country, we submit that under no circumstances should the tariff on tamboured lace cnrtaius be reduced. As it is, we are now unable to compete with the lower grades of said curtains. Eespectfully submitted. J. C. Atkin, Manager of the Wyoming Valley Lace Mills, Willces Barre, Pa. SEPTE3IBEE, 19, 1893. lACE CUETAINS. (Paragraph 373.) CEEIGHTON & BXJECH, ISfeic York, September 13, 1893. SiES : We beg to place before you a few facts in regard to the estab- lishment of, and increase in, in the lace-curtain industry in this coun- try, under the present tariff. In the year 1891 there was practically but one manufactory using from 350,000 to 400,000 pounds of yarn. There are now seven facto- ries using between 3,000,000 and 4,000,000 pounds. The value of the raw cotton, which ^ e formerly exported to manufacture these goods, taking the lowest estimate, is, say, 3,000,000 pounds, at 8 cents, $240,000. This cotton, when manufactured here into curtains, is worth about $1 per pound, say $3,000,000. Thus, by the establishment of the industry here, the difference between these amounts, which is a very consider- able sum, goes largely to our work peoi)le, and the gold, which would have to be exported to pay for the goods if manufactured abroad, is kept in this country. With a continuance of the present duties we believe that the manu- facturer of lace curtains will be still further largely increased, and that T H 56 882 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. finer goods, requiring skilled labor, will be produced, thereby, adding materially to the benefits above noted. Since the establishment of this manufacture in America it can be readily shown that the consumer has derived the benefit of a reduction of 20 per cent in the price of curtains. We would further state that there is now invested in this country, in the industry, over $2,500,000, a large portion of which is in imported machinery on which a duty of 45 per cent has been paid, and that aHy distirrbance to the industry would render the machinery almost worth- less. As the wages paid in this country for this class of labor rule mucli higher than are paid in England, and as a new industry of this kind requires at least five years for its firm establishment, we respectfully submit that any reduction on the tarilf at the present time Avould seri- ously cripple the American manufacturer. The SCEANTON Lace Guetain Manxtpactueing Co., Agents Oeeighton & BuECn. The Ameeican Lace Manufactueing Co., Maok Finley, President. John Beomi.et & Sons, Philadeljjhia. EowLAND & Schmidt, PhiladeJ^jhia. HOMEE Beos.' Caepet Co.. Saml. Homee, Je., President, Philadelphia. TEXTILE WORKERS OF PHILADELPHIA. Statement of Mr. John S. Stewart, of Philadelphia, Pa., chairman of the delegation of textile workers of that city, who presented a petition containing over 10,000 names, and read the following paper: addeess of textile wage-woekees befoee the committee on VP^ATS AND means. Mr. Ohaieman. The delegates comprising this body, to which you have so kindly granted a hearing, have been selected by their fellow- workmen from among at least 50,000 wage-earners employed in the pro- duction of textiles in upwards of 200 mills in and about the greatest of American manufacturing centers — the city of Philadelphia. The petitions we have been delegated to present to you are signed by the thousands who work beside us in the various dcjiartments of the great hives of industry and thrift, the cotton, woolen, silk, cbe- nille, upholstery, lace, and carpet mills, from whence we have hereto- fore drawn wages for the support of ourselves and our families. These petitions have not been prepared, nor aie they ]iresented, in any partisan spirit, notwithstanding any assertion wliich may have been jnade to that effect, nor has any one been coerced into signing them. Our presence is demanded here simply by the necessity of fnrnish- ing food and raiment for ourselves and our wives and families depend- ent upon us. We are not the bosses nor the mill-owners, nor are we in any sense either directly or indirectly their representatives, but on the othei' hand we produce tlie goods by the labor of our bands. TEXTILE "WORKERS OF PHILADELPHIA. 883 We are not self-appointed "walkins' delegates," nor are we dem- agogues striving to lead workingmen " into paths they know not." We are here because our means of living is either menaced or has been taken from us and because the loom is silent and the shuttle motionless that our eyes have been accustomed to watch and our hands to control. We come direct from our humble homes where our \Yives and babies are praying for the success of this appeal to you, who, by the will of a maj(n-ity of your constituents, have not only been selected to legislate for this great American people, but have also been again singled out from among you.r colleagues in Congress to serve as members of this most important Committee on Ways and Means. The eyes of the whole country are upon you and great indeed is your responsibility. Let me bring to your minds a picture of thousands of to-day firesides in our great city where sits the head of the family in enforced idleness, with the winter approaching and with the wolves of cold and hunger on the threshold. K"o i^ossibility of work, and the majority of his friends and neighbors in tlie same sad plight. He is honest, industri- ous, law-abiding, ablebodied, and intelligent, but he is powerless in himself. As an American citizen, a wage earner, a producer, demand- ing only that which is right, he has delegated to us, his fellow-work- men, the duty of placing his case in your hands, relying upon your sense of justice, your wisdom, your manhood, your patriotism to pro- tect him in his means of gaining a livelihood. Therefore, in his behalf and in the spirit expressed in this petition, which we are here to present, we implore you that you will speedily give to the country an assurance that the tariff, so far at least as it relates to textile goods, shall not be disturbed. Eise, we beseech you, above the spirit of partisanship or sectionalism, and consider our jjlea on belialf of American workmen, irrespective o.f what this party or that party may have inserted in their " catch-vote" platforms. We come straight from the masses, and we speak in no uncertain tone with the voice of the common people, and we pray of you to embrace this opportunity of iiroving yourselves by your action in this matter, which is so vital to the interests of your fellow-countrymen, that you can be and that you will be above all else American patriots. By so doing you will not only prove yourselves among the greatest of politicians, but you will win as well the blessings of your fellow-men. That you may understand and appreciate to some extent the dei)res- sion in textile pursuits the following comparative statistics have been collated from the mills in Philadelphia and vicinity. For four weeks in the month of August, 1892, in 17 mills the total number of persons employed was 10,109. The average hours worked per week by eacii individual was 60. The aggregate number of hours worked per montli by all employed was 240. For four weeks in the month of August, 1893, in the same mills the total number of persons employed was 7,475. The average hours worked per week by each individual was 17|. The aggregate number of hours worked per month by all employed was 69, showing a decrease of 71 i)er cent in time, 20 per cent in number of hands. These figures have not been sclerted, but are taken from all mills without excep)tion or omission, and they speak louder than any words that can be framed by human tongue and are by far the strongest argument we can use to persuade you to give heed to our appeals, as 884 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. stated in our petitions, with wliich our fellow worklngmen have over- whelmed us and which, on behalf of the 10,228 signers, I now have tI;o honor, as chairman of this delegation, of presenting to you. Mr. Stewart (after reading the paper). The industry in which I am interested is upholstery and chenille. Under the McKiuley tariff bill the business increased in proportion; and not only that, brrt the price has not increased to the consumer, but has decreased considera- bly, because it has stimulated home competition , making it so keen in that industry as to bring the price down. We know from exioerience as workingmen that this tariff as now levied and collected has beea an assistance in wages. I am here to talk about nothing but wages. Mr. McMiLLiN. The present law was passed in 1890? Mr. Stewart. Yes, sir. Mr. McMiLLiN. What increase of wages was given in your chenille mills in consequence of that? Mr. Stewart. I look upon the tariff as a protection against impor- tation. Mr. McMiLLiN. What increase of wages was given to the laborers in the chenille mills in consequence of the passage of the McKinley bill? Mr. Stewart. There was a large increase, because it gives us steadier work. Mr. McMiLLTN. What per diem increase, if any, did it give you? Mr. Stewart. I did not say there was any. The price of the article did not increase, but came down. Mr. McMiLLiN. 1 And by turning to the law that the rate on che- nille under the act of 1883 was 40 per cent. Mr. Stewart. Yes, sir. Mr. McMiLLiN. So that there was an increase to 60 per cent in the McKinley bill? Mr. Stewart. Yea, sir. . Mr. McMiLLiN. There was an increase of one-half of the original duty; that is, one-half of the amount of the duty was added to it, mak- ing it 60. Were your wages increased ? Mr. Stewart. The price of the article was not increased, because it was already so great. Mr. McMiLLiN. Your wages were not increased in consequence of that? Mr. Stewart. But there is steadier work, which we claim is an increase. Mr. McMiLLiN There was no increase in your wages? Mr. Stewart. Well, at the end of the week we found we had six day's work. Mr. McMiLLiN. How many hours are you working? Mr. Stewart. We are working forty-six hours. The firm in which I am employed has two branches, upholstery and chenille. The che- nille branch this week is entirely unenixtloyed. Jlr. Payne. How was it a year ago I Mr. Stewart. We were busy. Mr. Payne. You were then working six days a week? Mr. Steavart: Yes; and continued to do so up to this recent de- jiression. Mr. Payne. Before the passage of the McKinley bill, I suppose you were glad to get four days a week? Mr. Stewart. The McKinely bill increased the industry so much that after that the production was so great that it gave employment to many more men. TEXTILE WORKERS OP PHILADEIjAHIA. 885 Mr. Gear. The result was that goods were not imijorted? Mr. Stewart. Yes, sir. We worked more aud got more benefit than we had before. Mr. Dalzbll Without giving the names of the gentlemen, give us the industries represented by your delegation. ]\[r. Stewart. Lace curtains, Brussels carpet, upholstery, worsted- spinning, wolleus, worsted cloth, ingrain carpets, chenille curtains, silk ribbon, hosiery, blankets, and cotton goods. The district from which we come to-day is in an awful condition. We are well aware of the fact, and many of us are iu terrible straits. We believe honestly as workingmen that were it not for the threatening attitude of the tariff at this time that our business would be going on. There is no other menace holding over us, except the fear of the passage of a new tariff bill, because importers and commission men will not send in orders, but are waiting for the tariff to be brought down, and then they hope to get the goods in lower. We are here asking that the tariff' be not disturbed, for on the other side they are getting ready to supply our market. Mr. Turner. At whose suggestion does this delegatiou come here? Mr. Stewart. The workingmen of Philadelphia. Mr. Turner. It arose out of your fear of an improper disturbance of the tariff? Mr. Stewart. Out of the fear of present tariff changes. The indus- tries we represent were never in such a condition as they are today. One year ago there was scarcely an idle loom iu our district. A man could get work in a few hours, whereas to day he might walk for hours looking for work and he would be laughed at. Mr. Turner. Do the manufacturers have anything to do with the visit of you and your colleagues to-day? Mr. Stewart. No, sir; we are here as representative workingmen. Mr. Turner. What do you think about putting wool or the raw material of your grade of industry on the free list? Mr. Steavart. We are not here to ask anything else at all. We appear before your Committee of Ways and Means and ask you as American citizens and workingmen not to touch the tariff on textile goods. Mr. Turner. Tou should consider that perhaps some may think that to give your manufacturing friends free raw material might improve the conditions of labor. Mr. Stewart. I believe honestly that if you destroy the home com- petition or home production of wool, then we will have a foreign monop- oly of wool, and as soon as foreign wool drives the American producer out of the market, up goes the price of wool. Competition has kept the price down. Mr. Turner. Is there no competition in foreign wool? Mr. Si'EAVART. England largely controls the wool market of the world. It is her colonies from whence it comes, jrincipally from Aus- tralia. Mr. Turner. Do you not think that the low price of foreign wool would stimulate American production ? Mr. Stewart. When you destroy the industry by experiment, you can not see what to do after it is destroyed. Mr. Turner. You would maintain the duty on wool? Mr. Stewart. We are not here to argue that point. You asked me what I thought, and I have answered you. Home competition has gone 886 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. a great way in keeping up tliej)rice of articles such as came under the jMcKinley Irill. Mr. Turner. The tariff on woolisliigher than ever it was? I\ir. Stewart. I have not studied up that question, but I will say, because you ask me, that the American wool producer is the American farmer. From a lair and honest standpoint, 1 thiiik that the American farmer gets as nuich as the American manufacturer gets on cloth. I belie\-e that if you take the duty olf wool, tlie wool-grower will demand that the dirty be taken off cloth, and I feel that we could not afford to come here and advocate that we be destroyed at his expense. Tliey would retaliate. Mr. Turner. Do you not think, furthermore, that if that were done, possibly it would stimulate woolen manufacture in this country so as to greatly enlarge the demand for labor in the mills? Mr. Stewart. I can not see, sir, Avhy the woolen manufacturers, under tlie conditions as they now exist in other industries, ought not to be and have been as prosperous as any. That is the histoiy of our couTitry. There has been more wages paid, more investments made by working people in our building associations in Philadelphia than ever before in the history of the city. Mr. Turner. However, you have no particular knowledge as to wool i Mr. Stewart. I could not answer as to that, because I do not keep the run of it. I only want to answer from facts within my own expe- rience. Mr. Turner. Under a high protective tariff', American wool is the lowest in the world. Mr. Stewart. We believe further that any reduction in the tariff will be followed by a reduction in wages, and a reduction of all kinds of duties. Mr. Turner. I have no doubt that in your organizations you have discussed this matter frequently with intelligence, as j^ou seem to dis- cuss it to-day, and I would like to ask you if wool is put upon the free list without injuring the farmer, and thereby reducing the price of woolen goods, would it not be better for poor people in the way of cloth- ing and home comforts as well as an increased demand for workmen in the woolen mills ? Would it not stimulate the production of woolen goods to take the duty off' wool? Mr. Stewart. I have this to say of the difference in the amount of duty in price of the wool in a suit of clothes. The amount of duty on a suit of clothes which an individual would wear would not amount to much. There is only a few pounds of wool in a suit, even if it is ])oor wool. This is the difference the poor man pays for his warm clothing. Mr. Payne. Very cheap wool has not stimulated your industry much within the last month? Mr. Stewart. It does not so appear. Mr. McMiLLiN. Nor has the McKinley bill. Mr. Stewart. I can say, gentlemen, that I think it is the fear of the repeal of the McKiidey bill that has largely brought about this panic which know prevails, because in many industries, as you gentle- men know, the financial situation has not improved. Wedo notseethe improvement in the conditions of the textile workers. Mr. Turner. Have you noticed that there are adulterants in woolen goods in recent years ? Mr. Stewart. No, sir. I believe there ai'e as much adulterants used on the other side as here. TEXTILE WORKERS OF PHILADELPHIA. 887 Mr. Turner. Tliey nse ailulteraiits on both sides? Mr. Stewart. Yes; becausetliey adulterate almost everything where they can iise it with deception ; and they would use adulteration in almost anything, unless it was such as cotton goods, both here and abroad. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you believe that the wool-sellers are iu com- petition so as to extort a higlier price for wool? Mr. Stewart. I do not know. I simply know that if there is a reduction Mr. Breckinridge. You have a reason. Mr. Stewart. I do not believe there is an American combination. I believe the manufacturers out in Ohio and Indiana are small i^ro- ducers of wool and they have to shij) at once. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you believe that tlie producers could enter into a combination in order to extort high prices? - Mr. Stewart. I do not think they could, because I do not think the American farmers have got money enough to store wool a-\^'ay. Mr. Breckinridge. If they could not do it iu this country, why can they do it in the other countries! Mr. Stewart. We do not get it here; but it comes through large importing houses in London and Liverpool. The farmers ship directly to the factories. Mr. Breckinridge. Then your position is that it is impossible to combine in a single country, but that it is possible to combine in all countries ? Mr. Stewart. I believe we are differently situated here. There is a vast difference in sending a man out in Indiana and Ohio to buy wool and sending a man from England who goes directly to Australia or Asia, or places where they grow so much wool. Mr. Breckinridge. You do not believe they can buy from the farm- ers in this country? Mr. Stewart. I do not believe they could do it with our small crop of wool. Mr. Gear. Are operatives in Philadelphia paid fairly good wages since the passage of the McKinley bill? Mr. Stewart. It has been one of the best laws for the textile work- ers that has ever been placed upon the statute books. We get steady work and fair wages. Mr. Gear. A large change or reduction in the tariff' would affect your wages ? Mr. Stewart. It would, unquestionably. Mr. Gear. How? Mr. Stewart. It would bring down the price of wages. Mr. Gear. Would it close some of the factories? Mr. Stewart. Yes ; or compel us +o work on a level wath the wages across the water. Mr. Gear. You do not want to do that? Mr. Stewart. We think that in producing these articles we should be jjrotected. Mr. Gear. You think that if the opportunity is given, competition will bring the price down? Mr. Stewart. That is my experience in these goods. It has brought it down and kept it down. Mr. Gear. Did not the passage of the McKinley law stop the impor- tation of certain kinds of goods from other countries? Mr. Stewart. It has stopped the importation and iucreased produc- 888 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. tioii here. A cLaiige in the present law would nicake a great disturb- ance. Wr. Gear. If a change is made in the law would other industries start up 1 Mr. Stewart. There would be no industry started, and wages would go down. I do not say that factories would shut up. I believe there would be a material reduction in wages. We are American citizens, and we expect to live here and want to prosper. Mv. Gear. Are you an American by birth? Mr. Stewart. No, sir. I have been in this country going on eight- een years. Mr. Gear. Where were you born? Mr. Stewart. H^ear Belfast. Mr.' Gear. You were a workiugman in that country? Mr. Stewart. I never worked there much, because I was rather young when I came out. Mr. Gear. You have any number of men in Pliiladelphia who did come from that country and worked there? Mr. Stewart. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. What did they come here for? Mr. Stewart. To make a better living. Mr. Gear (ironically). I suppose a good many went back? Mr. Stewart. No, sir. Mr. BtJRROWS. How many worlcingmen are in your delegation? Mr. Stewart. There are about fifteen here. Several desire to speak, if the committee desires to hear them. Mr. Btnum. You stated that the price of goods has been reduced under the McKinley bill. How are the manufacturers going to pay an increase and give you steadier work, if that is the case? Mr. Stewart. I did not say that wages were increased. I said it increased our wages, because we had steadier work. Mr. Bynum. How have wages been kept up? When you had not competition the price was higher. Mr. Stewart. I did not say that. Mr. Btnum. You say the price is higher, and that the effect of the McKinley bill was to reduce the price to the consumer? Mr. Stewart. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynum. How is the manufacturer going to make steadier prices and steadier work if that is the case? Mr. Stewart. I think there is scarcely an article Mr. Bynum. Please answer my question. Mr. Stewart. You must allow me to answer in my own way. There is scarcely an article the price of which, after it has been put on the market, has not gone down. Mr. Bynum. Would not the manufacturer have reduced the wages of the workin gmen ? Mr. Stewart. No, sir. When an articile gets to a certjiin i)rice and it is no longer profitable it is not made. Mr. Bynum. You stated that the effect of the McKinley bill has been to reduce i^rices to the consumer, and at the same time you say that an increased demand has enabled the manufacturers to give you steadier emyloyment and therefore more wages. Where has the manufacturer found a better market at a lower price? Mr. Stewart. It is a larger market. Mr. Bynum. Do higlier prices make a larger market? Mr. Stewaet. The market is the consujner. TEXTILE WORKERS OF ' PHILADELPHIA. 889 Mr. Btnum. As long as the price is up does not that make a market? Mr. Stewart. It is the demand of the consumer that makes a market. If there is no consumer there is no market. , Mr. Btnum. How can the workingman be benefited? Mr. Stewart. The McKinley tariff act has kept out foreign compe- tition and created home competition which has brought thejirice down. Mr. Bynum. Is not this the case — that as long as a man has a high price he will supply the market? Mr. Stewart. Unless somebody else wants to do it at a less price. Mr. Btwtjm. I understand that you have been claiming that prices have been higher since the McKialey bill was passed? Mr. Stewart. Take a large class of goods, say cloth worth $1.25 or $2 a yard, and yon put in improved machinery and put that goods in the market at $1.65 or $1.50, won't you have to come down with the market? Mr. Btntjm. Tou started by saying that goods were selling for more money since the passage of the McKinley bill. Now your thoughts are right the reverse. Mr. Stewart. I say that home competition brought the price down. Mr. Byz^uji. Then home competition has brought down the price of the product lower than ever? Mr. Stewart. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynum. And the condition of the workingman is better than before? Mr. Stewart. Yes, sir; unctuestionably. We are getting steady work, undoubtedly. Mr. Byntjm. You say that if the tariff is taken off wool it would destroy that industry in this country? Mr. Stewart. That is a question I am not here to discuss. Mr. Bynum. I want to see if you know anything about it. Do you not know that this industry has been going down ever since the increase of the tariff on wool? Do you not kuow that the number of sheep in Pennsylvania, Ohio, and New York — even in Ohio — has been dimin- ished under this high protective tariff ? Mr. Stewart. I know that if you want to get an increase in the num- ber of sheep you have got to put more duty on. Mr. Bynum. You do not know that when we have put the duty on the price has diminished? Mr. Stewart. No, sir. Mr. Bynum. Do you not know that wool has sold lower the year after the McKinley bill was passed than ever? Mr. Stewart. I do not kuow those facts. Mr. Bynum. You do not know? Mr. Stewart. No. Why is it if wool has gone down under the McKinley bill you do not repeal it? Mr. Bynum. In this country we have only produced 150,000,000 out of some 600,000,000 pounds of wool raised in the world. You manufac- ture carpets largely in Philadelphia, I believe? Mr. Stewart. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynum. How about the wool going into carpets? Mr. Stewart. There are other gentlemen here who will answer that. Mr. Bynum. Are carpet wools imported into this country? Mr. Stewart. The lower-grade wools are imported. Mr. Bynum. Practically, do we produce any carpet wools in this country ? 890 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. Mr. Stewart. If we had carpet wools it would not be necessary to imjiort this cheap wool. Mr. Bynum. Do you not know tliat you do not import carpet wool? Mr. Stbwaet. We won't buy inferior wool if we can get good wool for the same price. Mr. Bynum. Do you not use good wcol for car^jets? Mr. Ste\yart. VVe use expeusiYc wool. Mr. BYNU3I. You do not grow tliat wool in this country? Mr. Steyv'AET. There is wodl in this country adapted to it. Mr. Bynum. 'W'here is it grown? ]\Ir. Stewart. In Dakota. It is possible to produce it there. Mr. Bynum. At about 14 cents a pound? Mr. Stewart. If the industry is protected it will be stimulated. It is possible to do anything. Mr. Bynum. You want to stimulate the farmer to grow sheep? jMr. Stewart. I am not here to argue about the farmer at all. Mr. Bynum. Do you know anythiug about carpet wool bringing 14 cents? :Mr. Stewart. Good wool brings IS to 20 cents. Mr. Bynum. Good wool is worth about 18 cents and carpet wool is worth about one-half. Mr. Stewart. I am not positive about that, and I do not want to answer as to anything I do not know. Mr. Bynum. If wool be put upon the free list, and we thereby increase the price of the home product, would it not be better to have Avool on the free list? Mr. Stewart. If wool is cheaper under the McKinley bill we will have wool so cheap that there will be no call for importing it. Mr. Bynum. Do you not know that we have to import wool to mix with American wools? Mr. Stewart. That is for the finer grade of goods. Those who wear that grade of goods should be made to pay for them — that is, those who buy them. Mr. By'num. Did you ever examine the reports of wages paid in Eng- land and in the United States? Mr. Stewart. Y''es, sir. Mr. Bynum. Are those correct statements of the wages paid? Mr. Stewart. There are gentlemen, practical men, who have worked in England, and I think these gentlemen ought to be called, in all fair- ness, and let them substantiate what they know, and not hackle one man Avith questions. ]\Ir. Bynum. What kind of labor is there in woolen goods? ?Sr. Stewart. I would like to substitute one of these other gentle- men who has had experience. Mr. Payne. You do not make cloth? Mv. Stewart. I am representing one particular industry, chenille goods and upholstery. I will call on Mr. Fitzgerald. TEXTILE WORKERS. STATEMENT OF MB. SMITH FITZGERALD. Mr. Chairman. We are here, as our chairman has said before, to discuss these matters in the way that you are trying to draw them out. We are here as workingmen, not as manufacturers, and we should not be expected to know the different rates of duties and such like. We come here to appeal to you in behalf of our industry, and to ask that TEXTILE WORKERS OF PHILADELPHIA. 891 the tariff remain as it is on textiles. I do not tliiiik it is fair to trj to embarrass a man by asking liim questions .on different branches of business in Philadelphia. I happen to AFork in a wool department, and may be able to answer a little more satisfactorily some questions than Mr. Stewart; but still I do not profess to know all about it. We all know that wool has been coming down, regardless of the tariff. Mr. Byntoi. Was it lower in 3890 than in 1889! Did it not fall? Mr. PayjME (interposing). Owing to overproduction in Australia! Mr. Fitzgerald. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynxjm. Have yon examined statistics as to the effect it had upon the American product? Mr. Fitzgerald. I do not know that I have examined that. Mr. Byntjm. Do you know that the duty was put on wool iu 18C7? Mr. Fitzgerald. That was when I was a little boy. Mr. Bykum. Did not wool begin to go down after that? Mr. Fitzgerald. I do not know that to be the reason. We want to get at the facts. jMr. Bykum. You want to get at the suppositions instead of the facts. Mr. Fitzgerald. No; not exactly. Mr. Bynum. In 1891 the McKinley bill was passed, and wool has been lower than ever before. Mr. Fitzgerald. It would have been lower still if you had not had any duty. Mr. Bynxjm. Is it not a fact that wool is selling in this market, and 3'ou can buy the same grades of wool, at about the same price in Lon- don? Mr. Fitzgerald. Wool in this country has no correct value at the present time. Mr. BynI'M. Is it not a fact that wool is selling in America at the same price it is in London! Mr. Fitzgerald. No; it is about 14 cents. Mr. Bykum. It is about 14 cents? Some has brought 22. Mr. Payne. The manufacturers are not buying now? Mr. Fitzgerald. No, sii-; nobody wants it now. It is very uncer- tain. Mr. Payne. When do you get a market for the goods you are making now! Mr. Fitzgerald. We are making them now for sale? Mr. Payne. When would you get a market! Mr. Fitzgerald. Next spring. Mr. Payne. You are making for next spring and summer? Mr. Fitzgerald. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. So, now, in manufacturing goods you have to take into consideration whether or not the reduction of tariff will be made? Mr. Fitzgerald. We have to know what the difference, if any, is going to be. Mr. Payne. And if you believe we are to have free wool by next spring you would have to buy at free wool prices in order to get on a level with the manufacturers who buy for next spring and summer busi- ness? Mr. Fitzgerald. Yes, sir. Mr. McMiLLiN. What percentage of the woolen mills in your section are idle now! Mr. Fitzgerald. The woolen mills are about all stopped. Mr. McMiLLiN. What percentage of labor heretofore employed in woolen mills are now out of employment? 892 FI.AX, JUTE AND HEMP. Mr. Fitzgerald. I could nnt answer. I could go over it and meu- tiou a few that are completely stopped. Mr. McMiLLiN. What percentage of laborers are out of employment or running on reduced time? Mr. Fitzgerald. Some are running two or three days. . Mr. McMiLLiN. Has there been any reduction in wages? Mr. Fitzgerald. Not in any woolen mill that I know of. Mr. Mc^^JiLLiN. Has there been a reduction of time or stoppage? Mr. Fitzgerald. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. How was it a year ago? Mr. Fitzgerald. They were all running. Mr. Payne. They were running on full time? Mr. Fitzgerald. Yes, sir. Mr. Burrows. Are you American born? Mr. Fitzgerald. No, sir; I am a Scotchman. I came to this coun- try in 1873. Mr. Burrows. What is your business? Mr. Fitzgerald. T am a wool sorter. Mr. Burrows. What business had you there? Mr. Fitzgerald. The same business. Mr. Burrows. State the rate of wages there and here. Mr. Fitzgerald. A wool sorter in Bradford, England, where I worked, earns about 30 shillings, or $7.50, a week. Mr. Burrows. That was your business? Mr. Fitzgerald. Yes, sir. Mr. Burrows. Is that your business here? Mr. Fitzgerald. Yes, sir. Mr. Burrows. Do you get that wages here for same kind of busi- ness? I\Ir. Fitzgerald. In Philadelphia we get $15, and in some kinds we get 616. ]\rr. Bynum. Is that business wholly done by hand? Mr. Fitzgerald. It is all done by hand. Mr. Burrows. Y'ou use the same "hands" in England that you use h ei' e ? [Laughter.]. Mr. Fitzgerald. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynum. There is no machinery used in it? ]\!r. Fitzgerald. No, sir. Mr. By^num. Theiithe remark was not quite as smart as you thought it was. What is the average rate of duty on woolen goods? Mr. Fitzgerald. I could not answer that. Mr. Bynum. Do you know what portion of the product of woolen goods is labor? Mr. Fitzgerald. I would not care to say as to that. ilr. Bynum. Do you know that all statistics give it from 20 to 25 per cent, and the labor cost of production is from 20 to 25 per cent? Mr. Fitzgerald: I have seen those figures. Mr. Bynum. Do you know that the average duty for woolens is about 90 per cent? Mr. Fitzgerald. What does that mean? Mr. Bynum. Do you think it absolutely necessary to maintain a 90- per-cent duty in order to protect labor when labor is only about 25 per cent of it? T\rr. Fitzgerald. Yes; if it does not make the goods any dearer nobody is hurt. Mr. Bynum. You gentlemen go into the "if' s" too much. I want to TEXTILE WORKERS OF PHILADELPHIA. 893 know if it is necessary to have a duty of 90 iier cent when the labor cost is only 25 x)er cent. Mr. Fitzgerald. That may be all right. We have not come here to discuss those questions. Mr. Bynum. That is the question we are interested in. Mr. Fitzgerald. You can get at those facts; you have them all on. file, and I supijose they are correct. Mr. Bynum. If there were only a difference of 50 per cent in wages, and you get twice as much wages here as there, then a sufficient tariff' to cover that difference would be all that is necessary. Mr. Fitzgerald. Other things are higher, besides our labor, which must be taken into consideration. Mr. Bynum. You have to pay duty on dyes; wools, of course, are higher, and rates of interest and things of that kind are higher. There is a duty on ina<;hinery ; but supposing you were to get free dyes, would you need to maintain the present tariff to iirotect your labor ? Mr. Fitzgerald. It must be borne in mind that if you give free dyes it will affect other manufacturers. Mr. Bynum. If we made the consumer pay you might be able to make that up. If the manufacturers had free wool would it be necessary to maintain the present tariff to enable them to pay higher wages in this country? Mr. Fitzgerald. The woolens, worsteds, and other compensatory quality of goods would make up that duty on wool. Mr. Bynum. They get about 35 or 40 cents a pound for dnty, do they not"? Mr. Fitzgerald. I do not suppose that if duties are made lower wool will suffer by it. That is why we have come here to-day. We do not want to go into this question. Mr. Bynum. There are quite a large number of workingmen engaged in the woolen industries who are strong advocates of free wool"? Mr. Fitzgerald. I suppose so. Mr. Bynum. Is there not a large proportion of workingmen who believe that they could get steady employment and higher wages if they had free wool ? Mr. Fitzgerald. Some even believe that. Mr. Gear. That would reduce it to scoured wool. If you increase it the compensatory conditions are increased, because it takes 4 pounds to make 1 pound of scoured wool! Mr. Fitzgerald. Yes; we have got to make our protest in a gen- eral way. I have a little paper here which I would like to read. We have other speakers, and I would like to have them address you before we go away; so, witli your permission, I will retire as soon as possible. Mr. Fitzgerald read tlie following paper: One year ago times were good andthe whole country was in a prosper- ous condition, but since then a change has gradually come about. The demand for our labor has almost ceased, confidence has been destroyed, and a severe financial panic has prevailed over the whole country. We do not pretend to understand all the causes which have brought about this state of things, but we can feel and see in our homes the ter- rible effects which these causes have produced, and we believe, gentle- men, that the fear and uncertainty in regard to tariff changes has been one of the principal causes. Therefore we think that it would be neither wise nor just to open up the tariff question at the present time. Know- ing that we were prosperous under the present tariff law, when there was no fear of its being changed, we think that the assurance that it 894 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. ■\vill not be chanj:^^^^ within a specified time, and that too not in the near fntnre, would be the quicljest and surest way of bringing pros- perity back to the Avhole country. We appeal to you as wise and patriotic statesmen, having the best wishes of _yi(ur whole country at heart, to consider well our petition and to adopt a course which will quickly bring about an iraproveraent in the condition of the workers engaged in the textile industries. TEXTIJ.E WORKERS. STATEItlENT OF JAMES ELGAE. I will state that in the city of Philadelphia, where I come from, things are in a bad state. We, as workingmen, were called together in a meet- ing to see. if we could not get some way of meeting with you, and to try to state to you the conclition in which we find ourselves. I would state to-day that 80 percent of the workingmen or the wage-earners of the textile iudustries are out of employment. The mills are all closed down or else are working on half time and three-quarters time. Some men are working only two to three days in the month. Very few are maknig fiTll time. We come to-day to state these facts to you, and 1 know whereof I speak. I know that numbers of men in the city of Philadelphia are going around to get contributions in support of the families of the workingmen. There are families in the city of Phila- delphia to-day who do not know where their dinner is coming from to- morrow. Those representing the different branches of industry and of work have come here to state these facts. We do not demand any- thing. We only plead that you will look at the condition of things in Philadelphia, and I know that if you could go there and see the situa- tion that you would recognize this as a fact. Some say that the cause of it is the silver bill; others say that it is the tariff. We workingmen believe that it is because of the agitation of the tariff which has brought us into the position in which we are now placed, because we stated in this petition that the manufacturers do not wish to run the risk of a reduced tariff. We are between two seas, as it were. The manufac- turers will not run the risk, and Ave have got no work, and so we have concluded to come as American citizens and workingmen to ask you to do what we think will enable us to support our families. It is not necessary for me to speak of this because 1 ieel that if I can go home to my family after only two or three days' work and see my children around me waiting for bread and I can give them no aid, I feel that in tliat case [am justified in coming here and asking you gentlemen to help us. You all know our situation. We claim and we speak for the workingmen of Philadeli)liia that the tariff affords a protection on manufactured articles in America and helps us as workingmen. This textile industry is an infant one. It is one we can not tell much about, especially my branch of lace curtains. The majority of the cur- tain factories were started up, and those working in the lace-curtain branch have stopped. The firm for which I work have been employing about 1350 peojile, have now oidy about 50 or GO at work in the lace- curtain deiiartinent. They pay good wages. Men on machines aver- age $16 a week. The finishing department, when ruuuiug full time, will average *0 i)er week. The lowest wages paid in that business is $1: a week and the highest $16. We know that in that part of Ken- TEXTILE WORKERS. 895 sington tliat tlie lace business is a benefit to it. It gives employment to a great many people. It started witli a plant worth $150,000 or more, and the average pay in that department is $S a week. At the same time skilled workingmen employed in the same branch abroad only make $7.50. You can see that in the statistics which have been given time after time. We therefore believe that protection gives us better wages and more work. We come i)i behalf of 250,000 people interested in the textile manufacturing industries in every part of that district which is represented in Congress by the Hon. Alfred O. Har- mer. We peo])le are a part of our American citizens, to whom in the future we must look. \V^e have got to educate them there. Do you think it would be right to send our shildren to school and get them educated and then not to look to them for work ? If the protection is not maintained we will have to compete with the lowest paid wages in Europe, and we all want to try to be American citizens, and not to be brought down to a level with them. I do not think it is right. We have men in the city of Philadelphia who came from Europe and who did not average last year $2.75 a week. That is the average in free trade countries. You do not want to bring us in that same position. If we come down to them in wages, we will have to comedown to their standard in living. That is as true as it Is that it is impossible for water to flow up hill. If the English were as skilled as we are, we would have to work for the same wages as they. It ought to be clear to you that it will come. If I have competition from two sources, the goods will have to be sold at the lowest market value — to use the trade expression. For instance, if there be fn Bradford, England, looms making a certain kind of cloth and one in Philadelphia making the same kind of cloth, the difference in wages would be regu- lated by the goods placed on the counter to be sold and we would feel it in America. If a customer can go into a store and buy English goods and English products at half a cent cheaper, he will do so. Tliere are men and women going into John Wanamaker's and other stores every day hunting for goods at a fiaction of a cent cheaiier, and when they find them they will buy them in preference to the dearer goods. With that competition, how long will the American looms last? The question is, which product is the highest i)riced one? As long as European product is sold over the counter at li cents cheaper it will be the one that will be sold. Therefore, it would bring us down to the European standard. We ask you before ena<-ting this bill to look into this matter and give us the benefit of it. We claim to be Americans, although some of us are naturalized Ameri(!ans. I am an American citizen, being American born. The loss of business from the importa- tion of goods made in Great Britain will affect our wages and we want you to aid us by jnaintainiiig the duty. We want you to give Ameri- can workingmen the benefit of the duty. Mr. Gear. When was your lace industry started? Mr. Edgar. Two years ago. Mr. Gear. It was since 18'JO! Mr. EdGtAR. Yes, sir; it was since the enactment of the McKinley bill. Mr. Gear. You never had such prosperity before the McKinley bill was enacted? Mr. Edgar. Jfo, sir; except in one or two instances, and they were small. ilr. Bynxim. Is there anypiotection against the importation of labor in your industry ? 896 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. Mr. Edgar. Ko, sir. Mr. Bynum. The workingman wTio has low wages abroad can come over and compete with you in work? Mr. Edgar. Yes, sir; he can at the present time. Mr. Btnum. Is there not a large number of men coming over from those countries and working in competition with you? Mr. Edgar. Yes, sir. Mr. Bynum. Is there not a surplus of labor now seeking work in the textile industries ? Mr. Edgar. There was not a year ago; in our district skilled work- men were advertised for. Mr. Byntjm. Prior to that time there was a surplus in this country; there has been no slack? Mr. Edgar. No, sir. Mr. Bynum. You speak of a depression in the industries of your people, and of your people being out of employment; is not that true of protected industries as well as of unprotected industries? Mr. Edgar. No, sir ; not in Philadelphia. Some nonprotected indus- tries were working. Mr. Bynum. Do you know that in other cities, for instance out West, where they are constructing city improvements, that labor is out of employment and everything is stopped ? Mr. Edgar. They derive a great deal of their living from the pro- tected industries. The protected industries make a circulation of money. Mr. Bynum. Is it not because of the general panic that your industry is depressed? Mr. Edgar. In the district where I work some employers and other business men are talking about closing their stores because we are idle and can not buy. Mr. Bynum. That is where the storekeepers are dependent upon you? I suppose that our storekeepers are doing the same thing. They have closed some stores in Alexandria and refused to trust railroad men. Mr. Edgar. All through Philadelphia there is a depression of busi- ness. Take, for instance, the firm for whom 1 work; they now payout only $22,000 a week to nearly 3,000 workiugmen. Mr. Bynum. I can understand that, where the business is largely dei)endent upon the protected industry; but in other cities, where they do not depend upon protected industries, the same conditions of things exist. The depression is not peculiar to the protected industries, bat affects the unprotected industries as well ? ' Mr. Edgar. Yes, sir. The Chairman. You say that the interests of skilled labor is to have steady employment at good wages. Mr. Edgar. Yes, sir. The Chairman. And that steady employment at good wages depends upon having a large market for the products which manufacturers make? Mr. Edgar. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Ifl understand the argument which all of you gentle- men have made, and to which we have listened with very attentive interest, I believe you claim that the reduction of duty on finished woolen goods would lead to a large foreign importation of those goods? Mr. Edgar. Yes, sir. TEXTILE WORKERS. 897 The Chairman. And a greater competition between the foreign class of those goods. Mr. Edgar. Yes, sir. The Chairman. And a greater competition between the foreign class of goods made'in this country; andyou believe tbat where the producer has to compete with the world's product he must pay the world's wages? Mr. Bdgak. Largely so. The Chairman. That is the reason why you do not want that com- petition; that df the producer had not to compete with^the world's product he would not have to pay the world's wages. 1 believe that is the position taken by all of you gentlemen? Mr. Edgar. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Are there not many lines of industries which have to compete with the world's product; does Hot the wheat-raiser have to compete with the world's product? Mr. Edgar. He would have to compete with the world's product if he were on the same conditions. The Chairman. Does he not have to do it, as a matter of fact? Mr. Edgar. The world has to compete with him. The Chairman. If you will turn to this book which I have here you will find that last year, 1892, we raised in this country $161,000,000 worth of wlieat and $75,000,000 of that wheat went abroad, which was probably one-third of the crop. Did not the American producer of that wheat have to compete with the foreign producers? Mr. Edgar. I don't know that all of the wheat-growers had to com- pete with foreign growers. We had a surplus. They bad to compete with us. We sent our wheat out to them. The Chairman. Yes, sir; and therefore we had to compete with them. Do you know tbe difference paid in Dakota and the difference paid for wheat bought of us in lihenish Prussia, Austria, or India? Mr. Edgar. No, sir. The Chairman. The price is larger in Dakota. Mr. Edgar. I believe so. The Charman. Do we not send out three-quarters of all of our cot- ton to compete with the world's product? Does that bring down wages in this country to the level of wages in India? Mr. Edgar. No, sir; because cotton is a home product. The Chairman.' We sent out of this country $2,500,000 worth of mowers and reapers, and $500,000 worth of supplies. Would you con- tend that the wages paid in making those implements are regulated by the wages abroad I Are not the wages paid in those industries higher than those paid abroad — those paid in Philadelphia and in other fac- tories ? Mr. Edgar. The laboring man is paid better here than anywhere in Europe; that is what I came here to keep up. The Chairman. Your condition is that if you have to cojnpete with the world's product you will have to pay the world's wages? Mr. Edgar. Yes, sir. The Chairman. I find in the list of exports of the United States that we send out an average of $1,000,000 worth of clocks and watches. Are not the wages paid in making watches and clocks very much greater in this country than in England, Germany, or Switzerland? Mr. 'Edgar. I think they are. It is because they are exported and not imported. The Chairman. For instance, we send out watches to India, and an T h^ 57 898 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. American firm has a contract to furnish the railroads of India with ■watches? Mr. Edgae. That is because we make a superior article. The OHAm:MAN. Are not the wages of men making watches and clocks as high as the wages paid to skilled mechanics in this country? Mr. Edgae. I suppose they are. The Chairman. We send abroad $10,000,000 worth of machinery of diiferent kinds and $3,500,000 worth of some particular kinds of jnachin- ery, and of all our exportations, furniture made of wood, and various industries, ttie product of which has to compete with the world's prod- uct without being obliged at all to reduce wages to the level of the put- side world ? Mr. Edgae. That is because we are exporting. The Chaieman. Those wares have to compete in a foreign market! Mr. Edgae. Yes, sir; and that shows that protecti«n on those arti- cles is a benefit to us. textiIjE workers. statement of wilham g. lees. Mr. Chaieman : As our chairman has said previously, we are not here as a partisan body, politically speaking. We come as delegates representing vast industries of the textile trade of Philadelphia. Indi- vidually I rei:)resent the ingrain carpet, a branch industry which in Philadelphia alone employs over 10,000 people. This industry under the protected tariff system has flourished. Mills and factories have sprung up. throughoiit the entire district of Philadelphia and vicinity and other businesses of a kindred nature have followed in the wake of the factories. They depend solely upon the textile industries for their support. I realize that it is admitted to-day real estate has had a boom. Hundreds of working men have spent thousands of dollars and invested it in obtaining homes for themselves and families which tliey hope eventually to call their own. Prosperity in our industry has walked hand in hand with that valuable industry in our district and now we see upon the horizon a dark cloud. As it approaches it becomes denser and thicker and threatens to envelope us in folds of adversity. That which was prosperity is now chaos and confusion. Large industries have shut down entirely while others are endeavoring to run upon short time with a reduced force. Those who invested their little savings in real estate are apprehensive of losing them. Already institutions of public charity are being inaugurated throughout the city of Philadelphia for the purpose of meeting out some relief to the sufferers. Much could be told, but words would fail to accurately describe the suffering and misery already felt in the city which we all so dearly love. As regards the industry which I represent I work with others in a branch of the textile trade that stands as free from competition as the ingrain carpet trade. Tears ago, prior to the civil war, our country depended largely upon Amsterdam and Halifax for the best grades of ingrain carpets, but since duties have been imposed upon importation that industry has thrived in our land while it has perished abroad. Manufacturers no longer import what they absolntely consume, We do not stand in TEXTILE WOEKERS. 899 competition with Brussels, as we would with a lower tariff. "We fear that with a tampering of the tariff upon that score they would be able to produce a cheaper carpet thereby underselling us and destroying this vast industry. We therefore appeal to you in behalf of the thou- sands of men we represent, to allow it to remain upon the statute books as it is, as we feel that by doing this you will restore confidence to the people and prosperity to the nation. Mr. Gear. Is there not in Philadelphia a large number of looms making carpets in private houses? Mr. Lees. Yes, but tlie amount is limited. They can not make car- pets properly. We can beat them with those power looms. textiIjE workers. statement of mr. martin s. leger. Mr. Chairman: I am not going to detain you for a long speech. I merely come here to represent the peoi)le who are employed in the silk business in Philadelphia and who likewise have mills in .Scraiiton. They are engaged in silk spinning, winding, and doubling. We are much oppressed. The mills are entirely stopped at Scranton, and at Philadelphia they are running only three days a week. I sup])ose it is for fear that the tariff, if changed, would interfere with the indus- try. We have had a tariff on silk. I once worked about three years in England. I have worked in silk all my life. The firm for which I worked got up a scheme to have work done in Englaud. There is no duty on our raw material, and they went in to have tlieir work done in England. But the inspectors in New York found th?it it was dutiable and put 60 per cent on it, which entirely knocked us out from import- ing from the other, side. Therefore, I am afraid that if any duty is taken off' it will be the means of stopping our industry in this country. The industries are prospering in Pennsylvania and New Jersey, and I am here on behalf of those people to call your attention to it, and to ask that you will not reduce the tariff on this special article. I may say that wages at this time are about $2.50 for a skilled man, and for a spinner and designer about $5 there. We pay a skilled man at winding and doubling $6 here. ADDITIONAL STATEMENT OF JOHN I.. STEWART. Mr. Chairman : I believe that that is all that we desire to say. We thank you for you kind attention and for hearing us so patiently. We would not have been able to answer all the questions as the most of the committee would desire us to do, but we have tried to answer them in a straightforward, practical manner. We leave the cause in your hands, hoping for a discrimination in favor of American industries. We are Americans and are willing to respond to the American cause in case of war and to defend her flag with our blood and our money. Foreigners owe no allegiance to the flag; he simply comes into the market — buys in our dear market and sells in his cheap market. He has no respon- sibility, and we appeal to you in the name of American citizens and as American workingmen, so tliat we can be able to live as American citi- zens ought to, Again we thank you, 900 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. TEXTILE WORKERS' PROTEST. Philadelphia, Pa., September 18, 1893. In response to a piiblic call issued by the Kensington Eeform Club for a mass meeting of textile workers, on Thursday evening, September 14, 1893, 'there came together the largest assemblage of the kind ever gathered in the Kensington mill district, and at this meeting the fol- lowing resolutions were enthusiastically adopted : Whereas the committee which appeared before the Ways and Means Committee at Washington, on September 9, purporting to represent the textile workers of Phila- delphia, asking that the present tariff be not interfered with, was purely the out- come of a scheme hatched and carried out in perfect secrecy by a few petty mill bosses: and Whereas the petition which they presented was signed by men, women, and chil- dren under pressure and in most cases without the signers being given an opportu- nity to know its contents, and then containing the names of less than one-fifth of all the textile workers of Philadelphia ; and, as ' ' honest deeds need shun no light," there- fore, we as real workers, manly enough to face the issue openly, and conscious of being in the right, in public mass meeting assembled, hereby Resolve, That we enter our earnost protest against the utterances and misrepresen- tations of the said committee being taken as the expression of the sentiments of the nnintimidated textile workers of Philadelphia; that we are more than ever con- vinced that free raw materials and a corresponding general reduction of duties is absolutely necessary to insure prosperity to the textile industries of this country; that tlie numerous reductions of wages in our mills in the past three years, aggre- gating from 20 to 45 per cent and more, is a positive proof that protection is a fraud upon the working people; that the false pretenses of those manufacturers and their agents who claim to want a high tariff for the benefit of the wages of labor is best exposed by the undeniable fact that every increase of the tariff has been invariably followed by reductions of wages; that we, tlierefore, earnestly request Congress to make no unnecessary delay in the revision of the tariff on the line of free raw mate- rials and a corresponding vcdtiction of relati-\'e duties, and the wiping out of the iniquitous discriminations against American labor which have so infamously charac- terized every prote(rtive tariff law of the past thirty-odd years. Besolved, That the chairman of this meeting be authorized to select a committee of three to lay our case before the Ways and Means Committee and Congress, either verbally or by memorial. John E. MDi,Hox,i,A3srD, Chairvian. Jambs Tokmey, Secretary. IRISH TEXTIIvBS. STATEMENT OF MES. EKNEST HAET, Foimder of the Donegal Industrial Fund, Donegal House, 43 Wigmore Street, Xondon, and Donegal Castle Irish Village, World's Fair, Chicago, as to the duties and tariff on the imported woolen stuffs, knitted goods, linens, and laces made in Ireland nndei the direction of The Donegal Industrial Fund. The Donegal Industrial Fund, Bunbeg, Gweedore, Ireland, and 43 Wigmore street, London, is an industrial enterprise founded by Mrs. Ernest Hart, in 1883, with the object of creating commercial industries on the west coast of Ireland and elsewhere in that country for the bene- fit of the agricultural peasantry. It has trained them to the production of high class homespun and vegetably dyed woolen cloths; of hand- knitted hosiery and gloves and other garments; of art linens, of embroid- eries and laces. And it lias founded homespun, knitting, lace making, lineu-weaving, and embroidery industries, which though philanthropic in aim are carried on on soiind commercial lines, and are capable of indefinite extension. It is at present engaged in carrying outthe scheme IRISH TEXTILES. 901 of the Irisli village and Donegal Castle at the World's Fair in Chicago, and in obtaining in this country an extended market for the products of its peasant workers. "WOOLENS. The homespuns of the-Donegal Industrial Fund are a unique produc- tion. They are all wool, made of the fine wool of the mountain sheep of the country; they are vegetably dyed, mainly from the wild plants of the bogs; they are extremely durable, and, also, owing to the fact that the natural oil of the wool is not thoroughly washed out, they are to a considerable extent impervious to rain. They are also hand-woven and in the majority of instances hand-spun. The exhibition of hand manufacturing processes in Chicago; the knowledge that the encouragement and development of this homespun industry means prosperity to some of the poorest parts of Ireland ; the honesty of the goods, their durability and artistic qualities, have excited great interest in these goods, and will lead to a demand for them in this country. They are, however, weighted in the market by the heavy prohibitive tariff of 50 per cent ad valorem duty and 44 cents to the pound, though they compete with no known product in America, and though they are made and can only be male under social and agricul- tural conditions, which do not and can never exist in America. The object, I believe I am correct in stating, of the legislature is not to place on goods which are the staples of necessity such tariffs as will be prohibitive, but so to arrange the tariff as to maintain the revenue and to allow of the importation at reasonable rates those goods which are required by the people and which do not interfere with American manufactures. Of such a character are the goods which I represent, and for which I ask a diminished tariff. I trust I may be allowed to support my contention by reference to a few of the figures gathered from the statistics and blue books issued regarding the woolen trade for the last ten years. That the imposition of the increased heavy duties of the McKinley tariff operated in both reducing the imports of woolens and the sources of revenue are patent facts. In 1890 the value of manufactured wool imports was $54,105,423; in 1891, $43,'_'35,409; in 1892, $35,792,906. The revenues derived from duties on these imports were, in 1890, 137,440,051; in 1891, $34,857,453; in 1892, $34,293,606, thus showing a decrease of imports amounting to nearly $19,000,000 and of duties on the same of over $3,000,000. There is no doubt that Great Britain and Ireland felt severely the increased tariff on woolen goods, for the imports from Great Britain and Ireland fell in 1890 from $56,582,342 to $41,060,080 in 1891. I am aware that this comparison between 1890 and 1891 hardly represents the facts, as every effort was made .by the English manufacturers to get goods imported in 1890 before the high tariff' came into force. Now, according to the principles of protection, a prohibitive tariff on a staple would be justifiable and maintainable if it resulted in largely stimulat- ing the home production of similar goods and the increased prosperity of the industrial classes. But an inquiry into the figures does not justify this conclusion. We find that in 1880 there were in America 57,530 looms, which num- ber had risen to 72,894 in 1890; and the hands employed from 161,567 in 1880 to 221,032 in 1890; the value of the products from $267,252,913 in 1880 to $338,231,109 in 1890. But on examination we find that this increase of woolen manufacture had not been in the direction of making 902 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. woolen cloths, but in making carpets, hosiery, and worsteds. In fact we find that in spite of high protective duties that there was an actual decrease in the production of woolen cloths in America, and that the products fell from $160,000,000 in 1880 to $133,000,000 in 1890. The woolen mills also decreased in number from 1,990 in 1880 to 1,312 in 1890 ; and there were, moreover, in 1890 no less than 267 idle woolen mills, representing a capital of over $6,000,000. But what is a significant and remarkable fact is that the cotton purchased for woolen mills rose from 24,000,000 pounds in 1880 to 37,000,000 pounds in 1890, while the foreign wool purchased dropped from 20,000,000 pounds in 1880 to 16,000,000 in 1890, and the domestic wool from 177,000,000 pounds in 1880 to 168,000,000 pounds in 1890. These figures and facts conclusively show that the high tariff 'did not result in increasing woolen cloth manufacture, but that it had the effect of introducing the admixture of cotton with wool in its manufacture so as to cheapen production. Another cause is proba- bly the fact, quoting the special report on wool and the manufacture "of wool issued by the Treasury Department in 1888, that "very few wools are raised in this country fitted for the manufacture of fine broadcloths and similar finished goods" (page Ixv). I have been unable to obtain the figures of 1891, 1892, 1893, so as to compare them with those of 1890 and to obtain some facts as to the effect of the McKinley tariff on the woolen-cloth industry here, but judging by the figures of the previous ten years it seems apparent, in spite of the enormously increased production of raw wool in the United States, that the she does not and can not manufacture enough woolens for her people's consumption, and that the result of the heavy tariffs istoplaceat a prohibitively high price imported woolens, whilst the home manufacturer reaps the benefit of aprotected competition for Mhich the consumer has to pay an enhanced price of staple goods. The purchasing power of the poor is thus cur- tailed, and in order to withstand the effect of high wages caused by the increased cost of living, and to meet, at the same time, the demand for cheapness manufacture is debased, as is shown by the increased use of cotton in woolen mills. If woolens were introduced at a moderate duty a healthy competition would be established, industry and enterprise would find their outlet in the direction most congenial, and by one of the necessities of civilized life being diminished in cost, purchasing power would be increased, and the revenue would be increased instead of being now actually diminished by the heavy duties imposed. So much for the argument in favor of admitting imported woolen cloths at a lower tariff. But apart from the general question, I would submit that the homespun Avoolen cloths made by means of our and similar industrial agencies, by the peasants of Ireland in the poor agricultural districts, may claim to be admitted with safety into the United States either at a small tariff' or duty free. Inasmuch as, first, they are handmade on handlooms and therefore compete with no woolen products of America; secondly, that they are the products of and give the means of subsistence to a peasantry with whom there is the livliest sympathy in this country. To remove the heavy duties againsttheirhandand cottage manufactures would be to aid these people in a far more substantial and permanent way than to raise relief funds for them in the times of their distress, which has been so frequently and generously done in America, but of which the necessity would be removed by industries. It may be contended that these goods are luxuries intended for the rich and fashionable and therefore it is only right that they should pay a heavy dutyj but in reply I beg to state that in the country where lEISH TEXTILES. 903 they are made they are the staple articles of clothing of the laboring classes. Owing to the fact that they are all wool, of great durability, and to some extent rain proof, they are worn by those persons whose avocations expose them to alternations of heat, cold and wet. Could they be placed at the service of the American laboring man, particu- larly of the far West, they would doubtless, owing to the qualities above stated, have a certain acceptability for him and a sphere of commercial usefulness. The importation of these homespuns into America is at present a small affair; but the demand for them is increasing, and the lowering of the heavy duties now imposed would lead to an increased revenue from this source owing to the increased importation of goods, which are unique and which compete with none manufactured in America. KNITTED GLOVES, HOSIERY, AND GOODS. The handknitting of gloves, hosiery, and fancy goods Is a large industry in the congested districts of the northwest of Ireland, and it is one of the greatest importance to the very poorest people. Gloves can only be well knitted, to be a durable article of wear, by hand. These handknitted gloves are largely used here, particularly by the industrial classes in the severe weather, and they may almost be said to be an article of common necessity. At present they bear the immense duty of 49^ cents to the pound and 60 per cent ad valorem. The result is that the prices of production are driven down to the lowest possible ebb, while the price to the consumer is more than double what it might be for an article which he had to import because it is not manufactured here. We are manufacturers of handknit hosiery and gloves, and are booking orders for America for the latter, and I ven- ture to submit that as these articles are not handknit in America, and as the agricultural and social conditions under which they are so made do not and will never exist in America, and inasmuch as their manu- facture is of great benefit to the most destitute parts of Ireland, and also as the demand for these goods is increasing and likely to increase, that no injury could be done to the home trade by an increased impor- tation at a lower tariff, but that the revenue would be increased by the removal of a prohibitive duty. ART LINENS. The linen industry of Ireland is so large, powerful, and well organized, and the trade with America is so extensive, that I do not propose to touch uijon this great question more than to bring before your notice a small Industry of art linens, which I have founded, the products of which have found much favor in America. These linens, known by the name of the " Kells art linens," are made on hand looms in the cottages in Ireland, under our direction, of yarns which are beautifully dyed and blended. The Unen industry is one almost peculiar to Europe, the hand-loom linen industry especially so. A demand has sprung up in the United States for our Kells art linens, on the ground of their pecu- liar usefulness for certain art industries, such as those of upholsterers, furnishers, etc. The present duty on them is 50 per cent, and it is obvious that so high a duty is largely prohibitive and a restriction of trade. As the demand for handmade art linens is likely to increase, I submit that a moderate tariff on tliese goods would result in an increased revenue, owing to the extended use of goods which are unique and com- pete with none of the manufactures in America. 904 FLAX, JUTE AND HEMP. LACES. Irish laces are industrial products of a quite special character. They are the products of a people who can only partially support themselves on their small agricultural holdings, and who live under conditions of cheapness of food and habitation which make a small daily earning an important addition to the means of the livelihood of the family. They are made by women and girls, who attend at the sa.me time to farm work and home duties. There are many varieties of such laces; they are special in character and peculiar in stitch, and are used for the trimming of ladies' dresses and for ecclesiastical and furniture purposes. Great interest has been excited by the exhibits of Irish laces which have been made by myself and others at the World's Fair. There is, in my opinion, no doubt that a considerable reduction of the present high duty of 60 per cent on Irish laces would lead to an increased trade, to no loss to the revenue. There is, I suppose, no object of trade on which the payment of duties is so often evaded as Irish laces. American ladies lay in large stocks of Irish laces for themselves and their friends on arriving on the other side, feeling that they are justi- fied in doing so by aiding the cottage industries of a peasantry, the con- dition of which excites their warmest sympathy. There is little doubt that the present high duty is an actual loss to the revenue, while' it protects no actual and potential industry in the States. ■ As laces and embroideries are grouped together in the customs reports, it is not possible to ascertain from them the exact imports of laces, and of Irish laces in particular. My experience as a manufac- turer on the other side, and a seller on this, is that this high tariff on lace operates in driving down the wages of the producer and increasing the price on the consumer, the merchant being the only person who profits thereby, the high tariff being made the excuse for underpaying the worker and for overcharging the consumer. A moderate tariff on Irish laces would lead, I believe, to an extended trade and increased revenue, the better payment of the worker, and a much lower price to the consumer, without any injury being done to any American industry. A distinction might certainly be made, and justly so, between hand- made and machine-made laces, of which the latter might at any time become an important industry in America; but as handmade or real laces are made under conditions which have not yet and are not likely to arise in America, the tariff on these may safely be reduced with benefit to all concerned. I respectfully beg to submitthis memorandum to the Ways and Means Committee of the Congress of the United States. SOriEDULE K. WOOL AND MANUFACTUEES OF WOOL. 905 WOOL. (Paragraphs 876-386.) STATEMENT OF ME. THEODOBE JUSTICE, OF PHILADELPHIA, PA. Mr. Jtisti'ce. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen of the committee: I " presume that it is your intention to place wool on the free list; and I also assume that in changing the laws that may destroy much of one of the largest American industries, that of agriculture; and I presume that before doing so you desire ample information on that subject to guide you in your wisdom. In endeavoring to give you any informa- tion, I want to call your attention to a few samples of wool as an object lesson, so as to more easily and quickly demonstrate what I wish to bring before you. In the first place, the wools of the roll which I now present are unlike the condition in which they left the sheep, for they are in the condition in which the manufacturer leaves them, with the alkali removed. In comparing this wool it is necessary to take the diameter and fiber in the same condition, biit in giving the rates of the wool I take into consideration the blood and fiber in this condition, that is, scoured. I know you will excuse the delay, because it will take but a few moments after I have arranged the samples. (Placing several samples of wool, in all conditions on the table.) This [indicating] is a sample of close merino fiber 2,000 diameters to the inch. That is grown in the Eocky Mountain region. In grazing, the natural oil in the wool causes the dust to adhere to it, and as soon as the winter commences and the grass disappears there is less adherence of dust than there is in better weather. During a season the farmer's clip of 100 pounds may contain- 20 pounds of loss. The value of wool consists in the amount of scoured wool that it will produce. This article [exhibiting] is wool from sheep produced in Australia. That climate is especially fitted for wool, as the sheep graze the year round. They do not have to be fed in winter as they do in the United States. Pasturage is better in the summer. The winters are rigor- ous in the United States, and it is necessary to feed the sheep. The cost of growing crops is in the planting and harvesting, and the feed- ing of sheep is labor, though there may be 10 per cent as interest on the investment, and things of that sort. The labor cost is 90 per cent for growing the wool in this country. The reason for that is that in this country there is a rigorous climate, where sheep have to be fed sometimes from November to the 1st of May; while in the southern half of the hemisphere the sheep run out from year to year. This is an important thing in raising wool. This sample before you [indicating] will perhaps give you an object lesson th'kt may be of some influence with you in determining your course with regard to the removal of this duty. It represents a clip of ' 70,000 pounds belonging to a gentleman named Layton, of northeast,' New Mexico. There is a great deal of sand in it. It was sold lately ; 907 908 WOOL AND MANUFACTITRES OP WOOL. aud it realized 2 ceuts a pound. The cost of marketing was 5 ceots, the most of which was freight. I sent a sample of this wool to Eng- land, and also to Antwerp. Our object was to get at its free-trade value. This [indicating] is the same scoured. We sent the wool in the'dirt as it comes to market, in order that the London merchants might know how to appraise its value. The firm of Helmet, Schwartz & Co., who are extensive dealers, reported that that was 28 cents scoured, making its value about 6 cents in the dirt. This is the free-trade value of this wool in London. With the duties upon the wool removed the London . value would be 6 to 6J cents a pound. The cost of the freight from London to this country would be about the same as bringing it from a farm in New York into New York City. The freight from 'London for a similar lot would be one-quarter of a cent apound. The actual freight from Colorado to New York would be 1,200 per cent more. When we ascertained that the London value of this wool was 6 cents a pound we wrote to the owner, stating what we had paid out in freight, making 5 cents for the cost of the marketing the wool. We wrote that the free- trade value of this wool was 6 cents, and that it was liable to be lower. We also wrote that, owing to the value of the wool, we could not advance anything on it. He wrote us that he owed the shearers a cent a pound; aud, although we had told him that we could, make no advance upon his wool, he drew on us for a cent a pound. He said that he owed that amount to the shearers, and his life was in danger; so we paid his draft. He wrote that it would make a serious condition for the wool industry if this price prevailed, which was to him only 1 cent a pound net on the farm. Helmet, Schwartz & Co. valued that wool at 28 cents scoured. Whitman & Co. returned us samples of sooured Cape, which they said was worth 29 cents, confirming the value of this wool as being worth 28 cents. Here is a better article [indicating], and if Mr. Stephens were here he would tell you that this scoured Cape is selling in London at 29 cents. It is a finer and more valuable wool than the New Mexico wool. If the freight on wool from the Eocky Mountain region to reach the market is twelve times as great as the freight on wool from London to reach the American market, the wool grower is barred with free wool from competition in his own market. More than half the whole clip of the United States is raised west of the Mississi])pi Eiver. When the tariff law was passed in 1§67 there was comparatively no sheep west of the Mississippi Eiver. Our sheep were east at that time, with the exception of a few in Texas. That tariff made the duty 12 cents a pound, or 11 per cent ad valorem, and, the high price which xarevailed outside made the duty fully 15 per cent ad valorem protection. Under that condition of affairs the wool clip of the United States increased with strides and bounds. We out- stripped every other nation in the world in that respect. We beat Australia even, -mth its large acreage of perennial pasturage. The Chairman. When vas that? Mr. Justice. From the time of the passage of the law in 1867 up to its repeal in 1883. It was repealed in 1883, went into effect in 1884, and wool declined very rapidly from that time. From 1873 to 1884 the tariff on wool in the United States was under the law of 1867. In ] 884 the repeal of the law had got into full operation, and the effect was fatal. The number of sheep in the United States in 1873 was 170,000,000. When the tariff of 1807 was repealed the tariff law of 1883 reduced the duty to 10 ceuts a pound. Woolens that had been WOOL. 909 protected by a duty of from 13 to 15 cents under the law of 1867 had increased enormously. With the reduction in 1883 to 10 cents a pound, a number of sheep in the United States were slaughtered. That tariff was inadequate. It was a protective tariff and not a revenue tariff'. When a tariff fails to be protective it is a revenue tariff. Under the revenue tariff of 1883, so far as wool was concerned, the wool clip of the United States decreased from 340,000,000 pounds in 1884, the first year after the new law went into effect, 12 per cent ; but from 1873, under the tariff law of 1807, up to 1884, when it was repealed, the wool clip of the United States measured by the number of sheep had in- creased 100 per cent. No other nation in the world had approached us. Australia had increased in the same time from 380,000,000 pounds in 1873 to 400,000,000 pounds in 1883, while the United States had increased 100 per cent. Take Great Britain, the only country which competes with us, and our condition is more favorable. In England sheep are fed. Although the winters are much harder the amount fed is less. Tlie British clip decreased 19 per cent, while the United States was increasing 100 per cent. During the same years, while the wool clip was increasing 100 per cent, the Gape of Good Hope, with free trade, increased only 6 per cent. This diagram [indicating] perhaps will answer as an illustration bet- ter than mere words can. This period of adequate protection showed that our wool clip had increased in an unparalleled degree, even exceed- ing that of Australia witji its perennial pasturage. Now, we will take the second period of inadequate protection from 1884 up to the time of the McKinley law. The increase in Australia was unchanged. Duriiig that second period, from 1884 to 1890, Austra- lia increased 29 per cent; the Argentine Eepublic, under free trade, increased 23 per cent; and Great Britain had held its own. The Gape of Good Hope increased 6 per cent, and the United States (the only nation in the world to do so) decreased 12 jier cent in her wool clip. It was because of this that the wool-growers of the United States demanded increased duties ; and when the McKinley bill was passed they were accorded the beggarly increase of 12 per cent; but there was so much noise made about it that some think it was increased many times more than that amount. These figures are taken from Mullhall's Dictionary, which was used by Helmet, Schwartz & Oo. Those were the figures which were quoted by Mr. Springer in his report from the Committee on Ways and Means. Mr. Taksney. Would not the same tabulated statement show a sim- ilar favorable condition of the cattle industry during tlie same year. Mr. Justice. I am not familiar with that, because I am in the wool business. Mr. Taesney. Is it not true that west of the Mississippi River the pasturage lands have been devoted to cattle? Mr. Justice. Changes in business conditions are always anticipated in this country. Merchants are looking ahead to see anything that is liable to injure their business. I have examined these facts because we are anxious to know what the effect will be. It is fair to assume that what has happened to manufacturers will occur again; and if the tariff law, which lasted from 1884 up to the passage of the McKinley law, was inadequate protection, then under a repeal the wool crop of the United States will be destroyed. In the opening up of the Western country the wool-growers felt that there was some assurance that the wool crop would not be slaughtered. 910 "WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF "WOOL. The farmers of Michigan, Ohio, Illinois, and other States found a good market from the drovers. Mr. Springer in his report shows that the number of sheep in the United States had decreased, but he only took in a portion of the situation. If a man has sheep in a certain field for a certain length of time, and he decides to move them into another field, during the time of that process the flock will multiply. He may have transferred a certain number from a pasture, and when he turns back to look on the pasture which has maintained more than that, he says his sheep have decreased. We had 40,000,000 sheep east of the Mississippi Eiver previous to the tariff law of 1867, and they have simply been transferred to another pasture. It has been attempted to be proven- that the number of sheep in the United States has decreased, because in Michigan, Ohio, and IlUnois sheep had been removed to the prairies beyond the Mississippi. "We have a gentleman in Philadelphia, Col. McGlure, an editor there, who writes about wool; and he writes to his paper that the wool clip has decreased east of the Mississippi Eiver, when he ignores the fact that the farmers sent their flocks away. Mr. Taksney. Are not those included in the statistics? Mr. Justice. No, sir; nor in the speeches made in Congress. It has been asked why it is that with increased protection under the McKin- ley law the price of wool has declined. It is very easily explained. This sample [indicating] is known as wool top. "When a wool that has a sound staple is scoured, carded, and combed^ the fibers will lay straight, and that is known as topped. The value of wool is based upon the yield of this article. This article to-day, and for a long time, has been selling in London at 40 cents a pound. Yesterday I was in- formed that an article not quite so good could be had at 37 a pound. This article called "top " is the only standard by which yon can meas- ure the rise and fall of wool. What has caused wool to decline since the passage of the McKinley? On the 1st of May, 1891, this [indicating] was selling in London at 50 cents, or 25 pence. On the 1st of March, 1892, the next year, or eleven months after, it was selling at 37 cents. There was a decline of 26 per cent in eleven months. The London market dominates the world. As that market falls our market falls. While wool was declin- ing 26 per cent in London the same article declined only 6 cents, or 3 per cent, in the United States. We have reduced the wools of the world to this condition; and under this condition on this wool ("indi- cating], that you may compare the result with what it was in 1868, the London price was 50 per cent below the American price. In 1869 it was 56^ cents below the American price ; in 1871 it was 41J per ce^nt. I do not know why that price occurred in that year. In 1872 it was 40 per cent below; in 1872 it was 58 per cent below; in 1874 the London price was 54 per cent below the American price; and in 1875 the Lon- don price was 55 per cent below the American price. In 1876 the Lon- don price was 54 per cent below the American price; in 1877 it was 45 per cent below the American price. During this period we had a premium on our gold, and you may say that it is not fair to compare the currency price in the United States with gold price when the currency was depreciated. In 1878 we were on a gold basis. We find that in that year the London price was 50 per cent below the American price; in 1879 it was 40 per cent; in 1880 it was 58 i)er cent below the American price, and so on down to 1891, when it was 44J per cent. The average was 51 per cent. "WOOL. 911 You may ask, are there other reasons? and why it is that we can not launch our product upon the market. We were always 100 per cent above them when we had an adequate tariff. I think every man in the wool business is convinced that if you remove this duty the American wool- grower will be enabled to compete with the foreign wool-grower. In the years first mentioned the wools have increased 50 per cent. During that time sheep were sold in Aus- tralia at 7 pence. They were killed and boiled down for the tallow within 150 miles of Melboru'ne. That was the condition of the wool industry in Australia. United States (Jonsul-General Wallace in his report, which is on file, states the reasons why wool in Australia is 12 cents a pound. It is because their land is largely owned by the Government, and fenced by the Government. The sheep do not even require to be herded. The only cost is the labor in shearing and the marketing of the wool and the sheep. Can we produce wool for 12 cents a pound? This wool [indicating] will net 1 cent a pound on the basis of to-day's London values. The wool-grower of the United States is getting 1 cent a pound, while his competitor in Australia is getting 12 cents a pound. If there is any manufacturer present, he knows that the farmer of Aiperica would have no market for his wool when it is only worth 1 cent a pound. Mr. Breckineidge. Why is it that wool is worth 12 cents a pound in Australia? Mr. Justice. It yields 50 per cent more. It contains only 48 per cent of grease. Mr. Beeckinridge. What percentage of this American sample is grease and dirt? Mr. Justice. In that sample 70 per cent is dirt. Mr. Breckinridge. You put the price on the grease and dirt, and not on the wool? Mr. Justice. That is the condition in which it is raised and sent to market in Australia. They have no facilities for washing. The wool is grown in that arid section. Mr. Stevens. The market is stni regulated in London 1 Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. In Australia they travel 300 miles to shear. The sheep carry the wool on their backs. Last year they sheared with 70 per cent dirt, and this year it is 80 per cent. Mr. Breckinridge. The wool grown by our farmers is not shipped to Philadelphia with that per cent of dirt, is it? Mr. Justice. Some of it is. If those sheep were transferred to Aus- tralia, and those in Australia were transferred to the United Slates, the ratio would be reversed. If sheep produced wool worth 12 eents in Australia, ours would be worth 60 cents in London. Mr. Gear. The rule is to ship in the grease? Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. It is less iu the east than in the west? Mr. Justice. If you have been on the ranches you have seen that the grass grows in bunches, and when the sheep lie down the alkali adheres to the wool. If you took those same sheep into Ohio (from whence they came, immediately after the law of 1867 was repealed) and should shear them in Ohio, the shrinkage would be probably 15 per cent less. Mr. Tarsnbt. Does not the fact of this discovery account for the falling off in the product of wool in those arid regions? Mr. Justice, Sheep have not fallen off in the Territories, When the 912 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OP WOOL. price of wool fell the farmers became discouraged, fearing that the iu4ustry would be destroyed. Mr. Tarsnby. Has there not been a large falling off in Kansas, Nebraska, and west of the Missouri Eiver? Mr. Justice. ISTo ; I have the figures here. I have the number of sheep in the United States east and west of the Mississippi Eiver, and, if you desire it, I will furnish it {producing paper). Mr. Tarsney. Have they not increased in Minnesota and New Mex- ico, and fallen off in Texas, Kansas, and Nebraska 'I Mr. Justice. The falling off has been mainly in the sections where agriculture is pursued. The increase has been on the ranches. Mr. Tarsney. Has there not been a corresponding increase in the raising of cattle because of the cattle syndicates having put money into cattle and horses in that section? Mr. Justice. It has been claimed that sheep raising in the United States east of the Mississippi has disappeared, because land has become more valuable. Senator Peffer has claimed in debate that the Territo- ries are the only place where wool-growing would be destroyed. It is the freight rate that makes wool-raising unprofitable. This sample [indicating] would be worth only 1^ cents. No man can raise wool at l| cents a pound. Mr. Stevens. What would the difference be'? Mr. Justice. The railroad freight is 3 cents a pound; and the rate from London is one-fourth of a cent. The railroad rate is 12 times as great as the freight from London. Mr. Breckinridge. Your argument is as to the effect it will have upon the wool-growers in the Territories? Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. Some of them are States now. I would like to ask how a man who raises that wool can pay twelve times as much freight to the market as the rate from London. I am under the impres- sion that the wool clip will be destroyed. Mr. Stevens. How much dirt is therein that sample [indicating]? Mr. Justice. Eighty per cent. I am speaking of what it nets the grower on tlie land. Mr. Stevens. What is it going to cost in Philadelphia? Mr. Justice. Under free trade, it would be 28 cents a pound. Mr. Stevens. That is 6 cents a pound net? Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. In the shrinkage of 80 per cent, it would cost 28 cents scoured. It costs 5 cents to ship it. If there are any further questions you wish to ask me, I am ready to answer. Mr. Whiting. Why is it that you prefer to buy the ranchman's wool? Mr. Justice. Because he is an American citizen. Mr. Whiting. There is more advantage in buying that sort of wool, is there not. Mr. Justice. There is a disadvantage. The Chairman. The consumer is an American citizen also? Mr. Justice. There is some consumed abroad. Mr. Whiting. I would like to know if the price of wool ordinarily advances after it leaves the farmer's hands ? Mr. Justice. I should say not. I think it more usually declines after it leaves his hands, for the reason that there is competition to get it. The farmer has a market immediately. After it gets to market there is competition to sell. A great many wool dealers have lost money. I can mention a house which was wealthy twenty years ago and now has nothing. WOOL. 913 Mr. Whiting. I saw a letter you sent to a wool buyer, saying that if he paid over 20 cents for washed wool he would be likely to lose money. Mr. Justice. Exactly. Mr. Whiting. The man replied that he did not feel like selling; and then you replied, last April, that the farmers could not afford to raise wool under a Democratic administration. Mr. Justice. I do not think I said that; I would like to have said it, but I don't think I did. Mr. Whiting-. When he asked yoii about selling you advised him to do so, on account of the fear of the duty being taken off. Mr. Justice. That is quite correct. Eighty per cent of the woolen mills are closed because they are apprehensive that woolen goods will be made free. Is Congress prepared to go to that extreme? The mill owners say that they can not make cloth at 50 cents less. Those woolen mills are idle. Mr. Whiting. Is it a fact that when the wool gets out of the far- mers' hands the market becomes better? Mr. Justice. I can cite circumstances in which it would be profit- able. For instance, we have in our warehouse to-day a great many million pounds of American wool. It is consigned by our clients. That wool has shrunken in value to the extent of $200,000 while this agitation for free wool has been going on. I did not mean to go into politics ; but shortly after the inaugiiration somebody called upon President Cleveland and suggested that the tariff would be reduced. The President is reported to have said: "What are we here for?" The manufacturers took alarm. They could not sell a pound of wool. The market remained dull, and they are waiting to see if the tariff is likely to be removed. Somebody called also upon Secretary Carlisle, and he is reported to have said that wool would be on the free list six weeks after Congress met. Mr. Whiting. That would not affect this clip? Mr. Justice. It would affect some of it. The mUls are shut down now. Mr. Whiting. Why are the mills shut down? Mr. Justice. Because they can not get orders for their cloth. Mr. Whiting. Why can they not get orders for their cloth? Mr. Justice. Buyers will not oider. Mr. Whiting. I think it is because they have not customers to buy the cloth. I know farmers go into town and sell wool where they used to sell it and would buy woolens in return to run them through the win- ter. When they sell their wool they now turn about and buy cotton goods, because they can not afford to buy woolen goods. They have been told each year that next year woolen goods would be cheaper; and the next year they are suiprised to find that the woolen goods have advanced after their clip had been marketed. That has been told them over and over again, but they have found that woolen goods have not gone down one cent. The merchant does not place his orders and the manufacturers are not making customers. Mr. Justice. Your information is wrong. If your facts are wrong your deductions are worthless. This room is full of manufacturers, and they can testify as to whether cloth is worth more or less than it has been. Mr. Taesney. When did they shut down? Mr. Whiting. Shortly after tariff revision was threatened. Mr. Tarsney. When was that? T H 58 914 WOOL AND MANUFACTUEES OF "WOOL. Mr. Justice. Shortly after Mr. Cleveland was inaugurated. Mr. Taksmey. Was not a bill passed in tlie House a year or two ago» putting wool on the free list? Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. Mr. Tabsney. The Presidential election indorsed the action of the House in that respect "? Mr. Justice. You are asking a question and I suppose you would like an answer. I believe more mills were closed last Saturday than, a week before ; I believe that more mills will be closed next Saturday than had been closed the previous Saturday. We employ a large number of salesmen. Mr. Whiting. Is it not a fact that nearly all the manufacturers have memoralized Congress that the present depression is due to the financial condition of the country? Mr. Justice. I think the best opinion of the manufacturers Mr. Whiting [interposing]. Have they not said it? Mr. Justice. They have said that the silver bill is the cause of it. When you repeal the silver law you will find that they fear tariff revi- sion, and will think that it was the only cause of this depression; and there will not be a single mill started until they can see their way through it. I am only repeating what has been said to me by manu-^ facturers. I happen to know one or two cases where they are running now on full time. I am telling what I know. I know where mills have started up only because the wages were reduced 10 to 20 per cent. The mills I have in mind particularly have run out of orders, and have shutdown. One man said to me: "We can not make goods at the present wages." ]Mr. Whiting. I know it to be a fact that manufacturers have sent out agents all over the United States to solicit fall orders, but the agents were unable to get orders. Orders were witlidrawn, so much so that the mills are doing but little business. It was not because the manufacturers did not have the goods at low prices; but it was because the buyers in the West would not buy, not fearing they would not be lower this fall, but they did not have tlie demand for them. That has been true before this depression. It is because of this growing inabil- ity on the part of the farmers and laborers to buy woolen goods. Each year they buy more and more cotton and less woolen goods. Mr. Justice. His information is not correct. One of the largest jobbers in Philadelphia said to me the other day, " [ am sorry to see the mills stop])ing. We will soon have a goods famine.'" Mr. Whiting. Have your jobbers regular salesmen? Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. I relocated that remark to one of the largest manufacturers in Philadelphia, Avho employs between 4,000 and 5,000 people, and asked him if the jobbers feared a goods famine in conse- quence of the idle mills, and he said there was no truth in it. He said, " I don't take any stock in that. I will show you.'' He said his usual sales woirld be about half a million dollars. His sales for August, he said, exceeded his cancellations only $2,500; and now his cancellations were equal to his sales. That was the head of a large concern. A dif- ference of §2,500 in the amount of business done in one factory shows very large cancellations. Some say the reason is that customers do not buy more. Others say that the money market is tight. Others say that the money has nothing to do with it, and that people are afraid of the tariff revision. Taking the duty off always takes the value off the cloth. It is a loss that is too great to be borne. WOOL. 915 Mr. Whiting. Do the retail merchants have enough to run through the ■winter? Mr. Justice. I don't believe they have. Mr. Breckineidge. Do I understand you to say that the ma;nufac- turers are without orders 1 Mr. Justice. They tell me so. I am only giving you hearsay. Mr. Beeckineidge. They would buy more, would they not, if they had profitable orders to fill? Mr. Justice. Undoubtedly. Mr. Bebckineidge. The jobbers are not giving orders because the retailers are not giving orders, and the retailers are not giving orders because the consumers are not? Mr. Justice. Exactly. Mr. Beeckineidge. Then you have destroyed the goose that laid the golden egg when you destroyed the consumer? Mr. Justice. There are times when business is dull. I su[jpose Mr. Stevens will tell you, no doubt, that there have been times when he would run his mill and store up his manufactured product, when he knew there was to be no revision of the duty? Mr. Whiting. Factories are not now in the habit of piling goods up. They take orders. Mr. Justice. If you will get Mr. Cleveland to say that he will veto any bill reducing the duties the mills will be running before thirty-six hours. Mr. Whiting. That is pure bluflf. Mr. Justice. That is my opinion. There is only one thing more that I think you have not considered. Mr. Beeckineidge. What class of wool is this [referring to a sam- ple]? Mr, Justice. That is full-blood merino. Mr. Beeckineidge. I suppose that is the commercial classification? Mr. Justice. Yes, sir; that is flue wool. That wool is made into the finest clothing. Seventy-five per cent of the clothing used is made of merino blood. If those sheep were brought to America and put on this market, they would produce that wool. Mr. Eeed. The manufacturer acts upon the demand of the jobber, does he not? Mr. Justice. At present; not always. Mr; Eeed. The jobber, also, in addition to the demand of the retailer and the miller, must have some opinion as to what will be the future demand? Mr. Justice. All merchants anticipate values. Mr. Eeed. And the retailer and jobber both anticipate what the demand of the consumer will be? The consumer does not order first. The order comes from the jobber, for if that were not the case the con- sumer would be likely to go unclothed during the winter. The order of the manufacturer is an anticipatory one and depends upon the opin- ion of the merchant, does it not, as to what will be the probable demand of the consumer? Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. The condition of affairs will probably lower the price before he gets his pay, and the solvency of the consumer, who may also be the retailer, is to be taken into consideration? Mr. Justice. Without the shadow of a doubt. Mr. Eeed. So that if the people believe, whether correctly or not, 916 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. that the introduction of this tariff 'agitation is going to lessen trade ob account of a possible fall of price it will decrease trade? Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. So that a man may act with honest motives, for the loss of half a dollar a yard has a powerful influence with orders, either to the producer or in the line of transportation or distribution? Mr. Justice. Tes, sir. Mr. Eeed. That is left out. Mr. Justice. That is a fact. Mr. Whiting. [To Mr. Eeed.] There is an element which you have left out. Mr. Eeed. Also the consumer may have his impression warped. He has been told each year about cheap prices — sometimes he believes it and sometimes he does not, and, judging from the result of the last election, perhaps, he does believe it, and has been influenced by talk about a free country with tariff removed and a general run of cheap- "" II ess all over the land. Mr. Justice. The wool-grower is crippled now. Mr. Eeed. That case of the ranchman is an extreme case. . The other case, where there was a market and where the wool clip was destroyed, would not be so great. Mr. Justice. I have a tabulated illustration of that. In some sec- tions they are close to the market, and the value of the farm would be much gi'eater here. I have merely cited the worst case, showing how it would affect the wool- growers in the western end of the 'continent when the transportation is so high. Mr. Geab. How much will wool shrink in washing? Mr. Justice. Fifty-two per cent. Mr. G-EAR. They take off' very considerable in fleece-washing? Mr. Justice. In Oliio it would hardly shrink so much on account of dirt. Mr. Geab. How about Iowa? Mr. Justice. It would be more like 70 per cent in Iowa. The farther west you go the more dirt there would be. Mr. Whiting. The transactions of the merchants' business would be a little more substantial than the question of the gentleman from ]Maine would indicate. Tie merchant first takes account of his goods on hand, and considers then the position of the market. That is what governs him — the accumulation of goods. Each man knows the con- dition of his own trade where he is doing business. Mr. Justice. If you will permit, I will get one more subject which I wish to treat upon, and I will then answer any questions which maybe asked. The next subject is shoddy. This sample [indicating] is made from broken-up rags. This large one is worth a penny and one far- thing a pound. Its value would be to-day, if brought over as ballast. 2 J cents. The duty on this is 30 cents a pound, .making the cost without ireight 32 cents. I may say there is less shoddy used in America than in any country in the world, and if you want to know why 1 will tell you; if you do not, I will pass the subject. If the price does not fall, they will have more of this this year. The kind used in the market is American rags. TViese rags are never as bad or as dirty as the foreign rags. So mauy people are out of employment in Europe that the voca- tion of a rag-picker is quite a respectable one. In times of contagious disease, when men die and are thrown in the trench, their clothing is dug up and finds its way to market. They are resurrected, scoured, and the rags are taken, beaten, ground up, and not always subjected WOOL. 917 to any process that would destroy disease. Mr. Payne is wearing a worsted coat, but in the broadcloth suit there is usually a large percent- age of shoddy. . Mr. Taesney. Tou have been speaking about the Australian and Mexican wools. If the same sheep were in Australia that they have in the West, the wool would be of the same quality, because there would be less dirt? Mr. Justice. Tes, sir, if the grade of sheep were the same. It is a question of climate. Mr. Taksnby. Is it not by reason of this difference in climate that the finer fiber is grown? Mr. J USTICE. No, sir. 8ome sheep from America were taken to Mel- bourne and exhibited there. They took the first prize. The jury was composed of Australians. An appeal was taken, but it was decided in favor of the American sheep. The American sheep were shorn iii Aus- tralia. Mr. Taesney. Did the sheep grow in Australia? Mr. Justice. They had been there long enough to become acclimated. Mr. Taesney. Is it not a fact that by reason of climatic influences . the wool of sheep in Kansas has more sand substance in it, which can not be eradicated from the fiber, and that, therefore, the manufacturers of the higher grades of cloth are compelled to import these wools of Australia and Montevideo to mix with their wools in order to make these finer grades of cloth? Mr. Justice. That is not correct. It is because there is better pas- turage in Australia. If that sheep were moved to Kansas and kept a year, it would not be any better. Mr. Taesney. We import to Ohio and other j^laces these fine sheep from Australia. Are we raising that same quality more now than we used to? Mr. Justice. Not to the same extent. I have understood that Mr. Stevens, or some of his neighbors, formerly made those wools so fine that you could draw a jroll through a finger ring. That was twenty-five years ago or more. That kind of sheep are not grown in this country, for the reason that they produce only 2 or 3 pounds of wool, and that class of wool to-day would not bring over 50 cents a pound, fleece washed, at the outside, in comparison with the 25 cents a pound of this grade [indicating]. Two pounds liom one sheep at 50 cents a pound would be $1 per head for the sheep. They are raising a better quality, but they cost 50 cents per head. Pick-lock wool-growing has ceased to be an industry. Mr. Taesney. I was talking with the superintendent and manager of a mill, who took me through the mill and showed me the processes of manufacture. He was using good machinery and making good cloth, and I asked him where he got his wool. He said he got a part ot it from Australia. Knowing the country as well as I did, I asked him why it was that he imported wool from Australia and Montevideo when the county in which the mill was located raised so much wool. He told me that it was absolutely necessary, for the reasons I have stated, that he should import some wool. Did he understand his business or did he teU the truth? Mr. Justice. Very likely he told the tpnth. Mr. Taesney. He told me it did not make any difference to him how much the duty was. Mr. Justice. Where was he located ? Mr. Taesney. In Michigan. He told me it did not make any differ- 918 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. enee to the maunfacturer whetlier the tariff was 25 per cent or f 1 a pound ; that he had to imj)ort so much wool in order to make cloth. The only effect of the ta.iiff on wool was to increase the cost of produc- tion to the consumer in the price. Did he act prudently in that"? Mr. Justice. If he increased the cost of goods to the consumer when other people where raising it at a loss in his own county, I do not think he did. Mr. Taesney. If he had to import a certain percentage of wool to mix with the domestic wool, as he stated to me, then the cost of that foreign wool was increased to the consumer to whom he sold it! Mr. Justice. I am not aware that there has been any increased cost of cloth since the McKinley bill was passed; but I am aware that importations have increased. Mr. Tarsney. I am getting at the effect of it. What I want to know is whether it is necessary for a manufacturer to import these for- eign wools to mix with his domestic wool'to make any grades of cloth! Mr. Justice. It is, to some extent. Mr. Tarsney. Then if we should cheapen the cost of foreign wools to the manufacturer, would not that lessening of the cost to the manu- facturer enable him to get a larger market for the domestic wool? Mr. Justice. Of course, if you reduce the cost of constructing the fabric, it would cheapen it, and it is generally believed that if you cheapen an article you increase the market; but there is one thing left out of the calculation. Mr. Tarsney. Let us get away from that point. If you say it requires 35 per cent of foreign wool to mix with 66 per cent of domestic to make the clothing that you are now wearing, and if this 35 per cent is reduced in cost to the manufacturer, do you. not think that it would have the effect of increasing his business and giving a greater market for the domestic production! Mr. Justice. The present state of affairs does not confirm that. Mr. Tarsney. The present state of affairs is abnormal. Mr. Justice. On the 1st of March American merino wool was worth 60 cents, and we are now offering it at 40 cents. Mr. Reed. When a man wants to buy goods his ability depends somewhat upon having the money in his pocket, does it not! Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Ton exhibited a sample here of a clip of 70,000 pounds. ' Mr. Justice. That was the clip of Mr. W. H. Layton, of Trinidad, Colo. We sold it for him tor years. Mr. Breckinridge. Is that anything like an average clip for a ranch in that part of the country! Mr. Justice. It is better than the average. Mr. Breckinridge. What is the average number of sheep! Mr. Justice. Sheep run in bunches of 2,000. More than 2,000 do not do well together. Mr. Breckinridge. As a rule, do those ranchmen receive a great- deal more protection on their clips than they pay on the woolen goods they consume! Mr. Justice. They consume very little woolen goods. Mr. Breckinridge. When you come East you do not find the clip so large! Mr. Justice. No, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you receive shipments in the older States from local dealers! WOOL. 919 Mr. JxiSTldE. We buy from the farmers. Mr. BeeckineidGtE. Can you tell what is the average clip of the farmer in the older States? Mr. Justice. Two hundred fleeces in Ohio would be an average — that is, 200 sheep.- Mr. Breckinridge. Do you think that the farmers of Ohio will avet age 200 sheep 1 Mr. Justice. A good many of them have 1,000. Mr. I-jRECKiNRiDGE. Will they average 200? Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Will they average that much in Pennsylvania? Mr. Justice. Not taking the whole State; merino will. Mr. Breckinridge. It is clear that the farmer or ranchman receives more benefit by a tariff on his wool than he has to pay to somebody else when he buys cloth ; but that is not true of the producer of wool on the small farms in the older States? Mr. Justice. Of course it is in proj)ortiQji to a man's clip. Mr. Breckinridge. Have you figured that out to see how the duties on wool and woolen goods aft'ect the wool-grower in the older States? Mr. Justice. If his income is reduced, his ability to buy will bo reduced. Mr. Breckinridge. I suppose the farmers in the older States where farms and flocks are small have to pay more protection on the woolen goods purchased for their families than they receive in protection on the wool they sell. The difference in this tarift' tax would be a losing business to them, would it not"? Mr. Justice. I do not think so. For instance, this suit of clothes contains 3 pounds of wool. If we had free wool, the woolen goods in it would probably cost 90 cejits. Under the McKinley law .as at first proposed, it would cost $1.80. The farmer who wears a suit of clothes like this pays 90 cents more under the McKinley bill than if he had sold his free wool in London. Mr. Breckinridge. Is not the tariff operative upon woolen goods the same as upon wool? Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. It is as beneficial to the woolen manufacturer as it is injurious to the farmer who consumes the goods? Mr. Justice. The manufacturer could not live without it, Mr. Breckinridge. I am not asking as to the merits of the case. I am considering the matter as an ordinary business proppsition or ar^ arithmetical question. Now, suppose the farmer receives $5 protection. on the small wool crop that he sells, but, in the course of a year, he purchases for his family woolen goods on which he has to pay $10 more" than he otherwise would pay; on that transaction is he not $5 out? He receives $5 and paid out $10, Mr. Justice. That is a matter of calculation. It is a mere question of figures, assuming that he buys his cloth no cheaper. Mr. Breckinridge. I am not assuming that. Mr. Justice. You are assuming that he gets cloth cheaper under free wool. Mr. Breckinridge. You are extending the range of the question far beyond the way I put it. Mr. Justice. I want to enlighten you. Mr, Breckinridge, If you will address yourself to the question I ask, you will enlighten me more, Mr. Justice. Some men are poor listeners, and I am one. 920 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. Mr. Breckinridge. You have not calculated what was the effect of the increased price upon wool and upon woolen goods to the great body of the small farmers in the older States, have you? Mr. Justice. Certainly. Mr. Breckinridge. Are you prepared to say how much the increased price has been to the farmers on an average, supposing he gets on his wool clip no greater an increased price by reason of the tariff than he pays out for what he buys'? Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Please give it in figures. Mr. Justice. Give me a moment. The man has 200 sheep, and they will yield 5 pounds each. That is 1,000 pounds. In scoured the shrink- age will be one-half of that amount, which leaves .500 pounds of scoured wool. If he sells that at 60 cents he gets $300 for his scoured wool. If he sells it at London price he gets only $150. Mr. Breckinridge. That is a difference of $150 on his clip, as you figure it. , Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. K'ow you want to know how much more he pays for his cloth. Assuming that his cloth is of this weight, he will pay 90 cents more for the wool in each suit. He has two suits for four in family. In this case I am counting a woman's shawl worth as much as a man's coat; say two suits a year at 90 cents each, which amouuts to $1.80. Mr. Breckinridge. What price suit is that? Mr. Justice. I am counting the wool in it. Mr. Breckinridge. You are giving an enormous price on the cloth- ing by reason of the protection. The cost of the protection on woolen goods is higher than the protectiou of the wool. Mr. Justice. I am talking about the effect of the cost of the duty on wool in clothing. It is a simple matter. It is safe to assume that 90 cents is over rather than under the additional cost of each suit. Assuming that a woman's shawl is wortb as much as a man's suit, though, if I throw in the shawl it would be fair to assume that the cost would be 90 cents for each suit. Mr. Breckinridge. What price would you call that — a $12 suit or a $20 suit? Mr. Justice. This suit I have on cost $27. Mr. Breckinridge. I am not talking of the cost of the wool, but of the cost of the suit. Mr. Justice. I know nothing about the cost of the goods. Mr. Eeed. I sup|)ose Mr. Breckinridge is not trying to make the farmer pay the manufacturer. Mr. Justice. I assume that the man has two suits a year at 90 cents each suit for the cost ot the wool, which makes $1.80. He makes $300 on this wool under the McKinley bill, and gets $150 by having free wool. Mr. Breckinridge. That is simply on the wool in the clothes? Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. Mr, Breckinridge. I did not ask you about that. When the farmer comes to buy his clothes he buys under the operation of the tariff on wooleu goods; and I ask you how much he would have to pay because of the increase on his woolen clothing? Mr. Justice. I am not competent to answer that. All I can tell you is that when the rate on wool is high he has to sell a great deal less wool; and when the rate on wool is low he has to sell more. WOOL. 921 Mr. Beeckinetdge. Ton are not prepared to say whetLer the farmer makes or loses by the tariff on the woolen schedule'? Mr. Justice. The wool in his free-trade clothing saves him $7.80, and reduces his income from his wool $150. Mr. Dai.zell. He loses immensely by free trade? Mr. Justice. He loses the difference between $7.50 and $150; he loses $142.50. Mr. Breckinridge. That is based on the calculation you have just given. Mr. Justice. Because you take the ground that you are not going to reduce the wages of labor. Mr. Breckinridge. I was not talking upon that subject. Mr. Jusl'iCE. You proposed to put wool on the free Mst. There is no question of that. That will bring down ^the wages of the wool- grower. Mr. Breckinridge. In regard to shoddy, if manufacturers are com- pelled, under very excessive conditions, to buy wool, is it not necessary for them to use shoddy and other adulterants so as to bring the price within the reach of the consumer? Mr. Justice. There are a great many classes of wool in which shoddy can not be used. It is impossible to use shoddy in worsteds. It fol- lows that if by competition or any other cause the manufacturer finds he must lower the price before he can sell his goods, he must cheapen this wool with an adulterant, or go out of the business. Mr. Breckinridge. If the selling price is too low for the cost of manufacture, then is he not compelled to use shoddy or other adulter- ants so as to secure a profit? Mr. Justice. He can not sell below the cost of production. Mr. Breckinridge. Either extreme will lead largely to the use of shoddy and other adulterants. Mr. Justice. I presume what has occurred before will occur again. The necessity of capturing the markets of the world has compelled the English to get a market. I presume that is oji account of com]jetition. One man makes goods, and his neighbor undersells him by using adul- terants. Mr. Breckinridge. Is it true that if a manufacturer is compelled to manufacture upon a very expensive basis and to buy at greatly enhanced prices the raw material which he used, he must use shoddy in order to get within the purchasing power of the consumer? Mr. Justice. If Mr. Whitman must compete with the English he will have to use shoddy, if they are using it. The Chairman. Is shoddy the best adulterant? Mr. Justice. It is the cheapest. The Chairman. Is it cheaper than cotton? Mr. Justice. This article is worth 2^ cents [indicating]. There is a duty of 30 cents on this when it is imported. This article was brought over by a man in his pocket. He smuggled it. If he had to pay duty on it, it would have cost him 32^ cents instead of 2J. The Chairman. The McKinley bill not only increased the tariff on wool, but it increased the tariff on shoddy. Why was that? Mr. Justice. The object is to keep it out. The Chairman. They are using cotton and other adulterants instead of shoddy? Mr. Justice. We can not adulterate wool with cotton without being detected. The Chairman. I undeistood you to say that the increased cost of 922 WOOL AND MANOTACTURES OF WOOL, such clotliing, if purchased under the recent tariff law, would be about 90 cenis? Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. The Chairman. That is simply the increased cost in the price of the wool in the goods? Mr. Justice. It would be the difference between the price of wool in America and London. The Chairman. As that passes through the hands of the jobber, the wholesaler, the retailer, and the consumer, is not that 90 cents increasing all the time, or does it remain stationary? Mr. Justice. If the merchants are doing business they are presumed to make on everything. The Chairman. You were speaking of the different prices of wool, and you said the free- wool price of that Colorado wool was 6 cents; the London iirice is tjj cents. Your idea is that if the tariff on wool were removed we would have free- trade prices? Mr. Justice. London prices would dominate the market. The Chairman. Is it not a fact that wool, particularly Australian wool, regulates the price in London ? Mr. Justice. Not always. The Chairman. Do the Germans or the French import wool to this country. Mr. Justice. To some extent. The Chairman. Is it not a fact that London is a free market, and if we had a free market could we not import direct from Australia? Mr. J USTICB. No, sir. The Chairman. Your belief is that we would have to import by way of London? Mr. Justice. Yes, sir; and I would like to give you the reason: The English vessels are heavily subsidized. They hold the trade of the world, because they are protected. Mr. Bynum. The English vessels are not subsidized. Mr. Justice. Yes, sir: they are. Mr. Bynum. No: the/ are not. The (jHAIbman. We will go into that question some other time. Mr. Justice. There is a gentleman in this room who wiU furnish you the facts. The Chairman. I understood you to say that by reason of the tariff o I woolen goods the American wool-producer gets the benefit of the tariff' in the price he gets for his wool. Mr. Justice, Whenever a nation is raising less than it consumes, the producer, having no surplus, gets the benefit of the protection. When he raises a surplus the markets of the world determine his price. The Chairman. I agree with you. Your proposition is correct. The effect of that is at the present time to double the prices in this country? Mr. Justice. Yes, sir. The Chairman. What do you think of the justice and humanity of a law that doubles the cost to the poor people in this country on one of the prime necessities of life for the benefit of the ranch owner in New Mexico? Mr. Justice. I think it is proper and right. I think he gets an equivalent for it many times over. I illustrated that in this questipn of the average increase in the clip of the farmer of Pennsylvania. The Chairman. We have a number of producers in this country who do produce more than they use. WOOL. 923 ]\rri JTTgTicE. That is true in the case of wheat. The Chaieman. Breadstuffs, meat, and cotton are in that category. We sold .$3,000,000 worth of breadstuffs last year. We have free-trade prices for cotton and meat, and generally for whatever we have to sell in the outside markets. Mr. Justice. E'xactly. The Chairman. I understood you to say that the threatened tariff changes, putting wool on the free list and the reduction of the duty on woolen goods, was paralyzlug manufacturing industries iuthis country today. Mr. Justice. I am sure of it. The Chairman. Is it a fact that a great many of the mills which have shut down are taking an opportunity to enlarge their machinery? Mr. Justice. I do not know anything of that kind. If there is such a manufacturer he is a curiosity. The Chairman. Is the American Wool Eeporter a fair paper? Mr. Justice. I think the information you get in that paper is not cor- rect. The Philadelphia reporter of that paper called on us for our market quotations and I declined to give them to him, because I said they would not report it correctly and would make me say the reverse of what I meant to say. Therefore I did not give them the information. I have seen a letter from Mr. Bennett, the proprietor of the paper, in which he says: " If Justice, Bateman & Co. won't give you the quota- tions get all you can and guess at the rest, because the Wool Reporter must have the correct quotations." [Laughter.] The Chairman. I dislike to say so, but it would seem that he had more confidence in that than in your company. Mr. Justice. He is a member of the Massachusetts legislature, and I would rather not discuss that. The Chairman. He is a Eepublican, is he not? Mr. Justice. I think he is a Democrat. His neighbors here will know. The Chairman. Here is the American Wool Eeporter for Septem- ber, 1893. In one of the columns it gives a list of the mills which have resumed. Mr. Justice. Does it say "have resumed?" They have reduced wages 25 per cent. Does he say that? The Chairman. 'No. Mr. Justice. He should have said that. The Chairman. I notice that on the opposite page there is a list of the woolen mills that have resumed, and among others is the mill at Fall Eiver. Mr. Justice. That is a cotton mill. The Chairman. It reports that there will be no change in the other mills. Mr. Justice. If he published that as a woolen mill it shows his information is not reliable. The chairman read a Hst of mills which it is said had resumed. Among others mentioned was the Sawyer Works, of Dover, N. H. Mr. Justice. I happen to know about the Sawyer Works. I received a letter from them before I came down here. We sold them wool largely, and hearing that they contemplated resuming, we offered them wool on a basis of 40 cents, scoured, which we had refused to sell the first of last March for 60 cents. ' We offered that as an inducement for them to buy, but they replied that they would not have any use for 924 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF "WOOL. wool for some time; so that starting up does not help the wool- gpowers much. The Chairman. Do you know that when wool was put on the free list in 1867 there was an immense production in woolen mills in this country and there was prosperity in that business? Mr. Justice. No, sir; I am not aware of that, and I would like some evidence of it. I think you are mistaken about wool being on the free list. Mr. TuRNEE. Is -that sample of wool from Ifew Mexico an average sample! Mr. Justice. It is better than an average. It is a safe statement to make that there are a million pounds of wool raised in that section which is inferior to this, but which no man will take to-day and pay more than the freight for it. Mr. Turner. It is degraded by being raised on alkali lands'? Mr. Justice. It is a poor grade. The sheep have been poorly fed. Mr. Turner. Is that grade of wool a large element in the market? Mr. Justice. That Territory raises a great deal of wool. Mr. Payne. Do you mean that this wool is of an inferior grade? He is asking about inferiority. Mr. Justice. Both. There are thousands and thousands of pounds of that on our market at 10 to 12 cents. On a free-trade basis it is not worth a cent. Mr. Turner. Have you an investment in wool or are you a manu- facturer ? Mr. Justice. We are agents for Western wool- growers. We receive wool and place it with different wool manufacturers throughout the country, selling each man what he requires for his business. Mr. Whiting. Are you the agent of the wool-growers, or the man who buys from the grower? Mr. Justice. We are the agents of the grower. West of the Miss- issippi it is shipped to market by the grower. In sections east, the merchant buys it from the farmer. Mr. Turner. Have you given the average number of sheep to the flock-master? Mr. Justice. It would be about 200 sheep. Mr. Turner. What proportion of the population constitutes sheep owners in those sections? Mr. Justice. I do not recollect the figures; but I can state that the number of flock owners are a million, and the number of people em- ployed by them amounts to another million. i Mr. Turner. You would say that was an average — 200 sheep to each flock-master? Mr. Justice. The number per capita of owners is larger in some sec- tions than in others. For instance, in North and South Carolina there are as few as five or six sheep to a farmer. Mr. Turner. What whould be the average, taking the country over? Mr. Justice. I could not answer that question, because there are so many sections with which I am not familiar. Mr. Turner. What is the necessity for these mixtures of wool mak- ing it necessary for the manufacturer to import foreign wool? Mr. J USTICE. There is no necessity for it. America can, with proper protection, raise all grades of merino wool, from the carpet wool to the thick lock wool. I stated a moment ago when you were not in the room that a man in this country had manufactured a reel of this wool so fine that you could draw it through a finger ring. That was grown in WOOL. 925 West Virginia. It can be produced there now; but the raising of the coarser grade of wool is more profitable. .Mr. Turner. Do we not import carpet wools? Mb. Justice. Carpet wools are imported. Mr. TuKNEK. For my own information, I want to know why Anstra lian wools are imported for the purposes of mixing in making liner fabrics'? Mr. Justice. It is because the Australian wool makes the soft fin- ish. It has taken the place of the thick lock wool that used to be raised in such quantities in this country. We have raised that before, and with adequate protection we can do it again. Mr. Turner. As a dealer familiar with the trade, what time, in your- opinion, would be reasonable to enable the manufacturers and mer- chants to adjust themselves to the change ? Mr. Justice. I do not see how any mills can make goods until the change comes. The McKinley law is so constructed that the specific duty on a pound of cloth is four times the duty on the unwashed wool. That would leave no specific duty, and therefore to put wool on the free list itself without any further action would lower the value of cloth 44 cents a pound at once; and that is what is causing the trouble, Mr. Turner. Eegardless of any allowance of time before the act taking effect, what would you say? Mr. Justice. If the date is fixed when the duty will be removed, there will be no necessity for closing the mills. If there was an assur- ance by this committee that it would not pass, or by the President that he would veto any bill that took the duty off goods previous to one year after the change, I think the mills would start at once. Mr. Turner. You did not quite get my question. I asked what would be a proper period of time as a notice before the act should take effect on free wool? Mr. Justice. I presume that it is safe to say that on an average wool is brought to the manufacturer at least a year before it reaches the back of the consumer; and it is believed that the consumer as well as the middleman is holding orders, because he expects to buy cheaper later on. I think the consumer would not buy at once, if he felt he could buy cheaper inside of a year. At present it would make half a dollar difference per yard on a three pound suit of clothes, which would be $1.50. Mr. Turner. I think there is great force in the idea. The protective prices ought to be taken care of. I was trying to get at what you would consider reasonable estimates as to the time necessary. Mr. Justice. I think that less than a year would be too little time to be allowed under the present uncertainty. The present uncertainty is almost as distressing as the actual change would be, for no man can make any calculations. Mr. Breckinridge. In answering a question a little while ago, you estimated that there was 90 cents' worth of wool in the price of a 3- pound suit of clothes, due to the duty on the wool schedule; and now you estimate $1.50. Mr. Justice. What I mean is this : That the cost of a suit of clothes is increased 90 cents on a 3-pound suit by the present tariff law, assuming that it is made of merino wool. Mr. Breckinridge. Just now you stated, in answer to a question of Judge Turner's, that the duty was 50 cents a pound on woolen cloth. Mr. Justice. Nearly 60 cents'. For instance, the duty upon a pound of cloth is four times the duty on unwashed wool. If this Is heavy .'ational Association of Wool Growers, to reorganize the association, elect a president, a vice-president from each State and Teriitury, and other olhcers, and to devise moans to promote our common interests. Let us not saciifice our liocks, hut keep aud increase tliem until the friends^of the agricultuial and other industries of the country shall be able to secure the protec- tion which they need. VIII. Free wool would be the colossal political crime of the ago. The director of the mint estimated the product of our mines of gold in lf<92 at l,r)96,375 fine ounces at the value of $33,000,000, and of our mines of silver at 58,000,000 ounces at the average commercial value of $0,875 per fine ounce, $50,75 i,000, or a total of $83,750,000, 'ihe destruction of these mines by legislation would be a colossal crime. But the annual product of our sheep husbandry ia gicater than all this. 936 Wool and ManuJtactures ot wooL. Tlie nuniljcr or.sliec]i in tlie IJiiited States is, in roniul nnmliors, 50,000,000,-witii an annnnl incnUict in wool antl mutton wliieli at fair prices -vvoiild be $100,000,000, and developeit to meet our needs wonld be $200,000,000. l-'ree-wool legislation destroying this would be (lie colossal political crime of the age. Tlie ludiana Wool-Growers' Association recently held a largely attended meeting in Indianapolis. Thomas Nelson, of Clark County, presided over the meeting. A committee, consisting of Hon. Calvin Cowgill, of Wabash; J. W. Robe, of Greencastle, and J. W. Hall, of Indianapolis, presented the. following resolutions to the association, and they were unanimously adopted : A moment's reflection forces the conviction that the less diversified are our pur- suits as farmers the more shall we be compelled to extort from our fields in exhaustive crops, not only imposing ujion us heavy expenses in juaintaining the fertility of our lands, but forcing nsiuto narrower channels of production, thus tending to glut the market and reduce the price for such surplus as we may be able to produce because of overproduction. For the foregoing reasons, and many others that might readily be assigned, Eesoh-ed, That we regard it as our imperative duty to ourselves, to our common country, and to more than 8,000,000 farmers and husbandmen of the United States interested either directly or indirectly in sheep husbandry, to use every honorable means of which we are capable iu resisting any legislation tending to lessen the present duties on the importation of foreign-grown wool. liesolve.d further, That we regard the fallacious and sophistical arguments used by the free-traders to induce the woolgrower to believe that if there were no duties imposed on the foreign article he would be able to realize a better price for his wool as an insult to the understanding of every intelligent farmer. The present fear of such legislation has to a large extent destroyed our markets and reduced the obtainable price that we can realize for our wool at least 33 per cent. Whereas we, as farmers and husbandmen of Indiana, being interested in wool- growing and sheep husbandry, viewing with alarm the threatened destruction of that industry because of the proposed repeal of the law imposing customs duties on the importation of foreign-grown wool, do respectfully but niost earnestly protest against any change or modification of the present law whereby wool and woolens may be imported into the United States upon more favorable terms to the importer than at present. And for our action we assign the following reasons : Such threatened repeal has caused already a depreciation in the value of sheep and wool in this country of nearly, or quite, 50 per cent on that kind of property of the aggregate value of $300,000,000. There is no branch of hvisbandry more remunerative to the American farmer if he can have that protection that will secure to him his home market for his wool than sheep husbandry, but it is impossilile for him to successfully compete on equal terms in thesame market withthosewho grow wool with the cheap labor and on the cheap lands of Australia, the Argentine Republic, and South Africa, and in other countries where it is produced at merely nominal expense. A^'hen it is admitted, as itnnist be by all well-informed persons, that this country's maiu reliance in preventing heavy balances of trade against us in our international trade with other nations is upon the products of our fields, our herds, and flocks, the threatened destruction of that great industry becomes inexplfcable. And more especially is that so when we reflect that if sfieep husbandry is destroyed the Amer- ican farmer shall be compelled to resort to branches of agriculture not only more laborious but farmore exhaustive of the fertility of the soil, thus in every way lessen- ing his ability to earn a decent livelihood. Why that great industry should be singled out for destructive legislation when none are asking for it, and none are to be benefited by it except the foreigner or importer of his products, surpasses our comprehension to understand. Wool — woolen rags. &B 1 WOOL. (Piirasi'»plis 875 et seq.) Cleveland, Ohio, September 13, 1893. Sir : If you want to suit this mill, kindly put wool and all raw materials on tlie free list. Should this be done, we are willing to have the tariff on manufactured goods gradually reduced to 25 per cent, which is sufficient. This country can never compete successfully with Eureopean manufacturers until it gets free wool. The proper thing for your connnittee to do is to act quickly and settle the matter for a year or two, and whether or not you reduce the tariff the mills will start up, as they will know what they have to figure on. Yours respectfully, Beckman & Co., Per F, A. Mehling. WOOL. (Faragrap)is 375 ct seQ.) San Feancisoo, Cal., September 8, 1893. At a meeting of the San Francisco Associated Wool Commission Merchants, held September 8, 1893, the following resolution was unan- imously adopted: Whereas the wool interests of the Pacific coast are in a deplorable condition because of the threatened action of Congress to take off all duties on wool and to make large reductions in duties on woolen manufactures, and because also of the delay and uncertainty of Congressional legislation ; and Whereas it is utterly impossible to market wools at any price so long as this uncertainty exists, owing to the fact that a large percentage of the woolen mills of the United States have ceased to operate; and Whereas if this state of affairs continues much longer it will have the result of bankrupting an immense number of people employed in raising sheep, growing wool, and manufactnriug and dealing in same : Therefore, Be it resolved, That we ask our representatives from the Pacific coast to urge upon Congress that some immediate action be taken, if possible, upon the question so vital to us. Be it further resolved, If a change is made, we ask that such legislation as bears upon wool and woolens may not go into effect for at least twelve months from date of its passage, and that some public announcement shall be made as soon as possible to allay the uncertainty now existiug. John H. Wise, Chairman. Thos. Denigan, Secretary. And others. WOOLEN RAGS. (Paragraph 389.) Cotton and linen rags, and similar old material, known as " paper stock," are used for the manufacture of paj^er, and are on the free list, being a raw material. The paper industry in this country is in a very prosperous condition as compared with the paper industry of European couutriesj machinery and enterprise have done, and are doing in this 938 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. country what Europe has not got to the saine extent. "VVe export paper to Australia aud even to England, and can compete in the world's market in some grades. This is in consequence of free raw material. What paper stock is for the manufacture of ]}aper, woolen rags are for the woolen industry. Woolen rags are used Ibr the manufacture of shoddy and mungo artificial wools, and these materials are needed to mix with cheap wool to make cheap garments, so that the workmen can wear good and cheap clothing. The prices of woolen rags in Europe range from 1 cent a pound to 10 cents a pound, while the prices in this country for the same grades are between 3 and 20 cents per pound. There is no reason why the shoddy manufacturers should have to labor under the present duty of 10 cents a pound on woolen rags, which is entirely a prohibitory duty. Cheaper wools in consequence of low duty, in conjunction with cheap artificial wools, which can be obtained only through free woolen rags, would enable a woolen manufacturer of this country to give the American people cheaper clothing, and also to compete with European countries in outside markets. A removal of the duty on woolen rags would not hurt the domestic dealer, as they would be able to buy from all countries, and thus do a much larger business. The dealers in paper rags are all doing a good and large business, and there is no duty on paper rags, so, that the same condition would prevail with the dealers in woolen rags. We, therefore, would suggest, and respectfully ask the honorable committee to remove the duty on woolen rags, and put the same on the free list, as the paper rags have been for many years. EespectfuUy subjnitted. Felix Salomon & Co. WOOLEK GOODS. (Paragraphs 391-408.) Tuesday, Sepemler 12, 1893. The following delegation appeared before the committee, Mr. Charles H. Clark, of Philadelphia; Mr. S. N. D. North, of Boston, Mass.; Mr.' William Whitman, of Boston, Mass.; Mr. William H. Grundy, of Phil- adelphia, Pa.; Mr. H. L. James, of Eockville, Conn.; Mr. Goodall, of Sandford, Me., and Mr. John Hopewell, jr., of Boston, Mass. The Chairman. Mr. North has given me a memorandum of the order in which the gentlemen will address the committee, and the first named is that of Mr. Clark, of Philadelphia. STATEMENT OF MR. CHARLES H. CL4EK, OF PHILADELPHIA. The Chairman. I appear here as secretary of the Manufacturers' Club of Philadelphia, and I have a very brief paper addressed to the chairman of this committee, which I will, with your permission, read. Manufacturers' Club, 1409 Walnut Street, Philadelphia, September 4, 1893. Sir: The board of directors of the Manufacturers' Club of Philadel- phia desires respectfully to represent to you that there are strong reasons why no radical changes in the tariff law should be attempted at the present time. WOOLEN GOODS. 939 Last year, wlien an appeal was made to tlie people upon the question ■wlictlier revision of the law should be undertaken, the condition of business was wholly unlike that which now exists. The nation had high prosperity in all departments of industry, the revenues of the Govei'n- moiit were adequate to its expenditures, and experience had not yet fully demonstrated the inacciiracy of the accusation that the tariff act of 1890 obstructed commercial operations and laid heavy burdens upon the shoulders of consumers. Since the beginning of the present year a wave of commercial depres- sion has swept over the country. In so far as this depression has affected manufacturing establishments, we believe it to be in a consid- erable measure due to the apprehension entertained by manufacturers and tbeir customers that there would be fulfillment of the threat of radical clianges in the duties upon imported materials. While that tlireat remains, no manufacturer can engage with confidence in any operation extending considerably into the future. He will not buy raw material in quantities, when a, change of the duties may involve him in heavy losses before he has turned the material into fabrics. He can not run his machinery upon fabrics in anticipation of a demand which may, because of heavy reduction of duties, satisfy itself with imported goods. His customers will not place orders for fabrics made with dear American labor wbile there is hope that fabrics made with cheap European labor can be had within a few months at lower prices. Manufacturers are afraid to operate their mills; merchants are afraid to buy. Into the industries which were in a state of unprecedented prosperity one year ago an element of demoralization and disorganiza- tion has been thrust, and with disastrous consequences alike to mill- owner and to merchant, to workmen and their families, and to the com- merce of all the manufacturing communities which thrive only when productive industry is in active operation. The extent of the depres- sion can not be estimated fiilly from the reports in the daily press. It is far more general and more severe than is indicated by any statistics that can be prepared. Large numbers of mills have ceased operations completely; but a much greater number are running upon short time while the smallest hope of better things remains. Many have already been compelled to reduce wages, and all that have not done so are feel- ing the pressure of a necessity to pursue that policy in the early future. It may be doubted if more than one manufacturing establishment in a hundred is at this moment working with the same number of persons the same number of hours a week as were employed in September, 1892. Idle men and women swarm in the streets of the towns in which these industries are planted, and while employers are helpless in the pres- ence of difficulties which threaten many of them with ruin, the unfortu- nate laborers, cut off from opportunity to earn their bread, observe the approach of winter with dread of the hunger and cold from which they must suffer, unless relief shall come to them in the shape of revival of industrial operations. We express the opinion that this relief may be afforded instantly by an authoritative assurance that your committee will not assail the tariff law in such a manner as to expose manufacturers to unequal com- petition from Etiropeans working with lower wage scales. The pretext upoTi which such changes have heretofore been urged are now shown to be insufficient to warrant severe reduction of the protective duties. It is known to you that the tariff law of 1890 did not make a general increase of the customs duties. The commodities upon which the duties were not changed at all far outnumber those upon which the duties 940 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. were increased; and so large and so important were the rednctions and ^ the complete removal of the duties, that it is fair to believe that the benefit to the people from these changes much more than compensated for any injury that could have been inflicted under any circumstance by the few cases in which the duties were increased. But we question if any respectable evidence can be produced in sup- port of the theory that the masses of consumers have suffered hurt of any kind from the higher duties imposed by a few of the schedules of the existing law. It would be difficult to name any (iommodity in gen- eral use which has not fallen in price — and the de per pound Valued at above 40 cents per pound Total yarna SlanTcets. Valued at not more than 30 cents per pound Valued at above 30 cents, and not more than 40 cents per pound Valued at above 40 cents, and not more than 50 cents iJer pound Valued at more than 50 cents per pound Total blankets Oarpets. Aubusson, Axminister, Moquettes, etc., square yard. per Brussels per square yard.. Druggets and bocMngs , do Felt carpetings do Saxon, Wilton, and Tourney Velvets do — Tapestry Brussels do... Treble ingrain, three-ply, etc do — Velvet and tapestry velvet do — Wool, Dutch, and two-ply ingrain do — Carpets not specially provided for do... Total carpets . Cloths. Valued at not more than 30 cents per pound Valued at above 30 cents and not more than 40 cents per pound Valued at above 40 cents per pound .'. - . Total cloths Dress goods, etc. — Cotton warps, etc. Valued at not more than 15 cents per square yard. Valued at more than 15 cents per square yard . . . Weighing over 4 ounces per square yard, per pound Dress goods, aU wool, etc., weighing over 4 ounces per square yard per pound. . AU others '. per square yard . . Total dress goods Flannels for wnderwear. Valued at not more than 30 cents per pound Valued at more than 30 cents and not over 40 cents per pound ■ Valued at more than 40 cents and not over 50 cents per pound - Weighing over 4 ounces per square yard, per pound Total flannels. $0.28 .387 .621 0.288 .357 .476 1.018 3.069 1.076 .491 .514 2.019 .773 .775 1.176 .665 .871 .270 .378 .931 .920 .133 .205 1.258 .214 .212 .346 .400 1.011 .992 Per cent. 133. 16 120. 20 102. 04 Per cent. 70 $14. 02 38,977.46 410, 647. 05 61.2 449, 638. 55 Percentage of reduction of duty from existing law at proposed rate of 50 per cent ad valorem. Eeduction in amount of duty at 50 per cent ad valorem. 87.24 104. 36 77.81 42.7 48.3 52.9 35.7 252. 17 246.51 188. 91 1, 218. 14 82.12 1, 905. 73 69.55 80.89 84.79 61. 39 69.72 76. 32 64.52 74 64.78 60 16 38.2 41 18.5 28.3 34.4 23.6 32.5 22.8 103, 056. 68 24, 153. 75 696. 49 424. 59 18, 999. 12 1, 448. 91 3, 966. 58 7, 061. 00 3, 208. 68 61.84 19.1 163, 015. 80 163. 04 141. 79 97.27 64.7 48.5 10, 277. 88 80, 492. 53 5, 975, 890. 28 6, 066, 666. 69 92.58 89.09 93.03 84.98 105. 96 46 43.9 41.2 62.8 782. 226. 95 482, 379. 25 2, 184, 887. 03 88, 254. 66 4, 605, 310^56 98.96 49.6 8, 143, 058. 45 107. 97 98.49 103. 37 93.64 63.7 49.2 51.1 46.5 16.81 252. 17 266. 33 37, 123. 90 93.62 46.6 37, 649. 21 966 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OP WOOL. ExhiUt showing the present ad valorem duty on woolen goods, etc. — Continued. Articloa. Value per unit of quantity. Average ad valorem rate of duty on importa- tions for fiscal year 1892. Percentage of reduction of duty from existing law at proposed rate of 50 per cent ad valorem. Eeduction in amount of duty at 50 per cent ad valorem. Hats of wool. Valued at not more tilan 30 cents per pound Talued at above 30 cents and not more than 40 $0. 260 .342 .470 .965 Per cent. 93.47 99.35 105. 26 79.90 Per cent. 46.5 49.7 52.5 37.4 $136.29 19.74 Valued at above 40 cents and not more th.an 50 275. 90 3, 371. 35 .862 81.37 38.5 3, 803. 28 Enit fabrics. Valued at not more than 30 cents per pound Valued at above 30 cents and not over 40 cents .209 .393 1.421 55.77 138.25 80.97 10.3 63.9 37.9 20.83 3.53 9, 919. 04 Total Icnit fabrics 1.425 78.28 36.1 9, 943. 40 Shawls. Valued at above 30 cents and not over 40 cents .390 1.206 138. 63 86.47 63.9 42.2 619, 55 137,441.80 1.202 86.57 42.2 138, 061, 35 All other manufactures, not specially provided for. .264 .353 1.250 164.92 149. 07 85.19 69.7 66.4 42.3 2, 383. 43 Valued at above 30 cents and not over 40 cents 7, 664. 94 154, 764. 59 1.178 1.591 88.66 91.11 42.3 164,812.96 Percentage of reduction of duty,from existing law at proposed rate of 60 per cent ad valo- rem. Eeduction in amount of duty at 60 per cent ad. valorem. Felts. Per cent. 34.1 $19, 167. 90 Plushes, etc, Flushes and other pile fabrics per pound. . .865 117. 19 48.8 122,539.30 Wearing apparel. Cloalts, dolmans, jackets, etc, for ladies and chil- dren's apparel, etc per pound.. Other clothing, ready made and wearing ap- parel (except knit goods) made up wholly or in part perjiound . 2.224 2.634 82.26 79.54 27. 24.6 128,557.88 160, 326. 81 2.396 80.60 25.6 288 884.19 Knit goods. 1.499 93.04 35.5 401,306.49 "Webbings, gorings, suspenderB, etc. -per pound. . 1.980 90.30 33.6 117,050.79 Total all manufactures of wool, except 95.89 47.1 16,127,504.19 WOOLEN GOODS. 967 , BESOLUTIONS OF THE ITATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF WOOL MANUFACTURERS, ADOPTED ' JANUARY 12, 1893. ! Whereas it has been the policy of the National Association of Wool Manufactur- ers, since its organization in 1864, believing in the principle of protection uniformly .■ applied, to accept the judgment of Congress in determining rates of duty on wool, '• provided they were accompanied by the necessary compensatory duties on woolen ' goods; and whereas it is now proposed to repeal the wool duties : Therefore, (1) Resolved, That the wool manufacturers nevertheless desire to again place upon record their belief that the existing tariff has proved advantageous to the wool- grower, the wool manufacturer, and the consumer of woolen goods. The proposed economic change is not in response to any demand from the industry we represent, 80 per centum of the machinery of the country having joined in protesting against the passage of the free- wool bill now pending in Congress, which protest is hereby reaffirmed. (2) The wool manufacture, organized and conducted for more than thirty years on the basis of a duty on its raw material, can not easily or quickly adjust itself to so radical a change of condition, and the utmost care should be taken, if such a meas- ure is to be enacted, to so adjust its terms and parts that the industry will not be suddenly and violently forced into a position that will carry general disaster to those engaged in it, and to every merchant and shopkeeper handling their goods. We trust that no Congress elected by the people and responsible to them will hastily or carelessly enact a law imperiling the $300,000,000 of capital invested in the wool manufacture. (3) In this belief we invite the attention of Congress to the fact that woolen goods are manufactured nearly a year in advance of the season for whose wear they are adapted, and that, in consequence, any law simultaneously removing the duty on wool and the compensatory duty on goods will compel the whole domestic pro- duction of a season, manufactured from duty-paid wool, to compete in the markets with foreign goods manufactured from free wool. The so-called Springer bill doubly discriminates against the domestic manufacture, in this respect, by admitting at reduced rates, simultaneously Vith the repeal of the wool duties, all foreign goods imported prior to its passage and held in bond. It would thus force the domestic product into direct competition with foreign goods manufactured from free wool. The inevitable consequence of such discrimination would be the loss of a whole season's production, which would involve the ruin of many mills and of many industries dependent upon them. A year should elapse after the wool duties disap- pear before the compensatory duties are repealed. (4) Believing the industrial welfare of the nation requires that the manufacture of wool shall be continued and developed in this country, we ask at the hands of Congress the most careful examination of all the conditions surrounding the indus- try in this and other countries, to the end that duties may be adjusted at a point that will equalize the difference existing in the cost of manufacture here and abroad, both in respect to wages and the cost of capital, machinery, and plant. (5) Experience has shown that simple ad valorem duties are invariably accom- panied by systematic undervaluations, equally disastrous to the manufacturer and the honest importer ; that the Government can not collect all that is its due under the ad valorem system, and that the danger of undervaluation is greater in woolen goods than in any other class of merchandise. . We therefore urge upon Congress the importance of retaining the specific form of duty, or some part of it, in this schedule, in accordance with the recommendation of the late Secretary Manning. (6) We protest against any method of tariff revision which singles out a particu- lar industry, like the wool manufacture, for reductions of duty which are not applied impartially and simultaneously to all other industries. The machinery, dyestuffs, and countless supplies necessary to the wool manufacture are all dutiable by the present law, and a reduction of the tariff on woolen goods and not on these necessary accessories would place the industry at a disadvantage under which its prostration " would be complete. (7) The customs administrative act of 1,890 has provided for the first time in our history a uniform, impartial, and effective administration of the tariff laws, with an export tribunal for the determination of disputed rates. and classifications, such as is necessary under any tariff law, for the honest collection of the duties imposed by that law. We strongly urge the retention of this law in substantially its present form, as a law equally in the interest of the Government, the manufacturer, and the honest importer. (8) Resolved, That the wool manufacture, standing fourth in importance among all our industries, consuming annually a volume of raw material almost equal to that consumed in Great Britain, employing a quarter of a million persons, to whom are paid $80,000,000 in wages, and supplying all but about 10 per centum of the clothing of our people, is an industry which has vindicated its right to exist in the United States, and has approved itself to the friendly and considerate treatment which we ask at the hands of Congress. 968 "WOOL AND MAiSIUPACTURES OF WOOL. WOOLEN^ GOODS. (Paragraphs 891 et seq.) STATEMENT OF ME, WILIIAM WHITMAN, OF BOSTON, MASS. Mr. Chairman : I would like to supplement what Mr. ISTortli has said on one or two points, only very briefly. Would you rather hear me now, or wait until I have been submitted to a cross-examination'? With your consent I should think it would take me perhaps fifteen minutes to say what I would like to say. The Chaieman. Just proceed. Mr. Whitman. The preparation for appearing here has necessarily been very hurried. We have not attempted to present to the committee any details, because tliat is a work of time. I wish in opening to ask you to give any revision of the tariff all the consideration that is due to vested interests. I am not going into the subject at all. The property which I represent, in which I am a moderate owner, under certain con- ditions would become practically valueless, not only valueless to its owners but valueless to the city in which it is placed, valueless for tax- ation purposes, valueless for the support of the community in which it exists. M"ow, I have devoted to that business twenty-five years of my life. It has been built up with great labor. All the original proprie- tors, all of my original associates, are dead. I mention that fact, gen- tlemen, to correct an erroneous popular impression. There is a popular impression that the owners of these vested interests are rich men. Now, such is not the case. They are owned by men in moderate circum- stances, and a very large proportion of these vested interests are in the hands of trustees for the benefit of the widow and orphan. A large portion of the accumulations of the workingmen deposited in savings banks are invested by furnishing capital to the various corporations throughout the State in which I live, and of course any great radical change affects their interest. As a matter of fact, the textile industry of Massachusetts, for which I speak particularly, is represented by a very large number of shareholders, most of them ijeople in moderate circumstances. Now, the next point I wish to bring to your attention, and Avhich is the only point I propose to press for your consideration, is to try to disabuse, I will not say your minds, because I hardly believe you enter- tain the views I speak of — but to or correct an erroneous impres- sion that the revenues can be increased by diminishing the duty. I would not have referred to it here had not some of our distinguished statesmen, I think, ventured to assert that by reducing the duties to a given j)oint the volume of foreign importation of Avoolen goods could be trebled. Now, whoever made that statement is wholly unfamiliar with practical business affairs. 1 am speaking wholly from a revenue standpoint. As a matter of fact, the increased duties imposed upon wool hj the existing law increased the importations in the year 1892 25,000,000 pounds over those of 1890, and the imports of wool in 1890 and the previous year were very large. The revenue from the importa- tions of these woolens was increased over 1890 by nearly $2,500,000. That was the increase of 1892 over 1890. The duty-paid value of these woolens declined under the higher rate of duty from 19 f„ in 1890 to 18 1% in 1892. I am statin g facts, not theories. The total revenues from woolen manufactures and wool in 1892 were practically equal to the amount raised in 1890, and they were $10,000,000 in excess of 1884. WOOLEN GOODS. 969 They were $15,000,000 in excess of 1885, and they were $10,000,000 in excess of 1886. The years 1890 and 1891 ought to be practically elimi- nated from the consideration of this subject from the fact there were excessive importations in those years in expectation of the new law going into effect. Now, gentlemen, the amount of revenue last year on wool and manu- factures of wool was $42,000,000. Of this amount $34,000,000 was collected on goods and about $8,000,000 collected on wool. The abolition of the duty on wool and the corresponding or compensating duty on goods would diminish the revenue on the same basis of importation as 1892, $16,500,000 on manufactures and $7,750,000 on wool, making the total loss of revenue $24,000,000. Now, I propose to try to refute the theorythat that loss of revenue can be made up by any lower rate of duty. The amount of importation at 50 per cent ad valorem required to give the same revenue which was realized last year would be $84,000,000 foreign value. This would mean an increase of importation over last year of $48,000,000, and that would mean an increase of importations duty-paid value of $72,000,000. If the ad valorem rate of duty should be fixed at 40 per cent it would require an importation of $105,000,000 to give the same amount of duty which was realized last year, an increase in the importations foreign value of $70,000,000 and a duty-paid value of -$98,000,000. If at 25 per cent ad valorem it would involve the importation of $168,000,000, an increased importation of foreign value of $133,000,000, and an increased importation duty-paid value of $166,000,000. Now, gentlemen, it would be absolutely impossible to bring about any such increased importations as I have named under any conditions, in my judgment. You could not create a market here for that additional quantity of goods without diminishing the domestic production to an equivalent amount. You could not draw such supplies even at the lowest i have named from Europe without putting up prices in Europe. It would be absolutely impossible. It is a mistake to suppose you can manufacture a market at wiU or create production at will. You could put the whole continent of Europe to work and they could not make that amount of goods in excess of what they are making. It requires time and planning and an expenditure of money and a long preparation to increase productions to any great extent; and besides, gentlemen, there is another fact which bears upon all this. The volume of foreign importations depends wholly upon the jjrosperity of the country. There are manufacturers, I know, who think that the moment our imports of foreign goods increase that it is a calamity ; but when these imports do increase it is a sure sign of national prosperity, because if they did not have the prosperity they would not have the power here^the power or ability to make these purchases. The income, gentlemen, that you will derive from woolen goods is not going to depend upon lowering the rates, because the higher the rates — as I have shown by the test of experience — the greater the revenue, but it is going to depend wholly upon establishing such conditions for this country as shall make it prosperous and enable the people to buy foreign goods, and upon these purchases depends your revenue. That is the only point, gentlemen, 1 wish to present for your consideration, which was not touched upon at all in the brief submitted by Mr. North. The Chairman. As to your argument, that an increase of duty does not diminish importation, is not that the line of argument you began with? Mr. Whitman. Does not diminish revenue? 970 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. The Chaiematst. You quoted the fact that an increased duty upon wool did not diminish the importation of wool? Mr. Whitman. It increased both revenue and quantity of importa- tions in those years. The Chairman. Do you suppose that was the design of the com- mittee in imposing an increased duty upon wool? Mr. Whitman. I do not. The Chairman. They thought it would check the importation of wool? Mr. Whitman. That I do not know. The Chairman. That is the general idea of a protective duty, to check the importation of the foreign article. Mr. Whitman. I do not understand it so. The Chairman. The committee which reported that bill gave that as their reason for increasing the duties — I had the sentence right before me, but I do not find it at this moment — in which they expressed that as their understanding of a protective tariif. Mr. Whitman. What committee was that, sir? The Chairman. The committee which framed the bill of 1890. Mr. Whitman. I was not a member of that committee. The Chairman. That was the object of the framers of the tariff law ; so they differ with you on that question. I think you are per- fectly right in saying that any very large increased demand from this country could not be supplied from abroad. Mr. Whitman. ISfot immediately. The Chairman. And the effect of it would be to raise prices abroad? Mr. Whitman. I think any such demand would have that effect. The Chairman. It would operate as a protection to the home pro- ducer also, would it not? Mr. Whitman. It depends upon when the advance came in. The Chairman. Any sudden advance coming in immediately at the very time it was needed? Mr. Whitman. It would operate something like this. I want to be perfectly candid The Chairman. We know that. Mr. Whitman. I do not wish you to think I am trying to evade any questions. I believe that large orders abroad to ship goods that came into competition with American goods would lead to a diminished demand for American productions, and that diminished demand for the American productions' would operate unfavorably upon the manufac- turers and the wage earners at the time. The Chairman. Would there be increased orders placed abroad if there was a sudden rise in the in-ices of the foreign goods? Mr. Whitman. There would not be until after the orders were placed. The Chairman. Not until after the orders were placed? Mr. Whitman. ISTot until after. The rise in prices does not take place until after there has been the extra demand. The Chairman. Does not the increased demand begin at once to stimulate the price? Mr. Whitman. It would not at once. The Chairman. But as soon as orders begin to pour over there on the other side, would not prices go up ? Mr. Whitman. They probably would. The Chairman. Because the mills there would not be able to fill those orders? "WOOLEN GOODS. 971 Mr. Whitman. Probably. The Chairman. Now, is it not true that in the use of the necessaries of life, and other articles also, that as you cheapen the price you greatly enlarge the consumption? Mr. Whitman. I think it is true as a rule that lower prices means increased consumption, but the proportion is quite small. The Chairman. Do you know there was an increased consumption of sugar the year after raw sugar was put upon the free list? Mr. Whitman. No; I did not. The Chairman. It was about 13 pounds per capita in the country, if I am not mistaken. Mr. Whitman. Do you mean the removal of the duty at the passage of the last act? The Chairman. Yes; putting raw sugar upon the free list cheapened the price of sugar, and increased the consumption. Mr. Whitman. That was not an increased duty, that was a removal of duty. The Chairman. But it cheapened the price of sugar and led at once to a greatly increased consumption. Would you not anticipate the same result if woolen clothes were cheapened to the people? Mr. Whitman. I think there might be a small increase of consump- tion. The Chairman. Tour argument was based upon the idea that the quantity consumed was remaining constant? Mr. Whitman. No ; I do not think so. The Chairman. I so understood your argument, that any increased importation would be just so much work taken from the home produ- cer? Mr. Whitman. Please repeat that; I can not hear very well. The Chairman. As I understand your argument, it was any large importation would be so much work taken from the home producer? Mr. Whitman. Any very large increase, such increase as I have talked about. . I do not mean to say that fluctuations of a few per cent one way or another would influence it very materially. The Chairman. Might not it be true, however, that a sensible decrease in the cost of woolen clothes would lead to such a large increase of consumption that there might not only be large importa- tions, but larger domestic productions? Mr. Whitman. I do not think it would; I do not think that would follow to any great degree. The Chairman. The duties upon woolen fabrics are compound; they are specific and ad valorem, and the specific duty is supposed to be conipensatory for the duty upon wool, is it not? Mr. Whitman. Yes. The Chairman. Is there any compensatory duty in the ad valorem ? Mr. Whitman. Compensatory for what; I do not think I understand your question. The Chairman. Well, probably the question does not explain itself. Is it not true that when these compound rates were adopted in 1867 — was that the year Mr. Whitman. 1866. The Chairman. That there was an internal- revenue tax upon woolen goods? Mr. Whitman. I think there was. The Chairman. And when these compound rates were adopted the 972 WOOL AND MANUFACTUEES OF WOOL. specific duty was made compensatory for the duty upon the wooi and the ad valorem duty was increased to compensate for the excise tax? Mr. Whitman. I could not answer that question because I- was not in business so far back. The Chairman. Then if it be true, as Mr. North says, that ia 1890 a pound of cotton and shoddy was used for every pound of wool, if that be true, is not the manufacturer getting a compensation through his specific duty on cotton or shoddy, upon one of which he pays no tax and upon the other he has until recently paid not a very high tax? Mr. Whitman. I do not know the proportion of cotton or shoddy that is mixed with wool in the manufacture, but in so far of course those things may be used in the manufacture of woolen goods there can be no question but what the specific duty affords an additional protection. There can be no doubt about that. The Chairman. It increases the real protection over the specific and ad valorem duty? Mr. Whitman. It does on those fabrics. The Chairman. Now, I will ask a question to you as a practical manufacturer which I started to ask Mr. Clark, I believe, and that is, supposing the manufacturer here and abroad both have free wool and they stand upon an equal footing as far as that is concerned, what is the chief disparity or chief disadvantage under which the home manu- facturer labors? Mr. Whitman. The chief disadvantage is the difference in the price of labor; that is the greatest; that is the preponderance. The Chairman. Can you tell the committee what is the difference in the labor cost in this country and in the countries with which we com- pete, not per diem, but in the unit of production? Mr. Whitman. I could not answer that question. The Chairman. Buying $100 worth of women's and children's dress goods which you manufacture, what would be the difference in labor cost in this country and the countries with which you compete? Mr. Whitman. I can not answer that directly, but I will make this statement: I have studied statistics more or less all of my life, and I got very little satisfaction. I do not want this understood to be any reflection upon the gentleman who furnished them, but I wanted to know just what the specific difficulty I labored under as against Brad- ford, England, and Eoubaix, France, so I took a young man who was a graduate of an institute of technology, an institution with which you all are familiar, and I sent him up to my mill. I refer to the mill I am treas- urer of, and kept him there for six months studying our works, study- ing the wages we paid our people, and then I sent him to Europe with this commission, to find out exactly what the same kind of labor was paid in Bradford, in Eoubaix, Prance, and in Belgium. I did not Want to go into the general question of the difference between the labor in all percentages that labor cost bears on the total cost, but I wanted to know just exactly why I could not make goods just as cheaply as over there. I did not do it with the idea of presenting these facts to Con- gress. I did it to know, to get at the bottom facts, and I confined it to my own business because that was something I knew all about and the man whom I had educated knew all about. These facts you will find in his report. You will find it in the paper Mr. North has sub- mitted to you and asked to be made a portion of your proceedings, entitled "The necessity, the efficacy, and the advantages of the duties on woolen goods," and it extends from page 44 to page 49. I know that report to be accurate, and it shows that the wages we pay in the city WOOLEN GOODS. 973 of Lawrence were practically double those paid in England, and more than double those paid on the continent. The Chairman. Now, do you refer to the per diem wages ? Mr. Whitman. I refer to the day earnings of the operatives. - The Chairman. That is not my question. Mr. Whitman. One moment. Now, if the productive power of the operatives or machines was the same there as it is here, then it follows necessarily that my labor costs more than double the labor costs there. Now, we examined into that question. It is a mistake, gentlemen, to suppose there is a greater productive power in a man or machine here than there, and the machines particularly, that is, that there is any great difference. It is a mistake to think that there is a much greater productive power here than there. I was questioned very closely when I appeared before the Ways and Means Committee before on that point, and my Impression is that it was by Mr. Breckinridge. Mr. Breckinridge. I did not get much satisfaction out of you. Mr. Whitman. I answered you very frankly. Mr. Breckinridge. Tes, very politely and frankly. Mr. Whitman. I am stating the facts about it. The machines run at just as high speed over there as here, the machinery is just as good, and produces probably as much per spindle, but I think, in fact, in England and Scotland they can produce more per spindle. The Chairman. Is it not a fact both in the cotton and woolen indus- tries that the disparity between skilled operatives in this country and England is much less than in a good many industries where we compete with them? Mr. Whitman. I can not answer your question. Will you be kind enough to repeat the question ? The Chairman. The disparity between the cotton and woolen indus- try in wages in this country and England is much less than in a good many industries where we do actually compete with them, as, for instance, the making of agricirltural implements, machinery, clocks, watches, and many things'? Mr. Whitman. I do not know about that. I do not think any special prominence in any one industry ought to be created. Mr. Eeed. What was your question, in cases where we are in direct comjjetition we give lower wages'? The Chairman. There is less difference between wages paid in the woolen and cotton manufacturing industries in this country and abroad than in many industries in this country and. abroad where we compete with them iu their own markets. Now, I find here in Mr. North's cen- sus report of 1890 the total product of woolen goods for the census year 'in this country was $338,000,000 worth, and the wages paid was $76,000,000, If I am correct, then about 23 per cent of the product was wages. I find now that last year the average ad valorem rate of duty on woolen manufactures imported into this country — I mean the year 1893 — was 95, nearly 96 per cent. Would you consider that an excessive duty to compensate for the difference in wages between the two countries? Mr. Whitman. The premises are all wrong; they are all wrong. Now let me explain, if you will. The 95 per cent of which you speak, one-half of it, as I have already stated to you in my earlier remarks, is duty on the wool. The Chairman. That is correct; 44 per cent is the duty on wool. Mr. Whitman. Now, the balance, somewhere about 48 to 50 per cent, is duty on the goods. Well, now, I claim first, and I will prove it to 974 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. any disinterested person, I am sure, that the relation of the labor cost to the total cost has nothing whatever to do with the amount of duty that ought to be imposed. In the first place these tables of the census are made up according to forms that have been in use for a great many years, and as is common of census reports of all industries, things are multiplied over and over as to value and not as to wages. Mr. North has informed me, and I think he has made the statement somewhere in his report, whether it has been published or not I do not know, but my impression is he has made the statement in his report modifying that to that extent. For instance, a man buys — but in regard to the labor cost of manufacture I will refer you to the same pamphlet to refute the point you have made, pages 25 to 44 inclusive. I will explain how it is done. Mr. Payne. He wants you to state what this shows. Mr. Whitman. For instance, a spinner of worsted yarns makes $100 worth of worsted and sells that $100 worth of worsted yarn t6 a weaver. It is returned as $100 worth of yarn Irom the spinner. When the weaver works that up, he returns it over again as a part of his product. That goes to a dyer and finisher and he returns it again as a part of his product, and so in all of these industries no matter which is taken, there is the same multiplication of products which makes the labor bear an unnatural proportion to the total cost. That you will find explained fully on pages 25 to 44 in answer to some speeches which were made in the House of Eepresentatives during the passage of the House bill 6007. Mr. ByNTJM. These are totals Mr. Whitman. They are multiplied. Mr. Bynum. They can not be multiplied when the aggregate amount Mr. Whitman. They are multiplied in various ways, as I have indi- cated. The Chairman. I presume Mr. North in making up these tables got from each factory the amount of the yearly pay roll and the value of the goods manufactured by it? Mr. Eeed. Uiflerent factories make different articles. Mr. North. The total footing of the product represents the value of all yarn sold, which value is duplicated in value of all cloths sold with- out a duplication of the wages, and it is impossible to get a percentage of the labor cost from the census figures, both physically and mathe- matically impossible. Mr. Eeed. I would like to ask a question to see if I understand this thing. A weaver buys $100 worth of yarn which has the labor of the yarn-maker in it ? Mr. Whitman. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. His product when he gets through is worth, say $200, and that includes the yarn itself? Mr. Whitman. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. So that his product of $200 is added to the $100 of the yarn-maker, is it not? Mr. Whitman. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. Making $300 the total, whereas in reality the totalis only $200? Mr. Whitman. That is exactly the result. Mr. Eeed. While at the same time the wages are not reproduced against it in the same fashion? Mr. Whitman. Noj that is the fact. WOOLEN GOODS. 975 Mr. Eeed. Suppose there wfis another process besides making the cloth, making clothes for instance, and the total result of that "product was $300 and that was returned at $300. You would have $300 and $200 and $100, which would give us $600. Of course the figures are entirely incorrect, but is not that the ideal Mr. Whitman. That is correct. Mr. TuKNBE. Is it possible that estimate of Mr. ISTorth is made on that basis'? Mr. Whitman. The censias work has been done in that way for a great many years. Mr. TuKNER. I thought we had something like solid rock when we had Mr. ISTorth here. Mr. Whitman. Mr. Korth, I suppose, did the work under special directions. Mr. Eeed. I presume he took the forms as furnished to him. The census is taken by sending out circulars, I understand? Mr. NoETH. Yes, sir; it has been always the case. Every one of the partially manufactured products in one line of industry is necessarily duplicated in the total product of that industry where it is sold as a separate article in the market. Gen. Walker in the Ninth and Tenth censuses has explained that very fully, and has stated the facts. Mr. TuENEK. Did you say in the case put by Mr. Eeed that the labor cost would be repeated as many times as he stated? Mr. NoETH. No. Mr. TuENEE. I mean cost of product as sent from one party to the other. Mr. NoETH. I would say that the value of the yam which is sold to the weaver is r^eated in the returns of the weaver, plus the labor wages put upon it. Mr. Eeed. Do not be misled by my figures. I was simply trying to get at the method of calculation. Mr. TuENEE. I was putting to him the illustration you gave. Mr. Eeed. What I was trying to guard against might lead you to the idea that the wages were duplicated and multiplied and that would not be the case. Mr. TuENEE. I wanted to know if the values were piled up in that way. Mr. Whitman, I do not think there is any doubt about that in all the census reports. Mr. Btnum. He put that labor on the yarn and charges it up as cost of labor? Mr. Eeed. But he only charges the labor once. Mr. Bynum. When he takes a piece of yarn and puts labor on the piece he pays for the labor and pays for the yarn. Now, when the charge is taken up again the charge aggregates what is paid for labor? Mr. Whitman. I will tell you how it is. Suppose Mr. Eeed for instance buys a hundred dollars worth of raw material and he increases its value by putting upon it 10 per cent of labor or profit. That would make a factor when he sells it of $110. Now, suppose that he or some other inember of the committee buys that at $110 and puts $40 of labor upon it. That makes the selling price $150. Now, suppose some other man buys that at $150 and puts $40 of labor upon it. That makes the value $195. Now, in the census returns the value of these products is given at $455 and the labor at $80 so that reduces the percentage of labor to less than 18 per cent. Mr. Bynum. Suppose that man buys $100 worth of material and puts 976 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. 10 per cent to it. Kow, he sells that to the next manufacturer, and he pays him $110. He pays for his labor and he puts on it $40 of labor, and that makes it $150. ITow he returns that in the census as having $110 partially manufactured and having put on it $40 so the labor is counted there. That makes $150. ifow, that man sells to the next man for $150, and he puts ou it $30 worth of labor, and that makes $180. Now, then, you would assume Mr. Whitman. $195, 1 make it. Mr. Bynxtm. Well, make it $195. Tou sssume it is all counted up, duplicated over in these final tables here, except the last 30 per cent, but if you go back you will find the $10 the man has put on has been calculated in the table, and the $40 the other man puts on has been counted, and when you finish it you have got the labor cost. Mr. Whitman. What do you make the total amount of labor? Mr. Bynum. The total amount of labor at that would be $95. Mr. Whitman. Ko, it would be $80 of labor. Mr. lifoETH. You keep adding the value of the labor to the value of the material. Mr. Bynum. But you only add what the second man puts upon it. Mr. Eeed. Let me make a suggestion. The first product is $110 with the labor added; the second is $150 with the labor added; the third is $190 with $40 of labor added. Now, you get $90 for the total labor, and the total product is $110 plus $150 plus $190 as returned in the census, not really. For instance, the first man who makes the yarn gives $110 for his yarn, and that includes $10 worth of labor, and the second man gives $150 for his product, and that includes $40 worth of labor, and the third man gives $190 for his product, which contains $40 more of labor. Now, the labor is added up and makes $90, and the products are added up and makes $450. Mr. Bynum. Eight there Mr. Reed. Wait a moment; let me see, because this testimony is not expert testimony; it is the census. Mr. Breckinridge. You are showing what is done. Mr. Eeed. Yes; the man who takes $100 worth of raw material and adds $10 to it in labor, returns that $110 to the next man. Mr. Breckinridge. Your point is, it is a reproduction of the same materia] and the addition is put in labor, not additional material? Mr. Eeed. Yes; that is tbe idea. I think you understand it. I think Mr. Bynum will understand it as soon as he gets into his mind that each one makes return and carries the product over of the man of whom he purchases it into his own product. There can be no doubt about that. There is the fallacy of the census, and the fact is, if any- body undertook to study any such a thing in our own census or any- body else's, and did not come out and say squarely it is, his experience is different from mine. Mr. Whitman. You will find it all explained in pages 25 to 44. Mr. Turner. Do you mean to say this kind of computation runs all through the values and computations made in the census tables? Mr. Whitman. I am so informed ; I do not know the facts. Mr. Turner. You do not state it as a fact of your own knowledge? Mr. Whitman. Not except in regard to woolen goods, but I presume th'e same method is adopted in taking the census of woolen goods as taking other goods. The whole thing gives entirely an erroneous' impression as published. ', Mr. Turner. I think the thing ought to be investigated. Mr. Eeed. I think the thing ought to be abolished. I know II WOOLEN GOODS. 977 exhausted it and myself, and I found the figures did not mean anything at all. The Chairman. The census of 1880 shows 17 per cent as the average labor cost of woolen goods. Mr. Payne. What is it practically? Mr. WhitmA-N. It constantly varies. Mr. Eeed. It constantly varies in regard to the product. For instance in my district is one mill and right along side of it is another mill making other woolen goods and the labor cost might be different ui each of those mills with the same amount of hands and almost the same management. It depends upon the product, and it depends upon varying circumstances outside of that. Mr. Whitman. Yes, sir ; they vary a great deal. In round numbers — that is, under free wool — I figure one-half the average would be wool, and about one-third wages, and about one-sixth labor, and the rest in such form as general expenses, insurance, etc. That is merely a rough estimate. Mr. TuENEE. You said just now that the volume of our imports is in some sort the measure of our prosperity. Did not you state the vol- ume of our imports depended upon the prosperity of the country? Mr. Whitman; I did. Mr. TuENEE. Would not you state that conversely, that the volume of our exports measured the prosperity of the country! Mr. Whitman. I think that it does, I think that it is one of the evi- dences of prosperity. Mr. Eeed. That is different somewhat, however, from being the cause of prosperity? Mr. Whitman. Oh, yes. Mr. Eeed. W"e spend money most anywhere when we have a lot of it. Mr. TuENEE. Stating it your way, if we should have a very large balance of trade, it would not indicate any adverse condition in our commerce? Stating it the way you just stated it, if the volume of our imports depended upon the prosperity of the country, then a large bal- ance of trade would not indicate any adverse condition ? Mr. Whitman. Not necessarily, but there is this to be said that when- ever imports of foreign merchandise become excessive they injure the country. ISTow, if you look back and study the history, of every panic which we have had since 1837, with the possible exception of the exist- ing depression — which I do not consider a panic at all — but if you will look back you wUl find that every great disturbance, industrial depres- sion, in the United States has been preceded by excessive imports. Mr. Beeckineidge. Overtrading? Mr. Whitman. Overtrading. Mr. Beeckineidge. It matters not what we trade in? Mr. Whitman. That is a fact, but every great industrial disturbance we have had in the memory of men now living has been preceded by excessive imports. Mr. Tuenee. According to that England ought to be in a constant remediless i^anic? Mr. Whitman. Not at all. Mr. Eeed. He said from causes in this country. Mr. TuENEE. Then the same rule does not apply to this country? Mr. Whitman. I am speaking only of this country. Mr. Tuenee. Have we had any recent large excess of imports over exports? Mr. Whitman. I do not think that the imports have been very T H 62 978 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OP WOOL. excessive. I stated in my former remarks I did not consider the pres- . ent condition of tilings was brought about by excessive imports. Mr. Bynxjm. I understood you to say the imports of foreign goods would displace the sale of so much of American product; that is, if a large importation was from abroad of woolen manufactures that it would necessarily reduce the sale of so much American product in the home market; is that your idea? Mr. Whitman. I confined my statement to certain excessive increases to make up a deficiency of revenues. I did not mean to say every sljght increase or decrease affects the market particularly one way or another. Mr. Bynum. Suppose you adjust the tariff so as to have more liberal trade; that is, that American manufactures and foreign manufactures may meet on an equality in the American market; do you think that would tend to reduce the sale of products at home, or sale of American manufactures or output? Mr. Whitman. Ton are not likely to increase materially importa- tions of foreign woolen goods that come in competition either directly or indirectly with the American fabric, you are not likely to make any material increase — I am speaking now of an immediate increase — with- out affecting our own industries. Mr. BYNtrM. JSTow, there I do not agree with you; there is where we differ. I am one of those who believe the removal of obstructions will increase production, and production and consumption go hand in hand; that when people can consume more than they can produce, that they go up together. Whenever you obstruct a market or you prohibit importation you wUl obstruct a market at the same time to exports, and you will find the American farmers consume just what the American manufacturers consume from them, but if you will give them an outlet they will consume that much more of goods, and that it will not injure the American manufacturer in the least, but will have the tendency to increase his sales in the home market. Mr. Whitman. Tour theory, as I understand it, is that if we should stop producing woolen goods and depopulate the cities Mr. Bynum. I did not make that assumption, because it is not so. Mr. Whitman. Or force them into other businesses or employ- ment Mr. Bynum. My theory is this: The farmers of this country are now producing a large surplus. If they can buy no more of the Ameri- can manufactures than the American manufacturers buy of them the trade must cease; but this surplus must be disposed of to another com- munity, and where there is a deficiency in other things they must buy from others. Mr. Whitman. Is not that an entirely different proposition ? If you will allow me, if you will make the proposition that prices wUl sympa- thize with a great steady production of a nation, I will assent to it. Mr. Bynum. That is my theory, that trade is nothing but a distribu- tion of surplus. And in order that there should be a distribution of that surplus, that a community who has a surplus of one character must take the surplus of another community. Kow, whenever you choose to lock up or put a barrier between the distribution, or obstruct that distribution, you necessarily reduce consumption, and that in reducing consumption you sacrifice the consumers in both coun- tries. For instance, if the farmers of this country get a liberal trade in exchange for their surplus of agricultural products, they would be enabled thereby to buy more American manufactures than they other- WOOLEN GOODS. 979 wise would. For instance, a farmer might exchange his wheat for silk, which farmers as a rule would not consume, but the cheapening of the price of silks may enable those who were able to consume it to consume more and in that way the farmer may realize more money and be able to go to the manufacturer and buy more woolen goods, and in that way the manufacturers would be benefited instead of injured. WOOLEN GOODS. (Paragraphhs 391 et sey.) BTATEMENT OF LOTTTS WINDMIILLEE. I asked for the privilege of expressing to your honorable committee my views on the tariff, especially on wools and woolens, not to further that or any other particular interest, but hoping that tlie result of a long study which I have given to this important question may interest you at a time when it involves the prosperity of our whole country. Of wool chiefly two kinds are imported. (1) The coarse, for carpets, which pays 32 per cent and 50 per cent ad valorem now, is not raised in this country. Nobody will object any longer against putting that on the free list. (2) Australian clothing wool, costing now 9 pence, about 20 cents exclusive of the present duty of 11 cents per pound. When this is removed the article would come into competition with Ohio fleece, because both are used to make the same fabrics. The shrinkage of both is 55 per cent. As the Australian staple is finer, and will become a formidable rival to our product, strenuous objections may again be raised against its free admission. We can not expect, however, that goods which are now made from it abroad can be manufactured here, if we can not get the material as cheap. It does not follow that the value of our wool must decline in consequence. Soon as the #uty on foreign wool is abolished, I expect to see a rise of 10 per cent at least in the value of Australian; and Ohio fleece should decline no further when a demand for it will begin to show itself again. There is none now. It is worth 24 cents per pound, much cheaper than ever, because our manufacturers have practically ceased to buy. Last week only 1,200,000 pounds changed hands in aU our markets, against 7,600,000 pounds during the same period a year ago. Piled up in the warehouses of the East and West it may decline until it can be exported to England in competition with Australian wool, if the uncertainty about the tariff lasts much longer. Some of the largest woolen mills of the country haA^eclosed, others are working half time. If the tariff discussion should continue until next spriag, I expect that every miU of importance in the country wiU shut down. Allow me to give you a few examples of the present duties on woolen goods. Here are cloths for carriage linings, made in Bradford, weighing 16 ounces, costing 4s. 8^. net per yard, or $1.13 ; the duty of 50 per cent and 44 cents per pound is $1,005; total, $2,135. At the World's Fair in Chicago, Thomson, from Huddersfield, exhibits cassimeres for men's wear, marked in plain figures, cost per yard in England 5s., $1.26; duty, $1.31; total, $2.56. When you remove the duties from raw materials, our manufacturers 980 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OP WOOL. will not object against a removal of tlie specific rates ■which now com- pensate them for that tax. The question about which there is a divers- ity of opinion is how much the other rates may be lowered without a disturbance of the present conditions. This is owing to the different estimates of the value of labor. I think it is on an average about twice as dear with us than in the countries where we buy our textile fabrics, and that about 50 per cent of their value is represented by labor when made in this country. A yard of domestic cloth sold by commission men for $1 usually represents 50 cents in labor, 30 in raw material, 20 in profit and cost of distribution. If the duty should be reduced at once to 25 per cent, I fear that many manufacturers would be obliged to stop altogether, unless they can get wages cheaper than is now practicable. "When free trade was introdiiced in England, its manufacturers and artisans had already been trained to use the mate- rial which was best adapted to their fabrics and had learned to econo- mize. Our experience during the recent financial depression has reduced prices, bat laborers could not exist if their wages were sud- denly reduced by one third or more. Some of them may acquiesce rather than be idle. But they would suffer for the necessities of life to an extent which would impair their efficiency. It may partially be due to the high rate of duties that the cost of living is so much greater here. But nearly two-thirds of the wages of a laborer is spent for food, which ought to be cheaper, because we raise it here and sell it abroad. Ifecessity must teach economy, but the lesson can not be learned on the spur of the moment. It will take years before our manufacturers will know it to the extent which has enabled the English to control the markets of the world. I take the liberty of suggesting as a practicable and simple measure the following : (1) Make all raw material, animal, agricultural, and mineral products, free. (2) Eeduce by one-half the rates on semicrude articles, which can be used only when manufactured. I refer to goods like re-reeled silk, hakled flax and hemp, hatters' fur, refined metals. After you removed the specific rates compensating for duties on the r aw material (3) make a horizontal reduction of 25 per cent from the present rates on all other goods. The adoption of such a measure would — (1) Not greatly disturb the industries which have adapted them- selves to the present duties, and may lead the way to further reductions. (2) A change so simple should give little occasion for long discus- sions, because all would be fairly treated alike. When the entire tariff had been remodeled before, almost every member wanted duties imposed on articles which his constituents made and the free admission of those which they consumed. If as much time were consumed now in discus- sions as formerly, our industries would continue to suffer, and all the interests which depend upon them would suffer with them. Objections to my suggestion wiU be made by protectionists, who may consider these reductions too great, and by free traders, who will say they are not large enough. I admit that my plan may not sufficiently rectify some incongruities of the McKinley bill, and beg to refer to some glaring examples. Pearl buttons are taxed 2J cents a gross, per line, and 60 per cent — a barbarous rate, which is circumvented, however, by importin-g the disks from Vienna, to bore the necessary holes in them. Manufacturers WOOLEN GOODS. 981 of pearl disks pay 40 per cent, whicli my proposition would reduce to 30 per cent. Tin plate is taxed $2.20 per 100 pounds; I suggest a reduction to $1.65, which would be 65 cents more than formerly. This industry has just been created. For the first time tin plates have successfully been made outside of Wales. The previous attempts to make them in Belgium and Germany had been failures. It may do less harm to allow a tax of $1.65 to remain than cripple a growing and prosperous industry. If not disturbed, it will absorb large quantities of our iron and employ a great many laborers. I expect it will develop to such an extent that tin plates may be made cheaper here than in Wales when you ineet again for another revision. Before I close I would like to submit as exceptions to my suggestion the following: (1) To abolish the tax on art and science. Paintings, books, and statuary should be free, and all the material which is used to make them. (2) Those articles of luxury which are deleterious to health when used to excess should be taxed as heavily as possible. I refer to tobacco, liquor, and opium. One of the chief objects of the new tariff should be the encourage- ment of our manufacturers. Before long our ability to export food must diminish as our wheat and cotton fields become exhausted and population increases. We must begin to look for other exportable commodities if we want con- tinually to enjoy our present commercial supremacy. If we encourage our manufacttirers they may be able to supply the prospective defi- ciency of our exports. They would then no longer be confined to our home market, but would compete with France, G-reat Britain, and Germany wherever their fabrics are now consumed. Louis Windmuller, Mew YorTc. WOOLEK GOODS. (Paragraph 892). STATEMENT OF ME. H. L. JAMES, WOOLEN MANUFACTTTREB, OF KOCKVUIE, CONN. Mr. Chaieman : I come before you concerning the woolen manufac- turers interested in this question of a tariff on wool and woolens. I come from Eockyille, Conn. I believe our factory is in the first dis- trict. Our business is entirely that of manufactures. We have one cotton mill manufacturing mostly cotton warps and muslins for men's wear, and cotton warp for ladies' wear; we have one sUk mill manufac- turing silk twist and sewing silk; we have two mills making knit goods and linens. We have five or six woolen mills engaged in making woolen cloth and fine goods for men's wear; we have one envelope mill. These several establishments are in Eockville, Conn., and are to-day entirely stopped. We haven't a spindle turning, not a loom running, not a man employed, and the whole industry of the town depends on these several mills. Our locality is one of the oldest localities in the coun- try. The corporation with which I am connected as treasurer and man- ager began business in 1821, and has had a continuous experience for over seventy years. We were compelled to stoD more or less in the win- 982 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. ter of 1857, whicli was called-the hard-times winter among the woolen people. I think our corporation had to suspend operations more or less in 1837, which was before my time. Aside from that, the corporation I represent has been in continuous business without stopping since 1821. Something has been said m your hearings about the running of the mills by taking orders, etc. Without going over the matter, I would like to say what my own experience and knowledge has been, knowing it to be the' experience and knowledge of all the people, more or less, who are engaged in the same business. In the month of July we sent out large samples of all our goods for the next year's consumption by the people. We are accustomed to take orders in the month of July and early in August for 5,000 or 6,000 pieces of fine goods for men's wear, and making quantity sufficient for the next two or three months to run us to January or February following. That is the common custom among the woolen mills. This year we sent out our samples as usual to the wholesale clothing trade of the large cities and also to the job- bing trade. We sell our own goods and have no commission houses. We have 150 customers in the wholesale jobbing and clothing trade in Boston, New York, Philadelphia, Baltimore, Cincinnati, Chicago, St. Louis, Louisville, l!5"ew Orleans, Milwaukee, and the larger cities. We received favorable resijonses. We were told that the goods were all right; that the cloths were proper in finish and style and manufacture. No objection Avas made to the cost of them; but buyers were not ready to buy, and the only reason they could give for not bujang was that they did not know what goods were going to be worth next spring, when they had to market them. They said that if such action was taken by this committee and this Congress as would have a bearing on values^ they could not predict what the values would be when they came to sell their goods. We sent samples in July and August, and took orders to deliver those goods in the fall and early in the winter. They want to know what the prices will be in the following summer. In July of this year, instead of getting orders for this season's busi- ness of 5,000 or 6,000 pieces, we had on our books the 1st of August orders for between 1,400 and 1,500 pieces. We have been delayed in getting additional orders for the same reason, that people would not order until they had some idea as to what would be done by this com- mittee. Instead of the mills starting up and increasing their produc- tion, instead of orders being increased as has been stated here, the contrary has been true. Instead of having our usual number of orders on hand, we have not taken orders, but the cancellations have more than equaled the orders that stand. The consequence is that we have been compelled to stop the work. In the month of' July we stopped the mills entirely one week, and the balance of the month and the early part of August we began three days in a week. Since then we have not run half of our machinery. This week other miUs have been stopped in the town, so that they are now nearly all stopped.- We read in the papers where mills start and stop, here and there, and where this mill and that mill increases; but the contrary is true. When one mill is started more have stopped or curtailed previous pro- duction. It is true in my own town, and it is also true in every other manufacturing town that I know of. It is not for the lack of endeavor- ing to sell goods; it is not because the goods are not of good quality and nicely finished; it is not because there is any stocks on the market, because the markets are practically bare of this kind of goods; but it is WOOLEN GOODS. 983 i simply a want of confidence on the part of the people to whom we sell^ the whole wholesale jobbing and clothing trade. lu the meantime our employes are out of work. They come to us and say: " Can't you give me something to do, as I have a wife and children, and I must take care of them." All we can say is what I said last Saturday: "This matter is coming up before the Ways and Means Committee, and unless we can get from them some helj) we can not help you." As a conse- quence, in many kinds of business half the goods under order have already been made and the other half will be inside of six weeks. If we get no further orders the mills will shut down. In the mean time very maby of our people wiU have no means of buying food for themselves and tamilies. That is the situation in our town ; and I say from my own knowledge that it is largely the situation in the woolen industry throughout the country. What I have said does not vary very much from what you can read in the papers day after day. Mr .Whiting. It the producers and consumers through the country were selling their products at a fair price, would not there be a demand for the goods ? Mr. James. There would be no demand for goods from any woolen people I know of until there is confidence on the part of the clothing manufacturers and jobbers who desire to contract to-day at prices that will not be cut under when they gets ready to market the goods which we sell to them. Mr. Whitino. They will supply the trade if the people will buy it and pay for it. Mr. James. They wont pay us 2J cents for goods under the expecta- tion that you will make them 2 cents next April. Mr. Btnum. The trouble with you is that the Mills bill did not pass, Mr. James. That is largely a matter of opinion. WOOLEN GOODS. (Paragraph 892). STATEMENT OF ME. LATZKO. Mr. Chairman : Permit me to express my sincere thanks to you for affording me an opportunity to be heard by this honorable committee. I desire to give you my views on textiles, and particularly on woolens. Although a foreigner, living in Bruenn, Moravia, Austria, the center of the Austrian textile industry, I am well acquainted with the Ameri- can textile industry. It is for a period of more than a quarter of a century that I have followed, step by step, the magnificent progress this industry has made. My first knowledge of the details of Ameri- can woolen industry dates back to the year 1866, when I returned to Austria, having spent a number of years in the woolen centers of Bel- gium, Prance, England, and Scotland, where I had started as a weaver, and finally acted as superintendent of woolen mills in France, England, and Scotland. I founded a woolen mill in Austria in 1866, and it was in that same year that my business relations with the United States commenced. I have since visited your industrial centers, especially the centers where woolen goods are manufactured, and frequently have exchanged 984 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. views and dates with American manufacturers, so that I may sa^y ttiat I am perfectly familiar with the details of your woolen industry as well as I am informed about those of my own country. This is one of the reasons why I thought my statement might be of some value to this committee. Before I begin, gentlemen, let me assure you that I do not come before you with the intention to convince you that you should abolish all duties on articles manufactured and imported by me into the United States. I simply intend to prove that the present tariff on woolens is higher than necessary for the protection of the American manufacturer, and to plead for a reduction. Although for many years I have been familiar with the fact that woolen and worsted goods of all qualities are manufactvired in the States, I may say the World's Columbian Exposition at Chicago alone with its 128 different exhibits of woolen goods amply proves that all qualities and grades are manufactured in the United States. I have studied thoroughly all those exhibits. The most important of the American exhibit have been assigned to me by the executive committee on awards, to make a report as member of the international jury, and I have found that the greatest part of those exhibits can compete with the very best and finest goods which are manufactured in Europe; style, quality, finish, coloring, are excellent. While examining those beautiful exhibits, I candidly say myself it seems a mere prejudice among certain classes of people in America that domestic goods can not be produced in the same qualities as foreign goods which are imported into this country. I am convinced that to-day the American manufacturer is able to make every kind of grade of wooolen goods at least just as good as we make them in Europe. And why not? There is, I am sorry to say, to-day no secret in the way of producing goods. I mean no technical secret. Furthermore the weaving is to-day the most important feature of the manufacturer. Your system of power looms has been adopted by European manufac- turers because we found your system far superior to those of Europe. I remember the time when I introduced in 1867 the first Crompton loom in Austria. Many of my conapetitors who at that time thought it impos- sible to make perfect goods on a loom which makes more than thirty- four picks per minute smiled at my efforts. The American Crompton looms which I introduced I think made seventy. The American manu- facturer could work this looni with satisfaction with such a speed. I, however, was obliged to run the loom with fifty-two picks per minute, because I could not find a weaver to work that as it was done in the United States. It is a well known fact that in regard to weaving all the good, industrious, and improved work that have been made during the last twenty-five years came from America.. The American sys- tems of Crompton and Knowles power looms have been adopted and found superior to all those heretofore used in Europe. Your wages for labor, particularly for skilled labor, are considerably higher than ours. WOOLEN GOODS. 985 Wages paid in leading American wovlen mills, SCHJBDUIE I. "Wool sorters $10.50 Wool scourers 8. 00 Dye-house hands : Second hands 10. 50 Kegular.. 8.00 Giggers 7. 00 Dry finish : Secondhand 12.00 Other labor, men 8.00 Speckers 4. 50 Burrers 7.00 Shearers, men 8. 00 Spinners, second hand 11. 00 Spinners 10.00 Spoolers, per spool.... 10 Card room : Secondhand .t-.. $12.00 Strippers 10.00 Pickers 7.00 Tenders 4.50 Weave rooms, second hantl 13. 50 Harnessers 7. 50 Loom fixers 12. 00 Drawers in 6. 00 Dressers, head 12. 00 Handers in 3. 35 Markers 4.50 Weavers, average 9. 50 Wetfinish 16.50 Wet, general help 8. 10 Repair hands 10. 00 Watchmen 9.00 SCHEDULE n. Wool sorters: Men Girls Scourers, men Assistant carders, men Card grinders, men Carders (section), men Carriers and strippers, men . Card boys Assistant spinners Spinners, men .*. Piecer boys Twisters, spoolers and reel- ers Engineers Firemen $14. 00 6.00 10.00 18.00 15.00 13.00 10.00 7.00 18.00 12.00 6.00 6.00 18.00 12.00 Watchmen Warp dressers Assistant overseers, weav- ing FixQTS or tuners Weavers Dr awers in Burlers or knotters Menders Fullers and gig hands Cloth examiners Shear hands Laborers Overseers Machinists and carpenters . 6 to 8 xo 20 to $14. 00 14.00 18.00 16.00 12.00 12.00 8.00 10.00 10.00 12.00 9.00 9.00 30.00 15.00 Average wages paid in European woolen mills. Card room: Secondhand $6.00 Stripper 5.00 Pickers 4.00 • Tenders 3.00 Weave rooms, second hand 7. 00 Harnessers 4.00 Loom fixers 8. 00 Drawers in 4. 00 Dressers, head 6. 00 Handers in 2. 50 Markers 3. 00 Weavers, average 6. 00 Wetfinish 6.00 Wet, general help 4. 00 Eepair hands 6. 00 Watchmen 5.00 But I find tbat using the same machines thait we use, your working- men produce more. Looking at your official statistics as well as the dates gathered by myself from a number of American manufacturers, and comparing the average number of yards of cloth, that you can pro- duce on the same loom used in European factories, I come to the con- clusion that your weaver, being more intelligent and more industrious Wool sorters $5.00 Wool scourers 3. 50 Dye-house hands : Second hands 5. 00 Regulars 4. 00 Giggers 3.00 Dry finish : Second hand 5. 00 Other labor, men 4. 00 Speckers 3.00 Burrers 4. 00 Shearers, men 4. 00 Spinners, second men 6. 00 Spinners _ 6. 00 Spoolers, per spool 4.00 986 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. than our -weavers, wlio work for lower wages, produce more value in a day than the European workingman. I now desire to submit to the committee a few tables that I have pre- pared showing the difference of cost in the manufacture of certain standard goods in the United States compared with Europe. The figures which I am going to present are those of your Bureau of Labor Statistics ; also others which I have prepared from my own observations. First in your own oiflcial statistics contained in the annual report of Commissioner Wright for 1891, the average cost for labor, oflacials, and and clerks, fuel and lighting, oil, repairs, and taxes in the United States amount to 48J cents per yard for 16-ounce fancy worsted cloth. I have compared this with data which has been famished me a few days ago by some of the most prominent manufacturers of the United States, and I find that your average of 48J cents per yard is higher than the actual cost for this class of goods stated ,in the communica- tions received by me from the manufacturers themselves. But never- theless I will take your official figures, 48J cents, as a basis for my calculations. [lYom Seventh Annual Eeport of the Commissioner of Labor, 1891, pp. 176 and 177.] Table 1. — Elements of cost in one yard. * Product No. Materials, net. Labor and supplies. Total. Labor and supplies, one yard. 190 . . $1.51 1.33 1.57. 1.38 1.60 1.57 1.36 1.30 $0.45 .34 .65 .28 .47 .60 .60 .42 $2.00 1.67 2.32 1.66 2.07 2.17 1.96 1.72 $0.49 193 205 . . . - .65 187 .28 183 .47 .60 203 - . . - .60 211 .42 This shows average cost for labor and supplies in one year to be 48J cents. Table A shows the cost of 60 yards of cloth manufactured in America to be $1.87 per yard. Tabue a. — Present cost in the United States of America of 60 yards fancy worsteds in weight of 16 ounces per yard, made of S-fold 40-worsted yarn, fine quality. Per pound. 55i pounds 2-40 yam, in white $1.10 Dyeing and dressing 15 1.25 55i pounds, at $1.25 69.37 Cost of labor, official and clerks, fuel and lighting, oil and other supplies, and repairs and taxes, per yard, 48i cents; 50 yards - 24.50 93.87 Cost of 1 yard, $1.87. This cost price is a little lower than the price stated in the ofBcial statistics. The latter shows this class of goods costs $1.95 per yard. The difference of 8 cents per yard is accounted for by the fact that since the official report was made yarn has become cheaper. Table B shows the cost of 50 yards to be, according to the report of the Commissioner of Labor, $1.95 per yard. WOOLEN GOODS. 987 Table B. — Cost in the United States of America of 50 yards fancy worsteds in weight of 16 ounces per yard wide, out of S-fold 40-worsted yarn, fine quality. [Seventh Annual Keport of tlie Commission iv of Labor, 1891, pp. 176 and 177.] Product number. Total cost per yard. Product number. Total cost per yard. 190 $2.00 1.674 2.32 i.eej 183 $2. 078 193 ... 186 2.179 205 203 ; 1.968 187 211 1. 723 Average cost per yard, $1.95. Table C shows the cost of the same class of goods as mamifactured in Europe to-day, namely, $1.53 per yard. Table C. — Present cost in Europe of 50 yards fancy worsted in weight of 16 ounces per yard, made out of 3-fold 40-worste,d yai'n, fine quality. Per pound. 55i potmds 2-40 yarn, ia wliite $0. 66^ JDyeing and dressing 15| Per pound 82 55i pounds, at 82 cents 56. 51 Cost of labor, official and clerks, fuel and lighting, oil and other supplies, and repairs and taxes, per yard, 40 cents; 50 yards , 20.00 76.51 Cost of 1 yard, $1.53. Table D shows the cost of the goods manufactured in Europe when imported into the United States under the present tariff, namely, $2.79 per yard. Table D. — Cost of 50 yards fancy worsted, imported under the present tariff. 50 yards, at $1.53 $76.50 Duty, 50 per cent ad valorem on $76.50 $38.75 50 pounds, at 44 cents 22.00 60.75 137. 25 Cost of landing, freight, and shipping, 50 yards 2.74 139. 99 One yard, $2.79. Table E shows the cost of 50 yards manufactured in America from the same yarn used by the European manufacturers (European yarn imported into the United States), namely, $2.49 per yard. This shows how much protection the American weaver enjoys at the present time. Table E. — Cost of 50 yards fancy worsted manufactured in America out of imported European yarn. 55i pounds yam, at 82 cents (price in Europe) $56.51 Duty on yarn, 40 per cent on $56.51 $22.60 55i pounds, at 38 cents t 21.09 ^ ' 43.69 100. 20 50 yards, cost of labor, official and clerks, fuel and lighting, oil and other sup- plies, repairs and taxes, per yard, 48i cents ; 50 y aids 24. 50 124.70 Per 1 yard, $2.49. 988 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OP WOOL. Table F sliows the cost of 50 yards, supposing that raw wool could be imported free of duty, namely $1.63 per yard. Table F.— Cost of 50 yards of fancy worsted out of S-iO yarn under free wool. If the TTliite yarn costs now $1.10 per pound, it -will cost under free wool 22 cents less, i. e., 88 cents. 2-40 In wliite under free wool $0.88 Dyeing and dressing ^5 1 pound yarn 1-03 551 pounds, at $1.03 ^'^'^^ Cost of labor, ofacial and clerks, fuel and lighting, oil and other supplies, repairs and taxes, per yard, 48i cents; 50 yards 24.50 81.66 One yard, $1.63. Table G-, cost of 50 yards imported into the TJnited States, supposing that a duty of 35 per cent ad valorem were laid on such fabrics, but no specific duty, namely, $2.06 per yard. Table G. — Undei- duty of SS per cent ad valorem 60 yards imported fancy worsteds. " 50 yards at $1.53 $76.50 Duty 35 per cent ad valorem on $76.50, 50 yards 26.78 103. 28 One yard, $2.06. Table H shows the cost of 1 yard in Europe, according to the report of Commissioner Wright, to be $1,377. Table H. — Elements of cost in 1 yard, according to the Annual Report of 1891, Commis- sioner of Labor. Product numbered 217 shows that the material costing net $1. 0192 And the elements of labor, of&icals and clerks, fuel, lighting, supplies, and repairs, costing 0. 3385 Total, one yard - 1-377 In reality the cost of labor, officials and clerks, fuel and lighting, supplies, repairs, and taxes being $0.40 per yard. As to this table I may add that Commissioner Wright figures the cost for labor per yard at 35A cents. My own figures of European labor are 40 cewts. But Mr. Wright arrives at his figures by giving the cost of labor in one factory only, while I have given the average figures of a great number of mills iu different localities. This explains the difference. Summary of tables. 1. Shows labor and supplies in one yard cost according to average shown by the report of Commissioner Wright $0. 48^ A. Present cost 50 yards manufactured in America 1. 87 B. Average cost 50 yards according to the report of Commissioner of Labor. 1.95 C . Present cost 50 yards in Europe 1. 53 D. Cost of 50 yards imported under present tariff 2. 79 E. Cost of 50 yards manufartured in America from European yarn 2. 49 » F. Cost of 50 yards ij^the United States under free wool 1. 63 G. Cost of 50 yards imported under 35 per cent ad valorem duty 2. 06 H. Cost of 1 yard in Europe according to report of Commissioner Wright . . 1. 37 WOOLEN GOODS. 989 One word more concerning the calciilations of the cost of produc- tion. IsTeither in the calculation of Mr. Wright nor in my own have been included the interest on the capital invested, or the depreciation of plant. But as these items would be nearly the same in Europe as here, the omission does not change the figures in either case. It thus appears from the tables here presented that under the pres- ent tariff the American manufacturer is protected by 49i% per cent. Under a tariff which permits raw material to come in free he would be protected by 71^ per cent, provided the present duties on manu- factured goods should be continued. Under a tariff which permits raw wool to be imported free of duty, while manufactured articles would be subject to an ad valorem duty of 35 per cent, as proposed by me, the specific duty of 44 cents per pound being abolished the American manufacturer would stOl be protected by 26-i\ per cent. It has frequently been stated that one of the main purposes of laying duties on manufactured articles was to protect the American laborer against the competition of foreign labor. The item of labor in goods costing $1.87 per yard to produce is about 73-i-\- of a cent of about 40 per cent. This labor would not be protected in full, but besides there would be an extra protection of 26i^o per cent over and above the differ- ence between the cost abroad and in the United States, if raw wool should be made free and only a duty of 35 per cent ad valorem be levied on woolen fabrics. Permit me to explain here how I arrive at the figure of 73^ cents for labor per yard in toto. The amount of 48J cents given by the offi- cial report quoted before does not include the cost of labor employed making the worsted yarn. This amounts to about 25 cents per pound, and I have added these 25 cents to the 48J cents given as the cost per yard of cloth, thus making the whole charge for labor 73J cents per yard of 16-ounce cloth. As I have mentioned before, by glancing at the above tables, you will observe how much the American manufacturer is protected in every case. Now I am of the opinion that the high tariff on raw mate- rial is a great drawback for your American manufacturers. The lead- ing woolen manufacturers of the United States want free wool, and they should have it. If this is granted them they will be able to com- pete with any nation of the world. Free wool would give a better chance to the manufacturer in America and to the importer as well, provided the tariff on manufactured article is reduced accordingly. It would cheapen the goods for the consumer, and the consumption would increase. A natural consequence of this would be that with the greater demand for goods there would be a correspondingly greater demand for labor, and thus labor will profit thereby as well. In continuation let me explain the personal interest I would have in such reduction. I will state first that the import of foreign woolen manufacturers has fallen off' considerably since the McKinley act has been in force. A reduction of duties would certainly stimulate imj)orts to a certain extent. It may seem astonishing that under the present high, almost prohibitive, duties goods could be imported at all. The class of goods imported consist in a large measure of high class fancy goods. These goods are very difficult to manufacture, because they are made from a very high and tine grade of yarn. Furthermore they ' are manufactured in ^comparatively small quantities. The American manufacturer does not care to produce goods of this class, because when Jie makes a style he wishes to produce large quantities of it, therefore 990 "WOOL AND MANUPACTUEES OF WOOL. goods that are not salable in large quantities are as a rule not manu- factured in American mills. The European manufacturer found that there is les.s competition in this class of goods, and this gives him an opportunity to compete. There is another circumstance which affords the foreig-n manufacturer a chance to sell his goods in the American market in spite of the disad- vantage of a high tariff. This is the fact that there is a certain class of consumers in the United States who prefer imported goods simply because they are imported. The same goods of the same quality may be manufactured in this country and be sold at a lower price than the imported article. Still this class of consumers insist upon having the imported goods though they have to pay much dearer for them and do not get any better value for their money. The weavers certainly have to take into consideration these tastes, and serve their customers accordingly. A reduction of duties would, as I said before, probably stimulate imports in a measure, but, on the other hand, the abolition of duty on raw material would enable the American manufacturer to produce his goods so much cheaper that the consumption would be largely increased. The increased imports in that case would hardly cut a figure compared with the larger profits derived by the American manufacturer by means of larger sales. I believe, therefore, that while a reduction of the duties on woolens preceded by the abolition of the duty on raw wool would inure to the benefit of the foreign manufacturer and the importer, it would not injure the American manufacturer nor the American laborer, as both of them would derive greater benefits from such a change in the tariff than either the importer or the foreign manufacturer. TO SHOW THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE WOOLEN INDTJSTBY IN THE UNITED STATES. Total produce of woolen goods: Importation of woolen goods 1840 $20,696,000 into the United States : 1850 42,207,000 1867 $58,719,754 1860 68,865,000 1870 37,064,001 1870 199,037,362 1880 35,356,992 1880 267,252,913 1890 56,582,432 1890 338,231,109 1891 41,060,080 Importation in 1890 shows only 16^ per cent, compared with, the value of goods produced in the United States of America. Mr. Latzko. The labor statistics of this country are wonderfully good. They are better made than an y thing in Europe. The only trouble is that only a practical man can understand them. They have gone into details, and I find their prices, as compared with the trade statis- tics in Europe, are very much better. • Mr. Ebbd. What is the difference between the cost per yard in Aus- tria and here of the goods you have mentioned? Mr. Latzko. The cost is $1.53, and the cost of the imported article is $2.79. Mr. Eeed. That includes the tariff? Mr. Latzko. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. Have you made any calculations as to what it would be with a tariff of 35 per cent? Mr. Latzko. Yes, sir: it would be $2.06. Mr. Eeed. And the American manufacturer can manufacture it at what price? Mr. Latzko. At $1.63. Mr. Eeed. Is that with free wool? WUyijJiJN OrUODS. 991 Mr. Latzko. Tes, sir. Mr. Eeed. How would he get in then? Mr. Latzko. The American manufacturer is protected with 26 per cent. Mr. Eeed. How would he get in, if it cost so much? Mr. Latzko. Just for the reason I have stated. There is a large class of people who want the imported article, whether it is better or not. Mr, Eeed. That class of people we already supply, do we not? Mr. Latzko. Not very much. It would help me, because it has fallen off. I have here a table which shows how much it has fallen oft'. It has fallen olf from 1874. The importations from Austria then were $600,000, and the whole now is only $159,000. Mr. Eeed. Then, as I understand you, the American manufacturer is not only at a disadvantage with the price of labor — which you think would be compensatory with the duty of 35 per cent — but he has another disadvantage in the preference of a certain class of people for foreign goods at any price? Mr. Latzko. When you bear in mind how many goods are sent to the market, $338,000,000 worth, and the total imported is only $41,000,000 worth — Mr. Eeed. Is not that generally true, that Americans have to con- tend against this prejudice arising from the preference for foreign goods ? Mr. Latzko. Tes, sir; as a general rule. Mr. Eeed. They always have that to contend with. Mr. Latzko. But we have that in Europe the same as you have here, because people want imported goods, as if they were something better. Mr. Eeed. That is one of the things to be taken into account in a tariff, and particularly this one? Mr. Latzko. 16 per cent is nothing in comparison with what you produce in this country, Mr. Stevens. You say you imported looms ; where did you get them, in England, or here? Mr. Latzko. I got them in Belgium, and some in England, too. It is thought all over Europe that your looms are the best. Mr. Stevens. What did they cost you? Mr, Latzko, About $400 laid down in Austria. Mr. Stevens. Were they imported from here? Mr. Latzko. They were not imported from here, but from England. We have to pay about 26 per cent duty on looms under the new Aus- trian tariff. Mr. Stevens. Your duty was $120 on each loom, because they cost $280. Mr. Latzko. Yes, sir. Mr, Stevens. They cost $450 here. MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. (Paragrnph 892.) KoEWiCH, Conn., September 11, 1893. Sir : At this time, with many other woolen manufacturers, we are greatly interested in the anticipated tariff revision. Allow us to call your attention to figures which do not at all times enter into discussion. 992 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OP WOOL. We are told, in the first place, that raw materials are to go on the free list. This is good, and meets with our hearty approval; but as our experience has been the wool which enters intothemakeup of goods is but about 50 per cent — that is, there are besides not only the labor account, but supplies, coal, insurance, taxes, interest, repairs, and many other expenses only known to those who have had them to pay. We feel that you, as a man of business, can readily see that the woolen manufacturer, when he hears of 25 to 30 or even 35 per cent ad valorem tariff, shrinks from the prospect. We think your good judgment will convince you that 50 or even 55 per cent (and this, in our opinion, should be a specif.c duty) will not leave the producer any excessive liroflt. Having been, during thepast twenty years, wool dealers as well as manufacturers, we have taken this opportunity to go through a list of woolen mills within a distance of 50 mUes or so with whom we have had business dealings during this time. On summing up, we find that of the seventy-two woolen mills within this radius, fifty-six have failed; not a very flatter- ing commentary on the woolen manufacturing business in this region, to say the least. The net result of our woolen manufacturing business for the past five years has not been at all satisfactory; the price of the raw material has been variable, and the net prices of goods have not been such that they have left the manufacturer but very little for his share. We think the woolen industries will be in a more healthy con- dition, and the extreme fluctuation done away with in a measure, when wool is on the free Mst, even though the duties may be reduced some on the manufactured product. We employ about 225 operatives in the production of woolen goods, and from the best information we can obtain we are convinced that the wages we pay our help are, in many instances, double the amount paid for similar work in foreign countries. We have figures to corroborate all the statements made in this commu- nication. We submit the above facts, and trust you may feel in accord with us on this subject. Bespectfully, yours, Hall Bbothees. liASTIKGS. (Paragraph 392.) Boston, Mass., September 19, 1893. SiE : We beg to call yoiar attention, in connection with the new tariff, to English shoe lastings. an article we have been importing for a great many years. These goods are not made in this country and could no be made profitably, even under the present rate of duty, owing to the small amount used and for other good reasons. These shoe lastings aremtide of worsted and cotton, the worsted warp forming the face and the cotton weft the back. We believe there are no other fabrics woven in this way. They are used exclusively for cheap, durable shoes, worn by the poor and middle classes. The present duty on them, under the McEanley law, is 50 per cent ad valorem and 44 cents per pound (an average of 125 per cent), the duty being higher on the coarser counts that arc used for the cheapest shoes than on the finer numbers. The coarser goods being heavier in proportion to their cost, the duty is relatively higher. The duty in the previous tariff was 35 per cent and 18 cents per pound LASTINGS. 993 or about 70 per cent, which, should, even iu the event of their ever being made here, be sufficient protection. Since the increase of duty under the McKinley law the demand has decreased fully 50 per cent, or from about 25,000 pieces to something less than half that quantity. These goods being used exclusively for cheap shoes and for no other purpose, and not being made or likely to be made in this country, we respectfully submit that they should be classed specially in the new tariff at a reasonably low rate of duty. Kespectfully, Farnswokth, Hoyt & Co. lASTIlsrGS. (Paragraph 392.) Boston, September 19, 18.93. SiK: The schedule of the article which we import from English man- ufacturers is a black English lasting used solely and only by shoe man- ufacturers in making a comfortable, durable, and cheap shoe adapted principally to the use of old women. This article is a cotton weft with a worsted face, of which 40 per cent is cotton. Judging irom our experience of many years in this business, it is not probable the present importation is more than 15,000 pieces per annum, and at the present time it is not manufactured in this country, and it never has been, with the exception of a short time some lifteen years ago, when the Oswego Falls Manufacturing Company, and the Lowell Manufacturing Company, used a portion of their waste wool from the manufacture of coatings to make this lasting for the same pur- pose. We were the selling agents for the Oswego Falls Manufacturing Company, and as they did not find it -profitable they gave ui) making the goods and the machinery was disposed of. These goods were scheduled in the old tariff as " manufacturers of worsteds," paying a duty of 35 per cent ad valorem, and 18 cents per pound, and in the present tariff they are classed with " woolen goods" and are now paying 50 per cent ad valorem and 44 cents per ]iound. A case of these goods at the present time would cost landed in Boston in bond $121.87, but when we wish to take these out of bond we are required to pay the duties of $152.42, which is 125 per cent on therfor- eign cost. While under the old tariff the duty would have been only $78.79, or a little more than 64 per cent. Our reason for calling this specially to your attention is that the consumption is not sufficient to give any opportunity to American manufacturers to make these goods. For this reason we feel that they should be classed by themselves as " worsted goods partly made of cotton," and the old duty of 35 per cent ad valorem, and 18 cents per pound, is quite sufficient to protect any manufacturers should they ever wish to produce them iu this country. Truly yours, Dean, Chase & Co. T H 63 994 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OP WOOL. LASTINGS. (Paragraph S93.) Deae, Sir: The elastic goring is practically a new industry in Amer- ica, and is gradually increasing, as the following facts -will show: In 1880 there were only 108 goring weavers in America, whereas to-day there are iip wards of 400, the female labor engaged in the indus- try as winders, warpers, finishers, etc., having increased in proportion. We, as a body, have been steadily employed at reasonable wages until the last three months. During the period of the gradual development of our industry mentioned above the trade has gradually declined in Eugland, as the following facts will show: In 1880 there were 1,100 goring weavers employed in Leicester, Eng- land; during the last three years there has not been more than 150 who have not averaged more than thirty-five hours per week. In Coventry, England, 450 were engaged weaving in 1880, and now there are not more than 100. The same conditions exist in other parts of the coun- try. In 1880 there were 57 manufacturers of goring in England; at the present time there are 21. The principal reason for this decline of the trade in England is, in our opinion, due to the inferior and cheap goring manufactured by the English manufacturers having failed to give satisfaction to the wearers of the Congress shoe, and thereby hav- ing practically ruined the trade. In the United States the manufacturers of elastic goring, profiting by the lesson taught by the Enghsh manufacturers, are making goring that will give satisfaction to the purchasers of Congress shoes, a large pro- portion being warranted by them; this has had the effect of gradually increasing the demand. Now, the point we beg to submit is: That if the tariff on elastic goring is put down to such a point as to allow the cheap and inferior goring of the English manufacturers to be put upon the American market, the ijievitable result will be that not only will it result in reducing our wages, but that it will also result in ruining our Industry by disgusting the purchasers of Congress shoes the same as they have done in England. Ninety-seven per cent of the goring used in America is made here. This is a showing that very few trades can equal — and we can consist- ently claim to be a home industry, and fail to see why English cheap gore made at starvation prices should be allowed to enter into competi- tion'with good gore made by American workmen at fair wages. We submit that it is immaterial to the manufacturers of shoes whether the goring is poor or not, as they know that if the wearers of Congress shoes are disgusted with them that it will not make any material difference to them, as they will purchase shoes of another kind, but it is a matter of vital importance to our association as a body, as it affects not only our own social ■\\elfare, but also the welfare of our wives and families. Eespe(.'tfully submitted. George Astill, Geo. Swann, Committee of Elastic Goring Weavers Amalgamated Association of America, BPvOCKTON, Mass., Sej/tonler ^'3, 1893. PIANO FELTS. 995 PIAKO FELTS. (raragraph 396.) Friday, September 15, 1893. STATEMENT OF MR. EICHAED EANFT, OF NEW YOKE, IMPORTER OF PIANOFORTE FELTS. Mr. Chairman, I represent a firm which has been established 35 or 40 years in New York City, importing piano felts. There are two or three qualities of these goods which we import for use in tlie manufac- ture of pianos. We supply the entire trade more or less with European felts. We have always kept them. We have to-day to import the same goods as before the McKinley bill was passed. We had these goods in woolens, but they were not satisfactory. The classification compelled them to be entered and paid as woolens not otherwise specified, paying an average of 7f per cent. In 1890 we found that our goods were specifically mentioned for the first time and brought in under paragraph 396, which has been spoken of for the first time this iporning. They now come under ready-made clothing and India rub- ber goods — felts not woven or otherwise specified. Under this new paragraph 396, Schedule K, the average duty is advanced from 7f to 114 per cent. The lowest rate is 100 per cent on under-felt, which is 30 per cent ad valorem as against a former duty of 90 cents, 77 cents, and 69.7 cents. Under this duty we find the average to be 78 per cent. This was found to be profitable enough to start a manufacture of these goods in this country. One concern in New York is making these goods, and there is only one firm which has suc- ceeded in making them. That firm has increased very largely. They have under this duty of 78 per cent in twelve or fifteen years made a million and a half dollars; and they began with nothing. Mr. Geak. That is Mr. Dolge? - Mr. Eanpt. That is Alfred Dolge. Mr. Gear. He makes other goods besides? Mr. liANFT. I do not want to convey a wrong impression. These goods now pay an average of 114 per cent against a former average of 78^. All we ask, gentlemen, is for you to do something fair, and to give us such an amount of duty as we charge to the pianoforte makers. These goods have all to be partly manufactured, cut up, and made into hammers. Some makers make the hammers in their own shops, and others procure these hammers from the trade. We would respectfully petition that this is not feasible. We want to get our goods out of the schedule of ready-made clothing and India-rubber goods. They have nothing to do with that schedule, and ought to be placed back under woolens. We will then pay the same rate that woolens are paying. We are perfectly willing to pay the American manufacturer a protec- tion of 40 or 50 per cent, enough to enable him to make up the differ- ence against the wages of Euroi^ean labor, and to allow a fair amount for his investment; but we think when it comes to paying as high as 130 per cent on goods sold to the American trade, we are justified in asking a reduction. Mr. Gear. Are these goods sold by the pound? Mr. Eanft. Yes, sir. Mr. Gear. Have they not largely declined in price since the passage of the McKinley bill? 996 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OP WOOL. Mr. Eanft. No, sir. Mr. Geab. Have they gone up in price'? Mr. Eanpt. No, sir; they sold for the same price. Mr. Payne. This ad valorem rate of duty is how much on the pound? Mr. Ranft. It is 49J cents a pound. Mr. Payne. It is a compensatory duty on wool? Mr. Eanft. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Is it not true that there were a very small amount of this kind of goods made in this country up to 1890? Mr. Eanet. I do not know as to that. Mr. Payne. Mr. Dolge claims that he has supplied three-fourths of the trade up to 1890. He gave that impression to us. He claimed to be making these goods up to 1890. Mr. Eanft. His working men have spoken to me about it. Mr. Payne. He divides his profits with his working men? Mr. Eanft. He claims to. Mr. Payne. It is run on the cooperative plan? Mr. Eanft. That is what he claims. Mr. Payne. Whether or not he has made all his money out of manu- facturing, you do not know? Mr. Eanft. He must have made it out of manufacturing? Mr. Payne. That is aU you know about it ? Mr. Eanft. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Does not the Government get the whole duty since 1890 out of these goods? Mr. Eanft. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. And the price is no greater to the manufacturer, and the domestic manufacture of the goods has increased? Mr. Eanft. I do not think so. Mr. Payne. Mr. Dolge claims that it has. Mr. Eanft. I deny that it has. Mr. Payne. You do not accept any statement, unless it suits your purpose? Mr. Eanft. Not at all. If we can not get these goods undes woolens, not otherwise specified, I would beg the committee to have these goods put in under the head of underfelts, or as woolens under another schedule. Mr. Payne. They are a high grade of manufacture, involving a great deal of labor cost? Mr. Eanft. I do not know. Mr. Payne. Mr. Dolge claims that, too. Mr. Eanft. You are right there. He claims everything. That is all I have to ask, to get a separate heading for underfelts, and to take it out of the ready-made clothing schedule, where it does not belong. The Chairman. The manufacturer is getting his wool cheaper? Mr. Eanft. Yes; I think it is lower. The Chairiman. And the consumer has not got any benefit? Mr. Eanft. Not under the McKinley bill. Albany, N. Y., September 8, 1893. We have thought it might be of interest to you to know more about tlie manufacturers of felts iu England -At the present time, with the prices they obtain for sauie iu their home market, and who are now seeking under the possible change in the present tariff to secure a FELTS. 997 receiving. You must remember they are, uuder the present tariff, get- ting a large trade for their felts and jackets in this countiy, while hold- ing the trade of their home market by reason of their paying for their labor so much less than we are paying in this country in this line of woolen goods. There are six firms manufacturing paper-makers' felts and jackets to-day in England, as follows: Joseph Porrits & Sons, Snniiybank Mills, Helmshore, Manchester, England; Porrits Bros. & Austin, Stub- bins Vale Mill, Ramsbottom, Manchester, England; Samuel Porrits & Sons, Eamford Woolen Mills, Hey wood, Manchester; James Kenyoii & Sons, Derby Street Mills, Bnrj, Manchester, England; Thomas Hardman & Sons, Fernhill Mills, Bury, Manchester, EiQglaud; White- head Bros., Eoyal George Mills, Saddlesworth Mills, Yorkshire, England. They are organized as an association making only one uniform price to their home trade, never varying the same under any circum- stances. Being only six they control the felt manufacturing in their home market, and have in several instances, by united action, wiped out all opposition that has started up to manufacture this special line of goods. Their prices to their home customers are 6 pence, or 12J cents, per square foot fer their lighter weight or wet felts, and 1 shilling, or 25 cents, per foot for their heavier or press felts. Our price is 14 cents and 27 cents per square foot, delivered free of freight or express charges to our customers, which the English manufacturers do not do, but make the English paper-makers pay their own carriage. We give price per square foot, as the English prices are made that way to their home trade. You also are aware that the felt manufacturers number eleven in this country and have no organization or agreement with each other in making one uniform price, but each manufacturer sells where and to whomsoever he can and at any price he chooses to make to the trade. We also know that the English manufacturers sell their goods in this country at much less prices than they do to their home customers, figur- ing in the duty they are now paying on the goods they import here. Should free wool be decided upon and passed by this Congress, with no specific duty on goods, then a compensating or ad valorem duty of at least 60 per cent is absolutely necessary to* enable us to compete with these six large firms in England, acting as one, for they make one uniform price for the American market, although diiferent from the price they make for their home market. We pay 90 per cent more for wages than they do in England. You may desire to learn how we know this fact. We answer by saying we have a superintendent that came with us the iirst of June from Joseph Porrits & Sons' mills, having grown uj)in their employ from a small boy until he became one of their most important superintendents, and he gave us the prices they were paying in these mills in England for warpers, loom-fixers, weavers, giggers, wool assorters, boss weaver, carder, fuUer, and wool assorter, and young boys. Yours, truly, HUTCK & AkGEESINGEB. 998 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. DRESS TRIMMINGS. (Paragrapli 398.) New York, September 21, 1893. Stes : We wisli to call your attention to the fact that these goods are composed of many different materials, and that, consequently, we have a great deal of trouble about paying duties. We have often had an article classified, say at 45 per cent, as being metal chief value, and the same article perhaps two weeks later will be classified again at 60 per cent, calling the glass chief value, and it also often happens the reverse. This makes it exceedingly difficult to know how to buy these goods 'in Europe, because it is impossible for us to tell how the duty will be determined when the goods arrive. Our dress trimmings are not enumerated in the tariff, although they were formerly specified. The same conditions prevail in regard to the importation of buttons, which are often composed of two or three dif- ferent materials, or even six. We respectfully beg that you will consider the propriety of making all dress trimmings pay a uniform rate of duty, which, in our judgjnent, would be amply sufficient if made at the rate of 30 per centum ad valorem. We have had no difficulty about undervaluations by dis- ^ honest competition, except on goods where the duties were upwards of 30 ]ier cent, never on goods at that or at a lower rate. \Ve send you also samples of buttons to show you, in a rough way, the difficulties which we meet with at the custom-house. This is not the fault of the appraisers. It happens constantly that they are in great doubt as to how the duties should be assessed. They make careful and painstaking analysis of samples, but as the prices for the component materials vary, and as the analysis is sometimes misleading, the result is unsatisfactory and frequently untrustworthy. We should be glad to see one uniform rate of duty for all textile fabrics and manufactured goods of every description. It would save all trouble about the classification of goods, and would enable importers to buy wtihout the risk of uncertainty and having the duties changed by the scale of new and varied decisions which they are given by the appraisers. We are manufacturers of dress trimmings, and we have no difficulty in competing with foreign goods on all such goods as are made in this country. We would be perfectly satisfied with a duty of 30 per cent on any goods which we manufacture. The most troublesome part of the tariff is the weight duty on any- thing containing wool or worsted. We have frequently ordered goods in Europe which we supposed would be classified at 50 per cent duty, and the manufacturer has afterward used a glossy, fine mohair in jjlace of silk, to give better effect. Then the goods would be classified at 60 per cent duty and 49^ cents per X)0und, and the result is that we always have lost money, and sometimes very largely, on goods contain- ing any wool, worsted, or mohair. As such goods are not made in this country for ladies' dress trimmings, or but very seldom made, Ave can not see any reason why we should pay any higher duty than on other trimmings. We are debarred at present from importing any worsted or mohair braids, because the weight duty added to the ad valorem duty has made double duty on such goods as high, in some cases, as 175 percent CAEPETS. 999 ad valorem, and in no case have the duties been' less tlian about 90 per cent, the latter being on the extremely line goods, and the very high duty being always on the cheap goods. If your honorable committee can do anything to simplify the tariff in making duties more uniform it will greatly relieve the importers and appraisers and it will diminish the inducement for undervaluation and fraud. Yours, respectfully, 0. L. WOODBEIDGE & CO. CARPETS. (Paragraphi 399 et se^.) September 20, 1893. statement of hon. william ryan, a kepresentative from the state of NEW YORK. Mr. CHAIE3IAN : Preliminary to the statement of the gentlemen who have come down here to represent the carpet industry I would like to say, as indicating the importance of the carpet industry, that it began in 1850 in the city of Yonkers, when it was commenced there by the late Alexander Smith with a force of six weavers, and it has grown on from that time until at the present day that establishment is the largest carpet manufacturing establishment in the world, as I havQ been informed, having a capacity of production of 43,000 yards of carpet per diem. They have made as much as that during the past year. This one establishment employs nearly 3,800 people. There are two other smaller establishments in the city of Yonkers employing 1,200 people. Of these 5,000 people 3,000 are women and children. The entire sums paid for wages in that city last year in the carpet industry aggregated over $3,000,000. When I speak of last year I mean previous to the first of July, 1893. The industry employs more than half of those engaged in all occupations in the city of Yonkers, which city is the largest in the valley of the Hudson between New York and Albany — being a city of about 35,000 population according to the last census. I might al 50 state that since the establishment of this industry there has been but one strilie in that industry. That strike occurred five yeais ago and was caused by influences altogether outside of the city of Yonkers. It was adjusted after a short cessation of work. The settle- ment was amicable to all parties and they have been running, up to the time of the commencement of the recent financial stringency, in a man- ner most satisfactory to alU With these few remarks I will introduce Mr. Coyne, who has been a workingman in that branch of the carpet industry for twenty years or more. STATEMENT OF MR. COYNE. Mr. Chairman: I appear here as a wageworker, having worked at the carpet business for nineteen years, and during all that time I have had steady work until two months ago, when the works closed down and are still closed. About 5,000 people are out of work, and that means a loss in wages of about $400,000 to the people of Yonkers in the carpet manufactories. IQOO WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. Under tlie tariff that existed prior to 1890 we had steady work, and we worked during many seasons in the night until 9 o'clock. When I went to work for the Smith people in 1874 they had 300 employes, and they now have 3,800. At that time carpets sold at $1.65 a yard, while to-day they are selling at 62^ cents a yard. In 1881 the average wages paid to girls was $1.25, and for the month ending June 30 last the wages were $1.43, so that while the price of carpets had fallen since 1874 wages have increased. In the city of Yonkers they make moquette carpet, and 90 per cent of all the moquette carpets made in the world are made at Yonkers. In 1881 moquette carpet sold at $1.55 a yard, and to-day the wholesale price is 90 cents a yard— a faUing off of 65 cents per yard in price. Another grade, Axminster carpet, which is made there, sold in 1869 for $3 a yard, and to-day it sells at $1.90 a yard. So it will be seen that the i)rice of the product has steadily decreased and wages have gradually increased. I will give you the difference in cost of labor in this country and the cost of labor in England. My only information as to the difference in cost in general of wages and labor was gotten while I was in the employ of the Smith Company, because I used to hire weavers, and on several occasions I hired girls from Scotland. On several occasions I asked them how much they got on the other side, and they told me that in their money it would amount to $3 a week, while in the Smith works they got $9.50 for weaving the same fabric. This shows an increase in wages of nearly 300 per cent in weaving alone. The mills are closed to-day, and I do not know why. I know that car- pets are not selling. Whether the cause is to be attributed to the silver bill or an apprehension of tariff' changes I do not know. Mr. Hopkins. For nineteen years the mills have never closed, you say, until a couple of months ago? Mr. Coyne. That is right. I feel that if the tariff is to be left as it was previous to passage of the act of 1890 our mills would manage to run steadily. Mr. Tarsney. You say that the Yonkers carpet manufacturers 'pro- duce 90 per cent of all the moquette carpets made in the world? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Taesney. Not all used in the world? Mr. Coyne. No. Mr. Tarsney. Do you export many carpets? Mr. Coyne. We have never exported any carpets, but I understand they are looking to that. Mr. Tarsney. You say that 90 per cent of all the moquette carpets made in the world are made in this country? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir; they are made on a loom which has been pat- ented. Tlie patent expires next January. They are patented in Eu- rope, and they have 400 or 500 looms running in England that pay a royalty. Mr. Taesney. Perhaps that is the reason why none are made in other parts of the world. Mr. Coyne. I should think so. Mr. Taesney. That is prohibitory protection. Mr. Coyne. I expect it is. Mr. TUENEE. Has the price of carpet declined all over the world? Mr. Coyne. I should think so. Tlie Chaieman. Has there been any improvement in machinery in that industry during the period you have mentioned? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. CARPETS. 1001 The Chairman. So that the labor of an operative iiroduces a much larger result ? * Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Hopkins. Do they work by piecework? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Hopkins. Can you determine whether they are paying more , wages in this country for the same kind of work than they are paying abroad ? Mr. Coyne. They work by piecework here and work by piece abroad. We pay more here by the yard for weaving, considering the nature and ■quality of the work. Most of the machinery used i]i carpet-making comes from England. The machinery used in some factories comes entirely from England. Mr. Turner. What is the average rate of wages paid to women and chiMren? Mr. Coyne. It is $1.'43 a day at present. Mr. Turner. What part of the work do they do? Mr. Coyne. They do almost every part of it. I started in the busi- ness early, and I have gone all through the work. I was superintend- ent for nine years-. Mr. Turner. Do you use jute foundation? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. We buy the jute and dress it, and put the warp into bags. Mr. Turner. Are the laboring people prospering ? Mr, Coyne. Very much so. I know some women who own their own homes. Mr. Turner. What percentage of them own their own homes ? Mr. Coyne. I know of 10 or 12. Mr. Turner. Out of 3,800 employes you only know 10 or 13? Mr. Coyne. I know 10 women. Out of the 3,800 I should say there would be one-third of the number who own their own homes. Mr. Breckinridge. What is the principal article of manufacture the men work in ? Mr. Coyne. Tapestry velvet, tapestry brussels, and axminster car- pets are the products of Yonkers mills almost entirely to-day. In the tapestry carpet there is about half a pound of wool. Mr. Breckinridge. What kind of a carpet is the moquette carpet? Mr. Coyne. It is a hard, tough fabric, that is woven on a loom that puts the tuck down in the face and the comb combs it up. It is not a shuttle, but a needle, loom. When we first started a girl would only run one loom, but now she runs two at a very much less rate of wages in cost. Mr. Turner. Do they pretty much all run two looms ? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir; they have run three. Mr. Turner. You speak of moquette carpet selling for 90 cents a yard. Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. You did not mention any other price? Mr. Coyne. That is the regular price. There is an extra grade called gobelin, which is a little finer. It sells at 15 cents a yard higher, but there is not very much of it made. Mr. Turner. Do they sell that cheaper? Mr. Coyne. They do not now. It has never been sold for less than 90 cents. Two or three years ago they made a cheaper grade and sold it for $1. Mr, Turner. The general run is on the 90-cent carpet? 1002 WOOL AKD MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. TuKNEK. You say thaf a girl will now attend two looms 1 Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. What is yonr connection with this mill? Mr. Coyne. I have no connection with it toxlay, because it is stopped. Mr. Turner. You are perfectly familiar with this business! Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. I started anew mill nine months ago and was. getting ready to manufacture carpets when this financial trouble came on and I had to close up. Mr. Turner. Is it customary for a girl to attend two looms in Eng- land, working on the same grade of goods? Mr. Coyne. My information on that subject is rather limited, because their looms are limited to about twenty. I do not know just what they are doing over there. They have to pay a royalty on our looms, and have not many of them running. Mr. Turner. In Yonkers you use that kind of loom more in making carpets than they do in England'? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Turner. Do I understand you to say that in England they only work about twenty of these looms ? Mr. Coyne. That is my information. Mr. Breckinridge. How much is the weaver paid— by the pick or by the yard 1 Mr. Coyne. They are paid by the yard. The Chairman. Is it the square yard or running yard? Mr. Coyne. The goods made in Yonkers are 27 inches wide. The wages are paid according to the grade — from 2J to 4 cents a yard; the more work a girl does, the more she earns. Some make 10 yards and others will only make 7. Mr. Breckinridge. How is it in England? Mr. Coyne. It is about the same. A girl will only make about $3 a week. Mr. Breckinridge. How much is paid there for the same grade of work ? Mr. Coyne. I am not familiar with English money, but I have hired a great many weavers. Those who come to Yonkers weave about as well as we do. Mr. Breckinridge. You do not know how much they get per yard abroad ? Mr. Coyne. I have heard it, but I have not charged my mind with it. I have known them, after working awhile, go back and stay until their earnings were all gone. Out of the 3,800 people whom we employ we have about 800 French, English, and Scotch weavers. Mr. Breckinridge. What do you advise us to do about this? Mr. Coyne. As for myself, I have seen so much prosperityin the car- pet business under a protective tariff' that I do not see any good reason why it should be touched. When the American manufacturers first started in the business of making carpets the American public were I)aying prices which were made by foreign makers. This was the case until after 1860, and to-day, with home competition, we are selling car- pets at 62^ cents a yard. Mr. Hopkins. It cost more to buy carpet of the foreigner? Mr. C!OYN]i. It cost very much more. I do not know exactly how much. Carpets were $1.25 a yard in 1874 and now they are only 02J cents a yard. Mr. Breckinridge. What kind of goods is this moquette carpet'^ CARPETS. 1003 Mr. Coyne. It is soft pile. It is made from yarn of American wool. Mr. Breckinbidgb. Do you not think it would iniprove the condi- tions of your business if wool was put on the free list? Mr. Coyne. No, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. You do not think it would? Mr. Coyne. Ko, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Why not"? Have you conferred with the pro- prietors about this ? Mr. Coyne. la the State of Kew York we use only about half a pound of wool to the yard. Mr. Breckinridge. It is not washed? Mr. Coyne. We can not use unwashed wool. We buy it, and wash it, and scour it. Mr. Breckinridge. You have to thoroughly clean it before you use it? When you say you use half a pound, you mean the wool in the clean state? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. And the ingrain men use about a pound and one-fourth. To-day we make a low grade of carpet which is selling in competition with the ingrain. When they use that much wool we would not be in it with them with wool on the free list. Mr. Breckinridge. You think their fabric would drive you out? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. In the State of New York the American pub- lic would be able to buy ingrain carpet for less money than they do to-day. Mr. Breckinridge. What is that ingrain carpet worth, say at whole- sale? Mr. Coyne. I could give you about the figures. They vary. Ingrain carpet to-day would be worth about 50 cents a yard; that is the wool ingrain. Mr. Breckinridge. That is a very much inferior grade to yours? Mr. Coyne. That is a matter of opinion. Mr. Breckinridge. It is all wool. Has it anything like the lasting quality ? Mr. Coyne. Yea, sir; I think it has. It is just as good. It is not quite so showy. Tapestry carjjet is an imitation of Brussels carpet. Mr. Breckinridge. You think free wool would help the ingraiu- carpet industry rather than hurt it? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. He is a home manufacturer, and we do not ask that he shall be discriminated against at all. Mr. Breckinridge. I have here some extracts from a paper which probably Mr. Hopkins will indorse. Do you know a journal called the Sherman Upholstery Carpet Trade Leaf? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Is it a responsible publication? Mr. Coyne. So far as I know. Mr. Hopkins. You do not know it well enough to give it a character here to-day? Mr. Coyne. No, sir. Mr. Breckinridge, Do you know of any more responsible trade journal? Mr. Coyne. No, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. It is a responsible publication, is it not? Mr. Coyne. Is it published in Philadelphia or New York ? Mr. Breckinridge. It is irablished in New York. Do you know the firm of Alexander Smith & Son? Mr. Coyne. I do- 1004 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. Mr. Breckinridge. That is the firm yoii have been talking about? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. It is the largest carpet manufacturing estab- ment in the world, is it not? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Do yon know Mr. Euglar? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. I see that that gentleman has gone over to Europe? Mr. Coyne. Tes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. As a representative of this firm with a view of establishing an agency for the sale of moquette? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. I suppose he has the well-founded hope that the American manufacturers may be able to sell moquette carpets abroad ? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. It would be to your interest, other things being looked after, to be able to get your materials cheaper and thereby enjoy the foreign as well as the domestic trade? Mr. Coyne. We have never been able to supply the domestic trade. We have just been able to supply that trade and that is all. Another factory started last year. Every manufacturer I know has been run- ning his looms constantly, almost, fifteen or sixteen years. Mr. Breckinridge. Is not there a large sale in New York for these goods? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir; all are sold. Mr. Breckinridge. Therefore there was not an overproduction. Mr. Coyne. I do not so regard it. The market absorbs them all, whether by auction or legitimate sales. There is this about it, how- ever, the trade goes by seasons, fall and spring. If the goods are on hand in the fall they sometimes send them out for sale by auction, but it does not always follow. Mr. Breckinridge. I see there are large auction sales? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. They generally sell at good prices. Mr. Breckinridge. They sold at 80 cents? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Those are made under a patent which expires upon the 17th of January next. Mr. Breckinridge. That is one of the reasons stated here how this has gone to Europe? Mr. Coyne. They are in a good position, having spent $6,000,000. H'obody else could get in there. I know that to be so. Mr. Breckinridge. You would consider it advantageous to increase the demand for your carpet in that way, would you not? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. And to increase the number of countries that you could have access to ? Mr. Coyne. We have access to aU countries to-day if we want it. Mr. Breckinridge. To the extent that you have to pay higher prices than other people for youi' wool your access to other countries is limited? Mr. Coyne. All our raw materials come from Europe. We are jusi as well off as if it was free. It Is simply a question of interest on capital. Mr. Breckinjiidge. I suppose you know of this provision in the tariff laws allowing a rebate on the materials used in home-made, goods CARPETS. 1005 which have been sent to a foreign market. I believe that the Smith Company is not certain it would be of any material advantage to it. Mr. Coyne. An explanation of that is found in the dillydallying manner in which the Government has treated applications of manu- facturers for rebate. We know of one case in which a request for rebate was made six months ago, and it has not been paid yet. Mr. Breckinridge. If there is a rebate your advantage consists in being able to get if? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzbll. It seems that under this administration it is hard to get back what the law gives you? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. I would like to make clear to the committee the fact that while the price of carpet h^s steadily decreased, wages have increased. Mr. Breckinridge. That is reasonable. Mr. Hopkins. I hope you will make that clear, so it will go into the record. Mr. Coyne. Iu 1874 the wholesale price of tapestry carpet was $1.25 per day and the average price of wages for weavers and girls was $1.22. In 1893 the same goods sell for 62^ cents a yard, and the wages are $lt43. ^ In 1882 the price of moquette carpet was $1.55 a yard, in 1893 its price is 90 cents a yard. In 1869 the price of Axminster carpet, which is pretty nearly the same kind of carpet as a moquette, but a little heavier goods, sold for $3.50, and in 1893 the same sells for $1.90 a yard. In starting a carpet manufacturing plant there are a great many things connected with it, such as carding, spinning, dyeing, printing, machin- ery, and other things which are hard to organize. In some instances mechanics can be secured in a well-established -pluce who will make carpets at a less labor cost than they can in new concerns, which are thereby placed at a disadvantage. M]-. Breckinridge. You have cited the price and watres for moquette carpet; how many yards of carpet of this kind could a girl weave formerly? Mr. Coyne. Twenty to twenty-four yards. Mr. Breckinridge. How many yards of carpet will a girl weave at the present time? Mr. Coyne. From 40 to 60 yards. Mr. Breckinridge. Her production has increased largely over 100 per cent, and therefore it is proper that her wages be increased. Mr. Coyne. That is right. That girl is working to-day for $1.43 per day; she learns to do that work in from two days to a week. In any other industry she would not make over $1.12 a day in Yonkers. Mr. Hopkins. The increased production is the result of improved machinery, which comes from the exercise of American ingenuity. Mr. Coyne. That is right. Mr. Breckinridge. Has there been much change in the cost of dye- ing during that period? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. So that there has been a change in the cost of production all along the line? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Hopkins. But that comes from improved machinery. Mr. Coyne. It comes from American ingenuity in devising machiaery to do that work. Mr. Breckinridge. This loom of which you speak as being iised in this moquette industry is an English loom? 1006 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. Mr. Coyne. No, sir; it is an American loom. Mr. Hopkins. That was invented by an Americjan boy who came from the farm. Mr. OoYNK. Yes, sir; it has been i)atented in England and France. Mr. Breckineidge. Is it your opinion that the tariff was the cause of its invention ? Mr. Hopkins. It would not have been invented if the boy had been kept on the farm. Mr. Coyne. If we had not had protection we would not have had a factory; and, therefore, we would not have had any use for the inven- tion. Mr. Bryan. You do not agree with the old adage then that necessity is the mother of invention f Mr. Coyne. JSTot altogether. Mr. Bryan. You would not say the less the necessity the greater the invention'? Mr. Coyne. IS^o, sir. Mr. Dalzell. With your improved methods you have had the home market of 65,000,000 of people to supply"? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzell. Do not you think that is an incentive to inventions- Mr. Coyne. The American people, I am told, are the largest con- sumers of carpets in the world. When this was invented the stock of Crosley's concern in England was sold on the exchange in London, and at that time it paid 25 per cent. Some of our workmen own some of the stock. To day that stock does not pay more than 4 or 5 per cent and sometimes they pass the dividends. Mr. Breokineidge. You spoke of this loom not being a shuttle loom, but a needle loom. Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. On what kind of a base do you build this carpet? Mr. Coyne. It is built on a base of jute. The back is jute, the warp is cotton, and the face is wool. We use a small quantity of linen thread for the selvage. Mr. Breckinridge. The lineu is a small factor. Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Jute, cotton, and Wool are the principal factors'? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir; I could give you the weight. Mr. Breckinridge. How much will a yard weigh"? Mr. Coyne. Two pounds and a little over. Mr. Breckinridge. How much of that would be wool? Mr. Coyne. It would be a pound and a quarter of wool, three- fourths of a pound of jute, and about 4 ounces of cotton with a trace of linen. In 16,000 yards you would not use a pound of lineu. Mr. Breckinridge. Are all widths substantially the same'? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir; there is the same weight for the same fabric. Mr. Breckinridge.' Is not dye quite a factor! Mr. Coyne. It is in moquette, Brussels, and ingrain. Tapestry are j)rinted. Moquettes are solid dye colors. Mr. Breckinridge. How much does it cost to dye a yard? Mr. Coyne. In England I should say it would be about 2 cents. Mr. Breckinridge. How much in this ('(nnitry*? Mr. Coyne. About the same. Mr. Breckinridge. So that tlic cost of dyeing is nota large factor? Mr. Coyne. ]S"ot now. It used to be. It can be done by machinery DOW. It used to be as high as 9 cents a yard. CAEPETS. 1007 Mr. Breckinridge. Is the cost of dyestufi'a material factor? Mr. Coyne. I am speaking of labor when I say 2 cents. Mr. Breckinridge. How much would be the cost of the dye? Mr. Coyne. Four or five cents a yard. Mr. Breckinridge. What kind of dye do you use principally? Mr. Coyne. We use aualine dyes. Mr. Breckinridge. You are now speaking of moquette carpets? Mr. Coyne. Tes, sir; so far as im]jortations go it is true of all. 1 have said that from 1870 to 1880 we had to work until 9 o'clock at night to All the American demand, and I knew of one factory to have night and day shifts in order to keep up with their orders. We have uo over- production in this country. At the present time I do not believe there is anybody at work. All are shut down. IMr. Breckinridge. Is yours the only firm in this country making moquette to-day? Mr. Coyne. There are some made at Hartford, Conn. The looms are paying a royalty to these patentees. They do not cut much of a figure in the trade, however. Mr. Breckinridge. Your patents expire pretty soon ? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir; next January. Mr. Hopkins. Do vou know how much capital is invested in the indus- try? Mr. Coyne. I know in a general way. Mr. Hopkins. What is it in New York alone? Mr. Coyne. About $30,000,000 in manufacturing alone. In selling there are $15,000,000 more invested. They are selling on four months' time. Mr. Hopkins. There are about $45,000,000 invested in this industry in New York in the manner you have indicated; how many employes are engaged in that directly in the State of New York ? / Mr. Coyne. I should say about 20,000 people in the State of Now York. Mr. Hopkins. If I understand you correctly, you say the average wages would be about $2 per day each? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir; skilled and unskilled. That would include designers, machinists, and mechanics. There are $3,000,000 a year paid out in Yonkers in wages. Mr. Hopkins. If these mills continue to be shut down it will mean a decrease of the purchasing power of 20^00 people to that amount. Mr. Coyne. They are really in a destitute condition. Many of them are in a bad shape. Some can stand it and they were not prepared for this. The carpet factory had been running steadily and had never been stopped except in one case where they had a shoit strike. Mr. Hopkins. The laborers were not prepared for this? Mr. Coyne. No, sir ; it came upom them like a clap of thun der. Some of them owned homes and had mortgages on them. Others could, not get their deposits out of the bank without thirty days' notice. The New York Herald had an article about that. The Chairman. I understand you to say there is a pound and a half of wool in that carpet? Mr. Coyne. There is about a pound and a quarter. The Chairman. Is that a running yard or a square yard? Mr. Coyne. The carpet is a yard wide by 27 inches. The Chairman. Do you know what the manufacturer gets in the va-j of compensation for the_wool he puts in a yard of moquette carpet? 1008 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. Mr. Coyne. No, sir; Iliave not looked it up. I tliink it is 40 per cent ad valorem. The Chairman. He gets the tariff on about 5 or 6 pounds of wool which he is supposed to put into a yard of carpet and the 40 per cent ad valorem is the protection against forc\;u competition. That is the way the bill was made up. AVhy is it that wages are so much higher in New York than Massachusetts "! •Mr. Coyne. I do not know why it is. Most wages are higher in New York. Our manufacturers say it costs them a little more than it costs elsewhere. The Chairman. It seems to be greater. You say the average wages for skilled and unskilled labor is $1! per day ? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. The Chairman. In Massachusetts, according to the offlcial statistics for 1890, it was but $365 a year — a little more than $1 a day for each employ6 ? JMr. Coyne. Yes, sir. The Chairman. What did you say was the selling price of a yard of moquette carpet 1 Mr. Coyne. Ninety cents. The Chairman. Add one- fourth to that and it would be $1.12^. Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. The Chairman. What is the amount of labor per yard in moquette carpet, if you ha^e considered that question? INIr. Coyne. I have not considered that. It varies from time to time according to the production. There are so many different processes in manufacturing moquette carpet that the labor cost depends almost entirely upon the production. For instance, if you had a pay roll of $100 a day and you are making 1,000 yards of moquette carpet, I would say that your labor cost forthat day would be 10 cents. If you were producing 500 yards it would be 20 cents. The larger the business the less it costs. It depends upon the size of the concern. The Chairman. It varies bet■\^■een 10 and 20 cents a yard? Mr. Coyne. I do not say that the moquette carpet can be produced for 10 or 20 Cents a yard for the labor. I cannot answer that question exactly because I am not prepared to do so. The Chairman. If the report containing the Massachusetts statis- tics of manufactures is correct you need protection against the cheap labor of Massachusetts, do youtiot? Mr. Coyne. Eeally, Massachusetts does not make any of the carpets which we do. They make ingrain, mostly, in Massachusetts. We do not make those. The Chairman. Is there any reason why labor should be cheaper in making ingrain than in making moquette? Mr. Coyne. 1 do not know that it should be any cheaper, but there is a difference. I know of girls who have worked for $1 a day in the silk business. Those working in the carpet business are getting $1.80 per day. The Chairman. I find that in Massachusetts the average wages for a male dyer was $1.08 per day, and in New York it is .1«1.58. In Massachusetts the average wages of a male finisher is $1.05 a day and in New York $1.50 a day. Mr*. Coyne. We pay $1.75 ;i day for that. The Chairman. In some linesthe wages in (!reat Britain are higher than the wages in Massachusetts. The printer in Massachusetts gets $1,08 and in great Britain he gets $1.13, in New York he gets $1.73. * CARPETS. 1009 Mr. Coyne. That is just about what I pay— $1.70 to $1.80. I have oueman working for me to-day who did the same kind of work in Eng- land and got less than a pound and not steady work. He came over here and went to work on the same machine, getting about double the wages. That man would not work here for less. The Chairman. Let us calculate what would be the ordinary rate on a yard of moquette carpet. It is 60 cents per square yard to start with. It is three-quarters of a yard wide? Mr. Coyne. It is 27 inches wide. The Chairman. That would be 45 cents to start with and 40 per cent ad valorem for the wool. You say it sells for 90 cents a yard? Mr. Coyne. It has sold as high as $1.55. The Chairman. When? Mr. Coyne. It was $1.55 a yard in 1882. " The Chairman. That was eleven years ago. Mr. CoYTSTE. It has been $1.25 within three years. The Chairman. Wool was worth more then than it is now! Mr. Coyne. I am not familiar with that. The Chairman. There are other materials ? Mr. Coyne. I am familiar with all the materials except wool. I buy aU the other materials. The Chairman. Materials are cheaper now than they were three years ago? Mr. Coyne. No, sir. I can buy foreign jute for less money than I can buy home jute. The Chairman. What I am trying to get at is the existing tariff ou a yard of moquette carpet. If there is 45 per cent specific duty and 40 percent ad valorem. Say it was a dollar, you would have 85 cents tariff protection under the existing law on a yard of moquette carpet. Is there anything like 85 per cent difference between wages paid in Eng- land and the wages paid in New York in making a yard of moquette carpet? Mr. Coyne. I should say not. The Chairman. Is there 40 cents a yard difference? Mr. Coyne. Eeally I do not know whether they make moquette carpet over there. I have never seen a piece. 1 have yet to see the first piece. The loom is an American invention. Whether they make it over there I do not know. I am engaged principally in tapestry and velvet, and upon that subject 1 am i^retty well qualified to answer. The Chairman." What is the tariff on tapestry? Mr. Coyne. Twenty-eight cents, I understand. The Chairman. That is on tapestry Brussels, which is the kind you are making? Mr. Coyne. We are making tapestry velvet. The Chairman. How much wool is there in a yard of the W and T ? Mr. Coyne. That is printed goods. The Chairman. The manufacturer gets a compensating duty for nearly 4 pounds of wool. He does not put 4 pounds into the carpet. Mr. Coyne. There is a shrinkage of 30, 40, or 50 per cent in that wool. The Chairman. Allowing for that shrinkage it would make less than 2 pounds of wool? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. The Chairman. What does that sell for now. Mr. Coyne. According to the grade — 80 cents to $1 . It is woven over a wire and the size of the wire regulates the price of the goods. T H 64 ■ • 1010 WOOL AND MANUFRCTUEES OF WOOL. The Chaikman. On a square yard of that caqjet the dwtj is first 40 cents per square yard and 40 per cent ad valorem, and a square yard would sell at the highest rate for $1.25. Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Forty per cent ad valorem on that $1.25 is 60 cents? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. The Chairman. You begin with 40 cents and 60 cents. Do you think it is anything like the diiference of $1 between what is paid in England in wages and what is paid in New York in making a square yard of that carpet? Mr. Coyne. There is a difi'ereuce of 200 per cent, and besides that there are expenses for carriage and handling. The Ohaieman. That makes the protection so much more, because the Englishman has to send the carpet over here. Mr. Coyne. He gets rid of the bulk. The Chairman. He has more to pay on that! Mr. Cqyne. I do not see that he has. The wool is in his market and we have to buy the wool in Liverpool. The Chairman. That is, when you buy foreign wool? Mr. Coyne. We use foreign wool almost altogether. The Chairman. Have you any idea that there is a dollar's difference in the wages in a square yard of carpet in this country and in England? I\Ir. Coyne. That carpet would sell for 90 cents. The Chairman. There is not a dollar's worth of labor in it? Mr. Coyne. Not when the material and labor is 78 cents. The Chairman. What, in your judgment, is the labor cost of a dol- lar's worth of A'elvet tapestry cari^et; what is the cost of a yard of it? Mr. Coyne. It depends entirely upon the size of the wire. It used to cost me 36 cents a yard to make a yard of tapestry carpet, and I finally got it down to 22 cents a yard, and perhaps if I could get started up again I could make it for less. The Chairman. You want us to give you 40 per cent protection on a square yard of that cari)et, which cost you in labor only $1? Mr. Coyne. Under the tariff prior to the act of 1890 the carpet mills of this country were started in almost every Eastern State. They have been increasing plants and building and have stopped buying on the other side. They have all been running. That was the condition Ave had in Yonkers two months ago, and I have come here to-day to ask you to i)ut us back where we were, if you can do it. " That will let us have Avork. Mr. Hopkins. You buy unwashed wool that goes into the moquette carpet. After you buy it what do you do with it before using it, in the making of a yard of carpet? Mr. Coyne. It is assorted, picked over and scoured, and made into yarn. There is a large percentage of waste, because, it is unAvashed wool. Mr. Hopkins. What you pay then is 15 cents per pound of wool and when you clean it and put in a condition that feature does not amount to much? Mr. Coyne. No, sir. Mr. Gear. That makes a pound of wool cost you about 30 cents? Mr. COA'NE. Yes, sir; and the duty must be added to that. :\Ir. Breckinridge. You have to pay the duty? Mr. Coyne. We do. I ha\e not bouglit any avooI since I have been in business. Mr. IJRECKINRIDGE. Now, you ask us for relief. CARPETS. 1011 Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir; I ttiiuk if you will leave the tariii' as it was prior to the passage of the McKinley act so that we cau have some- thing left and give the carpet makers and manufacturers some assurance that you will not change it, we will then know what we can do. On the wool we have, we have paid the duty and it is tied up more or less. There would be difference in turning it into carpet. Mr. Beeokinridge. Do you think the pending depression is due to imjiending tariff changes? Mr. Coyne. I think that the retail dealers feel to-day that so long as there is a chance of having free wool they will hesitate in buying carpet. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you not know that in every tariff bill that has Tiassed there has been a provision specifying the date when the wool schedules should go into operation ? Mr. Coyne. I know that, but under the present conditions the car- pets were made six months ahead. That is the case with tapestry, Brussels and moquette. The goods we offer for sale for the fall of 1893 we begin to make about April, and we do not send them to the con- sumer until along late in the fall, so that really we are carrying them in stock six months in a year. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you not know that that has been taken into consideration in the framing of a bill! Mr. Coyne. I think it would a fair thing to do. Mr. Breckinridge. I think it would be well for you to submit a statement suggesting a date when free wool ought to apply if it is to be adopted. Give us the date at which you think it could be adoi^ted without injury to your products. Mr. Coyne. I think we should be allowed a year and a half. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you know Mr. Warren T. Smith ? Mr. Coyne. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. He is a pretty good kind of a man, is he not? Mr. Coyne. I should judge he was. Mr. Breckinridge. He was talking recently of the tariff and the hard tames in the carpet trade, and he said : I must say I do not think the tariff eliange or tlie impeuding tariH' change i^ responsible for the present condition of affnirs. Mr. Coyne. I myself voted for the change. Mr. Hopkins. How does the change suit you? Mr. Coyne. Well, you see me here to-day. That is the best answer I can give. I do not think the tariff was the only question that entered into that business last November. I thought we ought to have a change and we got it with a vengeance. [Laughter.] Mr. Hopkins. With your jiresent information, if you had that over again how would you act? Mr. Coyne. I think I would do the same thing. Mr. Hopkins. Then you rather enjoy it? Mr. Coyne. In a measure. Mr. Breckinridge.' I do not believe you wdl be hurt by the change? Mr. Coyne. Oh, yes; I am already hurt, for I am out of work. Mr. Breckinridge. If this was due to the silver law you were aware that that act has not been enacted since the election? Mr. Coyne. I think myself that the silver law had more to do with that than the tariff' did. I think that among the manufacturers there is an unsettled feeling as to what is g(jing to be done. If you could give us some assurance of what is going to happen I think we would be better satisfied. 1012 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. Mr. Beeckineidge. If you knew you were going to get free wool and plenty of work you wo.uld not be afraid to take orders? Mr. Coyne. If I thought we were going to have free wool, I would not know what to do. The ingrain carpet men have free wooh Mr. Breckineidge. You have a skeleton in the closet in the shape of the ingrain man? Mr. Coyne. I liave nothing against the ingrain man because he is an American manufiicturer. I would have to go to making ingrain. Mr. Breckineidge. Could you do that without loss? Mr. Coyne. It would be a great loss. Mr. Geae. What would be the expense of a loom? ]\[r. Coyne. The skeleton loom is worth about $600 or $700. Mv. Gear. You would have to throw yours away? Mr. Coyne. Y^es, sir. CARPETS. (Paragraph 399 et seq.) STATEMENT OF SAMUEL HOWOETH, OF YONXEES, IT. T.- Mr. Chaieman : I siippose I ought not to apologize to you for com- ing before you as a worker who has been in the factory for forty-three years, thirty-two years on the other side and eleven years on this side. Perhaps I can say one or two things which might have some little influence with you on this tariff question. That, in my mind, is the cause of the present stoppage of the mills. I think that it is the tariff, or the fear of meddling with the tariff' which is the cause of the present depression. From what I know myself of the prices paid on the other side and the prices paid here, I think that if we had free trade, or anything approaching free trade, our firm would have to close, because a workingman could not work for the prices the workingmen are getting on the other side to-day. All our laws, bjsth municipal and national, are based on the protective principle, and it would take a good long while to adjust ourselves to free trade or anything approaching it. I came to this country eleven years ago a pronounced free trader. On the other side of the water I was a laborer. I was an out-and-out free trader and a follower of Mr. Gladstone. When I came here I held on to that idea, but by and by I found that wages here were out of all proportion to what they were on tlie other side. 1 began work forty years ago as a doffer. The principal items of cost entering into the manufacture of carpet is spinning, weaving, dyeing, and flnishing. These are all large items. I began to work for the sum of 30 cents per week. I worked only half a day, and the other half I went to school. I had to pay the sum of 4 cents for school books. Since, that time I have been in charge of help for more than twenty years — what yon call section hand — and I know that the wages paid for that class of help is good. The kind of labor yon would obtain heie, perhaps, for $3 a day you could get on the other side for $1. A man in my position would get over there perhaps *5 per week to start with and would be advanced by degrees up to $7 or ^H a AN'eek. Since 1 have been in iny present position 1 have received s 13.50 a week. The CiiAiEAiAN. Thirteen dollars and Jifty cents a week as against $5 on the other side ? iMr. HowoRTH. Yes, sir. It is a rule abroad that a beginner must CARPETS. 1013 commence at low wages and gradually go u]). Whenevex a boy or girl goes into that work, lie or she gets a certain amount. Ho long as they work at the particular piece of work they will not get any more. That system runs all through the spinning and printing; with the weaving, of course, it is different. In weaving it is so much per yard. It is also the same with settling and finishing ; that i.s skilled labor which enters very largely into the cost of the carpet ot other kind of labor, such as machinists, plumbers, and engineers. I am in correspond- ence regularly with people on the other side and I am receiving papers from John Crossley & Sons. That was where I worked as an appren- tice in carpet-printing. While I was being paid $9 a week here they were not getting more than $5 over there. Some of them are working for 15s. a week, which is not quite $4. They get 15s. to 18s. per -week. In the last paper which I received from England I saw a list of prices for skilled labor. The wages scale over there has been readjusted recently and the prices under the present readjustment is only about $4.80 a week. That is in London, where prices ought to be a little more. It costs more to live in London than it costs to live in the provinces. I know also that since I came here they do not work steadily on the other side. When I first came here I had to work overtime, sometimes until 8 or 9 o'clock at night. We have had steady work until this last stoppage. This is the only time within my recollection in the last ten years that we have not had steady employment. I used to wonder why they were so anxious to get this class of American carpets and I could not tell where all the carpet was used. Some gentlemen asked about the use of carpets here and at home. They do not use much carpet on the other side. On the other side the home of the workingman has a stone floor and you could not put a carpet down on it. When I was a boy about the only carpet we had was sand scattered on the floor. This is about as high as workingmen get over there. H.e can not put 3own Brussels or tapestry carpet, even if he had them, on account of the stone floor. That accounts for the difference in the consumption of carpets in this country and in England. Mr. Gbak. Do you not find that the ability of the operator to pro- cui-e the comforts of life are much greater here on account of the good wages? Mr. HowoRTH. My experience is that the operator here botli lives better and is housed better than on the other side, and that is due entirely to the better wages he receives. Mr. GrEAR. You would not like to make a change? Mr. HowoRTH. No, sir ; I would not like to go back to a free-trade basis because it would take long to get adjusted to it. On the other side everything is adjusted and settled on that basis. It would take us a number of years to get to that basis. Mr. Hopkins. What effect would it have on the laboring people of . this country if we should have free trade? Mr. HowoRTH. I should think it would be worse than the working- men on the other side. To begin with, the manufacturer here has still got his plant and his building and has paid for them at protection prices and naturally he would expect an interest on that price. Every- thing in our cities here is based on a protection basis. We see our policemen more than double what they do on the otli'^r side. In a lit- tle city of 35,000 the policemen of Yonkers are paid more than double of what they are paid on the other side. Mr. Gear. Doyou think that a material reditction of the tariff would shut up the mills in this country? 1014 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. Mr. HowOETH. I (To not know what tliey would do in that uase. They would either have to shut up or adjust the wages. Mr. Gear. Would not a large number of the operators have to go to doing something else — farming, for instance? Mr. HowoRTH. I do not know what they would go at. It seems there is a good deal of complaint among the farmers who are complain- ing that they are not getting sufficient prices for their products. The Ohairi^an. What is the difference in wages between a weaver at Halifax and a weaver in Antwerp, where Brussels carpets are made? Mr. HowoRTH. I don't weave Brussels; I weave tapestry Brussels. The Chairman. My question was, do you know what the difference in wages would be for a weaver in Halifax and a weaver in Antwerp? Mr. HowoRTH. I could not say. The Chairman. I see, according to the report of the Labor Bureau, that the carpet-weaver at Halifax makes $374 a year in wages. Mr. HowoRTH. That is good wages. The Chairman. He works 56 hours. Mr. Howorth. We work 60 hours. The Chairman. I also find from this report of the Bureau of Labor the average wages of employment in England is $1.20 per day, and in this country it is $1.51. Mr. Howorth. I think $1.20 on the other side is the extreme maxi- mum. The Chairman. That is the iigure given in this report of the Com- missioner of Labor. Mr. Howorth. I should question whether they got that much. They are getting steady work on the otlier side. I noticed that th« carpet- ^^'orkers were only working four days a week. Mr. Gear. What is the sum they would earn in this country? Mr. Howorth. A girl weaver here would make more than that. They used to employ men here formerly, but they have gone into the employment of women and more than half of the weavers now are girls. We find that girls weaving in this country are making more than the men on the other side. CARPETS. (Paragiapli SflM et sec|.) STATEMENT OF EDWAKD BUEKE. Mr. Chairman : I have been at work in the carpet industry in this country for eleven years. During that time I have had plenty of work and sometimes I have had to work at night. Work has been so steady that sometimes I could not get a day off. I do not really know what the cause of the sudden suspension of work is. I am not acquainted with the tariff or anything else in that respect, because I am only a workingraan. I have made $2 a day, and when I work overtime I have made as high as $2.50 a day. I have sisters working in the mills at Yonkers and they have made as high as $10 and $10.50 a week. We are now out of work, and we can not say what the cause is. It may be due to the tariff or it may be due to the money stringency. Some gen- tlemen here are better acquainted with that question than I am. All I CARPETS. 1015 can say is that we want this able body of men of the Committee on Ways and Means to help ns. If they can do that \vc will be satisfied. The Ohaieman. We will try to helj) you. CARPETS. (Paragraph S99 et wq.) STATEMENT OF ME. ALLEN AINSWOHTH, Mr. Chateman: I have worked at the carpet business for about seventeen years. I can say that I have always had good work. I have • always considered that I was doing well when I could get a day off once in awhile until the present depression came on. I do not know that I can say^^nything more than has already been said. Mr. Hopkins. Is there a feeling among you workingmen that if the Democratic party leaves the tariff alone you would get along and get good wages? Mr. AiNSWOKTH. Yes, sir. The Chairman. That is the feeling among the Republican working- men 1 Mr. AiNSWORTH. It is the feeling among the workingmen generally. Mr. Hopkins. Eepublicans as well as Democrats'? Mr. AiNSWORTH. We have had plenty of work with protection for twenty years. IVIr. Hopkins. Ton have always had plenty of work until this Dem- ocratic administration came into power? Mr. AiNSWORTH. I do not know about that being the cause. It is the lack of confidence. Mr. CocKRAN. Is not the difiQculty in getting money necessary to carry ou business? Mr. AiNSWORTH. I could not say about that. Mr. Hopkins. What do you workingmen want? Do j'on want the article in which you work put upon the free list or do you want the duty to remain as it is? Mr. AiNSWORTH. We would rather have the tariff left as it is. Mr. Hopkins. Why? Mr. AiNSWORTH. Because we think it would do us more good than to take the tariff off. The Chairman. What you want is plenty of work at good wages ? Mr. AiNSWORTH. Yes, sir. Mr. CocKRAN. Do you not think it would be better for you to have two employers competing for your labor, or do you think it would be better for yon to have two men looking for the same job? Mr. AiNSWORTH. If I had two men looking for me I wonld take the best job. Mr. CoCKRAN. How would it be if you and the other man were look- ing for the same job? Mr. AiNSWORTH. Then I would go after the man who had the job to give out. Mr. CoCKRAN. Do you not think that the average protected industry is protected enough? Mr. AiNSWORTH. There are a good many people protected who ought not to be. Mr. CoCKRAN. Do you think we could winnow them out? Mr. AiNSWORTH. No, sir; they have got to live. This is a new country. In England and Scotland and every place in the old country the smaller places have streets. If a man buys property in Yonkers he must go to work and build streets. 1016 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. MATS AND RUGS. [Paragraph iOS] JSTew York, September 20, 1893. Sir : The industry I represent has been m existence seven years for the purpose of manufacturing handsome rugs and carpets in one piece of any size, shape, design, or coloring. We found much up-hill work before us, on one hand the making of the gOods with the greatest difii- culty, teaching the hands how to do the work, paying for their time while they did not earn anything; and on the other, when trying to » introduce the goods we found the prejudice against all fine goods made in this country, which still prevails. We have, however, endeavored and succeeded to prove that such goods can be made satisfactorily. During our existence we paid for building up the business and sunk the large sum of $95,000 in it, excluding the value of our energy, with hardly any pecuniary remuneration. We can see our way clear to develop this industry at the present rate of duty upon such goods, which is to oflset the great difference in the wages between operatives here and abroad. With a small production as yet, we are comparatively not known to the people, and we have had occasion to note that importers of this particular line have stated that rugs and carpets of this class should be allowed to enter this country &ee, or with merely a nominal rate of duty. These importers further stated that such an act would not conflict with the manufacture of said goods in this country. In reference to this I beg to say that our goods are an exact reproduction of the Oriental rugs, also German, French, and English goods of the same nature, specified in tariff law as "car- pets woven whole for rooms." In the Orient rugs are manufactured in private houses, prisons, and in factories, the latter having been established by English syadicates within the last decade, and the wages paid for the labor in these estab- lishments are purely nominal. As a matter of fact, we can not compete with such labor, nor did we ever try to; but we can compete with European production at the present rate of duty levied upon this article. For instance, a Germ an manufacturer pays 13 marks (or $3.25), including all his expenses, for the production of 1 square yard of rug, whereas it costs us $5.50 to produce the same thing. Over one-half of the latter amount represents labor paid to operatives. A German manufacturer pays 1 mark (25 cents) for 1,000 tufts; we pay f 1. The wages paid by us to all our employes — such as dyer, designer, and sketch artist — are invariably four times as large as the salaries paid for the same class of work in Europe. Yours, respe«tfully, Egbert Stuntz. DATES OF WOOIi TARIFF. STATEMENT OF JOHir HOPEWELL, OF BOSTON, MASS. Mr. Chairman: The only thing to which I wish to call your atten- tion at this time is the question as to when this duty shall go into operation. We usually talk with the woolen people in September in getting our orders for the year. All goods made in September, Octo- ber, and usually in E"ovember are consumed that year^that is to say, are sent to the jobbers. The 1st of November there is a meeting of the DATES OF WOOL TARIFF. 1017 superintendent and president of tlie corporation, and tlieycan guess as to what will be consumed during the year. From November to the 1st of May we manufacture goods in stock, witliout orders. Some years we make too many goods and some years we make too few. 'They are so cheap and are sold so low that we have considerable control of that class of goods. That has kept our trade up, so that in March, April, and May we have time orders for the better class of goods to be shipped in June, July, and August, bills payable, in sixty days. So you see it is one whole year year between the time of ordering the goods and the payment for the goods. Of course in the intermediate time we well sell perhaps $30,000 or $40,000 worth. We manufacture or gamble as to about $250,000 or $300,000 worth of the goods we make. Some years the trade will take a little more, and often we have $50,000 too much. We have to-day something like $20,000 worth of goods unsold. Our mills are stopped. We stopped two weeks ago. It looks as if we would stop another mill in, the next two weeks. This depression in business is something we do not know anything about. Customers have can- celed orders, and they will not be replaced this year. You, gentlemen, will readily see our position. This has been to us so far a very trying experience, and we have been in the milling business twenty-six years. Some of our product is the making of plush. We ask you on behalf of burselves and 800 employes, many of them owning their own houses, but have nothing to live on, that whatever you do, give us a full year in which to turn around. If you contemplate any change, it should not take effect until 1895. We would like to set to work as many of our operatives as we possibly can, in order to give them something to live on. I believe that is the sentiment ol* nearly every woolen manufacturer in this country. Another thing in which I am interested is the question of ad valorem. I do hope you will not put on an ad valorem duty without a specific duty. While this new duty has helped us wonderfully in preventing undervaluation, still many manufacturers on the other side make goods so exclusively for the American market that there is no ad valorem price on it. They simply make it for whatever price they care to. When I was abroad I went into the consul's office and saw the clerks signing papers rapidly to which was attached pieces of goods. I said to him: " Of course you are certifying as to the correctness of the invoices." He said: "Theoretically, yes; but practically, no." " Why," said I, '■'• that is your duty, I supposed, as consul." He said,: "Theoretically, yes; but practically it would take fifteen men in this office to do that work. It is simply a physical impossibility for us to verify these invoices." We have to come in competition with these goods, and an equivalent specific duty would be very much better, and would be a greater protection than any ad valorem you can put on them. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you believe that for many of these goods thefe is no sale except in America? Mr. Hopewell. I understand that some manufacturers in Europe manufacture expressly for this market. They send their whole prod- uct, and make the i^rices on this side. Mr. Breckinridge. Those goods are simply consigned to agents in this country? Mr. Hopewell. They are simply consigned to the agent, who makes the price. 1018 WOOL AND MANUFACTURES OF WOOL. Mr. Beeckinridge. Do you remember one provision that was in the Mills bill for free wool and reduction of goods'? Mr. HoPEAVELL. Yes, sir; I will tell you that affected us in plushes. It gave us 12 cents a yard reduction in the cost of the goods. It takes three-fourths of a pound to make a yard of goods. Our actual saving was 12 cents a yard in the cost of the goods. The actual difference to the German manxifacturer was 28 cents a yard; that is to say, if you give us free wool, and take off the duty as contemjilated in the Mills bill, we shall be 22 cents worse off for protection under that duty. Mr. Breckinridge. I would be glad if you would submit a paper on that, and you can make your statement as full as you desire.- Mr. Hopewell. I may say in explanation that two years ago I was taken with the grip. My physician sent me abroad. Unfortunately I went to Carlsbad and, after taking the baths, I took cold. I stayed five months in bed and this is the first real business I have been able to conduct for over eighteen months, and I feel that it is a great strain for me to be here now. My partner told me that I ought not to come to Washington. Mr. Breckinridge. I would be glad to have you send a statement to the committee. Mr. Hopewell. I shall be more than happy to do so. There are other gentlemen here, and I will not take up more of your time. Any information tliat I have I will cheerfully give on any point. Mr. Breckinridge. Sujipose you give what the raw material costs, and what you think your particular industry would suffer. Mr. HoPEAA'iiLL. Very well. Mr. Breckinridge. I>robody here wants to put the manufacturers of the country into a place where they will be taxed on material and have a reduction on the finished product. Mr. Hopewell. I do not think this committee desires to do anything unfair. My only fear is that, not having the practical experience that we have had, you may do something that will hurt us. ^CI-IEDULE Xj. SILK GOODS 1019 SILKS. (Paragraph 409 et seq.) STATEMENT OF MR. JOSEPH NEUMANN, OF SAN FRANCISCO, CAL. Tuesday, September 5, 1893. Mr. Chairman : I have been here before, as many of yon who were here during the consideration of the McKinley bill know, and there- fore it is not necessary for me to have a further introduction. I be- lieve that it is well known that I am the father of silk culture in the United States. I brought it here from the old country. I started in business in California in 1865, and have been at it ever since; but have been unfortunate in it by reason of the diversity of opinion in reference to the tariff. I think, according to my estimate, outside of statistics, that we are consuming to-day $250,000,000 worth of silk goods, and I will ask if we can call it a luxury? The Chaieman. We would like to have you confine yourself as closely as possible to the idea which you wish to present to the committee, as we are pressed for time. Please-state whether you want the duty raised or lowered on raw silk, or manufactured silk, or whatever proposition . you desire to present. Mr. Neumann. I am very much obliged to you, Mr. Chairman, for reminding me on this matter of the tariff. As for me, it would make no difference if there is 200 or 400 per cent ad valorem duty on silk, instead of 50 per cent. I think it can be reduced to 25 per cent. Either one of them would not help the development of silk culture, unless Con- gress looks into the matter properly, to see where th6 evils come from and to find out why we shall import $250,000,000 worth of silk goods. The queston is, does the Government get its proper share of revenue under the tariff' of 50 j)er cent ad valorem'? Some statistics, which I got to-day from the Government statistician, show that about $33,000,000 worth of silk goods arrived in this country during the present year. I say that this burdensome duty is wrong, for the very reason that it encourages smuggling and undervaluation, and I think that if the rate were reduced to 25 per cent ad valorem and the law made stringent with respect to smuggling and undervaluations, the Government Avould get more money than it now gets under the 50 per cent duty. My aim is to help the i)roducts of the silkworm and to enable it to produce on this continent. We have an area within our States and Territories possessing a climate capable of the perfect culture of the silkworm, and we could produce about ten times the amount of silk- worms that have ever been produced on the face of the globe. The Chairman. Ton said you were the father of silk culture in this country, and now will you please state what experience you have had in the production of the cocoon and of silkworms"? Mr, ^sTeumann. I liave that in some papers here. The Chairman. You appeared before this committee wliile the McKinley bill was under consideration? 1021 1022 SILK GOODS. Mr. Neumann. Yes, sir. The Chairman. Did you advocate the bounty in the bill ais first pro- posed? Mr. Neumann. No, sir; because we have not yet produced" enough to make it worth while asking for protection, and reducing the bounty would not interfere with it. The Chaikman. Tell us something about your experience in the cul- ture of silkworms in this country. Mr. Neumann. Tlie production of silk requires, first of all, a climate and temperature suited to the worm. It requires an early spring, and it is a kind of work whicli, when there is nothing else to be done on the farm, enables the agriculturalist to expend his spare time in its growth and ripening, and the feeding of the worm in producing cocoons. The mulberry tree is the earliest/ one to produce leaves, and being subject to frost, if it is nipped the worm will die because there is no food for it. In that case, where there happens to be a frost, they must wait at least six weeks for the tree to produce a new crop of leaves. So, there- fore, in many instances the southern part of the United States, such as North and South Carolina and Alabama, and the whole distance way up to Oregon, mil be better suited to the production of the silkworm. The whole State of California is capable of producing the worm, south, north, east, and west; and the most wonderful results might be obtained. This can not be denied. The Chairman. Please state briefly what you want in the way of duty. Mr. Neumann. I would say 25 or 30 per cent ad valorem. Or make a specific tariff on silken goods would be sufflcient, provided that it can be made collectable. The Government would get more money then than it gets at present, under the 50 per cent rate. The Chairman. Then your proposition is that raw silk should remain on the free list? Mr. Neumann. No; nothing on the free list, except cocoons. The Chairman. What duty would you propose on raw silk? Mr. ISeumann. The cocoons are aproduct and raw silk is the manu- . factured article. Mr. Gear. You would let cocoons come in free? Mr. Neumann. Yes, sir. The quantity of raw silk which we now import would give employment to at least 15, 000. men. Mr. Gear. How much duty do you want on raw silk? Mr. Neumann. 15 per cent. If you charge 30 per cent duty on manufactured silk you ought to charge half that amount on raw silk. On the tariff bill now in existence there is 35 per cent on spun silk thread. If you charge that amount on spun silk thread you ought not to charge more than half that amount on raw silk. One is worth $3 a pound, while raw silk sells for $12 a pound. It ought to be taxed. It is a luxury, and naturally those who want to buy jewelry and to show themselves off in a better manner can generally afford to pay taxes to support the Government. Mr. Gear. Will a duty of 15 per cent be better than a duty of $2 or $3 a pound? Mr. Neumann. A specific duty of half a dollar will do. It used to be li5 per cent ad valorem on manufactured goods and 15 per cent on raw silk. I want to say in reference to the McKinley bill, that when the report was written that industry in our State was left out and side- tracked; and I want to ask why such things exist? I am here from the PLUSHES AND VELVETS. 1023 old country with ray money aud time and worked fVjr the benefit of my adoJ)ted country, which gave me liberty and e(inal rights j but I do not think that my labor should remain unrecognized. The culture of silk in this country can be made a success, ami has been, and I ha^'c the documents to prove it. I could speak here three days, if the gentlemen of the committee would listen to me. What I say can not be denied, because I can prove it here from a report made to the Agricultural Department iu 1885. The Chairman. In your statement made before the committee in 1890 you putiu the record these documents, and the testimonials sliovv- ing what you have done, so you need not go into that question now. What I understand you to advocate is that cocoons should remain on the free list, and that a tariff of 15 per cent ad valorem should bo put on raw silk"? Mr. Neumann. Yes, sir; or half a doWar per pound. It would bring in $4,000,000 or $5,000,000 in revenue. The Chairman. We imiDorted raw silk and silk materials in ISOii to the amount of $25,063,000. Your proposition of 15 per cent on raw sUk and 30 per cent on manufactured silk, I should think, would pro- duce a larger revenxie than we get from the rates now in existence. Mr. Nbumawn. I should think so, and it would prevent smuggling and undervaluation. The Chairman. I think we have now got your views on. the subject. Mr. Neumann. Very Avell; that is my information. At the same time I will state that I have no interest in any concern. My aim is to get recognition and to endeavor to ad\^ance the enterprise of silk cul- ture as it ought to be in this country. PLUSHES AND VELVETS. (Paragraph 411.) Friday, September 15, 1893. Mr. Db Forest. I wish to introduce Mr. Kip, and I wish to bespeak for him your most indulgent consideration, lie is president of the Bridgeport Plush Company, one of the largest and most important of our Bridgeport industries, employing some 500 men, an industry that has been building up year by year, and which labors under some pecu- liar disadvantages in regard to cost of labor and machinery. STATEMENT OF ME. FRED E. KIP, PRESIDENT OF THE SALT'S TEXTILE MANUFAC- TTJEING COMPANY, BKIDGEPOET, CONN. Mr. Chairman: It is important and interesting to know that since the enactment of the present tariff on silk plushes and velvets the cost to the consumer has been lowered considerably. Twenty- four-inch colored plushes sold in 1889 and 1890 for $1, now sell at 80 cents; 21- inch seal plushes sold in 1889 and 1890 for $1.60, now sell at $1.15; 49-inch seal plushes sold in 1889 and 1890 for $3.75, now sell at $2.75. The development made in this iiidustry in such short time is most remarkable. To-day the plush industry has here attained to larger proportions than in England; the successful development of the indus- try here having detrimented same in England. We understand that Lister & Co., of Bradford, tlie largest i^lush and velvet mill in England, 1024 SILK GOODS. bas sent a lepresentative over here from Eugland purposely to do all he possibly can to obtain reduction in this tariff to enable them to regain the lost American market. Lister formerly sold to the United States several millions per annum. They now do practically nothing here. Owing to difficulties in manufacturing, a certain quantity of plushes always comes out inferior (and are known in the market as seconds). A specific duty. is always desirable, but particularly so in this industry. If there were an ad valorem duty only it would be impossible (on account of these seconds) to prevent gross undervaluation of foreign goods. The offlcial records at the appraiser's office, New York, show that about^ one-half of the seal plush imported the year previous to the present tariff were invoiced as seconds. The specific duty of plush and velvets puts an effectual stop to this undervaluation (as a second practically weighs as much as perfect goods), and is therefore an absolute necessity. I am president of an American company (the Salt's Textile Manu- facturing Company, Bridgeport, Conn., the second in size here) and am also selling agent — as an importer — for three of the largest foreign plush and velvet manufacturers in Europe, one of same situated in England and the others in Germany, Austria, and France. Through my being connected at the same time with American and foreign mills, I am able to give authentic information as to wages, etc., paid by this industry in each of these countries. The following are the wages paid by the foreign mills: Mills. "Wages per week. Nanio. Foreign value. United States value. Sir Titiis Salt Bart Soils i Co 20 to22sbillinga.. $4. 60 to $5. 00 J. L. (leBall ifeCo Lobbeiieli, near Crefeld, Ger- man v. S 8 florins i 3.50 4 30 ^60 kreutzer J B Martin Lyon and Tarare, France (Salt's, deBall, and Martin are considered among the largest foreign manufacturers in their line.) The foreign average on wages is $4.02 per week, whereas the wages paid at the American mill amounts to an average of $10.50 per week; therefore the American mill pays 160 per cent more wages than is paid by the foreign mills making exactly the same goods. The skilled United States workmen, weavers, etc., earn $15 to $16 per week, but tht average of skilled and unskilled, including boys and girls, is $10.50 to $11.50 per week. The average cost of silk plush and velvets is made up of about three- fifths (or 60 per cent) material (the greater part of material being spun silk) and two-fifths (or 40 per cent) actual labor. Tlie materials used in making silk plushes and velvets are spun (oi' schappe) silk and cotton yarns. The spun (or schappe) silk yarns com- pose, however, by far tbe greater part, being about 33J^ per cent of cost and 75 per cent of all materials used. The spun silk yarns pay to-day a. duty of 35 per cent. Two or three United States si)inners are spni- ning these silk yarns here, but their spinning, either on account of ])iice or quality, does not sh 411.) STATEMENT OF ME. MAX DOEBMER, REPRESENTING NEW YORK PLUSH AND VELVET IMPORTERS. Mr. Chairman: I have a short statement here which I desire to read : Wednesday, September 20, 1893. Sir: We beg leave to submit a change of the tariff, which we con- sider the most reasonable and just way to admit schappe and silk pile fabrics of foreign manufacture into this country. The present tariff of $lf)0 a iiound and 15 per cent ad valorem on goods containing less than 75 per cent of silk and of $3.50 a pound and 15 per cent ad valorem on goods containing more than 75 per cent of silk means a duty of 75 per cnt to 125 per cent on goods which previous to the McKin- ley bill paid only 50 per cent ad valorem. It simply means a prohibit- ory tariff on all low qualities which are principally used by the middle and lower classes. We therefore propose to have the duty changed to ■'#1 a pound and 15 per cent ad valorem for goods containing less than 75 per cent of silk, and $3 a pound and 15 per cent ad valorem for all goods containing more than 75 -pei cent of silk, provided that there will be no change of the duties on the raw materials used for manu- facturing these goods. In case of a change the proportionate percent- age should be taken off from the pound duty. Our proposed rate of duty means a protection of 51 to 75 per cent to the domestic manu- fiicturers, which certainly should be and is sufiQcient. It means an honest and easy way of collecting duties, such as never can be obtained through an ad valorem duty, as no man, not excluding experts, can give the true value of pile fabrics within 15 to 20 jier cent. We main- tain that under the administration bill a specific duty is the only proper mode of collecting the actual duties on pile fabrics. Most respectfully, yours, Fred. J. Eemee, Max DobrmeRj Gomniittee (t/ppoi idcd by the New Yorli plush and velvet importers. PLUSHES AND VELVETS. 1037 Mr. Hopkins. What is your Lusiuess "! Mr. DoEEMBR. I am an importer. Mr. Hopkins. At whose instance do yon come before the commit- tee? Mr. DoERJMEE. On behalf of the importers of phish and silk velvets of New York. Mr. Hopkins. Do you know whether the articles mentioned in your printed address to the committee are cheaper to the consumer than they were before the adoption of the McKinley bill '? Mr. DoBEMEE. They are higher. Mr. Hopkins. How much? Mr. DoEEMBE. Well, that varies according to the quality and the degree of duty which they pay. They pay now a duty of $1.50 to !!p3.50,. and of course every quality pays different. Mr. Hopkins. What class of consumers takes these goods? Mr. DOEEMEE. They are the middle and better classes. Mr. Hopkins. These articles are sold to the rich people principally, are they not ? Mr. DoEEMBE. No; they are sold largely to the middle classes. The poor classes took them up, but the poor qiialities are driven out of the market, so that the poor class can not buy the goods any more. Mr. Hopkins. Ton say, " silk pile fabrics of foreign manufacture;" what do you mean by that? Mr. Doeejmbe. Foreign manufacture, or goods imported. Mr. Hopkins. You say, "silk pile fabrics;?' what do you mean by that? Mr. DoERMEE. Silk pile fabrics ; all velvets and plushes are called pile fabrics. Mr. Hopkins. Do you know whether any industries have been started in this country since the adoption of the law increasing the tariff? Mr. DoEEMEE. Yes, sir. Mr. Hopkins. How many? Mr. DoEEMEE. A few mills; not many. Mr. Hopkins. Do you know anything about the amount of product or output of those mills ? Mr. DoEEMEE. I can not give the exact figures; that would be pretty hard to do. Mr. Hopkins. Do you know the capital invested? Mr. DoBEMER. I do not know that either. Mr. Hopkins. Do you know the number of employes used in these various industries that have been started since the adoption of the McKinley bill? Mr. DoEEMBR. No; I could not give that exactly. Mr. TuRNBE. Can you illustrate in any way the price of the stuff now and then? Mr. DoEEMER. Before the McKinley bill we had 50 per cent; after the McKinley bill we had to buy at 125 per cent on a great many cloths. Mr. Turner. Have you anything to show us; have you some sam- ples? Mr. DOEEMEE. Yes, sir; I can show you samples (exhibiting same). Mr. TuENifE. Give the price before and after taking. Mr. DoEEMEE. This is domestic, and this is the foreign quality, both at the same price. The domestic quality would cost to im^iort to-day 95 cents and it is sold in this country at 65 cents. Mr. Hopkins. It is sold in this country at 65 cents ? Mr. Doeemer. Yes, and even with the duty of 50 per cent we can 1038 SILK GOODS. not import it. It can not be made and imported and sold in this coun- try for 65 cents. Mr. Hopkins. Ton say it is sold in this country now for 65? Mr. DoERMEK. It is sold now at 65 cents. Mr. Hopkins. It is sold for less than the import duty? Mr. DoE^MER. It is sold for less than it can be imported. That there pays 120 per cent. Mr. Hopkins. And sells for 66 cents in this country"? Mr. DoERMER. That is domestic goods made in this country and this is foreign goods which pays 120 per cent. Mr. Hopkins. But the domestic goods takes the place among the consumers of your foreign iwoduct? . Mr. DoERMBR. I should say so; certainly it does. Mr. Hopkins. And it sells here for 65 cents; in other words, it is sell- ing for 50 per ceut of what you claim the import duty Mr . DoERMER. We claim we can not manufacture the goods in Europe and compete with American manufactures if the duty was 50 per cent. Mr. Hopkins. What you want is this. You want the American Con- gress to reduce the import duties so as to benefit your manufacturers in Europe? Mr. DoERMER. No, sir; what we want is an equal chance. Mr. Hopkins. You claim that the manufacturer in Europe should have an equal chance with an American who pays taxes and helps to support this Government I Fred J. Eemeb. ^Ve give the American manufacturer about 25 per cent. You take our foreign goods that cost $1 a pound ; that would pay about 75 per cent duty to the Government. Mr. Doermer. You take the people who used to buy these goods and they do not buy them any more. They can not afford, they will not pay 65, therefore they can not afford to buy the cloths any more. It is not sold any more. Mr. Breckinridge. These products which Mr. Hopkins talks about have nothing to do with the cost of the article to the American con- sumer 1 Mr. DoERMEB. To the American consumer Mr. Breckinridge. Does it come out of the American consumer? Mr. Doermer. The American consumer has to pay considerably more. Mr. Breckinridge. He leaves him out of his calculations? Mr. Bryan. Did the price of domestic plush rise? Mr. Doermer. They never made them before. Mr. Bryan. So you do not know what the price was? Mr. Doermer. No, sir. Mr. Hopkins. That is, before the adoption of that law you gentlemen had the monopoly of the American market? Mr. Ebmer. There was no manufacturer making them. Mr. Hopkins. But after the adoption of the McKinley bill this prod- uct started up and sells the article in the market now for one-half of what you claim the import duty on them is — is that correct? Mr. Eemer. No, sir; it is not. Mr. Breckinridge. Has that' article sold anv higher than before the McKinley bill? Mr. Eemer. Yes, sir. The cost of these goods we sold before the McKinley bill was 67, and we can not import them now; it would be 128 per cent on that one quality alone. PLUSHES AND VELVETS. 1039 Mr. Beeokinridge. Do not you know what they are selling for in the stores'? Mr. Eemee. There are none imported. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you know what their equivalent is selling for, about? Mr. Eemer. One dollar. Mr. Breckinridge. What was it selling for before? Mr. Eemer. Seventy-iive cents. Mr. Breckinridge. Are they equivalent? Mr. Eemer. ISTo, the American goods are better. Mr. Breckinridge. The better one is sold for a dollar than the one for 75 cents? Mr. Eemer. Yes, sir ; that is right. Mr. Breckinridge. Then they come to the value of our money? Mr. Eemer. They could come to the value of our money, but all we want is just a chance to bring the goods in. Mr. Breckinridge. You do not contend the Americaii consumer is getting his money's worth, but what you want is an import duty Hxed so — - Mr. Eemer. So we could bring this in. Mr. Breckinridge. What you want is your manufacture brought sharp up to that quality of American manufacture? Mr. Eemer. No, we will give them 25 j)er cent, we will give them 75 per cent instead of 50. All we ask is to give us the chance. Mr. Breckinridge. What do you pay laborers in the production of this kind of an article abroad? Mr. Eemer. They vary from 3 marks according to the demand for the goods. Mr. Breckinridge. What is the price paid the same class of labor in this country? Mr. Eemer. One dollar and $1.50. Thedifferenceis, some lines work girls in these factories. They are mostly girls who run the looms in Europe. Mr. Breckinridge. What percentage would be the difference of the labor cost between Europe and here? Mr. Eemer. As between Europe and here? Mr. Breckinridge. On these articles. Mr. Eemer. I can not tell you exactly. Mr. Breckinridge. You pay from 50 to 75 per cent less for labor? Mr. Eemer. About 50 per cent. Mr. Breckinridge. Does your labor produce as mttch for each dol- lar it receives as here? Mr. Eemer. ITo ; they make more here. The labor will do more work here than in Germany. Mr. Hopkins. And for the same class of work? Mr. Eemer. They will do more here than in Germany. Mr. Hopkins. You pay 60 per cent less for the same amount of labor abroad than is paid here? Mr. Eemer. It is according to the demand in Europe. If the demand will be very great they have to pay more for weavers. Mr. Hopkins. Where is your establishment? Mr. Eemer. Crefeld, Germany. Mr. DoERMER. The looms produce more here. Mr. Hopkins. The development of this industry since the adoption of the McKinley bill has been very marked in this country? Mr. Eemer. No; there is only about live I'dctories started. 1040 SILK GOODS. Mr. Hopkins. They are furnishing the market with these grades of goods ? Mr. Eemee. Only a small amount, and there is no demand for these goods to-day to amount to anything. Mr. Hopkins. Do you know anything about what they are producing and putting on the market? Mr. Eemee. No ; I could not tell you. Mr. DoERMEB. He can not give the exact figures. Mr. Hopkins. Then you do not know whether the production has been a marked increase or not? Mr. DoEEMEE. We know that the increase has not been so much as people expected. Mr. Hopkins. How do you know that if you do not know anything about the output? Mr. Eemee. We can judge how many looms each factory has. Mr. Hopkins. Do you know how many factories there are manufac- turing this product now? Mr. Eemee. About five. Mr. Hopkins. Where are they located? ]Mr. EE3IEE. One in Bridgeport, two in N"ew York, one in Phila- delphia, and I think there is one in Paterson and one on Long Island. Mr. Hopkins. Are there more than those? Mr. Eemee. 1 think that is about all. The (Jhaieman. About how much of a dollar of your material is the labor cost? Sir. DoEEMEE. Which material? The Chaieman. Of the foreign product you have there. Mr. DoBEMBE. I could not tell you that, exactly. The Ohaieman. How much of the American factory is the labor cost? Mr. DoEEMBE. I should say the difference can not be very great. The looms here make so many more yards a day than the looms on the other side ; therefore the difference is not very enormous. The Chairman. Can you give an approximate answer to the ques- tion, of a dollar's worth of that American material j how much would you suppose was the labor cost? Mr. DoEEMEE. Thirty cents, I should say. The Chaieman. In the common grades, then, that are less than 75 per cent of silk, what is the average duty, do you know ? Mr. DoEEMEE. The average duty on the common goods is between 90 and 125 per cent. The Chaieman. Then on every dollar's Avorth of imported goods there is a tax of 90 to 125 per cent? Mr. DoERMEE. Ninety to 125 per cent. Mr. Eemee. And some grades go to 135 per cent? The Chaieman. There is a tariff duty of 135 per cent on every dol- lar's worth of goods, of which you estimate there is 30 cents work on the original material? Mr. Eemee. Yes, sir. Mr. Hopkins. You say 30 per cent is the labor; are you a manu- facturer? Mr. DoBEMEE. No, sir. Mr. Hopkins. Have you ever been interested in it? Mr. DOBMBE. Yes, sir. Mr. Hopkins. Where? Mr. DoEEMER. Not here; I was on the other side. Mr. Hopkins, Are you interested in it now ? PLUSH. 1041 Mr. DoERMER. No ; but I had a chance to get a mill here which was offered to me, but I would not take it because the duty is so high now I knew it can not last. Mr. Hopkins. Then you are satisfied this committee is going to reduce this so as to make it unprofitable for anyone to invest in it? Mr. DoEBMEE. Not at all. Mr. Hopkins. Did not you say you declined to become interested in this business because this import duty can not last? Mr. DoEEMEE. Exactly. Mr. Hopkins. And if it does not last, it is your judgment these mills can not run? Mr. DoEEMEE. Excuse me, I do not want to have our proposition come that way. We want to have a duty that is likely to be for some time and then you will see capital come forth. Mr. Hopkins. But did not you say you declined to invest in this business because these duties would not last? Mr. DoEEMEE. Exactly; I knew the duty would not last. I thought it would be changed, but I did not know what it would be. Mr. Hopkins. Then it would not be profitable to own a mill on this side of the water? Mr. DoEEMBE. That depends upon how the change will be. Mr. Hopkins. Let me ask you another question. Are you an importer, or do you represent foreign manufacturers as their agent? Mr. DoEEMEE. I represent foreign manufacturers, but at the same time domestic Mr. Hopkins. You come before this committee as the agent of for- eign manufacturers? Mr. DoEEMEE. As agent of foreign manufacturers. Mr. TuENEE. Let him complete his statement; what else do you represent? Mr. DoEEMEE. But at the same time we represent the domestic manufacturers, the domestic mills, so I can judge very well what the domestic mills can do in comparison with what foreign mills can do. Mr. Hopkins. What domestic mills do you represent? Mr. DOEKMEE. The Astoria. Mr. Hopkins. Where located? Mr. UoEEMEE. Long Island. Mr. Hopkins. Who is the general manager of the Astoria mills, can you give his full name? Mr. DoEEMEE. I think it is Mr. J. Mattman. Mr. Hopkins. He is general manager of that mill? Mr. DoEEMEE. Yes, sir. Mr. Eemee. If you ask any American manufacturer he will say that 50 per cent is satisfactory. Our proposition is to give him 75 per cent. PLUSH. (Paragraph 111.) New Yoek, September 26th, 1893. Sir : The undersigned committee, on behalf of the New York velvet and plush importers, respectfully request to have the proposed rate of duty on silk pile fabrics, which was submitted to your committee on the 20th of this month, amended by adding : "But in no case shall the duty be less than 50 per cent ad valorem." T H 66 1042 SILK GOODS. The passiis in tlie original petition commencing: "We," etc., should therefore read : We therefore propose to have the duty changed to $1 .00 a pound and 15 per cent ad valorem for goods containing less than 75 per cent of silk and $3 a pound and 15 per cent ad valorem for all goods containing more than 75 per cent of silk, hut in no case shall the duty be less than 50 per cent ad valorem, provided that there will be no change on the duties on the raw materials used for manufacturing these goods. In case of a change the proportionate percentage should be taken off from the pound duty and the minimum rate. Trusting that our request will be complied with, we remain, most respectfully, Fred. J. Eemeb. Max Doermek, "We recommend a reduction on the lower grades of 24-inch silk plushes from the present rate of duty to 50, upon the grounds that these plushes are mostly used by the working classes, who naturally require them as cheaply as they possibly can. We further recommend areduction of mohair plushes from the present rate of duty to the old rate of 35 and 40, upon the ground that the American manufacturers have not yet succeeded in making as nicely a finished plush, nor do they give as good a value for a larger amount of money as foreign manufacturers do, and that mohair plushes are used principally by the working classes on account of their durability and good wearing qualities. We see no reason for a reduction on plain silk goods from the pres- ent duty of 50 per cent, and we rather recommend that the same be retained, as they are used mostly by the better classes, who can afford to pay the present values, and thus encourage the American manufac- turer to improve under the present protection to that extent that American goods in finer textures may soon reach that standard which foreign fabrics have attained. We further recommend a reduction in wool fabrics for furniture cov- erings to the old standard of 35 and 40, as many of the cheaper fabrics of this texture and construction are also used by the working people, and that the American manufacturer has up till now paid very little attention to the making of them, only seeking to make the higher grades in these fabrics rather than the lower ones ; and as under the l)resent tariff the duty is as high on one as on the other, it is natural that the cheaper fabric made abroad has such a heavy duty placed upon it that the American workingman can hardly use them at the prices which they must necessarily bring with the heavy duty. Committee op National Furniture Manueacturers Association. Leo Austrian, Chairman. MANUFACTURES OF SILK. (Paragrnph 414.) New York, September 32, 1893. Sirs: I am a manufacturer of silks in Eraaus, Pa,, and reside in New York City. The principal line I manufacture is silk in the gray, and converted after woven. Tliis silk is made out of one fifth raw silk, which is free of duty, and four-fifths schappe silk, on which there is a MANUFACTUKES OF SILK. 1043 duty of 35 per cent. Labor and expense are about one-third of the cost of the material. These goods are largely imported, and are sold at lower prices in this market than our domestic goods can be sold for, although on these foreign goods there is a duty of 50 per cent ad valorem, and our competition is only balanced by the fact that our Amer- ican silks are more reliable and better made than these foreign silks, therefore bought by experts in preference, although comi^etitiou is very keen and lails in many cases. Heretofore I imported these goods from Lyons, but a year ago I built a mill, thereby giving employment to all the female help in the town and suburbs, and quite a number of males. I had them taught, and they are now reliable weavers. Should the duty on this class of goods be lowered, it would cause me to stop manufacturing in this country and import again, as I did heretofore. The town of Bmaus has suffered a great deal from not having employment fur women, only for men who are working in the iron works, etc. Their wages for their daily labor alone are hardly suflicieut to support their fanulies. Since I located there prosperity has naturally sprung up, and it would be a great calamity to these people should they be deprived of their daily earnings. Although this class of goods is one of the cheapest manufactured, nevertheless they are as much a luxury as any silk made. They are used entirely for draperies, etc. I wish to call the special attention of your honorable committee to the fact that these silks can not be classi- hed with the higher grades, for the reason that the better goods are made entirely out of raw silk, on which there is no duty, and the labor is the same, and therefore only nominal in comparison with this cheap grade I quote, and injustice to all the manufacturers of this c^ss of goods in this country it ought to be put on a fairer basis to meet com- petition a little more freely, either by advancing the duty on cheaiJ grades or by lowering the duty considerably on schapjie silk, which is classified as single thread, imported on paper tubes ready to put into the shuttle for weaving, and can only be used for that purpose, and it ought not to be identified with sxmn silk, which is manufactured to quite an extent in this country and used for various bther purposes. All of which I hereby respectfully submit to your due consideration, and remain respectfully, Paul Gumbinner. SCHEDULE M. PULP, PAPER, AND BOOKS. 1045 WOOD PULP. (Parajrapli 415.) The manufacturers of wood pulp would respectfully submit the fol- lowing statement: — The duty on wood pulp under the present law is specific and fixes the rate — Per ton. On ground wood pulp, dry weight $2. 50 On chemical wood pulp, dry weight (unbleached) 6.00 On chemical wood pulp (bleached) 7. 00 The duty was, before the present law, 10 per cent ad valorem, and the new law did not increase or lower the duty; it was changed to the specific form to prevent the undervaluation which was found to be going on to a large extent. The manufacture of wood piilpin this -country is comparatively new; it began in a very small way about 1870. It has grown very rapidly since that time, and there has been a steady change from the use of rags in the manufacture of paper to the use of wood pulp. The committee will observe that the present duty is among the low- est imposed wpon any article of importation, and does not wholly com- peusate for the difference between the labor cost in this couuti-y and other competing countries, as shown by the constantly increasing im- portations. (See accompanying tables.) There were imported : Tear eliding. Tons. Value. Year ending. Tona. Value. In June 30 1886 18, 000 32, 000 29,349 43, 857 $1, 165, 107 1,516.766 In June 30, 1800 48, 889 48, 513 41,118 63, 505 $1, 820, 088 1887 1891 1, 902, 689 1888 1892 1,820,143 1893 2, 008, 884 It will thus be seen by these figures that the duty is practically, a revenue duty. These importations are chiefly from K'orwayj'^weden, Austria, and Canada. Mechanical wood-pulp fiber is produced by grinding, which requires heavy and expensive machinery and large water power. Chemical fiber is produced by the use of chemicals and steam, and also involves an extensive and still more costly plants. In either iiroduct, an outlay for mill and machinery of from $15,000 to $20,000 for each ton of the daily product of a mill is required, according to the permanency of the machinery and structures. The production and use of mechanical wood-pulp began about 1808. The manufacture and use of chemical wood-pulp fiber began at an earlier date, but was confined to one or two mills in Pennsylvania, until its manufacture and use became more general between the years 1870 and the present time. 1047 1048 PULP, PAPER, AND BOOKS. Both of these processes were subject to patents, all of which have now expired. The introduction and use of these fibers were slow and difficult, there being a great prejudice among paper manufacturers against adopting them, and among paper consumers against using paper made from wood fiber. After a trial had been made, and preju- dice removed, the manufacture and consumption increased rapidly until it has now reached the enormous daily production and consumption of about 3,100 tons. The pulp mills are located in twenty-nine difi'erent States, and em- ploy capital to the amount of at least $60,000,000, as shown by the fol- lowing table : Total daily product of wood pulp in the United States: State. California Colorado Connecticut Delaware Georgia .-. lUinbis Indiana Kentucky Maine Michigan Minnesota Maryland Massachuaetts . . . New Hampsliire . New Jersey Mechani- cal. Tons. 10 12 6i lOi 694 10 316 10 13 60J3 lS2i Chemi- cal. Tons. 20 4 6 25 35 10 298 14 state. Michigan New York North Carolina. Ohio Oregon Ponnaylvania . . South Carolina . Tennessee Vermont Virginia WaaJiiiigton West Tlrginia . Wisconsin Mechani- cal. Tons. 2 871i 20 25 37i 2 144^ 29 236 Chemi- cal. Tom. 20 171 10 125 S 12 20 15 30 The yearly production of wood pulp fiber. Tons. Value. 608, 000 345, 000 $15, 300, 000 17, 919, 000 Total 953, 000 33, 219, 000 Cost of lahor to produce the same $23,253,300 Chemicals (dutiable), lime, interest on plant, insurance, taxes, wood on the stump 9,965,700 Total yalne of yearly product 33,219,000 The number of m^n employed and cost of labor embraces the cut- ting, hauling, and preparation of the wood, as well as the men employed in the various establishments. In the United States no women or boys are employed. The wood pulp industry employs fully 67,000 men in this country, affording support to over 335,000 persons. Competition has reduced the price of chemical wood fiber from 7 cents per pound in 1870 to 23 cents, and ground wood fiber from 4J cents in 1870 to IJ cents, now the selling price delivered at the mills. The raw material used in the production of this fiber is wood, and its value in the forest, or in the stump, so called, is small, estimated from 75 cents to f 1 per cord, which is not more than 5 per cent of the total cost of the pulp. There are few, if any, manufactured products in tMs country, the cost of which is so largely made up of labor as wood-piilp fiber. WOOD PULP. 1049 The cutting and transportation of tlie wood to the mill, its prepara- tion at the mill and the skilled labor employed in its manufacture, con- stitute fully 70 per cent of its value, or a much larger per cent, if you follow the labor cost into coal and other materials entering into its manufacture, the balance representing imported chemicals, lime (a native product), the interest of the money invested in the plant, in- surance, taxes, repairs, etc. We wish here to especially call your attention to a very important fact connected with the manufacture of wood-pulp fiber in this country, which is, that some of the principal woods (poplar and cotton woods) used in its manufacture are of very little value for other purposes, being of too inferior a growth to be considered even of value for fuel. They grow profusely in every State in the Union, and have a very rapid growth, reaching their maturity in a few years, then going to decay unless used. Therefore to encourage the transfer of this large and growing in- dustry to Norway, Sweden, Austria, and Canada, where they have cheap labor, cheap wood, and water power, not only deprives our people of a large capital investment, a large number of laborers of employment^ but our farmers and landowners of a ready market for their inferior woods. Wood pulp is manufactured extensively in Norway, Sweden, Finland, Germany, Austria-Hungary, and Canada, countries having cheap wood and water power, cheap chemicals, and cheap labor. At j)resent the in- dustry of the United States is most affected by competition with these countries. Canada has extensive forests, abundant water power, and cheaper labor than our own, and, lying along our border, will absorb this indus- try if the tariff is reduced, ^ Norway and Sweden have also special advantages. Labor is very cheap — ^about one- third our own; inexhaustible water powers and for- ests ; easy and cheap communications with the shipping ports, such as Christiania and Gothenberg, whence low freights are obtained to Ameri- can ports. Finland, with its numerous lakes, its extensive forests, its labor — cheaper far than in Sweden and Norway — and its low water freights to this country, either direct or by way of London or Hull, will become another formidable competitor. Wood delivered at the mill in Finland costs from $1.90 to $2 per cord; in Sweden and Norway, form $2.90 to $3; in the United States, from $5 to $9. The chemicals used in the manufacture of chemical fiber are cheaper in these countries, having free admission into Norway and Sweden. In Finland the labor employed in pulp mills costs from 25 to 30 cents per day. In pulp mills in Norway and Sweden the men are paid from 30 to 50 cents per day. A large number of women are also employed at from about 12 to 20 cents per day. In the United States no women are employed. 1050 PULP, PAPER, AND BOOKS. Comparative exhibit of wages paid to lielp in clieuiical j)ulp mills in the United States, Germany, and Austria : TJnited States. Germany. Austria. Foreinan in di^ebtor room.. Foreman in acid room Foreman in maoliiuo room . Foreman in wood room Cookers Acid malsers Wood-roora help Repair raon iMacbinists Pipers Carpenters Millwright Brick masons Lead burners Blacksmitlis Common labor Common labor yard Women Children $3.00 2.00 3.00 2.75 2.50 1.50 1.50 2.50 3.00 2.50 3.00 4.00 4.00 5.00 a. 60 1.40 1.40 $1.00 1.00 .83 1.00 .75 .60 .50 .75 .88 .82 .75 1.00 .88 1.25 .75 .67 .50 .25 •13 .62 .60 .72 .42 .38 .32 .43 .56 .46 .51 .77 .56 1.26 .64 .33 .31 .23 .13 For Austria the average figures for three of the largest mills were taken. In making the comparisons, we have taken the actual help em- ployed in a large mill in the United States, and equal amount of help at the prices paid for help in Germany and Austria. The result shows the cost of a ton of pulp for labor employed in making the pulp in the United States (exclusive of the cost of labor of cutting and hauling the wood) to be $13.27 per ton, and in Germany $1.49 per ton, and in Aus- tria $$2.83 per ton, a difference of $8.78 per ton as against Germany and $10.44 per ton as against Austria, which shows that the duty of $G per ton does not compensate for the difference in the price of labor. A corresponding difference in labor exists in the manufacture of ground-wood pulp. In view of the fact that wood-pulp fiber has become so important an industry in so many States in the Union, so recently established, engaging such a large capital, employing such a large number of adult laborers at such remunerative wages, and consuming so much wood of so little value for other pur]3oses, the wood-pulp interest respectfully request that the present duty be maintained. A. G. Paine, Eepreseiiting the Wood-pulp, Chemical Fiber, and Wood-paper Interests. PAPER. (Paragraph 419.) Eepresentative Speret. Mr. H. E. OofSn was before the committee last week, and has forwarded his statement in writing. He is interested in the manufacture of tissue paper, and has been since the McKinley- tarifif act went into effect. He has enlarged his plant. He is interested in tariff Schedule M, 419, Tissue paper. I will state on behalf of Mr. Coffln that on the faith of this schedule he has enlarged his plant, and is making a considerable quantity of paper. He desires that the tariff should remain as it is. It is now not very heavy. He has a fraction of the trade. He has attached to his PAPEE. 1051 paper a statement from tlie Bureau of Statistics showing tKat we im- ported last year 1,091,982 pounds, valued at $185,313, whicli is a large percentage of the total amount consumed. Windsor Locks, Conn., September 19, 1893. Dear Sie: "We submit the following statement regtarding present tariff laws, Schedule M, and so much of paragraph 419 as follows : Paper known commercially as copying paper, filtering paper, silver paper, and all tissue paper, white or colored, made up in copying books, reams, or in any other form, at 8 cents per pound, and in addition thereto 15 per centum ad valorem. The imports for consumption of paper under this clause for the year ending June 30, 1893, as per letter herewith annexed, just received from Worthington 0. Ford, Chief Bureau of Statistics, Treasury Department, amounted to as follows: Pounds, 1,091,982: value, $185,313 ; duties paid, $115,156. It is the belief of ourselves and the other paper manufacturers we represent that the 500 tons of paper imported as stated above embraces about one-half of all the paper consumed in this country, of the kinds referred to in above paragraph 419. The remaining half, or 500 tons, that is made in this country, is nearly if not fully equal, we believe, in quality to the foreign manufactured paper. All the above paper enumerated in Schedule M, paragraph 419, of which there has been made the -past year, iu this country, we estimate to be 500 tons^ none of this paper was made in this country i^revious to October, 1890, owing to the prevailing low ad valorem duty of 25 per cent previous to October, 1890. Owing to the competition among the paper manufacturers of this country, the present market prices of these papers, made by us, have been reduced at the present time nearly to the prices formerly paid for foreign papers previous to October, 1890. These papers enumerated in paragraph 419 are largely used for special purposes by domestic manufacturers, many of whom are unwilling to change to domestic- made goods. There seems to be no reason for this, except a dislike to change from a settled habit or from a prejudice to home-made paper, and they are willing to pay more for the paper of the foreign make than for the same quality of homemade goods, although others use for the same purpose the domestic paper to their entire satisfaction; therefore the consumption of foreign papers under this paragraph 419 is a matter of luxury and not of necessity. We pray you not to make any change in the duties collected under paragraph 419, for as a matter of revenue you are justified to let them remain unchanged. Under the tariff law in effect previous to October, 1890, the duty levied was, we believe, 25 per cent ad valorem on the same papers, which were classified with writing papers and a number of other papers; according to foregoing estimate that half of these papers consumed in this country are of foreign manufacture, we would say supposing that all these papers were made abroad and twice the quantity thus imported for the year ending June 30, 1893, the amount of duty collected on these papers at 25 per cent ad valorem would amount to $92,656, which is $23,500 less than the amount actually collected, as per annexed let- ter from Bureau of Statistics, upon half of the quantity of this paper. It is believed by us that nine-tenths of the paper enumerated in paragraph 419 is nearly, if not quite all, substantially the same value per pound; therefore the specific daty of eight cents per pound is fair and equitable upon all these papers as a class. 1052 PULP, PAPEK, AND BOOKS. We submit that we have been to a great expense in putting in new machinery into our paper mills to make the special papers since Octo- ber, 1890. The raw material used in making these papers, such as linen, threads and other linen stock, is admitted free of duty under the present tariff, and nearly all this stock used by domestic manufacturers is imported from Europe at the present time. That we labor under further disadvantages, in that the foreign papers manufactures are able to secure from the linen and flax mills of Europe by their long business relations their selection in their supply of their raw material, and we are obliged to take what we are able to get through the paper- stock importers of this country, yet we have up to this date succeeded in supplying one-half of all the paper used in this country of the kinds enumerated in paragraph 419 by the different consumers of these papers, in face of their natural disinclination to change from the for- eign only as we are able to convince them that the quality of our papers are practically as good and the prices are less than papers of foreign manufacture. The paper industry of this country, in our lines of manufacture, to- day is very much depressed, and two mills that have made these papers in competition with ourselves have become bankrupt, and are in the hands of the receiver. The prices at present we are getting for these papers are very close to cost, owing to high wages we are paying our workmen, and the item of labor being such a large factor of the special kinds of paper enumerated under paragraph 419 — and should you re- duce the present duty on foreign paper, we fear tlie result would be dis astrous to the paper industry and workmen employed therein in this country, as represented by ourselves, therefore we humbly pray you to allow the present duty under paragraph 419 to remain unchanged. EespectfuUy submitted. Herbert E. Coffin, (Of the firm of C. H. Dexter & Sons, Windsor Locks, Conn., who also represents, by request, the Diamond Mills Paper Company, office 44 Murray street, New York; the Jersey City Paper Company, Jersey City, ^. J. ; the Smith Paper Company, Lee, Mass. ; all paper manufac- turers of the special grade enumerated in Schedule M, paragraph 419, in the present tarift" bUl now in force.) Septemper 19, 1893. Dear Sir: In reply to your request I have to inform you that the imports for consumption during the year ending June 30, 1893, of papers -were as follows : Papers known commercially as copying paper, filtering paper, silver paper, and all tissue paper, white or colored, made up in copying books, reams, or in any other form: pounds, 1,091,982; value, $185,313; duty, $115,156. EespectfuUy yours, WOETHINGTON C. FORD, Chief of Bureau. Mr. H. E. Coffin, Windsor Lodes, Conn. LEAF METAL COATED PAPERS — PAPEK. 1053 LEAF METAIi COATED PAPERS. (Paragraph 120.) BALTIMORE, September 13, 1893. SiU: The undersigned respectfully submits that he is engaged in the manufacture of paper boxes and sundry articles made from paper of all kinds. Among the articles used in the manufacture of our goods we import largely of "leaf metal coated papers" subject to a duty of 35 per cent ad valorem as "surface coated paper." (See Schedule M, paragraiDh 420.) My object in calling the attention of your honorable committee to this article is to simply point out the facts that : First. This paper has never been made in this country, indeed never has there been an attempt to make it so far as I know, and in all likeli- hood it will not be made in the near future, if ever. It is now made in only one country, Germany. Second. Most goods that are made of this article on the other side are admitted subject to a duty of only 35 per cent as manufactures of paper. (Schedule M, paragraph 425.) Hence a discrimination of 10 per cent against the American manufacturer. Your subscriber respectfully asks that your honorable committee consider the advisability of ad- mitting "leaf metal coated papers" free of duty, or if this can not be done to place the Americaa manufacturer on an equal footing with the foreign producer of articles made from this product. I submit some samples of the paper and goods manufactured therefrom and shall be glad to answer such questions as your honorable committee may deem proper to ask in elucidation of what is here set forth. KespectfuUy submitted. GrEOKGE FeANKE. PAPER. (Paragraph 420.) New Yoek, Septemher 31, 1893. SiE ; We beg to call your attention as briefly as possible to the ques- tion of the present ad valorem duty imposed on lithographic produc- tions, to the diflficulty experienced in ascertaining the market value of the goods abroad, to the constant undervaluation by the importers which consequently results in a practical reduction of the duty, and to the advisability of changing the method of collecting the duty from ad valorem to specific, and, incidentally, to the importance of the litho- graphic industry as at present conducted in the United States. THE LITHOGEAPHIO INDTJSTEV IN THE UNITED STATES. No accurate statistics of the lithographic industry in the Uuited States exist, as far as we are aware, but the statistics of the National Lithographic Association ( which embraces sixty-six firms in twenty- two cities of the Union) show that the various members of that associa- tion gave employment in the year 1891-'92 to 5,903 hands, and had a capital invested in their business of $7,806,500. It is a fair assumption 1054 PULP, PAPER, AND BOOKS. that the association in question does not include more than 33J per cent of the lithographic industry, many of the largest establishments in New York city, and hundreds of smaller firms throughout the Union not being members of the asssociatiou, therefore it may be assumed that the capital invested amovints to nearly $24,000,000, and the number of hands employed to 18,000. While this is simply an esti mate, we are convinced that it is not far out of the way. The American Lithographic Company alone gives employment to 2,065 hands, has an invested capital of |3, 600, 000, and paid for labor during the year ending June 30, 1893, $1,336,470.92; the percentage of labor to the cost of materials and labor being 42.8 per cent. TARIFF. Paragraph Eo. 420 of the tariff law of 1890 provides as follows: Papers known commercially as surface-coated papers, and manufactures thereof, cardboards, lithographic prints from either stone or zinc, bound or unbound (except illustrations when forming a part of a periodical, newspaper, or in printed books accompanying the same), and all articles produced either iu whole or in part by lithographic process, and photograph, autograph, and scrap albums, wholly or par- tially manufactured, thirty-five per centum ad valorem. It will be noticed that lithographic prints are grouped with " surface- coated papers, and manufactures thereof, cardboards, photograph, autograph, and scrap albums," all of which are subject to a duty of 35 l)er cent ad valorem, with the exception of "lithographic illustrations when forming a part of a j)eriodical, newspaper, or in printed books accompanying the same," which articles are covered by paragraph No. 423 and are subject to a duty of 25 per cent ad valorem. Here it may be mentioned that "surface- coated papers, and manu- factures thereof," and "cardboards," while of themselves not raw materials, are part of the raw material used in lithography, and it seems hardly scientific to impose the same duty on both the raw mate- rials and the finished product; while "photograph, autograph, and scrap albums" have no possible connection with lithography, except that sometimes lithographic printing is a component part of photograph, or ^ autograph albums, forming, however, bnt a small part of their cost, while lithography has no possible connection with scrap albums. The lithographic industry would be fairly, satisfied with the duty of 35 per cent ad valorem, providing it could be equitably and honestly collected, although the differences which exist in the cost of materials, and, more particularly, in the wages paid to employes m Europe and in the United States, would warrant a much higher rate. From a pamphlet entitled, "Statistics of Labor of German Trades Unions for the Year 1891, Compiled from Statements by Labor and Local Unions, by Albert Pioch and Carl Schumacher, Members of the Central Com- mittee, Berlin, 1892," and from other sources, we find the following to be the average current rate of wages paid to lithographic artisans in the cities of Bautzen, Berlin, Crefeld, Dresden, Dusseldorf, Frank- fort, Halle, Leipzig, and Neu-Kuppin : Crayon .irtiats Transforrers Plovers Printers Peeders Poys and apprentices - Forcm.'in Weekly wages. $8.12 7.00 7.00 5.25 2.^7 1.12 16.75 Hours per week. 67 to CO 60 60 60 60 CU 60 PAPER. 1055 The average wages paid in Kew York City to similar employes are as follows : Weekly wages. Hours per week. Crayon artists $28. 00 28. 00 20.00 25.02 9.00 6.00 52.60 47 Printers 53 Feeders 53 Boys and apprentices 53 Poremen 53 Average of the foregoing tables. New York City. Crayon artists Transferers Provers Printers Feeders Hoys and apprentices Foremen Average $28. 00 28.00 28.00 25.62 9.00 a. 00 52.60 175. 22 25.01 Averaging these seven classes, as per above table, we find that the average weekly wages paid in New York is $25.01 against an average weekly wage paid in Germany of $6.80, so that, roughly speaking, the rate of wages paid to lithographic artisans in Germany is one-quarter of that paid in Kew York City (the rate of wages throughout the United States is, with trifling exceptions, the same as that paid in New York), in addition to which the hours of labor in Germany exceed those of the United States by nearly 12 -per cent. Similar disparities exist in many other items which go to make up the cost of production, such as rents, insiirance, paper, lithographic stones, inks, Dutch metal, chemicals, etc., all of which cost more in the United States than in Germany. For instance, take the item of Dutch metal, or gold leaf, as it is sometimes called. The European market price of this article is $1.17J per pack of 2,500 leaves, size 3§ by 3^ inches. The American market price of the same article is $3.65 per pack. It requires 2,300 leaves to gild 1,000 inside cigar labels, which, at the European market price of $1.08 plus 35 per cent duty on the metal on the finished lithograph, would be $1.46 against a cost of $3.36 for the metal bought in this market by the domestic manufacturer. (The present duty on Dutch metal is 8 cents per pack of 100 leaves, equivalent to an ad valorem duty of 170 per cent, a rate which is prohibitive so far as lithography is concerned.) It may be added that as far as known by us, Dutch metal is not manufactured iu this country. Anyone who has had any dealings with the custom-house must be aware how difficult it is to obtain information regarding importations, the customs authorities refusing to give information unless a definite case is presented to them, so that we are not at present able to give as many instances of the undervaluation of lithographic goods as we would wish, nor is it easy for the American manufacturer to ascertain what the market value of the goods is abroad, as no open market exists, 1056 PULP, PAPER, AND BOOKS. lithographic goods being almost invariably consigned to an agent or branch firm in the United States. In the case of lithographed cigar labels we have, however, been able to arrive at- a very good idea of what the market value would be in Germany, and in repeated instances have succeeded in having the sworn invoices increased in value. The goods imported, for instance, by Gebruder Klingenberg, of Detmold, have always been grossly under- valued, and although the custom-house authorities have added to the cost of production (as sworn to by a member of the firm of Klin- genberg) at first 8 per cent, then 18 per cent, subsequently 28 per cent, and at last 38 per cent, to the declared cost of production (see letter of Consular Agent George H. Murphy, Exhibit No. 1), the goods are still imported and invoiced to their agents, Messrs. Bckmeyer & Co., of INew York City, at from one-third to one-half of a fair foreign market value. As an illustration, on their original invoice of May 24, 1893 (see copy annexed. Exhibit Ko. 2), they gave the cost price of the inside label, " August Belmont," as 18.38 marks, say $4.59|, and of "August Belmont " outside label as 8.14 marks, say $2.03J,* or a total of 26,52 marks, or $6.63. This valuation was raised by the custom-house authorities on the inside "August Belmont" label to 28.38 marks ($7.09J) and on the "August Belmont" outside label to 11 marks ($2,75), or a total of 39.38 marks, equivalent to $9.84J, or 38 per cent added in all to the declared cost of production (see corrected invoice. Exhibit 1^0. 3) for 1,000 sets inside and outside labels, while the goods in question weresold to their customer in New York at $31 ^er 1,000 sets. Can anyone believe that there is any such profit as this in manu- facturing and selling these goods? $6.63 being the sworn cost of goods made in Germany and sold here for $31, nearly 468 per cent, or taking the raised value of $9.84J sold at $31, it still shows the fabulous profit of 315 per cent, less, of course, the duty of 35 per cent paid on the raised value of $9.84|. Apparently the Messrs. Klingenberg have succeeded in convincing the consular agent at Hanover that there is this immense profit in the lithographic business, for in his letter of June 15 (Exhibit No, 1, re- ferred to above), he writes as follows : Under the law as it stands, I am convinced that Messrs. Gebruder Klingenberg have done nothing to cast a shadow on their honesty. If it is true that there is an immense profit in this, consignment business, the fault— as I pointed out in a recent report which was forwarded to the Department of State, as an inclosure in his dis- patch on the subject, by the consul-general in Frankfort — lies not in the dishonesty of the shipper, but in the provision of the law which causes the duty on consigned wares to be based not on the price paid by the purchaser in America (as with other wares), but upon a foreign market value which, in many cases, does not exist. ^ # # iv « « tt All that remains, therefore, is to decide how much must be added to the cost of production to make Detmold market value. At first 8 per cent was added; the special agent, Montgomery, reported to the honorable the Secretary of the Treasury that 18 per cent should be added to make the fair market value; subsequently it was decided that 28 per cent must be added, and quite recently, I am iniormed, the late appraiser of New York added 10 per cent more, or 38 per cent, to the cost of pro- duction. Another illustration can be found in the label "Eapbael," which ap- pears in the same invoice, originally billed at the same price as the "Belmont," or $6.63 per 1,000 sets, which was raised by the custom- house to $9.85, and sold to their customer in this market on an order for 25,000 sets of a duplicate edition at $22 per 1,000 sets in and out- side labels. PAPER. 1057 Kote here that the Messrs. Klingeuberg invoiced a first edition oi "Belmont" labels on a small order of 10,000 sets, which necessarily included the cost of drawing, at the same prioe that they invoiced a duplicate edition of 25,000 sets of "Eaphael" labels, ou which, ol course, no cost of drawing had been incurred. For a third illustration take the label "La Francesca" (see copy oi invoice, Exhibit No. 4), which is of the same qnality, workmanship, and number of colors as the two labels above quoted, invoiced by the Messrs. Klingenberg at $6.93 per 1,000 sets inside and outside labels, which was raised by the custom-house to $9.21f per 1,000 sets on an order for 10,000 sets, and compare this with the "Eaphael" and "August Belmont" labels, which, although varying in the proportion of two to iive in the size of the edition, are invoiced at the same cost, whereas "La Francesca," which is of the same style and quality of work and was printed in an edition of the same size as the "Bel- mont," was originally invoiced at a higher valuation than the "Bel- mont," but was only raised by the custom-house to $9.21|, whereas the "Belmont" label was raised to $9.81J. We can further prove that our claim of under valuation is correct by an imjjortatiou of labels, "Chariot design," made by Schumacher & Ettlinger, of this city, the labels in question having been bought by the Messrs. Jacques Van Houten & Co., of Eotterdam, Holland, from the firm of Herman Scliott of Eheydt, Germany, and shipped by the former to Schumacher & Ettlinger (see copy of invoice. Exhibit 5), which shows the market value in Europe of the " Chariot" label to be $22.50 per thousand, which label is of the same size, number of colors and style of work as the "Mountain Eose" label, which was invoiced by Klingenberg at $9.02 (see copy of invoice annexed. Exhibit No. 4), the "Mountain Eose" label moreover being a trade-mark design, restricted to the use of one manufacturer, while the "Chariot" label, imported by Schumacher & Ettlinger from Messrs. Jacques Van Houten & Co., is a stock design sold to every one; therefore, the "Mountain Eose " must necessarily have cost much more to produce than the "Chariot," ou account of the larger edition, which could necessarily be sold of the "Chariot." Samples and price lists of Messrs. Klingenberg, Wiegand & Prank, Prescher, and Herman Schott, can be produced, showing the prices at which they sell labels in this country; they also show that the average price obtained in New York for a label like "Eaphael" or " La Fran- cesca" is $45 -pev 1,000 insides, less a trade discount of about one-third, net $30, while their sworn invoice, as raised by the custom- house, shows a valuation of only $7.10 per 1,000. Many other instances could be adduced, but we think the foregoing conclusively proves the fact of the systematic undervaluation of this class of lithographic products, and there is no doubt but that all litho- graphic products are similarly undervalued. In many lithographic products the cost of designing and the placing the design on stone, preparatory to printing (making the plates), forms a large part of the first cost, hence a second edition can always be pro- duced much more cheaply than the first. The appraiser can not tell which is the first and which is the second edition, neither can he tell how large a sheet was printed, or how many sheets constituted the edition; in fact, he has no facts to guide him in arriving at the cost or the market value of the goods abroad; how, then, can an ad valorem duty be efficiently collected? We assert, without fear of successful coutradiction, that no invoice of X H 6Z 1058 PULP, PAPER, AND BOOKS. cluclfd t K^p'^^^^^^^^^^^^^ *^^* *"^ ^^.''^^ ^'^^'•^^'^^•i '^^^ a flr«t edition and in- oml e it rfn hi i 'designing and drawing on stone, or that it was a sec ond edition, has ever been presented at tlie New York custom-house. THE REMEDY. In our opinion the remedy consists— u l^''/^ placing lithographic products in a class by themselves, putting ^^surface-coated papers" and "cardboards" in a separate class and erl b 1 ^i '^'^*°§™Pl'> and scrap albums" wherever they may prop- (2) By imposing a specific duty on lithographic products instead of the present ad valorem duty. Doubtless there are difficulties attending the levying of a specific duty, but these difliculties are no greater than those existing at pres- ent, when goods under an ad valorem duty sold at $31 per 3,000, and goods sold at $22 per 1,000 are invoiced at one and the same price (see invoice of " Belmont" and " Eaphael" labels. Exhibit No. 2), while conditions exist m the manufacture which make the cost of production mucb larger on one than on the other, the small order of 10,000 sets of Belmont" labels, which was a first edition and included the cost of drawing, being invoiced at the same rate as the large order of 25 000 sets of a second edition of " Eaphael," where no drawing had to be in- cluded. To arrive at a basis for a specific duty we give the lowest possible market valuation of four classes of labels and cigar brands, represent- ing the principal, or, say, 90 per cent of the principal importation of these goods; deducting from that market valuation the largest possible dis- counts which may be reserved for agents and commissions, say 25 per cent, taking the average weight of 1,000 labels, on such stock as would be of sufBcient thickness to produce the work to be 10 pounds, a duty of 60 cents per pound on the average valuation of four different quali- ties would be lower than the present duty of 35 per cent ad valorem, as illustrated by the following table: Table showing European market price of free designs sold to everybody : PerM. PerM. Le.ss— Weight of one thousand inside. Specific duty per pound. Inside label. 25 per cent com- valorein 35 per cent ad voralem. 12 colors and gold leaf, emboa.iod Mark. 100 80 60 *3; $25. 00 20. 00 15.00 .871 $18.75 15.00 11.25 .OoJ $6. 66 5.25 3.93 .23 Toitnds. 10 10 10 i ■to.esfj • 52ji 12 colors, not embossed Bands: Bronze (3 marks) } .39J„ .92 Gold leaf {4 marks)., i 2.49g Average . 02^5 * Average. We base the above calculations on the market price in Europe on such as are free selling designs; that is to say, prints that are sold to everybody from stock, and not such designs as represent trade-marks expressly made for one manufacturer, which necessarily command a PAPER. 1069 higher price on account of the smaller edition printed and sold and from their being restricted to one purchaser. The thickness of paper on which we base the above calculations is known to the trade as six points (0.006 of an inch), and to be fair toward foreign manufacturers we would propose to tax tbe thickness above six points with only as much as tbe present duty on the paper alone would amount to, which is as follows : A paper of the size 20 by 24, gauging six i^oints, weighs 94 i)ounds to the 1,000 sheets, a paper of seven points thickness weighs 114 pounds to the 1,000 sheets, therefore, one point on 1,000 sheets of 20 by 24, or 480,000 square inches, would represent 20 pounds of paper, which at the European value of 15 cents i^er pound would amount to $3 for 20 pounds, which at a duty of 35 per cent ad valorem would amount to $1.05. Each additional point of tliickness or fraction thereof above six points would therefore pay 2J cents for 10,000 square inches, or on 480,000 square inches, $1.08. While these remarks and calculations more particularly refer to lith- ographed cigar labels, the principle is applicable to all lithographic productions, and should be applied to all, excepting lithographic "illus- trations when forming a part of a periodical, newspaper, or in printed books accompanying the same," on which no change in the rate of duty or the method of collecting it is suggested. Should your committee conclude that it is not advisable to change the method of collecting the duty as suggested above, from ad valorem to specific, we would then respectfully urge that the committee advise that the duty on consigned wares be based on the price paid by the purchaser in America, and not upon a foreign market value, which, to quote from a letter of Consul general Murphy, of Detmold, dated June 15th (Exhibit No. 1) "does not exist." To substantiate the statements herein made, we would be pleased at any time to submit original or certified copies of the invoices referred to, samples of the various labels referred to, and other lithographic productions, and any further information which may be desired, Trusting that the statements herein made will receive the careful consideration of the committee, we remain. Very respectfully, yours, American Lithogeaphio Company, By G. W. Donaldson, Second Vice-President, PAPER. (Paragraphs 421 and 425.) Thursday, September 7, 1893. STATEMENT OF MR. W. B. JOHNSON FOK G. B. HURD & CO., OF NEW YORK. Mr. Chairman: I wish to speak in regard to the manufacture of paper, referring to note paper, envelopes, cut cards, and such. Now it is contended that a specific duty on envelopes as imposed by the customs tariff of 1890 was not equitable, because envelopes which cost 50 cents per thousand were taxed 25 cents per thousand, while the same tax of 25 cents per thousand was imposed on envelopes which were valued at $10 or over per thousand, consequently the tax of 25 cents per thousand 1060 PULP, PAPER, AND BOOKS. on envelopes which represented a cost of $10 per thonsand was absolutely nothing. Now as to the manufactures of writing paper, that is writing paper from flat sheets— it comes in large sheets 21 by 33 and numerous other sizes. The manufactures of writing paper were taxed ad valorem, but the tax was inequitable becaiise no classification of the products of such manufacture was made. That is to say, envelopes, which were taxed very low, cut paper, cut cards, and all that sort of thing were taxed just exactly the same as the unmanufactured product and not considered as far as the manufacture of stationery was con- cerned. Now there are two or three things here which suggest themselves. The duty suggested on writing paper in the flat, that is writing paper which comes in large sheets, that is suggested on this proposed revision or proposal for revision, is just exactly the same as that which was sug- gested in the present tariff, the Mills bill, and the prior bill — that is a duty of 25 per cent ad valorem upon the flat papers. The manufac- tures of papers are products of labor requiring qualified workmen and women in each department, the M^ages of such employes representing a large percentage of the value of the finished product. Now the tax on the manufacture of writing paper into envelopes, note and other sizes should be higher than on the flat sheet, because another j)rocess of manufacture has been involved which requires the employment of an increased amount of labor. The work in manufacturing writing paper into embossed and black bordered paper, that is the paper which is commonly used for mourn iug imrposes, or embossed paper for crests, monograms, and heraldic designs, is an art. That is all done by hand and it requires skilled workwomen who get large wages, and it entails still more extra labor and is another process of manufacture and should be taxed still higher than either of the products above mentioned. That is, this paper or plain envelopes and paper is made without any embossing or designs or black border (which is an art and which requires skilled hands to perform that part of the labor). Now, the point is, that this industry has not heretofore been considered at all; that is to say, it has not been considered over and above the man- ufactures of flat papers. These manufacturers do not produce any paper, they manufacture the paper after it has been produced and is sent to them in sheets, and the duty iipon that as I said is 25 per cent ad valorem, and there is no increase of duty upon the manufactured products of these manufacturers. Mr. Hopkins. Then your idea is the duty should be increased in pro- portion to the skill and labor put on these papers"? be enabled to enter into a fair competition with outsiders, with foreign- Mr. Johnson. That is exactly what I mean— in order that we should ers. Mr. Dalzell. Is very much of that done abroad? Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir. Until three years ago all the stationery used in the House of Eepresentatives and Senate of the United States was imported paper. That was Marcus Ward's imported paper, who send their stationery right straight along. That is the good quality of sta- tionery, not the cheap quality. For that matter we manufacture Mar- cus Ward's paper into envelopes here ourselves, and in doing that we have to compete against Marcus Ward's people on the other side, who manufacture the paper and send over their manufactures. We are per- fectly willing to enter into a fair comi)etition, whether in this country or in Europe, but we want to have a fnir fighting chance with them. Now, our proposition is this: Paper, writing, in flat sheets, unruled and uu- PAPER. 1061 printed, 25 jDer cent ad valorem, which is what it has been in all bills that have been established or proposed. Mr. Hopkins. And is now 1 Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir. That does not affect us, because we do not make it; we get it in the flat. Now, for paper, writing, manufactured into envelopes, note, letter, and other sizes, for correspondence and other purposes, 35 per cent ad valorem. We think that would be a fair duty. Mr. BuEKOWS. What is it now? Mr. Johnson. It is exactly the same as the flat paper ; it has not been recognized at all. Then for paper, writing, manufactured, and black- bordered, into envelopes, note, letter, and other sizes, for correspond- ence and other purposes, 45 i^er cent ad valorem. That process of manu- facture is in a good many gi-ades, and the cheapest process of black border costs $2 a thousand envelopes, so that much is added to the value of the envelopes over other envelopes of the same quality. Then for black-bordered cards — that is, the ordinary visiting cai'ds — 40 per cent ad valorem, because the i^rocess of manufacture and cutting the card is not so much as making the envelopes and paper, and the 40 per cent duty would be equitable for that. Mr. Dalzell. What you want is a new classification f Mr. Johnson. Yes. There has never been a classification on that class of goods. Mr. Johnson. The next is paper, writing, manufactured into envel- opes, note, letter, and other sizes, for correspondence and other jiurposes, stamped, embossed, illumin ated, printed, lithographed, or decorated from dies, stones, or otherwise, 50 per cent. Mr. Hopkins. You put one duty at 35 and the other at 45 per cent, etc.; I wish you would elaborate your ideas on that and show the com- mittee why you think those two amounts would be equitable and just not only to the manufacturers but to the consumers? Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir; I will do so. The 35 per cent duty will be upon the plain envelopes and paper, no matter what their cost. They would be plain envelopes and paper without any design, either heraldic or otherwise, or any black border. That would represent one process of manufacture. They are finished and they can be black-bordered or not, as we please. If we chose to black-border them, that is another process of manufacture which requires to be performed by hand labor. Our people are hand-labor employ6s. The finest stationery is made by hand. Mr. Dalzell. That has no protection now at all? Mr. Johnson. It is protected just exactly the same as the flat paper; there is no protection in the manufacture of it. Mr. TuENEE. Where is your business ? Mr. Johnson. The business I represent is George B. Hurd and Com- pany, 77 and 79 Beekmau street. New York ; I am interested with them, Mr. TuENEE. You are a member of the firm ? Mr. Johnson. I am interested with them. Mr. TuENER. Have you, been long connected with that establish- ment? Mr. Johnson. Ever since it started, about ten or twelve years ago, Mr. TuENEE. And the business of cutting and preparing this papei has been continued all this time? Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir. Mr. TuENER. And it had been an industry in this country for a great many years more before you went into the business? Now, whal 1062 PULP, PAPER, AND BOOKS. condition has arisen that makes it necessary to impose a duty which has never been imposed before? Mr. Johnson, The point is we consider the tariff should be equitable, arranged to meet Mr. Turner. I am not talking about the question of equity between you and those who manufacture the flat paper, as you call it, but what is there that has changed your situation or your relations to the public that would justify you to ask us to tax them? Mr. Johnson. It is natural that we want to have an opportunity to compete on fair lines with the foreign trade. That is the purpose, of course, of the business. Mr. Turner. But you have been working without any protection in your business all this time ? Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir; but we have not been able to do as much as we could with a little protection — that is to say, the product of the Eng- lish and Scotch houses is more largely used in this country than we think it should be. Mr. Turner. "\?ou have recently without any special duty been able to drive out the English goods from consumption here by Congress? Mr. Johnson. It" is true by making a special effort the Whiting Paper Co., who are represented and Interested as we are, were able to secure the trade of the United States Government; how they did it I do not know. Mr. Hopkins. It was a matter of patriotism more than business? Mr. Johnson. I presume it was a matter of patriotism, from what I understand. Mr. Turner. You are not now actuated by a mere patriotic motive?' Mr, Johnson. Since the United States has already purchased their supplies, I hardly feel patriotic enough to say we are. Mr. Gear. Do the foreigners compete with you largely? Mr. Johnson. Yes, sir ; very largely ; but it is in the very fine grades of paper, which are used by the best people. Mr. Gear. The imports are large? Mr. Johnson. Very large. Mr. Gear. If we give you this increased duty ; if we should so decide, you could increase your trade and keep out the foreigners? Mr. Johnson. We expect to be able to increase our trade in the very highest grades of paper. Mr. Gear. Without an increase of price? Mr. Johnson. Without an increase of price. Mr. Hopkins. This class of paper that you speak of is used largely by people of means, is it not? Mr. Johnson. It is used almost exclusively by people of means, it is the fine quality of paper, but there are many of these people who will not take American paper simply because it is American. They would prefer to have something with a royal crown or some other device stamped upon it. , , . ^ .^ xi, j. Mr. Hopkins. Then this reelassiiication would not afleCt the great mass of the people for whom Mr. Preston appears here? Mr. Johnson. It certainly would aflect the consumers of the high goods, but not the low-class goods. Mr. Tarsney. How would it affect the consumers of the high-class goods? ... ■■ 1 Mr. Johnson. It would affect us more than them in making us able to supply them with the paper they need, and prices would not be any greater. PAPEE. 106 Mr. Tarsney. You said it would affect tlie consumer? Mr. Johnson. Tlie question was asked wlietlier it would affect th consumer of cheap goods, the poorer class that Mr. Preston repn sented, and I said I did not think it would, because they did not us the paper and will not use it anyway. Mr. Tarsney. You say it would affect the consumers of thehigl class paper 1 Mr. Johnson. Not in the price of the paper, but it would in the us of it. They would use more of it, I think. We make just as gooi paper here. I would say the flat paper manufactured by Crane, wh makes paper for the bank-note companies and the Government of th United States, and for whom we are agents in New York, manufactur just as good paper as Marciis Ward and Company, or any other perso: in the world, I do not care who they are. The paper is flrst-class paper i; every particular, and the only difference between them is not that the; are not as high quality, but in the mere fact that that paper is markei with a British crown or marked "Royal linen, Marcus Ward and Com pany." It is not because it is any better paper, as we can show just ai good paper as they can produce anywhere, I do not care who they are The tariff imposed at present upon envelopes by the McKiuley bill o 25 cents per thousand and that suggested by the Mills bill of 20 pe cent ad valorem is an unjust discrimination against products whicl have undergone one or more processes of manufacture from the natura flat paper from which such envelopes are made, which is taxed 25 pe cent ad valorem. The wages of the skilled female labor employed ii the high grades of envelopes and black-bordering envelopes and uot^ and other paper is from $12 to $14 per week. We employ 300 hand in making unruled and unprinted writing papers into note, letter, an( other sizes, and 40 hands on black-bordering. If the duty we pray fo is granted, we think we can increase this force very materially. In thi above force there are about 30 married men and 16 widows. The bal ance are girls obliged to own their own living, ranging in years from 1' to an uncertain age. It is only within six months that another ne\ concern has been started in New York who are figuring to sell foreigi goods manufactured in England of this character very largely on thi basis of the duty that is now imposed. CLASSIFICATION SCHEDULE OF EQUITABLE CUSTOMS DUTIES PROPOSED ON WRITIN( PAPER AND THE MANUFACTURES THEREKUOJI. (1) Paper, writing, in flat sheets, unruled and unprinted, 25 per cent ad valorem (2) Paper, writing, manufactured into envelopes, note, letter, and other sizes, fo correspondence and other purposes, 35 per cent ad valorem. (3) Paper, writing, manufactured and black-bordered into envelopes, note, letter and other sizes, for correspondence and other jjurposes, 45 per cent ad valorem. (4) Cards, black-bordered, 40 per cent ad valorem. (5) Paper, writing, manufactured into envelopes, note, letter, and other sizes, fo cori'cspondence and other purposes, stamped, embossed, illuminated, printed, lithe graphed, or decorated from dies, stones, or otherwise, 50 per cent. State of New York, County of New Yorh, ss.: I, George B. Hurd, being duly sworn, declare that I am a manufacturer of fiui note paper, envelopes, visiting cards, and mourning stationery in the city of Nev York, at 77 and 79 Beekman street. The percentages of labor cost of our products from flat papers have been care fully and actually figured from goods in actual process of daily manufacture. The discrimination against our processes of manufacture under the present tarif has been carefully and actually figured in each case. The discrimin.ation against our products by the difference in wages in the Unite( 1064 PULP, PAPER, AND BOOKS. States and Great Britain has been carefully and actually figured from the schedule presented in the accompanying afBdavit. The schedule snhuiitted on our sample accompanying shows in each case the per- centage of actual discrimination against onr processes of manufacture. Geokge B. Huhd. Sworn to before me this 15th day of September, 1893. [seal.] Eaphael M. Matteson, Notary Public, New Torh County. State of New Yoek, County of New Yorlc, ss.: I, Henry Lamb, being duly sworn, declare that I was formerly employed by Gur- ney & Co., London, England, as a stamper, embosser, and illuminator, and that the following schedule of wages of employes and statement of facts relative to the proc- ess of manufacture and art decoration of unruled and uuprinted flat papers into envelopes, note, letter, and other sizes, suitable for correspondence and other pur- poses, is a true and just statement. That I am now employed in the city of New York, by the firm of George B. Hurd & Co., in the same capacity as I was employed at Guruey & Co.'s, London, England, and that my wages in England were 40 shillings per week, or equivalent to $10 in United States money. They now average, for the same amount of work per week as performed in England, $28 per week. That the schedule of wages for work in the several departments, as per statement below, is a fair comparison of the wages paid in this country and in Great Britain; and that the machinery used in the XJnited States for the same class of work is sim- ilar to and is not capable of turning out more work than that used in Great Britain, and the operatives in any department of George B. Hurd & Co.'s business do not turn out and are not able to turn out any more work than they do in Great Britain. The schedule aforementioned is herewith appended: Oreratives on — Wages Wages paid perj paid per ■week in Great Tveek in the Britain. United States. 'Envelope-machine liands . Color-stamping hands Bronze-staiaping liands .. Envelope paper cutter Black-hordering hands --. Printing hands 16s. = $4. 00 14s. = 3.50 40s. = 10. 00 30s. = 7.60 20s. = 5.00 36s. = 9.00 $8.00 6.50 28.00 14.00 12.00 18.00 Average per week. 6.60 14.40 Henry Lamb. Sworn to before me this IGth day of September, 1893. rsEAL 1 Raphael M. Matteson, ^ Notary Puhlic, New i'orlc County. POSTAGE STAMPS. (Paragrapli 425.) New York, September 8, 1893. Sie: Tou do doubt will be surprised to hear that postage stamps are now subject to a duty of 25 per cent, the last ruling of the Treasury DepartD^eut being that they come in under the heading of printed mat- ter. You no doubt have many friends who are collectors of postage stamps, and it is in behalf of the whole fraternity that I address you- I beg to call your attention to a few points in regard to the matter as follows : (1) That po.stag<' stamps circulnte in many parts of the world as money and are received in the savings banks both in England and in POSTAGE STAMPS. 1065 Belgium, and perhaps in other countries, in the same way in which actual money is received. In England, also, the post-offlces will redeem unused postage stamps, thus addmitting them to be a liability or obli- gation of the Government ; for this reason, stamps should come under the same head as other securities or obligations of other governments and should be free of duty. (2) The tax now imposed of 25 per cent on the actual market value is in no sense a protective one, as it merely works a serious injury to all dealers and to a number of collectors. Besides that, from the nature of the article, being very small in bulk, the difdculty of collecting any duty imposed is evident, as most of the stamps are sent in registered letter to dealers in postage stamps and to collectors. As the dealers are •known as such, the majority of their letters are stopped for the collec- tion of duty, but the number of collectors is so large that we believe that not one letter in a thousand which contains postage stamps is stopped for the collection of any duty. In order to accomplish the col- lection of duty on all stamps imported into the country it would be necessary to inspect every single letter that arrives in the United States from foreign parts, as the collectors include bankers and large merchants in all lines of trade. The newspapers and periodicals which circulate in foreign parts receive payment for a large part of their subscriptions in unused stamps from all parts of the world, and as these are sent in payment instead of money, it would be manifestly unfair to collect any duty on an equivalent for cash. (3) In all parts of the world postage stamps are used as a convenient means of remitting small amounts, and in correspondence with many parts it is almost an absolute necessity that remittances be made in this way, as money orders can not always be obtained and bankers will not draw drafts for small amounts. There is really no good reason why unused postage stamps are more properly dutiable than any other j)rinted matter having a face value printed thereon, and if unused postage stamps are dutiable, it would be as fair to collect duty on the face value of railroad tickets supposing they had been printed in Canada or any other foreign country. I also call your attention that in order to afford us any relief it is necessary to specify " postage stamps " on the free list, as according to past decisions of the Department, they now come under the heading of "Printed matter," and must pay duty as such. There is no possible way by which this could be taken advantage of in any way, shaj»e, or manner to the detriment of the revenue, as all similar articles are already free of duty, such as bank notes, bonds, etc. As you can well imagine, our business is not of sufScient importance to take up much of your time, but if you would like to see me or any one else connected with the business in this city, I would be pleased to call on you any day that you may designate. I feel confident, however, that I only need call your attention to the injustice that is being done our business to convince you that it is to the interest of every one to have postage stamps put on the free list. I make this request in behalf of over a million collectors in this country. Yours, truly, G-. B. Oalman. 1066 ■ PULP, PAPER, AND BOOKS. PUBLICATIOK8. (Paragraph 425.) U. S. Naval Obseeyatoiit, Washingt07i, D. C, Septemher 2, 1893. SiE: In 188G the American Association for the Advancement of fecience, an organization representing the great body of scientific men ot this country, appointed a committee of three to request nongress to remove the duties from scientific books and apparatus. That commit- tee consisted of Prof Cope of the University of Pennsylvania, Prof Forbes of Champaign, 111., and myself With the limited time at my disposal I find it impossible to bring the other members of the committee to Washington, and am, therefore, obliged to act for the committee and to submit their wishes in writing. We earnestly desire to have the articles enumerated in the three fol- lowing items placed upon the free list: (1) Books and pamphlets printed exclusively in languages other than English; also books and music, in raised print, used exclusively bv the blind. -^ -^ (2) All Government publications, publications of learned societies, and all publications givingobservations or results of scientific researches and investigation. (3) All scientific instruments and apparatus for the use of schools and colleges, and the various scientific bureaus of the United States Government. We also request that the duty on other scientific instruments and apparatus be made not greater than 20 per cent. The first of the above items has at our request already become a part of the customs laws. The Government receives very little income from the duties imposed upon the articles enumerated in item 2, but that small amount is paid by scientific students and "investigators, who are freely giving to the world the results of their labors, while as a class they are the least able to pay duties on foreign books that are essential to the proper prosecu- tion of their professional work. Such duties are an onerous tax on scientific progress in this country. Schools and colleges can now import, free of duty, all kinds of instru- ments and apparatus for they own use in instruction ; but by a remark- able feature of the jjresent law the General Government is obliged to pay high duties on all instruments and apparatus imported for the use of the several scientific bureaus in the Executive Departments. This feature of the present law frequently works to the great dis- advantage of the Government. Within six mouths the Naval Observ- atory of this city has been forced by this law into a contract with an American fiim, who have had no experience in that particular line, for the construction of one of the most delicate and important instruments in the whole outfit of the Observatory. A German firm have been building such instruments for many years, but the Government was prohibited from getting a thoroughly satis- factory instrument from this experienced and trustworthy firm because the ample appropriation was not large enough to pay the duty on an imported instrument. It is the boast of some of the American instrument makers, who were concerned in securing the passage of the present law, that they now have the advantage of the Government and will set their own prices. UNFINISHED ALBUMS. 1067 This is but on example of the "working of the present law, but it is easily seen that, for the Government at least, it is an absurd and expen- sive economic blunder. It is earnestly hoped that the articles enumerated in these three items will be placed on the free list in any new legislation. It is believed by our committee that a duty of 20 per cent or less is amply sufflcient for all scientiiic instruments and apparatus not named in the foregoing items. EespectfuUy, I. E. Eastman, Professor of Mathematics, U. 8. Navy, for the Committee. iS UNFINISHED ALBUMS. [Paragraph 425.] Baltimore, September 19, 1893. Sirs: We submit for your consideration the following: Sample ot an album, partially manufactured, made in Berlin, Germany, on whicli duty is assessed at 35 per cent ad valorem (act of 1890) as albums wholly or partially manufactured. We also submit a sample of a fin- ished album, on which the same duty is imposed. Under the old law of 1883 this iTuiinished article was admitted at 15 per cent duty as inanu factures of paper, or of which paper is the component material of chiei value. We import largely of these unfinished parts of albums, and cover same with plush, metal, celluloid, and other materials, all ol domestic manufacture. As we are extensive manufacturers of albums, and to further develop this industry, we think a proper discrimination should be made in the duty between the unfinished portion and the complete album. EespectfuUy, yours, Fr. Bbrgner & Co. SCHEDULE N". SUNDRIES 1069 BBISTLES AND BRUSHES. (Paragraphs 42G, 427.) Sir: We, the tindersigned brush manufacturers and importers oJ bristles, having been advised that a bill numbered 331, introduced bj Mr. Warner on September 0, and referred to your honorable committee, contains the following claiise: "Bristles, free; brushes, 15 per cent ad valorem," respectfully x)etition you to have the present clause, as now in force and contained in the tariff of 1890, retained in the new bill tc be framed by your honorable committee, \s'ithout any change, as fol lows: Paragraph 426, bristles, 10 cents per pound; paragraph 427, brushes and brooms of all kinds, including feather dusters and haii pencils in quills, 40 per cent ad valorem, and for the following reasons By a reduction of the rate of duty on brushes, which was passed ir 1883, and which reduction amounted to 10 per cent ad valorem on th( foreign value, the production of several branches of brush manufacture underwent a steady decline. This was especially the case in the manu facture of hair, tooth, nail, and bath brushes, which, previous to tht enactment of the tariff bill of 1890, had almost ceased to exist in this country and had been replaced by constantly increasing importations from France, Germany, and England. A great many skilled laborers had lost employment and many fac tories which jjroduced these goods were made idle. This decline in the prosperity of an American industry was mostly due to the larger cosi of American labor as compared to that of foreign countries, in w^hich, notwithstanding an equal ability and skill of the workman, the com, pensation for labor rarely, if ever, exceeds one-quarter to one-third ol that paid in the United States. Since the enactment of the tariff of 1890 a very slight betterment oi this condition, shown by a decrease of imports of about 8 per cent, is recorded. This proves that notwithstanding the additional duty of 1( per cent ad valorem on brushes and a reduction of 5 cents per pound on bristles, the comx)ensation thus given to the American manufacturej was hardly sufficient to inspire new activity into this industry. The same conditions in the proportion of American to foreign laboi exist to-day and any reduction of the ad valorem duty on brushes would prove disastrous not only to the branches before mentioned bul also to the manufacture of all other kinds of brushes now produced in the United States. A duty of 15 per cent ad valorem will enable foreign manufacturers to bring their products to our market at prices so much below the cosI of our production that the latter must be either stopped or, if con tinned, can only be carried on by an adequate reduction of the wages now paid for our American labor. The increased cost on imported brushes caused by freights and charges of importation amounts to so small a percentage as to make i1 hardly worthy of consideration. The now existing duty of 10 cents per pound on bristles may b( classified as strictly a duty for revenue only; it does not exceed abou1 1071 1072 SUNDRIES. 3 per cent on the average cost of all grades of brushes manufactured in this country and can not therefore be considered as a heavy tax on the consumer while it is a small protection to another American indus- try; that of dressing and preparing of the bristles produced in our own country. Eespectfully submitted. Bradley & Smith, J. J. Adams & Co., J. M. Martin's Son, And others. BRISTLES. ^ . Under the present tariff there is a duty of 10 cents a pound on bristles. Nearly all bristles used by brushmakers do not grow in the United States, and can not be produced here, as our pork-packers kill their hogs when they are very young and the bristles are too short and soft to be used in paint, varnish, whitewash, hair, cloth, and other staple brushes. Although the United States is a large producer of pork, it is an insignificant producer of bristles useful for staple brushes. Our firm used during the past year many bristles, and of them 95 per cent were imported from Europe and only 5 per cent grown in the United States. Other manufacturers may use somewhat larger i^ercentages of Ameri- can bristles than we do, but all must buy Russian, German, and French bristles, for by far the greater part of their purchases, for the emphatic reason stated previously, that they do not grow in the United States, and circumstances are such that they never will be grown in the United States. Of American bristles about 75 per cent are 2f inches long, gray, or black color, and without stifihess. For all the staple brushes used bj skillful workmen and in everyday life, the brush manufacturer must have bristles measuring from 3 inches to 6 inches long and very largelj white. Eussia and eastern Germany are the only countries in th( world producing such bristles in merchantable quantities. We think it would benefit brush manufacturers and the public t( have bristles put on the free list, and, if so, they should be distinctly named in that classification, so that they can not by any chance b( placed under a dutiable heading, as has been attempted in tariff biUi heretofore proposed. So far as we know, the only houses likely to object to this change an two or three establishments that clean and prepare American bristles who, perhaps, would like to extend their business to include the pre paring of foreign bristles, now done with economy by the brush manu facturers themselves. It is not desirable to make brush manufacturer tributary to bristle dressers ever, and atill less so when the dresser are of a monopolistic tendency. There are no raw bristles imported into this country ; all are partiall manufactured or dressed; all are assorted, tied up straight in bundles packed in cases or casks. Ko brush manufacturer wants to hav bristles come to him in a crude, raw state, as taken from first hands it would make his factory unclean. Every manufacturer in the worl is now educated to receive and work the bristles from the conditio they have been furnished to brush manufacturers for generations, an all would need new additional knowledge to take crude stock and pri pare it, aside from making their factories uninhabitable to the employ^ working at the cleaner, neater work of making brushes.. BRUSHES. 1073 Brush manufacturers do not desire to buy their bristles in an entirely- dressed condition from anyone. We all have our trade secrets, and the manner in which each of us dresses the bristles used in making his brushes is peculiar to himself. To have all bristles thoroughly dressed before being supplied to the brush manufacturers would reduce all of them to a level iu that particular, making several hundred brush manu- facturers pay unnecessary profits to three or four bristle-dressing estab- lishments. If a duty must stay on bristles, it should not on any account be made higher than at present levied now ad valorem. To be made ad valorem would be offering a bounty for undervaluation. The variety of bristles is of great number, quality of each changing almost every year, and we do not know anyone iu either the bristle or brush business who is expert. We believe that we are a representative brush manufacturing estab- lishment, and state these facts with oar views on them, as they may all be topics for consideration, PhiladelpbcTA, September 11, 1893. Sir: We would respectfully urge that horse hair and hog hair be retained on the free list, and that curled hair for mattresses, which is manufactured from these articles, be retained at the present duty (15 per cent). Also that the present tariff pertajning to bristles (10 cents per pound) be so amended as to admit the raw uumanufactured article free, but that the duty on the manufactured article be fixed at 15 cents a pound. We would point out that on account of the present duty being as high on the raw as on the finished bristles they are imported only in the latter state; further, on account of this inequality in the tariff', the manufacturer, workingman, and consumer are placed at a great disad- vantage. Free raw stock, or raw stock with a small specific duty, would pratically transfer the entire manufacture of Eussian bristles from Eussia to America, involving millions of dollars, lessening the cost of the finished product to the consumer, giving employment to the work- ingman, and insuring profit to the manufacturer. We believe these suggestions to be in the line of true tariff reform, which aims, as we take it, to reduce the cost of an article without injuriously affectin g established industries. Respectfully, yours, Petek Woll & Sons. brusiip:s. (Paragraph 427.) Boston, September 16, 1893. SiE : We desire to call your attention to the industry of manufactur- ing brushes, now protected by a duty of 40 per cent, which is, if any- thing, less than the industry should have. We hope that the Ways and Means Committee will not report any reduction from that rate of duty, as the result would be disastrous to brush manufacturers in the United States, and lead to reduction in the wages to employ6s. The duty on brushes prior to 1883 was 35 per cent; it was then changed to- 30 per cent, the result being a large increase in the .quantity of brushes imported and the killing of the manufacture of T H 68 1074 SUNDRIES. toilet, brushes and kindred kinds in the United States, which part 1 i!S m? ^^^*^'y ^^^ "®^®^ ®^°*^ been able to fully recover a foot- hold, ihe mauufacture of toilet brushes here was in a fairly healthy condition up to 1883, when the duty was reduced from 35 per cent to dO per cent, and one town, Lansingburg, N. Y., had many small brush lactones. As soon as the rate of duty was changed, French and other foreign manufacturers established agencies in New York City, and by selhug at lower prices than could be made here by our manufac- turers, placed their goods on the shelves of nearly every dealer in toilet brushes in the United States. The result was that few American toilet brushes were made here until last change in duty, and even now we have not recovered all the prestige lost on them. By that change in tariff in 1883 the brush manufacturing industry at Lansingburg was practically killed. The importations were as follows: July 1, 1882, to July 1, 1883. brushes, $443,095; July 1, 1883, to July 1, 1884, brushes, $591,733; and steadily increased in volume until July 1, 1890, to July 1, 1891, it was $866,796. Under the present tariff from July 1, 1891, to July 1, 1892, it decreased and Avas only $797,602. We have not as yet the amount imported for. the year ending July 1, 1893, but believe it will show a reduction from previous years. The present importation is fully one-sixth as much in value as there is manufactured in the United States. If with the duty of 40 p'er cent they can bring in that proportion, what may we expect with the duty lowered? "We could only hold our own by^ making sweeping reductions in the wages paid to our work people, who are now paid not more than other industries here, but are paid much more than German and French work people, which are the prin- cipal countries sending brushes to the United States. The duty on bristles, fromwhich brushes are made, is 10 cents per pound, specific, and is equivalent to 3 per cent on the cost of the manu- factured article; so that taking off the duty on bristles would be too small a help to warrant any reduction in the duty on brushes. Brushes are made mostly in small factories distributed well over the United States. There are very few large brush manufactories in the United States, and nearly all of the manufacturers are men of small' capital, actively engaged in their own shops. There is no trust, com- bination, or other union of any kind amongst the various brush manu- facturers in the United States; competition is sharp between all the makers of similar lines and profits very small. The public is not robbed for their benefit, and the entire wants of the United States in the way of brushes can be supplied by our manufacturers, as there is the skill and workmen here to make them. The only brush trust in the world is in Germany, with office and sales- room in New York City, and small rooms for putting together brushes partly made in Germany and making a few unimportant lines. They issue a catalogue iu our language and with values in our money, which is submitted; they have numerous traveling salesmen canvassing all this country, and have subagency at Chicago. By illustrations in their catalogue you will see that they copy the general appearance and styles of American brushes, which are distinctly different from the styles used abroad. A copy of their German catalogue is also submitted, showing German styles. Sliould the duty be reduced on brushes with thi'Av cheap labor and combined capital of $1,000,000 and business ability, the injury to brush manufacturing here would be gsreat. Brushes here and in Europe are made almost wholly by hand, ma- BRUSHES. 1075 chinery being used only to a limited extent, and only in doing some par- ticular parts of the manufacture. The percentage of cost for labor here in making brushes varies from 50 to 70 per cent of the total cost to manu- facture. In cheap brushes it is more than in expensive kinds, using largely of bristles, and the largest sizes of brushes; while in toilet brushes, such as hair brushes, the percentage of cost for labor is very large. Tliis percentage for labor includes the labor in dressing bristles or other fiber, making brush handles, putting the brushes together, and finishing them. The manufacture of artists' brushes in the United States is a young industry, and has grown remarkably in the last few years, notwith- standing it has had fierce competition from the European manufacturers, who disliked to lose this market and have our manufacturers get estab- lished. The published returns of one of them, a stock company, last year, which strives hard for the United States market, showed a divi- dend of only 4 per cent. The foreign brush manufacturers who are seeking the American mar- ket are extensive in size, and for wages pay in Germany and France about one-quarter to one-third what is paid for similar work here. Their work people are as skillful and swift workers as ours are. In fact, nearly every brush factory in the United States contains foreign workers, who are receiving three to four times as much pay for the same work as they received abroad. The rate of wages earned by brush-makers here is no higher than in other industries. Our house imports yearly, under the present rates of duty, several thousand dollars' worth of brushes, all of which we have the skilled labor and stock to manufacture, but can not make as cheaply as we can import. Should there be a reduction in the duty we should increase our importations or decrease wages of work people. The losers would be the work people, for with our experience and established trade we can supply trade with either our own make or imported, as circum- stances elect, on the cheap and medium-priced lines. On high-grade lines, which are but a limited part of the business in brush making, same as everything else, all home manufactures have established repu- tation, which it will take a little longer for foreigners to suppliant. But when supplanted it is equally hard to obtain again. We have recently been solicited to take the exclusive agency for the United States of one of the largest foreign brush manufacturers' goods, in the event of lowering the tariff, and other houses now manufacturing brushes will undoubtedly have same offers, as foreign manufacturers can better afford generally to sell to houses with established trade here than to come over and canvass for trade and grant credits over the country. We are sure that a reduction in the tariff on brushes would convert nearly every large brush manufacturer into a brush importer for the largest part of his business, resulting in employes being thrown out of work, in which, by many years' experience, many of them are specially trained. It is clear to us, and we hope we have made it clear to you, that duty on brushes should not be lowered, as our labor costs us much more than in Europe, our expenses of doing business are much larger than there for rent, interest, and all incidental charges. We have just as skillful work people and more labor-saving appli- ances, and therefore the only means of making goods cost less than they now do is to reduce wages of employes. This every employer dislikes to do, as you well know. Nearly every brush manufacturer now in business in the United States was once an employ6 at the bench him- 1076 SUNDRIES. self, having worked his way up, thus having thorongh by practical train ing m a business of intricate detail. We hope to receive from you favorable consideration, and regre exceedingly that circumstances are such that a personal appearance ii not possible before the 20th instant. Yours, respectfully, John L. Whiting & Son Co, Lew 0. B.iL,T,, Secretary. Baltimore, September 22, 1893. Sirs : We respectfully petition your honorable committee to allow the present duty of 40 per cent on brushes to remain as it is. Even now the French and Germans are enabled by reason of their great advant age of cheap material and cheaper labor, and lower expenses generally, to place a great many of their products in our markets. Whatever maj be the result of protection in other lines of manufacture, with whicl we are not familiar, we do know, and here affirm, that in our special industry it inflicts no hardships on the consumers because of the sharp competition among the producers in this country. Bristles are now subject to a duty of 10 cents per pound, which is calculated to be equivalent to from 3 to 3| per cent tax on the manu- factured article of brushes. With free bristles, the Germans would have a decided advantage over us in this country in producing supplies, in the saving of extra profits of middle men, and transportation. In the event that you should feel in duty bound to reduce the present duty on brushes, we respectfully appeal to you for free bristles. Eespectfully, yours, Wm. a, Tottle & Co. BRUSHES. (Paragraph 427). STATEBTEITT OF J. E. WELBOEN, OF BALTIMORE, KD. Mr. Chairman. I have come here to-day in the interest of the brusl manufacturers. When this bill was submitted or talked about for i reform of the tariff it exercised the brush manufacturers to a considera ble extent. The Mills bill proposed to put a duty on bristles of 1( cents, and to reduce the duty on brushes from 40 per cent to 15 pei cent. There was considerable correspondence among the brush-makers recently, and they finally had a meeting in New York. There wer( representatives from brush makers in different cities at that meeting and there were representatives from one house in Boston, one house ii Grand Eapids, one house In Chicago, two houses in New York city, anc one from our house in Baltimore. That meeting determined to appoin a committee of two members and two alternates to appear before thii committee, and ask that the duty be not disturbed at the present time The brush-makers would like to have the duty remain as it is, and if thi committee sees i)roper the brush-makers would like to have the dut; remain on bristles, which is 10 cents. We calculate that a duty of K cents to-day on bristles amounts to 3J per cent of the manufacturec articles. The other gentlemen who were to appear here have not don^ so, and hence I am here to represent the manufacturers. BRUSHES. 1077 The Chairman. We have had some gentlemen before us represent- ing the brush manufacturers. Mr. Welboen. I was uot aware of that. Mr. Hill, of Boston, and Mr. Hazey, of New Tork, and myself were the gentlemen appointed to appear before you. Mr. Hill was unable to come and has sent or will send a written statement. Mr. Hazey, I have not heard from. The Chairman. In what manner have jon derived your information as to what should be the action of this committee affecting your inter- ests? Mr. Welboen. 1 had supposed that for the reason that there is a great deal of interest being displayed in the brush business just now, and there is a A^ery large corporation in Germany which is said to have unlimited capital at its disposal. They have established a branch in New Tork City with representatives in other States, and have gotten out catalogues saying they are preparing to enter -into and take charge of the American market. That is about it. They are able to buy raw material very much cheaper than we are. They have an advantage in that respect of nearly 50 per cent, and have a great advantage in labor. Presumably they can do business cheaper than we can. Their laborers live less expensive than ours do. In my arti- cle I have pleaded for the manufacturers, but it seems to me that a man who is intelligent enough to organize the business and employ a large amount of labor is entitled to some consideration. The interests of the laborers and employers are closely identified. Mr. Bryan. How many men do you employ 1 Mr. Welboen. About 150. Mr. Bryan. How long have you been in business? Mr. Welborn. Fifteen or sixteen years. Mr. Bryan. How much capital have you? Mr. Welborn. About $90,000 active capital. We have about $10,000 which we consider as expenses in the way of fixed capital. Mr. Bryan. What capital did you start in with fifteen years ago? Mr. Welborn. We started with a small capital. We have worked hard and lived close. Mr. Bryan. What did you put in? Mr. Weljborn. I, myself, individually, put in $7,000, Mr. Bryan. Have you one-half interest? Mr. Welborn. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. The establishment has grown from $20,000 to $90,000? Mr. Welborn. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Has the stock been increased out of the profits of the business ? Mr. Welborn. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. What wages do you pay. Mr. Welborn. Our work is mostly done by piece. We have a mim- ber of hands who necessarily work by the week. They work at the bench and are paid by the dozen. Mr. Bryan. What do you pay when you pay by the week? Mr. Welborn. We pay $12 to $14 per week. Mr. Bey AN. What kind of work is that? Mr. Welborn. That is to men who have charge of rooms. Then we have a great many boys to whom we pay $2.50 to $3.50 a week. Their wages are increased along at about the rate of 50 cents per Aveek every six months. Mr. Bryan. You spoke of the foreigners having a large advantage over you. What has your business paid? 1078 _,UNDRIES. Mr. Welbokn. I have not looked up the statistics. I was put on this committee as an alternate and I did not know that I would have to answer these questions. We have men in our employ, one of whom is a Eussian Jew and the other is a Polish Jew, one has worked in Eussia and in Germany to some extent. The other has worked largely in Ger- many. I happened to meet him as I was leaving this morning and I asked him to give me an idea so far as he could of the wages paid laborers in that business abroad, and I think he told me that the high- est wages they got there was about 40 marks or about $10. This man, however, was not a skilled bru.sh-maker. He said to me that 1 mark over there would go as far as $1 would here. He told me that he could board there for about |1.50 a week, and that he could get a good house for about $10 a month. The Eussian Jew had only worked to a limited extent at Leipsic, and he told me he got 18 to 20 marks for about the same work that he was doing with us, for which we paid him $10 a week on an average. He can not earn as much as very many of the other men in the same room, some of whom will earn on an average $17 a week for ten months in the year. Mr. Bryan. This man of whom you speak said that while he got more dollars over here, they would not go as far as they would over there? Mr. Welborn. Not quite. Mr. Bryan. The condition of the laborer would be better there than here"? Mr. Hopkins. I suppose that was the cause of his leaving that country. Why does he not go back? Mr. Welborn. I do not know. Mr. Hopkins. Perhaps he can not get back. Mr. Welborn. 1 imagine he prefers to stay in this country. I have never seen one that did not prefer to stay here. Mr. Bryan. Ab a matter of fact, you have never taken pains to investigate the difference between the labor cost abroad and here? Mr. Welborn. I have not had an opportunity. It occurred to me the other day that I would write to the United States consul atNurem- burg and ask him for certain information. I told him that I wanted it to submit to the Committee on Ways and Means. Mr. Bryan. You have not heard from him yet? Mr. Welborn. Ifo, sir. Mr. Bryan. Do they manufacture brushes in any other country than Germany? ,^ i- • ■ ^ Mr. Welborn. I have my own line of brushes. My Ime is paint brushes and white wash brushes. We make no toilet goods.- Ger- many is the only country which can make that class of goods. W€ are going into a new branch, and that is the making of artists' brushes. Mr. Bryan. How many persons are engaged in this country in manu facturing the same class of goods that you are? Mr. Welborn. I could not tell you. They are divided up, and thej employ a great many people, perhaps 400 in each factory. There ar( men doing work in their own dwellings. There is no other brush fac tory in Baltimore. Mr. Bryan. Do you belong to an association? Mr. Welborn. We belong to no association. We are a busines firm. " As 1 have stated in my paper, it does not seem to be practicabl to have an association. I believe it can be stated substantially tha there has never been a large fortune made by any concern in the brus. BRUSHES. 1079 business in the United States. Wliile not very successful in business, we have made a comfortable competence. Mr. Bey AN. What was your profit last year? Mr. Welborn. About 11 per cent. . Mr. Bryan. Was that amount divided as dividends? Mr. Welborn. It was interest, profits, and debts jjaid. I ought to say, however, that we are careful about our credits, and investigate them very closely. On that account we lose very little money. I believe that up to the present time we have not lost over 3 per cent in that way. We have very often refused credits that others might have taken. One of our firm has died. We do most of the business our- selves, and two of us are on the road most of the time. Mr. Bryan. Is your company a corporation? Mr. Welborn. 0:^0, sir; it is a plain business concern. Mr. Bryan. Do you mean to say that you divided 11 per cent between your stockholders last year? Mr. Welborn. Yes, sir; we divided it among the partners. Mr. Bryan. I suppose you count the expenses of your partners, and you take out a certain amount for your share over and above that which you get as profit? Mr. WfLBORN. This 11 per cent is interest and all. We draw $3,000 ayearapiece. That has been done within the last year or two. For the first teij or twelve years we only drew out $1,500 apiece. Mr. Bryan. Have you added anything in the way of improvements to the plant in the last year? Mr. Welborn. Tes, sir; we are constantly getting little pieces of machinery. Mr. Bryan. Are you doing more than replacing what is worn out? Mr. Welborn. Tes, sir; we have never had any machinery at all until the last four years. Then there was some little machinery invented In the way of doing the nailing on the brushes. The brush work is mostly hand work. No machine has been invented which will handle the bristles economically. There is a bend in the bristles which makes a bulb shape. Even an unskilled man can not handle them so that they will not bend in every direction. Mr. Hopkins. Is this 11 per cent the gross earnings of your con- cern? Mr. We^jBORN. Tes, sir; on the capital invested. Mr. Hopkins. Out of the gross earnings you take the salary of your partners ? I want to see how much is left out of which you declare a dividend. Mr. Welborn. I can procure a memorandum of it and send it to you. My brother is the bookkeeper. Mr. Hopkins. The gross earnings are 11 per cent? •Mr. Welborn. I am not a bookkeeper, and I am not quite sure of that. Mr. Bryan. Do you mean to say that the income would be 11 per cent on the $90,000, and then you would take the exjienses of yourself and your brother out of that, reducing it by $5,000 or $6,000? Mr. Welborn. No; !• think that, to be truthful, I ought to say the probability is that that is our net earnings. We had taken our sal- aries out before that. Mr. Bryan. Ton mean that after the salaries are taken out it leaves 11 per cent for earnings on the capital? Mr. Welborn. Tes; and interest. Mr. Hopkins. What do you mean by interest? 1080 SUNDRIES. Mr. Welboun. We charge the capital up at 6 per cent interest. This comes out, and the remainder is divided. Mr. Hopkins. Will you be kind enough to get the figures showing what this 11 per cent is; whether it is gross earnings, or whether it is the net per cent divided as profits'? Mr. Welborn. I will do so. Mr. Bryan. Your understanding is that the 11 per cent includes the 6 per cent on the capital, and the balance would be what you would call profits? Mr. Welborn. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. You will furnish a statement if that is not correct? Mr. Welborn. I will. CURI^ED HAIR AND BRISTIiES. (Paragraphs 426 and 450.) Friday, September 8, 1893. STATEMENT OF MR. WILLIAM WILKINS, OF MESSSS. WILLIAM WILKOTS & CO. 310 WEST PRATT STREET, BALTIMORE, MD. ' Mr. Chairman : We are manufacturers of curled hair and bristles, and as we understood the tariff was to be revised, and thought per- haps there was some danger the duty on curled hair and bristles might be taken off, we concluded we would come down here and explain the matter to the gentlemen of the Committee on Ways and Means. ITow, the duty on both of those articles— I will take the bristles first— the duty on bristles formerly was 15 cents a pound and under the McKinley bill this was reduced to 10 cents a pound. These are the goods [exhibiting same] which we manufacture, if you -wish to look at them. They are manufactured for brush-makers in all colors, of course, and length. The reason we think the duty ought to remain as it is is on account of the difference in wages paid in Europe and the wages which we pay our workmen in Baltimore. Mr. Burrows. Have you a comparative table of the wages paid here and there? „ ■. ^-, • -j. +.., „„ Mr WiLKiNS. I have not a table of wages, but I can gjive it to you in a few words. The wages of good bristle workmen are from $1.50 to $2 a day in Baltimore, and in Germany and England the wages are 91 cents a day. In France they get about 55 cents a day, and in fepan and China they get about 8i cents a day; they hardly get anything there. I suppose that is like all the productions there. This is the reason we say the duty ought to remain as it is. Now, in regard to curled hair, ihe duty was formerly 25 per cent, and a few years ago it was reduced to 15 per cent ad valorem. Now, with regard to bristles, I would hke to men- tion a few things. Bristles in the new bill must be mentioned under a separate head, otherwise they might be taxed 20 per cent as articles minufactured in whole or in part. Now that makes free bnstles 7^" tuallv and it is not of much use to the bi-ush maker, as the 10 cents a Dound only amounts to 3 per cent of the goods; that is, the raw mate- rial. Besides that, there would be a great question come up as to what Mr. Payne. What percentage of labor is in the cost of producing bristles in the form yon present them here? Mr. WiLKiNS. They cost from 15 to 18 and 20 cents a pound. CURLED HAIR AND BRISTLES. 1081 Mr. Payne. What percentage of labor does it take to produce those bristles in that form ? Mr. WiLKiNS. From 18 to 20 cents a pound it costs to produce these. That is what we pay in our factoyy in Baltimore for labor. Now we have other expenses besides that. . Mr. Payne. What does the raw material cost you? Mr. WiLKiNS. That is the difference that I will explain to you. We purchase in the West, in New York, and the Eastern States; we make a contract with large packers and pay them a certain price per hog on the back. Then we engage bristles-pullers to secure the bristles and lay them carefully in a barrel, and those we bring to our factory in Baltimore and manufacture. Mr. Payne. Can you give us some idea how much a pound the raw material costs? Mr. WiLKiNS. About 15 cents a pound. Mr. Payne. Before they are pulled? Mr. WiLKiNS. When they are pulled. Mr. Payne. That includes the labor of pulling them? Mr. WiLKiNS. Yes; sometimes we get less frcmi a hog, and, of course, it costs more. Mr. Payne. But that includes the cost of pulling them? Mr. WiLKiNS. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Then after that the manufactucing costs you 15 to 18 and 20 cents more? Mr. WiLKiNS. Yes, sir; and besides that there is a loss in manufac- turing, all according to how the material is. If the material is good, then the loss would not be so much, but on some material we lose about 50 per cent, and then when the material is better there is not so much waste. There is a big portion wasted. Now, the European material is much better than the American raw material, and consequently they can manufacture their goods much cheaper, besides the wages are cheaper abroad. Now, the duty oh those articles ought to remain as they are, 10 cents a pound on bristles and then 15 per cent ad valorem on hair. If there is an advalorem duty on bristles, then the shorter sizes, which we have the most competition in, we would not be protected enough, and then on the longer sizes, of which we have not that com- petition, the brush-maker would suffer by being compelled to pay a higher rate of duty on goods which we do not manufacture but very little of. Now they have the Ocalka bristle, which is 5 or 6 inches long, but we do not get those articles in this country. Mr. Turner. What is the difference iu prices between the imported bristle and the bristle you get? Mr. WiLKiNS. Well, we keep about the same prices. Mr. Turner. You said you got yours for 15 cents a pound? Mr. WiLKiNS. You see the duty is 10 cents a pound. You see Ave have a different class of bristles from those abroad. We have long mixed in, and short mixed in, and I do not suppose anything could be purchased here like the bristles they have in Eussia, which I suppose are about 40 cents a pound, but that includes the long numbers. Our product is different. It is not so valuable on account of it not being so large. Mr. Bynum. We raise more meat and less hair on the hog? Mr. WiLKiNS. I suppose so. Mr. Turner. The average price for imported bristles for 1892 was nearly a dollar a pound ? Mr. WiLKiNS. That is right, they were full size. ■'■^^2 SUNDRIES. brStleT?^^^^' '^^^^ ^"^ ""^^ '^°'"*' '° competition with our sort c Mr. WiLKiNS. Long numbers, no, sir; very little. Mr. IXJRNEE. Where do you get your supplies of hair from ? Mr. WiLKiNS. We get them from the West. - We get our hair prii cipaJly from South America, Eio Janerio. This matter has been befor the committee several years ago, and this duty was reduced, but at th ^^^^"m*""^ "^^ ^^^ decidedly of the opinion it should remain as it ig Mr. lURNER. Do you use any other hair excefit the mane and tail o the horse? Mr. WiLKiNS. Yes, sir; we have also the hog hair. Mr. Turner. Do you use hog hair? Mr. WiLKiNS. We mix it to a certain extent; the people want it an( they make the demand. Mr. Turner. Is that process of treating it expensive? Mr. WiLKiNS. What do you mean? Mr. Turner. I refer to the method of converting it into curled hair' Mr. WiLKiNS. It is not so very expensive; I suppose between 4 anc 6 cents a pound. » The Chairman. What is the cost of manufacturing a pound of bris ties ? Mr. Wilkins. a pound of bristles costs from 16 to 20 cents to mauu facture. The Chairman. And the tariff is 10 cents a pound ? Mr. Wilkins. On bristles; yes, sir. Mr. Turner. The labor cost is only 5 cents a pound. Mr. Payne. No; 15 to 20 cents a pound. Mr. Turner. I misunderstood him. Mr. Wilkins. It is from 18 to 20 cents, and then our product whicl we get is not as valuable as that we receive from Europe. Mr. Turner. The curled hair when it leaves your hands is for mat tress-makers ? Mr. Wilkins. Yes, sir; for bedding, upholsterers, furniture, and, o course, it is according to what people want. The Chairman. We import very little curled hair. Mr. Wilkins. I think we import very little. We tried several yean ago, just before the change was made, and there Vas several gentlemei here at the same time. There was a gentleman from New York, fron Delaney & Co., Mr. Powell. Mr. Turner. How long has this duty of 15 per cent been maintained Mr. Wilkins. I think about three years ; before it was 25 per cent Mr. Turner. It was put at 15 per cent under the present law? Mr. Wilkins. It was put at 15 per cent under the present law. Mr. Turner. And. Mr. Blumenthal. The prohibitory duty has transferred it here. Mr. Payne. Speaking about buttons being manufactured in the Auburn prison, I would say that they have been manufactured there under a Democratic adminis' ration during the last two years. Are not pearl buttons made outside of prisons in this country? Mr. Blumenthal. Certainly. Mr. Payne. They are made by free labor? Mr. Blumenthal. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Do you know what the Austrian wages is for making buttons? Mr. Blumenthal. To-day it is about $5 to $G a week. Mr. Payne. Were not pearl buttons made by women at the low wages of 10 cents? Mr. Blumenthal. They can not be made by women. Mr. Payne. Have machines not been turned by women. Mr. Blumenthal. ISTot to my knowledge, and I have been over there quite a number of times. Mr. Payne. The old fashioned lathe is still used? Mr. Blumenthal. The lathe was used fifty years ago and it is now about the same. Mr. Payne. That was used in Austria. It is crude, being a hand lathe. Mr. Blumenthal. I do not believe women would have power enough to turn it. Mr. Payne. Women make buttons in this country, do they not? Mr. Blumenthal. They do, aided by machinery. Mr. Payne. Machinery has been very much improved in this coun- try since the introduction of the button industry, has it not! Mr. Blumenthal. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Machines have been invented which work almost auto- matically? Mr. Blitmbnthal. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. What has been the increase in the price in comparison with 1889, befo]^ the depression came? Mr. Blumenthal. The average price has been three times higher. 1094 SUNDRIES. Mr. Payne. Have they advanced over 7 per cent? Mr. Blumenthal. Certainly. Mr. Payne. Have they advanced within six mouths over what they were preceding the passage of the bill of .1890? Mr. Blumenthal. Allow me to qualify that. ■ Mr. Payne. You had better. Mr. Blumenthal. In answer to 1889, 1 will say yes. Mr. Payne. Not the entire year. "Were they not abnormally low in Mr. Blumenthal, If you wish I can give you the whole status of affairs in 1890. Prices advanced on the other side about 10 per cent to 15 per cent at the end of the year 1889, but to-day the prices are twice to three times as high as on the general average. Mr. Payne. Twice to three times as high? Mr. Blumenthal. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. And how did they sell to the consumer? Mr. Blumenthal. At that price. Mr. Payne. Do you know how many people are employed in this industry in the United States now? Mr. Blumenthal. I only know what the domestic manufacturers have testified to before this committee. In 1890 they testified that there were 8,000 people employed in it. Mr. Payne. And what do they testify now? Mr. Blumenthal. They testify now that there ^re 10,000 people; therefore I suppose that the increase has been 2,000. Mr. Payne. Where did you get that evidence from"? Mr. Blumenthal. From Mr. Knight and Mr. NeweU. Mr. Payne. Mr. Knight said last week that there were about 10,000 in 1890, and joii say that Mr. Knight testified that there were only 8,000 in 1890. Mr. Blumenthal. I have it here. Mr. Payne. You say 8,000 in 1890 and 10,000 now? Mr. Blumenthal. Before the Ways and Means Committee in 1890 he testified there were about 8,000 people employed in that industry. Mr. Payne. Do you not know that bone collar buttons can not be made in this country in competition with the European button makers even with a duty of 50 per cent? Mr. Blumenthal. I suppose there are certain classes of goods where there are some patented machines on the other side where they make these goods cheaper. I suppose that is true of collar studs. The importations would amount to probably $10,000 or $12,000. Mr. Payne. We do not manufacture them in this country on account of the low price. Mr. Blumenthal. I suppose that is the cause. The Chairman. Where did you get your information that the Mills bill put a duty of 4 cents a line on jjcarl buttons? Mr. Blumenthal. That has been told me by domestic manufactur- ers, and I believe it was quoted here before the McKinley Ways and Means Committee. The Chairman. This report which I have in my hand gives it as 25 per cent. Mr. Blumenthal. I have been informed that the Mills bill puts it at 12 per cent and they brought forward an amendment. The Chairman. In an official publication of this committee in sec- tion 429 of the Mills bill it is given as 25 per cent. BUTTONS. 1095 Mr. BLtTMENTlfAi.. I may be mistaken on tlifit; I only know from hearsay. Mr. Burrows. Did the price go up before the McKinley bill went into operation in 1889f Mr. Blumenthal. The McKinley bill went into operation in 1890. Mr. Burrows. It was in October, 1890. Did the price of buttons advance in 1890 under that bill? Mr. Blumenthal. Yes, sir; in December, 1889, they advanced, before they thought of the McKinley bill. It was a natural conse- quence of supply and demand. Mr. Burrows. Was there any combination or understanding among importers? Mr. Blumenthal. Yes,, sir. Mr. Burrows. Was there one? Mr. Blumenthal. There was one ; and I would like to explain that. Mr. Burrows. When was that made? Mr. Blumenthal. In May, 1890. It was done for the simple reason that pearl buttons were imported under a 25 per cent ad valorem rate of duty. The bill had 4 cents a line; and as it was passed it had 2^ cents ad valorem duty, and 4 cents a line. We knew this was an immense increase on the then existing rate. I am talking about the McKioley bill. In May, 1890, we formed a combination. At that time we had a great many smart customers who knew this increase would take place, and being our customers it was impossible to sell at this high price. We made a combination not to sell for less than a certain price, and we raised the price 50 per cent. Mr. Burrows. On the stock on hand? Mr. Blumenthal. Yes, sir; so that our customers would not get the benefit of the stock we had on hand. Mr. Payne. You do not know whether they import buttons complete, except the boring of the hole, and bring them in as unmanufactured buttons at a lower rate? Mr. Blumenthal. Soon after the McKinley bill went into effect, we imported unmanufactured buttons, or blank forms. Mr. Payne. They are all manufactured, except the boring of the holes? Mr. Blumenthal. These goods are not buttons, but blanks dutiable at 40 per cent ad valorem. Mr. Payne. That was a very simple process ? Mr. Blxjtmenthal. It could be done by machinery, or by hand. Mr. Payne. It is done by machinery at a very small cost? Mr. Blumenthal. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. So you are practically getting in pearl buttons at 40 per cent ad valorem ? Mr. Blumenthal. Ko, sir. Mr. Payne. There is only a very small shade of difference. Mr. Blumenthal. It costs to manufacture them. We could import them at 40 per cent ad valorem before the McKinley bill went into effect. Mr. Payne. You can do it under the present tariff? Mr. Blumenthal. I think that ought to be changed. I do not think, if you have a duty on pearl buttons, that we should be allowed to import these blank forms at 40 percent; but, as the courts have decided that we could do so, we would be very foolish not to do it. I think it ought to be understood that these blank forms should not come in at 40 per cent ad valorem. ^^96 SUNDRIES. Mr. Breckinridge. Is there much trade in these blanks? this time^^^'^^^'*^^' "^* ^^^ not influenced the market very much up to Mr. Payne. The decision is a recent one? Mr. Blumenthal. Yes, sir; it was delivered six weeks ago. Mr. Burrows. Do you not, and do not the importers generallv, know how much you are getting as a rebate? Mr. Blumenthal. The importers generally may get a refund. There ai-e only a few of the importers who have cared to take the risk. They had to pay 250 per cent, and they would run the risk of getting only 11.0 per cent in return. The duty was very great and exceeded the cost of the goods in many instances. It was prohibitory. Mr. Burrows. What will be the amount of the rebate? Mr. Blumenthal. I suppose it will be $75,000. Mr. Gear. How many prisoners are engaged in the Auburn prison m making buttons ? Mr. Blumenthal. That was six months ago. Mr. trE'AR. What percentage of convict labor, relative to the general labor in the country, is engaged in this industry? Mr. Blumenthal. The convict labor is small. Mr. Gear. Is it 1 or 2 per cent? Mr. Blumenthal. I do not believe it plays any great part in the total product. I only mention it because it has been said that the object of the McKinley bUl was ostensibly to benefit the working people of this country. Mr. Payne. As a matter of fact, do not the convicts steal so much that it is not able to compete with outside labor? Mr. Blumenthal. I suppose that most of them do steal? The Chairman. Do you remember the month in which the McKinley bill passed the House ? Was it not in May, 1890 ? Mr. Blumenthal. Tes, sir. The Chairman. Do yoii remember what the duty was on pearl but- tons, as it passed the House? Mr, Blumenthal. Four cents a line. The Chairman. It was 2 cents per line in addition to the 25 per cent ad valorem ? Mr. Blumenthal, As it was presented to the House, it was 50 per cent, and then there was an amendment which made it 4 cents a line, and eventually it passed at 2 cents a line. It was raised by an amend- ment from 50 per cent to 4 cents a line. The Chairman. I understood you in your answer to Mr. Burrows to say that in May, 1890, the importers knew the duty was to be increased, and were able to form a combination? Mr. Blumenthal. Yes, sir. PEARL BIJTTOlSrS. (Farngriiph 429.) Friday September 15, 1893. STATEMENT OF ME. A. C. EAYMOND, OF DETROIT, MICH. Mr. Chairman: I appear in behalf of the ]!>rational Bearl Button Association of the United States; I am not a raanufacttlrer or a dealer; I am a lawyer ; I am personally known to almost all the members of PEARL BUTTONS. 1097 this committee, as being a Democrat and being in full sympathy with the Democratic policy of the present administration and also in sympathy with the purposes of this committee, in its desire to I make a revision of the tariff, as I understand it, it is proper for me ta offer some word of explanation as to why I appear in behalf of this protected industry, which has been attacked perhaps more vio- lently than any other in the McKinley tariff. If you will permit me I will explain how my present connection with it came about; I have some friends who are stockholders in a pearl button factory. They said the association wotild be glad to retain me to present their case before the Committee on Ways and Means. I declined the offer. I said that as a consistent Democrat, believing in tariff revision and reform on a revenue basis, in accordance with the principles of the party. I could not consent to appear for them, fknew nothing aliout the business as a great many of those who have attacked it know nothing about it. They prevailed upon me to investigate the industry carefully, and ascer- tain the facts concerning it before I should come to a final decision. I visited some of the factories and was surprised at the very large amount of labor employed, especially at the large number of women and chil- dren employed. I investigated the business in various directions, and finally said to my friends, " I will appear on this condition, that I shall be permitted to advocate a reduction in the tariff. That was granted. I further stated to the association that all the statements which I should make before this committee at Washington should be supported as to the daily and weekly wages which is paid to labor; that I, as a Demo- crat, wanted to furnish proof of what I had to say before the committee concerning this industry. I told them if I could do that openly I would be willing to appear and for that purpose I have come here. I have brought here a formidable pile of papers, but 1 shall not present them to you in detail, but only to show you that 1 can back ujd every state- ment that I make. I want to speak first of the source of my informa- tion concerning this as a domestic manufacture. This circular was sent out to the manufacturers of the United States, engaged in this industry, of which there are, according to the best estimates, from 75 to 145 or 147 ; the additional ones being those who are mainly engaged in manu- facturing in their own homes with the assistance of their families ; but there are 72 or 73 of the principal manufacturers in the United States engaged in this industry. This circular was sent to them and the replies received by me serve as the basis of my information. The replies to this circular are confidential as between manufacturers, but the members of this committee can examine them if they desire to do so. The circular is as follows : New Yoek, May 17, 189S. Sir : The Pearl Button Association of the United State has retained Mr. A. C. Raymond, of Detroit, Mich., to represent its interest before the committees of Con- gress which at the ensuing session will have the new tariff bill in charge. It is of the utmost importance that he shall be put in possession of the exact facts concern- ing our industry at the earliest moment, that he may be able to present them accu- rately and intelligently before the committees. We have nothing to gain by any exaggerated, untrue, or misleading statements, for our case must rest upon its real merits, honestly and clearly set forth. The information furnished him by each man- ufacturer will not be disclosed to any other, but used solely inpreparing data for the benefit of all. Please fill out the blank attached hereto and forward to A. C. Ray- mond, 65 Moffat Block, Detroit, Mich. Yours, etc., A. W. Nbwbll, W. H. Leland, A. J. OSTHEIMKE. Truntees Pearl Button Association of the United Statea, 1098 SUNDRIES. I make the following proposition, which I will establish by proofs and exhibits. Proposition 1 : The pearl-button industry is not and can not become a monoply. Proposition 2: The labor cost of the product averages 61 per cent, which labor is performed about one-half by men and one-half by women and children, estimated to number from seven thousand to ten thousand hands in all. (See Exhibits 37, 34, 35, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 38. Also Exhibit Q.) Proposition 3 : The average earnings per week of American labor are 185 per cent greater than those of foreign labor, and the average earnings per gross, the standard lor piecework, are about 200 per cent greater. (See Exhibits 28 and 27.) Proposition 4 : The average increase of retail over manufacturers' prices for staple buttons in the United States is 97 per cent, while thcaverage increase in jobbers' prices between 1889 and 1893 is only 52| per cent. (See Exhibits 29 and 36.) Proposition 5 : The price of garments, such as underwear, on which are used a large proportion of the staple pearl buttons manufactured in the United States, has not been advanced to consumers an iota by reason of increased cost of buttons, such trifling increase in the cost having been absorbed by the manufacturers of the goods. (See Exhibits 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, and 48.) Proposition 6 : Present prices of an average invoice of staple American pearl but- tons are about 85 per cent higher than those of a corresponding Vienna invoice in 1889. (SeeExhibits32, 33, and 30, also Exhibit P.) Proposition 7: We recommend a change in the wording of the pearl-button schedule, which will prevent a frand now being perpetrated upon the Government and the manufacturers by those who are importing undriUed buttons as "manufac- tures of pearl " at a duty of 40 per cent, and suggest for the consideration of the committee this wording: "Pearl bnttons, or pearl disks, partially manufactured into buttons, or intended therefor, a duty of, etc." Proposition 8 : We recommend a reduction of 40 per cent in the present specific duty, leaving the new schedule IJ cents per line and 25 per cent ad valorem, which will substantially maintain the present situation as shown in proposition 6. Proposition 9 : The reduced duty we ask for of 1^ cents per line and 25 per cent ad valorem is not a tentative one, which we are willing to have still further reduced, but is the lowest duty which will permit the industry as at present organized to sustain itself. Proposition 10 : A pure ad valorem duty is not practicable or desirable for this industry, whose product consists of innnmerable sizes and qualities, differences in which require an expert to detect, thus opening a door for frauds upon the Goveru- , ment and manufacturers which could not be prevented. Mr. Raymond said : With regard to the alleged enormous duty of 300 and 400 per cent on pearl buttons it is all a myth. The present price of American buttons', in consequence of the depression in business, is below the cost of production of many of the manufacturers. In discussing the ninth proposition Mr. Eaymond said : It was sug- guested by some members of the Pearl Button Association that I should ask for a duty of If or 2 cents a line, because, when this committee came to consider the pearl-button schedule they would be sure to cut down whatever we asked for, and we would thus be more likely to have left what was needed (viz, IJ cents per line and 25 per cent ad valorem) than if we asked that at flrSt; but I declined any such proposition. I think I shall show from exhibits that the rate asked is one that the industry, as at present organized, ought to have for a reasonable length of time. In discussing the tenth proposition Mr. Eaymond said : This is a genuine infant industry, being about two and one-half years old. It has never been discussed before any of the committees of this House, and therefore I have brought some exhibits to show how the industry is carried on and to make some explanation of the terms used in the industry. These pearl shells [indicating some shells from which buttons are made] are imported from Australia, Japan, Egypt, and various portions of the Eastern World, and are cut into buttons with a lathe in this manner [exhibiting cut specimens]. This shell is mapped off into sec- PEARL BUTTONS. 1099 tioils. This section [indicating] is tlie lowest quality, and is called "thirds." This nerxt section here [indicating the center ot tlie shell] produces the biilk of the staple pearl buttons, known as " liiilf iines" or " mediums." This next section produces the better qualities, known as " three- fourths " and " fines." Mr. Blumenthal suggests that the present duty be reduced to 1 cent a line and 25 per cent ad valorem, which he says will enable a manu- facturer to make finer qualities at least. When we buy this shell we buy it as a butcher buys meat, bones and all, with these thirds and half fines in it. We have to use up the whole shell and sell the whole product. For that reason I say that while the duty suggested by Mr. Blumenthal might enable the manufac- turer to make the finer lines of goods, it would prevent him from mail- ing these cheaper lines of goods; and as these constitute quite a large portion of the products of each shell, it would stop the factories if the duty should be reduced to his figure. j^ow, I have here the different processes of the manufacture of but- tons: I have also the thick discs [exhibiting the various processes]. There are five operations through which every pearl button has to pass. I have here a tool which is used in the pearl-button industry. It is called a "chuck." Tou will see that there is a little place cut there for the button. A peculiarity of this business is that every individual button has to be handled by the finger and thumb of the operator. It requires an enormous percentage of actual handling. This cutting tool is put into the lathe, the disk cut out", which is afterwards put in the " chuck" and. treated with this turning tool, which is such a tool as many of you have seen in a turning establishment where banisters and uewel posts are turned out. So you see a turner in any portion of the world, either in the United States or abroad, can take his lathe, buy a little shell from a dealer in shells, go into his room, put up this lathe, and perform every operation connected with the manufacture of pearl buttons from the shell to the finishing of the buttons. He is usually assisted by his wife and children in the minor operations of carding, boxing, etc. This explains why the pearl-button industry can never become a monoply. In the next place let me say that this business is not monopolized or restricted by any combination to raise the prices. I have come in con- tact with several of these manufactures, and I find that they are very jealous of each other. Each one is afraid that the other will ascertain his process. They are not controlled or influenced in their prices by the association. It is a voluntary association, and was formed to present a united front and united money against this attempt of Mr. Blumen- thal to import these pearl buttons at 40 per cent ad valorem against the law and against the interests of manufacturers. Any poor Bohe- mian, Austrian, or German who was a turner at home (and there are large numbers of people in Austria known as turners from the cradle, father and son, generation after generation) can come to the city of New York, or anywhere else, with a chest of those tools, buy a little lathe and go to work in his room making pearl buttons, and can sell them to Mr. Blumenthal. So it is not a monopoly, and no monopoly can be formed to prevent anyone engaging in the business who knows how to use turning tools. As to the number of manufacturers, I have a list here (Exhibit 37) which was furnished me by the president of this association, covering seveaty-two of the leading manufacturers of the United States. In order to furnish some evidence as to the truthfulness of this statement, 1100 SUNDRIES. I have procured the affidavits of two of the leading shell dealers of the United States, Messrs. Albert Ochise and Daniel A. Shaw, of New York (see Exhibits 34 and 35). I asked those gentlemen to make affi- davits as to the number of customers on their books to whom they sell shells. Mr. Shaw swears before a notary public that he sells shells to seventy different firms and individuals. He is not so large a dealer as Mr. Ochise, who sells shells to 147 manufacturers. Many of these manu- facturers are doubtless those who follow the house industry. That gives au idea of the number of manufacturers in the United States, nearly all of which have been established, of course, since 1890. Mr. Burroughs. Do I understand you to say that all these have been established since 1890 'I Mr. Raymond. Pretty nearly all of them. Out of the seventy-two names which the president furnished me I have responses to the circu- lar from thirty-six, which covers the principal ones. It is one-half of the names furnished me, and discloses that there are 1,783 men employed in this industry by these 36 manufacturers, the aggregate weekly earn- ings of which are $459.20. There are 450 women and 90 children employed. The women eara $5, $6, and $7 per week. Fifty-two and one-half per cent of the employes are men, and the average wages $13.63 cents per week. The women and children represent 47J per cent. The average wages of women are $5.75 per week, and of children $3.79 per week. Leaving the children out of the calculation and calling the employes half men and half women, the average earnings from this industry would be $9.70 per week. We do not come here with any threat that if you do not retain this duty we are going to cut down the wages of our employes. We know that is all nonsense. We know that the employes of this industry must go on a footing with those of all other industries, the most of which are unprotected by the tariff. We do not propose to make that kind of an argument. If we are given the duty we ask for, for a reasonable length of time, 1 can assure you that tlie manufacturers will be willing to go on a pure revenue basis whenever that policy is adopted as to all other protected industries. Mr. Dalzbll. This is a protected basis. Mr. Eaymond. This is one that is necessary to sustain this industry. Mr. Dalzell. I understand you to draw a distinction between this and a revenue basis hereafter. Mr. Eaymond. Yes, sir; this is a protected basis. Mr. Dalzell. Don't you think that is unconstitutional. Mr. Raymond. Ko, sir; we are like a town that is obliged to sup- port the children whose parentage is unknown . This child is here of Republican parentage; what are you going to do with the braf? Are you going to kill him, or will you nurse him until he is able to sustain himself? Mr. Reed. Is not this an honest infant industry? Mr. Raymond. Yes, sir. Mr. Reed. Barring responsibility for the iufant"? Mr. Raymond. Yes, sir; it makes no difference how this brat got here; he is here. Perhajis it would have beeu a better policy never to Lave brought him here. Mr. Reed. The cost of his support falls upon the public at large? Mr. Raymond. Yes, sir. In all sections of the Republic tliere are more Republican infants of that kind than there are Democratic. Mr. Payne. You mean infants created under tariff? PEARL BUTTONS. 1101 Mr. Eaymond. Perhaps Mr. Tarsney had better address himself t( that question. I want to say something about foreign wages. I have attendee hearings-before this committee frequently, as all of you know. I was present during one of the hearings on the MoKinley bill. At thai time I heard my friend, Mr. Breckinridge, ask men who came before the committee asking advances in duty to show him in detail whereii and why American wages were so much higher than foreign wages I saw nearly every man fail to do it. I have here [indicating] the wages paid in foreign countries in this industry up to date. I said to these gentlemen of the Pearl Button Association: " If you claim to me tha the American rate of wages is such a large per centage higher than th* foreign wages I want you to pi^ve it. I want you to send a man t( Europe and let him go into the pearl industrial sections. I. want th( trade unions price list, with the signatures of the ofQcers of the tradi unions, and I want them to go before United States consuls and mak( affidavits as to their correctness." That has been done. It is on thesi facts that I propose to base my remarks. I have here Exhibits 20, 21 22, 23, 24, and 25 from six different American manufacturers showinj the cost of their operations — cutting, backing, facing, polishing, drill ing, boxing, shop expenses, and material. It varies on 14 to 26 lin( buttons from 32 cents to $1.64 per gross; out of that total we take th( price of the shell for each size of button. The balance is the mone^ paid for labor. There is nothing figured in as interest or anything o that kind. I find the percentage of the labor in the completed produc runs from 44 per cent up to over 86 per cent. I take the figures pre sented by these manufacturers. I have one paper here which the man ufacturer sent me to see it that was what I wanted, and he said hi would make affidavit to it. The notice to appear here came suddenly when I was at my summe: residence, and I had no time to send for his affidavit; he is responsible and his statement can be verified. (This statement has since been swori to.) The grand result of the affidavits of these six leading manufac turers shows the average of labor cost in this industry to be 61 per cent (See Exhibit 38.) Mr. McMillan. Have you the statistics showing what is the per centage of the labor cost abroad? Mr. Eaymond. Yes, sir; I have all the statistics, which I will b( delighted to leave with the committee, together with the affidavits take: before United States consuls. Mr. McMillan. What proportion is labor cost abroad! You havi given the proportion which labor cost bears to the whole cost of Ameri can product. What I want to find out is the statistics which gives thi proportion of labor cost compared with the whole cost abroad! Mr. Raymond. The price of the shell, probably, does not vary mucl between New York and Vienna, and the figures show, on an averag invoice of buttons, that the difference between the American price am the foreign price is about 85 per cent. The difference in the labor cos per gross in most cases is about 200 per cent. This matter I will refe to in another proposition. I have them all arranged in numerical order (See Exhibits 27 and 28.) I say in proposition three, that the average earnings per week in thi country are 185 per cent more than they are abroad. Per gross the; are about 200 per cent greater. Mr. Taksney. That would leave the average labor cost abroad abou 25 per cent? 1102 SUNDRIES. i\rr. Eaymond. Twenty-five per cent or 30? Mr. Tarsney. Tbirty per cent of what? Mr. Raymond. The increased labor cost hereof, the pro.luct is about 30 per cent of what it was over there? Mr. Tarsney. You do not mean that the labor cost of the product is only 30 per cent"? Mr. Raymond. JSo, sir; the average labor cost in this country, according to the estimates I have given, is 61 per cent. I have dis- covered that in figuring out percentages you are liable to make mis- takes unless you stick close to your figures. Mr. Tarsney. You say the labor cost here is 185 jjer cent greater than it is abroad? Mr. Raymond. 185 per cent greater, based ,on weekly earnings; but based on piece work, about 200 per cent greater. I am talking about the percentage of increase. Mr. Reed. The relative labor cost is an entirely different thing from actual labor cost. The relation between material and the work put upon it might be the same in both countries and yet the labor cost be very diflereuf? Mr. Raymond. I prefer in discussing this matter of percentage to cling closely to this calculation which I have made, because one is liable to become confused on percentages. Mr. BreckinridGtE. Have you calculated the cost of production here and abroad? One man may have one percentage of cost of pro- duction, and another man may have another percentage. Mr. Raymond. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinrid&e. If you need to protect an article here, and the difference in cost is too much, whatever it is that is causing that differ- ence, whether labor or something else would be entitled to be con- sidered in your answer. Therefore it seems to me that your calculation should address itself to that proposition. Mr. Raymond. When I come to a certain proposition which I have here I will produce the tables referring to that. The Chairman. We are pressed for time, and I hope you will be expeditious. Mr. Raymond. I will do so and will answer all these questions in their order. Mr. Payne. I think we had better let Mr. Raymond proceed until he has tiniished and then ask him questions. 3Ir. Raymond. 1 have here Exhibit 28, which shows the earnings per week of workmen in twelve places, including England, Vienna, Prague, Brunn, and other places in Austria and Bohemia, compared with the earnings of American workmen. The grand result shows that our wages are 185 per cent more per week than their wages, all of which is supported by these exhibits. These estimates are made out in the original German and translated, with the original typewritten translations attached to each case. Here is a comjiarative statement of the cost of American and foreign manufactures per gross for labor. These are Exhibits 21 to 26, and show about 200 per cent on each size of buttons more for labor in this country than abroad. This is supported by affidavits. Mr. Turner. How do you get the percentage of the prices of goods on this side since you say your clients will not disclose their prices? Mr. Raymond. I have the price lists. I say they will not disclose them to one another. Mr. Gear. It is based on that statement? PEARL BUTTONS. 11 Mr. Eaymonb. On their statements and affidavits. If any sta ments which I make are controverted, you can question several of th( manufacturers who have pledged me to stand up before this coinmiti and take oath to these facts. I do not want to deceive this commiti one iota. On the fourth proposition I.will say that the average increase of i retail over the manufacturers' price for staple buttons in the Unit States is 97 per cent, while the average increase in the jobbers' price only 52J per cent. We went to a prominent importing iirm in Detrc Edson, Moore & Co., and they went back to their price list of 1889 buttons. (See Exhibit 36.) Their figures show that in 1893 tlie jc bers' prices average 52J per cent over the prices of 1889. I emp]oye( man to go to the leading retailers in the city of Nes^ York, also to store in which one of the members of this committee is interested a buy pearl buttons. I have here the result of his purchases with t cash slip in every case, and description of the buttons, showing 1 prices paid per dozen. I wanted to see how much more the consun was paying as the result of tariif, or whether the retailer was aski exorbitant prices, and I discovered the latter. I have here the 11 exhibits. (See Exhibit 29.) I will not give i names. I take the average size, class, and quality of staple buttc sold by retailers and jobbers and I find the difference between t manufacturers and the retailers to run from 50 per cent, the lowest, 15 per cent, the highest, and I have one exhibit not in the list whi shows that the retailer's profit in one case was 200 per cent. A f I)rofit for a jobber should be 15 per cent, and for a retailer 25 per ce I think the gentlemen of the committee will acknowledge that. Th( are staple goods just as brown sheetings are staple in the dry goc business. If 40 per cent was takeif by the retailer and jobber out 97 per cent, as shown above, it would show an excessive profit of 57 j cent, or more than the entire increase on the staple goods between 1 prices of 1889 and 1893, as shown by Edson, Moore & Co.'s pr list. "We can not legislate to make retailers reduce their profits. (£ Exhibit 29.) As to jiroposition five, I will say that the prices of garments, such underwear, for which pearl buttons are largely used, have not be advanced a cent on that account. I have here letters from ten of 1 leading manufacturers of underwear written within twenty -four to for eight hours, which show the increase on buttons has in no instance bt added to the price of the garments since the McKinley bill. (£ Exhibits 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, and 48.) The manufacturer has absorbed the small difference, not more tha: cents on a garment. ISTo thing comes out of the consumers who buy t underwear, and I suppose that if this investigation had been continu to bnen and cotton the same thing would have been found—that on 1 average the consumer has not paid it. The increase is absorbed by 1 manufacturer. The next proposition is that present prices for an average invoice staple American pearl buttons are 85 per cent higher than for sa qualities impoi ted from Vienna in 1889. I have here a statement prices in Vienna of the various qualities running from 16 to 26 lin and in the United States of the same qualities at the present tir These prices are made by different houses, and they are correct a taken from the price lists in both cases. (See Exhibits 30, 31, 32, a 33.) 1104 SUNDRIES. While it is true tliat some low grades of buttons in Vienna sell at 12J cents per fjrpss, -which are worth in the United States 150 per cent more, if you take the high-grade button of the same size selling in Vienna at 65 J cents per gross, you will discover that the price of that button in the United States is only 25 per cent higher, or 88 cents per gross, so that while the low-grade button is six times as high in the United States as the high grade button, relatively, still the- actual increased cost per dozen buttons of the American goods is a little over 1^ cents per dozen on the low grade, and a little less than 2 cents per dozen on the high grade. (See Exhibit 32.) We have to buy the whole shell and must sell the whole product of the shell. Take the average price in Vienna and in the United States for thirds and for various other qualities, and multiply the average price of each quality by the proportion of that quality found in an aver- age invoice of 100 gross, and we find that the cost of 100 gross of but- tons is $41.75 in Vienna, and $77.40 in the United States, or 41^ cents a gross there, as against 77 J cents per gross here. This calculation shows that the average increased cost of a gross of American over for- eign buttons is 85 per cent. (See Exhibit 30.) Hence you see that all this talk about the duty on pearl buttons being 300 and 400 per cent is utterly untrue. Take the proposed schedule of IJ cents per line and 25 per cent ad valorem, and you will find the cost of the American gross of buttons with this duty added to the Vienna price will be 81.95 cents against 77J cents, the present market price. ( See Exhibi b 31 . ) In other words, if all of the proposed new duty should be added to present foreign prices the price of American buttons would be increased only three-eighths of a cent per dozen over present selling prices. (See Exhibit 31.) This, it seems to me, is conclusive proof as to the lairness and justice of the rate*we ask, and it ought not to be cut down one iota. As to the change in the working of the tariff in the pearl-button schedule, I think the language I suggest in proposition 7 ought to be substituted. Mr. Blumeuthal, himself an importer, agrees with me as to that. I want to say that this industry has improved rajtidly. Machinery has been introduced into these factories, and the cost of buttons is decreasing. The industry does not need an increase of duty nor the retention of the present duty, and 1 have not asked for either to-day; but have merely stated the exact facts and asked that the duty which represents substantially the difference in labor cost be retained. We trust that this committee, after having shown them that this is a proper duty, based on sworn statements, will not cut down the rate we ask for one-quarter of a cent a line, or any other amount, especially as we vol- untarily suggest a reduction of 40 per cent in the specific duty. And in no event should the duty be made purely ad valorem, because the moment you make the duty an ad valorem one on an article of that kind, which depends so much even upon the direction in which the light falls upon it, upon the shades, qualities, and different coloring of button faces, which can only be distinguished by an expert, you will practic- ally destroy the business by opening the door for fraud at the hands of importers. These manufacturers ought not to be subjected to any such dishonest competition. It is absolutely essential that this duty should be partly specific and part ad valorem. I do not know that I have any- thing further to say. Mr. Eeed. Your idea is to have a duty which would be protective? PEARL BUTTONS. 11 Mr. Raymond. My idea is to have a duty whicti -will make up i difference in the eost of production. Mr. Eeed. This cost of production is shown by the sworn stateuK involving labor and capital, and everything which goes to make up i price of the goods between this side and the other side, does it not"] Mr. Raymond. Yes, sir ; the difference in the price is based upon i market prices in Vienna and in New York, Mr. Eeed. It is not, therefore, confined to labor alone, although tl is a very large part of if? Mr. Raymond. Yes, sir; I will state that the proportion of laboi very much larger than here, from this fact; the factory system does : prevail over there except to a Hmited extent. These poor turners and buy a few ijearl shells and work with their families in their rooi and go out in the open market with the finished product and sell Sometimes 300 to 500 of them compete in the same market. It woi make an angel weep to see the small pay sworn to as being received those poor turners. This busiTiess will ultimately go into the fact( system, where improved machinery will reduce the cost to a point which the hand laborer can not support himself in the industry, a more than the old shoemaker in New England could now support h: self as he used to do by 'going around among the families and using their leather in making shoes. If this industry is permitted to sust: itself for a reasonable length of time I assure you that it can ultimat stand on as purely a revenue basis as any other industry; but just m in view of these figures, which I would not misstate to you, it see to me that our request is simjjly fair and just, and I believe that i Democratic party is not going to do anything that wiU intentiona injure the manufacturers of this country. Mr. Reed. On what basis 1 Mr. Raymond. On the facts. Mr. Reed. On the basis of protecting labor? Mr. Raymond. Where the facts can be shown or proven as has b( done in this statement. That is right and in accordance with the Dei cratic platform. Mr. Reed. Is not that the part of the Democratic platform which \ not adopted^ Mr. Raymond. No, sir. Mr. Reed. That point was rejected. Mr. Raymond. All the intelligence and good judgment does not i in the Republican party. The Democratic party represents the majoi of the voters of the CJnited States, and has as much judgment, int< gence, wisdom, and capacity for the government of this great nation has the minority. Mr. Reed. Does it occur to you that you have not answered my qi tion? Are you not maintaining the doctrine which was rejected ? I in sympathy with you now. If what you state is so, ought it not tc extended to other industries! Mr. Raymond. If you are in sympathy with me, and the same v* tive conditions of facts can be shown concerning other protected ind tries, will you sympathize with me to the extent of a reduction of per cent in their duties'? Mr. Reed. That depends upou the circumstances. If I was satisl that enough would be left to protect the industry it might make a ference. Have you found that this additional tariff has resulted higher prices, and beyond that are prices not safe? For instance T H 70 1106 SUNDRIES. give you my idea: If you reduce it materially beyond what you say, it would result in the destruction of this industry, would it not? Mr. Eaymond. I believe so. Mr. Eeed. But if you raise it two or three points higher it would not result in destruction. If you are going to err why not err on that side? Mr. Baymond. I do not think the committee is going to err. Mr. Eeed. That is a pious expectation in which I hope you will be justified. Mr. Eaymond. I have faith in this committee, even in the Eepublican contingent. Mr. Eeed. That is right, you have faith in them in your present line of business. Mr. Eaymond. I think that upon an examination of these exhibits which 1 have offered, this duty would be the only fair one, considering the difference in cost. Some of the manufacturers are using improved machinery, and are making buttons quite cheap. They will utimately succeed in reducing the price of buttons very materially below present figures, and those manufacturers who depend mainly upon hand-labor processes must eventually be forced out of the business. PEABL BUTTONS. (Paragraph 429.) Pkiday, Septemher 15, 1893. Hon. David H. Mercer, of Omaha, Nebr., was recognized to presen the following i)aper : Omaha, Nebe., Se^ptemher 11, 1893. I give you the cost of pearl buttons, line 24, as per card inclosed and made in our factory, and its actual cost per gross, finished and boxed ready for market : Cents. Actual cost of line 24 pearl buttons, at our factory in Omaha, for cutting blanks out of sbell 12 Backing 06 Facing 18 Drilling 03 Polishing 03 Total pay to button-maker per gross 42 Adding to girl for carding '. 04 Cards and thread 01 Paper box 01 Pearl shells to gross (Bombay) 35 Factory expenses I5 Actual cost to us per gross gg One good button-maker (expert) can make 5 gross, line 24, buttons per day, ready for carding, making $2.20 per day, averaging about, each week, from $10 to $12 (working ten hours per day). The girl that sews buttons on cards will average about 20 gross per day, making 80 cents per day; an average button-maker makes about $8 or $9 per week, working ten hours a day. Last year we paid 8 cents more for making said buttons, but this year we have reduced wages on account that buttons are selling cheaper. We are selling pearl buttons at pres- ent at 15 per cent below the so-called black list price of 1889. We have PEARL BUTTONS. 110 our own make machinery, whicb is far better than machinery used i the old countries. I herewith inclose a statement of cost for line 24 pearl buttons i Bohemia, which amounts to 79 kr. per gross, and it costs us 9 cents per gross for making same kind of buttons. If you will take th gross buttons made in Bohemia and sell it in America, for say, th the actual cost at 79 kr. per gross, you could sell it in America fc about 32 cents and take the 32 cents of United States money, exchang it for Austrian money, and you will get yet more than 79 kr. c Austrian money, so you will see that the Austrian or Bohemian mam facturer can sell his buttons in America for less than half what the bu tons cost to make here, and still he will make a profit. Therefore, say that we must have a specific tariff, lar^e enough so that the foreigi ers have to pay the difference between 32 and 98 cents, so that h would have to pay 66 cents duty on one gross of line 24 pearl buttons and corresponding same on all lines. . I think that they will appear before the committee representativ from Eastern manufacturers and they will explain the matter more fulb but we will say that as far as we are concerned, that we can not stan any cut on duty on pearl buttons, as we are working now with very small profit. We have invested in our works over $20,000 < which I myself have put in every dollar except three shares of $10 each, which are owned by three of my workmen. The pay roll of ou factory amounts to about $1,600 per month, and if the duty is lowere I will certainly lose everything, as we can not hire helj) cheaper tha we are doing now. Friend Mercer, I hope that you wUl be able to help to retain at leas the present duty so that I may be able to continue with the works, have put into the industry all of my savings which I saved in the las twenty years, and if the duty is lowered I will be thrown in the mark* in my old age which I could hardly stand. Ever since the question c lowering the duty on pearl buttons commenced my hair turned ha gray and I have not had a good night's sleep since. I have tried i explain everything truthfully and can send affidavits to sustain m assertions. Yours, very truly, Ekank J. Kaspar, President Omaha and Western Button Manufacturing Go. Kr. Actual cost of line 24 pearl buttons made in Bohemia on foot lathe. P<"^ grof Expert button-makers in Bohemia at present are making pearl buttons, line 24, of shell Bombay, at Fini shed ready for carding, and the oarding per gross, they pay Paper cards, thread, and paper box, all Mother-of-pearl shell to gross, Bombay i Tool machinery •- Total Expert button-maker on foot lathe can make 5 gross per day, working twelve hou per day, malsing .56 kr. per day. Before the MoKinley bill they paid for work f game line of buttons 21 kr. more per gross. 1108 SUNDEIES. BUTTONS. (Paragraphs 429, 430.) Thursday, Septemler 7, 1893. STATEMENT OF MB. H. G. KIHGHT, OF EAST HAMPTON, MASS. Mr. Chairman: I am here to-day with Mr. Newell, of Springfield, Mass., to make some statements with regard to the button industry. We are not here to make any argument or any speech unless the facts we present shall constitute an argument for our case, and we will not tax the patience of the committee more than twenty or thirty minutes, I think. The manufacture of buttons, Mr. Chairmen and gentlemen, is one of the smaller industries of the country, but one of great importance to those who are engaged in it and dependent upon it for support. Statis- tics of the census of 1880 show the importance Tof that industry. The census of 1890 will show a considerable increase in the industry, and if the census were taken to-day it would show a far greater increase. In the last year or two a large number of companies have been organized for the manufacture of peaj-l buttons, and there has been a revival of the vegetable-ivory button industry, so that now according to the best estimate we are able to make there are about 200 establishments, cer- tainly 175, engaged in the manufacture of buttons, employing a capital of $3,000,000. The amount annually paid in wages we estimate to be about $2,500,000, the value of the raw material used about $2,500,000, and the value of the product about $7,000,000. These estimates we have are approximately correct, but we can not vouch for their absolute correctness, for they are partly a matter of estimate. We will not trouble the committee with statistics at this time, but I will speak first of the different classes of buttons which are made. The button industry may be divided into four classes, each being indicated by the material chiefly used in their manufacture. Namely, first, manufactures that comes under the commercial or technical designation of cloth-covered buttons, such as most gentlemen wear on their best garments. In this class a great variety of textile fabrics are used. Piece goods and all manner of fancy goods are used, and the variety is very great. The- second class is known as hard buttons made from vegetable ivory, India rubber, bone, ivory, glass, and various compositions. The third class are metal buttons, in which many kinds of metal are used in con- nection with glass or otherwise, and the fourth general classification would be pearl buttons, an important industry which has somewhat Ijeculiar features and has increased greatly of late. Each class of but- tons is made of a great variety of sizes, shapes, patterns, colors, and qualities, varying in size from one-eighth of an inch, which is five Eng- lish line to l| inches, which is 60 English lines, in diameter, and vary- ing in cost from a few cents per gross to several dollars per single gross of 144 buttons. So great is the variety and cost of buttons that it is impossible for any appraiser or merchant, who is not an accomplished expert in such matters, to judge correctly of their cost or value and that has been assigned as the reason, whether it be a valid reason or not, why the duty imposed upon imported buttons should be, partially at least, specific. We have nothing to suggest upon that point any fur- ther. In most kind of buttons labor constitutes a large part of the cost of production. That is especially true of the vegetable ivory button to BUTTONS. 1101 whicli I Ixave referred, as will be seen by the statement prepared b; ray friend, Mr. Newell, who is present, aiid who will, if desired, exliibi samples and explain the process of manufacture. We are here to-day, Mr. Chairman and gentlemen, to represent am speak for two class of buttons, the covered-cloth and the vegetabh ivory button industry, both of which are leading and of the greates importance we think. The pearl-button manufacturers have an organi zation and will speak for themselves by counsel or otherwise. Th metal buttons have been enumerated with other manufactures of meta goods paying a duty of 45 per cent, and we supijose, we do not kno\\ but we suppose the metal button manufacturers, who are very numerou in the country, are satisfied with the present duty. I will call you attention first particularly to covered buttons and the material used i making them. The tariff of 1890, speaking first of the materials use in the manufacture of these goods, says — this is the provision of the tari: under schedule N, paragraph 428 : Lagtiugs, mohair, cloth, silk, or other manufactures of cloth woven or made in pai terns of such size, shape, or form, or cut in such manner as to be fit for buttons exch sively, ten per centum ad valorem. That has been the rate of duty on those goods for many years. A one time they were on the free list, but for many years they have bee subject to a duty of ten per cent. Paragraph 430 of the same scheduh schedule "]sr," Sundries, says: Ivory, vegetable ivory, horn, or bone buttons, fifty per centum ad valorem. The silk buttons, of Which many are made at the present time, mor of silk than any other covered buttons, are subject to the same duty a silk goods in general, 50 per cent ad valorem. The material which goe into this button cloth, all of which is imported, pays a duty of 10 pe cent, and you will therefore see we are protected to the extent of 4 per cent, the difference between the material, which is the cloth, whic is all imported and which must be for the present, and the dut imposed upon the imported buttons. A. good maay buttons are mad of worsted and woolen material; not so many as silk; but the duty o buttons of that class is the same as that which is imposed upon othe woolen goods, and are mentioned in the woolen schedule, paragrap 398, with various other articles. The duty imposed upon importe worsted buttons in that paragraph is ample, and I am free to say i more than really is necessary. If it was of any interest to the commi tee we could show here to-day samples indicating somewhat the kin of covered buttons which are made, the kinds of vegetable-ivory bu tons made, and the material which goes into the manufacture. M Chairman, it is tor you and the committee to say whether I shall ope this package which I have before me or only speak of it. If it is nei essary for the better understanding of the matter we will be pleased i exhibit samples — we could fill this room with samples if necessary, bi we have only brought a few, which we will show if desired. Our business is adjusted to the present tariff laws, and any reductio of duty, with the single exception I have referred to in worsted good, would necessitate a reduction in the wages. Competition is shar] profits are small, and prices were never lower than they are now, tl protection being on the silk buttons, our leading arti(!le, 40 per cen Any sharp reduction would create distress to individuals, to familie and to little communities where the industries are established. In tl town where I reside, Mr. Chairman, with a population of 4,000 or 5,0C people, about one-third of the entire population of that town is direct] 1110 ' SUNDRIES. or indirectly dependent upon this industry for support, and tlie same is true of other localities I believe. We therefore ask that the present rate of duty be continued on silk buttons and on vegetable-ivory but- tons, namely, 50 per cent ad valorem on the silk buttons and 50 per cent ad valorem on buttons composed of vegetable ivory. In the vege- table ivory goods we can see that the labor exj)ended upon the manu- facture of those goods would show a large percentage, and constitutes, probably, more than three-fourths of the entire cost of the goods. Mr. Breckinridge. WiU you let me see those buttons, please? Mr. Knight (opening package). Those are silk buttons, each of one size, and I will say to the committee that of each of these there are probably fifty or sixty patterns. All of these patterns can be made in six, eight, or ten sizes, and ten, fifteen, or twenty colors, so that this rep- resents a number that will run up to the thousands — three thousand at least. Mr. Hopkins. What was the price of those buttons in the retail mar- ket as compared with the prices before the adoption of the present tariff? Mr. Knight. The tariff has been the same for many years, and my^ memory goes back to the time when they cost about twice as much as they do now, when we were dependent upon the imported goods. Mr. Hopkins. When, you depended upon the imported goods did I understand you to say the price was double what they Iiave been since their manufacture in this country under a protective tariff. Mr. Knight. On some kinds it was fully double, and on all kinds it was a good deal in excess of the present prices. Mr. Hopkins. Was the amount of duty on those articles changed in the so-called McKinley bill? Mr. Knight. It was not. Mr. Hopkins. It was continued. Mr. Knight. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Has the price gone down to the same extent on the foreign article? Mr. Knight. Comparatively few buttons of this class are imported at present. I do not know very much about the foreign article of these cloth covered buttons. Mr. Breckinridge. You were speaking of cloth-covered buttons? Mr. Knight. Yes, sir; it remains for the members of the committee to see the material from ^/hich the cloth-covered buttons are made [exhibiting same] ; there are a few of the many. In regard to the cloth- covered buttons I do not care to add anything, but will simply answer any questions that may be asked, if I am able to answer them. Mr. Breckinridge. Are those buttons built upon a wooden or upon an iron shape? Mr. Knight. They are built upon a metal, mostly taggers' iron, so called, and some upon zinc, and some upon brass, but it is chiefly upon taggers' iron made expressly for that purpose. Mr. Breckinridge. Most of them are built upon taggers' iron ? Mr. Knight. They are. Mr. Hopkins. Where are the forms of those buttons upon which the covering is put manufactured, here or abroad? Mr. Knight. The forms are made in various localities — France and Germany, and a few in England, but mostly they are made in France' and Germany, Mr. BuRROVS^S. They are not made in this country at all? Mr. Knight. Very little. BUTTONS. Ill Mr. BuEROWS. Why nof? Mr. Knight. There are localities in France and in Germany, parti( ularly, where the industry has been established a long time and variety of material which is used is collected from various points. Fc instance in Lyons, in the city of Paris, and certain other places, certai things are made. There is no one factory where a variety of butto forms are made. So it is in Germany. They make only the one kin and sead it out. It would be impractical for one, two, or three factorif to make all the material which is requisite. Some efforts have bee made in this country and we ourselves have put some money into with reference to making some of these materials here, but we are nc able to do it successfally, because we can not make enough of any or kind. There is not enough of any one kind required to make it a object to establish these, so we gather them where they are made i France and in Germany. Mr. Breckineige. You are speaking of the form? Mr. Knight. Tes, sir 5 those are the forms. Mr. Hopkins. The covers are manfactured here? Mr. Knight. They are the imported forms. Mr. Dalzell. By forms, do you mean covers? Mr. Knight. The covers of the button. Mr. Hopkins. Where is the metal manufactured? Mr. KJNiGHT. Oh, the metal, of course, is imported and cut here. ' Mr. Beeckinetdge. This article which I hold inmy handis importec we do not make much of this in this country? Mr. Knight. Very little. Mr. Breckineidge. I wish you would describe to us the process ( making these buttons, as made of cloth, whether they are made b machinery or by hand? Mr. Knight. It is done largely by machinery, and that is one reaso why the cost of production has been greatly reduced in the last fe years — in the last quarter of a century. These covers are cut with round chisel. Most of the buttons are composed of five parts. Thei is the face of the button, which we call the shell and the back of tl button, which we call the collet, the center of the button, * piece ( paper, the shank of the button of canvas, and the cover, whatever yo choose, usually silk. Mr. Hopkins. You say the metal is imported also? Mr. Knight. The taggers iron is imported, the zinc and brass ■vf get here. Mr. Hopkins. When you cut it in the form of the button is it dor here or abroad? Mr. Knight. It is done here. Mr. Gear. You import the raw material and it is formed here? Mr. Knight. That is to us the raw material. Mr. Geae. You did not say how many hands were engaged in tl button industry in this country; can you give that? Mr. Knight. In this particular industry? Mr. Geae. The general button industry of all kinds. Mr. Knight. Yes, sir ; we have that. Mr. Geae. I did not notice that you gave it in your statement. Mr. Knight. It is, approximately, 10,000. In 1880 it was 6,025 ; i 1893 it exceeded 8,000, and we think that today it must be betwee 8,000 and 9,000, approaching nearly 10,000 operatives employed in tl various branches of the business. Mr, Gear. What is the class of labor? 1112 SUNDRIES. Mr. Knight. It is mostly operative labor, of course there are a few skilled workmen in those establishments. Mr. Geae. Boys, women, and girls'? Mr. Knight. Boys and girls; about half and half. Mr. Taesnby. Taking the entire cost of operating your plant for a year, including interest on money invested in it, the cost of your raw material of all kinds, and labor pay roll, what per cent of that total cost is represented by the labor? Mv. Knight. The qualities of the buttons vary. Mr. Taesney. Well, silk buttons'? Mr. Knight. On silk buttons it runs from 30 to 40 per cent; on vege- table ivory it runs from 70 to 85 per cent. Mr. Taesney. The entire labor cost, then, in producing silk buttons is from 30 to 40 per ceiif? Mr. Knight. That is the operative labor. Mr. Taesney. And the protection, now, is 40 per cent? Mr. Knight. Yes, sir. Mr. Dalzbll. That does not include the labor on the raw material, which comes to you ? Mr. Knight. Not at all. The labor, I compute, is after we receive it. Mr. Taesney. After you receive it? Mr. Knight. Yes, sir. Mr. Taesney. The labor of preparing the material abroad is included in the purchase price? Mr. Knight. Certainly. Mr. Taesney. Which is included in the expense of the material? Mr. Knight. At the present time there are about fifteen companies, firms, engaged in the manufacture of ivory buttons in this country, and they have been able to pursue it with only a small profit under the tariff of 1890, the duty being 50 per cent ad valorem. The prices of ivory buttons are much lower than formerly, and were never lower in our market than they are now. The improvements in machinery and tools have enabled us to reduce the cost of the product to some extent. These fifteen concerns turn out a product of about $1,000,000 a year at the rate they are running now, giving employment to 1,500 people or more, and a support to more than they employ. At the same time the importation of ivory buttons amounts to almost $600,000 a year, thus showing that under the present tariff we divide the business with foreign manufacturers, and the present duty therefore affords to-day revenue and protection. The imports of buttons into this country for the year 1891 aggregated $1,277,000; in 1892, $1,292,000; for the first seven months of this year, $820,000. If it goes through at that rate for the present year the imports will exceed $1,200,000. This includes ivory buttons, glass buttons, pearl buttons, metal buttons, and agate buttons. Mr. Beeckineidge. Those are not imports of ivory buttons exclus- ively, to which you have just alluded? Mr. Knight. ]S"o, sir ; the imports of ivory buttons I can give sepa- rately. The imports of ivory buttons for the seven months of this year was $700,000. Mr. Beeckineidge. How long have we been making ivory buttons in this country? Mr. Knight. It was commenced in the seventies. It was established as a good business in 1874. About one-third, it will be seen by the figures given, of the ivory buttons used in this country are imported. A slight reduction of the duty on those goods would necessitate the reduction of wages of the operatives here, and a material reduction BUTTONS. Ill would prove destructive to tLe industry iu this country. Labor coi stitutes a large percentage of the cost of producing these goods and th present duty is only equal to the difference between the labor here an the labor iu the same industry abroad. We have reliable statistics c prices paid for labor in this industry abroad. Mr. Gear. Where are these foreign ivory buttons made? Mr. Knight. They are manufactured in Germany, some in Austria and some in France, but more in Germany than in any other country Formerly some were made in England, but the German product ha crowded out the English. Mr. BuEEOW^s. Did you say you had a table showing the rate ( wages paid abroad ? Mr. Knight. We have it. Mr. BUEEOWS. Have you it here? Mr. Knight. We have not a table here showing those wages, but w know beyond all doubt what they are. Why, I have had the inforniE tion, personally, froili the manufacturers whose establishments I hav visited. Mr. Btjeeows. Can you secure a table of the wages paid abroad i this industry? Mr. Knight. I can, easily. Mr, Bueeows. Will you forward it to the chairman of this commil tee? Mr. Knight. If you desire. Mr. Dalzell. We want a comparative statement of the wages her and abroad. Mr. Knight. Yes, sir; Mr. Newell, will you remind me of the neces sity of having that done? Gentlemen, as I said in the beginning, I did not purport to make an speech or argument, and I will not detain you further, but will ask Mi Newell to show you some of the ivory buttons, stock, and the ra^ material, and add anything that may occur to him to what I have saic "We can not believe and do not believe that your honorable committe will favor legislation which will destroy or cripple the two industrie represented by us, the covered button industry and the vegetable ivor industry. We thank you for giving us this opportunity to be heard and with your permission we will file a paper containing the substanc of what we have said to-day and such additional points as may occu to us. Mr. Whiting. Tou say the forms are imported, and the covering? Mr. Knight. The covering we call the form. Mr. Whiting. There is a metallic form which the buttons are mad upon? Mr. Knight. There is a metallic form on which they are made. Mr. Whiting. Is that imported? Mr. Knight. That is not. Mr. Whiting. You make that? Mr. Knight. Yes, sir. Mr. Taensey. But you make it out of imported taggers iron? Mr. Whiting. Does that enter largely in the cost ? Mr. Knight. That is an item; the duty on that is about 40 per ceni Mr. Whiting. You put the buttons together here? Mr. Knight. We import the cover and cut the cover, there ar numerous processes of cutting it, some more rapid than others, and w cut the metal jjarts of the forms and we japan, or tin, or silver, or gild ii Mr. Whiting. You refer to covered buttons? 1114 SmSTDRIES. Mr. Knight. We use mostly imported forms or covers, like this we hare shown you here. Mr. Whiting. In regard to covered buttons, you import the form and you import the metal and you put it together here? Mr. Knight. Tes, sir. Mr. Whiting. And the 50 per cent on that you wish retained? Mr. Knight. 50 per cent is the duty on the imported buttons, silk buttons, and the duty on the taggers iron is about 40 per cent, so our protection is little less than 40 per cent. Mr. Hopkins. In what form is that taggers iron imported which you use, how does it come, cut up so you can put the forms over it? Mr. Knight. l^^To ; it comes in sheets. Mr. Hopkins. Explain that fully to the committee. Mr. Knight. It comes in sheets, any length we desire. The common size is 10 inches wide and 28 inches long; some is 14 and some longer. We have it come in sheets such as we may order so as to conveniently handle it in our machines. Mr. Hopkins. When it comes in that form what do you do to it? Mr. Knight. We cut it. Mr. Hopkins. Describe the process you go through in getting it so you can put the silk cover over it and make a button? Mr. Knight. We cut the back of the button. Sometimes it is a blank and we have to perforate it. We stamp that with our trade-mark. The back of the button we call the coUet. We cut the canvas that forms a shaiik and the cover, and then we put all that into the machine which brings the parts together and turns it oat a finished button. Mr. Hopkins. Is not that taggers iron of which you speak manu- factured in this country? Mr. Knight. Very little is manufactured in this country. The article we use is specially manufactured for button-making and for umbrella checks. Mr. Gear. Bo you use one number, altogether? Mr. Knight. No ; several numbers. Mr. Gear. Eunning from what. Mr. Knight. 32 to 38 wire gauge. Mr. Whiting. All the parts of the button are imported and put together here; is that the fact? Mr. Knight. All the material is imported. Mr. Gear. You manufacture this material into different forms? Mr. Knight. Yes, sir. When I say " all," there are buttons we make from cotton and various materials, made in this country in a small way. Mr. Hopkins. Explain in regard to these buttons, why they are made out of materials produced in this country? Mr. Knight. We make a large quantity of buttons, for shirts and drawers, of cotton, on zinc or brass that is used on underwear, and is a very cheap article. We make large quantities of those, and they are made wholly of goods that are not imported. Mr. Whiting. They have taken the place of the pearl buttons? Mr. Knight. To some extent. Mr. Whiting. Because the pearl buttons were too high? Mr. Knight. I believe that is the reason. Mr. Whiting. The pearl button is much better for that use? Mr. Knight. Much better, and there is another button which is taking the place of the pearl, an agate button which is not made in this coun- try at all. It is made in certain localities where there are pottery BUTTONS. 11] establishments, where the labor is next to nothing, and they are so there very cheap. They are sold down to 38 and 48 cents a gross, 3 4 cents a dozen. Mr. Payne. Vegetable ivory is used all over the world? Mr. Knight. To some .extent. Mr. PAYTVfE. There is not anything that could equal it anywhere? Mr. Knight. Well, it is said to be the best article that has ever bet used. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen, Mr. Newell will now show you son samples of vegetable ivory. They are made in an immense variety ai what he says and shows you will give you some idea of them. Before sit down, Mr. Chairman, may we be permitted to put in, very soon, paper setting forth the substance of what we have said to-day, wi such other points as may occur to us? The Chairman. Your testimony has been taken down by the ste ographer there. Mr. Knight. Well, I hope he has it down correctly. Mr. Geae. You will not forget that table in regard to wages? Mr. Knight. We have had but a few moments to prepare for th hearing, as we only had notice for a short time. Mr. Gear. I think you made an incorrect statement, inadvei^tentl I think you stated the raw material was so much and the product wi only about $200,000 more than the raw material, and I think that is mistake which you perhaps would like to correct in your testimony. Mr. Knight. Those statistics apply to the whole button industr but I will give it to you correctly. Mr. Gear. You stated that the raw material used was $2,500,01 and the product was $2,700,000. Mr. Knight. The product is $7,000,000. Mr. Gear. You did not state that. (See same corrected.) Mr. Breckinridge. You give those two items, what you pay f labor and material, as covering the cost of the production? Mr. KJNIGHT. The cost of labor and material separately. Mr. Breckinridge. Is it your purpose in giving the two to cov the cost of production, what you pay for labor and pay for material? Mr. Knight. Yesj that would cover the cost of production. Button industry of the United States, from the census of 18S0. Number of establishments , ] Amount of capital invested $2, 013, S Persons employed 6, 8 Wages paid annually $1,645, 1 Value of materials used 1,792,8 Value of product 4, 449, E Value of product is supposed to be tbe total amount of sales. Button industry of the United States as estimated in 1S9S. Number of establishments ] Amount of capital invested $2, 700, ( Persons employed 9, ( Wages annually $2, 400, C Value of materials used 2, 600, ( Product, gross sales 6, 000, ( Less commission and cash discount. 720, ( Net proceeds 5, 280, ( For year ending July 1, 1893. Horatio G. Knight LI 16 SUNDEIES. IVORT BUTTOlSrS. ( Paragraph 4S0.) STATEMENT OF MB. N. C. NEWELL, OF SPEINGFIELD, MASS. Mr. Chairman: I liaVe a sample of the vegetable ivory nut and the 7!ay tUey cut it out which will perhaps be of interest to you [exhibiting same]. Mr. BuEEOWS. Where does that come from? Mr. ]S"e"well. South America, Central America, largely Panama, A.spinwall, and different places. Mr. BtTEEOWS. That is what the button is made out of? Mr. Newell. Yes, sir ; there is a piece of button turned out of there. The center of it is all waste. We only get about 400 pounds of buttons )ut of a ton of nuts. The center is full of cracks and can not be used It all. Mr. BtJEEOWS. Is the material free? Mr. Newell. The material is free. There is no duty on it. Mr. Dalzell. What is it called in the tariff schedule? Mr. Kewell. I think it is called vegetable ivory; it is only known in :his country as that. There may be a scientific name. This goes :hrougli some 12 or 15 processes according to the variety of buttons. Taking a plain button like this they are much simpler to make than the i^arious colors; some of them are nicely colored, some are imitation Duckhorn, and, as I say, some would require 12 operations, and some )thers would be 15 or more. Now, I wish to say a word in regard to ;he percentage of labor on the vegetable ivory button. On such a but- ;on as that it is 75 per cent labor; that is the proportionate cost of labor. Mr. Payne. That is called the plain colored button? Mr. Newell. Yes, sir; we make these in all shades, of course, so that :hey would match different garments, and for mixed garments we put QQixed colors. It is the finest material in the world to take color. There is nothing whatever equal for a button, and the more it is worn the brighter it polishes, while the rubber and most other materials grow lull ; but with friction from wear this brightens. Mr. Dalzell. Is not that business comparatively new. Mr. Newell. No; Mr. Knight said that the business commenced in L874, but he is mistaken about that. We were making them in 1865, md it is an industry that really got ahead of the old country to start with. Although they manufacture them in England to a small extent we got into it very largely before they got into it, and thus we have iriven them to the wall on it. Mr. Breckineidge. When did this industry begin first? Mr. Newell. I was stating we commenced it ourselves about 1865. Mr. Breckinridge. Were you the first to make it? Mr. Newell. No; there were one or two other concerns, but a little ihead of us only. Mr. Br;pckineidge. When did they begin? Mr. Newell. I could not tell you, but it was only two or three years before we did. Mr. Geae. After 1860. Mr. Newell. After 1860 I am quite sure. IVORY BUTTONS. Ill' Mr. BxJEBOWS. Can you state the extent of the output in this countr; of that kind of button? Mr. I^Tewell. Well, it is — I could not tell you exactly. Our capac ity is about 2,000 gross a day. Mr. BxjBROWS. Does it supply the domestic demand? Mr. Newell. Yes, sir; we have enough machinery in this countr; to sai>ply the domestic demand entirely, but we are not able to entire! compete with foreign manufacturers. Mr. Burrows. Why not? Mr. Knight. Well, it is entirely on account of the cost of laboi because we get our material just as cheap as they do and it is entirel, on labor. Mr. Payne. Where does the competition come from ? Mr. I^J'ewell. It comes from Germany and Austria largely. Mr. Gear. What is the relative difference between the labor c Germany and Austria and this country; can you answer that? Mr. Newell. No, sir; I can not, except it is known. I did not suj: pose it would be necessary to state that, because everybody has ha( that very often told them, that in Aiistria it is about one-third and ii England about one-half. Mr. Gear. Everbody does not believe It although everybody ha heard it probably. Mr. Newell. There are men working for me now who can verify a] these statements and do. The Chairman. These are per diem wages? Mr. Newell. They are the wages per day. The Chairman. When you say labor is cheaper there than her you mean per diem labor? Mr. Newell. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. In proportion to what a man produces is the labo cheaper there than here? Mr. Newell. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Do you know whether the labor here is any more efB cient and produces more goods than the labor there? Mr. Newell. Well, our experience is that the laborer from Europ at first perhaps is a little slower, but put him beside one of our employ^ and its only a few weeks when they are right by their side. Of cours they must do the same to earn the same pay. Mr. Payne. They are paid by the piece entirely? Mr. Newell. Everything we do is by the piece. Mr. Payne. How do wages compare by the piece in England an( Germany in your business? Mr. Newell. The price is regulated really by what they would ear; by the week. That is just about a certain sum. Our girls earn on a: average $6.18 a week. Some of them would earn $7 and $8 a wee' who are very smart, and others would go below the $6.18. Now me: who work on this Mr. Hopkins. You stated the labor you paid here compared wit: what is paid in England is twice as much. Do you jnean you pay twic as much for the labor as for the same amount of work turned out i: England? Mr. Newell. Yes, sir; we do. Mr. Hopkins. How is it as compared with the product which i turned out in Germany? Mr. Newell. You mean as to the quantity? Mr. Hopkins. I mean as to the product. 1118 SUNDRIES. Mr. Newell. Well, I should say the German workman would do a trifle more in their own country than the English workmen. Mr. Hopkins. You did not get the point I am after. You know, I suppose, how much it costs you to produce a gross of buttons'? Mr. Newell. Yes, sir. Mr. Hopkins. How much does it cost in labor to produce that gross of buttons in Germany? Mr. Newell. 1 could only answer that by saying one-third of the labor, one-third of what it costs here. IMr. Hopkins. That is, the German manufacturer, your competitor in Germany, can produce a gross of buttons for one- third of the cost of labor that you pay here? Mr. Newell. Yes, that is our information from there; yes, sir. Mr. Whiting. Have you men from Germany working in your fac- tory? Mr. Newell. Yes, sir. Mv. Whiting. You think you pay them two-thirds more than they get at home when they come here? Mr. Newell. Three times as much; yes, sir. Mr. Whiting. Asa matter of liberality and to aid the community established around you? i\Ir. Newell. Well, our wages are fixed from the industries around us. All industries pay their help about the same prices, otherwise they would go from place to place. In order to secure our labor we have to pay as much as the envelope maker or the girls who work in the cotton mills, or other mills, so there is about an equalization of the labor around us, and that governs the price of their work. Mr. Gear. You do not do -it out of charity, but do it because you have to ? Mr. Newell. Yes, sir. Our men -average on this work $11.94 a week, and all we ask of course in this is to equalize the difterence in labor. Mr. Taksney. What is the factory price per gross of these buttons finished? Mr. Newell. I could give you all of those sizes if you wish. Here IS a vest and coat size, 24 lines, 50 cents, and 30 lines, is 65 cents, fac- tory price. Of course there is the cost of selling and a discount for cash, 6 per cent for ten days, 5 per cent for thirty days, etc. Mr. Bkeckineidge. I understood you to say that you pay your workmen not by the day but by the piece? Mr. Newell. Yes, sir; by the grogs. Mr. Breckinridge. You did not give us their wages, however, in the form in which you pay them; you have given their wages computed by the day and by the week? Mr. Newell. Yes;, that is what they run per week where they work by the week. This work is counted up and they are credited each by what they earn according to the number of gross they turn out. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you know what is the price of piecework of a corresponding character of work abroad? Mr. Newell. No, sir; I am not able to give you that. Mr. Breckinridge. Can you leave that card of buttons with us and give us a statement of how much you pay the workmen by the gross for each one of those numbers? Mr. Newell. You see I will have to give the various operations. The turning is perhaps 3 cents, sawing a cent and a half a pound, and would be made up in that way. BONE BUTTONS. 1119 Mr. Breckinridge. You pay them tliat way ; therefore the safest statement would be to give us a statement of what it costs just in the form in which j'ou j)ay them. I do not ask you to give it immedi- ately. Mr. Reed. He pays for the different operations. Mr. Breckinridge. But I want him to give a statement of what he pays tor each one. Mr. Newell. I can give you a statement of what each operation costs. Mr. Breckinridge. Exactly, so we can know exactly what you pay in wages for each one of these numbers. Mr. Newell. I have given the total labor cost on buttons here. Mr. Dalzell. No one operative makes a complete button ? Mr. Newell. Oh, no ; they go through fifteen or twenty processes before you get the button. Mr. Breckinridge. And you pay each one by the piece? Mr. Newell. Yes, sir; by the gross. Mr. Breckinridge. I will be very much obliged if you will give us a detailed statement of these various items, and to make it so that we can find out in that way just how much you pay your laborers. Mr. Newell. If you take the cost of that button, the samples on that card Mr. Breckinridge. You can take your own time about making that out. Mr. Payne. Do you make the highest grade of goods? Mr. Newelt.. We make the very highest grade made. Mr. Payne. The buttons which are more ornamental, I suppose, in color and finish ? Mr. Newell. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Will you state what percentage of labor is involved in the highest grade? Mr. Newell. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. What per cent of cost of labor is there in the highest grade, the best grade you make? Mr. Hopkins. Better give a statement about the character of the foreign? Mr. Newell. I could not give it exactly now, but I stated it was from 75 to 85 per cent labor, 85 for the highest grade. Mr. Payne. That answers the question, 75 to 85 per cent! Mr. Newell. Yes, sir. BOISTE BUTTONS. (Paragraph 130.) statemeitt op leopold moeitz, 1321 north fifth street, philadelphia, pa. • •• September 8, 1893. Mr. Chairman : I hope you will excuse me, because I do not speak good English. I will try and do the best I can, so that you will under- stand me. We are manufacturing bone buttons, and three years ago, in 1889, we were entirely knocked out of the market. Bone buttons were imported for less than we paid -in wages to make them. I have got the rate here, and I will hand it to Mr. Dalzell to be read. 1120 SUJSDEIES. (Mr. Dalzell read the paper as follows :) Mr. Leopolu MoitiTZ, 1S$1 North Fifth Street, Philadelphia, Pa. : Sir : Yours of the 13th at hand. If you ha;l made us the same oflfer some time ago we would wrote you that we could not sell your goods. We could have sold 2,000 or 3,000 gross for you ; hut now a new enemy is in the iield. The imported goods are now being sold here to our trade at $1 a great gross for a 27-line. If you can make us a price so that we can compete with them, we are willing to place an order. They cost ahout 85 cents to land here, and A-22 about 52 cents. Yours truly, Mr. MoEiTZ (continuiug). Now, gentlemen, you see at what price they can be imported. I^ow, if you want to see it particularly, I will show what it costs to manufacture; but still, I suppose, you will take my word. These buttons have got to go through the hand twelve times, four times, one by one, before they can be backed. Those twelve boxes make a great gross, and the labor paid for the same is 90 cents, and you have seen here what, they were imported for in 1885. Of course, we had to go out of business and lose the couple of dollars that we had saved. The McKinley bill put them at 50 per cent and we have come over here to beg- you not to take that duty off. Please leave it on, so that we can make these buttonS; We won't know what to do if we are knocked out, for that reason we have come over here to ask you to leave it on. I see some gentlemen laugh, but it is nothing to laugh at. Mr. Payne. It is no laughing matter for you! Mr. MORITZ. No, sir; I came into this country to work. This is the greatest country on earth. There is not another on earth like it. I am surprised that we have to come over here to talk about that ques- tion. Now, gentlemen, I was 20 years old when I came to this country. 1 never earned more than $2.50 a week in Germany. Now, that is not very nice. It is very hard for a boy to come away from his father and mother. You will all agree to that; but still I want to say what brought me away. If you ask me what I did there I will tell you freely. I thought I could make more money on this side, and I made up my mind to come here. I had my first free lodging in Castle Garden. It was not because I did not have the money, but because I wanted to save the money I had. Well, I did not sleep very well in Castle Garden, and I was rather sorry I did sleep there. Next morning I went out- side, and the first thing that attracted my attention was a workingmau who came along with a shovel and a coal basket. He went up to a stand and bought a dozen oranges. Now, I thought he had an order from some rich man to buy the oranges. I saw that he took one and ate it. I never had seen a workingman in Germany eat oranges. It looked to me as though oranges were only for very rich people, but soon I noticed the workingmen eating them. I said to myself, " This is the country where I will be at home," and I made no mistake. Mr. Bynum. They are not buying oranges over in New York now, but are waiting for bread. Mr. MOEITZ. Yes, gentlemen ; I am sorry to say it looks very bad. Of course I am a workingman to-day. I work to-day, and can sym- pathize with the working people. For some people it is very hard, for they have got no bread and no work. I can not see how it is. Of course, this is a kind of panic, they say, but still I do not know what is before us. I think I could give you my opinion, but you might then laugh again ; but still I have my opinion about it, and it is not worth while, perhaps, for me to say anything more. CONE BUTTONS. 1121 Mr. Burrows. What is your opinion ? Please state it, iu a word. Mr. MORITZ. Very well, and I will try to inake it sliort. You see, this country is rather proud. Of course, we liave a right to be proud, but still there is one thing;, and tliat is that the European people have our bonds and stocks. We have to pay interest on them. I calculate that the Euroi)ean people own our gold. Of course, we have it now, but if we would pay our debts we would not ha^e much left. There is another thing. Our people go over there. We want to pay our interest; yet we can do one thing, and that is, if you people, who are regarded as the fathers of this country, tell your children: "Oliildren, you must do your own work; you must not get your work done in foreign countries." If we do our own work our money will stay here and we will get rich. If we do not do our own work the money will go away and wc will be poor. I can see no dift'erence. If a man goes to the wall, like we did, and loses liis business, then he thinks about it. It was in Philadelphia, where hundreds of dollars worth of machinery was sold at action. It was button machinery. Some years ago, Phila- delphia had about 5,000 people employed in making bone buttons, but we can not now make them any more. Some smart manufacturers now import buttons. The other ones concluded they would lose everything. The machines were sold at auction, and nobody would buy them. A man came to n^e and said, '' ^loritz, buy those machines." I said: " I don't know; perhaps in a week I might be compelled to sell them again, and nobody would offer anything for them." They were sold as old iron. I say it is a pity to see that, and that thing should hot happen. We should do our own work, for that is best for everyone. I would like to show you something now on that point. Here is a piece of pumice-stone [exhibiting a small stone.] We use that iu our business, and it is imported. It is on the free list, fi-om what I hear. ZSTow, I never like to tell a lie. I will tell you, first, that I bought that for two and one eighth and two and three-eighths of a cent. On the 14th of June, I bought 279 pounds of that pumice-stone, and a man told ine the price was tour cents. I said, "How is that?" as the price always was 2J cents. He said he did not know. One man said they put on the duty on the other side, and the second one said he did not know. I went to the third one. The third one told me that they had made a combination. I did not know whether the combina- tion was made on the other side or on this side; but still they told me it was a combination. They were sold for four cents. Of course I was of the of)inion that they would come down again. I asked him again about it, and he told me that sometime they would go higher; and then I asked him again, and he told me that they were bought in " lump; " that is to say, they come from the other side at. a cost of about 4 J cents. Gentlemen, in my opinion this pumice stone could be manufactured here, and the importer could not run thcxprice up to 4^ cents. Mr. Tarsney. Had we not better put a duty on it now? Mr. MoKiTZ. I do not know. You see that shows that the importer is not always for the consumer. Mr. Dalzell. Pumice stone is not an artiticial product; it is a natural stone. Mr. MoRiTZ. Yes, sir; I am not as much acquainted with the matter as ^ ou are. i have some buttons here, which I will show you [exhibiting some buttons]. There is the collar button Ave sell, but we can not make it TH 71 1122 SUNDRIES. any more. They are all imported. I can not see why .50 per cent ad yalorem diity shonld be enonyh. I think tlifv must be undervalued. Mr. Whiting. You say the button can be imported for less thau your labor costs ' Mr. IMOEITZ. I said three years ago — from 18S9. Mr. Whiting. Until the time the'diity was put on? Mr. MoRiTZ. Yes, sir. - Mr. Whiting. Would it not be cheaper for the consumers in this country to give you a bounty and allow you to lie idle, rather than to have the buttons made here 'I Mr. MOEITZ. I want to show you how unjust it is to us here. It is on the free list, and the importer itays two and a half. For instance, you would pay me or any other button-maker a bounty, and yon would be as badlj^ off as ever. As S'lon as the importer finds o.ut he has got no competition, then he has got the jnuiket. Mr. Bynittvi. Is there no competitioa between importers? You have said they were selling at that time for less than the labor cost. They put them in here very cheap. Mr. MoKiTZ. But then, we made buttons here. Mr. Whiting. At a loss 1 Mr. MoEiTZ. Yes, sir. Mr. Geae. You siiut up your factories? Mr. MoEiTz. Well, we worked about half time. Mr. Tarsney. You were making them at a loss, and the reason you did not shut up was that you were making so many? Mr. MoKiTZ. Of course. 1 think I have already said a little too much. [Laughter.] I can tell >'ou that I lost money that year, and I would not stand it another year. I say that to you frankly. Of course, we have got this machinery. We people have got some feeling for the working people. I will tell you another thing. The manufacturer comes over here to see this Committee on Ways and Means. The manufacturer is really in no need of protection, or, at least, he needs less protection. ISo man in this room, if he goes into manufacturing — I don't care who he is or how much money he has — goes into it without the object of making a living and paying the interest on his money. He does it to make a profit. If a man makes no profit, he has to fail. Now, for instance, I make these buttons or any other thing, if a man comes in and manufactures them against me, he must make them for so much less than I can; and if he can not make them at a ])roflt, what must he do"? He must go back to his -workmen and say, " Gentlemen, I can not pay that price." If they will not work at that price, he will have to stop. I say it surprises me. Why is the American market so good? As I told yon before, the American workingm an lives like a lord as compared with the European laborer. The workingman here takes his money and spends it; but still if you should bring him to the same level with the workingman on the other side he could not do it. The workingman on the other .side does not have all the meat he wants to eat. The laborer here gets it three times a day. On the othsr side he does not wear half as much clothes, and, of course, he has to patch ninety-nine times out of a hun- dred; but here he buys new clothes; that makes a difference. When the workingmen have plenty of money, we are prosperous. Take it away from them and we have the same circumstances as on the other side. Mr. Whiting. Then, to be prosperous is to be extravagant. BONE BUTTONS. 1123 Mr. MoEiTZ. Well, we are rather extravagant. Mr. Whiting. The extravagance comes from the Grsvernment. Mr. MoRiTz. I think it does. It is very nice if a rich man can see the workingmeu getting along so well. When you see that the poor workingnian can not buy what he likes, it is pretty hard. I know how that is, for I went through those circumstances; and, of course, you people who have not done that can not appreciate it so well as a man who has. The Chairman. What was the occupation of the American working- man wh® bought the dozen of oraages? Mr. MoKiTZ. He had a shovel and a coal basket. [Laughter.] The Chairman. He was a coal shoveler, and was not engaged in a I)rotected industry. Mr. MoRiTz. No, sir; but still, Mr. Chairman, you can see that this whole country is one family. If one part of the country suffers the other ATill suffer. If we can not make a living in Philadelphia we can go somewhere else. We will go to Baltimore, and if we can not get a living there we will go down South or out West. The Southern man does not want us because he says there is too much competition there now. Mr. Turner. Did the workingnian buy the one^ dozen oranges as a foundation for his breakfast? Mr. Payne. The chairman's idea is that the Government should send the coal over and have the shoveJing done on the other side. The Chairman. E"o; that is not my idea. Mr. Moritz. Now, if you gentlemen have got nothing more to say, I have not. I hope you will allow the duty to stay. Mr. Burrows. Are you satisfied with the present rate of duty ? Mr. Moritz. Yes, sir. Mr. BtiRROViTS. Can you do business at that rate? Mr. MoRiTZ. Yes, sir. Mr. Burrows. If we do not allow you the rate what will be the effect? Mr. MoRiTZ. We will have to stop the factory. Mr. BYNIT3I. Or would have to go to doing something else. Mr. Moritz. Yes, sir; if you cut off the duty. Mr. Bynum. But the other fellow would get it cheaper. Mr. Moritz. Well, if you take off the duty I can go to the other side and make them over there. I would not hke to do that, but I would make monej\ We can get workmen over there at from $1 to $2 a week. I could send the goods over here. Mr. Byntim. When you would send the goods over here, would you not Jiave to buy something to take back. Mr. Moritz. Well, we could make that up by writing letters. I know the customers now. You see I would have that advantage. The Chairman. Gentlemen, the next meeting will be at 2 o'clock, and at that time Mr. Storer will be heard on the question of hops. And thereupon the committee took a recess. 1124 SUNDRIES. COAL. (Paragraph 482). Tuesday, September 19, 1893. STATEMENT OF HON. H. G. DAVIS, OF WEST VIEGINIA. Mr. Chairman: 1 have a map here which represents the coal fields of the United States. It is well known, as will appear from the number present today who are interested in coal, that it is one of the great interests of this country, and one that should not be passed by lightly. I believe the chairman of the committee has allotted us one hour and thirty minutes, and I ask the question now so that it may be understood by the gentlemen who are to speak. I will occupy but ten minutes. It is known by all, x>erhaps, that anthracite is the coal used on the Atlantic coast for general domestic purposes, and that has been on the free list for many years. Bituminous coal, which we are liere especially to represent, is used for hardly anything else except in the manufacture of gas and for consumption by locomotives. It pays a duty of 75 cents a ton, which duty is lower considerably than the general list of dutiable goods. It is believed by the bituminous coal people that there should be a move up, and not a move down, in coal, with respect to the tariff. There are people here to-day from four States, and it is hardly neces- sary to argue for free coal. It would not be thought about. As I see present the distinguished representative from Massachusetts (Mr. Stev- ens), I want to say that the people of New England could not consist- ently ask free coal, and at the same time say to the rest of us that we must pay two or three times as much on our goods which they manu- facture. We say to the people of New England, although they use a good deal of coal, to let it remain where it is. The duty on coal is more of an item in the way of revenue. Statistics show that Canada received about amillion dollars from the United States for the coal which is shipped there. For instance, last year I think Canada received about $1,()00,0()0 revenue on coal. Our Government received from bituminous coal during the last two years nearly a million dollars each year. I think it was $817,000 for the year ending June 30, 1893. So that I think in these days, when there is such a call for economy, this item is needed in revenue. There is a very considerable aj^prehpusion among coal men that cer- tain British American coals may be made free, and so in some way become a more serious rival than it has ever been, from the fact that the newspapers say, and it is generally believed in the country, that a ■ very formidable company, and a company certainly composed of very prominent and aggressive gentlemen in New York and Boston, has recently been formed, with large investments in Nova Scotia. Our people natiirally expect that free coal would be very dangerous to them. Mr. Eeed. Would it not be in the interest of the couvsumer"? Mr. Davis. It would be in the interest of the New England manufac- turer and consumer generally. I have stated that consumers generally in New England, and all over the Atlantic coast, use anthracite coal; and these gentlemen would very likely want to promote the interest of persons other than those perhaps; but it is hardly fair — certainly it is not here — to argue their cause. We arc here believing that they are on the wrong track, and you gentlemen should keeiJ them where they are now, and not let them COAL. 1125 make great fortunes upon tlie misfortunes of our mining districts. This coal interest is not a local one; it is a geneial one. To-day there are four States represented here, and it is perhaps the largest delega- tion you have ever had before you since you began hearings. There are about 100 people here from all sections. aTheir interests have brought them here. They know the interest of the miner and tlie operatives in Virginia, West Virginia, Pennsylvania, and. Maryland are in jeopardy, and they are here for the purpose of impressing upon you gentlemen the importance of keeping your hands off this industry. If the duty should be changed it ought to go up rather than go down. I will take pleasure in answering any questions which you gentlemen may wish to present. There is one point bearing on this which I have not touched upon. You will recollect that in 1854 coal from British America was free. In the early part of that year you know that no coal came to the United States. During the three last years there was nearly 1,200,000 tons, or $400,000 worth, per annum brought into the United States, which was at that time about one-fifth the entire seaboard consumption of coal. The next three years, when the duty was $1.25, it fell off very rapidly, and they only brought in about 8 per cent, showing that with the duty at 75 cents the exports were very great, and when the duty was $1.25 they were very much less. The Canadian coal is the only sharp competitor we have. For the year ending June 30, 1892 — I have not the figures for 1893 — Englard sent to the United States herself 300,000 tons, and paid a duty of 75 cents per ton. Take that duty off, which, perhaps, is four times as much as we make on coal on an average, and the result will be that a very large percentage of both coal from the provinces and from Eng- land will come to this country. The facts are that we can not afford in the present condition of the industry to. have any duty whatever taken off' coal. I have stated in the beginning, and the chairman will hand you a statement which shows, that coal is now a little over 22 per cent in duties on the general list; while the dutiable goods on the entire list are about 50 ]3er cent. The coal duty -is about one-half less than all the other articles combined which the consumer uses. There has been something said about reciprocity with Canadian coal. That may come about, but it is time enough when the offer is made to consider it, and it will hardly come to us. As to the tariff' on coal, it will be recollected that the first tariff, of which Mr. Madison was the author and patron, I believe, put coal at 56 cents per ton. The early tariff" law was, I believe, per bushel or ad valorem; but, for the sake of con- venience, I will put it in tons. The tariff of 1892, which was the next one, put coal at $1.25, and following on down to 1812, when it was $2.80 a ton during the war at that time. One difficulty about it is that we can not get it to the seaboard. What is known as Mr. Clay's tariff, in 1842, put coal at $1.75. What is known as the Walker tariff of 1846, followed up by the tariff of 1847, put coal at an ad valorem duty of 30 per cent in 1846 and 24 per cent in 1847. That was considered to be a low tariff' on coal, and yet that was at the rate of $1.20 per ton, while it is now 75 cents a ton. I name these tariffs more especially to show that in the early days of the Gov- ernment the coal was above the rest of the dutiable goods, taking them as a whole. The duties today are far below the average of the duti- able list. It is thought by the miner and by the operator, too, that if coal is 1126 SUNDRIES. made free, whicli I liope it is not to be, everytliing else tliat the miner and operator uses, the piok, the shovel, the hat, coat, etc., should not be taxed. When coal comes to the seaboard, which is the place where the price of it is affected, it is probably 96 per cent labor. Coal is worth but 10 to 15 cents in the mine, and when it comes to the seaboard it is all labor cost, except thai 10 or 15 cents. The whole of the product is American labor; and it coal is made free from any cause, there is no way that I can imagine by which we can compete, except by going to the laborer and saying, " You must take less for your labor;" and by going to the railroads and saying, "You must take less for transpor- tation." Keep in mind that the British coals ar« practically at the seaboard. I believe that in the British possessions the coal is dumped, in many instances, right from the mine into the vessel. Perhaps 20 miles would make the average of all the transportation in the English j)rovinces. In our cases we are from 200 to 400 miles from the sea, and we have to transport it that distance by rail. If we put it on the cars at the same rate that the vessels charge that 200 to 400 miles is against us, and the 75 cents will not pay for transportation that distance. Coal is sometimes called a raw material. I have just said that 95 per cent of it when it gets to the seaboard is labor, and whatever it is worth in the ground was only in consideration of using labor. When coal gets to the furnace, or the boiler, that is the end of it. It is a manufactured article when it comes there just as much so as any other article could be. If you take wool, or iron ore, or many other things, when they come to the factory they are only beginning to be manu- factured, and it requires coal in many instances, for the purposes of manufacturing them. Why, then, should coal be classed as a raw material when it is nineteen-twentieths labor ! Mr. Reed. What example is there of raw material in the sense of something on which no human labor has been expended"? Mr. Davis. I do not know of anything in tha.t sense. All things I believe, after nature produces them, must be handled in some form or other. Mr. Eeed. There is no such thing as raw material in the sense of ' speaking of coal as raw material? Mr. Davis. Certainly not. Mr. Eeed. You know that. Mr. Davis. I should have stated in the beginning that I am in the coal and railroad business, and I feel both ways. Mr. Eeed. For instance, you would not call wool raw material ? Mr. Davis. When wool gets to the factory it is a little different from coal. Mr. Eeed. Please explain the difference. Mr. Davis. When coal gets to the seaboard its use is ended. It is consumed, and it is a manufactured article when it gets there just as much as the coat upon your back. Bear in mind that free coal favors but one nation. No other nation will be benefited, except the British nation and the English provinces, and why should the United States and the hundreds of thousands of people who are now engaged in pro- ducing coal, and otherwise handling it in thirty States or more than half of this nation, be put at a disadvantage for the purpose of favor- ing a single nation and a few persons along the seaboard? Mr. Eeed. Does giving coal protection establish a privileged class 1 Mr. Davis. If you can call a million of people a privileged class who produce it, dig it, and bring it to the market, they are a privileged class. COAL. 1127 Mr. Eeed. I could not do it. I wanted to know if you could. Mr. Dayis. Tbe miners are here to-day who dig the coal. Mr. Ebed. I could not question that and never did. It is sometimes done, and I wanted your opinion. Mr. Davis. I am obliged to you. ^ Mr. Reed. I want you to furnish an argument to these people who are opposing this on the ground that it is a privileged class. If you could point out the follacy in their views I would be obliged to you. Mr. Davis. The class of people who are interested in it — who dig in the mines — perhaps make 75 cents a day or possibly $1 or $2 a day. If 300,000 or 400,000 such people, and many of them in my little State, may be called a privileged class, I do not know where you can find a class that is not privileged. Mr. Eeed. It is pretty big nonsense. Mr. Davis. Coal is a local article If you take the district of the distinguished chairman of this committee Mr. Reed. That is what I wanted to do. Mr. Davis. If I were to look at you both, I would see a good deal in both of you, Except that one has more in avoirdupois. I was going to say if you would take the district of the chairman, he has six counties which produce several million tons of coal. The men there are actually at work digging a tunnel for the purpose of working the mines. Mr. Bryan. What district is thatf Mr. Davis. That is the district of your chairman, the Second West Virginia. There are 3,000 or 4,000 people there who are depending almost entirely upon the digging of coal and getting it to market, ilake coal free and you take from them their bread. Mr. Btnum. What do they get for mining coal? Mr. Davis. From 40 to 60 cents per ton. Mr. Bynum. They do not get the 75 cents protection on the cost? Mr. Davis. They do not get that much for digging it. Mr. Bynum. Who does get it? Mr. Davis. The Government gets it. Mr. Bynum. If it is not productive of any revenue the Government does not get it? Mr. Davis. It is not there at all. Mr. Bynum. Then nobody gets it? Mr. Davis. I do not know that I can say that nobody does get it. It comes in in th^ general way of protection. Mr. Bynum. Does it not add that much to the price of the coal? Mr. Davis. My gracious! That is hardly a fair question. The coal is sold itself at $2.50, and how could it be added to the price of coal? It is suggested that 95 per cent is labor. Mr Bynum. The miner gets 40 cents a ton. I understand that there is 75 cents a ton levied for his protection, while he only gets 40 cents. Why is that? - Mr. Davis. I do- not know how you can say that 75 cents a ton is made for his protection. Mr. Bynum. Who gets it? Mr. Davis. Nobody. Mr. Bynum. Then it would be no harm to take some of it off? Mr. Davis. It would do a great deal of harm. It would take off the labor which is over 95 per cent, which you would take off that protec- tion for the coal in the ground. Mr. Bynum. I do iiot understand that anybody pays it. I do not 1128 SUNDRIES. understand how it would take it off, if 75 cents a ton is tTie protection on the coal. The labor only gets 40 cents for mining it. There is a tariff on that to pay for the labor. Mr. Davis. The tariff is not put upon the American coal. It is put upon the foreign coal. Mr. Reed. Perhaps he is laboring under the delusion that the taxis paid by the manufacturer on everything that is manufactured in the country. That is not true. Mr. Davis. Ton can not make such an argament as that on anythiug. We can not say that silks pays $11.50 when nobody gets it. Mr. Tarsney. How are the operators and the miners of coal in tlie State of Illinois, Iowa, ^Missouri, Kansas, and Indian Territory aflected by the tariff! Mr. Davis. Not at all, except in a general way. Mr. Taesney. The miners in Those States engiiged in mining coal are included in this 1,000,000 laboring men whom you desire to have protected by this tariff? Mr. Davis. There are nearly 300,000 men engaged in produtjing coal in the United States, but the competition would not come to us, except from the Atlantic seaboard. Mr. Tarsney. Do you know how any foreign imi)orter of coal, who pays wages to labor, in transportation, etc., for so many miles distance is affected when he disposes of his coal? Mr. Davis. The States on the Atlantic coast will be affected very little. It is the coal which comes to the Atlantic coast that we com- pete with. If there was no duty whatever on coal, not one ton of our coal could get 10 miles from the mine. Mr. Tarsney. If we permitted the importation of Nova Scotia coals free, it would reduce the cost of manufacture, cost of the commodities produced in Massachusetts and New England generally to tbat extent, and would not that benefit the coal miners of the West whom I have mentioned, and who consume the Massachusetts products? Mr. Davis. I think not. They Avould pay just the same for such goods that they pay to-day. There woiild be no change. Mr. Tarsney. If we can not take off', or reduce the duty on this coal used by the New England manufacturers, how can we justify a reduc- tion of the duty on their manufactured products which our constituents want to get cheaper? Mr. Davis. I have already said coal is now about 22 per cent ad valorem, and the dutiable list is about 48 j)er cent. You had better level it up, and let us come in with the remainder of the list; perhaps that will answer your question. Mr. Payne. Is 22 per cent sufficient to protect the miners? Mr. Davis. Tes, sir. Mr. Pay'NE. If the miners in West Virginia and Maryland have adequate protection in the 75 cents a ton, why should not the raisers of wool, the manufacturers of wool, and everything else, have a pro- tection that is sufficient to make up the conditions of labor between this country and the countries abroad? Why should not they all be put upon the same plane? Mr. Davis. Certainly they should; I see no reason why they should not. The trouble is that coal is below the rest of the list, and you talk about taking more off' coal. Mr. Payne. Seventy-five cents is adequate protection? Mr. Davis. I do not know about its adequacy. It is a protection that we will get along with. COAL. • 1129 Mr. Bryan. Where are your mine's located? Mr. Davis. In West Vii'gima. Mr. Betan. What is the freight rate from West Virginia to the sea- board? Mr. Dayis. It depends upon circumstances; about $1.50 to 82 a ton. Mr. Bryan. iSTo coal could come from your district to the seaboard? Mr. Dayis. I do not think coal could get 10 miles inward. Mr. Bryan. So that if we had free coal it would only be a benefit to the people liYing along the seaboard? Mr. Dayis. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. What you complain of is that when you shijj coal to the seaboard you come in competition with this foreign coal, but when you ship West you do not come in competition with that coal, but with the coal raised in the West. The geographical protection is not in faYor of the foreign coal when it is shipped inward? Mr. Dayis. Yes, sir ; the NoYa Scotia mines are all on the seaboard, and ours are 200 or 300 miles inland. Mr. Bryan. What yoii ask is protection against the high-xiriced freight rates in this country ? Mr. Dayis. No, sir. Mr. Bryan. Are you a railroad owner yourself? Mr. Dayis. I am an operator, and president of a little road that has transported coal, but has not paid a dividend. Tliat shows that they are not making great fortunes in that traffic. Mr. Bryan. What is the tonnage? Mr. Davis. Four mills per ton per mile. The coal sent to the sea- board, with which we have to compete, pays only 4 mills per ton for its carriage. Mr. Tarsney. How is it in other directions? Mr. Davis. It pays a little more — half a cent. Mr. Tarsney. Then the railroad operator discriminates against our own people lying West? Mr. Davis. I do not think so. Mr. Gear. The railroads divide with the miner to induce him to mine the coal? Mr. Davis. There will not be much in mining if there is a reduction in the tariff. There are other gentlemen here, aiul I would be obliged if you will hear them. ]Mr. Bryan. You have come t® give us information, and we are trying to get information. Do you know what they pay for mining coal in IfoYa Scotia? Mr. Davis. They pay about the same that we do here. Mr. Bryan. And yet you come here and say a tariff is necessary to protect your employes when they pay as much in Nova Scotia, the com- peting country, as we pay here. Mr. Davis. At the same time I told you they were practically on the seaboard, where they could dump the coal right into the vessel, while we had to transport it from 200 to 400 miles. Mr. Tarsney. It is not the cheap labor of foreign countries you want to be protected against, but it is the cost of the difference in transpor- tation, which is cheaper with them. Mr. Dayis. They are qu the seaboard. ilr. Bryan. When they bring it to Boston it costs them less than it costs you? Mr. Davis. Certainly. 1130 SUNDRIES. Mr. Bryan. Tou want protectfon against ship freight rates rather than against labor! Mr. Datis. The American coals are not transported from one port to another in the United States in American vessels, but in foreign vessels, which are cheaper bottoms than ours. Kova Scotia coals can be taken in either American or foreign vessels, which are cheaper. Tbe fact is, if you are going to have free coal, you ought to give us free ships. Mr. Bryan. The law which denies us free ships is a disadvantage to you when you whip coal in this country 1 Mr. Davis. Of course. Mr. Bryan. Is it not true that if the tariff was taken off the railroads carrying coals East might have to reduce their rates in order to com- pete in those Eastern markets? Mr. Davis. I take it that the railroad rates are about as low as they possible can be made. We haul as low as 4 mills a mile, and I do not see that it could be made cheaper. Mr. Bryan. Since you admit that the rate of wages paid in Nova Scotia is as low as it is in this country, perhaps the reduction ought to be made in freight rates rather than in wages? Mr. Davis. It would have to come off both. It couM not come off one. Mr. Taesney. Are railroad companies generally mine operators? Mr. Davis. Very seldom. Mr. Breckinridge. I see that we shiiD some coal to Cuba, and have done so for a great many years ? Mr. Davis. Yes, sir. Mr. BreokinridGtE. How much coal is shipped from all sections of this country to Cuba? Mr. Davis. Probably 1,000,000 tons are shipped from West Yixginia and Maryland. Mr. Breckinridge. Tou there come in competition with coals from foreign countries 1 Mr. Davis. Yes, sir; English andlSTova Scotia coals. Mr. Breckinridge. And you maintain a successful competition with them all the time? Mr. Davis. It is not very successful. They can get it there cheaper than we can. Mr. Breckinridge. You have been enjoying this market for a great many years, as is .shown by the table of exjxirts. Do we not supply all the gas coal for Havana? Mr. Davis. Not all of it. Mr. Breckinridge. For a great many years your section of country has been shipping approximately 1,000,000 tons a year to Cuba. Do you pay the miners wlio get out the coal any less than the miners who get out the coal which is sold in America? Mr. Davis. The miners are paid all the same. A miner does not know where coal goes to. Mr. Breckinridge. Does he receive any different wages for that? Mr. Davis. No, sir. There is no difference in a miner's wages. He can not take one carload and distinguish the difierent rate ol' wages between it and another one. Mr. Breckinridge. If you get the same freight rates so as to suc- cessfully compete with English coal and Nova Scotia coal, why can you not do it at home? Mr. Davis. We do not successfully compete. COAL. 1131 Mr. Breckinridge. If yon can do it snccessfnlly in Ciiba, as you liave for a gieat many yetirs, is it sufficient to say that you can not do it at home? What is tlie reason you can not and do not? Mr. Davis. For the same reason that- we can not do it in any other business. Sometimes competition is sharp and freights are low. Sometimes it is one cost, and sometimes it depends ahnost entirely upon freights. It is not true tliat we successfully compete. We send probably 1 ton in 50 that goes there. There is another thing to be said. Probably our product suits that market better than the Nova Scotia coal, because it is a better gas-making coal. Mr. Geae. Is not that Virginia coal mainly gas coal? Mr. Davis. The Nova Scotia coal and the English coal are gas coals, but not to the extent that our Virginia and Pennsylvania coals are. Mr. Gear. Therefore your coal is a necessity to that extent? Mr. Davis. To that extent. Mr. BRECKiNRiDaB. Is it gas coal that you send to Canada? Mr. Davis. Let me say to you that Canada takes good care to pro- tect her people. We are paying her to-day 67 cents tariff. Mr. Breckinridge. Canada takes goocl care to protect her people against our coal, and yet we are able to overcome her protection and successfully compete witli her? Mr. Davis. You forget that no West Virginia coals go into Canada. The coal which goes into Canada is that which is close up near the line, Avhere transportation is less. The coals we are talking about are the Virginia and Maryland coals, and they do not go into Canada. Mr. Bryan. Will you tell me how you sent this coal to Cuba; is it done partly by rail ? Mr. Davis. It goes to Baltimore by rail. Mr. Bryan. What is the rail rate? Mr. Davis. I think it is $1.50 a ton. Mr. Bryan. And then it goes from there by ship? Mr. Davis. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. Do you have the same rates for export as for internal transportation? Mr. Davis. Not always. Eailroads give a rebate for the purpose of competition when coal is shij)x:>ed to certain markets, Mr. Bryan. Does your road do tliat? Mr. Davis. My road is only one of thirteen roads. We all have our share pro rata in that case. Mr. Bryan. Your road makes a less rate when it ships to a foreign country than when it ships in this country? Mr. Davis. I"tlid not answer that question. Mr. Bryan. Will you answer it? Mr. Davis. I said that the coal shipped to certain markets where there is sharp competition has a rebate. I did not say it was foreign coal. Coal going to Boston to compete now with Nova Scotia coal can not pay as much as coal consumed along the line of the railroad. Mr. Bryan. The competition is greater where the railroads meet the sea? Mr. Davis. That is true the world over. Mr. Bryan. If we take the tariff off, could not that competition be met by the railroads coming down in their rates? Mr. Davis. No, sir; tltey could not do it. Mr. Breckinridge. Is that rule of which you speak true with refer- ence to gas coals that go to Cuba? 1132 SUNDEIES. Mr. Davis. There is a certain law in the railroad business that certan tonnage pays more going to one place than to another. The longer the haul the cheaper per mile the road can aft'ord to carry it. Mr. Breckinridge. The coal shipped to Cuba is used in part for gas making and in part for fuel. Therefore, what is not used for mak- ing gas comes in competition with the Nova Scotia coal for ordinary steam purposes, or as house coal 1 Mr. Davis. There is none used in the house in Cuba. Mr. Breckinridge. What are its uses! Mr. Davis. For general manufacturing purposes, and not for domestic purposes. Mr. Breckinridge. Does this rate for mining that j-ou speak of apply to Cuba as well as to America? Mr. Davis. The miner does not know whether it goes to Cuba or to the American market. Railroads can not discriminate one way or the other. Mr. Breckinridge. I amnot going into the matter. I simply wanted to know whether those rates to the miner applied to the shipments of coal to Cuba ? Mr. Davis. They do generally. Mr. Breckinridge. You do not exclude the Cuban coal? Mr. Davis. No, sir; we could not if we wanted to. BITUMINOUS COAIi. (Paragraph 4S2.) STATEMENT OF COL. WILLIAM LAME, OF NORFOLK, VA. Mr. Chairman: I think it proper to state that I am a merchant, residing in the city of Norfolk, Va. A part of my business has been to supply steamers with coal from the year 1866. I introduced the steam coal fr6m the Chesapeake and Ohio on the ocean. Afterwards when the Norfolk and Western interest was built up, introducing the great Pocahontas coal to Norfolk, I wns put in charge as agent of the Pocahontas Company. I came here to represent the Pocahontas inter- est and after getting here I was requested by these West Virginia gentlemen to speak in connection with them. I am very sorry, indeed, that I am not an elequent lawyer, so that I could present the case more ably and succinctly. I think that there is a great deal in the question, and I shall ask yon to give me your undivided attention, if you can, and when I tire you you can call me down. I have got a great many papers here, but I do not intend to use them all. I thought I might have to answer some questions, and I brought them along. This Pocahontas coal interest is one that is depending altogether upon this tariff. This coal is from Tazwell County, in Old Virginia, and from McDowell and Mercer Counties, in West Virginia. Mr. Jef- ferson spoke of this coal in his "American Notes." We were never able to reach this coal in Virginia until less than a decade ago, when some enterprising Pennsylvanians came there, and that is how it has been built uii. They built a railroad to these coal fields. I was deeply interested in this as a Virginian. It was a difficult task to build that road, tunnelling hills, crossing streams, winding down the New River. BITUMINOUS COAL. 1133 It cost a great deal of money. Primarily it was estimated that it was almost impossible for us to get the capital to build the road to these coal fields and we did not get it until this question of tariff on coal was settled. It was not a political question, but a mercantile one. Even British investors were unwilling to invest in it while the Morri- son bill was under consideration ; until after it was considered to be the policy of the United States to leave this 75 cents a ton on coal. After that we were able to get the money. I do not come here except as a merchant, but I would state that we have had a tariff on coal ever since the formulation of the Constitution, when the First Congress passed the first tariif bill, which was approved by President Washing- ton, for the protection of the coal pits in Virginia. What I know about the history of the coal trade is from my connection wi*'- it. I know that liom an outi)ut of about half a million of tons in 1886 it has increased to such an extent that we shipped for the tAvelve months ending June 1, 1893, 1,825,630 tons ; employed in transportation, 720 schooners and 762 barges and tugs, emjiloyiug 1,499 American ves- sels in the transportation of coal, and besides supplying with bunker coal, and that is my principal business, 482 ocean steamers, making 1,971 vessels leaving Lambert's Point for the twelve months. Of this 1,825,630 tons, about 200,000 tons went abroad, but nearly all of it went into the bunkers of foreign steamers. Steamers come here fi'om Europe and load with cotton, grain, sugar, or some other product. It is a question whether they shall stop at Hampton Roads or go to Syd- ney, or, in other words, whether the 500 or 600 steamers coming to Lambert's Point, or Newport News, will stop at American ports and get their coal or whether they shall go to Sydney or other ports. I tbink I can say that this interest is dependent upon this protection of 75 cents per ton. Ko commodity, as Senator Davis has said, so largely represents labor as coal. He says that at the seaboard, along- side the wharf at Boston, 95 per cent of the price of coal is labor and transportation. The average value of coal in the ground is not over 10 cents per ton. It is raw material when it goes to Boston; I admit that. In fact, everything that does not change its nature, however much labor and transportation it undergoes, is raw material. But there is entering into this price of coal not only the labor, but the transportation. Now, the larger the quantity we can haul to the seaboard the cheaper we can sell it. There are certain fixed interest charges on the cost of running a railroad. The roadbed, the rolling stock, and the additional, cost of handling business, which cost decreases with the volume of the business done. Upon that point I want to mention, lest I should forget it, that I have been trying my best to send our Pocahontas coal to Cuba, but can not do it. I find that I have been able to sell only two cargoes there within the last year, and I would not have been able to seU that if it had not been for this large volume of business, which decreases the price per ton of the coal at Norfolk and enables me to compete with foreign coal. Gas coal is in great demand in certain markets, but this gas coal could not be sold in Cuba were it not for the fact of this great bulk of business. I do not think we sell over 50,000 or 60,000 tons of gas coal to Cuba. We could not send gas co* to sell in Cuba were it not far the fact that we bring to the seaboard millions of tons of this other coal, which brings down the cost of transportation. Mr. Breckineidgb. I understand you to say that the reason you can send this gas coal is an account of the facilities of shipping other coal? Col. Lamb. Yes, sirj they therefore do something to protect them- 1134 SUXDlilES. selves. We send from Lambert's Point gas coal to London ; that is, from the Breckinridge mines, and Mr. Breckinridge, of this committee, may be familiar with that. There is only abont 30(i,000 tons altogether g(r!ng to Cuba 1rom the United States. If yon hanl less than a million tons for a distance of 400 miles, as wc have to do, there is precious little in it for the carrier. You must remember that the coal haul of 400 miles nnaiis a haul of 800 miles, because all the oars must be returned empty tliC whole distance. 1 wish to state that, for although I am a merchant, lonly own 10 shares in the Norfolk and Western. 1 have owned that ever since I was a mere strii)ling. I am a merchant dealing in coal, and am a for- warder. I do not own any stock in mines or in railroads. Our own plant at Pocahontas, is the smallest, employing only about 20,000 X->eople, directly and«M^directly, in the mines and mining districts. The number of railroad people employed in hauling coal, and building the tars, and running lOl! locomotives and 10,000 cars, is 4,700. This duty of 75 cents a ton does not affect anyone in this country except those liv- ing on the Atlantic seab'^ard and the Gulf. It does not hurt them nor favor them. What has been done by the Norfolk and Western Eailroad on the south side of Virginia has been paralleled by the Chesapeake and Ohio on the north side of the State. We bring these coals together. Tliey bring cannel from Kanawha. This,in some respects, enables them to protect themselves, but if it were not for that and the help of that bituminous coal which they bring to the sea they could not ship cannel ctial down. The output of Virginia is very small compared with the 113,000,000 tobs mined in the whole of the United States, but still it is a part of our production. It is raised in the two States and it is a matter in wliicli those two States are vitally interested. Tlie coal trade of Virginia has increased from 4J tons in 1878 to 10.000,000 tons in 1802. The ]Srorfi)lk and Western, and Chesapeake and Ohio have very rapidly increased their facilities for transpoitati<:>n. Now, tliis trade, aiid I suppose I may include Cumberland, although they have not asked me to speak for them, is vitally interested in this 75 cents tariff. It is not a political question, it is a question of bread and meat, of closing our mines and throwing these men out of employ- ment. Tliis tiade would be destroyed by the abolition of the duty, and I want to exjilaiii that as a merchant. The principal market is New England. I have some papers here, but I do not wish to burden you witi] figures. Lambert's Point sent about 1,000,000 tons of coal to New England, which, you see, is the larger part of it. We bring to the sea- board by the Chesapeake and Ohio a like quantity. This is about • 2,000,000 tons. Deprive us of the transportation of these 2,000,000 tons and take the New England market from us, for we can gei no other, and the price of coal at Lambert's Point and Newport News would decrease so as to paralyze the trade, except the local trade we might be able to get. Mv. Breckinridge. Can you give us the reason for that? Col. Lamb. I think so. When we first started this Pocahontas brrsi- ness, in 188(5, we had to introduAi it into the market. We hauled about half a million tons, and really about every ton we sold at Lam- berts Point was sold at a loss. That was because of the capacity of the road. You must understand that the larger the business the rail- road does the better will be its ])roflts. If you keep the road employed up to its maximum capacity you can do the business much cheaper BITUMINOUS COAL. 1135 than if yon only do a minimnm business. I say that if jou take away those 2,000,000 tons which go into the IS'ew England market it will destroy onr trade as rapidly as it has been built np. Our great com- petitor is Nova Scotia coal. We have to haul our coal from 275 to 400 miles. Maryland has not to haul it quite so far, but she has to go down the Chesapeake Bay 200 miles, and often against head winds, and some- times ice. Nova Scotia is right on the water. Some of it is literally under the sea. After they get it up they can dump it right into the vessels and send it to New England in competition with this coal. They have no railroad haul. We learn that labor in Nova Scotia is about the same as it is liere. Mr. Breckineidge. How much cheaper do they sell that Nova Scotia coal? Col. Lamb. They get their coal free on board at Louisburg for $1 per ton. We can not get it at Lamberts Point for less than $2.50 per ton. Navigation laws do not affect them. They would be able in. time to carry it cheaper. ^Ir. Breckinridge. Their cost is $1.50 a ton against your $2.50? Col. Lamb. I will come to those figures in a moment. Here is a letter from Nova Scotia, published in the New York Times January 15, 1888: FREE TRADE WOULD SUPPLY THIS COUNTRY AVITH CANADIAN COAL. A Halifax letter to the New York Times has the following: The coal famine, the ever-recnrring troubles in Pennsylvania, and the jiromiuence of "free coal" in tariff discussions make the coal fields within easy reacli of the United States objects of unusual interest. Attention has recently been called to the coal deposits along the line of the Canadian Pacific Railroad, and very likely they may yet have great importance to the Northwestern States of the Union, but they can never compete for the coal trade of the manufacturing centers of the East. To the great Northern cities on the American seaboard the only Canadian coal deposits of direct interest are those of the maritime provinces, and they liave an importance that is not fully realized. The Kew England market especially is concerned with Nova Scotia's coal possibilities, and will be most aifeotecl by a change in the trade relations, but the c[uality of Canadian coal and its low cost make its availability also a question of concern to New York manufacturers and to the railroad and steamship managers of all the sealioard States. The question is, Can the Provinces supply economically any considerable part of the 50,000,000 tons of soft coal burned every year in North America? Let the facts answer. * The most important of the coal fields in the Province of Nova Scotia is that in the island of Cape Breton, about the Bay of Sydney, on the eastern shore. The greater part of this field is under the Atlantic Ocean, but fortunately nearly all the seams can be worked far out beneath the ocean, and many a miner toils under the waves. The seams are, very peculiar in shape, and long puzzled the geologists. Now it is understood that one who followed them closely would start from near the sliore and would go downwards and inland till he met the turn of an ellipse, when he would bend round to the eastward, and with a slow incline go far out to sea. The miner, of course, does nothing of the sort, hut sends down a shaft or slope at some point whence he can easily ship his coal, and then he hits the seam to be worked at a depth according to the place where his shaft is sunk. Then he works out in tha seam, under water, and has "levels" almost level. At Lingan, near Sydney Bay, there are nine distinct and well-known seams. (Jlost of these at other places are found under different names). The whole surface extent of the coal district thereabont is 200 square miles. The eubraarine fields alone, at at a low estimate, have been reckoned to contain nearly 2,000,000,000 tons, and" this includes only the region that can be economically worked from the shore. So nearly impermeable are the strata that at a moderate depth the submarine workings are per- fectly dry. Nearly all the se,ams lie at easy angles, and the roofs of the works are so hard that work is unusually safe. Yet with 2,000,000,000 tons available it is a rare year that sees the Sydney district mines bring much over 500,000 tons to the surface. Next in amount of coal .available comes Cumberland County, which lies between the Basin of Utinas and Northumberland Str.TJt. The area of the field is estimated at 300 sq^uare miles. (If is not so well situated for shipping the coal as either the 1136 SUNDRIES. Sydney or the Picton district, but one port, Parrisboro, is only 25 miles from the chief mine, the Springlull, and offers the advantage of havijiy not more than six or eight weeks' interruption to shipping.) The Cumberland district is producing not far from 375,000 tons a year, not a titlie of what it might produce. The smallest of Nova Scotia's three useful coal districts is that in Piotou County, on the northern shore of the peninsula, midway between the other two. It is noted for the great size of its beds and for their excellent q^uality . (In less than 6,000 feet of strata there are sixteen beds containing 141 feet of coal, and varying in thickness from 3 to 34 feet. Six of the beds measure altogether 80 feet. The thickness here more nearly resembles that of European fields than anywhere else in America.) The output will average about 400,000 tons a year. All these districts produce bituminous coal, and bituminous only. There is no gainsaying the fact that it is good coal — better coal than most of that marketed from the Pennsylvania mines. (Tests have repeatedly shown this. Coal from the Block House mine, in the Sydney district, has yielded at New York and Boston gas works 10,316 cubic feet of IB^-candlo gas and 1,460 pounds of coke a ton — a Aery sat- isfactory showing.) When tried on board Her Majesty's ship Ganiict it was found to raise steam fifteen minutes quicker than any other coal that had been supplied to the ship, and the percentage of ash and clinker was very small. Analyses of other coal from the same district have shown more than HO per cent of carbon, making it equal to Welsh coal. The Cape Breton coal had a big reput.ation in the United States as a gas coal, the average yielding from 9,000 to 10,000 feet a ton, but the tariff' killed the export, and the reputation is probably forgotten. The Pictou coal has been most used for steam-raising, and large quantities of it have been burned on Atlantic steamers and in the locomotives of the Intercolonial Eailway. The Cum- berland coal has been used for both steam and house purjioses. The reports of the users show that both the Cumberland and Pictou coals make little ash and compara- tively little smoke when the right appliances are used. The cost of coal mined and put on the cars varies from 60 cents to $1.25 per ton. Surface laborers get from 85 cents to $1, and mechanics 1.10 to $1.50 a day. The wages of the coal-cutters vary from $2.25 to^l-TS a working day. The mines give employment to about 4,500 persons, and the underground workers do not average more than 210 working days a year. Labor i« plenty and supplies aje cheap. With all this excellent coal, with all these favorable conditions for getting it out, why is the Nova Scotia coal industry really so insignificant? One word tells the story, anrobably cheaper than coal is shipped at any port iu tlio world. The accountant's statement shows that the companies whose books he examined have been making during the past iive years an average profit of about40 cents per ton on their output, not including various sources of revenue, such as proiits of the com- panj' stores, revenue from railroads outside of coal traffic, and proiits of the steam- ship comijauy.. This profit per ton should be considerably increased by consolida- tion, but even this as a basis shows an annual profit, for the combined present output (about 825,000 tons) of all the mines except the one above mentioned, 0])erated individually, of about $330,000. Mr. Breckinridge. Have they no mines west of Quebec! Col. Lamb. They have not any others until they come to the Pacific Ocean. Mr. Gear. The Canadian Pacific gets large supplies of coal from Iowa and Illinois. Col. Lamb. I am aware of that, but he was asking about Canadian coal. They carry it up the St. Lawrence in barges. We are able to sell them some Illinois coal in spite of their duty. TH 72 1138 SUNDRIES. Now, gentlemen, this Dominion Coal Company lias gone into the business at Boston and is selling coal laid down at the wharves at $3 per ton. They have sold 8,000 tons of it. We can not profitably sell it at that price now. Our coal costs us there $3.15. The Kew England consumers now consume 6,000,000 tons of bituminous coal. We are working on the very smallest margins now to reach New England. We have greatly increased our output and yet our miners are not paid as well as they should be. It would be a shame to decrease their wages. The railroads hauling this output are making no dividends, for they can not make dividends at the present rates. The colored stevedores whom I employ only get 15 cents per hour. These inen labor night and day. They have never struck for higher wages. Notwithstanding navigation laws which forces us to ship principally in New England bottoms, the vessel owners have recently declared the rates were rainous, and have threatened to tie up a large part of their tonnage. Indeed, but for the barge system, as we can not get the cheap foreign carriers that the Dominion Coal Company can employ to carry their coal, in the winter we could not meet current prices and survive. Remember, vessels in coal trade generally, like coal cars, have to go back emi^ty. Where is this 75 cents coming oif, if we are to compete with Sir Don- ald Smith, K. G. M. G., of Montreal, who is now offering the Canadian Government coal at prices which, but for the reputation of Virginia coal, would stagger us. We have all we can do now to meet this com- lietition of a foreign power. Now, if we go under, and you lose your supply of Cumberland coal from the same cause, ijrices will advance in the New England market, for instead of having threeorfour independ&nt sections competing for the trade, you will have one foreign corpora- tion. If the Dominion Coal Company, limited, drives out the six millions of American coal from the New England market at 12J cents royalty, New England will be paying for the support of the Canadian Govern- ment $750,000 annually in gold (we will take silver for our Virginia coal). Should war come with England, what then? Have spoken of the New England market because, so far as it is con- cerned, this tariff operates as a i^rotective tariff, and the small import of Canadian shows that there it is not a revenue tariff, but certainly a section which has grown rich on its protected industries, has no right to complain that those industries should have to use protected coal. Do not forget that the coal for domestic fuel, which keeps the poor man warm and cooks his food, has no duty to pay. Our bituminous coal is used for steam purposes exclusively, and I repeat that this duty protects the New England consumer. And who pays the 75 cents duty on steam coal in New.England'? We sell our bituminous coal there now as cheaply as we can, after haul- ing it 400 miles by rail and sending it 500 or 600 miles by sea, certainly the American ijeople pay no duty, but pay for raw material, tratisportation, and labor, but every ton brought in by the Dominion Coal Company, limited, pays 75 cents duty, and if they are not paying it why are they working so hard to have it repealed ? It does not keep them from under- selling us now, but they want this additional profit. There were 113,000,000 tons of bitumiuoirs coal mined in the United States in 1892. Will any one pretend the American people would have gotten it 75 cents cheaper if there had been no dnty 1 The Ameri- can people are not lying awake about this duty. It is the Dominion Coal Company, a foreign corporation, which is demanding the reiJeal. BITUMINOUS COAL. 1139 We liave 000,000 square miles of bituminous coal already discovered in our vast country, and well distributed; it is the cheapest fuel to the greatest number found in the world. It is proper that our Gov- ernment should look after its development, it only needs protection along the coast so that iu time of war our seaports shall not be depen- dent on foreign supplies. We suffered in the South during the Civil War for want of coal. Many and many a blockade runner, built for speed, with a priceless cargo of cotton, Avas sacriiiced by indifferent coal, because the splendid steam coals of Alabama, Georgia, and Vir- ginia had not been developed. Coal could enter South Atlantic and Gulf ports from Great Britain, but for the duty. But there is something peculiar about this tariff on coal. While on the Atlantic and Gulf coasts it appeals to the members who are in favor of protection, on the Pacific coast it is a tariff for revenue only, and what is agreeable over there the duties can be paid in silver at 16 tol. There were some 1,350,000 tons of bituminous coal mined in Califor- nia, Oregon, and Washington last year, but the high price paid the miner prevents the 75-cent duty being any protection, and consequently we find more foreign than domestic bituminous coal used in these States, San Francisco importing in 1892 more than the production of the three States; which production decreased over 600,000 tons from 1891 to 1892 for the want of sufficient protection to make the business profit- able. in conclusion, as an American citizen, I beg you as a matter of jus- tice to retain this duty on coal. Every one in Virginia is in favor of it. It is a serious question with us ; the Old Commonwealth had too long depended solely on agriculture to the neglect of commerce, manu- factures, and mining, and was getting poorer and poorer, but in the last decade a change has come over the spirit of her dreams and her quiet bays are whitening with the sails of commerce, her rivers are now turning the wheels of industry as they flow to the sea, her valleys are resounding with the anvil chorus, and her everlasting hills are giving up those rich minerals which have slept undisturbed for centuries. Nothing in all this industrial development has so stimulated our people to greater hope and effort than the wonderful success of her coal trade, and if you have any patriotic love for the old State, that contributed so much to the glory and renown of our country's history, I appeal to you, as members of the most important committee of the House of Eepre- sentatives, to save her from the grievous injury that would be inflicted ujion her if the Congress of the United States closes her mines for Che benefit of the Dominion Coal Company, limited, and their royal land- lord, her Majesty's Colonial Government of the Dominion of Canada. Mr. Bryan. Suppose we were to discover coal right along the Atlan- tic seaboard, could we mine it for $1.50 a ton? Col. Lamb. Then it would not pay us to haul coal to the seaboard, a distance of 400 miles. Mr. Bryan. That is not the question. Do you think that such a dis- covery would be a national calamity? Col. Lamb. No, sir; I do not think that anything is a calamity that increases American production. 1140 SUNDRIES. BITUMINOUS COAL. (Paragraph 432.) ' STATEMENT OF HON. W. A. H'COKKLE, GOVERNOR OF WEST VIRGINIA. Mr. Chairman: I have no learning on the coal trade, but we have some gentlemen here, one especially, whom I hope you will hear. I am not here especially interested in the coal trade, because I own n» coal mines; but I am governor of the State which has the largest coal area in the world, the State of West Virginia. It has 16,000 square miles of coal area. The State is now in the beginning of its progress, and is on the road to commercial suj)remacy. It is not similar to the Pennsyl- vania region of which my friend has spoken. Only four years ago the wolf howled and the fox screamed over the Elkhorn valley. There are to-day in that valley 10,000 men and 3,590 coke ovens making the whole country glow in the night-time with their ilame. There is progress in such enterprises all over the State. We do not know, gentlemen of the committee, and I do not say it dogmatically, that the Nova Scotia coal will drive the West Virginia coal out of the market, but 1 do assert that we are to day giving four months' notes to the railroad company foi- transporting every ton of coal that comes out of the mines. I do assert that even with 75 cents protection to-day the miiiers in the Ifew Eiver section are trembling as to whether there shall be a strike. I do also assert that in my own beautiful valley, with the protection of 75 cents on this great product of the State, that there was a reductioii in prices last week. I know that the State is doing the best it can. Now, gentlemen of the committee, why should you do something the effect of which you know not of? Why not adopt a plan of which you will be certain? The present basis we know. If our markets were assured, if we were settled, we could take care of ourselves. But four years ago the great steamship companies said they could not sail over the blue waters of the ocean unless the steam was made with Welsh coke. Only last year, owing to tlie enterprise of the distin- guished merchant who is here to address you, and the energy and vigor of the Norfolk and Western, American coke is to day driving the steam out of the boilers of vessels that go from here to Europe. I heard someone speak of the consumer a while ago. Now the miners have come to tell you that if we take away the small amount of tariff', the selfish idea of the consumer must not alone be taken into consider- ation, but the people from the mines and the valleys are the ones upon whose shoulders the burden must fall. When we have to-day only a very small share of the tariff, would you take away the growth of the industry in those beautiful valleys and quiet the mines, make them shut down ; make the coal-shaft stop, and check the busy energy and -vigor of all that country? We are to-day looking down to the sunny seas of the South for the glory and progress of West Virginia. We are looking there to-day ibr the magnificent development which we liave begun in our region, which is pouring the golden dollars into the beautiful Kanawha. We are asking that our coal may go down the Ohio, through the Mississippi jetties which you have built, and in a short time through the Nicaragua Canal. I tell you to give We-sfc Virginia a chance and she will certainly drive out tlie coal which comes from the Australian dominions of Her Majesty the Queen. Now, 1 am a Democrat, and I am talking from a Democratic stand- • BITUMINOUS COAL. 1141 point. I say that tlie spirit of selfishness slionkl not reign supreme. I do ask that this committee will not lay its hands upon the industry, ■which will paralyze my beautiful State, and will render sterile her fair valleys. I know that perhaps you gentleineu are tired of these discus- sions; but you are here today to consider the question of the tariff on coal. I know nothing of the special refinements of the tariff, but I do know tliat if you take away this protection the interest must die. All we ask is our fair share p/ the policy of the country. I cate nothing- for the learned gentlemen who claim to know all about this question. I know not Avhere they get their learning, biit I know the people of West Virginia, I know the miners of West Virginia, I know the coal- land owners of West Virginia, and I know the men wlio dig the coal, and they are here to-day. I do know the storelceepers in West Virginia, and in fact I know the people from the wealthy coal baron down to the poor devil whose house is at the mouth of the mine. I care not what your theories are. You will never strike a man who is interested in the coal industry but you will strike the coal miner, the railroad trans- porter, and the river man. If you take the tariff off coal, which is less in proportion than the average duties, I believe it will hurt you; but putting aside the refinement of theories and controversies, the great ' proposition remains that you will hurt every man, woman, and child engaged in the coal industry. Therefore, I say, take your hands off the tariff on coal and leave it as it is. Another thing I do know, and that is that politics to-day plays a part in that portion of the State. I mean to say that we were raised up as a buffet for armies to march against, when men pursued each other with cannon. We are to-day in that same border warfare in the great politics of this country; therefore I say, meaning no threat, " don't do it." Mr. Tarsnet. When were you elected governor of the State of West . Virginia"? Governor McCoBKLE. Last November. Mr. Tabsnby. On the Democratic ticket? Did not the State con- vention which nominated you indorse the platform adopted at Chicago ? Governor McCoeklb. Yes, sir. Mr. Taksney. Was that in favor of raising the tariff schedule? Mr. Ebed. It was for a tariff for revenue only. Mr. Taesney. That plattbrm construed upon a revenue basis would mean a reduction of the schedule as it now exists? Governor McCoekle. Yes, sir. Mr. Taesney. Will yon please point this committee to any schedule which you could reform and reduce to a revenue basis? Governor McGoekle. I would reform the New England manufac- turers' tariff', which is four times as high as the tariff on coal to-day, '. and coal has not its fair proportion. Mr. Taesney. Have you any West Virginia product on the tariff schedule which you could suggest to us to reduce in the line of Demo- cratic reform ? Governor McCoekle. No, sir; and I will tell you that this protesta- tion of the i^eople means that there should be a fair reduction, and not a singling out of the one product of West Virginia, leaving thousands of tariff duties on the jjroduct of New England which are bought by the consumers and miners in the State where I live. Mr. liBBD. What reason have you for supposing that only a reduc- tion of the duty on coal is contemplated? Governor McCoekle. I did not say anything about that. 1142 SUNDRIES. • Mr. Eeed. I believe in letting manufacturers Jive as well as the coal miners. Governor McCorkle. Certainly. Mr. Eeed. And consequently you mean to assist these gentlemen in reducing the tariif, which is necessary for the protection of New Eng- land? Governor McCorkle. The tariff is a local question, and West Vir- ginia is not in the position of New England. Mr. Eeed. I want to nationalize it, and I want you to he^) me. Governor MoCoekle. We are getting New England ideas of thrift, and want fair treatment under the tariff laws. Mr. Eeed. How much ? I like a good deal you said. I like it a great deal better than Mr. Tarsney seems to. I quite agree with you, and if you wiU only broaden it a little, I will help you. In New England our mills are already shut down, and you have not yet reached that stnge. I want you to address some argument to our Democratic friends on this committee that will induce them to spare you. We will help to spare you. Governor McCoekx,e. I wish to say that at the election held last year they did not spare you. 'Mr. Eeed. We have got to redeem ourselves from that last election. Governor McCorkle. We are perfectly willing to have a fair reduc- tion, understand; bu(. the duty on coal is only half what it is on the products of New England. If protection is going to be our rule, as it has been for lo these many years, we want a fair show in the business. If you are going to reduce things, leave coal, and bring the manufac- turers' products down even with coal, and then we will be content. Mr. Bryan. You want the two to go together? Governor McCorkle. If you could bring coal up to those manufac- tured products, we would prefer it. Mr. Bryan. These gentlemen who have come to appear before the committee have come to give us information, so that the tariff will be intelligently revised, and will you please mention some of the products of your State which you think could be reduced ! Governor McCorkle. I do not recollect any. [Laughter.] Mr. Bryan. I hope the stenographer will underscore that answer. Of course you do not ask for anything without a good reason. Is it not mere seliisbncss on your part which leads you to think that you ought to have this protection ? Governor McCorkle. 1 think not. Mr. Bryan. Then give some reason why there should be a tariff on coal? Governor McCorkle. I devoted several minutes to an elucidation of that, and I thought I made a very good speech. Mr. Bryan. I think if you can distinguish between a speech and an. argument, you did make a good one; but can you give us a reason why there should be a tariff' on coal? Governor McCorkle. For the perfectly good reason that if the tariff' is taken off, coal will be brought in from foreign countries and it will drive us out, and lessen the i^rice of labor. We want revenue in this country. Mr. Bryan. That point is not being discussed. Governor McCorkle. This duty may be slightly above the revenue basis, but I don't think it is, and we do not care about tinkering with it until we are equalized. BITUMINOUS COAL. 1143 Mr. Beyan. If we pioduccd all the Cfxil in tlii.s country we would not import any. Governor McCoekle. Certainly not. Mr. BiiYAN. Do you desire that we should produce all the coal which we consumed Governor McOobkle. ISo, sir; I would like to have a price on coal so that our people would not be hurt unjustly; and at the same time enable those who produce it and the people who are working for them to make a living. Mr. Beyan. Do you know what the relative wages are in this country and Nova Scotia? Governor McCoeklb. I have heard it from very good authority, that they were less in jSTova Scotia than here, but we hear that disputed. I am not learned on that question. I can tell you more about the Demo- cratic idea. Mr. Beyan. You come to make a speech, instead of an argument? Governor McOoekle. There are other gentlemen here, and I liope you will hear tbem, especially one gentlemen who is directly interested in this pro]>erty. ]\Ir. Beyan. The reason yon want a tariff' is to help the laboring man, and to be compensated for the difference in freight rates'? Governor McCoekle. You can put it that way. Mr. Beyan. And if the tariff' on cjoal were reduced you would not be able to compete on the seaboard, without areductiou of railroad rates? Governor McOoekle. I think railroad ratcj on coal in West Virginia are just about as low as they can be made. Mr. Beyan. You get that information from the railroads ? Governor McOoekle. Necessarily. Mr. Beyan. The opinion you have in regard to the necessities of the tariff' you get from the people who enjoy it? - Governor McOoekle. Certainly. Mr. Beyan. Are you willing to take the opinion of the New England people as to whether they need a tariff? Governor McCoeicle. Some people are more truthful than others. Mr. Beyan. You would not claim that your people are more truthful than others? Governor McCoeKle. Out of regard for my friend Mr. Eeed I would prefer not to discuss that question. Mr. Beyan. 1 do not care to lead you into any embarrassment. Mr. McMiLLiN. From what point do you anticipate comiDetition in case there is a reduction ? Governor McOoekle. I understand Nova Scotia would be the prin- cipal competing point, and also England. England would take unfair advantage of us. I am informed that Galveston is the port where most coal is received. That comes about this way; that English vessels go out with cotton, and bring back coal as ballast for almost nothing. They bring it in at San Francisco also, and all along the lakes. Therefore, I think a reduction would not be fair to them. Mr. McMillin. Ts it not a fact that we are largely exporters of coal ? Governor McOoekle. I can not answer that question. I expect we do sell some. I think we sell to the western part of Canada. Mr. McMillin. That being so, then the present rates work both ways? Governor McOoekle. Yes, sir. Mr. McMillin. Are we not also exporters of coal to Cuba? 1144 SUNDRIES. Governor jNIcCoiikle. I uudcrstaud that we arc; and I understand the reason of that is that we are drawing the coal trade from steamers. Mr. McMiLLii-t. English steamers? Governor McCoekle. Yes, sir. Mr. McMiLLiN. If we can successfully exjiort coal in the event that the duty is taken off, is it not possible for us to drive them out of that trade and compete with them in Cuba and Canada? Governor McCoukle. I do not know. Mr. McMillin. I do not, either. Governor McCorkle. I think that if the duty were taken off they ■would have less chance of bringing coal in. There are a great many dogmatical statements made about this matter. The reason we wish the tariff duties to remain on, is that it prevents foreign coal coming in. Mr. McMillin. It is the opinion of ex-Speaker Girow, of Pennsyl- vania, that we could export coal. Governor McCorkle. Yes, sir. Mr. McMillin. He took that position and gave the facts, which were not controverted at the time. 1 believe that he then advocated free coal. Governor McCorkle. Yes, sir. Weliave taken a great deal of time, but there are several gentlemen here, and I would ask that they be heard for a few minutes, i will introduce Mr. Miller, from the New Eiver District, and I think he can give you some iuibrmation. BITUMINOUS COAIi. (PiiraginpU 433.) STATEMENT OF HOK. E. H. McCiTLLOirGH, PHILADELPHIA, PA. ^ Mr. Chairman: 1 ])resume I liave been put forward as the only speaker froin tiie great. State of Pennsylvania. When I reflected that that State turns out 80,000,000 tons of coal per annum and emxiloys 30,000 men, I was reminded that she has some interest iu this tariff question. A reduction in the tariff must make a reduction in. the wages of the miners, and a reduction of 1 cent per ton on the coal Pennsylvania produces, means a reduction of $800,000 to thfii miners. It is quite a serious matter. The only question I wish to speak of is the question of the economic value of the Nova Scotia coals. I can speak of a case in point which happened four years ago, and I think it should be mentioned. ^Ve had a long strike in the Pittsburg district, and the Btiston Gas Light Company, together with other companies, were obliged to go to Nova Scotia and buy coal. After the strike ended the question of damages which we were to pay in default on our contract came ni). They got expert testimony on the subject and when the verdict was rendered it was found that the economic value of Nova Scotia coal was 70 cents per ton below the Pittsburg. We sent a great deal of coal to Cuba tfi supi)ly the gas companies there. A great many of the Eastern gas companies are using water gas. The best price we can make is about .^53. 75 a ton alongside the Miiarf in Bos- ton. The Nova Scotia coal can be put in Boston for 75 cents a ton. This new syndicate is causing us considerable anxiety and we fear it is going to injure our interests. I think if the duty is taken off coal we will be shut out from New England, and the price will be governed by BITUMINOUS COAL. 1145 how nuxcli it will cost ns at the mines. The raih-oads are carrying it now a distauce of 400 miles for ■'$1.40 per ton. There is no money in it. I have nothiug to do with the railroads, but as a miner I do not see how any lower i^oint of cost of transportation can be reached. If you take that duty off yon will deal a blow to the industry from which it will never recover as long as 1 live. I think the gentleman who spoke before me said that the price of tlie coal was affected at the seaboard only, but I think that in that he is wrong. Everything which affects the market price of our coal in my judgment is reflected upon the Western States, and in fact aU markets. I hope that this reduction will not be made, and I for one emphatically protest against it. BITUMINOUS COAL. (Paragraph 43a.) STATEffiENT OF W. D. WALgSIDGE, OF NEW YORK. Mr. Chairman : I have cnnie only to represent the Cumberland coal region of the State of Maryland. Tliis region is probably the oldest producer of bituminous coal in this country, and yet notwithstanding that fact it has a great many more years of life and activity in it. There are about $35,000,000 invested in its mining properties. It now employs upwards of 10,0p0men directly. Thesemenaremenof families, and many of them own their own homes and are as intelligent and well informed as any citizens in the United States. The output of this region this year will be about 3,500,000 tons, of which amount 2,000,000 will be sent to tide water and will find its market in New England. I have a liaper which I will read : I have the honor to represent the Cumberland coal region of the State of Maryland — the oldest producer of bituminous coal in this country — notwithstanding which fact, however, it has a very great many years of active life yet remaining to it. . Upwards of $35,000,000 are represented in the mines of our region, and it gives direct emidoyment to more than -10,000 able-bodied men, most of whom are the heads of families, and a very large percentage of whom own their own homes. Our miners are, as a class, well-educated, intelligent and contented citizens of the United States. The output of the region this year will be about 3,5C0,000 tons, of which about 2,600,000 tons will be sent to tide water, finding its mar- ket in the N"ortheastern States. I have said that the Cumberland region has a great many years of active hfe before it. This statement is based on the presumption that the present or, if exigencies demanded it, a higher duty be maintained on bituminous coal. In the past the 75 cents xjer ton duty has been sufii- cient to protect it. But that was not all the protection we had. The fact that the numerous coal deposits inlSTova Scotia, at the very thresh- hold of our largest and best market, have, in the past, been operated in a desultory manner, under antiquated methods and ijrimitive appli- ances, has probably been as great if not a greater source of protection than has the comparatively small 25 per cent duty in force the past 20 years. But through the aid of American capital, genius, and enterprise the 1146 SUNDRIES. Dominion lias awakened from her stupor, and to-day the bituminous coal industry of the United States, an industry second to none in mag- nitude, is confronted with a danger as great if not greater than would have been had the duty been removed in years gone by. What, then, ■will be our condition if both these barriers are removed. Our condi- tion will be truly deplorable. We will be in extremis indeed. If you remove the duty on coal it means a paralysis of our business until, through a reduction in labor, competition can be restored. Nova Scotia coal can be placed on board ocean bottoms at the mine's mouth. Qwl coal must be transported from 200 to 300 miles to accom- plish the same result. K"ova Scotia coal is to-day offered in Boston at lower prices than we can meet. Is not then the American investor in and operator of British coal mines sufficiently well protected ? And may not the operators of Amer- ican coal mines look with confidence to an American Congress for that protection which they so peculiarly need by leason of tlieir disadvan- tageous geographical position? We believe that you will realize that no other American industry is so seriously threatened by foreign com- petition as is the bituminous coal and that you will ijermit us to suffer ■the ills we have and not force ,us to experience the evils we so sorely dread. Mr. WalbeidGtE. Our miners are not paid too much, but they are doing well. The transportation companies can not be asked to carry coal for much less than 3 mills per ton per mile. The investors in many American mines can not be asked for a less return, because a great many of them are making nothing at all now. The new syndicate will mine coal with the most approved raining methods, and will put the coal on vessels and run it down to Boston. They have arranged for a large number of coal barges which \Till be towed by steamers. They can carry from 10,000 to 12,000 tons each. This is reducing the cost of the water transportation to a minimum. Mr. Reed. The question of labor involved is not mining labor alone, but it is the labor of trans]iortation as well? Mr. Walbeibge. Protection i^rotects not only labor but the owner of the property, as well as the transporter. Mr. Eeed. Then on general principles you must know that for such necessities of life as this, applied in all the diiilerent phases, the Amer- ican producer is entitled to the American market I Mr. Walbridge. I can not agree to the idea that the British pro- ducer is entitled to the American market? Mr. Eeed. Then you agree to my proposition ? Mr. Walbridge. I do, undoubtedly. I believe the American mar- ket belongs to the American people. Mr. Eeed, It is not altogether the apprehension in regard to the mining laborer? Mr. Walbridge. Yes, sir; it is. I do not believe that we can pay the money that we are now paying them if we have to get a less price for this material. A portion of the reduction will necessarily have to come out of the price of labor. Mr. Eeed. Tou would be deprived of so much of the American mar- ket, and on account of this loss the less coal you would mine the less you would pay the miner you employed? Mr. Walbridge. No; we pay the miuers by the ton. Nobody can expect us to mine coal at a loss. That loss must be distributed among the miner, the owner, and the transporter. Any such reduction would necessarily have to be divided up among those three. BITUMINOUS COAL. 1147 Mr. Eeed. Your royalty is only about 15 c»Kits. Mr. WALBRiDaE. Yes, sir. Mr. Eeed. The major amoniit will come out of the larger sum, which is labor? Mr. Walbridge. The largest item of expense in producing coal would be the transportation? Mr. Gear. That is labor, mostly. . Mr. Walbridge. That is labor, but I had reference to labor in the mines. Mr. Eeed. It must come out of the miners' labor and wages, and out of the transportation companies' labor? Mr. Walbridge. Most undoubtedly. Mr. Eeed. So that any redaction would reflect itself in their wages'? Mr. Walbridge. Yes, sir; it would reflect itself unquestionably in the reduction of their wages. Mr. Breckinridge. You sell largely to New England, do you? Mr. Walbridge. Yes, sir; our sales amount to nearly $300,000. Mr. Breckinridge. Over what roads do you ship ? Mr. Walbridge. Over the Baltimore and Ohio and the Pennsyl- vania. Mr. Breckinridge. What is your port of shipping? Mr. Walbridge. The principal i^orts of shipment are Baltimore and Philadelphia, and some from South Amboy, which latter is local. Mr. Breckinridge. To what places do you ship principally? Mr. WALBRIDGE. To Providence, Fall Eiver, Boston, Portsmouth, Portland, and some of the smaller ])orts in Maine. Mr. Breckinridge. You generally sell at so much per ton delivered ? Mr. Walbridge. No, sir; we refuse to gamble on rates; we sell coaJ f. o.b. at Philadelphia, for instance. Mr. Breckinridge. You deliver it to the port to which it goes? Mr. Walbridge. We deliver it at the water. We do not deliver it to its final destination. Mr. Breckinridge. Do you know what it costs to deliver coal at Providence? Mr. Walbridge. Three dollars and twenty-five cents based on to-day's coastwise rates. Mr. Breckinridge. What is the price delivered in Baltimore? Mr. Walbridge. Two dollars and fifty cents. Mr. Breckinridge. You sell at the same price to the dealer in New England as to the dealer In Philadelphia and Baltimore? Mr. Walbridge. Yes, sir ; it is the practice in our region to put it at f. o. b. price, and the New England purchaser takes the risk of freights. Some contracts, you understand, extend over six months. The coastwise rates conflict and we can not gamble on those rates, there- fore the purchaser gets the coal, pays fer it, and takes the risk. Mr. Breckinridge. You charge the same price for the coal regard- less of the mar]i:et to which it goes? Mr. Walbridge. We do not charge a different price when it comes here to Washington, for instance. Mr. Breckinridge. It is the same price less the cost of transporta- tion? Mr. Wax,bridge. Yes, sir. Mr. Breckinridge. Is that true in all cases? Mr. Walbridge. That is true with a very few exceptions. Some- times we meet competition. Sitmebody is after you and if you can not get the trade it is 5 cents off, but the price at the mines is the same. 1148 SUNDRIES. Mr. P>KECKiNRiDGE. Eegardlcss of the point of tlie ultimate desti- nation? Mr. Walbeidge. Yes, sir. Mr. Reed. Oau you give us the net price at the mines? Mr. Walbeidge. On the average for this year we would be glad if we could get 90 cents a ton net on board of the cars. Mr. Keed. Do you consider the-royalty in that? Mr. Walbeidge. That is getting the coal and the material at the mines and outside labor, the interest charges and anything else that comes into it — my own salary, for instance. Mr. Eeed. Tou figure everything at 90 cents; which pays you? Mr. Walbeidge. It does not cost that. It costs 75 to 80 cents, and the-balance is what we get for the coal. , The Kova Scotia Government leases the coal lands for $30 per square mile. The lesses have to pay 12J cents per ton on the output. It does not make any difi'erenco whether tliey sell it or not. They do not pay for it until it is mined. Mr. Eeed. You are compelled to buy the coal lands and get all out of them you can 1 Mr. Walbeidge. Yes, sir; every ton of coal we take out is so much out of the capital. When all the coal is gone, "Good morning;" you are gone. Mr. Eeed. These gentlemen will not have to struggle against that at all? Mr. Walbeidge. ifot in the slightest degree. They have ninety -nine years lease of the mines. If you rent a house and the nmn saj's that he will pay for all the repairs, it does not cost you anything if you knock the plastering down. Mr. Beeckineidge. You own your mines? Mr. Walbeidge. The company I represent does. Mr. Beeckineidge. You do not pay any royalty? ^ , Mr. Walbeidge. No, sir. , Mr. Eeed. You are under the control of your lessors? Mr. Walbeidge. No, sir. • Mr. Eeed. Are not some of your mines leased? I do not mean yours personally. Mr. Walbeidge. No, sir; I do not know of a mine in Maryland that is leased. There may be some, but I do not know of any. Mr. Beeckineidge. You say that the coal cost now about $3.25 at Providence, and that the 90 cents a ton represents what you get for it at the mines? Mr. Walbeidge. Yes, sir. Mr. Beeckineidge. That represents transportation from the mines to the point of shipment? Mr. Walbeidge. Transportation from the mines to Philadelphia or Baltimore is $1.40. There is a slight charge for expenses which makes it $1.45 to $1.50. Mr. Beeckineidge. The transportation to Providence is how much? Mr. Walbeidge. It is 70 cents now. Mr. Beeckineidge. Then the price is $3.25 on the vessel at Provi- dence or delivered on the wharf. Mr. Walbeidge. That is the price delivered alongside at Providence. Of course, you understand that in selling we have to charge for selling. The business is done by a salaried man or an agent. We figure it at about 10 cents per ton. Mr. Beeckineidge. Usually it is delivered to dealers at $3.25 along- side? . ^ Mr. Walbeidge. Wte do not deliver it alongside. We deliver it to the dealer f, o. b. at Philadelphia. BITUMINOUS COAL. 1149 BITUMINOUS COAL. (Parsgrapli 432.) STATEMENT OF JOHN P. ABBOTT, EEPKESENTING THE MINERS OF THE CUMBERLAND VALLEY. Mr, Chairman : I have been appointed chairman of a delegation of miners and have been sent np here to state the facts of the case, as we understand them and believe them in our region. We believe that a reduction in the iirice of coal would affect us as workingmen. I. would like to read a preamble which has been drawn up by the miners for your consideration. Mr. Abbott then read the following jireamble: To the honorable the Senate and House of Representatives of the Congress of the United States : The undersigned citizens of Allegany County, State of Maryland, respectfully represent to your honorable bodies that we are directly interested as miners in the production of semibituminous coal from the Georges Creek coal region of this county, and that we have been selected by the miners and laborers of our respective mines to lay before the Committee on Ways and Means this petition for them and ourselves and to impress by our presence, as their representatives, the distress to us and our families that would result from a reduction of the present duty on foreign coal. * We also represent that the employers of labor in the Georges Creek coal region pay liberally for mining and labor connected with its pro- duction, and that we sincerely believe that whatever benefit is derived from the present duty on foreign coal is divided liberally with the labor which produces it. We also most respectfully represent that we believe the present low price of Georges Creek coal in the eastern markets is so low that com-- petition with Nova Scotia coal admitted at a lower rate of customs duty than now exists will drive our coal out of market, or to maintain a place for it will be at a reduction of the wages of all labor connected with its production. We, therefore, respectfully urge your honorable bodies to leave undis- turbed the present tariff duty of 75 cents per ton on foreign coal, and we will ever pray, etc. Chas. Eupebt. William Byees. J. A. Cunningham. P. Baeey. (An4 others,) Mr.»GEAE. flow many laborers do you represent? Mr. Abbott. About 3,000. Mr. Gear, flow many do you represent indirectly? Mr. Abbott. I could not exactly say. Mr. Gear. Those you represent labor at the mines? Mr. Abbott. Yes,' sir. 1150 SUxXDRIES. BITUMINOUS COAIi. (Paragraph 433.) STATEMENT OF M. ERSKKTE MIIiER, OF STAUNTON, VA. Mr. Chairman : I am not in the habit of speaking before such an august assemblage as this, but the matter on which I appear is busi- ness, and I wish to speak only as a business man. I appear to speak in behalf of the New iliver coal miners on the Chesapeake and Ohio Eailroad. The output from those mines is 1,800,000 tons. It is chiefly semi- cannel coal. They make some coke on the line of the road. Some- thing over a million tons of this coal goes to tide water and becomes a commercial commoditj^ in the New England market. This has been going on for fifteen years, and the competition which we have had to undergo with the present duty of 75 cents a ton has been very severe, and has kept the margin of profit down so close that it has been quite a struggle. Only within the last thirty days we found it necessary to reduce our selling price. Goal for the last five or six years lias been sold at tide water delivered at 81.2.5 a ton, for semicannel. This coal has chiefly gone to New England. The price paid to the Chesapeake and Ohio Railroad for hauling this coal a distance of 400 miles is only $1.30 per tan. The delivery price at Newport News is $'-'.30. The average distance is 400 miles; some distances are more, some less. Mr. BRECKiNEiDaE. Does not that include the return haul? Mr. Miller. That is the direct haul from the mines to Newport News, which is 400 miles. This recent redaction whicli we had to make left the price 87 cents per ton, and in order to meet that and to enable the coal agencies to handle coal we had to reduce the price to the miner to 40 cents per ton for mining coal, and that left 37^ cents to the dis- tributor for expenses of drivers, track layers, and all extra work in the mines and all the outside work. After all that has been paid tliere is a very slight margin of profit. Mr. Bryan. You speak of some cannel-coal? Mr. JliLLER. Yes; that is a very superior coal; it can be used for a variety of purposes. We do not care for protection for local consump- tion. Mr. Bryan. Do you sell it at the seaboard cheaper than you do at home? Mr. Miller. The retail price is always the same. Mr. Bryan. What is your retail price? Mr. Miller. It runs from $1.25 to $1.50 per ton, depending upon the consumer. A man who buys it to burn in his house pays $1.25 to $1.50. That output represents a great bulk. I suppose it is 90 per cent, if uot more, of the whole business of the road. This is a ^veat determining factor in the business. If you take the net price, after paying royalty you would get only 37^ cents a ton for all expenses. As the bulk of our business goes to tide water, if this duty is removed it will result in shutting up a great many of the mines. Mr. McMiLLiN. What steamships do yon supply? Mr. Miller. We do not supply any local business. . Mr. McMiLLiN. What do you supply? Mr. Miller. Collieries do business through agencies. Coal is shipped to agencies. BITUMINOUS COAL. 1151 Mr. McMiLLiN. The agents handle all the coal tliat goes into use? Mr. Miller. Yes, sir; thi.s is a question that does not concern the operators directly. The Old Dominion Steamship Company do their coaling at ISTewport News as do some steamers from Boston. Mr. McMiLLiN. Do any of those plying in the foreign trade get their coal there? Mr. Miller. I can not answer that; I presume some of them do. Mr. McMiLLiN. You don't know to what extent? Mr. Miller. No, sir; this coal field in which we are operating is coking coal. Bituminous coal fields cover half a dozen or more coun- ties in West Virginia. They are of great value and this is the only reason that they began to grow. The protection which we enjoy keeps these other peoiile from fixing the prices upon our coal. Mr. McMiLLiN. It does not fix the price, however, to the consumer! Mr. Millet;. The price has gone down 10 per cent on a(!COunt of competition between ourselves. There are three or four mines which produce 3,0(i0,000 or 4,000,000 tons of tliis coal, and what is not con- sumed is shipped abroad. From the Pocahontas district everything is obliged to oome to tide water. Mr. Bryan. You say that you ship to agents? Mr. Miller. The Norfolk and Western has its selling agents and the Chesapeake and Ohio have theirs. It represents a great deal of money. There are 5,000 or 6,000 miners employed. There are 20,000 to 40,000 people depending upon this work. Thas has a future. Mr. MgMillin. What is the thickness of your vein? Mr. Miller. It is fi'om 3 to 6 feet. Mr. McMillin. There are from 5,000 to 10,000 tons of coal to the acre? Mr. Miller. It would run from 3,000 to 6,000 tons to the acre. A tousand tons to the acre is the estimate for each foot of thiekuess. The general prosperity of this business depends upon its being pro- tected Irom this ruinous competition. The best evidence that we are not getting exorbitant prices for coal is the fact that it is being sold for a fraction over .*3 a ton. Mr. Bynum. Your market is at tidewater, and you would suffer if you were to take off this duty ? Mr. Miller. Yes, sir. This represents over 1,000,000 acres of coal land, which is being gradually developed. If you take this duty off it would practically wipe West Virginia off the map. MJh Bynum. Do you represent the miner or the railroad? Mr. Miller. I represent the miner. I am the operator in the coal lands. In some cases we lease; in some cases we own. We have a common interest with the miner. We can not prosper unless our men do. Mr. Bynum. How much land do you own? Mr. Miller. I' am operating with a corporation. In each instance we own a great deal of land. Mr. Bynum. About how many acres 1 Mr. Miller. About 2,500 acres of land. I am interested largely in that region. We have brought a great deal of capital there. Mr. Eeed's constituents have made investments there. If this duty is taken off we can not continue development. It would paralyze the whole business. Mr. MoJIiLLiN. What is that land worth per acre? Mr. Miller. It is worth from $300 to $500 per acre. 1152 SUNDRIES. Mr. BTtYAN. Is it worth aiiytliiiig for any other purpose? Mr. iMiLLEE. There may be some timber on it, but at farming a mm would starve to death. The whole State of Virginia is underlaid witu coal, and the time will come when this country will be deioending upon that region for coal. Mr. Bryan. When the price of land comes down do not you think that they will be compelled to take less royalty? Mr. Miller. That may be the case. Mr. Bryan. Instead of the land being worth $500 an acre they might be compelled to sell it for ^300 or $400 i^er acre. Mr. Miller. Yes, sir ; but bear in mind that we can not receive $300 or $400 per acre for this land until we invest a great deal of money. We had to invest fortunes before we could take anything out. We must also provide a sinking fund. When a man iuvests such large amounts of money he must know what he is doing. Mr. Bryan. Is it not true that you rent some land? Mr. Miller. Yes, sir. Mr. Bryan. If the land decreased in value it would cut down the royalty ? Mr. Miller. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. Mr. Miller, you sell coal to foreign steamship compa- nies? Mr. Miller. Yes, sir. Mr. Payne. You mean those coaling in American ports? Mr. Miller. Some little coal has gone to foreign countries. Some has gone to South America; but it does not cut much of a figure. Mr. Eeed. In cases where mines are leased and worked by an oper- ator, what protection does the lessor have that the coal will not be mined wastefuUy? Mr. Miller. There are stipulations by which the lessor is very well guarded. He has the right of inspection. The operator does not want to work the mine wastefully. A man would be foolish to do so. Mr. McMiLLiN. It would be against his own interest? Mr. Miller. Yes, sir; whether he is lessee or au owner. Mr. McMillin. What is the average amount ot coal mined per man? Mr. JfiLLER. Each miner will i)roduee 2 or 3 tons a day. I have known them to produce as high as 8 to 10 tons per day. The average would be probably about 4 tons. It runs more or less than that. Mr. McMillin. What are the wages'? Mr. Miller. Forty cents a ton. Different sections have different prices, in the Pocahontas region they do not pay anythiug like ftiat. The only pay 25 to 30 cents per ton. Mr. McMillin. I suppose the reason of that is that the coal is mined easier ! Mr. Miller. It does not take so much work. The Chairman. Do you employ white or colored miners'^ Mr. Miller. We employ both. The Chairman. What class is in the majority? Mr. Miller. We have more colored miners than white. The Chairman. Do you find that a colored man is usually as good a miner as a white man? Mr. Miller. Yes; I believe that the most prosperous man in my colliery is a black man. Mr. Turner. How do you operate, by steam or electricity? Mr. Miller. I have one mi)ie operated by electrical machines. Mr. Turner. Have you succeeded pretty well with them? • Mr. Miller. Yes, sir; we have been operating three or four years. BITUMINOUS COAL. 1163 Mr. TuENEB. What is the cost of operating per ton? Mr. Miller. We figured that we could do it cheaper by electricity, but we have not realized our exiiectations. We have encountered some difficulties which we did not anticipate, and it has entailed some extra cost. Mr. Turner. How long since you have employed colored men for miners '? Mr. Miller. I have employed them ever since I have been in busi- ness — fifteen years. Mr. Turner. Have you had about that proportion all the time? Mr. Miller. We have not been very particular aboat it. We sim- ply employ the men as they come. We do not care anything about a man's color if he is a good miner. Mr. Turner. Have you increased the proportion of colored men in your employ 1 Mr. Miller. I do not think we have. Mr. Turner. Do the men stay with you from year to year? Mr. Miller. I have men who have been with me ever since we began business. Mr. Turner. What proportion, of the men remain? Mr. Miller. The greater proportion. I know that a mining popu- lation has a great many floating, restless sort of men, but I think that more than half of them have been there for years. Mr. Turner. Have they any organization °? Mr. Miller. No, sir, they have not. I do not think the men have found it necessary to organize. We have never had any serious strikes in that region since I have been there. The Chairman. The colored miner does not often strike? Mr. Miller. Eecently, when we made a reduction, some of the ugliest fellows we had were our colored men, but they came in without trouble. I hope that the committee will consider that if this duty is taken oft" it would be a very serious matter and it would result in paralyzing prices. This section in West Virginia has about 58 per cent of all of the coal in the world. Mr. Breckinridge. Does not protection keep the prices from going down? Mr. Miller. I do not think it does. It is our position that if you take the protection off the price would go down, I do not think it would benefit the people. Mr. Breckinridge. The question is much broader than that. Pro- tection does prevent the price of coal from coming down? Mr. Miller. It keeps it from reckless competition. Mr. Breckinridge. Under this protection you transport coal over 400 miles, while the liTova Scotia people are right on the seaboard. Is not that the situation ? Mr. Miller. Yes, sir. The fact is that we believe that the Nova Scotia people can put the coal right into the vessel. It can practically be floated right out of the Nova Scotia mines and can come to Norfolk, Newport News, Baltimore, or Philadelphia. By the time our coal gets there we have already incurred the expense of at least $1.50 to get it to tide water. This makes competition necessarily closer for our coals. We send more or less coal to the South. We send to Charleston and Savannah. Mr. Breckinridge. And to Cuba? Mr. Miller. Yes, sir. TH 73 1154 SUNDRIES. Mr. BTJECKiisrEiDGB. You would not lose that trade? Mr. MiLLEE. That is a small proportion of the trade, but every little helps. Mr. CocKRAN. Does not your colliery send coal to Cuba? Mr. MiLLEE. We have never sent any coal direct to Cuba. Mr. CocKEAN. Your coal finds a market there? Mr. MiLLEE. I can not answer that, but I think it is likely that some of our coal has gone to Cuba. Mr. CocKEAN. Is it not a fact that Nova Scotia can not compete with you there, because your coal is a superior gas-making coal. ' Mr. MiLLEE. Our coal is a superior coal. Mr. Cocke AN. Is it not much better to pay a reasonable price for good coal than to burn out furnaces and boilers by using inferior coal? Mr. MiLLEE. On general principles I believe it is. Our coal is the best steam coal in the world. Under present conditions we have no difficulty in competing for the business, but if you take off the 75 cents per ton duty I have just shown you that we will lose the coastwise trade and be at a disadvantage of $1.30 per ton. If you do that, you open the door to competition. It would pay these people to import the other coal against ours by reason of the diiieri'iice in price. If the conditions A7ere the same, we could meet tlieir coiupetition, because our coal is of superior quality. Mr. CooKEAN. Does not some of your coal go to Arizona and old Mexico? Mr. MiLLEE. Yes, sir; it goes to old Mexico in limited quantities. Mr. CockeAn. It is used there in smelters. Mr. MiLLEE. Yes, sir. We have there to meet in competition with coke that is sent to Galveston; it goes inland to Arizona and JSfew Mex- ico. We are able to compete with these people by reason of the fact that coke absorbs moisture. It does not handle well, but breaks and becomes deteriorated. Mr. Beeckineidge. The removal of this duty would not be injurious to you from that point of view? Mr. Miller. No, sir; but from my knowledge of the situation I do not see how we can expect any improvement. Mr. Breckinridge's native State of Kentucky is largely underlaid with coal. The coals along the Ohio Eiver are unequaled. That has come within my knowledge, because I was raised there. Our people on New Eiver are oft' slack-' water navigation of the Kanawha, and the railroad has to run parallel to the river hundreds of miles. Mr. MoMiLLiN. Is it a fact that the coals of Kentucky have been sliipped to England and used? Mr. Miller. Some cannel coals have been used. The coals of Ken- tucky are a different character of coal entirely. Mr, McMillin. It is used mucb as a coking coal. Mr. MiLLEE. It is not such a valuable coal for steamers; it makes more ashes. Mr. Beyan, Do you screen your coal? Mr. Miller, No, sir. On the Kanawha they screen it. Mr, Bryan. Is there any statute law in your State on the subject of screens ? Mr. Miller. I think there is. Mr. Bryan. The law does not allow you to screen until after measur- ing the mines? Mr. Miller. I have not looked into that, because that does not apply to us. They require screens for certain sizes in paying for the mining- MANUFACTURED C0KK8. 1155 MANUFACTURED CORKS. (Paragraph 434.) COMPAEATITE WAGES PAID IN THE UNITED STATES AND EUKOPE PRIOR TO THE PASSAGE OP THE PRESENT TARIPE ACT AND THE WAGES PAID AT THE PRESENT TIME. Wages in the United Statet. ("Work 55 hours per week.) Pitts- burg, 1893. 1890. $20. 00 $13. 00 12.00 6.00 9.00 6.60 8.70 4.04 7.50 5.20 New York, :893. Foremen, per week Operatives : Slicera, etc., per week. Tapers, etc., per week Porters, p.ir week Eounders, per week- - . $21. 00 11.13 4.70 9.00 6.60 The wages paid to operatives in Laucaster, Pa., are to-day at from 6 to 10 per cent higher than they were prior to 1890; skilled operatives now receive 15 per cent higher wages. ■WAGES IN EUROPE. (Work 72 hours per week.) In Gibraltar, operatives — slicers, etc. — receive $2.40 per weet ; other operatives — tapers and sorters — from 60 cents to $1.20 per week; cork- wood sorters from $3.10 to $3.60 per week. In Seville, Spain, the operatives receive upon an average 25 per cent more than they pay in Gibraltar. In Leith, Scotland, girls receive $1.50 per week, and women $3 per week. In Stockholm, Sweden, and in several places in Eussia, punchers receive from $3 to $3.60 per week ; tapers, from $1 to $1.50 per week. The lowest wages paid in this country prior to 1890 was $4.04 per week. At the present time these operatives receive from $4.70 to $6 per week of 55 hours work ; while in Gibraltar they receive from 60 cents to $1.20 per week of 72 hours. In Seville the same operatives receive from 75 cents to $1.50 per week of 72 hours. In Sweden and Russia, $1.50 per week of 72 hours. The use of machinery in the manufacture of corks in this country is about the same as in Europe; in fact, cork-cutting machines are sent from here to Europe. The importers of corks have the advantage over the manufacturers in this country, they i)aying only for the actual weight of the corks imported by them, whUe the manufacturers who import cork wood lose by the waste in cutting corks two-thirds in weight; hence pay triple freight. The present rates of duty on corks and cork cut into squares is specific, and has proved itself entirely just and satisfactory to the trade. 1156 SUNDRIES. It has likewise succeeded to prevent tlie former abuses of undervalua- tions. It was urged by the importers that the specific duty of 15 cents per pound on manufectured corks would prohibit the importations of the same, but the official statement furnished by the U. S. Bureau of Sta- tistics proves that under the present specifle duty the imports have considerably increased and have yielded a larger revenue to our Gov- ernment, namely: Duties collected in — 1887 $52, 382. 90 1888 66, 335. 49 1889 61, 797. 74 1890 85, 933, 47 The increase in 1890 shows that, the importers unjustly fearing that the specific duty would prove itself prohibitory, large amounts of manu- factured corks were imported under that wrong impression, hence the increase from $61,797.74 in 1889 to $85,933.47 in 1890 in duties paid and for the fiscal year of each. The returns for 1891, fiscal year ending June 30, include the imports for the first year under the present tariff. This tariff of 1890 went into active operation October 6, 1890 j from that date the specific duty took effect. From October, 1890, to June 30, 1891, there were imported during the nine months manufactured corks on which the duty collected amounted to $98,780.93, thus proving conclusively that the present specific duty is far from being prohibitory ; on the contrary, the importers have found it equitable as well as profitable, or they would not have increased the importations of manufactured corks. For the fiscal year ending June 30, 1892, the imports have further increased, and the duties collected advanced to $100,288.45. During the past fiscal year, June 30, 1893, the duties collected have further increased to $105,455.79. It can not be claimed that the specific duty is unjust or that manu- factured corks pay in proportion to their value a higher duty under the present law. The U. S. Senate Committee on Finance has carefully investigated the prices ruling in Europe for raw materials, including unmanufac- tured cork wood. Their official statement (Senate Eeport 1394, Fifty- second Congress, second session. Part 1, p. 352) proves that cork wood has gradually advanced from 1850 from 4.8 cents per pound to 7.3 cents per pound in 1891. The competitions in all trades all over the world have never been severer than they are at the present time. The manufacturers of corks in this country have not only to compete with the importers, but have for the past three years been subjected to the keenest competition among the manufacturers themselves, as well as the traders in general. EespectfuUy submitted. John Robinson, For the manufacturers of corlcs in, the United States. Few Yoek, Sej^temher 22, 1893. COEKS. 1157 CORKS. (Paragraph 184.) A BRIEF ON BEHALF OP CERTAIN IMPORTERS OP CORKS, CARRYING ON BUSINESS AT THE CITY OP NEW YORK. First. As the reasons then presented against the enactment of the so-called "McKinley bill" are equally potential touching its repeal, I beg leave to invite the attention of the committee to the following documents, being originals now on file in the archives of the House of Representatives, or copies of documents originally filed but now lost or mislaid, to wit : (1) Memorial of Anheuser-Busch Brewing Company, of St. Louis, Mo., against increase of duty on hops, rice, corks, etc. Filed March 10, 1890, and marked "Exhibit 1." (2) Petition of mineral-water dealers of Saratoga Springs, 'N. T., protesting against any increase of the ijresent duty on corks (A. D. 1890); also claiming that, inasmuch as no protection is afforded their industry by the proposed tariff bill (the McKinley bill) as to corks used in bottling foreign waters, that coiks should be placed on the free list. Filed April 9, 1890, and marked " Exhibit 2." (3) A circular letter similar to the one heretofore presented to the House of Eepresentatives and signed "the importers of corks in the United States," being an earnest protest against the passage of the disastrous McKinley bill, and marked "Exhibit 3." (4) A copy of an exceedingly well reasoned remonstrance against the passage of the McKinley bill, filed with the Committee of Ways and Means that had such bill under consideration, the original being now lost or mislaid, and marked " Exhibit 4." Second. The operation of the existing tariff has practically pro- hibited the principal corks that are used by the poorer classes ot people of the United States from being imported, or if imported, the importing merchant was compelled to sell at or in some instances below cost — a statement susceptible of easy proof, if opportunity be afforded. Third. Seven cents per pound would be an ample protection to the trust of domestic manufacturers, and yet the destructive rate of 15 cents per pound is the present duty. Seven cents per pound would be equal to between 25 and 27 per cent ad valorem — certainly a sufficient protection to a soulless combination that gets its cork bark free. Fourth. In no other country does such an excessive and onerous duty exist upon an article of universal use — an article indispensable to the convenience and comfort of every household. In England they are free; in France the duty is 2| cents per pound; in Italy, 1^; Germany, with her high-tariff ideas, only taxes corks 1^ cents per pound. Fifth. The trust of domestic manufacturers has had for twenty years or more the entire monopoly of all corlcs used by druggists, and now Lave also almost the entire monopoly of all cheap soda-water, beer, and ale corks. Sixth. It is susceptible of proof that the manufacturers of corks in this country, following the example of some other industries, are form- ing themselves into one great trust, and if present unreasonable and excessive rates of duty ujion the imported article continue unrepealed, the purchasers of corks will be at the mercy of the manufacturers' trust, the importers being expelled from the market. 1168 SUNDRIES. Seventh. Assuming that this enlighf.ened committee believe ■with me that the consumer pays the duty and that trusts are injurious and dan- gerous to society, I will conclude with the request that the exhibits herewith filed may receive the careful consideration of the committee. Egbert Ohristt, Attorney for cork importers. In referring to the so-called " McKinley bill " (H. E. 9416, Fifty-first Congress), Mr. Carlisle, then a member of the lower House of Congress, used the following language : No rediiction has been made in the amount of duties imposed under any schedule except that relating to sugar and molasses. In all the other thirteen schedules of dutiable goods, embracing almost every important article the people use, except tea and coffee, which have been free for many years, increases are made, and in many of them the increase is very large. The present chairman of the Finance Committee Of the Senate, in his discussion of the bill, used the following strong language: On every article absolutely necessary to the home life of the farmer, the mechanic, and the day laborer, existing tariff taxes have been retained, and in many most vital instances enormously increased. * * * xhe mask is at last clear off. We are no more to be deluded with soft and skillful words in behalf of protection, as an inci- dent to revenue, nor are we any longer to listen to the siren's pathetic song in thenur- sery of infant industries. These infants, wliose crying woes and puerile attempts to walk alone for the last hnntlred years have excited so much sympathy and subsi- dized so much eloquence, have now become full-grown, robust highwaymen, no longer asking protection for their weakness, but demanding the legalized privilege as a right and without disguise, to raid, loot, and plunder every precinct of honest industry in the United States. (Cong. Eec, Vol. 21, pt. 8, pp. 7531, 7532.) As an appropriate maxim, and thoroughly consistent with the senti- ments so well expressed by the eloquent Senator, I beg leave to cite the following: " Let a beggar sleep in your straw- and he'll make him- self your heir." I now beg the attention of the committee to the discussion in the Senate attending the striking out of the amendments reported by the Finance Committee of the Senate to the McKinley bill as it passed the House of Eepresentatives, touching duties upon manufactured and par- tially manufactured corks. I quote from the Congressional Eecord, Vol. 21, part 10, pp. 9668, 9669: The next amendment of the Committee on Finance was, on page 101, line 24, after the word " cubes," to strike out "ten " and insert " five,'' so as to read: 411. Cork bark, cut into squares or cubes, live cents per pound. Mr. Aldrich. The committee are satisfied, after further investigation, that this amendment should not be made, and I ask that it be disagreed to, and that the House rate may stand. Mr. Caelislb. I should like to hear the reason why the committee think the amendment should not be made. The House certainly has largely increased the duties upon cork bark, which is a material used in the manufacture of corks in this country, and is not produced here. So, neither upon the ground of raising revenue nor upon the ground of protection, it seems to me, is there any justification for the increase of duty. Mr. Aldkich. After very careful examination by the committee they became sat- isfied that the House rates decreased existing law ; that the House rates were less than 25 per cent ad valorem upon the average corks which are imported: and they therefore ask that the House rates may be retained. Mr. McPherson. Then why not leave the ad valorem rate as it is, at 25 per cent, and that would cover both the unmanufactured and the manufactured corks f cuKKS. 1159 Mr. AiDEiCH. For the reason, as tlie Senator unilerstands, that the majority of the committee are always in favor of levying specific rates wljen it can be done. The President pbo XEMrouE. The tjuestion is on agreeing to the amendifient pro- posed by the committee. The amendment was rejected. The next amendment of the Committee on Finance to paragraph 411 was, on page 102, line 1, after the word " corks," to strike out "fifteen" and insert "seven and one-half," so as to read : Manufactured corks, seven and one-half cents per pound. The President pro tempore. The question is on the amendment proposed by the Committee on Finance. Mr. Carlisle. I suppose it is not necessary to ask for a yea-and-nay vote, because the result will be the same. The amendment was rejected. I have made this lengthy extract because I know personally that the amendments were made by the Committee on Finance of the Senate after the full consideration of the subject, having been furnished with conclusive documentary proof (not now recoverable after diligent search through the archives of the two Houses of Congress), that the specific rates prescribed by the House bill upon manufactured and partially manufactured corks were largely in excess of the theretofore existing ad valorem duties. I therefore most respectfully submit that the present duties on corks, manufactured and partly manufactured, were the result of entire misapprehension on the part of the zealous high-tariff Senator from Rhode Island and should be repealed. Finally, I most respectfully submit to this honorable committee, that public policy and just dealing require that, corks, manufactured and partially manufactured, should either be admitted free or that present duties should be reduced to at least an uniform rate of 6 cents per pound. Robert Christy, Attorney for importers of corTcs of New York City, CORKS. * (Paragraph 484.) ISTew York, September 30, 1893. SiE: Being the oldest house in the United States engaged in the importation and manufacture of corks and cork wood, we beg leave to address you upon the subject of the tariff. it seems to us that three principal conditions should be especially determined in fixing a rate of duty, viz: (1) Revenue received by the Government. (2) Price of goods to consumer. (3) Wages paid to operatives. We will present these three points in the order named. First. The revenue derived by the Government from the present spe- cific duty on corks — namely, 15 cents per pound — has shown a steady increase year by year since its establishment in 1890, and is greater in each and every year since 1890 than in any year preceding. The duty collected in 1893 is the largest on record. This is plainly shown by the following table furnished by the U. S. Bureau of Statistics: 1160 SUNDKIK.5. Duties received. Under ad valorem duties — 1887 $52,382.90 1888 66,335.49 1889 61,797.74 1890 85,933.47 Under specific duty— 1891 98,780.93 1892 100,283.45 1893 105,455.79 It may also be said that this duty, beiug specific, enables the Gov- ernment to collect all its due, and also prevents undervaluations, which drove many respectable houses out of the business in the past. Second. The price of the goods to the consumer has steadily decreased in the last three years. This is partly owing to improvements in machin- ery and general economics, but it is especially due to the very keen competition now existing among American manufacturers themselves and also with the Spanish importers. We are to-day selling corks at an average of 20 per cent less than three years ago, which prices are the lowest ever recorded in America. Third. The wages paid by the manufacturers throughout the country have steadily increased in the last few years. We subjoin a table show- ing the average weekly wages of our own operatives, as follows : 1890. 1893. ! 1890. 1893. $18.00 10.40 8.70 $21. 00 11.13 9.30 $4.04 4.21 7.50 $4.70 4 63 Slicers jBlockers - -. 9.00 This table shows that we are paying materially higher wages now than we did under the old ad valorem duty. We have now shown the conditions under the present specific duty to be — (1) That the duties paid to the Government are continually increasing. (2) That corks are sellingtlower that ever before. (3) That wages paid are higher than before the present specific dutyt We therefore think that, according to true Democratic principles, we are justified in asking that the present specific duty remaia unchanged. We might also add that cork wood, oar raw material, is free, and with reason, as it is not grown at all in this country. The cork industry of this country is in the hands of a large number of independent manufacturers and importers, and the prices they obtain for their goods are so low that a decrease of duties, particularly if on an ad valorem basis, would result in the ruin of many, if not all, of these concerns. At least, the factories now operating in America would have to be transferred "to Spain, Tours, respectfully, Tbuslow & Co. CORKS. 1161 CORKS. (Paragraph 4S4.) New Yoek, September 28, 1893. SiE: Our reasons for asking the present specific duty to be main- tained are as follows: First. Prior to the enactment of the McKinley bill corks or cork wood manufactured came in under an ad valorem duty of 25 per cent. Although for many articles the ad valorem duty is preferable, it is not so for corks. Corks, even for an expert, are exceedingly difficult to appraise, and it was found practically impossible to collect the right duties, especially outside the port of New York. Many importers, knowing this fact, had goods sent in bond to interior cities. They were passed at an undervaluation of 30 per cent to 70 per cent, owing to the lack of knowledge of foreign values, and houses who desired to do an honest business were obliged to discontinue importing. All importers except the Spanish houses advocated for years the adoption of a specific duty, and when it was granted under the McKin- ley bill the rate was made as near as was practicable an equivalent of the ad valorem. The frauds perpetrated and the necessity for a change is clearly shown in a special letter from Col. Ayer, special agent of the Treasury Department, to the Secretary of the Treasury, under date of January 7, 1890, a copy of which we attach hereto; also by a letter from George E. Batcheller, Acting Secretary of the Treasury, to the chair- man of the Ways and Means Committee, under date of January 10, 1890, copy of which we also attach. Second. It was stated by the Spanish importers that the rate of 15 cents per pound as now existing would i)rohibitthe importation of for- eign corks. By reference to the table of importations as furnished by the Bureau of Statistics it has shown that the importations have not only not been prohibitive, but have actually increased. The duties collected on importations, as shown by records in the Bureau of Statistics, are as follows : • Coj-fcs manufactured. ' June 30 Duties collected. 1887 $52,382.90 1888 ..-- 66,335.49 1889 61,797.74 1890 85,933.47 June 30 — Duties collected. 1891 $98,780.93 1892 100,288.45 1893 105,455.79 The last three years, 1891, 1892, 1893, having been under the specific duty, it conclusively refutes the assertion that the specific duty would either prohibit or seriously diminish the importation of foreign corks. Third. It was further urged by the friends of the former ad valorem duty that the specific duty would increase the price to consumers. As a matter of fact the result has been precisely the reverse, and the consumer is able to buy both foreign and domestic corks to-day at a lower price than under the ad valorem duty. The reasons for this are twofold: Firstly, because the specific duty, while increasing the duty on poor goods, which are seldom imported to this country, it has decreased the duty on fine goods, which the con- sumer of foreign corks in this country mostly requires. Secondly, 1162 SUNDRIES. domestic corks are cheaper, owing to the very severe competition among the manufacturers. This decrease in price can at once be proved by reference to the books of any of the manufacturers or of their customers. In addition to the three reasons for maintaining the specific duty given above, we would like to refute some erroneous statements which we learn have been made to the Ways and Means Committee by the Spanish importers. They claim, firstly, ''that labor has not received its share under the McKinley act, but that wages have been reduced from 10 to 20 per cent." We reply to this that we have carefully examined the pay roll of two firms, Armstrong Brothers & Co., of Pittsburg, Pa., the largest manu- facturers in this country, and Truslow & Co., of Brooklyn, N". Y., the largest in this State, and have compared the present average earnings of their operatives with the average earnings previous to 1890. In both cases we find a decided increase. This has also been confirmed by letters from other firms to whom we have written on the subject. In many instances the increase is over 15 per cent. They claim, secondly, " that the greater part of the corks manufac- tured in this country are produced by machinery, and that women and children are employed to attend that machinery." In answer to this we admit that corks are chiefly made by machin- ery, but not in America alone, the same applies equally to all European countries, with the possible exception of the one Spanish province of Catalonia. We can farther state that American machinery is being used more largely every year for the manufacture of corks in Europe, even in Spain itself. As to the argument of the Spanish importers, that women and children are principally engaged in the manufacture of corks in this country, we can positively assert that such is not the case in the United States, while it is quite true of Europe. Women are employed here, but only in a small part of the manufacture. The wages of women employed in Europe are about one-fifth of what is paid in the United States, England excepted. In Spain, Germany, and Russia, the average pay for women and girls is about 75 cents to $1.50 per week. In England $1.60 to $3. The aver- age wages paid to women and girls here now is about $4.50 to $6. As to men and boys they earn on an average in Europe about one- third what they earn in the United States. The importers have stated, thirdly, " that a trust has been formed since the McKinley act." We consider this to be malicious in the extreme, as there is no truth in the statement. A positive evidence of there being no " trust" is the unhappy fact that there exists the most severe competition between the different manufacturers, and that corks are sold so low that the business is very unremunerative. In concluding our remarks, we would state generally that we find the present specific duty of 15 cents per pound to be equitable and just to both importers and manufacturers. That a change to an ad valorem duty would bring about the dreadful state of affairs existing prior to 1890, and that a reduction of duty would make the manufac- turing business so unprofitable that it would drive a large percentage of the manufacturing from the United States to Europe. EespectfuUy, yours, GUDEWILL & BUCKNALL. COKKS. 1163 CORKS. (Paragraph 4S4.) Treasury Department, Office of the Secbetart, Washington^ J). C, January 10, 1890. Sir : I inclose herewith, copy of a report dated the 7th instant, and of its inclosures, from special agent Ira Ayer, of this Department, in relation to the undervaluation of corks, and suggesting the substitu- tion of specific for the present ad valorem rates thereon. ' Respectfully, yours, GrEO. E. BATCHBLLER, Acting Secretary. Hon. William McKinlet, Jr., Chairman Committee on Ways and Means. Office of Special Agent, Treasury Department, 402 Washington Street, New Torh City, January 7, 1890. Sir : In connection with my duties as agent at this port it became necessary during the past year to look into the invoice value of corks imported at New York, and at several of the interior ports under immediate transportation bond, notably at Chicago, Milwaukee, St, Louis, and Ifew Orleans. Investigation shows that corks were being largely undervalued, par- ticularly at this port, and at Milwaukee, Chicago, and New Orleans, and a strong efibrt was made to secure advances on these importations, with varied success. An importation at New Orleans was advanced on information furnished by me, from 25 to nearly 100 per cent on some lines, and the advance was largely sustained on reappraisement. At this port it was generally understood that the practice existed on the part of shippers of corks in the vicinity of Barcelona, Spain, of making out two sets of invoices, one for custom purposes and one for the purchaser, the difference in prices being 25 per cent or thereabout. This was practically admitted by certain importers, and frequent ad- vances were made. The difllculty in securing correct values has grown out of the fact that there are but few who are competent to pass upon these goods. At this port we were fortunate in having some importers and maufac- turers who were well posted, and who rendered valuable assistance to the Government in this direction. In view of the diiBculties mentioned, it became apparent that some mode of collecting duties on corks other than that upon an ad valorem basis was desirable, and after much careful consideration a schedule showing the comparative work- ing of the present 25 per cent ad valorem duty and a proposed specific duty of 20 cents per pound was prepared (Exhibit A inclosed). By an inspection of this schedule it will be seen that the corks which are prin- cipally imported have been divided into six classes, and that with the exception of brewers' corks the duty of 20 cents per pound, as proposed, would be practically the same as the present ad valorem rate on a just valuation of the goods. 1164 SUNDRIES. On brewers' corks it is stated that an increased rate is necessary in order to protect properly domestic manufactures. From my experience liere in the matter of undervaluations I fully concur in the views held by these gentlemen as to the desirability of a specific rather than an ad valorem rate of duty upon corks, and beg in closing to commend the subject to the careful attention of the Depart- ment. I am informed that parties interested have a hearing before the Com- mittee of Ways and Means of the House on Friday, the 10th instant, and the Department wiU determine as to the propriety of furnishing the committee with a copy of this report. I should add that cork squares or blocks are imported to some extent, and as they are in great part manufactured they should, in my opinion, pay the same duty as corks. In order that there maybe no misapprehension as to the purport and intent of the foregoing, I submit below substitutes for the present pro- visions of law pertaining to cork importations, which it is believed will fairly meet the case: Corks and cork bark, manufactured, including cork squares, twenty cents per pound. Paragraph 683, act March 3, 1883, to remain as it now is, viz : Corkwood or cork bark, unmanufactured, free. Eespectfully submitted. Ika Atee, Je., iSpecial Agent. Hon. William Windom, Secretary of the Treasury. CORKS. (Paragraph *Si.) New Toek, September 29, 1893. SiE : Eeferring to our letter of yesterday's date, and more especially to the paragraph relating to the statement of the importers that a "trust" has been formed, it appears to us possible that the only thing which could give color to such a statement might be that a firm in Williamsburg and another in Lancaster, finding business very unprofit- able, sold their machinery and stock to Armstrong Brother & Co., of Pittsburg, and retired entirely from the business. Surely, however, this can not be construed to be a trust: and to prove positively that no trust exists, we give below the names of twenty factories who are strong competitors of Armstrongs and of one another. The names of the manufacturers are as follows : Truslow & Co., Brooklyn, N. Y.; New York Cork Works, Brooklyn, N. Y.; Conkling & Titus, Brooklyn, N. Y. ; Paddock Manufacturing Company, Brook- lyn, N. Y.; Andrew Morton, New York, N. Y.; John Wilking, New York, N. Y.; Albany Cork Works, Albany, N. Y.; E. W. McCready & Co., Chicago, 111.; Excelsior Cork Cutting Company, Chicago, 111.; Chi- cago Cork Works, Chicago, 111. ; Banar & Wieland, Pittsburg, Pa.;. Alfred L. Butz, Philadelphia, Pa.; Samuel Wilkie, Philadelphia, Pa; COKKS. 1165 Brauer & Brueckmann, Philadelphia, Pa.; J. P. Hodge, Boston, Mass.; Eichard Beeching & Co., Boston, Mass.; William Beeching & Co., Bos- ton, Mass.; M. F. Stinson & Co., Boston, Mass.; E. P. Goodwin, Nor- wich, Conn. ; William King, Perth Amboy, N. J. There are also various others of less importance. EespectfuUy, yours, GUDEWILL & BUCKNAXL. CORKS. (Faragrapli 131.) STATEUENT OF CHAHLES D. ABHSTBONG, OF ABUSTBOITG, BBOTHEB ft CO., OF FITTS- BUB6, FA. Prior to the passage of the McKinley act corks paid 25 per cent ad valorem duty, but the undervaluationsby certain importers, on accountof of the great difiiculty of proper appraisements, were so notorious and bare- faced that my house was compelled to cease this branch ot our business — formerly an important one — as corks were sold by other importers, who paid as much or more than we did in Spain and other producing coun- tries, at less than actual cost to us laid down in New York. This fact was conclusively proved, and the documents as submitted bj"^ the special agent of the Treasury at the port of New York are, I believe, on file at Washington. The specific duty of 15 cents per pound was adopted as being prac- tically equal to the average rate of duty paid on corks under the ad valorem duty of 25 per cent, and the records of importations since 1890,. and the duties collected on the same, demonstrate that this calculation was carefiilly and conservatively made. At the time this change was being considered by the Ways and Means Committee, the plea was made by the importers that their busi- ness would be ruined by the passage of this act, and that they would be compelled to retire completely from the field. The statistics enu- merated below show the falsity of this claim and tend to prove the statement which I now make, that the importing business has increased materially since 1890, both in volume and in the number of houses engaged in it. Duties collected on corks. Ad valorem : 1887 $52,382.90 1888 66,335.49 1889 - 61,797.74 1890 85,933.47 Specific: ^ 1891 98,780.93 1892 : 100,288.45 1893 105,455.79 Cork workers of the United States are paid much higher wages than those of Spain, Portugal, Germany, Sweden, Eussia, and other Euro- pean producing and competing countries. American machinery has been introduced abroad to a large extent, consequently the methods of manufacture in America and Europe are now very similar, and the out- put per operative day is nearly equal. The following table is compiled from personal knowledge of the writer of wages paid in Europe and at Pittsburg, Pa.: 1166 SUNDRIES. [Work: Eiirope, 72 hours per week; Pittstnrg, 55 honrs per week.] Europe, per week. Pittsburg, per week. f3. 00 to $4. 00 '3.00 5.00 3. 00 4. 00 1.50 2.00 1.20 1.50 2. 00 2. 50 2. 00 2. 50 $13. 00 to $15. 00 9.00 12.00 12.00 5.00 6.00 5. 00 7. 00 5. 00 7. 00 9.00 Slicers Tapering machine ; Operatives, female Eonuding machine : Sorters Laborers Since the passage of tlie McKinley act there has been an average increase in the wages of the cork workers of the United States of at least 10 per cent. The labor on corks represents, iii some classes of goods, as much as 80 per cent of the cost of production. Stuce 1890 there has been a constant decline in the selling prices of all kinds of cork products in the United States, until to-day they have reached the lowest point ever known in the history of the business. Corks are sold from a uniform list by discount. The following table shows a percentage of the list, the goods netted the manufacturers in 1889 and 1893: Per cent of Ust. 1889. 1893. Bottlers' corks 70 70 30 60 50 18 Brewers' corks Druggists' corks In fact, the competition has been so keen that during the past year a number of manufacturers have been compelled to close out their business. There are at present about twenty-five importing competing factories besides many smaU ones engaged in cork manufacturing in this country, and the United States ranks among the leading cork producers of the world. To reduce the present specific duty or to return to the ad valorem duty would surely work great injury to this industry, and would certainly compel American manufacturers to transfer a large part of their plant to the other side, as they could not reasonably hope to cope successfully with Spanish and Portugese labor under the man- agement of French, German, and English capitalists. Since the passage of the McKinley act, in spite of a material increase in the cost of raw material in Europe — (1) Importations have increased. (2) Eevenues have increased. (3) Wages paid American laborers have increased. (4) On account of the severe competition among domestic manufac- turers, the price of corks to consumers has reached the lowest point ever known. ^ (5) Under the specific duty the business of cork importing is open to any person desiring to engage in it, as undervaluation is not possible, and on account of fair, honest competition, imported corks are to-day sold at lower prices than ever before known in this market. Eespectfully submitted, Charles D. Armstkong, For the Cork Manufacturers of the United States, EMERY — MATCHES. 1167 EMERY. (Paragraph 437.) Boston, September 19, 1893. SiE : We wish to call your attention to what seems to us to be an excessive duty, under the present tariff laws, upon manufactured emery and flour emery. As you are aware, all genuine emery stone is imported into this country. We think there is no mine which has been opened which has proved to be strictly emery stone, or which is now in operation. The ore, under the present tariff, comes in free, costing, we think, from 1 cent to 1^ cents per pound, freight paid. We believe that a quarter of a cent per pound would fully protect the laborer of the United States as against foreign labor in the preparation of emery for use. The present duty on ground emery is 1 cent per pound. Very respectfully, yours, D. Webstee King- Glue Co. D. Webster King, President. MATCHES. (Paragraph 441.) The York Match Company, of York, Pa., desire to present the follow- ing reasons why the present duty of 10 cents per gross on matches should be retaiued: First. We regard the 10 cents per gross not as a protection to our interest, but as a license that the foreign manufacturer pays for the privilege of entering this market. We hold that we haA'e the first claim on the trade of this country, because we help to supi)ort its industries and carry forward its enterprises. Second. The price of matches to the consumer would not be affected a fraction by any change in the above duty, but the reduction would inure to the benefit of the foreign manufacturer, aflbrding him a market in which to dispose of his surplus stock. The consumer, instead of complaining about the price of matches, is amazed at the quantity he can get for his money. Third. We pay our employes such wages and salaries as are entirely satisfactory to them, and have never had a strike in our manufactory on account of wages or any other cause. In fact, we have never known of a strike to occur in a match manu factory. Our labor costs us much more here than it does in Europe for the same class of work. It is just surprising at what a low figure girls can be etnployedin Sweden, which is a large manufacturer of matches. A girl in our manufactory that will earn say $5 per week, can be had in Sweden for less than half that amount; in fact, we have been informed that Swedish labor of this class is not more than one^flfth what ours is. We do not think that we are asking for anything in this matter but simple justice when we urge upon you the retention of the present duty. We do not make our prices on the duty or license of lO cents per gross paid by the foreign manufacturer, but base them on the cost of produc- tion. The York Match Co. 1168 SUNDRIES. MATCHES. (Paragraph 441). STATEMENT OF 0. C. BARBER, OF CHICAGO, HI. Mr. Chaikman : I Lave come before you on a different subject from the gentJemen who have just spoken. My subject is that of the manu- facture of matches. We have a protection of 10 cents a gross on matches, that is to say, there is a tariff of 10 cents a gross of 144 boxes of matches of 100 matches to each box. I would like to have it retained for the reason that it is a protection. The Swedes are the great manufacturers of matches for the whole world. They are the largest competitors that we have in the markets of the world. They are a people content with small Xvages, and are industrious. They have conquered the markets of India and nearly all the markets outside of Europe except the American market and a part of the South American market. They have been able to do Ihis because of the cheapness of their product. The rate at which they pay their labor (men are not employed in the match business) is at the rate of about 25 cents a day for girls, where we pay an average of about $1. You can see (vhat the result would be if we should undertake to compete with them. It is a simple matter so long as we are established on a protective basis. The whole system of the commerce of the country is established on the system of protection, and we cannot see why we should be left out and separated from the system. It can not be done without greatloss to our business. We think that if you should conclude to continue the pro- tective system in this country in order to keep up the rate of wages we are now paying, we thiuk you would do us injury if you left us out of the protection list. If it is to be the rule of this country that it is to continue under the protective system we want to be recognized. If the free-trade system should be adopted we would have our doubts of being able to continue. It takes a long time to build up a system,. and after it is built up it takes a long time to readjust it to a new basis diametrically opposed to the One in existence. The Swedes are estab- lished on a free-trade basis. How long it would take us to adjust our- selves to that we do not know. Therefore, we ask you to continue our protection. I want to show you that it will not amount to much to the consumer. The tariff of 10 cents on a gross of matches of 144 boxes, 100 matches to the box, if estimated, would be a reduction in the cost of the matches in this country of one-fourth of a cent on a hundred which would be absorbed by the dealer; the consumer would get no benefit. Matches are put up in dozens. The difference in the cost of matches now and what the cost would be if the tariff was taken off' and the matches were reduced accordingly would be less than a cent a dozen. A retail dealer could not see how to divide that, and would keep the cent. We are employing between 6,000 and 7,000 people in the match industry in the United States. It is a small industry compared with the others of which you have been hearing. It is an article which enters into every household, and every person is more or less affected by the quality of matches. It has been the habit of European manu- facturers to send khe best goods to the countries where they Iiad the most competition, and therefore they dumped upon us their poor quali- ties. To-day the industry is well established in this country. It has been established over forty-five years. 1 have grown up with it in that hatters' furs. 11C9 time, or since 1845. I have been through free trade and everything else in that business. I worked at it when we had free trade away back in the 'fifties. I was a boy in the business at that time. I used to peddle matches. I would go out with a wagon load of matches and come back with a wagon load of cotton, beeswax, sugar, candles, gin- seng, sheep pelts, and things of that sort,\aud I used to take those and distribute them among the laborers in payment of their wages. The cash money which I would receive would serve to pay for the phos- phorus, which was imported. This is the system that was under free trade. Under the broad system of protection which has been adopted in thifi country for several years the country seems to have thrived, and any policy changing it would radically reverse the whole system. That is my speech. The Chairman. This country can thrive under a good many mis- fortunes. Mr. Baebee. Yes, sir; it can. HATTERS' FURS. (Faragrapli 414.) New Tore, September 13, 1893. SiB: The sections of the tariff bill now in force relating to hatters furs and the raw material from which they are produced are as follows : Schedule l>r, laws of 1890, section 444: "Purs dressed on the skin, but not made up into articles, and furs not on the skin prepared for hatters use, 20 per cent ad valorem." And in the free list, sections 587 and 588: "Furs dressed; fur skins of all kinds not dressed in any manner." "Hatters' furs" were dutiable at 25 per cent ad valorem in the tariff of 1842, 10 per cent in 1846, 8 per cent in 1857, 10 per cent in 18G1, 20 per cent in 1862, and 20 per cent in every tariff enacted since 1862. When the tariff act of 1870 placed on the free list the raw material irom which hatters' furs are prepared, namely, "Fur skins not dressed in any manner," or its briefer equivalent, "undressed furs," a portion of the business of manufacturing "hatters' furs" was transferred from England, France, and Germany to this country. During twenty-three years the present tariff has proved protective without being prohib- itory. Although having a large factory in Connecticut in which we produce the article in question, we are not able, with the present pro- tection to the industry, to manufacture over one-half of all the hatters' fur we sell, importing, at 20 per cent duty, all the medium and lower grades. The present tariff thus secures to the consumer the benefit of a free and continuous competition between the American and foreign manu- facturers to sell in this market. The American manufacturer would be driven out of the business, as they were prior to 1870, by any serious changes in the schedules. In every revision of the tariff from 1870 to 1890 the subjects received a full share of consideration, and in every case the final decision of the committee has been to continue the classification and duties as already quoted. We respectfully ask that no change be made now. Very respectfully, yours, W. A. & A. M. White. TH 74 1170 SUNDRIES. HATS. (Pnragra)))! 451.) New York, iSeptember 16, 1893. Sir : We appear before your your committee to advocate the retea- tiou of the present duty on fur felt hats, namely: Scheduled — hats, for men's, women's, and children's wear, composed of the far of the rabbit, beaver, or other animals, or of which such fur is the component material of chief vakie, wholly or partially manufactured, including fur hat bodies, ad valorem, 55 per cent; and to impress upon your minds, as earnestly as it is possible for us to do, that the result of the past has demonstrated that the duty of 55 per cent ad valorem is by no means excessive. In support of our views we present the following reasons: First. That practically aU of the material used in the manufacture of fur felt hats is subject to duty. The furs prepared for hatters' use are subject to 20 per' cent ad valorem, and the duty on other materials ranges upwards to 50 per cent on silk and satin linings, hat bands and bindings. Second. That 55 percent of the cost of these hats is composed of labor for which we pay two and one half times more than is jjaid in Europe, and in support of this statement we submit a photographic copy of a part of a pay roll of the largest hat factory in Europe, Messrs. Viuenet Fils, which shows that some of the hands earn 12 J centimes, or 2^ cents an hour, for identically the same work for which we pay 10 cents au hour. Others earn 30, 35, and 40 centimes an hour, or 6, 7, and 8 cents, where we pay for the same work 20 cents an hour. Others on this pay roll have earned 35, 40, and 45 centimes, or 7, 8, and 9 cents an hour, where we pay 25 cents an hour. The foremen on this Vinemet pay roll receive 40 and 42^ francs per week, or $8 and $8.50. The foremen in American factories are paid from $20 to $30 per week. Third. That contrary to the popular idea, that the machinery used here is so much superior to that adopted by European manufacturers. The fact is that both countries use practically the same machinery. Fourth. Notwithstanding the present duty, there has been no increase in the price of hats to the consumer, for the reason that they are man- ufactured in twelve difierent States, viz, New York, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Connecticut, Ehode Island, Massachusetts, Maine, Cali- fornia, Missouri, Indiana, Illinois, and Maryland. And there exists no trust nor combination in regard to prices. The keen competition among over two hundred factories, employing about 25,000 hasids, causes the hats to be sold on a very close margin of profit. Fifth. That with the present means of rapid transit between this country and Europe, and with the system of the cable code, the two countries are brought so closely together that any material reduction in the present duties would enable European manufacturers to destroy this industry, or compel the reduction of labor to the European stand- ard. The following is an illustration of the comparative cost of a hat in this countiy and Europe, costing $15 per dozen in this country: " Ameiican cost. Fur, 20 per cent of $15 $3. 00 Trimmitige, 20 per cent of $15 '. 3.00 Liibor, 55 per cent of $15 8.25 Incidentals, 5 per ceut of ^15 . . . , ,,.,,...,,,,,,,, , 75 15.00, HATS. 1171 Foreign cost. Fur, lesper cent less than American cost, Tvhicli is $3 $2.50 Trimmings, 33J per cent less than American cost, which is $3 2.00 ' Labor, 40 per cent of American cost, which is $8.25 : .' 3. 30 Incidentals, one-half of American cost, 75 cents 38 8.18 The above shows that a hat costing $16 per dozen to produe here can be made in Europe for $8.18, the greater part of the difference being the price paid for labor. With the duty of 55 per cent added, the total cost of the foreign hats would be $12.68; the same hat manutactured here would cost $15, which shows that the present tariff is not prohibi- tory, and we have never asked for such a tariff'. We wish to impress on your committee as earnestly as possible to do so the fact that our industry must have adequate protection or be destroyed. The percentage of increase in the importation of fur hats into this country during the year previous to the passage of the pres- ent law we believe to have been unprecedented m the history of any other industry during the same period. We desire further to say that in our reqiiest we represent the wishes of 25,000 laboring men engaged in our industry in this country. We assert and are prepared to prove that English and other European manufacturers have made preparations to flood the American market with their goods the moment it is announced that the present tariff' is to be reduced. EespectfuUy submitted by the undersigned committee of fur felt hat manufacturers. Jerome Taylor, James L. Care, e. v. oonnett, C. H. Merritt, C. H. Tenney, A. B. Waring, Committee. APPENDIX. The reason that the importation of fur felt hats increased so largely from 1888 to 1891 is that up to that time the foreign manufacturers had not becon^e familiar with the styles and character of the hats wanted for the American market. Previous to the above dates English hats were proverbially known as heavy and clumsy, also lacking the nobby style, character, and finish which the American public required. A short time prior to 1888 the well known firm of Christy & Co., hat man- ufacturers, Stockport, England, one of the largest in that country, vis- ited the United States with their manager and foreman for the purpose of learning the ingenious methods of the American manufacturer, and to become acquainted with the styles and trimmings to suit our market. At this time they entered into an agreement with one of our leading manufacturers to return with them to England, at a salary of $1,000 per mouth, to teacli them and their workmen the American method of making fur felt hats, and at this time many valuable American tools and machinery were purchased in this country and sldpped to Eng- land. Thej'^ have since been copied and are now in universal use throughout England, Belgium, Prance, and other European countries, 1172 SUNDRIES. and are operated by tlif^. labor paid the low prices of those countries; for instance, Vinceuet, one of the largest on the Continent, also many in the south of France and other parts of Europe, employing from 50 to CO per cent of women, who do the hardening, felting, pouncing, and finishing of the hats. All of these processes in this ox)untry are done by men (and are branches of the hat business which no woman should be called upon to perform ; as example, the felting of the hat bodies consists of* shrinking them in scalding water with diluted sulphuric acid. Owing to the high temperature generated by this boiling water and the excessive heat of our summer months, the men in this depart- ment are obliged to work clad with little or no clothing. In winter the steam is so dense that it is hard for men to remain at this work, to say nothing of women. On the continent a large proportion of the felting of hats is done by women. The pouncing process consists of rotating the hats by machinery at an enormous velocity, and applying to it sandpaper, which causes an immense amount of dirt and dust. In the finishing department the hat body is steamed over wooden forms, ironed with heavy heated tools, and rubbed with sandpaper to produce the requisite finish. This process is laborious for men, but in many Euro- pean factories is performed by women (except in England), who work for about 15 francs, or, say, $3 a week. In the above branches of hat manufacturing in the United States men only are employed, earning from $12 to $18 per week, and often more. A short time after the American manufacturer went to Christy's to give this English firm a knowledge of American methods of making fur hats, a merchant who had formerly been connected as a partner with a practical American manufacturer conceived the idea that owing to the great difference in wages paid for labor in foreign hat factories and the difference in the other costs of production that hats could be imported into this country and sold at a good profit, and at the same time undersell other dealers, on account of the paltry duty at that time of 30 per cent. With this purpose in view he went to Belgium and visited the factory of Messrs. Vincenet, at Brussels, one of the largest concerns of the kind in the world, taking with him wooden forms, shapes, and samj)les of American hats, and while there instructed those interested in the factory in regard to the wants of this country so far as style and quality were concerned. For some time this merchant imported large quantities of hats into this country, realizing enormous profits, and was able to undersell the American makers. His example was immediately followed by many others in the trade. When the present tariff became a law the importation greatly decreased, although a number are still imj>orted. The Government already receives a large revenue from the duty on hatters' furs, silk, satin linings, bands, bind- ings, leathers, dyestuffs, and mcidentals used in the maniifacture of fur felt hats, both for men's and women's wear; and as the present duty on these hats and hat bodies is by no means prohibitory, we would urge upon your committee that, if not slightly increased, it may be at least retained. Eespectfully yours, Aethtje B. Waring, Yonkers, JT. Y. Geoege Julb, Ifewark, If. J. GLOVES. 1173 GliOTES. (Paragraph 458.) I have the honor to hand you herewith a plain and comprehensive schedule, embracing all classes of kid or other leather gloves, to take the place of paragraph 458 of the present law, which schedule was pre- pared and unanimously recommended by the Glove Manufacturers' Association of the United States, as appears by the signatures of the officers of that association attached thereto. This schedule provides for specific duties, instead of the compound, specific and ad valorem, imposed by the present law. The advantages of a specific duty are set forth in a communication herewith inclosed, dated New York, September 19, 1893, addressed to M. S. ITorthrup, Sec- retary of the Manufacturers' Association, by Hon. J. B. Wilkinson, jr., a member of the Board of United States General Appraisers ; also a communication, dated New York, September 18, 1893, addressed to Mr. Northrup, together with a statement of duties collected on leather gloves during 1893, stating what the reductions would be in the sched- ule proposed by the manufacturers, calculated on the importations of last year, prepared by E. C. Leseur, United States Examiner at the port of New York ; also a communication of September 20, 1893, addressed to me by the chief of the Division of Customs, exjiressing his commen- dation of a specific rate of duty, and stating his reasons therefor; also a communication of September 20, 1893, from Hon. 0. S.Hamlin, Assist- ant Secretary of the Treasury, stating the number of reappraisements of kid gloves imported at New York, and the advances sustained by the Board of Appraisers, which would not have been necessary under a specific rate. I also transmit a statement of the importations of gloves for the years 1890, 1891, 1892, and 1893, forwarded me by the acting chief of the Bureau of Statistics, under date of September 19, 1893, stating what duties were collected under the tariif of 50 per cent ad valorem exist- ing i^revious to October 1, 1890, and the rate and amount of duty col- lected on the importations subsequent to the enactment of the tarift of 1890, which shows that the rates were increased in the first nine mouths "of 1891, 2.71 per cent, for 1892, 4.70 per cent, and for 1893, 4.38 per cent over the tariii' rates existing previous to October 1, 1890. As stated in the communication of General Appraiser J. B. Wilkinson, jr., "the rate of duties," recommended by the manufacturers, "are easily collectible, and are generally a slight reduction upon the present tariff." Customs officials unanimously condemn ad valorem duties as opening the way to fraudulent importations and greatly increases the cost of collection. The appraisers of merchandise dutiable at ad valorem rates are in constant contest with the importers, and the uncertainty attending their eftbrts to arrive at a just decision of what the duties ought to be tends very seriously to embarrass the trade in those articles. There is a constant feeling of uncertainty as to the price at which these goods may be put upon the market. On the other hand, specific duties are collected-with the least expense, without controversy or delay, and the dealers in the goods are able to make steady and uniform prices based uijon the cost of the article in the for- eign market; and manufacturers, knowing what competition they have to meet, can conduct their business without the dangers of the sudden fluctuations in prices brought about by variations in the cost of importa- tion, inseparable from the assessment of ad valorem duties. The large 1174 SUNDRIES. importers of goods of this class have come to recognize the importance of having specific duties, and those representing a very large propor- tion of this trade have expressed their desire to have them imposed. The Manufacturers' Association, recognizing the advantage of specific duties, have recommended a somewhat lower tariff than the present one— in fact, one slightly below the tariff existing previous to October 1, 1890. To meet the demand for a lower tariff they ask that specific duties be imposed on all goods imported and brought into competition with theirs at the proposed rate, which will enable them to conduct their " business without interruption, and to pay a just and reasonable com- pensation to their employes. Lower rates of duty than those proposed, it is believed, will seriously cripple this industry or compel a marked reduction in the compensation paid to laborers employed- therein. AU of which is respectfully submitted in behalf of the Glove Manu- facturers' Association of the United States, a large proportion of whom conduct their business within the district which I have the honor to represent. Very respectfully, F. M. OXTRTIS, M. C, Twenty-second New Yorlc District. To (he honorable Committee on Ways and Means of the Bouse of Repre- sentatives, Washington, J). C: We, the undersigned, manufacturers of leather glovBS, pray you to adopt the following tariff schedule upon leather gloves. Gloves of all descriptions composed wholly or in part of leather, whether wholly or partly manufactured, including what is known in fabrication as glove tranks, shall pay duty at the rates fixed in connec- tion with the following specified kinds thereof and one dozen pairs as the basis. The length stated to be the extreme length when stretched to the full extent. Per dozen pairs. ^ Upon all glace leather gloTea commercially known as sclimasclien, of lamb or sheep origin : Ladies' or children's : 14 inches in length or under $1.50 Over 14 inches in length - 2.50 Men's or cadets' 3. 00 Upon all other glace leather gloves of lamb or sheep origin : Ladies' or children's : 14 inches in length or under 2.00 Over 14 inches in length 3. 00 Men's or cadets' 4.00 Upon all glace leather gloves of Md or goat or other origin except lamb or sheep : Ladies' or children's : 14 inches in length or under 3. 00 Over 14 inches in length 4.50 Men's or cadets' 5.00 Upon all leather gloves with exterior grain surface removed, commercially known as suede, castor, etc., of lamb or sheep origin: Ladies' or children's : 17 inches or under '. 2.00 Over 17 inches in length 3.00 Men's or cadets' 4.00 GLOVES. 1175 Per dozen Upon all other leatlier glores witli exterior grain surface removed, ooramer- cially known as suede, caster, etc., of kid or goat or other origin except lamb or sheep : Ladies' or children's: 17 inches in length or under ,$3.00 Over 17 inches in length.; "."..'.'. ....'.". 4. ,50 Men's or cadets' !!'..!!!!..!!"!' 5! 00 And in .addition to tlie above rates there shall be pa id : Upon all ladies' or children's lined gloves 1. 50 Upon all men's lined gloves ] " 1" (jo Provided, That all gloves represented to be of n. kind or gr.ide below their actual kind or grade shall pay additional duty of $5 per dozen pair.s. Unanimously approved and adopted by the Glove Manufacturers' Association of the United States. D. W. Campbell, President. M. L. KORTHRXTP, Secretary and Treasurer. J. G. Allen, Chairman Excrutirc Committee. d. b. judsun, James Kadfoed, Geoege M. Place, P. P. Aegensingee, Lucius N. Littauee, Members Exocutire Gommittee. New Toek, September 13, 1893. Dear Sir: In reply to yours of yesterday's date, I beg to state that with an experience of fifteen years as examiner of leather gloves at this port, I am convinced that it is impossible to equitably collect the duty upon an ad valorem basis on this commodity, for the reason that some importers will undervalue, and it is almost impossible to ascertain their Actual foreigu market value. The specific part of the existing tariff has been the most satisfactory part of it. The schedule you submit is strictly specific, and in my opinion, simple, clear and collectible. Eespectfully, yours, E. 0. Leseur, United States Examiner. Mr. William P. Fostee. p. s. — I think the firms whose names appear on the accompanying petition received during the year 1893, about 85 per cent of all the leather gloves imported into this port. E. 0. L. Schmaschen ,14 Over 14 - Lamb, 14 Overll •■•• Kid, 14 Ovpr 14 Men's, all kinds Sufedes, L. or S. ori;;iii, 17 and over SuMea, K. orG. origin, 17 and over Average va hie per dozen. 3.30 5.00 4.00 7.00 5.00 9.00 6.00 4.05 fi.OO 1693. Specific. 1.75 2.25 '3.25 "4.25 Ad valo- rem. 52.67 50.00 56.71 50.00 64.04 60.00 70.80 50.00 50.00 Proposed Bpeoiflo. Advalo- rem. 45.45 60.00 50.00 60.00 60.00 50. (;o 60.06 .43 .60 Eeduc- tion. Per cent 7.22 6.71 "4.04 4.14 7.00 1176 SUNDRIES. Office of the Boaed of U. S. General Appraisers, Neip Torlc, September 19, 1893. Dear Sir : I have considered the glove schedule submitted by you for my examination, and, while I have no opinion to offer as to the. measure of duty to be assessed upon gloves,! have no hesitation in say- iug that the specific duties you name are easily collectible and are gen- erally a slight reduction upon the present tariff'. Upon gloves of great length, the reduction is very considerable. My experience as a general appraiser leads me, speaking of the interests of domestic manufacturers, importers, and consumers, as well as of the interests of the Government revenue, to favor specific instead of ad valorem duties, at least so far as relates to the glove schedule. Eespectfully, yours, J. B. Wilkinson, Jr. Mr, M. S. NoRTHRTJP, City. B'EW York, Septemher 18, 1893. Dear Sir: In response to yours of the 16th, I enclose the calcula- tion desired. The first three lines which are specific under the present tariff are given exact, the others are impossible to get exact and are estimated as per notes A and B. To.u can, ho wevcr, depend upon the estimates being substantially correct. Truly, yours, E. C. Leseur, United States Examiner. M. S. N'ORTHRUP, esq. statement of duties collected on leather gloves, during 1893, witli proposed rates and reduc- tions. Description. Sclimaschen, 14 inches and under Lamb 14 inclies and under Kid, 14 inches and under SitedeK and all over 14 inches Men's gloves Received. Dozens. 265, 648 92, 952 200, 360 740, 688 105, 806 Duty. $470, 471 219, 256 660, 225 1, 919, 101 448, 943 Equal to- Per dozen. $1.77 2.35 3.29 2.59 4.24 Proposed. Keduction. Per dozen. Pe}- dozen. $1.50 $.0.27 2.00 .35 3.00 .29 *2.30 .29 t4.00 .24 Per cent'. 15. 25 14.89 8.81 11.19 5.66 *EBtimated. The great hulk will come under the new schedule, as suede of larab or sheep origin* 17 Indies or under at $2. Thirty cents per dozen added to total will ahout cover the extra amount col- lected upon all over 17 inches, which is a very small proportion. tEstimatefl. The great bulk will come in as Glac6 men's or cadets of lamb or sheep origin at $4 per dozen, a few Schmaschen at $3 per dozen, and goat at $5 per dozen. There are very few men's suedes, so that $4 per dozen may he considered a fair average for men's gloves. E. C. Lesiiue, United States Examiner. Kkw Yoke, September 18, 1893. Treasury Department, Office oip the Secretary, Washington, D. C, September 20, 1893. Dear Sir: In reply to your enquiry I have to sny that, without com- nientiiig upon the nitcs of duty specified in tiie projjosed measure relative to kid ; :i )\d l;i u co:ivi:ia3;l that the aflixing of specific rates GLOVES. 1177 of duty, per dozen, to sncli gloves, acoordiug to classes, is a great im- provement over ad valorem or compound rates, both as to simplicity of method and as to certainty of collection. Yours, very truly, John C. Comstock, Chief Division of Customs. Gen. K M. Curtis, M. C. House of Representatives. Treasury Department, Office op the Sboretart, Washington, D. C, September 20, 1893. Sir : Eeferring to your visit at the Department this morning, in regard to advances made on appraisement of kid gloves imported into the United States, I have the honor to state that an examination has been made of the weekly reports forwarded from the board of general apijraisers at Kew York during the year 1892, under the provisions of section 18 of the act of June 10, 1890, and it is found that circulars Kos. 55, 78, 85, 91, 160, 176, 182 and 206, promulgating such weekly reports of the board, show numerous advances of ladies suede gloves, the advances ranging from 1 to 6 francs per dozen, and from 1 to 7 marks per dozen. A volume containing such circulars is forwarded herewith for your further information. Respectfully, yours, . C. S. Hamlin, Acting Secretary. Hon. N. Martin Curtis, United States Rouse of Representatives, Washington, D. C. September 14, 1893. On behalf of the importers of leather gloves in the United States, representing fully 85 per cent of the entire importations, we herewith respectfully present a schedule of tariff rates upon leather gloves which they have agreed upon, and have instructed us to ask shall be incor- ' porated in your tariff measure now under consideration, to take the place of paragraph 458 of the act entitled "An act to reduce and equal- ize duties on imports, and for other purposes," approved October 1, 1890. The following reasons for the adoption of this schedule by your committee are presented : (1) Because it is a pure and simple specific duty schedule, which avoids the evils of undervaluation and also of unjust discriminations which are inseparable from the ad valorem duty system. (2) Because, after mature consideration and consultation, the import- ers have agreed upon this schedule as equitable and just to all con- cerned, and which, if adopted, will, we believe, result, first, in an increase of the revenue derived therefrom, arising from an increase of the importations, and, second, insure a reduction in the price to the consumer. (3) Because, if adopted, it will secure a reduction of the tariff rate upon leather gloves, and a corresponding increase of importations, without causing any serious disturbance either to the importing trade or to tbe domestic manufacturing industry. (4) Because the customs officials, after three years of experience in 1178 SUNDRIES. administering tlie present sclieclule, which is partly specific and partly ad valorem, greatly desire the adoption of a strictly specific schedule, as in the interest of a good administration of the customs laws, and as preventive and curative of the evils of undervaluation, which no sys- tem of reappraisement has yet been found adequate to eradicate. (5) Because this industry has suffered for many years under the evils of undervaluation, arising from the ad valorem system, until the act of 1890, when the partially specific schedule was established, underwhich the trade has revived and made substantial gains, as shown by the ofl&cial records, chiefly because of the easy administration of the specific features of the law. (6) Because this schedule has been framed, after a long consideration by ofiflcial experts, who have taken into account the experiences of past years, not only of the importers and domestic manufacturers, but also of the ofleials of the Treasury and the customs administrative officers, and it may be regarded as their recommendation, in which not only the interests of the importer and domestic manufacturer Jire considered, but also the interests of the Grovernment and the consumer. It is, there- fore, consistent with a sound public policy that it be now adopted, and thus put at rest for the future the vexed questions which have grown out of the divergent interests incident to the ad valorem system. > (7) Because it is approved by the customs officials, as is shown by the letter hereto appended, and their testimony exhibited before the previous Congressional investigation of the subject, as will be found in the hearings before your committee of previous Congresses. Our pres- ent efforts for a strictly specific duty, therefore, are in line with the general policy earnestly desired by the customs ofiicials, including the Board of General Appraisers. It is, we believe, the only method by which the proper duties can be easily collected upon all importations. We also append the petition for the adoption of this schedule, signed by the importers representing 85 per cent of the total importations. We have the honor to be, very respectfully, yours, Wm. F. Fostee, Chairman of Glove Importers^ Committee, Re;presenting the Importers. We, the undersigned importers of leather gloves, pray you to adopt the following tariff schedule upon leather gloves : Per dozen paira. Upon all glace leather gloves, commercially known as Schmasohen, of lamb or sheep origin : Ladies' or children's : 14 inches in length or under $1.50 Over 14 inches m length 2.50 Men's or cadets 3. 00 Upon all other glace leather gleves of lamb or sheep origin : Ladies' or children's : 14 inches in length or under 2.00 Over 14 inches in length 3. 00 Men's or cadets' 4. 00 Upon all glace leather gloves of kid or goat or other origin, except lamb or sheep : Ladies' or children's : 14 inches m length or under 3.00 Over 14 inches in length 4.50 Men's or cadet's 5.00 GLOVES. 1179 Per dozen pairs. Upon all leatlier gloves with exterior grain surface removed, commercially known as Suede, (Jastor, etc., of lamb or .gbeep origin: Ladies' or cliildren's: 17 inches in length or under .' $2.00 Over 17 inches in length 3. 00 Men's or cadet's 4. 00 Upon all other leather gloves with exterior grain surface removed, commer- cially known as Suede, Castor, etc., of kid or goat or other origin, except lamb or sheep : Ladies' or children's : 17 inches in length or under 3.00 Over 17 inches in length 4.50 Men's or cadet's ,. 5.00 And in addition to the above rates there shall be paid: Upon all ladies' or children's lined gloves 1.50 Upon all men's lined gloves 1. 00 Provided, That all gloves represented to be of a kind or grade helow their actual kind or grade shall pay an additional duty of $5 per dozen pairs. Wertheimer & Co. Hugo Rothschild. And others. Frldat, S^tember 15, 1893. STATEMENT OF ME. W. H, STJTTY, KID GLOVE IMPOETEB. Mr. Chairman and gentlemen of the committee : I am one of the com- mittee of seven representative glove importers of l^few York. I am one of seven decided upon by the glove importers to prepare a paper chang- ing the tariff. Out of the number, three have disagreed with the oth- ers, and consequently three out of the seven are not in accord With us. Sheepskins are put down at the same price as lambs' skins, $2 a dozen. The ad valorem rate would be 5 francs a dozen. To-day it is $2 a dozen, making 100 per cent. Fourteen marks would represent 50 per cent. I am of the same opinion as Mr. Peyser, that a change ought to be made. Another branch is men's gloves which are imported at an invoice price of $5 a dozen. The McKinley bill makes $3.50, including schmarschen, sheepskin, and kid. The proposition is to make the rate on lambskin 4 per cent, on schmarschen 4 per cent, and on kid 5 per cent, which would make a duty of at least 5 per cent on the whole. The cost of the manufacturing is $1 more than the cost in Europe. We think if we could get them here, that would be all the duty that would be necessary. The present cost is $1 for men's gloves alone. Two dollars will give 100 per cent protection on the cost of manufac- ture between Europe and America. If you wish it, we will make out another tariff and send it to you. The other gentlemen referred to have placed in writing what they have to say, and it will be presented to the committee. STATEMENT OF DE. H. M. PEYSEE, IMPORTEE OF KH) GLOVES m NEW TOEK AND BOSTON. Mr. Chairman : There has been a specific tariff imposed on kid gloves which are classified under three heads— schmarschen, lamb, and kid. There is one question which ought to be decided, and that is as to the 1180 SUNDRIES. designation of lamb and steep, for the reason that it is impossible to distinguish between that and what Is known as schmarschen, or in England, slink skin. What we desire is that there should be but one rate of duty for lamb and slink skins and sheepskins. I would like to submit a sample of the slink skin (placing on the table a glove madeof 4-1-1 p TTlfl't'f^Plfl 1 ^ Mr. Payne. Has the revenue been increased in the aggregate? Mr. Peysee. I think it has under the McKlnley tariff. Mr. Payne. And have the prices remained the same? Mr. Peyser. In some cases they have materially advanced, in the others it is not affected. They have changed the intent of the original bill at the custom-house. Mr. Payne. Slink skin is the term known in the trade in Germany and in a great portion of the United States as well 1 Mr. Peysee. Probably. Mr. Payne. It is the skin of the unborn animal? Mr. Peysee. Not wholly that. There is no reason why there should be that distinction. Mr. Breckineidge. 'Where do you get your material? Mr. Peysee. Mostly in South America and in the Spanish islands. Schmarschen is the name by which it is known in the trade. Mr. Breckineidge. What per cent of the skin used in the manu- facture of these goods is made from slink skin ? Mr. Peyser. Hardly any. It would not make any difference in the American market. Mr. Beeckinridge. You depend upon foreign countries for your supply? Mr. Peyser. Tes, sirj in that class of goods. TAEirF ADOPTED BY IMPORTERS' MAT 1, 1893. All glace smaschen product of sheep and sheepstlu gloves : Up to U inches $1.00 From 14 to 20 inches -■-■. 1.50 ALove 20 inches 2.50 Lambskin gloves : Up to 14 inches 1. 50 From 14 to 20 inches 2.50 Above 20 inches 3. 75 Kid or any other leather, not specilied : Up to Winches 2.50 From 14 to 20 inches 3.75 Above 20 inches .' 5.00 Suede or undressed of sheepskin origin : Up to 17 inches 1. 00 From 17 to 20 inches 2.00 From 20 to 24 inches 3.00 Above 24 inches , 4. 00 Others : Up to 17 inches 2. 00 From 17 to 20 inches 3. 00 From 20 to 24 inches : ■. 4.00 Above 24 inches 5.00 At a subsequent meeting of the committee it was voted that the above schedule should apply to all women and children's gloves, andthatall men'sand cadets' gloves of sheep origin shall pay $2.00 Of other origin, shall pay 2.50 Men's Suede ; 2.00 KID GLOVES. 1181 KID GliOTES. (Paragraph '458.) Kew Toek, Septemher 18, 1893. We, the undersigned, importers of kid gloves, hereby desire to pro- test against a petition that has been presented to your committee, signed by certain other importers of kid gloves and by certain domestic manufacturers of gloves, on the following grounds, viz : First. In the above-named petition, ladies' and children's glace gloves made from leather, product of sheep, are subdivided under two head- ings, viz, Schmaschen and lamb or sheep, which subdivisions are fre- quently difQcult to determine, and if made to pay different rates of duty would result in confusion and error. We also declare that the subdivisions and rates proposed in the above-named petition are unfair, and will give an example : Sheepskin gloves costing in Eirrope 10 to 15 francs ($2 to $3) would be made to pay duty of $2 or from 66| to 100 per cent, the same article now paying 50 per cent under the McKinley tariff ; while Schmaschen gloves costing in Europe ixom 15 to 22 marks ($3.75 to $5.50) would be made to pay $1.50 per dozen or about 33 per cent, the same article now paying 53 per cent under the McKinley tariff. We therefore petition that all women's and children's glace gloves made from leather product ot sheep be made to pay one uniform, specific duty, notwithstanding the fact that sheepskin gloves have been imported in large quantities, costing half the price of some Schmaschen and lambskin gloves, in order that the duty levied m>y be absolutely collectible without error. Second. In the above-named petition your committee is asked to make the duty on men's gloves higher than that now collected under the McKinley tariff. Under the McKinley tariff the average duty col- lected on all men's gloves for the year ending June 30, 18&3, was $4.24 per dozen or 71 per cent. (See Eeport Bureau of Statistics.) Gne leading American manufacturer of men's gloves, Mr. Northrop, stated to the Committee of Ways and Means in 1890 that a duty of 50 per cent ad valorem was all the protection they needed ; another leading American manufacturer, Mr. Littauer, has stated that 40 per cent was full protection and would enable them to pay as high wages as they paid under a 50 per cent ad valorem duty. We furthermore desire to state that many lines of men's gloves imported previous to the adop- tion of the McKinley tariff have been excluded by the operation of that tariff. We therefore petition your committee that the following schedule be adopted as the tariff for leather gloves, making simple, collectable, and just distinctions and rates; and we further petition that, whatever change you may be pleased to make, the duty on glov.es be made purely specific. Women and children's glace gloves : Product of sheep — Per dozen. Up to 14 inches $2.00 Above 14 inches 3.00 Men's and cadet 2.50 Product of all other leather — Up to 14 inches 3.00 Above 14 inches 4.00 Men's and cadet • 3.50 1182 SUNDRIES. Women and chilclren's undressed gloves : Per dozen. Product of sheep— ~ Up to 17 inches - *|-"" Above 17 inches "^-50 Men's and cadet ^■"" Product of all other leather— Up to 17 inches ^-"O Ahovc 17 inches ^ --- *-^^ Men's audicadet ^-^^ Alllined gloves 90 cents per dozen extra. , , , ^,. ^ , Provided, That all gloves represented to he oT a kind or grade below this actual kind or grade shaU pay a penal duty of $5 per dozen pairs. ^ Perrin FeJsties & Gib., , - Henky M. Peyser & Company, and others. New York, September 7, 1893. Sir: The correct and just specific schedule for leather gloves, which would yield the largest possible revenue to the United States and which would stop all undervaluations and crooked work at the apprais- er's store, would be as follows : On all leather gloves, either finished or partly made, that aretwelve^ inches or less in length, $5 per dozen pairs. An addition of 50 cents per inch per dozen pairs for every inch in length over and above twelve inches. This would cover the whole ground. Please put it in your schedule and you will do the riglit thing for the Government and the American glove trade. Yours, respectfully, John G. SCHKAM. GLOYBS. (Paragraph 458.) New York, September 18, 1893. Sir: "We submit the following for your committee's considerations passing upon the glove tariff. To insure the full collection of duties we favor a specific tariff. The young of lamb is very difficult to dis- tinguished ii'om a Sniaschen, and in our opinion all leather gloves of sheep or lamb origin should pay tlie same duty as Schmaschen. No matter how high or low you place the tarifi', they should pay alike. Keal kid, which is easily distinguished from all other glaceglove leather, should pay a higher- tariff'. All suedes (undressed kids) should pay the same duty, as it is practically impossible to distinguish their origin when the grain is removed. The foregoing all applies to ladies' kid gloves, upon which we recom- mend the present ruling of fourteen inches as the minimum tariff, scaled sixteen and twenty inches and upwards: Importers seem a unit in favoring a reduction in the tariff on ladies' kid gloves. Very few are made in this country, and any reasonable specific tariff will certainly prove a benefit, but the recommendation of these same importers towards an advance upon gent's gloves must appear very inconsistent to you, aud, as we fancy, contrary to the fixed puqjose of your committee. As large glove manufacturers at Glovers- ville, N. Y., we know that the protection asked on gent's gloves is both unnecessary and excessive, aud we particularly cSl your attention to the following: HATS. 1183 The present tariff of fifty per cent ad valorem and $1 per dozen on gent's kid gloves make the present duty average about $3.50 per dozen (based upon 90,000 dozen imported within a year) . This tarift" restricted the importation of the cheaper and medium-priced gent's goods, such as the working and poorer classes could buy. We feel very safe in saying that but for the exclusion of these cheaper gent's gloves the average duty would have been less than $3 per dozen. Now, as large manufacturers of domestic leather gloves at Glovers- ville, N. Y., we assure you that tlie total cost of labor upon a dozen gent's kid and dog skin gloves is but from $1.50 to $3.50 per dozen for cut- ting, shaving, slitting, stitching, sewing, closing, embroidering, laying off, and all manner of hand and machine labor performed thereon — ^in other words, aside from the leather and findings required, the sum of $1.50 to $3.50 pays for the making of a dozen gent's unlined gloves in any factory in Fulton County, New York State. From personal visits and investigation in many European factories of France, Germany, and Austria, we know that the same labor on gent's gloves cost from $1 to $2.50 per dozen; therefore the utmost dif- ference in labor between the cheapest possible production abroad and the highest in this country is $2.50 per dozen. These are the two exti'emes, and we think that $1.50 specific on gent's goods n^ould fully protect American labor — (as the average). If your committee should favor $2 per dozen on gent's goods you can be assured that you have more than protected the difference of labor in the two hemispheres. The additional labor upon ladies', children's, and gent's lined kid goods in this country is barely 25 cents per dozen. Eespectfully, yours, M. Beebek & Co. HATS. (Paragrapli 460.) STATEMENT OF CHRISTIAN SCHMIDZ, IMPORTER OF STRAW GOODS, OF NEW YORK, N. Y. Mr. Chairman : I represent the straw industry. The two largest manufacturers are here. And I represent the importers to show you that we are in entire harmony. Prior to 1883 the duties were 40 per cent on straw hats and 30 per cent on the raw material. We want to be protected against English competition, and ask that the raw material be put on the free list. We could not get that in 1883, and the rates were reduced 30 per cent on hats and 30 per cent on the raw material. The tariff of 1890 intended to give us free raw material, but, instead of accomplishing this, the wording of the bill destroyed the intention of the frameis of it. Articles up to 20 were assessed at 40. Some of these goods which I have shown you can not now, and never will be, made in this country. If the consumer is to have the benefit of raw material, these rates must be adjusted in the new tariff. In section 460 of the law of 1890 straw hats were thrown into the schedule with bone and India rubber, with which they have no con- nection. In 1890 a straw hat was a straw hat; but now it is classified as India rubber, and some are classified as articles of wood, because they are made of bamboo. The bamboo hat from the Philippine Islands was made 30 per cent ad valorem, because it was a manufacture of AYOOcl. These things shouUi be adjusted, W§ woijld like to suggest 1184 SUNDKIES. to you that in the new bill paragraph 618 should be in the free list. It provides for braids, plaits, and laces. Yellow hemij and manila should be left out. Hemp has always gone in at 20 per cent and we have been asked to pay 50 per cent. It happened to be fashionable two years ago. We sent for the raw material, but it did not come at all. These hats have never been made in this country, and why should we pay a tax of from 40 to 60 per cent? Originally it was 100 per cent; but the last decision was 40 per cent. Mr. Eeed. Perhaps the Government might want to receive some revenue on this article. Mr. ScHMiDz. This is so small an article that it gives but little rev- enue. This industry has never been sufficiently consulted, and conse- quently the whole thing is iu a maddle. I thiiik it would be right to adjust that ; and, if it is not done now, we may not have a chance to do it again in a lifetime. Mr. Payne. You did not come before the committee four years ago? Mr. ScHMiDz. No, sir. We would also ask you to consider the mat- ter of vegetable substances in this connection. It has been provided for in previous tariffs. This [exhibiting a straw hat] was classified at 90 per cent." For the next year or two this may be of no consequence, as it is out of fashion; but it will be fashionable one of these days. That we want to be put under the head of vegetable substances. 'Sow, we come to the particular thing. Here is a lot which we call raw material and which is imported in large quantities. These two gentlemen present are the only manufacturers who finish a hat like this one which I now show you. This hat is imported at 30 per cent. We do not think that these factories which have spent from $100,000 to $150,000 of labor for this hat should have competition by the importa- tion of $100,000 worth of these hats which are made in Europe. We import that too ; so we ought to be favoring the duty on this. It is necessary to put this on the free list as raw material. This hat can not be made in any other place in the world than Tuscany. We want that put on the free list, because these plants are employing from 1,000 to 15,000 people. They should have the benefit of this. The labor cost abroad is 50 to 75 cents a dozen ; and here it is $1.75 to $2 a dozen. Nobody is' opposed to this, and I do not see that it makes much difference, because we can not tell how much duty was paid on it in the' last two years. Four or five years ago the whole revenue from these goods was $150,000 to $250,000. We ask for a little change in the present tariff paragraph 460, which is under the head of " felt and India rubber." We ask you to put straw hats under a special paragraph. The paragrapli in reference "to hats and bonnets for women and children should be more specific iu order to settle litigation. These two hats [indicating] come under the same duty, 30 per cent. They are finished in Italy. We finish these hats, and we want to be protected from the cheap labor of finishing in Italy. I think we ask only what is reasonable, and nobody will object. The question of rev- enue has hardly anything to do with it. There are some fancy lots of, hats here which come in free. Nothing that we maunfacture is braided in this country. There are no plaits or fancy goods of any kind which come under that head. The plaits are made in China, but not in this country. There is a braided hat which previous to 1883 came in under 30 per cent. After 1883 it came in under 20 per cent, and now it is on the free list. By reason of its constructioTi it came under a difterent paragraph, and varied anywhere from 40 per cent to 100 per cent. HARNESS. 1185 • HATS. Tariff of 1890. No 460: Manufactures of bone, chip, grass, horn, india rubber, palm leaf, straw, weeds, or whaltbone, or of which these substances or either of them is the com- ponent material of chief value not especially provided for in this act, 30 per cent. We propose for new tariff: Bonimts, hats, hoods, and flats, for men, women and children, composed of chip, grass, palm leaf, willow, straw, bamboo, or any other vegetable sub- stance, hair, or of which eithpr of these substances is the component material of chief value, or of other material not otherwise provided for, 30 per cent. Tariff of 1890. No. 518. Braids, plaits, laces, and similar manu- factures composed of straw, chip, grass, palm leaf, willow, osier, or rattan suitable for making or ornamenting hats, bonnets, and hoods, free. We propose for new tariff: Braids, plaits, laces, and similar manu- factures composed ol^ or of which either of the following substances is the com- ponent material of chief value, straw, chip, grass, palm leaf, willow, hemp or manilla, or any other vegetable substance, or of hair suitable for making or orna- menting hats, bonnets, and hoods, hand- plaited bodies of straw, the particular produce of Italy and known in trade as ''Leghorns," suitable only for being shaped and finished into hats, flats, bon- nets, and hoods for women and children (the same hats and flats if imported shaped and finished, to pay 30 per cent), free. HARINTESS. (Paragraph IGl.) Sir: We are instructed by the Eetail- Harness-Makers' Protective Association, wliich met in convention at the city of Chicago on the 15th of August, to address you in reference to the tariff on harness and other goods in our trade, which we think is unjustly dealt with in the matter of duties. The iirst item to which we would call your honorable attention is the duty on harness. Granting, that as we are informed by correspondence from the customs, that no harness is brought in at a less duty than 35 per cent ad valorem, this is not sufficient to enable those of us manu- facturing a first-class article to compete with the foreign makers, as we have to pay three times the wages, which is one of the largest com- ponent parts of a harness. Our mountings cost 50 per cent more than either the English or French harness- makers have to pay, and our leather, which is the smallest component part of a harness (not the largest, as the customs suppose it is), costs 60 per cent also more than the foreign makers above mentioned. The second article, to which we would call your attention, is that of saddles, in the manufacture of which we are compelled to use imported goods, such as serges, on which the duty is 45 and 50, making 95 per cent duty; worsted web for saddle girths, on which we pay 50 and 60 or 120 per cent, and hogskins 20 per cent; straining web (linen), 35 per cent. On the top of all this we have to pay three times as much for making, and then our men are no better oft' than their fellow-crafts- men on the other side, as the matter of rent is, at the least, three or T H 75 1186 SUNDRIES. foiir times as high; for instance, our men have to pay from $12.00 to $16.00 per month in advance, whereas the same men pay on the other side 3s. 6d. to is. per week for their little house. Under these circum- stances we ask you, gentlemen, how we can compete with harness and saddles coming into this country at the foregoing duties? A glance at the figures will show you that we actually pay on an average double on our raw material (which we can not get made here) than is paid on the goods ready made for the market. Another illustration of the injustice of the present tariff, or rather the tariff under which our ^oods are brought in (as there is no mention of our trade in the McKinley bill) is, for instance, the mountings, which is part of our raw jnaterial, is 45 per cent, and yet made up into har- ness ready for the market, requiring no labor, is 35 per cent; this we think unjust and unfair. There is another injustice which is commonly practiced not only by private individuals but by importers also; that is, of having new har- ness and saddles used on the other side after purchasing and then bring them in as personal property in one case and as second hand in the other. This is a fair illustration of the grievances we wish t6 submit to your honorable board, as we feel that these and other things, includ- ing the keen competition in trade, whichjias brought what should be other- wise a profitable trade down to such a low level that neither employes or employers can make a fair livelihood in comparison Avith other craftsmen requiring the same amount of capital and mechanical skill; and we venture the assertion that there is no trade that requires more skill and attention to make it successful, and which takes longer to become proficient in its manufacture; and as our business is supported only by the most wealthy, to whose tastes we have to cater, we think our home manufactures should be better protected. In proof of the above there is now three importing houses in New York City alone that is doing more business than twenty of the leading harness-makers of the same city; and we submit the following table of duties, which we trust your honorable board will give due consideration and thought, and enable those of us who have now 10, 20, or 30 men to employ three times that number : Harness per cent.. 75 Saddles do 75 Saddlery hardware do 30 All leathers as now do 20 Serges ad valorem (no weight duty).. 35 Worsted girth wehs do 35 All kinds of compositions do 25 On behalf of the committee, we remain, Yours, respectfully, J. J. Btillings. Robert Curbie. White & Kerr. Wood Gibson. Andrew Halladay. Edward Bach. IS'EW York, Septeniber 14, 1893, HAKNES3. 1187 HAEISTESS. (Paragraph 161.) [New Tort Jonmeymen Saddle and Hamesa-makers' Association, ofBce 114 lEast Thirteenth street.] September 17, 1893. Sir : At a meeting of the above association, called for the purpose of giving expression to the views of our trade on the discussion of the tariff now pending before your committee, we, the undersigned, were appointed a committee to present to your committee the following as the evils of the present tariff laws and the remedies to be applied in future legislation. The present tariff laws as regards saddles and harness manufactured in whole or in part are, to say the least, very ambiguous and difficult of proper construction. We respectfully call your attention to section 4, tariff laws, 1890 : AD VALOREM DUTIES ON UNENUMBRATED ARTICLES. Sec. 4. That there shall be levied, collected, and paid on the importation of all raw or unmannfactured articles, not enumerated or provided for in this act, a duty of ten per centum ad valorem ; and on all articles manufactured, in whole or in part, not provided for in this act, a duty of twenty per centum ad valorem. Now, we are morally certain that the major portion of the harness coming into this country come in under the latter part of the above clause at 20 per cent instead of 35 per cent, which is the duty on manu- factured harness. Importers have a very happy way of importing har- ness in unfinished parts, thereby evading full duty, when all that is necessary to completely finish it is to jjunch holes and buckle the parts together. Even if the full duty of 35 per cent were levied and collected it would not afford adequate protection to American labor as against the poorly paid labor of men and women, boys and girls, now employed in the large saddle and harness manufactories of Walsall, Birmingham, and other European cities which manufacture expressly for the Ameri- can market. Tour petitioners would further respectfully suggest that, since the importation of saddlery and harness has assumed such vast proportions, your committee would bestow on it the attention such an important industry deserves and have one uniform duty ou all sad- dles and harness imported in whole or in part, so that every American workingman and manufacturer when he takes a copy of your new tariff laws in his hand he knows the duty paid on all articles against which he has to compete, and the higher the duty on saddles and harness the better for the American harness-maker. Respectfully, yours, John Meehan, Chairman. E. Z. GOTTGH, Secretary. Patrick G-. Crane, Wm. ]sr. Hazel, Chas. a. Thomas, Committee, 1188 SUNDRIES. IVORY. (Paragraph 462.) STATEMEirr OF ME. OTTO GERDATJ, OF 41 DEY STREET, NEW TOEK. Wednesday, September 20, 1893. Mr. Chairman : I beg to draw your attention to ivory unmanufac- tured and ivory for piano and organ keys. ITOEY, UNMANUFAGTUEED. Eaw ivory is not always imported in whole tusks, becaiise for the convenience of packing and carrying to the coast, because the African natives often keep the hollow parts for ornaments, and also because different branches of the ivory workers require different parts of the tusk, it is often sawed in logs, or, in other words, the hoUow parts, the point pieces, or the solid pieces, arrive separately. The hollow pieces are used here mostly by brush manufacturers, the point pieces for cane and umbrella handles, and the solid pieces or blocks are turned into billiard balls, etc. As long as a tariff has been in existence such raw ivory was always admitted free of duty as " ivory, and vegetable ivory, unmanufactured," free, but in the so-called McKinley bill in the free list, paragraph 618, the ambiguous phrase "ivory and vegetable ivory, not sawed, cut, or otherwise manufactured" was used, and the custom-house offlcials de- clared that while such logs of ivory certainly ought to be free because they were perfectly crude, with the original bark on and not manu- factured in any way, yet they were bound to interpret the clause ac- cording to its wording and call them dutiable at 40 per cent, the same as worked up pieces of ivory, because the cross cut made them sawed. The committee which framed the McKinley bill never intended such a meaning of that clause. What they meant to cover was the impor- tation of partially finished knife handles, pistol handles, etc., but a special provision for these was unnecessary because the production of such articles requires the cutting of the ivory lengthwise or in slabs, which would not leave the bark of the tusk intact. Major McKinley's attention was drawn to the danger of such a doubtfnl wording, and he promised that the clause would be changed in such a way as not to affect these crude pieces, but in the rush of business it was overlooked. In substantiation of the above, I attach hereto copy of a communication received from the firm through whose efforts this ambiguous wording was put into the tariff", from which it wiU be seen that it was never even their intention to have a duty placed on these crude pieces. The Chairman. You say this is manufactured ivory. Mr. GrERDAU. Yes, sir ; that pays a duty of 40 per cent as manufac- tured, the same stuff worked up. Mr. Hopkins. Your contention is that it is raw ivory and should come in free of duty? Mr. Gerdau. Yes, sir. Mr. Hopkins. How does that affect ivory? Mr. Gerdau. I am not through yet. I will read the letter which the ■ firm gave me who advocated this raise, if you wish it. ivoEt. 1189 New York, January 10, 1891. +1. w'* ^'^" J?.™^"^!,'^ *° y°'"" iiquii'y' ^e l>eg to advise you that we suggested to Ways and Means Committee of the Fifty-first Congress the phrase "Ivory and vegetahle ivory, not sawed, cut, or "otherwise manufactured," for raw ivory, in order to exclude any possible free admission of ivory piano keys, knife handles, and, in lact, any ivory cut lengthwise and crosswise, but we certainly did not mean to ask lor any duty upon ivory cut across only into pieces on which the outside bark or enamel ot the tusk has been preserved intact around its whole circumference, and Jiave no objection to the continued free entry of such. Yours, very truly, ,, „ _, Ahnold, Cheney & Co. Mr. Otto Gerdau. Furthermore, no business firm in the United States has been or could be benefited by it, because the importation of these pieces does not conflict with the business of any American firm, but, to the con- trary, is of necessity to all the small ivory-turners. No one can con- tend that any plausible reason existed then or does now to warrant a duty on such crude ivory, but under the present ambiguous phrase it might even be claimed that whole tusks are dutiable because an ax is used to cut them from the skull, and if a like wording were used for lumber, trees cut from the root would probably be dutiable as manu- factured lumber. I therefore request that the wording for raw ivory is made iutelli- gent, and that it is admitted free of duty by the same plain clause which has been used in every other tariff, viz, "Ivory and vegetable ivory, unmanufactured," free, or as "Ivory and vegetable ivory not sawed lengthwise and unmanufactured," free. lYORY FOB, PIANO AND OEGAN KEYS. This is manufactured by only three manufacturers in the United States. There are manufacturers of this article in England, France, and Germany, but even under the old rate of 30 per cent none but one German firm could ever be induced to try this market. In spit^ of the rate of 30 per cent being as good as prohibitive, the McKinley bill raised the duty on it another 10 per cent, making it 40 per cent. Two of these manufacturers had an argument in the newspapers over their own signatures about the tariff, as per inclosed clipping. You will see from it that one of them states himself that 10 per cent is quite enough protection on this article, and I request that the prohibi- tion is removed and that a fair rate of duty, permitting some competi- tion, is placed upon ivory for piano and organ keys. Office of Pratt, Eead & Co., Deep Biver, October 20, 189^. To the Editor of the New Era : SiK : The people of Deep River, by their cordial interest in the success of this com- pany, have shown me so plainly their appreciation of its value to the town that I venture to call attention to their opportunity at the coming election to decide whether the business shall increase or decrease. The special reason for my writing is the statement made at the Democratic headquarters that the manager of this company favors the success of the Democratic party, the effect of such a statement, and no doubt its intended effect, being to create the impression that the success of that party was expected to help the company. Nothing can be further from the truth than such a notion. On the contrary, no one can realize better than myself the serious danger to this business which would result at this time from Democratic success. Whatever may have been the expectation in preceding campaigns as to the changes which the Democrats would make if they secured control of national affairs, that party, in the present campaign, is absolutely committed to the principle of " a tariff 1190 SUNDEIES. for revenue only." At the national convention the conservative planks referring to tariff reform were struck out from the party's platform and an explicit declaration inserted in favor of this free-trade doctrine. The advocates of free trade have con- trol of the party's tariff policy, and the tariff which they will enact, if the Democrats get control of the Government, will be based on free-trade lines and opposed to a protective system. That is the line on which they are fighting this campaign, and no one who has not taken part, as I have, in shaping tariff legislation in Washing- ton can appreciate the vigor with which the McKinley act will be torn in pieces if the Democrats win. The lobbies of the Capitol will swarm with the representatives of foreign manufacturers, whose business depends upon the repeal of the present duties, and the agent of the German ivory-cutters will be among the foremost. With a Democratic President and a majority in Congress hostile to the protective system, the duty on manufactures of ivory will be reduced (10 per cent is the rate they aak) and German ivory will flood the market. Most piano-makers are Germans, and easily induced to buy ivory from German houses. As wages at Hamburg are about one-fifth as high as in Deep River and the raw material is cheaper there than here, one can see how impossible it is to hold our business if exposed to competition with them. Under the encouragement of the McKinley tariff, on the contrary, the business of this company is steadily gainiog. The pay roll, for example, the fund that is paid into the town, has increased 18 per cent in the past two years, and is still gaining. So far, therefore, as one has at heart the success of this company, it is his duty at the next election so to cast his vote as to prevent a change in the present tariff. If the people of Deep River wish a prosperous business continued here they can contribute to that end. If they wish to see this business crippled, the pay roll cut down, and our workmen discharged, they can contribute to that end. If they aid the Democratic party to return to power on the tariff issue, they inflict on their own home industry an injury which will be felt first of all by themselves. There should be no mistake in Deep River as to which party in this election is the friend of Pratt, Read & Co. Yours, respectfully, Geokgb L. Chenbt, General Manager. 77 South Street, Boston, Mass., Octoher 25. To {lie Editor of the New Era: My Dear Sir : Having read very attentively the communication of Mr. George L. Cheney, general manager of Pratt, Read & Co., published in the Deep River New Era of 2l8t instant, I would state the following facts in relation to the business of manufacturing ivory goods in this country : The tariff last in operation previous to the McKinley bill levied a duty of 30 per cent upon piano forte ivory and of 35 per cent on ivory combs. The Mills bill did not change these percentages, I am informed. The McKinley bill levies a duty of 40 per cent upon all sawed ivory, thus raising the duty upon pianoforte ivory 10 per cent and upon ivory combs 5 per cent. The entire amount paid for labor in the United States upon a set of pianoforte ivory is not over 10 per cent of the cost of the raw ivory, and on ivory combs not over 12i per cent, so that the 10 per cent which Mr. Cheney mentions as the lowest rate the foreign manufacturer asks would cover the entire amount paid in this fcoun- try for labor upon pianoforte ivory and nearly the whole amount upon combs. Some years since a gentleman of large business ability and experience called^ in my behalf, on the principal manufacturers of ivory in Germany, and I believe in the world, and was courteously shown everything except the bleaching process. From his report to me I have ever since believed that the labor cost of manufactur- ing piano ivory and combs in the town of Essex was smaller than it was in the estab- lishment which the gentleman visited. I have no fear that the company of which I am the treasurer would lose any of its business under absolute free trade. If other companies lost theirs, we should expect to acquire it. In respect to the relative cost of the raw material in the United States and at Hamburg, I believe that raw ivory is about one cent per pound cheaper there than here, owing to the freight and insurance being so much less to Hamburg from the African coast than to New York or Boston ; but more than this saving would have to be paid out on the transportation of the manufactured article to this country. In conclusion, 1 should like to assure Mr. Cheney that under the secret-ballot act of Connecticut he can, without in anywise endangering his business interests, safely cast his vote from conscientious motives, and not at the dictation of any corporation. Yours, truly, Geokgb Ropes. COCOA MATTING AND MATS. 1191 Mr. Hopkins. Have you any facts or figures with you that would show it would be prudent or wise to reduce the tariff on pianoforte ivory from 40 per cent to 10 per cent? Mr. Geedatj. There is not .5 per cent imported now. When there is 95 per cent imported there ought to be some competition. We desire some competition, which is now prohibited. Mr. Hopkins. Why do you put it at 10 per cent? Mr. Gerdaxj. Because it is an ivory costing $2 or $3 a pound, a very expensive article, because you see there is no work done to it except as it leaves the saw. Afterwards it is completed, but it is not polished at all. If you put 10 per cent upon an article on which nothing has been done after it leaves the saw I call it enough. I think the 10 per cent will fully cover the difference in the wages. That is all I wish to call attention to. If you let this phrase remain it is an error; it is a mistake. Maj. McKinley promised me at the time he would see it was corrected, but it was rushed through and the change was never made. COCOA MATTING AND MATS. (Paragrapli 464.) The undersigned, the largest inanufacturers of cocoa matting and mats in the United States, respectfully petition for the repeal of the present high tariff' on cocoa or coir matting or mats, and submit for your consideration the following facts, viz : The McKinley bill is the first tariff bill that has ever provided spe- cifically for cocoa matting and mats. The former tariff', which was in existence for upwards of twenty years, reads under Schedule N, sun- dries : " Floor matting and floor mats exclusively of vegetable substan- ces, 20 per cent ad valorem." This was equivalent to about $2 a roll on each roll of 50 yards of coir matting one yard wide, which is equal to a specific duty of 4 cents per square yard. Under the present McKinley tariff we are pay- ing a specific duty of 12 cents per square yard for matting, which is equal to 60 per cent ad valorem, an advance of three times the former rate. Upon mats prior to the McKinley bill we paid 20 per cent ad valo- rem, equal to 1-fird cents per square foot. The present (McKinley) tar- iff' advanced this to 8 cents per square foot, an advance equal to a duty of 100 per cent ad valorem, or five times the former rate. Upon matting, the present specific duty of 12 cents per square yard is equal to an ad valorem duty of 60 per cent. Upon mats the present specific duty of 8 cents per square foot is equal to an ad valorem duty of 100 per cent. As the largest American manufacturers, whose capital is invested in this country, we feel qualified to address you on this subject. We employ upwards of 200 men at our factory in Brooklyn, B. D., N. Y. No other manufacturers employ to exceed (as we are informed) more than one-half this number. The imported matting does not compete with the domestic. It is a high grade, handmade, fancy article, more expensive than American goods. The price of the imported article principally sold here, but in limited quantities, is about 70 cents a yard; the average of the domes- tic article principally and very largely sold here is 50 cents a yard. The labor involved in the manufacture of imported matting and mats 1192 SUNDRIES. i s equivalent to less than the work of eight workm en. Thn s, to protect tno work oi eight workmen, who do not and can not make similar expensive and handmade articles, the tariff was increased on cocoa matting from 20 per cent ad valorem or 4 cents per square yard to 12 cents per square yard, or an equivalent of 60 per cent ad valorem, and on mats from 20 per cent ad valorem or 1,^ cents per square foot to 8 cents per square foot, or an equivalent of 100 per cent ad valorem. This enormous increase in the rate of duty has had the effect of largely reducing the sale of the imported goods, and has nothelped the sale of domestic goods at all. We do not understand why such a prohibitory duty was put on these goods in the McKinley bill, as it was certainlyuunecessary for the protection of American manufacturers. The only way we can account for it is that our competitors wished to exclude these imported articles altogether, which, although they did not compete with them, they may have thought the exclusion of them would increase their sales by com- pelling purchasers to take the cheaper American article. For many years the demand for the imported goods has gradually diminished, and for several years prior to the present (McKinley) tariff bill we had not sold more than one-third the quantity of imported cocoa matting and mats that we did in former years, and since the passage of the McKinley bill our sales have fallen off to such an extent that we fear, if a change is not made at once, that we shall be compelled to give lip this part of our business (which we have conducted in this country for upwards of forty years) entirely. The only matting that we import is a high grade and high-priced fancy article made of peculiar yarn that is worked by hand and is not made in this country, and does not compete with domestic goods. We, therefore, respectfully request that the rate of duty be put back where it was before the passage of the McKinley bill to 20 i^er cent ad valorem on cocoa or coir matting and mats, or, if a specific duty is decided upon, that it be made equivalent to the above ad valorem, viz, If cents per square foot on mats, and 4 cents per square yard on matting. Danagh & Smail. Brooklyn, September 17, 1893. Sirs: On behalf of my fellow- workingm en of the cocoa mats and matting industry I most respectfully and earnestly appeal to you to allow the present rate of duty on imported mats and matting to remain as it is, viz, 8 cents a square foot on mats and 12 cents a square yard on matting. This rate was granted us after we had fully shown the horrid evil of the coolie labor (of India) products being permitted to be placed on our market at such a ruinous rate that it was impossible for our employers to compete with them. The result of the present rate is that much of the poor grades are not imported, but the better gi'ades are, because the profit is very large, owing to the trifling cost of labor in India, which is from 3 to 6 cents a day. The competition between the American manufacturers is so sharp for years that five of them were obliged to give up the business, and those who continue on are discouraged by the condition of their trade, which is half ruined by our degrading home evil, convict labor. Hoping you will grant our request of allowing the present rate to stand, I remain, respectfully, D. J. CuRNEN, 300 Plymouth Street, JEx-Presideiit Mat Malcers' Pro. Ass. PIPES — UMBEELLA STICKS. 1193 PIPES. (ParasrapU 4G3.) Philadelphia, Septemler 21, 1893. _ Sirs: In view of tlie approacliing tariff legislation, we the under- signed, representing tlie employ6s engaged in the manufacture of briar root and wood tobacco pipes, do hereby most respectfully and earnestly protest against any reduction whatsoever in the present rate of duty by which American labor is barely protected, and we beg to submit the following facts which will convince you that our request is entirely justified and deserving your kind consideration. We are oblighed to compete with pauper and prison labor, largely employed in this branch of manufacture in Europe. In France, Germany, and Austria, wood pipes are made in enormous quantities and imported into this country, and the wages workmen there receive" is from $1.50 to $6 per week, whereas, the workmen in the United States earn from $7 to $20 per week at wood-pipe making, and even with the present tariff' of 70 per cent ad valorem we are not nearly able to compete with them on many styles of pipes that come here in large quantities, as the custom returns will show. ' The first consequence of any reduction in the present rate will be a proportionate reduction in the wages of thousands of skilled workmen and laborers directly or indirectly connected with the trade, such as turners, carvers, sawyers, polishers, workers in horn, amber, and many others, including those employed in digging, carting, and freighting the roots and wood in various States of the Union. And we now ask you, in the name of our fellow -workmen, to use your valuable influence in the preservation of the present tariff' rate on wood tobacco pipes. Very respectfully, yours, Edwaed p. Flagg-, No. 991 Marshall Street. John C. Wiestenbbrg, 344 Wharton Street, And others. UMBREIiliA STICKS. (Paragraph 471.) New Tore, September 32, 1893. Sir: Regarding duty on finished sticks for umbrellas and parasols, also walking canes, we ask'thatthe presentrate of 35 per centand50per cent respectively be maintained, for the reason that manufacturers of sticks are even with this duty suffering considerarbly from competition of finished sticks, especially from Austria and different parts of Ger- many. With the exception of a small percentage of high-priced sticks, the labor constitutes by far the greater part of the value of the finished article, and it being an acknowledged fact that such labor is much cheaper in those parts of Europe named above than in this country, the trade here needs a protective duty as heretofore, whicii in our opinion alone will save it from being crippled. Yours, respectfully, Edw'd Benneohe. , INDEX BY NAMES. ■ A. ■ : ■' • Page. Abtott, JolinP., coal. V 1150 Absalom, Edmund, iron and steel 349 Acker, Merrill & Condit, cigars 595 Ackerman, E. E., cement 138 Aokerman, M. S., cement 138 Adam, Henry, hops 647 Adams, J. J., & Co., bristles and brushes .- 1072 Adler, Max, corsets 724 Ainsworth, AUen, carpets 1015 Allen, Benjamin, woolen goods 941 Allen, J. C, gloves 1175 Allen, Penrose, phosphorus 52 Andrew, Charles, hops 647 Anshuetz, Edward, leaf tobacco .'. 594 Argensinger, P. P., gloves 1175 Armington, B. F., bauxite 15 Armstrong, Charles C, corks 1166 Armstrong, Theodore, chemicals 15 Arrington, Louis, green glass bottles 171 Asay, Harrison, phosphorus ; 53 Astill, George, lastings 994 Atkin, J. C, lace curtains 880 Atwater Manufacturing Company, wire rods 396 AufFmordt, C. A., seal plush 1029 Austrian, Leo, mirror plates 215 Auth, Conrad, glass bottles 174 B. Babbott, Frank L., jute and burlaps 820 Babson, A. C, cement .* 146 Bach, Edward, harness 1186 Baker, Edwin H., knit goods 734 Baldwin, Joseph, dye woods 28 Bangs, 6. M., macaroni . ". 631 Barbour, Mr., flax and hemp 790 Barbour, O. C., matches .' j 1168 Barbour Spinning Co., flax 788 Bardwell, Jex, lantern slides 178 Barry, P., coal 1149 Barteu, John, salt 692 Battelle, J. G., iron and steel sheets 355 Battle, J. M., chloral hydrate 55 Beeber, M. & Co., gloves 1182 Bemis, J. M., burlaps 794 Benneche, Edward, umbrella sticks 1193 Bent, William H., cotton machinery 484 Benton, Frank, honey 645 Bergner, Fr. & Co., unfinished albums 1067 Bernardin, A. L., domestic tin 367 Betts, Edgar K., collars and shirts 869 Bickner, I., Dutch metal 437 Biddle, E.E., linens 861 1195 1196 INDEX BY NAMES. Page. Ring, S. B.jhops *. 651 Bissell, A. F.,(ivewooda 28 Blabon, George W., oilcloth 826 Blair, George W., fliut and lime glass 175 Blaise, Patrick, liops 665 Blake, W. V., earthenware 103 Blum, Alfred, mirror plates 212 Blumeuthal, Gustave, buttons 1088 Bodine, Frank L., window and bottle glass 183 Borger, W. A., silk goods - 1026 Bortz, John H., leaf tobacco » 567 Boss, C.W., hops 647 Bradley & Smith, bristles and brushes 1072 Bradley, Thomas W., pocket cutlery 412 Bromley, John, & Sons, lace curtains 882 Brenaman, C. H., tobacco leaf J 555 Brewer, H., & Bro., grain bags. 823 Brewer, J. H., earthenware ■ 109 Brice, Charles, gold leaf 434 Bromley Manufacturing Company, chenille 731 Brosius, Hon. M., leaf tobacco 586 Browning & Bros., dyewoods 28 Buckeye Brewing Co., hops -.. 647 Bruckman, John C, hops 647 Brunt, Henry, earthenware 81 Bryant, Charles 200 Buckminster, W. B., quicksilver 468 Burger, Rutherford, steel wire 396 Burgess, George H., baryta'snlphatc 36 Burgess, William, earthenware 103 Burke, Edward, carpets 1014 Burpee, F. T. C, granite 250 Bussing, A., horse nails 425 Bridges, William, dressed flax 813 Brigel, Leo A., hops 647 Byers, William, coal ^ 1149 C. Cable Mills, flax 788 Cabot, Godfrey L., lampblack 43 Cake, George L., window glass .' 200 - Caiman, G. B., postage stamps 1065 Camp, Hugh N., lead ores 456 Camp, William D., window glass 211 Campljell, D. W., gloves 1175 Campbell, James, window glass 200 Campbell, W., bronze powder 436 Capitan, Frank J., beet sugar 527 Carl, Alvin, hops '_ 647 Carr, James L., hats 1171 Chamberlain, Capt. H. S., iron and steel !!!..!!!..!'.! 255 Chambers, J. A., glass 183 Chase, S. B., cotton cloths 1 !.....!!!! ! 718 Chase, William L., burlaps .\\.\. .[[W. 817 jute, etc ..'.'.'!."!!.'.'!!.".""..'.".'.'.'". 802 Cheney, George L., ivory 1190 Christy, Robert, corks ..!!!!!![.'!.'!!!! 1157 Clark, Charles H., woolen goods ....'.'.'... 938 Clark, Horace B., window glass '.!.!!!!!!.!"!! 211 Clark, .James F., hops 665 Clarke, Frederic W. , degras ! J .'. 64 Clifford, C. E., horses g25 Cluett, Coon & Co., collars and cufi's __[[ 869 Coates, Dr. L. R., iron and steel '!!!.'"'..!!."! 255 Cochrane, Alex. , chemicals ......'.'. 11 Cockley, D. S., steel tubes !.!!!.!!!.'!!]."! " 389 Coffin, Herbert R., paper . 1050 Colby, F. G., mineral oil , .----!"!.'..!...]...!!!!!!!]"] 54 Collins, Jas. Ross, burlaps .....! iiljll.i !]!!!"[! 813 INDEX BY NAMES. 1197 Connett, E. v., hats 1171 Converse, John H., woolens ".""!'!... 941 Cooper, H.D., linen and juto - ... . 806 Cooper, C.B.,rooang tin 387 Corliss, Charles H., collars and shirts 868 Coty, Antoine & Hewlett, poppy seed oi oil 34 Coulston, J. W., poppy seed oil 35 Coyne, Mr., carpets 999 Cramp, Samuel H., woolen goodg 941 Craig, J. J ., marl ile .,,.... 245 Crane, Patrick G., harness .' 1187 Creighton & Burch, lace curtains 881 Cresson, Geo. v., woolen goods 941 Cronemeyer, W. C ., tin plates 359 iron and steel 255 Cullman, Jos. F., tohacco leaf ,572 Cunningham, J. A., coal 1149 Cunningham, William B., hurlaps 815 Curnen, D. J., mats and matting 1192 Cnrrie, Robert, harness 1186 Curtis, Hon. N. M., gloves 1173 Cutler, Thomas R., beet sugar 520 D. Daily, G. B. F., silk goods 1026 Dalzell, W. C, axles 402 Danagh & Small, cocoa matting and mais 1192 Darnsmont, A., hops , 647 Davies, David, iron and steel 349 Davis, Henry L., wire rods 395 Davis, Hon. Henry G., coal 1124 Dean, Chase & Co., lastings '. 993 Delaney, Chas., woolen goods 941 Degener, William, seal plush 1030 Denigan, Thos., wool 937 Detroit Fish Co., fish 667 Devoe & Reynolds, color makers 37 Dexter, C. H. & Sons, paper 1052 Diamond Mills, paper 1052 Disston, Henry, saw plates 1 395 Doak, James, jr., woolen goods 941 Dobson, James, woolen goods 941 Doermer, Max, plushes, etc ~. 1036 Dolan, Thomas, woolen goods 941 Donaldson, G. W , papers, etc 1059 Dornan, Robt., woolen goods 941 Dudley, W. W., mineral salts... ^ 59 Dunbarton Spinning Company, flax 788 Dunham, A. C., spool thread 704 Dymond, John, sugar 534 E. Eastman, I. R., publications 1066 Eberhart, John P., window glass 193 Edgar, James, textile worker 894 Eisner & Mendelson, mineral salts 61 Elder, Cyrus, iron and steel 255, 330 Elkins, "George W., woolen goods 941 Ellis, George H., phosphorus 53 Elsas & Pritz, hops 647 Ely, George H., iron ore 283 iron and steel 255 English, Hon. Thomas D., cotton backed satin 709 Ernst, G.,rice 640 Esterbrook Pen Co., pens 468 Evans, George D., iron and steel 338 1198 INDEX BY NAMES. Pago. Evans, Howard, woolen goods 941 Ewart, Eichard H., linen 859 F. Faber, G. W., cigars ■. 595 Falkberg, Lees & Co., sacoliariue 56 Famsworth, Hoy t & Co., lastings -,. . - 992 Farrell, P. A., green glass i 175 Field, J. Q. A. , granite 250 Field, Thomas, hosiery and knit goods 765 Finley, Mack, lace curtains 882 Fisher, W. Wharton, dye woods 28 Fitch, Hon. Ashbel P., hops 649 Fitler, E. H-., woolen goods 941 Fitzgerald, Smith, textile worker 890 Fitzpatrick, J. 6., Company, corsets 725 Flagg, Edward P., pipes 1193 Fleming, Howard, cement 139 glazed bricks 110 Foot, James D., files 422 Foot, J. L., green glass 175 Foppes & Partisch, rattan 501 Ford, E., plate glaSs 235 Foster, William F., gloves 1178 Fowler, E. P., beet sugar 525 Fox & Searles, hops 651 Fox, HnghF., hops 651 I'ox, James A., Bermuda vegetables 609 Frankfield, A., watches 470 Franke, George, metal-coated paper 1053 Freeman Bros. & Co., tobacco leaf 549 French, E. J., beet sugar 527 Frisbie, Ed. C, meat extract 688 Fritz, Otto H., leaf tobacco 574 Frost, Eufus S., woolen goods 956 G. Gallahue, A. H., Bermuda vegetables 609 Gallup, H. H., guns 425 Garland, Mr., Amalgamated Association 334 Gearing, John, iron and steel 335 Gerdau, Otto, ivory 1188 Gibson, Wood, harness 1186 Gilbert, N. A., Swedish bars 387 Glllinder, James, woolen goods j 941 Gilson, E. P., marble 241 Gilpin, Chas. L., iron and steel 255 Gird, Richard, beet sugar 527 Gleason, Clark E., window glass 211 Goepper, Herman &, Co., hops ^ 647 Gonzales, Antonio, tobacco leaf 572 Goodale, A. M., balbriggan J 766 Goodall, Mr., woolen goods ,. . 938 Goodsell, E. L. , Almeria grapes 669 Goodwin, George H., earthenware 109 Gough, K. Z., harness __. Ilg7 Graves, Amos, horses 625 Gray, Theodore, axles ;.. 4O7 Green, L. N., china clay I54 Green, G. W. jr., webbing , ^.. [] 768 Gribbin, Jas., dressed flax ' [][ 8I3 Gribble and Nash, camphor [ _ ] 22 Grundy, William H., woolen goods 938 941 Guenther,N., leaf tobacco ^._ '574 Gudewill & Bucknall, corks ,. 1161 Guise, C. C, tobacco, leaf 549 Gunter, Enock, iron and steel 349 Gnttejroann, E. ^ Co., hops ..,,.,, .,,,,.,„„.,,..„,,.,,,.ii',^i^l,!^^ii,'i^[ §51 INDEX BY NAMES. 1199 H. Page. 1 Sigmund, leaf tobacco 574 Haebler & Co., eoment 145 Hagan, Philip, iron and#teel .'......'.".".'.' 340 Hage, J. D., cabbage * " 644 Haines, H. S., window glass 211 Hale, Henry S., woolen goods ". 941 Hall Brothers, woolen goods ' 991 Hall, John W., white earthenware 168 Halladay, Andrew, harness 1186 Hamilton, Thomas J., leaf tobacco .' .' ] 594 Hammett, A. M., window glass 200 Hanson, J. F., hosiery \\ 762 Hart, A. H. & Co., flax and hemp ]"' 788 Hart, J. E., marble "' 247 Hart, Mrs. Ernest, Irish textiles 900 Harteau, H., plate glass 226 Harter, Hon. Michael D., agricultural machinery 493 Harvey and Outerbridge, fish 669 Hatch, George C, pocket cutlery 420 Hauck, Louis J., hops «....: 647 Haufman, C. H., iron and steel -. 340 Hazel, William N., harness 1187 Hecht, Isaac, beet sugar 529 Herbert, Harry, iron and steel 349 Herman, Max, collars and cuffs 874 Hey, George, silk labels. 704 Hill, Lew. C, brushes 1073 Hilton, Hughes & Co., hosiery and knit goods 732 Hitchcock, E.' A., plate glass '. 227 Hoffmann, Jos. E., tobacco leaf , 572 Holden, L. E., lead ores. 442 Homer, Saml., jr., lace curtains 882 Hooper, George L., hosiery 765 Hopewell, John, dates of wool tariff 1016 Hopewell, John, jr., woolen goods ■ ' 938 Hopkins, Chas. W., guns 425 Hoskins, C. J., iron and steel 349 Honghton & Richards, bar iron 354 House, Edward O., collars and shirts 869 Howe & French, fish glue 33 Howorth, Samuel, carpets 1012 Hubbard, John A., rice 639 Hudepohl, L., hops 647 Hunt, Alfred E. , aluminum 429 Hurd, G. B. &. Co., paper IO59 Hutchins, C, H., cotton machinery 486 Huyck & Argorsinger, felts 997 I. Ikirt, Hon. G. P., pottery 67 Innis & Co., dye woods 28 Italian Chamber of Commerce, farm products 609 Ithaca Gun Co., guns 424 J. James, H. L., woolen goods 938, 981 Jarrett, John, iron and steel 349 Jayne, H. W., coal tar products 25 Jeitles, James M., tobacco leaf 567 Jenkins, William, iron and steel : 349 Jennings, A. G., laces 875 Jersey City Company, paper .• 1052 Jessup, J. B., fiah 667 John, David, iron and steel 349 Johnes, Kobert, iron and steel 349 Johnson, W, B., paper.,,,.., ,,, ..„,„.,,,.,,.,,,., 1059 1200 INDEX BY NAMES. Jones, Hon. Frank, lime 146 Jones, Jerome, earthenware 91 Jones, S. Lewis, bauxite • 15 Jones, Thomas F., beet sugar - ■• 527 Judson, D. B., gloves 1175 Jule, George, hats 1I71-' Jnnge, William & Co., hops 651 Justice, Theodore, wool 907 K. Kansas City Company, bags : 806 Karges Furniture Company, mirror plates 215 Kaspar, Frank J., pearl buttons 1107 Ka-vanaugh, C. H.,knit goods 767 Kealy, John A., window glass '. , -. 200 Kearney & Foot Co., files 422 Kent, Percy, grain bags' 823 Kerbs, Wertheim & Schiffer, leaf tobacco 573 Kilgallon, J. C, iron and steel 343 Kimes, Jesse B., china clay'. 351 King, D. Webster, emery 1167 Kip, FredE., plushes^ etc 1023 Klipstein, E. C., alum 14 Klotter, George, hops 647 Kuerze, E. JI., hops 647 Knowles, George &. Son, china clay .' 153 Knowles loom works, cotton macliincrj- 487 Koerber, E. C, nuts and almonds 688 Knhles & Stock, leaf tobacco 572 Kuisheedt, Alex. E., laces 774 L- La Manna, Azema & Faman, canned vegetables , 666 Lamb, Col. William, coal.. 1132 Lambert, John, iron and steel 255, 314 Langsdorf, Morris K., leaf tobacco 579 Lapham, O. K., beet sugar 53O Latzko, Henry, woolen goods 983 Laufman, P. H., iron and steel 255 Laughlin, Maj.G. M.,iron and steel 255,322 Lawrence, Wm., wool 93O Leeds, Jno. H., licorice paste 29 Leeds, W. B., tin plate 376 Lees, Wm. G., textile worker , . . ggg Leger, Martin S. , textile worker 899 Leland, W. H., pearl buttons 1097 Lesley, R. W., cement HI 145 Lewis, Paul, iron and steel ' 349 Lewis, William D., woolen goods 1 95g Lichten, A. , tobacco leaf ..:.... 567 Lilienthal Bros., hops 654 Littauer, Lucius N. , gloves .t 1175 Loewi, Valentine, glucose 545 Lorimer, John H., woolen goods 944 Lowy, Maurice, hosiery and gloves 734 Lovering, William C, cotton cloth _ 709 Lutterbey, E., hops 647 Lyon, J. Crawford, oilcloth '[ g44 M. Macfariane, Hugh C, leaf tobacco 57O Maguire, William, dressed flax ' 843 Manrara, Edward, leaf tobacco '' 570 Marshall & Co., flax and hemp [' 7gg Martin's Sons, J. M., bristles and brushes ..........'....'.. 1072 INDEX BY NAMKS, 1201 rage- Masters, Samuel A., Bermuda vegetables 612 Matheson, William J., dyestuffs 22 Mayer, Joseph, eartliernware 109 Mayer, Strouse & Co., corsets . 724 McAlpine, A. J., fish 667 McCall, Hon. Samuel W., date of tariff bill 5 McAnhffe, J., green glass 175 McCorkle, Gov.W.A., coal 1140 McCullough, E. H.,coal .- 1144 McGuire, J. K., cement 139 McKerley, George, dressed flax , 813 Meehan, John, harness 1187 Meeker, E., hops 655 Mehling, P. A., -wool 937 Mercer, Hon. David H., pearl buttons 1106 Merfeld, Joseph, tobacco leaf 549 Merritt, C. H., hats 1171 Merz, Henry, ultramarine 44 Merz, Valentine, hops 665 Meyer, Hon. Adolph, hops 664 Meyer, G. A. & E., gypsum 149 Michels, Ivan C, lead ores 464 Miller Bros. Cutlery Co., pens 468 Miller HaU & Son, metal bedsteads 483 Miller, Jno. E., buttons 1087 Miller, M. Erskine, coal 1150 Miller, Owen, musical instruments 494 Miles, J. S., Pasteur filter 169 Mitchell, George A., woolen goods 941 Moerlein, William, hops 647 Mohr, F., mirror plates 215 Montgomery, J. E., tinsel thread 439 Mooney, W. W. & Sons, sumac 63 Morgan, James L., jr., chemicals 12 Moritz, Leopold, bone buttojis , 1119 Morrison, R. S., window glass 179 Morse, E. E., marble 236 Moses, John, earthenware 109 Muhlhauser, H., hops 647 MulhoUand, John E., textile worker 900 N. Naylor, John S., woolen goods 941 Neahr, M. I. & Co., bag-makers ; ^ 806 Newbur£cer,M.D., leaf tobacco 574 Newell, A, W., pearl buttons 1097 Newell, L. C, ivory buttons 1116 Neumann, Joseph, silk culture 1021 Nicholas, 6. S., cigars 595 Niedringhaus, F. 6., tin plates , 358 Nimmo, Joseph, farm products 599 Nordlinger, Henry, pease and mushrooms 643 prunes and plums 686 North, S. N. D., woolen goods 952 Northam, E. J., beet sugar 527 - Northrup, M. L., gloves II75 0. . O'Connell, John, hosiery and knit goods 732 Osborn, Owen, hosiery 746 Ostheimer, A. J., pearl buttons 1097 Ottenheiraer Bros., corsets 729 Oxnard, Henry T., beet sugar 505 P. Page, George H., tin plate 381 Page, J. Scaver, colors and paints 37 T H 76 1202 INDEX BY NAMES. Page. Paine, A. G., wood pnlp ; 1047 Parker, J. Eugene, farm products 606 Pauly, F. G.,dye woods 28 Pearce, Ed. D., chemicals 12 Pearce, Thomas A., woolen goods 941 Pearson, Ed. M., earthenware 109 Peyser, Dr. H. M., gloves 1179 Pfahler, W. H., woolen goods 941 Phillips, Hon. T. W., window glass 211 iron ami .steel. 348 Pierce, A. 6., cotton yarns 695 Pierce, H. A., beet sugar 527 Pilditch, Frank S., flat steel wire ; 399 Pilling, Mi. , hosiery 746 Place, George M., gloves 1175 Pohl, Paul, jr., grapes 686 Pollock, James, woolen goods 941 Pope, Albert A., bicycles 494 Portuondo, Juan F., leaf tobacco 575 Potter, H. A., oilcloth 830 Pratt, D. , thimbles 495 Preston, Jno. H., oilcloth 833 Putney, Simeon F., window glass 200 K. Eadford, James, gloves 1175 Raegener, Lewis C, saccharin n 5li Eanft, Eichard, piano felts : 995 Eaneh, John, leaf tobacco 594 Raymond, A. C, pearl buttons 1096 Reeves, David, iron and steel 255 Reisinger, Hugo, hops 651 Eemer, Fred J.,plnshes, etc 10 ?6 Eennous, Kleinle & Co., brushes 10 So Eeynders, Chas., leaf tobacco 576 Reynolds, Alphonse W., window glass 211 Eiohardson, Hon. Geo. F., glass mirror plates 223 Eichardson, John, Chipa clay 150 Eichey, H. A., tobacco and cigars 581 Eiebei, Fred, leaf tobacco 594 Eiessner, T., bronze powder 436 Riggins, Jos., window glass 200 Riglander, J. W., wire, etc 401 Eipley, Daniel C, fliut and lime gla.ss 176 Eobinson, John, corks 11,55 Rockwell, F.H., cattle 626 Rockwell, W. F., pocket cutlery J 409 Eoeblings, John A., Sons, iron and steel wire .^ 400 Eoebling, F. W., iron and steel 255 Eopes, George, ivory 1190 Eosenfeld, Adolph, collars and cuffs 863 Eothbarth, Martin & Co., hops 651 Rothbarth & Sons, hops 651 Rothschild, Hugo, gloves 1179 Eowland & Schmidt, lace curtains 882 Rosenwald, T. & Co., hops fi51 Rupert, Charles, coal 1149 Russell, Albert, iron and steel ?. 349 Rutherford, William, burlaps 818 Eutty, W. H., gloves II79 Byan, Hon. William, carpets 999 S. Sachs, Harry, pearl buttons 1088 Sadler, Thomas, iron and steel 349 Salomon, Felix, woolen rags 938 Salomon. Felix & Co., degias 690 INDEX BY NAMES. 1203 Page. Sanford, Arnold B., cotton yams 696 Schaller Bros., hops 647 Schlieder, Ed G.,liop8 665 Schloss, Henry W., braid 769 Schmalholz Simon, leaf tobacco 594 Schmidz, Christian, hats - 1183 Schmitt, Emile, hops ; 647 Schmidt, P., hops 647 Schneider, Adolph G., leaf tobacco 574 Schneider, Peter W., hops 647 Schram, Jno. G., gloves 1181 Schrceder, F. A., tobacco leaf 572 Schwarz, Benj., & Sons, hops 651 Scull, M. Albert, cement 126 Search, Theo. C, woolen goods 941 Sears, E. H., iron ore '. 353 Seddon, Thos., iron and steel 255-321 Semple, E. M., leaf tobacco 570 Sextro, Joseph, mirror plates 215 Seymour, Henry T., shears 496 Sgobel & Day, potatoes 666 Sharpless, John M., dye woods 28 Sheard, Titus, knit goods 754 Shirts, J. D.M., brushes 1084 Shook, Col. A. M., iron and steel 255 Sihler, Dr. Chr., microscopes ; 493 Sinclair & Babson, cemeut 145 Simonds, F. W. & Co., hops 651 Skiddy, W. W., licorice paste 26,31 dve woods 32 Smith & Dove Co., flax 788 Smith, J. Henry, hosiery -. 738 Smith Paper Co., paper 1052 Smith, Thos. C, porcelain 157 Smith, W. J., flint glass •. 177 Snelliug, E. P. , cotton machinery 490 Sperry, Hon. Lewis, iron ore 353 leaf tobacco 586 paper ^ 1050 Stead & Miller, chenille 731 StefSn, A.jleaf tobacco 594 Stephani, A. & Co., macaroni 639 Stephen, John, dressed flax 813 Stirling, William K., iron and steel ,. .• 255 steel 295 Stevens, John E., hemp and jute 779 Stewart, John S., textile worker -. 882 Stillings, J. J., harness 1186 Storer, Hon. Bellamy, hops _. 646 Stowe, B. L., hydraulic hose ". 824 Stubbs, Dr.W. C, sugar 530 Stnntz, Robert, mats and rugs 1016 Swank, James M., iron and steel , 255 gwann, George, lastings 994 Swenspn, S. M., sugar 542 Sylvester, Lewis, leaf tobacco 584 T. Taloott, John B., hosiery 762 Talcott, Frisbie & Co., meat extract 689 Tappan, Wallace, leaf tobacco 574 Taylor, John M., earthenware ^ 109 Taylor, N. & G., tin plate 363 Teague, Samuel W., china clay 152 Tenney, C . H., hats 1171 Thomas, Charles A., harness J.187 Thomas, Thomas, iron and steel 349 1204 INDEX BY NAMES. Page. Thomas, W. H. & Bro., cigars , 595 Thompson, James & Co., flax and hemp 788 Toomey, A. J., macaroni 627 Tormey, James, textile worker 900 Toney, J. R., razors 421 Tottle, William A. & Co., brushes 1076 Treadwell & Seward, hosiery 760 Treford Park, cigars 595 Truitt, Joseph P., woolen goods 941 Truslow & Co., corks 1160 Turuer, A. E., flax and hemp 788 linen yarn 858 Turner & Harrison, pens 468 U. Uchtmann, E., hops 651 Uhlenberg, Charles V., tobacco leaf 549 Ullmann, Carl & Co., hops 651 Ulmer, Frank, guns 425 V. Van Duzer, J. S., tobacco leaf 563 Van Home, D. A., glass 181 window glass 193 Victoria Mills, bags 806 Videon, R. S., window glass 211 Vijelies, William, tobacco leaf 572 Wadson, Thomas J., Bermuda products 612, 616 Walbridges, W. D . , coal 1145 Walker, Mr., encaustic tiles Ill Walker, Fred. A. , earthenware 97 Walker, W. H., oil cloth 858 Wardlaw, S. & Co., flat steel wire 399 Waring, Arthur B., hats 1172 Warne, M. T., gypsum 150 Warner Bros., corsets 725 Warner, Dr. Lucien C . , corsets 726 Watson, George B., mica ■. . 466 Wattenberg & Co., hops 651 Webster & Co. , degras 691 Weichsell, William, iron and steel 337 Welborn, J. E., brushes ...: 1076 Wertheim, J., tobacco leaf 573 Werthheimer & Co., gloves II79 Wetterer, John, hops 647 Wharton, Joseph, iron and steel 255 iron ore 294 Whitcomb, W. O., metal bedsteads 471 White & Kerr, harness 1186 White, W. A. & A. M., hatters' furs 1189 Whiting, John L., brushes 1076 Whitman, William, woolen goods 968 Whitney, Macduff & Co., flax 788 Wiestenberg, John C, pipes 1193 Wiley, John A., card clothing 408 Wilkins, William, bristles 1080 Willets, Jos., earthenware 108 Willets Co., German pot clay 156 Williams, David, iron and steel 349 Williams, John D., iron and steel 349 Wilson, Alfred, iron and steel 349 Wilson, ,Iohn, flax dresser g08 Wilson, T. A., lenses 236 INDEX BY NAMES. 1205 Pa«e. Windmiiller, Louis, woolen goods 979 Wing, Hon. L. B., wool 929 Wise, JohnH., wool 937 Wolf, Henry J. F., hops 647 Wolff, N. &Co.,,liop8 647 Wootlbridge, C. L., dress trimmings 998 Woodruff, M. J., wood screws 426 Woods, R. E., German pot clay 155 Wulling, J. M., sugar 544 Y. York Match Co., matches 1167 INDEX BY SUBJECTS. A. Agricultural products: Pago. Gallahue.A.H 608 Masters, Samuel A., Bermuda 612 New York 600 Nimmo, Joseph 599 Parker, J. Eugene 606 Albums unfinished : Berguer, Fr. & Co 1067 Alizarin, assistant 24 Alizarin, colors 22 Almonds, Koerber, E. C 687 Alum 15 Klipsteiu, E. C 14 Aluminum: Cost '. 433 Hunt, Alfred E 429 Amalgamated Association : Iron and steel 334 Anchovies 611 Animals : (See Cattle.) (See Horses.) Aniline colors 23 Census 782 Cotton, price . , 783 Grain 814 Brewer,H. & Bro 823 Kent, Percy 822 Balbriggan, Goodale, A. M 766 Bamboo reeds 501 Baryta sulphate, Burgess, George H 36 Barytes 1 13 B. Bauxite : Armington, B. F 14 Foreign 430 Jones, S. Lewis 14 Beans, New York 600 Beluga fish bladders 33 Bermuda, area, etc 614 Crops 620 Statistics 613 Vegetables. (